#linuxcnc Logs

Jun 06 2017

#linuxcnc Calendar

12:48 AM Loetmichel: roycroft: a jet-black steak would not taste that good, but not be that harmful to your digestive tract at all. On the contrary, it could help your diarreah from Taco bell ;)
01:07 AM IchGucksLive: good morning from germany
01:09 AM Longbow: good morning from SLovenia :)
01:21 AM IchGucksLive: Turboss logger is on today
01:21 AM TurBoss: morning
01:22 AM TurBoss: IchGucksLive: I meet Jesus
01:22 AM TurBoss: *ive
01:22 AM IchGucksLive: cool the real one or the valencia guy
01:22 AM TurBoss: he is 10 km from here
01:23 AM TurBoss: isn't he the real one?
01:23 AM TurBoss: :D
01:23 AM IchGucksLive: some day i will be down at your place and visit him and maybe you 2
01:24 AM TurBoss: that would be nice
01:24 AM TurBoss: don't forget to try paella and carajillo
01:24 AM IchGucksLive: TurBoss: DrippityDrops please make the calender your fafiot
01:24 AM IchGucksLive: so you do not need to keep logging
01:25 AM TurBoss: sorry, fafiot?
01:25 AM IchGucksLive: in your browser
01:26 AM IchGucksLive: here at mozilla i only need to put TO in tthe topline to get the logs
01:26 AM IchGucksLive: as it regionises the offen visited
01:26 AM IchGucksLive: ok i need to move on making CNC finishes
01:26 AM TurBoss: ahhh cool
01:27 AM TurBoss: I will add log to my bot
01:27 AM TurBoss: he bridges the matrix.org with springrts
01:35 AM DrippityDrops: hmm, log should come back as a pm maybe? or just be in the link of the "topic" just to use it normally seems too easy
02:20 AM Deejay: moin
02:20 AM TurBoss: hi
05:01 AM XXCoder: heys
05:02 AM Tom_L: haze
05:03 AM XXCoder: hazel
05:43 AM IchGucksLive: hi from Germay
05:43 AM XXCoder: hey ich
05:43 AM IchGucksLive: n
05:44 AM IchGucksLive: XXCoder: do you know if there are redy made probe subroutines or do i need to write the 10 lines myself
05:44 AM XXCoder: I saw example of probing for tool length but besides that I didn't really research it
05:45 AM IchGucksLive: i think i will make a Video tutorial on that
05:45 AM IchGucksLive: Z is not the problem
05:45 AM XXCoder: cool
05:45 AM IchGucksLive: its X+ X- Y + Y-
05:45 AM jthornton: morning
05:45 AM XXCoder: yeah I know. just saying that was only one I saw :)
05:45 AM XXCoder: hey jthornton
05:45 AM IchGucksLive: probe screen is not that good for students
05:46 AM IchGucksLive: they shooudt know what hapens in the back
05:46 AM IchGucksLive: wather is horrible here so what ngc
05:47 AM jthornton: yea no rain for the next week
05:47 AM XXCoder: no rain for next 2 months here
05:48 AM XXCoder: well not really but rains is very rare in summers here :(
05:48 AM XXCoder: its rainforest biome here, it should rain more!
05:48 AM XXCoder: and it used to,.
05:51 AM jthornton: and the chicken door goes up on schedule
05:52 AM XXCoder: yay! timer based?
05:52 AM IchGucksLive: o<probexneg> sub
05:52 AM IchGucksLive: T100 M6 (load Probe D2 )
05:52 AM IchGucksLive: G91 ( relative mode for probing)
05:52 AM IchGucksLive: G38.2 x-10 F100 ( trip switch on the way down)
05:52 AM IchGucksLive: G90 ( absolute mode)
05:52 AM IchGucksLive: #<toff> = [#5410 / 2] (calculate Toolradius)
05:52 AM IchGucksLive: G92 x#<toff> (SET Offset)
05:52 AM IchGucksLive: G1 x[#toff *1.5] F150 (MOVE free)
05:52 AM IchGucksLive: o<probexneg> endsub
05:52 AM IchGucksLive: M2
05:52 AM jthornton: for now yes
05:53 AM IchGucksLive: ( trip switch on the way to PART)
05:53 AM XXCoder: whats next is website ui for it lol
05:53 AM archivist_herron: IchGucksLive, currently probing needs some work to calibrate out probe error and effective tip diameter
05:53 AM XXCoder: so you can set times or "activate now" or whatever
05:54 AM IchGucksLive: archivist_herron: for me it seems ok
05:54 AM jthornton: yes I have a manual bypass to override the timer if needed
05:54 AM archivist_herron: IchGucksLive, for a CMM accuracy it is missing some required info
05:55 AM XXCoder: I think he want to automate find x and y
05:57 AM IchGucksLive: o<probexpos> sub
05:57 AM IchGucksLive: T100 M6 (load Probe D2 )
05:57 AM IchGucksLive: G91 ( relative mode for probing)
05:57 AM IchGucksLive: G38.2 x+10 F100 ( trip switch on the way down)
05:57 AM IchGucksLive: G90 ( absolute mode)
05:57 AM IchGucksLive: #<toff> = [[#5410 / 2]*-1] (calculate Toolradius)
05:57 AM IchGucksLive: G92 x#<toff> (SET Offset)
05:57 AM IchGucksLive: G1 x[#toff *2] F150 (MOVE free)
05:57 AM IchGucksLive: M100 (Reload Gcode)
05:57 AM IchGucksLive: o<probexpos> endsub
05:57 AM IchGucksLive: M2
05:57 AM jthornton: why not use pastebin for code
05:57 AM XXCoder: or dpaste or one of billion paste websites
05:58 AM jthornton: I like this one no ads http://paste.ubuntu.com/
05:58 AM IchGucksLive: ok i will test this
05:59 AM IchGucksLive: Question i dont know CAN i put "axis-remote --reload" direct into a ngc or only in user mcode
06:05 AM jthornton: that's not a G code...
06:09 AM IchGucksLive: i onlky thought
06:10 AM IchGucksLive: so my user mcode is always my gest friend
06:10 AM IchGucksLive: and the offsets
06:10 AM IchGucksLive: G92.1
06:20 AM IchGucksLive: im off
09:38 AM gregcnc: capthindsight sometimes i don't get CL https://chicago.craigslist.org/wcl/tls/6164430897.html
09:50 AM nubcake_ is now known as nubcake
10:23 AM Simoniou1 is now known as Simonious
10:39 AM archivist: gregcnc, have you fetched it yet!
11:14 AM Loetmichel: maan, that double pack ramen for lunch was a bad idea without anything else today ... and no water either... *acid reflux* *headace* :-(
11:43 AM Jymmm: Loetmichel: you ate ramen raw without water?! that musta been super crunchy!!!
11:47 AM Loetmichel: Jymmm.EXEPT the water in the rame
11:47 AM Loetmichel: n
11:47 AM Loetmichel: which wasnt THAT much
11:47 AM Loetmichel: maybe half a liter
11:47 AM Loetmichel: which is way too less for a day
11:53 AM Jymmm: Loetmichel: eating and drinking are NTO the same thing ;)
11:53 AM Loetmichel: NTO?
11:54 AM gregcnc: alternate spelling of not
11:55 AM Jymmm: what gregcnc said
11:56 AM roycroft: it's the internet spelling of not
11:57 AM roycroft: excuse me
11:57 AM roycroft: it's teh internet spelling of not
11:59 AM Loetmichel: Jymmm: water intake by eating does count into the daily water needed, but half a liter is WAAAAY to less.
11:59 AM Loetmichel: <- i s just topping up with 3 aspirin and 1.5 liters sparkling water. Headache is already gone ;)
12:08 PM CaptHindsight: gregcnc: that lathe has variable pricing
12:10 PM Jymmm: LoetmichelNuh uh!
12:25 PM phipli: morning
12:26 PM IchGucksLive: hi
12:26 PM phipli: windy out
12:27 PM roycroft: it's sunny and warm here, but the rain returns in a day or so
12:29 PM phipli: people have been asking "how did you get to work" knowing I usually cycle...
12:29 PM phipli: funnily enough I cycled.
12:30 PM phipli: thankfully on the way home the gale force winds were /helping/
12:52 PM IchGucksLive: phipli: where in the world are you
12:54 PM skunkworks: http://electronicsam.com/images/matsuura/20170606_095422.jpg
12:54 PM gregcnc: wow
12:54 PM skunkworks: I know it isn't a problem in Europe.. But over here surge strips go BANG
12:55 PM LeelooMinai: Is it India? :)
12:55 PM skunkworks: I think it was wired off of 208 by mistake..
12:55 PM skunkworks: :)
12:55 PM LeelooMinai: I heared once than in India voltages that are 20% off are "normal":)
12:55 PM phipli: IchGucksLive, UK
12:55 PM skunkworks: My coworker was not amused...
12:55 PM IchGucksLive: it this the mashine that is transformed to LCNC
12:56 PM IchGucksLive: phipli: the channel hit a high of 120kmh
12:58 PM phipli: yeah, the trees are all shedding little branches and the gusts are almost stalling the computer fan I have circulating air in the conservatory
12:58 PM phipli: skunkworks, bit more and you'll be able to run a proper welder!
12:59 PM phipli: oh wait, is it meant to be European or American voltage?
12:59 PM gregcnc: it's a 120V outlet
01:00 PM phipli: when people have 240v in america, do they use different sockets?
01:00 PM gregcnc: yes
01:00 PM LeelooMinai: Yes...
01:00 PM phipli: what do you use for 240?
01:00 PM skunkworks: The surge strip went BANG and didn't take out the breaker
01:01 PM gregcnc: https://www.generatorjoe.net/html/web/outlet/nemaspecs.gif
01:01 PM LeelooMinai: phipli: https://www.askmehelpdesk.com/attachments/electrical-lighting/28954d1265551059-adding-220v-outlet-l279-ea-5.jpg
01:01 PM skunkworks: phipli, bunch of differnt depending on the current
01:01 PM phipli: weird
01:01 PM phipli: we actually have two plugs as well, but you nearly never see the other
01:01 PM phipli: for 3 phase we tend to wire it into boxes instead of plugs
01:01 PM roycroft: phipli: our power is split phase
01:02 PM roycroft: the mains are 250vac coming into the building
01:02 PM roycroft: there are two hot wires, and a "neutral" that is actually a tap that splits the voltage in half
01:03 PM roycroft: it's actually fairly convenient because one can bring dual voltages to a subpanel/receptacle with four wires (two "hot", the split phase "neutral", and ground)
01:03 PM LeelooMinai: Here in Canada normal sockets are 110V, but there are some "special" ones for electric stoves and I believe dryers.
01:04 PM phipli: so you have two of the three phases in your house?
01:04 PM roycroft: you use split phase power in canada as well
01:04 PM LeelooMinai: Whidch are twice the voltage.
01:04 PM gregcnc: canada has the same as we do
01:04 PM roycroft: no, it's not 2 of three phases
01:04 PM roycroft: it's single phase
01:04 PM roycroft: split phase is not two phase
01:04 PM gregcnc: one pahse of three
01:04 PM roycroft: if you want three phase that's a completely separate power drop that is usually not available in residential areas
01:04 PM phipli: we have three phase to the street and then it goes down the road 1, 2, 3, 1, 2, 3 etc.
01:04 PM phipli: in theory
01:05 PM phipli: 240 or 250v AC depending on where you live
01:05 PM LeelooMinai: Right, it's not three phase.
