Back
[00:17:50] <pink_vampire> hi
[00:18:34] <pink_vampire> I wasn't in front of the computer for long time.
[00:38:33] <SpeedEvil> h
[00:51:56] <cyborg_ar> is there a way to make a hardware button call a python script, that in turn can set/reset signals in the HAL? I dont need this to be realtime but the logic is pretty complex and it would be annoying to make the whole logic circuit using hal components
[01:03:17] <enleth> cyborg_ar: try classicladder for something inbetween
[01:03:31] <enleth> works for me, even though the editor makes me want to puke
[01:06:32] * jymmm tosses a bucket at enleth
[01:06:42] <jymmm> you do, you clean it up
[01:07:47] <enleth> keep the bucket, I've seen worse, but if I had to choose a single piece of linuxcnc that's in a direst need of an overhaul, it's the ladder editor
[01:08:32] <enleth> just updating it to the upstream version would make a difference, but the upstream is still hideous
[01:08:50] <cyborg_ar> hehe
[01:09:05] <cyborg_ar> i guess i can try classicladder
[01:09:22] <cyborg_ar> what i want to do is kinda stupid anyway
[01:09:31] <enleth> the signal and variable windows are a crime against UI design
[01:09:37] <jymmm> cyborg_ar: I can hold your beer for ya
[01:09:49] <cyborg_ar> i wanna make a button (actually a pair of buttons at arms separation) that goes through all the steps to bring the machine up after estop
[01:10:07] <enleth> cyborg_ar: definitely sounds like a job for some ladder logic
[01:10:27] <cyborg_ar> that is, at first push turn the machine on, second push homes all axis, third push starts the program
[01:10:28] <jymmm> Sounds like a job for a safety relay
[01:10:51] <cyborg_ar> once the program is over pushing the two buttons again restarts it
[01:11:08] <cyborg_ar> it works fine till you hit estop, or the machine reboots
[01:12:07] <enleth> cyborg_ar: map the buttons directly to classicladder inputs, make a simple state machine using the bit (%B) relays
[01:13:03] <cyborg_ar> i guess i will give it a try, it does sound better than putting an assload of flipflops and gates in the hal file
[01:13:21] <cyborg_ar> it wouldnt be so bad if you didnt have to manually number them
[01:13:31] <enleth> definitely
[01:14:07] <enleth> the native hal logic is IMO almost unusable because you can't easily make self-contained logic modules
[01:14:32] <cyborg_ar> but yeah the way this machine is to be used needs to be simple, two interlocking buttons plus estop
[01:14:38] <enleth> at least not without allocating a shitload of unused logic device instances and maintaining ranges used by modules
[01:14:58] <cyborg_ar> it always does the same steps. so operator loads material, and presses buttons that ensure hands are not in the choppy bits
[01:15:49] <enleth> make a finger-sized guard around the buttons, to be sure they don't kick or headbutt one of them?
[01:16:01] <cyborg_ar> they are flush
[01:16:24] <enleth> good. never underestimate the creativity of a machine operator
[01:16:28] <cyborg_ar> also i am thinking of adding an interlock timer to ensure they dont just jam one permanently
[01:16:37] <enleth> doable in cl too.
[01:16:38] <cyborg_ar> i've seen that one
[01:16:48] <jymmm> Use a safety relay
[01:17:02] <cyborg_ar> how does the safety relay home the machine?
[01:17:13] <jymmm> NEVER trust computer control for safety.
[01:17:25] <jymmm> If the computer fucks up, the fingers are still there.
[01:17:42] <cyborg_ar> i dont, estop cuts power to the drives on top of signaling linuxcnc
[01:17:53] <cyborg_ar> anyway this machine is horribly designed
[01:18:02] <cyborg_ar> so i dont really care much about safety
[01:18:05] <enleth> jymmm: if he has a separate electrical estop, this should be fine
[01:18:14] <cyborg_ar> the controller board has no charge pump
[01:18:33] <cyborg_ar> it doesnt even have the enable line wired to the drives
[01:18:58] <cyborg_ar> i wish they had given this to me to design from scratch instead of buying an of the shelf shit one
[01:22:41] <enleth> cyborg_ar: you can put on-delay timers right where the button signals enter a ladder rung, set like a 1s on-delay, route the timer output to halui.estop.activate or something
[01:23:07] <enleth> cyborg_ar: and inform the operators that holding any of the buttons longer than 1s will just trip the estop
[01:23:16] <enleth> or 5s or whatever
[01:23:31] <Jymmmm> bah got disconnected
[01:23:59] <cyborg_ar> not necessary, you just need to make one shots on both buttons of <1s if the buttons get hit with more than a second difference between eachother it is as if they werent pressed at all
[01:24:18] <enleth> cyborg_ar: pulse timer, then
[01:24:22] <cyborg_ar> yep
[01:24:23] <enleth> cyborg_ar: set to 1s
[01:26:29] <enleth> I'd have sent you the CL config on my mill to give you some ideas, but the PC controlling it doesn't have WOL enabled
[01:26:43] <enleth> I can do that later today, though
[01:26:48] <cyborg_ar> it's ok i get the idea
[01:27:19] <cyborg_ar> i was kinda dreading the idea of using CL because it looks like shit, but seems to be the only thing flexible enough to do this properly
[01:27:27] <cyborg_ar> it is also easier to verify and document
[01:27:32] <enleth> you bet it does
[01:27:38] <enleth> the editing part, mostly
[01:27:45] <cyborg_ar> than a spaghetti hal netlist
[01:27:46] <enleth> it works really well, though
[01:28:05] <enleth> and the backend code that actually simulates the rungs appears to be solid
[01:28:08] <cyborg_ar> at least for people that frequent a factory floor
[01:28:14] <cyborg_ar> electricians know ladder
[01:29:02] <enleth> even if you don't, it's simple enough to learn
[01:29:55] <cyborg_ar> yeah it is a relay diagram drawn sideways
[01:30:36] <enleth> actually, in some parts of the world that's the correct orientation on paper as well
[01:30:49] <cyborg_ar> neat
[01:31:24] <cyborg_ar> my electrician training was in argentina so i'm mostly used to their conventions, the US has a lot of differences
[01:31:56] <enleth> I'm pretty sure it's OK to draw vertical ladders here, in Poland as well
[01:32:23] <enleth> probably a remnant of Soviet engineering practices
[01:33:41] <MrSunshine> gah trying to find how many turns there is on a microwave oven transformer ... cant find anything about it :/ thinking of trying to make myself a simple magnet drilling machine =)
[01:34:06] <enleth> MrSunshine: get two of the same, cut one apart?
