#linuxcnc | Logs for 2016-10-03

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[00:14:20] <pink_vampire> Crom: I have it for few years now..
[00:14:48] <pink_vampire> what type of stock material?
[00:15:00] <pink_vampire> aluminum? steel? brass?
[03:11:33] <Deejay> moin
[06:48:22] <nubcake> morning everyone
[08:20:00] <MacGalempsy> hello
[08:20:12] <MacGalempsy> Erant: there
[08:21:12] <MacGalempsy> is an ebay seller with 8x2mm single start leadscrews, 500mm for lime $20 w antibacklash nut
[08:58:35] <pink_vampire> MacGalempsy: link??
[09:01:43] <nubcake_> hi
[09:14:59] <archivist> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CLaBFkeHG0A
[09:55:33] <nubcake> f**k my garage-connection...
[09:56:17] <MattyMatt__> run a wire
[09:56:42] <nubcake> i finally figured how to configure&wire the bob to the vfd-board to start the spindle.. now i just got to figure why my spindle speed can't be regulated by the software...
[09:57:34] <archivist> once you learn it will all become easier for next time
[09:58:03] <nubcake> MattyMatt__ not an option, it's more than 50m passing the driveway so i can't dig there, got to stick to the powerlan+wifi solution :/
[09:59:25] <nubcake> archivist: me?
[09:59:40] <MattyMatt__> http://www.instructables.com/id/Laser-Transceiver/
[10:00:04] <nubcake> sweet, but probably expensive as hell
[10:00:14] <archivist> bring the machine indoors
[10:00:28] <nubcake> there's not enough room :'(
[10:00:49] <nubcake> the wife occupies all of it with idk... wife-stuff...
[10:01:37] <nubcake> oh wow, 50bucks for the transceiver isn't too bad i guess
[10:01:55] <MattyMatt__> that laser rust remover looks handy too :)
[10:02:09] <FinboySlick> If they're on the same electrical circuit/phase, ethernet over powerline is pretty decent too.
[10:02:34] <nubcake> i get around 10megabit/s they're both on L3, but not the same circuit
[10:03:01] <nubcake> there's 2 fuse-boxes in between
[10:03:07] <FinboySlick> Fuses aren't a problem.
[10:03:17] <nubcake> nah, but the line-length itself
[10:03:46] <nubcake> the direct-distance is ~50m but the wires themselves are easily 80-100m in total
[10:04:09] <nubcake> so i guess 10megabit is still a decent speed for that length
[10:05:15] <nubcake> plus each connection to and from a fuse adds a little resistance to the whole thing
[10:08:57] <MattyMatt__> proper fuses or circuit breakers?
[10:09:43] <MattyMatt__> inductance would be bad, I'm guessing
[10:10:06] <nubcake> they're all good, just tried to say that each time the cable's are connected to something there's a resistance resulting from that connection
[10:10:32] <nubcake> idk, my english fails me so hard.. not even to mention when it gets technical :(
[10:12:50] <MattyMatt__> circuit breakers = electromagnet fuses
[10:13:48] <nubcake> i know how those work, but still the connection is physical
[10:14:02] <nubcake> as in directly attached copper to copper
[10:14:34] <nubcake> there's no inductance interferring too bad with the signal as those circuits are barely used
[10:15:21] <nubcake> most of the load is ohmic load
[10:15:32] <MattyMatt__> a long straight wire is also an inductor, which may be more of a problem than resistance
[10:15:45] <MattyMatt__> for high freguency
[10:16:24] <MattyMatt__> 50m would be tricky for cat5 also afaik
[10:16:26] <nubcake> well, it is, but with that in mind i was saying 10 megabit is still quite ok so
[10:16:44] <MattyMatt__> so f**k your connection :)
[10:17:09] <nubcake> from practical experience i can say even 100m for cat5e still results in speeds mostly higher than 500megabit/s ^^ but that's off course not what cat5e should deliver
[10:18:46] <nubcake> but i would still consider that "good enough" for my personal use (instead of buying additional hardware just to reach that 1gbit/s speed even though there's overhead and you'd never get all of that gross-bandwidth)
[10:19:08] <nubcake> well, got to get ready, wife wants to go to the movies (:
[10:19:15] <nubcake> cheers, i'll be back later
[10:19:52] <nubcake> (and yes, fuck my connection :D )
[10:20:38] <MattyMatt__> next time, get the cable to the garage, and worry about the house later :D
[10:21:47] <MattyMatt__> archivist, that laser deruster doesn't seem to touch old paint
[10:21:51] <gonzo_> cat5 is a twisted pair transmission line, so the inductance cof the wires an be forgoten about. It's nore about the EM wave traveling
[10:22:08] <gonzo_> more
[10:23:36] <MattyMatt__> yeah I suppose ethernet already has echo cancelling etc
[10:23:49] <MattyMatt__> you'd need that for short cables too
[10:25:36] <MattyMatt__> it's all voodoo to me above 30Mhz. I learned on TTL where it's all just fast DC
[10:26:10] <MattyMatt__> above 30Mhz or above 2m
[10:26:19] <MattyMatt__> 2m distance
[10:30:25] <MacGalempsy> http://www.ebay.com/itm/371643584003
[10:30:41] <MacGalempsy> possible partial solution
[10:31:14] <MacGalempsy> screw and heaters
[11:01:52] <gene_> Does anyone have a clue why I get following errors on my Z axis, at the stop point? g1 f20 is bad, g0 doing 90 ips is fine
[11:15:24] <archivist> there is a ratio of accelerations mentioned somewhere, if violated a stepper system can have that error
[11:15:30] <Erant> MacGalempsy: Yeah, I've seen 'm. I should be able to fit a 12mm leadscrew though. (Which is what's in there right now). The annoying bit is having to turn the leadscrew.
[11:16:45] <Erant> gene_: Can you paste your .ini/.hal? You might have MIN_FERROR set to something funky, or the STEPGEN max acceleration might be off.
[11:17:09] <Erant> As in, pastebin or something. Please don't paste it in here ;)
[11:17:15] <MacGalempsy> Erant: im using the 8x2 with a 2:1 gt2 gearset
[11:22:29] <gene_> The machine is in mid job ATM and runing fine with all air cuts as G0. Putting it on pastebin might throw a stopper error.
[11:22:49] <gene_> I'll let you know when I have done that.
[11:22:53] <Erant> MacGalempsy: I've got a direct-drive setup right now with a 12x1.27. So going to anything over a 2mm pitch would mean I'd probably want gearing. 2mm is... OK. Adding gearing means rebuilding the adapters, which I wouldn't be too excited about.
[11:23:06] <Erant> gene_: What's your MIN_FERROR?
[11:24:59] <Erant> I'm already not using my servos to their rated speed. Not even close, really.
[11:24:59] <gene_> FERROR = 0.002
[11:25:01] <gene_> MIN_FERROR = 0.00005
[11:25:28] <gene_> humm, I think thats a bit tight
[11:25:48] <Erant> You might want to try and increase the MIN_FERROR by a factor of 10. Or a factor of 2.
[11:26:05] <Erant> gene_: What kind of setup is this? Stepgen?
[11:26:49] <gene_> Next time I start it, I'll pull a 0 out of that string first. Yes stepgen, mesa 5i25 issueing the steps
[11:26:58] <Erant> MacGalempsy: How are you finding the added backlash in your geared setup?
[11:27:31] <Erant> gene_: I've got a similar setup (though not actually steppers). Is there a PID component?
[11:27:53] <gene_> yes
[11:28:03] <MacGalempsy_> Erant: my machine is still under construction. If the belts are tight, it should limit the backlash
[11:29:15] <Erant> gene_: What's P set to, and what's FF1 set to?
[11:29:52] <gene_> Pgain 4000, eveerything else is zero except FF2 is .00025
[11:30:09] <gregcnc> erant i have some of these in the shop on some linear stages, they feel very nice
[11:30:15] <gregcnc> http://www.universal-thread.com/lead.htm
[11:30:16] <pcw_home> what is the servo thread rate?
[11:30:39] <Erant> MacGalempsy_: I've got that setup for my Z axis (with a ball screw), seems to work OK... I'm not entirely sure if I have the best quality pulleys though...
