#linuxcnc Logs
Nov 29 2017
#linuxcnc Calendar
12:21 AM IchGucksLive: hi
12:25 AM IchGucksLive: later
02:02 AM Deejay: moin
02:30 AM Contract_Pilot: Bored want to play
02:38 AM Contract_Pilot: I do need to pull these steppers off the lathe... new ones arriving from china next week i hope and hope they work.
02:38 AM Contract_Pilot: 3phase
04:51 AM jthornton: morning
04:56 AM TurBoss: morning
05:57 AM Tom_L: morning
06:21 AM jthornton: hows the mill coming along?
06:37 AM XXCoder: jthornton: saw mini table thingy for drill press
06:37 AM XXCoder: makes it into mini mill
06:37 AM XXCoder: pretty awesome
06:38 AM jthornton: I had a cheap one but it had acres of slop so pretty useless
06:38 AM XXCoder: this is whole kit https://www.aliexpress.com/item/220-V-680W-Quality-Mini-Electric-DIY-Drill-Variable-Speed-Micro-Drill-Press-Machines/32819057326.html
06:39 AM XXCoder: no way to remove backlash?
06:41 AM jthornton: I gave it away lol
06:41 AM jthornton: that's a purdy one
06:41 AM XXCoder: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Precision-multifunction-Milling-Machine-Bench-drill-Vise-worktable-X-Y-axis-adjustment-Coordinate-table-2-5/32721798636.html
06:41 AM XXCoder: 33 bucks by itself
06:41 AM XXCoder: well plus shipping heh
06:41 AM archivist: pure chinesium
06:41 AM XXCoder: yep
06:42 AM XXCoder: free shipping https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Mini-Multifunctional-Cross-Working-Table-For-Drilling-Milling-Machine-Bench-Vise-Mechanic-Tools/32412116087.html
06:44 AM XXCoder: aww found one $16 but sold out
06:46 AM XXCoder: if I had shop I'd buy it just for learning
06:46 AM XXCoder: also nice for some other uses
06:46 AM XXCoder: I bet slop is nightmare though
06:47 AM XXCoder: I see that it has 3 set screws on front
06:47 AM XXCoder: https://ae01.alicdn.com/kf/HTB1n9QYFFXXXXXSaXXXq6xXFXXXr/Mini-Multifunctional-Cross-Working-Table-For-Drilling-Milling-Machine-Bench-Vise-Mechanic-Tools.jpg
06:48 AM XXCoder: y axis has in least one visiable
06:48 AM XXCoder: jthornton: what ya think
06:51 AM jthornton: looks better than the one I had
06:51 AM XXCoder: cool though im not buying one till shop exists.
07:05 AM XXCoder: I cant belive I didnt think of habitity for humanity for too long
07:05 AM XXCoder: they might take queen size futon bed
07:06 AM XXCoder: laters
07:07 AM jthornton: night
09:03 AM nos: It works! :D
09:03 AM nos: https://i.imgur.com/tDyrsA5.png
09:04 AM nos: andypugh, thanks!
09:07 AM nos: Chamfering in elliptic toolpaths is apparently an oft-requested feature among CNC customers, and seldom delivered, so I'm very happy to be able to verify this toolpath. :)
09:12 AM SpeedEvil: :)
09:14 AM SpeedEvil: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CVZXj53i9Js 'Chamfering in elliptic paths' (to the tune of
09:14 AM SpeedEvil: Together in Electric Dreams )
09:24 AM nos: :D
09:26 AM nos: The inro reminds me of this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IUVmcKcTZ4A
09:26 AM nos: Mort Garson[Plantasia] 1976 Full Album
09:26 AM nos: Music for plants.
09:26 AM nos: I tried it on a friend of mine who says he hates music.
09:26 AM nos: He didn't complain.
09:32 AM Simonious: https://snag.gy/kabC7S.jpg the y-axis on the DR is self zeroing sometimes and the behavior seems to be getting worse.. continuity is good from the inside of the encoder to the inside of the DR (not sure I got the encoder back together aligned the way it wants inside), what next?
09:33 AM SpeedEvil: nos: neat
09:35 AM Connor: Simonious: Try swapping the X and Y axis and see if it follows the scale, or stays on the same axis. Might be a issue with the DRO itself and not the scale.
09:55 AM Simonious: https://snag.gy/D7mrBs.jpg hmm, same behavior either way. If I disconnect both cables from the DRO and zero, the x-axis stays zeroed for a second or two before reverting to the tick mark.
09:55 AM Simonious: So.. maybe the DRO is hosed.
09:58 AM nos: :(
09:59 AM Connor: Stuck button?
09:59 AM Connor: or bad button?
09:59 AM Simonious: Hmm, interesting notion, I just pulled and cleaned all the buttons, but maybe
09:59 AM Connor: Cleaned them before or after this started?
10:00 AM Connor: If before, it's possible you used something that caused oxidation on the switch contacts..
10:02 AM Simonious: AFTER
10:03 AM Simonious: there was a stuck button, now the Y zeroes, but the X doesn't, switching the cables has no effect on that behavior, so..
10:03 AM Simonious: I'll take it apart and do a visual and connection run through on the X axis
10:04 AM Connor: So, it's 100% the DRO and not the scales.. the scales would only make the value tick up randomly if they where going bad.. or not at all... no way for them to reset to 0.
10:12 AM Connor: Simonious: The other thing to look for would be bad or swollen capacitors..
10:22 AM Simonious: Connor: hmm, good idea
10:23 AM Simonious: https://snag.gy/ZrYLvd.jpg This is what it looks like inside
10:23 AM Simonious: I swapped the board on the left with the one below it and I did see slightly different behavior in terms of which board would zero some of the time and which wouldn't.
10:25 AM Connor: You might try calling Accu-Rite and see if they can walk you through some more diagnostics..
10:26 AM archivist: magic key strokes to self test etc
10:26 AM Connor: What does swapping the boards around do? Change which reset button it's linked too?
10:26 AM Simonious: swapped the x and y displays, the displays are on the front of those boards
10:27 AM Simonious: so, yes, that too
10:27 AM Connor: Did it follow the swap?
10:30 AM Simonious: Connor: yes
10:30 AM Connor: Yea, okay.. so it's the board.. not the switch..
10:30 AM Simonious: also pulled the keypad to confirm it wasn't a key fault, same behavior, so that isn't it
10:31 AM Connor: and since it's only 1 of them, it's probably not the PSU.
10:31 AM Connor: especially since you swapped them around..
10:31 AM Simonious: This might be enough troubleshooting to justify stopping and getting another DRO, wonder if I can find a loaner..
