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[00:00:54] <CaptHindsight> DIY CNC Epoxy Granite
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-0Cn0WRXPKs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ywr31rX9VUo
[00:01:24] <CaptHindsight> valen has his diy with pics somewhere that I can't find right now
[00:11:18] <DLPeterson> CaptHindsight, those videos are awesome. thanks for sending.
[00:12:33] <XXCoder> $2,900 sale price for armbot
[00:12:35] <XXCoder> not bad
[00:12:44] <XXCoder> https://farmbot.io
[00:12:46] <DLPeterson> what is the name of the part cast into the granite base?
[00:12:49] <XXCoder> too bad cant afford that
[00:13:13] <XXCoder> DLPeterson: looks like just metal to hold rails
[00:13:22] <XXCoder> they milled it to make it very flat
[00:13:22] <DLPeterson> yeah
[00:13:30] <DLPeterson> and then bolted the rails to it
[00:13:47] <DLPeterson> are the rails something that are available off the shelf or are they also custom?
[00:13:53] <XXCoder> off the shelf
[00:13:58] <XXCoder> I forgot name of it
[00:14:13] <XXCoder> other type is SBR (supported bar rail)
[00:14:14] <CaptHindsight> XXCoder: the farmbot should be on wheels vs rails
[00:14:39] <CaptHindsight> autonomous farming
[00:15:03] <CaptHindsight> with a laser bug zapper
[00:15:16] <XXCoder> CaptHindsight: it weeds too, though no bug zapper lol
[00:16:24] <CaptHindsight> that's going to look like a piece of doodoo in a few years
[00:16:46] <CaptHindsight> once the rain and snow get involved
[00:16:46] <XXCoder> probably? they said it will be able to stay outside for years
[00:18:20] <XXCoder> it is open source though so anyone can build it
[00:18:31] <XXCoder> https://farmbot.io/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/Greenhouse-e1467249925312.jpg nice
[00:18:49] <CaptHindsight> t-slot and skate bearings
[00:19:05] <XXCoder> yeah it dont need millimeter precision
[00:19:54] <DLPeterson> CaptHindsight, at the end of the second video, there is a lighter CNC machine that looks to be based on something like 80/20, did you see that?
[00:20:37] <CaptHindsight> XXCoder: lets see what suits are filed in 3-4 years, whats the warranty?
[00:21:09] <XXCoder> "Warranty: We are still developing our warranty and will let you know when it is completed. What you need to know now is that if anything goes wrong with your FarmBot that is our fault, we’ll make it right."
[00:21:17] <CaptHindsight> hahahaha
[00:21:32] <XXCoder> its still at prototype developing so not a surpise
[00:21:39] <CaptHindsight> the "we let you know" warranty
[00:22:26] <CaptHindsight> I'd really hate to start bringing up science and facts but....
[00:22:59] <CaptHindsight> look at machines that are left outside for a few years
[00:23:08] <XXCoder> I know
[00:23:13] <CaptHindsight> how are they built? What materials are used?
[00:23:16] <XXCoder> I dont think it can be left outside either
[00:23:24] <XXCoder> did you see link though
[00:23:28] <XXCoder> its under nice tent
[00:23:56] <CaptHindsight> they should spend more time on engineering and less time beard trimming
[00:25:03] <CaptHindsight> just IMHO
[00:26:09] <DLPeterson> dang so much h8
[00:26:25] <CaptHindsight> DLPeterson: just tired of scammers
[00:26:51] <XXCoder> CaptHindsight: one nice thing is that it is also open source
[00:26:57] <XXCoder> meaning I dont have to buy off em
[00:27:41] <DLPeterson> dang, they claim millimeter accuracy
[00:28:17] <XXCoder> farmio? yeah for farming its quite accurate
[00:28:22] <CaptHindsight> DLPeterson: there's a whole generation that can do no wrong, well what they think since they never faced failure since it was always praised as a best effort
[00:37:35] <CaptHindsight> I have this great new idea for a coal powered aircraft ...
[00:41:23] <XXCoder> doable. go for it. make your bes effort
[00:45:40] <CaptHindsight> just as soon as my battery free electric car is done
[00:46:07] <XXCoder> you forgot about my massless matter
[00:46:08] <CaptHindsight> my 20 mile long extension cord should be here from China next month
[02:28:09] <Deejay> moin
[02:38:28] <MattyMatt> happy independence day, rebel scum
[02:38:40] <XXCoder> IMPERIALS!
[02:38:50] <XXCoder> They have discovered our secret base!
[02:39:33] <archivist> we had Trump sent over to control you lot
[02:40:16] <MattyMatt> he could join the SNP
[02:40:20] <XXCoder> archivist: your group miswired Trump
[02:40:38] <MattyMatt> he owns more of scotland than any scottish person
[02:40:42] <XXCoder> his speech is connected to arsehole which is apparently also mislocated to face
[02:40:42] <archivist> nope, he has a random setting by default
[02:42:29] <MattyMatt> unless you count HMQ as scottish. was she born at balmoral?
[03:31:12] <XXCoder> finally hes done! running it now :)
https://youtu.be/dVLSX_WCMI0
[05:32:20] <Loetmichel_> XXCoder: you mean: his digestive tract works in reverse whenever he tries to say something?
[07:53:22] <Polymorphism> http://imgur.com/a/UHgGx https://imgur.com/a/NhVWn
[07:53:28] <Polymorphism> some pics
[07:55:00] <archivist> same as last night pics with no annotation, dunno what to say
[07:55:54] <Polymorphism> Just posting those for anyone interested, I had mentioned I would post pics
[07:56:03] <Polymorphism> I talked to george he wants me to measure the length of the rails and the extrusions
[07:56:18] <Polymorphism> after that I'm going to try leaving all bolts loose
[07:56:23] <Polymorphism> and following the steps again
[07:59:45] <archivist> length might not be the right measure of fit, work out where there is a problem and measure the error there
[08:04:10] <cpresser> Polymorphism: that looks quite nice. i would recommend to use washer together with the hex-screws
[08:53:41] <Duc> and some blue loctite
[08:54:17] <Magnifikus> any idea why gmoccapy with toolchange just blocks? i enter the toolnumber in popup and the interface goes grey executing the change.ngc
[08:55:24] <Magnifikus> and strangegly it complains that change.ngc is not proper ended with M2
[08:55:39] <Magnifikus> either nobody uses it or its somehow wrongly executed
[08:59:24] <archivist> is it waiting for some hardware handshake?
[09:02:05] <Magnifikus> maybe need to dig depper maybe
[09:40:27] <_abc_> Hello. Can someone please say if the live 2.7(.4?) iso will run on an amd x64 as is?
[10:04:03] <CaptHindsight> _abc_: an AMD x86/x64 APU sure
[10:05:26] <_abc_> Okay, thanks
[10:05:37] <_abc_> You mean CPU
[10:05:50] <CaptHindsight> APU
[10:06:03] <archivist> but... that does not mean a bios on a motherboard wont screw you over
[10:06:26] <_abc_> I know I know.
[10:06:46] <_abc_> I want to try so I have limited time. Have to lug a monitor to the headless thing, etc
[10:06:54] <CaptHindsight> are you using an Opteron server system?