[11:31:01] <gene_> 250000 Peter
[11:32:02] <pcw_home> FF1 must be 1
[11:32:37] <Erant> pcw_home: (fwiw, mine was partially a problem with MAX_OUTPUT being lower than MAX_VELOCITY :P)
[11:32:45] <gene_> I'll try that but doesn't that change to effective servo mode?
[11:32:53] <Erant> There was other shit wrong, but that's what a post-mortem showed :)
[11:33:15] <Erant> gregcnc: They certainly look spiffy.
[11:34:16] <Erant> gregcnc: Max load is 50lbs for a 1/2" lead screw?
[11:34:43] <gene_> I'm doing more with an 8mm screw
[11:35:15] <gregcnc> I bought the stages off ebay 10 years ago? thinking I'd make tiny cnc cylindracl grinder
[11:35:35] <pcw_home> the stepgen is effectively a velocity mode servo (so FF1 should always be 1)
[11:35:38] <gene_> And another of those 8mm's is going in as x drive on a 11x36 Sheldon under rebuid right now
[11:36:16] <MacGalempsy> Has anyone used the smartprobe.ngc to digitize a 3d model?
[11:37:43] <gregcnc> hmm load are low. maybe only used for instruments?
[11:39:33] <Erant> gregcnc: Looks like it. Though I'm wondering what fails.
[11:58:16] <gene_> pcw_home: I miss-copied to you, all F1 are 1.000
[12:02:20] <Erant> gene_: What's P set to?
[12:07:11] <Erant> MacGalempsy_: Yeah, at some point I'd like to move to a belt, partly because I'm only using a third of my RPM range, and the servos stick out an annoying amount.
[12:07:26] <Erant> So if I can loop 'm back, that'd be great.
[12:07:33] <Erant> Not one of my biggest concerns right now though.
[12:09:20] <pcw_home> FF2 is probably too high also (0.000025 = 25 usec would be closer for PCI)
[12:11:24] <Erant> How much of a concern is that btw? I actually wonder how much of a delay my servo drives create.
[12:11:36] <Erant> (Which... I need to properly tune those again.)
[12:21:01] <gene_> pcw-home: That I can fix at the end of this pocket, about 2 hours. I must have lost track as someone said that it should be one servo period
[12:21:11] <pcw_home> Its very minor (but 0.00025 is big enough to be a major overcompensation)
[12:37:26] <pcw_home> No FF2:
[12:37:27] <pcw_home> http://freeby.mesanet.com/noff2.png
[12:37:29] <pcw_home> Proper FF2: (= seconds between position read and velocity write)
[12:37:30] <pcw_home> http://freeby.mesanet.com/ff2.png
[12:37:49] <IchGucksLive> hi
[12:56:26] <gene_> pcw_home: Thanks for clarifyng that time. better understood now.
[13:14:04] <MacGalempsy> IchGucksLive: hello
[13:15:27] <IchGucksLive> ;-)
[13:28:19] <MacGalempsy_> gregcnc: you around?
[13:28:26] <gregcnc> yo
[13:29:10] <MacGalempsy_> what do you think about this? http://www.ebay.com/itm/371643584003?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
[13:29:55] <MacGalempsy_> the shot size is about .6oz
[13:30:30] <MacGalempsy_> i dont see where the hydraulics hook up
[13:33:15] <kyle____> why aren't servo-stepper hybrids more common
[13:33:27] <kyle____> seems like a good mix of technology
[13:36:00] <IchGucksLive> no torque
[13:36:21] <IchGucksLive> kyle____: price and power is not for hobbyists
[13:36:30] <kyle____> true true
[13:36:56] <IchGucksLive> a 1200OZ stepper at 100euro is worth a servo at 400
[13:42:06] <MacGalempsy_> this is what you need http://www.ebay.com/itm/SCORBOT-ER-4U-ROBOTIC-ARM-ER-III-/172301458270?hash=item281df79b5e:g:POEAAOSwU-pXq4ke
[13:43:43] <IchGucksLive> kuka500
[13:44:06] <gregcnc> dang comcast. macgalempsy i don't know anything about those. can you find manuals fro the machine it's from? building from scraps is likely more work time than getting a machine back in service
[13:45:22] <IchGucksLive> MacGalempsy_: cheep crap gearsteppers from stepepronline at 50box and a wood frame and you are on
[13:45:51] <MacGalempsy> gregcnc: agreed on work time. no manual that I can see. but the key like is that it is a whole assembly
[13:46:10] <gregcnc> i wouldn't know
[13:46:32] <IchGucksLive> MacGalempsy alone the servos are twice the price
[13:46:39] <MacGalempsy> we'll see what the shipping price
[13:46:43] <IchGucksLive> id you buy alone
[13:46:58] <MacGalempsy> that robot arm is pretty sweet
[13:47:25] <IchGucksLive> it looks also powerfull
[13:47:45] * MacGalempsy cleans up the drool
[13:50:19] <gregcnc> 12V servos
[13:52:37] <MacGalempsy> it says it has a DB25 connector, so I wonder if the drivers and such are onboard
[13:53:08] <IchGucksLive> there might be a internel controller
[13:53:34] <gregcnc> http://www.intelitek.com/robots/scorbot-er-4u/
[13:54:25] <IchGucksLive> belt drive robots are only for fun
[13:54:43] <MacGalempsy> plastic printing
[13:56:20] <gregcnc> http://digital-circuitry.com/MyLAB_Robotics_ER4PC.htm
[13:56:37] <IchGucksLive> someone has seen awallin her
[13:56:49] <IchGucksLive> or is he only logging the channel
[13:57:58] <gregcnc> i think he was here a few months ago
[13:58:01] <MacGalempsy> i dont need this machine, but it is cool looking
[14:04:34] <MacGalempsy> Can someone help me out with the "x count" variable on here? does that mean it only probes 51 times? http://www.probotix.com/wiki/index.php/Probing
[14:04:42] <MacGalempsy> on the smartprobe.ngc
[14:07:22] <gregcnc> this doesn't seem to work on me https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r4T0_SqQPyc
[14:18:32] <Erant> IchGucksLive: Eh, if you don't mind scouring eBay for a bit you can find servo setups for not-that-much.
[14:19:34] <Erant> I got 3 200W servos with drives and 3 36VDC 13A power supplies for...$315, or 280EUR.
[14:19:53] <Erant> Good drives too, I like 'm.
[14:20:08] <Loetmichel> IchGucksLive: what do you want ffs?
[14:20:14] <IchGucksLive> i only work with stepers
[14:25:09] <Erant> IchGucksLive: I wanted something that could get me higher speeds, so servos it is. Plus I like the fact that it can tell me when its fucked up.
[14:25:51] <Erant> I haven't fully integrated it with LinuxCNC, but the servo drives tell me over RS485 if they're having issues following.
[14:25:52] <Jymmm> Erant: It's fucked up ;)
[14:26:08] <Erant> Jymmm: It'll tell me when it's more fucked up than normal ;)
[14:26:25] <IchGucksLive> agree
[14:26:38] <Jymmm> Erant: I'm tallin ya, your more fucked up that normal... always ;)
[14:26:47] <Jymmm> s/that/than/
[14:26:58] <Erant> I'm still undecided whether I want to hook up my limit switches to my drives, or directly to LinuxCNC...
[14:27:05] <IchGucksLive> but today i milled stone at 2500mm/min at 10mm depth 4.5hr without a steploss at all
[14:27:07] <Erant> Jymmm: I wouldn't have it any other way.
[14:27:17] <IchGucksLive> speed is good
[14:27:28] <Jymmm> Erant: And that's why we love ya!!!
[14:27:29] <IchGucksLive> ok i want more but tools are an issue
[14:28:15] <kyle____> 2500mm/min sounds nice
[14:28:27] <kyle____> my laser cutter can do 3mm plywood at 720mm/min!
[14:28:31] <kyle____> blazing fast
[14:29:01] <kyle____> some day i'll own a real machine
[14:29:09] <IchGucksLive> tomorrows work hopfully http://tv-profi-gmbh.de/princess2_cam.jpg
[14:29:43] <Erant> IchGucksLive: 100IPM then? Steppers probably running at 1000RPM, so .1" per rev or half a thou per step (ignoring microstepping). Guess that ain't too bad.
