#linuxcnc Logs
May 18 2018
#linuxcnc Calendar
12:12 AM lcvette: pcw_home_: Thnak you for your wisdom on the pc! just got her up and running, i had the rtai usb laying around so i ran it live for fun to see what the latency would be..lol WOW.. 2825/3485 ridiculous that was running it with no changes straight from first fire up on a usb thumb drive
12:15 AM lcvette: much better already!
12:15 AM lcvette: now on to make a stretch preempt thumb drive to load
12:44 AM lcvette: thank you sir!
12:55 AM fragalot: Hey
12:57 AM gloops: http://www.fluiddesigner.co.uk/
12:57 AM gloops: didnt even know that existed
01:03 AM CaptHindsight: lcvette: most of the RTAI development in the past 6 years was done on APU's like yours, so those numbers are not surprising
01:04 AM lcvette: they are gratifying
01:04 AM lcvette: lol
01:04 AM fragalot: did you get new hardware then?
01:05 AM lcvette: yup
01:05 AM fragalot: what are you getting now?
01:05 AM lcvette: now im researching what to do about linuxcnc
01:05 AM lcvette: getting?
01:05 AM fragalot: latency wise
01:06 AM lcvette: 2825/3485
01:06 AM fragalot: tiny bit better than before then :P
01:06 AM lcvette: hahahaha just a smidge
01:07 AM lcvette: CaptHindsight: are you running preempt rt with a ethernet mesa card?
01:08 AM CaptHindsight: The Mesa Ethernet driver is preempt_rt only, no RTAI
01:09 AM lcvette: correct
01:09 AM lcvette: im just curious what version of linuxcnc people are running who are running the preempt rt kernal
01:10 AM lcvette: i was running the debian preempt rt stretch test before
01:10 AM CaptHindsight: preempt_rt latency jitter does vary from kernel to kernel version
01:10 AM lcvette: but others were saying they ran other versions
01:11 AM CaptHindsight: not sure if anyone keeps track of which versions are better than others
01:11 AM lcvette: just curious what the consensus is on what people like about the version they are running
01:12 AM lcvette: im also wondering if perhaps i failed to update or load everything i needed to load on my install
01:13 AM lcvette: and maybe thats whay i was having problems
01:13 AM lcvette: maybe dependency issues
01:13 AM lcvette: at least im reading about things of that nature that sounded similar
01:14 AM RyanS: looking for some recommendations. Plasma Z axis, round linear rails, vs Hiwin profile rails, leadscrew or ballscrew designs. is there anything wrong with this round rail+acme screw design for this purpose eg: http://www.veloxcncrouters.com/xz-za-series
01:16 AM CaptHindsight: RyanS: just dirt getting into things if it's not covered
01:17 AM lcvette: for plasma, i'd say round would be fine
01:17 AM CaptHindsight: plasma is non contact so things don't have to be as rigid as whats required for cutting tools
01:17 AM lcvette: agreed
01:17 AM fragalot: Z backlash is typically also less of an issue
01:18 AM gloops: could maybe fix up some gator on the screw if need be
01:18 AM lcvette: either ballscrew or lead screw would be good but make sure the lead is fast enough to keep up with the adjustment required for any torch height control you may be using
01:19 AM gloops: like motorcycle forks
01:19 AM lcvette: ie don't use a fine thread lead screw
01:19 AM RyanS: ok but what I understand about plasma is, plate stock is never going to be that flat and torch height is critical for cut quality
01:20 AM gloops: 10mm pitch then
01:20 AM fragalot: it is critical, but not 0.01mm critical like a mill would be
01:20 AM lcvette: it will till be very accurate
01:21 AM lcvette: 5mm lead with a 200 step per rev motor will give you .025mm per step resolution in full step mode
01:22 AM RyanS: ..so I would have thought less friction with profile +ballscrew for quick reaction? or is the fact that leadscrew only 40% efficient not much of a big deal?
01:22 AM lcvette: or .00098"
01:22 AM fragalot: RyanS: given the low forces, negligible gains.
01:23 AM lcvette: for the z axis it isn't going to be doing alot of travel
01:24 AM lcvette: for x and y you want probably something other than screws
01:24 AM lcvette: belt or rack and pinion
01:24 AM CaptHindsight: plus you're making one machine, not designing for manufacture
01:24 AM CaptHindsight: so we'll let you slide a bit :)
01:24 AM fragalot: lcvette: so for Z what he wants is a pair of height adjustable skates? :P
01:25 AM gloops: as you arent plunging the backlash in a leadscrew shouldnt be a problem, gravity will keep it on the bottom
01:26 AM RyanS: it's tempting just to buy the velox z axis and call it a day, but not very satisfying considering I have a mill and lathe to make the parts
01:27 AM lcvette: fragalot: z axis on a plasma table is the least travling axis on the machine, when cutting it generally will deviate less then 1/8" or 3mm unless you're cutting something really warped or maybe something oddly bent
01:28 AM fragalot: lcvette: Indeed.
01:28 AM lcvette: ryan
01:28 AM lcvette: another alternative is to use v groove bearings
01:28 AM lcvette: thats what i used
01:28 AM lcvette: keeps things nice and flat
01:29 AM lcvette: easy and inexpensive
01:34 AM RyanS: yeah, I've looked at this floating head mechanism, it's a nice solution but I can't work out how the two sets of bearings are connected to the leadnut to still allow the bottom ones to move independently enough to hit the micro switch https://youtu.be/DEc5YQFjN1A?t=44
01:36 AM RyanS: shoulder bolts mounted in slots perhaps
01:40 AM gloops: well i think my artistic mental blockage is easing up
01:40 AM gloops: ideas are starting to flow again, this was always happening to Picasso
01:41 AM gloops: nothing for 6 months then 3 paintings in one day
01:42 AM RyanS: thinking of a career in cubist painting? :-)
01:42 AM gloops: not really, just trying to get some simple designs together
01:43 AM lcvette: RyanS: the two sets of bearings are independent on two planes like you imagined, and spring loaded against tow pins
01:43 AM lcvette: so when the torch nozzle hits the work piece the screw drives the second plate down triggering the seroing switch
01:45 AM RyanS: so the leadscrew nut is attached to the top or bottom set of bearings?
01:46 AM lcvette: top
01:47 AM lcvette: bottom set of bearings, faceplate and torch are spring loaded against the top bearing plate
01:47 AM RyanS: ah yeah I can see the bolts for the nut
01:49 AM RyanS: doesn't that introduce backlash or some 'springiness ' when the screw is driven?
01:49 AM lcvette: against what?
01:51 AM lcvette: the only load it ever sees it when it touches off
01:51 AM RyanS: because plasma is non-contact, thats impossible?
01:52 AM lcvette: that was some pretty stout spring tension from what i saw
01:52 AM lcvette: its like worrying that your going to fall into outer space
01:52 AM lcvette: i think your trying to find problems where non exist
01:53 AM RyanS: haha. so if I want a pneumatic plate marker too, would I need to lock the bearing sets together?
01:54 AM lcvette: what are you trying to make here?
01:54 AM lcvette: one machine or an all in one machine?
01:55 AM RyanS: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EPgbngKA0qQ
01:56 AM RyanS: actually that seems to be fixed to the gantry carriage
02:45 AM Deejay: moin
02:53 AM MarcelineVQ: first test cut on cnc lathe, stepover speeds were a little high, had to turn down feed manually, but success!
02:55 AM gloops: excellent, video to follow?
02:55 AM MarcelineVQ: it's a bit of an embarassing cobble compared to most people stuff but I'll try to take some shots
02:56 AM MarcelineVQ: First test cut was a wooden beer bottle
02:56 AM gloops: lol MarcelineVQ, nobody cobbles better than me!
02:56 AM gloops: but no pressure, was just interested, i dont post many pics
02:57 AM MarcelineVQ: It would have been good to take a vid of its first run but I had my fingers on the stop buttons the whole time
02:58 AM MarcelineVQ: lesson learned on that one, more stock material is better
02:58 AM gloops: i think ive got a first product, very simple, probably wont sell as vastly saturated market already, but nevertheless, the machine has made shop quality items
03:01 AM gloops: whats the distance between centres MarcelineVQ?