01:05 PM phipli: but you can also request three phase
01:05 PM LeelooMinai: Yes, but $$$:)
01:05 PM phipli: which was what I was talking about
01:05 PM roycroft: most of the time one cannot get 3 phase power in a residential neighborhood in this country
01:05 PM phipli: my grandparents have three phase - don't know how much it costs.
01:06 PM roycroft: it requires a dedicated drop that might come from far away, and cost tens of thousands of dollars to install
01:06 PM roycroft: it's always cheaper to generate one's own 3 phase power when necessary in those areas
01:07 PM roycroft: business/industrial areas have both split phase and 3 phase
01:07 PM LeelooMinai: Right, unless you need high power/currents.
01:07 PM roycroft: as do a lot of farms
01:07 PM phipli: heh. yeah. installation is silly expensive
01:07 PM phipli: my grandparents have probably had it since the '50s
01:07 PM phipli: probably cost them 4 chickens and a cow.
01:08 PM LeelooMinai: I remember this crazy guy in IK on YouTube, what was his name...
01:08 PM roycroft: if they live on a farm it was probably just a normal power drop
01:08 PM phipli: roycroft, you don't get the power advantage if you generate your own.
01:09 PM phipli: yeah, it is / was a farm
01:09 PM phipli: he was an Agricultural contractor
01:09 PM LeelooMinai: Photoinduction? :) He built some crazy PSU and got industrial power into his house for his "experiments", like powerinf 10k watt light bulb in his room...
01:09 PM phipli: and my uncle runs a carpentry shop from the old barns
01:10 PM phipli: but yeah, the other plug I was talking about is round pin for 15A 240V
01:10 PM phipli: (our sockets are usually 13A 240V)
01:11 PM roycroft: you get motors that run more smoothly, easy variable speed, and the ability to do instant reverse if you do your own 3 phase conversion
01:11 PM roycroft: power advantage is nice
01:11 PM roycroft: but it's not everything
01:11 PM roycroft: there are good, valid reasons to generate 3 phase from single phase in a shop
01:11 PM LeelooMinai: I liked the round pin sockets in Europe better then those Canadian/US ones - they are lame. If they are made cheapely, the damn plugs can fall off by themselves or the blades can bend. I hate them:)
01:12 PM roycroft: i use twist-lock plugs and receptacles in the shop for all machinery
01:12 PM roycroft: and i use good quality receptacles for the standard ones
01:13 PM roycroft: i don't have the problem of plugs coming out unintentionally
01:13 PM phipli: roycroft, yeah, there is a variable frequency inverter at home for driving machines
01:13 PM roycroft: replace your $1 receptacle with a $4 receptacle and the problem goes away
01:13 PM LeelooMinai: Right, but there's tons of those in the house - lots of work.
01:13 PM LeelooMinai: I replaced some, but not all.
01:13 PM roycroft: so do them as you get annoyed
01:14 PM phipli: heh
01:14 PM roycroft: plug comes out, replace that one
01:14 PM phipli: "motivational annoyance"
01:14 PM roycroft: eventually they'll all get done
01:14 PM roycroft: or the ones that don't are ones you don't care about
01:15 PM LeelooMinai: I just don't like the whole idea of using flat "blades" - cheap plugs also have problems, like they bend... Imo the whole system is kind of badly engineered.
01:15 PM gregcnc: so poorly engineered it' was adopted as standard
01:16 PM LeelooMinai: Everything can be adapted as standard, but does not mean it's good necessarily.
01:16 PM sync: well, it is kinda stupid to have contacts exposed when you pull the plug out a tad
01:16 PM CaptHindsight: gregcnc: I've come across cars being sold on CL similar to the lathe
01:16 PM LeelooMinai: They are exposed by themselves often - as I wrote, some plugs tend to just slip out under the cord weight.
01:17 PM gregcnc: pricing proportional to the number of replies received?
01:17 PM CaptHindsight: starts low, then goes up
01:18 PM CaptHindsight: I avoid them or for fun use the Chinese approach
01:19 PM roycroft: european receptacles are generally switched, with the switch right on the receptacle
01:19 PM CaptHindsight: Nothing is settled until everything is settled
01:19 PM roycroft: i don't know when that was adopted as code, but i know when i was there in the 70s it was not common
01:20 PM LeelooMinai: I think UK even have some circuit protection in plugs or receptacles? Forgot now, but it was even safer.
01:20 PM LeelooMinai: US ones are scary:)
01:20 PM phipli: sync, ours have insulation on the bottom of the pins so if you pull them out a little they're insulated
01:20 PM phipli: we have built in fuses in our plugs
01:20 PM roycroft: uk wiring is scary as hell
01:20 PM roycroft: they not only allow ring circuits, they're very common
01:21 PM CaptHindsight: try India for scary
01:21 PM phipli: sync : https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f7/Moulded_and_rewireable_BS_1363_plugs_%28horizontal%29.jpg
01:21 PM roycroft: i think the uk is the only place in the world that uses ring circuits, unless some of the former colonies still do
01:22 PM CaptHindsight: extra current that way :)
01:22 PM LeelooMinai: Right, India is not exactly known for safe anything, but I would not laugh at them for too long - I read that they intend to go 100% solar/green power eventually, etc. - at leat they have good plans for the future.
01:23 PM sync: yeah the bs1363 is arguably the safest plug there is, but also the one that liks to stab your foot the most phipli
01:23 PM sync: roycroft: only in the uk there are switches
01:24 PM LeelooMinai: phipli: lol, now compare to: http://g01.a.alicdn.com/kf/HTB144z7JFXXXXayXFXXq6xXFXXXF/100Pcs-Lot-1-0M-2-Flat-Pins-US-font-b-Plug-b-font-font-b-North.jpg
01:24 PM sync: everywhere else it is really uncommon
01:24 PM roycroft: oh, i thought that was a .eu thing
01:24 PM sync: no
01:24 PM roycroft: it's only a uk thing?
01:24 PM sync: yes
01:24 PM roycroft: so they switch their unsafe ring circuits :)
01:24 PM sync: well the ring circuits are not really unsafe
01:24 PM sync: because they fuse every plug
01:25 PM roycroft: but what if the load is unbalanced?
01:25 PM roycroft: i.e. most of the load is at one end of th ering
01:25 PM LeelooMinai: Well, actually that plug I linked is not even worst - the cheapest have just thin sheet bend over to create two layer "blade".
01:25 PM roycroft: you can still exceed the safe current for the wiring, even if no individual outlets exceed it
01:25 PM gregcnc: you must have terrible receptacles
01:26 PM * roycroft suggested replacing the $1 receptacles with $4 receptacles some time ago
01:26 PM roycroft: don't blame the model for a poor implementation
01:26 PM LeelooMinai: I was talking plugs above...
01:26 PM roycroft: replace your $1 plugs with $4 plugs :)
01:26 PM gregcnc: but obviously the problem is poorly engineered system
01:27 PM sync: roycroft: well then the wiring is shorter to the load, so it works out again
01:27 PM LeelooMinai: gregcnc: You think it's a good system?
01:27 PM sync: I agree that it is not the best solution but it saved copper back then
01:27 PM roycroft: i'm not going to claim that i think that the north american system is ideal
01:27 PM gregcnc: I have no trouble with it
01:27 PM LeelooMinai: gregcnc: But other people have.
01:27 PM roycroft: but i do like that our plugs/receptacles are more compact, generally, than the .eu two round prong ones
01:28 PM gregcnc: trouble happens mostly when you don't follow code and have shit equipment
01:28 PM roycroft: and i would argue that one can make .eu style plugs/receptacles as crappily as the bad north american ones
01:29 PM sync: they will not be unsafe tho
01:29 PM roycroft: the difference being that in .eu such goods are actually inspected and not permitted to be sold if they're shite
01:29 PM sync: nah
01:29 PM sync: that doesn't happen
01:29 PM sync: you can still import crap and sell it
01:29 PM sync: it is just illegal, like in the us
01:29 PM LeelooMinai: My poiint is that it's less likely because the plugs/receptacles are designed differently. US ones are more prone to cause problems with cheap cords, etc.
01:30 PM phipli: sync : I have the "is that lego under my foot" reflex, but yes, they are painful.
01:30 PM CaptHindsight: I'd rather hear an argument over 50Hz vs 60Hz
01:30 PM roycroft: 50Hz is too slow
01:30 PM LeelooMinai: Well, 60Hz makes things like timing far easier:)
01:30 PM roycroft: it would extend my work day because the clocks run slowly
01:30 PM roycroft: i want 80Hz power
01:30 PM roycroft: so i can go home sooner
01:31 PM roycroft: but of course, the ideal line frequency is 42Hz
01:31 PM roycroft: sadly, we live in a less than ideal world
01:31 PM gregcnc: 42hz?
01:31 PM roycroft: yes
01:32 PM roycroft: after all, 42 is the answer to life, the universe, and everything
01:32 PM LeelooMinai: gregcnc: Have you ever admitted that anything US-related is inferior? :p
01:32 PM roycroft: leeloominai: have you ever claimed that anything us-related is NOT inferior?
01:32 PM LeelooMinai: Sure, many times...
01:32 PM roycroft: you have some pretty serious hate for your neighbors to the south
01:32 PM gregcnc: I'm out for today this is becoming like the previous three weeks
01:33 PM roycroft: we're a country
01:33 PM roycroft: like other countries are countries
01:33 PM roycroft: we have our strengths and weaknesses
01:33 PM roycroft: no worries, gregcnc, i'm not going to pursue this
01:33 PM roycroft: i think i've made my point :)
01:34 PM LeelooMinai: Hey, don't make this about me now - it was me pointing some fault about receptacles and suddenly gregcnc was suggesting they don't exist.
01:34 PM LeelooMinai: Just say "yes, they kind of suck" and don't try to defend them imo.
01:35 PM roycroft: except they don't
01:35 PM roycroft: inherently
01:35 PM roycroft: some of them do
01:35 PM roycroft: that does not mean all of them do
01:35 PM roycroft: nor is it a valid indictment of the design
01:35 PM LeelooMinai: In reality they do and I was decribing why and how.
01:35 PM roycroft: you love to buy chinese crap because it's cheap, and then complain about cheap chinese crap
01:36 PM phipli: roycroft, extra value for money
01:36 PM roycroft: i have no problem with cheap chinese crap, as long as you know it's cheap chinese crap
01:36 PM roycroft: and if that works for you fine
01:36 PM phipli: you get a product /and something to complain about/
01:36 PM LeelooMinai: If the design does not pass the reality test, it's not a good design - especially if it's something as crucial as mains sockets/connectors.
01:36 PM roycroft: but if you need better quality be prepared to pay for better quality
01:36 PM roycroft: this is pointless
01:36 PM * roycroft disengages
01:37 PM phipli: heh
01:37 PM roycroft: i've been watching some of the oxtoolco videos lately
01:37 PM phipli: I bought a chinese inline power meter
01:37 PM phipli: the pcb inside was /against/ the aluminium case
01:37 PM phipli: as in, the tips of the solder points
01:38 PM phipli: it is now slightly modified
01:38 PM roycroft: i'm becoming interested in tom's use of "mini pallets" for clamping random stuff on the milling machine without having to remove the vice
01:38 PM LeelooMinai: phipli: Maybe it was a novel grounding/shielding design:)
01:38 PM phipli: clearly
01:38 PM phipli: I prefer my solution though
01:38 PM roycroft: i don't have a hernia-causing kurt that is a pain in the butt to remove/install
01:39 PM roycroft: but still, not having to reindicate the vice just because i had to machine a weird part is nice
01:39 PM phipli: I got myself some of those quick clamp things that you see on vacuum machines a while back
01:39 PM * JT-Shop has the unpleasant task of moving all of the business stuff from partners garage to mine...
