#linuxcnc Logs
Jan 18 2018
#linuxcnc Calendar
12:24 AM XXCoder: `Wolf: could use "instant heater" to warm water faster
12:27 AM `Wolf: problem is water i goes in the boiler at 54F, goes out the other side at 65F if the shower valve is open 3/4 of the way on the hot water side
12:27 AM `Wolf: i/is
12:27 AM `Wolf: point of use heater is only good for washing hands, not meant to supply more then 1/2 gallon or so
12:28 AM `Wolf: my guess is that the domestic side heating coil in the boiler is scaled up from the well water
12:29 AM `Wolf: add that to having 2x the water pressure now that the house is supplied by city water vs when it was on the well water
12:44 AM XXCoder: fun
01:12 AM Cromaglious_: PaulCNC kits showed up, now trying to get some time to go over there and start setting them up, I need to take the NEMA24 motors over and redo the stepper mount holes for them.
01:13 AM Cromaglious_: oh yeah, need to order some female-female db25 gender benders, I got shells, not Gender benders
01:15 AM gloops: im finding that this was probably an ambitious design for a beginner haha
01:15 AM XXCoder: you design?
01:15 AM XXCoder: *your
01:16 AM gloops: yeah, i have had a dire few days snagging things up, ive learnt a bit though
01:20 AM XXCoder: cool
01:20 AM gloops: successfully shimmed one ballnut, one to go and i can finally get away from alignment crap, should be very quick, oh just got to secure some 4.5 inch pulleys to the motors
01:25 AM CaptHindsight: we just had a pulley shear its set screw on a dock door
01:26 AM CaptHindsight: ~1" OD, 6" OD pulley/sprocket
01:26 AM gloops: i dont like grub screws for pulleys
01:27 AM gloops: my plan was to drill the shaft and make a tapered pin with threads on one end and go right through
01:29 AM CaptHindsight: roll up overhead doors don't seem to use keyed shafts and pulleys
01:32 AM gloops: i bet the motors on those are good for cnc
01:36 AM gloops: design lessons to be learned, do not skip over any aspect of the design, small things like attaching the pulley to the motor
01:36 AM CaptHindsight: gloops: nah just regular old general porposes AC motors
01:37 AM gloops: i didnt think too much about getting a relatively big pulley on a 10mm shaft, i just thought yeah that will work itself out
01:37 AM CaptHindsight: my day in a nutshell https://youtu.be/Mw0riLqQBj0?t=1m47s first 30 seconds
01:37 AM gloops: ive spent quite a bit of time making adjustable plates to take the motors with pulleys for tensioning, a lot of messing about - and the whole thing now depends on getting the pulleys to stay on the motor
01:38 AM XXCoder: CaptHindsight: first 30 seconds from your link time?
01:38 AM CaptHindsight: yeah
01:49 AM Deejay: moin
01:49 AM XXCoder: ya know, stoogies isnt as funny to me now as it was back then
01:52 AM CaptHindsight: XXCoder: watching the colorized version of the 3 Stooges and the Nazi Spy's
01:53 AM CaptHindsight: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QRc43duqdBc odd watching them in color
01:53 AM XXCoder: pretty high quality colorization
01:54 AM CaptHindsight: yeah, I forgot how short they all were
02:03 AM XXCoder: rubik god https://youtu.be/Ko-Obw6Ee7I
02:12 AM gloops: sht item removed from ebay i was bidding on
02:13 AM gloops: nothing worse than opening ebay to look at the little bargain you have lined up, to find an empty window
02:14 AM archivist: I have one I am bidding on today, hoping to snap it up cheeeeep
02:15 AM gloops: this was a strangle little lathe with a rotating headstock
02:16 AM gloops: ahh well, its gone, anything interesting archivist?
02:17 AM Wolf__: silly question, archivist only buys interesting things
02:17 AM XXCoder: so its boring or archibist already bought it
02:18 AM Wolf__: I
02:18 AM Wolf__: I’m debating on ordering dividing kit for my phase ii rotary table...
02:19 AM archivist: I already have what I am bidding on, but I done want to destroy the one I have to make a measuring tool for cnc
02:21 AM archivist: one like this for less :) https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Optical-square-Double-Prism-Optical-Square-Builders-square/162831866774
02:22 AM gloops: cant you get anything out of old cameras for that stuff archivist?
02:23 AM archivist: in a camera there is no real effort to be accurate
02:23 AM gloops: i dont know lol, some pretty sharp cameras
02:24 AM gloops: some optical mirrors, prisms stuff like that
02:26 AM archivist: in the builders item you get two 5 sided prisms stuck together, this gives accurate 90 deg
02:27 AM archivist: regardless of the prism angle
02:27 AM gloops: old enlargers - projects to the scale of the film grain, that is quite fine, onto an area, well as big as you like
02:28 AM archivist: a penta prism from an SLR has an image righting job as well so it is not the same
02:29 AM archivist: I want to play with laser level plus optical square
02:32 AM gloops: must be good to have time to play heh
02:32 AM archivist: but you are playing too!
02:40 AM XXCoder: whoa. thousands of king books, first editions and manuscripts, got destroyed
02:42 AM XXCoder: http://mainepublic.org/post/original-stephen-king-manuscripts-among-items-ruined-bangor-water-main-break
02:42 AM gloops: this project is like the battle of stalingrad, a brief window of opportunity existed to secure the objective, but now the october rains are turning into snow, my tanks are stuck in the mud, i must move forward, or die!