03:01 AM MarcelineVQ: up to 28 with the current setup
03:01 AM MarcelineVQ: x travel is fairly limited though, 2.8 inches or so
03:02 AM gloops: 28 inch? thats table leg size
03:02 AM MarcelineVQ: yeah, I've cobbled this together to make obstacles for horseback riding
03:03 AM renesis: heh cool
03:03 AM MarcelineVQ: And as experience for the next machine
03:04 AM gloops: so 2.8 inch x travel, is that from the centre? if so youre looking at 5 inch stock maybe
03:04 AM MarcelineVQ: yeah 2.8 radius
03:04 AM MarcelineVQ: mostly I'm aiming to be working with 4x4's which are around 5 inch dia
03:05 AM gloops: thats ok for spindles, how long do you reckon youd be talking to turn a contoured spindle 28 inch
03:06 AM MarcelineVQ: I'm not sure, will have to be part of testing to find out. the longer part is turning the square stock down to round stock since the interrupted cuts are hard on the machine, after that you can turn the spindle up to lessen the chip load
03:06 AM gloops: i know when i put a 4x4 in the manual lathe it gets a bit scary when the speed is up lol, only got mt1 tapers
03:06 AM MarcelineVQ: these tapers are mt2 iirc
03:07 AM gloops: yeah rounding the stock off is the snag, bandsaw is useful, if you have a jig knocked up to take the corners off
03:07 AM gloops: saves some time
03:08 AM MarcelineVQ: what I'd like to do is get some green wood and cut it down to rounds, green cuts really really nice, with the caveat that it has to shrink which can cause cracking so you need to oversize
03:09 AM MarcelineVQ: one could make a stock of roundstock fairly quickly that way, not production fast, but fast enough
03:09 AM MarcelineVQ: you could buy round posts if you're lazy but they're so full of cracks there's not much wood left by the time you get to good wood
03:09 AM gloops: yeah a lot of chair parts were turned green here in the old days, then stored to dry, before finishing dress up
03:10 AM gloops: it goes oval when drying
03:10 AM MarcelineVQ: yeah depends on the peice and the stacking/storing
03:10 AM MarcelineVQ: wood is whacky stuff
03:10 AM MarcelineVQ: yellow cedar is abundant around here so I'd like to learn how to work it because that wood lasts forever
03:10 AM gloops: they used cleft/split wood which helps a lot, dont suppose anybody is going to go to that trouble now
03:11 AM RyanS: anything wrong with turning dry wood, is it more difficult?
03:11 AM gloops: cedar is frightfully expensive here
03:11 AM MarcelineVQ: it's just harder, and the chips are more prone to tear out than cut out
03:11 AM MarcelineVQ: you can get like, plastic chips when cutting green wood, those stringers
03:12 AM gloops: yeah it just streams off
03:12 AM gloops: maybe experiment with tooling, i dont have much trouble with pine on manual lathe, you can gauge it better by hand though, adjust tool angle etc if it doesnt feel right, until you feel it cutting nice
03:12 AM MarcelineVQ: cedar is cheaper than non-cedar around here if you're buying from a mill, the right mill anyway
03:14 AM gloops: i wish i could find some cheap cedar it would be ideal for outdoor signs, its around the same or more than oak here
03:14 AM RyanS: hmm they say Australia has nice timbers but I don't know not many places near me sell it. I made something from blackheart sassafras which looks interesting
03:15 AM MarcelineVQ: e.g. red or yellow 4x4 cedar is $2.20 per lineal foot at the local mill, green wood
03:15 AM MarcelineVQ: fir is 2.25
03:15 AM gloops: pff try adding a 0
03:15 AM MarcelineVQ: well it grows here :>
03:16 AM RyanS: get some ebony
03:16 AM gloops: RyanS i dont think we get much timber from Aus, could be wrong though, all ours seems to come from the north
03:16 AM RyanS: or ligum vitae, lol
03:17 AM MarcelineVQ: 3"x4"x10' is $1 per lineal foot on special currently, that's too small for the things I'm making, but it's pretty cool
03:18 AM MarcelineVQ: beats the shit out of buying from a big chain store
03:19 AM MarcelineVQ: all they have is that pressure treated SPF 4x4 with all the weird cuts in it, I assume to let the PT penetrate better
03:21 AM MarcelineVQ: It's fun to see it all come together, time to go play with cad in fact. catch you guys later.
03:22 AM RyanS: treated pine... if you don't mind breathing arsenic fumes or whatever they use
03:24 AM gloops: talking of CAD, i think ive found the paramtric tool i was looking for http://nikitron.cc.ua/sverchok_en.html
03:26 AM gloops: sverchok is russian for 'cricket' (equivalent to Grasshopper 3d) seems theres nothing Blender doesnt do
04:00 AM gloops: hmm, but failed to install add on
04:54 AM MrTrick: I've got a *largish* CNC, and most of the time I don't really need access from all of its sides.
04:54 AM MrTrick: Until I do.
04:55 AM MrTrick: Any suggestions on making it movable without impacting stability when it's supposed to be stationary?
04:55 AM MrTrick: something like https://sc01.alicdn.com/kf/HTB1AAdHHVXXXXXMXFXXq6xXFXXX7/best-price-high-quality-small-wood-cnc.jpg_220x220.jpg
04:55 AM XXCoder: wheel lift system, it lowers and push down and you can wheel it around
04:56 AM XXCoder: when it lifts wheels its on normal legs and you can rebalance for level so on
04:59 AM MrTrick: hmm that's a nice idea. Is that a readily available thing?
05:00 AM XXCoder: no idea
05:00 AM MrTrick: bah train stop
05:00 AM * MrTrick will be back on later
05:22 AM gloops: going to have level issues with that
05:23 AM XXCoder: yeah its only for moving
05:23 AM XXCoder: have to relevel evemn if just lower and rise wheels
05:23 AM XXCoder: let alone move machine
05:25 AM gloops: well if its only to move to access something, then return to same place for using, should be ok, but if its going to be used in different [places its gonna be a pain to level it up every time its moved
05:58 AM IchGucksLive: hi all
05:58 AM XXCoder: hey
05:58 AM XXCoder: agreed gloops
06:03 AM IchGucksLive: MrTrick,
06:03 AM IchGucksLive: MrTrick, still online
06:19 AM IchGucksLive: hi Slorobot
06:20 AM IchGucksLive: Slorobot, how is the weather in slovenia
06:21 AM Slorobot: Hi IchGucks! Its quite sunny today
06:21 AM IchGucksLive: as here in germany
06:22 AM Slorobot: Nice :) I'm new user of linuxcnc, could you help me with some questions about planning?
06:22 AM SpeedEvil: Planning what?
06:22 AM jthornton: just ask your question
06:23 AM Slorobot: Planning hardware and software for 6axis industrial robot
06:23 AM RyanS: sunny in Germany, well it's freezing in Melbourne Australia
06:23 AM IchGucksLive: Slorobot, a 6DOF
06:23 AM IchGucksLive: Slorobot, a scara or hax
06:24 AM IchGucksLive: Slorobot, if you modify a real KUKA or ABB its a better thing then from scratch
06:25 AM IchGucksLive: Slorobot, get the LIVE DVD from linuxcnc.org
06:25 AM IchGucksLive: there is a Robot simulation on the DVD that runs a 6DOF
06:25 AM Slorobot: I've got an offer for update an Manutec r15
06:26 AM IchGucksLive: let me see what drives this got
06:26 AM Slorobot: Do you think it has sense for updating it with linuxcnc or better some used industrial plc?
06:27 AM * MrTrick back online, hi IchGucksLive
06:27 AM IchGucksLive: yes there are standard AX500 inside
06:27 AM Slorobot: So you think it will not be a problem?
06:27 AM IchGucksLive: hi MrTrick im the man beond https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCmwhCL92ZQRSVqFe3jGwJSQ/videos
06:28 AM MrTrick: that is... a LOT of videos.
06:28 AM IchGucksLive: Slorobot, no its a bunch of cabeling but with a MESA setup you can go as full 7i77
06:28 AM MrTrick: impressive. :-)
06:28 AM IchGucksLive: MrTrick, as i read the logs 200x200mm
06:29 AM Slorobot: Great, thank you IchGucksLive!
06:29 AM MrTrick: 200x200? Not sure if you got wires crossed, I was asking about whether it's possible to make a CNC more movable
06:29 AM MrTrick: eg to slide out for access
06:30 AM IchGucksLive: im in germany and the english is not the best to be understud
06:30 AM IchGucksLive: slide out for access please discribe
06:31 AM IchGucksLive: MrTrick, we decide on forst material USe
06:31 AM IchGucksLive: so ALU or wood or ....
