#linuxcnc | Logs for 2016-06-04

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[00:00:26] <djdelorie> yeah, dust mask won't help against that
[00:00:41] <[cube]> next time weraing 3m carbon filter
[00:00:47] <[cube]> well, doubt i'
[00:00:52] <[cube]> li'll be cuttin gthat crap again
[00:00:59] <[cube]> its just to make this shroud
[00:01:03] <[cube]> i wanted it transparent
[00:01:22] <[cube]> those little hole pockets going to glue in magnets
[00:01:26] <[cube]> for quick release
[00:01:32] <[cube]> http://i.imgur.com/kdOi2QT.jpg
[00:02:01] <XXCoder> that ones fine, not cool for lungs but not deadly
[00:02:22] <[cube]> and that large recessed pocket around the spindle hole...i have one of those LED halo lights
[00:02:27] <[cube]> goign to plug it into the router relay
[00:02:33] <[cube]> so it toggles the light when cutting
[00:02:34] <[cube]> should be neat
[00:02:45] <XXCoder> hm I think I see little bit errors on making circles?
[00:02:49] <XXCoder> wavey circles
[00:02:57] <[cube]> thats from the tabs
[00:03:01] <XXCoder> ahh
[00:03:08] <[cube]> literally this was the first cut i ever did on the machine
[00:03:11] <[cube]> that software is amazing
[00:03:15] <XXCoder> nice
[00:03:23] <XXCoder> I need vacuum kit for my machine lol
[00:03:32] <[cube]> my god
[00:03:38] <[cube]> when cutting that plastic
[00:03:39] <XXCoder> I see very thick plastic there?
[00:03:41] <[cube]> chips EVERYWHERE
[00:03:48] <XXCoder> stacked or another peice, much thicker?
[00:03:49] <[cube]> yeah i did another cut separately
[00:03:53] <[cube]> thats the vacuum holder
[00:03:58] <[cube]> 20 passes!
[00:04:00] <[cube]> 20mm
[00:04:00] <[cube]> lol
[00:04:05] <[cube]> it cut much nicer
[00:04:06] <XXCoder> lol 1 mm passes
[00:04:08] <[cube]> slowed the feed rate
[00:04:19] <[cube]> hey, wahts a few mins for a nice cut :P
[00:04:26] <XXCoder> indeed.
[00:04:46] <XXCoder> though you could have added clamp switch around or bolt downs so it could clut nicely all way around
[00:04:50] <XXCoder> cut
[00:05:10] <[cube]> yeah, still learning my machine
[00:05:17] <[cube]> mind you, i did a lot of clean up
[00:05:30] <[cube]> you will laugh at the cut...
[00:06:19] <[cube]> its not that bad, but clearly my settings werent optimized
[00:06:28] <[cube]> FR was too slow and spindle too high
[00:06:36] <[cube]> second cut on thicker stuff I adjusted
[00:06:45] <[cube]> http://i.imgur.com/TEdK7uw.jpg
[00:08:54] <XXCoder> looks kinda melty
[00:09:01] <[cube]> extremely
[00:09:10] <XXCoder> man I want place where i can grab sheets like that scrap
[00:09:19] <[cube]> yeah was jus tluck
[00:09:19] <XXCoder> so I have more plastic material for fun
[00:09:28] <[cube]> someone left it next to a dumpster at my apt
[00:09:30] <XXCoder> though my machine rpm is way too insane to cut most plastics for now
[00:09:57] <[cube]> yeah i had my router full speed and it melted the sheet to the mdf below
[00:10:04] <[cube]> had to kind of pry it off
[00:10:06] <XXCoder> I wonder though
[00:10:14] <XXCoder> cant you do lines with different feeds
[00:10:16] <XXCoder> see what works?
[00:10:22] <[cube]> yeah for sure
[00:10:32] <[cube]> should do that at some point
[00:10:38] <[cube]> tonight was just anxious to get this done
[00:10:42] <[cube]> got the machine all calibrated
[00:10:47] <[cube]> wanted to cut!
[00:11:00] <XXCoder> :)
[00:11:39] <[cube]> its not exactly the best machine but it'll doo for me
[00:11:42] <[cube]> old mdf router
[00:11:46] <[cube]> 7-8 years old
[00:11:55] <[cube]> http://i.imgur.com/4Ud44UA.jpg
[00:12:21] <[cube]> got the whole setup for a grand
[00:12:37] <[cube]> took it apart and replaced all the bearings on it
[00:12:48] <[cube]> finally got it configured today so im happy
[00:13:43] <XXCoder> that machine looks very decent
[00:13:46] <XXCoder> just 1k wow
[00:13:50] <[cube]> ya
[00:13:52] <[cube]> canadian!
[00:14:06] <[cube]> it was in rough shape when i picked it up
[00:14:11] <[cube]> the bearings were completeled seize
[00:14:14] <[cube]> dragging on the rails
[00:14:20] <[cube]> *completely
[00:14:42] <[cube]> replaced them with better coated bearings and just roated the rails, good as new
[00:14:47] <[cube]> *rotated
[00:15:35] <XXCoder> nice
[00:16:21] <[cube]> wondering if there's a way to polish the rough edges of the plastic...
[00:16:25] <[cube]> to make it all nice and clear
[00:16:40] <[cube]> i tried using a torch and it kinda worked on smooether spots
[00:16:45] <[cube]> but mostly its too rough
[00:18:05] <XXCoder> there is something like flame polishing for glass
[00:18:14] <XXCoder> I wonder if there is something similiar for plastic
[00:18:36] <[cube]> yeah the flame definitely works on plastic, even this
[00:18:47] <XXCoder> wouldnt it discolor though?
[00:18:48] <[cube]> but the edges are just too hacked up and caked
[00:18:56] <XXCoder> maybe first file em
[00:19:02] <[cube]> http://i.imgur.com/TEdK7uw.jpg
[00:19:04] <XXCoder> then sandpaper file
[00:19:18] <[cube]> look at the 6 pockets in that pick
[00:19:22] <[cube]> the little magnet pockets
[00:19:31] <[cube]> they're flamed in this pic
[00:19:32] <[cube]> http://i.imgur.com/kdOi2QT.jpg
[00:19:32] <XXCoder> yeah it does not look good
[00:20:17] <[cube]> i thinkt the only way to do it is to do multi step polishing
[00:20:55] <[cube]> tried a belt sander to clean it up but just melts it
[00:21:11] <[cube]> might just forget about it and finish the damn thing :P
[00:21:12] <XXCoder> that heats too much
[00:21:18] <XXCoder> use something less energic
[00:21:29] <[cube]> yeah
[00:21:34] <[cube]> if done by hand it would take hours
[00:21:45] <[cube]> maybe a dremel...
[00:22:48] <[cube]> wish there was a magic solvent i could just dump it in
[00:23:31] <[cube]> hm this is really cool
[00:23:32] <[cube]> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7na8kQ78vkQ
[00:23:45] <XXCoder> 1) disolve ugly stuff, 2) make sure parts I wanna stay stay well. ;)
[00:23:50] <XXCoder> magical solvent indeed lol
[00:24:15] <djdelorie> acetone is as close to a "magical solvent" as I care to get...
[00:24:25] <[cube]> yeah, might try that tomorrow
[00:24:51] <XXCoder> distilled water and sandpaper
[00:25:20] <[cube]> i wonder if i can use a headlight polighin compound on the face parts
[00:25:26] <[cube]> they're all marred up
[00:25:31] <[cube]> *polishing
[00:25:43] <XXCoder> wow flame polish looks good
[00:26:33] <[cube]> ya
[00:26:37] <[cube]> think i'll do that tomorrow
[00:26:45] <[cube]> sang, polish with car compound then flame
[00:26:47] <[cube]> *sand
[00:28:15] <XXCoder> 2000 grit + flame. boom clear
[00:28:38] <[cube]> yeah he's saying the flame isnt exactly optically clear
[00:28:50] <XXCoder> autocaptions isnt too clear
[00:28:55] <[cube]> ah yeah, 2000 + flame
[00:29:01] <[cube]> i'll do a test on a scarp piece
[00:29:05] <[cube]> *scrap
[00:29:31] <[cube]> toothpaste might work too
[00:33:00] <[cube]> http://dendds.com/uploads/RDA_index.pdf
[00:33:31] <[cube]> start with a little colgate and finish off with some baking soda
[00:33:31] <[cube]> lol
[00:33:55] <XXCoder> what is RDA and is there chart convert to grit?
[00:34:14] <[cube]> i think the highest grit is comparable to 2000
[00:34:24] <XXCoder> meaning something like 7
[00:35:33] <[cube]> insteresting that 'whitening' toothpastes are higher grit
[00:37:48] <Crom> onvr you finish polishing, rinse, rinse again, and rinse yet again. Then paint with a coat of Rustoleum X2 UV resist clear coat. I did my head lights 2 years ago and still looking good
[00:38:16] <[cube]> hmm clear coat....not a bad idea
[00:38:26] <Crom> UV resist clear coat
[00:38:44] <Crom> the acrylic oxides..
[00:38:51] <[cube]> interesting
[00:39:02] <[cube]> this is what amazon prime is for...
[00:39:05] <Crom> which is why it gets coady
[00:39:11] <Crom> cloudy
[00:39:21] <[cube]> the rustoleum works well on acrylic or doesnt?
[00:40:01] <[cube]> totally buying this...
[00:40:01] <[cube]> https://www.amazon.ca/NOVUS-7136-Plastic-Polish-Kit/dp/B002UD0GIG/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1465017189&sr=8-5&keywords=novus+plastic+polish
[00:40:02] <Crom> I did 400, 800, 1500, 2000, then a touch of propane torch, then the rustoleum
[00:40:13] <Crom> does work
[00:40:21] <[cube]> nice
[00:41:04] <[cube]> https://www.amazon.ca/Rust-Oleum-249117-Painters-Touch-Multi-Purpose/dp/B002BWOS5I/
[00:41:18] <Crom> 400 circlular, 800 verticle strokes, 1500 horzontal, 2000 diagonal
[00:41:52] <[cube]> yeah i'll bet the first 400 circular is the critical
[00:42:14] <[cube]> might do it with radial polisher
[00:42:20] <[cube]> get it nice and uniform
[00:42:25] <Crom> on my odyssey I need to do it again.. I missed some old clear coat... on my cadi it's perfect
[00:42:41] <[cube]> nice
[00:42:49] <Crom> oh yeah, wet sand everything
[00:42:52] <[cube]> ever use collinite?
[00:42:58] <Crom> nope
[00:43:05] <[cube]> stuff is magic on car
[00:43:08] <[cube]> wax
[00:43:31] <Crom> I tend not to wax my cars... just my head lights
[00:43:50] <[cube]> it supposedly lasts 3 mos
[00:43:54] <[cube]> depending on washes
[00:43:59] <[cube]> detailer friend swears by it
[00:44:07] <[cube]> been his businsess for 20 years
[00:44:21] <[cube]> the wax is meant for boats and other industrial stuff, but apparently its the best
[00:44:24] <Crom> that's the Rustoleum!