02:43 AM archivist: at the moment squareness of the homebrew machine is hard to measure
02:46 AM gloops: i guess with extrusions you have a better chance of controlling square, welding can foil the best attempts to keep square
02:47 AM archivist: with extrusions your squareness is limited to the saw that cut the ends
02:48 AM gloops: well, machine cutting the ends, you can check the squareness of a cut simply, with regular tool kit
02:49 AM gloops: which you can with steel, but as soon as you weld - you have no control over what happens
02:52 AM gloops: when half a turn of bolt securing a ballnut is the difference between perfect fit and jammed, may as well face it, youre gonna be scraping grinding filing shimming etc
02:58 AM archivist: I wonder how many times BT is going to fsck with my connection today.....
02:59 AM archivist: 11 times it bounced yesterday
03:07 AM XXCoder: review on one of those crappy cnc routers https://hackaday.com/2018/01/16/review-linksprite-mini-cnc/
03:12 AM XXCoder: if I ever get one, I would remove that board and use better system and linuxcnc
03:55 AM gloops: id like to have a look at one of these routers now, to compare it to my idea of what a router needs to be
03:55 AM gloops: one of those routers
03:57 AM gloops: just looking at a pic id say hopelessly inadequate, surprising though with the bracing and so on, could be up to the job
03:58 AM XXCoder: its fine for engraving and very little else
03:59 AM Contract_Pilot: Hope to get someone on the zone that has a slant pro get me VFD peramaters
04:00 AM gloops: no book with it i take it then Contract
04:00 AM Contract_Pilot: I have the manuals but tormach does things a bit funkey
04:01 AM Contract_Pilot: And no manual with the BOB hahaha... only get 1 to play with dont want to let the smoke out..
04:06 AM gloops: i only really know the chinese mach 3 bob and the one vfd ive got, hy thing
04:07 AM Contract_Pilot: Yea, to bad there was no standard in what they call items hahahaha
04:08 AM Contract_Pilot: https://forum.linuxcnc.org/pathpilot/33705-making-life-a-little-simpler-new-bob-for-the-lathe?start=10#104657
04:08 AM gloops: only problem i had with the parameters was the setting for pwn, it was set for 5v signal, i was using 10v, pretty obscure information in the 'manual'
04:19 AM Contract_Pilot: Yea, the manuals for the Emerson and Hitichi are hundreds of pages hahaha
04:22 AM Contract_Pilot: hope somone on the forum or the files can give me some assistance or it will be trial and error hahaha...
04:22 AM Contract_Pilot: Wish i knew what i did with my scope i think i loaned it out a few years ago.
05:00 AM jthornton: morning
05:01 AM XXCoder: yo
05:29 AM jthornton: yea it's sunny today with a high of 35°F... maybe the UPS weenies will deliver all my packages today
05:30 AM XXCoder: nah they will wait till its very rainy and cold and deliver em
05:30 AM jthornton: Saturday looks like the day to change out the nest box
05:31 AM jthornton: UPS and the trash man will not come out here if there is any sign of snow on the road however FedEx and USPS will
05:31 AM XXCoder: use fake snow see if it stops em ;)
05:36 AM jthornton: maybe when I'm not expecting a package or 3 lol
05:37 AM XXCoder: :)
05:44 AM jthornton: just got my first large egg, they have all been small to medium or a double yolk three times
05:45 AM XXCoder: yay
05:54 AM Tom_itx: 18°F with a high of 48
05:54 AM jthornton: 13°F with a high of 35°F and sunny
05:55 AM Tom_itx: with a slight chance of paint today
05:56 AM XXCoder: jt one of interesting things you could is make egg cnc, it draws on egg with cnc machine
05:56 AM XXCoder: you have plenty of junk cnc parts im sure lol
05:56 AM jthornton: yup
05:56 AM XXCoder: https://egg-bot.com/
05:57 AM jthornton: first you need to laser scan the egg to get the shape
05:57 AM XXCoder: eggbot dont need that
06:01 AM SpeedEvil: just approach until the pen touches
06:01 AM XXCoder: or just use servo with spring
06:02 AM XXCoder: then it doesnt care if egg is little bigger or smaller
06:02 AM SpeedEvil: yeah - doesnt need sensing
06:02 AM XXCoder: eggbot uses 2 pancake nema17s and one servo
06:07 AM SpeedEvil: Now, work out how to make it for $5 and rapidly shell boiled eggs
06:08 AM XXCoder: axidraw used to test mouses lol https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPfZdZaTGG4
06:08 AM SpeedEvil: :)
06:09 AM XXCoder: I wonder how good my mouse is lol
06:16 AM XXCoder: its kinda brilliant when you think about it
06:17 AM XXCoder: you cant repeat it with human as factor
06:17 AM XXCoder: but cnc no problem! cant pin issue on human, just mouse.
06:17 AM SpeedEvil: You can in a way that you don't actually care at all
06:17 AM SpeedEvil: and is more relevant
06:17 AM XXCoder: human factors would be how it feels, how easy it is to use, so on
06:18 AM XXCoder: cnc testing for techinical side
06:18 AM SpeedEvil: Put a couple of bits of wood down in a right angle, fixed, and then move the mouse around, occasionally putting it into the corner for drift
06:18 AM XXCoder: mouse rotation would cause distance changes
06:18 AM XXCoder: its not eprfectly round after akk
06:18 AM SpeedEvil: hmm
06:31 AM SpeedEvil: I'm not completely sure his clamping solution is not rotational
06:32 AM XXCoder: dunno, though as long as it dont rotate post-clamp its fine I think
06:33 AM SpeedEvil: those sorts of clamps aren't very rigid, and the small force may induce rotations
06:34 AM XXCoder: possible
06:34 AM XXCoder: though with force so littlke
06:34 AM XXCoder: dunno. it may indeed cause it to draft just enough
06:51 AM jthornton: I guess I need to add fix the water heater to my list
07:55 AM Contract_Pilot: Wow fast reply on the zone....
