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[01:40:45] <FloppyDisk525> CaptHindsight - Not only can you buy parts, T-shirts, too:
http://store.lathe.com/t-shirt.html
[01:46:25] <unfy^work> so. gonna start yoga stuff. supposed to reduce AF probs by 45% or something. the really important question: hot pink or black yoga pants :D
[01:46:47] <XXCoder> both dont blind eyes enough
[01:46:56] <XXCoder> use riot of random neon colors
[01:48:25] <unfy^work> looks like doods don't wear the traditional tight fit stretchy things
[01:48:40] <unfy^work> well, the chickly.... not so much 'traditional'
[02:05:04] <Deejay> moin
[02:05:06] <Crom_> neon purple
[02:09:33] <unfy^work> deejay o/
[02:09:51] <unfy^work> when i go shopping for some pants/shorts or whatever, i'll make sure to grab the loudest things I can find
[05:54:02] <jthornton> morning
[06:03:08] <Deejay> lunch time
[06:03:11] <Deejay> hi jt
[06:11:24] <XXCoder> having fun with my printer lol
[06:11:31] <XXCoder> http://picpaste.com/pics/IMG_20160903_033803-zV8hW2zd.1472899213.jpg
[06:11:36] <XXCoder> still issues but yeah
[06:11:50] <archivist> blue turd
[06:11:58] <XXCoder> yeah womat shit
[06:12:20] <XXCoder> womiat dammnit cant spell that animal. it shits cube crap
[06:12:34] <XXCoder> wombats
[06:12:36] <archivist> wombat
[06:12:50] <XXCoder> I have 6 of those blue turds heh
[06:12:58] <XXCoder> this pic is first one that didnt have bad issue
[06:13:04] <XXCoder> still have couple issues though
[06:18:34] <pink_vampire> XXCoder: very nice!!
[06:18:51] <XXCoder> its still bit melty, trying 200c now
[06:19:05] <XXCoder> and 15% fill lol been using 100% to test fill stuff
[06:23:25] <unfy^work> pewp!
[07:24:08] <enleth> XXCoder: 100% fill is guaranteed to give you problems
[07:24:27] <enleth> too much shrinkage stresses
[07:24:33] <XXCoder> yeah as soon as I tested 15% it was pretty good
[07:48:35] <Tom_itx> wow that one really shook the house
[07:48:55] <Deejay> what happened?
[07:48:58] <Deejay> earth quake?
[07:49:03] <Deejay> storm?
[07:49:12] <XXCoder> nah
[07:49:13] <Tom_itx> waiting to see hob big it was yes earthquake
[07:49:14] <Deejay> or did you just fart? ;)
[07:49:23] <XXCoder> keep your private life private ;)
[07:49:59] <Deejay> oh oh
[07:51:40] <pink_vampire> lol
[07:52:10] <Deejay> hi pink
[07:52:18] <Tom_itx> 6.6
[07:52:42] <Deejay> where are you located, Tom_itx?
[07:52:57] <Tom_itx> that one, Pawnee Ok. USA
[07:53:17] <Tom_itx> http://earthquake.usgs.gov/earthquakes/map/#{%22autoUpdate%22%3A[%22autoUpdate%22]%2C%22basemap%22%3A%22grayscale%22%2C%22feed%22%3A%221day_m25%22%2C%22listFormat%22%3A%22default%22%2C%22mapposition%22%3A[[32.58384932565662%2C-105.908203125]%2C[42.81152174509788%2C-90.63720703125]]%2C%22overlays%22%3A[%22plates%22]%2C%22restrictListToMap%22%3A[%22restrictListToMap%22]%2C%22search%22%3Anull%2C%22sort%22%3A%22newest%22%2C%22timezone%22%3A%22utc%22%2
[07:53:36] <XXCoder> long url
[07:53:45] <Deejay> no worky worky for me :/
[07:54:22] <XXCoder> yeah that kinda urls tend not to.
[07:55:23] <SpeedEvil> http://earthquake.usgs.gov/earthquakes/eventpage/us10006jxs#executive
[07:55:24] <Tom_itx> wonder if JT-Shop felt that
[07:55:24] <pink_vampire> use some url shrink service
[07:55:41] <SpeedEvil> http://earthquake.usgs.gov/earthquakes/eventpage/us10006jxs#dyfi - did you feel it?
[07:56:12] <pink_vampire> no
[07:56:15] <SpeedEvil> Oklahoma city hasn't been shaken like that for a while.
[07:56:17] <pink_vampire> i'm in ny
[08:02:54] <JT-Shop> if it was at night no way I'd feel that
[08:03:16] <XXCoder> whereever that is, im probably thousand miles away
[08:03:37] <Tom_itx> JT-Shop, it was at 7:03 am
[08:03:51] <Tom_itx> ~30 min ago
[08:03:54] <JT-Shop> looks too far away from me
[08:05:06] <Tom_itx> i bet OKC has damage
[08:12:47] <SpeedEvil> http://earthquake.usgs.gov/earthquakes/eventpage/us10006jxs#shakemap
[08:12:48] <Deejay> :(
[08:13:02] <SpeedEvil> The peak 'damage' rating hits 'light'
[08:13:11] <SpeedEvil> And that is well away from okc
[08:13:40] <SpeedEvil> ~10%g
[08:22:01] <JT-Shop> going to be a great day for a ride to the Lou on the BlueWing
[09:23:12] <unfy> here in Omaha area it was "neat"
[09:23:27] <unfy> having been through several quakes in cali .... knew what was going on
[09:23:32] <unfy> some other folks were freakin out though
[09:23:39] <unfy> not aware of any problesm here
[09:30:46] <MacGalempsy> good morning
[09:32:52] <Tom_itx> hi mac
[09:33:15] <Tom_itx> unfy you felt it in Omaha?
