#linuxcnc Logs
Mar 26 2017
#linuxcnc Calendar
12:08 AM XXCoder: whats baltic wood like
12:12 AM roycroft: are you talking about baltic birch plywood?
12:12 AM XXCoder: apparently. isnt that very soft wood?
12:12 AM roycroft: no, birch is a very hard wood
12:13 AM roycroft: baltic birch plywood has a larger number of thinner plies than american plywood
12:13 AM XXCoder: hmm whats name of very soft wood? baltic?
12:13 AM roycroft: and it is void-free
12:13 AM roycroft: balsa wood
12:13 AM XXCoder: ahh balsa
12:13 AM XXCoder: thanks
12:13 AM XXCoder: im thinking on what to get for 12 bucks lol
12:13 AM XXCoder: damned amazing shipping.
12:14 AM XXCoder: i has V bits and spacer nuts in cart (for electrics) but I got no ides for last 12 bucks lol
12:14 AM roycroft: buy a cd
12:14 AM XXCoder: cd of what
12:14 AM roycroft: of whatever music you like but don't have
12:15 AM XXCoder: ah I like [music type not found]
12:15 AM roycroft: or buy a book
12:15 AM roycroft: or a dvd
12:15 AM XXCoder: kinda hard to find
12:16 AM roycroft: i have hundreds of items on wish lists for when i need to fill out an order to get free shipping
12:16 AM XXCoder: bah lol
12:17 AM roycroft: it doesn't help you tonight, but you might consider doing that for the future
12:17 AM roycroft: start building wish lists
12:17 AM XXCoder: maybe I'll just buy one of those wireless machg3 mpog controllers lol
12:17 AM roycroft: you can sort them by price, so it's easy to find something that pushes you right over the free shipping minimum
12:21 AM Crom: bass wood is the name plate wood you get at Michaels
12:22 AM Crom: balsa by definition is a hard wood heh
12:23 AM XXCoder: bamboo has harder wood
12:23 AM XXCoder: some types
12:23 AM XXCoder: I always wanted to have bamboo farm
12:25 AM XXCoder: how is acrylic on milling?
12:25 AM XXCoder: anything special?
12:27 AM XXCoder: what a weord setup https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qyIVZD7rPzM
12:32 AM XXCoder: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VsoJcfAlo8o nice anoizing. was it beach that made homebrew anodizing?
12:47 AM XXCoder: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gm3BWRE6I24 this guy is moron
12:47 AM XXCoder: fingers is not good clamps!
01:01 AM roycroft: b\b b
01:01 AM roycroft: \\\
01:02 AM XXCoder: ?
01:29 AM roycroft: that was one of my cats saying hi
01:29 AM XXCoder: lol ok
01:30 AM roycroft: my macbook pro is in the shop for repair
01:30 AM roycroft: i'm using my old powerbook g4 in the meantime
01:30 AM roycroft: and whenever i turn it off it forgets its network configuration
01:31 AM roycroft: the wpa2 key is really long and difficult to type in
01:31 AM roycroft: so i have been leaving the machine on when even when i'm not using it
01:31 AM roycroft: and that is an invitation to cat dancing
01:32 AM XXCoder: lol
01:32 AM XXCoder: make laptop keyboard cover :)
01:32 AM XXCoder: has cnc roputer? much fast lol
01:32 AM CaptHindsight: better than a fraidycat
01:32 AM roycroft: george dubya bush was president the last time i used this laptop before this weekend
01:32 AM CaptHindsight: er you mean Cheney?
01:32 AM roycroft: i was amazed that it still booted up
01:33 AM CaptHindsight: do the batteries charge?
01:33 AM XXCoder: lol 2003 is when I got my first laptop. still works, though battery is so dead
01:33 AM roycroft: i got this one in '03 or '04
01:36 AM CaptHindsight: I had the laser feedrate at 50k ipm earlier over a ~3" x 3" area
01:38 AM CaptHindsight: I guess I'll be testing the trajectory planners limits vs servo thread period soon
01:38 AM XXCoder: nice
01:41 AM CaptHindsight: I think the new TP looks ahead 50 moves
01:42 AM CaptHindsight: wonder if that could be raised to 100's or even 1K
01:42 AM CaptHindsight: have all the XY moves planned during the Z moves that are 1000 x slower than XY
01:55 AM XXCoder: roycroft: you ever make inlay?
02:10 AM IchGucksLive: morning from grmany
02:11 AM IchGucksLive: CaptHindsight: if there is tiny gcode steps use G64
02:11 AM IchGucksLive: this will speed up your code by 500%
02:12 AM IchGucksLive: XXCoder: still on
02:12 AM XXCoder: yeah
02:12 AM IchGucksLive: acrylic is good as you go for PC
02:12 AM IchGucksLive: names Makrolon
02:12 AM XXCoder: g64 isnt that turn on slight flex so it can run constantly, meaning much faster
02:12 AM IchGucksLive: if you ar on PMMA
02:12 AM IchGucksLive: it is a miss
02:13 AM XXCoder: I have a problem heh im trying to make an inlay
02:13 AM IchGucksLive: XXCoder: yes it is and the flex is your choice
02:13 AM XXCoder: I have made gcode to carve inside
02:13 AM IchGucksLive: inlay is bst on CRC
02:13 AM IchGucksLive: best
02:13 AM XXCoder: I have made one to carve outside
02:14 AM XXCoder: but I has no idea how to remove surrounding areas so it can be put together
02:14 AM IchGucksLive: the outside part to get into the inlay must ofcause be milled first
02:14 AM IchGucksLive: give me a idee on the look like
02:15 AM XXCoder: http://thecraftchop.com/files/images/signforlove.svg
02:15 AM XXCoder: I want black areas to be inlay
02:15 AM IchGucksLive: if it is not Tippy Toppy
02:15 AM XXCoder: I just realized my design error, it wouldnt fit together. im still not sure how to make inside areas (black area)
02:16 AM IchGucksLive: is it Acrylic
02:16 AM XXCoder: im using 90 degree tool
02:16 AM XXCoder: nah wood
02:16 AM IchGucksLive: Why Not yust black color
02:16 AM IchGucksLive: let me move 25steps down to grep a part
02:16 AM XXCoder: sure im just wanting to challenge. but yure right
02:17 AM IchGucksLive: the su is out so the parts outside the house are also a consider
02:17 AM IchGucksLive: 2min
02:20 AM IchGucksLive: image taken processing
02:22 AM IchGucksLive: processed uploading
02:23 AM IchGucksLive: XXCoder: http://heimwerkermarkt-tretter.de/hs_2.jpg
02:23 AM IchGucksLive: the sparkles are from sand storm
02:23 AM XXCoder: yeah mine looks great so far
02:23 AM XXCoder: just thinking on what to do atm
02:23 AM IchGucksLive: HOW to
02:24 AM IchGucksLive: first make the shit with Transparent coad
02:24 AM IchGucksLive: then mill
02:24 AM IchGucksLive: then black out
02:24 AM XXCoder: transarent coad?
02:24 AM IchGucksLive: and then get the upper code off
02:25 AM IchGucksLive: Clear lacquer
02:25 AM IchGucksLive: otherwise the inlay color will submurge to the outside
02:26 AM IchGucksLive: this are signes for the Nature Rock monoments
02:26 AM IchGucksLive: so i use concrete color to sees
02:26 AM IchGucksLive: seel
02:26 AM Deejay: moin
02:26 AM XXCoder: ahh
02:27 AM XXCoder: right now im just playing arpund with floor wood samples lol
02:27 AM XXCoder: so if it goes screwy its fine
02:27 AM IchGucksLive: then use the primer
02:27 AM IchGucksLive: as they are watersealed already
02:29 AM IchGucksLive: impregnation
02:29 AM XXCoder: makes sense
02:29 AM IchGucksLive: it is also a cool effect on masking your side way
02:29 AM XXCoder: think ill just do engrave now
02:29 AM XXCoder: but I do want try inlays later
02:29 AM IchGucksLive: so if it Rains and only then you got a cool painting on it
02:31 AM IchGucksLive: its very rare so it is a start up in the USA
02:33 AM XXCoder: allright looks like I got it
02:33 AM XXCoder: I got 4 nice clampos
02:33 AM XXCoder: new 90 degree cutter
02:34 AM IchGucksLive: ther are cheep ones
02:36 AM XXCoder: it is
02:36 AM XXCoder: brb going to my linuxcnc computer
02:37 AM IchGucksLive: bye
02:39 AM MacGalempsy: hello folks
02:40 AM IchGucksLive: morning MacGalempsy
02:41 AM MacGalempsy: IchGucksLive: any fun planned for today
02:42 AM IchGucksLive: lets see when the grandchildren arrive
02:42 AM IchGucksLive: coder is on a cool wood carving
02:42 AM IchGucksLive: look in the docs
02:42 AM xxcodercnc: IchGucksLive: yo
02:42 AM IchGucksLive: as we speek his cnc arrives
02:43 AM IchGucksLive: dont break the bit
02:43 AM IchGucksLive: the color lady woud do that on a 0,2mm bit in 5mm width
02:43 AM MacGalempsy: ah. all the cnc stuff arrived?
02:44 AM xxcodercnc: homing
02:44 AM IchGucksLive: i miss one part since 3month
02:44 AM IchGucksLive: as the one education school do not own a lathe it is a miss to get nuts on D40mm
02:45 AM IchGucksLive: using ready made https://www.dold-mechatronik.de/Rotgussmutter-mit-Gehaeuse-einbaufertig
02:46 AM IchGucksLive: MacGalempsy: Coad still not dry from Yesterday http://heimwerkermarkt-tretter.de/hs_2.jpg
02:47 AM IchGucksLive: http://heimwerkermarkt-tretter.de/hs.jpg without coad for bio reserve
02:47 AM MacGalempsy: those look great
02:51 AM xxcodercnc: dry running it
02:51 AM IchGucksLive: dont forget cooling on dry ru
02:51 AM xxcodercnc: i had changed from 1200 mm/m to 800 but it didbnt save
02:51 AM IchGucksLive: it may start fire
02:51 AM xxcodercnc: no cooling system sadly
02:53 AM IchGucksLive: XXCoder what is the partsize going to be
02:54 AM xxcodercnc: not very large
02:54 AM xxcodercnc: entire stock is 102mm x 127mm
02:55 AM xxcodercnc: the decal is covering 75% area approx
02:55 AM IchGucksLive: let me start a sim
03:01 AM MacGalempsy: ah yes. the sim.
03:05 AM xxcodercnc: how goes sim heh
03:10 AM IchGucksLive: camotics is not simulating today
03:11 AM IchGucksLive: let me restart f wine did somthing
03:13 AM xxcodercnc: i use linuxcnc directly for sim on my home omputer :)
03:18 AM IchGucksLive: hi back
03:19 AM IchGucksLive: i dinont know but sim is off today
03:19 AM xxcodercnc: hmm ok
03:19 AM IchGucksLive: 2 more min
03:23 AM xxcodercnc: setup almost done
03:25 AM IchGucksLive: no not getting it this morning
03:25 AM IchGucksLive: the setup of camotics is influenced by wine
03:25 AM xxcodercnc: oh well
03:25 AM xxcodercnc: theres linux camotics
03:35 AM IchGucksLive: http://pasteall.org/pic/index.php?id=113917
03:35 AM IchGucksLive: i got it
03:36 AM xxcodercnc: looiks great
03:36 AM IchGucksLive: why the hell is wine influencing camotics steeing
03:36 AM IchGucksLive: settings
03:37 AM xxcodercnc: no idea its supposely pure linux
03:37 AM xxcodercnc: with windows port and such
03:37 AM xxcodercnc: unless theyre cheating and using windows only with checks with wine compitabilioty
03:43 AM IchGucksLive: ok im off will look at your mill outcome
03:58 AM xxcodercnc: well
03:59 AM xxcodercnc: first successful run. from design to part
03:59 AM xxcodercnc: only error was me misunderstanding what font engrave works, so that is little deeper than i expected
03:59 AM xxcodercnc: butr know what it looks cooler. im keeping it that way LOL
04:00 AM xxcodercnc: unsetting now, will upload video after i go to comp0uter and edit it
04:01 AM MacGalempsy: u making money yet?
04:01 AM xxcodercnc: not yet lol its a successful hobby not business :P
04:08 AM XXCoder: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x3cW-aKK1ic
04:08 AM XXCoder: crazy!!
04:13 AM Deejay: plunging hard into the wood :/
04:13 AM XXCoder: and moving like part arent there
04:14 AM Deejay: hehe
04:14 AM XXCoder: while machine wont notice wood, wood might break or pop off. :P
04:14 AM MacGalempsy: whats so crazy
04:15 AM MacGalempsy: is that a vacuum table?
04:15 AM XXCoder: no idea
04:15 AM Deejay: that the same (vacuum)
04:15 AM Deejay: *thought
04:15 AM MacGalempsy: the one i wanted to see was the sawblade running on that machine making the giant lego
04:16 AM XXCoder: that video was awesome
04:16 AM MacGalempsy: they had a verticle and horizontal circular saw
04:16 AM XXCoder: making lego brick out of quite large wood block
04:17 AM MacGalempsy: they do string instruments at my dad's work
04:18 AM MacGalempsy: cnc the tops and the holes in mandolins and archtop guitars
04:18 AM XXCoder: program name "openshot"
04:18 AM XXCoder: like gunshot out in open
04:19 AM XXCoder: stupid https://discuss-assets.s3.amazonaws.com/444372b7a794902d2c06f199f486455c2dd74f2a72b1.jpg
04:19 AM XXCoder: I suppose theres some kinda sounbd based pun
04:22 AM MacGalempsy: stupid, but they probably sell a few to hipstere
04:22 AM MacGalempsy: *s
04:28 AM XXCoder: yeah
04:28 AM XXCoder: I still find it so dang ironic about them its self expression
04:28 AM XXCoder: and they are mostly same
04:28 AM XXCoder: same glasses same pants so on
04:36 AM XXCoder: I'm unable to connect phone to usb and access files
04:37 AM XXCoder: and now it works
04:37 AM XXCoder: knew that if I complained it woulf solve itself
04:40 AM MacGalempsy: try a diff. port?