[14:30:24] <IchGucksLive> agree
[14:30:57] <IchGucksLive> i never started with servos as i spend money on a test that woudt bye me 3 mashines and no movement at all
[14:31:17] <IchGucksLive> around 2k euros at omron steppers
[14:31:28] <IchGucksLive> with xtra drives
[14:31:38] <IchGucksLive> not a single step they made
[14:31:53] <IchGucksLive> only errors and then smoke
[14:31:55] <Erant> Stuff starts shaking and falling over if I quickly decel my table from +100IPM...
[14:32:16] <Erant> IchGucksLive: Huh. Drives faulty? Motors hooked up wrong?
[14:32:54] <IchGucksLive> i dident even try it they must been around me somwhere in the farest corner
[14:33:13] <IchGucksLive> as servo forever told me to go fo r it
[14:33:46] <IchGucksLive> no way 1200oz steppers are moving 1tonn of mashine quite good
[14:35:14] <IchGucksLive> i also use only halfstepping
[14:35:22] <IchGucksLive> and gear them to 0.01mm
[14:35:27] <IchGucksLive> per step
[14:35:52] <IchGucksLive> most at 30:1 gear
[14:36:01] <IchGucksLive> that is a real good setup
[14:36:28] <IchGucksLive> Rack pinion T10
[14:36:31] <IchGucksLive> or t5
[14:36:48] <IchGucksLive> Metric some more expensive but the hell of pricise
[14:37:35] <IchGucksLive> the plasma at that setup has run 10hr at 30full sheets 2x1meter and hat 0.05mm to the dial at the end
[14:38:02] <IchGucksLive> ok it has been 3years ago
[14:38:10] <IchGucksLive> inne to check now ;-)
[14:38:22] <IchGucksLive> need
[14:38:43] <IchGucksLive> it is over motorised
[14:38:52] <IchGucksLive> as only the heads are moving
[14:38:57] <IchGucksLive> nothing against
[14:39:34] <IchGucksLive> im off Gn8
[14:39:39] <IchGucksLive> working day ahead
[14:57:05] <MacGalempsy> this is stange. im trying to run the smartprobe.ngc and it initiates, but once it gets to the starting point, an error msg comes up that it has not come in contact
[15:01:21] <andypugh> You know, I think it is possible that I might actually hate Glade.
[15:01:53] <Mac-Mill> haha
[15:02:29] <Mac-Mill> i guess the probed item needs to be sitting on a flat surface
[15:11:03] <ToddZ> what did Glade ever do to you?
[15:11:51] <andypugh> It refuses to let me do what I want to do
[15:12:28] <Mac-Mill> yay its working
[15:12:36] <ToddZ> What do you want to do?
[15:12:38] <andypugh> (What I want to do is have an image with buttons on top, but it makes that really hard)
[15:12:48] <Mac-Mill> i want it to solve world hunger
[15:14:23] <andypugh> ToddZ: Specifially I am trying to figure out a way to make https://forum.linuxcnc.org/forum/41-guis/26550-lathe-macros re-sizable.
[15:14:54] <andypugh> Currently is is fixed at 700x390
[15:18:16] <andypugh> Is pygtk.org down?
[15:20:56] <CaptHindsight> looks like it
[15:22:04] <CaptHindsight> http://isitdownorjust.me/pygtk-org/
[15:24:47] <CaptHindsight> there seems to be lots of sites down today
[15:27:34] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: The fiber got wet with all the thunderstorms =)
[15:28:18] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: I guess 'The Cloud' doesn't like water too much =)
[15:28:28] <CaptHindsight> Jymmm: are you sure, I heard it was gophers and groundhogs
[15:29:01] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: Could be, but I took care of those with moth balls around here =)
[15:29:54] <Jymmm> works really really well too
[15:31:20] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: Hey, was was all that "derating" stuff about running parallel conductors? What needs to be derated?
[15:32:36] <CaptHindsight> Jymmm: it has to do with the number of current carrying conductors in the same conduit
[15:33:08] <CaptHindsight> conduit fill is just how many you can pack into a conduit
[15:34:56] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: 'conduit fill' says I can have 18 12ga in 3/4, so I'm good there, just not sure on the "...in the same conduit" you speak of.
[15:35:53] <CaptHindsight> http://www.southwire.com/support/DeratingAmpacities.htm
[15:36:49] <CaptHindsight> Jymmm: if you did gave 18 #12 wires in there they could not be protected by 20A breakers
[15:37:59] <CaptHindsight> if 12 wires were current conducting then you'd only be allowed to have 10A breakers protecting them
[15:38:21] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: From that link, is mentions a "table" ?
[15:38:32] <Jymmm> 'DERATING FOR NUMBER OF CONDUCTORS'
[15:38:37] <CaptHindsight> Table 310-16 NEC
[15:38:58] <Jymmm> this? WireCurrentAmpacitiesNEC
[15:39:04] <Jymmm> https://lugsdirect.com/WireCurrentAmpacitiesNEC-Table-301-16.htm
[15:40:35] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: At the bottom of that page it says " 20 amperes for 12 AWG", is that PER conductor?
[15:41:16] <Jymmm> per circuit?
[15:41:50] <CaptHindsight> Jymmm: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OLIHEiiY_Rs
[15:42:08] <Jymmm> looking..
[15:42:59] <gregcnc> 14 min mark is relevant
[15:43:20] <CaptHindsight> you'll need watch a few of his videos to understand it all
[15:44:13] <CaptHindsight> just because the wires fit doesn't mean you can install the maximum allowed current protection device (breakers)
[15:44:28] <CaptHindsight> for a single conductor
[15:44:42] <gregcnc> NEC is something like an encyclopedia in total?
[15:45:03] <CaptHindsight> just a few hundred pages
[15:46:08] <CaptHindsight> http://www.electrician2.com/calculators/wireocpd_ver_1.html
[15:46:20] <Jymmm> Ok, "Thee current carrying conductors".... hot(s) and neutral? Excluding ground?
[15:46:27] <Jymmm> *three
[15:47:04] <CaptHindsight> iirc, including ground if non-metallic conduit is used
[15:47:24] <Jymmm> and I'm usng pvc... of course ;)
[15:47:46] <CaptHindsight> I rarely used it so I don't recall the exceptions for it
[15:49:22] <Jymmm> So derate by 70%? as per https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=OLIHEiiY_Rs#t=903
[15:49:59] <CaptHindsight> LOL Note: NM cable shall have a 90 degree C insulation (used for derating) but shall be used at the 60 degree C ampacity (334.80). See Note 12 and example 6.
[15:53:41] <CaptHindsight> Jymmm: your main issue would be paralleling #12's, it sounds reasonable but they usually don't allow that until you get to wire sizes of #4 and larger
[15:54:09] <CaptHindsight> http://electriciantesting.blogspot.com/2009/12/wire-ampacity-and-conduit-fill.html
[16:01:16] <Jymmm> Ok, 12ga = 20A, 10ga = 30A. parallel 12ga (to me) = 10ga, so I should be like 10ga and do 30A. But do you beieve I still need to derate, even though I'm *NOT* considering 2x 12ga (@ 20A each) = 40A ?
[16:01:32] <MacGalempsy> ok. finally digitizing the first knob. the tip is 0.04 and I did a 0.01 step value.
[16:02:08] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: ^^^^^
[16:02:10] <MacGalempsy> should get a good preview of the knob face
[16:02:41] <CaptHindsight> Jymmm: well you're actually doing it backwards, you start with the loads and work through the formulas to arrive at the proper wire size
[16:03:21] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: Well, I already had the 12ga wire.
[16:03:22] <CaptHindsight> everyone tends to think #12 means 20A circuit
[16:03:40] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: Per this chart it does... http://www.cerrowire.com/ampacity-charts
[16:04:39] <nubcake> weird... with linuxcnc set to pin1=pwm spindle, using the relais from the bob and enabling it by clicking spindle clockwise instantly runs the spindle up to 20k rpm.. clicking + and - doesn't change the speed..
[16:05:15] <nubcake> once i turn the selector knob from "pc" to "manual" i can set the spindle speed to my needs (doesn't keep that speed on "pc" though)
[16:06:29] <CaptHindsight> Continuous Load - The maximum continuous load shall not exceed 80 percent of the conductor ampacity before the application of any adjustment factors [215.2(A)(1)]
[16:07:39] <CaptHindsight> 0.8 x 20A = 16A
[16:08:53] <Jymmm> times 2 = 32A.