07:56 AM Contract_Pilot: Now crack open thi 400 page manual andtry and learn how to set this drive up to freq input
07:59 AM XXCoder: you sure that 400 page book is not just index for rest of manual? ;)
08:09 AM gloops: well, 2 screws on X, i can send the gantry along by turning one screw, the other side rotates with it /me chalks 'thats it' under the screw affair
08:18 AM Contract_Pilot: yea like bad 1980'shi gi instructions
08:19 AM Contract_Pilot: hi fi
08:59 AM archivist: bah some bum beat me https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/small-bakelite-cased-Prism-by-Hilger-Watts-Ltd-London/401473049450
09:02 AM sync: this thing is for surveyors tho
09:02 AM archivist: yup was going to re-case for machine measuring and see how accurate they are
09:03 AM sync: the main problem is that they are quite small
09:03 AM archivist: considering the distances are much larger for surveying, they should be reasonable for machine use
09:04 AM sync: yeah I wondered about that
09:04 AM archivist: the entry hole of a HP optical square is probably smaller than those
09:05 AM sync: yes, but those are made for interferometers
09:06 AM sync: and not for autocollimators
09:09 AM archivist: often different markets command differing prices for similar accuracy
09:09 AM archivist: sellers like to hide that
09:10 AM sync: I have one of those hp squares and it is quite useless for use with an autocollimator
09:10 AM sync: the aperture is just too small
09:10 AM slipalong_: Anyone fitted a power drawbar to there mill. looking for advice on springing to hold the tool holder in place
09:11 AM archivist: the mirrors on my polygon are probably ok
09:12 AM archivist: slipalong, belville washers are often used
09:13 AM slipalong_: Im using a MT3 collet so do you think I will get away with using a strong coil spring.
09:13 AM slipalong_: Im having trouble sourcing the belleville washers
09:13 AM archivist: should be easy to find
09:13 AM slipalong_: Found a few on ebay but not sure what rating to ise
09:14 AM slipalong_: are they called belleville in the UK?
09:14 AM sync: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/232631747507
09:14 AM sync: ah interesting
09:15 AM sync: the autocollimator insert looks like this
09:15 AM sync: I need to get a second alighment telescope and make the autocollimator insert
09:16 AM archivist: some of the autocollimators are one axis some two, and there are lower grade versions called angle dekkor
09:16 AM archivist: minefield
09:17 AM archivist: slipalong_, something like that yes, I got some direct from the uk maker many years ago
09:18 AM archivist: wanted to put a couple of tons on a paper roller
09:19 AM sync: nah, with the MAT you can't really go wrong
09:19 AM sync: as there is only a metric and non metric version
09:19 AM slipalong_: Ive found a supplier, but not sure which ones to ask for.
09:19 AM sync: pretty happy that I got a sweep square
09:20 AM archivist: depends on spring rate(dia,thickness) needed and distance to compress(how many)
09:20 AM slipalong_: Its a MT3 collet so 3 mm should so it.
09:21 AM archivist: collets dont usually have the right button to pull in unless you are adding that
09:21 AM slipalong_: so if each compresses .5mm then I need 6
09:22 AM archivist: usually you compress a lot less each, more washers
09:22 AM slipalong_: Im adding a phnumatic ram on top
09:22 AM IchGucksLive: hi from germany
09:22 AM slipalong_: ah ok
09:23 AM slipalong_: so I will go for 12
09:24 AM slipalong_: so I need to work out how much force I will get out of a 4" ram with 100psi air supply
09:24 AM slipalong_: then get the apropriate washers
09:24 AM archivist: just counted 40 ish pairs in something here
09:25 AM slipalong_: so that move .5 mm each
09:25 AM archivist: you are unlikely to get that much movement each washer
09:25 AM slipalong_: 40 would be a lot of hight to add to the top of a spindle
09:26 AM slipalong_: spinning at 6000 rpm
09:26 AM * gloops notes archivists plan for future consideration
09:26 AM archivist: slipalong_, ask andypugh next time he is in
09:27 AM slipalong_: will do. Thanks for the help again!
09:27 AM archivist: this stack here is about 6 inches
09:29 AM gloops: with large format cameras, with tilt/shift ability, you can read square by the focus of the image hitting the back
09:29 AM IchGucksLive: bright sunshine no wind after a hevy storm
09:29 AM gloops: viewed through ground glass
09:29 AM archivist: is extended 12mm with nut off, impossible to put back together without a press
09:30 AM slipalong_: so I can go for 75% less washers
09:30 AM slipalong_: and hight
09:31 AM slipalong_: about 40 mm
09:31 AM archivist: iirc this is the spring for some hydraulic thing
09:31 AM slipalong_: any idea of the spring rate
09:31 AM slipalong_: yes a drawbar
09:32 AM archivist: there are some pull force things on the web for various tapers,
09:33 AM slipalong_: I only use 12mm end mills max so boot need to go mad
09:34 AM slipalong_: be good if I could do some maths to get some idea though
09:34 AM archivist: http://tacrockford.com/product/gauges/force-check/technical/typical-power-drawbar-clamping-forces/
09:35 AM archivist: http://www.calqlata.com/productpages/00041-help.html
09:36 AM archivist: http://www.clamprite.com/orderinginfo.htm
09:41 AM Contract_Pilot: got some spindle speed control now need to find the setting to get it to go...
