#linuxcnc Logs

Oct 09 2017

#linuxcnc Calendar

12:03 AM ziper: im still not sure exactly what a turret lathe is
01:54 AM archivist: I think ziper needs a pipe threading machine
01:58 AM selroc: hello
02:16 AM IchGucksLive: good morning from Germany
02:16 AM IchGucksLive: morning selroc
02:16 AM selroc: hi
02:17 AM selroc: rain
02:17 AM XXCoder: gonna make bed at 12 am ugh
02:17 AM XXCoder: not best time to make bed
02:18 AM IchGucksLive: its getting a nice day here
02:19 AM IchGucksLive: selroc: how does the cnc go
02:19 AM XXCoder: crystal clear night.
02:19 AM XXCoder: not typical fall so far. :(
02:19 AM XXCoder: normally it constantly rains in falls.
02:20 AM Deejay: moin
02:20 AM IchGucksLive: moin to germany Deejay
02:21 AM selroc: the pieces are all there
02:30 AM IchGucksLive: selroc: so time to get some friend giving you a hand on mounting
02:30 AM IchGucksLive: im off 2 garden
02:30 AM selroc: yes
02:30 AM IchGucksLive: greening today
02:30 AM selroc: ciao
03:06 AM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
03:12 AM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
05:11 AM jthornton: morning
05:22 AM selroc: hi
05:57 AM Deejay: hi
06:04 AM * jthornton renames FireFox to Crash-n-Bunr
06:04 AM jthornton: Burn
06:18 AM syyl: fire-what?
06:18 AM syyl: that thing is still around?
06:25 AM jthornton: what do you use?
06:33 AM Tom_L: morning
06:33 AM jthornton: morning
06:35 AM Tom_L: get anywhere with your server remote login?
06:38 AM Tom_L: i use ff but i must say it acts differently on this pc over the other one
06:38 AM jthornton: been out of town since friday
06:43 AM jthornton: gotta backup my zoneminder configuration and reinstall the server
06:43 AM Tom_L: what happened to it?
06:44 AM Tom_L: are you using ubuntu on that one?
06:44 AM jthornton: I was trying to set it up to be able to log in from outside my LAN and screwed up something so now it can't update lol
06:45 AM Tom_L: i need to set one up and get a couple of those cameras one of these days
06:49 AM jthornton: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0734T9DYQ
06:49 AM jthornton: I got that camera the other day, going to try a manual zoom one next
06:50 AM jthornton: https://www.amazon.com/2-8-12MM-Varifocal-Surveillance-Waterproof-Detection/dp/B01N2R5THA
06:53 AM jthornton: it was pretty cool to see my neighbor coming over to take care of the chickens and the postman trying to deliver a package
06:56 AM Tom_L: does it focus with the zoneminder software?
06:56 AM Tom_L: the manual one...
06:57 AM jthornton: no, it's a manual zoom and focus
06:57 AM jthornton: I have one pt camera and have never set up the pt in zoneminder
07:48 AM SpeedEvil: I have a driveway cam, it's awesome.
07:48 AM SpeedEvil: Having it go 'bing' ~20-30s before the person hits my door is really quite nice.
08:34 AM JT-Shop: what software do you use?
08:50 AM SpeedEvil: motion
08:53 AM JT-Shop: this one? https://github.com/Motion-Project/motion
08:57 AM archivist: I have used motion here too, be careful with disk space, it eats it
08:59 AM SpeedEvil: JT-Shop: yes
08:59 AM SpeedEvil: I set it up for snaps every 30s.
09:00 AM SpeedEvil: Which is a good compromise, and motion detection does ~0.5s for 30s.
09:00 AM JT-Shop: thanks, I'll take a look at it
09:02 AM archivist: I set up a script to move a days images to a dated sub directiory
09:03 AM SpeedEvil: yeah - and compress to a movie
09:07 AM archivist: I was running a neighbours camera for a while http://www.archivist.info/88/
09:07 AM archivist: camera indoors gets reflections off the window
09:10 AM SpeedEvil: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1280-720P-1-0MP-Bullet-IP-Camera-IR-Outdoor-Security-ONVIF-2-0-Waterproof-Night-Vision/32225491510.html I have - which works well.