04:40 AM XXCoder: heh read what I said :)
04:45 AM XXCoder: editing video. fun :P
04:47 AM XXCoder: jt youre in time lol
04:49 AM XXCoder: jt youre in time lol
04:49 AM Deejay: i can see you - twice :) \o/
04:51 AM * XXCoder breaks into song to while out time of video export
04:51 AM XXCoder: :P
04:52 AM JT-Mobile: morning
04:52 AM XXCoder: whats up
04:52 AM JT-Mobile: getting ready to head home
04:52 AM XXCoder: I just finished making video
04:53 AM XXCoder: just waiting for export to be done, then youtube :P
04:53 AM XXCoder: yay youtube time
04:56 AM XXCoder: 50% uploading. I hope I dont acciently click yes on that brainkilled "stabilizing video"
04:59 AM XXCoder: https://youtu.be/xF8erDoJlsY
04:59 AM XXCoder: done :)
04:59 AM XXCoder: sorry on bad shaking on first part
05:01 AM Deejay: yay, looks nice
05:01 AM XXCoder: I need to understand estlcam font engraving settings but glad it turned out good also
05:02 AM XXCoder: I checked return to 0,0,5 mm and found it would have hit clamp, so I modified program to rise 10 mm not just 5. so didnt hit yay
05:03 AM XXCoder: Deejay: you can see tachmeter on spindle
05:03 AM XXCoder: its not used yet
05:06 AM XXCoder: oh yeah
05:07 AM XXCoder: Deejay: I left rapid at 10% :P
05:07 AM XXCoder: thats why its so slow moving spot to spot
05:08 AM JT-Mobile: cool did you make the clamps
05:09 AM XXCoder: nah
05:09 AM XXCoder: I couldnt make em without good clamops
05:09 AM XXCoder: so I decided just buy 4, make more
05:19 AM XXCoder: this is cool feature. https://youtu.be/gn9PXGsnreg?t=409
05:19 AM JT-Mobile: see you back at the house
05:19 AM Deejay: yeah, at the end, its moving somewhat slow for my impression ;)
05:19 AM Deejay: not millig, but slow as heck ;)
05:19 AM XXCoder: yeah
05:20 AM XXCoder: estlcam has threading?? weird
05:20 AM XXCoder: not tap
05:20 AM XXCoder: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xO-GHEIIOQQ
05:23 AM XXCoder: I love the foam demo
05:42 AM XXCoder: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SVIecDQRWgk nice
06:05 AM XXCoder: stone milling wow
06:05 AM XXCoder: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pxPEWbx-Qs0
06:33 AM XXCoder: nice
06:34 AM XXCoder: estlcam can make any 3d model
06:34 AM XXCoder: im looking at avocodoboat ngc program
06:38 AM XXCoder: just pone problem, my machine isnt tall enough for it lol
06:51 AM Deejay: seems if he just whorls water ;)
06:51 AM XXCoder: its a boat for avocodo seed
06:52 AM XXCoder: avocodo has this annoying requirement to be half in water half outside for weeks
06:52 AM XXCoder: then it finally germinates
06:52 AM XXCoder: so boat helps by holding seed right way, and it lowers with water level.
06:52 AM XXCoder: so its always halfway in water
09:39 AM {HD}: XXCoder: are you starting an avocado farm?
09:40 AM {HD}: I sprouted one once but then I realized that you need a subtropical climate which, I do not have.
09:44 AM R2E4_bevins1: morn'in, afternoon, evening....
10:43 AM {HD}: Where would/could I buy bearings that are 10+' long?
10:43 AM archivist: what kind
10:45 AM archivist: often something of a non stock size you make or get made or join others in series
10:58 AM IchGucksLive: hi
10:58 AM IchGucksLive: XXCoder:
10:58 AM IchGucksLive: did you get the wood carve
11:00 AM IchGucksLive: lookin the Vid you made
11:03 AM IchGucksLive: XXCoder: Estlcam got the option to stop over the last position not on the part Zero
11:07 AM IchGucksLive: commented your vid ;-)
11:07 AM IchGucksLive: back later
11:08 AM zeeshan: the internert drives me insane sometimes with the amount of nonsense out there
11:08 AM zeeshan: this is what happens when the whole world is on there :[
11:10 AM malcom2073: The internet is bad
11:10 AM malcom2073: mkay?
11:10 AM malcom2073: It should only be used for youtubing machining videos, music, and IRC.
11:11 AM malcom2073: Hey zee, I've figured out what my next project is gonna be: eddy brake.
11:11 AM zeeshan: like on car dynos?
11:12 AM malcom2073: Yeah, starting really small though, like 1-5hp motors, then scaling up
11:12 AM malcom2073: Want to try my hand at winding electromagnets, figured this is a good way to play around withit
11:12 AM zeeshan: nice
11:13 AM zeeshan: will be fun :D
11:13 AM archivist: and hot
11:13 AM malcom2073: The math is well beyond me, so I'm doing the trial and error approach. Nice things about electromagnets is they're fairly easy to toy with. Not powerful enough? Increase either turns, or amps
11:14 AM malcom2073: archivist: Good excuse to use my mill to turn an aluminum disc into a air turbine wheel :-D
11:14 AM sync_: the maths is not really difficult
11:14 AM sync_: calculating the braking torque, moreso
11:14 AM * {HD} ponders...
11:15 AM rebecca: did someone say turning an aluminium disc into something? http://imgur.com/a/xSZuB
11:16 AM archivist: there was probably one on a machine I saw a few years ago on a blanking press, sales droid set it to full speed and then pressed the stop button, the stop was as instant as one can tell by ear or eye
11:16 AM malcom2073: Nice heh
11:16 AM malcom2073: archivist: It's a pretty cool technology, and pretty simpel
11:16 AM malcom2073: simple*
11:18 AM rebecca: eddy brakes are fascinating
11:19 AM malcom2073: I also have a convenient source of 5hp, 10hp and 550hp sitting on stands in my garage, that I can play with
11:19 AM malcom2073: I've wanted to get a full size engine running on the stand for years, never had a good excuse
11:21 AM rebecca: malcom2073: combustion engines?
11:21 AM malcom2073: rebecca: yeah
11:21 AM archivist: I fired up my "little" engine the other day, made a bit of noise
11:21 AM rebecca: ahhh... just coz? or they have a practical function?
11:23 AM malcom2073: The 5 and and 10hp were generators, both had fried stators so I've yet to find another use for them. The big one is a racecar motor I built a couple years back and never got around to putting in a car
11:23 AM archivist: my toy generator http://www.collection.archivist.info/searchv13.php?searchstr=perkins+PD+generator
11:24 AM malcom2073: Haha, your generator puts mine to shame
11:24 AM archivist: 60A 3phase 440v
11:24 AM malcom2073: Diesel, nice
11:25 AM malcom2073: I'd love to get somethign that size... someday
11:25 AM malcom2073: Biggest one I have is only 3kw
11:25 AM archivist: I got volts out of it even after being outside so long
11:25 AM rebecca: archivist: build a matching tesla coil for it!
11:26 AM archivist: that would be naughty
11:26 AM malcom2073: Gloriously so
11:26 AM rebecca: hehe
11:26 AM malcom2073: Neighbors won't complain about the generator noise then ;)
11:26 AM archivist: looking at restoring the electrical panel and selling
11:53 AM zeeshan: im taking this industrial design class
11:54 AM zeeshan: in 2 weeks i need to come up with a working prototype for something "camping" related
11:54 AM zeeshan: i dunno wtf to make
11:54 AM zeeshan: all the power generating devices seem to me well established
11:54 AM SpeedEvil: zeeshan: quadcopter campfire.
11:54 AM zeeshan: lol
11:54 AM zeeshan: whats that
11:55 AM zeeshan: i was thinking of a way to heat my truck cap
11:55 AM zeeshan: with a campfire..
11:55 AM SpeedEvil: Collects wood for campfire, and then detonates the lithium batteries to ignite.
11:55 AM zeeshan: that way you save on the fuel being burned
11:55 AM zeeshan: lol
11:55 AM archivist: solar powered quadcoptor cam night light
11:55 AM zeeshan: archivist: rofl
11:55 AM archivist: camp
11:55 AM zeeshan: they have that stove light
11:56 AM archivist: may need large battery
11:56 AM SpeedEvil: archivist: I was watching a solar powered helicopter on mars video the other day
11:56 AM zeeshan: that is powered using a TEG
11:56 AM SpeedEvil: 2-3 min flight per day, 1kg, 1.1m rotor diameter, ~200W flight
11:56 AM zeeshan: they were thinking of something along the lines of gravity light
11:56 AM SpeedEvil: 600m range
11:56 AM SpeedEvil: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w3y7iJEe7uM
11:56 AM archivist: or any impractical dream as its a design class
11:57 AM zeeshan: the gravity light is a proven concept tho
11:57 AM zeeshan: you hang the light
11:57 AM zeeshan: put some stones (12kg) in a bag
11:57 AM zeeshan: and drop
11:57 AM SpeedEvil: mgh sucks though
11:57 AM zeeshan: it charges the battery
11:57 AM zeeshan: which powers the light
11:57 AM zeeshan: no need for batteries..
11:57 AM archivist: which is a mere glimmer
11:58 AM SpeedEvil: AA battery + solar is a lot better in practice
11:58 AM zeeshan: http://www.impacthound.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/08/gravitylightspecs.png
11:58 AM SpeedEvil: I trust an AA eneloop cell + solar a hell of a lot more than gearbox and weight to carry a lot of weight
11:59 AM SpeedEvil: http://www.banggood.com/Astrolux-A01-Nichia-219B-102LM-AAA-Mini-Waterproof-Keychain-EDC-LED-Flashlight-p-1026854.html - I have, which is great
11:59 AM SpeedEvil: It has ~100 hour, 1 hour, and 10 hour rates.
11:59 AM archivist: what an over sized chain, someone never looked at a clock barrel
11:59 AM zeeshan: archivist: youre right
11:59 AM zeeshan: the old wind up clocks were better!
12:00 PM zeeshan: i dont care what it is
12:00 PM zeeshan: i just wanna get this done
12:00 PM zeeshan: this is the last class for my masters
12:00 PM zeeshan: need to GTFO
12:00 PM zeeshan: ASAP
12:00 PM zeeshan: lol
12:00 PM archivist: wind up radio is now an old idea
12:00 PM zeeshan: the other thing i was thinking was a kinetic energy generator
12:00 PM zeeshan: but better than the ones that are out there right now
12:00 PM SpeedEvil: zeeshan: wind-up astrolabe.
12:00 PM zeeshan: they only rely on linear motion
12:00 PM zeeshan: i was thinking some how using a gyro to harness the energy in all directions?
12:01 PM zeeshan: since im not savvy enough to generate directly from a gyro
12:01 PM zeeshan: i was thinking the gyro would some how convert motions to linear
12:01 PM zeeshan: in two different directions
12:01 PM archivist: you still have to spin it up, use the winding as the source
12:01 PM zeeshan: i dunno ;p
12:01 PM SpeedEvil: you would in principle use the spinning gyro, and attach it to a gimbal, and then gear from the gimbal axes to something faster
12:01 PM SpeedEvil: I question if it is ever going to be plausible.
12:02 PM archivist: the wind up torch I got was useless
12:02 PM SpeedEvil: It would be really amusing if you could do a generator which runs off the earths rotation.
12:02 PM zeeshan: the project they were the most impressed with
12:02 PM zeeshan: was the stove light
12:02 PM zeeshan: it sits on a wood stove, and turns on using a peltier
12:02 PM SpeedEvil: Such is technically feasible but a mechanical impracticallity
12:02 PM zeeshan: and it works damn well
12:02 PM SpeedEvil: Until it's overheated
12:02 PM zeeshan: lol SpeedEvil
12:02 PM zeeshan: 2 weeks man!
12:02 PM zeeshan: i aint harnessing the power of the earth in that time :)
12:03 PM SpeedEvil: zeeshan: maglev bearing, few tons rotating at a thousand RPM, and you should be good.
12:03 PM archivist: there is a limit before the peltiers die in the fire
12:03 PM zeeshan: what about a wind up device
12:03 PM zeeshan: that goes between two trees?
12:03 PM SpeedEvil: A hammock.
12:03 PM SpeedEvil: Internet of springs.
12:03 PM zeeshan: lol
12:03 PM SpeedEvil: A wifi controllable spring.
12:04 PM zeeshan: what if i mount two linear transducers
12:04 PM zeeshan: in a gyroscope
12:04 PM SpeedEvil: A guillotine that automatically blood and tissue types the person and stores the organs.
12:04 PM zeeshan: ?!?!
12:07 PM zeeshan: so the transducer is a shaft and the axis of the gyro
12:07 PM archivist: zeeshan, the sequet barrel here wont let the light go out while winding http://www.collection.archivist.info/searchv13.php?searchstr=PD+webb+clock
12:07 PM zeeshan: archivist: what is that
12:07 PM zeeshan: a clock?
12:07 PM archivist: yes is a clock, customer made his own escapement I did that part
12:07 PM archivist: there are gears in the barrel to maintain power during winding
12:07 PM zeeshan: clocks are too complex for me :)
12:07 PM zeeshan: i just googled escapement
12:07 PM zeeshan: theres like 2908320982893 versions
12:07 PM SpeedEvil: zeeshan: what is your course in?