09:41 AM Contract_Pilot: only giving me max 8HZ
09:42 AM gloops: ive just got to get a bandsaw to pass under the router and change places with it
09:42 AM archivist: jack and pack, rollers
09:42 AM archivist: or take it to bits again
09:44 AM gloops: it will go under whole if i can lay it down and twist it to the right angle, gonna have a go in a bit
10:02 AM ziper: is this a good deal https://miami.craigslist.org/mdc/bfs/d/lathe-john-lang-sons-of/6439200893.html
10:03 AM archivist: heh the Johnstone museum is using some of my pics
10:05 AM archivist: http://johnstonehistory.org/tools/gallery.dwp?&tool=gallery&task=album&gallery_id=223&album_id=757
10:06 AM gloops: 8ft bed
10:06 AM archivist: real lump of cast iron
10:07 AM gloops: handy, if youve got 4 mates to lift the job on
10:08 AM archivist: some bits of lang spotted on my travels http://www.collection.archivist.info/searchv13.php?searchstr=lang+pd
10:12 AM gloops: suppose it depends what you want to do ziper, look at the fittings for that lathe, the size of everything, thats an awful lot of work if youre only turnin 6 inch bits of 2 inch bar
10:16 AM gloops: dunno though it is a nice lathe lol i think
10:19 AM ziper: i wonder how his majestys standards differed from theirs
10:19 AM Rab: That plaque about paint & finish is pretty great.
10:20 AM Rab: Maybe it's the safety yellow on all the controls.
10:22 AM gloops: my lathe came off a ship, not in this class though, ive not noticed anything untoward for it having been on a ship, dont know how much ship lathes get used, probably not as much as one in a factory
10:22 AM archivist: during the war there were specified paint standards too
10:23 AM archivist: a lathe would generally have a "war finish" badge
10:23 AM gloops: probably kept clean and well maintained
10:23 AM archivist: until the current owner :)
10:24 AM gloops: lol, well it was probably scrap anyway, bloke restores machines including steam engines, i dont think he was going to bother with mine
10:28 AM archivist: cannot see taper attachment as claimed
10:29 AM archivist: I dont call the topslide a taper attachment
10:34 AM SpeedEvil: On some lathes, it's the ways
10:35 AM MarcelineVQ: "<archivist> I dont call the topslide a taper attachment" XD
10:35 AM archivist: there is an extra guide behind for taper turning
10:36 AM archivist: hangs off the rear of the carriage like http://www.collection.archivist.info/archive/DJCPD/PD/2014/2014_04_17_Southbend_lathe/IMG_1796.JPG
10:42 AM Contract_Pilot: Think i am gonna take my drugs and call it a morning some progress...
10:42 AM Contract_Pilot: Cannot wait to get this buttoned up.
10:59 AM Loetmichel: maaan, i think my ride wants a new turbocharger soon... just drove off the diesel today with open windows... *knockknockknockknock [kickdown] rrrrrrooooOOOOOAAAAARRRRR PFUUUUIIIIIIIIIIII* ... only when cold though, so the turbo bearing may be THAT bad... interstingly you dont hear a thing with windows closed, seems the Omega is pretty well insulated ;)
11:03 AM dave__ is now known as gloops
11:07 AM * gloops cant wait to be looking at linuxcnc again
11:08 AM gloops: if i was building a small mill id get something like this - half the job done https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Cross-Milling-Machine-Working-Table-Compound-Precision-2-Axis-75mm-X-75mm/142656800575?
11:15 AM Contract_Pilot: http://www.stevenrhine.com/VFD/Tormach%20Lathe%20and%20Mill%20VFD%20Programming.xls
11:16 AM Tom_itx: that looks like a drill table
11:16 AM Tom_itx: i've got one i've never found use for
11:16 AM jthornton: I gave mine away
11:22 AM archivist: tiny xy travels
11:23 AM gloops: not big no, but motors on that - away it goes
11:24 AM Tom_itx: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/cnc/Mill_Steel/Paint/
11:26 AM Tom_itx: now i sit and wait
11:29 AM Tom_itx is now known as Tom_L
11:29 AM gloops: hope you dont have to wait as long as i did heh
11:29 AM Tom_L: that's the 2nd coat
11:29 AM Tom_L: on most of it
11:29 AM IchGucksLive: hi
11:29 AM gloops: hello
11:29 AM Tom_L: ich
11:29 AM gloops: well, im moving again, still a bit to do though
11:37 AM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
11:39 AM IchGucksLive: will ther be a RT on 18.04
11:43 AM IchGucksLive: so DT today did grab the money he needs to build the big wall
11:43 AM IchGucksLive: and all from foreners
11:43 AM fragalot: really?
11:43 AM Tom_L: i thought his friends from the south were buying that for him
11:43 AM IchGucksLive: he is the best ever
11:44 AM fragalot: how did he manage that
11:44 AM Tom_L: probably threaten trade
11:44 AM IchGucksLive: Apple did it
11:45 AM fragalot: IchGucksLive: how did you fare in the storm?
11:46 AM IchGucksLive: sitting and grapping tree down infos from my 65km zone
11:48 AM IchGucksLive: is this 15.000.000.000 Billion ?
11:48 AM fragalot: depends on US or UK
11:48 AM IchGucksLive: lots of money saved today
11:49 AM IchGucksLive: or name it the otherway taypayer lost
11:49 AM IchGucksLive: tax
11:50 AM IchGucksLive: all good as DT said we grabed 35Billion
11:50 AM fragalot: 1000 mil in US, 1 mil mil in UK
11:50 AM fragalot: so i'd rather be a billionaire in the UK
11:51 AM Tom_L: i'd be happy to be a billionaire anywhere
11:51 AM IchGucksLive: Tom_L: not a best as everyone knowa you and like you to take part
11:52 AM Tom_L: yeah i don't need those friends
11:52 AM fragalot: I don't know Tom_L
11:52 AM IchGucksLive: living behid bars is not fun
11:52 AM fragalot: so there's no risk in him giving me money
11:52 AM gloops: money doesnt always make people happy
11:52 AM gloops: and free things can make people happy
11:52 AM fragalot: gloops: it does up to a point
11:53 AM fragalot: once you have enough to live a worry free life, more is not better
11:53 AM Tom_L: i'm just saying if i was in that position i wouldn't mind too much where
11:53 AM gloops: fragalot they still find other reasons to be depressed
11:53 AM fragalot: gloops: of course
11:53 AM IchGucksLive: the freek tht got 357MILION this wek showing all on Facebook
11:53 AM fragalot: but being depressed ebcause you can't pay rent is another matter
11:53 AM gloops: a few mill would do me
11:54 AM IchGucksLive: 500.000 bet to win
11:54 AM IchGucksLive: best
11:54 AM fragalot: actually, if you look in history at things people have done to get rich, it's pretty fun
11:54 AM IchGucksLive: or 2.500 livetime pention
11:54 AM Tom_L: does UK have a lottery?
