#linuxcnc Logs

Nov 08 2017

#linuxcnc Calendar

12:26 AM CaptHindsight: Touchscreen gestures in Linux using Touchegg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=28Jjf5Ak6Q0
12:29 AM CaptHindsight: ^^ how well does this work with LCNC?
12:35 AM hazzy: My guess is not very well :)
12:35 AM CaptHindsight: there is a package for ubuntu
12:36 AM CaptHindsight: but I don't have any LCNC installs using Ubuntu
12:37 AM CaptHindsight: we shipped some LCNC systems with nice cap touch monitors a few years ago
12:37 AM CaptHindsight: every user asked us for a mouse and keyboard after trying it for a few days
12:40 AM CaptHindsight: looks decent in the video
12:40 AM hazzy: I have a SAW touch monitor on my machine and a SSD with Ubuntu and LCNC, I will test if I get a chance
12:40 AM hazzy: What UI did those machines use?
12:40 AM CaptHindsight: it says it works with trackpads as well
12:43 AM hazzy: Axis does not work great on a touch screen as the targets are so small :D
12:43 AM CaptHindsight: Ubuntu 12.04LTS, what GUIs did that have?
12:43 AM CaptHindsight: was it Gnome or was that already Unity ?
12:43 AM hazzy: Oh Unity, which sucks
12:43 AM hazzy: First thing to go :D
12:43 AM hazzy: I meant what LCNC UI did you use on those machines?
12:44 AM CaptHindsight: oh was Axis
12:44 AM hazzy: ok
12:44 AM CaptHindsight: they were 24" monitors
12:44 AM CaptHindsight: so the buttons were big enough
12:45 AM CaptHindsight: we built them as all in one systems
12:45 AM hazzy: Ok, that seems like it would be quite usable on a screen that big
12:45 AM CaptHindsight: hung the PC on the back of the LCD
12:46 AM hazzy: neat, keep everything together
12:46 AM hazzy: Ok, goodnight Capt!
12:47 AM CaptHindsight: LCNC lab robots
12:47 AM CaptHindsight: so no real dust, chips, swarf etc
12:47 AM CaptHindsight: hasta banana
12:48 AM CaptHindsight: ahaha Canonical wrote all the libs for Touchegg
01:27 AM IchGucksLive: morning from Europ as it awakes to rain
01:42 AM IchGucksLive: later
01:46 AM archivist: gloops you are nearer than Guildford to me, although I lived near Guildford during the 1960's
01:57 AM gloops: will probably go for a lot more than the current bid
02:00 AM archivist: about 140 miles from there, was talking to somebody up here while doing a job, he went to same school in Guildford as me
02:05 AM gloops: small world
02:07 AM archivist: I have a website with some surplus(new old stock) on it while bigging for a lathe from Inverness I got an order for a filter capacitor
02:08 AM archivist: looked at the name.... emailed is that you selling the lathe? yes
02:08 AM archivist: delivered his part by hand
02:10 AM gloops: thats a chance in a million lol
02:11 AM archivist: or more
02:20 AM Contract_Pilot: Hey long time everyone
02:21 AM Contract_Pilot: Anyone with a spare 5I25 or 6I25 floating arround that could use a 7i76 or a 7I77
02:25 AM Deejay: moin
02:35 AM Contract_Pilot: Deejay long time
02:35 AM Contract_Pilot: I scrapped the G0704 mill conversion because I got a Tormach 1100
03:15 AM miss0r: Goodmorning
03:17 AM Contract_Pilot: Evening well Very Early Morning Here.
03:21 AM miss0r: What are you still doing here then ? :) (not even early morning here)
03:34 AM Contract_Pilot: 1AM here now
03:34 AM Contract_Pilot: Could not sleep
03:38 AM Contract_Pilot: https://forum.linuxcnc.org/54-user-exchange/33534-mesa-cards-7i76-7i77-sale-or-barter-for-5i25-6i25
03:45 AM miss0r: I need to learn stuff about mesa cards, so I can finaly decide what I need for my mill convertion :) but that is somewhere in the future
03:47 AM Contract_Pilot: it is rather simple
03:48 AM Contract_Pilot: Still have one running on my lathe but changing out for a tormach board
03:48 AM Contract_Pilot: Eventually for simple path pilot modifications
05:06 AM jthornton: all right the RPi3 chicken door is up and running
06:04 AM IchGucksLive: hi
06:05 AM makerman: hi
06:07 AM IchGucksLive: ;-)
06:20 AM IchGucksLive: later
08:09 AM gloops: yay my stuff arrived
08:09 AM gloops: bah i wasnt in
08:10 AM SpeedEvil: My three very precise glass cylinders have arrived from Russia.
08:10 AM hazzy: gloops: Great!
08:10 AM SpeedEvil: Which is nice.
08:10 AM gloops: hazzy just got to go to the depot for them
08:11 AM SpeedEvil: ~50mm optical flats on the ends, ~90mm tall.
08:11 AM gloops: SpeedEvil - always a relief when glass arrives intact
08:11 AM SpeedEvil: I have not actually looked at them yet.
08:16 AM gloops: right off i go
08:20 AM archivist: SpeedEvil, is the length supposed to be accurate or the parallelism
08:20 AM SpeedEvil: yes
08:21 AM archivist: I has english
08:22 AM SpeedEvil: Both
08:22 AM archivist: 90mm seems a lot
08:23 AM sync: well, mostly the flatness
08:23 AM sync: but you get the length for free
08:23 AM SpeedEvil: archivist: yes. But they were about the price of a couple of 50mm optical flats.
08:23 AM SpeedEvil: And instead I get eight
08:24 AM archivist: but usually they save on the material
08:24 AM SpeedEvil: yes, these are not new.
08:25 AM SpeedEvil: I would be surprised if I paid 5% of the new price
08:25 AM archivist: I got mine ex army it is a set for micrometer checking
08:26 AM sync: well, if you want to check 100mm micrometers you need them to be that long
08:26 AM archivist: be careful of wringing them together, they can really stick
08:26 AM archivist: one of mine has a crack
08:36 AM SpeedEvil: archivist: https://i.imgur.com/hsIoNAt.jpg seems accurate.