12:07 PM archivist: its just a weight and in out shafts and a rope+weight
12:07 PM zeeshan: the double three leggedf gravity escapement looks useful tho
12:07 PM zeeshan: for automation uses :)
12:08 PM zeeshan: SpeedEvil: industrial design
12:08 PM archivist: the clock did get a gravity escapement
12:09 PM SpeedEvil: zeeshan: rethink the paradigms! http://imgur.com/gallery/cJZkP
12:15 PM zeeshan: what about a peltier blanket
12:15 PM zeeshan: that wraps around your exhaust after the cat
12:15 PM zeeshan: so the exhaust isnt stupid hot
12:15 PM zeeshan: to damage the pelts
12:15 PM SpeedEvil: Adds very significant weight
12:15 PM zeeshan: but enough to generate electricity
12:15 PM SpeedEvil: and unreliability
12:16 PM zeeshan: okay what about using it around a camp fire
12:16 PM zeeshan: :D
12:16 PM zeeshan: i feel like you'd need a like a container filled with water or something
12:16 PM archivist: the average drunk cannot even keep themselves out the fire let alone something than can be heat damaged
12:16 PM zeeshan: and the peltiers would be all on the outside
12:17 PM archivist: I have seen a drunk pulled from camp fire :)
12:17 PM zeeshan: lol
12:17 PM archivist: he was steaming a bit
12:17 PM zeeshan: i really feel like campfires can be exploited
12:17 PM zeeshan: cause most of the heat is wasted
12:18 PM zeeshan: i always think that every time im up north camping
12:18 PM zeeshan: "man thats a lot of wasted heat"
12:18 PM zeeshan: even a small camp fire
12:18 PM zeeshan: for food..
12:18 PM archivist: problem is scale and the average idiot
12:18 PM SpeedEvil: The best way to exploit a campfire efficiently is to put the fuel in a proper stove of some form
12:18 PM SpeedEvil: This can reduce fuel consumption a hundredfold or more
12:19 PM zeeshan: https://i.ytimg.com/vi/Lk-YAEFnnpo/maxresdefault.jpg
12:19 PM zeeshan: theres a guy who makes this
12:19 PM zeeshan: you stuff some wood in there
12:19 PM zeeshan: light it up
12:19 PM zeeshan: its basically a stainless steel portable fire stove
12:19 PM SpeedEvil: zeeshan: now you are making me looka at my recent delivery of 1.6mm SS offcuts
12:19 PM zeeshan: :)
12:20 PM zeeshan: SpeedEvil: i think its an excellent idea
12:20 PM zeeshan: to have a portable stove
12:20 PM zeeshan: but i dont like the idea of ss fo rit
12:20 PM zeeshan: it should be something lighter. like titanium
12:20 PM SpeedEvil: Magnesium is lighter.
12:20 PM zeeshan: magnesium will also blow up :D
12:20 PM zeeshan: titanium isnt too far off from blowing up either tho
12:20 PM archivist: and will light the area rather better
12:21 PM zeeshan: interesting
12:21 PM zeeshan: titanium actually has a higher melting point than SS.
12:21 PM archivist: use old magnesium clutch housings for lols
12:21 PM zeeshan: damn it
12:21 PM zeeshan: theyh already make a titanium version
12:21 PM zeeshan: :(
12:21 PM zeeshan: http://www.fireboxstove.com/combo-kits/3-inch-titanium-folding-firebox-nano
12:22 PM zeeshan: how can i beat that!!!!!!!
12:22 PM archivist: that is only nano, make a mega
12:22 PM zeeshan: i also dont like the design of it
12:22 PM zeeshan: maybe i can improve it?
12:22 PM zeeshan: problem solved?!
12:23 PM zeeshan: im gonna put a bunch of copper tubing on one side
12:23 PM zeeshan: connected to a peltier :p
12:23 PM zeeshan: OR
12:23 PM zeeshan: use a thermal generator
12:23 PM zeeshan: to run a fan which makes the fire more efficient?
12:27 PM archivist: heatpipe
12:27 PM archivist: mix all the buzzwords
12:29 PM zeeshan: rofl
12:29 PM zeeshan: heat pipes scare me
12:29 PM zeeshan: dont they usually have some nasty working fluid
12:30 PM zeeshan: like ammonia or r134a
12:30 PM zeeshan: omfg
12:30 PM zeeshan: i think i got something new!
12:31 PM zeeshan: changing the fire box shape
12:31 PM zeeshan: to a V shape
12:31 PM zeeshan: survival 101
12:31 PM zeeshan: the self feeding fire. you take 4 logs and put them in a V shape (30 degree angle from the ground)
12:31 PM zeeshan: then you stack logs on the v and set the vertex logs on fire
12:31 PM zeeshan: as they burn, the logs self draw
12:32 PM zeeshan: i can do this!
12:32 PM IchGucksLive: hi
12:32 PM archivist: er self feeding is old hat
12:34 PM zeeshan: yes
12:34 PM zeeshan: but not in a fire box
12:34 PM archivist: and in a fire box, jymm linked one a few weeks ago
12:36 PM zeeshan: link
12:37 PM archivist: google images "self feeding rocket stove"
12:37 PM zeeshan: doesnt look portable to me
12:37 PM zeeshan: isnt titanium either
12:37 PM zeeshan: :)
12:37 PM archivist: well use a lighter metal and make it foldable
12:38 PM zeeshan: there you go
12:38 PM zeeshan: consumer product development
12:38 PM zeeshan: i will give earnings to you and SpeedEvil for first 5 sales
12:38 PM zeeshan: :-)
12:38 PM archivist: but in other respects old tech :)
12:38 PM zeeshan: well thats the thing man
12:38 PM zeeshan: a lot of old things are coming back again
12:38 PM zeeshan: because we have newer manufacturing techniques
12:38 PM zeeshan: and materials
12:38 PM zeeshan: like the stirling engine could benefit so much by using ceramics
12:39 PM * archivist wanders off to patent the wheel
12:39 PM zeeshan: so rather than reinventing the wheel
12:39 PM zeeshan: it's better just to see how to improve old tech
12:39 PM zeeshan: and guess wha tyou get a new product
12:39 PM zeeshan: like that folding bow saw
12:39 PM zeeshan: bow saws have been around for as old as the bronze age
12:39 PM zeeshan: yet these guys made it all foldable, and sell it for a price for $70
12:39 PM zeeshan: and its a damn good product!
12:40 PM archivist: there are so many re inventions worse than the old tech
12:40 PM zeeshan: it's something im considering buying
12:40 PM zeeshan: i agree
12:40 PM zeeshan: but a few are damn good
12:40 PM zeeshan: https://agawacanyoninc.com/pages/how-to
12:40 PM archivist: in collecting adjustable spanners I see quite a few bad designs crop up
12:40 PM zeeshan: you have to admit
12:41 PM zeeshan: this saw is pretty ingeneous
12:41 PM zeeshan: they took an old ass tool and made it way better for camping purposes
12:48 PM CaptHindsight: IchGucksLive: CAM and optimization is another story. The main speedup is not having Linuxcnc close the servo loop for the galvos
12:50 PM CaptHindsight: the galvo amps perform that, they just take the position info ...
12:50 PM IchGucksLive: did not work with servos till uptime
12:51 PM CaptHindsight: the amps only can work so fast so you just need to find out how fast you can push them until they can't keep up, and stay under that rate
12:52 PM zeeshan: archivist: buy any hilger watts tools lately?
12:52 PM zeeshan: a frigging youtuber in the states has made them famous here
12:52 PM zeeshan: meaning ebay prices have spiked.
12:54 PM IchGucksLive: zeeshan: what tools are this
12:54 PM zeeshan: inclinometers, levels
12:56 PM IchGucksLive: so the cool stuff
12:57 PM SpeedEvil: I have a TB103
12:57 PM archivist: zeeshan, mebe
12:57 PM SpeedEvil: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Hilger-Watts-90-Degree-Clinometer-TB103-1-/132103899572 (though in better condition)
12:58 PM archivist: I snagged another one as well :)
12:58 PM zeeshan: you use the inclinometers
12:58 PM zeeshan: to check the condition of a surface plate right?
12:58 PM archivist: cheaper to get a whole one than buy a replacement bubble
12:58 PM SpeedEvil: I use them to setup my hammock.
12:58 PM zeeshan: theres a mirror on the other side?
12:58 PM zeeshan: SpeedEvil: rofl
12:59 PM archivist: I used mine to set the column square
12:59 PM archivist: it was also used to set a set of stairs parallel :)
12:59 PM zeeshan: rofl
12:59 PM zeeshan: damn machinists!
12:59 PM archivist: that was entertaining
01:00 PM zeeshan: http://www.fowlerprecision.com/Products/Electronic-Levels/548952500.html
01:00 PM zeeshan: modern stuff
01:00 PM archivist: iirc we got then to 19 secs or better
01:01 PM * archivist giggles at the fowler write up
01:01 PM SpeedEvil: http://www.fowlerprecision.com/Products/Electronic-Levels/548952500.html
01:01 PM SpeedEvil: • Wyler Levelsoft software
01:02 PM SpeedEvil: Any bets that this already is not running well due to not being updated?
01:02 PM archivist: I can see people moving about on the floor and it bending thus the plate moving
01:03 PM SpeedEvil: http://www.fowlerprecision.com/Products/Software/548207910.html - I am amused by the entire lack of mentioning the OS
01:04 PM archivist: the feet on the latest level look like they have been "cleaned" by an antique dealer, need some refinishing and setting up
01:04 PM zeeshan: jesus
01:04 PM zeeshan: its only 16,550$
01:05 PM SpeedEvil: http://www.fowlerprecision.com/Downloads/Support-Files/ , with file titles like 'IBR USB 2000 XP' does not raise confidence
01:05 PM SpeedEvil: hah
01:05 PM SpeedEvil: and the google play app for one thing not being available in my country
01:09 PM IchGucksLive: i will close down for some minutes
01:35 PM Wolf_: I’m still trying to find a manual for my old “fowler” height gage
01:46 PM IchGucksLive: Gn8
02:30 PM enleth: Still looking for someone in the US who could hold onto a servo drive for me while I look for a buyer. Anyone?
02:30 PM zeeshan: what kind of servo drive?
02:30 PM enleth: (Bosch Z15-1A, almost unmarketable in Europe but several sell every quarter in the US)
02:31 PM enleth: A friend is flying to US tomorrow, but they'd need to pass it to someone local, no way I'd find a buyer in a week.
02:35 PM enleth: Basically I need someone to get the package, then hold onto it for a couple of weeks/months, then slap a new address label on it and drop it off at the post office. Obviously I'm covering all shipping and a couple beers for the trouble.
02:36 PM enleth: Those drives sell for $200, which makes it worth the hassle, I think.
02:37 PM zeeshan: i sold mine
02:37 PM zeeshan: tr15 drives..
02:37 PM zeeshan: Too bad hes not coming to Canada
02:37 PM zeeshan: Id help you out
02:38 PM enleth: are USPS parcel rates from US to Canada significantly higher than within US?
02:39 PM zeeshan: us has flat box
02:39 PM zeeshan: which cant be beat
02:39 PM zeeshan: flat rate boxes i mean
02:44 PM enleth: yeah, looks like $45 to Canada, doesn't make sense
02:49 PM enleth: that's $13.60 (flat rate Medium Box) within the US
02:52 PM SpeedEvil: The international ones to the UK went way up since a few years ago
02:52 PM enleth: at least there's an ocean in the way, so it's kind of reasonable that it might be expensive
02:55 PM enleth: BTW, I wonder whether anyone ever tried shipping a solid block of lead that fits exactly into the flat rate box
02:56 PM SpeedEvil: Or W
02:57 PM sync_: most probably
02:59 PM enleth: considering that it's the first thing I though of when I saw the "no weight limit" note, and it's the US, where people actually do have a common use for lead, it must have been done, if only to see what happens
03:02 PM SpeedEvil: I have had a block of carbon that about filled one shipped to me
03:02 PM SpeedEvil: though it was foam
03:10 PM CaptHindsight: plus you'd have to add the customs duty onto the shipping into Canada
03:11 PM CaptHindsight: insurance on flat rate is another few $ if it's over $50 in value
03:13 PM jym: USPS is real picky about packaging and insurance claims.
03:13 PM CaptHindsight: which the online shipping rate and time calculators conveniently leave out
03:14 PM enleth: of my math is correct, a Flat Rate Medium Box would hold about 90kg/200lbs of lead
03:15 PM CaptHindsight: please describe how the item was packed: 1/4" thick walled titanium box with bubble wrap inside flat rate box
03:15 PM enleth: I suppose the postman would be royally pissed by that
03:15 PM CaptHindsight: I bet it would not make it out of the post office
03:16 PM CaptHindsight: it would get dropped
03:16 PM CaptHindsight: and the flimsy box would tear
03:16 PM enleth: and then it would stay in the basement
03:16 PM CaptHindsight: the flat rate boxes are near paper thin
03:16 PM jym: enleth: USPS Priotity mail is flat rate to 75 lbs, so I think just making HEAVY on the outside should do the trick
03:16 PM jym: marking*
03:16 PM enleth: CaptHindsight: you could glue it on all sides
03:17 PM CaptHindsight: we have to double box anything that might break if it's close to the size of the box
03:17 PM enleth: jym: I'd expect it to arrive with "NO SHIT!?" added next to that
03:17 PM jym: Anyone know about gas pip/gas fittings?
03:17 PM jym: enleth: lmao, maybe =)
03:18 PM jym: enleth: ..but as ong as it arrived, who cares =)
03:18 PM CaptHindsight: jym: they re generally considered inedible
03:18 PM jym: CaptHindsight: awwwww
03:18 PM CaptHindsight: also not good presents for Mothers Day or wedding anniversaries
03:20 PM jym: I need to go from (I believe) 1/2" pipe, to shutoff valve, to quick release, to 50ft hose, to propane heater. All low pressure. It's the fitting sizes that confuse me.
03:20 PM jym: NPB, flared, and all that shit.