[09:49:33] <MacGalempsy> unfy?
[09:50:34] <MacGalempsy> wow. there was a 5.6 last night in Pawnee, OK
[09:50:43] <MacGalempsy> my wife said she woke up to that
[09:51:42] <MacGalempsy> im in Fayetteville
[09:52:11] <MacGalempsy> well, West Fork actually
[09:53:32] <MacGalempsy> a friend of mine is considering a 3040 4 axis mill for jewelry, does anyone have any experience with these Chinese units?
[10:00:33] <unfy> tom: yeah
[10:05:41] <enleth> is it possible to recondition a vernier calipers by re-grinding the jaws, then offsetting the vernier scale?
[10:06:25] <cradek> if they're inside/outside, seems like you'd lose the use of one or the other
[10:06:46] <enleth> true
[10:06:47] <cradek> but I don't see any other reason why it wouldn't be possible
[10:07:49] <enleth> I've got a nice pair of 30cm calipers with fine adjustment, but the jaws show a lot of use
[10:08:33] <enleth> I have yet to test them on some gage blocks, maybe it will suffice to knock off the burrs
[10:08:55] <cradek> very possible
[10:09:41] <enleth> at any rate, the inside jaws on 30cm calipers aren't terribly useful anyway
[10:11:32] <archivist> I sometimes just shorten the tips to leave the best
[10:12:05] <cradek> I've done that with abused sidecutters, but never calipers
[10:12:06] <archivist> most wear being right at the points
[10:13:43] <cradek> oh you mean the scribes?
[10:13:44] <archivist> also with care remove any high points leaving the original face intact
[10:14:13] <archivist> scribes!! internal points :)
[10:15:00] <archivist> not supposed to use ones vernier as a scriber (we all do)
[10:15:52] <enleth> actually turning old calipers into a scriber sounds like a good idea
[10:16:12] <CaptHindsight> MacGa
[10:16:28] <enleth> cut off the stationary jaw, attach a scriber holder, done
[10:18:39] <skunkworks> I have a pair of side cutters since I was in middle school. Some import set I got from my grandpa. The best side cutters I have ever had.
[10:20:05] <archivist> takes care to recondition cutters, my Linstrom cutters been done a couple of times
[10:20:09] <skunkworks> they get lost every so often - but seem to always re-appear..
[10:21:44] <enleth> archivist: don't you have to weld onto them at some point to bring the edge back to the correct width?
[10:22:37] <archivist> enleth, nah just keep the jaw parallel when closes
[10:22:48] <archivist> closed
[10:23:10] <enleth> until you run out of clearance where the handles meet at the pivot
[10:23:26] <archivist> adjust the handle :)
[10:23:48] <archivist> "take out the wear" a clock makers term
[10:29:26] <enleth> fair enough
[10:31:47] <enleth> one other thing I'm wondering about - I've got several bore gauge sets, each missing some anvils, but I figured it's always used with a micrometer and "calibrated" then verified for each measurement, so the exact length of an anvil shouldn't be important as long as the whole set covers a range of diameters with no gaps, right?
[10:33:00] <enleth> which means that making replacement anvils doesn't take much in the way of precision at all, they just need to fit the threaded hole and have a properly shaped business end
[10:33:05] <archivist> as good as your "feel" and micrometer calibration
[10:33:34] <enleth> pretty much
[10:34:15] <unfy> didn't find any wonderful colors on the pants btw ._. ...... but was just a regular store, not a fitness store.
[10:34:24] <archivist> some refinishing not so easy though
[10:40:37] <CaptHindsight> Oklahoma is crumbling
[10:48:03] <MacGalempsy> it is in the midst of a Hymilayan scale paleohistoric mountain range
[10:48:29] <MacGalempsy> I was on a trip once that claimed the Arbuckle Mountains were on that scale
[10:49:28] <CaptHindsight> MacGalempsy: depending on the source the ChinaCo routers can range from bad to just shy of OK
[10:50:41] <CaptHindsight> https://imagebin.ca/v/2aq3eWhTxbGY these had 1-2mm of lash since they had no threads or nuts on the ends of the ballscrews to preload the bearings
[10:51:39] <CaptHindsight> https://imagebin.ca/v/2aq2qZUtbOIM came with red oxide treated fasteners
[10:52:00] <CaptHindsight> ^^ brand new just out of the crate
[10:52:16] <CaptHindsight> all the linear bearings were crunchy
[10:53:36] <CaptHindsight> had to completely disassemble, clean and rebuild, shim the bearings, etc etc
https://imagebin.ca/v/2apzmk7rpwvC
[10:55:17] <CaptHindsight> other have gotten similar routers with nuts on the ballscrews for setting preload
[10:56:25] <CaptHindsight> all the bearings were skate types, never seen one with angular contact bearings
[10:56:26] <MacGalempsy> I am considering letting her design and just use my 4th axis
[10:56:34] <MacGalempsy> its just for carving wax
[10:57:55] <MacGalempsy> CaptHindsight: do you think the base setup was worth the chasis, and just do some mods?
[10:58:21] <MacGalempsy> did you have to change out the bob?
