#linuxcnc Logs

Jun 13 2018

#linuxcnc Calendar

01:19 AM IchGucksLive: morning from germany
01:23 AM IchGucksLive: off 2 garden till later
02:25 AM miss0r: goodmorning
02:34 AM Deejay: moin
02:35 AM miss0r: mornin'
02:42 AM miss0r: I've been doing some repairs on a pretty large milling machine. But something is puzzling me quite alot in the circuit diagram: https://imgur.com/a/0Q9rbQQ This is a cutout showing some of what I am puzzled about. What is the big idea with the setup regarding Y13.2(a clutch). The way they have arranged the varistor n. everything. Also: what seems to be the purpose of that variable resistor? Can someone shed some light on this?
02:47 AM jesseg: miss0r, where's the variable resistor?
02:47 AM jesseg: oh there's a bunch
02:47 AM jesseg: clicking image makes it more clear :P
02:49 AM jesseg: I'm honestly not sure if those are resistors
02:50 AM miss0r: yeah. but the way I read this: R132 offers a 47ohm resistrance between KA13.2 and the clutch(Y13.2) it then has the variable part connected to another source of power through KA13.3, which is also grounded through a varistor
02:51 AM jesseg: Have you verified that those parts actually are resistors?
02:51 AM jesseg: I know they are rated in ohms but so are relay coils
02:51 AM miss0r: I haven't actualy put a multimeter to them, but they are some quite large wire wound elements on a cheramic tube, on the top of the control box, under a steel mesh
02:52 AM jesseg: well that sounds like resistors..
02:52 AM jesseg: oh.
02:52 AM jesseg: they are big?
02:52 AM jesseg: how long are they roughly? are we talking mm? inches?
02:52 AM jesseg: feet :P
02:52 AM miss0r: I'd say 30mm in diameter and 120mm long
02:52 AM jesseg: AHHHH.. load dump (breaking) / soft start resistors?
02:54 AM miss0r: sure sure...
02:55 AM miss0r: but what is up with that setup?
02:55 AM jesseg: I have *no* idea
02:55 AM jesseg: what are the boxes along the bottom?
02:55 AM jesseg: I don't read German :P
02:56 AM miss0r: so perhaps KA13.2 does the 'start up', and then KA13.3 latches a second later, when the startup current has fizzled out
02:56 AM jesseg: A1/A2 is often used for relay coil terminals though
02:56 AM jesseg: K is often for a kontactor
02:56 AM jesseg: i.e. relay
02:56 AM miss0r: Me neither :D but that is the PLC output, driving the relays
02:56 AM miss0r: yeah.
02:56 AM jesseg: oh so those A1/A2 pairs are the coils for the contacts shown above?
02:57 AM miss0r: yeah, usualy A1 and A2 are + and -, respectively, in europe
02:57 AM miss0r: When it comes to coils
02:58 AM miss0r: That could make sense.. but one last thing that is puzzling me then, assuming we got this right
02:58 AM MrHindsight: maybe a D grade for the schematic
02:58 AM jesseg: Are the 3 phases connected to the 4750, 7754, and 7750 ? like on the motor?
02:58 AM miss0r: the Varistor R13.2 'should' me installed parallel with Y13.2 directly
02:58 AM miss0r: if it should work as advertised
02:59 AM MrHindsight: what year is this from?
02:59 AM miss0r: 4750 is a fused line of +24vdc
02:59 AM miss0r: the rest are GND from seprate terminals
02:59 AM jesseg: man that varistor looks like a coil symbol I've seen on some old schematics :P
03:00 AM miss0r: MrHindsight: The machine itself is from 56 or 62(I can'r remember for sure). But it was refurbished in the late '90s
03:00 AM jesseg: miss0r, two grounds...?! are you sure?
03:00 AM MrHindsight: makes more sense
03:00 AM miss0r: jesseg: They are the same potential. But the wires are named after the terminal number they connects to
03:01 AM jesseg: oh I see, the varistors or whatever all go to one common, and the resistors and contactors all go to the other common
03:01 AM miss0r: the GND throughout this diagram has upwards of 40 different names
03:01 AM miss0r: well, they end up on the same terminal block in the end
03:02 AM jesseg: miss0r, hmmm.. What is -Y13.1 ?
03:02 AM miss0r: the same as Y13.1 an electric clutch
03:02 AM jesseg: is that a normally closed contact in the -KA13.1 switch?
03:02 AM jesseg: oh that is an electric clutch?
03:02 AM miss0r: yeah
03:03 AM MrHindsight: 24V, 47 ohms, ~.5A
03:03 AM miss0r: the KA13.1 is a NO
03:03 AM jesseg: What is Y13.0 ?
03:03 AM miss0r: jesseg: electric brake
03:03 AM jesseg: so its' 4 electric clutches and an electric break?
03:03 AM miss0r: MrHindsight: Yeah....
03:03 AM MrHindsight: yet they seems to ondicate 2.1A
03:03 AM miss0r: jesseg: on 'this' side of the manual, yes. its a quite complicated machine
03:04 AM MrHindsight: indicate even
03:04 AM miss0r: MrHindsight: Yeah, but Ka13.3 does some magic also
03:04 AM miss0r: well, this is all part of what I want to find out. This machine has some issues with the clutches not latching properly
03:04 AM jesseg: so why would we switch 24v through the varistor straight into ground?
03:04 AM miss0r: and theres a very real chance that the rebuild done in the late '90s was very halfassed (I've found many issues that was never done right)
03:05 AM jesseg: miss0r, are the variable resistors 3 terminal center tapped?
03:05 AM miss0r: jesseg: I don't that is the point. I think the point is that you apply a supply on another setting on the variable resistor, *after* the startup current has fizzled out. and the fact that the varistor is not mounted directly in parallel with the clutch seemed flawed in my mind
03:05 AM jesseg: i.e. a "wiper" and two end terminals
03:06 AM miss0r: yeah
03:06 AM MrHindsight: I'd have to compare that drawing to what I'd see with a meter to be sure of what the drawing means
03:06 AM miss0r: MrHindsight: You can ask me, I've been around the controller there once or twice
03:06 AM jesseg: miss0r, is there any chance it's a pull-in/hold-in configuration?
03:07 AM miss0r: yeah. that is what I am trying to say :)
03:07 AM MrHindsight: pin 3 of KA13.2 does it connect to pin 1 of Y13.2 only or?