03:20 PM jym: NPT*
03:21 PM CaptHindsight: lotsa pipe jargon, OD, ID NPT, FPT etc
03:22 PM jym: ...and 50,000 different thread types/sizes
03:22 PM roycroft: you basically have three kind of fittings
03:22 PM CaptHindsight: and propane has their own fittings
03:22 PM roycroft: pipe thread, which is tapered and is a nominal size
03:23 PM roycroft: compression, which uses tubing that is an exact od size, and the ends of which are straight - they use a football-like sleeve over the tubing that gets compressed to make a gas-tight seal on the fitting
03:24 PM roycroft: and flare, which uses flared ends that seat on the fitting
03:24 PM roycroft: they also use tubing which is an exact od size
03:25 PM codepython777: anyone can recommend me a good glue gun?
03:25 PM roycroft: i'd put a 1/2" npt gas-rated shutoff valve on that pipe
03:25 PM CaptHindsight: manual or cnc? :)
03:25 PM roycroft: use black pipe for any nipples, etc that you need
03:25 PM jym: codepython777: That was my thought =)
03:26 PM enleth: codepython777: anything by STEINEL, if it's available in your area
03:26 PM codepython777: enleth: amazon us link please?
03:26 PM roycroft: and there is a special teflon tape to use for gas - it is yellow, vs. the white that you normally use for water
03:26 PM codepython777: enleth: https://www.amazon.com/Steinel-33241-3002-Glue-Gun/dp/B000MER42G ?
03:26 PM jym: roycroft: The yellow I'm aware of,though I don't know the difference
03:26 PM roycroft: for the 50' piece, you can get yellow flex tubing that is gas rated
03:26 PM roycroft: the yellow is thicker and seals better
03:27 PM jym: roycroft: that's it, it's thicker?
03:27 PM roycroft: propane/natural gas molecules are smaller than molecules
03:27 PM jym: ah
03:27 PM roycroft: than water molecules, rather
03:27 PM roycroft: so you need a tighter seal
03:27 PM codepython777: enleth: https://www.amazon.com/Steinel-33241-3002-Glue-Gun/dp/B000MER42G - there are pretty expensive compared to others i was looking at! :)
03:27 PM jym: roycroft: I was going to use yellow or pipe dope
03:27 PM enleth: codepython777: looks exactly like the one I have, I've seen it cheaper but it's worth it
03:27 PM roycroft: the white stuff may also be more sensitive to hycrocarbons, and might break down over time
03:27 PM roycroft: i'm not sure about that
03:28 PM roycroft: all i know is you use the yellow stuff for gas
03:28 PM CaptHindsight: http://allthumbsdiy.com/plumbing/when-to-use-ptfe-teflon-yellow-or-white-tapes-or-pipe-dope
03:28 PM enleth: codepython777: got tired of shitty glue guns burning up, shorting out or falling apart
03:28 PM roycroft: if you get some of that flex hose for the 50' extension, you can adapt whatever it's end is to your valve
03:29 PM jym: roycroft: This is a "temporary" thing, I'd coil up the hose nightly. Was thinking of using 1/2" air hose, due to the long run at 5 psi, to reduce resistance.
03:29 PM jym: CaptHindsight: thanks, I'll read it in a bit
03:30 PM codepython777: enleth: did you try stanley?
03:30 PM roycroft: i would not use air hose
03:30 PM roycroft: unless it is rated for propane
03:31 PM roycroft: the propane could corrode the hose from the inside
03:31 PM roycroft: and the results could be catestrophic over time
03:31 PM roycroft: use something rated for that gas that you are using
03:31 PM roycroft: you might be able to find a flexible hose that is propane rated at a welding shop
03:31 PM roycroft: something similar to oxy/acetylene hoses
03:32 PM codepython777: enleth: https://bestheavydutystuff.com/heavy-duty-hot-glue-gun-industrial-hot-melt-glue-gun-reviews-comparison/
03:32 PM enleth: codepython777: yes, and while they lasted appreciably longer than generic cheapo ones, I've seen them die from being left on for too long
03:32 PM roycroft: that urls says that the yellow tape is the same as the white, but 2x as thick
03:33 PM roycroft: er, 2x as dense
03:33 PM jym: roycroft: Heh, tubing is cheap, the fittings are expensive http://www.homedepot.com/p/HOME-FLEX-3-4-in-x-25-ft-IPS-Underground-Yellow-Poly-Pipe-19-0711025/301016140
03:33 PM roycroft: it also says there's a pink tape that's triple density
03:33 PM roycroft: and is required for all fittings 1/2" and larger
03:33 PM codepython777: enleth: Surebonder PRO2-220 220-Watt Adjustable Temperature Industrial Glue Gun - this one seems to have good reviews
03:33 PM enleth: codepython777: the steinel survived a couple days of unattended operation (some idiot left it on) just fine, possibly because it's got a lower "idle" heat level and only starts heating full power when you press the trigger
03:34 PM jym: roycroft: Um, ouch http://www.homedepot.com/p/HOME-FLEX-Underground-Yellow-Poly-Gas-Pipe-Coupler-1-in-18-429-010/300867556
03:34 PM codepython777: enleth: I'll probably try the surebonder... https://www.amazon.com/Surebonder-PRO2-220-Adjustable-Temperature-Industrial/dp/B008CDS324
03:35 PM jym: roycroft: and not sure how to transition that to pipe
03:35 PM jym: OUCH OUCH http://www.homedepot.com/p/HOME-FLEX-Underground-Yellow-Poly-Gas-Pipe-Transition-3-4-in-IPS-to-3-4-in-MIP-18-445-007/300867559
03:36 PM roycroft: if it were me, i'd try to use that stuff and bury it
03:36 PM roycroft: i don't know if trenching and burying is an option for you
03:36 PM roycroft: but that would be the best way to go
03:36 PM jym: roycroft: Heh, not now it's not. thus the air hose
03:41 PM jym: What fitting is that on the hose? https://i.ytimg.com/vi/eoWZJTYxh0o/maxresdefault.jpg
03:42 PM Crom: looks like a 3/8ish flare fitting
03:43 PM jym: Crom: 3/8" Is that "common" for propane grills, etc?
03:43 PM jym: what confuses me is that 1/4" propane fittings, AINT 1/4" =)
03:43 PM Crom: yep
03:44 PM Crom: it's what's on my Harbor Freight 3 burner camp stove
03:44 PM jym: Crom: gotacha
03:44 PM Crom: not 1/4" not 1/2"
03:45 PM jym: so that's 3/8" ??? http://www.harborfreight.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/i/m/image_23435.jpg
03:46 PM jym: the desc says 5/8 in.-18 Female http://www.harborfreight.com/propane-regulator-with-5-ft-hose-69463.html
03:47 PM jym: Ok, this says 3/8" http://www.homedepot.com/p/King-Kooker-High-Pressure-Adjustable-Regulator-with-Type-1-Connection-34502/203009032
03:47 PM jym: f'ing hf
03:48 PM Crom: yeah that's bigger than 3/8. 3/8 outside is about the size of the hose
03:49 PM roycroft: npt sizes are nominal, not actual
03:49 PM jym: Crom: I think HF was a typo and it really is 3/8
03:49 PM roycroft: a 1/4" npt pipe will be about 3/8" in diameter
03:49 PM Crom: true...
03:50 PM roycroft: 1/4" tubing will be exactly 1/4" in diameter
03:50 PM Crom: pipe is measured ID, tubing is measured OD
03:50 PM jym: So, it's 3/8" what? Flare? NPT? I think it has a tapered end
03:50 PM Crom: vflare
03:50 PM Crom: flare
03:51 PM Crom: straight thread. seals on the taper
03:51 PM roycroft: i'm on extremely limited bandwidth at the moment
03:51 PM jym: This I believe is the male counterpart http://easyfirepits.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/PHA38.jpg
03:51 PM roycroft: web browsing is all but impossible
03:52 PM Crom: jym, yep that's it
03:52 PM jym: Ok, they call it #/8 MALE FLARE... http://easyfirepits.com/product/pha38/
03:52 PM jym: 3/8*
03:53 PM jym: So, I now know at least ONE end =)
03:54 PM Crom: this is the connector on my stove. 3/8 pipe to 3/8 flare http://www.suremarineservice.com/FIT-357.aspx?gclid=Cj0KEQjwzd3GBRDks7SYuNHi3JEBEiQAIm6EI5GHOaYca8SVJIevRfrHq2vbKUMX9Wu-WywvEMYofDcaAp0o8P8HAQ
03:54 PM jym: They ship these heates with the hose unattached http://www.homedepot.com/catalog/productImages/1000/87/87af6f48-7074-48b7-96bd-53ec1999e9ce_1000.jpg
03:54 PM jym: Crom: Now, why doe sthat say NPT on one end and SAE on the other?
03:55 PM Crom: npt is the female to pipe end and SAE is the flare male end
03:55 PM Crom: SAE Society of American Engineers
03:55 PM jym: AH, so that's direct to pipe, gotcha
03:55 PM R2E4_bevins: Hi all
03:56 PM Crom: yo r2
03:56 PM jym: brb
03:56 PM R2E4_bevins: WooHoo! remap is working.... Tollchanger works
03:56 PM R2E4_bevins: toolchanger
03:56 PM Crom: NICE!
03:56 PM Crom: any video yet?
03:58 PM R2E4_bevins: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E02xONwPMhE
03:58 PM R2E4_bevins: Still have timing adjustments to do
03:59 PM Crom: NICE!!!
03:59 PM Crom: ISO or BT30?
03:59 PM R2E4_bevins: IS0
04:00 PM R2E4_bevins: ER32 collets I have for now
04:00 PM R2E4_bevins: Mesa Inside....
04:01 PM jym: Crom: I know the 3 burner you have, but it looks like HF doens't sell it anymore
04:02 PM jym: Crom: that thing must be HEAVY
04:03 PM Crom: ISO takes less space vertically than R-8, AND it uses pull studs which is really nice since you don't wear out the threads... But on a TTS that really doesn't matter since you never change the 3/4 R-8 collet
04:05 PM R2E4_bevins: Yeah, this machine weighs 14,000lbs
04:05 PM Crom: 2 out side round burners, 1 middle rectangle burner below that is the 'oven' toaster really
04:05 PM R2E4_bevins: 20 foot long
04:07 PM jym: Crom: any clue what size this is? http://imgur.com/ZdRoLlJ
04:07 PM Crom: nice... using steppers or servo's?
04:08 PM R2E4_bevins1: Big ass servos with Yaskawa drives
04:09 PM Crom: jym, kinda hard to tell... if the diameter of the pipe is around 7/8" it's 1/2" ( like the nipple between the T and the elbow), bigger it's 3/4"
04:09 PM Crom: but it kinda looks 1/2" to me...
04:10 PM jym: Crom: Let me go take my calipers to them, gimme a few it's raining today
04:10 PM Crom: the gas valve knob, looks a bit big... on 3/4" it's about the same size as the valve body
04:11 PM R2E4_bevins1: If self.task = 0 exit remap?
04:11 PM Crom: r2e4 don't look at me... NO clue
04:20 PM Crom: this stove http://hfreviews.com/item.php?id=7782
04:21 PM Crom: and yep they don't sell it anymore... Twatstards
04:32 PM jym: Crom: Heavy? You use it THAT much?
04:33 PM Crom: We use it like 5 times a year. And if the Maker space is having a an event we use it there for the chili and nacho cheese pots
04:33 PM jym: Crom: Ah, gotcha.
04:34 PM jym: Crom: Ok, the T has '3/4' stamped on it... http://imgur.com/p0JbxgZ
04:34 PM Crom: ok... it's 3/4" then
04:35 PM Wolf_: pipe is measured on OD, fittings on the other hand measure weird
04:35 PM Deejay: gn8
04:35 PM jym: Crom: the pipe caliper http://imgur.com/OIj1vA4
04:35 PM Crom: nite Deejay
04:35 PM jym: Deejay: gn9
04:36 PM Crom: yep 3/4.. size over 1.050"
04:36 PM Crom: ish
04:36 PM jym: Ok cool, and that's 3/4" NPT ?
04:36 PM Crom: yep
04:36 PM jym: Cool, now I know both ends, it's the middle parts that'll be a bitch =)
04:37 PM Wolf_: SCH 40 Bare & Black Standard Steel Pipe : SCH 40 Pipe-3/4 3/4 in 1.050 in
04:38 PM jym: Wolf_: what's "bare" ?
04:38 PM jym: black and galv I know, but never heard of "bare"
04:38 PM Wolf_: they call it bare but usally its gal (my guess)
04:40 PM jym: Wolf_: ah, ok.
04:40 PM jym: Do you thik it's "safe" just to flip the T 180 degrees, or do I need to pull apart and dope everything? http://imgur.com/JFvLxFQ
04:41 PM Wolf_: would need to break the flex line loose
04:42 PM jym: Wolf_: Now, flex line(s)... they don't use tape/dope, do they?
04:42 PM Wolf_: which is a compression fitting or a flare fitting
04:45 PM Crom: on NPT fittings.. Tightening... you usually don't have to redope.
04:45 PM Wolf_: I would still spray it with bubbles after to make sure
04:46 PM jym: Crom: From CaptHindsight link "One very important thing to remember is that PTFE thread sealant tapes and pipe joint compounds are only to be used on NPT male threads. Neither should be used on SAE mechanical threads or as a gasket sealer (i.e. sink basket gasket). "
04:46 PM jym: http://allthumbsdiy.com/plumbing/when-to-use-ptfe-teflon-yellow-or-white-tapes-or-pipe-dope
04:46 PM Crom: flare, my rule to myself is, if I take it off, I get a new one, if I loosen to reposition, I'll use same one, but I do a soapy water test to check for leaks
04:46 PM jym: Wolf_: Yea, that's a given, I have a few spray bottles all over the house just for that.
04:48 PM jym: This is the PERFECT for gas leaks, and is actually a pretty good cleaner too https://www.dollartree.com/20-oz-Totally-Awesome-Cleaner/p8056/index.pro
04:48 PM jym: The right soapiness , right out of the bottle.
04:48 PM Crom: jym Tottaly! that Stuff ROCKS!
04:49 PM jym: Crom: I'm aactually impressed by it. Better than many other brand name cleaners
04:49 PM Crom: And it kills ants!