06:32 AM RyanS: you mean like leveling castors to move the machine?
06:32 AM MrTrick: I have a http://www.qdcnc.net/product/qd6090_desktop_cnc_router , it's heavy and large.
06:33 AM MrTrick: I want to move it into a "bay" in the workshop and put some doors in front so I can keep the noise and dust inside.
06:33 AM MrTrick: err wait sorry, not the desktop model
06:33 AM MrTrick: more like https://sc02.alicdn.com/kf/HTB1tRuFIFXXXXbOXFXXq6xXFXXXF/QD-6090-marble-cnc-machine-cnc-router.jpg_350x350.jpg
06:33 AM RyanS: MrTrick how about http://www.wdscomponents.com.au/product/4003/stem-fitting-adjustable-levelling-castors-wds-12197/?sku=35071&gclid=CjwKCAjw8_nXBRAiEiwAXWe2yZALebaETwpV4Bn19Q2aT4vP2BbrE8VlqlfMU1owXCbOkCuoai-7oBoCuQMQAvD_BwE
06:34 AM IchGucksLive: that is a real good mashine
06:34 AM XXCoder: RyanS: nice
06:35 AM RyanS: i want these castors for my welding table but $100 each is crazy
06:35 AM IchGucksLive: im off guys may the bitbreak be far from you
06:35 AM MrTrick: RyanS: looks interesting. I suspect they won't quite solve the problem - won't be able to reach the back ones while the CNC is pushed in
06:35 AM MrTrick: hmm, maybe the pallet jack would be enough
06:40 AM RyanS: yeah or some of those fold down machine feet, so you mount them beside castors, move the machine and stomp on the pedal to lift the castors off the ground
06:42 AM RyanS: https://www.richmondau.com/product-category/adjustable-feet/floorlocks-adjustable-feet/
06:43 AM RyanS: 300kg capacity
06:44 AM MrTrick: I wonder if there's something that can be linked front-back
06:51 AM * MrTrick suspects "pallet jack" will be the best answer.
06:51 AM MrTrick: thankfully there's nothing exposed or protruding under the frame
07:13 AM XXCoder: fancy electric lift system ;)
07:13 AM XXCoder: even more fancier: make it auto level
07:16 AM MrTrick: heh tempting
07:22 AM RyanS: ill sell you a bucket of Linak linear actuators i don't know what to do with :-)
07:24 AM MrTrick: mainly I'd like to replace this "richauto" dsp controller
07:24 AM MrTrick: wretched thing is a bit unreliable
08:46 AM gloops: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Large-format-CNC-machine-1620mm-x-1300mm-Needs-electrics/112991455025?
08:46 AM gloops: my area, very cheap atm
08:47 AM gregcnc_: post some pictures when you have it setup?
08:47 AM gloops: not bought it yet lol
08:48 AM gloops: id go a couple of hundred on it
08:52 AM gloops: will be watching, ive got the electrics already
08:52 AM gregcnc_: it's worth more than that to buy somebody else's problems
08:52 AM gloops: well, screws, rails, alu profile, z axis etc, plus a lot of work, thats worth £1200
08:52 AM gloops: which i might fetch in the last minute, im guessing about 4-500
08:52 AM gloops: it
09:00 AM gloops: someone from doncaster is on facebook selling a whole batch of PCs - PCs are junk worth about £20, he does state that mach3, vectric aspire - basically a whole suite of software worth about 5k is installed on every drive - which he wont be deleting
09:01 AM gloops: came from a workshop apparently
10:07 AM syyl: sounds fishy ;)
10:48 AM * JT-Shop has always wanted to cut a bathtub in half...
11:07 AM miss0r: damn.. i just got a quote from the local tool pusher... 6445,08eur for a speeder head...
11:07 AM miss0r: ouch, I don't I'll be needing that anyway :)
11:51 AM Spirit532 is now known as Guest61971
11:59 AM fragalot: Ohayo
12:00 PM CaptHindsight: おはようございます
12:01 PM fragalot: CaptHindsight: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wtx9xXyojrU
12:01 PM CaptHindsight: wood, you build it
12:02 PM CaptHindsight: wow, someone that uses a tablet to read prints while working
12:03 PM CaptHindsight: how high tech
12:03 PM fragalot: he normally prints them full-scale
12:04 PM CaptHindsight: https://youtu.be/Wtx9xXyojrU?t=7m20s I wish I could eye things out that straight
12:05 PM fragalot: lol
12:08 PM CaptHindsight: hope class linear bearings
12:46 PM miss0r: fragalot: I got a quote from my local tool pusher for a speeder head... 6445,08eur !
12:48 PM andypugh: I have a design for a speeder head that would be cheaper than that. It doesn’t even use gears, it’s friction drive.
12:49 PM miss0r: Anything would be cheaper than that :D I could buy a pretty decent complete replacement spindle for that amount :)
12:49 PM miss0r: What does that design of yours looks like?
12:50 PM andypugh: I was trying to find the 3D model
12:50 PM andypugh: But it looks rather like a speeder :-)
12:51 PM miss0r: I'm always running into limitations with my 4000rpm spindle
12:51 PM andypugh: But, instead, I made this: https://photos.app.goo.gl/OosTAvfNXTsuaLLH2 to clamp to the end of the overarm
12:52 PM andypugh: To mount this: https://photos.app.goo.gl/FrO0VXvoSslA8i4S2
12:52 PM miss0r: Indeed. I am considering doing the same thing
12:52 PM miss0r: ish
12:53 PM andypugh: And I laugh at the limitations of your 4k spindle and mention my 1k spindle
12:53 PM miss0r: hehe
12:53 PM fragalot: miss0r: lulz
12:53 PM fragalot: miss0r: those pig-blanket things arrived
12:53 PM miss0r: I am trying to come up with a solution. I don't want to spend alot of time mounting/unmounting the spindle motor.
12:53 PM fragalot: naturally I tested it by pouring 200ml of oil onto one
12:53 PM miss0r: fragalot: Let the waste begin!
12:53 PM miss0r: how'd it do?
12:54 PM fragalot: quite well
12:54 PM miss0r: o.0
12:54 PM miss0r: how well?
12:54 PM andypugh: But can your 4k spindle do this? https://youtu.be/thtDRjgbxRE
12:54 PM fragalot: miss0r: it caught nearly all of it.. And i'm sure that if the sheet had been more level it would have gulped it all up
12:54 PM miss0r: andypugh: I don't know what speed that is, exactly, but I can go as low as 20 rpm
12:55 PM andypugh: My lowest speed tops out at 45 rpm.
12:55 PM fragalot: mine goes down to 0
12:55 PM fragalot: and at the moment it also goes up to 0
12:55 PM miss0r: lol
12:55 PM fragalot: because the mill head of the rf45 fell over onto it's electrical panel THAT I ONLY JUST FIXED 3 WEEKS AGO
12:55 PM andypugh: But at the minimum speed it will do 1rpm and I cant’t hold it with a big spanner.
12:55 PM miss0r: andypugh: even though I am 'limited' at 4k rpm, it is a quite capable spindle
12:56 PM miss0r: well, ofc. you cant :D
12:56 PM fragalot: miss0r: so are you going to bolt a separate spindle to yours then?
12:56 PM fragalot: so you can run out of program memory faster?
12:56 PM miss0r: fragalot: I think I'll try to come up with a system that uses the ISO40 coubling.
12:56 PM miss0r: indeed :D
12:57 PM fragalot: can you lock the spindle?
12:57 PM miss0r: No. So, it will need to have a steady mounting pin, like those speeder heads
12:58 PM miss0r: fragalot: Have you decided to accept or decline my viking party invite? :P
12:58 PM fragalot: the heart says yes
12:58 PM fragalot: :P
12:58 PM fragalot: but alas reality gets in the way
12:58 PM miss0r: only because it has no idea of the amount of colesterole involved
12:59 PM fragalot: lol
01:00 PM miss0r: have you made any further progress on that mill of yours?
01:00 PM gloops: tommorrow looking a good day to be in the garage, royal wedding and football
01:00 PM miss0r: did you finaly get someone to look at the dovetails?
01:01 PM fragalot: miss0r: barely been home
01:01 PM miss0r: sucks
01:01 PM fragalot: and i'll go re-mill the dovetails next saturday
01:01 PM fragalot: the guy I can do it at is on holiday 'til then
01:01 PM miss0r: gah... Its just one of those things that can drive you mad
01:02 PM fragalot: yup
01:03 PM fragalot: but I managed to tidy up just enough so that I can walk from one end of the shed to the other without tripping over 4 things
01:04 PM miss0r: down to three, ay?