01:39 PM phipli: but haven't set them up yet
01:39 PM phipli: for doing PCBs without having to faff clamping them down
01:39 PM LeelooMinai: Chinese are masters at eliminating "not needed" components. Like using cell battery + LED without any resistor. You just need bad enough battery with high internal resistance.
01:39 PM skunkworks: JT-Shop, falling out?
01:39 PM roycroft: if you are doing that, then you have not engaged in proper breeding practices, jt-shop
01:40 PM roycroft: as if you had, you'd have some built-in labor to do it for you
01:40 PM phipli: the chickens are too young
01:40 PM phipli: to carry a decent load as of yet
01:40 PM LeelooMinai: to be eaten
01:40 PM phipli: that too
01:40 PM LeelooMinai: phipli: You will eat them? o_O
01:41 PM phipli: I'm far to far away to eat JT-Shop's chickens
01:41 PM phipli: and mine are pets
01:42 PM LeelooMinai: Pet chickens... weird. I don't think they are very inteligent, are they?
01:42 PM phipli: smart enough
01:42 PM phipli: I'd say somewhere between cat and dog
01:42 PM phipli: at the cat end
01:42 PM LeelooMinai: ...
01:42 PM phipli: birds are smarter than people give them credit
01:42 PM phipli: also, people tend to ignore how smart things they eat are
01:42 PM LeelooMinai: Some are, like crows.
01:42 PM phipli: eg, pigs and cows are quite smart
01:43 PM LeelooMinai: phipli: You think dogs are more intelligent than cats? :)
01:43 PM roycroft: chickens are not particularly smart
01:43 PM roycroft: pigs moreso
01:43 PM roycroft: i'm not sure about cows
01:43 PM sync: roycroft: I usually only mount my vise if I need it
01:43 PM JT-Shop: skunkworks: no he has cancer
01:43 PM roycroft: bummer, jt-shop
01:43 PM phipli: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2F5kLv6ErOA
01:43 PM roycroft: it would be better if just had a falling-out
01:44 PM JT-Shop: yea, I left everything over there hoping he would beat it but it don't look good now
01:44 PM skunkworks: JT-Shop, ouch - sorry.
01:44 PM CaptHindsight: 42Hz Chicken brains
01:45 PM JT-Shop: on a good note one of the old farts motorcycle gang and good friend got a liver transplant the other day (he had liver cancer)
01:45 PM JT-Shop: and he is doing well :)
01:46 PM LeelooMinai: phipli: lol, ok, but that's probably their limit:p How long do they live anyways?
01:46 PM roycroft: i use a vise for most things, sync
01:46 PM Phiplii: 14 years it lucky?
01:46 PM CaptHindsight: phipli: have they trained then to play cards yet?
01:46 PM LeelooMinai: Hmm, not bad
01:47 PM LeelooMinai: They are basically todays small dinosaurs from what I read.
01:48 PM Phiplii: Yes
01:48 PM Phiplii: mental
01:48 PM LeelooMinai: But probably cannot be trained to poop in one place, like cats/dogs, so... useless:)
01:49 PM * JT-Shop wonders what we are talking about now
01:49 PM phipli: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LwtuoHyLEiw
01:49 PM phipli: LeelooMinai, they don't have control of pooing unlike mammals
01:50 PM LeelooMinai: Right, so not a good idea to keep them indoors:)
01:51 PM roycroft: are you talking about birds and pooing?
01:51 PM LeelooMinai: "chickens as pets"
01:52 PM Phiplii: roycroft : yes
01:52 PM roycroft: so
01:52 PM CaptHindsight: the 2 chicken videos
01:52 PM roycroft: if they cannot control their pooing
01:52 PM roycroft: how do they manage to target car windshields so well?
01:52 PM roycroft: do they circle overhead until it happens?
01:53 PM LeelooMinai: No, the car moves so fast that manages to gather a lot of poop in flight:)
01:53 PM Phiplii: Chickens rarely circle overhead
01:53 PM roycroft: oh, i thought you meant birds in general
01:53 PM roycroft: not chickens specifically
01:54 PM LeelooMinai: Well, they can jumo/fly kind of from what I have seen - in a kind of hopless attempt to fly. I guess some reminder from flying birds:)
01:56 PM Phiplii: Smaller chickens can fly for a few seconda
01:56 PM Phiplii: bigger ones can't
01:56 PM CaptHindsight: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cE3EhGgza4c drone looks and flies just like a bird
01:56 PM JT-Shop: why is that?
01:56 PM LeelooMinai: Hmm, weird - probably about mass and kind of feathers they have.
01:56 PM JT-Shop: I've see turkeys fly straight up a cliff
01:56 PM Phiplii: power to weight
01:57 PM Phiplii: wild chickens are at the more flying end of the scale
01:57 PM LeelooMinai: May be also good at escaping predators when they are small.
01:57 PM Phiplii: I guess we made them too big
01:58 PM JT-Shop: ah yea being breed for meat and more eggs
01:58 PM CaptHindsight: the wild turkeys around here jump and glide across the roads
01:58 PM LeelooMinai: Right, that would bug me if I had a pet chicken. Eating his brothers/sister for dinner...
01:58 PM Phiplii: JT-Shop : when yours are a bit bigger, making them hop for treats is funny
01:58 PM roycroft: i've seen turkeys fly straight down from an airplane
01:58 PM roycroft: while les nessman looks on in horror
01:59 PM CaptHindsight: http://www.cnn.com/videos/us/2016/10/10/controversy-over-live-turkeys-thrown-from-plane-orig-tc.kark
01:59 PM JT-Shop: they fly up to my lap now for treats
02:00 PM Phiplii: :)
02:00 PM LeelooMinai: CaptHindsight: Well, I am on the "that's stupid and cruel" side I guess:)
02:01 PM CaptHindsight: just teaching them to fly, like throwing someone in water as a swim lesson
02:01 PM Phiplii: Sholder chickens yet? For Captain JT-Shop?
02:01 PM LeelooMinai: CaptHindsight: Yes, and then the person drowns:p
02:02 PM roycroft: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mLwidmacaRA
02:02 PM IchGucksLive: gn8
02:02 PM CaptHindsight: roycroft: was the first thing that came to my mind :)
02:04 PM CaptHindsight: wow late 70's
02:06 PM roycroft: that really was one of the funniest moments in the history of television
02:06 PM JT-Shop: just got lap chickens, max of 3 can fit before they start knocking each other off lol
02:07 PM LeelooMinai: At least before 2016;p
02:07 PM roycroft: and other than the clothing and hair styles, it has held up well over the years
02:09 PM LeelooMinai: I guess depends on ones sense of humour.
02:10 PM LeelooMinai: Hmm, I will be painting a lot of steel, some galvanized. I got some 1-2-3 primer and spray enamel. I also uinderstand I should clean the steel first. I thought maybe acetone?
02:11 PM LeelooMinai: I have acetone, mineral spirits, IPA, soap and water:)
02:12 PM aventtini: hi guys
02:12 PM LeelooMinai: The primer is latex-based water solvable, but is supposed to work on any surface.
02:13 PM aventtini: guys i have a question regarding Pulse Dir to Step DIR
02:13 PM CaptHindsight: go ahead
02:13 PM aventtini: has anyone setup a machine
02:13 PM aventtini: controller is in pulse dir
02:13 PM aventtini: larkin step dir to analog
02:14 PM aventtini: viper servo step2 liniar
02:14 PM sync: LeelooMinai: consult the TDS of your coating system
02:14 PM aventtini: i have XDIR+ XDIR - on 5V
02:14 PM LeelooMinai: sync: The what?
02:15 PM sync: technical data sheet
02:15 PM aventtini: XCP+ and XCP- on 5 v
02:15 PM roycroft: i use the least noxious stuff for cleaning that works
02:15 PM aventtini: http://032c30a.netsolhost.com/catalog/papers/pdf/Step2Lin_manual.pdf
02:15 PM LeelooMinai: Hmm, http://www.rustoleum.com/product-catalog/consumer-brands/zinsser/primer-sealers/bulls-eye-1-2-3-water-base-primer
02:15 PM roycroft: i usually start with mineral spirits
02:15 PM LeelooMinai: "sticks to all surfaces without sanding"
02:16 PM roycroft: and move to denatured alcohol if that does not work, then acetone, then lacquer thinner
02:16 PM roycroft: and in extreme situations i'll use mek
02:16 PM Crom: XXCoder: I just had a thought.. Adding a flywheel on the bottom of the spindle mounted to the er11 chuck
02:16 PM roycroft: but i hate using that stuff
02:16 PM sync: LeelooMinai: that is not the TDS
02:17 PM sync: but it is on that site
02:17 PM LeelooMinai: Hmm, this one has "acrylic forula" - I thought it was latex-badsed... well, I guess whatever.
02:17 PM LeelooMinai: sync: But TDS cannot have procedures for all materials - I mean they cannot list all possibilities, no?
02:17 PM sync: highly unlikely, as latex is too soft for most other paints and the surface energy doesn't make it a good choice to be painted
02:18 PM sync: LeelooMinai: you say that without even having looked at it
02:18 PM LeelooMinai: sync: Because I can see only MSDS link.
02:20 PM sync: look between the msds and the description
02:20 PM sync: there is the link
02:20 PM sync: http://www.glasurit.com/product-info-commercial-vehicles
02:20 PM LeelooMinai: Right, reading the datasheet
02:20 PM CaptHindsight: aventtini: what are you using to control the servo amp? LPT and BOB or Mesa FPGA card?
02:20 PM sync: but a proper coating supplier should give you something like this
02:22 PM CaptHindsight: aventtini: page 5 shows just Step, Direction and +5V for inputs to the amp
02:22 PM LeelooMinai: sync: Still, I would assume that the idea is to get the surface clean - so, it more depends on the material you deal with.
02:22 PM LeelooMinai: Probably should not use acetone on plastic, for example:)
02:23 PM LeelooMinai: That's why I thought this is more about how one cleans steel stock.
02:23 PM LeelooMinai: From what I have, I think I will first use mineral spirits and then acetone.
02:24 PM LeelooMinai: Do not have denaturated alcohol.
02:24 PM sync: denatured alcohol usually is also not a good choice
02:24 PM LeelooMinai: Hope the stuff will stick to the falvanized parts - read that those are tricky.
02:24 PM LeelooMinai: galvanized*
02:24 PM sync: as it will leave a residue, or moreso than other solvents
02:25 PM sync: ideally you get silicone remover
02:25 PM LeelooMinai: Ideally I would have 2 part epoxy paint, like Loetmichel suggested, but, have to compromise:)
02:26 PM sync: get some
02:27 PM CaptHindsight: it won't stick well to an unsanded powder covered surface
02:27 PM sync: and some proper primer
02:27 PM LeelooMinai: I read that that primer I have si good for my case.
02:27 PM LeelooMinai: Or I think watched some guy on youtube using it.
02:28 PM LeelooMinai: But he had southern accent, so not sure now:p
02:28 PM LeelooMinai: I think I will scratch the galvanized one with sandpaper a bit, just in case.
02:29 PM LeelooMinai: But then it won't be glavanized any more probably.