[16:09:19] <Jymmm> #10 is 30A x .8 = 24A
[16:12:22] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: I'm really not trying to argue or even debate. Just when I have 6 spools of #12, and no other use for them, I'm not going to go out and buy #10. So, I pulled 8X #12 ( Yeah I know what you said, sue me) cause it just "made sense" to me that #12 + #12 = #10, and #10 is 30A which is what I'd prefer to have.
[16:13:12] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: But, I'm also not wanting anythign stupid to happen either.
[16:13:36] <CaptHindsight> Jymmm: I'm just spoon feeding you the info since you asked. But there is not a simple answer.
[16:14:04] <CaptHindsight> you have to look at the whole circuit
[16:15:49] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: And I very much appreciate it, really. and I know I'm 'off the book' here (due to #12 and not #4), I'm just trying to understand if I still need to derate, even though I only plan on 30A max continous instead of 2x #12 = 20A+20A (if that makes sense)
[16:16:44] <CaptHindsight> then there is the next size up rule, since #12's are limited to 16A then you are allowed to use a 20A breaker
[16:17:12] <MacGalempsy_> it will be interesting to see how the probing works out since the shaft is fatter than tip
[16:20:30] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: You just had to toss in a monkey wrench in there, didn't ya?! lol
[16:21:07] <CaptHindsight> it looks simple at first
[16:21:25] <CaptHindsight> https://jadelearning.com/jadecc/courses/UNIVERSAL/NEC05.php
[16:21:51] <CaptHindsight> woops https://jadelearning.com/jadecc/courses/UNIVERSAL/NEC05.php?imDif=2580.1
[16:22:12] <CaptHindsight> General permits ungrounded phase conductors, grounded conductors and neutrals, size 1/0 AWG and larger, to be installed in parallel.
[16:22:51] <CaptHindsight> new code looks like 1/0 and larger, I think t used to be #4's
[16:22:55] <MacGalempsy_> looks like there will be some additional cleanup, but overall, the digitizing is going well
[16:23:13] <MacGalempsy_> only 5000 hours until the process is done
[16:23:46] <CaptHindsight> MacGalempsy_: touch probe RE of a large surface at 1um res? :)
[16:24:02] <Jymmm> MacGalempsy_: That's 208 days
[16:24:05] <MacGalempsy_> lol.
[16:24:10] <MacGalempsy_> i was being sarcastic
[16:24:24] <MacGalempsy_> the knob is about 1" in diameter
[16:24:35] <JT-Shop> howdy
[16:24:49] <MacGalempsy_> the grid is 1.5x1.5 @ 0.01" res
[16:24:57] <MacGalempsy_> welcome back cotter
[16:25:17] <JT-Shop> a 1500 mile weekend
[16:25:33] <MacGalempsy_> how many hours on the road?
[16:25:39] <CaptHindsight> Jymmm: you don't know how many times I wished I could have just used 3/4" conduit vs running 2- 1/2" conduits
[16:25:53] <JT-Shop> all day friday and most of today
[16:26:02] <MacGalempsy_> mpg?
[16:26:11] <JT-Shop> 44
[16:26:16] <MacGalempsy_> outstanding
[16:26:58] <JT-Shop> took the wifes Honda Civic Hybrid
[16:27:46] <CaptHindsight> Jymmm: or after the 3/4"is in place there is a change to a 2 or 3-way switch to control some lighting
[16:28:11] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: I bet, gotta love change orders AFTER the work has been done.
[16:28:23] <CaptHindsight> now the fill is higher and you need large conductors or run another conduit
[16:28:54] <CaptHindsight> and it's behind the ductwork now
[16:29:09] <CaptHindsight> or plumbing
[16:29:18] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: Oh, does it matter which buss bar I connect X and Y to? or Y and X ?
[16:30:15] <Jymmm> or concrete =)
[16:32:19] <Deejay> gn8
[16:32:34] <CaptHindsight> Jymmm: just don't stand in it waiting for it to dry :)
[16:32:36] <MacGalempsy_> gn8 Deejay
[16:33:13] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: Nah, I'm the poor bastard that is mixing it ;)
[16:33:52] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: "...boy are my feet tired"
[16:34:51] <CaptHindsight> Jymmm: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZhN-jOVNKBc using this technique?
[16:35:19] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: EXACTLY =)
[16:36:08] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: And in spite of your advise, I pulled 8 conductors =)
[16:36:34] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: ...and only 8" short on all of em (seriously)
[16:37:27] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: But I have room to pigtail =)
[16:37:42] <CaptHindsight> Jymmm: so you need a conduit and wire stretcher
[16:38:41] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: No, more than enough conduit. Just emptied the spool and it "looked" to be long enough at the time when I layed them all out in the yard.
[16:39:29] <CaptHindsight> could be worse, you could be 20ft short and need to buy another 500ft spool
[16:41:05] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: Well, had I not already drilled the hole thru the wall, I could have lowered it down 2ft and had the length needed.
[16:52:48] <andypugh> So fill the hole you have and drill another>
[16:55:16] <Jymmm> Damit andypugh, quit making sense!
[16:56:09] <andypugh> Sorry, I try to avoid it generally.
[16:59:19] <Mac-Mill> so while probing with smartprobe.ngc, the purple dots are disappearing on the screen. does that mean the data are not going to be written?
[17:00:44] <gregcnc> capthindsight you probably need a couple more? http://rockford.craigslist.org/tls/5811374792.html
[17:01:12] <Jymmm> andypugh: I have to check, but now that you mention it, I might be able to lower the hole and just extend on the inside. But just have been priming, caulking, and painting to seal up all the holes/cracks for the last two months, so just got so sick and tired of everything to even think of such a thing.
[17:02:36] <andypugh> What purple dots? What screen are they on?
[17:03:36] <andypugh> OK, so re-purpose the first hole as a ship’s telephone or something
[17:07:18] <Jymmm> Well, other than it's thunderstorming (I finished all the summer repair projects literally within 20 minutes of the first drops falling yesterday)
[17:08:11] <Jymmm> I'll have to open the service pole to see how short I really am
[17:10:59] <Mac-Mill> the purple dots are in the liveplot and show the path of the moving touchprobe
[17:11:37] <Mac-Mill> the thing errored, so I opened up the tolerances and giving it a quicker run to get a product to work with in meshlab
[17:13:04] <cncdrew> I am having some trouble getting the estop working / wired correctly
[17:13:48] <kyle____> that's not good
[17:13:55] <Mac-Mill> cncdrew, what control card are you using?
[17:13:57] <kyle____> have you tried turning it off and back on again?
[17:14:03] <kyle____> i'll leave now
[17:15:01] <cncdrew> my BOB is http://www.ebay.com/itm/361715262575
[17:15:31] <cncdrew> I have wired the EStop to pin 10 and ground
[17:15:38] <cncdrew> and set pin 10 to estop in
[17:16:19] <andypugh> Sounds reasonable so far.
[17:16:26] <andypugh> So, what happens?
[17:16:29] <cncdrew> you can see the wiring for the BOB here:
[17:16:31] <cncdrew> http://www.gbeshop.com/InfoBase/SAVEBASE/PKG/004393/Image/New_5axis_breakout_board_interfaces_fw_r2_c1.jpg
[17:16:44] <cncdrew> Glad it sounds good so far. :)
[17:17:05] <cncdrew> machine runs - estop has no effect
[17:17:12] <andypugh> Hmm
[17:17:22] <nubcake> did you invert it's signal?
[17:17:39] <cncdrew> didnt try invert.
[17:17:45] <andypugh> That was my first guess, but the machine works in both conditions
[17:17:52] <andypugh> So it isn’t invert
[17:17:53] <nubcake> oh ok, then it's not that
[17:18:02] <cncdrew> Should I connect the other side of the estop to pin 17 and set that to estop in?
[17:18:12] <nubcake> no
[17:18:23] <nubcake> estop is being switched against ground afaik
[17:18:35] <andypugh> When you say “set pin 10 to e-stop-in”. Where and how?