[00:44:46] <[cube]> the one i pasted?
[00:44:56] <Crom> yep
[00:44:59] <[cube]> damnit
[00:45:03] <[cube]> not elligible for prime
[00:45:41] <[cube]> http://www.amazon.com/Collinite-Liquid-Insulator-Wax-845/dp/B000JK2D06/
[00:45:43] <Crom> Hmm Collinite the nano seal terminology sounds similar to something I use to use...
[00:46:01] <[cube]> the reviews speak for themselves
[00:46:15] <[cube]> its really nice stuff
[00:46:57] <Crom> used to use
[00:47:58] <Crom> welp nite nite.. I have to fix a generator tomorrow, pick up ballots, go to a meet and greet, and focus lights for a play
[00:48:04] <Crom> nice long ass day
[00:48:08] <[cube]> nice have fun!
[00:48:08] <[cube]> night
[00:48:16] <Crom> might
[00:48:19] <Crom> night
[00:48:29] <Crom> need to get a light out here...
[00:50:36] <XXCoder> night
[01:11:12] <XXCoder> [cube]: plastic you cut is PC?
[01:14:12] <[cube]> plexiglass
[01:14:16] <[cube]> so, acrylic
[01:14:21] <XXCoder> ok
[01:14:21] <[cube]> i think they are the same thinf
[01:14:53] <[cube]> cnc is so much more exciting than 3d printer i feel like
[01:15:01] <XXCoder> yeah
[01:15:06] <[cube]> I was exicted when i built my printer
[01:15:08] <XXCoder> but know whats MORE exciting?
[01:15:09] <XXCoder> combo
[01:15:18] <XXCoder> adder-subtractor cnc machine
[01:15:18] <[cube]> but tbh i never really use it lol
[01:15:26] <[cube]> coul dbe the 4hr+ build time
[01:15:37] <XXCoder> metal one even lol
[01:15:44] <[cube]> the cnc your gigantic parts are built in minutes....
[01:15:51] <[cube]> ive never had such freedom!
[01:15:52] <[cube]> lol
[01:15:56] <XXCoder> basic ones lol
[01:16:07] <XXCoder> I have had jobs where part is made in cnc for hours
[01:16:10] <[cube]> hehe true
[01:16:11] <[cube]> depends
[01:16:15] <[cube]> yeah
[01:16:21] <XXCoder> contour is very expensive cnc op
[01:16:35] <[cube]> this is only for wood plastic...
[01:16:41] <[cube]> i know that metal jobs can take forever
[01:16:47] <XXCoder> your machine probably can do limited aluminium
[01:16:53] <[cube]> and need to be flipped, fixtures blah balh
[01:17:02] <XXCoder> metal jobs well it depends
[01:17:12] <XXCoder> I have had jobs where it is very short
[01:17:20] <[cube]> migth try cutting some flashing
[01:17:28] <[cube]> aluminum flashing
[01:17:36] <XXCoder> and jobs where simple job take long time. (very hard metal, just drill one hole takes 4 minutes)
[01:17:43] <[cube]> yeah
[01:17:57] <[cube]> i had some experience with boring titanium
[01:17:59] <[cube]> my god...
[01:18:03] <[cube]> wouldnt wish tha ton anyone
[01:18:17] <XXCoder> heh my worse so far is 3 1/2 hour one part
[01:18:30] <XXCoder> I finished 4 books that week
[01:18:33] <[cube]> no TOO bad
[01:18:42] <[cube]> lol
[01:18:43] <[cube]> nice
[01:19:04] <[cube]> alright dude
[01:19:11] <[cube]> tomorrow is a new day for cnc
[01:19:16] <[cube]> im off, g'night!
[01:20:03] <XXCoder> night
[01:31:38] <maxcnc> Hi from a wet Germany
[01:31:53] <maxcnc> Waterlevels are stable
[01:32:09] <XXCoder> hey
[01:32:41] <maxcnc> 42 inshured by ligtning
[01:33:01] <maxcnc> starting up all mashines plasma work today as always
[01:33:27] <maxcnc> bye till ?!
[01:33:41] <XXCoder> same old maxcnc :P
[02:25:22] <XXCoder> hmm
[02:25:23] <XXCoder> http://www.amazon.com/AmScope-LED-144W-ZK--Adjustable-Illuminator-Microscope/dp/B00JZJO7YC/
[02:25:27] <XXCoder> what you guys think
[02:26:23] <Deejay> moin
[02:26:28] <XXCoder> hey
[02:51:23] <XXCoder> uggggggh
[02:51:26] <XXCoder> "My dogs got so constipated it cost me, 125.00 at the vet... sending back 2 weeks still bad breath and no change ."
[02:51:40] <XXCoder> it's review for "NOVUS 7136 Plastic Polish Kit - 2 oz."
[06:32:01] <jthornton> my guess after some testing is that wall warts are not regulated power supplies
[06:32:50] <SpeedEvil> Most are these days
[06:33:21] <jthornton> so I need to look for a newer one?
[06:33:40] <SpeedEvil> context?
[06:34:10] <jthornton> http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/how_to/atmega168/mega168_howto_main_index.php
[06:34:55] <jthornton> I'm also assuming that the unloaded output voltage of a regulated power supply is pretty close to the output voltage rating
[06:35:08] <jthornton> like my 5v and 24v power supplies I sell
[06:35:25] <SpeedEvil> If your circuit is not using other than 5V, use a quality USB PSU
[06:35:47] <SpeedEvil> Regulated PSUs will typically move 5% or so from load to off load.
[06:35:56] <SpeedEvil> unregulated ones 30-40%
[06:36:55] <jthornton> ok let me do some math on what I have
[06:39:18] <jthornton> my 9v wall wart is 15% over voltage unloaded
[06:40:10] <jthornton> my regulated power supplies are about 1-2% over rated voltage unloaded
[06:41:18] <malcom2073> Yeah wall warts are *terrible* at regulation
[06:41:34] <malcom2073> I had a 12v one that hit almost 18v unloaded
[06:43:41] <jthornton> I think I'll go grab an old pc power supply and us the 12v from it
[06:44:11] <jthornton> but first I have to clean my desk off so I have room lol
[06:57:42] <jthornton> hmm I found a D-Link 5v regulated power supply
[06:59:26] <jthornton> I also found 6 sq ft of desk that was mia
[07:08:30] <zeeshan|2> jthornton: lol
[07:14:42] <_methods> you have any small buck-boost boards?
[07:14:57] <_methods> i usually put one of them between the power supply and the load
[07:15:04] <_methods> especially if i'm using some chinese trash
[07:15:45] <_methods> then you don't have to worry about the power supplies voltage either
[07:15:55] <_methods> just make it what you want with the buck/boost
[07:18:38] <jthornton> I don't think I have any... but I have http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Free-shipping-5pcs-lot-4-channel-IIC-I2C-Logic-Level-Converter-Bi-Directional-Module-5V-to/32310624938.html
[07:20:28] <pink_vampire> I have also voltage converters like that_ they work perfect.
[07:32:47] <jthornton> I guess I could drag out my Tenna lab DC power supply...
[08:00:00] <zeeshan|2> i thought hotels in usa/canada were expensive
[08:00:03] <zeeshan|2> at 400 bux a night
[08:00:15] <zeeshan|2> holy fuck im trying to book a hotel for my dad whos going to see my brother (emergency)
[08:00:21] <zeeshan|2> hotels in swiss are 1000$+
[08:00:23] <zeeshan|2> WTF
[08:00:35] <_methods> i just buy a bunch of those cheap ass buck boosts to keep around for stuff like that
[08:01:31] <_methods> http://www.ebay.com/itm/DC-DC-Adjustable-Boost-Buck-Step-Down-Up-Converter-XL6009-Solar-Voltage-Module-/261813576458?hash=item3cf54e230a:g:aGwAAOSw7aBVBkdl
[08:01:33] <_methods> like that
[08:02:05] <_methods> good for little projects
[08:05:23] <dioz> how would a sensor determine position of a hydraulic cylinder?
[08:06:13] <dioz> as far as the levels of extension, with regards to a hydraulic cylinder
[08:07:37] <Loetmichel> plenty of possibilities.
[08:08:19] <malcom2073> dioz: String pot would be good for that
[08:08:21] <zeeshan|2> lvdt
[08:08:54] <zeeshan|2> glass scale encoder
[08:09:11] <malcom2073> Dependingon the level of precision needed yeah
[08:09:16] <zeeshan|2> i like string pot
[08:09:18] <zeeshan|2> cheap =D
[08:09:34] <malcom2073> I like string pots :-D
[08:09:49] <Loetmichel> capacitive (inside the cylinder, search for the piston), magnetic from the outside (magnet in the piston plate, bunch of reed switches or a coil on the outside), even by resonance (ultrasonic transducer in the piston, so it can detect the amount of oil
[08:10:00] <dioz> what is that? a rod with a donut around it?
[08:10:18] <zeeshan|2> dioz: its a spool
[08:10:21] <Magnifikus> anyone familiar with can here? wonder if my drive states CanOpen DSP402 / DS301 will it do interpolation or is something optional? the spec for 402 is "meh"
[08:10:21] <zeeshan|2> on a potentiometer
[08:10:27] <zeeshan|2> that uncoils or coils
[08:11:03] <zeeshan|2> http://www.firstmarkcontrols.com/isopot.gif
[08:12:00] <saldot_> hi. Re-fitted the cnc at the local makerspace with a new spindle but i cant find any info on how to re-calibrate it.. anyone know any good guide?
[08:14:32] <saldot_> It's a linuxCNC PC->C10 board -> C41 board -> VFD -> spindle
[08:18:26] <zeeshan|2> http://linuxcnc.org/docs/html/examples/spindle.html
[08:22:40] <Magnifikus> Sync, looks like the drive has interpolation over can open, so i guess syncronized moves are a go :)
[08:30:13] <archivist> dioz, you can also have the same string on an encoder
[08:31:06] <jthornton> having completed and tested the power supply part of Tom_itx tutorial I move on
[08:44:11] <Tom_itx> heh, get to the good part
[08:57:09] <jthornton> working on it, at wiring up the isp programmer
[08:58:56] <saldot_> So my spindle is turning, but m3 s1000 gives me like 5000 rpm.
[08:59:18] <saldot_> i've set the setp pwmgen.0.scale 24000
[09:00:58] <saldot_> is there any other settings that could influence the speed of the spindle?
[09:01:03] <saldot_> *are
[09:04:32] <saldot_> or perhaps it's something i need to set on the VFD?