04:49 PM jym: Crom: Yes, yes it does.
04:50 PM Crom: Hint, if it kills ants it'll kill Bees
04:52 PM jym: Crom: Don't get the smaller blue container, but this is great in tha laundry for cold water, and if you have blood on something, put one scopp in a small tub and soak whatever in it overnight and it takes out the blood https://www.dollartree.com/Xtreme-Values-New-Arrivals/Bonus-Buys/LA-s-Totally-Awesome-Oxygen-Orange-Base-Cleaner-32-oz-Tubs/1155c942p322974/index.pro
04:53 PM jym: Crom: oh wait, I used another cleaner for ants. I'll try it on ants this time.
04:55 PM jym: Crom: Oh, is THAT why I see the yellow flex lines that say "DO NOT REUSE" on them?
04:55 PM Crom: we get that as well
04:56 PM {HD}: for steps per inch how many is to many? 2k, 4k, 6.4k...819.2k?
04:57 PM CaptHindsight: jym: people put PTFE tape on lots of things that actually should not have it
04:57 PM CaptHindsight: jym: and how much blood is considered a little? :)
04:58 PM jym: CaptHindsight: Yeah, I was one of them. But I never udnerstood that flared fittings didn't need it
04:58 PM Crom: for laundry, we get the BIG 20 mule team box, and toss their measure cup, we use a Stainless steel condiment cup from a restaurant for the measure. Works great and we're not wasting detergent and we get even more loads than the box says.
04:58 PM jym: CaptHindsight: less than 4 sq in
04:58 PM CaptHindsight: so far less than a bucket :p
04:58 PM Crom: {HD}, depends on application...
04:59 PM jym: CaptHindsight: Never tried, more into zombies than vampires
04:59 PM CaptHindsight: never cleaned up after zombies myself
04:59 PM jym: Crom: I like the orange stuff comes with a 1oz cup. I save them, works great for toher things.
04:59 PM Crom: if you smallest tollerance is < 0.001 you probably want more steps, < 0.050 you can probably go alot less steps
04:59 PM jym: CaptHindsight: No need, just toss em in the fire pit
05:00 PM CaptHindsight: tip well noted
05:00 PM jym: CaptHindsight: Vamps, well they want the whole stake to the hear thting, it's squirt, blah blah blah
05:00 PM jym: heart*
05:00 PM Crom: if the zombie is fresh enough but old enough to dry out a bit... you can really get some good BTU's out of them
05:01 PM jym: Crom: Don't want zombie smoked food
05:01 PM CaptHindsight: I think vampires turn into dust after their hearts get a steak through them
05:01 PM CaptHindsight: at least what I've seen on TV
05:02 PM Crom: too big for cooking food... but pretty good size for running a power plant
05:02 PM CaptHindsight: zombies pretty much just lie there
05:02 PM jym: Crom: Well, wasn't that one time that zombie smoke infected a whole town?
05:02 PM Crom: CaptHindsight, crap tooo true... great movie
05:03 PM Crom: Judge Reinhold was in that
05:03 PM jym: which movie?
05:03 PM CaptHindsight: Brains!!!!
05:03 PM jym: Retuen of the living dead circa 1980's ?
05:04 PM CaptHindsight: if you burn zombies it just makes more zombies
05:04 PM jym: Crom: Yeah, that's what I though.
05:04 PM jym: err CaptHindsight
05:05 PM jym: Damn, that flex line is $37?! I'll buy one just in case, glad HD has a 90 day return policy.
05:06 PM jym: MY rule of thumb for HD... if you THINK you might need it, get it anyway. You have 90 days to return it and better than having to make a second trip to go bac
05:07 PM {HD}: Crom: So the upside to lots of steps is theoritical acuracy. What is the downside?
05:07 PM Wolf_: you can return stuff w/out reciept at HD also, just get store credit
05:07 PM {HD}: Wolf_: But, you have to show ID and they log it and only allow a certain amount returned...
05:08 PM Wolf_: yeah, but longer then 90 days =) lol
05:08 PM {HD}: True!
05:11 PM Crom: I buy stuff with my va id.. 10% discount... have taken stuff back without receipt... refund of the item price to a gift card
05:12 PM jym: Wolf_: Hell, I've had them pull up the old transaction using my CC number when I forgot the recipt at home.
05:12 PM Crom: on little stuff... nothing big
05:13 PM Roguish: hey all. has anyone experience with these: http://charteroakautomation.com/our-products/manual-bed-mill/
05:15 PM Crom: hmmm looks like a X3 clone
05:15 PM Roguish: RF45 I believe
05:15 PM CaptHindsight: at least they are square vs round column (drill press) mills
05:16 PM {HD}: Can I buy things from a grizzley warehouse? Or only during tent sales?
05:17 PM {HD}: grizzly
05:17 PM Crom: decent travel 26X 12Y 22Z
05:17 PM CaptHindsight: G0704 not at Grizzley http://www.automationtechnologiesinc.com/products-page/cnc-router/g0704cnc
05:18 PM CaptHindsight: or Taig http://www.automationtechnologiesinc.com/products-page/cnc-router/taig-gecko-cnc-mill-milling-machine-engraver-router
05:19 PM CaptHindsight: you can find Bridgeports in same price range
05:23 PM Crom: http://charteroakautomation.com/our-products/cnc-bed-mill/ Charter Oak price wise compares favorably to Tormach
05:23 PM Crom: CharterOak, bigger machining volume, Servo
05:23 PM Crom: 's vs tormach steppers
05:23 PM roycroft: {hd}: grizzly allow showroom pickup
05:24 PM roycroft: you can order ahead of time and have it held for pickup or you can purchase when you show up, if it is in stock
05:25 PM {HD}: roycroft: That is great! I decided that it is less expensive to drive the 1k miles then to pay $700 shipping.
05:25 PM CaptHindsight: $700? is it with a lift gate and to a home?
05:26 PM {HD}: No, I just have a cart full of shit.
05:29 PM Crom: rent a drop deck trailer, and drive 700 miles... roundtrip... 3 days... 40 to 70 gallons of fuel 2 nights... cheaper to pay the $700
05:30 PM CaptHindsight: NT30
05:31 PM CaptHindsight: I see Matsuura 500 and 710's all the time for far less
05:32 PM CaptHindsight: but if new and with a warranty is important then go for it
05:37 PM Crom: CaptHindsight, how much are you seeing 710's for?
05:41 PM Crom: {HD}, lots of steps takes time to send... so you can get limited on IPM
05:42 PM Crom: but then you're going for uber high positioning so fast isn't really wanted
05:44 PM Crom: I actually powered down my Linuxcnc machine and cnc mill until the closed loop steppers get here...
05:58 PM Crom: guess I could fire it up and play with PIS speed control while I'm waiting...
05:58 PM Crom: PID
06:01 PM CaptHindsight: Crom: $2500 and up
06:01 PM CaptHindsight: same for the 500's
06:04 PM CaptHindsight: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Matsuura-MC-800-V-DC-Twin-Spindle-VMC-new-1987-/252345138451 $4450 or best
06:07 PM CaptHindsight: http://www.ebay.com/itm/1994-Kitamura-Mycenter-0-Kitamura-Mycenter-0/132055362816 $4k still hooked up
06:09 PM CaptHindsight: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Bridgeport-Interact-412-VERTICAL-MACHINING-CENTER/332151719240 $2500
06:10 PM {HD}: Why are the grizzly combination lathe mills so cheap!?
06:11 PM CaptHindsight: cheap and low cost
06:13 PM {HD}: CaptHindsight: Oh, so maybe not worth it?
06:15 PM CaptHindsight: all made in China
06:15 PM CaptHindsight: depends on how lucky you are
06:16 PM Crom: my step daughter has taken the car and is driving her boyfriend around... poor car...
06:21 PM Crom: sign at a protest. I'm British, and I'm on a march. Things must be bad!
06:24 PM jym: lol
06:25 PM Crom: http://blog.californiarighttocarry.org/?page_id=4712 Pereuta V California En banc here June 15th, 2017...
06:25 PM Crom: idiots... Heller and McDonald said, there is no 2nd ammendment right to concealed carry. just Open Carry
06:28 PM Crom: ahhh Charter Oak is using clearpath steppers
06:29 PM jym: Crom: and there is no open carry in Calif, phuked both ways
06:30 PM jym: But, we have CCW here as will issue in this county.
06:30 PM Crom: Nichols V. California... waiting on Oral Arguments...
06:30 PM Crom: he put in for En Banc for initial hearing... Havent heard if that has been approved.
06:31 PM Crom: its fully briefed...
06:32 PM Crom: I've been following this case since he filed it.
06:32 PM jym: Crom: where you at?
06:32 PM Crom: Temecula, Riverside County on I-15, so cal
06:33 PM Crom: 2 miles north of San Diego County Line
06:33 PM jym: Crom: Ah, ok.
06:33 PM Crom: 5 miles east of orange county line
06:33 PM jym: Huh, I never realized OC was that close to SD County
06:33 PM Crom: jym, where you at?
06:34 PM jym: Crom: NorCal, about 2hrs north of Sac.
06:34 PM CaptHindsight: why is only the 2nd amendment important to gun owners?
06:34 PM Crom: <-- graduated from Morro Bay HS, born in San Pablo, town north of Richmond
06:34 PM CaptHindsight: They don't seem interested in protecting other rights
06:34 PM Crom: folks live in Richmond, and my brother in Walnut Creek and I have a step son and Step daughter in Sac
06:35 PM jym: CaptHindsight: IT's just the ONE right that is being infridged on so drastically.
06:35 PM CaptHindsight: jym: are you joking?
06:35 PM Crom: Well 2nd is the most trod upon... 1st, 4th, 14th,.... are tied in as well
06:36 PM jym: CaptHindsight: Calif now has a "must register to buy ammo".
06:36 PM CaptHindsight: now I see why
06:36 PM jym: CaptHindsight: ...and you are limited on qty too.
06:37 PM Crom: like that's going to stop people from buying in Nevada or Arizona...
06:37 PM jym: CaptHindsight: It's hard to put up a fight on 20 different things all at the same time.
06:37 PM Crom: That was one of the struck down terms in Heller... registration to buy a handgun.
06:38 PM jym: CaptHindsight: During katrina, the National guard confiscated registered firearms.
06:38 PM * {HD} would protect all of the US Constitution. The 2nd just makes sure you 'can' protect the rest of it.
06:38 PM Crom: and a weapon without ammo is not a weapon
06:38 PM Crom: jym as did New Orleans cops
06:39 PM jym: Crom: Oh? I didn't know that.
06:39 PM {HD}: The shipping containers full of rusted/ruined firearms was a discrace to history.
06:39 PM Crom: cops led, NG provided support
06:40 PM jym: Crom: lovely.
06:41 PM jym: Crom: NV/AZ are probably loving it.
06:41 PM Crom: http://www.theshootist.net/2008/12/court-decision-on-new-orleans-gun.html
06:41 PM jym: Crom: I had a friend smuggle across the border me a pint of MEK
06:41 PM roycroft: as folks ask that we not discuss politics here, i should appreciate if we did not have extended discussions about gun law here
06:42 PM Crom: mo business for their gun shops and more sales tax revenue...
06:42 PM Crom: jym... ditto for a gallon of oil based paint
06:43 PM gregcnc: jym, they coming for you now
06:44 PM Crom: I'm mainly into CNC for AR-15 and M1911 80%'s
06:44 PM Crom: Id love to make a 100% of both as well
06:45 PM jym: Crom: Yeah, gallon of oild based primer is next to smuggle in.
06:45 PM jym: gregcnc: let em try... the stuff evaps quickly enough ;)
06:46 PM Crom: I can get quarts of rustoleum oil based paint... gotta go to Yuma, AZ for gallons
06:46 PM jym: Crom: are you making jsut the lowers?
06:47 PM Crom: MEK and TEC are great solvents
06:47 PM Crom: jym... right now... 3040 don't do steel...
06:47 PM jym: No clue on TEC, is that toulene?
06:47 PM jym: Crom: 3040?
06:47 PM gregcnc: I recently discovered nitromethane as a solvent
06:47 PM Crom: TRIC
06:47 PM CaptHindsight: does CA have a variance for Acetone?
06:47 PM jym: CaptHindsight: not yet
06:47 PM Crom: trichloroethylene
06:48 PM jym: Crom: OH 111
06:48 PM jym: no wait...
06:48 PM Crom: jym fleabay CNC 3040 engraver 30cm x 40cm x 75mm Z
06:48 PM gregcnc: do you have any aerosol cans out there or is everything pump spray now? and have they colse all the tacobells yet?
06:48 PM CaptHindsight: jym: so no acetone in CA?
06:48 PM jym: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1,1,1-Trichloroethane
06:48 PM Crom: that's it...
06:48 PM Crom: I get get Acetone at walmart in quarts
06:49 PM jym: CaptHindsight: Ca does have Acttone, just not MEK
06:49 PM Crom: mineral spirits, and methyl alcohol
06:49 PM jym: Crom: 111 has been banned federally a long time ago.
06:49 PM Crom: 111 and MEK do a better job than Acetine
06:50 PM Crom: jym not in MX
06:50 PM jym: Crom: Nothing in MX is banned.
06:50 PM CaptHindsight: Lowes asked me for ID to purchase a gallon of polyester resin since it came with a few oz of MEKP
06:50 PM jym: Crom: I have two pints. by IBM =)
06:50 PM roycroft: mek is a carcinogen
06:51 PM jym: CaptHindsight: That's sad.
06:51 PM CaptHindsight: so I went next door to Home Depot and no ID required
06:51 PM roycroft: acetone is not, although it's very high in vocs
06:51 PM Crom: roycroft, alot of things are... used in moderation and with proper ventilation...