[10:07:01] <_abc_> Nono.
[10:07:29] <_abc_> Wait, I don't remember what the cpu is called. 2.5GHz 1 core or 2 core amd64
[10:09:28] <CaptHindsight> FX series?
[10:09:45] <CaptHindsight> A series?
[10:09:48] <_abc_> I really don't remember. Will look later.
[10:09:59] <_abc_> Athlon?
[10:10:09] <_abc_> I think it's nearly 8 years old.
[10:10:44] <CaptHindsight> BIOS might be the only issue
[10:11:09] <Magnifikus> archivist, its was some commented line for simulation :)
[10:11:16] <_abc_> BIOS an issue how? Not allowing boot from the hybrid iso?
[10:11:39] <Magnifikus> now another question: "G43 Z15. H1" this should select the length offset for tool1 from table
[10:11:46] <Magnifikus> but i dont get the Z15 here
[10:11:55] <CaptHindsight> power management or similar causing real time delays
[10:12:00] <_abc_> Ah okay.
[10:12:19] <_methods> z15. tells it to move to z15. after loading tool length offset 1
[10:12:52] <Magnifikus> ah but my highest z is, guess its fusion bork somehow
[10:12:55] <Magnifikus> 0
[10:13:09] <_methods> well fusion isn't borked
[10:13:19] <_methods> you've told it to move to z15 somewhere in your settings
[10:13:24] <_methods> maybe your clearance plane?
[10:13:46] <Magnifikus> retract + clearance is 15 yes
[10:13:49] <_methods> or maybe a toolchange position
[10:13:53] <Magnifikus> ah its g54 related not g53
[10:13:56] <_methods> yeah that would explain it then
[10:13:58] <Magnifikus> than its okay
[10:14:23] <_methods> if retract and clear are z15 it will try to move to that
[10:14:33] <_abc_> What's the name of the window manager in the live 2.7 iso please?
[10:15:36] <_methods> i think it uses lightdm
[10:15:40] <_methods> but don't quote me on that
[10:16:03] <_abc_> I won't.
[10:17:15] <Magnifikus> okay thanks method :)
[10:17:26] <Magnifikus> no i just need to get rid of all the toolchange and offsets bla
[10:17:50] <Magnifikus> for manual tool change
[10:18:32] <CaptHindsight> _methods: they solved it!
[10:18:44] <CaptHindsight> http://www.3ders.org/articles/20160701-how-3d-printing-can-be-used-to-manufacture-durable-concrete-business-cards.html
[10:19:49] <CaptHindsight> I wonder if they will ever have proper wooden teeth?
[10:22:07] <_abc_> Best business card idea I saw was printed circuit board, functional, USB disk on key implemented ;) Also writing and images and all that.
[10:22:19] <_methods> hahahah
[10:22:33] <_abc_> The guy was an ee / wizard, USA
[10:23:55] <_methods> the market no one knew even existed
[10:23:58] <CaptHindsight> _abc_:
http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/a/arthurccl101182.html
[10:24:02] <_methods> the concrete business card market
[10:24:22] <_methods> i should try and get in on this before it explodes
[10:24:25] <_methods> i could make millions
[10:24:27] <_abc_> You could smash your competition with that
[10:24:40] <_methods> sounds like a concrete way to make a living
[10:24:52] <_methods> a real solid path to success
[10:25:31] <_abc_> Okay, the joke is stale by now. Stop ;)
[10:25:38] <_methods> hahah
[10:25:46] <_methods> but i have so many more
[10:25:56] <CaptHindsight> do go on
[10:26:14] <CaptHindsight> http://3dprintingindustry.com/news/3d-printed-cosplay-in-focus-81013/
[10:26:31] <CaptHindsight> ^^ here's a real market for 3d printed stuff
[10:26:34] <_methods> yep
[10:26:54] <_methods> the furry market
[10:27:39] <gregcnc> i saw the concrete business card this week and couldn't fathom the applications I must be dense
[10:28:16] <CaptHindsight> wooden clothing
[10:28:47] <CaptHindsight> untapped markets
[10:29:46] <_methods> yeah the mob has had the cement shoe market for awhile
[10:30:11] <_methods> the 3d printer crowd probably should avoid that market segment
[10:30:36] <CaptHindsight> clothing and home accessories made from dairy products
[10:31:05] <_methods> cottage cheese hat
[10:31:20] <CaptHindsight> aged cheddar vest
[10:32:04] <_methods> smoked gouda shorts
[10:32:32] <CaptHindsight> beddah then cheddah
[10:33:51] <Tom_itx> i see all the brilliant minds are working hard today
[10:33:57] <_methods> hehe
[10:34:13] <_methods> i'm takin the day off
[10:34:36] <Tom_itx> so this is what the other half of your brain does?
[10:34:37] <_methods> yard work all day yesterday in 100 deg weather
[10:34:51] <_methods> cooked what was left of my brain
[10:35:15] <CaptHindsight> I'm just hoping to flood the channel with dumb comments early in the day to get it over with
[10:35:25] <_methods> good luck with that
[10:35:41] <Tom_itx> or you're just lowering the bar
[10:36:34] <_abc_> https://encrypted.google.com/search?q=printed+circuit+board+business+card
[10:36:34] <_abc_> http://www.instructables.com/id/Circuit-Board-Lab-POV-Business-Card/ ;)
[10:37:50] <CaptHindsight> http://cdn.instructables.com/F0W/8YTM/GLFUE0H7/F0W8YTMGLFUE0H7.MEDIUM.jpg about as low profile as the concrete cards
[10:39:25] <_abc_> http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-3673469/Armies-GROW-drones-field-Chemputer-BAE-Systems-enable-rapid-prototyping-UAVs.html
[10:40:07] <_abc_> I wonder if they'll 3d grow the soldiers in the same vats...
[10:40:40] <_abc_> Is there a current stereolitho system which grows the item from the bottom at all?
[10:40:46] <CaptHindsight> been done, they call the vat a uterus
[10:42:08] <CaptHindsight> bottom up
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t6iuv-Y036Y
[10:43:49] <CaptHindsight> Top down
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L-eSRdxjvD8
[10:45:43] <CaptHindsight> just for fun I should make a side across version
[10:46:18] <gregcnc> righty or lefty? would it matter?
[10:47:00] <CaptHindsight> I'm sure some might care
[10:47:27] <CaptHindsight> front back vs back front
[10:48:58] <CaptHindsight> are there any good movies at the theater today?
[10:53:16] <Duc> not from what Ive seen
[10:53:22] <Duc> most look pretty bad
[10:55:48] <CaptHindsight> looking at the indie list now
[10:57:07] <Magnifikus> anyone tried to use gmoccapy without this strange blockheight stuff for blockheight?
[10:57:30] <Magnifikus> i just want to alter the tool offset after a manual toolchange
[10:57:42] <Magnifikus> and retain the z-value i touch off manualy
[10:59:53] <Duc> CaptHindsight: the wife and I are a little spoiled since there is a theatre here with a 21+ section only
[11:01:20] <CaptHindsight> thanks for reminding me why I don't go
[11:04:39] <Duc> LOL. the kids behave better than the parents. I really want a cell phone blocker
[11:05:32] <CaptHindsight> and buckets of food
[11:06:29] <Roguish> cocktails, too.