02:29 PM CaptHindsight: depends on how long you want the paint to stick
02:29 PM LeelooMinai: I don't know - 5 and half hours? :)
02:29 PM roycroft: mineral spirits work for cleaning most things for me
02:29 PM LeelooMinai: How about - forever...
02:30 PM CaptHindsight: Glasurit is a urethane if i recall correctly
02:30 PM sync: CaptHindsight: it depends on the system you use
02:31 PM CaptHindsight: sync: I formulate inks paints and coatings etc.
02:31 PM roycroft: glasurit have urethane systems
02:31 PM LeelooMinai: I found about 1 million can paints in the stores around - it's almost impossible to guess what they will do:/
02:31 PM sync: LeelooMinai: just use some scotchbrite pad
02:31 PM aventtini: Capt
02:31 PM CaptHindsight: looks like she's trying to coat something on the cheap with what she has
02:31 PM aventtini: im useing a http://www.szghauto.com/uploads/2015/06/231714444708.pdf
02:31 PM LeelooMinai: sync: A, right, good idea.
02:32 PM aventtini: CN5 connector
02:32 PM * roycroft knows just enough about paint systems to do what he needs to do
02:32 PM sync: CaptHindsight: still doesn't invalidate my statement
02:32 PM LeelooMinai: Paint paints.
02:32 PM CaptHindsight: wasn't trying to
02:32 PM roycroft: so far i'm really happy with my new paint system, btw
02:32 PM roycroft: lusid 777
02:32 PM aventtini: pahe 95
02:33 PM aventtini: page95
02:33 PM roycroft: it's an industrial, not automotive, urethane system
02:33 PM roycroft: i painted my lathe stand with it, and it's holding up well so far
02:33 PM roycroft: i'm going to paint my lathe with it eventually
02:33 PM CaptHindsight: paint vendors tend to have complete systems from substrate to top coat for a reason, they know it works that way
02:33 PM LeelooMinai: Got on yak shaving/sidetracking of course in the process and learned a bit about LPHV etc. spray guns and things like that, but decided to not get too crazy and just use stuff in can and be done with that hopefully.
02:33 PM aventtini: i nvere setup on this sytems
02:33 PM aventtini: only on mesa
02:33 PM CaptHindsight: anything else is experimental
02:34 PM aventtini: now i want to close the loop on this step2liniar
02:34 PM roycroft: i try to stick with a system
02:34 PM CaptHindsight: so you'll just have to test it to find out how well it all works
02:34 PM roycroft: although i used up my old ppg epoxy primer on the lathe stand
02:34 PM LeelooMinai: CaptHindsight: And it also lets them to lure people into their products, so one cannot really trust 100% in that plan, if money is a concern.
02:34 PM roycroft: i brought it into the paint shop and they looked at it, and told me that it should work ok
02:35 PM roycroft: but when i used it up i got the epoxy primer recommended for the 777 product
02:35 PM aventtini: X direction signal - X direction signal + X pulse signal - X pulse signal + all of them on 5V
02:35 PM roycroft: leeloominai: when you're paying $200+/gallon for paint you don't generally want to experiment to save a couple dollars
02:35 PM roycroft: if you're going through hundreds of gallons/year, perhaps
02:36 PM LeelooMinai: lol, ok, but I am not painting a plane.
02:36 PM CaptHindsight: ideally you want to have all the coats of polymer, polymerize to each other
02:36 PM roycroft: but for one-off paint jobs, buy the complete system
02:36 PM roycroft: and don't cut any corners at all
02:36 PM roycroft: which means using their reducer, and not off-the-shelf lacquer thinner or whatever
02:36 PM roycroft: use their hardener
02:36 PM CaptHindsight: and avoid epoxies if it will be exposed to sunlight
02:37 PM roycroft: use their clear over their color
02:37 PM roycroft: mixing products, especially if you don't know what you're doing, is penny wise and pound foolish
02:37 PM LeelooMinai: And at the end, don't forget to stick their logo on the finished frame:)
02:37 PM roycroft: it's really pointless trying to help you
02:38 PM roycroft: you're so stubborn and judgemental
02:38 PM * roycroft gives up
02:38 PM CaptHindsight: aventtini: so you're not using Linux CNC with the servo amp?
02:38 PM aventtini: on this one no
02:38 PM LeelooMinai: I guess my sense of humour is sometimes being misread:)
02:39 PM roycroft: someone wants to buy the mandolin i've had for sale for a while
02:39 PM aventtini: I wanted a mesa 7i77
02:39 PM roycroft: that will pay for my backing plate blank, and some additional tooling :)
02:39 PM aventtini: but i dont know how to set up the gears on the machines
02:39 PM LeelooMinai: roycroft: I was listening - just because I joke about something, does not mean I do not process the information being provided.
02:39 PM aventtini: problem is that is running on in one direction
02:40 PM aventtini: ok
02:40 PM aventtini: but in - no
02:40 PM sync: but I think glasurit system 68 is a urethane, CaptHindsight
02:40 PM sync: their primers are epoxy based tho
02:40 PM aventtini: and i dont understand why
02:40 PM LeelooMinai: roycroft: I think you are still angry about me not likeing US:)
02:40 PM aventtini: i never set un on this step dir puls dir
02:40 PM aventtini: etc
02:41 PM aventtini: if it was on linux it was ready in 2H
02:41 PM aventtini: but this time i did not have a choice
02:42 PM aventtini: i cant see the diferance on pulse/dir and step /dir
02:42 PM aventtini: 5v on + and 5V on - for direction
02:43 PM CaptHindsight: sync: an epoxy primer would be safe under a highly pigmented urethane in sunlight
02:44 PM roycroft: i'm not angry, but exasperated
02:44 PM sync: yeah, all of their system 68 stuff is high solid
02:44 PM sync: mostly chromates <3
02:44 PM roycroft: the epoxy primer for the 777 urethane is rated for sunlight exposure
02:44 PM roycroft: but they recommend their clear over the 777 for extended uv exposure
02:45 PM CaptHindsight: I mostly work with 100% solid systems
02:45 PM roycroft: since my machines live indoors and i don't have big south facing windows, i'm not concerned with uv exposure to my paints
02:46 PM CaptHindsight: aventtini: too many docs to read through for me today
02:46 PM sync: well, the CV filler is 78% dichromate
02:46 PM sync: not too bad imho
02:46 PM aventtini: maybe im wrong
02:46 PM aventtini: pulse dir and step dir same thing
02:47 PM CaptHindsight: aventtini: step + dir is the same as pulse + dir, if you're not getting a direction change then check the Direction signal with a meter
02:47 PM aventtini: from controler im gettin 0v in + and 5v-
02:47 PM aventtini: so controller is sending the right signal
02:48 PM aventtini: problem is this step2liniar it has direction 5v+ 5V+ and dir
02:48 PM aventtini: 4 wires
02:49 PM aventtini: xdir+ and xcp+ 5v +
02:49 PM aventtini: and the rest dir- gos to direction , pulse - go to step
02:49 PM CaptHindsight: trying to debug this without a diagram is difficult
02:50 PM aventtini: http://032c30a.netsolhost.com/catalog/papers/pdf/Step2Lin_manual.pdf page 5
02:50 PM CaptHindsight: what is xcp+ ?
02:51 PM aventtini: xpulse direction 5v
02:51 PM CaptHindsight: you have seen this all day/week/month it's all new to us here
02:51 PM aventtini: i think stepper drivers has this step dir
02:51 PM aventtini: http://www.szghauto.com/uploads/2015/06/231714444708.pdf page 95
02:52 PM aventtini: its not a complicated setup
02:52 PM aventtini: only is running now ok in one direction
02:53 PM CaptHindsight: plus you are posting Chinglish docs
02:53 PM aventtini: today was the top of the chake
02:53 PM aventtini: it was 4 months on mesa
02:53 PM CaptHindsight: and English is not your first language
02:53 PM aventtini: now this shity china
02:53 PM CaptHindsight: so ..........
02:53 PM aventtini: manuals
02:53 PM aventtini: with no schematics
02:54 PM aventtini: we are learning slow now
02:54 PM CaptHindsight: the controller might output differential Step and Dir
02:55 PM CaptHindsight: drive the amps Dir with 5V+, does it change direction when you connect and disconnect 5V+ ?
02:55 PM aventtini: i was thinking takeing the xdir+ and xcp+ to a 5v enable
02:56 PM aventtini: and drive only from xdir- and xcp-
02:56 PM aventtini: nope
02:56 PM aventtini: i have seen in the manual only 5v on all 4 wires
02:56 PM CaptHindsight: if nope is the result than the amp doesn't sound like it is working properly
02:56 PM aventtini: thas a litttle strange
02:57 PM aventtini: this step2liniar is a board that takes the Step/dir to a Velocity command
02:58 PM CaptHindsight: the amp should only need one of the differential outputs from the controller XDIR+ or XDIR-
02:58 PM aventtini: and it has a encoder imput so you can cloase the loop in it
02:58 PM aventtini: i have a indramat trm3 with analog +-10v
02:59 PM CaptHindsight: but if the amp doesn't change direction when you apply 5v+ or Ground (0V) to the DIR pin then the amp isn't working properly
03:00 PM aventtini: if i test with a potentiometer direcly on the +- 10v
03:00 PM aventtini: it works ok
03:01 PM CaptHindsight: post a drawing of your wiring
03:01 PM CaptHindsight: I can't (will not) keep track of the wiring diagram in spoken word format
03:01 PM CaptHindsight: spoken/written
03:02 PM aventtini: im working on a schematic this week
03:02 PM aventtini: today was first day of movment
03:05 PM CaptHindsight: post a hand sketch of the Step and Direction connections
03:06 PM CaptHindsight: should be 6 wires or less
03:06 PM aventtini: one sec
03:07 PM CaptHindsight: since the amp has 5V+ as an input to the optos it's likely active low
03:08 PM CaptHindsight: for Step
03:08 PM CaptHindsight: and the direction should change when you drive the Step input Low
03:08 PM CaptHindsight: vs no connection
03:11 PM CaptHindsight: assuming that you have 5V+ connected and are using it's ground as Low
03:13 PM aventtini: http://imgur.com/a/hnLX0
03:13 PM aventtini: i think i tums be active low
03:14 PM aventtini: i did not test this
03:16 PM CaptHindsight: why did you connect XDIR+ and XCP+ to the 5V+ power?
03:16 PM CaptHindsight: they are outputs from the controller
03:17 PM aventtini: because the step2linar have 2x 5v
03:17 PM aventtini: +
03:18 PM aventtini: yes
03:18 PM aventtini: xdir+ and xcp+ come from controler and conected to 2x 5v + on step2linar
03:19 PM CaptHindsight: yes, but that is not how the inputs work
03:20 PM aventtini: i asume that
03:20 PM aventtini: from the step2linar schematic
03:20 PM CaptHindsight: is there a 5V output on the controller?
03:21 PM aventtini: http://imgur.com/a/hnLX0
03:21 PM aventtini: yes
03:21 PM aventtini: you mean aditional 5v?
03:22 PM aventtini: http://imgur.com/a/hnLX0
03:22 PM aventtini: i have added 2 pics
03:23 PM CaptHindsight: XDIR+ and XCP+ are not %V+ power
03:23 PM CaptHindsight: they are just the opposite of the - signals XCP- and XDIR-
03:24 PM CaptHindsight: %v+/5V+
03:24 PM aventtini: 4 of 5v ?
03:24 PM aventtini: right?