[10:59:35] <CaptHindsight> MacGalempsy: I got these locally from Automation Technologies and had the budget and time to rework them
[10:59:51] <CaptHindsight> bob?
[10:59:59] <MacGalempsy> breakout board
[11:00:02] <MacGalempsy> or controller card
[11:00:16] <CaptHindsight> they didn't come with a BOB or controller
[11:01:36] <CaptHindsight> we used a $10 ChinaCo PCIe LPT card and 3 axis stepper driver with LPT connector
[11:02:21] <MacGalempsy> ok. that sounds good
[11:02:28] <MacGalempsy> I was thinking about a smoothieboard
[11:02:37] <CaptHindsight> http://www.automationtechnologiesinc.com/products-page/digital-stepper-motor-driver/3-axis-dsp-based-digital-stepper-drive-max-60-vdc-6-0a
[11:02:38] <MacGalempsy> but not sure that can handle 4th axis
[11:03:28] <archivist> just use linuxcnc !
[11:04:05] <CaptHindsight> https://imagebin.ca/v/2aq0JWfJZfXK the final product working away in the lab
[11:05:04] <CaptHindsight> the PC, drivers and power supply all fit into two low profile mini-itx cases
[11:06:14] <MacGalempsy> brb need to reboot
[11:45:15] <MacGalempsy> well, the new install of windows 7 is pretty cool
[11:45:30] <MacGalempsy> did a bunch of tweaks, and it is humming along
[11:45:37] <Tom_itx> win7 and below is ok
[11:45:43] <Tom_itx> except ME
[11:45:48] <MacGalempsy> fusion 360 only takes 16 seconds to fully load
[11:45:57] <MacGalempsy> it was taking over a minute
[11:46:01] <MacGalempsy> sometimes longer
[11:46:07] <Tom_itx> catia load in ~10 here
[11:46:20] <MacGalempsy> catia? what is that?
[11:46:33] <Tom_itx> better than fusion 360
[11:46:40] <archivist> cost+++
[11:46:41] <Tom_itx> about 75k better
[11:46:42] <MacGalempsy> it would be cool if this chatroom had a bot like the #reprap channel
[11:47:04] <archivist> to do what though
[11:47:05] <Tom_itx> i have one but haven't installed it
[11:47:13] <Tom_itx> definitions
[11:47:14] <Tom_itx> etc
[11:47:21] <MacGalempsy> yeah like kthx
[11:47:26] <archivist> there are some lurking logging etc
[11:48:26] <MacGalempsy> so last night when doing a HDD recovery, I plugged both drives into the LSI controller, and it would only allow me to mount them as virtual drives
[11:48:47] <archivist> torque_calc
[11:48:47] <the_wench> http://www.daycounter.com/Calculators/Lead-Screw-Force-Torque-Calculator.phtml
[11:48:52] <MacGalempsy> did a recovery and it was pulling both drives as though they were raid
[11:49:13] <archivist> see lurking waiting to pounce and answer
[11:50:13] <MacGalempsy> I think there would be a lot of lurking around here, a bunch of sneaky bastards
[11:52:59] <archivist> just checking one thing I had in the bot, regofix have broken their site
[11:53:04] <archivist> http://www.rego-fix.com/en/home/products/collets-reduction-sleeves-tapping-collets/er-collets/paction/list/pcontroller/Article/anext/1/redirected/1/ptab/kind/size/er-11/kind/er-11-standard-mm.html
[12:00:17] <archivist> er collet dimensions
[12:00:17] <the_wench> http://www.rego-fix.com/en/home/products/technical-information.html
[12:00:27] <archivist> fixed that
[12:32:38] <AndroUser> Hello guys
[12:33:22] <AndroUser> Any 2.6
[12:33:32] <AndroUser> To downlode
[12:35:05] <MacGalempsy> ?
[12:54:42] <AndroUser> 2.7 i working bad for me
[12:54:55] <MacGalempsy> what is the problem?
[12:54:58] <AndroUser> And i cat find the 2.6 cd
[12:56:29] <AndroUser> On servo conf it works realy bad
[12:56:50] <AndroUser> I need a 2.6 to make a working machine
[12:57:07] <AndroUser> Then instal 2.7 and replace ini
[12:57:24] <AndroUser> I dont know why but it works
[12:58:37] <MacGalempsy> I think there is a way to pick any LinuxOS you want and just add the packages
[12:59:08] <aventtini> Dont know
[12:59:21] <aventtini> I will try 2.6.4
[12:59:42] <aventtini> I found on torents and is beta 1
[16:26:13] <Deejay> gn8
[17:00:27] <andypugh> Youtube is getting very het-up about the correct answer to the expressin X=6÷2(1+3)
[17:01:08] <andypugh> I can see why, I definitely get the answer that YouTube considers incorrect
[17:01:10] * SpeedEvil sighs.
[17:01:16] <SpeedEvil> Isn't it 1?
[17:01:23] <andypugh> Apparently not
[17:01:26] <SpeedEvil> I'd have to go and look up operator precedence
[17:02:51] <andypugh> Well, I think it is 1 too. I think that 2(1+2) has higher precedence than 2 x 3
[17:03:24] <andypugh> (i miss-typed the original expression, it’s 6 ÷ 2(1+2)
[17:05:37] <SpeedEvil> https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Crbe09UVUAMoA1p.jpg - heh - I remember the earlier discussion about lots of damage in the OK quake
[17:05:42] <SpeedEvil> this seems to be the worst of it
[17:06:24] <cradek> today's was the first earthquake I've ever felt, and it woke me up
[17:08:16] <Crom> Done!