[01:34:22] <enleth> primary or secondary?
[01:34:40] <enleth> primary should be trivial, the wire is quite thick and should be accessible to a pair of calipers
[01:34:49] <MrSunshine> enleth: well both ... to calculate what currents/voltages needed with each for what holding power =)
[01:35:10] <MrSunshine> as the secondary should require higher voltage and less current =)
[01:35:43] <cyborg_ar> well for voltages and current you can use the power of the microwave
[01:35:52] <cyborg_ar> as a pretty good estimate
[01:36:05] <enleth> MrSunshine: measure wire diameter, measure winding cross-section, divide, multiply by a packing factor of 0.8-0.9
[01:36:06] <cyborg_ar> microwave secondaries are in the range of 2000V
[01:36:33] <MrSunshine> so that would be about 1:10 then for voltage stepup
[01:36:42] <MrSunshine> in sweden
[01:36:54] <enleth> sounds about right
[01:37:22] <enleth> see if the secondary wire diameter is 1/10th of the primary wire's, and the widing cross-section is about the same
[01:37:25] <MrSunshine> and from videos i would say its about 6x8 or 6x10 turns on the primary
[01:48:39] <archivist> use both primary and secondary
[01:49:09] <MrSunshine> just series them or ?
[01:49:19] <MrSunshine> but i wanted to reduce the height of it maybe also =)
[01:50:30] <archivist> parallel
[01:50:40] <MrSunshine> hmm
[01:50:53] <MrSunshine> would that help ? =)
[01:52:14] <archivist> the magnetic force is related to ampere turns so yes, but the best is a rewind
[01:55:55] <enleth> MrSunshine: incidentally, Make It Extreme just posted a microwave transformer electromagnet build
[01:56:17] <MrSunshine> enleth: yeah =)
[01:56:21] <MrSunshine> thats where the idea was born
[01:56:29] <enleth> they just removed the secondaries, which appears to be good idea
[01:56:33] <MrSunshine> but no info on holding powers etc
[01:56:57] <MrSunshine> just showing some .. but not actualy how much force. .a nd i want to know what one magnet could do in force =)
[01:57:36] <enleth> if you want to maximize it without making new windings, get two transformers, cut them open like they did and push two primaries onto a single core
[01:57:39] <enleth> then connect in parallel
[01:57:59] <enleth> should do the trick nicely
[01:58:17] <MrSunshine> enleth: yeah but the amps would be throught the roof and it would be very high =)
[01:58:32] <enleth> depends on the voltage you apply
[01:59:25] <archivist> amps*number of turns, so there is a compromise
[02:00:29] <MrSunshine> but wouldnt more turns be able to supply the same magnetic force at a lower amp ? =)
[02:00:38] <archivist> basically fill the space with copper that has enough resistance(dc_/inductance(ac) for the voltage to not get too hot
[02:31:40] <Deejay> moin
[05:56:50] <jthornton> morning
[05:57:05] <XXCoder> hey jthornton
[05:57:14] <XXCoder> man work bought in 10 machines
[05:57:20] <jthornton> what's up this morning?
[05:58:00] <jthornton> I saw that yesterday
[05:58:47] <XXCoder> found out it wasnt bought
[05:58:56] <XXCoder> it was just from sister company that went down
[06:02:15] <SpeedEvil> :/
[06:02:47] <XXCoder> yeah. boing taking a BIG hit affected us pretty badly
[06:04:24] <XXCoder> *boeing
[06:07:12] <XXCoder> if I get laid off I wonder how easy for me to find another machinist job
[06:17:42] <jthornton> http://www.seattletimes.com/business/boeing-aerospace/boeing-outruns-airbus-in-value-of-jets-delivered-in-2016/
[06:21:10] <XXCoder> hmm might be recovering. hope spo
[07:05:27] <Wolf_> morning
[07:06:17] <XXCoder> hey the pre-dog
[07:09:19] <Wolf_> haha
[07:10:41] <archivist> oops
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/162346983636?ul_noapp=true
[07:11:13] <archivist> I only want to measure the voltages
[07:11:25] <XXCoder> lol first result of "pre-dog"
http://naturalhistory.si.edu/lewisandclark/images/Black-tailed_prairie_dog.jpg
[07:11:38] <XXCoder> second:
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/e8/ff/f1/e8fff12d885e7bc5943340c5b5c1e9f2.jpg
[07:11:43] <XXCoder> neither is real dog :P
[07:12:24] <Wolf_> archivist: lol, the mi5 should have a circuit voltage for the probe as well right?
[07:12:42] <archivist> yes
[07:12:56] <Wolf_> mine should be here tomorrow
[07:13:00] <archivist> not found any docs for it
[07:14:16] <archivist> another aaaaaarguino came home in my pocket today, had to go fetch from the post office
[07:14:25] <Wolf_> lol
[07:14:38] <Wolf_> I now sorta have a spare mega2560 I can use
[07:15:16] <archivist> ordered a couple of the 4x20 LCDs so I can fix and remove the code for my LCDs
[07:15:51] <archivist> then....merge calibration and probe into one
[07:16:29] <Wolf_> could just make the LCD calls use a library so it won’t effect what LCD type is used (i2c or w/e)
[07:16:51] <XXCoder> can mega2560 be used for something not 3d printer?
[07:17:00] <Wolf_> but I haven’t looked at your code yet.