09:11 AM SpeedEvil: Note that this camera is vulnerable to mirai
09:11 AM SpeedEvil: So don't expose it to external network
09:12 AM SpeedEvil: Don't expose any camera to external networks without carefull auditing of the software.
09:31 AM JT-Shop: dang $18 for a camera
09:31 AM JT-Shop: I don't do business with aliexpress anymore, lost $400 there
09:31 AM selroc: just remove the gateway from your ip settings and you have a secure pc :-)
09:34 AM SpeedEvil: selroc: Well, yes, but there is no good reason to expose random things to the internet.
09:36 AM SpeedEvil: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B8DjTcANBx0 - related
09:40 AM selroc: that's why I said that
09:42 AM selroc: your camera recording pc should not have a gateway set
10:21 AM SpeedEvil: qh
10:21 AM SpeedEvil: ah
10:41 AM frankk: hi guys, any good option to fusion 360 cam? im having problems when selecting a lot of contours to cut, thanks
10:42 AM Deejay: re
12:01 PM IchGucksLive: hi
12:02 PM hazzy: hello Ich
12:02 PM IchGucksLive: ;-)
12:22 PM Deejay: hey grandpa
12:35 PM miss0r: Goodevening
12:39 PM miss0r: Do you guys know where I can aquire a cable management chain that is closed off enough that chips do not get inside?
12:41 PM enleth: miss0r: get a regular chain and sew a jeans hose around it? that's how it's done on many welding robots
12:41 PM enleth: to prevent spatter from reaching the cables
12:41 PM miss0r: That makes sense. Doesn't have that nice clean look thou :)
12:41 PM miss0r: Not a half bad idea
12:42 PM enleth: it looks pretty decent, actually
12:42 PM miss0r: I'll need to go through my sons discarted clothing. Too bad todlers have very short legs
12:42 PM miss0r: (its a pretty thin cable chain I have, and very few cables)
12:43 PM IchGucksLive: miss0r: howmany cables
12:43 PM enleth: many TIG torches have a jeans hose over the cable/hose bundle
12:43 PM enleth: but the biggest I've seen were on robots
12:44 PM miss0r: IchGucksLive: Three cables and an oil hose
12:44 PM miss0r: fak... The cable chain I have do not open. That won't do.
12:45 PM miss0r: The original cable management here is just a thin spring plate, the cables are cabletied to
12:46 PM miss0r: but that spring plate broke a long time before I got this machine.
12:46 PM enleth: miss0r: you can still put jeans over it, chain or not
12:46 PM miss0r: Absolutly. But I would like to add some support nonetheless
12:46 PM enleth: miss0r: get a sewing shop to produce several long thin strips of jeans with thwo halves of a zipper on the long edges
12:46 PM enleth: won't be expensive
12:46 PM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
12:47 PM enleth: and you can remove it with the zipper
12:47 PM hazzy: The fabric jeans are made from is called denim :P
12:47 PM miss0r: ohhh... shots fired
12:47 PM enleth: hazzy: right, couldn't remember the name, couldn't be bothered to look it up
12:48 PM Jymmm: hazzy: Zipper? I prefer removing using teeth, more fun that way.
12:48 PM miss0r: Honnestly: I don't even know where to begin on finding a sewing shop... :S i'll google a bit
12:48 PM IchGucksLive: miss0r: somthing like thatr cheep or somthing stabler https://www.netzwerkartikel.de/netzwerk/M502962/Flexibler-Kabelkanal-Schwarz-1-8-m-lang-ca-4-5-cm-Durchmesser-MANHATTAN.html
12:49 PM Jymmm: miss0r: may dry cleaners, upolstery shops, tailors, etc
12:49 PM miss0r: IchGucksLive: Yeah, but that would accumulate small chips
12:49 PM Jymmm: many*
12:49 PM hazzy: You could sew your self, it would not be very difficult at all
12:50 PM IchGucksLive: miss0r: you need to do the end with a tighten rubber
12:50 PM hazzy: denim is cheap too
12:50 PM miss0r: damn. Theres a taylor 400meters from here :)
12:50 PM IchGucksLive: is it for tourch
12:50 PM miss0r: IchGucksLive: No, its for a mill
12:51 PM hazzy: Oh, I was thinking torch, maybe all of us
12:51 PM miss0r: Yeah. I failed to specify that
12:51 PM enleth: hazzy: sewing zippers can be a little tricky if you haven't ever done it. OTOH it doesn't get any easier than sewing a straight rectangular piece along the edge.