[09:07:29] <zeeshan|2> use a multimeter
[09:07:48] <zeeshan|2> vfd usually output -10 to 10v
[09:08:00] <zeeshan|2> if your max frequency on the vfd is set to 60hz
[09:08:06] <zeeshan|2> which gives you 5000 rpm
[09:08:51] <zeeshan|2> use that info to adjust the scale correct
[09:14:28] <saldot_> zeeshan|2: sorry, disconnected. Switched to another wifi, should be bette rnow
[09:15:02] <saldot_> so.. my spindle is 24000rpm and the max hz is 400 si it's 60 rpm/hz.
[09:15:44] <saldot_> which is working, if the vfd output's 140hz the spindle spins at ~8500rpm
[09:16:08] <saldot_> but linuxCNC is'n outputting the correct pwm signal for the VFD i guess.
[09:17:02] <saldot_> since if i enter m3 s6000 the VFD sends out 140hz, it should be 100 hz
[09:18:01] <saldot_> but if i do m3 s10000 i get 200hz, which is spot on
[09:18:06] <saldot_> so it's on the lower end i guess..
[09:18:12] <Loetmichel> saldot_: usually you can adjust the scale for the analog signal on the VFD with parameters.
[09:18:18] <Loetmichel> tried to adjust it there?
[09:18:35] <Loetmichel> scale AND offset
[09:19:06] <pcw_home> sounds like you BOB has linearity problems, Check with a DVM as zeeshan suggested
[09:19:21] <pcw_home> s/you/your/
[09:19:37] <Loetmichel> yeah, it could be the RC filter, too
[09:20:24] <pcw_home> yeah, also linearity may be frequency dependent
[09:21:04] <saldot_> pcw_home: think i missed that message from zeeshan, had connection issues. could you copy/paste what he wrote?
[09:21:57] <pcw_home> use a multimeter
[09:21:58] <pcw_home> vfd usually output -10 to 10v
[09:21:59] <pcw_home> if your max frequency on the vfd is set to 60hz
[09:22:01] <pcw_home> which gives you 5000 rpm
[09:22:02] <pcw_home> [use that info to adjust the scale correct
[09:23:29] <saldot_> perhaps i missunderstand, but i think this VFD outputs 220V.. since that's what the spindle can handle. no?
[09:24:30] <saldot_> also the output of the VFD seems fine. if it's going at for example 200hz the spindle is spinning at 12000rpm
[09:24:47] <zeeshan|2> voltage controls the torque output
[09:24:49] <zeeshan|2> frequency controls the speed
[09:25:01] <zeeshan|2> for a simple scalar drive
[09:25:37] <saldot_> ok
[09:25:44] <pink_vampire> hi
[09:25:47] <pcw_home> You are using the VFDs analog input to control the speed, This is normally 10V for full speed
[09:25:48] <pcw_home> so you need to check your BOBs analog output to see where the problem lies
[09:25:57] <saldot_> no, i'm using PWM
[09:26:14] <saldot_> also, what is BOB?
[09:26:24] <pcw_home> Breakout board
[09:26:27] <saldot_> ah
[09:26:28] <pink_vampire> I'm looking for a magnetic motor brake
[09:26:58] <saldot_> I have a c10 bob, connected to a c41
[09:27:04] <zeeshan|2> bob is pcw's uncle
[09:27:05] <zeeshan|2> :)
[09:27:17] <saldot_> and then i connect the VFD to the c41
[09:27:23] <saldot_> zeeshan|2: heh, good one. =))
[09:27:27] <pcw_home> the C41 converts the PWM to 0..10V
[09:27:31] <pink_vampire> if i hit the e stop the z axis spindle drift down and crushes the end mill
[09:28:05] <saldot_> pcw_home: oh, right. didnt know
[09:28:47] <pcw_home> you need to check the 0..10V on the output of the C41 to see if its a VFD issue or PWM --> voltage issue
[09:29:02] <saldot_> will test
[09:29:34] <saldot_> and it's linear? so my max rpm is 24000, m3s12000 should give me 5v right?
[09:29:35] <zeeshan|2> when i first heard bob
[09:29:39] <zeeshan|2> i was so confused
[09:29:40] <zeeshan|2> :D
[09:29:47] <malcom2073> pink_vampire: Yeah you need a brake
[09:29:49] <zeeshan|2> saldot_: ya it should be linear
[09:31:07] <pink_vampire> malcom2073: do you know where i gen get something that is easy to mount, or which company sell stuff like that?
[09:31:16] <archivist> pink_vampire, some VFDs have DC injection braking, others have an external resistor for braking
[09:31:17] <pink_vampire> can*
[09:31:23] <malcom2073> not for cheap, but you may be able to find something used on ebay
[09:31:38] <saldot_> zeeshan|2: i'm getting -24.7v.. Oo
[09:31:38] <zeeshan|2> pink_vampire: your z isnt that heavy
[09:31:45] <pink_vampire> archivist: i want to brake the Z axis motor.
[09:31:53] <zeeshan|2> just make a spring + lever based brake
[09:31:56] <zeeshan|2> using a simple pin
[09:31:56] <jthornton> does the SPINx1 output 0-10v?
[09:32:03] <archivist> pink_vampire, I know
[09:32:08] <zeeshan|2> saldot_: doesnt sound right
[09:32:22] <saldot_> nah, will check again. that's strange
[09:32:56] <pink_vampire> I want something that connect on to the motor shaft
[09:33:16] <archivist> saldot_, using the correct ground reference?
[09:33:18] <saldot_> same again. perhas i cant measure while the vfd is on?
[09:33:28] <pink_vampire> so it will be, motor> brake>ball screw
[09:33:30] <malcom2073> Hehe: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Dupar-Canada-Ltd-Electromagnetic-Brake/401125618195?_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851&_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D36892%26meid%3D2d7597b53d7d41e6aa662a4f1e1cacea%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D3%26rkt%3D6%26sd%3D361447785025
[09:33:36] <pcw_home> jthornton: the SPINX1 outputs 0 to 100 percent of the supplied voltage (its a potentiometer replacement)
[09:33:37] <pcw_home> (input voltage must be from 5 to 15V)
[09:33:53] <malcom2073> Or you know, something like this: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Electroid-Power-Off-Brake-90-BFSB-7-6-48V/152104731818?_trksid=p2047675.c100009.m1982&_trkparms=aid%3D777000%26algo%3DABA.MBE%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D36892%26meid%3Df1e8e89c084e44f08e85b6656e2d8d86%26pid%3D100009%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D1%26sd%3D401125618195
[09:33:55] <jthornton> ok thanks
[09:34:01] <zeeshan|2> wow malcom2073
[09:34:02] <zeeshan|2> thats cheap!
[09:34:08] <pink_vampire> malcom2073: this is not what i mean
[09:34:27] <malcom2073> pink_vampire: The latter is what my Z servo had on it
[09:34:31] <malcom2073> Something very similar
[09:34:43] <malcom2073> The former was a joke.
[09:35:47] <pink_vampire> i want something that will act as extended shaft
[09:36:13] <malcom2073> put it on the end of the ballscrew, instead of on the motor side
[09:37:55] <pink_vampire> I want it also to be nema 34, so the screws will fit.
[09:39:11] <pcw_home> so if you connect SP+ to 10V and SP- to GND you get 0..10V
[09:39:31] <malcom2073> you're getting pretty specific
[09:39:34] <malcom2073> and specific is typically expensive
[09:39:53] <malcom2073> http://www.jvl.dk/917/motor-brake
[09:39:58] <malcom2073> Bet it's in the $3k range
[09:40:55] <pink_vampire> that look very cute
[09:42:00] <pink_vampire> how do I calculate the holding torque?
[09:43:54] <pink_vampire> http://www.scotteq.com/default.aspx?page=item+detail&itemcode=MAB34X-91
[09:44:00] <pink_vampire> $522.91/EA
[09:44:08] <pink_vampire> not that bad.
[09:45:10] <Polymorphism> zlog
[09:45:27] <malcom2073> Be worth buying the $40 brake, and making an adapter to make it work heh
[09:45:39] <JT-Shop> do you have a manual for the SPINx1?
[09:46:25] <JT-Shop> found it
[09:47:53] <pcw_home> I just google to find our manuals (they all are named xxxman)
[09:48:29] <pink_vampire> malcom2073: the motor shaft is half inch
[09:48:56] <pink_vampire> the cute one only get 1/4" :(
[09:49:20] <DaViruz> for $500 you could probably find a motor with internal brake?
[09:50:26] <pink_vampire> like what type?
[09:52:10] <malcom2073> pink_vampire: So make an adapter and stick it at the end of the ballscrew
[09:52:43] <pink_vampire> to make an adapter to what?
[09:57:08] <zeeshan|2> look at how its done on an industrial machine
[09:57:18] <zeeshan|2> on mine i have a rotor and brake pad
[09:57:22] <zeeshan|2> w/ a hydraulic solenoid
[09:57:23] <zeeshan|2> (lathe)
[09:57:31] <zeeshan|2> on the mill its an electromagnetic brake part of the motor
[09:57:43] <zeeshan|2> use whatever is easiest!
[09:57:54] <gregcnc> i just don't hit the estop
[09:58:11] <zeeshan|2> im confused
[09:58:14] <zeeshan|2> what does brake have to do with e-stop
[09:58:37] <gregcnc> as long as the servo is powered the z doesn't fall
[09:58:44] <zeeshan|2> yes but when you turn off the machine
[09:58:47] <zeeshan|2> its going to fall?
[09:59:06] <gregcnc> only 3mm /yr
[09:59:23] <zeeshan|2> so how is that different than hitting e-stop?
[09:59:33] <gregcnc> why not just add some counter balance for a simple fix on a smll machine
[10:07:28] <gregcnc> If you still have some shaft on the motor or the opposite end of a ballscrew installing a brake is easy, but if you don't.....
[10:19:12] <Polymorphism> Anyone here use zero camera? I'll take my question off the air
[10:19:14] * Polymorphism afk
[10:34:01] <saldot_> zeeshan|2: found the problem. there was a small potentiometer on the c41 BOB that regulated the voltage beeing sent to the VFD. it was way off.
[10:34:08] <saldot_> so thanks a lot for the help =)
[10:50:31] <enleth> I received photos of this Denford ORAC lathe that cropped up on an auction, it's not mint condition (paint chipped here and there) but there's no rust and it seems complete. There are at least two toolholders with it.
[10:50:58] <enleth> Multifix style, I assume they (or something that fits properly) are still being manufactured.
[10:51:44] <enleth> worst case I can swap for a wedge style QCTP
[10:54:22] <gregcnc> http://www.denfordata.com/bb/viewforum.php?f=43
[10:54:51] <jthornton> now if I can find a focused tutorial on compiling and downloading to an ARV I'll be set
[10:55:00] <jthornton> most seem to wander about too much
[10:55:34] <gregcnc> when looking for a small cnc lathe I considered Orac but didn't find one close enough to bother.