03:07 AM jesseg: I think the wiper on the resistor provides the higher pullin current
03:07 AM miss0r: MrHindsight: yes
03:08 AM miss0r: jesseg: Ahh... indeed
03:08 AM jesseg: and I think the varistors are just snubbers
03:08 AM miss0r: yeah, idiotic snubbers
03:08 AM miss0r: ;]
03:08 AM jesseg: and I think they have the snubbers going to a different ground so as to not inject voltage spikes into the main ground, beats me though
03:09 AM miss0r: I milled a PCB the other day, with 20 diodes and 20 small caps, as snubbers for the electromagnetic hydraulic valves. Each valve was eating a relay a month
03:09 AM jesseg: LOL... yup...
03:09 AM miss0r: They also had varistors mounted, but they are not realy suited for that task
03:10 AM MrHindsight: was wondering if the /|\ below pin 3 of R132 is a connection or if it jumps over
03:10 AM miss0r: Which brings me back to thinking they might not know what they were doing all the time
03:10 AM miss0r: MrHindsight: old european standard for 'jumping over'. it is not used anymore(in newer drawings)
03:11 AM jesseg: yeah I usually draw a semicircle jump-over :P
03:11 AM MrHindsight: ok so that is a connection vs + is no connection
03:11 AM miss0r: today the standard is; if theres not a '.' or dot where two wires cross, they are not connected
03:11 AM gloops: wonder why its making extra slices https://ibb.co/fKFxqJ
03:11 AM jesseg: miss0r, well now that I guess I understand what the system does, I don't remember what your question was.. or was it just what does it do..
03:12 AM MrHindsight: if signal cross over in the drawing they only are a connection if it /|\
03:12 AM miss0r: MrHindsight: what you see under R132 is just two wires crossing eachother - they are not connected
03:12 AM MrHindsight: oh then WTF
03:12 AM miss0r: MrHindsight: thats what I said :)
03:13 AM miss0r: jesseg: Basically I had to talk to someone to understand wtf was going on
03:13 AM jesseg: miss0r, did you achieve that? :D
03:13 AM jesseg: if so I'm going to bed. I may anyway :P
03:14 AM MrHindsight: I'm glad we all agreed to add a . when signals connect
03:14 AM miss0r: I think it is reasonable to think that KA13.3 provides the initial latching of the clutch, then KA13.2 takes over to hold the clutch shut, using less current. and the Varistor R13.2 is just flawed
03:14 AM miss0r: well.. not exactly flawed, just strange that you'd not mount that directly parallel to the clutch
03:15 AM jesseg: miss0r, what's wrong with the varistor?
03:15 AM jesseg: is it not snubbing? maybe it's burnt out
03:15 AM miss0r: why on gods green earth would you mount the snubber with a resistor in there?
03:15 AM jesseg: well, it still completely blocks the high voltage spike before it reaches any relay contacts.
03:16 AM jesseg: it clamps it half way up the variable resistor, so above the tap on the resistor is protected. and it also protects the pull in contacts.
03:16 AM miss0r: +---[resistor]----clutch--+-GND
03:16 AM miss0r: | |
03:16 AM miss0r: +-----[varistor]-----------
03:16 AM jesseg: and in fact, resistors are often used with snubbers to dissipate some of the energy so the snubber has to dissipate less
03:17 AM miss0r: yeah, you could just as easily have mounted it directly on the clutch, making it less strange for me to read! :)
03:17 AM jesseg: the goal is to protect the relay contacts from high voltage
03:17 AM MrHindsight: olden days
03:17 AM miss0r: jesseg: Which it fails to do, sadly
03:17 AM jesseg: yeah you'd think they'd just put them right on the clutch
03:17 AM MrHindsight: before there was fancy solid state devices
03:17 AM miss0r: the varistors in there are too slow to handle the small spikes, eating away at the contacts
03:17 AM jesseg: miss0r, yeah you might want to just replace them with reversed diodes :P
03:17 AM jesseg: if it's DC for sure
03:17 AM miss0r: that is what I already made & installed a PCB for
03:18 AM miss0r: with a 5A diode and a 0.1uF cap
03:18 AM jesseg: cap and diode in parallel?
03:18 AM miss0r: yes
03:18 AM jesseg: sounds good
03:18 AM miss0r: you could vissible see the spark in the relay contacts when they unlatched
03:18 AM miss0r: now theres nothing visible, anyway
03:19 AM jesseg: cool
03:19 AM miss0r: sadly this turned out to make sense
03:19 AM miss0r: Its having issued making a proper latch contact(mechanical). This beast of a mill produces alot of smoke
03:20 AM jesseg: because of slipping clutches?
03:20 AM miss0r: yeah
03:20 AM jesseg: ahh well they may be worn out
03:20 AM miss0r: well... they have alot of 'clutching material' left on the disks
03:20 AM miss0r: So I'll probally need to get in there and adjust them
03:20 AM jesseg: if they are engaging at all they are probably pulling in, right
03:20 AM jesseg: gotcha
03:21 AM miss0r: But this is a shit task
03:21 AM jesseg: well goodnight then :D
03:21 AM jesseg: yeah glad it's you and not me :P
03:21 AM miss0r: the front cover of the gearbox weighs in at around 3� metric tons
03:21 AM MrHindsight: would any solid state diode be fast enough in 1956?
03:21 AM jesseg: lol yup.
03:21 AM jesseg: re gearbox cover
03:21 AM miss0r: hehe. Goodnight jesseg
03:21 AM jesseg: don't know about 1950's diodes :D
03:22 AM miss0r: MrHindsight: Well, the retrofit with the PLC'n everything was done in the late '90s. By then the diodes were absolutly fast enough
03:22 AM MrHindsight: that drawing made me ill :p
03:22 AM miss0r: hehe
03:23 AM miss0r: You should see some pre cold war era russian circuit dragrams
03:23 AM MrHindsight: once you understand their minds...
03:23 AM miss0r: I've often come to the conclusion, that it is alot easier to disregard the diagram, and just work with the machine like you have none
03:24 AM miss0r: That strategy has not failed me yet
03:24 AM MrHindsight: there are some pretty horrible designs out there :)
03:24 AM MrHindsight: you look at it and go NO, they wouldn't do that..
03:24 AM MrHindsight: what am I missing? :)
03:25 AM MrHindsight: OH GOD they really did do that!
03:25 AM jesseg: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b4vJ8l2NfIM
03:25 AM miss0r: I did a rebuild on a radial drill(russian pre cold war era)... I ended up simply not using the diagram. Every time I thought I had figured out what their symbols meant, I turned a page and it made less than no sense again.
03:26 AM miss0r: I'm thinking that you might need a special russian technician decoder ring to read it
03:27 AM miss0r: At the moment I'm running at test with that mill.
03:27 AM miss0r: I have installed two seprate powersupplys to handle the clutches
03:28 AM miss0r: And turned them up to 26 volts, with the possibility of upping it to 28
03:28 AM MrHindsight: whats the name of that open source and horrible schematic capture program?
