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[01:14:04] <pink_vampire> hi
[02:30:01] <Deejay> moin
[02:42:57] <pink_vampire> hi Deejay
[04:30:24] <jthornton> morning
[04:41:42] <XXCoder> hey all
[04:41:44] <XXCoder> hey pink_vampire
[04:41:46] <jthornton> dang heat index of 106 today
[04:41:51] <XXCoder> you havent been on for while heh
[04:41:59] <pink_vampire> hi XXCoder
[04:42:10] <XXCoder> jthornton: this week is record breaking heat for almost everywhere in usa.
[04:42:22] <XXCoder> I'm just lucky enough to live atht place that barely dodge that
[04:45:12] <jthornton> going out early to try and finish up the big dig today
[04:45:19] <XXCoder> still dogging eh\
[04:46:02] <jthornton> busted a hydraulic hose first thing yesterday morning and it was 1pm by the time I had it fixed so too hot to dig
[04:46:25] <jthornton> I have one strip left to dig that is about 10' x 65' x 1'
[04:46:44] <XXCoder> forgot what you was digging for?
[04:46:52] <archivist> oil
[04:47:05] <archivist> gold
[04:47:11] <jthornton> 30' x 50' x 12' wood frame metal skin building
[04:48:06] <archivist> http://www.collection.archivist.info/Dads_Shed.JPG
[04:48:30] <XXCoder> where dad jokes live at
[04:49:12] <archivist> I wish I could expand space
[04:49:22] <XXCoder> ask doctor who ;)
[04:49:30] <jthornton> yep dad went up
[05:14:06] <Polymorphism> we areee the champions
[05:14:19] <XXCoder> champ
[05:18:55] <XXCoder> man I love this gif
http://cubiclebot.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/catzooka.gif
[05:20:59] <Polymorphism> that's one way to deal with a rodent problem
[05:21:16] <XXCoder> yeah
[05:21:27] <XXCoder> its fairly good, though if you look close theres few glitches
[05:21:46] <jthornton> got the base done yesterday for the press brake and the shafts and bearings showed up
[05:22:11] <jthornton> http://gnipsel.com/images/press-brake/press-brake-03.jpg
[05:53:11] <latheguy> Spewing the cats out of the internet, it seems
[05:53:47] <XXCoder> apparently lol
[07:14:01] <latheguy> hey, is it possible to tell LinuxCNC to output a given number of steps?
[07:14:57] <archivist> move a distance that will be a set number of steps* scale
[07:15:31] <latheguy> well, sure, if I knew it was properly calibrated
[07:17:10] <archivist> measure the distance moved
[07:19:06] <latheguy> I know, I was just trying to find other ways of doing it
[07:19:21] <latheguy> It made sense to be possible to do that
[07:20:37] <archivist> without measuring you have no clue errors in your set up numbers
[08:55:31] <gregcnc> golf just became about 1000 times more interesting
https://youtu.be/tpEkN1NdjKU
[09:00:06] <archivist> and
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z5u_2bGPdUY
[09:14:25] <_methods> damn i had no idea golf had any redeeming qualities
[09:25:53] * tiwake flails at _methods
[09:26:27] <gregcnc> https://www.instagram.com/p/BCwjNZ-SmYo/ Mmmm coffee
[09:55:07] <cradek> https://www.flickr.com/photos/67292116@N00/28251289542/
[09:55:43] <gregcnc> wow, that's a good one
[10:51:45] <_methods> snappage
[11:45:18] <skunkworks> https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/mach1mach2cnc/conversations/messages/151060
[11:50:56] <cradek> :-(
[11:51:33] <skunkworks> a lot of unhappy people right now
[11:52:05] <skunkworks> https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/mach1mach2cnc/conversations/messages/151058
[11:52:38] <skunkworks> I always think that is funny.. I have always thought linuxcnc support is pretty phenomenal...
[11:55:36] <archivist> can be hard for a dev causing the ship to sink to see the wood for the trees
[12:02:47] <ssi> anyone seen ContractPilot around lately?
[12:03:11] <archivist> !seen contractpilot
[12:03:12] <the_wench> Never heard of the entity contractpilot you ask for
[12:03:19] <ssi> lies!