[11:07:10] <Duc> this place serves drinks in the section plus free small popcorn
[11:08:25] <CaptHindsight> I like the full bar idea
[11:08:45] <Duc> its pretty good
[11:09:10] <CaptHindsight> I'd pay $20 for decent seat and cocktail service + drinks
[11:09:23] <CaptHindsight> and no cell phones or kids
[11:09:55] <Duc> I think it was 3 dollars more than regular seating and came with a free popcorn so that made up the difference
[11:10:14] <Duc> drinks cost money but seperate bar upstairs
[11:12:29] <Duc> we want to see Dory but no 21+ section
[11:17:04] <CaptHindsight> >10pm or midnight show
[11:18:29] <DLPeterson> anybody here using the Mesa FPGA boards? I've never used any FPGA so I'm not really sure whether I should sign myself up for something like that :)
[11:19:18] <archivist> plenty do
[11:20:18] <DLPeterson> what is involved in getting the FPGA set up and making linuxcnc aware of the functionality that has been programmed to it?
[11:21:56] <Tom_itx> load a proper bitfile for your hardware setup
[11:22:34] <archivist> it is mostly about setting up linuxcnc
[11:27:08] <pcw_home> Basically the specific FPGA functions available are discovered by the driver and presented as HAL pins/parameters
[11:27:09] <pcw_home> But you must connect these pins in HAL and setup appropriate constants in the INI file to suit your machine
[11:31:43] <archivist> DLPeterson, what sort of machine?
[11:37:03] <DLPeterson> archivist, not sure yet but some benchtop 3-axis mill. currently thinking a G0704/PM-25MV or similar
[11:38:56] <DLPeterson> am thinking of renishaw linear encoders on all three axes so 3 quadrature encoders would be needed, limit switches, and 3 servo motors that take an enable, direction, and a PWM or frequency input for the velocity or torque command
[11:39:17] <DLPeterson> and then having linuxcnc close the position loop
[11:42:18] <archivist> renishaw while nice is a bit good for that mill
[11:44:22] <DLPeterson> is there another mill of that size that would be on par with the renishaw? or something that I could do to improve the G0704/PM-25MV? Would lapping all the ways do it?
[11:44:54] <archivist> fixing the ways, squaring it up etc yes
[11:45:03] <enleth> DLPeterson: that really sounds like a waste of money if you're willing to go for top of the line encoders and servos
[11:45:11] <archivist> or start with an industrial machine
[11:46:37] <DLPeterson> enleth, archivist what machine would you recommend that is of comparable size?
[11:46:40] <enleth> DLPeterson: if a bridgeport is too big/heavy for the space you have, some Deckels and Schaublins were made quite small
[11:46:57] <DLPeterson> and what are the specific reasons for it being a waste of money?
[11:47:13] <archivist> chinesium
[11:47:36] <enleth> and I'm sure they made some small mills in the US too
[11:47:50] <roycroft> what kind of material will you be machining, dlpeterson?
[11:48:37] <DLPeterson> aluminum and steel, maybe some plastic here and there
[11:48:54] <roycroft> if you machine steel with a lightweight mill/drill you will have to take very light passes
[11:49:14] <roycroft> and you'll want to do plunge cuts as much as you can
[11:49:20] <roycroft> they're not very powerful nor very rigid
[11:49:53] <archivist> there were a number of copies of the deckels and the style
[11:49:56] <enleth> DLPeterson: you're just going to spend a good chunk of cash to buy quality hardware to be fitted on a piece of dung. quite possibly wasting that hardware because it won't be sized to fit some real iron in the future
[11:50:47] <roycroft> i have a g0463, which i think is a better machine that the g0704, and i know it's not even remotely capable of doing the kind of work that a bridgeport class mill can do
[11:51:16] <DLPeterson> just stiffness and straightness issues?
[11:51:42] <roycroft> it's more rigid, yes
[11:51:44] <enleth> stiffness and mass for chatter damping
[11:52:04] <roycroft> i have mine bolted down to a heavy stand that i made
[11:52:10] <roycroft> that helps quite a bit
[11:52:23] <enleth> and thickness of crucial parts that actually take the most abuse during a cut
[11:52:41] <roycroft> folks have done things like fill the column and base with granite/epoxy to make it more rigid
[11:52:50] <DLPeterson> hmm, interesting
[11:53:02] <roycroft> i try to take really light passes when machining steel with mine
[11:53:13] <DLPeterson> how light are we talking?
[11:53:17] <roycroft> and mine is not cnc
[11:53:31] <roycroft> 0.010" with a 1/2" end mill, for example
[11:53:56] <roycroft> it can take a while to get work done :)
[11:54:17] <roycroft> it's a lot better if you can "hog out" with plunge cuts
[11:54:37] <roycroft> i'm not saying this to dissuade you from getting a mill/drill
[11:55:06] <roycroft> just be realistic and don't expect it to work like a decent knee mill
[11:55:36] <enleth> DLPeterson: a deckel-like mill with a footprint barely larger than a wide stand for that chinese mill, but weighing 5x more, will probably happily take a 1/4" deep cut
[11:55:38] <roycroft> if you're going to cnc it and are doing low volume production you might be able to afford the time it takes to make parts
[11:56:45] <enleth> DLPeterson: and deckels are considered precision machines for small parts work
[11:56:49] <roycroft> don't expect the g0704 to hold 0.001"
[11:56:55] <enleth> not hogging mills
[11:56:57] <roycroft> maybe 0.005"
[11:57:10] <roycroft> unless you spend a lot of time tweaking it
[11:57:43] <roycroft> also, consider the parts you will be making
[11:58:04] <archivist> my mill is bad, I therefore measure before final cut, adjust gcode then cut
[11:58:31] <roycroft> you don't have a lot of z axis distance with a mill/drill
[11:58:34] <roycroft> there's no knee
[11:58:44] <DLPeterson> enleth, is there a US manufacturer that makes something like a deckel? Deckels are no longer made, right?