03:28 AM miss0r: :S
03:28 AM miss0r: halfland something?
03:28 AM miss0r: no...
03:29 AM miss0r: I've repaired a machine once, after a retrofit, where the electrical builders managed not to notice the clutches was rates 28 volts, and ran them with 24 volts.
03:29 AM MrHindsight: Kicad
03:29 AM miss0r: You making a test of the schematic ?
03:31 AM MrHindsight: Eagle, that what all the *duino schematics are done with
03:32 AM miss0r: I use diptrace :]
03:32 AM miss0r: I have to get back to coding my EDM.. its not doing itself
03:48 AM rmu: kicad is not that bad
03:49 AM miss0r: I am >||< this close to buying a used Charmilles Eleroda e110 EDM
03:55 AM gloops: finding a few little quirks with some sketchup scripts, nice to know windows apps act irrationally at times as well
03:57 AM gloops: slicer, if you re-open it and leave the last values in the boxes, it throws mistakes, if you re-type all the values, it works fine, strange
04:14 AM IchGucksLive: hi all
04:15 AM IchGucksLive: miss0r, isent there a AGIE the same price
04:15 AM miss0r: I wish :)
04:21 AM IchGucksLive: im off
04:35 AM miss0r: I wonder where I can get a ballscrew cover for a 6mm one
04:50 AM gloops: funny when youre building a router, you look at stuff people have made and think yeah ill be able to make that and this and those..
04:50 AM gloops: and you will..but only when youve become an expert in a multitude of CAD apps and their plugins
04:51 AM gloops: so add on another 6 months for that
04:54 AM Loetmichel: hihi
04:58 AM miss0r: One can hardly become an expert in any real CAD program in 6 months :)
05:00 AM gloops: well for most people thats true miss0r
05:00 AM Loetmichel: miss0r: do tell... i have failed to understand 3 different 3d CADs so far... (f260, turbocad 17 and solidworks). Maybe i am truly spoiled by my use of Corel Draw as a "CAD" since version 4 came out...
05:01 AM Loetmichel: old dog and new tricks and stuff ;)
05:01 AM Loetmichel: f360
05:01 AM miss0r: hehe yeah.. I've been using MasterCAM x5 for ~5 years now, and I don't consider myself anything close to an expert
05:01 AM miss0r: and I'm not being modest.
05:03 AM XXCoder: those kind of programs its very easy to start
05:03 AM Loetmichel: something about the 3d workflow isnt sitting well with my brain... having done "sheet metal folding" for years in my mind instead of in the "CAD"
05:03 AM XXCoder: but theres no end to learning,.
05:03 AM Loetmichel: cant get around how 3d CADs do it.
05:04 AM Loetmichel: i fail as early as finding some "lock points" to attach two primitives at the right place. a thing that i do in 2d Corel on a daily basis.
05:05 AM miss0r: :D
05:06 AM miss0r: We all have our limitations. At the moment arduino is kicking my ass..
05:07 AM gloops: trouble is there are thing that the CAD was never specifically designed to draw, the problem is working out ways to draw the thing using whatever tools the CAD has available
05:08 AM gloops: if youre using them day in day out you learn all the tricks
05:08 AM gloops: if not..youve got a lot of googling to do
05:12 AM miss0r: hehe... my temporary wiring in this control box, looks like you could die from looking at it
05:50 AM gloops: my temporary wiring still looks like that, i think it will always remain temporary lol
05:51 AM gloops: fire service would be horrified if they looked in my garage
05:51 AM miss0r: hehe. I can't stand that. I like my wiring looking neat
05:52 AM miss0r: otherwise getting an overview after not having no mess with it for a while is damn near impossible
05:53 AM XXCoder: permently temporary
05:56 AM miss0r: well. The idea is that I will bring this EDM to a job site... I can't have it look like a rats nest ;)
05:58 AM gloops: could do with a dead welding rig, on wheels, rip the insides out and stick the edm inside it, just have the torch cables coming out - pro job
05:58 AM gloops: if you need to do anything inside, just put a cloth over your head like the old photographers used to do, so nobody can see inside the box
05:59 AM XXCoder: yeah flammable cloth
06:01 AM miss0r: hehe. I have a nice box... "nice".. It just needs to work for now, then I can look at making it crisp. I'm still planning to have Loetmichel make me an enclosure once I have it running like I want it to
06:01 AM miss0r: In my line of work, Image is everything
06:01 AM gloops: i made one miscalculation with my metal control box, the vfd sticks out too far, so cant put the doors back on it
06:02 AM gloops: i need to sort that out, its not such a bad job really would look ok with the doors on, and stop dust getting in
06:02 AM miss0r: can't you make a cutout around the VFD?
06:02 AM gloops: of course once the router is working - all those good intentions get forgotten
06:02 AM gloops: thats what ill have to do yeah miss0r
06:03 AM miss0r: you 'could' add a rubber lib around the hole, to seal for dust
06:03 AM gloops: it would work ok actually, id still be able to see the vfd readout
06:03 AM gloops: with doors closed
06:06 AM miss0r: indeed
06:28 AM jthornton: morning
06:29 AM gloops: hmm, just fired linuxcnc up, trying to home the wrong direction, why would that happen out of the blue
06:29 AM gloops: was fine yesterdays run
06:31 AM XXCoder: connected connector for stepper backwards?
06:31 AM jthornton: direction wire hanging loose
06:32 AM XXCoder: hmm yeah that would do it
06:32 AM gloops: it was 12v supply plug not fully in
06:33 AM gloops: not sure why that affects it - obviously switches not powered, but still dont see why that would make a change of direction
06:34 AM XXCoder: not enough power for direction?
06:38 AM gloops: well, the 12v supply just powers the input switches, everything else had normal power, just moved normally but wrong direction
06:40 AM XXCoder: weird
06:44 AM jthornton: are your limit/home switches normally closed?
06:55 AM gloops: forget tbh, open i think
06:57 AM gloops: anyway, todays testing done, can finally get a sliced profile with slots, from a 3d shape, and get gcode that works
06:57 AM gloops: slot size at same size is just too tight though - 9mm to 9mm, will try 9.1mm slots next time
06:58 AM gloops: 1 week of spare computer time on that task alone!