11:54 AM fragalot: 1) MIT students figured out that you could force a 10% win if you spent enough on a certain lottery
11:54 AM fragalot: so they did that for years
11:55 AM fragalot: 2) someone figured out based on spam being sent in the early days of the internet that certain ones affected the stock market
11:55 AM gloops: thre was a kid from a slum won 8 million here, he bought a stately home and had his mates round joyriding cars in the garden haha
11:55 AM gloops: think hes skint again now
11:55 AM fragalot: filter out which ones, invest at the start of the spam, sell when he predicted it to drop
11:55 AM fragalot: etc
11:55 AM gloops: Tom yeah we have lottery
11:56 AM IchGucksLive: Spain is cool they get everything out 2days befor X-mas
11:57 AM IchGucksLive: firer alarm BYE
11:58 AM gloops: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1440199/Lotto-lout-gives-neighbours-hell-by-racing-bangers-round-garden.html
12:00 PM fragalot: I should really make URL's clickable in cygwin at some point
12:01 PM Rab: More detail needed on these alleged "old bangers".
12:06 PM gloops: just cheap cars Rab, there was a documentary on TV about it, i think he eventually blew all the money and just went back to his old life
12:10 PM fragalot: as you do
12:17 PM Loetmichel: gloops: IIRC he has a few mil debt now
12:17 PM Loetmichel: on top of blowing all the money
12:17 PM fragalot: once you have enough debt, everything is fine again
12:20 PM gloops: leopards never change their spots
12:43 PM gloops: still need to get some shielded cable
12:47 PM fragalot: wrap everything in tin foil
12:56 PM gloops: i have got some copper tape but apparently its no good
12:56 PM gloops: plus winding yards and yards of cable in it isnt a very appealing prospect
12:57 PM fragalot: LOL
12:57 PM fragalot: -caps
01:05 PM gloops: http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Best_Wiring_Practices < its all here in the docs
01:10 PM gloops: would this be ok - https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/4-core-1-5mm-SY-control-cable-motor-multicore-flex-shielded-braided-armoured/302536572835?
01:13 PM fragalot: order a length of 5.755km
01:13 PM fragalot: as they claim it will be supplied in 1 continuous length
01:14 PM gloops: shielded and armoured, that sounds ideal, i have no idea about the load or anything though
01:14 PM fragalot: armoured might not be ideal
01:15 PM fragalot: since this is likely going to a spindle that will move a lot, the cable must be designed to flex repeatedly
01:15 PM gloops: too stiff?
01:15 PM gloops: hmm
01:15 PM fragalot: but the "armoured" in the link you sent is likely marketing wank
01:16 PM fragalot: it's just braided shielding
01:16 PM fragalot: also, 5-core may be cheaper as it's more common
01:17 PM Rab: The shield strands are relatively few and thick, finer shield would be more flexible and robust. But it might not be a problem.
01:19 PM gloops: i think its steel braiding though not copper, nothing really comes up in ebay if you type - stepper motor cable, or cnc cable
01:21 PM Rab: The description claims "Galvanised Steel Wire Braid Armour", sounds legit.
01:22 PM Rab: Polyurethane jacket would be better than PVC.
01:26 PM gloops: might be as well just going to electrical supplies shop and telling them what its for
01:26 PM fragalot: yup
01:27 PM fragalot: ask for shielded continuous bending cables
01:27 PM fragalot: don't use a CY or LIYCY cable as it will degrade rapidly
01:27 PM MrHindsight: crane or festoon cable
01:28 PM MrHindsight: robot servo cable
01:29 PM MrHindsight: https://www.wireandcableyourway.com/images/products/6636.JPG this is armored cable, it's not made to be flexed except during installation
01:30 PM fragalot: never seen a ribbed cable
01:30 PM gloops: i was just thinking the steel braid might be ok in the event of a knock or something
01:31 PM MrHindsight: https://cnc-specialty-store.com/images/motor-cables-plugs-amphenol/servo-motor-encoder-cable.gif
01:31 PM Rab: fragalot, it's this with a plastic jacket. Meant for building electrical: http://healthybuildingscience.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/85/2013/01/bx-02cw.jpg
01:32 PM fragalot: Rab: US cables?
01:32 PM fragalot: ribbed just seems.. annoying to work with
01:32 PM Rab: fragalot, I guess so. Very common here.
01:32 PM Rab: If you need flexibility, it's less annoying than rigid conduit. ;)
01:33 PM Rab: But certainly not appropriate for repetitive flexing.
01:33 PM fragalot: i'm more thinking of it snagging on anything and everything during installation if you're doing it alone :P
01:34 PM MrHindsight: you want whatever the gauge conductors required made with the thinnest strands possible
01:34 PM MrHindsight: same for the shielding
01:35 PM fragalot: and a high flex jacket
01:35 PM fragalot: no use having super flexible conductors if the jacket falls apart :P
01:40 PM MrHindsight: https://scciclient.blob.core.windows.net/ecdcontrolscom/uploads/documents/productdetail/lutze-driveflex-a220-series-07-23-14-2320.pdf
01:40 PM gloops: https://www.cnc4you.co.uk/4-Core-Screened-Cable-0.75mm-12Amp
01:40 PM gloops: i metre lengths what use is that
01:40 PM fragalot: surely they are cut to length?