12:51 PM miss0r: The misses does have a sewing machine....
12:52 PM hazzy: He should do a hidden zipper, now those are tricky!
12:52 PM miss0r: Meh. by the time i've set it up and threaded it, I would be installing the one I have someone else make
12:52 PM Jymmm: miss0r: youtube sewing zipper, I' sure you'll find lots of examples
12:52 PM enleth: miss0r: there's also velcro, but it might catch chips
12:52 PM IchGucksLive: miss0r: what about this one http://de.academic.ru/pictures/dewiki/67/Cable_drag_chain-metal.jpg
12:52 PM enleth: IchGucksLive: looks cool but kinda expensive
12:53 PM hazzy: looks expensive :O
12:53 PM miss0r: IchGucksLive: That looks sexy!
12:53 PM miss0r: Hehe. and alot overkill. It is already kidden behind an armored harmonica cover. But the small chips find a way in there anyway
12:53 PM miss0r: hidden*
12:55 PM hazzy: how about something like this: https://www.mcmaster.com/#standard-electrical-conduit/=19qmi4j
12:55 PM miss0r: I think the denim is more in my price range
12:55 PM hazzy: can you fish the wires?
12:55 PM miss0r: hazzy: Its what I do for a living.
12:55 PM miss0r: But the tubes does not realy guide the cables the way I want
12:55 PM hazzy: ok :)
12:57 PM miss0r: meh. Back to work. I have to lift that horrible servo back into place, and remount the timing belt through an access panel made for people with tiny hands
01:16 PM IchGucksLive: im off Gn8
03:35 PM Connor: So, I just saw a video of a kit for CNCing a Bridgeport.. They ended up using the Quill instead of the Knee for the Z. Thing was.. the motor looked big enough to do the Knee!! WTF
03:35 PM Connor: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6b0Jf-xzE0s
03:37 PM hazzy: oh, Flashcut
03:37 PM Connor: yea.. I was just looking at the hardware side...
03:38 PM * hazzy is unimpressed with there hardware, especially
03:38 PM hazzy: :D
03:38 PM cradek: why would you not start with a cnc bridgeport
03:44 PM gloops: hmm, well not sure what you can make for consumption by the general public on ebay, on a cnc bridgeport
03:46 PM gloops: although these are nice..wonder how he makes them - https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10209306094762489&set=pcb.288393831677449&type=3&theater&ifg=1
03:48 PM gloops: looks like the sole is dovetailed on, thats some nioce machining, he puts a batch on about every 2 week, sold like hot cakes
03:48 PM TurBoss[m]: hello
03:48 PM TurBoss[m]: when I plug the PSU my motors make "tuc" noise
03:48 PM TurBoss[m]: :D
03:49 PM TurBoss[m]: I thinks its normal
03:49 PM TurBoss[m]: only one time
03:49 PM TurBoss[m]: when start
03:49 PM TurBoss[m]: but when is switch a relay I can ear it again "tuc"
03:50 PM TurBoss[m]: heheh
03:50 PM gloops: definately a 'tuc' sound?
03:50 PM TurBoss[m]: sound yes
03:50 PM TurBoss[m]: sorry not english speaker
03:51 PM gloops: do they work ok ?
03:51 PM TurBoss[m]: yes
03:51 PM gloops: yes thats normal
03:51 PM TurBoss[m]: but when i fire the relay I can ear tha sound again
03:51 PM gloops: whats the relay for?
03:52 PM TurBoss[m]: spindle
03:52 PM TurBoss[m]: unconnected
03:52 PM TurBoss[m]: atm
03:52 PM TurBoss[m]: just the relay
03:52 PM TurBoss[m]: is a 5v relay driving a 220 relay
03:52 PM TurBoss[m]: that will drive the spindle
03:53 PM TurBoss[m]: 5 v relay has the diode in place
03:53 PM TurBoss[m]: i should need a snubber network on the ac side?
03:53 PM gloops: so when you spindle on, the motors power off and on again?
03:53 PM TurBoss[m]: yes it seems
03:53 PM TurBoss[m]: at least the same sound
03:54 PM TurBoss[m]: but spindle is uncconected just the relay for now
03:54 PM gloops: ok, the relay pin - do you have a motor wire to it as well?