03:25 PM aventtini: is 0v for one direction and 5v+ for another ?
03:25 PM CaptHindsight: the controller has differential outputs, not one output for active low and the other for power
03:26 PM CaptHindsight: the amp has 5v+ power and (most likely) active low
03:26 PM CaptHindsight: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Differential_signaling
03:28 PM aventtini: so i nead a convertor
03:28 PM CaptHindsight: the amp needs 5V+ from your controller, and then you can use either the - or the + outputs from the controller to amp Step and Dir inputs
03:28 PM LeelooMinai: aventtini: Differential signals still use ground that is common for them, it's just that they are compared to each other to decode the value.
03:29 PM CaptHindsight: you don't need a converter, you can just use one side of the differential signals/outputs from the amp
03:29 PM aventtini: aaa
03:30 PM aventtini: i think i understand why is like this
03:30 PM aventtini: its controler has encoder inputs as well
03:31 PM aventtini: so it can be use as a close loop maybe
03:31 PM CaptHindsight: thats another topic
03:31 PM aventtini: i will use only the dir/step
03:31 PM aventtini: 2 wires
03:31 PM aventtini: and the rest of the 2 wires?
03:31 PM aventtini: not in use ?
03:32 PM CaptHindsight: CN11 on the controller has a 5V+ pin
03:33 PM CaptHindsight: yes, don't use the other differential signal
03:33 PM aventtini: handweel
03:33 PM aventtini: is on cn11
03:34 PM CaptHindsight: I see 5V+ on a few other connectors on the controller
03:34 PM aventtini: i did not show you the machine
03:34 PM aventtini: http://www.thumar.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/IMG_4351.jpg
03:35 PM aventtini: you say to use a driffrent port
03:35 PM aventtini: why the 5 v?
03:35 PM CaptHindsight: CN13 pin9
03:35 PM aventtini: from another CN?
03:36 PM CaptHindsight: CN13 pins 10.23 for ground to test the inputs on the amp
03:36 PM aventtini: CN13 is the encoders
03:36 PM CaptHindsight: the amp requires 5V+ to the optos for them to operate
03:37 PM aventtini: aaaa
03:37 PM aventtini: i understand now
03:37 PM aventtini: you say i need to aply 5v to step2linar
03:37 PM CaptHindsight: you can test by applying 5V+ to the amp 5V+ and short the Step and Dir to ground
03:37 PM CaptHindsight: yes
03:37 PM CaptHindsight: yes, the amp
03:37 PM aventtini: and 2 wires xdir+ and xdir- to direction nad step
03:38 PM CaptHindsight: step2linear = amp
03:38 PM aventtini: and come from cn13 with 5v to amp
03:38 PM aventtini: right?
03:38 PM CaptHindsight: only one wire from Step and one wire from Dir
03:39 PM CaptHindsight: so 5V+ power from CN13
03:40 PM CaptHindsight: try Step- and Dir- to Step and Dir
03:40 PM CaptHindsight: and if the direction is backwards then use Dir+
03:41 PM aventtini: http://imgur.com/a/hnLX0
03:42 PM CaptHindsight: almost
03:42 PM CaptHindsight: XDIR- to AMP DIR
03:43 PM CaptHindsight: leave XDIR+ not connected
03:44 PM CaptHindsight: XCP- to AMP STEP
03:44 PM CaptHindsight: XCP+ not connected
03:45 PM CaptHindsight: GN13 5V to AMP 5V+
03:45 PM aventtini: i will test tomorow
03:45 PM aventtini: hope it works
03:45 PM CaptHindsight: post another pic before you go
03:45 PM CaptHindsight: of the drawing
03:46 PM CaptHindsight: XDIR + or - will never go to STEP on the AMP
03:47 PM CaptHindsight: DIR is only for DIR and XCP is only for STEP/PULSE
03:49 PM aventtini: http://imgur.com/a/hnLX0
03:49 PM CaptHindsight: that looks like a good start
03:50 PM aventtini: hope it works
03:50 PM CaptHindsight: if you don't get movement then swap XCP- for XCP+
03:50 PM CaptHindsight: if the movement is backwards from expected the swap XDIR- for XDIR+
03:52 PM aventtini: tnx for help
03:52 PM aventtini: next time back to mesa
03:52 PM CaptHindsight: you should be able to make single steps by shorting the STEP input on the AMP to ground, each time it touches ground it should make a step
03:52 PM aventtini: aaaa
03:52 PM aventtini: good to know
03:53 PM CaptHindsight: just short taps to ground to produce a Low pulse
03:53 PM aventtini: im a little scared on tests
03:53 PM aventtini: it has 8kw 40nm motor
03:54 PM aventtini: i dont want to make a runway
03:54 PM aventtini: :))))
03:54 PM SpeedEvil: First bolt the motor down properly and don't play with it on a desk :)
03:55 PM aventtini: :)))
03:55 PM aventtini: problem is that is on a linar scale
03:56 PM aventtini: and i need to test with motor coneced to axis
03:56 PM aventtini: connected
03:56 PM aventtini: :)
03:56 PM CaptHindsight: you also have to be aware of the Enable Out on the step2lin
03:56 PM CaptHindsight: page 10
03:56 PM aventtini: motor is on tacho and encoder is on linear scale
03:56 PM aventtini: yes i have seen that
03:57 PM aventtini: and i need to sort a delay until the controller boots up
03:57 PM aventtini: and enable
03:57 PM CaptHindsight: are the encoders connected?
03:57 PM aventtini: yes
03:57 PM CaptHindsight: if no it will run away
03:58 PM aventtini: only like mesa if encoder channes are inverted
03:58 PM aventtini: i dont have like linuxcnc
03:58 PM aventtini: maxferror
03:58 PM CaptHindsight: if DIR is backwards it will runaway
03:58 PM aventtini: i was thinking on that
03:59 PM CaptHindsight: error is analog via the Gain adjustment
04:01 PM aventtini: it look like this step2linar a good board
04:01 PM aventtini: hope it works well
04:02 PM aventtini: i have converted the sinus liniar scales to TTL
04:02 PM aventtini: with the original bord from the tnc
04:02 PM aventtini: and i have found out that is not good to use a stabilizated power supply
04:02 PM aventtini: with mesa for example
04:03 PM aventtini: because some time when working there are some riples form power supply
04:03 PM aventtini: and right now im testing mesa with transformar and bridge
04:10 PM Deejay: gn8
04:13 PM XXCoder: Crom: if has lathe can always directly replace that coupler /er11 attachment thing with heavier metal one.
04:13 PM XXCoder: more mass but takes no more space
04:13 PM XXCoder: in fact it can even have thicker flange on end closer to spindle itself
04:13 PM Crom: I can't do the thread or taper
04:14 PM XXCoder: drat too bad
04:14 PM XXCoder: you'd be able to sell em as upgrades
04:14 PM Crom: I can make a ring that would fit around it and get grub screwed on
04:15 PM XXCoder: yeah though I wonder about balancing it
04:15 PM Crom: with the pointy grub screws into the rollpin it'll never come off
04:16 PM Crom: with the outside inside facing and parting off in the same work holding it should be pretty balanced
04:17 PM XXCoder: part itself can be I'm more concerned about chinese part itself
04:18 PM Crom: it seems to be pretty colinear
04:43 PM LeelooMinai: roycroft's triangulation discussion lead me into pages like this one: http://www.galileo.org/tips/structures/frames.html
04:43 PM LeelooMinai: Now, I remember I saw toy/blocks that had parts that looked like those pieces there, etc. anyone remember what those toys are called?
04:44 PM cradek: erector set
04:44 PM LeelooMinai: Hmm... that sounds pretty generic. Isn't there some brand name like "lego"?
04:44 PM ve7it: mecano
04:44 PM cradek: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Erector_Set
04:45 PM cradek: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Erector_Set#/media/File:Erectorsetmcnyjeh.JPG
04:46 PM ve7it: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meccano
04:46 PM LeelooMinai: Hmm, seems this goes long way back - some of that looks pretty ancient - like 50s or something.
04:46 PM cradek: yeah it's a very old toy. looks like in 2015 meccano bought the trademark.
04:46 PM phipli: Meccano?
04:47 PM cradek: but they have always been called erector sets
04:47 PM phipli: ah. sorry.
04:47 PM ve7it: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meccano#/media/File:20030514_160101-Meccano_set-rt1.jpg
04:47 PM phipli: too slow
04:47 PM phipli: (me)
04:47 PM cradek: oh maybe they were two different kinds of set and they merged in 2015?
04:47 PM cradek: huh
04:48 PM ve7it: maybe meccano was a Canadian product.... I built a lot of funs stuff with the sets avaialable... had a clockworks type motor for moving projects
04:48 PM DaViruz: i have meccano-books from like 1950
04:48 PM phipli: "Current "Erector" sets are actually "Meccano" sets manufactured by Meccano, France and marketed in the United States as "Erector"."
04:49 PM phipli: Meccano was originally British
04:49 PM phipli: but marketed in Canada and France as well
04:50 PM phipli: Never heard of "Erector Set", but I guess that is because it was American
04:51 PM phipli: archivist, https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/25/Rew7a20-597_meccano_steam_engine.jpg/1920px-Rew7a20-597_meccano_steam_engine.jpg
04:51 PM LeelooMinai: I am trying to slyly lure my small nephew into engineering-something. He likes building things with lego, Minecraft is his obsession, etc., so thinking maybe something with bolts like that would be a good "lure":)
04:52 PM LeelooMinai: He is also into cars of all sorts and I see they have cars there too.
04:52 PM LeelooMinai: Not very cheap, but nice: https://www.amazon.ca/Meccano-6026719-Elite-Road-Assortment/dp/B00TZF8ADA
04:53 PM LeelooMinai: But those "bolts" are probably plastic, no?
04:53 PM phipli: says "Meccano is the classic metal construction system"
04:54 PM LeelooMinai: Well, on the box it looks like plastic - maybe it's rendering. I mean the sheet parts look metal, but not bolts.
04:54 PM phipli: how old are they?
04:55 PM LeelooMinai: Hmm, he is 10-11 - something close.
04:55 PM phipli: ah right
04:55 PM phipli: old enough to do quite complicated things then
04:55 PM LeelooMinai: Right, he has no problems with lego technic I once got for him. Kind of failed with plastic Apache though:)
04:56 PM LeelooMinai: But I blame games - he had no patience for it.
04:58 PM LeelooMinai: But, I got a bit angry last time he was at my house to pick up an aluminum scooter and I wanted to check if he knows abaut basic safety like how to use the clamp there properly and he had no idea:/
04:59 PM LeelooMinai: And he is rather smart otherwise.
05:00 PM phipli: it is an exposure thing
05:00 PM phipli: the more he does it the better he'll get
05:01 PM phipli: We worry a little about what my nephew tells his teachers
05:01 PM LeelooMinai: Well, it's more like no one to explain those things to him. I try, but it's tough to do that without discouraging.
05:01 PM phipli: he told his nursery teacher that they'd been blowing up pigeons once...
05:01 PM phipli: he forgot to mention they were plastic
05:02 PM LeelooMinai: lol
05:02 PM phipli: thankfully they're in quite a rural part of the country and so the teachers probably didn't care even if they thought they were real pigeons
05:03 PM LeelooMinai: Right, they could be from that place where they throw turkeys from planes...