[11:59:22] <roycroft> iirc the g0704 has fairly limited spindle travel as well
[11:59:50] <roycroft> yes, it's 2"
[12:00:16] <archivist> short Z is a real pain
[12:00:31] <DLPeterson> roycroft, yeah it seems like many people lock the spindle all the way up and just use the head travel
[12:01:17] <roycroft> just know what you're getting
[12:01:46] <enleth> DLPeterson: I'm not in the US, so I've never looked very hard, but from what I've seen on forums and ebay, the second hand market for deckels in the US does exist
[12:01:48] <roycroft> if you do get a lightweight one you might look on the machining forums for articles about doing the granite/epoxy fill
[12:01:53] <roycroft> folks say that helps quite a bit
[12:02:01] <enleth> DLPeterson: I don't see any cheap FP1 or FP2 right now, but they crop up
[12:02:22] <archivist> dont be frightened of an ex college machine
[12:02:45] <enleth> DLPeterson: and there's plenty of accessories right now, including special-purpose heads, which is a nice unique feature of those two models
[12:02:48] <DLPeterson> roycroft, good to know. I'm also thinking of going with the LMS 5500 which removes the tilting head and has a bit more secure mounting of the column to the base so it should address some of the rigidity issues
[12:03:15] <roycroft> also don't be afraid of a step-pully 3 phase machine, like the lower end bridgeports
[12:03:32] <roycroft> you can get a vfd for it and do both the phase conversion and variable speed control with one device
[12:03:52] <enleth> that too
[12:04:10] <enleth> and there were some pretty small and lightweight bridgeports
[12:04:14] <enleth> and some even smaller clones
[12:04:55] <roycroft> whatever you get, i would recommend a bridgeport (r8) taper, and not morse taper
[12:05:12] <enleth> or an ISO taper
[12:05:16] <roycroft> the lightweight mill/drill range is pretty evenly split between r8 and morse
[12:05:19] <enleth> but it's rare on small machines
[12:05:25] <roycroft> you'll find a lot more tooling for r8 than morse
[12:05:55] <roycroft> yeah, i'm talking about what's common on really small machines
[12:06:11] <enleth> but the small deckels have an ISO30 taper
[12:06:20] <enleth> and the deckel clones should too
[12:06:40] <roycroft> all this being said
[12:06:50] <roycroft> i got my g0463 about 8 years ago
[12:07:00] <roycroft> and while it's far from ideal, i've been able to make parts for 8 years
[12:07:08] <enleth> also, I've seen photos of a bridgeport clone, US-made, that looked something like a bridgeport scaled down by 3/4 or so, probably wighing less than 600kg
[12:07:14] <roycroft> i'd like a bigger mill, and i'll get one
[12:07:21] <enleth> can't remember the name, but it exists
[12:07:24] <roycroft> but i can get things done now with what i have
[12:07:27] <pcw_home> funny little Deckel:
[12:07:28] <pcw_home> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Deckel-FP41NC-L-Traveling-Column-CNC-Milling-Machine-with-Dialog-3-Control-/282067338570?hash=item41ac86054a:g:yxQAAOSwMNxXXwF1
[12:07:52] <enleth> pcw_home: looks nice, but a bit expensive
[12:08:04] <enleth> I mean, not for a deckel if it's in a very good condition and well equipped
[12:08:07] <pcw_home> Yeah
[12:08:12] <enleth> but probably a bit much for a hobbyist
[12:08:19] <pcw_home> looks really clean
[12:08:35] <enleth> I'd buy that in a heartbeat if I needed a precision mill to make money, though
[12:08:56] <enleth> I've seen FP1s for less than $2k though
[12:09:12] <enleth> vertical head only, no accessories
[12:09:25] <enleth> but the beauty of their design is that you can buy all that later
[12:10:15] <Duc> would love a deckel but a machine with a tool changer would be nice also
[12:19:41] <Magnifikus> hmm how do i get the result of g38.2 as machine coordinates?
[12:21:01] <Magnifikus> or the current offset on z applied
[12:26:01] <DLPeterson> roycroft, is it possible to make something like the LMS5500/G0704/PM-25MV hold 0.001"? with the CNC upfit it would get ball screws, and if the table ways are lapped and one is careful on the depth of cut it seems acheivable.
[12:30:20] <archivist> DLPeterson, measure, know its limits then possibly if you write your code knowing how much spring/flex happens
[12:32:05] <DLPeterson> ok
[12:32:10] <archivist> I achieve a thou but, unidirectional gcode with measuring
[12:42:54] <roycroft> what archivist said
[12:44:09] <roycroft> less so than stuff from harbor freight, i still consider grizzly machinery to be "pre-assembled kits" that need to be at least partially disassembled, tuned up, and reassembled to be useful
[12:44:33] <roycroft> the tolerence you hold with it depends on how much effort you're willing to put into fine tuning it
[12:44:54] <archivist> a seller over here gives rebuild instructions with new machines
[12:45:20] <roycroft> but realise that with so little mass you're not going to have the rigidity to hold really close tolerence no matter what
[12:45:24] <archivist> before you run, rebuild the spindle.....
[12:46:06] <roycroft> the g0463 is still a lightweight machine but it has much more mass than the g0704
[12:46:43] <roycroft> when i bought mine the g0704 hadn't been introduced yet, but i'd still have chosen the g0463 over the g0704
[12:46:54] <roycroft> had i the choice
[12:47:30] <roycroft> there are rebuild instructions for many of the imported mill/drills readily available online
[12:48:12] <roycroft> btw, as i've stated before, i haven't done a cnc conversion on mine (yet - and i'm not sure i shall)
[12:48:19] <enleth> DLPeterson: oh, and also the obvious if you're going for the chinese mill - maybe ditch reinshaw and those servos, buy chinese linear scales and servos instead?
[12:48:21] <roycroft> but i did get the x-axis motor feed for it
[12:48:41] <roycroft> in part because my right elbow causes me problems at times
[12:49:03] <roycroft> but i found that having the motor feed makes for more even machining, and i can take slightly deeper passes with it
[12:49:04] <enleth> DLPeterson: if the machine turns out to be crap in the long run, you'll have put a lot less money in it and it would still easily sell to a hobbyist on ebay
[12:50:31] * roycroft is pondering picking up a tubing roller that's on sale at hf right now - he has a 25% off coupon which reduces the sale price nicely
[12:50:53] <roycroft> i think i have time to see if i can break it before the warranty expires :)
[12:51:54] <roycroft> i'd like to do some interesting things with my belt grinder build and having a tubing roller would make that a lot easier
[13:10:57] <Magnifikus> hmm i can get the current absolute position with g28.1, can i do the same for the current position with g54 etc?
[13:11:16] <Magnifikus> i want to get an absolute g38.2 value
[13:13:32] <Magnifikus> ah #5422
[13:21:19] <Polymorphism> roycroft,
[13:21:24] <roycroft> yes?
[13:21:26] <Polymorphism> if its pittsburg its a lifetime warranty, so it won/t run out
[13:21:56] <roycroft> i don't know what brand they've stamped on it but it has a published 90 day warranty
[13:22:31] <roycroft> oh, it says it's pittsburgh
[13:22:44] <Polymorphism> must only apply to the hand tools
[13:22:48] <Polymorphism> I would go by the 90 days
[13:22:52] <roycroft> but it also says 90 days
[13:22:59] <roycroft> http://www.harborfreight.com/tubing-roller-99736.html
[13:23:06] <roycroft> but that's ok
[13:23:12] <roycroft> i'll know today whether it will break or not
[13:23:42] <roycroft> and i know the difference between a bender and a roller, and know how to properly operate both
[13:23:53] <roycroft> so the folks whining about breaking it right away i take with a grain of salt
[13:26:16] <Polymorphism> they actually have some decent stuff
[13:26:27] <Polymorphism> people just like to parrot what others say to try to be cool
[13:26:40] <Polymorphism> to fit in
[13:26:48] <Polymorphism> most haven't actually used any harbor freight tools
[13:27:00] <roycroft> i know what to expect of them
[13:27:12] <roycroft> and i consider any hf tool a semi-finished kit
[13:28:59] <roycroft> if i can buy a tubing roller for $140 and spend a couple hours dialing it in that to me is a good alternative to spending $750 on a tubing roller that works flawlessly out of the box
[13:29:15] <roycroft> especially as it will be an occasional use tool
[13:30:15] <roycroft> the biggest problem, imo, with reviews of hf tools is that their customer base is mostly hobbiests with no training who don't know how to use them and don't have reasonable expetations of them
[13:31:03] <roycroft> there's also a big "borrow and return" crowd who feel the need to justify their sleazy conduct by writing negative reviews
[13:36:14] <CaptHindsight> i stopped going since I got tired of them asking if I get their coupons in the mail
[13:51:38] <Polymorphism> true
[13:51:42] <Polymorphism> that and QC
[14:14:57] <roycroft> well, i picked the roller up
[14:15:08] <roycroft> i probably need to replace all the pot metal fasteners with real ones first thing
[14:15:21] <roycroft> but it looks like it will be able to do work after that
[14:29:23] <BeachBumPete> I have one of those
[14:46:09] <Duc> roycroft: there is a guy on pirate4x4 that makes new rollers for the HF roller
[14:48:14] <BeachBumPete> yes he does and they also make power feed setups for them as well.