10:32 AM Connor: Yup. You might be able to buy a new one off of ebay that'll work with those scales.
10:32 AM Connor: more modern one even..
10:33 AM archivist: the one I fixed forgot its setup, typed a bunch of instructions get it back to normal
10:33 AM Simonious: archivist: same kind of behavior I'm having?
10:33 AM archivist: not quite, cannot see your images
10:34 AM Simonious: oh? I thought that site was great for image share.
10:35 AM archivist: I get a grey screen, these silly sites are not using html, jut send some bad js to then load the image
10:36 AM Simonious: Bummer, I find that to be a very convenient site.
10:37 AM archivist: if I view source then I find https://i.snag.gy/ZrYLvd.jpg
10:37 AM archivist: not the same one I fixed
10:39 AM Simonious: http://www.acu-rite.com/pdf/manuals/obsolete/ACURITEIImanual.pdf starting p21 tehre are testpoints and troubleshooting tips
10:39 AM Simonious: *there
10:39 AM * Simonious ponders
10:39 AM archivist: hehe why use plain html when you can obscure with pagevars.image.getImageInfoResponse = {"info": {"url": "https://i.snag.gy/ZrYLvd.jpg", "can_edit": null}, "success": true};
10:39 AM Simonious: probably cheaper to buy a new one
10:44 AM archivist: just found the email, it had locked it back into single axis mode
10:44 AM archivist: it was a model 800
10:46 AM Connor: I still have to install my DRO on my bridgeport.. Not looking forward to it.. I'm so OCD I'll probably spend the whole day on just one axis..
10:58 AM skunkworks: The dro on our edm had a bad voltage regulator. The previous owners had replaced the Z axis scale - thinking that was bad but in reality - unplugging any one of the 3 scales made the dro work again.
10:59 AM archivist: scope and a dvm :)
11:01 AM gloops: this is fully operational? https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Table-Bench-Saw/292347704902?
11:02 AM archivist: barn find
11:02 AM gloops: that fence hasnt moved for decades lol
11:02 AM Simonious: skunkworks: checking the power supply is my next activity
11:03 AM archivist: gloops, at least it is old cast iron vintage
11:04 AM gloops: it probably is a good saw, would clean up, eventually
11:04 AM gloops: i wouldnt post that as fully operational though, maybe motor running
11:04 AM archivist: I drove within a few miles of atherstone on monday
11:05 AM archivist: untrustworthy for that statement
11:05 AM gloops: 60 mile from me anyway
11:05 AM archivist: 20 from me
11:16 AM hazzy: Anybody familiar with the MicroKinetics CNC control? www.microkinetics.com
11:16 AM hazzy: Is it based on EMC?
11:18 AM hazzy: I know a couple of people that were trying to help them with lathe tool wear compensation, I think they gave up ...
11:21 AM archivist: seems to be windaz
11:22 AM stjohn: hi guys, who is using their mill with a touch probe?
11:23 AM hazzy: archivist: Yes, it is windoze based, like Mach
11:24 AM archivist: stjohn, probably many ask a better question :)
11:24 AM stjohn: hi, you know how to set up touch probe with mill?
11:25 AM stjohn: archivist: actually touch probe is set up and i want to use it..
11:25 AM archivist: stjohn, do you mean with linuxcnc or any old mill
11:25 AM stjohn: archivist: was using probe_screen but it stopped working with latest axis update..
11:26 AM stjohn: archivist: this is linuxcnc channel?
11:26 AM archivist: check your hal pins etc then to see if it still connects correctly
11:26 AM archivist: has a pin name changed
11:27 AM stjohn: archivist: no, all that is working perfect. its a problem with axis and glade...
11:28 AM Connor: https://knoxville.craigslist.org/tls/d/nardini-fast-trace-cnc-tool/6405379154.html
11:28 AM stjohn: archivist: i get 'must be in mdi mode to issue mdi command...'
11:28 AM Connor: wonder what it would take to get it working via CNC
11:28 AM stjohn: archivist: i cant believe i am the only one using probe screen with latest axis version..
11:29 AM archivist: stjohn, not sure this is a probe problem at all iirc saw another related problem the other day
11:30 AM archivist: "mdi mode to issue mdi command" is nothing to do with probes
11:31 AM archivist: look at the recent bugs
11:31 AM stjohn: archivist: of course not...
11:32 AM stjohn: archivist: but this is what i am doing and this is where the problem arises..
11:32 AM IchGucksLive: hi
11:32 AM IchGucksLive: stjohn: hi im in germany
11:32 AM IchGucksLive: you better call a ngc that homes for you
11:32 AM stjohn: IchGucksLive: hi! we where talking yesterday..
11:32 AM IchGucksLive: the touch probe
11:33 AM stjohn: IchGucksLive: i was looking at your stuff but i was not sure how to use just the bit i wanted, the probing stuff...
11:33 AM IchGucksLive: o<znullen> sub
11:33 AM IchGucksLive: G91 ( relative mode for probing)
11:33 AM IchGucksLive: G38.2 Z-25 F100 ( trip switch on the way down)
11:33 AM IchGucksLive: G90 ( absolute mode)
11:33 AM IchGucksLive: G92 Z0 (set Z0 )
11:33 AM IchGucksLive: G1 Z3.5 F150 (move tool free)
11:34 AM IchGucksLive: o<znullen> endsub
11:34 AM IchGucksLive: M2
11:34 AM IchGucksLive: stjohn: please double klick my nickname
11:35 AM IchGucksLive: in the user frame
11:35 AM stjohn: IchGucksLive: yes, i did this but i cant see where the private chat channel has opened..
11:36 AM stjohn: IchGucksLive: how do i join it? sorry i am not an irc user.. lol
11:36 AM IchGucksLive: chat software you using ?
11:36 AM stjohn: IchGucksLive: weechat, i literally just installed it..
11:36 AM archivist: just use /msg nick
11:37 AM archivist: no need to click names
11:37 AM stjohn: archivist: thanks!
11:37 AM stjohn: archivist: nope, nothing..
11:39 AM IchGucksLive: stjohn: try slach querry my nick
11:39 AM IchGucksLive: query
11:41 AM IchGucksLive: ok no problem
11:55 AM IchGucksLive: hi daughertyh9008
11:59 AM Simonious: k, power supply is fine (logic was a little high, *may* have damaged things in the past), so I need a new DRO, don't care much what it looks like as long as it has a similar featureset and can read the quadrature signals
12:14 PM miss0r: So... messing about with the aircondition heater in here last night, and forgetting to turn it back on... My shop is now 6c inside. feck
12:14 PM miss0r: So no work tonight. I have to wait for everything to heat back up
12:21 PM Jymmm: miss0r: 2 gallons of gasoline and a road flare =)
12:22 PM miss0r: sorry. this is a metric shop. otherwise an excellent idea ;P
12:22 PM Jymmm: Fine (drama queen)... 5 kilos of petro and a metric road flare, happy now?