[07:17:05] <archivist> well mine has an odd character set
[07:17:29] <Wolf_> ahh, well with the 4x20 you can switch lol
[07:17:47] <archivist> have to replace . with , and - with + to look right
[07:19:05] <jthornton> XXCoder: you can use an arduino for anything you want
[07:19:07] <Wolf_> weird
[07:19:20] <XXCoder> hm ok heh
[07:19:35] <Wolf_> yeah, the mega is just a bigger arduino (more i/o pins)
[07:19:44] <archivist> you will need to join AA arguino anon
[07:20:14] <Wolf_> hey I have less than 10 of them on the desk
[07:21:46] <Wolf_> I think...
[07:27:37] <Wolf_> load cell and hx711 will be here today anyways
[07:33:31] <archivist> hmm this pro mini is different, a clone of a clone
[07:33:53] <Wolf_> weird lol
[07:34:01] <Wolf_> diffrent pinout?
[07:35:31] <XXCoder> first result of clone of a clone.
http://learn.genetics.utah.edu/content/cloning/cloningmyths/images/instantclones.gif
[07:37:03] <archivist> same pinout different LED locations
[07:40:03] <_methods> yeah there are may diff clone versions
[07:40:25] <Wolf_> just diff layout/board routing
[07:40:28] <_methods> i think it all depends on what chip they had a rejected pile of laying around
[07:41:22] <_methods> usually the pins will stay the same but they'll use diff components
[07:41:55] <_methods> diff board layouts
[07:42:17] <_methods> jthornton: did you say you were in kansas city?
[07:42:34] <_methods> auction coming up there on the 19th
[07:43:03] <_methods> http://www.myronbowling.com/Auctions/LSI-Midwest-Lighting-875C50.html
[07:43:05] <jthornton> opposite corner of mo
[07:43:09] <_methods> ah ok
[07:43:11] <jthornton> poplar bluff
[07:43:26] <_methods> looks like it was a pretty nice shop
[07:43:36] <_methods> probably be a good auction
[07:44:52] <_methods> nice little amada press brake
[07:45:25] <_methods> http://www.myronbowling.com/_filelib/ImageGallery/2016_Auction_Images/LSI/LSI_JPGs/DSC_0658.JPG
[07:45:57] <_methods> http://www.myronbowling.com/_filelib/ImageGallery/2016_Auction_Images/LSI/LSI_JPGs/DSC_0628.JPG
[07:46:07] <_methods> that 2nd one might go in your shop a little easier
[07:46:30] <archivist> getting the last orders out the door by the look of it
[07:46:54] <_methods> http://www.myronbowling.com/_filelib/ImageGallery/2016_Auction_Images/LSI/LSI_JPGs/DSC_0579.JPG
[07:47:00] <_methods> nice little slip roll
[07:48:31] <archivist> I went to a local auction and one of the machines was still running parts
[07:48:43] <_methods> yeah you see that quite a bit
[07:48:52] <_methods> a lot of auction places like the machines to stay under power
[07:48:57] <_methods> so people can see them working
[07:49:06] <_methods> running jobs is even better
[07:49:45] <_methods> http://www.myronbowling.com/_filelib/ImageGallery/2016_Auction_Images/LSI/LSI_JPGs/LSI-056.jpg
[07:49:59] <_methods> punch sharpener i think
[07:51:27] <_methods> oh yeah it is
[07:51:34] <_methods> http://www.myronbowling.com/_filelib/ImageGallery/2016_Auction_Images/LSI/LSI_JPGs/DSC_0685.JPG
[07:51:39] <_methods> better pic of it
[07:51:44] <_methods> or a 2nd one i guess
[07:51:50] <gregcnc> not a pizza oven?
[07:51:53] <_methods> not
[07:51:55] <_methods> lol
[07:52:22] <_methods> http://www.amada.com/america/generalfabrication-toolgrinder
[07:54:07] <gregcnc> no idea what it's for. punch tooling?
[07:54:27] <_methods> yeah
[07:54:44] <_methods> it's an automatic grinder
[07:54:54] <_methods> so you don't have to set up grinding jigs on surface grinder
[07:56:09] <gregcnc> so easy your mom can run it?
[07:57:10] <_methods> yeah
[07:57:15] <_methods> that's the premise basically
[07:57:36] <_methods> i still always cringe letting "operators" load punch tooling
[07:58:06] <_methods> the consequences are much more extreme than on a cnc mill or lathe
[07:58:14] <_methods> or i should say can be
[07:59:37] <gregcnc> mismatching dies or just improper loading? i don't know anything about them other then what they do
[07:59:50] <_methods> mismatching or loading them unoriented
[08:00:06] <_methods> i spent 16 hours trying to get a ram unjammed one time
[08:00:31] <_methods> operator loaded a rectangle punch and die crossed
[08:00:34] <_methods> +
[08:00:39] <_methods> was not pretty
[08:01:22] <_methods> or improper clearance between punch and die
[08:01:29] <_methods> makes for some lovely material jams
[08:02:19] <gregcnc> just like anything else lots of room for error, even if it looks simple enough
[08:08:30] * jthornton just remembered his print from the other day and it went wrong... horribly wrong
[08:14:11] <_methods> did you make some squiggly plastic
[08:14:28] <_methods> it didn't go burn down the house wrong did it?
[08:15:00] <jthornton> made a few layers ok then it detached and wow what a mess it even threw the Y belt off
[08:15:16] <_methods> nice
[08:19:42] <_methods> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1qsR1VEdTPxCcEcoxiFMYMWCLAmWcv3vHLnozDRr2X_0/edit#gid=1330635981
[08:19:48] <_methods> great googly moogly
[09:27:36] * JT-Shop thinks he figured out what when wrong with the print, cura default layer height is 0.1mm and PETG don't like that
[09:28:42] <Wolf_> too low?