[11:01:56] <enleth> gregcnc: yeah, found the forum, it looks to be an official site of Denford, lots of information there
[11:02:20] <gregcnc> schematics, manuals, etc
[11:13:47] <Tom_itx> zeeshan|2 that's what wood blocks are for
[11:14:19] <Tom_itx> jthornton, i've been wandering for days with mine
[11:14:22] <archivist> my cmm used a plastic spray can lid
[11:16:07] <jthornton> I'm burning in the rain
[11:16:16] <Tom_itx> huh?
[11:16:40] * Tom_itx checks the weather map
[11:17:00] <Tom_itx> clear nice day here
[11:17:16] <Loetmichel> MUAHAHAHAHA... "The Common Wisdom of the Entire Aerospace Industrial Complex: "You can't land a rocket back on earth." Elon Musk: "Hold my beer...""I am watching the vid in the unloading of the spacex rocket off the barge. the qoute was in the comments ;)
[11:17:19] <Tom_itx> did you piss off mother nature?
[11:19:27] <jthornton> I guess, it's been raining forever lol
[11:19:50] <jthornton> I need a simple outline of how the avr process goes so I can get a grasp of the process
[11:19:57] <Tom_itx> http://www.intellicast.com/Local/WxMap.aspx
[11:20:05] <jthornton> like a hello world for avr
[11:20:09] <Tom_itx> the rest of the world is clear... just swampeast..
[11:20:26] <Tom_itx> jthornton for avr?
[11:20:40] <Tom_itx> the blink is about the simplest one
[11:20:40] <jthornton> supposed to move out this afternoon for a week or so
[11:20:42] <Tom_itx> on my page
[11:20:42] <jthornton> yea
[11:20:59] <Tom_itx> blikk delay then blink using interrupt
[11:21:17] <Tom_itx> PORTX ^0xFF
[11:21:23] <Tom_itx> xor toggles pins
[11:21:23] <jthornton> that's what I'm working on now
[11:21:52] <jthornton> I downloaded a bunch of files from the "C source code for this project"
[11:21:59] <Tom_itx> the makefile etc should all be there including a working .hex file
[11:22:08] <Tom_itx> why?
[11:22:30] <Tom_itx> set up avrgcc
[11:23:25] <Tom_itx> windows or linux?
[11:23:34] <jthornton> linux
[11:23:50] <Tom_itx> just install avrgcc it should be in the repo
[11:24:04] <Tom_itx> i don't use it enough to really help with that
[11:24:15] <Tom_itx> avrdude will work on either too
[11:24:38] <Tom_itx> should come with it
[11:24:40] <jthornton> it's installed
[11:25:04] <Tom_itx> i just works (SM)
[11:25:14] <Tom_itx> it*
[11:25:23] <Frank_3> guys quick quest. best program to draw circuit diagrams? :D thanks
[11:25:30] <Tom_itx> eagle
[11:25:46] <Frank_3> ill try it, i've heard of it
[11:25:51] * Tom_itx waits for the qualifications now
[11:26:07] <Frank_3> :D
[11:26:10] * jthornton goes to check the burn barrel
[11:26:19] <Frank_3> it isnt free right?
[11:26:27] <Tom_itx> alot bitch about the interface but i've used it for years
[11:26:32] <Tom_itx> student is
[11:26:36] <jthornton> it's free to a point
[11:26:38] <Tom_itx> limited 2 layers and board size
[11:26:54] <Tom_itx> board is big enough for most experimenters
[11:27:34] <Tom_itx> i still use 4.16 instead of newer versions
[11:27:45] <Frank_3> enough for me i guess, im making the router cnc control panel
[11:28:01] <Tom_itx> you may need to make a few components
[11:28:06] <Tom_itx> but that's not that hard either
[11:28:13] <Tom_itx> i've got my own lib of parts
[11:28:32] <Frank_3> sure no problem
[11:28:39] <Frank_3> i have rhino 3d already in the pc
[11:28:40] <Tom_itx> just go off the part data sheet which usually gives pad dimensions etc
[11:28:44] <Frank_3> should i use that instead?
[11:28:51] <Tom_itx> up to you
[11:29:14] <Tom_itx> i've got sw and catia but wouldn't use them for drawing circuits :)
[11:29:14] <Frank_3> i guess eagle has some components already drawn?
[11:29:21] <Tom_itx> quite a few yes
[11:29:24] <Frank_3> eagle it is
[11:29:27] <Frank_3> hehe thanks
[11:29:29] <Tom_itx> more than when i started using it
[11:29:39] <Tom_itx> which was somewhere around ver 2xx
[11:30:04] <Tom_itx> you must 'open' the libs first
[11:30:15] <Tom_itx> due to resources they're not all open by default
[11:30:41] <Tom_itx> like regular pin headers will be in pinhead lib
[11:31:05] <Tom_itx> board connectors in con- something
[11:31:08] <archivist> kicad is really free
[11:31:18] <Tom_itx> but lacks robustness
[11:31:22] <Frank_3> okey, im already downloading it
[11:31:40] <Frank_3> and i lack electrical knwoledge hehe
[11:31:52] <Tom_itx> draw the schematic, then the board. make sure they stay connected if you want error checking
[11:32:11] <archivist> he wont need a board for a control box
[11:32:16] <Tom_itx> ERC DRD are electrical rule check and design rule check
[11:32:25] <Frank_3> the board?
[11:32:28] <Frank_3> noooo no board
[11:32:29] <Frank_3> hahaha
[11:32:56] <Frank_3> just pc, vfd, mesa cards, and some fuses/circuit breakers
[11:33:00] <Frank_3> contactors
[11:33:26] <JT-Shop> linux has some check the synaptic package manager
[11:33:55] <Tom_itx> DRC*
[11:34:19] <Frank_3> i actualy should start using linux, to get used to, i've never used it so far
[11:34:25] <Frank_3> anyway..
[11:35:52] <Frank_3> what do you use to protect the drivers and the control box? is it really necessary a gfci?
[11:38:57] <enleth> Frank_3: it's good to have one
[11:39:14] <enleth> they're cheap, no reason not to use them
[11:40:00] <enleth> you'll immediately know you have ground leakage when you install one and first thing it does is trip
[11:48:27] <Frank_3> lol
[11:48:34] <Frank_3> i have one on the main board,
[12:01:23] <maxcnc> hi from a wet and thundery southwest germany
[12:01:53] <Loetmichel> maxcnc: rock am ring ;)
[12:02:36] <maxcnc> there it is also wet but there is no music here it sounds nice
[12:03:57] <maxcnc> Frank_3: there is so many cool stuff for DRO Electric circuits in linux
[12:04:55] <maxcnc> Bad to me now its offical i will close down the shop at the end of this month
[12:06:36] <maxcnc> so i will be off at the end of this month as we move back to the old location and then start at 1.8 with the ld crew
[12:07:13] <Frank_3> helloo maxx
[12:07:26] <maxcnc> ;-)
[12:12:06] <maxcnc> so let me quick change the Website
[12:15:29] <maxcnc> hi Dan
[12:15:54] <Danilochka> Hi can a tb6600 adjust spindle speed? I can't seem to adjust mine
[12:16:24] <maxcnc> tb6600 is a stepper driver
[12:16:42] <Danilochka> So no?
[12:17:03] <Frank_4> nope
[12:17:10] <maxcnc> you might get a nmax speed as 500RPM on a stapper
[12:17:11] <Danilochka> Okay, thanks
[12:17:17] <Frank_4> you need analog output for spindle
[12:17:27] <Danilochka> Okay
[12:17:39] <Frank_4> 0-10v analog interface AFAIK
[12:17:47] <maxcnc> the BOB can output a PWM that drives a Spinle
[12:18:24] <Danilochka> On the tb6600 there is a pwm pin, but according to the manufacture it's not for spindle
[12:19:16] <maxcnc> http://linuxcnc.org/docs/html/examples/spindle.html
[12:19:32] <maxcnc> Danilochka: what pin is it to the parport
[12:20:13] <maxcnc> net spindle-pwm pwmgen.0.pwm => parport.0.pin-09-out
[12:20:29] <Danilochka> http://vi.raptor.ebaydesc.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemDescV4&item=251998289920&category=71394&pm=1&ds=0&t=1464916690965
[12:20:31] <maxcnc> if yoiu use a standard parport it is the best
[12:21:03] <maxcnc> oh rasptor disastor Polymorph is cool with it
[12:21:55] <Danilochka> Sorry what?
[12:22:15] <maxcnc> no its internal as many got this
[12:22:27] <maxcnc> where are you in the world
[12:22:34] <maxcnc> USA Europ Asia
[12:22:41] <maxcnc> im in Germany
[12:22:46] <Danilochka> Canada
[12:22:51] <Danilochka> Why?
[12:23:05] <maxcnc> to get you infos on components
[12:23:37] <Frank_4> beware, hes a hacker
[12:23:39] <Danilochka> Ah, wait so I can control speed via tb6600 pwm without spindle driver?
[12:23:54] <maxcnc> its about 10USD to get a real good part to control a VFD
[12:24:09] <Danilochka> Link plz?
[12:24:24] <maxcnc> http://de.tmart.com/PWM-to-0-10V-Digital-to-Analog-Module-Green_p299674.html?cc=EUR&fixed_price=hk_intl&gclid=CI_B1ujrjs0CFQ4TGwoduDAHcg
[12:25:06] <Danilochka> Okay, and hooking that up is self explanatory?
[12:25:25] <maxcnc> depends on knolige
[12:25:50] <maxcnc> the cheepest way is via a RC for 10cent
[12:26:08] <maxcnc> google pwm to analog
[12:26:13] <Danilochka> Well there's only PWM and GND for analog control from tb6600
[12:26:41] <Danilochka> Nvm I see how to hook it up
[12:27:07] <maxcnc> the tb6600 got its own pwm signal for sync with other drivers thats not for spindel or VFD
[12:27:30] <maxcnc> do you mean the Driver board from China like the old TB 6560
[12:27:40] <Danilochka> Okay, thanks, I gotta go
[12:29:03] <maxcnc> Frank_4: seams like poly chganges the nicks all the time
[12:29:50] <maxcnc> oh blue sky outside for the firat time this day
[12:29:53] <Frank_4> sorry who?