12:23 PM miss0r: hehehe. nah - the moment has passed
12:23 PM Jymmm: miss0r: Bite me and the queen you rode in on! ;)
12:23 PM miss0r: Good thing I was just down here to mess around a bit. No orders for tonight
12:26 PM miss0r: holy! This unit draws 4kW of power when you put it into "turbo mode"... With a 4.5-1 yield that is... 18kw of heat
12:26 PM miss0r: This shouldn't take too long. By tomorrow everything in here should be somewhat normalized
12:28 PM djdelorie: a centiflare?
12:29 PM Jymmm: djdelorie: KiloFlare ;)
12:29 PM djdelorie: how many kilocandles per deciflare?
12:30 PM miss0r: lol
12:31 PM Jymmm: djdelorie: 1^48 PJ's
12:31 PM Jymmm: djdelorie: PJ == PetaJoules
12:31 PM djdelorie: picojymmms ?
12:31 PM Jymmm: P, not p
12:31 PM djdelorie: petajymmms?
12:31 PM Jymmm: Joules
12:31 PM * djdelorie does not want that many pajamas
12:32 PM djdelorie: metric or otherwise
12:33 PM * miss0r sighs
12:34 PM miss0r: Its a wasps nest to mention anything metric/imperial in here
12:34 PM djdelorie: millinests
12:34 PM MrHindsight: nah
12:35 PM * Jymmm smacks djdelorie with a metric hammer and imperial crowbar!
12:35 PM miss0r: I think the people of the internet should adopt a system that is universal for all. Might I recommend metric ? :]
12:35 PM djdelorie: only if it includes swatch time
12:35 PM MrHindsight: SI
12:35 PM djdelorie: base 60 is not metric
12:35 PM Jymmm: djdelorie: I kinda like the idea of swatch time, in a way, sorta.
12:36 PM djdelorie: yeah, there's only two of us in our group at work that share a timezone. Time is a blurry concept.
12:36 PM Jymmm: miss0r: What are those things you get from the lumber yard that you frame a house/building with?
12:36 PM MrHindsight: once you get used to converting between units it doesn't really matter
12:37 PM djdelorie: Jymmm: hammers?
12:37 PM MrHindsight: like needing different languages all over Europe
12:37 PM Jymmm: djdelorie: No, they come from trees
12:37 PM djdelorie: wooden hammers?
12:37 PM djdelorie: treenails?
12:37 PM djdelorie: splinters?
12:37 PM MrHindsight: they could just standardize on European and forget about all the silly regional languages :)
12:38 PM miss0r: Jymmm: Are you referring to metric lumber beams?
12:38 PM Jymmm: miss0r: Are they metric?
12:38 PM djdelorie: I made a metric house once. It was 1/25.4th scale.
12:38 PM djdelorie: I had to buy ten dolls for it
12:38 PM miss0r: Jymmm: yeah. Leymen in the woodworkings, like myself, still refere to them in inches. but they are sold as metric
12:38 PM MrHindsight: miss0r: what do they call 2x4's there?
12:39 PM miss0r: 50x125mm
12:39 PM gloops: lol
12:39 PM miss0r: (a bit undersized actualy)
12:39 PM djdelorie: five by twelves?
12:39 PM MrHindsight: hmm thats like a 2x5
12:39 PM * miss0r hands djdelorie a calculator
12:40 PM djdelorie: I'm just reading what you wrote, converting from mm to cm
12:40 PM miss0r: lol yeah... its 50x100. my bad
12:40 PM djdelorie: five by tens then
12:40 PM gloops: pse = 44 x 94
12:40 PM Jymmm: Well a 2x4 is the ROUGH-CUT dimensions, but for framing actual dimensions is 1.5x3.5 inches
12:40 PM MrHindsight: 2x4's here are closer to 1.5 x 3.5 inch
12:40 PM djdelorie: or half a decimeter, except nobody uses decimeters or fractions in metric
12:41 PM miss0r: djdelorie: In the metal buisness everything is in mm
12:41 PM gloops: 4x2 - the material planed off
12:41 PM djdelorie: side note: why do they use mm/min instead of mm/sec
12:41 PM MrHindsight: typical ceiling heights here are 8 feet (from top of floor to bottom of ceiling)
12:41 PM miss0r: plumbers are doing half/half metric and inches actualy
12:42 PM gregcnc_: doh units again?
12:42 PM gloops: 2.4 metere
12:42 PM miss0r: gregcnc_: I might have sparked the fire. sorry
12:42 PM MrHindsight: so about an inch lower
12:43 PM MrHindsight: many items used in the building trades have names that revolve around their size in inches
12:43 PM gloops: you cant beat the old perpendicular design for houses, tall windows high ceilings
12:43 PM MrHindsight: just pondering what they are called outside the USA
12:43 PM gregcnc_: why are chocolate bars 90g now vs the std 100g? or it is some odd brand we found?
12:44 PM gregcnc_: 305mm polish sausage just doesn't sound right
12:44 PM miss0r: gregcnc_: you have no idea
12:44 PM miss0r: hahaha
12:44 PM MrHindsight: the most common electrical box here is 4" square or 1900 box
12:45 PM gloops: gregcnc that probably followed a big ad saying 5% off!
12:45 PM MrHindsight: 1/3 meter long hot dogs?
12:46 PM gloops: or they will release a new bar stating '10% extra free' - same as the old size
12:46 PM gregcnc_: that might stick
12:46 PM MrHindsight: this is why it will never change here :)
12:46 PM roycroft: you mean 0.3048m longs?
12:46 PM * miss0r does a facepalm
12:46 PM djdelorie: tridecilongs
12:46 PM MrHindsight: gallons are very popular, milk, gas, etc
12:47 PM MrHindsight: 3.75 L will never fly
12:47 PM gloops: do you still have hundredweights?