[09:30:27] <JT-Shop> yea 0.2mm is the min for PETG
[09:31:16] <JT-Shop> I think it curls up if too thin, I started a print again and on the second layer it started to mess up
[09:33:26] <Wolf_> something else to add to my PETG notes lol
[10:56:22] <gregcnc> another kickunstarter
http://tinyurl.com/zrm4sco
[10:58:21] <archivist> tinyurl does something to my pc before the redirect
[10:58:57] <archivist> but the drone phail was on the bbc website today as well
[11:00:44] <gregcnc> https://techcrunch.com/2017/01/11/unable-to-fund-production-of-its-camera-drone-lily-will-shut-down-and-refund-customers/
[11:00:47] <archivist> I hear the disk thrash for a number of seconds with the tiny url before it redirects
[11:01:19] <archivist> I am wondering what tracking and cookies they throw out
[11:01:50] <gregcnc> all failed or unfunded projects should be posted to kickstopper
[11:03:05] <gregcnc> there was some board game that set a record for funding last week maybe?
[12:04:59] <JT-Shop> finally getting a good PETG print
[12:22:39] <ktchk> anyone looked at Maslowcnc a big wood router?
[12:33:28] <Wolf_> well, thats a neat looking setup...
[12:34:10] <Wolf_> I wonder what the tolerance is on a #25 roller chain tho
[12:34:53] <ktchk> the gear motor is set at 8148 pluses per rev and .4mm per movement
[12:35:18] <Wolf_> yeah, the motor is accurate, but $1 per foot chain on the other hand?
[12:35:52] <ktchk> for wood large as 4x8 feet 1mm is good
[12:36:21] <Wolf_> I think you are missing my point, whats the build tolarance on the chain
[12:36:40] <Wolf_> could be much as 1/8” over 4-5 feet…
[12:37:18] <ktchk> a tensioned chain with weight on both side can handle 1mm
[12:38:12] <Wolf_> never mind, I’ll have to look it up
[12:38:37] <ktchk> I sent the pcb to be Gerber
[12:40:07] <ktchk> to build the ground control software I installed the ubuntu 16.04 for python 2.7.11 on a new hard disk
[12:40:51] <ktchk> but still trying to get the geared motor
[12:41:54] <Wolf_> well tolerance on the sprocket for #25 chain can be 0.007” on machined and 0.021" on hot rolled
[12:42:37] <Wolf_> that might be per tooth on the gear...
[12:46:28] <Wolf_> but what I was saying is what is the tolerance between pins on the roller chain
[12:47:06] <Wolf_> seeing its mass produced stamped/punched out steel plate
[12:48:07] <ktchk> Maybe timing belt is better
[12:49:28] <Wolf_> don’t get me wrong, its a really cool idea for large format machine to make neat looking things with
[12:50:16] <IchGucksLive> hi
[12:51:05] <IchGucksLive> Deejay: there is a hevy night expected
[12:51:59] <ktchk> one thing I can not get through is the gear and sensor combination
[12:52:14] <IchGucksLive> ktchk: watch the ratio at your location its offen not equal
[12:52:33] <IchGucksLive> 27.85 EQ 30
[12:52:58] <ktchk> inch?
[12:53:49] <IchGucksLive> no the gearing is most not planatary its a mix inside
[12:54:21] <IchGucksLive> so you get not exact or stepping off precision
[12:54:24] <ktchk> right and 200:1 as Bar said
[12:54:25] <Wolf_> and having done cabinet work, 1mm on a 4’x8’ sheet isn’t good, make waste piece really quick
[12:56:39] <IchGucksLive> ktchk: 198.05
[12:57:00] <ktchk> how did you get that
[12:57:29] <ktchk> the geared motor??
[12:57:42] <IchGucksLive> based on 100:1 inside shiftments
[12:57:47] <IchGucksLive> i got one here
[12:58:35] <ktchk> the sensor? how many pulses?
[12:59:46] <IchGucksLive> can you give me the bar redings to look at
[13:00:59] <ktchk> the 8148 pluses per rev means 194:1 gear with a 42 pulses counter disk
[13:02:23] <IchGucksLive> did you check the full rev is shown
[13:02:58] <IchGucksLive> ill do a 100mm round bar on it with a 6mm pin on side
[13:03:04] <ktchk> no that is in the design table
[13:03:31] <IchGucksLive> the dial is zero placed on the 6mm pin and then full 360
[13:04:07] <IchGucksLive> then if ofset i do minimal step and step by to see dial zero
[13:04:27] <IchGucksLive> best on my oppinion
[13:06:03] <ktchk> you put the counter on the main shift instead on the motor?
[13:07:00] <Wolf_> makes more sense to me being a servo (right?) then you take the gear train error out? I think
[13:07:41] <IchGucksLive> a 10000 counter is only 34 HKD
[13:08:07] <ktchk> but it need 8148 counts
[13:08:33] <ktchk> have to order one made
[13:08:44] <Wolf_> trying to make a exact clone of that maslow?
[13:08:53] <ktchk> right
[13:09:29] <Wolf_> 42 pulses is low res disk, you should be able to make one I think
[13:09:51] <ktchk> but not a 194:1 gear motor
[13:10:12] <Wolf_> is it using lcnc for control?