[12:30:00] <maxcnc> its 1hr till sunset
[12:30:06] <Frank_4> here 2pm
[12:30:32] <maxcnc> our canadian fiend tht took 2month to decide on a mill
[12:30:39] <Frank_4> ohh yeah
[12:30:42] <Frank_4> hehe
[12:30:59] <Frank_4> cant complain too much either, im always bothering people :D :D
[12:31:18] <maxcnc> thats why we are all here
[12:31:35] <Frank_4> my irc soft. changes my nick too, idk why, from frank_2 to frank_3.. etc
[12:31:59] <Frank_4> not on porpouse ofcourse
[12:32:21] <Frank_4> why are you closing the shop
[12:32:56] <maxcnc> the area is changing here and my work is no longer alowed as im in a Hairdresser studio backyard
[12:33:38] <maxcnc> and the rome projekt from my brother in law is closing the local gov is conected to this
[12:34:04] <maxcnc> so he IchGucks is starting all over at his shopside
[12:34:55] <maxcnc> Hard to explain mutch Harder to understand and imposible to belive
[12:35:51] <Frank_4> hehe,
[12:36:08] <Frank_4> i could say the exact same thing on this side of the planet
[12:36:37] <maxcnc> myself got a new anouncment from the university of sience
[12:36:56] <maxcnc> to deal with CNC as they got all mashines from here
[12:37:16] <maxcnc> and belive or not only one at the school is used to linux 10.04
[12:37:18] <Frank_4> well that sounds nice, isnt it?
[12:37:24] <maxcnc> no
[12:37:36] <maxcnc> students are real hard work
[12:37:46] <Frank_4> true
[12:37:52] <maxcnc> better to stay with the bit shop
[12:38:03] <Frank_4> sometimes i would like to learn german
[12:38:07] <maxcnc> http://heimwerkermarkt-tretter.de/
[12:38:27] <maxcnc> making keys selling stuff
[12:39:16] <maxcnc> by the way Frank_4 can you tell me if the images on the indey side are changing
[12:39:30] <maxcnc> outside europ there is some problems
[12:39:31] <Frank_4> i would totally go bankrupt if i worked in a place like that, i would like to make 200 projects, looking at that stuff every day
[12:39:39] <Frank_4> yes
[12:39:43] <Frank_4> they are
[12:40:15] <Frank_4> hey, do you have 3 phase there?
[12:40:20] <Frank_4> electric power
[12:40:24] <maxcnc> i need to change this side also as from yesterday we also got Power Tools
[12:41:00] <maxcnc> yes we got 480V ad the shop has a 40kW connector
[12:41:20] <maxcnc> but 4 plasmas at 500W eatch make the money
[12:42:17] <Frank_4> 480v? i have 440 here for 3phase
[12:42:35] <Frank_4> do you wire throw the circuit breaker and fuses the neutral?=
[12:42:45] <Frank_4> or you only conect the 3 phases and earth
[12:43:18] <maxcnc> only 2pases
[12:43:22] <maxcnc> ony 3
[12:43:28] <maxcnc> bad typo
[12:43:38] <maxcnc> only the 3phases
[12:44:04] <maxcnc> Loetmichel: noch da
[12:45:04] <maxcnc> Frank_4: between eatch phase and earth is 240V
[12:45:23] <maxcnc> between tha phase is 480V
[12:46:39] <Frank_4> ok, and earth connection right?
[12:46:55] <Frank_4> meaining 5 wire system
[12:48:07] <maxcnc> yes
[12:48:30] <maxcnc> L1 L2 L3 N Earth
[12:49:54] <maxcnc> in color Black Brown Black Blue Gren/yeslow
[12:50:03] <maxcnc> yellow
[12:50:14] <maxcnc> e=ee
[12:50:23] <Frank_4> hehe thanks,
[12:50:25] <maxcnc> ;-)
[12:50:41] <maxcnc> has been a real hard week here so i wil close down
[12:51:51] <maxcnc> Bye
[14:16:53] <Tecan> http://www.aliexpress.com/item-img/Wholesale-Creative-High-Definition-Horizontal-Glasses-Lazy-Glasses-Novelty-Bed-Lie-Down-Periscope-Glasses/1905360458.html ??
[14:18:22] <enleth> 240 phase to ground, 480 phase to phase? where the hell does he live?
[14:18:35] <enleth> this doesn't even make sense
[14:31:51] <jthornton> Tom_itx: got the makefile to work... I think
[14:34:13] <Duc> How well does the 7i76E work with a laptop and a external power supply
[14:40:32] <pcw_home> Probably depends on the laptop
[14:42:52] <pcw_home> Some NICS are troublesome and Laptop power management usually raises is cycle sucking head eventually
[14:44:03] <pcw_home> The Dell E6420 I have works fine if you dont adjust the backlight or switch power sources while running
[14:45:38] <arauchfuss> So trying to understand everything in my hal files.
[14:46:08] <Duc> ok. I was looking at using the system to make a portable system that used two motors and a camera intergated into linuxcnc for movement
[14:46:33] <arauchfuss> To reverse the jog axis on my joypad I changed the scale to -127.5
[14:46:40] <arauchfuss> why not just an even 128?
[14:47:00] <Duc> Buddies would like me to make a sentry gun mount for testing of firearms. LOL
[14:49:28] <archivist> arauchfuss, because scale is about dimensions as well
[14:50:28] <archivist> I bet you have a metric conversion to inch scale of some sort
[14:51:23] <Tom_itx> jthornton, if not i should have one around here that works for linux
[14:51:48] <Tom_itx> i'd have to dig a bit deeper for it
[14:55:13] <JT-Shop> I was just missing a lib and needed to figure out the syntax for 328 that it needed a p
[14:56:21] <arauchfuss> archivist: ah I thought it was a relative 128 value.
[14:56:25] <arauchfuss> time to read
[14:57:16] <Tom_itx> JT-Shop, so you got it goin now?
[14:57:17] <arauchfuss> whenever I see a value like 8 16 128 I make assumptions
[14:57:58] <archivist> exceedingly little binary in machine scale
[14:59:00] <archivist> think about 25.4 /2 and you see 12.7
[14:59:48] <arauchfuss> is scale based on the whole axis range?
[15:00:18] <archivist> no, your mechanics
[15:00:38] <archivist> leadscrew pitch etc
[15:00:51] <arauchfuss> ah got it.
[15:01:30] <pcw_home> most linuxcnc scale numbers are things like steps or encoder count per machine unit (machine units being inches or MM)
[15:01:48] <arauchfuss> I take it people use scale for final calibration of their machines?
[15:01:55] <arauchfuss> or just the compensation file?
[15:02:38] <archivist> the scale should be right for your mechanics, the compensation only for mid screw error
[15:03:31] <archivist> I think you need some serious measuring to bother compensating
[15:04:46] <Tom_itx> JT-Shop, try something like this: avrdude -c avrisp2 -p m328 -P usb -U flash:w:"/usr/local/avr/test.hex":a -e
[15:05:08] <Tom_itx> for the avrdude cmd line
[15:06:17] <arauchfuss> archivist: yeah I don't have a laser for measuring that :)
[15:06:53] <archivist> glass scales are an easier step probably
[15:08:15] <enleth> interesting, the original Emco 8 has the X handwheel mounted on a "stalk" protruding towards the operator quite a distance
[15:09:01] <archivist> arauchfuss, is your machine stepper or servo ?
[15:09:03] <enleth> which means I could try to get the same part and fit it to the ORAC
[15:11:53] <JT-Shop> thanks Tom_itx
[15:12:53] <JT-Shop> is /usr/local/avr/test.hex a file that gets loaded with avrdude?
[15:27:55] <Tom_itx> yes
[15:28:10] <Tom_itx> change that to suit
[15:29:33] <dioz> i ned to precision cut pieces of sheet metal with detail. what is the best method to accomplish this?
[15:33:46] <dioz> aviation snips?
[15:34:08] <dioz> because of the compound action?
[15:37:24] <SpeedEvil> waterjet is close to the best.
[15:37:52] <SpeedEvil> How thick? Snips can work - as can other methods - fretsaw or similar
[15:49:23] <dioz> i'd say... 12 gauge and up
[16:04:30] <Deejay> gn8
[16:06:14] <enleth> dioz: is that 2.78mm?
[16:06:22] <enleth> a bit thick for handheld tools
[16:09:28] <Tom_itx> JT-Shop, you need root access or permission to the USB port
[16:09:43] <enleth> dioz: if you really want to do it freehand, good pneumatic nibblers and shears will handle that thickness, but seriously, get it cut on a waterjet or a laser
[16:09:44] <Tom_itx> fwiw
[16:10:21] <enleth> Tom_itx: to the USB serial device, actually, if you're talking about programming AVRs
[16:10:34] <Tom_itx> well that then
[16:10:53] <Tom_itx> i figured he might have issues otherwise
[16:11:22] <enleth> on most distros they're assigned to the "modem", "serial", "dialout" or "tty" group
[16:11:22] <JT-Shop> Tom_itx: I added myself to something to get access to the usb port when I was messing with the scanner
[16:11:34] <Tom_itx> i don't program avrs much with linux and am not fluent with it so the details are fuzzy
[16:11:43] <JT-Shop> dioz how many pcs
[16:12:19] <JT-Shop> yea I think I added myself to the serial group or something like that
[16:12:31] <Tom_itx> JT-Shop, i should have sent you a breadboard adapter
[16:12:43] <JT-Shop> anyway there is not text.hex anywhere on my linux machine
[16:12:59] * Tom_itx smacks the moonshine outta RedneckZee
[16:13:02] <RedneckZee> :-)
[16:13:15] <JT-Shop> yes if you mean the 6 pin to breadboard adapter
[16:13:17] <Tom_itx> JT-Shop, whatever program you compile. foo.hex
[16:13:25] <Tom_itx> ahh you got one?
[16:13:27] <Tom_itx> cool
[16:13:40] <JT-Shop> ah ok, I thought it was a real test file lol
[16:13:52] <JT-Shop> yep and got it all wired up
[16:14:01] <Tom_itx> makes breadboarding a bit easier
[16:14:20] <JT-Shop> knowing what your doing makes it easier lol
[16:14:49] <Tom_itx> just follow the wires in the pic and you're golden
[16:15:05] <Tom_itx> i purposely tried to make em neat
[16:15:27] <JT-Shop> mine are neat too lol
[16:15:42] <Tom_itx> most of mine aren't :)
[16:16:38] <JT-Shop> I'd like to use it for show n tell or a nano the uno which works is clumsy to deal with
[16:16:39] <Tom_itx> http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-210pcs-Male-to-Male-Solderless-Flexible-Breadboard-Jumper-Leads-Cable-Wires-/252338418220?hash=item3ac08ab22c:g:2t0AAOSwdU1W~IbA
[16:16:42] <Tom_itx> get you some of those
[16:17:01] <JT-Shop> got a fist full of them with the uno
[16:17:04] <Tom_itx> i use cat 5
[16:17:21] <Tom_itx> or whatever cat is standing by
[16:17:23] <JT-Shop> is it solid core? I forget
[16:17:34] <JT-Shop> cat gut
[16:17:36] <Tom_itx> not the jumpers but the main is
[16:18:10] <RedneckZee> going to a pick up truck will be a big change
[16:18:18] <RedneckZee> but i cant think of ever wanting to drive a regular car again for daily
[16:18:29] <RedneckZee> i can move shit, atv, off road, setup my telescope in the bed
[16:18:30] <Tom_itx> then when you get serious about debugging you can get one of these: https://www.saleae.com/
[16:18:32] <RedneckZee> sleep in the bed
[16:18:34] <RedneckZee> woohoo
[16:18:49] <RedneckZee> cnc and drive
[16:19:11] <Tom_itx> JT-Shop, i've got an early ver of one of those and love it
[16:19:55] <Tom_itx> or a clone of it for cheap
[16:20:57] * JT-Shop rides this to work http://gnipsel.com/images/JD350/350b01.jpg
[16:21:28] <RedneckZee> haha jthornton
[16:21:29] <RedneckZee> nice
[16:21:41] <XXCoder> JT-Shop: your mpg is excessive, use hummer
[16:21:43] <RedneckZee> what type of engine is in that?