[14:53:18] <enleth> there's also this
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FbqaH1kDztk
[14:53:22] <Duc> was tempted to buy the setup when I had a offroad kit
[14:54:04] <enleth> probably one of the most overengineered tubing rollers ever
[14:54:08] <enleth> but it's damn impressive
[14:55:29] <Duc> LOL looks good but I would put a motor on the wheel
[14:55:58] <enleth> with the wheel this big it's probably not necessary
[14:56:04] <enleth> looks quite comfortable to crank
[14:58:03] <enleth> also this video reminds me I need a saw like theirs
[15:03:30] <Duc> that is alot of spinning
[15:03:49] <Duc> that was one of the reasons why I picked up the cold saw off craigslist
[15:06:54] <roycroft> the box for the tubing roller alleges that dies for square tubing are available
[15:07:30] <enleth> the one they have appears cold enough
[15:09:01] <enleth> not sure whether to get one like this, a band saw or try looking for an old style automatic reciprocating saw
[15:09:54] <Duc> bandsaw would be better I tink
[15:09:57] <enleth> the latter seems to be slow but safe and quite capable where the former two would be prone to overheating or snagging
[15:10:10] <Duc> you mean a power hacksaw?
[15:10:14] <enleth> yeah
[15:11:15] <Duc> cold saw or bandsaw would be better
[15:11:44] <Duc> I would prefer a horizontal bandsaw then the cold saw I got
[15:11:50] <enleth> I have a long list of things to make out of steel tubing the size they used for this video or slightly smaller and I've been putting that off because I don't have anything to make clean cuts with
[15:12:20] <enleth> any experience with chinese bandsaws?
[15:16:05] <Duc> a few people have really good luck with them but I had shit luck with it cutting straight
[15:16:45] <Duc> they need alot of adjustment and good blades to make them cut better
[15:17:23] <Sync> well, you get a parts kit
[15:17:40] <enleth> yeah, that's to be expected
[15:19:47] <XXCoder> amazing video of making brass linked rings! but its on facebook.
https://www.facebook.com/105532069860055/videos/161303707616224/
[15:19:48] <XXCoder> :(
[15:19:56] <XXCoder> I hate facebook videos
[15:20:53] <Deejay> i hate facebook ;)
[15:25:10] <Duc> enleth: I would search craigslist for a jet or bigger bandsaw
[15:30:17] <XXCoder> or just buy cnc waterjet cutter or plasma cutter ;)
[15:31:35] <Duc> I wish plasma cutters filled the void. I have a Powermax 65 but cutting stocks of metal with it sucks.
[15:36:48] <enleth> XXCoder: well, I've got $500 for this give or take
[15:37:11] <enleth> so the best I could do is a handheld plasma cutter and a jig to run it around a piece of tubing parallel to the surfaces
[15:37:24] <XXCoder> yeah saw such setup on youtube
[15:37:37] <XXCoder> not too complex really. use magnets if want no center hole
[15:38:04] <XXCoder> it gets bit diffult if you want no center hole and its not ferretic metal
[15:38:12] <enleth> that might work and a plasma cutter could be useful for other things so that may actually be a better purchase than a saw of any kind
[15:38:29] <enleth> center hole?
[15:38:47] <XXCoder> in orer for it to be able to bolt on
[15:38:54] <XXCoder> so it rotates for circle cut
[15:39:10] <XXCoder> ah you dont need it for tubes though lol
[15:39:36] <XXCoder> I was thinking circles on sheet for some reason
[15:39:41] <enleth> ah, sure
[15:40:07] <enleth> I've seen an interesting type of jig for cold cut tubing saws
[15:40:27] <enleth> it's basically a set of chains with tensioners and the saw sits on rollers
[15:40:49] <XXCoder> I bet you can make one out of used inline roller skates
[15:41:08] <enleth> so you put the chains around the tubing, with the saw strapped to the chain, tighten it, and just roll along
[15:41:18] <Duc> interesting
[15:41:27] <Duc> 500 should get a good saw
[15:41:30] <enleth> but it works for the big stuff
[15:41:38] <Duc> there is the evolution saw for that price I think
[15:41:54] <XXCoder> how large dia tube does that jig can cut
[15:42:34] <XXCoder> alternate way
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1V8VO2f2GS4
[15:42:55] <enleth> I've seen it advertised for thick wall HVAC conduits, big iron pipes and such, seemed to work on anything from 150mm diameter up
[15:43:04] <enleth> probably no upper limit if you have a longer chain
[15:44:24] <enleth> all it really does is make sure you're going along the shortest circular path around the cylinder by tensioning the chain first
[15:44:29] <Duc> he made that look easier I wish I could hand cut like that
[15:47:07] <enleth> a good magnetic ground clamp could do that too
[15:48:42] <Duc> how much tubing are you looking to cut
[15:49:13] <XXCoder> and is it all same size?
[15:49:26] <XXCoder> if it is you can make quick jig using framing and skate wheels
[15:49:50] <XXCoder> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lzACaWqRS5E
[15:50:48] <enleth> cylinders are easy, I'm more interested in square/rectangular tubing
[15:51:38] <enleth> Duc: similar size and amount to the video I posted earlier,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FbqaH1kDztk
[15:52:19] <Duc> enleth: yea a cold saw or bandsaw would work alot better. Cleaner edges and quicker
[15:53:04] <enleth> but a plasma cutter would be more versatile
[15:53:33] <Duc> eh. hard to get clean straight edges and would take forever to cut that amount of tube
[15:53:44] <enleth> ok, point taken
[15:53:56] <Duc> I use mine in a pinch and it drives me nuts
[15:54:21] <XXCoder> geez guys making really heavy set box. wonder what its fir
[15:54:43] <Duc> I will say it does work better on thicker tubes then cut off wheels
[15:55:33] <Duc> XXCoder: which video
[15:55:43] <XXCoder> one enleth posted
[15:56:02] <enleth> well then, I need to understand the relative pros and cons of a circular cold cut saw and a bandsaw for my use cases
[15:56:27] <XXCoder> ah its metal bender
[15:56:36] <enleth> no experience with either for metal cutting
[15:56:36] <XXCoder> no wonder it needs to be very strong
[15:57:17] <enleth> check out the rest of their videos
[15:57:49] <enleth> some of it is just hipster furniture, but a few are real gems of DIY heavy duty toolmaking
[15:58:42] <Duc> enleth: Buddy had this one and it worked well
[15:58:44] <Duc> http://www.trick-tools.com/Evolution_SteelSaw_2_TCT_Chop_Saw_SteelSaw2_2171
[16:01:11] <XXCoder> I love it when tools first use is to complete it@
[16:01:23] <enleth> ok, but what would actually be the determining factor to decide whether I need a cold cut saw or a horizontal bandsaw?
