#linuxcnc Logs

Sep 14 2017

#linuxcnc Calendar

01:00 AM -!- #linuxcnc mode set to +v by ChanServ
01:31 AM IchGucksLive: morning from germany
01:33 AM IchGucksLive: pfred1: still online
01:34 AM pfred1: IchGucksLive hmm?
01:34 AM IchGucksLive: i use the DVD burner lasers in a row with printed mounting
01:35 AM IchGucksLive: its 5USD for about 250mW
01:35 AM pfred1: what do you use the lasers for?
01:35 AM IchGucksLive: thats my oine https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PnxBwhehQWE
01:36 AM pfred1: I was looking at a whole bunch of lasers earlier
01:36 AM IchGucksLive: yeh i read the logs
01:37 AM IchGucksLive: there are now 1.5W lasers for low cost
01:37 AM IchGucksLive: that will do a nice job
01:37 AM pfred1: I saw just not with drivers
01:38 AM IchGucksLive: drivers can be made easy
01:38 AM pfred1: that's what I was thinking
01:38 AM IchGucksLive: its the cooling problem mainly
01:38 AM pfred1: yes
01:38 AM IchGucksLive: as they are decined to make PWM
01:39 AM pfred1: it is definitely something I want to do someday
01:39 AM IchGucksLive: look at laserfreak.net
01:40 AM IchGucksLive: tart with a dvd burner then you got a imprechen how to hanle them
01:40 AM IchGucksLive: it is quite fast to get them killed
01:40 AM IchGucksLive: walking on the floor and touching the mount is enopuph sometimes
01:40 AM pfred1: they need a constant current drive?
01:40 AM IchGucksLive: i do full grounding first
01:41 AM pfred1: ah static
01:41 AM IchGucksLive: as the diodes are 3.2mm it is a freeking solder
01:41 AM pfred1: it is so humid where I am static normally is not much of an issue
01:42 AM IchGucksLive: and to fit them but there are redy made tubes
01:43 AM pfred1: plus i have a concerete floor where I have my machine so pretty low static still something to watch out for though
01:44 AM IchGucksLive: ok
01:44 AM IchGucksLive: i need to tell that there are redy made mashines as of 100usd
01:45 AM IchGucksLive: so no need to get things together
01:45 AM pfred1: I make stuff because i like to do it
01:46 AM IchGucksLive: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/METERK-DK-BL-1500mW-mini-DIY-Laser-Engraving-Machine-Wireless-Bluetooth-Print-Engraver-Bluetooth-4-0/32790003050.html
01:47 AM pfred1: that machine has a small work envelope
01:48 AM pfred1: my machine is probably over 4 times as big
01:49 AM IchGucksLive: but it hal all the cooling and driver stuff
01:49 AM pfred1: actually about 10 times as big
01:49 AM pfred1: that machine is super small!
01:50 AM pfred1: it is only 42x42mm
01:50 AM IchGucksLive: there is a bigger one www.aliexpress.com/item/1pc-1-5W-DIY-mini-laser-engraving-machine-1500mW-Desktop-DIY-Laser-Engraver-Engraving-Machine-Picture/32823482474.html
01:50 AM IchGucksLive: but also twice the price
01:50 AM pfred1: I already have a 419mm machine now
01:52 AM pfred1: so I just need a laser to mount on it
01:54 AM IchGucksLive: then as you are outside Europ you can go for 2500mW
01:54 AM IchGucksLive: in germany only 100mW is alowed
01:55 AM pfred1: what is wrong with Germany?
01:55 AM IchGucksLive: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/450-nm-2500-mW-12V-High-Power-Laser-Module-have-TTL-Adjustable-Focus-Blue-Laser-module/32716309676.html
01:55 AM IchGucksLive: pfred1: safty first
01:55 AM pfred1: why does the German government insist on not allowing everything?
01:56 AM pfred1: can't you decide for youeself what to do?