[17:08:56] <Crom> just under an hour to send a fax with my signature
[17:10:40] <Crom> cradek, where?
[17:11:00] <cradek> Lincoln NE
[17:11:02] <CaptHindsight> http://earthquake.usgs.gov/earthquakes/eventpage/us10006jxs#executive
[17:11:35] <cradek> CaptHindsight: yeah need to zoom out those maps...
[17:12:12] <Crom> wow that was in OK
[17:12:19] <cradek> oh hey you can click it and then zoom out
[17:13:11] <CaptHindsight> we had a 2.9 about 3-4 miles below us that lasted a second, it was like suddenly dropping in an elevator
[17:14:22] <Crom> if it's under a 4.5 we hardly feel them... we did have a 3.3 right under us several years ago that wobbled the house for about 8 seconds
[17:14:40] <cradek> http://earthquake.usgs.gov/earthquakes/states/oklahoma/images/OklahomaEQsBarGraph.png
[17:16:01] <CaptHindsight> we rarely get any in the midwest but I wonder if the New Madrid will break loose in my lifetime
[17:17:10] <CaptHindsight> been ~200 years since it last did
[17:18:49] <malcom2073> andypugh: Is it 12?
[17:19:39] <malcom2073> Oh, you mistyped, so it'd be 9
[17:22:53] <andypugh> Reading between the vitriol in the comments, I get a feeling that US gets 9 and UK / Europe / Asia gets 1.
[17:23:49] <malcom2073> I can udnerstand the confusion. It should be typed 6 ÷ 2 * (1+2).
[17:24:08] <CaptHindsight> andypugh: does your island ever get earthquakes?
[17:24:39] <andypugh> Tiny ones, about every 20 years. Never any hint of damage or fdanger.
[17:25:16] <malcom2073> however, the fact that the US gets the same answer as me, and the rrest of the world doesn't.... makes me wonder if I misunderstand order of operations
[17:26:16] <malcom2073> Ah, it seems I did misunderstand
[17:27:10] <CaptHindsight> I get 1 and I'm in the USA
[17:28:03] <malcom2073> I seem to recall being taught, that division and multiplication were left to right, not M then D
[17:28:09] <malcom2073> eg: they're equal in precidence
[17:30:10] <CaptHindsight> PEMDAS
http://www.purplemath.com/modules/orderops.htm
[17:30:12] <malcom2073> Read the exceptions part of
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_operations
[17:30:13] <andypugh> Yes, but I was taught “BODMAS” and the implicit multiplication in 1(1+2) has higher precedence
[17:30:33] <malcom2073> " However, in some of the academic literature, multiplication denoted by juxtaposition (also known as implied multiplication) is interpreted as having higher precedence than division"
[17:31:07] <CaptHindsight> Speakers of British English often instead use "BODMAS", which stands for "Brackets, Orders, Division and Multiplication, and Addition and Subtraction"
[17:31:12] <andypugh> Rather than repeat the arguments over there, I think it is safe to say that globally, the expression is (perhaps surprisingly) ambiguous.
[17:31:52] <malcom2073> Indeed. It would be interesting to find out if there was actually academic concensus on this... but I don't feell like there will be
[17:32:15] <malcom2073> It explains why facebook occasionally comes up with these things
[17:32:22] <CaptHindsight> 6 ÷ 2 * (1+2) is this the original problem?
[17:32:26] <malcom2073> as "Bet you can't solve this one simple equasion!"
[17:32:33] <malcom2073> CaptHindsight: Yes
[17:33:31] <CaptHindsight> so it's PEMDAS but also from left to right
[17:33:46] <CaptHindsight> (1+2) is first
[17:33:58] <CaptHindsight> then 6 / 2
[17:34:49] <malcom2073> CaptHindsight: Except implied multiplication *may have* higher precedence than division, depending on who you ask
[17:35:06] <CaptHindsight> that throws a cure
[17:35:10] <CaptHindsight> curve
[17:35:29] <malcom2073> I think it's interesting, because you always think of mathematics as being universal truth
[17:36:05] <CaptHindsight> who do we follow, oh maths lord, show us the light!
[17:36:14] <andypugh> 1/2x is not interpreted by many people as meaning “half of x” is it?
[17:37:09] <CaptHindsight> you mean 0.5x :)
[17:37:38] <CaptHindsight> what does the back of the book say?
[17:38:43] <malcom2073> CaptHindsight:
https://math.berkeley.edu/~gbergman/misc/numbers/ord_ops.html
[17:39:04] <malcom2073> The answer is: fix the problem
[17:39:51] <malcom2073> Which I think is a halariously awesome answer.
[17:40:39] <CaptHindsight> I bet the SAT or similar has their own Correct answer
[17:41:31] <CaptHindsight> and I thought only vowels are ambiguous
[17:43:00] <LeelooMinai> If you are a programmer, this is not a problem since although * and / have the same precedence, the associate left to right:)
[17:43:58] <andypugh> LeelooMinai: Diferent programming languages interpret -2^2 (or -2**2) diferently
[17:44:55] <andypugh> I was wrong about UK earthquakes there have been 10 fatalities caused by eartquakes in the UK since 1048
[17:45:06] <andypugh> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_earthquakes_in_the_British_Isles
[17:45:48] <CaptHindsight> so about 1/100 of a person per year
[17:45:52] <LeelooMinai> Since 1048... lol
[17:46:06] <LeelooMinai> Those states must be rock-solid
[17:46:10] <LeelooMinai> stats*
[17:48:00] <LeelooMinai> Are tool changers only the realm of big/expensive machines?