01:04 PM miss0r: I wonder what this Meca 320mm rotary table I have here will fetch me
01:04 PM fragalot: miss0r: 2 actually
01:04 PM miss0r: Great improvement :D
01:04 PM fragalot: indeed :P
01:05 PM andypugh: gloops Le Mans MotoGP this weekend too,
01:06 PM miss0r: I have a rotary table that looks exactly like this one: same model, same level of nastyness :D http://www.1stmachineryauctions.com/media/lot/thumbnail/320/a802f77f4f85deb3fc84c6b0dc380e9a019951ac.jpg
01:07 PM fragalot: same number of holes drilled into it?
01:08 PM miss0r: alright, without that
01:08 PM miss0r: theres not a single hole in this one
01:08 PM fragalot: how do you indicate the center then?
01:08 PM miss0r: only hole is the MT2 in the center of this one
01:08 PM fragalot: :P
01:08 PM * miss0r slaps fragalot :D
01:09 PM fragalot: :P
01:09 PM miss0r: I think i'll sell it to a client of mine for 250eur
01:09 PM fragalot: friend of mine has a really nice 950mm one
01:09 PM miss0r: sweet
01:09 PM fragalot: you just need to make your own chuck key before you can use it
01:09 PM fragalot: and use the torch to loosen up one of the jaws as that one hasn't moved in about 40 years
01:09 PM miss0r: ... the guy with the dog poops ?
01:09 PM fragalot: and remake one screw as the hole is completely wallered out
01:10 PM fragalot: miss0r: yes
01:10 PM miss0r: what a waste
01:10 PM fragalot: like I said, he's got /Really/ nice stuff
01:10 PM fragalot: it's frustrating :P
01:10 PM miss0r: I would keep this unit, if only it was build for 90 degree mounting as well
01:10 PM miss0r: and smaller
01:10 PM miss0r: and less heavy
01:11 PM miss0r: and had indexing plates
01:11 PM miss0r: bleh :D
01:11 PM miss0r: I think it weighs around 60 or 70 kgs
01:11 PM fragalot: lol
01:11 PM gloops: might have a look at that andypugh, too much to do really for a full GP,
01:11 PM fragalot: indexing plates you can DIY
01:11 PM miss0r: Yeah, its not fun man handeling it around
01:12 PM gloops: for some reason i cant get a plugin to install think ill try a shut down
01:12 PM fragalot: but the rest is harder
01:12 PM miss0r: yeah
01:13 PM miss0r: I realy realy need to start cleaning in here now. The internet is keeping on delaying me :D
01:13 PM gloops: that parametric slicer thing fragalot, there is a blender plugin, should you ever need it, Sverchok - equivalent to grasshopper 3d, does that and a lot more, if you can get it to plug in
01:13 PM miss0r: and I have a promosing client showing up thursday to have me look at some drawing - I wouldn't want it to look like this, when he shows up
01:14 PM fragalot: gloops: don't need it. slic3r does everything I need, and it does it amazingly well.
01:15 PM gloops: http://nikitron.cc.ua/sverchok_en.html
01:20 PM miss0r: fragalot: I think I just landed another extruder unit exactly like the first one I made for that saw.. Only a bit bigger, for a somewhat larger saw :D
01:21 PM fragalot: :D
01:21 PM miss0r: and yes, I will make the comments in english this time ;)
01:21 PM fragalot: :P
01:21 PM fragalot: and use state machines instead of relay logic
01:21 PM miss0r: yeah yeah yeah
01:21 PM fragalot: :-)
01:22 PM miss0r: There are limitations, one step at'a'time
01:22 PM fragalot: exactly why you use state machines
01:22 PM miss0r: You are annoyingly logic
01:22 PM fragalot: much easier to wrap your head around as well for sequential things
01:29 PM jdh: use a state machine with relay logic
01:37 PM miss0r: I also need to come up with another solution. They are having some issues when cutting realy thin wafers. 0.2 ish mm ones. They are suctioned into place on the saw blade, and are thrown off with the centrifugal force, instead of just dropping into the extractor. I'm thinking a thin air film
01:37 PM CaptHindsight: how long till this becomes a thing? https://video.vice.com/en_us/video/vice-the-human-weeble-wobble/5af06bfdf1cdb30baa585624
01:37 PM miss0r: perhaps with some water droplets mixed in, so I don't dry out the blade
01:42 PM gregcnc_: stupid USPS customs forms, what if what I send weighs less than 1oz each?
01:43 PM CaptHindsight: make is a "set"
01:43 PM CaptHindsight: say .25oz ea x 6 now becomes 1.5oz "set"
01:44 PM gregcnc_: yeah, that sounds reasonable
01:44 PM CaptHindsight: or if it's just one piece under 1oz then make it 1oz
01:45 PM gregcnc_: I can't see why decimals don't work, and I hate that it won't print a 4x6 for intl
01:45 PM CaptHindsight: yeah, there can be lots of frustration with the USPS website forms
01:45 PM CaptHindsight: it doesn't work at the post office either
01:46 PM CaptHindsight: they are constantly getting frustrated with why the system won't take their input
01:46 PM CaptHindsight: and they keep on changing how the UI works
01:47 PM gregcnc_: last time I was there the puter locked up completely
01:49 PM CaptHindsight: some fields don't let you backspace
01:49 PM CaptHindsight: "highlight" then "delete" then re-enter data
01:54 PM gregcnc_: ha i haven't run into that
01:57 PM gregcnc_: I think the pitney bowes service will print a 4x6, but i'm not paying for that
01:58 PM Lcvette: Having a bit of an issue with my Linux CNC install
01:59 PM CaptHindsight: Lcvette: yes?
01:59 PM Lcvette: Getting a PXE-E53: no boot filename received
02:00 PM Lcvette: Then pxe-mof: exiting Intel boot agent
02:00 PM Lcvette: It won't let me into f2 to the BIOS to check if the boot settings are set right
02:01 PM CaptHindsight: where do you find these motherboards? :)
02:01 PM Lcvette: Just goes straight to "reboot and select proper boot device or insert boot media in selected boot device and press any key"
02:02 PM CaptHindsight: it's a PXE problem not Linux
02:02 PM CaptHindsight: how about after a cold cold boot?
02:02 PM Lcvette: What's pxe?
02:02 PM Lcvette: What's a cold cold boot?
02:02 PM gloops: not quite a cold cold cold boot
02:03 PM CaptHindsight: from complete power down, OFF
02:03 PM CaptHindsight: cord pulled from the outlet
02:04 PM Lcvette_: I just sit on everything and unplugged power
02:04 PM Lcvette_: Shut
02:04 PM CaptHindsight: PXE https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Preboot_Execution_Environment
02:05 PM CaptHindsight: hopefully the BIOS will let you turn it OFF
02:05 PM CaptHindsight: more total crap embedded OS from Intel in firmware
02:07 PM Lcvette_: Ok so I need to go into BIOS and turn off pxe
02:07 PM CaptHindsight: what I would do
02:08 PM CaptHindsight: try and see if the board will just use legacy BIOS mode
02:08 PM Lcvette_: Cold cold boot let me in bios
02:08 PM CaptHindsight: \o/
02:09 PM CaptHindsight: yeah, they don't make it easy
02:11 PM Lcvette_: While I'm in here, sould I turn off virtualization?
02:12 PM CaptHindsight: yes, and all power management
02:13 PM CaptHindsight: anyone every try these high data rate slip rings? http://www.senring.com/ethernet-slip-rings/
02:13 PM Lcvette_: Intel speed step?
02:13 PM CaptHindsight: Lcvette_: kill it
02:14 PM Lcvette_: Filter pll frequency?