[16:22:07] <JT-Shop> no, you got that wrong it's gpm
[16:22:19] <JT-Shop> diesel
[16:22:32] <XXCoder> oh you're right lol gallons per mile
[16:23:31] <JT-Shop> it's a rough ride too
[16:24:18] <JT-Shop> the hoe rides better and gets better mileage but the crawler and really pull when the going gets sticky
[16:24:27] <RedneckZee> no i know its diesel
[16:24:31] <RedneckZee> but is it like a 4 banger?
[16:24:35] <RedneckZee> i always wondered what goes in them
[16:24:42] <JT-Shop> https://www.deere.com/en_US/docs/construction/non_current_products/crawler_dozers/350B.pdf
[16:24:50] <RedneckZee> 3 cyl
[16:24:50] <RedneckZee> lol
[16:24:52] <JT-Shop> 3 cyl
[16:24:59] <RedneckZee> that is cool
[16:25:34] <RedneckZee> 10,600lb
[16:25:38] <RedneckZee> that weighs the same as my leight
[16:25:40] <RedneckZee> lathe
[16:25:42] <RedneckZee> thats heavy as hell
[16:25:46] <JT-Shop> that's without the 6-way
[16:25:55] <JT-Shop> 12k with the 6-way
[16:26:24] <RedneckZee> jeez
[16:26:42] <JT-Shop> oh that is with the dozer, usually they list the weight bare
[16:27:09] <JT-Shop> the 6-way should be the same weight as the loader
[16:27:36] <JT-Shop> anyway you don't pull it behind a pickup lol
[16:28:36] <RedneckZee> not mine at least :P
[16:29:31] <JT-Shop> nor mine
[16:30:07] <JT-Shop> I had to get a buddy with a big dodge dually and a gooseneck to haul it home
[16:35:30] <Tom_itx> hope you don't plan on moving soon
[16:48:03] <Frank_5> i have 4x 1kw servomotors AC 220v, they are rated for max input/output 30amps each, meaning i would need a main circuit breaker of 120ampsż?żż?
[16:54:04] <JT-Shop> you size the circuit breaker to protect the wire going to the machine
[16:54:56] <JT-Shop> Tom_itx: my next address will be in a jar...
[16:57:24] <Frank_5> okey, but 120amps wouldnt be near the max required for the 4 motors in the worst case scenario? because i have a 32amp (380V 3 phase) MAIN circuit breaker where the line enters the building i think i am in problems
[16:57:30] <RedneckZee> JT-Shop: that isnt always true
[16:57:47] <RedneckZee> for example in our control boxes, we fuse 1amp for the fans
[16:57:54] <RedneckZee> even tho they have a 14awg wire
[16:58:32] <gregcnc> fuse can smaller than safe rating of wire but not larger
[16:59:45] <JT-Shop> well yes you can put a smaller breaker...
[17:01:30] <roycroft> as has been mentioned, you size your breaker to protect the downstream wiring
[17:01:52] <RedneckZee> not always
[17:01:55] <RedneckZee> that is always a given
[17:02:01] <roycroft> if your load side wiring is 14ga then your breaker can be no greater than 15a (20a in an open chassis)
[17:02:08] <RedneckZee> how do you select your wire size to begin with?
[17:02:26] <roycroft> by engineering your device properly :)
[17:02:31] <andypugh> You choose the wire to suit the load
[17:02:41] <RedneckZee> that sometimes is not an easy task
[17:02:44] <andypugh> Then choose the breaker to suit the wire
[17:03:04] <RedneckZee> yea, but some devices do not have internal fuses
[17:03:23] <RedneckZee> so you could technically size the wire close.
[17:03:32] <RedneckZee> so 14awg, which can possibly draw 15-20A
[17:03:35] <andypugh> That’s no reason to use the supply wire as the fuse ;-)
[17:03:45] <RedneckZee> but the device can only handle 2 a
[17:04:05] <roycroft> so fuse the device at 2a
[17:04:15] <RedneckZee> at work the fire pump guys from what i recall sizes to peak current
[17:04:21] <RedneckZee> which means all the wires are sized to peak current also
[17:04:23] <roycroft> keeping in mind that electricity is not push technology
[17:04:29] <RedneckZee> cause it is the worst case scenario
[17:04:33] <roycroft> i can tell a story about that, but i'll not do so right now
[17:04:35] <root-x> http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-CTIlNTz5GCw/UGR-VUCVUqI/AAAAAAAAAas/iqKPcSPYOLw/s1600/Intensidad+y+potencia+en+funci%C3%B3n+de+secci%C3%B3n+de+cables.jpg
[17:04:58] <andypugh> TBH You are unlikely to save the device by using a breaker that will trip on a fault current. The fault is already there when the breaker trips
[17:05:21] <root-x> http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-fqohhCTI430/UGR-MF4Z6-I/AAAAAAAAAak/hKslzbTxpgY/s1600/Di%C3%A9metro+de+los+cables+en+funci%C3%B3n+de+su+secci%C3%B3n.jpg
[17:05:29] <roycroft> wires should be sized to handle the maximum continuous current that your load can safely handle without the wires overheating
[17:05:42] <gregcnc> just in case use 0000 fro everything
[17:05:47] <RedneckZee> rofl greg
[17:05:51] <roycroft> using too large a wire will not damage your load
[17:06:12] <enleth> it might
[17:06:23] <enleth> if your short circuit currents are too high
[17:06:28] <SpeedEvil> Or if it falls on it
[17:06:41] <RedneckZee> andypugh: most devices
[17:06:50] <RedneckZee> like fans will take a bit more than their rated fuse
[17:06:52] <RedneckZee> for a short period of time
[17:06:56] <RedneckZee> the fuse is very effective
[17:06:59] <roycroft> the assumption is that the wire is self-supported and secured
[17:07:02] <andypugh> root-x: That sort of table always makes me wonder why you wouldn’t use 4x 2.5mm cables rather than 1x 25mm :-)
[17:07:57] <andypugh> (Macroscopic Lits cable)
[17:08:00] <RedneckZee> andypugh: http://i.imgur.com/NrNZQXU.jpg
[17:08:03] <andypugh> Litz, I mean
[17:08:04] <enleth> short circuit currents in a shop electrical system can easily exceed 1kA and reach several kA if the wires are oversized and the uplink is beefy enough, with a transformer nearby
[17:08:07] <RedneckZee> i designed that at work along with EE
[17:08:08] <root-x> 2x5x4
[17:08:26] <RedneckZee> some of those fuses protect the transformers!
[17:08:47] <enleth> that's why breakers are usually rated at several kA short current, the max they can disconnect before the contacts weld shut
[17:09:15] <RedneckZee> enleth: i like fuses for this reason
[17:09:18] <RedneckZee> cheapest bang for the buck
[17:09:27] <RedneckZee> for highest short circuit ka
[17:09:33] <RedneckZee> 200k kA from what irecall
[17:09:34] <Frank_5> my motor specifications asks for 2mm^2 wire, and a chart tells me its max ampacity is 20 amps,
[17:09:39] <roycroft> i use a mix of fuses and circuit breakers for most control devices i design
[17:09:41] <root-x> andypugh yes two 25mm cables is same one 50mm.
[17:09:41] <XXCoder> cheaper than replacing protected circuit thats for sure.
[17:09:42] <RedneckZee> regular breakear is like 14k kA
[17:09:55] <Frank_5> im freaking confused
[17:09:57] <enleth> RedneckZee: I like properly sized wires instead
[17:10:01] <andypugh> root-x: Not for current capacity
[17:10:05] <SpeedEvil> andypugh: connector failures are essentially impossible to make safee
[17:10:16] <SpeedEvil> andypugh: and to diagnose
[17:10:19] <enleth> anyway, don't go slap oversized wiring willy-nilly just because it's more bigger more better. it's not.
[17:10:32] <roycroft> i generally build multiple power buses, each of which is breaker-protected, and then fuse individual components as needed
[17:10:36] <Frank_5> i think my motors require too much electrcity and the main building Circuit breaker cant even hold it
[17:10:54] <RedneckZee> roycroft: there you go! :P
[17:11:04] <RedneckZee> you arent fusing to the size of the wire in that case!
[17:11:06] <andypugh> SpeedEvil: Which is why I am not overly fond of the ring-mains we use in the UK. You can have only have the capacity you think you have, if the ring is broken, but with no sign that anything is wrong.
[17:11:20] <enleth> Frank_5: the charts are always relative to how the wire is laid out, which determines its cooling capacity
[17:11:20] <andypugh> (only half)
[17:11:30] <roycroft> i am, in the sense that we have been discussing
[17:11:56] <roycroft> i.e. the fuse/breaker must be less than or equal to the capacity of the load side wiring
[17:12:04] <RedneckZee> ya
[17:12:56] <roycroft> if i'm protecting a device that is rated at 2a, i can install a 16ga wire between my 2a fuse and the device
[17:12:58] <Frank_5> enleth: how can i determine the power that my servos are going to pull? they are 1kw ac 220v (4 of them) and the spec sheet says its MAX inrush current is 31amps, how can i know the continous ampacity that they will draw?
[17:13:14] <Frank_5> i have to make the math of the accelerations and forces they have to move right?
[17:13:18] <roycroft> but if i'm protecting a device that is rated at 10a, i can't use a 20ga wire between the 10a fuse and the device
[17:13:18] <andypugh> RedneckZee: That box would look a lot prettier with cable-lacing rather than cable ties :-)
[17:13:20] <enleth> Frank_5: you're *probably* never going to have to run your servos full power all at the same time
[17:13:45] <roycroft> tie wraps are evil
[17:13:49] <andypugh> Frank_5: Is that the power supply inrush current?