01:41 PM fragalot: still, 0.75 is a tad thing isn't it?
01:41 PM fragalot: thin
01:41 PM fragalot: also, this is plain CY cable; it is not suitable for flex applications
01:41 PM gloops: says ok for 12 amps
01:43 PM MrHindsight: without a temperature spec it's meaningless
01:43 PM fragalot: depends on the duty-cycle applied to it.. May be OK to connect a stepper, but really that spec is made up
01:43 PM MrHindsight: Standards: Generally to BS6500
01:44 PM MrHindsight: so we get this from China, it's cheap so don't complain
01:44 PM fragalot: what you could do
01:44 PM fragalot: is set up 4 copper bars
01:44 PM fragalot: with 4 spring loaded brushes
01:44 PM fragalot: and skip the whole cable part
01:45 PM Tom_L: gloops, i got 18ga shielded for mine
01:46 PM Tom_L: https://www.digikey.com/products/en/cables-wires/multiple-conductor-cables/473?k=2424c&k=&pkeyword=2424c&pv77=2076&FV=fffc0584%2Cfffc00d8%2Cfffc01a0%2Cfffc1f99&mnonly=0&ColumnSort=0&page=1&quantity=0&ptm=0&fid=0&pageSize=25
01:46 PM Rab: Ideally you will have many small strands per conductor, for maximum flexibility. "Real" industrial wire will have specs for the strand configuration. At work we use extremely tough control cable for high-vibration applications; the conductors are 22ga (0.645mm) consisting of 19x 34ga (0.160mm) strands each. The jacket is polyurethane, almost (not quite) indestructable.
01:47 PM fragalot: PUR++
01:47 PM Tom_L: yeah i was lucky enough to find some surplus like that for my limit switches
01:47 PM Tom_L: very fine braided wire
01:48 PM Rab: For flexibility on a budget, industrial audiovisual cable has similar construction and it's a little easier to find and purchase by the foot. I use Canare Star Quad mic cable for a lot of low-voltage applications. It's extremely durable and flexible.
01:49 PM Rab: Unfortunately a lot of AV cable isn't rated for high voltage/current, though.
01:50 PM Rab: Probably fine for small steppers, but not suitable for 240VAC spindle.
01:50 PM fragalot: or make it longer and have a huge bend radius to reduce flexing
01:50 PM fragalot: :P
01:50 PM Rab: Yeah, I think half the battle is constraining the cable so it avoids the worst fatigue modes.
01:52 PM Rab: Hence e-chain, and carefully fixing the wiring where it enters and exits the chain.
01:52 PM fragalot: and nowhere else.
01:54 PM MrHindsight: another corner cut by Chinaco routers/mills..
01:54 PM Tom_L: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/cnc/psu/wire.jpg
01:54 PM Tom_L: i wish i could get some more of that
01:55 PM MrHindsight: it works for a while out of the box but the cables soon wear since they use whatever was cheapest vs what is appropriate
01:55 PM MrHindsight: they would use solid thermostat cable if they could get away with it
01:56 PM Tom_L: hah
01:58 PM fragalot: MrHindsight: i'm more impressed they haven't tried using the frame as one of the conductors
01:58 PM gloops: right thats more good info thanks
02:02 PM MrHindsight: fragalot: O often purchase older machines where they have used the frame as a neutral
02:03 PM MrHindsight: O/I
02:04 PM fragalot: that'd be brilliant in EU where it's rare to have neutral be ground too
02:04 PM gloops: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/ALL-CY-CABLE-0-75MM-16MM-2-CORE-5-CORE-CY-CONTROL-FLEXIBLE-CABLE-PER-METRE/171352110328?
02:04 PM MrHindsight: some expert tech has gotten to the wiring
02:04 PM gloops: probably wouldnt last long
02:04 PM fragalot: gloops: that too, is a CY cable
02:04 PM fragalot: which is intended for permanent installation
02:05 PM Rab: "Suitable for fixed installations or for flexible use when temporarily moved, and in conditions of medium mechanical stress."
02:05 PM fragalot: flexible use -> you may move the part to the side for maintenance with the cable connected
02:06 PM Rab: rite
02:06 PM Rab: Hmm, the Canare mic cable is rated for 500V...conductors too small for power applications though.
02:07 PM gloops: SY cable then?
02:07 PM gloops: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/SY-CABLE-0-75MM-16MM-FLEXIBLE-CONTROL-BRAIDED-CABLE-X1M-X10M-X25M-X50M-100M/172012648361?
02:07 PM fragalot: SY is even worse
02:08 PM Rab: Doesn't look encouraging: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SY_control_cable
02:09 PM gloops: It is a highly flexible multicore cable, with (class 5)[which?]copper conductors and a galvanised steel wire braid (GSWB) for mechanical protection. The cable is typically manufactured with PVC insulation, bedding and a transparent PVC sheath.[2] The transparent sheath means signs of deterioration, damage or corrosion can be detected with ease.
02:09 PM MrHindsight: https://www.iewcsolutions.co.uk/products/wire-and-cable/industrial-and-control-cable/motor-and-drive-cable/vfd#/manufacturer%3Bgauge%20size%3B%23%20of%20conductors%3Bjacket%20material%3Boverall%20shielding%20type?_k=0jpspn
02:09 PM gloops: this is not dedicated shielding though, ive got plenty of ordinary wire
02:10 PM gloops: offers 'some shielding protection'
02:10 PM Rab: gloops, I believe they are using "flexible" simply as an antonym of "rigid", without implication of highly repetitive stress.