05:03 PM phipli: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFK8RE2pIBs
05:03 PM phipli: no wild turkeys here
05:03 PM phipli: a turkey is for christmas dinner, not dropping from a plane
05:04 PM LeelooMinai: phipli: I would be careful with videos with eploding pigeons - someone may take this as training for some terrorist act:p
05:05 PM phipli: yeah
05:05 PM phipli: what a world we live in
05:05 PM phipli: you can't even innocently explode plastic pigeons without drawing suspicion
05:05 PM LeelooMinai: A flock of 10000 exploding pigeons could be pretty effective at creating chaos...
05:06 PM LeelooMinai: Well, not plastic - I mean I saw a pigeon with a backpack not so long ago - but it was drugs I think:)
05:06 PM LeelooMinai: Not me on drugs - the backpack had drugs inside:p
05:07 PM phipli: <nods reassuringly and slowly throttles the bandwidth>
05:07 PM LeelooMinai: Damn, and again - I got from triangulating my cnc frame into exploding pigeons in 10 minutes...
05:07 PM phipli: (closest thing I can manage to backing away)
05:07 PM phipli: my bad
05:08 PM phipli: here. I'll help you get back to CNC related things
05:08 PM phipli: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BNh7ujxSI4E
05:08 PM roycroft: http://www.roycroft.us/PoisoningPigeons.mp3
05:09 PM LeelooMinai: phipli: Some people have definitelly too much time on hand...
05:09 PM TurBoss: andypugh: I fixed my boot issues
05:09 PM phipli: I understand it was a test for a paid job :p
05:09 PM TurBoss: was the legacy usb option on the bios
05:09 PM andypugh: Wierd
05:09 PM TurBoss: and siwched to ps/2 keyb+ mouse
05:10 PM LeelooMinai: TurBoss: A... had the same problem, now I remember.
05:10 PM TurBoss: other linux failed too
05:10 PM TurBoss: now working
05:10 PM TurBoss: perfect
05:10 PM TurBoss: 6000ns latency :D
05:11 PM LeelooMinai: But it was with my wireless little keyboard for linuxcnc. Tracked it to fast boot option that skips some usb compatibility procedures.
05:12 PM phipli: LeelooMinai, jolly little ditty
05:15 PM LeelooMinai: Hmm... if one has 2mm or 3.2mm steel sheet and wants to attach some small mounting "thing" to it, are there any options except welding?
05:16 PM LeelooMinai: Also, even with welding, could be risky, no?
05:16 PM phipli: rivnuts
05:16 PM LeelooMinai: As normal arc-welding seems to melt part of the matieral...
05:16 PM sync: welding to 2mm steel is easy enough
05:17 PM phipli: or braze?
05:17 PM LeelooMinai: Well, rivets would be like scews though - they would weaken the sheet-part structurally.
05:17 PM sync: although I would probably use mig
05:17 PM LeelooMinai: Hmm... brazing is using metal as glue?
05:17 PM phipli: rivnut are these : https://ae01.alicdn.com/kf/HTB1f77CHVXXXXXHXVXXq6xXFXXXr/5mm-100pcsFlat-stainless-steel304-Rivet-Nut-font-b-Rivnut-b-font-Insert-Nutsert-blind-nut-font.jpg
05:18 PM phipli: but still make a hole yes
05:18 PM LeelooMinai: Can you even use brazing on steel?
05:19 PM phipli: yeah
05:19 PM LeelooMinai: Er, just checked and it seems to involve scary flame tools.
05:19 PM phipli: yes
05:19 PM phipli: what type of brazing were you thinking of? :p
05:19 PM phipli: surely fire is a bonus?
05:20 PM LeelooMinai: I thought that maybe you can do something similar to arc welding, I don't know.
05:20 PM LeelooMinai: I want to attach some mounts for my triangulation threaded rods.
05:20 PM phipli: epoxy?
05:21 PM phipli: if you want to avoid fire and holes?
05:21 PM phipli: can't think of much else, other than perhaps string
05:21 PM LeelooMinai: Er, I know epoxy is nice, but I don't think it's a good place to use it for tensioning rods...
05:22 PM LeelooMinai: Unless it's some magic NASA epoxy:)
05:22 PM phipli: velcro is out the window too then I guess...
05:23 PM phipli: would tack welding it on be enough?
05:24 PM LeelooMinai: It all ends with welding - I try to avoid it at all cost, but always ends there:)
05:25 PM LeelooMinai: Tack welding is what? Blob of weld in one point?
05:26 PM LeelooMinai: I guess as long as it is strong...
05:28 PM phipli: yeah, bit like spot welding... but with other welders
05:28 PM LeelooMinai: I found some welding helmet in my basement, but cannot find the darkened window part. I guess if I just buy the sticks and some gloves, I could try. But what about clothes? Does one need some expensive jacket or what welders use?
05:28 PM phipli: good for getting things square, temporary fitment... speed...
05:29 PM phipli: LeelooMinai, the usual sensible stuff
05:29 PM phipli: boots
05:29 PM roycroft: leeloominai: wear comfortable old clothing
05:29 PM phipli: avoid high plastic content
05:29 PM roycroft: but no synthetic fabrics
05:29 PM roycroft: cotton or leather
05:29 PM roycroft: wear long sleeves
05:29 PM phipli: gloves
05:29 PM roycroft: the uv from the welder will sunburn your arms quickly
05:29 PM phipli: only if you're doing a lot surely?
05:30 PM roycroft: i don't like to button my welding jacke all the way up
05:30 PM LeelooMinai: Damn, UV from an arc sounds pretty brutal.
05:30 PM roycroft: if by "a lot" you mean "5-10 minutes or more", if you're not used to welding
05:30 PM phipli: interesting
05:30 PM phipli: I don't weld much
05:30 PM roycroft: since i don't like buttoning my jacket all the way up i usually wear a bandana around my neck to keep my throat from getting sunburned
05:30 PM phipli: but the only complaint I've heard about sunburn is from my dad
05:31 PM LeelooMinai: well, if it burns skin, I better make sure that I have proper eye protection:/
05:31 PM phipli: and that was with an industrial stick welder and 3 inch plate
05:31 PM phipli: LeelooMinai, Yes!
05:31 PM roycroft: it will put your eye out for sure
05:31 PM roycroft: that helmet may have an auto-darkening lens
05:32 PM roycroft: if there's a hole in the front you need to get a lens
05:32 PM phipli: "arc-eye" feels like sand in the eyes
05:32 PM roycroft: if there's a fairly clear window in the front investigate and see if it's auto-darkening
05:32 PM phipli: and also has long term effects
05:32 PM LeelooMinai: I don't think it has auto-enything - seems pretty old and not expensive.
05:32 PM phipli: like cancer and cataracts
05:32 PM LeelooMinai: And that's why I wanted to avoid welding I guess...
05:32 PM roycroft: i don't know what arc-eye feels like
05:32 PM phipli: take care it isn't a gas welding shield
05:33 PM phipli: they're not as dark
05:33 PM roycroft: because i've always had enough sense to avert my eyes or use a proper shield lens when i'm near welding operations
05:33 PM phipli: roycroft, I've not had it either - we're just warned when we're learning
05:33 PM LeelooMinai: lol, I wonder if people weld with cameras and full helmets - that would take care of risk:)
05:33 PM roycroft: and what phipli said
05:33 PM phipli: yes. I was about to go back to that to make sure he saw
05:33 PM roycroft: gas welding lenses are not sufficient for arc welding
05:34 PM roycroft: i have a nice auto-darkening jackson helmet
05:34 PM roycroft: but you can use a cheap helmet
05:34 PM LeelooMinai: I saw things like that, but over $100
05:34 PM roycroft: auto-darkening is really good when you're just starting out
05:34 PM LeelooMinai: I think they use photosensor + lcd
05:35 PM roycroft: lining the stick up, then flipping the helmet down by snapping your neck, and not moving the welding stick in the process is an acquired skill
05:35 PM LeelooMinai: But, what is their advantage? That you can see when not welding?
05:35 PM canid: I got my auto-darkening hood for like $35
05:35 PM canid: It's not great but it works on a budget
05:35 PM roycroft: and so you'll be not striking an arc at all, or strking it in the wrong place until you get used to it
05:35 PM roycroft: yes, you can see before you strike the arc
05:35 PM roycroft: you need to position the rod to strike the arc
05:36 PM roycroft: you can't just wave it randomly in the air
05:36 PM LeelooMinai: Hmm, and then photosensor gets broken, or connection fails, and you have arc directly into your eyes - I don't know:)
05:36 PM LeelooMinai: Seems a bit risky.
05:36 PM roycroft: about 100% of professional welders use an auto-darkening hood
05:37 PM roycroft: but they use a $300 one, not a $35 one
05:37 PM roycroft: and you're not going to damage your eyes in a split second
05:37 PM roycroft: if the auto-darkening fails you pull the stick/torch away and kill the arc
05:37 PM LeelooMinai: I wonder how long it takes
05:37 PM roycroft: you'll do that instinctually
05:38 PM LeelooMinai: "first 5 microseconds is sage"
05:38 PM LeelooMinai: safe*
05:39 PM SpeedEvil: 'most' of the damage is due to UV.
05:39 PM roycroft: yes
05:39 PM SpeedEvil: All of the UV is absored by the auto-dark, even when set to clear
05:39 PM roycroft: it is?
05:39 PM roycroft: so no worries then
05:39 PM roycroft: but even so
05:40 PM SpeedEvil: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gtTdiqDqHc8 - also - I want this.
05:40 PM roycroft: you'll still kill the arc faster than you can imagine being ablt to do so if the auto-darkening fails
05:40 PM SpeedEvil: realtime HDR AR (is it AR if your goggles completely cover your face)
05:41 PM LeelooMinai: SpeedEvil: I just suggested thing like that above.
05:41 PM LeelooMinai: And of course it exists...
05:41 PM SpeedEvil: I diddn't read up
05:41 PM LeelooMinai: There's too many people - they already invented everything.
05:42 PM SpeedEvil: :)
05:42 PM LeelooMinai: Right, that would be ideal. You can have HDR, process it, even display HUD info, like temperature, etc. and be totally safe. Also, not cheap:(
05:43 PM roycroft: that's pretty cool, speedevil
05:43 PM SpeedEvil: I wonder about doing it cheap with cellphone cameras, filters, and obscuration
05:43 PM LeelooMinai: lol... and few minutes into the video they have info there about current, etc. in a HUD
05:44 PM roycroft: ugh
05:44 PM roycroft: i have yard/garden work to do today, and it's 27 degrees out
05:44 PM LeelooMinai: O, right, and 3D so you can judge depth, etc. and you are rolling.
05:44 PM LeelooMinai: So two cameras I guess.
05:45 PM LeelooMinai: And as a bonus, after welding you can just walk to the set of Dr. Who and make more money as an extra: http://i.imgur.com/nd4bMih.jpg
05:46 PM JT-Shop: phipli: did you get a chance to look at the door code?
05:47 PM SpeedEvil: roycroft: http://www.veskimo.com/why-best-cooling-vest.php - DIY is pretty easy
05:54 PM roycroft: there are probably more robotic welders in this country than human welders at this poitn
05:54 PM roycroft: point
05:54 PM LeelooMinai: Right, but those are not really DYI
05:55 PM roycroft: you can buy a used one off ebay and hook an arduino to it
05:55 PM LeelooMinai: I mean their construction - lots of money.
05:55 PM LeelooMinai: O, right, now I remembered something else - I saw something called spot welding - like a c-clamp thing. Can it be used on 2mm sheet metal?
05:55 PM roycroft: sure
05:56 PM LeelooMinai: Viable for me or out of question (expensive, etc.)?