08:37 AM gregcnc_: at least within 1/128th eh?
08:38 AM archivist: or gnats cock which ever is larger
08:39 AM archivist: SpeedEvil, similar http://www.collection.archivist.info/archive/DJCPD/PD/2010/2010_04_15_Levels/IMG_0591.JPG
08:40 AM archivist: one dead inch rest different to set thimble at various angle to check for drunk thread
08:41 AM archivist: SpeedEvil, your turn to do a translation http://www.collection.archivist.info/archive/data/hob/index.html
08:42 AM SpeedEvil: Still waiting for the first image
09:51 AM gloops: happy with my little bundle from china, everything there + they threw in all the ballscrew end bearings and motor couplers, very good value
10:39 AM {HD}: Well I bought one of the cheap ebay tig welders. I guess I’ll let you know what I think when it shows up.
10:40 AM Contract_Pilot: Sup I am still awake...
10:41 AM Contract_Pilot: ick... e-bay aqnd tig
10:41 AM {HD}: Lol
10:41 AM {HD}: Yep
10:41 AM Contract_Pilot: I have a miller Diversion 180
10:42 AM {HD}: This thing cost less then getting my oxygen acetylene bottles refilled.
10:42 AM Contract_Pilot: My Welding Section.. http://www.stevenrhine.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/Welders.jpg
10:42 AM roycroft: i have an everlast powertic 250ex, and i'm quite happy with it
10:42 AM roycroft: powertig
10:42 AM Contract_Pilot: Yea, my O2 bottle got mixed with a rental bottle did not notice...
10:45 AM {HD}: I already have a bottle of argon so hopefully the machine works well enough to make me happy.
10:45 AM {HD}: If it doesn’t work then I’ll just go back to the oxygen acetylene.
10:47 AM Contract_Pilot: Yea, i am wanting to get a Miller 625 plasma
10:48 AM * roycroft just sold his plasma cutter
10:48 AM {HD}: I have a hand me down 50 amp plasma cutter that I’ve never used. I don’t even know what that would be capable of cutting through.
10:49 AM roycroft: mine was 50a
10:49 AM roycroft: it was rated to cut 3/4" stock all day long, and could be pushed to 15/16"
10:50 AM {HD}: Wow! I’ll have to try that out. I can’t currently for see a scenario where I need to cut any thicker than 1/4”.
10:51 AM {HD}: I’ve always just use my gas torch for that.
11:07 AM roycroft: the plasma cutter will be a lot cleaner and faster
11:07 AM roycroft: i got mine because i was buying a lot of other welding gear at the time and thought it would be a handy thing to have
11:08 AM roycroft: i ended up not using it though - what i really could use is a laser cutter
11:08 AM roycroft: but i can't justify the cost of that
11:09 AM roycroft: so i'll job that kind of work out to someone else
11:11 AM slipalong: Guy's, any idea where I can get a decent guide to speeds and feeds. Going through end mills at a rate of knots
11:13 AM enleth: slipalong: breaking them or just throwing away the dull ones?
11:13 AM roycroft: machinery's handbook?
11:14 AM slipalong: Breaking!
11:14 AM roycroft: stop doing that!
11:14 AM roycroft: those things are expensive!
11:14 AM slipalong: Problem is my AMA25 will only do 2000 rpm
11:14 AM slipalong: tell me about it
11:14 AM gregcnc_: any utting tool maker will have recommendations
11:14 AM gregcnc_: cutting
11:14 AM gloops: breaking bits tut tut
11:14 AM roycroft: there are like a zillion online feeds and speeds calculators
11:14 AM gloops: theres a few guides https://cncrouterbits.com.au/technical_speeds_feeds
11:15 AM gloops: cant remember the one they all use
11:15 AM roycroft: teh google will provide you with a cornucopia of choices
11:15 AM gloops: oh thought it was a router
11:16 AM slipalong: I am cutting out Home switch brackets in 2mm mild steel
11:16 AM slipalong: 3mm 2 flute endmill
11:16 AM slipalong: It did 90% of the job and broke running 2000 rpm and 100mm/M
11:16 AM gloops: seems a very light tool
11:17 AM slipalong: http://www.sgs-tool.de/PDF-speedfeeds/SGS-Speeds-Feeds-GP-metric.pdf
11:17 AM slipalong: this document is on about running a 3mm end mill at like 20,000 rpm!
11:18 AM slipalong: going to need nitrous oxide kit on my motor
11:18 AM gregcnc_: surface speed is a max, running lower is OK but slow
11:18 AM roycroft: you could have a rigidity issue or spindle runout
11:19 AM roycroft: especially with smaller tooling (3mm counts as "smaller"), runout can be a serious issue
11:19 AM slipalong: The mill is a crappy chinese thing so probably both
11:19 AM slipalong: how would I check?
11:19 AM gloops: well the current trend seems to be higher rpm faster feed
11:20 AM gregcnc_: .0001" indicator on the endmill
11:20 AM gregcnc_: current trends vs. what works
11:20 AM slipalong: just use a DTI without the motor going
11:21 AM slipalong: and wiggle the endmill
11:21 AM slipalong: is that good enough
11:22 AM roycroft: you're using some kind of collet to hold your tooling, right?
11:22 AM roycroft: not a drill chuck
11:23 AM gregcnc_: https://youtu.be/tD0FiDtzmS0?t=44s
11:23 AM gregcnc_: you can check against flutes just turn the spindle backward so it's not trying to cut through your indicator probe
11:25 AM gregcnc_: i didn't watch all of that but clean collet, taper, and nut are also a good start
11:25 AM slipalong: yes collet is some crazy threaded thing that came with he mill. The end mills are threaded also
11:25 AM roycroft: threaded?
11:25 AM roycroft: so you screw the end mills into the collet?