[17:48:37] <andypugh> LeelooMinai: Not at all
[17:49:01] <andypugh> Rack tool-changers are moderately common on home-built routers
[17:49:23] <LeelooMinai> Hmm, I see them only on big machines on youtube
[17:50:30] <LeelooMinai> Not sure how it could be done cheaply for a hobbyist - they would require some magic/expensive collet system for once.
[17:50:41] <SpeedEvil> LeelooMinai: Not really
[17:50:58] <SpeedEvil> LeelooMinai: you can hack something with the normal collet and a fairly simple mechanism
[17:50:59] <LeelooMinai> Well, or a robot holding a wrench or something:)
[17:51:02] <SpeedEvil> yeah
[17:51:03] <Crom> the tormach tts system is duplicatable
[17:52:06] <LeelooMinai> It seems to be pneumatic
[17:52:32] <Crom> they're using a air cylinder to push against the cupped washers to release the collet
[17:53:02] <Crom> the washers pull the collet bar up to lock the collet
[17:53:06] <andypugh> LeelooMinai: One example (slightly fancy)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=etfmFJKksgQ
[17:54:56] <LeelooMinai> Ok, now do that with Chinese ER11 spindle:)
[17:55:12] <andypugh> I made my own drawbar and collet thingy, but have not (so far) got round to the auto-change part. Still jolly handy:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pxrzJ_KfcQ0
[17:55:38] <Crom> leeloo you don't
[17:56:16] <LeelooMinai> Well, I guess it's possible, but would require some pretty weird design.
[17:56:33] <XXCoder> andypugh: nice
[17:56:35] <Crom> with er11 it's easier to swap spindles
[17:56:38] <andypugh> I don’t recall seeing anything which didn’t use a through-spindle drawbar
[17:56:50] <LeelooMinai> Crom: lol, swap spindles
[17:57:14] <Crom> 300w dc's are pretty cheap
[17:57:58] <LeelooMinai> Well, you would need to probably have the "wrench" system as part of each socket for the tools, but I could see it done - not sure if it's worth it, but still...
[17:58:15] <Crom> er collets are good in changed tools, just not good for holding tools to be changed
[17:59:19] <LeelooMinai> Probably it would be easier to just have each tool in proper collet in the first place.
[17:59:56] <Crom> R8 is about your best spindle size for tool changer
[18:00:02] <LeelooMinai> Or maybe with the niut part maybe even.
[18:00:35] <Crom> C5 collets tighten on the outside threads.. R8 has the internal thread for rod or pull stud
[18:00:40] <LeelooMinai> R8 is one of those tapering systems?
[18:01:15] <LeelooMinai> Hmm, no it's more like ER
[18:01:25] <Crom> yep.. 2 different angles.. straight and angled..
[18:01:39] <Crom> so it centers and clamps well
[18:01:43] <LeelooMinai> What is the name of those systems where you just have tapering part, like for drills?
[18:02:00] <Crom> Morse taper or ASE taper
[18:02:13] <LeelooMinai> Right, Morse
[18:02:40] <Crom> morse is a self holding taper.. meaning you have to knock out the collet or tool
[18:02:52] <Crom> R8 is a releasing taper
[18:03:10] <LeelooMinai> And ER?
[18:03:45] <andypugh> Not a fan of R8. My spindle is SK30 with BT30 pull-studs in a aindle that was built as ER30. Luckily the angles and sizes are identical and other differences are minor
[18:03:45] <Crom> mixture of both
[18:04:15] <andypugh> Err, not ER30. 30INt
[18:04:19] <Crom> BT30 has drive notches or lugs?
[18:04:28] <andypugh> Yes
[18:04:32] <Crom> on the spindle side
[18:05:20] <andypugh> Spindle has a tapered hole and two drive dogs. Tool holders have a flange with cut-outs for the dogs
[18:05:22] <LeelooMinai> So I look at those R8 collets and what is that thread at the back for again?
[18:05:32] <jdh> R8 has the advantage of relative inexpensive and some ubiquity
[18:06:07] <Crom> LeelooMinai, for holding the R8 device via a draw bar into the spible
[18:06:12] <andypugh> M objection to R8 is that you need a lot of headroom to get it out, which can be a problem when pushing the envelope of work size on your machine
[18:06:29] <Crom> big screw from the other end of the spindle shaft.
[18:06:33] <LeelooMinai> But I see R8 holders have a nut like ER ones, so this is not enough?
[18:06:58] <Crom> you have an example?
[18:07:03] <andypugh> But, R8 + 3/4 collet + pneumatic cylinder could be an easy way to a TormachTTS tool changer
[18:07:14] <LeelooMinai> Hmm, maybe those are some weird hybrid ones:
http://www.arceurotrade.co.uk/Catalogue/Collets/ER-Milling-Collet-Chucks-R8-Shank/ER40R8-Milling-Collet-Chuck
[18:07:41] <LeelooMinai> A, no, this is an adapter?
[18:07:52] <andypugh> Those are R8-mount ER32 collet chucks.
[18:08:02] <Crom> yep adapter
[18:08:26] <andypugh> So, you put the tools in the collet and leave them there, then tool-change with the R8
[18:09:09] <LeelooMinai> Riight, then I see how R8 is easy to change autimatically - you just control the screw in the spindle I guess.