[13:10:20] <IchGucksLive> if you as i read modify the Soft so why not going for a 200Counts/rev on the motor
[13:10:39] <IchGucksLive> thats 9HKD
[13:10:54] <Wolf_> yeah ^ use what ever encoder and just adjust it in the software
[13:11:00] <IchGucksLive> and connecting is standard Hole or pin available
[13:11:34] <ktchk> read more about maslow he order a special reared motro
[13:11:59] <IchGucksLive> up to you
[13:12:06] <IchGucksLive> only gussing here in Germwany
[13:12:21] <IchGucksLive> as Storm Aproches
[13:12:22] <ktchk> look at the forum
[13:12:28] <Wolf_> doubt it, its probably something stupid like a power car seat motor that happens to have feed back for seat memory
[13:14:42] <roycroft> sturm und drang in deutschland
[13:16:45] <IchGucksLive> roycroft: schnee inclusive
[13:17:04] <roycroft> ours is mostly melted, finally
[13:17:17] <roycroft> although portland got 30cm of snow yesterday
[13:17:36] <roycroft> it barely missed us - there was snow just north of here yesterday
[13:17:39] <roycroft> but we got rain
[13:17:52] <IchGucksLive> ill hope i will be missed this night to
[13:18:05] <roycroft> i'm ready for winter to be over
[13:19:59] <IchGucksLive> winter starts here next week
[13:20:06] <IchGucksLive> return visit
[13:20:31] <IchGucksLive> ktchk: maybe its a increment absulut Bit Multiturn encoder
[13:20:48] <IchGucksLive> 8192
[13:21:09] <ktchk> it is a simple counter
[13:21:27] <ktchk> at the back of the motor
[13:21:45] <IchGucksLive> and it is broken ?
[13:22:10] <ktchk> you have one maslow?
[13:24:17] <IchGucksLive> no i use fixed ones
[13:25:16] <IchGucksLive> the 2 way push pull need gravety and tilting to be changed for partsize
[13:25:33] <ktchk> the maslow have kinematics build-in the software
[13:25:50] <IchGucksLive> and if the wire turns over it selv the meshurment is not the wanted
[13:26:12] <ktchk> not wire but chain
[13:26:16] <IchGucksLive> there is a free version out for Foam
[13:26:50] <ktchk> maslow is open source
[13:27:13] <IchGucksLive> i need to close hard day ahead if i make it to the school
[13:27:17] <IchGucksLive> Gn8
[13:27:56] <ktchk> bye
[13:36:50] <Wolf_> damn he left..
[13:53:32] <roycroft> folks, can someone tell me if the data connection from a mesa i/o anything blade to its daughter board is fairly susceptable to noise?
[13:54:01] <roycroft> what i'm thinking of is a 5i25 in the linuxcnc computer and a 7i76 in an external enclosure that contains the driver, etc.
[13:54:14] <roycroft> i don't want to bring the cable inside the external enclosure though
[13:54:41] <roycroft> i would put a db25 connector on the outside, and am thinking of an idc connector in the inside, and a piece of ribbon cable to the daughter board
[13:55:00] <roycroft> is that asking for trouble?
[13:55:36] <Tom_itx> probably not
[13:55:45] <Tom_itx> you could always wrap it in a shield
[13:55:53] <roycroft> yes
[13:56:08] <roycroft> and i could use a short, shielded cable inside, but that's pretty bulky
[13:56:13] <roycroft> ribbon cable is a lot easier to route
[13:56:26] <Tom_itx> every other one is gnd right?
[13:56:35] <roycroft> i believe so
[13:57:08] <roycroft> the goal is to be able to completely disconnect the external enclousure and remove it without having to open it up
[13:58:49] <JT-Prusa> Tom_itx: you get the update?
[13:59:00] <Tom_itx> a little birdie told me about it
[13:59:10] <Tom_itx> but i haven't had a chance to grab it yet
[13:59:43] <roycroft> maybe i'm just weird, but i cringe every time i see folks pulling cables to their enclosures and terminating them on the inside, instead of using connectors
[14:00:39] <Tom_itx> JT-Shop, i'll grab it in a bit.. gotta run a couple errands first
[14:06:51] <jdh> roycroft: you don't have enough wires
[14:39:18] <DaViruz> having a M3 on a G01-move seems to disable path blending from the G01 on the previous line, even if the moves are exactly colinear. is it possible to modify this behaviour?
[14:46:24] <DaViruz> i.e a M3 causes a stop
[14:46:36] <skunkworks> m3 is a que buster - so no. If you want to control i/o without effecting blending - look at M62 - M65
[14:47:03] <skunkworks> http://linuxcnc.org/docs/html/gcode/m-code.html#mcode:m62-m65
[14:47:05] <DaViruz> oh. of course!
[14:47:54] <DaViruz> that'll solve it. thanks!
[14:51:24] <DaViruz> hell, that'll solve another issue as well
[14:52:04] <JT-Shop> Sam is batting 1000 today :)
[16:52:33] <Deejay> gn8
[17:24:03] <MacGalempsy> Hey everyone
[17:26:11] <MacGalempsy> got the smoothing circuit soldered together, and its coming out at 69.2V
[17:26:27] <MacGalempsy> but that is ok because the max voltage on the amps is 90
[17:41:16] <zeeshan> well
[17:41:17] <zeeshan> i gotta say
[17:41:32] <zeeshan> after some experience with renishaw digital touch probe and auto tool setter
[17:41:41] <zeeshan> im impressed at how easy machining setup is
[17:41:45] <MacGalempsy> :)
[17:41:54] <zeeshan> i really need an atc :(
[17:43:13] <MacGalempsy> build one
[17:43:29] <zeeshan> basically what im thinking for work
[17:43:34] <zeeshan> every cam code has a probing routine in it
[17:44:10] <zeeshan> operator/machinist will still need to get close to the origin
[17:48:38] <sync_> for what kind of lot sizes?
[17:49:22] <zeeshan> one offs, multiples
[17:49:38] <sync_> k
[17:50:14] <zeeshan> why
[17:50:56] <sync_> well, otherwise I'd have said, model fixture and just probe automatically and not have the op do anything besides loading
[17:51:14] <zeeshan> im impressed at how fast loading tools up
[17:51:15] <zeeshan> is
[17:51:26] <zeeshan> w/ a tool setter
[17:51:33] <sync_> no shit
[17:51:55] <zeeshan> you'd be suprised at how many people don't know it
[17:52:11] <zeeshan> so i don't think its a "no shit" piece of knowledge
[17:53:03] <sync_> if I'd be running a shop a presetter would be my first investment
[17:53:07] <sync_> you save so much time
[17:53:22] <sync_> or a blum laser in the machine
[17:59:23] <zeeshan> i'd buy some machines first :)
[18:10:00] <sync_> obviously, but you know
[18:14:21] * JT-Shop2 gets started on the last part of hanging some itch in the new shop
[18:14:40] <JT-Shop2> what fun to hang itch on the roof!