[12:03:26] <archivist> !seen ContractPilot
[12:03:26] <the_wench> Never heard of the entity ContractPilot you ask for
[12:04:22] <ssi> bah I'm not sure how to find him now
[12:04:25] <ssi> and I have no irc logs anymore :(
[12:05:20] <archivist> Contract_Pilot_L | 2015-09-17 06:14:42 | Ping timeout: 246 seconds
[12:05:32] <archivist> !seen ContractPilot_L
[12:05:32] <the_wench> Never heard of the entity ContractPilot_L you ask for
[12:05:40] <archivist> !seen Contract_Pilot_L
[12:05:40] <the_wench> last seen in 2015-09-17 06:14:42GMT 838:59:59 ago, saying Ping timeout: 246 seconds
[12:08:42] <JT-Shop> http://gnipsel.com/images/equipment-shed/big-dig-18.jpg
[12:19:05] <ssi> nuts
[12:19:34] <Sync> ssi: try the linuxcnc forum?
[12:21:47] <ssi> yeah good idea
[12:21:49] <CaptHindsight> !seen Contract_Pilot
[12:21:49] <the_wench> last seen in 2016-04-17 03:51:48GMT 838:59:59 ago, saying Quit: Leaving
[12:26:44] <ssi> found 'im
[12:26:50] <ssi> internet stalking accomplished
[12:28:12] <CaptHindsight> gregcnc: for a mere $179 you to can get the plans to build your own CNC plasma table
http://chicago.craigslist.org/chc/tld/5679902567.html
[12:28:57] <ssi> or you could come buy my cnc plasma table and save yourself a bunch of work
[12:29:24] <FloppyDisk> I saw that ad for the $179 plans, thought that was a little steep...
[12:30:05] <ssi> also, anyone want a converted hardinge hnc?
[12:30:10] <CaptHindsight> I'm going to post an add for the same only for $150 and IRC support and when paid send them this link
http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?GantryPlasmaMachine
[12:30:43] <ssi> or how about an atrump 10x52 cnc knee mill that needs a linuxcnc control built for it?
[12:30:54] <CaptHindsight> ssi: pickup from Atlanta?
[12:30:57] <ssi> yep
[12:31:15] <ssi> I'm starting the purge
[12:31:27] <CaptHindsight> oh, you have a big forklift
[12:31:34] <ssi> I have a big enough forklift
[12:31:36] <ssi> for everything but the vmc
[12:31:36] <FloppyDisk> Emits showers of sparks - way jealous of that hackerspace...
[12:31:45] <CaptHindsight> have flatbed will travel
[12:31:50] <ssi> bring cash
[12:31:53] <ssi> <3
[12:33:46] <CaptHindsight> when I get the new space, moving myself
[12:35:09] <FloppyDisk> I do like cable track...
[12:35:34] <CaptHindsight> I need to separate things that like to burn from things that burn and clean from dirty
[12:35:50] <ssi> lol
[12:35:52] <CaptHindsight> not enough zones here right now
[12:36:34] <CaptHindsight> heh, wasn't referring to you at all :)
[12:37:56] <CaptHindsight> FloppyDisk: those plasma cutter deals were old listings or scams
[12:38:57] <FloppyDisk> Oh... I do like the ann arbor plasma cutter - my cable track comment is in reference to their wiring, although I should keep my mouth shut as it' more out of jealousy:-)
[12:42:04] <gregcnc> http://chicago.craigslist.org/nwc/tls/5690477991.html probably not cheap enough
[12:47:26] <CaptHindsight> cnc machines on CL are always overpriced, I'm not sure what they end up selling for
[12:47:40] <CaptHindsight> at least around here
[12:47:44] <FloppyDisk> If you could get them at auction, they'd go for very little...
[12:48:05] <gregcnc> almost looks like a school
[12:48:11] <CaptHindsight> they would be lower on ebay as well
[12:49:44] <CaptHindsight> gregcnc:
http://chicago.craigslist.org/nch/tls/5680881841.html
[12:50:50] <CaptHindsight> same one in Itasca asking $3500
[12:51:15] <gregcnc> same listing?
[12:51:43] <CaptHindsight> different, but would pay $3500 of a manual BP that old?
[12:51:49] <CaptHindsight> of/for
[12:51:53] <gregcnc> right
[12:52:34] <FloppyDisk> But a 'broken' circuit board of an old cnc makes it a project. No profitable running machine shop would buy that... We would...
[12:53:41] <CaptHindsight> I need to find that guy in Elk Grove that had a shop full of broken cnc grinders
[12:54:17] <CaptHindsight> he'd buy them at auction and hope they worked
[12:54:26] <gregcnc> if all it needs is linuxcnc/mesa
[12:54:40] <CaptHindsight> yeah, all had control issues
[12:57:15] <gregcnc> CL now lets you search up to 200 miles. that's useful.