03:54 PM TurBoss[m]: no
03:55 PM gloops: well, there might be a jumper to isolate the relay
03:55 PM TurBoss[m]: they are in separeated paralel ports
03:55 PM gloops: ahh
03:56 PM TurBoss[m]: steps -> oboard port
03:56 PM TurBoss[m]: IO pci port
03:57 PM hazzy: I wonder if the 5V supply is being pulled down by the inrush current when the relay starts
03:58 PM hazzy: Is the 5V supplied by a switch mode supply?
03:58 PM TurBoss[m]: could be
03:58 PM TurBoss[m]: its just a 7895
03:58 PM TurBoss[m]: *7805
03:59 PM gloops: i get this when i switch the PC on, the motors power up then down straight away, then power up again when the op system boots
04:00 PM hazzy: that sounds like they are being enabled when the parport is probed at start up
04:00 PM gloops: yes, hardware test i think, something like that
04:01 PM hazzy: That is common, and can be dangerous with a spindle (I know from experience :D )
04:02 PM TurBoss[m]: LPT pins are at unkown state when boot
04:02 PM TurBoss[m]: hohoho
04:02 PM TurBoss[m]: I keep my electronics off until lcnc is on
04:02 PM gloops: you dont want to be holding a spanner on it at that moment
04:02 PM hazzy: no, for sure
04:03 PM hazzy: TurBoss[m]: can you try isolating the the supply for the relay from the supply for the drives?
04:03 PM TurBoss[m]: they are
04:03 PM TurBoss[m]: 2 psu
04:03 PM TurBoss[m]: at least 2 regulators
04:03 PM TurBoss[m]: not 2 psu but 2 regulators
04:04 PM TurBoss[m]: isn't insuficient?
04:04 PM hazzy: the logic is isolated too?
04:04 PM gloops: you can keep the relay port side i think - if theres a jumper
04:04 PM TurBoss[m]: no
04:04 PM TurBoss[m]: hmm
04:04 PM TurBoss[m]: I'll check
04:06 PM TurBoss[m]: what do you mean with isolated logic
04:06 PM TurBoss[m]: ?
04:06 PM TurBoss[m]: https://www.codeproject.com/KB/boards-embedded-devices/845211/9.3.jpg
04:06 PM TurBoss[m]: my relay schematic is like this one
04:07 PM TurBoss[m]: instad of a 222 I have a bc547
04:07 PM TurBoss[m]: and relay is 5 v
04:08 PM TurBoss[m]: drives 220
04:08 PM TurBoss[m]: v
04:08 PM hazzy: Do you have the transistor before the relay?
04:08 PM hazzy: ok
04:08 PM TurBoss[m]: yes
04:08 PM hazzy: that should work
04:08 PM TurBoss[m]: but if I put the big relay
04:08 PM TurBoss[m]: motors do its sound
04:09 PM TurBoss[m]: the big relay goes next to the tiny relay
04:09 PM TurBoss[m]: but far away
04:09 PM TurBoss[m]: wires go separated
04:09 PM TurBoss[m]: I'll take a picture
04:09 PM hazzy: great, that will help
04:11 PM hazzy: I think it is most likely caused by the large relays inrush current pulling down the main supply
04:11 PM hazzy: or maybe EMI from the relay ...
04:13 PM TurBoss[m]: I'll need a snubber network on the relay driven the AC relay?
04:13 PM hazzy: That is what I am thinking
04:14 PM TurBoss[m]: and another sbubber for the 220 relay drivinf the spindle :D
04:16 PM TurBoss[m]: https://i.stack.imgur.com/hIloS.png
04:17 PM Deejay: gn8
04:18 PM TurBoss[m]: n8
04:19 PM Jymmm: hazzy: you are driving a relay and having issues?
04:19 PM hazzy: no, TurBoss is having trouble driving a relay
04:20 PM TurBoss[m]: its me
04:20 PM Jymmm: TurBoss[m]: So YOU are to blame, huh?
04:20 PM hazzy: Yes, he always is :D
04:20 PM Jymmm: TurBoss[m]: what's it (not?) doing?