12:47 PM gregcnc_: put milk in 2 liter bottles
12:47 PM djdelorie: soda is already in 2L bottles
12:48 PM gregcnc_: right people would get it
12:48 PM MrHindsight: yeah they would have 2L and 4L bottles and jugs
12:48 PM gloops: the old farm hands used to moan about the sacks they carried. 8 stone - fine, 12 stone - heavy, 16 stone mans stuff
12:48 PM MrHindsight: buying gas would really confuse em
12:48 PM gloops: special technique to get 16 stone of wheat on your back
12:49 PM MrHindsight: stone is fun, I wish we used that here
12:49 PM roycroft: as long as we're on another metrification discussion, i do have one really big problem with american customary units that i think is inarguably a serious flaw
12:49 PM gregcnc_: we should have rated engine displacement in gallons
12:49 PM Jymmm: MrHindsight: Talk to andy about that
12:49 PM roycroft: we have a unit name that is identical for two different types of measurment - ounces
12:49 PM MrHindsight: 1/14 stone to lbs
12:49 PM miss0r: gregcnc_: That would yeild some curious decimals or some realy nice'n big engines
12:49 PM Jymmm: MrHindsight: I think it took him 12 years and 110 tons of stone to reroof the house
12:50 PM roycroft: and it's not always clear which type of measurement it's being applied to
12:50 PM roycroft: does a can of tomatoes contain 14.25 ounces of tomatoes or do the tomatoes in it weigh 14.25 ounces?
12:50 PM gregcnc_: liquids are fl oz, no?
12:50 PM MrHindsight: roycroft: yeah people here are used to fluids being in fluid oz
12:50 PM roycroft: but tomatoes are not liquids
12:50 PM roycroft: there is liquid in them
12:50 PM MrHindsight: yet to be accurate liquid chems are sold by weight
12:51 PM roycroft: but you really can't call them liquids
12:51 PM gloops: 16 stone = 224 lbs - or 2 hundred weight, lot to carry
12:51 PM roycroft: the cans don't state "fluid oz"
12:51 PM MrHindsight: 1Kg of alcohol
12:51 PM gregcnc_: usually it says net weight for mass
12:51 PM miss0r: roycroft: 'round here we have two weights on stuff like that. g / g(netto) - the latter defines what is actualy inside a can/box
12:51 PM roycroft: it just says "14.25 ouncs"
12:51 PM MrHindsight: can of tomatoes vs bag
12:51 PM Jymmm: 15 lbs of propane.... @ a specific temperature =)
12:52 PM MrHindsight: can will be in fluid oz
12:52 PM roycroft: um, 15 lbs of propane is 15 lbs of propane
12:52 PM gregcnc_: propane is difficult to measure any other way
12:52 PM MrHindsight: bag will be based on weight
12:52 PM roycroft: and it's dispensed as a liquid, so the meter is going to be fairly accurate
12:52 PM miss0r: unless you release it into a room to float around - hard to weigh it there, ha... HA?
12:52 PM MrHindsight: nah they sell it by the canister
12:52 PM Jymmm: gregcnc_: I meant as dispensed/filled, which is NEVER "by weight"
12:52 PM MrHindsight: then they only fill to ~70%
12:53 PM roycroft: when i buy gases at the welding outfitter there is a tare weight on the bottle
12:53 PM MrHindsight: so who really knows what you get
12:53 PM roycroft: i can easily determine how much gas is in it
12:53 PM Jymmm: gregcnc_: ...but volume.
12:53 PM MrHindsight: <--- these many
12:53 PM roycroft: when i refill my "non-refillable" propane tanks i fill by eeight
12:53 PM roycroft: weight
12:54 PM Jymmm: roycroft: I weight them before and after, so I make sure not to OVERFILL them
12:54 PM roycroft: they are not supposed to be refilled because it's allegedly difficult to determine how much is in them
12:54 PM djdelorie: and propane doesn't work if it doesn't have a bit of room to vaporize into
12:54 PM roycroft: i know that an average canister of propane - those little disposable ones used for camping stoved and lanterns - weighs about 850 grams when bought from the store
12:54 PM Jymmm: roycroft: And I date each tank when I refill it, and once it's been refilled 5x, I toss it.
12:55 PM roycroft: so when i refill them, i fill until they weigh 850g
12:55 PM Jymmm: roycroft: They have the net/gross/tare weight on them, use that.
12:55 PM roycroft: not the little disposable ones
12:55 PM Jymmm: the one lb ones is what I refill
12:55 PM roycroft: my bigger ones do
12:56 PM Jymmm: Mine to, I thinks it's a fed requirement
12:56 PM MrHindsight: gregcnc_: just FYI if you need a propane refill the menards usually has empty tanks left outside the self serve cages
12:56 PM roycroft: but propane is sold by the gallon
12:56 PM roycroft: and yes, the mass varies based on temperature, but not by very much
12:57 PM roycroft: it would be more accurate to sell it by weight
12:57 PM roycroft: although that would also vary, depending on where on the planet one happens to be when purchasing the propane
12:58 PM gloops: propane isnt very good for welding
12:58 PM MrHindsight: I use it for cutting
12:59 PM gloops: well its cheaper than acetylene
12:59 PM gregcnc_: I've seen the tanks before, didn't think much of it. people just leave them?
12:59 PM MrHindsight: oxy/propane
12:59 PM roycroft: even if you're at sea level, a given volume of propane would weigh more at the north pole than at the equator, since the earth is not a perfect sphere
12:59 PM roycroft: i mostly use propane for grilling and making beer
12:59 PM MrHindsight: gregcnc_: yes, they don't seem to get how it works
01:00 PM gregcnc_: at retail scales would be calibrated
01:00 PM MrHindsight: gregcnc_: they don't put the empty into the cage after removing the new tank
01:01 PM MrHindsight: I never fill my tanks at the north pole :)
01:04 PM roycroft: then you're getting cheated :)
01:04 PM MrHindsight: the big adjustment here would be converting to kilometers and liters
01:04 PM roycroft: yay - it looks like aliexpress liked my order this time
01:04 PM roycroft: it has shipped
01:04 PM MrHindsight: even though speedometers in cars have had both units for decades
01:05 PM roycroft: actually, i think the biggest cultural challenge would be converting from fahrenheit to celcius
01:05 PM MrHindsight: km/h and m/hr
01:05 PM roycroft: people would figure that out soon
01:05 PM roycroft: as soon as they started getting expensive speeding tickets
01:06 PM MrHindsight: plus think of all the money to be made on replacing all the speed limit signs
01:06 PM roycroft: and as far as volume, much, if not most, liquids sold at supermarkets is sold in metric units already
01:07 PM roycroft: there would be a long transition period
01:07 PM roycroft: and during that period signs would be replaced as needed, i.e. as part of normal maintenance
01:07 PM roycroft: it's not like we'd all wake up one morning and every sign in the country would have been replaced
01:08 PM MrHindsight: they had them back in the 70's and early 80's
01:08 PM roycroft: yes
01:08 PM MrHindsight: MPH and km/h
01:08 PM roycroft: back when we legally adopted the metric system for the second time
01:08 PM Simonious: holy crap you've been talking about metric vs wackymeasures for 40 minutes in here!