11:25 AM slipalong: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/RDGTOOLS-THREADED-ENDMILL-VARIOUS-SIZES-METRIC-MILLING-ENDMILL-ENGINEERING/371680513307?hash=item5689e28d1b:m:m4a0ipLjaFxd-xUqF7-Fmsg
11:26 AM slipalong: 9.95 each!!!!!
11:26 AM gloops: those are 4 flute though
11:27 AM gloops: you can get them for £1 each near enough
11:27 AM slipalong: where from?
11:27 AM slipalong: eBay?
11:28 AM roycroft: i haven't used anything like that before
11:28 AM roycroft: i'm skeptical about it, but they may be fine
11:28 AM gloops: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Drillpro-5Pc-4Flute-End-Mill-Cutter-Drill-Bit-4-6-8-10-12mm-HSS-CNC-Milling-Tool/152528122554?
11:28 AM gloops: ive had these
11:28 AM roycroft: check runout and rigidity though
11:28 AM gloops: top chinese unbreakable last three lifetimes etc
11:28 AM roycroft: to me, that seems a likely cause of the breakage
11:29 AM roycroft: it's quite common for small tooling to break when there is spindle runout
11:29 AM roycroft: check for runout with the machine turned off
11:29 AM slipalong: Im sure you are right I will go and check runniout
11:29 AM gloops: also maybe, if cutting sheet - is the sheet secure?
11:29 AM gloops: in the middle area
11:29 AM roycroft: yes, if it's sheet and it flexes you can have issues
11:30 AM slipalong: no the sheet was only secured at the sides so that another posibiliy=ty
11:30 AM roycroft: make yourself a jig to support the sheet near the cuts
11:30 AM slipalong: I was pausing the program and moving the clamps aboiut
11:31 AM roycroft: mount the test indicator holder not on the mill, turn the imill on, and see if the spindle vibrates
11:31 AM slipalong: These are just one off brackets to mount the limit switches
11:31 AM slipalong: going to do it now!
11:31 AM roycroft: there are a lot of variables that could be the cause of your problem
11:31 AM roycroft: so don't focus just on speeds and feeds
11:31 AM roycroft: because speeds and feeds are the most forgiving bits
11:32 AM roycroft: that said, get your speeds and feeds right in the end :)
11:32 AM gregcnc_: 100mm/m at 2k, .025mm/t is small enough feed that alone wouldn't break the tool
11:33 AM roycroft: having speeds and feeds wrong is more often the cause of premature dulling of the tool or burning up the tool than breaking the tool
11:34 AM Loetmichel: roycroft: i have the easy appoach to that "upping feed and depth until *KNACK*, then a bit less with a new tool" ;)
11:34 AM gregcnc_: both result in the tool breaking
11:34 AM roycroft: yes, gregcnc_
11:35 AM roycroft: i got the impression (perhaps the wrong impression) that his tooling was just breaking
11:35 AM roycroft: as he reported no signs of wear or overheating
11:35 AM gregcnc_: after 90% of the job
11:35 AM gregcnc_: he's new and may not know what that looks like
11:35 AM roycroft: agreed
11:36 AM gregcnc_: regardless feed is fine sped is low
11:36 AM Loetmichel: some cheap ebay toosl are dull from the start though
11:36 AM gregcnc_: yes, I only buy real tools
11:36 AM Loetmichel: i even had some i could saw trhu with a normal hacksaw...
11:36 AM roycroft: i just wonder how rigid threaded tooling can be, with no indexing shoulder
11:37 AM roycroft: at any rate
11:37 AM Loetmichel: roycroft: if you dont change the tool between multiple runs of rigid tapping: no index needed. unless you want to have the thread start all at the same side
11:38 AM roycroft: he needs to see if there's spindle runout and machine vibration before investigating tooling issues
11:38 AM gregcnc_: who's tapping?
11:38 AM roycroft: loetmichel: he's not tapping
11:38 AM roycroft: he's using tooling that is threaded and screws into the "collet"
11:39 AM Loetmichel: ah
11:39 AM gregcnc_: http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net/threads/43791-Eccentric-end-mills?p=593871#post593871
11:39 AM slipalong: roycroft: DTI shows .0.4 deflection with me heaving on the quill
11:39 AM slipalong: .04
11:39 AM Loetmichel: interesting concept
11:39 AM roycroft: what about tir?
11:40 AM roycroft: and i'm assuming that's 0.04mm
11:40 AM roycroft: not 0.040"
11:40 AM archivist: slipalong, how much is heave in grams
11:40 AM slipalong: no I don't work in old money
11:40 AM roycroft: this is an international channel
11:40 AM slipalong: 1500g
11:40 AM roycroft: units are important
11:40 AM gregcnc_: assume metric
11:41 AM archivist: metric thou :)
11:41 AM slipalong: 0.04mm
11:41 AM roycroft: i try not to make assumptions
11:41 AM slipalong: sorry!
11:41 AM gregcnc_: making assumptions makses things more intersting ask my wife
11:41 AM roycroft: even though i just said "i'm assuming 0.04mm"
11:42 AM slipalong: is that bad, do I need new bearings
11:42 AM roycroft: what really irritates me, archivist, is all the machinists who say "mil"
11:42 AM roycroft: because on your side of the pond that means millimeters, but here it means thousandths of an inch
11:43 AM archivist: mil is a circular measurement
11:43 AM roycroft: and i don't always know where a person is located
11:43 AM enleth: who uses "mil" for milimeters?
11:43 AM slipalong: yes the army use it instead of degrees
11:43 AM gloops: .4 mm?
11:43 AM gloops: oh .o4
11:43 AM archivist: 1000 mil to a circle
11:43 AM roycroft: i would agree that it's a misnomer everywhere
11:44 AM roycroft: lots of irritating people, enleth
11:44 AM enleth: I've heard "milis" in speech, which is reasonable
11:44 AM enleth: but not "mil" as "mm" in writing
11:44 AM gloops: i always say 'mil'
11:44 AM gloops: 200 mil
11:44 AM roycroft: on teh youtube i can usually tell by their accent whether they mean mm or thousands of an inch
11:44 AM slipalong: no defo 0.04mm with me yanking on it hard
11:45 AM slipalong: isn't quill isn't a noise
11:45 AM gloops: c7 ballscrew is to .05mm
11:46 AM roycroft: what is the tir of your spindle, slipalong?