06:51 PM CaptHindsight: well they tried to phase out all the common higher vapor pressure solvents a few years ago
06:51 PM jym: CaptHindsight: I do have to register to buy pesticide, but that' because it's agricultrual grade,
06:51 PM CaptHindsight: Acetone got a pass by congress
06:52 PM roycroft: there is no such thing as "moderate" exposure to carcinogens
06:52 PM roycroft: that's not how cancer works
06:52 PM Crom: R-12 Freon was banned for the sole reason of DuPont's patent ran out... so they could come out with R-134a
06:52 PM roycroft: 1 drop is as dangerous as being fully immersed
06:53 PM Crom: roycroft, but WHICH drop?
06:53 PM roycroft: as far as proper handling, i would agree that it can be handled safely
06:53 PM CaptHindsight: is that like asbestos? or burned bacon?
06:53 PM roycroft: that's the thing - one cannot know
06:53 PM jym: CaptHindsight: BACON ABUSE!!! YOU BASTARD!!!!
06:53 PM Crom: it's a justifiable risk.... Smoking tobacco causes cancer... it's still legal..
06:54 PM roycroft: moving from discussing gun law to discussing california environemental/consumer protection policy is a lateral move at best
06:54 PM jym: Crom: Walking across the street causes cancer.
06:54 PM Crom: jym, standing at the curb in the sun causes cancer
06:54 PM roycroft: however, that said, i can see the reason that california agencies/legislatures pass most of the laws they do
06:54 PM roycroft: but often those regulations/laws are misguided and counterproductive
06:55 PM roycroft: it's not a california problem per se - it's a general problem with bureaucracies
06:55 PM roycroft: they tend to take narrow views when enacting laws/reglations
06:55 PM Crom: and they get more liberal over time...
06:56 PM jym: Crom: well, I meant that EVERYTHING causes cancer.
06:56 PM * roycroft is trying hard to keep political labels out of this, as they're almost always misused and almost always meaningless
06:56 PM CaptHindsight: cancer is a natural mutation
06:56 PM jym: Crom: farting cows cause cancer!!!
06:56 PM roycroft: mek, as an example, is in a class of things that should probably be regulated
06:56 PM CaptHindsight: happens all the time with and without bacon fat or smoking
06:57 PM Crom: Denmark TAXES farting cows!
06:57 PM roycroft: but certainly ntt banned
06:57 PM roycroft: not
06:57 PM * zeeshan drinks a bit of MEK, yum.
06:57 PM CaptHindsight: how big are the non-farting cows?
06:57 PM Crom: you find them in the beef case at the super market
06:57 PM jym: CaptHindsight: Well cancer is your own cells gone renegade. so it's really what triggers the mutany, be it internal or external.
06:57 PM roycroft: the average consumer is not aware that it is carcinogenic, and would likely use it with as little concern as using mineral spirits or denatured alcohol
06:58 PM roycroft: industry knows the potential danger and has procedures for using it safely
06:58 PM CaptHindsight: I didn't know farting cows were so dangerous :)
06:58 PM roycroft: making it harder for the average consumer to obtain has a public health benefit
06:58 PM Crom: TSP is still a fravorite of mine... the fake TSP they sell now, doesn't work 1/8th as good...
06:58 PM roycroft: banning it outright is harmful to industry and unnecessary
06:59 PM roycroft: another good example
06:59 PM roycroft: tsp causes sever algae blooms in stormwater runoff
06:59 PM roycroft: used in moderation and disposed through a sanitary sewer it's fine
06:59 PM CaptHindsight: sounds almost as if lawmakers have agendas other than public safety
07:00 PM Crom: CaptHindsight, it's called follow the money
07:00 PM jym: CaptHindsight: haven't they always?
07:00 PM CaptHindsight: who knew?
07:00 PM roycroft: wastewater processing plants can remove the phosphorous before the effluent is reintroduced into the environment
07:00 PM zeeshan: algae like TSP?
07:00 PM roycroft: phosphorous causes algae blooms
07:01 PM Crom: zeeshan, it's the phosphates...
07:01 PM zeeshan: wouldnt that also mean
07:01 PM zeeshan: that crap you wash your clothes with
07:01 PM Crom: old time laundry detergents used to be loaded with them.
07:01 PM roycroft: that goes down your sanitary sewer
07:01 PM roycroft: and it is expensive for wastewater treatment plants to remove phosphates
07:02 PM roycroft: which is why many states limit the amount of phosphates permissible in detergents
07:02 PM Crom: not anymore... to many laundrys drain into grey water systems with dont get processed...
07:02 PM zeeshan: lake erie is f'edf
07:02 PM CaptHindsight: zeeshan: would Canada hit you with customs for this? http://www.ebay.com/itm/BRIDGEPORT-INTERACT-412-VERTICAL-MACHINING-CENTER/191884918055
07:02 PM zeeshan: it had one of th elargest blooms ever
07:02 PM roycroft: but a lot of people use tsp for exterior cleaning and let it run into storm sewers
07:02 PM zeeshan: CaptHindsight: yes
07:02 PM roycroft: which are not processed in any way
07:02 PM CaptHindsight: zeeshan: what %? just wondering
07:03 PM zeeshan: 13%
07:03 PM CaptHindsight: jikes
07:03 PM zeeshan: unless i buy it for my business
07:03 PM roycroft: i use tsp for cleaning my brewery
07:03 PM zeeshan: then its 0%
07:03 PM roycroft: but i try to use it as conscienciously as possible
07:03 PM zeeshan: im pretty sure my next mill/lathe will be a modern one :o
07:03 PM roycroft: i reuse the tsp-laden cleaning solution several times
07:03 PM zeeshan: i really want a machine with linear guides
07:04 PM roycroft: and always make sure every drop of it goes down a sanitary sewer drain, and never down a storm sewer
07:04 PM zeeshan: i hope not
07:04 PM zeeshan: theres fish that live in my storm sewers!
07:04 PM zeeshan: :D
07:05 PM Crom: roycroft, yep... I only dump TSP into the toilet. The ONLY guarenteed black water receptical anywhere...
07:05 PM malcom2073: zeeshan: I've changed my mind: I'm going to build a water brake. Looking into the costs, water brake is cheaper... but the actual design work and tool pathing is more complicated.
07:05 PM roycroft: the argument is often made that people can be educated, and we would be better off educating people than regulating them
07:05 PM gregcnc: dyno?
07:05 PM malcom2073: Yeah, I needed a new project heh
07:05 PM gregcnc: how big?
07:05 PM zeeshan: malcom2073: yes
07:06 PM Crom: roycroft, problem is the people that bdon't give a shite
07:06 PM roycroft: i would counter that reasonable, sensible regulation eliminates the need for the average consumer to be highly educated on the hundred of products they use
07:06 PM malcom2073: gregcnc: Starting out, tiny, 1-5hp
07:06 PM malcom2073: Scaling up as I learn
07:06 PM gregcnc: RPm?
07:06 PM malcom2073: for the small one 4k, my final target is 550hp/6krpm
07:07 PM roycroft: some of the frustration here, i suspect, is that many folks on this channel know how to use industrial products safely but are not large enough businesses to be able to obtain some of the legally or to be worth the paperwork required to obtain them legally
07:07 PM CaptHindsight: what's everyone need the TSP for?
07:07 PM CaptHindsight: lotsa laundry?
07:07 PM roycroft: i use it to clean my brewery
07:07 PM roycroft: as i said earlier
07:07 PM CaptHindsight: that I can see
07:07 PM roycroft: and it's not the main ingredient
07:07 PM roycroft: i make a cleaner out of 2 parts oxyclean free and 1 part tsp, by weight
07:07 PM roycroft: the oxyclean free does the actually cleaning
07:08 PM Crom: CaptHindsight, it's really good for cutting organic sludge... cigurette smoke residue on walls, etc...\
07:08 PM roycroft: but it leaves a soapy film that is difficult to remove
07:08 PM roycroft: the tsp in the mix lets it rinse cleanly
07:08 PM zeeshan: malcom2073: why that high
07:08 PM zeeshan: dont car wheels spin at like 2000 rPM max
07:08 PM malcom2073: zeeshan: motor dyno, not chassis
07:08 PM zeeshan: O
07:08 PM zeeshan: go 9k!
07:09 PM Crom: pneumatic valves... 12k!
07:09 PM zeeshan: http://www.ducks.ca/assets/2016/04/lake-erie-bloom-1024x776.jpg
07:09 PM zeeshan: damn you america
07:09 PM zeeshan: bringing algae blooms up here
07:09 PM zeeshan: :o(
07:09 PM malcom2073: Damn, that's bad
07:09 PM malcom2073: It's like an infection heh, spreading north
07:09 PM gregcnc: are used dynos available or are water brakes that cheap to make?
07:09 PM malcom2073: :-P
07:10 PM Crom: yep Toledo...
07:10 PM malcom2073: gregcnc: I'm doing it a project as much as an end product, all in all it'll probably wind up costing me about the same, but parts-wise water brakes are damn simple
07:10 PM Crom: though Ontario side doesn't look better
07:10 PM zeeshan: its all coming up from the states :)
07:10 PM roycroft: at least lake erie is no longer on fire
07:12 PM gregcnc: for 5HP I'd go with ac motor, VFD, resistor bank. I actually want to try a DC motor and servo drive to accomplish the same, but I should look into 400Hz ac motors
07:12 PM Crom: Bridge at Sarnia is pretty cool looking
07:12 PM jym: CaptHindsight: Oh pints/gallons of naphtha are "banned" in Calif. But guess what charcoal lighter fluid is?
07:13 PM gregcnc: almost naphta
07:13 PM Crom: jym, it's not quarts... it's at best cups
07:13 PM jym: CaptHindsight: and Coleman Fuel too
07:13 PM malcom2073: gregcnc: The intention is to get a feel for water brakes
07:13 PM zeeshan: you klnow how they say the water after treatment is clean
07:13 PM gregcnc: ah ok
07:13 PM zeeshan: i think thats bullshit
07:13 PM Crom: fuild for for zippo lighters... isn't that naptha?
07:13 PM zeeshan: i went to investigate myself near a water treatment plant's outlet
07:13 PM zeeshan: water smells like SHIT!
07:13 PM gregcnc: did you taste it?
07:13 PM zeeshan: i could see the poor fishys in there :(
07:13 PM jym: Crom: Well, I CAN buy 2oz of (real) MEK in calif for $5, or smuggle in a pint for $7, eh.
07:14 PM zeeshan: gregcnc: cmon man
07:14 PM Crom: yep...
07:14 PM zeeshan: if it smells like shit
07:14 PM zeeshan: its prolly shit :p
07:14 PM gregcnc: don't bottom feeders love that crap?
07:14 PM zeeshan: they do
07:14 PM zeeshan: goby
07:14 PM gregcnc: OK
07:14 PM zeeshan: and zebra mussels
07:15 PM gregcnc: shrimp and other nasty crap i won't eat
07:15 PM zeeshan: yum shrimp
07:15 PM Crom: but the algae blooms kill the bottom feeders
07:15 PM jym: Crom: just toss in some bleach and ammonia, that take care of it
07:16 PM Crom: California put Crappie into Clear Lake to eat the Algae. They didn't... state had to come in and basically shock the lake like a huge swimming pool and pretty much killed everything in the lake
07:17 PM jym: and thanks all for the help on the propane stuff!
07:17 PM Crom: jym, np... it's why we're here...
07:17 PM t12: anyone ever work with the SMC ethernet/ip units?
07:17 PM jym: t12: the lil smc routers? Nope never heard of em
07:18 PM Crom: t12 not current stuff, probably not for 20 years
07:18 PM t12: the pneumatics controllers
07:18 PM jym: oh THAT smc =)
07:18 PM t12: i think i just got a bum one, it seems to randomly crash and flutter valves while doing so
07:18 PM Crom: oh not that either...
07:18 PM zeeshan: t12 yes
07:18 PM zeeshan: thats what we use at work
07:18 PM t12: zeeshan: ever see failures like that?
07:18 PM Crom: t12, stick a arduino nano to log the voltage on the valve lines
07:19 PM t12: well the ethernet part needs to work, when it comes up with an error it wont even link
07:19 PM t12: then i bounce power a few times and it boots and links
07:19 PM zeeshan: t12 not sure :(
07:19 PM t12: then fails randomly later
07:19 PM Crom: t12, things I'd check for... ground loop, noise on ethernet line.
07:19 PM jym: t12: check if there is a firmware update
07:19 PM Tom_itx is now known as Tom_L
07:20 PM Crom: yep noise on ethernet... try running a fiber converter on that line... fiber from the wall, to the machine, then switch back to rj-45 ethernet wired
07:20 PM t12: this is just on a bench
07:20 PM t12: short lines, beefy supplies
07:20 PM t12: no loads
07:21 PM Crom: bad solder joint?
07:21 PM jym: t12: check if there is a firmware update
07:21 PM t12: could be at that point i just replace
07:21 PM Crom: got another to test against?
07:21 PM t12: nah going to try and obtain one
07:22 PM t12: the price gap between used devicenet and ethernet/ip is pretty steep
07:22 PM t12: but ethernet is so much easier on the compuer side
07:23 PM t12: looking for fw now
07:23 PM t12: though i dunno how i'd load ti
07:23 PM Crom: when i worked industrial... if a replacement unit cost less than a day of lost production... we had a spare...
07:24 PM Crom: cost of -- less than a week, local supplier with guarenteed stock, over a week... oh well...
07:26 PM jym: What is FPT? http://www.homedepot.com/p/3-4-in-Brass-FPT-x-FPT-Lever-Handle-Gas-Ball-Valve-VGV1LHB4EB/205812148
07:26 PM jym: Female, but what?
07:26 PM t12: pipe thread?
07:26 PM Crom: female Pipe Thread
07:26 PM jym: as opposed to NTP ?
07:26 PM jym: Neutered? lol
07:26 PM Crom: NTP is National Pipe Thread
07:27 PM gregcnc: description says NTP
07:27 PM jym: Crom: Right, so wouldn't it be Female NTP ?
07:27 PM jym: not FTP ?