[17:19:02] <cncdrew> I used stepconf to set pin 10
[17:19:16] <cncdrew> Also - the board has 2 grounds
[17:19:31] <cncdrew> should I use the signal ground?
[17:19:48] <nubcake> the one on the side you connected your estop to
[17:20:04] <andypugh> You probaby want a wire from the left-side GND to the e-stop and then back to the P10 terminal
[17:20:07] <nubcake> which should be the bottom left connector when the parallelport is facing away from you
[17:20:28] <nubcake> exactly what andypugh just said
[17:20:39] <cncdrew> ok. So I did that. No effect.
[17:20:58] <cncdrew> should I have a setting in stepconf for estop out
[17:21:07] <andypugh> OK, time to simplify things and test
[17:21:42] <andypugh> Disconnect the e-stop and connect a wire to the bottom-left GND terminal.
[17:21:46] <andypugh> Start LinuxCNC
[17:22:46] <andypugh> Select “machine - show Hal configuration” then select the “watch” tab and add the “parport.0.pin-10-in” pin
[17:23:09] <andypugh> Then see if touching the wire to the e-stop in terminal causes a change of state
[17:23:29] <andypugh> Then try it with the e-stop switch.
[17:24:05] <andypugh> cncdrew: You don’t need to use e-stop out in most cases
[17:26:01] <cncdrew> ok. Great. Thanks very much. I will try it when I get home.
[17:26:05] <nubcake> does anyone know if there's cap rail cases for the 8x relais board for arduino/raspberry ?
[17:26:25] <nubcake> cncdrew, usually gnd is connected to 1 side of the estop, p10 to the other
[17:26:57] <andypugh> nubcake: I don’t know what cap rail cases are
[17:27:14] <nubcake> uhm.. i dont know the proper translation, let me look for a google image really quick ^^
[17:27:30] <nubcake> http://www.elektrotresen.de/media/images/popup/310/064/404563/10040456399.jpg
[17:27:51] <andypugh> Aha! We call that DIN rail
[17:28:01] <nubcake> oh ok, didn't know that
[17:28:31] <nubcake> i know the coloquial term for it but not the technical ^^
[17:28:41] <andypugh> Sometimes “top hat rail” is used, but generally it’s DIN rail.
[17:28:55] <nubcake> good to know :)
[17:28:59] <andypugh> (And, yes, that’s _your_ DIN)
[17:29:07] <nubcake> yup i figured that .D
[17:29:08] <nubcake> :D
[17:30:20] <nubcake> already found a case for the raspberry to mount it on the DIN rail, just can't find a case for the 8x relais board
[17:32:38] <andypugh> I have used these: http://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/din-rail-terminal-accessories/7527606/
[17:33:41] <andypugh> My relay board was a little narrower than the 72mm required, but the length was right for a particular combination, so it worked.
[17:34:23] <andypugh> Top row, to the right of the power supplies: https://goo.gl/photos/PC9pLUUaoSe8CcKi9
[17:34:41] <Nick-Shop> 7i37 -how do I close a gpio output using test hal command? Also, how would I open it again?
[17:35:53] <nubcake> andypugh: sweet, thanks for the info :)
[17:36:03] <nubcake> that thing probably works for my case
[17:36:05] <andypugh> Nick-Shop: 7i37 outputs will show-up as outouts of the host vard
[17:36:50] <Erant> How the hell do the Chinese make ballscrews that cheap? Even considering them not really being C7 grade... how?
[17:37:02] <jdh> subsidy
[17:37:43] <pcw_mesa> if you have the GPIO bit set to output and the output pin inverted (normally suggested for a 7I37 output), you
[17:37:43] <nubcake> to kill the rest of the market?
[17:37:44] <andypugh> So something like “halcmd setp hm2_5i24.0.gpio.000.out 1”
[17:37:45] <pcw_mesa> halcmd setp gpioxxx.out true (for on)
[17:37:46] <pcw_mesa> and
[17:37:48] <pcw_mesa> halcmd setp gpioxxx.out false (for off)
[17:38:39] <Erant> I'm just impressed. (and confused)
[17:39:02] <nubcake> I'm Infused and compressed..
[17:39:05] <nubcake> kidding ^^
[17:39:20] <andypugh> Erant: If you just have a machine making them, and you don’t actually inspect them, it’s probably quite cheap.
[17:40:17] <Nick-Shop> <pcw_mesa> thanks
[17:40:24] <Erant> andypugh: I guess. The fine print says something about a 'plastic reverser'?
[17:40:29] <andypugh> Nick-Shop: I used a sample card, PCW used xxxx, in both cases you need to use the name of the actual FPGA card
[17:41:15] <andypugh> Nick-Shop: halcmd show pin will list all the actual pin names
[17:42:11] <andypugh> You might prefer to use “halcmd -kf” to get a HAL prompt with tab-completion so you don’t have to type “halcmd” before every command.
[17:43:34] <Nick-Shop> why isn't anything easy anymore
[17:46:45] <andypugh> What isn’t easy about that?
[17:47:25] <andypugh> If you need to do it a lot, then you could set up a “sim_pin” in the HAL file.
[17:54:01] <Nick-Shop> Are these the lines that set an output pin in a hal file?
[17:54:03] <Nick-Shop> setp hm2_5i23.0.gpio.040.is_output 1
[17:54:04] <Nick-Shop> setp hm2_5i23.0.gpio.040.invert_output 1
[17:54:53] <pcw_mesa> yep
[17:55:47] <Nick-Shop> and I do it for all the output pins individually?
[17:55:53] <andypugh> They configure the pin as an output. They don’t set the value
[17:56:04] <pcw_mesa> Yep
[17:56:12] <Nick-Shop> right
[17:56:36] <Nick-Shop> got that one -I think-)
[17:56:37] <pcw_mesa> (as Andy says, that's only done once at startup)
[17:57:34] <CaptHindsight> gregcnc: thanks for the link
[17:57:35] <pcw_mesa> because All GPIO pins are inputs unless told otherwise
[17:58:03] <Nick-Shop> I have a spindle brake switch - how do I call that in net line
[17:58:49] <Nick-Shop> i noticed that I didn't have to do spin for the inputs
[17:59:17] <Nick-Shop> setp
[18:01:07] <andypugh> There isn’t an existing HAL pin for spindle brake. Under what conditions do you want the brake to activate?
[18:06:19] <Nick-Shop> when I start cr1 which is main power relay Fount I cal call the same net with another pin and it does close - ohm meter
[18:07:02] <Nick-Shop> is there a list of valid net statements
[18:07:08] <andypugh> No
[18:07:44] <andypugh> Because you can choose net names completely freely
[18:08:23] <Nick-Shop> darn - gotta go - dinner time -thanks for the help.
[18:08:37] <MacGalempsy> anyone have experience taking the point cloud file and making a mesh? using meshlab, but wondering if there is anything easier to use
[18:08:46] <andypugh> “net Nicks-silly-net-name hm2_5i23.0.gpio.000.in => axis.0.home-sw-in” is entirely valid
[18:09:25] <andypugh> MacGalempsy: It’s actually a hard problem.
[18:10:44] <andypugh> point clouds can be rather ambiguous
[18:11:09] <Nick-Shop> saving to notes so I don't have to ask again
[18:11:24] <MacGalempsy> was hoping to probe and import
[18:11:41] <MacGalempsy> the mesh output is too smoothed, so to say
[18:13:04] <MacGalempsy> i guess measure and draw will have to be the way
[18:15:47] <MacGalempsy> since they are on a grid. perhaps drawing over the points is the best way to go
[18:18:44] <cncDrew> I am having trouble with my Estop
[18:19:12] <nubcake> welcome back cncDrew
[18:19:13] <cncDrew> I tried the following: used stepconf to set pin to as estop in
[18:19:32] <cncDrew> connected wire to ground on BOB
[18:19:38] <cncDrew> started linuxcnc
[18:20:24] <cncDrew> machine > show hal config > watch > parport.o.pin-10-in
[18:20:49] <cncDrew> showed as yellow circle. Touched the wire to pin 10 and no change
[18:21:19] <cncDrew> also redid the config to use pin 11, repeated all steps with same results.