07:04 AM myil: Good evening
07:04 AM jthornton: morning
07:04 AM myil: just i download linux cnc
07:05 AM myil: how to install it on windows/linux mint
07:05 AM myil: i download it as a ISO image
07:05 AM jthornton: you can't install on windowsw
07:06 AM jthornton: http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.7/html/getting-started/getting-linuxcnc.html
07:07 AM gloops: myil think of it as a seperate operating system, linuxcnc runs on the debian platform, you dont install it on another operating system like windows, its a full install in itself
07:08 AM gloops: i.e you want a seperate hard drive or partition for it
07:10 AM myil: oh
07:10 AM myil: for windows people can't able to install linux cnc
07:11 AM gloops: you can run it live from a usb, for trial purposes, to have a look at it and play with it
07:11 AM gloops: doesnt save any settings though
07:11 AM myil: many of my friends using cnc software but its costly
07:11 AM gloops: mach3/4?
07:12 AM myil: in my area so many people doing business related so i plan to promate linuxcnc
07:12 AM gloops: well, very easy to install and set up, just needs a hard drive
07:12 AM myil: if i get knowledge about it then only able to serve others
07:14 AM miss0r: wooo! My toughbook just got dropped off by UPS
07:22 AM unterhausen: you can set up a flash drive to run linux and save changes
07:38 AM jthornton: what's the difference between SCR and TRIAC in a solid state relay?
07:43 AM pcw_home: I dont think theres much practical difference (2 SCRs are needed VS 1 TRIAC)
07:44 AM jthornton: I noticed that automation direct offers both for each current range so was wondering
07:48 AM pcw_home: SCRs do go up to higher current and I think in general are a little better electrically
07:48 AM jthornton: thanks
07:48 AM jthornton: making an auto start for my dust collector
07:49 AM pcw_home: auto?
07:49 AM miss0r: I wonder if I can use an OA/OEM product key for windows 7 to install a windows 7 iso, I just find online
07:49 AM jthornton: yea when the saw is on a current sensor switch will turn on the dust collector
07:50 AM jthornton: https://www.automationdirect.com/adc/Shopping/Catalog/Sensors_-z-_Encoders/Current_-a-_Voltage_Sensors_(AC_-a-_DC)/Current_Switches_-a-_Indicators/Single_Range_AC_Current_Operated_Switches/ACSN100-AE-F
07:50 AM pcw_home: Ahh, somehow I was thinking dust detector
07:51 AM SpeedEvil is now known as Guest943
07:57 AM Tom_L: jthornton, lower right corner is what i used to control my toaster oven: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/toaster_oven/control_sch.png
07:58 AM Tom_L: since it's an inductive load, yours may need some modification
08:02 AM Tom_L: a pic of the board is in that same folder
08:24 AM Loetmichel: miss0r: just came close to finish the Projector enclosure... few hickups to correct, then make two, paint them and hopefully pass the EMI test: -> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=17121&g2_imageViewsIndex=1
08:24 AM Loetmichel: had some "mind bending issues" while doing the power filter housing... _
08:25 AM Loetmichel: ... and the bottom mounting holes.
08:25 AM Loetmichel: all in 2d Coreldraw... ;)
08:25 AM miss0r: nice
08:41 AM flyback: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uWTUxqqkBl8
09:00 AM gloops: ive not had corel draw for 15 years or more
09:00 AM gloops: i like the concept of sketchup now ive tried it - basic drawing with loads of different scripts/plugins
09:01 AM Loetmichel: gloops: corelDraw 8 to top it off ;)
09:05 AM sety: Sketchup is good.
09:06 AM sety: Very good AI.
09:07 AM gloops: ive only had it a few days but the idea is great, it kinda puts the purpose out to the market
09:07 AM gloops: scripters making apps for various tasks, if people want em the scripter might make a few quid, if not they dont
09:08 AM gloops: i dont mind paying £10 one off for a tool that does something specific straight off
09:08 AM BitEvil is now known as SpeedEvil
09:59 AM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
10:17 AM jthornton: Tom_L: I just need to sense that current is flowing so the $28 device from AD will be good and simple
10:18 AM jthornton: is that for temperature control?
10:19 AM * jthornton goes back to looking for the box with the rest of the faucet bits in it...
10:25 AM IchGucksLive: hi all
10:25 AM IchGucksLive: gloops, ?
10:29 AM IchGucksLive: jthornton, what you using the Amp sensor for
10:30 AM IchGucksLive: Loetmichel, we are very old as we use corel8
10:34 AM IchGucksLive: im off till later
11:20 AM ktc is now known as Guest12609
12:02 PM IchGucksLive: hi
12:08 PM IchGucksLive: its cold outside but BBQ is on and we expect lots of peopple tonmight for the first summer event at
12:08 PM IchGucksLive: temp below 5 deg expected so keep snow cloth in reatch
12:09 PM IchGucksLive: im off BYE
12:09 PM Loetmichel: cold?
12:09 PM Loetmichel: here its 17.5°C outside...
12:09 PM IchGucksLive: tonight
12:10 PM IchGucksLive: im off
12:18 PM seb_kuzm1nsky is now known as seb_kuzminsky
01:13 PM Tom_L: jthornton, that circuit was for the heating elements and the temp was regulted with an avr using a PT100 sensor
01:20 PM jthornton: ah
01:48 PM gloops: well thats enough cad learning for one day
01:48 PM gloops: you can do too much
01:52 PM gloops: the brain/memory works by repeating things
01:52 PM gloops: synpatic networks grow stronger when something is run through them regularly
01:53 PM gloops: so youre actually better off doing the same thing over and over for a week or two, than trying to blitz a whole load of information in one session - youll just forget most of it again
02:34 PM miss0r: hazzy: you still around?
02:34 PM * fragalot looks around
02:37 PM hazzy-lab: miss0r: yes
02:39 PM fragalot: found him!
02:39 PM * fragalot is eagle eyes malone
02:42 PM Tom_L: lcvette how's the mill coming along?
02:43 PM lcvette: good
02:43 PM Tom_L: cuttin parts yet?
02:43 PM lcvette: just finished the home and loimit switches getting them wired
02:43 PM lcvette: not yet but getting closer
02:43 PM Tom_L: they didn't have those wired when you got it?
02:43 PM lcvette: im trying to figure out how to configure the limit switches right now
02:44 PM lcvette: they usually don't send machines with home or limits
02:44 PM lcvette: they generally use only absolute encoders
02:44 PM lcvette: with no physical home or limits
02:44 PM lcvette: so what they sent was kind of half ass add on
02:44 PM lcvette: was not very good
02:44 PM lcvette: so i opted to remove and redo myself
02:45 PM gloops: got them working then?
02:46 PM lcvette: literally just finished getting them wired to the mesa board and powered on the machine
02:46 PM lcvette: have not yet configured anything in hal
02:46 PM Tom_L: gloops what cad are you working on?
02:46 PM Tom_L: lcvette still have enough IO for it all?