05:56 PM roycroft: you can get a spot welder pretty cheap
05:56 PM roycroft: you can build one really cheap
05:57 PM LeelooMinai: It cannot use AC welder?
05:57 PM LeelooMinai: I assume it uses current, no?
05:57 PM roycroft: yes
05:58 PM LeelooMinai: Hmm, reading about it, right, it's what one sees they do with the robots on car bodies.
05:59 PM LeelooMinai: So I guess it's good when joing sheet metal mostly.
06:00 PM sync: well, it is how cars are held together
06:00 PM LeelooMinai: But it weakens the place where the weld is, so one can as well make a hole and put a bolt there.
06:00 PM LeelooMinai: I mean in my case.
06:01 PM sync: what makes you think that it would weaken the metal where the weld is?
06:01 PM LeelooMinai: "The spot welding process tends to harden the material, causing it to warp. This reduces the material's fatigue strength, and may stretch the material as well as anneal it. The physical effects of spot welding include internal cracking, surface cracks and a bad appearance. The chemical properties affected include the metal's internal resistance and its corrosive properties."
06:01 PM roycroft: good welds are at least as strong as the metal they're joining, and often are stronger
06:01 PM LeelooMinai: Sounds pretty bad.
06:02 PM sync: it is not
06:03 PM phipli: JT-Shop, sent you some feedback, but in summary it all looks good
06:03 PM SpeedEvil: spot welding can be weaker. It all depends on joint design.
06:03 PM roycroft: if you spot weld your stand together it's not going to fall apart due to metal fatigue
06:03 PM roycroft: it might fall apart because you did not spot weld it properly
06:03 PM roycroft: but it won't fall apart due to metal fatigue
06:03 PM SpeedEvil: Properly designed spotwelds in properly sleected materials are not an issue
06:03 PM LeelooMinai: Well, read also about the welding equipment - seems much more complicated than what I have (there's only transformer inside basically.)
06:04 PM SpeedEvil: spot welding equipment is often little more than a transformer and timer.
06:04 PM LeelooMinai: Since it seems to include capacitor bank, I guess to release a lot of energy in short time.
06:04 PM roycroft: my spot welder is essentially a heavy transformer with two big copper electrodes sticking out
06:04 PM roycroft: and a clamp handle to squeeze the electrodes together (with the metal sandwiched in between)
06:04 PM LeelooMinai: Hmm, maybe the simple ones do not have storage.
06:05 PM phipli: people use microwave transformers to make spot welders
06:05 PM phipli: they're amazing at what they do
06:05 PM roycroft: my tig welder can do pulse spot welding
06:05 PM phipli: but limited compared to other welders
06:05 PM phipli: they are for sheet metal work only
06:05 PM phipli: and access becomes an issue
06:05 PM roycroft: https://www.harborfreight.com/240-volt-spot-welder-61206.html
06:05 PM roycroft: pretty simple
06:06 PM roycroft: but that works fine
06:07 PM LeelooMinai: That's a lot of copper there:)
06:07 PM roycroft: that thing looks
06:07 PM roycroft: "portable"
06:07 PM roycroft: but it works best mounted on a stand
06:07 PM LeelooMinai: I guess this is a bit less universal than arc welder, but seems super-simple to use.
06:09 PM roycroft: i wouldn't weld structural members together with a spot welder
06:09 PM roycroft: i have other welding machines for that
06:09 PM roycroft: but it's quite useful for sheet metal
06:09 PM * LeelooMinai sighs
06:11 PM LeelooMinai: I wonder if something like that could be used to make holes in sheet metal for rivets...
06:11 PM LeelooMinai: I mean something working on the same principle.
06:12 PM LeelooMinai: But I guess with sheet you can just use some punch machine or what they use.
06:12 PM LeelooMinai: Unless there are some held-held tools that can do that?
06:13 PM LeelooMinai: hand-held I mean, not pwoered by eletriocity.
06:13 PM roycroft: http://www.trick-tools.com/Roper_Whitney_XX_Deep_Throat_Hand_Punch_Kit_135010001_1566
06:14 PM roycroft: i've joined a fair amount of sheet metal starting with that
06:14 PM roycroft: i puch holes in one sheet
06:14 PM roycroft: clamp it to the sheet to which i'm joining it
06:14 PM roycroft: drill through the second sheet with a 1/8" spot drill, using the punched holes as guides
06:15 PM roycroft: hold it all together with a bunch of clecos
06:15 PM roycroft: and then weld it up
06:15 PM roycroft: i just pull one cleco at a time and fill the hole with weld
06:15 PM LeelooMinai: Right, so you punch small diameter holes first, as it requires less force.
06:15 PM roycroft: no, i usually punch 1/8" holes and then drill 1/8" holes
06:15 PM roycroft: because most of my clecos are 1/8"
06:15 PM LeelooMinai: Well, 1/8 is small
06:16 PM dioz: the smallest hole you punch in your material is the same size as the material
06:16 PM dioz: if smaller you drill
06:17 PM roycroft: if i want a smooth surface on one side i'll form a lip on one of the sheets before joining them
06:18 PM dioz: you mean a hem?
06:19 PM dioz: roycroft: i got a whitney punch. i use it pretty much daily at work
06:19 PM roycroft: not a hem
06:19 PM roycroft: i don't fold it back on itself
06:19 PM roycroft: i guess you would call it a flange
06:20 PM dioz: flange in/ flange out
06:20 PM roycroft: i have a tool that pushes the metal down the thickness of the metal
06:21 PM dioz: i have to do a bunch of triangulation tonight
06:21 PM Crom: nice.. just received my M42 HSS 3/8 x 3/8 x 3" bit of tool sttel
06:21 PM roycroft: so when you put another piece of sheet metal on top of that the top surfaces are flush
06:21 PM dioz: i have to fabricate a dropped cheak transitional elbow
06:22 PM dioz: Crom: what you gonna do with it?
06:22 PM dioz: spin it?
06:23 PM roycroft: hint to idiot vendors' website developers:
06:24 PM roycroft: if you make a popup window that blocks the screen when i first visit your site begging/demanding that i provide personal information i'll be annoyed, but close it and try to continue navigating your site
06:24 PM roycroft: when you do it every time i click on anything i go away, never to return
06:24 PM dioz: i ate way too many snap peas
06:29 PM JT-Shop: I know what you mean roycroft, worst is the emails from stuff you used to do and they never quit even though you click on stop it
06:29 PM roycroft: clicking on unsubscribe usually just gets you on more lists
06:29 PM roycroft: i report them to abuse@
06:30 PM roycroft: and threaten to get the hosting site in the anti-abuse rbls if they don't deal with it
06:30 PM roycroft: and then i follow up and get them in the anti-abuse rbls if they don't stop it
06:30 PM enleth: another weirdo bridgeport problem - it seems that the Z axis is "drifting" downwards
06:31 PM enleth: when I re-run a program, the tool cuts ever so slightly lower each time
06:31 PM enleth: I'm not sure yet if there's any repeatable relationship between the drift and the amount or type of prior Z motion
06:32 PM enleth: gcode generated with F360 with no custom postprocessor changes
06:32 PM enleth: I checked the axis for backlash and there is none I can detect
06:32 PM LeelooMinai: lol, walmart seels welding helmets it seems
06:32 PM LeelooMinai: sells*
06:46 PM LeelooMinai: I read that it's supposed to be included in next linuxcnc debian packageā€¦
06:46 PM chopper79: The biggest reason I am looking is the mill at work that I retrofitted about 3yrs ago is needing some updates and one of the guys who operates it has done nothing but bitch about wanting conversational for the last 4 months. Figured maybe I shut him up a bit by giving him something.
06:47 PM chopper79: And the boss asked me to help make him be quite as well
06:47 PM SpeedEvil: Give him conversational, but only with an alexa interface.
06:47 PM chopper79: lol
06:48 PM chopper79: Spoiled CAT employee that can not even cut his own stock so..... thats what I am dealing with on that
06:49 PM chopper79: Nativecam may be more then he wants to learn also and it is not just point and click like the tormach conversational.
06:50 PM chopper79: with pictures I mean
06:51 PM LeelooMinai: O, I know, I was a bit confused when I could not get the stock to dosplay.
06:52 PM LeelooMinai: Finally managed to get it visible by pressing on some button on linuxcnc that makes it ignore slashes in code or something like that.
06:52 PM LeelooMinai: Then when I was actually runing the code, it would not do anything...
06:52 PM chopper79: Sounds like I might get myself into a mess with this...
06:52 PM LeelooMinai: Until I figured that now I need to unpress that button.
06:53 PM LeelooMinai: And then it was fine. So it was one "trap" that got me, but otherwise it seemed sensible.
07:03 PM LeelooMinai: What is "cheater lens" on a welding helmet?
07:03 PM sync: magnifying glasses
07:03 PM LeelooMinai: A, wait, it's just a magnifier.
07:04 PM LeelooMinai: Wlamart has this for $99 CAD, so $75 or so USD: http://www.lincolnelectric.com/en-us/equipment/welding-gear/Pages/product.aspx?product=K2953-1(LincolnElectric)
07:04 PM LeelooMinai: You think it's ok for a hobby welding with arc?
07:06 PM LeelooMinai: They have TIG rating 10A there - not sure if it's TIG only helmet, but I don't think so.
07:06 PM malcom2073: Remember, with those auto-darkening ones: You get what you pay for. The cheaper they are, oftentimes the slower they are to darken.
07:07 PM LeelooMinai: well, I assume brand like Lincoln would not sell unsafe ones...
07:07 PM LeelooMinai: Seems 100 microseconds to switch
07:07 PM LeelooMinai: And two sensors
07:10 PM sync: the problem with a lot of the low end ones is that they like to flicker at low currents
07:10 PM LeelooMinai: Well, I have also seen glasses for $15... that's another option:)
07:11 PM LeelooMinai: However... I guess using only glasses is not a good idea?
07:12 PM sync: the glasses usually are for gas welding
07:13 PM sync: I find an auto darkening helmet to be useful, I had a cheap one and finally broke down and got a viking 3350
07:13 PM LeelooMinai: Well, wondering if it's better to get $50 normal helmet, or $100 cheap auto-darkening one mostly.
07:14 PM LeelooMinai: Beause I am not buying a $200 helmet if I don't even know if my welding experiment will work.
07:15 PM enleth: OK, there has to be some electrical problem
07:15 PM enleth: I had the mill do a long loop of G0s up and down, just barely touching a piece of stock in the downward position
07:16 PM LeelooMinai: sync: But do you know maybe if that helmet will work with Arc or only Tig?
07:16 PM sync: it doesn't care
07:16 PM LeelooMinai: A, ok
07:16 PM enleth: after 20 repetitions it ended up cutting a small hole into the stock with the endmill, maybe 0.2-0.3mm deep
07:16 PM LeelooMinai: It has some 9-13 adjustment - whatever it is.
07:21 PM sync: the number of the lense
07:21 PM sync: basically the darkness
07:21 PM sync: enleth: tacho slipping? or something like that
07:21 PM LeelooMinai: Is it the same scale as #10 on shades for normal helmets?
07:30 PM sync: yes
07:32 PM enleth: sync: I guess I'll check the coupler
07:32 PM enleth: the error seems to be consistent in one thing only - it's creeping downwards
07:33 PM enleth: I found one guy on cncforums who had a Z axis creep problem on Heidenhain ROD encoders that turned out to be signal noise
07:33 PM LeelooMinai: enleth: I told you few days ago to check the coupler...