04:20 PM TurBoss[m]: its works
04:21 PM TurBoss[m]: but makes the stepper motors do its powerup sound
04:21 PM Jymmm: rephrase that please
04:21 PM TurBoss[m]: yes..
04:21 PM TurBoss[m]: when i plug my electronics
04:22 PM TurBoss[m]: the motors do its caracteristical sound "tuc" :)
04:22 PM TurBoss[m]: then if i enable the relay I can ear it again
04:22 PM Jymmm: the steppers engage idling.
04:22 PM Jymmm: So there is a loss of power (brown out) ?
04:23 PM TurBoss[m]: like a hard reset of the electronics
04:23 PM Connor: cradek: I picked up a nice manual Bridgeport. Just looking at what it would take to CNC it if we wanted to. It's in a Maker Space.. so, I'm a bit concerned with CNCing it.
04:23 PM Jymmm: TurBoss[m]: Are your PS ample enough to carrythe loads?
04:23 PM Connor: Heck. I'm concerned with a Power Feed on the X axis..
04:23 PM TurBoss[m]: hmmm
04:24 PM TurBoss[m]: cound be...
04:24 PM Jymmm: TurBoss[m]: 5A? 10A?
04:25 PM Jymmm: switching? linear?
04:25 PM TurBoss[m]: its a 100VA 24v Transformer with a rectifier and a linear regulator for logic
04:25 PM hazzy: That is tiny!
04:25 PM TurBoss[m]: yes?
04:25 PM TurBoss[m]: hmm
04:26 PM Jymmm: TurBoss[m]: Replace it with a switching 24VDC PS at 5A or better and see if that helps
04:26 PM Jymmm: maybe even 2A
04:26 PM TurBoss[m]: okay
04:26 PM TurBoss[m]: thanksy you
04:27 PM hazzy: You are running the motors and logic off that same supply?
04:27 PM TurBoss[m]: yes
04:27 PM TurBoss[m]: not same voltage
04:27 PM Jymmm: TurBoss[m]: Either a) a laptop power supply, or maybe soemithing like this http://www.ebay.com/itm/24VDC-360W-15A-switching-power-supply-9PIN-adjustable-voltage-LED-LIGHT-METAL/331572125432
04:28 PM TurBoss[m]: thansk
04:28 PM TurBoss[m]: I'll buy it tomorrow
04:28 PM Jymmm: TurBoss[m]: These are kinda nce too... http://www.ebay.com/itm/MEAN-WELL-24-VDC-SWITCHING-POWER-SUPPLY-SP-200-24-/391901691868
04:28 PM Jymmm: nice*
04:30 PM TurBoss[m]: great
04:30 PM TurBoss[m]: but...
04:30 PM TurBoss[m]: hehehe
04:30 PM Jymmm: http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-AC-DC-1A-3A-10A-30A-50A-70A-Switching-Power-Supply-5V-12V-24V-F-LED-Strip-/253009105891
04:30 PM Jymmm: TurBoss[m]: Butt???
04:30 PM TurBoss[m]: the tiny relay works fine (no sound on motors) when the big relay is not wired
04:31 PM hazzy: I also think you should have the logic completely separated from the stepper/relay supply
04:31 PM hazzy: When a relay starts is basically shorts the circuit
04:31 PM TurBoss[m]: ok that could be done
04:32 PM hazzy: maybe all you have to do is add a small 5v for logic, your motors are small so don't need much
04:32 PM hazzy: and they are working fine now
04:32 PM * TurBoss[m] goes to try to not release a lot of magic smoke to the atmosphere
04:32 PM hazzy: hehe
04:32 PM hazzy: It is slippery stuff
04:33 PM Jymmm: TurBoss[m]: IMNSHO... you have WAY too many components going on. two Q's to drive two relays,
04:33 PM TurBoss[m]: transistors?
04:34 PM Jymmm: I get it, but for every added item, adds one more point of failure/headache/asprin/tequilia
04:34 PM Jymmm: Yes,
04:34 PM TurBoss[m]: heheheh
04:34 PM Jymmm: Q == Transistor.
04:35 PM hazzy: you could drive the big relay directly with a MOSFET
04:35 PM hazzy: or use an SSR
04:35 PM Jymmm: Hell I could give you a chip that works GREAT for driving DC relays from logic circuits
04:35 PM hazzy: SSR will not cause nois problems since it only stars conducting at the then voltage is at the cross over point
04:36 PM TurBoss[m]: I'm goint to separate psu
04:38 PM Jymmm: TurBoss[m]: I DO understand you are working within your means with what you have on hand. But at least test using a QUALITITY power supply that you KNOW is GOOD/GREAT, you cna always buy one to dedicate to your projects later on.