01:56 AM pfred1: then you have roads with no speed limits is makes no sense
01:56 AM evilren: because the german people have decided on whats decent
01:56 AM evilren: eh roads shouldnt need speed limits
01:56 AM pfred1: here if you have a fast enough car they can't pull you over anyways
01:57 AM evilren: speed limits outside of dangerous conditions just exist to make local governments money
01:57 AM pfred1: people go up my road fast because they know there's no cops around
01:59 AM IchGucksLive: pfred1: cause of the 64765 US dead people every year on not ruling them
01:59 AM IchGucksLive: last year
01:59 AM pfred1: we have a lot of people and a lot of roads
01:59 AM IchGucksLive: we got no speed limit
02:00 AM pfred1: and most folks drive as fast as they want to anyways
02:00 AM IchGucksLive: my couson from NY came over for a 6hr bike ride as fast as he coudt go and went back to sthe states
02:00 AM pfred1: I just took a trip and believe me I was hauling
02:00 AM pfred1: yeah it was a 9 hour drive
02:00 AM pfred1: so got to make time in there
02:01 AM pfred1: 571 miles one way
02:01 AM IchGucksLive: if you are realy going with it i assume there are 5500W moduels dont use them
02:01 AM pfred1: out of state tickets as long as you pay them they don't end up on your abstract
02:02 AM IchGucksLive: im off later
02:02 AM pfred1: l8r
02:14 AM Longbow: good morning from Europe :)
02:29 AM Deejay: moin
03:02 AM Longbow: Can anyone explain to me how to control/command the PID from HAL? - I want to command one separate axis/joint from a HAL component
03:02 AM Longbow: if I alter the pid.N.command the axis just jumps because it expects a gradually change of value
03:02 AM archivist: command an axis sure but the PID?
03:03 AM Longbow: but where to write this value, to get a gradual change to the PID command?
03:03 AM Longbow: I want to command a separate axis. I 've been told to do it from PID because during program.run it is not possible to do jog movements
03:04 AM Longbow: when HAL.is-inauto mode then the jogging commands(form HAL) will not work
03:05 AM archivist: you are trying to command a move/jog PID is the feedback/control of a loop
03:06 AM Longbow: I can do halui.joint.speed "10"; halui.joint.3.increment "200"; halui.joint.3.increment-plus "1"
03:06 AM Longbow: and it works
03:06 AM Longbow: but when I home the axis and during the program.run it wont work anymore
03:07 AM Longbow: How am I supposed to command a move from a HAL component during a program.run?
03:07 AM Longbow: the halui.joint.N.increment-plus/minus wont work then
03:09 AM archivist: I am guessing you have a similar problem to gear change and the hobbing problem with jumps in value, this can be fixed with some of the maths comps
03:10 AM Longbow: I dont think I understand you?
03:10 AM Longbow: I am just trying to move a separate axis (not the X Y Z) of a tool changer to do a toolchange.
03:11 AM Longbow: but it only works when HAL.is in mdi/joint mode
03:11 AM Longbow: when there is g code running HAL is in auto mode =program.run and it will not jog then
03:12 AM Longbow: @archivist: Are you proposing that I command the PID with a limit2 function to gradually change the value to the setpoint?
03:12 AM Longbow: I assumed that linuxcnc code already has it somewhere
03:13 AM Longbow: so just like the soft-start of the spindle motor?
03:17 AM archivist: in the hobbing we grab the old value, then switch the scale etc, , so yes using other comps to make sure there is no jump, just a proper move
03:19 AM Longbow: hmm. But how does EMC2 control the axis with G1 xyz Fxxx? It also passes the speed(Fxxx) to a component and then to the PID.N.command?
03:20 AM archivist: I have never done a toolchanger yet
03:21 AM Longbow: *yet :D
03:22 AM Longbow: if I command a PID from position 10 to position 50, it also has to have an acceleration + deceleration at the end included
03:23 AM Longbow: g1 fxx does just that but where
03:23 AM archivist: that is all done in the trajectory planner
03:24 AM archivist: or motion planner
03:25 AM Longbow: aha
03:25 AM archivist: or a bit of the two tj does the plan, mp is doing it
03:25 AM Longbow: so inthere the value MAX_ACCELERATION comes into play
03:26 AM archivist: yes
03:26 AM archivist: I go shopping on a Thursday
03:26 AM Longbow: I am wondering if I can use it too - to not write a component to do the same thing
03:26 AM Longbow: ok
03:27 AM archivist: yes as long as you dont run the toolchanger while machining, if you wish to do that, then more thought
03:28 AM Longbow: A G Code program can never be fully obeyed. haha
03:28 AM Longbow: I wish to do just that - while machining :P
03:28 AM archivist: I know some are preparing the tool change during a cut
03:30 AM archivist: the tool change would slow down to match the speed of the cut unless the PID is really separate and not in the motion planner
03:30 AM archivist: have to pick someone up in a bit
03:31 AM Longbow: you are saying to wait for the machining to end and then execute the tool change? - doing so I can use the motion/trajectory planner
03:31 AM archivist: the multi axis stuff andypugh is working on would seem to be what you want
03:32 AM archivist: yes
03:32 AM Longbow: I saw that ArcEye wrote several toolchanger components
03:32 AM Longbow: ok
03:32 AM archivist: one of the read lots to understand
03:32 AM Longbow: on the forum?