07:27 PM t12: would a neutered pipe thread just be a section of pipe
07:27 PM t12: with no threads
07:27 PM jym: t12: maybe, I have pipe threads
07:27 PM jym: hate*
07:27 PM Crom: true... but they abreviated to a TLA so FPT
07:27 PM gregcnc: like HD is picky about details
07:27 PM jym: TLA ?
07:27 PM Crom: TLA == Three Letter Acronym
07:27 PM jym: Crom: ah
07:28 PM jym: See, it's shit like that why I have pipe threads!
07:28 PM jym: hate*
07:28 PM jym: FNTP, I get.
07:28 PM gregcnc: huh FPT is valid for female NTP, who nkew
07:29 PM jym: I still like neutered
07:29 PM Crom: then there is MIPS and FIPS
07:29 PM jym: Crom: and those are?
07:29 PM jym: so I guess there is MPT too ?
07:29 PM jym: for Male NTP ?
07:30 PM Crom: ahhh they TLA'd them as well http://www.homedepot.com/p/HOME-FLEX-3-8-in-MIP-x-1-2-in-FIP-Gas-Valve-x-72-in-Stainless-Steel-Dryer-Connector-HFDC-7K-72/204626671
07:30 PM Crom: jym yep
07:30 PM jym: Crom: k, what are mips and fips?
07:30 PM jym: male and female, but ips?
07:31 PM jym: Male pipe threads on the outside of the fitting.
07:32 PM jym: Female pipe threads on the inside of the fitting.
07:32 PM Crom: I think it's Inch Pipe Screw
07:32 PM jym: 'ed
07:32 PM Crom: Iron Pipe Size
07:33 PM Crom: National Pipe Thread...
07:33 PM jym: FUS
07:33 PM jym: adn NPS?
07:33 PM Crom: ahhh IPS is straight thread, not tapered like NPT
07:33 PM jym: ah
07:34 PM jym: oh so all NPT is tapered, good to know.
07:34 PM Crom: https://www.jamestowndistributors.com/userportal/document.do?docId=515
07:34 PM jym: NPS (National Pipe Straight) is a straight thread used for mechanical joints or where fluid sealing is accomplished by an o-ring or washer at the base of the threads. NPS is a U.S. standard.
07:34 PM Crom: conduit is straight thread
07:34 PM gregcnc: pipe threads are the most messed up thing ever. I swear my compressor used three different standards, and I ended up adding two more when I added aftercooler and more filtration.
07:35 PM jym: Crom: TLA... Male Pipe Taper... MPT is a comonly used shorthand designation for Male Pipe Taper (Male NPT).
07:35 PM jym: http://pipeandhose.com/taxonomy/term/29
07:37 PM Crom: probably a better TLA..
07:37 PM Crom: bbiab ---~~~~~ tobacco though...
07:37 PM gregcnc: that's a good one. i never found anything comparing all of them
07:38 PM Wolf_: I switch everything to JIC fittings
07:38 PM Wolf_: on my air compressor anyways
07:38 PM Crom: Wolf_, those are the hydralic fittings AvE loves so much?
07:39 PM Wolf_: yeah, I keep a stock of fittings and hose in my shop, 4k and 5k psi rated hose
07:40 PM gregcnc: the heat exchanger i put on was was JIC
07:40 PM jym: Has anyone seen these with a hole for a padlock? http://www.homedepot.com/p/3-4-in-Brass-FPT-x-FPT-Lever-Handle-Gas-Ball-Valve-VGV1LHB4EB/205812148
07:40 PM Wolf_: check supplyhouse.com
07:41 PM jym: ty
07:41 PM Tom_L: https://www.google.com/search?q=3/4+in+gas+ball+valve+with+lock&tbm=isch&imgil=gO3bdpmepKNnpM%253A%253BLJGGcPpJsVHg-M%253Bhttps%25253A%25252F%25252Fwww.grainger.com%25252Fproduct%25252FJOMAR-VALVE-Brass-FNPT-x-FNPT-Gas-Ball-36FN29&source=iu&pf=m&fir=gO3bdpmepKNnpM%253A%252CLJGGcPpJsVHg-M%252C_&usg=__swsINyWk7LyTZLJgC9DKdk8PZ5k%3D&biw=1104&bih=711#imgrc=gO3bdpmepKNnpM:
07:43 PM Tom_L: https://www.zoro.com/jomar-valve-gas-ball-valve-full-port-fnpt-34in-240-004b/i/G9490442/?gclid=CP_5-qmz9dICFQSMaQodqQUHJg&gclsrc=aw.ds
07:43 PM jym: Ah "locking wing" is the term
07:43 PM jym: thanks
07:53 PM Crom: there we go krdc desktop sharing...
07:58 PM Crom: now to see what kind of proformance hit I take
08:01 PM gregcnc: anyone have any links for gear hobbing? i'm trying to understand what's happening when hobbing helical gears
08:01 PM malcom2073: andy should, but he's not here atm. He's the master of odd hobs
08:04 PM gregcnc: It's just math, but my googlfoo is weak on this topic
08:06 PM jym: gregcnc: your GoogleFu is no good!
08:06 PM gregcnc: i found gear stuff, but not detailed enough
08:07 PM jym: gregcnc: andy or archivist I would think.
08:07 PM gregcnc: i bet archivist would have some info
08:08 PM Crom: helical hobbing requires coordinated moves I do believe
08:08 PM gregcnc: i think so
08:10 PM Crom: taking gear held in X, rotated in Y, the cutter is at an angle on Z and you have to rotate the gear Y as your Z goes up and down
08:12 PM Crom: so your cutter max Y stickout is at the proper rotation of gear for given Z
08:12 PM gregcnc: Z moves at the helix angle, is that all?
08:13 PM archivist: see wiki for andys implementation
08:13 PM Crom: z moves straight up and down... cutter is held at fixed 5th axis angle.
08:14 PM archivist: dont forget to add/subtract the hob angle
08:14 PM gregcnc: Z is coordinated to the feed direction by the helix angle?
08:15 PM Crom: yep
08:15 PM Crom: rotation of A 4th axis is coordinated to Z
08:16 PM archivist: one of my axes is not cnc'd it is original to machine
08:16 PM archivist: http://www.collection.archivist.info/searchv13.php?searchstr=barber+colman
08:17 PM XXCoder: ich yeah? ill need to look into stop options.
08:17 PM Crom: you want the max diameter point of the cutter and the bottom of the gear tooth on the helix angle line. So center of cutter to max diameter point to center of gear tooth bottom of the groove stay in line
08:17 PM archivist: both feed in and hob angle are manual on mine
08:18 PM gregcnc: archivist in that hobber capable of helicalgears?
08:18 PM archivist: another one I did also has manual hob angle and feed
08:20 PM gregcnc: i worked at barber colman for a while
08:20 PM archivist: the machine has limited angles due to the way its made, you can just rotate a slide under to get helical so a universal mill is easy to make into a helical hobber
08:21 PM gregcnc: yeah looking at it I see the swivelinghead, but it looks cramped
08:21 PM archivist: mine was made for watch size spurs
08:22 PM archivist: I just added encoders to its geared shafts and software gear the drive with linuxcnc
08:23 PM archivist: so no damage to the original metal of the machine
08:23 PM gregcnc: how did they do the coordination for helical gear mechanically?
08:25 PM archivist: depends on the machine as it was not designed for helical it lacks differential but here is a diagram of that type http://www.collection.archivist.info/hobbing.html
08:26 PM archivist: so this mikron has differential http://www.archivist.info/cnc/works2008/P1010240.JPG
08:28 PM archivist: the other method is swing the slide to helix angle but that is a bit of a kludge and you run across the hob face then
08:29 PM archivist: so helix angle is limited by hob width
08:29 PM gregcnc: so electronically you could coordinate Z or adjust the hob angle as you feed
08:30 PM gregcnc: but hte machine still needs to be set for hob lead?
08:31 PM archivist: hob lead and helix angle are just a sum/diff depending on left/right of cutter and blank
08:31 PM gregcnc: understood
08:32 PM archivist: I no longer have access to the mikron manual but I seem to remember an extra 1 in the maths for lead direction
08:34 PM archivist: one book to find with a lot of info is the barber colman "Hob handbook"
08:35 PM enleth: have you seen NYC CNC's new surface grinder? apparently John scored an enormously good deal with a huge fully automated Okamoto grinder
08:35 PM archivist: part brochure ware and part technical info to design hobs
08:36 PM archivist: gregcnc, I have also used linuxcnc to mill helicals, not too hard to do
08:37 PM archivist: fly cutting http://www.collection.archivist.info/archive/DJCPD/PD/2009/2009_08_13_cnc_helical/P1010261.JPG
08:38 PM gregcnc: archivist yes I saw the video. I'm thinking about some options. I don't have an optimal machine on which to setup hobbing right now.
08:38 PM archivist: also steep helical rack, worm http://www.collection.archivist.info/archive/DJCPD/PD/2008/2008_10_07_Merlin_worm/p1010054.jpg
08:39 PM CaptHindsight: I like the leadscrew on that Z axis
08:39 PM archivist: last pic that is vice screw
08:40 PM gregcnc: I like that the lens seems to makes the lead screw reverse pitch
08:40 PM CaptHindsight: the z axis screw looks polished and threadless from this distance
08:41 PM archivist: the z axis is 1mm pitch that part is plain
08:41 PM archivist: actually is threaded and a bit out of focus
08:42 PM archivist: is is the donor lathes leadscrew
08:42 PM CaptHindsight: archivist: up late or early? Isn't it like -2am there
08:42 PM Crom: and G61 must be in effect
08:43 PM archivist: CaptHindsight, night drink
08:43 PM CaptHindsight: back to the grindstone for me
08:44 PM jym: WTH... FIP/MIP is another TLA for Female NPT
08:44 PM gregcnc: rockford library has the hob book
08:44 PM archivist: Crom, the way I slowly enter and move g61 is hardly needed :)
08:44 PM jym: Some bastard REALLY needs to stop changing crap
08:47 PM archivist: Crom, and this might be the code from the worm http://www.archivist.info/cnc/helical_worm2.ngc
08:48 PM archivist: inside rear of skull cam no g61
08:50 PM archivist: 90% preparation and 3 lines to do the cut and move out
08:51 PM Crom: nice!
08:52 PM archivist: and a mechanical setup for the shaft angle at 90 to helix
08:54 PM archivist: iirc I edited the comments in that file in 2014 so it was a bit more understandable
09:02 PM zeeshan: archivist: your slitting saw technique reminds me of what i saw at the local steam engine building meeting
09:02 PM zeeshan: a guy wanted to make checkered plate
09:02 PM zeeshan: he took like 6 slitting saws with custom spacers
09:02 PM zeeshan: and set it an angle plate =D
09:03 PM archivist: that was accepted technique, gang milling on a horizontal
09:03 PM zeeshan: pretty interesting
09:03 PM zeeshan: i woulda never really thought of doing it like that
09:04 PM zeeshan: i woulda used a v groove cutter on the cnc
09:04 PM zeeshan: :)
09:04 PM archivist: very high production rates
09:04 PM zeeshan: yes
09:04 PM zeeshan: ps
09:04 PM Crom: v groove your very limited on feed speeds
09:04 PM zeeshan: i exploded a 1/32" 2" dia slitting saw yesterday
09:04 PM zeeshan: :-)
09:05 PM archivist: I know about exploding saw blades too :)
09:05 PM zeeshan: cutting aluminum out of all things..
09:05 PM Crom: heat build up or too much torque?
09:05 PM zeeshan: too much torque
09:05 PM archivist: must lube and must clamp properly
09:05 PM zeeshan: i feel like that slitting saw should be running at 3000 rpm
09:05 PM zeeshan: but it was only running at 800
09:06 PM Crom: ooops
09:06 PM archivist: mine was a clamping error
09:06 PM zeeshan: and i was feeding 0.0004"/tooth
09:06 PM Crom: at 3000 or 800?
09:06 PM zeeshan: 800
09:06 PM zeeshan: it doesnt matter
09:06 PM zeeshan: its inches per tooth!
09:06 PM zeeshan: :P
09:07 PM zeeshan: archivist: now trhat i think about it
09:07 PM zeeshan: my setup was not rigid
09:07 PM zeeshan: that might be the reason why it broke
09:07 PM Crom: so 0.00008 /tooth is a better feed?
09:08 PM zeeshan: i think feed and speed was fine
09:08 PM archivist: it spat the work out the side of the machine :)
09:08 PM zeeshan: archivist is right, it was rigidty
09:09 PM Crom: ok flex caused the saw to bind, and that pulled it apart
09:55 PM Tom_itx is now known as Tom_L
09:55 PM jym: Can hydralic fittings work on lpg?
09:56 PM Tom_L: have you tried them?
09:57 PM Tom_L: i'm guessing fittings are designed to be different on purpose
09:57 PM jym: Tom_L: this is an extension of an earlier conversation
09:58 PM jym: but they look like steel, so nm.
10:11 PM jym: Crom: This isn't half bad, other than indoor use only... http://www.webstaurantstore.com/ts-ag-5d-safe-t-link-3-4-npt-quick-disconnect-gas-hose-component/510AG5D.html
10:12 PM Crom: I like the fusable link in it...
10:14 PM Crom: hydraulic fittings are more designed for high pressure, rather than low pressure, high flow
10:14 PM Crom: $40 not a bad price for that gas connector
10:15 PM jym: Crom: Yeah, I didn't think so either. and I think it's $40 for BOTH halfs too
10:15 PM jym: but, indoor only =(
10:17 PM jym: Crom: it's the only 3/4 NPT I've found , but still looking.