04:39 PM Jymmm: TurBoss[m]: hit a thrift store for laptop PS cheap
04:39 PM Jymmm: that are usually emi/rfi clean
04:39 PM Jymmm: they*
04:40 PM TurBoss[m]: oh ok
04:41 PM TurBoss[m]: I made some test
04:41 PM TurBoss[m]: the big relay has a holder
04:41 PM TurBoss[m]: so I can remove it easy
04:41 PM TurBoss[m]: now works fine
04:42 PM TurBoss[m]: after remove the big relay
04:42 PM hazzy: But when you put it back in it makes the "tuc" sound again?
04:42 PM TurBoss[m]: yes
04:43 PM TurBoss[m]: with just the 5v relay I can toggle it fine
04:43 PM hazzy: That almost proves it is the power supply not being able to provide enough current for the relay inrush
04:43 PM hazzy: TurBoss: I would suspect you have some old PC power supplies laying around, you can get very good 24V and 5V from those, at pretty good amps
04:43 PM TurBoss[m]: sorry inrush?
04:45 PM hazzy: inrush = the extra current it takes to start current flowing in the relay's coil, after the magnetic field is their it only takes a little current to maintain it
04:45 PM TurBoss[m]: sorry I'm confused, the big relay is 220VAC
04:46 PM hazzy: Both sides? Signal side and contact side?
04:46 PM TurBoss[m]: yes!
04:46 PM hazzy: So the little relay switches 220V to the big relay?
04:46 PM TurBoss[m]: tiny relay 5v in 220vac out
04:47 PM TurBoss[m]: big 220vac -> 220VAC
04:47 PM TurBoss[m]: yes
04:47 PM hazzy: ah, I have it now, sorry
04:47 PM TurBoss[m]: thats what confuses me , what has the psu do there
04:47 PM hazzy: So that means you need a bigger supply to the house :D
04:47 PM hazzy: just kidding
04:48 PM TurBoss[m]: :D
04:48 PM TurBoss[m]: I'll try with a bigger psu
04:48 PM TurBoss[m]: I have a lab one here
04:49 PM TurBoss[m]: 30v 10A
04:49 PM hazzy: so now I really don't understand what is causing the problem.
04:49 PM hazzy: yes, see it that supply helps
04:49 PM TurBoss[m]: emi from the relay?
04:49 PM hazzy: could be
04:49 PM hazzy: but you say is far away
04:50 PM TurBoss[m]: far than before
04:50 PM TurBoss[m]: :D
04:51 PM TurBoss[m]: ah sorry
04:51 PM TurBoss[m]: transforme is 200VA
04:51 PM TurBoss[m]: 24V
04:51 PM TurBoss[m]: not 100 as I said
04:51 PM hazzy: ok, that is probably enough, motors are only NEMA23, right?
04:52 PM TurBoss[m]: yes
04:52 PM TurBoss[m]: it gives me 8Amps
04:52 PM hazzy: ok, i think that should be fine
04:53 PM TurBoss[m]: I'll try snubber network
04:55 PM * hazzy is installing wheezy to see if you can install GTK+ 3 on it
04:56 PM TurBoss[m]: great!
05:10 PM TurBoss[m]: Hurray Snubber network on the big relay coil fixed the problem!!!
05:10 PM TurBoss[m]: Thanks
05:20 PM hazzy: Huzza!
05:23 PM hazzy: Firefox Quantum runs great on my 2005 T43! Chromium and Iceweasel will hardly even start up
05:24 PM TurBoss[m]: on a Pentium 4 too I can confirm
05:25 PM hazzy: I am so used to the cutting edge stuff not working on old hardware, glad to see it is not always the case
05:40 PM Jymmm: TurBoss[m]: ULN2003A
05:44 PM TurBoss[m]: issen't that a transistor array?