11:46 AM roycroft: insert one of those threaded end mills
11:46 AM roycroft: set up your test indicator against the end mill
11:46 AM slipalong: dont know what you mean sorry
11:46 AM roycroft: rotate the spindle manually
11:46 AM roycroft: tir = total indicated runout
11:46 AM slipalong: do that
11:47 AM slipalong: I have done that
11:47 AM roycroft: pushing on the quill/head will give you a sense of rigidity
11:47 AM roycroft: but has nothing to do with runout
11:47 AM slipalong: oh
11:47 AM roycroft: runout is inaccuracy of the spindle itself
11:47 AM slipalong: ok
11:47 AM slipalong: let me check that
11:48 AM roycroft: you should probably measure tir on the quill itself as well as on the tooling
11:48 AM roycroft: measuring the quill will give you the runout of the spindle
11:48 AM roycroft: measuring the tooling will give you an idea of the runout of the toolholder
11:50 AM slipalong: so with the DTI on the quill if I rotate I get 0.035 deviation max
11:50 AM roycroft: i'd like to see better, but that's not horrible
11:50 AM slipalong: with a full 360 turn bu gand
11:50 AM roycroft: assuming you mean 0.035mm
11:51 AM slipalong: yes
11:51 AM gregcnc_: .035" would break tooling instantly
11:51 AM roycroft: which is his problem :)
11:51 AM gregcnc_: after 90% of the job is done
11:51 AM gregcnc_: im out
11:52 AM roycroft: oh, if he said that then i missed that
11:52 AM slipalong: The quill bearings aunt tapered so no way to increase pre-load
11:53 AM roycroft: 0.035mm tir on the quill is acceptable
11:53 AM roycroft: measure on the tooling now
11:53 AM roycroft: above the flutes, of course
11:55 AM archivist: slipalong, divide your feed by x to get the same feed per tooth per rev
12:00 PM gloops: im in the strange position where there is nothing i need to buy
12:03 PM miss0r: I realy need to completely figure out this damn peck subroutine in my mill. 5000 lines of code to just do 105 holes with peckdrilling *sigh*
12:03 PM IchGucksLive: miss0r: Lis yiour friend
12:04 PM IchGucksLive: miss0r: is it a pattern
12:04 PM miss0r: yeah
12:05 PM archivist: use linuxcnc and that will dramatically reduce line count
12:06 PM miss0r: Yeah. I'm still collecting data (and money) to make that upgrade
12:06 PM IchGucksLive: http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.6/html/gcode/gcode.html#sec:G82-Drilling-Dwell
12:06 PM gregcnc_: ich phillips 432 control doesn't have L
12:06 PM miss0r: if using linuxcnc I don't care about line count to be honnest :) I only bitch about it now, because I have 80kb of memory i'm trying to fill with a 2400baund connection
12:07 PM miss0r: I have G81 and G83 drill cycle & deep hole drilling cycle
12:07 PM slipalong: Yes so turning the quill by hand I get 0.035mm runout. with the DTI on the end mill I get 0.04mm runout
12:07 PM miss0r: I just need to rewrite my post processor to use it
12:08 PM IchGucksLive: gregcnc_: but it does have pattern
12:08 PM archivist: I was reading some old comparison cam to hand coding while waiting this afternoon and ther were worrying about fitting in 63k of mem
12:08 PM miss0r: IchGucksLive: not G82
12:09 PM IchGucksLive: miss0r: move one up or down
12:09 PM gregcnc_: slipalong so your 0.025 per tooth became .045 on one tooth and nothing on the other
12:09 PM archivist: slipalong, you were probably feeding too fast for that size endmill at 2krpm
12:09 PM miss0r: archivist: I actualy stumbled across a 128kb memory module on ebay once. But the price was absolutly ridiculous something like 4 times what I payed for the mill
12:09 PM archivist: hehe
12:10 PM miss0r: IchGucksLive: It can be done. I just need to rewrite the post processor, no doubt. I'm just not feeling like it right now. And I don't want to enter 105 coordinates by hand, as this is a one-of
12:11 PM miss0r: I'll just suck it up, and wait for the code to transfer
12:11 PM IchGucksLive: miss0r: do you got the pattern as a file or image
12:11 PM miss0r: hoping to not get a memory overflow nearing the end of the transfer :D
12:12 PM miss0r: IchGucksLive: A file, I guess. I just drew it in MasterCAM
12:12 PM miss0r: 2200 lines to go
12:13 PM miss0r: FSCK !
12:13 PM miss0r: I forgot to set the depth ! :@@@
12:14 PM miss0r: phew, false alarm
12:17 PM gloops: slipalong not much difference there
12:20 PM gloops: could make a difference using downcut spirals as well for that particular job
12:20 PM miss0r: memory overflow... Fsck me
12:24 PM gloops: well, first look at chinese sbr 16 rails, these are stiff, and quite heavy
12:25 PM gloops: 30 odd kg going on the Y axis in screws and bearings alone, before any frame
12:27 PM IchGucksLive: gloops: as i told you its good sbr16 the 20 will be overshoot
12:27 PM gloops: Ichs this looks quite adequate to me, at a glance
12:30 PM gloops: but Y and Z combined - must be approaching 100kilos, that is a deadweight!
12:49 PM miss0r: IchGucksLive: Wrote it manually - Slowly but surely getting there: http://picpaste.com/IMG_20171108_191706-P2g0U5jF.jpg
12:50 PM IchGucksLive: good as it is
01:03 PM IchGucksLive: Loetmichel: bist du da
01:07 PM Tom_L: gloops which set did you get?