02:46 PM lcvette: oh yeah, plenty
02:47 PM lcvette: with more to spare
02:47 PM lcvette: lol
02:47 PM Tom_L: you had 34 to start with
02:47 PM Tom_L: unless you added a sserial card
02:47 PM Tom_L: are you making a file with all your wiring connections to linuxcnc?
02:48 PM gloops: Tom-L various, blender, sketchup recently, seem to end up switching between quite a few for different jobs, then the messing about importing from one to another
02:48 PM lcvette: i have a schematic
02:48 PM Tom_L: i made an IO map shoing wire colors, what they go to etc
02:49 PM Tom_L: it's helpful when you need to change or add something in the software later
02:50 PM lcvette: Tom_L: just emailed you my schematic
02:51 PM Tom_L: not here yet
02:53 PM Tom_L: what did you use to make that?
02:53 PM Tom_L: nice n neat
02:54 PM lcvette: excel and draftsight to run the lines
02:55 PM lcvette: imported the spreadsheet, then ran the lines like a regular drawing
02:55 PM lcvette: allowed me to use layer for the lines
02:55 PM Tom_L: i think catia would do that but i've never used that part of it
02:56 PM lcvette: i cut my teeth on autocad in the late 80's and early 90's
02:56 PM Tom_L: i despise acad
02:56 PM lcvette: draftsight is pretty much like old autocad
02:56 PM Tom_L: i've used it some
02:56 PM lcvette: but free
02:56 PM lcvette: lol
02:56 PM Tom_L: i've got it on floppies, is that old enough?
02:57 PM lcvette: same here
02:57 PM lcvette: hahahahaha
02:57 PM lcvette: student edition from college years
02:57 PM Tom_L: i've got 2017? 18? student ver here somewhere
02:57 PM lcvette: probably took 12 years to pay off in student loans
02:58 PM lcvette: from way back then
02:58 PM lcvette: shaking my head
02:58 PM Tom_L: it got you here
02:58 PM lcvette: yeah
02:58 PM lcvette: can't compalin
03:00 PM Tom_L: relay ka2 has no field wire
03:01 PM Tom_L: maybe it doesn't need it
03:01 PM lcvette: good eye
03:02 PM lcvette: it needs it, must have deleted it or missed it
03:04 PM lcvette: im looking in the wiki and i don't see a configuration for how i did my home and limits
03:04 PM lcvette: I have a seperate home switch and Limit switch for each axis
03:04 PM Tom_L: http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Homing_And_Limit_Switch
03:05 PM lcvette: but only one limit switch
03:05 PM lcvette: ie no min/max limit signal
03:05 PM lcvette: just a limit signal for extents of travel
03:05 PM Tom_L: i do that on one of my axis and use a soft limit on the other end
03:06 PM lcvette: im there but there isn't a config that matches
03:06 PM Tom_L: separate inputs?
03:06 PM lcvette: its on the schematic
03:06 PM lcvette: lol
03:07 PM lcvette: the limit switch is stationary and there are trigger tabs that activate it at travel extents in each direction
03:08 PM lcvette: so it won't know if its limit + or Limit -
03:08 PM gregcnc: no problem
03:08 PM lcvette: which i don't car about as long as it stops motion
03:09 PM Tom_L: yeah that won't matter
03:10 PM lcvette: so how would that look in the hal?
03:11 PM lcvette: # --- MAX-Y --- net max-y <= hm2_7i92.0.7i77.0.0.input-05
03:11 PM gregcnc: the min and max limit are set to the same pin if I've used the correct terms
03:11 PM Tom_L: are the home switches wired separate from the limits?
03:11 PM lcvette: yes
03:11 PM Tom_L: in the ini you'd give it a home direction and use a soft limit for the other end i believe
03:11 PM lcvette: i have 3 home switches and 3 limit switches
03:12 PM lcvette: all have seperate inputs on the 7i77
03:12 PM lcvette: but the other end has a limit trigger
03:12 PM Tom_L: fwiw, i triggered the swithces with my finger the first time to make sure it was what i expected
03:13 PM Tom_L: and set the soft limit short of what i wanted until i was satisfied it all worked
03:13 PM lcvette: the limit switch will trigger on both ends
03:13 PM gloops: you can wire all the limit switches to one pin
03:14 PM Tom_L: yeah, you just won't know which limit triggered it when you get an error is all
03:14 PM gloops: if its normally open - doesnt matter where a switch is hit - its full stop
03:14 PM lcvette: they are already wired seperately
03:15 PM gregcnc: if you trip a limit it will be up to you to look at machine coordinates G53 and figure out which way to go
03:15 PM lcvette: hang on maybe im not explaining myself properly
03:15 PM lcvette: i'll make a video
03:15 PM Tom_L: no i get what you did
03:15 PM Tom_L: 6 switches, 3 limit, 3 home shared by each end of the travel
03:16 PM Tom_L: so 6 hal input pins
03:16 PM Tom_L: is that correct?
03:17 PM lcvette: correct
03:17 PM lcvette: home switches trigger before limits
03:18 PM Tom_L: net Z-home parport.0.pin-12-in-not => axis.2.home-sw-in
03:18 PM lcvette: the limit switch will trigger at the ends of travel in both directions
03:18 PM Tom_L: net Z-limit axis.2.neg-lim-sw-in
03:19 PM Tom_L: woops i deleted too much there
03:19 PM Tom_L: net Z-limit parport.0.pin-13-in-not => axis.2.neg-lim-sw-in
03:19 PM Tom_L: something like that
03:20 PM lcvette: oooh is it ok to share the min/max pin number?
03:20 PM gregcnc: yes
03:20 PM Tom_L: just depends what you need/want
03:20 PM lcvette: its currently setup already for home max min
03:20 PM lcvette: so if it will allow the same pin for min and max thats the easiest fix
03:21 PM lcvette: Gregcnc thanks
03:22 PM lcvette: sorry missed your earlier comments
03:22 PM gregcnc: my setup is slightly different than what you need as I home on the limit, otherwise i'd post it
03:22 PM Tom_L: gregcnc, that won't generate an error if you set a soft limit on one end?