05:46 PM Jymmm: TurBoss[m]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ULN2003A
05:47 PM hazzy: that looks like a great array for cnc stuff
05:47 PM Jymmm: hazzy: bingo =) Or anyhting that uses logic level for contorl
05:48 PM TurBoss[m]: darlington
05:48 PM TurBoss[m]: I know
05:48 PM TurBoss[m]: why i need that
05:48 PM TurBoss[m]: ?
05:49 PM Jymmm: cause te grass is blue?
05:50 PM Jymmm: Save you on component count? Can drive 24VDC to 220VAC relays directly and flyback built in?
07:52 PM {HD}: How do I secure oxygen and acetylene tanks in the back of a truck?
07:52 PM hazzy: With a ratchet strap. :P
07:53 PM hazzy: It is perfectly legal and safe to lay them on there sides, as long as you let them sit up vertical for some time before you use them
07:55 PM enleth: and if the acetylene tank starts making any noises by itself, run fast and don't look back
07:56 PM enleth: which reminds me I have to install a chain to secure some oxygen and acetylene bottles that the landlord stores in the basement
07:57 PM enleth: they get on my nerves every time I see them just standing there by the wall, completely unsecured
07:57 PM enleth: nevermind the fact that they're in a fucking basement, but the best I can do is secure them against tipping
07:58 PM hazzy: honestly I am much less scared of the acetylene tank, it is low pressure and the gas is absorbed in acetone so it takes a little while to be released even in a sever accident and the tank is ripped open
07:59 PM enleth: hazzy: it does have the capacity to self-combust if the circumstances are just right^Wwrong, though
07:59 PM hazzy: It is quite possible for the acetylene to be released slow than needed even during normal use
07:59 PM hazzy: Yes, that is true, but not when mixed with the acetone
07:59 PM hazzy: that is why the acetone is there!
08:00 PM enleth: but you're right, I'd be hard pressed to decide whether I'm more afraid of an acetylene tank, or an oxygen tank
08:00 PM enleth: one can go off if you so much as look at it sideways if the bottle was, unknowingly to you, handled or refilled improperly
08:01 PM enleth: the other can make absolutely everything in the vicinity readily flammable
08:01 PM hazzy: Knocking the valve off an oxy tank is almost certain to result in a big accident
08:01 PM hazzy: it goes like a rocket!
08:01 PM enleth: it's probably a question of which is going to get you a quicker and more painless death
08:02 PM hazzy: https://youtu.be/ejEJGNLTo84
08:02 PM hazzy: ^ this is interesting
08:03 PM enleth: I've seen that years ago
08:03 PM enleth: but that's just compressed air, isn't it?
08:04 PM enleth: if you knock a valve off oxy, the fact that it's trying to become airborne is probably the very last of your problems
08:04 PM hazzy: I think so, oxy is liquid so I would think would thrust for a lot longer
08:04 PM enleth: I'd expect the sparks from bouncing around against stuff to be the real threat
08:05 PM enleth: OTOH, with enough oxygen you don't even need a spark
08:05 PM hazzy: yeah, with enough oxy even the tank will burn!
08:05 PM hazzy: but it has to got pretty warm to get started
08:06 PM enleth: if anything, you *want* the cylinder to do an >I MUST GO MY PEOPLE NEED ME trick and go burn stuff up somewhere else
08:08 PM enleth: which is why those cylinders in the basement are such a bad idea
08:08 PM enleth: oh, and they're right next to the steel central heating mains
08:08 PM hazzy: you want them to have there freedom if they decide to become rebellious
08:08 PM gregcnc: I picked up my mapp gas cylinder one day. terrified when i found it was empty
08:08 PM enleth: 70C surface temperature at those pipes
08:09 PM enleth: if that oxy started leaking fast, they'd be the first thing to ignite
08:10 PM hazzy: That is quite warm, though not warm enough, but still, might should move those tanks :)
08:10 PM hazzy: Steel needs to be red hot before it will oxidize fast enough to be sustainable
08:11 PM enleth: there's some insulation on those pipes
08:11 PM enleth: doesn't look flame-retardant
08:13 PM hazzy: I burned a ball bearing for some students the other day. Erlenmeyer flask filled with oxy. Heat bearing and drop it in, bingo. But I forgot to put water in the flask to cool the slag before it hit the bottom.
08:13 PM hazzy: the .125" bearing burned thru the class and quite deep into the counter
08:14 PM hazzy: *glass
10:04 PM Crom: heh