03:33 AM archivist: and in source code
03:34 AM Longbow: can I just implement this separate axis as the 4th - A. and then when tool changing use a G code to move it?
03:34 AM Longbow: I can call a G code from a HAL component, right?
03:34 AM archivist: not sure if you can
03:35 AM archivist: have to go
03:35 AM Longbow: ok thanks!
05:17 AM jthornton: morning
05:17 AM Deejay: hey
05:18 AM XXCoder: yo
05:30 AM jthornton: finished the chain link fence yesterday
05:31 AM XXCoder: nice
05:34 AM jthornton: yea, glad to get that done
05:34 AM XXCoder: I bet
05:47 AM jthornton: last group moved to the coop at 7 weeks... dunno if I can keep 10 in the brooder that long
05:50 AM XXCoder: people voting on bill on weakens ADA :( that sucks
05:57 AM SpeedEvil: yay! Democracy! sigh
05:58 AM SpeedEvil: Also - holy fuck - that's gutting it, not weakening.
05:58 AM XXCoder: no shit.
05:59 AM SpeedEvil: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bvim4rsNHkQ On a happier topic of things exploding.
06:00 AM _methods: well it's hard to lower taxes on the rich when you have a bunch of worthless disabled people sucking up all the tax money
06:01 AM _methods: /s
06:03 AM XXCoder: poor barge
06:05 AM _methods: hopefully that tangerine shitgibbon will be impeached soon and all this silliness will cease
06:06 AM XXCoder: he havent been organge for long while now
06:06 AM XXCoder: but he will always orange in my heart forever. lol
06:47 AM Longbow: hey, is the acceleration of axis in linuxcnc LINEAR / S / BELL ?
06:48 AM Longbow: moving my table (~1200lbs) from standing still the machine jerks, but not so in the actual coordinated movements while non-stationary
06:50 AM jthornton: I think acceleration is linear
06:51 AM Longbow: hmm, that would expert the jerk with lots of stationary G0
06:51 AM Longbow: Why not do better acceleration curve? Shouldn't be too difficult
06:52 AM jthornton: go ahead and submit some code
06:52 AM jthornton: shouldn't be too difficult
06:52 AM Longbow: Im wondering why it isnt already done? Are there any implications to it? - part accurancy?
06:53 AM Longbow: If you have a PID working then you just feed the PID'command with a different than linear curve
06:53 AM jthornton: Tom_itx: you up yet?
07:31 AM archivist: Longbow, jerk limitation has been discussed, I though someone was going to do something about it
07:32 AM jthornton: did michael put that in machinekit?
07:32 AM Longbow: It would be nice if somebody adds it. I will be testing with linear vs bell curve in the following weeks.
07:32 AM archivist: dunno, was rob was going to do it ?
07:33 AM archivist: something you may see in the linuxcnc dev mailing list archives
07:37 AM jthornton: I think there was some discussion a while back on the dev list
07:37 AM jthornton: Longbow: why don't you add it?
07:38 AM jthornton: it's easy and fun...
07:39 AM Longbow: I will be testing on my own machine. The question is what is the reason not to have it? - speed?
07:39 AM Longbow: It could be added as a choice at first.
07:39 AM archivist: difficulty in implementing probably
07:39 AM jthornton: go ahead and add it then
07:40 AM jthornton: should be easy for you to code that in
07:40 AM Longbow: Im new to the emc2 world...
07:40 AM Longbow: you dont have to troll
07:41 AM Longbow: I see some new exeron cnc milling machines also using only linear acc/de
07:55 AM Tom_itx: jthornton, yep i'm up and out the door
10:37 AM mtpocketscnc: any f-engrave guys able to tell me about how much prismatic overcut? or is there a rule for it? i'm not finding alot in my reading and would like to try an inlay without wasting too much material.
10:40 AM archivist: I think I would do a test first
10:44 AM mtpocketscnc: my earlier tests resulted in lots of tearout.. I can do a couple tests yet but since i am just getting going i don't have a lot of material to test on yet. is there a good start point on prismatic overcut or do i have to just play until i get it? sorry there is just something i'm not getting about that setting i think
10:45 AM archivist: tear out is cutter/speed/wood
10:46 AM archivist: blunt? not fast enough? crap softwood?
10:49 AM mtpocketscnc: been wondering on that a bit too. seems real slow to me on feed. guess i have to go find some more material and test some more. just hard headed about spending the money lol
10:52 AM archivist: rpm has to be high to hit the wood and cut before it manages to bend/tear out
10:54 AM mtpocketscnc: i think my 90 degree vbit (only one i could find locally) doesn't help either due to how wide it gets as depth becomes deeper
11:04 AM roycroft: chip clearance can be an issue with that kind of cutter, but a good vacuum system or compressed air jet will help with that
11:06 AM mtpocketscnc: I just looked at spiral downcut bits I think I will order some today.