02:15 PM Lcvette_: Internal pll over voltage
02:15 PM Lcvette_: Primary plane current limit
02:15 PM Lcvette_: Gt frequency
02:15 PM Lcvette_: Gt voltage mode
02:16 PM Lcvette_: CPU oc fixed mode
02:16 PM Lcvette_: CPU cache ratio
02:16 PM CaptHindsight: you want those all set and not too change while it's running
02:16 PM Lcvette_: CPU ratio
02:16 PM CaptHindsight: no overclocking burst mode super duper overclocking warp jumping etc
02:18 PM CaptHindsight: http://www.senring.com/fiber-optic-rotary-joints/ up to 8 channels of fiber
02:19 PM Lcvette_: I need to write all these down and make a post
02:19 PM CaptHindsight: Lcvette_: some setting might conflict with others
02:19 PM Lcvette_: Lots of options and I'm not knowledgeable enough to set them at the moment
02:20 PM CaptHindsight: you need to keep it from any clock throttling while running
02:20 PM Lcvette_: Think I will leave them as is and just resolve the first issue at hand for now
02:20 PM Lcvette_: Lol
02:20 PM Lcvette_: One bite stca time
02:20 PM CaptHindsight: yeah, change one at a time
02:20 PM Lcvette_: At
02:23 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.dsti.com/slip-rings/standard/ese/
02:24 PM Lcvette_: Ok I can turn off " launch pxe oprom policy"
02:25 PM Lcvette_: Is under csm
02:25 PM Lcvette_: Compatibility support module
02:25 PM Lcvette_: Which can be emailed or disabled as a whole
02:26 PM Lcvette_: Inside it are also
02:26 PM Lcvette_: Storage oprom policy
02:26 PM Lcvette_: And videonoprom policy
02:26 PM Lcvette_: Video oprom
02:26 PM Lcvette_: Can be turned off individually or as a whole folder
02:27 PM Lcvette_: Do I want just the pxe? Or the whole folder of those disabled?
02:34 PM Lcvette_: Hey!!! booted
02:35 PM Lcvette_: Woo hoo
02:39 PM IchGucksLive: hi all
02:40 PM IchGucksLive: Lcvette_, what is your latency now on the new board
02:40 PM Lcvette_: Have not yesterday in preempt
02:40 PM Lcvette_: But tested in RTAI was very good
02:41 PM Lcvette_: 2xxx 3xxx
02:41 PM IchGucksLive: cool
02:41 PM IchGucksLive: the board is a
02:43 PM Lcvette_: ASRock H97M pro4 with Intel G3258
02:52 PM IchGucksLive: im off bye
03:17 PM Connor: Anyone know of a chart, source or reference for the torque applied to hold down clamps and vise bolts on a bridgeport table? Working on usage/safety manual and want to provide hard numbers..
03:18 PM Connor: I know the head should be torqued down to 25ft-lbs in cross pattern, then 50ft-lbs
03:25 PM Lcvette_: skunkworks: are you in here?
03:26 PM Lcvette_: Maybe machinery's handbook?
03:27 PM Connor: I don't want some chowder head to crank down to hard on the t-slots and break out a chunk of the table..
03:29 PM SpeedEvil: Work out a clamping force maximum, work out bolt torques to get that
03:29 PM Connor: SpeedEvil: Doesn't take into account the strength of the T-Slot though.
03:31 PM Lcvette_: I of the t slot, t nut, and vise are all in good shape and properly stoned with no burrs, the torque sould be all in the bolt
03:31 PM CaptHindsight: use Chinese hardware store grade nuts and bolts
03:32 PM Lcvette_: The load put on the table is all compressive
03:32 PM Lcvette_: Which would be hard to hurt the table before the that's or bolt broke
03:32 PM Lcvette_: Threads*
03:33 PM Connor: Yes, but, you can break out the T slot groves. I've seen tables, rotary tables etc where that's happened.
03:33 PM CaptHindsight: have a torqued just enough but not too far contest, winners get to keep their jobs
03:33 PM Connor: I've seen it on T-slots for lathe compounds too.
03:34 PM Lcvette_: CaptHindsight: you know how to get WiFi working on stretch?
03:34 PM Lcvette_: I forgot what I did and can't find it in my notes
03:35 PM Lcvette_: I got my lan to the 7i92 working
03:35 PM Lcvette_: Thought that would get the WiFi working as well
03:35 PM CaptHindsight: <-- not often a Debian user
03:35 PM Lcvette_: But maybe I changed something else I'm forgetting
03:35 PM Lcvette_: Ok
03:36 PM gloops: just tighten them tight then another half turn
03:37 PM gloops: for good luck
03:37 PM Lcvette_: Lol
03:37 PM Lcvette_: Sounds excessive
03:37 PM gloops: tried and tested
03:38 PM SpeedEvil: Connor: If something is canted and pulling on the t-slot,not clamped to it, that'll put far more stress on.
03:38 PM Lcvette_: Agreed
03:39 PM SpeedEvil: Connor: Perhaps making a little clamp that sits in the t-slot and you screw stuff into that might mitigate oopses.
03:39 PM pcw_mesa: Lcvette_ on the pro4 board you will need to turn of the MACs irq coalescing (since it has a Intel MAC) for good real time Ethernet performance
03:39 PM Connor: Right now, I'm just trying to put a number down for the amount of torque to put on the bolts for the vise
03:39 PM pcw_mesa:
03:40 PM pcw_mesa: (I thnk that's mentioned in the hm2_eth manual page)
03:46 PM Lcvette_: Ok.. I will go look for how to do that
03:50 PM lcvette: join
04:02 PM lcvette: pcw_mesa: http://linuxcnc.org/docs/html/man/man9/hm2_eth.9.html#SEE%20ALSO
04:03 PM lcvette: didn't see anything in here
04:14 PM XXCoder: LOL. Today seattle reveals the new glass panels on space needle. Fog is in, so nobody can see top of tower.
04:26 PM Lcvette_: pcw_mesa: I'm searching and finding old parts of your results on this board and talking about turning off the irq coalescing but no instructional information
04:26 PM Lcvette_: Lol
04:26 PM Tecan: http://www.netpipe.ca/zen/albums/Electronics/Projects/logo.png or http://www.netpipe.ca/zen/Electronics/Projects/logo2.png ?
04:34 PM pcw_mesa: Lcvette_ its in the notes section of the manual page
04:39 PM Deejay: gn8
04:39 PM andypugh: XXCoder: Are you in Seattle?
04:40 PM XXCoder: tacoma
04:40 PM XXCoder: my friend is there though
04:40 PM andypugh: I read a book set in Seattle, one of the odder ones I have read.
04:40 PM andypugh: By Megan Lindholme (Robin Hobb)
04:42 PM lcvette: oh
04:42 PM lcvette: think i already had that setup
04:42 PM lcvette: pcw_mesa: you mean like this?
04:42 PM lcvette: # This file describes the network interfaces available on your system # and how to activate them. For more information, see interfaces(5). source /etc/network/interfaces.d/* # The loopback network interface auto lo iface lo inet loopback auto enp0s25 iface enp0s25 inet static address 10.10.10.1 hardware-irq-coalesce-rx-usecs 0
04:42 PM XXCoder: this author? andypugh https://www.librarything.com/author/hobbrobin
04:42 PM XXCoder: err hold on
04:43 PM XXCoder: ah many pennames
04:43 PM andypugh: Ah, she actually lives in Tacoma
04:45 PM andypugh: Of her books I would suggest Assassins Apprentice, as it is good and the beginning of a good series. But Wizard of the Pigeons is set in Seattle and I quite liked it. Feels like an early work, though.
04:47 PM XXCoder: sometimrs I like realistic magic genre
04:48 PM XXCoder: that book seems to be that so plan to read it later. currently reading wheel of time
04:48 PM XXCoder: very good, though I know last 2 books kinda suck then really sucks
04:48 PM XXCoder: due to working on notes from dead author
04:48 PM XXCoder: you ever read Myst trilogy?
04:49 PM lcvette: pcw_mesa: https://pastebin.com/5n69CWrX
04:49 PM XXCoder: oh yeah theres myst games kickstarter, if you like Myst games. chance to own Gehn's inkpot and pen lol
04:49 PM XXCoder: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1252280491/myst-25th-anniversary-collection/description
04:49 PM XXCoder: few days left
04:50 PM andypugh: I played Myst and Riven. Loved them both.
04:50 PM andypugh: I actually have Riven on my iPhone. But can’t say I have played it much
04:50 PM XXCoder: I wnt in for Maintainer level of support
04:50 PM XXCoder: *went
04:51 PM XXCoder: I wanted next one but im deaf and it adds LOT of music stuff as well as the inkwell
04:51 PM XXCoder: https://ksr-ugc.imgix.net/assets/021/255/007/8a2404096c39b715fe561fc13b41f3e1_original.jpg?w=639&fit=max&v=1526497103&auto=format&q=92&s=73d8a18572833e0e9d3407e1a65204f7
04:54 PM andypugh: I am not at all clear what it takes to get the MacOS versions.