[17:13:54] <pcw_home> Frank_5: even 1KW average would be high
[17:14:02] <roycroft> and anyone who tries to use them in my telco huts gets thrown out
[17:14:03] <Frank_5> yes
[17:14:17] <RedneckZee> we want to make money
[17:14:20] <RedneckZee> not make things prettty :P
[17:14:42] <andypugh> Frank_5: You could consider a soft-start circuit to charge the servo supplies, then size everything for the 4kW rating.
[17:14:46] <roycroft> tie wraps are sharp and will cut you
[17:14:51] <roycroft> and more importantly, will cut other cables
[17:14:55] <RedneckZee> they are?
[17:14:58] <roycroft> yes, they are
[17:15:00] * RedneckZee has never been cut by one
[17:15:01] <pcw_home> peak power would likely be at the end of a XYZA G0 move
[17:15:04] <RedneckZee> you're prolly not using a zip tie gun
[17:15:10] <RedneckZee> and using side cutters :P
[17:15:17] <Frank_5> and the motors are super oversized,
[17:15:23] <Frank_5> 2 for the X long axis
[17:15:25] <andypugh> I find it hard to accept that cable ties are not suitable for tying cables :-)
[17:15:27] <Frank_5> only 150kg
[17:15:30] <gregcnc> i've cut myself on tie wraps and I'm always careful around them
[17:15:31] <XXCoder> I use standard tie and they leave sharp edges when loose end is cut off
[17:15:50] <roycroft> you've probably never tried to pile 300 cables on a cable ladder
[17:15:55] <pcw_home> I really doubt if you can use 1KW continuously
[17:16:08] <RedneckZee> you guys said i wouldnt use my drives fully
[17:16:09] <RedneckZee> and i do
[17:16:10] <RedneckZee> a lot!
[17:16:10] <RedneckZee> lol
[17:16:11] <roycroft> and i do have a gun for installing tie wraps
[17:16:18] <RedneckZee> cause theyre undersized unfortunately
[17:16:19] <Frank_5> it says on spec sheet, that maximus OUTPUT current is 30 amps
[17:16:19] <RedneckZee> :{
[17:16:20] <XXCoder> use a underflow supplier and it will cover when there isnt enough power
[17:16:20] <roycroft> because i do use them occasionally
[17:16:22] <roycroft> but very rarely
[17:16:27] <Frank_5> continous*** SRy
[17:16:39] <gregcnc> Zee you are maxing out current, but not power
[17:16:40] <roycroft> and never in a telco hut
[17:16:49] <Frank_5> pcw_home: same as peak
[17:16:57] <roycroft> i buy waxed string by the case though
[17:17:29] <Frank_5> andypugh: ill be googling about soft start circuits, but when i turn the contactors on for the drives there is when they pull max current?
[17:17:35] <enleth> Frank_5: worst case, just try to wire it as well as you can and see what happens. You don't have the full resources of a commercial machine integrator so don't sweat over doing it as if you were one.
[17:17:42] <pcw_home> RedneckZee: you lack peak current capability, something different
[17:17:57] <enleth> Frank_5: get it working early, debug later
[17:18:02] <RedneckZee> PCW: explain?
[17:18:07] <RedneckZee> so im not hitting 2kW?
[17:18:14] <RedneckZee> but yet im ferroring out
[17:18:15] <RedneckZee> im confused
[17:18:22] <pcw_home> yes
[17:18:35] <RedneckZee> the bus voltag eis 200v or something
[17:18:38] <Frank_5> but i would prefer if i hadnt have to change the circuit breaker for the building,
[17:18:39] <RedneckZee> and they draw like 18 A
[17:18:48] <RedneckZee> 15
[17:18:50] * JT-Shop wanders inside for a glass of cab
[17:18:52] <Frank_5> anyway.. i think im going to try it
[17:18:57] <RedneckZee> so its not drawing 3kW?
[17:18:58] <gregcnc> measure SERVO voltage when it happens and you'll see it's nowhere near full voltage
[17:19:11] <pcw_home> Nope its not
[17:19:11] <RedneckZee> very hard to
[17:19:11] <enleth> Frank_5: you can always limit power on big servos
[17:19:13] <RedneckZee> cause its a short period
[17:19:16] <RedneckZee> prolly need a scope
[17:19:21] <roycroft> it would be rare that you could just change the main breaker for the building anyway
[17:19:26] <RedneckZee> what is it drawing then?
[17:19:33] <roycroft> most breakers are sized for the wiring
[17:19:34] <andypugh> Frank_5: Basically you use two contactors. One feeds the drives through a power resistor (sized to handle charging the bus caps in a few seconds) then once the bus voltage is right, you switch in a second contactor that is a direct feed.
[17:19:53] <roycroft> you would likely have to do some rewiring in order to change out the breaker
[17:19:59] <Frank_5> enleth: really? is that the function of "first torque limit" and second torque limit? heh now im getting happier
[17:20:00] <RedneckZee> http://www.sandman.com/IMAGES/WaxedStringSample2.jpg
[17:20:05] <RedneckZee> christ this cable lacing looks ugly
[17:20:07] <andypugh> With some drives and LinuxCNC you can handle that in HAL, becsue the drives report-back bus voltage.
[17:20:07] <Frank_5> i thought i had to change my servos for smaller steppers
[17:20:10] * RedneckZee likes zip ties
[17:20:21] <enleth> Frank_5: and if you limit their power, they will just perform as well as smaller servos that fit within your building's supply limit
[17:20:30] <pcw_home> steppers _will_ have higher average power
[17:20:32] <gregcnc> Zee it's like starting in 5th gear, engine can't make full power because RPM is low regardless of how much torque you have
[17:20:33] <roycroft> that's not cable lacing
[17:20:39] <pcw_home> (very wasteful)
[17:20:41] <roycroft> that's tying knots in pieces of string
[17:20:51] <enleth> Frank_5: but if you move or decide to upgrade the building's uplink, you'll still have bigger servos
[17:21:19] <RedneckZee> anyway youre not sizing the wire for power.
[17:21:22] <RedneckZee> youre sizing it for amps
[17:21:24] <andypugh> My latest bit of cable lacing was rather spoiled by the fat resolver and Cat5 cables: https://picasaweb.google.com/108164504656404380542/Holbrook#6289136202698936898
[17:21:26] <Frank_5> the thing is that,, sooner or later i think i will have to, im already planing on a plasma table
[17:21:28] <Frank_5> hehe
[17:21:30] <RedneckZee> and i was told here repeatidly id neverr hit that
[17:21:33] <RedneckZee> and i hit it regularly
[17:21:46] <RedneckZee> i'm glad i sized the wire for peak current
[17:21:59] <gregcnc> the wire still wouldn't burn up
[17:21:59] <root-x> I put a soft start for my toroidal transformer and now not have problems with the breakers take down. my softstart costs $7
[17:22:03] <RedneckZee> wouldnt
[17:22:05] <pcw_home> Frank_5: You can limit the power by simply limiting the maximum speed and accelrration
[17:22:06] <RedneckZee> i totally agree
[17:22:12] <RedneckZee> but if you want to follow standard
[17:22:16] <RedneckZee> you gotta size it for peak
[17:22:25] <RedneckZee> if really interested, i can get the exact ul standard from work
[17:22:45] <andypugh> Frank_5: FWIW I talked about soft-start circuits with one of the LinuxCNC devs who works for a company that supply very large motors, and they frequently use a soft-start scheme like I described.
[17:23:02] <Frank_5> pcw_home: so that means that when drives are turned on (was planing on only 1 contactor) they do not draw 30 amps each right?
[17:23:36] <XXCoder> what is most "normal" alum alloy?
[17:23:41] <pcw_home> If they are AC powered drives, they will have a soft start circuit built in
[17:23:41] <XXCoder> 2040?
[17:23:47] <andypugh> The motors won’t. The bus caps will, momentarily.
[17:23:48] <Frank_5> anyway, now im more calmed than before, i got nervous
[17:23:56] <Frank_5> that they wouldnt work
[17:23:59] <pcw_home> so no they will not draw 30A
[17:24:18] <XXCoder> dunno about servos but dont steppers use max power when holding?
[17:24:27] <andypugh> XXCoder: Yes
[17:24:30] <gregcnc> no
[17:24:34] <pcw_home> max current (not max power)
[17:24:36] <andypugh> Maybe :-)
[17:24:44] <enleth> Frank_5: they will only draw what's needed at the moment and you can limit that by limiting speed/torque in software even if the drives don't have a direct limit setting
[17:24:57] <gregcnc> full current but same as servo not full power because voltage is low
[17:25:01] <enleth> Frank_5: but if they do, use that
[17:25:01] <Frank_5> andypugh: the idea sounds awesome andy, i will definetively give it a try, i started doing the schematic diagram today
[17:25:22] <XXCoder> I cant figure which aluminium alloy is most "normal"
[17:25:30] <gregcnc> common?
[17:25:33] <jdh> 6061
[17:25:34] <XXCoder> yeah
[17:25:37] <enleth> XXCoder: 6061
[17:25:41] <XXCoder> ok thanks
[17:25:49] <pcw_home> gregcnc: exactly, thats why the end of a XYZ G0 move is often the point of highest power
[17:26:43] <pcw_home> ( end of velocity ramp I mean, because maximum speed and maximum acceleration)
[17:27:01] <gregcnc> right that what I was thinking
[17:27:28] <Frank_5> pcw_home: i mailed mesa for 2 cards, but i have a family member going to usa in 3 months, is it posible to get it delivered/arriving, when he gets to the hotel? maybe i should ask this in private sry
[17:29:04] <pcw_home> probably, we have caught up mainly and can typically deliver with a day or 2 of order date
[17:29:34] * RedneckZee looked at my wiring notes
[17:29:45] <RedneckZee> i sized to cont current
[17:29:46] <RedneckZee> not peak
[17:30:03] <Frank_5> awesome
[17:30:50] <roycroft> if you have a slow-blow fuse or slow-trip breaker sizing to continuous current is usually fine
[17:31:06] <RedneckZee> yes
[17:31:12] <RedneckZee> im using cc time delay fuses
[17:31:30] <RedneckZee> ive only blown the fuse when i have blown the drive
[17:31:33] <RedneckZee> =/
[17:31:53] <enleth> actually even a
[17:31:56] <enleth> damn
[17:32:02] <enleth> even a B type breaker might be fine
[17:32:05] <Tom_itx> zee, why you bein all redneck today?
[17:32:11] <malcom2073> Today?
[17:32:15] <Tom_itx> hah
[17:32:17] <RedneckZee> bought a truck
[17:32:18] <malcom2073> :P
[17:32:18] <RedneckZee> :)
[17:32:24] <enleth> they will allow for 3x the rated current for 100ms or so
[17:32:30] <malcom2073> With knobby tires and big chrome bumpers?
[17:32:36] <RedneckZee> no
[17:32:37] <RedneckZee> i hate chrome
[17:32:41] <jdh> gun rack?