[18:09:29] <qknight> we got linux cnc installed with kernel 3.4.9-rtai-686-pae and we can't load pluto_step using loadrt with halcmd, the problem is that the kernel module can't be loaded properly. the error is: RTAPI: ERROR: could not open shared memory (No such file or directory), HAL: ERROR: could not initialize RTAPI, halcmd: hal_init() failed: -22, NOTE: 'rtapi' kernel module must be loaded
[18:09:35] <LeelooMinai> E, hmm, is the screw in the spindle?
[18:09:42] <qknight> we tried to load that module but it is not there in the kernel module folder
[18:10:05] <andypugh> I have the same sort of thing for my mill, a bunch of BT30 toolholders with ER32, 25 and 20 collets to grip the tools:
https://goo.gl/photos/fGcJoQyLAMPagyu37
[18:10:09] <Crom> LeelooMinai, yep through the hollow center
[18:10:40] <qknight> the rtapi.ko can be found in /usr/realtime-3.4-9-rtai-686-pae/modules but should be in /lib/modules/3.4-9-rtai-686-pae
[18:11:33] <LeelooMinai> I guess my mini dream of sitting at the computer and the machine changing the tools is a bit unrealistic:p
[18:11:35] <andypugh> qknight: How did you install linuxcnc?
[18:12:12] <qknight> andypugh: with the image from a live-cd
[18:12:35] <qknight> andypugh: we did not use apt-get upgrade IIRC yet
[18:12:44] <Crom> the top end can be just a bolt, or a nut on a threaded rod, a bunch of spring washers tensioned with a bolt of nut, and you can have a way to put the springs even tighter to loosen a collet in the R8 recepticle. THat basically how Tormach does their tool TTS system
[18:12:45] <qknight> andypugh: no clue why that kernel module is not in the right folder
[18:12:50] <andypugh> A LiveCD should work.
[18:13:18] <qknight> andypugh: well we installed form a liveCD
[18:13:31] <andypugh> Yes, that has me very puzzled
[18:13:57] <qknight> andypugh: would you consider doing 'apt-get update -> apt-get upgrade' to help?
[18:14:05] <Crom> that's how I installed on this box
[18:14:33] <Crom> it's still debian wheezy 32 bit
[18:15:05] <andypugh> qknight: andypugh@debian:~/linuxcnc-dev$ sudo find / -name rtapi.ko
[18:15:05] <andypugh> [sudo] password for andypugh:
[18:15:21] <andypugh> (Hmm, that went poorly)
[18:15:45] <Crom> I'm running the RTAI kernel though..
[18:15:55] <qknight> andypugh: find / -name rtapi.ko -> /usr/realtime-3.4-9-rtai-686-pae/modules/linuxcnc/rtapi.ko
[18:16:09] <andypugh> My point was that my (functioning) RTAI install has it at: /usr/realtime-3.4-9-rtai-686-pae/modules/linuxcnc/rtapi.ko
[18:16:22] <Crom> mine /usr/realtime-3.4-9-rtai-686-pae/modules/linuxcnc/rtapi.ko
[18:16:26] <qknight> andypugh: we have it there
[18:16:35] <andypugh> And it works on my system
[18:16:42] <qknight> did my 'depmod -a' maybe crash it?
[18:16:55] <andypugh> It’s not impossible
[18:16:57] <Crom> Linux LinuxCNC 3.4-9-rtai-686-pae #1 SMP PREEMPT Debian 3.4.55-4linuxcnc i686 GNU/Linux
[18:17:29] <andypugh> reboot (because RTAPI can get in a terible module tangle) and then see what “halrun” at the command prompt gives you
[18:17:29] <Crom> my uname -a
[18:24:03] <qknight> andypugh: wow! that reboot really made a difference
[18:24:22] <qknight> now the rtload finds something after the reboot, which keeps me puzzled
[18:24:48] <andypugh> Yes, it took a while to dawn on me, but RTAPI can get caught unable to exit because of mutually-dependent modules.
[18:30:10] <qknight> andypugh: failed to communicate with pluto-servo board after programming firmware
[18:30:17] <qknight> andypugh: any idea what could cause that?
[18:30:32] <andypugh> Has it ever worked?
[18:30:54] <qknight> andypugh: not sure. maybe we have the wrong cable or the board does not have a firmware?!
[18:30:57] <qknight> no clue
[18:31:20] <andypugh> Pluto isn’t supremely determinstic. There seems to be little logic about which systems it works on and which it doesnt
[18:31:21] <qknight> the port is EPP mode and on 0x378
[18:31:35] <andypugh> Set to EPP in the BIOS?
[18:31:51] <qknight> andypugh: we have EPP for sure
[18:32:08] <andypugh> OK, that’s the sum total of my Pluto knowledge
[18:32:23] <qknight> thanks very very much!
[18:32:24] <andypugh> There might be more knowledge of it on the mailing list.
[18:35:43] <CaptHindsight> http://www.knjn.com/eu/ShopBoards_Parallel.html this Pluto?
[18:37:09] <CaptHindsight> http://www.knjn.com/FPGA-Parallel.html
[19:24:17] <cradek> qknight: it's my experience that the pluto work with very few parallel ports. the symptom is the "failed to communicate" message.
[19:24:53] <cradek> qknight: I've had success with Pentium II and III machines with parallel port on the motherboard, and pretty much nothing else works
[19:25:08] <cradek> qknight: I have never seen an add-on parallel port on a card work
[19:25:57] <cradek> qknight: (I have only used pluto-servo, never pluto-step.)