04:54 PM XXCoder: they are working on that
04:55 PM XXCoder: most games mac version will be downloadable
04:55 PM XXCoder: I think only 2 games have issues. look for "good news!" update
04:55 PM andypugh: TBH much as I enjoyed them, I don’t have Myst-sized amounts of time available now.
04:55 PM XXCoder: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1252280491/myst-25th-anniversary-collection/posts/2181424
04:56 PM XXCoder: yeah me either, but I love the linking book so I went for minium that has that
04:56 PM lcvette: ok, new Latency test with 4 youtub vids going every office program opened and me moving stuff around, 19,165/18,600
04:56 PM XXCoder: gehn inkwell is just eh
04:56 PM lcvette: no bios settings changed from stock
04:56 PM XXCoder: lcvette: try this. find HD nature video, almost full screen
04:56 PM XXCoder: 3 or 4 glxgear windows
04:56 PM lcvette: what is glxgears?
04:56 PM XXCoder: move one of those around rapidly in entire test time
04:56 PM lcvette: i tried to apr-get
04:56 PM XXCoder: run it in terminal
04:57 PM XXCoder: andypugh: im wrong, just one game. "First Caveat: Myst: Masterpiece Edition is giving us trouble. We’re working on it, but we’re not sure about it. Soooo… we’ll be converting the original Myst to fill that hole."
04:57 PM andypugh: lcvette: Or, alternatively, decide that will do and decide _not_ to watch nature videos and run glxgears when machining.
04:58 PM lcvette: ok gears are running
04:58 PM lcvette: latency isn't moving
04:58 PM andypugh: XXCoder: The lowest tier specifically says you only ge the Windows10 version. The others don’t seem to mention what version you get.
04:58 PM XXCoder: one tend to not affect anything
04:59 PM lcvette: oh, just keep opening teminals
04:59 PM XXCoder: windows 10 is for sure thing. mac versions you will get downloads, except for one
04:59 PM XXCoder: or just end command with space & to background it
04:59 PM XXCoder: glxgears &
05:00 PM andypugh: Or you can run Linixcnc and choose the “Latency Histogram” config and that plots the latency and has a button to open as many glxgears as you might want
05:00 PM XXCoder: nice didnt know that existed
05:00 PM lcvette: ok i have 6 glxgears running, 4 youtube vids, 6 software aps opened, the irc window and a few other linuxcnc forum pages
05:00 PM lcvette: and moving windows around
05:00 PM lcvette: latency is still standing strong at those numbers
05:01 PM XXCoder: yeah good chance its very firm there
05:01 PM andypugh: You can reset the stats if you want
05:01 PM XXCoder: andypugh: I guess pick number slightly highest than worse latency got for some mirgin?
05:01 PM XXCoder: for example say 19k, set it to 20k
05:01 PM XXCoder: s/highest/higher
05:02 PM lcvette: ok
05:02 PM andypugh: 50k is fast enough for most stepper machines. And if you have Mesa cards then you are only running the 1mS thread.
05:02 PM lcvette: i still need to research my bios settings
05:02 PM lcvette: this is running 7i92
05:02 PM andypugh: I would stop worrying about latency about now.
05:02 PM XXCoder: andy i want mesa evenually but way overkill for my machine for now. my machine got 15k latency anyway
05:02 PM lcvette: and preempt rt stretch
05:03 PM andypugh: Anything up to 400k is OK with Mesa. Stop worrying.
05:03 PM lcvette: i was getting latency wanrings
05:03 PM andypugh: (Well, maybe not “OK” but “just about usable”
05:03 PM andypugh: Latency warnings on the 1mS thread?
05:04 PM andypugh: That’s wierd.
05:04 PM lcvette: when i started linuxcnc
05:04 PM andypugh: And your latency was the same then as now? Or have you twaeked things?
05:04 PM XXCoder: ya his system was having serious issues with layency
05:04 PM XXCoder: wasnt it over 180k something? worse than my laptop
05:05 PM XXCoder: doh gonna go laters
05:05 PM lcvette: yeah was really bad
05:05 PM lcvette: 380k
06:44 PM andypugh: I am not sure I can afford the drives to give me the required space: https://photos.app.goo.gl/ORe9cobfC6kThUZf2
06:45 PM lcvette: are you trying to copy the internet?
06:45 PM lcvette: lol
06:46 PM andypugh: I think it’s a corrupted ZIP fle: https://photos.app.goo.gl/FYRa23HcEhCjQDGI3
07:23 PM Tom_L: andypugh pb ssd?
07:23 PM Tom_L: :)
07:25 PM andypugh: I wonder how much 784PB of SSD would cost?
07:26 PM Tom_L: more than 94 trillion
07:26 PM Tom_L: oh wait... a petabyte of storage for $117,000
07:27 PM Tom_L: aliexpress probably has it cheaper
07:28 PM lcvette: Tom_L: what OS are you running?
07:28 PM Tom_L: on what?
07:29 PM lcvette: lol.. your preempt ethenret machine controller
07:29 PM Tom_L: win7, 8.1, 10, wheezy, stretch and i forgot what the server was
07:29 PM Tom_L: stretch
07:29 PM lcvette: axis?
07:29 PM Tom_L: yeah
07:29 PM lcvette: sretchwith axis
07:29 PM lcvette: ok
07:29 PM lcvette: near it?
07:30 PM Tom_L: yeah but my hands are dripping with sub sammich sauce atm
07:30 PM lcvette: sammich sauce....
07:30 PM Tom_L: https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/jvDN76Pq7Z/
07:31 PM Tom_L: i did that to get it
07:32 PM lcvette: oooh
07:32 PM Tom_L: http://www.linuxcnc.org/testing-stretch-rtpreempt/
07:32 PM lcvette: is that the after install update
07:32 PM Tom_L: is the other way
07:32 PM Tom_L: but you don't get to choose your desktop with the 2nd method
07:32 PM lcvette: im on stretch right now
07:32 PM lcvette: i used the second method
07:33 PM lcvette: :(
07:33 PM Tom_L: you can do it over
07:33 PM Tom_L: if you want
07:33 PM Tom_L: the first method is with a blank ssd
07:34 PM lcvette: my ssd was blank a few hours ago
07:34 PM lcvette: brand new samsung 250gb
07:34 PM lcvette: :/
07:34 PM lcvette: im on the new system
07:35 PM Tom_L: better?
07:35 PM lcvette: just finished getting evrything back to where it was before
07:35 PM lcvette: bah
07:35 PM lcvette: not even close
07:35 PM lcvette: 18k/19k
07:35 PM lcvette: no bios settings done
07:36 PM lcvette: all still stock
07:36 PM Tom_L: so why ain't the machine runnin yet then?
07:36 PM lcvette: that was with 6 glxgears screens running, 4 youtube vids every software program opened and severla lcnc forum tabs opened and me moving windows around real fast
07:37 PM lcvette: cause now im back to software issues
07:37 PM lcvette: something about stretch
07:38 PM lcvette: missing lots of stuff
07:38 PM Tom_L: http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.7/html/getting-started/getting-linuxcnc.html#_installing_on_debian_wheezy_with_preempt_rt_kernel
07:38 PM Tom_L: so try that
07:38 PM lcvette: even my gmoccapy sims won't open
07:38 PM Tom_L: set up wheezy
07:38 PM Tom_L: it's old
07:38 PM Tom_L: should comply with gmocappy
07:39 PM Tom_L: i'm running wheezy on my mill
07:39 PM Tom_L: i use the stretch pc for testing
07:40 PM lcvette: well shit
07:40 PM Tom_L: it's up to you
07:40 PM lcvette: i didn't know i could do that
07:41 PM Tom_L: you could try it once i suppose
07:41 PM Tom_L: i've never tried installing preempt until stretch
07:42 PM Tom_L: i've got a blank ssd i could try it i suppose
07:42 PM lcvette: i was under the impression i HAD to run stretch
07:42 PM Tom_L: no, it's just the lastest version
07:42 PM Tom_L: not necessarily the best for everyone
07:42 PM lcvette: well how about that
07:42 PM lcvette: so debian wheezy is like regular linuxcnc
07:43 PM Tom_L: it _is_ linux
07:43 PM lcvette: so should run the stuff my buddy has from the regular debian wheezy inuxcnc
07:43 PM Tom_L: just like windows 7 8 10 etc just a different version
07:43 PM Tom_L: earlier
07:43 PM Tom_L: i don't see why not if you install it correctly
07:44 PM lcvette: i don't understand the whole naming convention yet
07:44 PM lcvette: its very confusing
07:44 PM Tom_L: yeah it is
07:44 PM Tom_L: i know stretch is debian 9
07:44 PM Tom_L: i forgot what wheezy was
07:44 PM Tom_L: apparently 7.9 something
07:45 PM lcvette: so "if" i install it correctly...lol
07:45 PM lcvette: you realize I am the guy right
07:46 PM lcvette: you know that they refer to
07:46 PM pcw_mesa: Wheezy=7, Jessie=8, Stretch=9 AFAIK
07:46 PM lcvette: in staticstical analogies
07:47 PM lcvette: Peter, do you concur about running wheezy with preempt rt to resolove my issues ?