01:09 PM IchGucksLive: Tom_L: http://stores.ebay.de/rattmmotor88/Ball-Screw-Linear-Guide-/_i.html?_fsub=2801572819
01:12 PM Tom_L: seems the only way you can get square rails in a kit is the 400 700 1000 ballscrew lengths
01:12 PM FinboySlick: IchGucksLive: That looks a bit stiffer than your gantry mill.
01:13 PM IchGucksLive: image
01:13 PM FinboySlick: Nevermind, my brain parsed the text wrong. It's miss0r's mill ;)
01:13 PM IchGucksLive: FinboySlick: on budget is a build not as you want
01:15 PM FinboySlick: IchGucksLive: I got confused and thought it was your picture. I thought you upgraded.
01:16 PM IchGucksLive: i only downgread
01:19 PM gloops: sorry phone - i got these Tom_L http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/SBR16-300-1350-1350MM3-SETS-LINEAR-RAILS-3-SETS-BALL-SCREWS-BALLSCREW-RM1605/311367687009?
01:20 PM gloops: they machined the ends for £20 and when they arrived they also threw in all the ballscrew end bearings and motor couplings, £220 cant grumble at that
01:34 PM IchGucksLive: gloops: where did the parts come form
01:35 PM IchGucksLive: shanghai direct
01:42 PM Tom_L: so you went with the round linear rails
01:42 PM gloops: shanghai yeah
01:42 PM gloops: 1 month - but that included machining
01:42 PM IchGucksLive: gloops: coustom service
01:43 PM IchGucksLive: yeah he is fine on coustom parts
01:43 PM Tom_L: so X and Y are the same length
01:43 PM gloops: Tom yeah i went with the round, it is a wood router not metal mill i thought the round would be ok
01:44 PM gloops: Tom ive already got 2 1000mm ballscrews - which ill use for Y, im going to use both the 1350mm screws for X
01:44 PM gloops: so machine will be 1350 x 1000
01:44 PM Tom_L: i see
01:44 PM gloops: with the steel im guessing the gantry and z will be pretty heavy
01:45 PM Tom_L: i'm wondering if 1000 may be a bit long for my design for X
01:45 PM gloops: bit long is always better than a bit short
01:46 PM Tom_L: may be too much weight if it's at one end of the travel
01:46 PM gloops: well the package above was 50 odd kilos
01:46 PM Tom_L: i've been hunting for a 1" plate to use for it
01:46 PM Tom_L: alum
01:46 PM gloops: for the z axis?
01:47 PM Tom_L: got my eye on a couple peces
01:47 PM Tom_L: no for x
01:47 PM gloops: ahh right
01:47 PM gloops: its not cheap stuff is it
01:47 PM Tom_L: i got 2 plates for Y and Z to mount the spindle and X axis too
01:47 PM Tom_L: not too bad surpluse
01:47 PM IchGucksLive: gloops: ratmotors got spare 500mm Balscrew for a larger Z
01:47 PM Tom_L: like $13 for the 2 .500 plates
01:48 PM Tom_L: ~ 10 x 10 roughly ea
01:48 PM gloops: Ichs i bought a 400mm screw and bearings seperate - will give 8 inch z movement
01:48 PM Tom_L: X will be more i'm sure
01:48 PM gloops: how thick is that Tom ? 1 inch?
01:48 PM gloops: that is very cheap
01:48 PM IchGucksLive: im off
01:49 PM gloops: in rip off UK two plates for Z will cost me £80
01:52 PM gloops: the difference in your design though Tom - the ends of your axis arent fixed, a gantry is joined up square on, so can use a bit lighter sections
01:52 PM Tom_L: surplus
01:52 PM Tom_L: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/cnc/local_stock/stock_index.php
01:53 PM Tom_L: they have 12-15" round bar if you need some
01:53 PM gloops: lol, thats like alladins cave
01:53 PM Tom_L: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/cnc/local_stock/9.jpg
01:53 PM Tom_L: they've got some bigger than that
01:54 PM gloops: expensive stuff new
01:54 PM roycroft: i just made an offer on an 80mm spindle, so i guess i'll find out fairly soon whether such a spindle will work for me
01:54 PM Tom_L: good to live in an aircraft town
01:55 PM gloops: ahh thats the source for it, i went to a scrapyard here the other day and got some box section steel, big pile of ally scrap at the side - like a mountain, but nope, you cant have a look through it, not one stick of it can be sold due to regulations
01:56 PM Tom_L: yeah we've got a steel scrap yard here too
01:56 PM roycroft: i live in timber country, yet local hardwood lumber sells for tourist prices
01:56 PM roycroft: there are very few sources for affordable hardwood around here
01:57 PM gloops: they sell like old - new stuff, thats all, box section had light surface rust but otherwise full new lengths
01:57 PM Tom_L: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/cnc/local_stock/5.jpg
01:57 PM Tom_L: i've been scoping out those racks to find my X table
02:07 PM gloops: some nice slabs there
02:17 PM gloops: roycroft - big bandsaw? or chainsaw mill, cut your own
02:21 PM roycroft: i have neither
02:21 PM roycroft: although i do have two 6" riser blocks for my 14" bandsaw
02:21 PM roycroft: i can saw up to about 18" thick with that
02:21 PM roycroft: the upper wheel flexes quite a bit when i have the riser blocks installed and the blade tensioned
02:22 PM roycroft: but i can do some rough resawing with that setup when necessary
02:25 PM miss0r: You know the feeling when you've just realized you can't seem to find any HSS 18.5mm twistdrills and it is late in the evening and nowhere to get one
02:25 PM gloops: sounds like an ideal moment to open a can miss0r
02:26 PM miss0r: would that be referring to beer? :]
02:26 PM SpeedEvil: miss0r: If you drill with a red hot 18mm bit, it may be the right diameter
02:26 PM miss0r: SpeedEvil: Hehehe yeah that might well be the case
02:26 PM SpeedEvil: Spade bits can be great when you need to have random dimensions
02:27 PM roycroft: so use an undersize drill followed with a boring bar
02:27 PM SpeedEvil: Or that
02:27 PM miss0r: roycroft: yeah... its 105 holes...