[16:02:03] <enleth> XXCoder: they made a two-tank sandblaster and about halfway through the build used it to clean itself
[16:02:12] <XXCoder> nice
[16:05:18] <enleth> Duc: I'll try to find the local counterpart, some brand over here probably orders from the same chinese factory
[16:05:37] <XXCoder> good they know safety
[16:05:40] <Duc> it really comes done to personal perference
[16:05:48] <XXCoder> they cleaned tanks by filling it with water
[16:05:59] <XXCoder> ensures there is no gas left in it
[16:06:05] <Duc> Bandsaw will take up more room but can handle larger pieces
[16:07:19] <Duc> I would get a bandsaw personally
[16:07:23] <XXCoder> they made automated surface circle cutter
[16:08:31] <enleth> Duc: do any interesting tooling wear/cost of ownership, safety or usage difficulty considerations come to mind?
[16:08:46] <Duc> a noraml size cold saw can handle 3in diameter piece but a small bandsaw can take 5in
[16:09:25] <Duc> enleth: Nothing major for safety, bandsaw blades are cheaper than coldsaw blades by about 4x
[16:10:39] <Duc> enleth: either is really easy to use
[16:10:43] <enleth> wouldn't it be easier to make a shitty cold saw cut straight if it didn't out of the box than a shitty bandsaw?
[16:12:24] <Duc> not sure, never had a shitty cold saw to play with. which country were you in again?
[16:12:40] <enleth> I mean, it appears to me, though I might be wrong, that if the cold saw's axis of rotation is positioned properly and the hinge doesn't have too much play, it will cut true - but even with a good (vertical) bandsaw I had to spend a lot of time aligning it to keep the blade from twisting and cutting at an angle, so I'm worried about that with a shitty horizontal bandsaw
[16:12:59] <enleth> Poland
[16:14:31] <enleth> OTOH, a bandsaw does have the means to be adjusted because it's a natural thing to do with it, while a cold cut saw that's misaligned right out of the factory might be hard to correct because it wasn't really meant to allow it
[16:14:52] <Duc> a used industrial saw will cut straight. Over in Poland cold saws should be easier to get
[16:15:19] <Deejay> gn8
[16:15:21] <Duc> the clamp on a cold saw would play a big part in the alignment
[16:15:45] <enleth> the cheapest examples of both are priced similarily, with bandsaws a bit cheaper, as far as I can see
[16:16:15] <enleth> and I think there are a bit more bandsaws being offered
[16:17:14] <XXCoder> the 2 tank sandblaster video is awesome
[16:18:57] <Duc> how straight of cuts do you need
[16:20:07] <XXCoder> watching them make a dining table. jeez way overkill frame
[16:21:03] <Duc> overkill lasts alot longer
[16:21:26] <XXCoder> indeed
[16:21:37] <XXCoder> that'll last hundreds of years
[16:22:21] <SpeedEvil> unless insects
[16:22:35] <XXCoder> SpeedEvil: that'll only affect surface
[16:22:38] <XXCoder> not frame
[16:22:45] <XXCoder> unless there is bugs THAT mean
[16:22:54] <SpeedEvil> Well, they can eat the whole top
[16:24:40] <XXCoder> and its paired with chairs I probably will break in a year
[16:28:43] <Duc> enleth: I guess Im not sure if 500 is alot in poland or cheap
[16:33:12] <roycroft> well the first test went fine
[16:33:32] <roycroft> i rolled some 1/2" schedule 40 galvanized water pipe to about 120 degrees effortlessly
[16:33:36] <roycroft> and i did not break the roller
[16:33:39] <roycroft> or even stress it
[16:33:46] <enleth> Duc: the absolute cheapest bandsaws I can find here are $300
[16:34:07] <roycroft> i paid $350 for my 7x12
[16:34:31] <roycroft> it was an hf damaged thing
[16:34:35] <roycroft> missing the coolant pump
[16:34:35] <Duc> enleth: Looks somewhat like this?
http://www.harborfreight.com/horizontal-vertical-metal-cutting-bandsaw-93762.html
[16:34:45] <enleth> Duc: and FYI $500 is exactly the monthly pay of a good chunk of the population here
[16:35:00] <Duc> harbor freight is cheap shit in the US but still works
[16:35:09] <roycroft> 4x6 bandsaws ago for $125 on cl around here
[16:35:15] <roycroft> go, not ago
[16:35:29] <Duc> the hf 7x12 should be decent I tink
[16:35:40] <roycroft> the worm gear is brass in the hf
[16:35:45] <roycroft> it will wear out in a couple years or so
[16:35:50] <enleth> Duc: it looks absolutely exactly like it down to the smallest details, save for the colour scheme
[16:35:57] <roycroft> but you can order a replacement steel one from grizzly for about $30
[16:36:25] <Duc> enleth: probably same shit
[16:37:03] <enleth> Duc:
http://www.koro.net.pl/allegro/fotos/przecinarkag5012wnowezdjecia002_big.jpg
[16:37:09] <enleth> that's precisely the same thing
[16:37:42] <Duc> yep it works but still needs tweaking. At least you know where the bottom starts
[16:38:02] <roycroft> http://www.roycroft.us/7x12Gear.jpeg
[16:38:06] <enleth> do you have that one/know someone who has it?
[16:38:09] <roycroft> that's what happens to the brass gear after a while
[16:38:37] <Duc> roycroft: at least they had spare parts
[16:38:48] <roycroft> i got the replacement from grizzly, not hf
[16:38:52] <Duc> enleth: I did at one point but the shitty base drove me nuts
[16:39:01] <roycroft> hf still sell it with the brass gear
[16:39:18] <enleth> the base looks flimsy indeed
[16:39:26] <enleth> what about the upper part?
[16:39:50] <Sync> it's a parts set
[16:41:04] <Duc> what do you consider a straight cut
[16:41:20] <roycroft> enleth (et al.): lots of folks buy that 4x6, however it's branded, and make a new base for it
[16:41:27] <roycroft> i used to have a jet 4x6, and could never get it to do square cuts
[16:41:35] <roycroft> my 7x12 cuts dead square
[16:41:48] <roycroft> as in i don't need to machine most cuts after
[16:42:00] <enleth> there's another model, $30 more, that appears to have a sturdier base:
http://www.maktek.pl/panel/duze/przecinarka-tasmowa-do-metalu-g5010b_5ta3ff.jpg
[16:42:21] <enleth> lists the same size rating for rectangular stock
[16:42:42] <enleth> the base appears to be cast
[16:43:01] <enleth> and might actually be reasnably rigid
[16:43:49] <enleth> it doesn't include a stand, but that's not a problem, one of the first things I need to weld are new worktables anyway
[16:44:19] <enleth> might just as well slap together a stand for it
[16:44:55] <Duc> are you able to return if it sucks
[16:47:04] <enleth> as a consumer I've got two weeks after delivery to notify the seller that I'd like to return anything ordered over the internet
[16:47:17] <enleth> and then two more weeks to actually send it back
[16:47:38] <enleth> but I get to pay for the return shipping
[16:48:31] <Duc> can you buy one locally?