07:33 PM enleth: LeelooMinai: jeez, it's not the same axis
07:33 PM enleth: that was Y
07:34 PM enleth: and it had backlash, not drift
07:34 PM LeelooMinai: Yes, well, how about checking couplers on all axis:)
07:35 PM LeelooMinai: Choices, choices... http://www.canadiantire.ca/en/pdp/lincoln-electric-darkfire-autodarkening-welding-helmet-shades-9-13-0580037p.html#srp
07:35 PM LeelooMinai: My nephew could use it on Halloween too:p
07:37 PM enleth: nah, not loose
07:38 PM LeelooMinai: Hmm, if my little welding box has 50 amps - take 3/32 electodes or 1/7 electrodes (E6013)?
07:38 PM LeelooMinai: 1/8*
07:39 PM LeelooMinai: Maybe the thinner ones, 3/32...
07:39 PM roycroft: i would use the 3/32 sticks with that
07:39 PM roycroft: it's pretty wimpy
07:39 PM roycroft: don't push it
07:39 PM LeelooMinai: Right, that was my thought too
07:40 PM roycroft: get yourself a wire brush with a slag chipper while you're at it, if you don't have one
07:40 PM LeelooMinai: Right
07:40 PM roycroft: and do not forget welding gloves
07:41 PM roycroft: if you don't know the duty cycle of that welder assume it's 20%
07:42 PM roycroft: so one minute on, four minutes off
07:42 PM LeelooMinai: http://www.canadiantire.ca/en/pdp/mastercraft-welding-chip-hammer-0589476p.html#srp
07:42 PM LeelooMinai: What is that springy part for?
07:42 PM LeelooMinai: Is that supposed to be just a handle or it does something?
07:43 PM roycroft: yes, it's a handle
07:43 PM LeelooMinai: A, nm: "Shock reducing spiral handle"
07:43 PM roycroft: it absorbs some of the shock while you're chipping away the slag
07:44 PM roycroft: you can get a combination wire brush/chipping hammer with a wooden handle
07:45 PM roycroft: and there are combo units that are metal with the spring handle like that one, but the wire brush part is a replaceable wooden insert
07:48 PM LeelooMinai: Ok, I think I got everything - if I have it all tomorrow, soon I will be able to try welding something. What can go wrong.
08:17 PM Tom_L: while welding, cover everything you don't want sun tanned
08:17 PM enleth: swapped Z and Y interpolators, waiting for a couple dozen G0s to finish
08:18 PM enleth: OK, still creeping
08:19 PM enleth: it's actually somewhat consistent
08:19 PM roycroft: enleth:
08:19 PM roycroft: is it slipping down?
08:19 PM roycroft: or is it not rising back up all the way?
08:21 PM roycroft: if you have an upper limit switch, can you raise it to thare, zero, go down, repeat without creeping down?
08:29 PM enleth: roycroft: I'll do exactly that tomorrow, now I need to mill some more parts that won't really be affected by Z creep
08:30 PM enleth: I mean, I'll have to do a little bit more hand fitting during assembly because of that, not scrap the parts
08:33 PM roycroft: it must suck to have to deal with a creepy mill
08:52 PM X704 is now known as tiwake
08:53 PM LeelooMinai: lol: "Washington (CNN )President Donald Trump suggested his oft-promised border wall could be covered in solar panels in a meeting with congressional leaders"
09:01 PM SpeedEvil: https://3dprint.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/10/GettyImages-476477932-1024x683.jpg CEO looking confused and unsure if this is what he signed up for, holding 3d printed rocket engine.
09:01 PM LeelooMinai: ?
09:02 PM Vitran: No, it's the "its 2 a.m. and we need a photo for the press. K. I'll stand over there. Yeah, sure. Good."
09:03 PM SpeedEvil: :)
09:03 PM LeelooMinai: I guess I am missing the contexct or something...
09:04 PM SpeedEvil: It's arguably more on topic than your post.
09:05 PM SpeedEvil: More seriously - it's a neat 3d printed thingy that's made it possible for them to do things everyone said was impossible at the price
09:05 PM LeelooMinai: SpeedEvil: I am not complaining it is not on topic - just "do not get it" - do you have to assume negatives by default? :)
09:06 PM LeelooMinai: First I thought it's Checy Chase:p
09:06 PM LeelooMinai: Chevy*
09:06 PM Vitran: Here. I'll be almost on topic but also somewhere out in space. Here is the paintball gun innards I am working through. http://i.imgur.com/nk32dau.png
09:07 PM Vitran: Which is what I am rebuilding the Hardinge to machine
09:08 PM Vitran: i just realized. I have been working on making my own paintball gun for over a year
09:08 PM Vitran: dang. time passes fast
09:09 PM LeelooMinai: Vitran: Wonder why - I would think that's million desisnges already on the market by now...
09:09 PM LeelooMinai: that there's*
09:10 PM Vitran: http://www.zdspb.com/tech/misc/animations.html
09:10 PM Vitran: There are hundreds, yes
09:10 PM Vitran: but there have been some big changes over the years. I want to make my own
09:11 PM gregcnc: just because there are a million designs doesn't make them good
09:11 PM Vitran: There is also the open source paintball gun
09:11 PM Vitran: but I don't like autocockers
09:11 PM Vitran: which it is
09:12 PM LeelooMinai: gregcnc: Well, how do you know he wants to make a better gun than all the others even? :)
09:12 PM Vitran: Maybe I want to make a Custom 98?
09:13 PM Vitran: Nah. I want my own and I want it to be awesome
09:13 PM gregcnc: someone put a lot of effort into those animations
09:13 PM Vitran: oh yeah. I have talked to that guy online
09:13 PM Vitran: the website is a treasure trove of info
09:13 PM LeelooMinai: Probably autism/ocd:)
09:14 PM SpeedEvil: Vitran: add 'autoshoot' :)
09:15 PM Vitran: That is surprisingly easy
09:15 PM SpeedEvil: yeah
09:15 PM Vitran: Also this
09:15 PM Vitran: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HoRPWUl_sF8
09:15 PM gregcnc: he appears to produce and sell parts
09:15 PM Vitran: He developed some of his own designs and sells them
09:16 PM gregcnc: no surprise he's looked at many deisgns
09:16 PM Vitran: Well, more improvements to standard markers
09:17 PM LeelooMinai: A, I think now I get it - the solar powered wall will powered those sentry guns...
09:17 PM gregcnc: right, then you need to know the market very well
09:18 PM Vitran: What's funny is the talks about Smart Parts. Smart Parts made a marker far cheaper ($200) that was on par with $1000-$2500 markers, flooded the market and then went bankrupt
09:18 PM Vitran: The marker is the SP Ion
09:18 PM Vitran: The Ion also shut down many other competitors
09:19 PM gregcnc: why did they bankrupt?
09:20 PM Vitran: Their higher end markers that had a larger profit margin were not selling and people slowed down buying the Ions
09:20 PM LeelooMinai: Do those things have any practical use? :)
09:21 PM Vitran: Not really
09:21 PM Vitran: Fun. I play every weekend I can
09:22 PM enleth: roycroft: to be honest, I like this mill very much, it's just got some problems to iron out
09:23 PM Vitran: Supposedly they were originally used by loggers to mark trees.
09:23 PM roycroft: and you still have to move it, don't you?
09:23 PM LeelooMinai: Vitran: lol, ok...
09:24 PM LeelooMinai: logger commando
09:25 PM Vitran: Most of the paintball stuff is now going towards 'Military Simulation' with this sort of stuff https://mcsus.com/
09:25 PM Crom: argh... I've been sewing sticky back Velcro. I now have to takt the bobbin area apart and remove goey stuff.
09:26 PM Crom: Upper thread won't go around the bobbin...
09:26 PM LeelooMinai: Vitran: Cannot say those things excite me... I imediatelly see some neocon military types and it totally turns me off:)
09:27 PM LeelooMinai: Or guys stalking ducks with camuflage paint on their faces:p
09:33 PM Vitran: I see paintball as a straightforward pneumatic mechanism that is challenging. I like straightforward challenges
09:36 PM LeelooMinai: But if it did something interesting in the end, it would be even better.
09:40 PM enleth: roycroft: and a couple truckloads of other stuff
09:43 PM Tom_L: it's getting harder each day to find something OT in here
09:48 PM LeelooMinai: People migrated from IRC to other places long time ago.
09:49 PM LeelooMinai: Most channels barely exist, so I would not hope for tightly focused channels on topic with a lot of participating people and constant stream of valuable information.
09:50 PM Tom_L: i would
09:50 PM LeelooMinai: well, I mean one can hope, but that won't happen:)
09:51 PM Tom_L: i've been on irc quite a while and have seen channels maintain rather well
09:51 PM LeelooMinai: Tried to find fusion360 channel recently, or at least some kind of channel where people talk about CADs, etc. - nopw
09:52 PM Tom_L: i could accept that
09:52 PM LeelooMinai: Forums is the best one can find it seems.
09:52 PM LeelooMinai: I guess most people do not even know what IRC is, so...
09:53 PM Tom_L: let's not tell them
09:53 PM Tom_L: let them stay on facebook, twitter, etc
09:54 PM LeelooMinai: I meant people who have some technical interests:)
10:03 PM * roycroft likes his universe, and shuns facebook/twitter/google/etc.
10:03 PM LeelooMinai: What, no google? What do you use, Bing? :p
10:03 PM roycroft: duck duck go
10:03 PM LeelooMinai: lol
10:04 PM roycroft: which does not keep track of my queries and sell the data to the highest bidder
10:04 PM LeelooMinai: How do you know? :)
10:04 PM roycroft: reputation
10:05 PM LeelooMinai: Not sure if they can match google in terms of resources, quality of searches, etc. - probably not.
10:06 PM roycroft: i'm not willing to give up my privacy/personal data for convenience
10:06 PM LeelooMinai: From what I know google has pretty monstrous hardware and technologies used.
10:06 PM roycroft: i can usually find what i'm looking for
10:07 PM LeelooMinai: Including specialized chips for searches - that is silicon.
10:07 PM roycroft: i don't care
10:07 PM roycroft: i hate big brother government
10:07 PM roycroft: and i hate big brother corporations even more
10:08 PM LeelooMinai: Well, too late now - you are pretty much there whatever you do.
10:08 PM roycroft: do you have to argue about every goddamn thing?
10:08 PM roycroft: you asked me a question
10:08 PM LeelooMinai: And it will get only worse it seems:)
10:08 PM roycroft: i answered it
10:08 PM roycroft: i didn't try to tell you what to do
10:08 PM roycroft: i just told you what i do and why
10:08 PM roycroft: and you start an argument over it
10:09 PM LeelooMinai: lol
10:09 PM Tom_L: omfg stfu
10:09 PM roycroft: i'm not interested in that
10:09 PM roycroft: use what you want
10:09 PM roycroft: i'll use what i want
10:13 PM LeelooMinai: roycroft: No - you have to use Google.
10:21 PM roycroft: does anyone here use dro pros dros?
10:21 PM roycroft: i have a shumatech for my mill/drill, and i like shumatech, but he doesn't make them any more
10:22 PM roycroft: dro pros have some nice features
10:22 PM roycroft: i'm a bit concerned with their "magnetic" scales, as i've no experience with them
10:22 PM roycroft: glass scales are pretty standard
10:23 PM roycroft: the "magnetic scales" are really low profile though
10:38 PM t12: 2