02:27 PM roycroft: yeah
02:27 PM SpeedEvil: Various ways depending on how much you care about the holesize and what it's in
02:28 PM roycroft: well by the time you're 1/3 done it will be morning and yoy can go buy the proper size drill to finish the job
02:28 PM miss0r: luckily its alu... and it needs to accept a M20x1.5 tap, so dimentions are not 'critical'
02:28 PM SpeedEvil: Grind down a bigger drill.
02:29 PM gregcnc_: that much margin in aluminum might be fun
02:29 PM miss0r: Thought about it, but decided i'm not that rich. The bigger drills I have around here are somewhat pricy
02:29 PM SpeedEvil: A spade bit can work
02:30 PM roycroft: do you have an 18.5mm reamer?
02:30 PM miss0r: At the moment I am running an 18mm drill, and it turns out to be 18.2-3 something. I wonder if I can force the tap
02:30 PM roycroft: i don't ream holes that i will tap
02:30 PM miss0r: roycroft: sadle I skipped the 18.5 one. I have 18 and 19
02:30 PM gregcnc_: rush job?
02:30 PM SpeedEvil: miss0r: you could also stone one side of the 18mm to make it wander a bit more
02:31 PM gloops: its not funny really, but im just like that with spanners
02:31 PM roycroft: an 18mm twist drill will probably be boring holes that average 18.1mm in diameter anyway
02:31 PM roycroft: so you're pretty close with what you have
02:31 PM gloops: if i need a 17mm i can only find 16 and 18 mm
02:31 PM miss0r: gregcnc_: Isn't it always?
02:32 PM miss0r: I think I will follow this 18mm drill with a boring bar
02:32 PM miss0r: I couldn't live with myself if it turned out below average
02:32 PM miss0r: boring bar = boring head
02:32 PM SpeedEvil: How thick is the aluminium
02:33 PM gloops: reamers?
02:33 PM roycroft: boring bar + boring head :)
02:33 PM miss0r: SpeedEvil: Only 10 mm, luckily
02:33 PM miss0r: gloops: I don't own a 18.5mm reamer
02:33 PM miss0r: roycroft: Generaly the way it works ;)
02:34 PM roycroft: you should be able to bore those holes to size in a single pass
02:34 PM roycroft: still not fun, but it's doable
02:34 PM roycroft: cnc or manual?
02:34 PM roycroft: oh, silly question
02:34 PM miss0r: I started drilling with a 19mm drill. Only to discover that some idiot had ground it down with an angle grinder at some point(I might be said idiot). I didn't notice that till it was too late. New workpeice
02:34 PM roycroft: if it were cnc you'd just use an undersize endmmill
02:35 PM miss0r: roycroft: it is cnc. but the plate i'm working on it somewhat impossible to fixate enough for milling
02:35 PM gloops: tis an odd size, 18.256mm = 23/32s
02:35 PM miss0r: gloops: 18.5 is a pretty good size for threading an M20x1.5 tap ;)
02:35 PM SpeedEvil: isn't it the nominal size?
02:36 PM miss0r: Yeah
02:36 PM gregcnc_: 18.5mm is standard outside the stonage
02:36 PM SpeedEvil: If your drill is actually doing 18.3, then I'd just try it gently
02:36 PM SpeedEvil: (tapping)
02:37 PM miss0r: wall... you'd need a 17.3mm drill for the 'regular' M20 tap, which is 2.5mm incline
02:37 PM miss0r: This is a fine thread
02:37 PM miss0r: And thoes I probally have 5 of laying on the shelf
02:38 PM gregcnc_: 18.25 is 90% thread, that's pretty brave
02:38 PM * miss0r looks at gregcnc_ with his bloodshed eyes: 'it'll have to do' :P
02:38 PM SpeedEvil: ^actually I lie, I am a barbarian and would likely try to impact wrench a modified 8.8 bolt through
02:38 PM miss0r: I'm gonna follow it through with a boring head
02:39 PM miss0r: LOL !
02:39 PM miss0r: Thankyou for that :] Now I just cheered up alot :D
02:40 PM SpeedEvil: Also, depending on what you can do, a broach
02:41 PM miss0r: SpeedEvil: i've done that once actualy. In a rubber suit with human excrement up to my armpits, in the deepest darkest sewer, trying to fix a hydraulic valve
02:41 PM miss0r: Now thats a story worth telling while sitting down to eat with the inlaws ;)
02:42 PM miss0r: And that repair actualy held up for 3 months, till it was possible to drain the place and do a replacement
02:44 PM miss0r: I think the boring head will do just fine. The CNC can do that for me. Looking back I should've spend more time mounting the workpeice'n billing the holes. But now I'm here, with no spare material to go with and a deadline tomorrow morning. So the usual
02:45 PM miss0r: billing=milling
02:45 PM gloops: it is always darkest before dawn miss0r
02:46 PM miss0r: yeah. thats what i'm afraid of - working till dawn.
02:46 PM SpeedEvil: Good luck.
02:46 PM SpeedEvil: For something only 10mm thick, a very basic drillbit could be made
02:46 PM miss0r: I'm not worried - it'll be fine. I just curse myself for not checking up on the drills before it being too late
02:46 PM SpeedEvil: I suspect actual flat faces with no twist would work just fine
02:47 PM miss0r: SpeedEvil: I'm just worried about the (runout*finish)/time spend making it
02:48 PM miss0r: also 105 holes is alot, even in aluminium. That could wear out a simple drill halfway through
02:49 PM SpeedEvil: It's 10 10cm deep holes.
02:50 PM miss0r: That is almost true. All the starting the holes is what has me worried
02:51 PM SpeedEvil: If you're getting 18.2mm, then finishing off to 19 is a much lighter task.
02:53 PM SpeedEvil: Good luck.
02:53 PM miss0r: Yhanks ;)
03:22 PM CaptHindsight: Touchscreen gestures in Linux using Touchegg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=28Jjf5Ak6Q0
03:23 PM CaptHindsight: ^^ how well does this work with LCNC?