03:22 PM Tom_L: so do i
03:22 PM gregcnc: soft limits should be inside switches
03:22 PM Tom_L: and i add an offset after it homes
03:23 PM lcvette: i will have soft lmits on both ends
03:23 PM gregcnc: it will be fine
03:23 PM gloops: ive only got one switch per axis, doesnt matter that much as my motors arent strong enough to damage anything mechanically
03:24 PM gloops: just lost steps
03:24 PM Tom_L: [AXIS_0]
03:24 PM Tom_L: HOME_OFFSET = 0.10
03:24 PM Tom_L: after mine homes, it moves .1 in from the switch
03:24 PM Tom_L: as a soft limit
03:24 PM gregcnc: right you must have and offset
03:24 PM Tom_L: then i set another limit for the far end
03:25 PM gregcnc: it has to be done that way
03:25 PM gloops: yeah same here
03:25 PM Tom_L: MIN_LIMIT = -17.750
03:25 PM Tom_L: MAX_LIMIT = .10
03:25 PM gloops: i never work from actual home anyway
03:25 PM Tom_L: me either, i use work offsets
03:25 PM gregcnc: you never do it's for the control
03:25 PM Tom_L: some guys do
03:26 PM Tom_L: i don't like to do it that way
03:26 PM gregcnc: sure, but mainly it's so the control knows about itself
03:26 PM Tom_L: absolutely
03:27 PM Tom_L: lcvette, you set a HOME_SEARCH_VEL as well so it won't go full blast while homing
03:27 PM Tom_L: and HOME_LATCH_VEL after it finds home and backs off to the soft limit
03:28 PM Tom_L: which will be inverted
03:28 PM Tom_L: from the home velocity
03:28 PM Tom_L: HOME_LATCH_VEL = -0.20
03:28 PM MrHindsight: http://www.3ders.org/articles/20180611-cytosurges-fluidfm-3dprinter-upgrade-enables-metal-3d-printing-on-existing-structures.html
03:29 PM MrHindsight: no few micron Yodas yet
03:29 PM MrHindsight is now known as CaptHindsight
03:29 PM * Tom_L gives Mr a Capn hat
03:30 PM lcvette: yes.. need to go through all that still
03:31 PM Tom_L: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/cnc/configs/NEW_MILL/
03:31 PM Tom_L: all my config for a stepper system using shared home/limit switches
03:31 PM lcvette: at the moment im fixing the switche hal code then i need to fix some settings in the drives for my 5mm lead screws and get the movements correct in linuxcnc and on the machine
03:31 PM lcvette: then i will come back to the homing
03:32 PM lcvette: when the scaling is correct
03:33 PM Tom_L: mine are 5mm screws and i'm using inch if that helps any
03:33 PM lcvette: yes but my drive settings for the gear ration are off, they are programmed for 6mm screws
03:34 PM lcvette: so the pulse increment is off between linuxcnc and the drive
03:35 PM lcvette: gregcnc... getting a debug error on using two inputs the same
03:37 PM Tom_L: http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.7/html/config/ini-config.html
03:37 PM Tom_L: near the bottom has some switch settings
03:37 PM Tom_L: under Homing
03:38 PM lcvette: going to look
03:38 PM Tom_L: http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.7/html/config/ini-homing.html#cha:homing-configuration
03:39 PM Tom_L: i'm not exactly sure which one to use in your case
03:40 PM gregcnc: ini sets values
03:40 PM gregcnc: hal needs ot be configured
03:40 PM Tom_L: right
03:40 PM lcvette: hal is what i configured
03:41 PM Tom_L: those are the physical connections
03:41 PM Tom_L: the ini tells it what to do with them
03:42 PM gregcnc: net both-home-x <= parport.0.pin-12-in-not
03:42 PM gregcnc: net both-home-x => axis.0.neg-lim-sw-in
03:42 PM gregcnc: net both-home-x => axis.0.pos-lim-sw-in
03:43 PM Tom_L: that would probably need to be condensed to one line though wouldn't it?
03:43 PM gregcnc: that's in my hal, I have another "=>" line to add homing
03:43 PM gregcnc: no
03:43 PM lcvette: https://pastebin.com/jSjHvvcz
03:44 PM Tom_L: i didn't know whether repeating the net name would flag an error
03:44 PM pcw_mesa: just a style thing
03:46 PM Tom_L: lcvette you also need to connect them to an axis signal like greg showed you
03:47 PM gregcnc: that's in there
03:47 PM Tom_L: i didn't read the whole thing :)
03:48 PM lcvette: im looking in my ini
03:48 PM pcw_mesa: the one pin per line style is good when you need so separate the statements either for readability or because the hal code is divided into separate files
03:48 PM pcw_mesa: need to
03:49 PM Roguish: the " => " are for reading clarity only... does not get read.
03:50 PM Tom_L: i personally would combine the pin to the axis.0 signal and save a few net names for clarity
03:51 PM Tom_L: ymmv
03:51 PM lcvette: over my head
03:51 PM Tom_L: no it isn't
03:51 PM Tom_L: just a sec
03:51 PM lcvette: eyes are glazed over
03:52 PM gregcnc: change min-z or max-z to limit-z in all instances
03:53 PM lcvette: i was about to ask if that is ok to do
03:53 PM Tom_L: net min-z <= hm2_7i92.0.7i77.0.0.input-05-not
03:53 PM Tom_L: net min-z => axis.2.neg-lim-sw-in
03:53 PM Tom_L: net min-z axis.2.neg-lim-sw-in <= hm2_7i92.0.7i77.0.0.input-05-not
03:53 PM lcvette: can i just eliminate the min max for a single limit
03:54 PM Tom_L: like pcw said though, it's just style
04:00 PM lcvette: https://pastebin.com/wUcyVGhP
04:00 PM lcvette: like this?
04:03 PM lcvette: that allowed it to load
04:05 PM Roguish: lcvette: if it doesn't error on startup, it's most probably ok. you should check it with halshow anyway, just to be sure...
04:06 PM lcvette: getting ready to try that now
04:07 PM lcvette: Tom_L: i think i understand what you are saying, i am affraid to move away from the style that is here because of shared information between my buddy and the quest to figure out the index homing situation
04:07 PM lcvette: so if this will work it is as close to what he is running as possible
04:07 PM lcvette: homing remains the same actually
04:08 PM lcvette: but I have copied your recommendation to send to him
04:08 PM lcvette: perhaps its something that will prove helpful for the quest for index homing
04:08 PM Roguish: lcvette: definitely a good idea to keep your files neat and organized.
04:09 PM Tom_L: if it works, don't fix it
04:23 PM Deejay: gn8
04:23 PM gloops: Wetherspoons boss bans EU drinks - ours are superior lol https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/973847/Brexit-news-Wetherspoons-EU-booze-ban-customs-union-champagne-prosecco-latest-Tim-Martin
04:23 PM gloops: thats the spirit!
04:25 PM CaptHindsight: spirit, drink, get it? ha
04:25 PM gloops: no pun intended
04:26 PM gloops: brexit is getting down to the nitty gritty now
04:27 PM gloops: half the shadow cabinet resigned tonight, the SNP walked out of parliament earlier
04:27 PM XXCoder: shadow cabinet sounds evil :P
04:27 PM gloops: yes some would call it the dark side
04:31 PM miss0r: gloops: Hows those overview pictures of the mill & control box comming along? If I didn't know better, I'd start to think you were never planing on taking em
04:32 PM lcvette: ok, i just tested to see if the home and limit switches show in halmeter and they do
04:32 PM lcvette: so that seems to be good right?