11:06 AM roycroft: they're expensive but well worth the cost
11:07 AM roycroft: i was having trouble machine cutting dovetails in baltic birch plywood a while back
11:07 AM roycroft: the top ply kept tearing out
11:07 AM roycroft: i got a spiral downcut bit and the problem went away completely
11:08 AM Jymmm: tree
11:10 AM Jymmm: roycroft: I like CMT... https://www.amazon.com/CMT-192-001-11-Carbide-Downcut-Diameter/dp/B000P4NQGQ
11:11 AM roycroft: i'm using whiteside
11:11 AM roycroft: and they're not solid carbide, but i'm using 8mm bits
11:12 AM roycroft: not tiny ones such as would be used for most inlay work
11:12 AM Jymmm: roycroft: I understand, was just sharing what had worked well for me is all.
11:14 AM roycroft: CMT are good bits
11:15 AM roycroft: if anyone is ever doing straight cuts on the edges of plywood, btw, there are some nice combo spiral bits available
11:15 AM roycroft: they're downcut on the shank side and upcut on the tip side
11:16 AM roycroft: basically they suck the edges towards the center of the wood on both sides
11:16 AM mtpocketscnc: https://pasteboard.co/GKlznFg.jpg
11:16 AM mtpocketscnc: this is what i want to put inlay on
11:16 AM mtpocketscnc: sorry don't know how to make pic upload nicer
11:17 AM roycroft: nice
11:17 AM mtpocketscnc: first real project. proud of my machine for facing job
11:17 AM roycroft: i think you'll be happy with the results the spiral bit will give you
11:18 AM roycroft: there should be no tearout or fuzziness
11:18 AM Jymmm: mtpocketscnc: Heavy cracking in that wood, any chance of it splitting more later on?
11:18 AM mtpocketscnc: good was worried because i don't know how thins will behave on endgrain
11:19 AM roycroft: i would stabilize the wood with epoxy
11:20 AM Jymmm: or at least apply an oil to soak into the pours.
11:20 AM roycroft: with the spiral bit you'll be doing a diagonal shear cut, and pushing the cut end down into the wood, which will support the edge of the cut and prevent tearout
11:20 AM mtpocketscnc: filled everything with epoxy
11:20 AM Jymmm: pores*
11:22 AM mtpocketscnc: i don't know how my method will work out but i used scraper to apply
11:22 AM roycroft: end grain can be a bit tricky, but if you experiment on some scrap you will almost certainly find a speed/feed combination that will cut cleanly
11:22 AM mtpocketscnc: used the stuff from the two tuber thing
11:23 AM roycroft: that's typically how folks do epoxy fill - glob it on and use a scraper to push it in and level it
11:23 AM roycroft: and that epoxy is all the more reason to use a spiral bit
11:23 AM mtpocketscnc: i have to get better at it. was a ton of sanding after for me
11:24 AM roycroft: a conventional bit would tend to chip the epoxy
11:25 AM mtpocketscnc: should i mask everything when engraving?
11:25 AM roycroft: that shouldn't be necessary
11:25 AM roycroft: think of a conventional bit as a chopping action
11:25 AM roycroft: and a spiral bit as a slicing action
11:26 AM Jymmm: mtpocketscnc: Be sure to do a test run on scrap that has been expodied too before doing the expensive stuff
11:26 AM roycroft: slicing is much more clean and much more controlled
11:27 AM Jymmm: mtpocketscnc: One of those green kitchen scrubby pads are EXCELLENT for remove the straggly bits after carving without having to sand.
11:27 AM Tom_itx: 3
11:27 AM Tom_itx: 3M abrasive pads
11:27 AM Tom_itx: come in several colors
11:27 AM Jymmm: mtpocketscnc: There is no need to PM me, you can talk right here =)
11:28 AM Tom_itx: white i think is the finest
11:28 AM roycroft: white is what i use on ss
11:28 AM Jymmm: Tom_itx: the green kitchen ones are the perfect grit wihtout being too agressive
11:29 AM roycroft: green should be fine for cleaning up wood
11:31 AM mtpocketscnc: thanks for the info. this piece is going to be a donation at my own expense. a friend of mine runs a home care buisiness and can hopefully help show my work
11:52 AM JT-Shop: I start a thread on backyard chickens about building an automatic door and some idiot chimes in how he whipped out his CC and just ordered one and replied 3 times to questions about his purchase... some people are just a.. h....