03:23 PM CaptHindsight: Canonical wrote the libs for it
03:23 PM CaptHindsight: there is not a deb package
03:24 PM CaptHindsight: https://github.com/JoseExposito/touchegg
03:25 PM CaptHindsight: https://github.com/JoseExposito/touchegg/wiki/All-actions-supported-by-Touch%C3%A9gg
03:27 PM CaptHindsight: "Unity reserves to itself gestures with 3 and 4 fingers making impossible to Touchégg make use of them."
03:42 PM gloops: well, i will have 2 ballscrews left over, at 1000mm and 300mm
03:43 PM gloops: God is telling me to make a cnc wood lathe
03:50 PM CaptHindsight: I'll pray for you :)
03:51 PM XXCoder: Ark, and now cnc lathe
03:51 PM XXCoder: he dont n eed much now eh
03:52 PM MarcelineVQ: I could go for some nanomachine desktop-manufacturing
03:52 PM MarcelineVQ: so it could go: ark, cnc lathe, nanomachines
03:55 PM gloops: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/10pcs-mini-Micro-Small-8x9-5mm-Two-phase-4-wire-stepper-motor-with-copper-gear/282228460926?
03:56 PM gloops: the motors are cheap anyway
03:56 PM XXCoder: fancy
03:56 PM MarcelineVQ: oh neat, I have one of those from an old scanner bed
03:57 PM XXCoder: theres ones that have screws also
03:57 PM XXCoder: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/282258782427
03:57 PM CaptHindsight: MarcelineVQ: those are often only a few steps per rev
03:58 PM CaptHindsight: MarcelineVQ: you might want to look at piezo motors for nanoscale positioning
04:01 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Physik-Instrumente-C-182-PCD-Piezo-Motor-Driver-w-M-663X013-Positioner/331210209222
04:01 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.physikinstrumente.com/en/products/linear-stages-and-actuators/Compact-Linear-Stages-with-Piezomotor-Drives/u-521-piline-linear-positioning-stage-1000351/?sortnr=1000400
04:01 PM MarcelineVQ: I meant actual nanomachines, not micromachines! But those are plenty cool too
04:03 PM MarcelineVQ: really like that gimbal example here https://youtu.be/-5jf_wwB_MI?t=55s
04:12 PM CaptHindsight: MarcelineVQ: http://www.jcnabity.com/ modify an old SEM
04:17 PM andypugh: I just blew the mA range fuse in my “Fluke” multimeter from China.
04:18 PM andypugh: I am now even more convinced that it is the real thing. The fuse is enormous.
04:18 PM roycroft: fluke meters don't blow fuses easily - that must have been a fluke
04:19 PM andypugh: I put 240V across it with the plugs in the mA position, but on the ACV setting.
04:20 PM andypugh: The fuse is slightly fatter than an AAA battery and only slightly shorter.
04:20 PM andypugh: (Bussman 1000V 10kVA fuse)
04:23 PM andypugh: Yikes! £18 each from a UK supplier. I paid only 4x that for the DMM
04:25 PM JT-Shop: https://www.amazon.com/DMM-44-Fluke-Digital-multimeter-replacement/dp/B007HR74X0
04:25 PM JT-Shop: that one?
04:26 PM andypugh: Yes.
04:26 PM andypugh: Or, more usefully, this one: http://uk.rs-online.com/web/c/test-measurement/multimeters-accessories/multimeter-fuses/?applied-dimensions=4294800418
04:27 PM jdh: mine is like 473mA
04:28 PM JT-Shop: hmm cheaper than amazon lol
04:28 PM jdh: some wweird numbee
04:30 PM andypugh: RS are even cheaper than themselves on those. Same fuse, different section (and you need ot buy them in 5s): http://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/cartridge-fuses/4597918/
04:32 PM MarcelineVQ: oh my lord, that fuse is $35 through electric supply here if you want namebrand
04:46 PM SpeedEvil: If you're only measuring low volts, then along with a sticker on the meter, swapping in a lower breaking voltage fuse would not be insane
05:00 PM Deejay: gn8
05:54 PM miss0r: Thats 105 holes drilled'n tapped
05:54 PM MarcelineVQ: you madman
06:01 PM miss0r: You have no idea *mwuhahaha*
06:01 PM miss0r: I'm off for tonight Gnite
07:11 PM ziper: anyone have any input on the difference between oil rings that looks like corrugated cardboard and the ones that are like a tiny coil spring with a guard over it
08:05 PM rob_h: first sounds abit like X seal , other a shaft seal maybe a image helps here
08:05 PM gregcnc_: i don't think he is around, but he's talking piston rings
08:07 PM rob_h: i see alot of types there too
08:07 PM Tom_L: i don't think there's much difference. probably just mfg style
08:08 PM Tom_L: and no he didn't wait for an answwer...
08:09 PM rob_h: well 6mins he did ...
08:09 PM BeachBumPete: heh
08:09 PM Tom_L: damn you.. be quicker next time!
08:09 PM Tom_L: BeachBumPete what's up?
08:10 PM BeachBumPete: hey tom
08:10 PM Tom_L: did you see my latest 'something to do'?
08:10 PM BeachBumPete: not much just workin on parts
08:10 PM BeachBumPete: musta missed it
08:10 PM Tom_L: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/cnc/Mill_base_XAxis3.jpg
08:10 PM Tom_L: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/cnc/Mill_Steel/Steel10.jpg
08:11 PM BeachBumPete: nice yeah I think we discussed it a little bit
08:11 PM Tom_L: just piddling on it as i have time
08:11 PM Tom_L: got the steppers for it
08:11 PM Tom_L: or for something...
08:12 PM BeachBumPete: nice
08:12 PM Tom_L: still makin gun rails?