[12:57:56] <CaptHindsight> malcom2073 mentioned that there are CL search engines
[12:58:17] <_methods> searchtempest
[12:58:22] <gregcnc> i use searchtempest
[12:58:24] <CaptHindsight> I don't get why they don't let you search by whatever radius you want
[12:58:37] <gregcnc> they claim it's supposed to be a local thing
[12:59:11] <CaptHindsight> yet they show you matches from surrounding areas hundreds of miles away
[13:00:10] <CaptHindsight> I picked up a ChinaCo AC/DC Tig the other day. All the parts are on ebay
[13:00:28] <CaptHindsight> all the boards are $99.99
[13:00:46] <CaptHindsight> ea
[13:01:24] <gregcnc> that's one thing about some china stuff, spares are readily available online and pretty cheap
[13:02:06] <CaptHindsight> I went through it and tightened a few connections and screws, works like a charm
[13:25:26] <CaptHindsight> http://madison.craigslist.org/hvo/5619791124.html reality show in the making
[13:34:11] <FloppyDisk> I want a operator fool proof torque wrench that stop tightening at a set torque (say 200 oz in), but allow the handle to keep moving? Such a thing exist?
[13:34:59] <FloppyDisk> Ratchet style torque wrenches will allow you to tighten w/ the ratchet, but you need to stop tightening at the 'click', if my understanding is correct?
[13:35:07] <CaptHindsight> not for cheap
[13:35:21] <FloppyDisk> That might be ok...
[13:35:24] <CaptHindsight> yes, when they click
[13:36:00] <FloppyDisk> I'm not that familiar, but don't you stop tightening when they 'click' or you over torque?
[13:36:27] <CaptHindsight> yes
[13:37:01] <FloppyDisk> But, I want to keep pulling w/ out tightening.. Always like to make it hard..
[13:37:07] <CaptHindsight> there are some electronic types that stop at the set torque but I haven't seen them for < a few $k
[13:37:10] <archivist> it is very obvious when they click, have to be a special type of gorilla to misuse
[13:37:22] <FloppyDisk> ^:-)
[13:37:34] <FloppyDisk> Ummm, assume operators are gorilla type...
[13:38:02] <archivist> ordinary gorillas should be ok, it is the special ones
[13:38:02] <CaptHindsight> they should be sent to work at the circus
[13:38:56] <CaptHindsight> oh I know, modify a digital torque wrench to give them a 10KV zap when they turn too far
[13:38:56] <archivist> I have an open ender that lets go and rotates 90 deg free
[13:40:00] <FloppyDisk> I like the zap idea!
[13:40:30] <gregcnc> nobody makes the big ones like the small torque drivers? some types use a clutch
[13:40:45] <FloppyDisk> archivist, what's an open ender (like open ended box wrench?). where might I find it..
[13:41:00] <CaptHindsight> http://www.protorquetools.com/torque-wrenches/electronic-torque-wrenches
[13:41:05] <FloppyDisk> gregcnc - yes, was thinking of a clutch possibly... Like a torque limiting clutch.
[13:41:19] <archivist> FloppyDisk,
http://www.specialized.net/Specialized/74Z0021-Huber-Suhner-PCSMA-Torque-Wrench-1Nm-8mm315-3831.aspx
[13:41:44] <FloppyDisk> Thanks for the links, looking at them now!
[13:42:00] <CaptHindsight> 10-20KV or two metal spikes that spring outward into the palm
[13:42:06] <CaptHindsight> might be overkill
[13:42:31] <gregcnc> you may end up with broken torque wrenches
[13:43:23] <archivist> there was a vid of a new type of wrench a few months ago
[13:43:43] <gregcnc> FloppyDisk, how much torque anyway?
[13:44:24] <gregcnc> http://www.mountztorque.com/products/torque-wrenches/tsn-cam-over-torque-wrench
[13:44:42] <FloppyDisk> I'm waiting for the spec, WAG is 1.4 Nm, 200 oz-in, 1 in-lb.
[13:45:00] <FloppyDisk> It's a polypropolene jar/lid
[13:45:09] <FloppyDisk> Jar only:
http://www.qorpak.com/product/1164/natural-polypropylene-jars-jars-only
[13:45:15] <FloppyDisk> Cap only:
http://www.qorpak.com/product/1863/white-unlined-polypropylene-caps
[13:45:50] <CaptHindsight> hire women to do it
[13:45:52] <FloppyDisk> I tried to look up their torq spec on the webpages above, didn't see anything:-( Waiting for customer... Get the impression he doesn't know...
[13:46:02] <CaptHindsight> far less testosterone
[13:46:50] <Loetmichel> there was one time when i thought i had thought i might have slept in a gamma ray source...
[13:46:58] <FloppyDisk> I liket he cam-over torque wrench, just need to get the right torque spec, they look too strong.
[13:47:25] <Loetmichel> had to fiss a bunch of M8 8.8 screws to the wall with a 1/4" ratchet wrench...