[19:26:56] <cradek> it's utterly terrible hardware. if at all possible, you should replace it with good hardware from pico or mesa.
[19:35:00] <cradek> I've tried to debug it at the hardware level with little success. signs point to improper expectations on pin 1, but doing the obvious of adding a pullup doesn't seem to fix it. A picture of the programming phase on a pci epp parallel port:
http://timeguy.com/cradek-files/emc/pluto-pin1top-pin2bottom.jpg
[19:36:00] <Crom_> I have, but you have to go back to the days of vesa, eisa, isa days
[19:36:39] <cradek> have what?
[19:37:05] <Crom_> seen a add on parallel port work
[19:37:13] <cradek> with a pluto?
[19:37:46] <Crom_> hmm maybe I'm thinking of a different pluto...
[19:38:04] <Crom_> video editor...
[19:38:13] <cradek> yeah no
[19:38:30] <Crom_> used parallel ala laplink
[19:38:48] <cradek> this is a small buggy hobby-quality fpga board programmable over the parallel interface
[19:38:56] <XXCoder> filiment keeps gfetting tangled
[19:39:02] <XXCoder> I need a real reel support lol
[19:39:31] <Crom_> XXCoder, 2 skate bearings and some plywood and a rod
[19:39:37] <XXCoder> indeed
[19:39:47] <XXCoder> where do I buy skate bearings that dont need ship? lol
[19:39:52] <Crom_> or you could print one...
[19:39:56] <XXCoder> amazon does have that 100 for 20? something lol
[19:39:57] <cradek> a skate shop
[19:40:01] <Crom_> thrift shop old inline skates
[19:40:15] <XXCoder> or that thats good idea
[19:40:23] <MacGalempsy> home depot
[19:40:29] <XXCoder> I do plan to go there
[19:40:37] <XXCoder> find a nice sealed boxes for reels
[19:40:50] <Crom_> then you also get wheels.. and bolts that fit bearing for other projects
[19:41:35] <Crom_> idlers for a laser rotary table
[19:44:10] <JT-Shop> the Japanese Fair at the Botanical Gardens in St Louis was unbelievably huge with more people that I seen at any event
[19:45:50] <MacGalempsy> that sounds pretty cool. what kind of food did you eat?
[19:46:29] <XXCoder> Crom_:
https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:814597
[19:47:20] <JT-Shop> we didn't even know it was going on, we ate at Zia's on the hill(Italian) then went to the Botanical Gardens
[19:48:00] <MacGalempsy> nice
[19:48:01] <JT-Shop> they had some really neat exhibits and good smelling stuff in the food court
[19:48:20] <JT-Shop> 325 miles on the BlueWing
[19:48:37] <JT-Shop> time for this cowboy to pee on the camp fire
[19:53:20] <Crom_> that's a great idea!
[19:55:03] <Crom_> use a peltierre setup as a dehumdifier in the case...
[19:55:46] <XXCoder> peltierre?
[19:58:27] <Crom_> peltier
[19:59:23] <XXCoder> electric heat/cooler?
[20:02:23] <SpeedEvil> There is no need for a peltier in anything that generates heat to remove humidity
[20:02:37] <SpeedEvil> if you're 10C over ambient, your interior humidity will be ~50%
[20:03:19] <XXCoder> sealed boxes will just have diseccant in it
[20:03:22] <XXCoder> nothing complex
[20:06:28] <Crom_> just read peltier dehumids totally suck... Junction doesn't get cold enough...
[20:07:18] <malcom2073> peltiers are better at making heat than making cold
[20:07:58] <XXCoder> stiring engine then
[20:08:12] <XXCoder> can make things uber cold lol
[20:11:20] <tiwake> stirling?
[20:13:48] <XXCoder> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stirling_engine
[20:14:06] <XXCoder> its a heat pump or temperate difference energy extractor
[20:26:23] <malcom2073> I've seen them used along with parabolic sunlight collectors as solar energy producers
[20:27:44] <SpeedEvil> Sealed boxes for outdoor electronics do not work well
[20:28:24] <SpeedEvil> Atmospheric pressure variations and heat make them 'pump' air in and out through even tiny holes, which then condenses
[20:29:28] <malcom2073> Yeah if it's sealed, it needs to be *really* sealed, and dry inside
[20:52:09] <XXCoder> SpeedEvil: indeed
[20:55:45] <Crom_> finally put a Raspberry Pi to permenent use..cups print server
[20:57:32] <Simonious_> seems reasonable :)
[20:57:48] <Simonious_> I'm thinking about mounting one under my desk to keep irssi alive
[21:09:48] <Crom_> thinking of switching the RPi3 with a zero
[21:10:05] <XXCoder> lol cool
[21:11:31] <Crom_> then I can just keep it headless and kb/mouse less
[21:19:10] <Simonious_> yeah, I'd just ssh in if I do it.
[21:27:11] <Crom> ugh.. I'd need to get a hub hat for it.. or run a otg hub off of it..
[21:27:32] <Crom> time to go look for carp
[21:28:06] <Crom> they need a v1.4 zero with built in wifi
[21:28:30] <Crom> then it becomes the perfect SBC
[21:29:40] <Crom> there is that 1" cube linux dual board computers
[21:30:02] <Crom> one usb and wifi built in
[21:31:16] <SpeedEvil> They need a zero you can actually regularly buy in moderate quantity
[21:31:38] <Crom> VoCore that's it
[21:32:18] <SpeedEvil> http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Orange-Pi-Lite-Support-ubuntu-linux-and-android-mini-PC-Beyond-and-Compatible-with-Raspberry/32662738571.html
[21:32:19] <SpeedEvil> also
[21:35:32] <Crom> SpeedEvil, NICE!