04:32 PM gloops: i thought youd got the general idea from the pic of the gantry i posted miss0r
04:32 PM miss0r: gloops: Hardly an overview picture ;) I'd just like to marvel at the whole thing. You know - I somewhat feel part of that project :D
04:33 PM gloops: lcvette you dont have to crash through the switches to test them - just trigger them by hand
04:33 PM lcvette: im just easing into them jogging at turtle pace
04:33 PM gloops: you were part of it miss0r, your advice was key to making it work
04:34 PM gloops: ive told a lot of people to come here, from facebook, to see the real experts
04:35 PM CaptHindsight: https://postimg.cc/image/ysj897bnh/ found this, but its 4:3 for the monitor
04:35 PM gloops: for some reason the mach3 gurus dont seem to know half as much about cnc as linuxcnc people
04:36 PM CaptHindsight: https://postimg.cc/image/9mia2mpvh/
04:37 PM miss0r: gloops: mach3 people rarely 'get their hands dirty' :)
04:38 PM CaptHindsight: mach3 lost steps and hit the table (lower left corner) https://postimg.cc/image/egk0ujegr/
04:41 PM CaptHindsight: http://www.firepick.org/ anyone ever play with this?
04:41 PM CaptHindsight: http://www.firepick.org/principle/
04:42 PM miss0r: CaptHindsight: damn.. sad happending with that mill table
04:43 PM CaptHindsight: after 30 years of not a single hit
04:43 PM miss0r: yeah...
04:43 PM CaptHindsight: oh well LCNC and a new spindle later
04:44 PM miss0r: I broke the tip of my haimer 3D taster a few weeks back
04:44 PM miss0r: I never thought that would happen
04:44 PM miss0r: But I was distracted, and I NEVER get distracted
04:44 PM CaptHindsight: firepick is still open loop?!
04:45 PM CaptHindsight: well sort of since the camera closes the loop if done properly
04:46 PM CaptHindsight: at least they used OpenCV for that
04:54 PM CaptHindsight: well NO SHIT: NOTE: FIREPICK IS CURRENTLY INACTIVE. WE CURRENTLY RECOMMEND THAT YOU USE A CARTESIAN PNP. DESPITE MUCH WORK AND EFFORT TO MAKE FPD WORK AS DESIGNED WE FOUND THAT THE ACCURACY AND SPEED OF COMMERCIAL ROTATIONAL DELTAS HAVE PROVEN ELUSIVE IN A DIY MAKER CONTEXT.
04:54 PM CaptHindsight: could have just asked us in here
04:55 PM CaptHindsight: http://www.firepick.org/mailinglist/
05:02 PM Tom_L: aka: we don't know wtf we're doing so we give up
05:06 PM Tom_L: damn i wish i had a spindle motor. got a couple weeks to myself and no good project to spend it on
05:07 PM lcvette: Tom, what type of spindle motor?
05:07 PM Tom_L: well i'm currently using my old sherline spindle on the new mill but it's way underpowered
05:08 PM Tom_L: don't want a chinaco hss but can't decide which way to go
05:08 PM lcvette: so you need like a 3phase 1.5hp?
05:08 PM Tom_L: single phase preferrably run off mains
05:09 PM lcvette: no vfd?
05:09 PM Tom_L: wouldn't matter, i'm up in the air which way to go
05:09 PM lcvette: definitely go 3 phase
05:09 PM lcvette: with vfd
05:09 PM Tom_L: considered a servo setup of some kind
05:09 PM lcvette: no
05:09 PM lcvette: this is an area i can certain return the help favor
05:10 PM lcvette: ive tried every spindle motor setup known to man
05:10 PM lcvette: on my G0704
05:10 PM Tom_L: i considered using the current spindle since i've got holders for it rather than getting something that requires new tool holders
05:10 PM lcvette: DC, BLDC, Servo, Single phase static rpm, and 3ph vfd
05:11 PM Tom_L: BLDC is the way to go imo
05:11 PM lcvette: no way
05:11 PM Tom_L: why?
05:11 PM lcvette: weak
05:11 PM Tom_L: on the low end?
05:11 PM lcvette: compared to a 1000:1ct 3ph motor
05:11 PM Tom_L: i want overall torque
05:11 PM lcvette: then the 3ph motor is what you want
05:11 PM Tom_L: not a bazillion rpm spindle head
05:11 PM lcvette: hands down
05:12 PM lcvette: im talking about a reghular 3ph motor
05:12 PM lcvette: that runs a belt
05:12 PM Tom_L: i'm running a timing belt on it currently
05:13 PM lcvette: good for 0rpm - 7200rpm
05:13 PM lcvette: with a vfd and 1:2 belt ratio
05:13 PM Tom_L: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/cnc/Mill_Steel/Assembly/Final/Vise_parts/table_slot3.jpg
05:13 PM Tom_L: just extending that slot with a .250" cutter made the motor too hot to touch
05:14 PM lcvette: you can run the motor im talking about all day and all night with no problem
05:14 PM lcvette: its max rpm will be 3600
05:14 PM Tom_L: i'd like something i can analog control
05:14 PM Tom_L: 0-10v preferrably
05:14 PM lcvette: vfd is 0-10v
05:15 PM Tom_L: over +10 -10
05:15 PM lcvette: with fwd and reverse
05:15 PM Tom_L: got a link to it?
05:15 PM Tom_L: finance dept may buck a bit
05:16 PM Tom_L: right now the spindle tops out around 5k rpm
05:16 PM Tom_L: maybe 5500
05:17 PM Tom_L: at 7200 i'd consider going 1:1 on the pulleys
05:27 PM CaptHindsight: if you plan on cutting steel then you really want a gearbox and or motor with some low end torque
05:28 PM Tom_L: not planning on but could happen to a minor extent
05:29 PM CaptHindsight: every Chinese spindle I saw on ebay either had no torque curve or had none below 5-6K rpm
05:29 PM CaptHindsight: mystery motors
05:30 PM CaptHindsight: Tom_L: for the time being wind some copper tube around it and water cool what you have
05:31 PM Tom_L: yeah it's hard to find anything with low end torque
05:38 PM CaptHindsight: https://youtu.be/P6LrTAQyvb0?t=7m14s
05:38 PM CaptHindsight: hydroforming copper tubing by hand
05:39 PM Tom_L: freeze it full of water?