01:09 PM roycroft: metric or imperial minutes?
01:10 PM Simonious: I like the way I said it better.
01:10 PM Jymmm: roycroft: Martian Minutes, cause time is relative to the rotation around the sun =)
01:10 PM MrHindsight: variety is the spice of life
01:11 PM MrHindsight: to many standards and it gets boring
01:11 PM MrHindsight: to/too
01:12 PM roycroft: but short periods of time are usually relative to the rotational period of the planet, not the orbital period
01:12 PM gregcnc_: why is the imperial gallon different than the US gallon? i probably used to know
01:12 PM roycroft: and the rotational period of mars is slightly longer than that of earth
01:12 PM roycroft: so martian minutes would logically be longer than earth minutes
01:12 PM MrHindsight: imperials sounds more formal
01:13 PM roycroft: because we defined it differently in the us than the brits did :)
01:13 PM roycroft: we also have both liquid and dry gallons in the us
01:13 PM MrHindsight: is there a metric gallon like the metric ton?
01:15 PM roycroft: there is not
01:15 PM MrHindsight: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slug_(unit) another fun one
01:16 PM roycroft: down in california (especially around santa cruz) there are banana slugs, which are humungous
01:17 PM MrHindsight: did gallons evolve completely unrelated to cubic inches and just happen to end up as an even 231cui?
01:20 PM gregcnc_: I thought US gallon is based on 8lb water.
01:20 PM MrHindsight: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gallon#History
01:20 PM MrHindsight: It had been redefined during the reign of Queen Anne, in 1706, as 231 cubic inches exactly
01:21 PM gloops: a gallon is a pigskin full
01:21 PM gloops: no pigs bladder, or could be goat
01:21 PM Jymmm: Then a cup must be a pregnant woman's bladder =)
01:21 PM gloops: inch - 1 thumb width
01:22 PM gloops: joiners didnt carry tape measures, they had a dried thumb
01:23 PM gloops: 1 foot = self explanatory
01:23 PM Jymmm: gloops: That must shock the ladies ;)
01:23 PM MrHindsight: I though it was hands, like handing down the family business, with actual hands from the father that passed away
01:23 PM hazzy: gloops: less arbitrary than the length of the path travelled by light in a vacuum in 1/299,792,458 of a second :P
01:24 PM gloops: well hands were used yes, and spans, yard = 3 feet or one pace (stride)
01:25 PM MrHindsight: I imagine that the foot was also shorter back then
01:25 PM gloops: and the funny thing is, you can measure the pyramids with lasers - theyre pretty bloody close to dead square
01:25 PM roycroft: the concept of geometry has been around for a long time :)
01:27 PM gloops: MrHindsight horses are still measured in hands?
01:27 PM roycroft: the meter was originally defined as 1/10,000,000 the distance from the equator to the north pole
01:27 PM roycroft: but back in the 18th century we weren't able to measure all that accurately
01:27 PM IchGucksLive: Gn8
01:27 PM roycroft: so it became the length of a special stick
01:29 PM gloops: 'the rule of thumb'
01:29 PM MrHindsight: horse ruler?
01:30 PM MrHindsight: hand goes back to ancient Egypt
01:31 PM MrHindsight: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancient_Egyptian_units_of_measurement
01:32 PM MrHindsight: gloops: pretty good based on what they used ^^
01:35 PM gloops: http://transmissionsmedia.com/the-inexplicable-precision-in-the-construction-of-the-great-pyramid-at-giza/
01:36 PM gloops: actually a bit of a rambling link
01:39 PM gloops: An error of three arc minutes represents an infinitesimal deviation from true of less than 0.015 per cent. In the opinion of structural engineers
01:43 PM MrHindsight: proof that the Chinese did not build the pyramids :)
01:43 PM MrHindsight: I'm only kidding
01:47 PM MrHindsight: units of measure have a fascinating history
01:47 PM MrHindsight: starting out with practical measurements based on body parts that most people have
01:49 PM roycroft: it's a good think no units of measurement were based on the size of the penis
01:49 PM roycroft: otherwise people would have been cheated 100% of the time
01:49 PM gloops: they dont call me 'big gloops' for nuthin you know roy
01:51 PM Jymmm: gloops: ...or BLOOPS for short ;)
01:51 PM gloops: language itself is based on familiar human actions or behaviour
01:51 PM MrHindsight: well as proven by the pyramid builds it's not the size of the units, it's how you use them
01:51 PM gloops: lol Jymmm
01:51 PM gloops: 'running water'
01:52 PM MrHindsight: back in HS i think we raced through Geometry as a subject in 1/2 a semester
01:53 PM MrHindsight: with no practical applications
01:53 PM gloops: yes school is pretty dull
01:54 PM MrHindsight: pick your favorite unit of measurement, doesn't really matter
01:54 PM gloops: pythagoras stoked his imagination drawing lines in the sand and playing with bits of string
01:54 PM MrHindsight: it's all about the geometry
01:54 PM Jymmm: MrHindsight: My UOF of choice is lightyears
01:54 PM Jymmm: UOM*
01:54 PM gloops: archimedes was slaughtered by the invading army, even though the alarm had been raised hours before and all his townsfolk had long fled
01:55 PM gloops: he was in his room engrossed in a mathematical problem
01:55 PM MrHindsight: obviously at the hands of anti-intellectuals
01:57 PM roycroft: high school geometry for me was used as a platform to introduce mathematical proofs
01:57 PM gloops: maybe, but probably the typical - brutally hack to pieces first, ask questions later
01:58 PM MrHindsight: roycroft: thats sounds about right
01:59 PM MrHindsight: from find the correct answer to show the proof
01:59 PM MrHindsight: find/solve
01:59 PM roycroft: yup
02:00 PM roycroft: it was a difficult class for many because of that
02:00 PM MrHindsight: I read some recent article on lower grades and math
02:01 PM MrHindsight: where the work appeared to be simple addition and subtraction but was more about showing your work
02:01 PM MrHindsight: yet still without any practical application
02:02 PM MrHindsight: and guesstimating
02:02 PM MrHindsight: multiple choice answers
02:04 PM roycroft: i rarely had multiple guess questions on math exams
02:05 PM MrHindsight: the correct answers were only approximations
02:06 PM MrHindsight: last paragraphs http://articles.mcall.com/1997-08-10/news/3160246_1_math-curriculum-multiplication-tables-teaching/3
02:08 PM MrHindsight: just an example
02:08 PM MrHindsight: estimation and precision both have their place
02:15 PM Tom_L: man i feel like i got a good deal on this plate for my X axis
02:16 PM Tom_L: checking online a 12 x 12 is $115
02:16 PM Tom_L: i got a 9 x 30 for about the price of a _good_ meal
02:16 PM albert: hola
02:17 PM Tom_L: the piece i had my eye on was gone today
02:18 PM albert: quiero instalar cnc en ubuntu mate se podria?