07:48 PM lcvette: seems like im not the only one having gmoccapy issues with stretch]
07:48 PM lcvette: err. debian 9
07:48 PM Tom_L: it looks pretty straightforward from that wheezy preempt page
07:48 PM lcvette: do i need to format this harddfrive?
07:49 PM Tom_L: no i don't think so
07:49 PM lcvette: or just install over existing
07:49 PM Tom_L: it'll write over it
07:49 PM lcvette: okwell there went a whole day..lol
07:49 PM Tom_L: keep any configs you may need
07:49 PM pcw_mesa: I'm not sure what your issues are... Basic LInuxCNC runs fine on Stretch
07:49 PM Tom_L: good experience for ya
07:49 PM lcvette: i saved thejm from the last go around as well as all my network settings
07:49 PM Tom_L: pcw_mesa, i think gmocappy is complaining about some packages
07:49 PM lcvette: as long as its no gmoccapy
07:50 PM lcvette: even the sims error out
07:50 PM Tom_L: i've never tried running it
07:50 PM lcvette: try to run a sim
07:50 PM Tom_L: no touch screen here so no need to
07:50 PM lcvette: it won't even open
07:50 PM lcvette: so..
07:51 PM lcvette: lol
07:53 PM lcvette: i spent days trying to fix my hal and ini files... all the while... it wasn't them
07:54 PM pcw_mesa: umm, sims run fine for me on stretch
07:54 PM Tom_L: none of my sims will install or run
07:54 PM Tom_L: tried gmocappy and axis
07:55 PM pcw_mesa: Maybe its the installed version, they run fine booted live
07:55 PM lcvette: im on the installed version
07:55 PM lcvette: i do remember the live version starting
07:56 PM lcvette: because i remember seeing what each of the different sim looked like
07:56 PM lcvette: but now i just get an error message
07:57 PM lcvette: but then cmorley gave me a player.py file to fix the error message i was getting and then some would load but with more errors blocking some of the screen you couldn't close or move
07:57 PM lcvette: missing ngc files etc
07:57 PM Tom_L: i was running 2.7.12 and updated to .13 the other day
07:57 PM Tom_L: neither one would run the sims
07:58 PM lcvette: anyway, im not well versed enough to resolve it on my own, so if going to wheey will resolve it without any other ill effect, that would mean my machine will be up and running and i can see some light a the end of the tunnel
07:58 PM pcw_mesa: Running live now, the axis sims work, the gmoccopy sims fail on that python player error
07:58 PM Tom_L: will it install in 32g?
07:58 PM Tom_L: i've got this old ssd i may try it on
07:58 PM pcw_mesa: probably
07:59 PM pcw_mesa: it might even install on 8
07:59 PM lcvette: https://forum.linuxcnc.org/39-pncconf/34559-odd-error-message-popping-up-for-missing-gst-file?start=10#110859
07:59 PM Tom_L: i wonder if i've got a wheezy dvd
08:00 PM lcvette: cmorley gave me a player.py file in this thread
08:00 PM lcvette: 8?
08:00 PM lcvette: debian 8?
08:00 PM lcvette: jessie
08:01 PM lcvette: tom, i think it took 8.2gb?
08:01 PM Tom_L: that link i gave you was for wheezy
08:01 PM lcvette: yeah
08:02 PM lcvette: i will go with whatever has clear instructions
08:02 PM lcvette: i honestly don't know what the differences are
08:03 PM lcvette: unless there is something that will affect performance of the mesa hardware
08:03 PM Tom_L: nothing i'm aware of
08:03 PM Tom_L: i'm gonna download wheezy and try it i guess
08:04 PM Tom_L: per: http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.7/html/getting-started/getting-linuxcnc.html#_installing_on_debian_wheezy_with_preempt_rt_kernel
08:04 PM Tom_L: see if it works
08:04 PM Tom_L: unless i got something special on that old ssd...
08:07 PM lcvette: ok, mee tyoo
08:07 PM pcw_mesa: I suspect that the chooser does not copy all the gmoccapy ngc files so you probably have that file
08:08 PM pcw_mesa: so re-installing may be a bit silly if you already have the .ngc file
08:08 PM pcw_mesa: (and you may well find the same issue with wheezy)
08:09 PM Tom_L: it's got wheezy on it already and the sims work fine
08:09 PM Tom_L: i don't think it's got preempt-rt on it though
08:10 PM pcw_mesa: right so if the .ngc fil eis already there, I would just copy it to the proper directory
08:13 PM pcw_mesa: (cant run locate on the live image so Im not sure if it there or not)
08:14 PM lcvette__: on my config files the files are there but won't or can't be opened
08:14 PM lcvette__: not sure about the sim files
08:14 PM lcvette__: didn't check
08:14 PM lcvette__: but was getting similar errors
08:14 PM lcvette__: paths were correct
08:15 PM lcvette__: triple and quadruple checked
08:15 PM lcvette__: physically followed them to look and see the files
08:15 PM pcw_mesa: the gmoccapy tool file is there?
08:15 PM lcvette__: spellings were correct
08:15 PM lcvette__: im saying in my config files
08:15 PM lcvette__: in my case it was a tool_change.ngc file it couldn't open
08:16 PM lcvette__: file was in the folder
08:16 PM lcvette__: path was correct
08:17 PM pcw_mesa: but the gmoccapy sim files work?
08:18 PM lcvette__: no
08:18 PM lcvette__: i just did not follow to see if the files were there
08:18 PM lcvette__: it was the same issue i was already seeing
08:18 PM Tom_itx: Linux Wheezy-Backup 3.4-9-rtai-686-pae #1 SMP PREEMPT Debian 3.4.55-4linuxcnc i686 GNU/Linux
08:19 PM Tom_L: that's what i've got on the old ssd
08:19 PM Tom_L: i don't think it's preempt-rt though
08:19 PM pcw_mesa: I see in a forum post you said the gmoccapy sim worked from the chooser
08:20 PM lcvette__: one did
08:20 PM lcvette__: others had the same errors
08:20 PM lcvette__: see last post
08:20 PM lcvette__: or second to last post
08:21 PM Tom_L: lcvette, are you running 32 or 64bit?
08:21 PM lcvette__: 64bit
08:21 PM lcvette__: and i can't get debian 7
08:21 PM pcw_mesa: Does look like a path problem which may be the same with Wheezy
08:21 PM lcvette__: says debian 7 has been superceded with debian 8 jessie
08:22 PM lcvette__: and the instructions specifically state: Be careful and don’t download Debian 8.
08:22 PM lcvette__: lol
08:22 PM lcvette__: if its a path problem its not of the actual file
08:22 PM pcw_mesa: This is not likely to be a linux issue at all
08:22 PM lcvette__: at least not in the case of my configs
08:23 PM lcvette__: it may be a path problem of where the plugin is supposed to be
08:23 PM lcvette__: if thats how that works
08:23 PM lcvette__: or that the right plugin isn't there
08:23 PM lcvette__: or version
08:23 PM lcvette__: possibly
08:23 PM lcvette__: similar to the player.py incident
08:25 PM Tom_shop: https://cdimage.debian.org/cdimage/archive/7.11.0/amd64/iso-dvd/
08:25 PM pcw_mesa: the missing ngc file is not likely a version or plugin error its most likely a path issue
08:25 PM Tom_shop: https://www.debian.org/releases/wheezy/debian-installer/
08:26 PM lcvette__: maybe im misunderstanding
08:27 PM lcvette__: [PYTHON] PATH_APPEND = /home/cnc/linuxcnc/configs/VMC2/python TOPLEVEL = /home/cnc/linuxcnc/configs/VMC2/python/toplevel.py LOG_LEVEL = 8
08:28 PM lcvette__: the files it was looking for are in those foldrs
08:28 PM lcvette__: the path is correct
08:29 PM lcvette__: unless im not understanding how to do it correctly but it worked on other debug errors i had to fix so i assumed i was doing it properly
08:30 PM lcvette__: Tom_shop: are those disks?