[18:21:45] <MacGalempsy_> with fusion 360, making a spline from a CSV file seems to be pretty good
[18:21:47] <cncDrew> Any suggestions. Is the BOB broken? How can I validate that
[18:22:39] <MacGalempsy_> cncDrew: have you monitored the pin when you push it?
[18:22:57] <MacGalempsy_> ok
[18:23:07] <JT-Shop> watch indicates he is watching it in the watch window
[18:23:18] <MacGalempsy_> yeah, just saw that
[18:23:38] <JT-Shop> cncDrew: have you seen the parallel port tester on the forum or my website?
[18:23:51] <cncDrew> watched carefully :)
[18:24:10] <cncDrew> no. What is the parallel port tester?
[18:25:30] <nubcake> cncDrew, you did supply the 12-24v to the BOB, right?
[18:26:09] <cncDrew> actually. Just using power from the USB.
[18:26:21] <cncDrew> didnt think of that.
[18:26:28] <nubcake> that could be the reason *just guessing*
[18:26:31] <JT-Shop> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Parallel_Port_Tester
[18:26:36] <JT-Shop> well it's on the wiki
[18:26:49] <JT-Shop> what bob do you have?
[18:27:10] <nubcake> http://www.ebay.com/itm/361715262575
[18:27:15] <nubcake> this is his board
[18:29:20] <nubcake> cncDrew, you might want to give it a try, should work with the 24V supply connected
[18:29:35] <nubcake> (if the board isn't broken)^^
[18:29:52] <cncDrew> thanks nubcake. I will give it a try.
[18:30:52] <MacGalempsy_> the pic shows it needs 12-24v
[18:31:12] <MacGalempsy_> a USB just doesnt have the juice
[18:38:21] <MacGalempsy_> anyone near upland CA?
[18:38:43] <Erant> 'upland'?
[18:38:52] <MacGalempsy_> yeah, its a city
[18:38:58] <MacGalempsy_> in the LA metroplex
[18:39:39] <Erant> Huh. Then no. About 600 miles north :)
[18:39:54] <MacGalempsy_> central valley?
[18:39:59] <Erant> Bay Area
[18:40:18] <MacGalempsy_> got my BS at SFSU
[18:41:04] <MacGalempsy_> http://www.ebay.com/itm/15-ton-injection-molding-machine-/172358591804?hash=item28215f653c:g:9dUAAOSwLnBX7aFV
[18:41:09] <MacGalempsy_> wonder what it will go for?
[18:41:12] <Erant> Also I think I know why the Chinese ballscrews are so cheap: http://www.2thinking.com/ebay/Industry_Care/I-21/I-21-06/5.jpg
[18:41:23] <Erant> MacGalempsy_: Cool. You in the LA area now then?
[18:41:33] <MacGalempsy_> no about 24hrs east
[18:41:42] <MacGalempsy_> NW Ark
[18:41:47] <JT-Shop> lol
[18:41:57] <JT-Shop> near the mini dragon
[18:42:12] <MacGalempsy_> JT want to take a road trip to LA?
[18:42:12] <Erant> Haha.
[18:43:05] <Erant> MacGalempsy_: What's in Upland?
[18:43:18] <MacGalempsy_> that plastic injection machine I just linked to
[18:43:19] <JT-Shop> yea to have a crawfish boil with my brother in Reserve
[18:43:37] <Erant> MacGalempsy_: Wait, that says Santa Clara
[18:44:01] <MacGalempsy_> that must have been another boy machine
[18:44:15] <MacGalempsy_> anyways, santa clara is just a few more hours on I5
[18:44:51] <MacGalempsy_> if I didnt stop and see all the family, they would kill me
[18:45:19] <MacGalempsy_> Erant: go check it out for me!
[18:45:30] <Erant> Yup. I've thought about making a plastic injection system but I always decide that resin's probably easier. (and then I proceed to not do that either)
[18:46:00] <Erant> MacGalempsy_: I can kick it for you, and mumble something about how the drivetrain's probably shot.
[18:48:30] <MacGalempsy> these are the ones in upland (the guy has 3) http://www.ebay.com/itm/331982690973?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
[18:48:45] <MacGalempsy> they are a little larger than the other one
[18:50:49] <MacGalempsy> the coasts always have the good stuff
[18:51:30] <kyle____> might bid $5 on that injection molder
[18:51:46] <kyle____> that's all i'll do though
[18:51:51] <MacGalempsy> bid snipe that thing! you do need to know its 3ph
[18:52:20] <MacGalempsy> $5 for the machine $4500 for power conversion
[18:52:22] <kyle____> oh wow it only has a day left
[18:52:48] <kyle____> oh someone put a pretty high max bid on it
[18:53:01] <MacGalempsy> kyle____: did you try bidding yet?>
[18:53:02] <kyle____> now i'm just being a jerk
[18:53:07] <kyle____> yeah i'm stopping at 10
[18:53:13] <Jymmm> https://www.precisionmoldedplastics.com/contact-us/
[18:53:23] <Jymmm> I know where that is =)
[18:53:47] <MacGalempsy> Jymmm: palletize and ship east please
[18:54:03] <Jymmm> But if a plastic molding place is sellng it, doesn't that say something about it?
[18:54:13] <kyle____> read the description
[18:54:17] <kyle____> he doesn't like the color!
[18:54:27] <Jymmm> MacGalempsy: I know where it is, about 600 miles south of me =)
[18:54:31] <Erant> MacGalempsy: What are you actually molding? You looking to set up a shop?
[18:54:54] <MacGalempsy> Erant: that is the plan until the oil and gas industry needs geologists again
[18:55:18] <MacGalempsy> i got the cnc and the edm, now just need an affordable injection machine
[18:55:40] <Erant> Interesting. Mold making's complicated, sort of a black art.
[18:55:54] <MacGalempsy> I am considering getting all three of the upland ones, hoping three will make one or two
[18:56:28] <MacGalempsy> Jymmm: looks like those three because parts machines, so it is a gamble. the one in santa clara seems a better way to go
[18:56:52] <MacGalempsy> Erant: the ex business partner may have given him the crap one
[18:56:58] <Jymmm> MacGalempsy: Only 200 miles away =)
[18:57:03] <Erant> I have a friend that regularly gets molds made in China.
[18:57:47] <MacGalempsy> got some copper round stock on the way, so hopefully I can cut an electrode and burn some test pieces by the end of the week
[18:58:20] <Erant> And being able to 'read' a casting is cool. The way they go "oh, you're seeing this artefact, that means we need to change the mold here and here, change the pressure by X psi and the temperature by X degrees"
[18:58:36] <Erant> Actually, he may have written a blog post about it... Sec.
[18:59:53] <Erant> MacGalempsy: http://www.bunniestudios.com/blog/?p=4146 in case you're bored. He describes some of the problems with his molds.
[19:01:24] <MacGalempsy> my molds should only be .25oz shots.
[19:01:44] <Erant> (Of course, that's a _really_ complicated mold)
[19:01:53] <Erant> Right.
[19:02:32] <MacGalempsy> the flow liines are probably due to it cooling before the mold is full.
[19:02:54] <Erant> Yeah. It's fascinating hearing him talk about the iterations.
[19:02:54] <MacGalempsy> that is a lot of surface sq inches, too
[19:03:13] <Erant> (The guy, bunnie, is a delight to talk to in general)
[19:03:19] <MacGalempsy> for every sq inch, the books says 3-5tons of clamping pressure
[19:03:49] <MacGalempsy> that puts that cover at over 300tons
[19:04:17] <Erant> Yup.
[19:05:05] <MacGalempsy> I cant believe you ran that thing up to $30
[19:06:43] <MacGalempsy> the mini-jector machines look pretty cool, too.
[19:14:44] <MacGalempsy> JT-Shop: any update on the plastic printer?
[19:58:32] <Erant> Too bad I can't find the actual ballnut on the Hiwin site: http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-Hiwin-CNC-23-Ballscrew-10TPI-0-1-Pitch-Ballscrew-Ballnut/282122687764
[19:58:48] <Erant> Otherwise that'd be a cheap-ish conversion.
[19:59:25] <Erant> Too bad this one doesn't fit: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Kuroda-Ballscrew-GG12-02-300mm-travel-length-for-CNC-3-Axis-NIB-/122132324118
[19:59:40] <MacGalempsy> whats wrong with the one on there?