05:39 PM CaptHindsight: room temp water
05:39 PM CaptHindsight: just need to seal the ends well
05:39 PM Tom_L: yeah
05:40 PM CaptHindsight: or machine an aluminum heat block with water channels and use DI water
05:42 PM Tom_L: or antifreze
05:43 PM CaptHindsight: RV type with the propylene glycol vs ethylene
06:12 PM JT-Shop: yea I made $200 in one hour today... to bad I only worked 1 hour
06:13 PM Tom_L: better than a poke in the eye with a sharp stick
06:13 PM JT-Shop: yea, I agree
06:14 PM gloops: you cant beat these little jobs heh
06:15 PM JT-Shop: I'm up to sanding the sheetrock down some and hanging drywall above the surround... might get to use the shower before I turn 65
06:15 PM gloops: i hear americans dont skim their plasterboard - i.e no wet plaster
06:15 PM JT-Shop: yea all I had to do was email two prints to my buddy two towns over and wait for him to make the parts then run and pick them up
06:16 PM JT-Shop: I spray plaster on then knock it down leaves a lumpy finish
06:16 PM JT-Shop: sorta textured
06:16 PM Tom_L: that flat texture look?
06:16 PM gloops: would be frowned on here lol
06:16 PM JT-Shop: they call it knock down
06:17 PM Tom_L: i thought they did that with a trowel
06:17 PM JT-Shop: yea flat texture
06:17 PM JT-Shop: 18" knock down knife
06:17 PM Tom_L: yeah
06:17 PM gloops: i worked with an aussie who had moved here, he was totally baffled by the plaster sold here, had no idea what to do with it
06:17 PM JT-Shop: with a long handle for the ceiling
06:18 PM JT-Shop: don't they use kangaroo dung for plaster there?
06:19 PM gloops: well, he said their plaster was really easy to use, just sorta went flat with very little effort
06:20 PM gloops: probably wasnt a plasterer as he claimed i dont think
06:22 PM JT-Shop: I've found that less is better when it comes to plaster... I only put on how much I need to cover and blend the joints
06:22 PM Tom_L: yep, alot less to sand off
06:22 PM JT-Shop: could be like people in Ripley county if they saw it done once they are experts lol
06:22 PM Tom_L: i generally do 2-3 light coats
06:22 PM JT-Shop: aye
06:23 PM Tom_L: but don't tell anybody. i don't know how to do plaster...
06:23 PM Tom_L: one of my least favorite jobs
06:24 PM CaptHindsight: call the tapers
06:24 PM gloops: dont need to sand it, use thistle finish - put a couple of coats on, wait - timing is everything, until its just right, then 'pull it in' you get a finish like glass
06:27 PM JT-Shop: I feel the same way about concrete work
06:27 PM gloops: concrete is similar - you cant do anything with it while its too wet, not finish wise anyway
06:28 PM CaptHindsight: don't fall asleep in it
06:32 PM gloops: well, theyre the kind of skills that just get handed down in the trades, once theyre lost, its not easy to work again from scratch
06:33 PM gloops: not many DIYers work out how to plaster properly
06:35 PM JT-Shop: I can imagine trying to sort out a skill like that is impossible without a lot of time
06:35 PM JT-Shop: hmm, my 4" cyclone should be here Friday
06:36 PM JT-Shop: damn the DusKolector has some bad blow by for some reason
07:37 PM andypugh: Look on Youtube for “Ventian plaster”
07:37 PM andypugh: Or, even better, “Venetian Plaster”
07:41 PM andypugh: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marmorino
08:20 PM CaptHindsight: https://fthmb.tqn.com/mVglRHBtaaAPWFI7yLu0fbxh0vE=/768x0/filters:no_upscale():max_bytes(150000):strip_icc()/SistineChapel-57ffd66e5f9b5805c2ac4916.jpg
08:21 PM CaptHindsight: that's why you don't see this on ceilings today
08:43 PM aircooled is now known as hazzy-lab
11:28 PM Tom_L: https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/High-Speed-Bldc-Brushless-Motor-Spindle_1905913371.html?spm=a2700.7724857.main07.144.44a7f52bv4KL8E
11:28 PM Tom_L: hmm, possible spindle motor
11:32 PM RyanS: hmm my bf30 mill uses a 2.2kw BLDC
11:32 PM RyanS: same shape
11:32 PM Tom_L: no price
11:33 PM Tom_L: sketchy directions
11:33 PM Tom_L: top notch for china :)
11:33 PM RyanS: actually those are the same size. Aliexpress would have prices
11:35 PM Tom_L: looks like 6 models available
11:36 PM Tom_L: 750, 1100 and 2200w in 2 rpm ranges
11:38 PM Tom_L: i'm sure the electronics are meant to be in a case. just finding it is the trick
11:38 PM RyanS: https://tinyurl.com/yctg3vae
11:40 PM RyanS: why not a 3 phase AC with VFD?
11:41 PM Tom_L: finding one that's not 6 bazillion rpm is a trick
11:41 PM nallar is now known as Ross
11:41 PM Tom_L: i don't see the controller for that one you linked
11:42 PM RyanS: does BLDC have better low end torque
11:42 PM Tom_L: i'm no motor expert
11:42 PM Tom_L: i thought it did
11:42 PM RyanS: they have all sorts of controllers
11:44 PM Tom_L: that one linked is DC input
11:44 PM Tom_L: applications are scooter bike etc so it must have good low end torque
11:46 PM RyanS: https://tinyurl.com/yalnrq44 but this ones dc
11:47 PM Tom_L: most of those are for scooters etc
11:49 PM RyanS: im thinking of doing a redneck cnc lathe conversion, just steppers on the leadscrews and possibly BLDC or AC VFD motor
11:51 PM Tom_L: that one looks the most promising so far
11:51 PM Tom_L: i wonder what frame 123mm is
11:52 PM RyanS: http://www.leadshine.com/producttypes.aspx?type=products&category=dc-bldc-servos&producttype=brushless-dc-servo-drives ?
11:53 PM Tom_L: still gotta have a supply for them
11:53 PM Tom_L: that one was 110/220vac input
11:53 PM Kevin`: RyanS: both types of motors can be configured to have good starting torque but it's easier and more common with bldc - the controller *must* drive the motor with a phase offset, whereas induction motors are commonly driven at a fixed frequency
11:56 PM Tom_L: motor is 20 lbs
11:56 PM Tom_L: not sure what the sherline motor weighs
11:57 PM RyanS: although it's a bit impractical, I could just change the lathes speed with the manual gearbox
11:58 PM RyanS: I have a 24V, 155 watt wheelchair motor. any good for a toolpost grinder?
11:59 PM Tom_L: i considered looking for a treadmill motor