08:30 PM Tom_L: images
08:30 PM Tom_L: the netinst CD are smaller downloads
08:30 PM lcvette__: i gots no cd
08:30 PM Tom_L: it says usb stick as well
08:31 PM lcvette__: on usb
08:31 PM lcvette__: ok
08:31 PM Tom_L: run one of the netinst ones
08:31 PM Tom_L: last row has usb stick
08:32 PM pcw_mesa: on sim the gmoccapy tool file is in ~/linuxcnc/nc_files/examples
08:32 PM pcw_mesa: bbl
08:35 PM lcvette__: ok, but besides that i think that is just the tip of the iceberg with stretch being a bit new and having some compatibility nuances and for me that just is too much
08:35 PM lcvette__: i don't have the skillset yet
08:35 PM lcvette__: you guys are great but man im wearin ya out..lol
08:36 PM lcvette__: netboot?
08:37 PM Tom_L: naw, just another day on irc
08:37 PM lcvette__: no not netboot
08:37 PM lcvette__: lol i just resolved pxe earlier today
08:38 PM Tom_L: time for some R&R
08:39 PM lcvette__: do it to it! i have my work cut out for me!
08:39 PM Tom_L: what route are you gonna take?
08:41 PM lcvette__: debian 7
08:41 PM lcvette__: link
08:41 PM lcvette__: just finished downloading the netinst
08:41 PM lcvette__: gonna make a bootable iso with rufus now
08:41 PM lcvette__: then follow the instructions and give it a whirl
08:42 PM Tom_L: k
08:42 PM lcvette__: i may do it to my corsair hardrive
08:42 PM lcvette__: that way i can just swap between them if i need to revert back real wuick
08:42 PM lcvette__: that will work right?
08:43 PM Tom_L: should
08:43 PM Tom_L: keep a good backup of your configs
08:43 PM Tom_L: or 2
08:43 PM lcvette__: yeah they are on a seprate thumb drive and i emailed a copy to myself so they are in the cloud too
08:44 PM Tom_L: i keep my bit files with the configs
08:44 PM Tom_L: just in case
08:44 PM lcvette__: bit files?
08:44 PM Tom_L: the files you downloaded to the 7i92
08:44 PM lcvette__: ah yes
08:44 PM Tom_L: remember waaaayy back when...
08:44 PM lcvette__: mesaflash
08:45 PM lcvette__: yeah..heh.. back when i was a rookie
08:45 PM lcvette__: lol
08:45 PM Tom_L: this is a trial by fire channel
08:46 PM lcvette__: dude
08:46 PM lcvette__: i live in a fire suit
08:47 PM lcvette__: asbestos britches
08:47 PM lcvette__: lol.
08:49 PM pcw_home: if you start with a stock wheezy config you have a fairly long path ahead
08:50 PM pcw_home: you will need to both install Linuxcnc and a Preempt-RT kernel (I think there are packages for these)
08:51 PM lcvette__: there are?
08:53 PM lcvette__: i'd love to have stretch work i just fear im up for one hit after another... it seemed like an endless possibility of problems ahead and i just didn't know how to resolve them
08:53 PM pcw_home: I dont think so...
08:54 PM pcw_home: You got config files from someone using gmoccapy, what version of gmoccapy did they use?
08:55 PM lcvette__: what was with the latest linuxcnc debian wheezy download
08:55 PM lcvette__: right from the linuxcnc download page
08:56 PM lcvette__: but it was configured on an rtai machine
08:56 PM lcvette__: not preempt rt
08:56 PM pcw_home: that should not make any real difference
08:56 PM pcw_home: its not real time
08:57 PM pcw_home: Not sure what wheezy has (and it will vary with LinuxCNC version)
08:58 PM lcvette__: https://pastebin.com/RDCKUyE7
08:58 PM lcvette__: that is the latest debug i received
08:58 PM lcvette__: that was after using cmorleys player.py
08:58 PM lcvette__: that allowed it to open somewheat but it was frozen and unresponsive
08:59 PM lcvette__: and had to be terminated manually due to unresponsivemness
09:01 PM lcvette__: i researched this alot and saw there was some gladevcp issues
09:02 PM pcw_home: I guess I would start with a simple gmoccapy config without touching any of the default paths
09:03 PM pcw_home: perhaps a pncconf generated config
09:03 PM lcvette__: ok
09:03 PM lcvette__: i made one but in axis
09:03 PM lcvette__: i did not see an option to use gmoccapy
09:04 PM pcw_home: and see if the base system is broken somehow, because using someone elses config/file structure makes everything harder
09:06 PM lcvette__: i will go see if i can find the gmoccapy option in pncconfig
09:06 PM pcw_home: you can choose AXIS, TKLinux, Gmocappy, or Touchy from pncconfs "Screen" page
09:06 PM lcvette__: ok, must have missed it
09:07 PM lcvette__: was all overwhelming back then
09:09 PM lcvette: my pncconf does not have gmoccapy
09:09 PM lcvette: axis, tklinuxcnc, mini, touchy
09:12 PM pcw_home: have you updated to the latest LinuxCNC?
09:13 PM CaptHindsight: pcw_home: ever have any experience with these or similar at 100Mb or faster? http://www.senring.com/ethernet-slip-rings/
09:13 PM lcvette: i thought i was upddated
09:13 PM CaptHindsight: (1000M) Ethernet Slip Rings ^^^
09:15 PM lcvette: 2.7.11
09:16 PM pcw_home: Hmm gmoccapy on pncconf may be master only. let me check 2.7.13...
09:18 PM lcvette: ive heard the term master before but don't know what it refers to
09:19 PM pcw_home: its the current development version of linuxcnc
09:20 PM lcvette: ah
09:20 PM pcw_home: Oops looks like Gmoccapy is only pncconf option in master
09:20 PM lcvette: lol
09:21 PM lcvette: so i can't upgrade
09:21 PM lcvette: or don't need to
09:21 PM lcvette: or should but won't matter because its only on the rtai linuxcnc distro
09:22 PM pcw_home: just means you cannot use pncconf with 2.7.x to generate a hal/ini file set for gmoccapy
09:22 PM lcvette: ah
09:22 PM pcw_home: this is not related to RTAI or Preempt-RT
09:22 PM lcvette: ok
09:22 PM lcvette: so going to wheezy wouldn't have helped me
09:23 PM lcvette: because its a "linuxcnc" and not a built
09:23 PM lcvette: and only linuxcnc has master
09:24 PM lcvette: ?
09:24 PM lcvette: i know im confused
09:30 PM pcw_home: Im not sure what the actual issue you have is but it seems mainly related to gmoccapy
09:30 PM lcvette: yeah
09:30 PM lcvette: im not in love with gmoccapy
09:30 PM lcvette: i just don't know how to change it without breaking it
09:31 PM pcw_home: I think maybe Norbert (sp) on the forum may help if you ask a question with gmoccapy in the title
09:31 PM lcvette: i'd be happy with axis or touchy
09:31 PM lcvette: which section?
09:33 PM lcvette: duh gmoccapy
09:35 PM lcvette: hey while i have you here, do you still run your asrock h97m pro4?
09:37 PM lcvette: i got my final results after a pretty hard test
09:38 PM lcvette: 24k/19k on latency
09:38 PM lcvette: sound about right?
09:38 PM lcvette: way better than the old setup
10:02 PM pcw_home: yeah you can get quite a bit better by tweaking things but its really makes no practical difference
10:04 PM pcw_home: CaptHindsightno, have not seen those, I would be tempted to use one of the duplex fiber interfaces with an air gap
10:04 PM pcw_home: (for one full duplex channel)
10:05 PM CaptHindsight: pcw_home: yeah, was thinking the fiber is probably more reliable
10:06 PM lcvette: ok
10:06 PM lcvette: so i can leave m bios setting alone
10:06 PM lcvette: they scared me
10:46 PM Lcvette_: Posted on gmoccapy
10:50 PM Tom_L: haha. bios scares ya ehh?
11:42 PM nallar is now known as Ross