[13:47:57] <Loetmichel> screwed in the first one, tightened int one-handed ... and broke the head off...
[13:48:11] <gregcnc> mountz drivers are in that range
[13:48:48] <Loetmichel> ... peeled the bolt out of the wall... insert a second one from the fresh box i just opened...
[13:49:00] <Loetmichel> tightend it CAREFULLY...
[13:49:20] <Loetmichel> ... had the head in the nut..
[13:49:49] <Loetmichel> ... turned out the whole box was hardened to glass state and not annealed by accident...
[13:50:01] <CaptHindsight> nice
[13:50:15] <Loetmichel> can you imagine my looks to the screws and the small ratchet?
[13:50:20] <Loetmichel> ... and my hands?
[14:27:30] <CaptHindsight> FloppyDisk: get one of the electric jar openers and add a strain gauge
[14:29:11] <CaptHindsight> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Black-Decker-Lids-Off-Automatic-Jar-Opener-White-JW200-/371683752864
[14:29:59] <gregcnc> but he needs an automatic jar closer, he'll have to plug it in backwards
[14:34:01] <CaptHindsight> reverse the + and -
[14:34:48] <CaptHindsight> perfect for pranking grandma
[14:35:13] <CaptHindsight> make every jar a challenge
[14:42:36] <CaptHindsight> https://youtu.be/LT5_-A0m8_U?t=8m15s 20,000 Watt Light Bulb Test, in what looks like his dining room
[14:46:52] <gregcnc> i hadn't watched that clip yet. where do you use a 20kW bulb?
[14:47:34] <CaptHindsight> searchlight
[14:48:05] <CaptHindsight> and apparently in your bedroom or out on the deck
[14:48:18] <tiwake> gregcnc: a baseball stadium? for giving the passing car sunburning blisters?
[14:48:28] <SpeedEvil> If you use it outside, you risk attracting Mothra.
[14:48:51] <CaptHindsight> you'll need a big bug zapper to go with it
[14:49:12] <gregcnc> 20kW would warm that room right quick
[14:49:59] <CaptHindsight> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wYenANBM3Io Enormous Bug Zapper!!
[14:54:21] <tiwake> nice
[15:12:42] <CaptHindsight> http://www.3ders.org/articles/20160716-customize-your-american-girl-doll-with-diy-3d-printed-prosthetic-limbs.html
[15:13:11] <CaptHindsight> what!? Do they sell a doll with no arms and legs?
[15:28:09] <CaptHindsight> https://thescribblepen.com/
[15:52:10] <malcom2073> searchtempest is awesome Re: earlier discussion
[15:52:22] <malcom2073> I went from wondering where all the things I was looking for where, to "Zomg I don't have enough money!"
[15:58:33] <FloppyDisk> CaptHindsight - OMG, hacking that jar opener is a great idea.
[16:07:41] <XXCoder> CaptHindsight: nope but that news is awesome
[16:11:23] <CaptHindsight> XXCoder: no more will dolls have to go headless or limbless
[16:13:08] <XXCoder> CaptHindsight: well Sid have nice poineering program on toy repair.
https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-SPFLn3MJjnw/VUrASF3sYaI/AAAAAAAAfQA/ECep4vHfvKA/s1600/Hannah's%2Bdoll.gif
[16:13:51] <XXCoder> pity he went crazy with toys being alive.
[16:14:57] <CaptHindsight> when I was a kid there were doll hospitals
[16:15:16] <CaptHindsight> you'd drop off the doll and then get a call from the doll docs
[16:15:59] <CaptHindsight> after the bad news and payment your doll would be ready for release in a few days
[16:18:07] <XXCoder> lol ok
[16:18:21] <CaptHindsight> http://www.americangirl.com/shop/dolls/doll-hospital
[16:18:21] <XXCoder> also, thats dang bright light
[16:21:04] <Scipione205> Hi guys
[16:21:32] <Scipione205> my friend is stressing me because he's scared that 12mm steel shaft could bend
[16:21:48] <Scipione205> it's about 800mm long, for a CNC
[16:21:56] <Scipione205> 2 shaft per axis
[16:22:00] <Scipione205> *shafts
[16:22:07] <CaptHindsight> post pics
[16:22:16] <Scipione205> what pics?
[16:22:40] <CaptHindsight> everything bends, it's how much that might matter
[16:23:40] <Scipione205> http://mtm.cba.mit.edu/machines/stages/img/index.jpg
[16:23:40] <Scipione205> yes I know that everythings bends
[16:23:42] <CaptHindsight> if your wondering about how the shafts might twist, bend etc
[16:24:02] <Scipione205> but supported shafts are a bit more expensive that unsupported ones, but the bearings costs too much
[16:24:49] <CaptHindsight> what forces and loads and in what directions will they be applied?