08:12 PM BeachBumPete: I ALMOST built a heavy duty version of something like that at one point
08:13 PM BeachBumPete: always man
08:13 PM BeachBumPete: got two new prototypes working now
08:13 PM Tom_L: i don't have alot of space but want something a little heavier than the silly sherline
08:13 PM Tom_L: should have quite a bit more travel too
08:13 PM Tom_L: i think i'll just use a slab of aluminum for the table
08:14 PM Tom_L: probably 1-1.25 thick or so
08:14 PM Tom_L: depends what i find at the scrap yard
08:15 PM BeachBumPete: sweet
08:15 PM Tom_L: i've got my eye on a couple pieces
08:15 PM Tom_L: just waiting to get some rails and ballscrews to see what fits
08:15 PM gregcnc_: AL is fine if you don't beat on it
08:15 PM Tom_L: gregcnc_ i keep a sacrificial plate on my sherline for that purpose
08:16 PM Tom_L: may do the same on this one
08:16 PM BeachBumPete: a nice piece of fortal or something should work fine
08:16 PM gregcnc_: my vise and collet block essentially don't come off
08:17 PM Tom_L: i see no real need for slots
08:17 PM Tom_L: i'll probably do a hole pattern with threaded holes
08:17 PM BeachBumPete: got one of those jailbroke fire sticks works pretty nice so far
08:17 PM Tom_L: maybe alternate dowel pin holes
08:17 PM BeachBumPete: yup holes and pins is da ticket
08:18 PM Tom_L: that's what most large fixturing is anyway
08:22 PM Tom_L: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/cnc/pendant/profile.jpg
08:23 PM Tom_L: i've got that bolted to the stock sherline table
08:23 PM Tom_L: just flycut it off every so often
08:24 PM Tom_L: is there an 'inbetween' clamp set between say the sherline size and normal strap clamps?
08:24 PM Tom_L: aren't the normal ones like 3/8" studs?
08:25 PM Tom_L: or 1/2
08:27 PM Tom_L: looks like tormach is 5/8 T slot
08:29 PM BeachBumPete: I dont remember what mine are but standard CNC stuff
08:29 PM Tom_L: looks like 1/2" studs near as i can tell
08:30 PM Tom_L: 1/2 13
08:32 PM sync: how is your trike going BeachBumPete?
08:34 PM Tom_L: http://forum.weldingtipsandtricks.com/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=6993
08:34 PM Tom_L: that's a serious rack
08:34 PM BeachBumPete: well its right now in the buying tools stage and working on sourcing parts for the front suspension setup
08:35 PM BeachBumPete: that looks nice
08:35 PM Tom_L: do you do much wirefeed?
08:35 PM BeachBumPete: my Tig is rather larger older commercial unit and it IS its own stand
08:35 PM Tom_L: i can't seem to feed .025 wire thru mine without it binding
08:35 PM Tom_L: .030 works good
08:36 PM BeachBumPete: I actually sold my little mig welder because I never used it since I got the Tig
08:36 PM sync: I like the mig for roll cages
08:36 PM BeachBumPete: I like tig for roll cages ;)
08:36 PM Tom_L: i need more practice
08:37 PM sync: tig takes too long imho
08:37 PM sync: and has no benefit
08:37 PM Tom_L: what sort of gas pressure do you use?
08:37 PM Tom_L: tig is prettier i think
08:37 PM BeachBumPete: it does take too long but the benefits are arguable
08:37 PM sync: I don't use any higher alloyed steels tho
08:38 PM Tom_L: does mig inherently produce a 'taller' bead than say stick or tig?
08:38 PM sync: no, it depends on your process you are using with mig
08:38 PM Tom_L: i learned on stick but haven't used my mig enough to get real used to it yet
08:39 PM Tom_L: i wish i'd have kept my stick welder
08:39 PM BeachBumPete: I HATED my stick welder LOL
08:39 PM Tom_L: mine was gas and real hard to start
08:39 PM Tom_L: old old lincoln
08:39 PM Tom_L: didn't even have a recoil on the rope
08:39 PM Tom_L: :)
08:40 PM BeachBumPete: then I got to use a DC stick welder in a guys shop once. No comparison
08:40 PM sync: I don't mind doing tig on rollcages but it just takes too long
08:40 PM sync: on parts I can get out again it depends if i tig
08:40 PM sync: but on stuff that is welded in the car, always mig
08:41 PM Tom_L: if it beads up too much slow the wire feed down some?
08:41 PM BeachBumPete: I guess I just enjoy the Tig too much it never bothers me to use it
08:41 PM Tom_L: also do you push or pull with mig?
08:41 PM Tom_L: i've always pulled
08:42 PM Tom_L: i tried pushing and it looks like crap
08:42 PM sync: I don't think that there is a significant difference but you need to talk to a welding engineer for a definitive answer
08:43 PM Tom_L: i think it's too hard to see the arc puddle when pushing
08:43 PM Tom_L: maybe that's just me
08:43 PM sync: I was in the lectures in uni but I don't have much experience
08:43 PM sync: maybe just try both and bend and etch a sample
08:46 PM sync: one tip BeachBumPete, please don't make the mistake and add gussets where they are subjected to tension/compression
08:52 PM BeachBumPete: heh why don't you just design it for me
08:53 PM sync: because you are not paying me to do so :P
08:54 PM sync: it is easy to do right tho
08:54 PM BeachBumPete: so the tips are just free because you are such a nice guy then? LOL
08:55 PM sync: no, because I hate badly engineered stuff
08:55 PM sync: especially when it would have been easy to do right
08:56 PM BeachBumPete: I kinda get the feeling that you assume mine will be
08:57 PM sync: possibly
08:58 PM sync: you need to do gussets along the neutral axis, that is all
08:58 PM BeachBumPete: I am far more concerned with how to mock up that front Corvette suspension bits than where and how I will gusset it.
09:08 PM Vitran: I came across an odd thing. I powered up the machine btw and the servos started to fly at full speed
09:09 PM Vitran: I think the old servo drive has the PLC generate a tachometer signal
09:09 PM Vitran: to trick the drive into thinking there is a tachometer on the motor
09:23 PM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
09:46 PM Roguish_ is now known as Roguish