02:19 PM Tom_L: i think so
02:19 PM Tom_L: err maybe it was mint jt was working with
02:20 PM Tom_L: mate is just the desktop environment
02:21 PM Tom_L: which i actually like better than xfce
02:22 PM Tom_L: fine.
02:25 PM gloops: been watching for deals on ally plates here, none forthcoming, ive got to order some next
02:25 PM gloops: week
02:26 PM Tom_L: this was ~25 lbs at $30
02:26 PM Tom_L: opposed to online upwards of $200
02:27 PM gloops: an 8 x 16 inch, half inch is about £40, so about $50 or so
02:28 PM Tom_L: probably about a 5th that at the surplys
02:28 PM Tom_L: surplus
02:28 PM gloops: none local that sell it, there is a mountain of scrap ally at the local scrapyard, not for sale
02:28 PM Tom_L: why won't they sell it?
02:29 PM gloops: i think its something to do with regulations, they dont sort it, and they wont let me look through it
02:30 PM MrHindsight: around here it's only scrap at the yards, nothing really salvageable
02:30 PM Tom_L: so i should have most of the major pieces i need now
02:30 PM gloops: i went down a few saturdays back - not many people around on saturday morning, asked the kid on the weighbridge if i could have a quick look - cant do it, all camered up
02:31 PM MrHindsight: gregcnc_: have you found anything other than junk, chips, scrap at the recyclers?
02:31 PM Tom_L: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/cnc/local_stock/5.jpg
02:31 PM Tom_L: i found mine off one of those shelves
02:32 PM gloops: i can see large pieces of plate - probably too thing , and some long sections of useable profiles - but all jumbled up with rubbish and mostly mangled, probably would get the pieces i need though
02:32 PM gloops: too thin
02:33 PM Tom_L: you just gotta know what you need going in and what you're willing to accept if they don't have it
02:33 PM MrHindsight: Tom_L: is that a scrap yard?!
02:34 PM MrHindsight: looks like the drops at metal supermarkets around here
02:37 PM MrHindsight is now known as CaptHindsight
02:37 PM gregcnc_: mrhindsight I don't check often. I went by T&C on priarie once and they had full lengths of AL bar.
02:38 PM CaptHindsight: huh, whebever I drop there it's all junk or already chopped down
03:06 PM stjohn: hi guys, i am using axis with latest linuxcnc on my milling machine. i am having problems with the probe_screen.py panel... anyone else using this? cheeers!
03:08 PM cpresser: stjohn: you need to describe your problem :)
03:19 PM stjohn: msg cpresser: the functions for probing using the probe_screen no longer work...
03:20 PM stjohn: I am not sure what more there is to say.
03:21 PM stjohn: cpresser, all was working fine, i upgraded now when i try say to find x on the edge of a block i get the 'must be in mdi mode to issue mdi command' error message..
03:22 PM stjohn: probe in z still works but thats all..
03:22 PM stjohn: very strange.
03:24 PM stjohn: latest linuxcnc and axis..
03:26 PM stjohn: oops...
03:26 PM stjohn: sorry!
03:26 PM stjohn: i hate irc.
03:26 PM Jymmm: lol
03:26 PM stjohn: lol..
03:26 PM MarcelineVQ: I"m sure he meant for you to say that publicly and not via /msg anyway
03:27 PM stjohn: yes, sorry just installed this client and trying to learn how to use it..
03:27 PM stjohn: must be like 30 years since i used irc.
03:28 PM Jymmm: stjohn: Well, it's hexchat... DUH lol
03:28 PM stjohn: do you have a recommendation?
03:29 PM Jymmm: On linux, I like weechat,
03:29 PM Jymmm: It's terminal/sheel based, not gui
03:29 PM Jymmm: shell*
03:29 PM MarcelineVQ: I'd just use hexchat on linux too unless you use terminal irc
03:29 PM Jymmm: But allows you to have multiple panes, etc
03:29 PM stjohn: i have no idea what client is best. yes i tried weechat also. seemed fine but i dont want to have to learn and remember more commands..
03:30 PM stjohn: yeah but how to move around the panes..
03:30 PM stjohn: lol..
03:30 PM Jymmm: stjohn: Do I REALLY have to say it???
03:30 PM stjohn: guys! does anyone use probing on their machines?
03:31 PM stjohn: i have a touch probe and would really like to use it.
03:31 PM hazzy: You are not the only one who is having that problem with the probe screen. IIRC somebody wrote a patch to solve the problem
03:31 PM MarcelineVQ: rene-dev was having probe issues with a recent linuxcnc
03:31 PM stjohn: was working fine then i upgraded now i can only probe in z... weird.
03:31 PM Jymmm: stjohn: https://weechat.org/files/doc/stable/weechat_user.en.html
03:32 PM Jymmm: stjohn: It's really not THAT hard to learn the commands, you don't need to use most of them anyway
03:32 PM hazzy: stjohn: I really like KiwiIrc: https://kiwiirc.com/client/irc.freenode.net
03:32 PM Jymmm: stjohn: or just use the irc client on the web or within mozilla
03:33 PM gloops: i just use hexchat - comes pre-installed with mint
03:33 PM Jymmm: stjohn: Nothing to install/learn... https://webchat.freenode.net/
03:34 PM hazzy: Hexchat is good, but it causes X to crash on Debian stretch :(
03:34 PM stjohn: Jymmm: my head is full. irc is the last of my problems.
03:35 PM Jymmm: stjohn: So, you DO need another hole in the head, huh?
03:35 PM gloops: i dont use probe though so dont know anything about this problem
03:35 PM stjohn: no one use a probe?
03:35 PM cradek: lots of people use probes
03:35 PM gloops: archivist?
03:35 PM cradek: but it's your special screen that is broken, not probing
03:36 PM gloops: yes lots use them, not all around at any given moment though in here
03:36 PM stjohn: i am really not sure what the problem is. one of the subroutines works - probing z, the rest dont.