[16:25:08] <Scipione205> we would like to build a 5 axis mill
[16:25:33] <Scipione205> for milling materials like delrin, aluminum, wood, etc
[16:25:41] <CaptHindsight> thermoplastic body for lead screw positioners?
[16:25:58] <Scipione205> no no
[16:26:14] <Scipione205> the picture is only about how the axis would be like
[16:26:47] <Scipione205> but I intend to use stainless steel shafts, polymer bearings, stainless steel threaded rod and polymer nut
[16:26:58] <Scipione205> (polymer = IGUS bearings and nuts)
[16:27:10] <CaptHindsight> the whole design matters not just the detail about 12mm rods
[16:27:21] <Scipione205> yes I know
[16:27:33] <Scipione205> I was thinking about over-design a bit
[16:29:08] <Scipione205> maybe you could point me to something that helps me designing and do calculation
[16:29:22] <Scipione205> it was 5 years ago the last time I did something like that
[16:32:38] <CaptHindsight> machinedesign.com
[16:34:42] <Scipione205> CaptHindsight: thank you, I'm checking this out right now
[16:34:46] <CaptHindsight> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mzWMdZZaHwI&list=PL3D4EECEFAA99D9BE
[16:34:54] <CaptHindsight> 40 video series
[16:35:15] <CaptHindsight> Lecture Series on Design Of Machine Elements
[16:37:19] <CaptHindsight> http://machinedesign.com/technologies/linear-motion
[16:38:08] <Scipione205> thank you very much!
[16:38:48] <CaptHindsight> http://www.ansys.com/Products/Structures
[16:40:56] <CaptHindsight> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_finite_element_software_packages
[16:57:59] <Deejay> gn8
[18:24:55] <Jan-> hihi cnc people
[18:26:08] <Jan-> I notice that the topic is specifically linux software - is there anywhere better I could talk about windows stuff?
[18:27:24] <Jan-> oh hey speedy
[18:27:27] <Jan-> you're everywhere!
[18:32:57] <malcom2073> Jan-: It's pretty specifically linuxcnc, but any general cnc chat often happens here
[18:33:20] <Jan-> fair enough
[18:33:32] <malcom2073> You're not liable to get much sympathy if you're having issues with Mach,likely get more jokes and laughs than help... but it doesn't hurt to ask :-P
[18:33:41] <CaptHindsight> some here never get enough of knocking Windows CNC software
[18:33:41] <Jan-> right now we're at the "hammering pieces of metal" stage
[18:34:04] <Jan-> once we get something that will motor itself up and down at the press of a button, we'll worry about how to drive it :)
[18:34:29] <Jan-> (the assumption being that the mechanics are the hard part)
[18:34:59] <malcom2073> I've found the part between building the base machine, and using the machine for actual work is the hardest
[18:35:06] <Jan-> well yes.
[18:35:27] <Jan-> right now we have two axes which will happily wind up and down their lengths... using a power drill.
[18:35:34] <Jan-> but hey, it all seems pretty rigid and plausible :)
[18:35:46] <malcom2073> Nice
[18:36:09] <Jan-> what we want to be able to do is draw stuff in say adobe illustrator and somehow get it to cut those things out.
[18:36:17] <Jan-> The assumption is that's possible. Somehow.
[18:36:30] <malcom2073> Yep, that's the tough upart.
[18:36:50] <CaptHindsight> Jan-: have you seen this?
http://machinedesign.com/technologies/linear-motion
[18:37:03] <Jan-> Err, well, I'm gonna stick with my assumption that the mechanics are the tough part.
[18:37:04] <malcom2073> And sure, easiest way is probably to export it to SVG, then use inkscape or something like that to convert it to gcode for the machine to use
[18:37:12] <CaptHindsight> Jan-: or these?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mzWMdZZaHwI&list=PL3D4EECEFAA99D9BE
[18:37:14] <Jan-> What I want to avoid is having to write code.
[18:37:38] <Jan-> Most of all I want to avoid having to write some huge design tool specifically for it.
[18:37:46] * Jan- is not really a software engineer
[18:38:02] <malcom2073> There are already tools out there for going from images to cut patterns
[18:38:12] <Jan-> I was hoping so.
[18:38:31] <Jan-> I was sort of hoping we could do it without going to linux, but that may be a forlorn hope :/
[18:38:48] <malcom2073> The actual process of producing gcode can be done without using linux
[18:39:05] <malcom2073> using the gcode to make the machine move, that's what linuxcnc is for
[18:39:27] <Jan-> that or grbl on an arduino maybe
[18:39:40] <malcom2073> True, it's a matter of what compromises are you willing to make.