[18:44:12] <MacGalempsy> itch?
[18:45:33] <Tom_itx> couple errands turned into an evening event...
[19:01:57] <Tom_itx> JT-Shop, ^^ new code running
[19:15:42] <Wolf_> so… I think I scored a good deal
[19:16:16] <pfred1> Wolf_ how'd you do that?
[19:16:57] <Wolf_> http://imgur.com/a/VvHc3
[19:17:53] <Wolf_> this is one of 5 boxes the guy I met today had sitting, sadly outside under a carport! =/
[19:17:55] <pfred1> I have a couple older Kennedy boxes
[19:18:24] <pfred1> smaller ones
[19:18:26] <Wolf_> I bought this one with all the stuff show in it
[19:19:11] <Wolf_> $80…
[19:19:25] <roycroft> too bad most of that stuff is rusted
[19:19:34] <roycroft> how much did you pay for the lot?
[19:19:44] <Wolf_> $80
[19:19:46] <pfred1> it doesn't look rusted to me
[19:19:54] <roycroft> the tool box is worth 2x that much by itself
[19:20:02] <roycroft> so you did good
[19:20:09] <Wolf_> and the last drawer has 2 drill index in it
[19:20:29] <roycroft> that mike is probably worth the $80 by itself as well
[19:20:44] <Wolf_> yeah, easily
[19:21:03] <Wolf_> I was sad to see the rule combo set so rusted
[19:21:27] <sync_> they are pretty useless imho tho
[19:21:33] <sync_> I have one, but I never use it
[19:21:36] <Wolf_> and both of the last words stick…
[19:21:48] <pfred1> I've bought old combination squares they're rasy to clean up
[19:22:05] <sync_> hm, carbide tipped caliper
[19:22:13] <roycroft> you can clean that other stuff up
[19:22:16] <roycroft> it's just surface rust
[19:22:22] <Wolf_> yeah, I noticed that pretty quick :)
[19:22:22] <roycroft> but it's still sad to see it in that condition
[19:22:30] <sync_> I never got why anybody still uses the last words tbh
[19:22:38] <roycroft> because they work?
[19:23:02] <sync_> sure, but it is 2017, I'm not gonna switch directions on an indicator
[19:23:06] <Wolf_> really, main things I need/want were the v-blocks, assorted stones and the handbook lol
[19:23:07] <sync_> or have that superlarge tip
[19:23:34] <roycroft> yes, it's nice to have the machinery's handbook drawer pre-populated for you
[19:24:00] <roycroft> i'm not saying there are not other tools that can be used to indicate things
[19:24:10] <roycroft> but i don't see a problem with a last word
[19:24:12] <roycroft> i have one
[19:24:24] <roycroft> i'm not going to toss it and replace it with something else "because it's 2017"
[19:24:27] <sync_> exposed linkage and the switch is a no
[19:24:35] <roycroft> but mine works
[19:24:42] <roycroft> why should i replace something that works?
[19:24:48] <Wolf_> I have a 0.0001 interapid already
[19:24:49] <sync_> sure, I found one at some point as well
[19:24:53] <sync_> but I threw it out
[19:24:58] <sync_> not gonna waste time with it
[19:25:12] <roycroft> if it breaks then i'll replace it with something that seems to be the best value at the time
[19:25:18] <roycroft> which may or may not be a last word
[19:25:20] <Wolf_> at worst I’ll use the last word for setting up my 3d printer :P
[19:25:50] <sync_> I just got all the mahr variants, some come in handy
[19:25:55] <roycroft> but to suggest getting rid of something that is perfectly functional just because there may have been advances in technolgy since that may be more elegant is wasteful
[19:26:22] <_methods> nice score
[19:26:33] <pfred1> I am no pro so I don't need the latest, or the greatest
[19:26:37] <Wolf_> fun part is there is another top box, mid box and 2 bottom boxes full of stuff the guy offered me for $500
[19:26:59] <roycroft> even if you're a pro you're a fool if you throw away expensive tools every time something new comes out
[19:27:34] <roycroft> wolf_: the empty boxes, if in good condition, are worth way more than that
[19:27:46] <Wolf_> they are all full…
[19:27:56] <roycroft> my kennedy rolling box cost about $550 on sale
[19:27:59] <sync_> sure, I'm not throwing out stuff that is still ok to use, but the switch and the open linkage just make it useless for me
[19:28:11] <sync_> as there is too much potential to go wrong there
[19:28:15] <Wolf_> one has 3 drawers of files and 2 of hammers, and a load of proto wrenches
[19:29:00] <_methods> yeah at $500 that's a no brainer
[19:29:05] <roycroft> it is impossible to have too many files
[19:29:08] <_methods> even if they're empty its worth that
[19:29:17] <roycroft> hopefully they're not all lumped together and rusty
[19:29:20] <Wolf_> I’ll have to get some pics of this guys mess at his house, he buys out auction lots of stuff
[19:29:34] <Wolf_> as a hobby...
[19:30:18] <pfred1> some places stuff is just going begging
[19:30:34] <pfred1> not by me though it was never here
[19:30:55] <pfred1> all we got around here is corn, soybeans, and chikens
[19:30:56] <Wolf_> I need to pick up the other stuff I’m getting, about 15 large kant twists and a milwaukee die grinder for under $200
[19:31:48] <Wolf_> he also had 3 shelfs of nothing but sanding belts, paper and grinding wheels… was frigging nuts
[19:31:50] <pfred1> we had some pretty twisted up kant twists in a shop I used to work in
[19:32:07] <Wolf_> shelfs= shelving units
[19:32:32] <pfred1> I bought a couple milk crates of grinding wheels at a flea market once
[19:32:52] <Wolf_> yeah, some of these are surface grinder wheels…
[19:33:06] <pfred1> yeah 1 1/8" bore
[19:33:11] <Wolf_> also had a new in box tool post grinder
[19:34:09] <Wolf_> least I think it was
[19:35:36] <MacGalempsy> Wolf_: did he have any wooden machinist boxes?