11:53 AM Tom_itx: heh
11:53 AM Tom_itx: JT-Shop, did you figure out what you needed earlier
11:55 AM IchGucksLive: hi from germany
01:03 PM IchGucksLive: hi jelly-home are the beans ok
01:42 PM IchGucksLive: Gn8
02:07 PM CaptHindsight: thermal printer wire markers fade over time
02:08 PM CaptHindsight: I haven't seen a small inkjet version that uses pigment
02:08 PM CaptHindsight: is there one out there?
02:13 PM CaptHindsight: hot melt could also work
02:13 PM CaptHindsight: or foil
02:17 PM Jymmm: CaptHindsight: application?
02:18 PM CaptHindsight: handheld portable laser wire marker
02:18 PM Jymmm: Can't do laser, because most wire jackets are PVC
02:18 PM Jymmm: (if you meant laser engraving that is)
02:19 PM CaptHindsight: it prints on tags, not on the wire
02:19 PM Jymmm: There is a "hot stamp" iirc
02:19 PM CaptHindsight: not engraving
02:19 PM Jymmm: http://www.taymer.com/products/cable-and-wire-printing/
02:19 PM CaptHindsight: bonds toner/micronized thermopolymer onto small tags
02:20 PM CaptHindsight: not for continuous wire
02:21 PM CaptHindsight: Jymmm: ever built a machine and wanted to tag each wire with a unique ID?
02:22 PM Jymmm: CaptHindsight: done it MANY MANY times... https://www.amazon.com/Ideal-44-103-Marker-Booklet-Legend/dp/B00529VAQW
02:23 PM CaptHindsight: now lets say you are making this for someone that requires special characters not found on the pre-printed strips
02:24 PM CaptHindsight: or yeah DUH, don't use a label printer use pre-printed labels
02:26 PM MrSunshine: ah, sensors in place .. nut for the ballscrew in place .. now to figure out how to configure linuxcnc for the dual motor setup
02:26 PM CaptHindsight: what do kids say today instead of Duh?
02:27 PM CaptHindsight: MrSunshine: did you find that in Master? (dual motors for an axis)
02:27 PM MrSunshine: CaptHindsight, only have installed master yet .. not tried to configure anything .. tomorrows work =)
02:34 PM MrSunshine: https://github.com/LinuxCNC/linuxcnc/blob/master/configs/by_interface/parport/stepper-gantry/stepper_mm.ini in that the coordinates is x y z a ... shouldnt that be something like x y z y ?
02:34 PM MrSunshine: for dual y motors ?
02:35 PM MrSunshine: ah that is set in the kinematics.hal
02:35 PM MrSunshine: and in the ini trivkins is loaded, in the kinematics.hal gantrykins are used ? .. hmm
02:36 PM JT-Shop: not in master
02:36 PM JT-Shop: your setting up a dual motor gantry?
02:36 PM MrSunshine: yes
02:37 PM JT-Shop: http://linuxcnc.org/docs/devel/html/config/ini-homing.html#_home_sequence
02:37 PM JT-Shop: http://linuxcnc.org/docs/devel/html/config/ini-homing.html#_home_sequence
02:38 PM JT-Shop: so you could configure joint 0 X, joint 1 and 2 as Y and joint 3 as Z
02:40 PM MrSunshine: need a good example config to work from :/
02:46 PM JT-Shop: I used to have one but lost it
02:49 PM MrSunshine: well will be interesting to configure this atleast =)
02:49 PM JT-Shop: stepper or servo?
02:50 PM MrSunshine: stepper
02:50 PM MrSunshine: tho fate has it that i have two different screws of rhte same axis .. i realy hope that works :/
02:56 PM skunkworks: MrSunshine, doesn't matter
02:57 PM MrSunshine: good =)
03:35 PM gloops: different screws on same axis?
03:37 PM MrSunshine: gloops, yeap
03:39 PM gloops: can only think that will lead to some head scratching lol
03:39 PM MrSunshine: gloops, linuxcnc should solve that ... imo =)
03:39 PM MrSunshine: one 5mm pitch and one 10mm pitch :P
03:40 PM JT-Shop: just a different scale for each joint
03:40 PM gloops: not saying it isnt doable but youre gonna need to have that in mind, quite a lot
03:44 PM MrSunshine: https://forum.linuxcnc.org/49-basic-configuration/32260-example-ini-and-hal-files-for-joints-axes-master-2-8-pre-dual-motor-gantry there was some nice and easy to understand config files =)
03:47 PM MrSunshine: do i need to have the home switches at exactly the same position for both motors or can i offset how much it needs to compensate somehow ?