[18:39:56] <malcom2073> If grbl is adequate for what you want to do, then by all means
[18:40:11] <Jan-> I suspect our needs come under the general heading of "basic as hell"
[18:40:20] <malcom2073> hmm, grbl may not be up to that task
[18:40:28] <malcom2073> But hey, doesn't hurt to try :-P
[18:40:39] <Jan-> I'm getting a certain feeling about your attitude to grbl :)
[18:40:52] <CaptHindsight> it almost works
[18:40:55] <malcom2073> It does almost work
[18:41:12] <Jan-> ohdear
[18:41:15] <Jan-> this isn't sounding good
[18:41:18] <malcom2073> Like I said, it may work for oyu
[18:41:55] <malcom2073> It requires a certain amount of literal flexability
[18:42:15] <malcom2073> What kind of machine do you have?
[18:42:38] <Jan-> this particular PC is a dual xeon video editing workstation.
[18:42:41] <Jan-> But it runs windows 7.
[18:42:47] <malcom2073> Sorry, what kind of *cnc* machine do you have?
[18:42:57] <Jan-> A large pile of parts and good intentions? :)
[18:43:08] <malcom2073> Hah nice, so your own design?
[18:43:18] <Jan-> the plan is to end up with something that will just about cut thin aluminium probably using a router.
[18:44:00] <Jan-> the horizontal axis is about 18 inches, the vertical one is about a foot, and the big long main one is about two feet.
[18:44:25] <Jan-> each rotation of the *ahem* "lead screws" advances the machine by 1.5 millimeters.
[18:44:41] <malcom2073> why the ahem?
[18:44:42] <Jan-> Stepper motors and controllers are yet to buy.
[18:45:00] <Jan-> Um well, because they're not really lead screws, they're *mumblemumble*
[18:45:02] <JT-Shop> all thread is my guess
[18:45:06] * Jan- shifts awkwardly from foot to foot
[18:45:19] <Jan-> *mumblemumble* what he said
[18:45:30] <Jan-> but hey, we found some straight lengths!
[18:45:32] <malcom2073> Then I think grbl will do fine for you heh
[18:45:46] <JT-Shop> nothing to be ashamed of gotta start somewhere
[18:45:59] <Jan-> well we sort of had this plan of doing it as much from parts on hand as possible.
[18:46:03] <malcom2073> indeed, there have been people here who made routers out of drawer slides and MDF
[18:46:11] <Jan-> so far we think we can get to a working cnc machine for about UK£100
[18:46:15] <Jan-> including steppers
[18:46:17] <Jan-> hehe
[18:46:34] <malcom2073> Ebay has chinese stepper drivers for like $15
[18:46:39] <Jan-> I noticed.
[18:46:44] <malcom2073> Or if you do the grblboard, its drivers are only like $10
[18:46:46] <JT-Shop> where is Andy...
[18:46:47] <Jan-> That's sort of the plan. But I don't know how much torque they develop.
[18:47:15] <Jan-> I mean look obviously this is all very low end, the thinking is that if we try as hard as we possibly can and end up with something that barely works, we'll be doing quite well.
[18:47:45] <malcom2073> The pololu's on the grb can drive nema17's just fine, which is good enough for a very slow weak router
[18:48:06] <Jan-> well it's never going to be fast, it uses M10 by 1.5 threaded rod :)
[18:48:15] <malcom2073> I mean slow cutting
[18:48:19] <malcom2073> Slow moving too though
[18:48:30] <Jan-> well on the upside, that does give us quite a bit of mechanical advantage.
[18:48:56] <malcom2073> You're going to be hard pressed to cut aluminum with rods like that, especially overa 24" span... but it may be alright
[18:49:09] <Jan-> Which we will possibly need. Due to extremely elementary anti-backlash arrangements.
[18:49:37] <Jan-> well it's not supported by that m10 stuff, it's supported on one-inch steel tube.
[18:49:47] <malcom2073> Right, but the linear motion is with the m10 stuff
[18:49:57] <Jan-> Yes.
[18:50:10] <malcom2073> And that stuff tends to bend under load, which means under cutting load it's going to allow the tool to move more than it should
[18:50:23] <Jan-> and when I say one inch steel tube, I do not in any sense mean leftover curtain rail. *cough*
[18:50:24] <malcom2073> But! You can deal with that when you get to it, and upgrade later to something better
[18:50:37] <malcom2073> Step 1: Stop lying to us. Sarcasm not withstanding, be honest.
[18:50:45] <malcom2073> If it's curtain rod, say that.