02:11 PM gloops: yeah i think they are Rab
02:11 PM MrHindsight: http://www.ukcables.co.uk/cables/tri-flex-plus
02:12 PM gloops: saved those links MrHindsight thanks
02:14 PM fragalot: note that VFD cable is great for shielding, but may not be intended to flex continuously
02:14 PM gloops: lol
02:15 PM gloops: only the y z and spindle wires are going to move
02:15 PM Rab: Here's the good stuff: https://www.igus.com/wpck/5560/app_overview_Chainflex
02:15 PM Rab: Hmm, lots of Chainflex on US eBay. Not super cheap.
02:16 PM gloops: yes anything over £40 is out
02:16 PM MrHindsight: http://uk.farnell.com/w/c/cable-wire-cable-assemblies/multicore-cable/screened-multicore-cable?range=inc-in-stock
02:18 PM fragalot: tbh, you're going to be cheapest off just going to the local cable farm
02:18 PM MrHindsight: gloops how many conductors do you need? and what gauge?
02:19 PM gloops: well 4 for the motors,
02:20 PM gloops: gauge pretty thin, .75 or 1mm
02:20 PM fragalot: http://uk.farnell.com/lapp-kabel/1027761/shld-flex-cable-4cond-0-75mm2/dp/2813466
02:21 PM gloops: that does look better, finer braiding than the ones on ebay
02:22 PM Rab: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Wire-control-cable-OLFLEX-FD-CLASSIC-810-4G2-5mm2-PVC-grey-5-pcs/222743416417
02:22 PM fragalot: ölflex is what we typically use for e-chains
02:22 PM fragalot: and like I said - the local cable farm will have it cheaper
02:24 PM fragalot: Rab: shame that does not mention the length
02:24 PM fragalot: if that is 50m that's a pretty decent deal
02:24 PM gloops: i was looking for the length yeah
02:24 PM fragalot: but since it says "5pcs".. I'm skeptical, lol
02:25 PM Rab: fragalot, guessing it's 5m.
02:25 PM fragalot: then that is a ripoff extraordinaire
02:25 PM fragalot: it even states unopened in original retail packaging :P
02:25 PM gloops: well got a spot of painting to do bbl
02:29 PM MrHindsight: 5pcs 1cm long
02:29 PM MrHindsight: floor scraps
02:31 PM MrHindsight: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Staircase-timer-3m-30m-230VAC-DIN-20-45-C-IP20-16A/222743415873 why would you need a timer for stairs?!
02:31 PM fragalot: MrHindsight: it's for appartment buildings
02:31 PM fragalot: you push a pushbutton which activates the lights for X minutes
03:19 PM gloops: US economy to hit 5% growth
03:39 PM Deejay: gn8
04:48 PM Loetmichel: MrHindsight: in germany even small appartment builings have them in the staircaises
04:50 PM Loetmichel: i lived in one 4 stories high as a kid. we made fun of it to see if we could get up all 4 flights of stairs with one press of the button... which resulted in regular bruises when we missed the goal by a few steps and were engulfed in total darkness running up the stairs we could no longer see two steps a time :-)
04:51 PM Loetmichel: (they were timed to slowly climb up one flight and then retrigger the lights at the next button)
05:06 PM miss0r: My electrode spindle is starting to look pro :D https://imgur.com/a/FeLCd
05:17 PM Rab: miss0r, very nice!
05:18 PM Contract_Pilot: I may just have to wait 6 months and buy an Emerson VFD
05:18 PM miss0r: Thanks. I do feel rather pleased with myself ;)
05:20 PM Contract_Pilot: I ahve the settings for the Emerson VFD just having issues translating it to Hitachi WJ200 to many settings... http://www.stevenrhine.com/VFD/Tormach%20Lathe%20and%20Mill%20VFD%20Programming.xls
05:28 PM Contract_Pilot: gloops i am not feeling it.
05:29 PM pfred1: I'm feeling it
06:11 PM JT-Shop: oh fun learning a new HMI software... machine down old is not compatible... only machine in the world making this part... no pressure lol
06:14 PM jdh: which one
06:14 PM JT-Shop: hmi? Maple Systems
06:14 PM JT-Shop: or the part it's a parking brake part used in all cars in the US
06:15 PM pfred1: so a useless widget then
06:15 PM jdh: we have lots of non-replaceable maple systems
06:15 PM jdh: they were kinda cool 20 years ago
06:16 PM pfred1: ow a buddy of mine made these ittle plastic things that were in every bra in the world
06:16 PM jdh: new ones are nice for multi-protocol stuff
06:16 PM JT-Shop: they are cost effective but I've never used their software
06:16 PM pfred1: there's an indispensible item!
06:19 PM JT-Shop: oh well I've made some progress I've imported the AB tags and figured a few things out like PLC changing screens...
06:20 PM jdh: oh, you are using one of the new full screen panels?
06:20 PM JT-Shop: it's a 7" HMI
06:23 PM JT-Shop: oh well I know enough to be dangerous now time to quit for the night
06:36 PM roycroft: i ordered some new saw blades
06:36 PM roycroft: the local store were out of stock with no eta
06:36 PM roycroft: so i went online
06:36 PM roycroft: and saved heaps of money
06:36 PM roycroft: but it was still $200 for two blades
06:37 PM roycroft: and then another $50 for a couple zero clearance inserts
06:37 PM roycroft: yikes
06:38 PM * roycroft needs to stop spending money on things not budgeted
06:42 PM pfred1: I make my own zero clearancei nserts
06:49 PM MrHindsight: Loetmichel: I would have done the same. We used to climb the stairway without touching the steps.
06:49 PM MrHindsight: you could only use the railings and window frames and trim
06:50 PM MrHindsight: it was like rock climbing
07:12 PM roycroft: i've made my own, but it takes time to make them well
07:12 PM roycroft: and i don't need to replace them when replacing a blade with an identical one
07:13 PM roycroft: the blades i purchased today are new types for me
07:13 PM roycroft: so it's a one time investment
07:16 PM Contract_Pilot: Ok, I give up again on this VFD prob some tiny setting out of the hundreds...