[16:49:13] <Sync> I have a portaband on a stand
[16:49:15] <Sync> it is awesome
[16:49:26] <enleth> not so cheap for sure, and no guaranteed returns then
[16:50:03] <enleth> unless I order online from a supplier who's in the same city to retain the right to return it, then drop it off in person
[16:51:19] <Duc> sync: now that is another option. Alot of guys love using those in a horizontal fixture
[16:52:04] <enleth> but in general it's quite rare to find metalworking equipment in hardware stores here
[16:52:09] <Sync> yeah Duc
[16:52:20] <Sync> it is lovely for chopping stuff out of plate
[16:52:42] <Duc> and for cutting stuff that is already attached to things
[16:54:16] <enleth> yep, only one hardware store chain carries any horizontal bandsaws and it's the same thing as the HF one you linked to but 50% more expensive
[16:54:46] <roycroft> the fit and finish might be a bit nicer
[16:54:51] <enleth> so I'm left with online orders or specialized tool stores
[16:54:51] <roycroft> but the castings are the same
[16:56:55] <enleth> interesting, used portabands seem to be really cheap on ebay
[16:57:16] <enleth> found two for $80
[16:58:13] <enleth> not sure if the blades are available over here, I don't think they're being sold in my area
[16:59:35] <enleth> ah, they are, just not under the portaband name
[17:00:43] <enleth> but a corded one from the US probably won't take 230V
[17:01:26] <roycroft> i've been buying some milwaukee 18v cordless tools lately
[17:01:34] <roycroft> i'm tired of the old dewalt stuff with the big heavy batteries
[17:01:48] <roycroft> one reason i went with milwaukee is because they make an 18v sawzall
[17:01:53] <roycroft> er, 18v bandsaw
[17:01:59] <roycroft> they make the sawzall too
[17:02:17] <Frank_12> Hellop
[17:02:21] <roycroft> but i want a portable band saw - i used to lug my 4x6 around, but the 7x12 is way too heavy to move out of my shop
[17:02:49] <Sync> enleth: yeah they are suprisingly expensive new but worth it
[17:04:01] <SpeedEvil> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Balance-Board-Hoverboard-Spare-Parts-350W-Motor-Wheel-6-5-Inch-Working-Condition-/322171449603?hash=item4b02ea3103:g:KqYAAOSwepJXcS9F + plywood + ESC + small lithium battery
[17:04:45] <Duc> sawzall work but not as well
[17:05:41] <Duc> Some guy is really trying to lowball me for the TechnoCNC table on ebay
[17:05:42] <enleth> http://www.koro.net.pl/allegro/fotos/g5013wbezchlodzenianowezdjecia0101_big.jpg - this appears to be the same arm design as the cheapest one but a more powerful motor and a much better base with a vise-like material clamp
[17:05:52] <enleth> $450
[17:06:02] <Duc> much better setup for a bandsaw
[17:06:22] <Sync> the problem with them is the blade control
[17:06:53] <enleth> and all models up to $600 seem to be this, painted in different importers' colors
[17:08:41] <enleth> so I'm basically choosing between this one and
http://www.maktek.pl/panel/duze/przecinarka-tasmowa-do-metalu-g5010b_5ta3ff.jpg which is $100 cheaper, cuts the same maximum size and appears to have a better arm design (or at least a different one), but a lighter base
[17:08:45] <enleth> still cast though
[17:09:58] <Duc> I would do the one for 450
[17:14:06] <enleth> ok, I'll think about it some more, but it makes sense to get it
[17:14:41] <enleth> thanks
[17:14:58] <XXCoder> ugh mowing sucks
[17:16:24] <XXCoder> anyone willing to send over drive type mower for free, inc. shipping? lol
[17:41:02] <Tom_itx> get a goat
[17:42:47] <XXCoder> compelling.
[17:42:58] <XXCoder> though grass dont grow fast enough for that
[18:39:06] <SpeedEvil> #multirotors
[18:39:15] <SpeedEvil> take a quadcopter, put another rotor on the bottom
[19:35:18] <TurBoss> Hi
[19:35:31] <XXCoder> hey boss
[19:36:08] <TurBoss> to build a gantry now tha JA is merged where i should look?
[19:36:20] <TurBoss> i'm confused with the term "Teleop"
[19:36:46] <TurBoss> Hi XXCoder
[19:36:56] <XXCoder> not sure what JA is
[19:37:04] <TurBoss> JointAxes
[19:37:10] <XXCoder> ahh ok
[19:37:33] <XXCoder> maybe someone can answer though its beginning of very quiet time now
[19:37:35] <XXCoder> july 4th
[19:37:45] <TurBoss> ahhh
[19:37:46] <XXCoder> and its getting late and people going out to party.
[19:37:52] <TurBoss> :D
[19:37:59] <XXCoder> yeah. dunno what my plan is though lol
[19:38:45] <TurBoss> will ask tomorrow thx!
[19:38:49] <XXCoder> np
[21:56:52] <yasnak> 2016-07-04 16:15:25.79 spid7s Database 'msdb' cannot be opened. It has been marked SUSPECT by recovery.
[21:56:57] <yasnak> I literally cannot win this weekend
[21:57:17] <XXCoder> aw
[21:57:30] <XXCoder> I was working on van
[21:57:45] <XXCoder> my van dont seem to supply any power to o2 sensor :(
[21:58:02] <yasnak> Ahaha, O2 sensors. Always fun
[22:00:37] <XXCoder> yeah
[22:00:50] <XXCoder> well found what fuse # it is later
[22:17:21] <XXCoder> fuse was fun
[22:17:31] <XXCoder> tried start engine then check if power is supplied
[22:17:33] <XXCoder> it is not
[22:34:42] <XXCoder> dammit looks like cant do anything for now
[22:42:09] <yasnak> LOL
[22:42:22] <yasnak> oops. on phone with m$ suuport
[22:42:49] <yasnak> If only tech would work...then it'd be worthwhile. When I'm spending my entire day fixing this vs making chips...yeah :/
[22:49:44] <XXCoder> sucks
[22:55:15] <XXCoder> it really sucks that its wiring issue
[22:55:19] <XXCoder> its not fixab;e
[22:56:05] <XXCoder> next weekend I plan to work on EGR to BPT hose see if its filled in or not
[22:56:26] <XXCoder> because that is common problem for po400 (not enough or too much flow) error
[22:57:35] <XXCoder> http://ww2.justanswer.com/uploads/FI/FixUrNissan/2013-02-05_031508_quest_bpt_hose_that_brakes.jpg
[22:57:49] <XXCoder> see the one labeled "hose that usually breaks"
[23:13:32] <XXCoder> well happy 4th americans
[23:16:09] <Tom_itx> just waiting for the 5th
[23:16:34] <XXCoder> me too largely though I plan to go out and watch fireworks from home
[23:16:46] <XXCoder> not too great view but hey zero miles.