[18:50:57] <Jan-> Well, it actually is one inch steel tube.
[18:51:14] <malcom2073> Then at least it's fairly sturdy heh
[18:51:18] <Jan-> I wouldn't put money on how straight it is.
[18:51:53] <JT-Shop> if the object is to learn all about CNC your on the right track
[18:52:08] <Jan-> oh sure. if this ends up being a multi year project, so be it.
[18:52:10] <Jan-> it's for fun
[18:52:11] <JT-Shop> have you visited my web site?
[18:52:37] <Jan-> if it's the one in the topic, yes
[18:52:49] <JT-Shop> gnipsel.com
[18:53:16] <Jan-> oh okay
[18:53:56] <Jan-> see the requirements for linuxcnc seem to be quite specific, I guess due to the real time thing.
[18:54:02] <Jan-> this worries me
[18:54:30] <JT-Shop> why
[18:54:42] <Jan-> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Hardware_Requirements
[18:56:18] <JT-Shop> do you have a desktop pc of some type?
[18:56:34] <Jan-> sure. we can probably come up with a low powered one specifically for this, from the junkbox.
[18:57:38] <JT-Shop> simple, download the livecd and burn it then test the latency
[18:57:55] <Jan-> I think if we can make grbl work we will.
[18:57:59] <Jan-> but that's a good backup plan
[18:59:37] <malcom2073> Oh yeah, skunkworks_, not sure if you saw my message, but I found the manual for the control system on the mfg website suprisingly. Got it up and running with that :-D. Learning how to use it now. Damn thing still has a punch-tape reader
[19:00:38] <Jan-> Anyway I'm not doing the mechanics.
[19:00:43] <Jan-> He reckons he can get something reasonable together.
[19:00:47] <Jan-> At that point it becomes my problem :/
[19:07:46] <Jan-> you're gonna laugh, but I didn't know you could put a plasma cutter on a CNC machine.
[19:07:57] * Jan- scratches her head
[19:09:23] <Tom_itx> mmm this must be Jan- from #avr
[19:09:34] <Jan-> oh hey tom. how'd you figure?
[19:09:46] <Jan-> we're still using your ISP widget :)
[19:14:10] * JT-Shop retires to the couch
[19:14:18] <JT-Shop> hey Tom_itx the big dig is done!
[19:14:29] <Tom_itx> JT-Shop you .... damn you beat me to the question
[19:14:47] <Tom_itx> i bet you're happy
[19:15:05] <Jan-> Tom_itx: how's everything going?
[19:15:35] <Tom_itx> earth is still spinning on it's axis so.. ok i guess
[19:16:00] <Jan-> well, you can have this donut, if it helps
[19:16:03] * Jan- hands Tom_itx a donut
[19:16:42] <Tom_itx> just had enchiladas
[19:17:05] <Jan-> *sigh* I love mexican food, but it's hard to get in the UK
[19:17:33] <Jan-> until recently we had none at all the town where I live. There is now, but it's... wait for it... Taco Bell. Is that even mexican?
[19:17:35] <Tom_itx> i forgot what you were doing... theater props was it or something like that?
[19:17:50] <Jan-> movie props quite often yes.
[19:17:56] <Jan-> hence cnc cutter :D
[19:19:34] <Jan-> it's possibly a crazy desire, but there are lots of people on youtube that seem to have made them from parts of an old shower head or something, and of course everything on youtube is a model for real life.
[19:20:12] <Tom_itx> made what from a shower head?
[19:20:49] <enleth> Jan-: FYI, you'll find that threaded rods have a tendency to somehow become smooth rods when used to drive stuff. the thread just kind of decides to - uh - screw it and gets ground off by the nut
[19:20:56] <enleth> but, yeah, it's cheap to replace I guess
[19:21:16] <Tom_itx> use acme rod at least
[19:27:35] <Jan-> enleth: that was sort of the thought.
[19:27:49] <Jan-> you can reduce the friction by running it up and down a few times with a power drill, with rubbing compound.
[19:28:19] <Jan-> And yeah. If this thing gets used enough to wear it out, we can always change the drive screws out for something better.
[19:29:26] <enleth> sure, that's ought to be enough at least for initial setup of the drive electronics and software
[19:30:10] <Jan-> I assume there's some sort of "how many steps per unit distance" setting somewhere.
[19:30:59] <Jan-> some of these stepper motors have one hundred steps per revolution, and 1/66 of a mm seems enough resolution
[19:33:04] <Tom_itx> 200 steps per rev are pretty common
[19:33:15] <Tom_itx> 1.8 deg step
[19:33:39] <Tom_itx> drivers can microstep for finer stepping
[19:34:01] <Tom_itx> i'm getting about 40k steps per inch on mine
[19:34:08] <Jan-> since we're using comparatively fine threads, I wondered if we should avoid motors with lots of steps.