07:16 PM Contract_Pilot: Nap time
07:17 PM roycroft: i am pretty close to having the prototype frame for my router table completed
07:17 PM roycroft: the next step is installing the router lift and getting the vfd working with the remote panel
07:17 PM roycroft: so that is likely to be what happens this weekend
07:41 PM Loetmichel: roycroft: that reminds me that i still have to wire the usb/rs485-adapter that i plugged into the CNC PC two years ago into the VFD and config linuxCNC correctly to set the speed...
07:41 PM Loetmichel: MAAAN am i lazy ;)
07:46 PM jdh: Loetmichel: mine is 2 or 3 years also
07:56 PM XXCoder: wow. hospitals got sick of high medicine prices
07:56 PM XXCoder: so they created new medicine company
08:15 PM Tom_L: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/cnc/Mill_Steel/Paint/Paint4.jpg
08:23 PM pfred1: Tom_L how did you weld the frame straight?
08:24 PM Tom_L: carefully
08:24 PM Tom_L: i will shim the column a little bit when i go to align it all
08:24 PM pfred1: I welded up a little box once when I clamped it up it was 0.001 out of square when it cooled down it was 0.005 out of square
08:25 PM pfred1: I had about twice as many clamps on that box by weight as the piece itself too
08:25 PM Tom_L: heh i know what you mean
08:25 PM pfred1: not even exaggerating i had huge C clamps all over it
08:26 PM pfred1: but just heating up and cooling down there was no stopping it from moving
08:26 PM Tom_L: i tacked it all then went back and added short beads
08:26 PM pfred1: there's a video on Youtube where this guy welds with a laser on the steel
08:26 PM pfred1: and yo ucan see the beam moving back and forth on the target
08:27 PM pfred1: it don't stop where it started either
08:27 PM pfred1: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0pf-qQDslhU
08:29 PM jesseg: haha welding with a laser.. I initially thought he had a 1500W laser pointer :P
08:29 PM Tom_L: you can always take it to a shop and have it normalized
08:29 PM Tom_L: or if it's a small enough piece, put it in a pottery kiln
08:33 PM pfred1: what Catepillar does is they weld stuff then they machine it
08:33 PM pfred1: they use jigs that weigh tons too
08:34 PM XXCoder: pfred1: Tom_L I guess you tacked em in then welded it so it dont get bent
08:34 PM XXCoder: also, nice work so far!!
08:34 PM XXCoder: went for blue I see
08:34 PM pfred1: I like battleship gray for homebuilt machinery
08:35 PM XXCoder: you plan to use some program to mill slots or bolt holes or something?
08:38 PM Tom_L: i'm thinking a bolthole pattern maybe
08:38 PM Tom_L: also add a sacrificial plate to the top of it
08:38 PM XXCoder: cool
08:38 PM Tom_L: like i do on my sherline
08:39 PM Tom_L: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/cnc/Mill_Steel/Assembly/Mill_Assembly2.jpg
08:39 PM Tom_L: you can see the plate on the sherline there
08:40 PM XXCoder: ho I spy a tiny mill
08:40 PM XXCoder: thats gow you made some of parts on larger?
08:41 PM Tom_L: yeah
08:41 PM Tom_L: not very many
08:41 PM pfred1: damn this kernel looks good
08:42 PM Tom_L: i did the x y hole patterns on it
08:42 PM XXCoder: yeah tiny workspace
08:42 PM Tom_L: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/cnc/Mill_Steel/Y_Axis_Plate1.jpg
08:43 PM XXCoder: bet that saves so much time
08:43 PM Tom_L: sure alot more accurate that way
08:43 PM Tom_L: over measuring and drilling
11:45 PM gloops: always a bit too far away https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Dust-Extractor/162852681686?
11:47 PM SpeedEvil: They're barely more than that, delivered
11:47 PM roycroft: that's pretty useless
11:47 PM roycroft: 750w
11:47 PM SpeedEvil: https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B005C9GXUK/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1
11:47 PM SpeedEvil: It's really not
11:47 PM roycroft: it's not going to be very effective
11:48 PM SpeedEvil: oops - wrong channel
11:48 PM SpeedEvil: It's fine over in ##woodworking
11:48 PM roycroft: my dust collector is 1hp and it can't keep up with my planer, and sometimes not with my table saw
11:49 PM SpeedEvil: what thickness of hose do you have back to the collector?
11:49 PM roycroft: if i ever start getting caught up on expenses i'm going to get a 2hp one
11:49 PM roycroft: 4"
11:49 PM roycroft: and a short one at that - 10'
11:49 PM SpeedEvil: 4" may be a bit tight
11:50 PM roycroft: i have a 0.5µ top bag on the collector
11:50 PM roycroft: that's part of the problem
11:50 PM roycroft: and it's a bag, not a pleated filter
11:50 PM roycroft: whenever i get a 2hp one i'll put a pleated filter on it
11:50 PM gloops: i thought these would be £200 or more
11:51 PM SpeedEvil: I need to add a case to mine, and swap teh bag round
11:52 PM gloops: 3kw http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/INCOMPLETE-Industrial-Vacuum-Cleaner-100L-3-Motors-Wet-Dry-Car-Carpet-Cleaning/273026224987?
11:52 PM gloops: you only need a 2 inch pipe for a router
11:53 PM roycroft: i'm enclosing my router in a box underneath the top of teh table
11:53 PM roycroft: there will be a 4" dust collection port on that box
11:53 PM roycroft: and i have an incra wonderfence
11:54 PM roycroft: it has a 2" vacuum hose connector on the fenc