03:36 PM cradek: I agree that's a surprising failure mode
03:37 PM stjohn: i cant see what the difference is in the way they are called.
03:37 PM stjohn: i am not a programmed so i dont know how to dig deeper.
03:37 PM stjohn: programmer.
03:37 PM hazzy: stjohn: what UI are you using? I am going to try and duplicate your set up
03:37 PM stjohn: axis.
03:37 PM hazzy: ok
03:37 PM stjohn: sounds good. thanks.
03:38 PM stjohn: you have a probe?
03:38 PM stjohn: latest version all.
03:38 PM cradek: better to give a version number
03:38 PM stjohn: one sec..
03:39 PM hazzy: stjohn: I have a probe, but should be able to test on a sim config
03:40 PM stjohn: linuxcnc/axis 2.8.0~pre1
03:40 PM hazzy: Did you build it from source?
03:41 PM cradek: if you are not a developer you should use released versions, currently 2.7.11 is the latest
03:42 PM stjohn: debian jessie, linux 8.9
03:42 PM gloops: i updated to 2.8, its on the repository
03:42 PM stjohn: build from source..
03:42 PM gloops: when is 2.8 officially out?
03:42 PM cradek: unfortunately we don't schedule future releases
03:43 PM gloops: can you make it before my machine is finished lol
03:43 PM stjohn: lol
03:43 PM hazzy: stjohn: And did you download the screen from github or from the forum? https://github.com/verser-git/probe_screen
03:43 PM cradek: maybe! but maybe not.
03:43 PM Jymmm: cradek is always so concise ;)
03:44 PM hazzy: cradek: there are a lot of good reasons to use master even if not a dev :)
03:44 PM Jymmm: cradek: Definite Maybe
03:44 PM stjohn: I cant remember, i just copied it from the version i was already happily using before i upgraded...
03:44 PM cradek: when will your machine officially be finished?
03:44 PM cradek: :-P
03:44 PM Jymmm: cradek: For ref, it's 2017AD
03:45 PM gloops: in the new year probably, 2.8 is easier to run 2 motors on 1 axis
03:45 PM Jymmm: ;)
03:45 PM stjohn: actuallz we used master as i am friends with rene-dev, my machine is using his servo drives...
03:46 PM stjohn: i am a linuxcnc user, mechanical engineer, not a programmer..
03:46 PM stjohn: so design, cad, cam, that stuff..
03:48 PM hazzy: stjohn: same here, ME and I will only look at code if there is a really good reason :)
03:50 PM stjohn: hazzy, only so much time in the day..
03:50 PM stjohn: hazzy: i enjoy making things :-)
03:51 PM stjohn: how do you write a message to someone correctly in this screen?
03:51 PM hazzy: stjohn: I PMed you
03:52 PM XXCoder: "Your tires will glide across the snow with these snow socks" yeeah gliding is exactly what I want to do on car. LOL
03:52 PM XXCoder: bad word to use
03:56 PM Tom_L: CaptHindsight did you see the rest of it?
03:56 PM Deejay: gn8
03:57 PM stjohn: i am testing some lang vices. if i can get this fucking probe screen working i will be very happy!
03:57 PM Tom_L: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/cnc/local_stock/stock_index.php
03:57 PM Tom_L: just a few pics while wandering thru it
03:57 PM gloops: ./msg
04:03 PM Contract_Pilot: looks like tormach redirected the pathpilot2-0 page hahaha
04:16 PM nallar is now known as Ross
04:19 PM CaptHindsight: Tom_L: that would be a supplier around here, not surplus
04:20 PM CaptHindsight: at least they would market themselves as one
04:33 PM CaptHindsight: Contract_Pilot: they could have Tivoed Pathpilot
04:33 PM CaptHindsight: they are in the position of it being under GPL as well as having to protect their sales
04:34 PM Contract_Pilot: they can sell you a flash drive
04:35 PM Contract_Pilot: Was told it was going to be a public release or you can pay for a flashj drive
04:45 PM CaptHindsight: is PathPilot more than just a User Interface for LCNC?
04:46 PM CaptHindsight: PathPilot™
04:59 PM hazzy: CaptHindsight: They did quite a bit of tinkering with other stuff, but basically yes, they did not change anything major
04:59 PM Tom_L: so are they selling it or giving it away?
05:02 PM skunkworks: tried to read some zip 100 disks today. surprisingly a complete failure ;)
05:03 PM syyl: did the world get black and white while you tried it? ;)
05:06 PM Jymmm: skunkworks: Too bad you didn't ask me last week, I had a fully working USB ZIP drive, and discs that worked fine
05:07 PM skunkworks: This one was ide.. I still have a parallel one too.. But it was just for funsies..
05:07 PM Jymmm: skunkworks: oh gawd... parallel
05:08 PM Jymmm: skunkworks: That was the worse one ever!
05:08 PM Jymmm: Although, it was kinda fun drilling out all those zip disks =)
05:09 PM Jymmm: skunkworks: OH! hang on...
05:09 PM Tom_L: ok so ebay shows item location NY shipping from LA
05:12 PM Jymmm: skunkworks: https://i.imgur.com/3EL8JwV.jpg
05:17 PM skunkworks: :)
05:22 PM Jymmm: skunkworks: https://i.imgur.com/vTjiBLd.jpg
05:23 PM Tom_L: doubled as a lunch warmer
05:25 PM SpeedEvil: https://youtu.be/Ui4lUzFIZKM?t=90 The importance of training in mills.
05:25 PM Jymmm: Tom_L: Lunch you say? How about a Grilled cheese bacon patty melt? https://i.imgur.com/EcOpsB7.jpg
05:27 PM Tom_L: that's not lunch
05:27 PM Tom_L: that's a heart attack
05:28 PM Jymmm: What, you gonna live forever?