[19:34:21] <Tom_itx> no
[19:35:55] <Jan-> no don't do that, or no get ones with few steps?
[19:36:30] <Tom_itx> lots of steps is ok
[19:36:37] <Jan-> and that won't make it slower?
[19:37:15] <Tom_itx> depends on the drivers and power supply
[19:37:58] <Jan-> I suspect both will be Super Low Cost Shenzhen Brand
[19:38:18] <enleth> rebranded/used Leadshine probably
[19:38:42] <enleth> unless you go for the smallest ones like stepsticks
[19:39:57] <enleth> but they're intended for 3D printers which don't have to overcome any cutting pressure in addition to axis friction
[19:40:09] <Jan-> we're not really caring how big this thing is.
[19:40:15] <Jan-> so we can strap on more or less anything
[19:40:44] <enleth> see if you can grab any "serious" looking stepper drives on ebay
[19:40:54] <Jan-> there's also an option to put one motor on each end of the thread, depending on whether that even works.
[19:41:55] <enleth> there are ways to do that, but unless the motors are identical and you know what you're doing, you need two stepper drives for this, which doubles the cost for axis
[19:42:22] <Jan-> well yes
[19:42:28] <enleth> it's probably better to buy cheap used stuff on ebay so that you have a chance to buy something beefier
[19:42:39] <Jan-> I guessed you'd have to wire the motors so that they rotated the opposite directions.
[19:42:44] <Jan-> which is doable.
[19:42:52] <Jan-> but yes
[19:43:09] <enleth> there'a a multitude of companies that disassemble scrapped plotters and stuff like that, then put all the parts on ebay
[19:43:33] <enleth> medium size plotter motors is what you need, $10 a piece too if you're lucky
[19:43:46] <Jan-> I don't even really know what "medium sized" means
[19:43:56] <enleth> maybe less if you find a set of 2 or 3 at a discount
[19:44:24] <enleth> NEMA23 is medium for an old cutting plotter/big proof-grade printer
[19:44:27] <Jan-> I suspect that we would need two motors to drive the biggest axis, just to keep it squarer.
[19:44:52] <enleth> (cutting plotter as in, a vinyl cutter)
[19:44:57] <Jan-> I know what you mean
[19:45:24] <enleth> those two types of machines are probably the richest sources of old steppers
[19:45:34] <Jan-> there's a place on ebay selling nema 23 motors rated for four amps for £30 a pop
[19:47:20] <Jan-> I'm not sure if that's big or small it seems mediumish.
[19:48:06] <enleth> 4A phase current? that's on the high side for NEMA23 I think
[19:48:17] <enleth> medium-high-something
[19:48:22] <Jan-> it's twice the length of most of the nema 23 ones.
[19:48:30] <enleth> but that's still quite expensive if used
[19:48:38] <Jan-> that's new
[19:48:47] <Tom_itx> double stack
[19:48:51] <Tom_itx> or triple
[19:49:03] <enleth> ah, for a new one, it's a fair price
[19:49:13] <Jan-> this one:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/121684006513
[19:49:20] <enleth> but if you want to keep it under 100GBP, look for used ones
[19:49:36] <Jan-> I don't know how much grunt these things have
[19:49:47] <Jan-> I've taken the thing in my hand and wound it round, it takes *some* torque to movie it
[19:49:57] <Jan-> I don't know how much these will do
[19:50:02] <Tom_itx> http://www.automationtechnologiesinc.com/products-page/nema-23
[19:50:06] <enleth> you can actually measure it
[19:50:23] <skunkworks_> https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/mach1mach2cnc/conversations/messages/151091
[19:50:34] <Jan-> they have a spec in newton meters
[19:50:44] <Jan-> I guess we can just put a lever arm on it and test
[19:50:51] <Jan-> but it's hard to quantify the tool forces
[19:50:51] <enleth> or a bobbin and some string
[19:51:21] <enleth> plenty of ways to do that
[19:52:02] <Jan-> well we could always put a giant laser on the end.
[19:52:09] <Jan-> then you can cut anything you want with no tool forces at all!
[19:52:46] <Sync> that'S not really the case tho
[19:53:15] <Jan-> why's that
[19:54:06] <Jan-> gah what's all this ounce-inches
[19:54:16] <Jan-> woah 570 ounce inches, that's tons
[19:55:56] <Jan-> anyway, I need to sleep
[19:55:58] <Jan-> thanks guys :)
[20:57:59] <Frank_12> hi people
[21:19:10] <cncakias> hello