[20:00:46] <Erant> I have an ACME leadscrew. I just look at ballscrews every once in a while, just 'cuz.
[20:01:42] <Erant> I don't think I'd actually ever replace the leadscrews.
[20:02:31] <Erant> The nuts, that's a different story. I've got 5 thou of backlash to get out of those fuckers.
[20:02:59] <MacGalempsy> no antibacklash nut?
[20:05:56] <MacGalempsy> Erant: what about the backlash compensation in LCNC?
[20:06:59] <Erant> MacGalempsy: I've got that set, but obviously if the table moves without LCNC knowing you're f-ed ;)
[20:07:24] <Erant> And yeah, it's an anti-backlash nut but it's not great, and hard to get at.
[20:07:37] <MacGalempsy> how would it not know if you are using feedback?
[20:08:11] <Erant> If the cutter grabs the work and moves the table to the other end of the backlash?
[20:09:19] <MacGalempsy> then the feedback shows its off and corrects the position
[20:09:42] <MacGalempsy> oh. wait, nm
[20:09:43] <Erant> You're assuming I have a DRO or something?
[20:09:47] <Erant> :)
[20:09:52] <MacGalempsy> lol. dro built into LCNC
[20:10:04] <Erant> There's fundamentally just 'slack' in the system
[20:10:55] <MacGalempsy> you are right, better scrap it and get a new machine
[20:11:22] <Erant> I mean... Yes :) At some point, once I outgrow this little one.
[20:11:32] <BeachBumPete> evening linuxCNC
[20:11:37] <Erant> Sup Pete
[20:11:41] <MacGalempsy> hi BeachBumPete
[20:11:50] <BeachBumPete> Hey mac hello Erant
[20:12:05] <MacGalempsy> getting ready to hunkerdown?
[20:12:15] <BeachBumPete> not sure yet ;)
[20:12:38] <BeachBumPete> it'll either be a hunker down or a Hurricane Party :)
[20:12:40] <MacGalempsy> will it be your first hurricane party? (pending)
[20:12:44] <MacGalempsy> lol
[20:12:59] <BeachBumPete> no definitely NOT my first Hurricane party
[20:13:11] <BeachBumPete> it does look menacing tho I must say
[20:13:22] <BeachBumPete> Haiti is gonna get their azz kicked tonight
[20:13:32] <BeachBumPete> as if they did not have enough problems already
[20:14:28] <MacGalempsy> yeah. any progress on getting the machines out of storage?
[20:15:14] <BeachBumPete> actually we are planning to move them this weekend if the weather holds. I am in contact with a local rollback wrecker that will do it for a reasonable price
[20:15:41] <MacGalempsy> fantastic. electricity all ready to plug and chug?
[20:15:52] <BeachBumPete> no not exactly :(
[20:16:16] <MacGalempsy> :(
[20:16:23] <MacGalempsy> baby steps
[20:16:38] <BeachBumPete> it is not a problem really just been doing a lot of other things lately.
[20:17:45] <BeachBumPete> I sure miss having access to the VMC I can tell you that
[20:18:05] <BeachBumPete> I was working on my custom blue sky laminate Field Target rifle stock this weekend
[20:18:52] <BeachBumPete> I started cutting it out and then remembered that while I have inlet the actions before using wood routers and guides the last one I did with the mill went VERY nicely
[20:19:20] <BeachBumPete> I started cutting the inletting with the router but it is slow and tedious
[20:19:56] <MacGalempsy_> i missed the part of what you were cutting
[20:20:21] <BeachBumPete> what do you mean?
[20:20:46] <MacGalempsy_> you said you said you started cutting "it" but I got disconnected
[20:21:33] <BeachBumPete> hang on a sec
[20:22:49] <BeachBumPete> https://s32.postimg.org/o85xifv0l/01_team_walther_lgu.jpg I am TRYING to build something like this...
[20:23:08] <MacGalempsy_> bad a$$
[20:23:14] <BeachBumPete> AGREED
[20:24:11] <BeachBumPete> That is actually for another fine Air rifle called a Walther LGU but mine will be for my Weirauch HW77
[20:24:20] <BeachBumPete> Very similar rifles
[20:24:34] <MacGalempsy_> you just want to build the stock?
[20:24:55] <BeachBumPete> yeah I have built quite a few
[20:25:30] <MacGalempsy_> ever find anything useful on grabcad.com?
[20:25:34] <BeachBumPete> but no I want to build the Stock, design my own custom scope riser quite different from that one and the wheel as well. I make all of those
[20:26:08] <BeachBumPete> I have been on Grabcad many times and there have been interesting things but I never found anything that I could use aside from just being inspirational
[20:26:54] <BeachBumPete> https://s32.postimg.org/i5yary6kl/02_team_walther_lgu.jpg this is the similar stock in simple hardwoods
[20:27:51] <MacGalempsy_> i see it is an air rifle. for some reason I was thinking 22
[20:28:08] <BeachBumPete> no these are competition air rifles
[20:28:21] <BeachBumPete> both of those are actully spring piston airguns
[20:28:39] <MacGalempsy_> the base model is 570, so what does it go to with the team stock?
[20:28:44] <BeachBumPete> they recoil a little bit unlike their precharged pneumatic air rifle counterparts
[20:29:14] <BeachBumPete> oh hell that stock is probably over a grand easy
[20:29:29] <BeachBumPete> that is without the adjustable buttstock
[20:29:58] <BeachBumPete> the Walther LGU is a fantastic air rifle tho I may try to get one at some point soon.
[20:30:36] <MacGalempsy_> my last air rifle is a benjamin-sheridan that will no longer hold pressure
[20:31:02] <MacGalempsy_> my bud wants me to make a fitting to turn it into a PCP
[20:31:22] <BeachBumPete> don't do that it is not safe for that rifle actually.
[20:31:40] <BeachBumPete> sent it to Mac1 Airguns for their Steroid treatment
[20:31:56] <BeachBumPete> it will come back shooting very strong and be easier to cock
[20:32:22] <BeachBumPete> he has a custom steel replacement lever arm that is stronger than stock and has better geometry
[20:32:39] <BeachBumPete> http://www.airguns.ee/gallery/c/yulevaated/weihrauch_hw97k_custom/0004%20-%20Weihrauch%20HW97%20K%20V-Mach%20LP%20Competition.jpg
[20:32:40] <MacGalempsy_> got to trust guys named mac
[20:32:50] <BeachBumPete> That is the same rifle I have
[20:33:00] <MacGalempsy_> hell ya
[20:33:01] <BeachBumPete> without the stock but working on that part
[20:33:17] <BeachBumPete> His name is actually Tim Macmurray
[20:33:52] <BeachBumPete> he is like a third generation airgunsmith and knows everything there is to know about the Benjamin Sheridan guns as well as most others..
[20:34:08] <MacGalempsy_> http://picturearchive.gunauction.com/573/10572584/img_8879.jpg_thumbnail0.jpg
[20:34:17] <MacGalempsy_> I have that one, but with a carbon barrel
[20:34:19] <BeachBumPete> He is also a Field Target Competitor/Benchrest Competitor I have shot in Tournaments with him several times.
[20:34:46] <BeachBumPete> that looks nice rimfires are fun too
[20:34:49] <MacGalempsy_> wanting an eotech, but too much $$$ to justify it
[20:34:54] <BeachBumPete> I prefer airguns tho
[20:34:57] <MacGalempsy_> Volquartsen Superlite
[20:35:09] <BeachBumPete> I enjoy being able to shoot inside my house and in my backyard
[20:35:36] <MacGalempsy_> inside? lol
[20:35:40] <BeachBumPete> I am somewhat familiar with the Volquartsen rifles
[20:35:47] <BeachBumPete> yeah I practice inside quite often
[20:36:02] <BeachBumPete> across my new house I can get just shy of 30 yards
[20:36:30] <BeachBumPete> I have a special target that is packed with some heavy duct seal clay
[20:36:46] <MacGalempsy_> down a hallway?