05:29 PM Jymmm: Although, it does need grilled onions and shrooms
05:29 PM Jymmm: maybe a side of sweet baby rays bbq sauce on the side for dipping
05:39 PM CaptHindsight: Jymmm: were happy to pay that back then
05:40 PM CaptHindsight: otherwise you'd be popping floppies in and out all day long
05:40 PM CaptHindsight: we could load the whole OS and tons of apps without having to swap floppies
05:45 PM Tom_L: and finding out the middle one of a backup was bad
05:47 PM CaptHindsight: some apps would make you swap 2-3 floppies for some process
05:48 PM CaptHindsight: those were the days :)
05:48 PM Tom_L: i never understood that
05:48 PM CaptHindsight: RAM was probably full
05:49 PM CaptHindsight: my Mac had at least 512KB :)
05:49 PM CaptHindsight: adding a 20MB HD was like moving to a supercomputer
05:51 PM CaptHindsight: same for when the PC AT came out
05:54 PM Tom_L: i think mine is still in the back of the closet somewhere
05:57 PM Contract_Pilot: odd this mobo has a LPT header but no LPT settings in the bios and not listed as a resource with lshw
05:58 PM CaptHindsight: might have been left off your version of the BIOS
05:59 PM CaptHindsight: Dell, HP, Compaq etc would have stripped down BIOSes all the time
05:59 PM CaptHindsight: more BIOS features meant more tech support headaches
06:00 PM CaptHindsight: why I never seem to get lucky finding old big brand systems to use for real time
06:03 PM Jymmm: CaptHindsight: $4K eh
06:05 PM CaptHindsight: the PC/AT came with an internal 20MB HD, system price was around $6k
06:06 PM Jymmm: CaptHindsight: That's STILL not $4k for a hdd alone.
06:06 PM CaptHindsight: Mac512's were $3k
06:07 PM Contract_Pilot: Yea, will ahve to investigate it a bit further
08:12 PM Tom_L: a little more progress http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/cnc/Mill_Steel/Mill_Mockup2.jpg
08:12 PM Tom_L: Z plate won't be that big
08:32 PM malcom2073: What's the name for the mechanismin a clock that allows the gear to move only one tooth each time it's moved back and forth?
08:33 PM SpeedEvil: escapement
08:33 PM malcom2073: Fantasitc! Thanks
08:33 PM malcom2073: I just figured out a good use for one of those
08:34 PM malcom2073: We have a pick and place machine at work, which has a gear that pulls the part tape along, but it moves forward inconsistant distances. I could use that to ensure it only moves one tooth each time the lever is pulled
08:35 PM archivist: there are many types of escapements
08:35 PM malcom2073: I'm sure there's a better name for that mechanism when applied not in a clock environment, but this will get me on the right track
08:35 PM archivist: its the right word
08:36 PM malcom2073: I'm thinking have a DC motor on the gear, and a solenoid push the escapement to trigger a single movement
08:36 PM jdh: escapements are commin
08:36 PM malcom2073: Rather than using a servo, or stepper
08:36 PM Tom_L: i just saw some the other day searching for soemthing else
08:36 PM jdh: and singulators
08:36 PM malcom2073: When you want to advance, turn on them motor to tension the gear, and then trigger the escapement
08:36 PM archivist: but many mechanisms use a ratchet for movement advance
08:37 PM Tom_L: rachets & pawls
08:37 PM malcom2073: I need to ensure only a single tooth under varying motor tensions
08:37 PM Tom_itx: https://shop.sdp-si.com/catalog?cid=p474
08:37 PM malcom2073: I thought about a ratchet, but wasn't sure how to ensure it could never move more than a single tooth
08:37 PM archivist: there are ratchets with interlocks, use a solenoid
08:38 PM archivist: limit the pawl movement
08:38 PM archivist: limit the motor to one rev with a switch
08:39 PM jdh: I have one that is clutch driven. Kicks out after one rev
08:39 PM malcom2073: This has to fit in 8mm width, so it's all fairly small
08:39 PM malcom2073: Or rather, 10mm
08:39 PM Tom_L: piston rod like arrangement with adjustable stroke
08:39 PM Tom_L: would advance the tape
08:40 PM jdh: cylinder + ratchet/pawl
08:40 PM archivist: variable eccentric so the pawl advances by the right amount
08:41 PM malcom2073: Tom_L: The tape is engauged on a toothed gear through holes in the tape (like old dot matrix printers
08:41 PM malcom2073: archivist: But the tape might be tensioned, and pull past
08:41 PM archivist: many forget the anti back turn pawl
08:41 PM Tom_L: malcom2073 right
08:42 PM Tom_L: you still need a way to control the gear advancement
08:42 PM malcom2073: ohhh, offset two pawls so you enguage the one before the second, so it alternates which one is touching/
08:42 PM malcom2073: Tom_L: I have a DC motor that provides tension
08:42 PM malcom2073: But the motor turns off after advancement, so the pawls need to keep the tape from moving in either direction
08:43 PM archivist: here in my hand I have a clock driven by a ratchet, the clever thing is the pinch point of the pawl as the limit so only one tooth at a time
08:44 PM malcom2073: archivist: Got a picture in your archive?
08:44 PM archivist: just a mo
08:47 PM archivist: malcom2073, scan of manual page with adjustment http://www.collection.archivist.info/archive/manuals/IS2184_Gents/page_0013.jpg
08:48 PM archivist: the forward stop it forces the drive pawl inwards so the gear cannot move and over rotate
08:50 PM archivist: uses gravity on the pawls to keep them engaged yet keeps them under control, forward movement is on relaxation of the solenoid in this case
08:50 PM malcom2073: Hmmm
08:50 PM archivist: this is the classic school clock slave dial
08:52 PM archivist: regardless of the current set in the master clock, the driving force is the spring setting in the dial
08:52 PM Tom_itx: http://www.knasmusic.com/diyeverything/pickandplace/tapefeeders.php
08:52 PM Tom_L: similar idea
08:53 PM andypugh: archivist: You saw this? http://bodgesoc.blogspot.co.uk/2015/09/clock.html
08:54 PM andypugh: Still running :-)
08:57 PM archivist: one sets the drive spring for the weight of the hand on that particular dial basically
08:59 PM malcom2073: Oh cool, they have a video of it running too
09:06 PM archivist: malcom2073, and now an image of the one here, the solenoid was missing when I got it http://www.collection.archivist.info/searchv13.php?searchstr=gent
09:07 PM Tom_L: i don't see the files he's talking about
09:07 PM archivist: was seized up in the shed cleaned it
09:07 PM malcom2073: Ah cool
09:11 PM Tom_L: hah, he put the ngc files in the zip too
09:11 PM malcom2073: I'm thinking it may be easier to design, to somehow trigger a switch on a single revolution (like a CAM lobe), and use an indexing gear
09:13 PM malcom2073: Like a geneva wheel
09:13 PM archivist: I was about to say geneva mechanism
09:15 PM malcom2073: Probably have that drive a small gear which drives the larger gear on the tape
09:15 PM malcom2073: Have the small gear be equivalant to 4 teeth on the tape, then just use a 4 sided geneva mechanism. could even work the cam of that into the limit switch the stops the motor
09:19 PM archivist: malcom2073, old HP plotter used it to change pens