[23:32:57] <roycroft> bah humbug
[23:33:04] <roycroft> this is my least favorite day of the year
[23:33:09] <XXCoder> why
[23:33:17] <roycroft> neighbors are shooting (illegal) bottle rockets into my yard again
[23:33:24] <roycroft> because of all the fireworks bullshit
[23:33:45] <roycroft> at least it's not bone dry this year
[23:33:49] <roycroft> i don't have to sit outside with hose in hand
[23:34:12] <roycroft> it's going to take me an hour tomorrow to clean up all the trash in my yard though
[23:34:18] <roycroft> and i won't be able to sleep until 2am
[23:34:36] <XXCoder> heh I can sleep like baby anyutime. one of nice perks of being deaf
[23:34:48] <XXCoder> though I normally sleep at 4 am so wont make difference
[23:35:15] <roycroft> the law in oregon is no fireworks that shoot more than 1' high or 6' along the ground
[23:35:24] <roycroft> but illegal fireworks are all over the place
[23:35:41] <roycroft> my house is full of smoke already, and it's just getting dark
[23:35:43] <XXCoder> here its right by native american reservation
[23:35:56] <roycroft> there are tribal fireworks stands all over the place
[23:36:02] <roycroft> one does not have to travel far
[23:36:41] <roycroft> i used to enjoy going to the city's fireworks display on the 4th
[23:37:06] <roycroft> but nowadays i have to stay home and watch/guard the property
[23:37:32] <XXCoder> some cities here its outright illegal
[23:37:38] <XXCoder> no fireworks at all
[23:37:45] <XXCoder> besides offical
[23:37:47] <roycroft> it's unenforceable here
[23:37:53] <roycroft> too many assholes
[23:37:55] <roycroft> not enough cops
[23:38:20] <roycroft> and this year is worse than usual - we have olympics trials going on, and for some reason there'e extra heavy security near the university
[23:38:39] <roycroft> there must be some terrorism threat or something
[23:38:53] <roycroft> people are complaining that security is insane, with multiple police checkpoints to get near the venue
[23:39:15] <roycroft> fortunately that's on the other side of town, and i'm not going anywhere near there until the trials are over
[23:39:33] <XXCoder> theres always people looking to show a message
[23:39:38] <XXCoder> only a few but yeah
[23:40:27] <DLPeterson> os1r1s, have you used the head tilt feature on your PM-25MV? I'm wondering if going with the LMS 5500 would be better since the machine might be a touch more rigid without the tilting head
[23:42:44] <roycroft> what's patriotic about trying to burn down your neighbor's house?
[23:42:47] <os1r1s> DLPeterson Dunno ...
[23:43:02] <os1r1s> DLPeterson I don'y think the tilt causes an issue
[23:43:07] <XXCoder> whats less patriotic about exploding ty weapons? heh
[23:43:14] <XXCoder> *toy
[23:43:50] <roycroft> at best it's a celebration of war
[23:44:01] <roycroft> i celebrate freedom and indepencence, but i don't celebrate war
[23:44:05] <XXCoder> roycroft: know whats funny?
[23:44:12] <XXCoder> it was signed in july 2nd.
[23:44:21] <XXCoder> deleration of independance
[23:44:25] <roycroft> yes i recall that
[23:44:36] <roycroft> a lot of historic dates are arbitrary
[23:44:54] <os1r1s> DLPeterson Not sure how readilt that can be cnced
[23:44:59] <roycroft> the queen's birthday is in april
[23:45:07] <roycroft> but it is usually rainy in england in april
[23:45:14] <roycroft> so they changed her birthday to june
[23:45:51] <roycroft> jesus was born in the spring
[23:46:15] <roycroft> but there was a pagan holiday at the winter solstice, so they changed his birthday to december to get the pagans to go along
[23:46:47] <XXCoder> easter day is fun one. egg-laying painting rabbit day ;)
[23:47:31] <roycroft> cholesterol day :P
[23:47:41] <XXCoder> no thats thankgiving day
[23:47:48] <roycroft> that's nap day
[23:47:54] <XXCoder> hmm true that lol
[23:48:07] <roycroft> and football day for some
[23:48:27] <XXCoder> wanna know the worse hell day for reserants?
[23:48:32] <XXCoder> easter day.
[23:48:38] <XXCoder> followed by mom's day
[23:48:44] <roycroft> i thought mother's day was the busiest day at restaurants
[23:48:50] <XXCoder> surpise.
[23:49:03] <DLPeterson> os1r1s, i wasn't thinking of actuating the tilt, just that i might never use it so maybe better not to have it so the machine is more rigid... dunno. was going to email ArizonaVideo99
[23:49:21] <XXCoder> that'd be awesome to have 4th axis
[23:49:41] <roycroft> easter is another annoying day, but not as annoying as the 4th of july
[23:49:53] <roycroft> it's only slightly annoying, and that's just because a lot of stores are closed
[23:50:00] <roycroft> i have to remember to work around that every year
[23:50:04] <roycroft> and every year it's a different day
[23:50:21] <roycroft> sunday after the first full moon after the spring equinox
[23:50:27] <roycroft> how the heck am i supposed to remember that?
[23:50:32] <XXCoder> xmas is pretty bad in one way, family time is good but "lets give useless shit" side sucks
[23:50:57] <roycroft> christmas is better than easter
[23:51:03] <roycroft> because it usually falls on a weekday
[23:51:06] <roycroft> and it's a day off work
[23:51:20] <roycroft> easter is a holiday and it's always on a bloody sunday
[23:51:28] <XXCoder> black friday is odd one. "lets be thankful... for greeeeed!"
[23:51:32] <roycroft> all the disadvantages of a holiday and none of the advantages
[23:51:39] <roycroft> oh, i like that day
[23:51:54] <roycroft> that's my annual "i won't spend one penny, not in cash at a local store, nor online" day
[23:52:04] <XXCoder> its not holiday for my job so no difference
[23:52:06] <roycroft> i get to protest consumerism on that day
[23:52:29] <XXCoder> I do buy online a little but if store opens on thursday for "black friday" its blacklisted
[23:52:48] <roycroft> i get black friday off
[23:52:51] <roycroft> it's a trade i make
[23:52:58] <roycroft> i work on veterans' day
[23:53:08] <roycroft> and take the day after thanksgiving off, so i have a nice four day weekend
[23:53:23] <XXCoder> last eyar I had 2 days off that week, thankgiving and friday, but that does not always happen
[23:53:46] <roycroft> and as far as the not buying anything goes
[23:53:55] <roycroft> i'm never in need of food on that day
[23:54:03] <roycroft> and i can get by without anything else :)
[23:56:02] <DLPeterson> anybody know if these are real:
http://www.skyfirecnc.com/index.asp ? There was a massive forum listing on CNCZone that looked promising but seems some people have yet to see their machines.