10:18 PM Crom: https://www.google.com/express/product/12635486938904178067_150146950599228715_8613692?mall=Arizona&directCheckout=1&utm_source=google_shopping&utm_medium=product_ads
10:20 PM Crom: nm 3/8 flare on that
10:22 PM evilroot: Hmm
10:22 PM * evilroot is working with pneumatic linear actuators at the moment
10:23 PM Crom: https://www.amazon.com/DORMONT-A75-4-Inch-Quick-Disconnect/dp/B00ELID1WG/ref=pd_bxgy_328_2?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=B00ELID1WG&pd_rd_r=ZN8K7WT8RQE1NKABTQ0B&pd_rd_w=VgXg9&pd_rd_wg=Thdm0&psc=1&refRID=ZN8K7WT8RQE1NKABTQ0B#productDetails
10:24 PM Crom: jym, last link doesn't mention indoor only
10:25 PM Crom: jym, https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00KXOX9HY/ref=s9_acsd_hps_bw_c_x_4_w 1" pipe size
10:26 PM Crom: jym, heh they have one for 1 1/4" pipe.... $158
10:29 PM jym: Crom: Bah, the specs say indoor only
10:29 PM jym: http://www.dormont.com/products/qd
10:30 PM jym: Water coil https://www.amazon.com/Bunn-12689-1-Bunn-O-Matic-Brewer-381596/dp/B00DBPJM5U/ref=pd_day0_328_5?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=B00DBPJM5U&pd_rd_r=8881QGXYQV5ZT3KKA02E&pd_rd_w=ynMpb&pd_rd_wg=tq13q&psc=1&refRID=8881QGXYQV5ZT3KKA02E
10:31 PM evilroot: It's surprisingly difficult finding the right kind of valves
10:31 PM evilroot: They simply have two ports, and the position changes given the difference in pressure between the sides
10:31 PM evilroot: But most valves are on/of
10:32 PM evilroot: Or very difficult to drive with a motor
10:32 PM Crom: found the spec sheet at dorman gr^*&^^
10:35 PM jym: Crom: BASTARDS... "Safety Quik and Swivel MAX are not for use in temperatures lower than 32°F (0°C) and are for indoor use only."
10:35 PM jym: Crom: Temps = frickin snow on the ground! lol
10:35 PM jym: Crom: "Hey, I know... I'll grab the torch and defrost the gas quick connect !!!"
10:38 PM Crom: hehe... yeah for outdoor gas connections you'll want water catches inside the building...
10:39 PM jym: water catches?
10:39 PM Crom: t
10:39 PM jym: Still dont get it
10:40 PM jym: I fond dorman's outdoor quick connects, but I only see 1/2"
10:40 PM jym: found*
10:40 PM Crom: section of pipe with t's so water drops will fall to the bottom of the catch pipes
10:40 PM jym: Why would I need a drop loop OUTDOORS?
10:40 PM jym: drip loop*
10:41 PM jym: you saw a pick of the existing piping =)
10:41 PM jym: pic*
10:41 PM jym: Nice, -40F too
10:42 PM Crom: jym keep water from freezing in quick connects...
10:42 PM jym: ah, gotcha
10:43 PM jym: Crom: http://www.webstaurantstore.com/dormont-30d-10qd-portable-outdoor-gas-connector-with-quick-disconnect-for-natural-gas-and-liquid-propane-appliances-1-2-x-10/3203010QD.html
10:44 PM Crom: they have a 12' as well
10:45 PM jym: Crom: I really dont want the hose, just the Quic fittings
10:45 PM Crom: page 24! http://media.wattswater.com/C-D-Wholesale.pdf
10:45 PM jym: Crom: I figure that at 50ft at 5psi, I'll need the larger volume
10:46 PM Crom: dorman 7031-4142 3/4 quick connect mobile home connector
10:46 PM Crom: also 1"
10:47 PM Crom: for pool heaters, we come off the meter with 1 1/2", run that up to 100', then drop to 3/4" for the last 2'
10:48 PM jym: Crom: 1.5" ?
10:48 PM Crom: yep...
10:48 PM Crom: we ran 1.5" PE the yellow gas line
10:49 PM jym: But that's underground only
10:49 PM jym: Crom: I'm just tyring to get past the resistance of the 50ft
10:49 PM Crom: true... but for low pressure gas to go 100' for a 65Kbtu heater... took a 1.5" line
10:50 PM Crom: how many btu?
10:50 PM jym: let me look...
10:50 PM Crom: oops... not 65k it was 250kbtu
10:51 PM jym: 60K btu... http://www.homedepot.com/p/Dyna-Glo-Pro-60K-BTU-Forced-Air-Propane-Portable-Heater-RMC-FA60DGP/202223041
10:51 PM jym: let me find the draw...
10:52 PM jym: 2.8lbs/hr
10:52 PM jym: 1.8lbs/hr for the lower setting (30K btu)
10:53 PM jym: or a 20lb tank empty in 14 hours =)
10:53 PM jym: and I'm guessing thats on low =)
10:54 PM jym: Yep, on low.
10:54 PM Crom: 1" would be fine for the line. 0241058 7030-4142 dormont quick connect
10:54 PM jym: the pipe is only 3/4" =)
10:55 PM Crom: http://kscdirect.com/item/DOR%2B7030-4142/DORMONT%2BMANUFACTURING%2BCOMPANY_40-4142-24%2BSuprSafe%2B%2B%25283%252F4%2522%2BMIP%2Bx%2B3%252F4%2522%2BFIP%2529%252C%2B1%252F2%2522%2BQD%252C%2BDust%2BCap%2B%2526%2BDust%2BPlug
10:55 PM jym: http://www.dormont.com/products/series_7000
10:55 PM Crom: $100
10:56 PM jym: ouch
10:57 PM Crom: 3/4" $78 http://kscdirect.com/item/DOR%2B7120-4142/DORMONT%2BMANUFACTURING%2BCOMPANY_7120-4142
10:57 PM jym: Order QTY must be in multiples of 10
10:57 PM jym: I don't evne need the hose, just the connector
10:59 PM Crom: you order it how you can get it... search for that part number...
11:00 PM jym: yep, I get it, thanks.
11:04 PM jym: Crom: the yellow tubing... is there NTP fittings for it?
11:04 PM jym: NPT*
11:04 PM mrpackethead: .02/.06/.06
11:04 PM Crom: http://www.shop.groebner.com/advancedwebpage.aspx?cg=542&cd=3&SKUTYPE=202&SKUFLD=SKU&DM=1250&WEBID=7249
11:05 PM Crom: you have to get either the risers (90 degree elbow) or straight adapter that you have to fuse 0n to the pipe.
11:05 PM jym: ah
11:06 PM Crom: you can get T's, reducers in PE...
11:06 PM Crom: which fuse onto the pipe
11:07 PM jym: Yeah, at $30 each =(
11:07 PM Crom: PE pipe == medium rigid plastic tubing
11:07 PM jym: Crom: fark it... this and a garden hose... http://www.homedepot.com/p/Sioux-Chief-5-8-in-x-3-4-in-Brass-Barb-x-MIP-Adapter-903-41253001/202254896
11:07 PM Crom: I think we spent $10 to $20 for Ts risers weren't cheap... but it got added into the quote... so we were still making money
11:08 PM Crom: jym don't get caught by the fire marshall
11:09 PM jym: $42?! http://www.homedepot.com/p/HOME-FLEX-Underground-Yellow-Poly-Gas-Pipe-Transition-to-1-in-IPS-to-1-in-MIP-18-445-010/300867548
11:09 PM jym: Crom: Nah, I'd like to, but yeah...
11:09 PM jym: Crom: This isn't a "hold my beer..." moment =)
11:19 PM jym: Crom: Hoe do I calc the diameter I really need for a 50ft run at 60K BTUs?
11:19 PM jym: how*
11:22 PM Crom: there are charts... lemme look
11:24 PM Crom: www.endot.com/OpenFile.aspx?path=21eb7_0.pdf&Type=1&pid=34
11:24 PM Crom: 98Kbtu 50' 3/4"
11:24 PM Crom: 48kbtu 50' 1/2"
11:30 PM Crom: PE is best bought from suppliers... I use PEP Pool and Electrical Products. Not hard to get an account
11:33 PM jym: Crom: oh hey, by that chart LPG is 114K BTU for 50ft is 1/2"
11:34 PM jym: Wait, it says liquid propane, but I'm pushing gas
11:34 PM Crom: yep
11:34 PM jym: but the footer says low pressure, which would be gas, no?
11:35 PM jym: "LP Gas flow is given in thousands of BTU/hr."
11:35 PM Crom: nope... this chart refers to low pressure after regualation so gad
11:35 PM Crom: gas
11:35 PM jym: maybe just nomenclature and not literal?
11:35 PM Crom: I think so...
11:36 PM jym: Wel, then that's even better! 1/2 fittings/hose would be cheaper and more available
11:38 PM Crom: oh lpg is at 11" not 3.5" no wonder the super btu ratings
11:38 PM jym: NG is 3.5" ?
11:38 PM Crom: I was thinking you were doing Natural gas
11:38 PM jym: Low pressure(5psi) propane
11:38 PM Crom: inches of water pressure
11:39 PM jym: 11" WC ~= 5 psi iirc
11:39 PM Wolf_: I get to do all this same shit at some point to hook up a cook top and water heater in my house...
11:40 PM jym: Wolf_: make it a tankless =)
11:40 PM Wolf_: except I need to install a reg and tank as well
11:40 PM Wolf_: it is a tankless heater
11:40 PM Wolf_: propane
11:40 PM jym: nice
11:41 PM jym: Wolf_: We had the swater supply lines replaced. The plumber forgot to turn the WH from pilot to ON again. In the morning it DID heat the water enough to take a shower, but would take all day to heat back up.
11:41 PM Crom: propane water heaters are expensive. tanked kind... tankless is about the same price as a natural gas
11:41 PM Wolf_: I was going to do 2 tankless heaters, one for hydronic underfloor heat but now I’m think of doing that with a solar array and holding thank
11:41 PM jym: I tell you this because that little fucking pilot light burns enough to heat a water heater in 24 hours.
11:42 PM Wolf_: yeah, tanked water heaters are a waste imo
11:42 PM XXCoder: considering solar water heater?
11:42 PM Wolf_: yup
11:42 PM jym: Propane tankless are more expensive than tanked, but the savings....
11:42 PM XXCoder: nice
11:42 PM jym: Wolf_: whare are you on the planet?
11:43 PM XXCoder: thats not common here as it could freeze in winter
11:43 PM Wolf_: 45 min north of DC
11:43 PM XXCoder: I know of only one guy, he drains hoses when it gets close to freezing
11:43 PM Crom: I think we had 3 days with freezing last year
11:43 PM Wolf_: I was going to set it up as a gravity draining array w/ open loop holding thank
11:43 PM Wolf_: tank*
11:44 PM jym: Wolf_: have tou looked at geothermal?
11:44 PM XXCoder: I heard of driveway water warming
11:45 PM Wolf_: yeah, just a heat pump w/ a water heat exchanger on both ends
11:45 PM jym: Wolf_: solar is great, when there's sun. geothermal works all year long, no matter what the temp is.
11:45 PM XXCoder: in winter its to keep it ice free, and in summers, warming water
11:45 PM Wolf_: and $10k to have a well drilled
11:45 PM jym: Wolf_: there are horitontal and vertical ones.
11:46 PM jym: Wolf_: $10K is cheap in comparison. below frostline it's a constant 56F all year long.
11:46 PM Wolf_: yeah, horizontal means digging a 4’ deep 6’ wide trench 100’ long
11:46 PM Wolf_: and my ground is rocky clay
11:46 PM jym: Wolf_: gimme a few, I'll grab a video I found.
11:46 PM Wolf_: I looked in to it already
11:46 PM Crom: wooo that would be a great air conditioner for me
11:47 PM Wolf_: I could do a pond loop as well, but the pond is about 400’ from the house
11:48 PM XXCoder: I wonder if glass hothouse would work as water warmer
11:48 PM XXCoder: sine it keeps heat in it would last. add big barrels of sealed water so it retains heat for long time once heated
11:48 PM jym: Wolf_: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c2mO0pI_tCE
11:49 PM jym: Wolf_: https://blog.heatspring.com/how-can-i-design-geothermal-systems-a-4-step-guide-to-designing-geothermal/
11:49 PM Wolf_: jym: the hydronic underfloor heat is aux for my house, also have a 180k btu wood pellet stove and Mitsu mini split system
11:50 PM jym: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kRQuKyQAbtM
11:50 PM jym: Wolf_: I REALLY like that last video, very informative I thought
11:50 PM XXCoder: I hate how any energy videos always links to bullshit over-unity
11:51 PM Wolf_: derp, 50k btu on the wood pellet stove, will heat 2200 sq ft, my house is only 1400
11:52 PM jym: Wolf_: you still have to buy/store/handle/ pellets
11:53 PM Wolf_: yeah, no kidding, had the pellet stove for 2 years now
11:53 PM jym: =)
11:53 PM jym: Wolf_: And i have a wood stove, so handling cord wood like 11 times before it even gets burned
11:53 PM XXCoder: theres pellet maker
11:53 PM XXCoder: if you run a wood shop, its handy
11:54 PM Wolf_: 42k btu Mitsu Mr Slim outdoor unit w/ 5 indoor splits, I should be fine lol
11:54 PM XXCoder: https://woodgears.ca/reader/alois/press.html
11:55 PM jym: Wolf_: You r clay soil.... we have TWO lava layers here, so not gonna happen.
11:55 PM XXCoder: thin soil around here
11:55 PM XXCoder: then its rocks all way dopwn
11:56 PM Wolf_: its all rock and clay in my yard
11:56 PM XXCoder: its due to geographically recent flash flood nat end of ice age
11:56 PM Wolf_: any digging is done with a excavator
11:56 PM jym: Still, $10K is well worth it. Especially if when you get a $550/mo electric bill =)
11:57 PM Wolf_: mini split won’t pull that much
11:57 PM jym: Wolf_: whats the low temp in the winter?
11:58 PM Wolf_: teens in F
11:58 PM jym: and the mini split works well? doens't go into defrost cycle often?
11:58 PM Wolf_: granted this winter was odd, 15 one day, 70 the next
11:59 PM Wolf_: the one I got is rated to umm
11:59 PM XXCoder: pooping wood https://woodgears.ca/reader/alois/26-b.jpg