[20:36:54] <MacGalempsy_> thru the kitchen
[20:36:59] <BeachBumPete> it is made from furniture grade plywood and has a steel plate inside in case the duct seal fails
[20:37:34] <BeachBumPete> actually it is sitting in my master bathroom hallway, shooting down that hallway into the dining room, across the kitchen and into the far bathroom LOL
[20:37:53] <MacGalempsy_> now Ive heard it all
[20:38:24] <BeachBumPete> I take a sharpie marker one of the pointy ones and just put dots on the target paper. I try to dot the dots :)
[20:38:30] <BeachBumPete> its quite challenging
[20:38:57] <BeachBumPete> If its nice out I shoot across the back yard caddy corner inside the fence
[20:39:05] <BeachBumPete> that is just shy of 50 yards
[20:39:52] <BeachBumPete> the Field target competition has a max of 55 yards so this is good practice, same with benchrest comp.
[20:39:59] <MacGalempsy_> so is your air rifle subsonic?
[20:40:49] <BeachBumPete> yes most precision air rifles are subsonic, when the projectiles, any projectiles break the sound barrier and then slow passing back thru it creates turbulences that can affect accuracy
[20:41:06] <BeachBumPete> I actually shoot World Field target class
[20:41:17] <MacGalempsy_> thats what I head. wobble at breaking the sound barrier and more wobble coming back down in velocity
[20:41:28] <BeachBumPete> which has a muzzle energy limit of 12ftlbs
[20:42:06] <BeachBumPete> so my chosen pellet which weighs around 8 grains needs to go out at around 800 FPS slightly less actually.
[20:42:15] <BeachBumPete> any more than that and you are disqualified.
[20:43:36] <MacGalempsy_> dang. tough stuff. brb grabbing some h2o
[20:46:26] <MacGalempsy_> well. its mostly water
[20:46:39] <MacGalempsy_> but partially ethanol
[20:48:02] <BeachBumPete> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9mbuXpgQ4TQ This is a little video of the 2016 WFTF championships in Lisbon Portugal...
[20:48:20] <MacGalempsy> are you there?
[20:48:25] <MacGalempsy> were you there?
[20:48:48] <BeachBumPete> no unfortunately I have never been able to afford to travel abroad for competitions.
[20:49:01] <BeachBumPete> I have shot in several National Championships however
[20:49:12] <MacGalempsy> make those stocks and take the trips as a tax writeoff
[20:49:19] <BeachBumPete> I wish
[20:49:30] <MacGalempsy> take a loss, and pay less tax
[20:49:36] <BeachBumPete> the best I ever shot was a tie for fourth place in the Nationals
[20:50:16] <MacGalempsy> I hope you didnt pick the music for this video
[20:50:24] <BeachBumPete> it is a VERY competitive shooting sport. The winners generally miss no more than two or three shots during the whole match
[20:50:32] <BeachBumPete> No its just one someone put together
[20:51:18] <BeachBumPete> It is a helluva lot of fun tho
[20:52:20] <MacGalempsy> I use to enjoy archery, took like 8 semesters of it
[20:52:27] <MacGalempsy> good way to start each morning
[20:52:40] <BeachBumPete> I used to shoot 3d tourneys
[20:52:54] <BeachBumPete> but I much prefer airgun competitions for some reason.
[20:53:12] <BeachBumPete> perhaps it is the gadjets and eye candy of the guns themselves but I just love it :)
[20:54:46] <MacGalempsy> the who package
[20:55:06] <kyle____> wait airguns can fire supersonic pellets?
[20:55:07] <BeachBumPete> ?
[20:55:17] <kyle____> i was totally missing out as a kid
[20:55:25] <BeachBumPete> lots of airguns are capable of supersonic
[20:55:43] <kyle____> we're talking about like, handheld rifles?
[20:55:44] <BeachBumPete> but most of them are not very accurate when doing so
[20:55:49] <BeachBumPete> sure
[20:56:01] <kyle____> i guess it's not that far-fetched, just never considered it...
[20:56:23] <BeachBumPete> I used to have a korean made Career 707 that could fire .22 caliber pellets at well over 1300 FPS
[20:56:44] <BeachBumPete> it sounded just like a rimfire and would blow thru 4x4's easily
[20:56:59] <BeachBumPete> it was designed to be more of a hunting air rifle
[20:57:03] <kyle____> sounds dangerous :P
[20:57:10] <BeachBumPete> it was amusing but not my cup of tea
[20:57:34] <kyle____> that seems like a lot of sustained pressure to hold in your hands
[20:57:40] <BeachBumPete> I gave it to my Father in law and he uses it to snipe jackrabbits at 100 yards that get into his garden
[20:57:48] <kyle____> nice
[20:57:57] <kyle____> reminds me of my grandma...
[20:57:58] <BeachBumPete> it is a pre charged pneumatic rifle that holds 3k psi inside it
[20:58:14] <BeachBumPete> when taken care of properly it is quite safe
[20:58:43] <BeachBumPete> there are literally thousands of these type rifles around the world now and people shoot them every day without issue.
[20:59:00] <kyle____> hm
[20:59:09] <MacGalempsy> is yours a 177 or 22?
[20:59:11] <BeachBumPete> the modern match rifles used in this years Olympic games in Brazil are the same system
[20:59:45] <BeachBumPete> my match rifles are all .177 caliber mostly because it is the most accepted caliber for competitions
[20:59:56] <kyle____> oh i see
[21:00:05] <MacGalempsy> well, the wifey wants me to turn off the puter for the evening and come watch a movie. catch you all later!
[21:00:40] <BeachBumPete> there are airguns that operate much like black powder rifles firing very heavy lead rounds at subsonic velocities that are capable of taking large game
[21:00:53] <kyle____> how long do pre-charged rifles stay pressurized?
[21:01:14] <BeachBumPete> you mean how many shots per charge?
[21:01:18] <BeachBumPete> Gn8 Mac
[21:01:27] <kyle____> i mean, do you need to empty it for storage?
[21:01:39] <kyle____> hard to find any indication of that just from google
[21:02:16] <BeachBumPete> no not generally in fact you do not want to leave them empty because they can collect condensation inside easier that way so you want to keep at least some pressure in them
[21:02:40] <kyle____> ah cool
[21:03:06] <BeachBumPete> my guns are spring piston but I do have a PCP rifle and pistol. I built the pistol myself years ago.
[21:03:34] <kyle____> pre-charged pistols are a thing then?
[21:04:08] <BeachBumPete> sure have been for years now. they are mostly hunting type single shot or ten shot round clip style
[21:04:56] <kyle____> i've really been missing out...
[21:05:03] <Duc_mobile> might finally have a house to put a offer on
[21:05:41] <BeachBumPete> even crosman airguns makes them now they are called Prod or marauder pistol
[21:05:46] <BeachBumPete> http://www.pyramydair.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2010/12/12-10-10-01-Benjamin-Marauder-precharged-pneumatic-pistol.jpg
[21:07:10] <BeachBumPete> Duc_mobile congrats I know how hard it is to find the "RIGHT" house...good luck
[21:07:14] <kyle____> damn you for making me reconsider my fun budget
[21:07:29] <BeachBumPete> hehe sorry man.. I have the same problem
[21:07:50] <kyle____> i've been wanting a gun but unfortunately i'm stuck in california for the time being
[21:07:52] <BeachBumPete> I need to buy another Field target scope as well as that new Walther LGU or another HW97
[21:07:57] <Duc_mobile> BeachBumPete: 1 Acres which should be enough to place a shop on the property depending on the price
[21:08:12] <BeachBumPete> nice
[21:08:15] <kyle____> looks like air guns are a bit more acceptable here but i need to do more digging to be sure
[21:08:33] <kyle____> specifically in the county and so on
[21:08:37] <BeachBumPete> yeah man believe it or not Cali has some reasonable airgun hunting laws
[21:08:43] <kyle____> awesome
[21:08:51] <kyle____> well, heading home now, probably be on later
[21:08:58] <BeachBumPete> you can actually hunt turkey there with the right caliber and power
[21:09:02] <BeachBumPete> Gn8 man
[21:09:09] <BeachBumPete> I gotta go too..
[21:09:11] <BeachBumPete> Gn8
[22:41:58] <Erant> kyle____: fwiw, I'm machining a 10/22 receiver in CA.
[22:43:05] <Erant> (Though pistols are significantly harder)
[23:40:47] <tiwake> Erant: rlly? an 80%?