[21:35:54] <Crom> 512MB ram ehhhh....
[21:37:35] <Crom> 600Mhz GPU
[21:37:44] <SpeedEvil> There are several models
[23:25:59] <XXCoder> hmm
[23:26:25] <XXCoder> whats best hole size for m4 bolts
[23:26:32] <XXCoder> clear not to be tapped
[23:27:08] <Crom> finally figure out the search..
http://www.aliexpress.com/af/orange-pi-quad-core.html?ltype=wholesale&d=y&origin=n&isViewCP=y&catId=0&initiative_id=SB_20160903180709&SearchText=orange+pi+quad+core&blanktest=0
[23:29:35] <Crom> hmmm no M4's here... M3 and M5
[23:30:24] <Crom> m3 is 2.844.81 for m5
[23:30:41] <Crom> m3 is 2.84mm m5 is 4.81mm
[23:30:53] <Crom> snug
[23:30:59] <XXCoder> thats tapped sizes
[23:31:12] <XXCoder> im looking for just holes for bolts to go though
[23:31:18] <Crom> that's the out side of the screw thread
[23:32:42] <Crom> so clearance would be like 3.85mm for a M4 look like
[23:33:03] <XXCoder> rad or dia?
[23:33:11] <Crom> diameter
[23:33:15] <XXCoder> ok
[23:33:25] <XXCoder> I think ill just go 4 mm
[23:33:37] <XXCoder> since it will be 3d printed
[23:34:35] <XXCoder> thanks
[23:34:38] <Crom> sounds good, 3.95mm be snugger and you wouldn't probably need to clean them out
[23:36:41] <BeachBumPete> Hello linuxcnc :)
[23:37:15] <XXCoder> yo machinist at beach
[23:37:44] <tiwake> BeachBumPete: bum be late?
[23:38:09] <BeachBumPete> Yeah I think it is kinda late LOL
[23:38:23] <BeachBumPete> But hey man it's labor day weekend
[23:38:40] <BeachBumPete> So I can sleep in til noon if I want hehe
[23:38:48] <XXCoder> yep
[23:39:10] <BeachBumPete> I scored some neat stuff for my shop yesterday
[23:40:10] <BeachBumPete> When I left Tennessee I had to give away all the stuff I stored my junk on and in
[23:40:31] <BeachBumPete> So I needed some kinda shelving or something
[23:40:43] <BeachBumPete> Did not want to spend a bunch
[23:41:07] <BeachBumPete> My wife showed me an ad on a local Facebook for sale page
[23:41:37] <BeachBumPete> Guy had one of those rubermade type five shelf units
[23:42:05] <BeachBumPete> I asked him if he had more than one and he said no
[23:42:46] <BeachBumPete> I figured that they sell them at home depot so I could get more if I wanted because I actually wanted like three
[23:42:59] <BeachBumPete> So I went over to buy it
[23:43:35] <BeachBumPete> While we were on our way over another guy posted that he had several of them in his garage he did not need anymore
[23:44:17] <BeachBumPete> So I wound up getting four of them in two different sizes for less than it costs to buy one new
[23:44:19] <XXCoder> you made it there?
[23:44:34] <BeachBumPete> I am pretty pleased with that hehe
[23:44:50] <XXCoder> nice
[23:45:18] <BeachBumPete> I have enough shelving now to put all my crap on and get the shop organized a lot better
[23:45:50] <BeachBumPete> My wife and I cleaned them all up today and put them together in the shop.
[23:46:17] <BeachBumPete> I don't know what the load rating is but they seem like they will hold a pretty good amount
[23:47:32] <BeachBumPete> I got all sorts of crap that winds up tangled up and in the way that will now have a place
[23:48:39] <BeachBumPete> I need to buy or build a shed tho now to go out back so I can put my lawn mowers and bikes and other stuff out there
[23:50:42] <XXCoder> man
[23:50:47] <XXCoder> having hard time figuring some stuff lol
[23:50:56] <XXCoder> like how to design a clamp
[23:51:18] <BeachBumPete> I made some clamps awhile back
[23:52:15] <BeachBumPete> I need to source a
[23:52:29] <BeachBumPete> An argon cylinder
[23:54:43] <BeachBumPete> Anyone doing anything interesting over the holiday weekend?
[23:55:16] <XXCoder> me well not really
[23:56:47] <BeachBumPete> I wrecked on my recumbent bike last night LOL
[23:57:19] <XXCoder> would 3 mm of material strong enough to hold spindle? ( clamp bolt together using 2 parts, both has 3 mm material area for bolts)
[23:57:22] <BeachBumPete> Bent the damn handlebars and almost broke my leg
[23:57:30] <XXCoder> what happened?
[23:58:06] <BeachBumPete> My daughter just learned to ride a bike
[23:58:28] <BeachBumPete> And she wanted to ride with my wife and I down the green belt
[23:58:56] <BeachBumPete> We were swapping back and forth riding in front of or behind her
[23:59:26] <BeachBumPete> It was my turn and I decided to zoom along the side to the front
[23:59:48] <BeachBumPete> Just while I was about to pass her she swerved in a curve