[19:35:38] <MacGalempsy> :P
[19:35:45] <Wolf_> yeah 2 of them
[19:36:03] <MacGalempsy> nice, you should get those.
[19:36:17] <Wolf_> those were empty :P
[19:36:26] <pfred1> Gerstners?
[19:36:29] <MacGalempsy> Dad finally handed over my granddad's cherry gerstner box bought in the early 50s
[19:36:31] <Wolf_> yup
[19:36:50] <Wolf_> I have a early 1900’s wood box already
[19:36:57] <pfred1> one of these days I'm going to make a decent wooden tool box
[19:37:02] <MacGalempsy> the unfortunate part is he took out all the tools and gave them to my uncle
[19:37:09] <Wolf_> oddly not a gerstner, but looks like one
[19:37:12] <pfred1> I already made a hack one out of scraps that turned out OK
[19:37:21] <Wolf_> http://i.imgur.com/zRGNFu6.jpg?1 I need to look this up
[19:38:01] <MacGalempsy> Wolf_: got the smoothing circuit done up today. it puts out 69.2V
[19:38:16] <MacGalempsy> now to make a holder so it doesnt short
[19:38:26] <pfred1> MacGalempsy what's a smoothing circuit?
[19:38:29] <Wolf_> lol
[19:39:24] <MacGalempsy> it is part of dc transformer in the mill. it only had the transformer, choke and rectifier
[19:39:48] <pfred1> a DC transformer?
[19:39:57] <MacGalempsy> yeah, part of it
[19:40:03] <MacGalempsy> ac/dc
[19:40:03] <pfred1> you're just full of surprises
[19:40:16] <pfred1> transformers don't work on DC
[19:40:50] <MacGalempsy> hodge podge- anyways, it cleans up the wave.
[19:41:07] <pfred1> east Rutherford New jersey I know where that is
[19:41:29] <pfred1> heh I used to live in the 201 area code
[19:41:35] <Wolf_> lol, wonder if I can get him to let me have the Themac J-7 tool post grinder for a couple hundred…
[19:41:47] <Wolf_> http://www.themacinc-us.com/PriceList.html
[19:41:58] <pfred1> they're still around?
[19:42:05] <Wolf_> yeah..
[19:42:08] <pfred1> wow
[19:42:23] <pfred1> the shop I worked in in Livingston is long gone now
[19:42:33] <MacGalempsy> so what are you going to use it for Wolf_?
[19:42:36] <pfred1> though the company still sort of exists
[19:42:59] <pfred1> I wish I was there when they shut that place down
[19:43:13] <Wolf_> really, I don’t need it, I’ll probably see if I can trade some of his stuff by gettign a buyer for the thing
[19:43:22] <pfred1> I probably should have nicked stuff while i was working there
[19:44:05] <Wolf_> he had a several hundred taps there
[19:44:39] * MacGalempsy knows who he wouldnt want hanging around his shop.
[19:44:55] <Wolf_> looks like he got the whole support room from a pepsi plant and nabisco plant
[19:45:33] <pfred1> MacGalempsy is your shop going under?
[19:45:58] <MacGalempsy> no, be even then it wouldnt be a reason to steal anything
[19:46:13] <pfred1> MacGalempsy why the hell not everything gets scrapped then
[19:46:36] <Wolf_> and a few other factory lots, so ton of bearings, taps, fasteners…
[19:47:03] <Wolf_> shop gets closed, room full of shit gets auctioned off for $500
[19:47:09] <roycroft> it's ok if it is being scrapped and you get permission to salvage
[19:47:20] <roycroft> stealing is not ok, ever
[19:47:27] <MacGalempsy> thats the point
[19:47:33] <roycroft> a lot of shops auction off their assets
[19:47:50] <Wolf_> this guys house is proof of that lol
[19:48:12] <roycroft> if the business is in bankruptcy it would likely be illegal to give away the stuff or sell it outside the control of the bankruptcy court
[19:48:21] <pfred1> MacGalempsy there's a better than fair chance you don't know the first hting about the situation
[19:48:25] <roycroft> and it's always illegal to steal it
[19:48:42] <pfred1> they ended up royally fucking me over
[19:49:32] <pfred1> had i known ahead of time I'd have taken care of my compensation package early
[19:50:21] <pfred1> evryone in that shop got tooled
[19:51:33] <pfred1> you think when the old man kiked the bucket and his rotten kid took over he did the right thing?
[19:51:54] <pfred1> that ain't how it goes
[19:52:35] <MacGalempsy> i may not know the situation, but I do know that stealing is wrong, not matter what.
[19:52:54] <pfred1> pfft
[19:53:00] <pfred1> how about all they owe me?
[19:53:43] <pfred1> yeah it's OK to screw me over but I can't get anything
[19:53:55] <pfred1> well fuck you too
[19:54:15] <MacGalempsy> I had a maid once who talked about how her kid stole from a job, I asked her if she told him it was wrong and she said no. so I fired her on the spot
[19:54:22] <MacGalempsy> you could sue
[19:54:46] <pfred1> there was a court case
[19:55:01] <pfred1> but they had some bullshit excuse that the judge bought
[19:55:47] <tcurdt> anyone here running linuxcnc on a raspberry pi?
[19:55:52] <pfred1> I should have poisioned the judge with the shit they were poisioning me with
[19:56:06] <pfred1> then saw what he thought about it all
[19:56:36] <pfred1> if the bastards still knew his own name after a dose of that crap
[19:57:31] <MacGalempsy> tcurdt: I havent heard anyone in talk say definitively that they, personally, have had success. however, there are a couple of youtube videos that show it working
[19:57:50] <MacGalempsy> talk = jere
[19:57:53] <MacGalempsy> here
[19:58:11] <MacGalempsy> tcurdt: are you giving it a shot?