03:47 PM MrSunshine: say one switch is at 0 other is at -0.1 in relation to that one
03:57 PM JT-Shop: yes, you can make the home offset different for each joint
03:58 PM JT-Shop: hmm I can't remember the fix for this relay board being on when the output is off...
04:01 PM MrSunshine: will be a very interesting day tomorrow me thinks =)
04:01 PM JT-Shop: I think this explains it lol SMAKN® 5V Active Low 2 Channel Relay
04:01 PM MrSunshine: is it possible to configure joints etc from stepconf or is it stillv ery basic ?
04:02 PM JT-Shop: well you can create a 3 axis configuration then add the extra joint and make the changes to the ini as in the link I gave you
04:03 PM MrSunshine: aight =)
04:03 PM MrSunshine: thanks alot =)
04:38 PM Deejay: gn8
04:58 PM Tom_itx is now known as Tom_L
05:01 PM Cromaglious_: OK first chips and belt conversion installed
05:02 PM Cromaglious_: broke 1 tooth on a carbide 4 flute... 6mm end mill
05:03 PM MarcelineVQ: :(
05:05 PM Cromaglious_: crap endmill anyway...
05:05 PM Cromaglious_: have 4 3/8 on order
05:05 PM MarcelineVQ: what are you cutting?
05:06 PM Cromaglious_: T nuts.. HF says a 44991 is a 1/2 slot table.... LIERS! it's 7/16"
05:06 PM MarcelineVQ: isn't 6mm 1/4? Are you meaning to go up a size?
05:06 PM Cromaglious_: I have a ER11 so I[ve have 6mm end mills now I'm ER16.. I can go up to 2/8 or 10mm
05:07 PM Cromaglious_: 3/8
05:07 PM MarcelineVQ: how do you like the mill so far?
05:08 PM Cromaglious_: without belt conversion... total crap, with belt consersion pretty nice
05:08 PM MarcelineVQ: watching a vid of one at the moment, is it too fast before conversion?
05:08 PM Cromaglious_: used a file for about 20 minutes breaking every edge on the damn thing
05:09 PM Cromaglious_: tooo slow before conversion
05:09 PM MarcelineVQ: yeah the edges are pretty crispy on chinese machines. too slow? interesting
05:09 PM Cromaglious_: 2500 top speed before the conversion, 4500ish after
05:14 PM MarcelineVQ: gosh that seems really fast for most materials I can think of, I'm quite uneducated on the matter though
05:14 PM Cromaglious_: at 4000 I can cut as fast as I can turn the table handle
05:14 PM Kevin`: unit mm/min?
05:15 PM MarcelineVQ: I guess in the end if the chips look right it is right
05:17 PM Cromaglious_: i am so going to change lead screws... 0.0625" turn absolutely blows
05:18 PM Cromaglious_: 20tpi is SO much nicer 0.050" turn.
05:18 PM roycroft: or remount your motors in a belt drive configuration
05:18 PM roycroft: gearing up to double the speed or so
05:19 PM Cromaglious_: still waiting for vise to show up...
05:31 PM Cromaglious_: speak on the devil... 4"showed up
05:59 PM Crom_: DOH Forgot to tram the vise
06:10 PM * JT-Shop calls it a night
06:40 PM * Tom_L calls it a day
06:41 PM Crom_: I call it wonderful
06:41 PM skullworks: Another list purge user returns.
06:44 PM Crom_: I got my 100% veterns administration rating finally... only took 9 years... Bought a 44991 HF X2
06:44 PM Crom_: Have a LMS 4" Kurt style vise strapped down to it
06:44 PM Crom_: woo I get 1.24" from face of back jaw cut area
06:45 PM Crom_: This will tide me over until November, then I'll get a 3" kurt style
06:50 PM skullworks: An X2 makes me think about small parts and small vices.
06:50 PM skullworks: http://www.penntoolco.com/productimage.php?product_id=103802
06:51 PM skullworks: Then I get a headache and have to look at my Kurt 688 and then I feel better.
06:54 PM Crom_: http://picpaste.com/20170914_155929.jpg
06:55 PM Crom_: http://picpaste.com/20170913_110846.jpg
06:56 PM Tom_L: i bet that puts the table in a bind
06:57 PM skullworks: I bought a X1 Super base with the X/Y table and screws to mount inside my Sinker EDM tank.