[19:59:11] <tcurdt> MacGalempsy I am thinking about it ... thought I hear here first if someone is happy using it already like that :)
[19:59:35] <MacGalempsy> have you checked the lcnc forum yet?
[20:01:08] <tcurdt> MacGalempsy not so much of a forum guy - didn't even know there is a lcnc forum :)
[20:01:08] <tcurdt> thanks for the pointer
[20:01:40] <MacGalempsy> from the one thread in the forum that I am looking at, it looks like it may be ok on the latency test, which is 47663
[20:01:51] <jymmm> Tom_itx: you probaly want machinekit, not lcnc
[20:01:55] <MacGalempsy> https://forum.linuxcnc.org/forum/search?query=raspberry%20pi%203&childforums=1
[20:02:06] <jymmm> tcurdt: you probably want machinekit, not lcnc
[20:02:44] <tcurdt> jymmm could you elaborate on that?
[20:03:25] <jymmm> tcurdt:
https://www.google.com/search?q=machienkit
[20:03:35] <tcurdt> jymmm :-p
[20:03:45] <tcurdt> that far I got myself ;)
[20:03:57] <tcurdt> but why would I want that over linuxcnc?
[20:04:09] <jymmm> rPi
[20:04:14] <pfred1> because they focus on arm
[20:04:42] <tcurdt> pfred1 thanks - that was the crucial bit of information I was looking for
[20:05:09] <pfred1> machinekit is a fork of LinuxCNC
[20:05:24] <pfred1> if it is what i think it is
[20:07:56] <tcurdt> but why shouldn't linuxcnc run on a raspberry pi with at RT kernel? curious to why they forked
[20:08:00] * tcurdt is searching
[20:08:19] <pfred1> there was a difference in opinion about some htings
[20:27:08] <malcom2073> tcurdt: It wasn't forked *just* to run on other devices
[20:27:54] <malcom2073> someone here runs it on a pi, talking to an ethernet mesa card
[20:28:10] <tcurdt> just read ... linuxcnc is local only and machinekit is not ... whatever that means exactly
[20:28:25] <malcom2073> tcurdt: It means you can run machinekit headless: On a pi with no monitor, control it remotely
[20:36:33] <tcurdt> malcom2073 I see .. so a proper protocol ... and no xwindows/vnc business
[20:36:53] <malcom2073> tcurdt: Last I heard, google protobuffers, though i'm not sure if that's the direction they continued in
[20:43:49] <Wolf_> hmm crap… do I really need a nice tool post grinder...
[20:44:20] <jdh> yes
[20:44:49] <tcurdt> Anyone know a good feature comparison of grbl and linuxcnc somewhere? I am still a bit lost.
[20:45:17] <malcom2073> tcurdt: grbl is good for uh... flimsy simple and small machines.
[20:45:24] <malcom2073> Well... not good
[20:45:30] <malcom2073> I'd say capable? Nah... able?
[20:47:21] <tcurdt> malcom2073 could you elaborate a bit more ... that's still quite vague
[20:47:48] <malcom2073> My main complaint is that grbl has shit for motion planning. It does silly things like assumes that infinite acceleration is possible under certain conditions
[20:49:27] <malcom2073> I don't know that it supports more than 4 axis either, and is limited to arduino speed step clocks (16khz?)
[20:50:06] <malcom2073> more than 3*
[20:51:23] <tcurdt> I guess I will never be so lucky to have more than 3-4 axis :) ... so for now that would be ok
[20:51:39] <tcurdt> for the motion planing I cannot yet judge how critical that is
[20:51:51] <malcom2073> I wouldn't use it, not for anything that matters. If you're tinkering around and don't care if you make something that isn't to spec, then it's fine
[20:52:01] <tcurdt> I'd assume more interesting when the machines uses servos, no?
[20:52:09] <malcom2073> grbl has no support for servos
[20:52:21] <jdh> step/dir servos
[20:52:26] <malcom2073> Those are called steppers
[20:52:42] <malcom2073> Or are you talking about hybrids?
[20:52:45] <Wolf_> jdh, was that a serious yes or help spend my money yes lol
[20:53:03] <jdh> I am talking about servo drives that accept step/dir input
[20:53:12] <jdh> Wolf: I'm a fan of buying toosl
[20:53:21] <Wolf_> lol
[20:53:22] <tcurdt> malcom2073 I meant motion planing is more important with a servo setup (as a question)
[20:53:28] <malcom2073> jdh: That doesn't count, and all the limitations of grbl still exist for that :-P
[20:53:43] <malcom2073> tcurdt: It is *extremely* important, for both steppers and servos.
[20:53:44] <jdh> sure, but it was an incomplete condemnation
[20:54:03] <jdh> one might say trumpian
[20:54:18] <tcurdt> malcom2073 interesting - I didn't think it would matter that much for steppers
[20:55:04] <malcom2073> tcurdt: The motion planning is independant of the actual method of motion. Doesn't matter if you use steppers or servos, if your planning is shit, your motion will be shit :)
[20:55:39] <jdh> people make stuff with mach which has similar constraints
[20:56:11] <sync_> malcom2073: well linuxcnc doesn't really have timeoptimal jerk limited planning either
[20:56:42] <malcom2073> sync_: Are you really arguing that grbl's motion planning is not too bad? :P
[20:57:10] <malcom2073> And I thought the new s-curve planner was limited jerk
[20:57:29] <jymmm> By jerk, you mean the operator, or ???
[20:58:02] <malcom2073> jymmm: derivative of acceleration
[20:58:44] <jymmm> oh man, thought they were on to something there for a moment... dumbass limiting would be awsome!
[21:01:06] <tcurdt> malcom2073 I would have thought motion planing is more important on servos because the potentially higher speed/acceleration ... interesting
[21:09:19] <sync_> malcom2073: no, there is lookahead but no jerk limit
[21:21:52] <MacGalempsy> malcom2073: did you get your generator dialed in with the new couplling?