08:34 PM evilroot: Blah
08:34 PM * evilroot is considering tearing down a few robots and selling the parts
08:34 PM evilroot: Seems like such a damned shame though
08:39 PM MarcelineVQ: Or you could combine them into a super robot
08:44 PM evilroot: Nah, I decided not to be a supervillain a while back
08:53 PM MarcelineVQ: you can use it for good until it inevitably becomes evil
08:54 PM evilroot: Yeah, that's kind of the issue haha
08:54 PM evilroot: But I'm starting to feel like I'll get more in pieces than as a whole
08:55 PM evilroot: Irks the engineer in me since they're such incredible machines as they are, but at this rate just the linear rails and servos will probably fetch more
08:57 PM MarcelineVQ: What's your plan afterwards? What are you doing next?
09:03 PM evilroot: I have 7 of them left, originally had 13
09:04 PM evilroot: I intend to use 3 myself to mill aluminum and route PCBs
09:04 PM CaptHindsight: CARTESIAN?
09:04 PM evilroot: Yes
09:04 PM CaptHindsight: rigid enough for milling?
09:04 PM evilroot: Oh HELL yes
09:04 PM evilroot: Industrial grade
09:05 PM CaptHindsight: what are travels?
09:06 PM evilroot: I have a few versions, the largest being 1 x .8 x .4 meters
09:06 PM CaptHindsight: good size
09:06 PM evilroot: And the smallest .6 x .4 x .2
09:07 PM evilroot: They're 0 backlash, ballscrew driven
09:07 PM evilroot: I have one SCARA too
09:08 PM CaptHindsight: what res on the encoders?
09:08 PM CaptHindsight: encoders on the servos or on the linear bearings?
09:08 PM evilroot: On the servos
09:09 PM CaptHindsight: good for lots of things
09:09 PM CaptHindsight: what brand are they?
09:09 PM evilroot: Quadrature encoders, 300 pulse per rev on each channel
09:10 PM evilroot: The bot itself is accurate to 40 micron Z and 60 X/Y
09:10 PM evilroot: Machine is Seiko, the linear rails and pillow block bearings THK SR-W series
09:11 PM CaptHindsight: 10-20 years old?
09:11 PM evilroot: Servos Yaskawa Minertia
09:12 PM evilroot: Yeah, 90's. Work perfectly though, these things were beuilt ungodly tough
09:12 PM CaptHindsight: pick-n-place, materials deposition, inkjet, pcb milling etc
09:12 PM evilroot: Yep!
09:12 PM evilroot: Pretty much you name it
09:12 PM CaptHindsight: yeah I know them
09:12 PM CaptHindsight: if they aren't worn
09:12 PM evilroot: I've been selling them for $1200 each
09:13 PM CaptHindsight: with drives?
09:13 PM evilroot: Original controller if people want it
09:13 PM CaptHindsight: not bad
09:13 PM evilroot: Personally I use that as a power supply and then 3x Geckodrive G320X's
09:13 PM CaptHindsight: are you in the US?
09:14 PM evilroot: They also have a 120psi compressed air line and two smaller lines for oil/pnuematic/etc to the toolhead
09:14 PM evilroot: 4 axis btw, the toolhead rotates
09:14 PM CaptHindsight: what dia and pitch approx on the ball scews?
09:14 PM CaptHindsight: even better
09:14 PM evilroot: 360 deg contiuous
09:14 PM evilroot: Also tons of control lines run to the toolhead too, like 30 digital liens
09:15 PM evilroot: *lines
09:15 PM evilroot: Yeah, I'm in Durham NC
09:16 PM evilroot: Not sure on the dia/pitch of the leadscrews off the top of my head, but they're BIG
09:17 PM CaptHindsight: D-Tran?
09:17 PM evilroot: Yeah
09:17 PM CaptHindsight: I have a Seiko SCARA
09:17 PM CaptHindsight: ~1m reach
09:18 PM evilroot: http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/attachments/f21/203075d1499831283-conversion-project-seiko-d-tran-xm-5000-cartesian-industrial-robots-img_20170306_171334.jpg
09:18 PM evilroot: That's one
09:18 PM evilroot: http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/attachments/f21/203077d1499831342-conversion-project-seiko-d-tran-xm-5000-cartesian-industrial-robots-img_20170307_133423.jpg
09:18 PM evilroot: And here's an axis without the covers
09:19 PM evilroot: The discoloration is pretty much all old grease, they clean up beautifully
09:19 PM CaptHindsight: I think we talked about these before
09:19 PM evilroot: Yeah
09:19 PM evilroot: I think so, I've had them a while
09:20 PM CaptHindsight: I buy similar on ebay
09:20 PM CaptHindsight: I keep the servos
09:20 PM CaptHindsight: on them
09:23 PM CaptHindsight: use the 7i77's
09:24 PM malcom2073: nice, my dad makes CNC routers out of that sort of thing evilroot
09:25 PM malcom2073: https://scontent-ort2-2.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/20245445_1490894870974813_1117775587309822915_n.jpg?oh=41afcea689a817bbaac716e530cdf017&oe=5A606EE7
09:27 PM evilroot: Nice
09:27 PM evilroot: I honestly like them as they are
09:27 PM evilroot: Also I learned how to program them in their original language, DARL IV
09:27 PM evilroot: haha
09:33 PM BeachBumPete: what is a good search term for a poly slider, thin shim washer?
09:37 PM evilroot: 7i77?
09:37 PM evilroot: How exactly does that work?
09:42 PM Tom_L: plugs into a 5i25 doesn't it?
09:43 PM Tom_L: 77 is a servo card right?
09:46 PM evilroot: Given the Y axis uses a 500W 70V servo it seems like the motor control cards would be expensive
09:47 PM evilroot: Whereas the G320X is an all in one package that just needs step/dir
10:05 PM CaptHindsight: http://www.geckodrive.com/g320x.html is a brushed servo drive
10:06 PM BeachBumPete: Just an opinion here but in no way does a G320X compare to a proper closed loop servo setup using 7i77 mesanet cards...
10:06 PM CaptHindsight: fine for some apps
10:07 PM BeachBumPete: I know I had them on my RF45
10:07 PM BeachBumPete: but again no comparison to the mesanet stuff
10:08 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.yaskawa.com/delegate/openAttachmentFile?documentId=TSE-C253-20G&cmd=documents&documentName=TSE-C253-20G.pdf the motors he said that come with the robots
10:09 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.yaskawa.com/delegate/openAttachmentFile?documentId=TOE-C245-1&cmd=documents&documentName=TOE-C245-1.pdf
10:10 PM CaptHindsight: DC servos (Yaskawa Minertia)
10:10 PM CaptHindsight: brushed on top of it
10:12 PM evilroot: Its worked well for me
10:12 PM evilroot: Plus they recently had a big drop in price, $129 each
10:13 PM CaptHindsight: I have some brushed DC motors with belt drives and ballscrews on machines that are not speedy but accurate to a few um
10:14 PM evilroot: CaptHindsight: want to buy some robots?
10:14 PM evilroot: :-D
10:15 PM CaptHindsight: next app that size I'll check back with you
10:16 PM CaptHindsight: I don't stock much since every app I get is so different
10:18 PM CaptHindsight: https://opentrons.com/
10:19 PM CaptHindsight: rickety and I dislike the software
10:20 PM CaptHindsight: http://docs.opentrons.com/?_ga=2.141457394.1750211670.1505443630-1729498935.1505443630
10:21 PM CaptHindsight: make it a language or dumb it down so anyone can use it, why be in between?
10:42 PM skullworks: About the only thing I'd want to use a Gecko 320x for is a 4th axis where your doing like 74:1 worm drive to get 360┬░ on the 4th.
10:47 PM skullworks: I have an old HAAS 5C indexer with air closer - the OEM stepper drive in the unit was some primitive unipolar drive made up of descrete components - many of which have been out of production for many years. Thankfully you can just not hook up the center tap lines and drive it with a bipolar drive.
10:48 PM CaptHindsight: it didn't use relay logic?!
10:49 PM skullworks: I need to steal the 7 pin amphenol connector off the back of the dead HAAS control unit.
10:49 PM CaptHindsight: now featuring solid state Fleming valves
10:50 PM Crom_: http://picpaste.com/20170914_155929.jpg http://picpaste.com/20170913_110846.jpg
10:51 PM skullworks: Mount the connector on the back of my machine control cabinet and throw a Gecko 230V in there, and add an air solenoid.
10:51 PM CaptHindsight: just outside your shop?
10:51 PM Crom_: Using white lithium on the dove tail and it's not binding too bad
10:51 PM Crom_: Right now the back patio is the shop
10:53 PM skullworks: What just seems wrong to me is that the X1 table seems larger than the X2.
11:09 PM Crom_: Couldn't pass up the 4" on close out.
11:17 PM * evilroot is still not sure what to do with these crazy pneumatic linear slides
11:17 PM evilroot: They're 5ft long and position is based on differential pressure
11:18 PM evilroot: Was thinking maybe automated sanding or painting
11:27 PM evilroot: Not a lot of power and only 1mm precision, but they're really fast and smooth
11:31 PM Crom_: halloween is coming... some sort of animatronic?
11:55 PM Crom_: Got a bunch of parallels off the facebook machinists for sale group.
11:55 PM Crom_: almost full set or starrett adjustables