[17:32:45] <RedneckZee> but knobby tires are in the works
[17:32:47] <Tom_itx> come with a greentooth gal too?
[17:32:47] <RedneckZee> gun rack is in the works
[17:32:50] <malcom2073> Missing the tailgate?
[17:33:05] <malcom2073> You southern canadians have a redneck flag like we do here?
[17:33:05] <jdh> one door painted primer gray?
[17:33:13] <_methods> truck nuts
[17:33:15] <Tom_itx> or missing
[17:33:51] <Tom_itx> did you get it to haul off the subaru in?
[17:33:57] <RedneckZee> http://images.dealer.com/autodata/ca/640/color/2016/CAC60TOT091A0/0040.jpg
[17:33:59] <RedneckZee> looks like it
[17:33:59] <RedneckZee> no
[17:34:02] <RedneckZee> subaru is traded in
[17:34:06] <roycroft> i need to paint my pickup
[17:34:15] <malcom2073> that's like... the minivan of redneck trucks
[17:34:25] <JT-Shop> crumb I'm out of c clamps
[17:34:30] <roycroft> i want to do a hippie paint job on it
[17:34:40] <roycroft> because i'm a hippie and i live in eugene
[17:34:49] <roycroft> i can't decide on the base color though
[17:35:03] <roycroft> i really like forest service brown - i think that would be great for a pickup
[17:35:29] <jdh> uhm, that's a toyota, not a truck.
[17:35:38] <Tom_itx> xactly
[17:35:42] <malcom2073> jdh: +1
[17:35:47] <roycroft> my pickup is a toyota
[17:35:58] <roycroft> and you'll note that i never referred to it as a truck :)
[17:36:13] <malcom2073> Toy Yoda
[17:36:32] <RedneckZee> call it whatever the fuck you want
[17:36:36] <RedneckZee> as long as you dont call it a subaru
[17:36:37] <RedneckZee> i'm happy
[17:36:40] <Tom_itx> he just did
[17:36:45] <malcom2073> No you're right, wouldn't insult subaru that way
[17:36:52] <RedneckZee> lol
[17:36:53] * Tom_itx snickers
[17:36:58] <RedneckZee> youre comparing a subaru to toyota
[17:37:01] <RedneckZee> the joke is on you :)
[17:37:19] <malcom2073> Jokes on you, I've never owned either :-D
[17:37:28] <RedneckZee> heres one company that developed lean manufacturing
[17:37:30] <roycroft> a toyota pickup is closer to being a truck than to being a buick skylark
[17:37:36] <RedneckZee> and another that can't even build a fucking engine in 2010.
[17:37:55] <roycroft> mine's an 88
[17:37:56] <roycroft> with a 22r
[17:38:11] <RedneckZee> roycroft: this thing has 16 injectors lol
[17:38:16] <RedneckZee> direct port and multiport
[17:38:18] <RedneckZee> it swaps between em
[17:38:19] <roycroft> what's an injector? :P
[17:38:27] <RedneckZee> 22 mpg
[17:38:33] <RedneckZee> pretty much same as subaru but i can run 87 octane now
[17:38:35] <RedneckZee> instead of 94
[17:39:00] <RedneckZee> i got my heated seats, mirrors, hooray
[17:39:00] <RedneckZee> :D
[17:39:10] <roycroft> wait
[17:39:12] <Tom_itx> u ain't no redneck
[17:39:18] <roycroft> you just bought a vehicle that you're calling a "truck"
[17:39:28] <roycroft> and now you say this vehicle has heated seats?
[17:39:42] <jdh> chevy/ford/dodge could be redneck.
[17:39:47] <RedneckZee> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pickup_truck
[17:39:50] <RedneckZee> wiki doesn't like
[17:39:51] <RedneckZee> lie
[17:39:54] <RedneckZee> dont make a fool of yoruself
[17:39:55] <RedneckZee> ty
[17:40:12] <enleth> if you're real redneck, your seats should be heated by the rage agains anything not American
[17:40:16] <enleth> and nothing else
[17:40:19] <enleth> *against
[17:40:24] <roycroft> well
[17:40:38] <roycroft> the rage against anything you *think* is not american
[17:40:41] <JT-Shop> my BlueWing has heated seats...
[17:40:51] <RedneckZee> https://youtu.be/19BNRvuNLWE?t=104
[17:40:52] <RedneckZee> this sold me
[17:40:53] <Tom_itx> for ole farts
[17:40:55] <Tom_itx> :)
[17:40:55] <RedneckZee> on the 2016 model
[17:41:09] <roycroft> bigrigs are allowed to have heated seats
[17:41:13] <roycroft> but nothing smaller
[17:41:45] <andypugh> You should all buy Ford to keep me in a job. I promise to waste my salary on machine tools.
[17:41:52] <roycroft> although the thing that really disqualifies a vehicle as a truck is an automatic transmission
[17:42:05] <RedneckZee> roycroft: logic fail
[17:42:05] <RedneckZee> lol
[17:42:18] <Tom_itx> andypugh as long as you keep us fed with good videos n pics
[17:42:25] <malcom2073> "No true truck"
[17:42:28] <malcom2073> hehe
[17:42:43] <XXCoder> found on road dead
[17:42:52] <enleth> roycroft: are you saying people in the US can drive manuals?
[17:42:55] <XXCoder> fix or repair daily
[17:43:07] <Tom_itx> XXCoder they come with heated tailgates now did you know?
[17:43:10] <malcom2073> I still laugh at people that actually think mfg makes a difference prior to 100k miles
[17:43:25] <Tom_itx> so when you're pushing it in the winter you won't freeze your hands
[17:43:25] <XXCoder> Tom_itx: what is it supposed to do?
[17:43:30] <roycroft> while i'll reiterate that i'm an atypical usian, i've been driving manual transmission vehicles all my life
[17:44:00] <XXCoder> auto for me, I suck on manual
[17:44:17] <roycroft> but i'll add this, enleth
[17:44:28] <roycroft> a bonus for me is that nobody ever asks to borrow my pickup
[17:44:29] <RedneckZee> malcom2073: certainly did in my case
[17:44:30] <RedneckZee> :)
[17:44:33] <roycroft> because they don't know how to drive it
[17:44:35] <roycroft> :)
[17:45:05] <roycroft> so there is at least partial truth in your belief
[17:45:22] <roycroft> i can teach anybody to drive a stick in 15 minutes
[17:45:25] <roycroft> but i don't advertise that
[17:45:28] <andypugh> The truck I drive has no synchromesh either, you need to double de-clkutch
[17:45:28] <RedneckZee> its not hard at all
[17:45:57] <Tom_itx> i remember those days
[17:46:04] <roycroft> the old volkswagen manual transmissions don't have a synchro for first gear
[17:46:10] <RedneckZee> haha
[17:46:14] <RedneckZee> crunch crunch
[17:46:14] <roycroft> so you have to double clutch to get into first
[17:46:23] <enleth> OTOH, aren't many modern big rigs basically automatic with manual override?
[17:46:30] <andypugh> The annoyance with that truck is that on a hill you often can’t get out of first gear, because the road speed drops faster than the flywheel spins down.
[17:46:31] <RedneckZee> enleth: yes
[17:47:00] <roycroft> so don't drive it in scotland
[17:47:12] <andypugh> (And first gear on that vehicle is good for about 6mph)
[17:47:19] <roycroft> except in the southeast
[17:47:40] <RedneckZee> so my car is on order right now
[17:47:49] <RedneckZee> when it is in and i bring my car in to drop off
[17:47:55] <RedneckZee> am i supposed to fill the gas to full?
[17:47:57] <RedneckZee> and they do the same for me?
[17:48:04] <Tom_itx> take it empty
[17:48:08] * RedneckZee has never traded in before
[17:48:09] <Tom_itx> and expect full
[17:48:15] <RedneckZee> lol
[17:48:25] <Tom_itx> it's just good negotiation
[17:48:39] <roycroft> you're spending thousands of dollars on your new vehicle
[17:48:48] <roycroft> neither you nor the dealer should worry about a bit of fuel
[17:48:51] <Tom_itx> they're raping you anyway
[17:48:57] <andypugh> They won’t expect a full tank on a trade-in.
[17:49:00] <malcom2073> They're raping might as well give you a full tank
[17:49:06] <malcom2073> that's the equivalant to asking for lube
[17:49:10] <roycroft> takt it in with whatever amount of fuel happens to be in the tank
[17:49:18] <RedneckZee> the rape is worth every bit to me considering i know how the car has been handled
[17:49:21] <andypugh> >
[17:49:27] <jdh> they don't expect anything on the tradein
[17:49:29] <Tom_itx> i did a deal once where even the owner of the dealership wouldn't fill the tank
[17:49:33] <roycroft> and drive away from the dealer with whatever amount of fuel happens to be in the tank
[17:49:41] <RedneckZee> plus a similar truck 2014 model with 25k miles
[17:49:42] <andypugh> <jocular> Ask them to transfer the fuel from the old car to the new car
[17:49:43] <roycroft> make sure you know where there's a filling station nearby, just in case
[17:49:46] <jdh> and if you aren't giving it to them on the day you negotiate, they can change teh amount
[17:49:46] <RedneckZee> was going for 4k less
[17:49:50] <RedneckZee> so not worth buying used
[17:50:00] <RedneckZee> andypugh: ROFL i like that idea
[17:50:25] <RedneckZee> jdh i already signed the paperwork
[17:50:26] <Tom_itx> including the acumulated rust
[17:50:28] <roycroft> they would probably agree to do so, for a $100 fuel transfer fee
[17:50:29] <RedneckZee> just waiting for my car to come in
[17:50:36] <RedneckZee> car/truck
[17:50:37] <RedneckZee> whatever
[17:50:40] <RedneckZee> pick up
[17:50:41] <RedneckZee> suv
[17:50:54] <Tom_itx> 4 wheeled non subaru
[17:50:55] <malcom2073> crossover pickup
[17:50:59] <RedneckZee> i like that last one
[17:51:04] <RedneckZee> but then it has a subaru in there
[17:51:05] <RedneckZee> and it ruins it
[17:51:05] <RedneckZee> :{
[17:51:10] <jdh> I want cooled seats on my next vehicle
[17:51:30] <Tom_itx> jdh, sit on a block of ice
[17:51:33] <RedneckZee> haha
[17:51:36] <malcom2073> Cooled seats are amazing
[17:51:38] <RedneckZee> fuck im so excited
[17:51:41] <RedneckZee> i can finally get an atv
[17:51:45] <malcom2073> My expedition has them
[17:51:46] <RedneckZee> and do shit ive wanted to do for a long time
[17:51:48] <RedneckZee> move my canoe and stuff
[17:52:03] <RedneckZee> last time i was this happy was when i first drove the rx7
[17:52:13] <Tom_itx> gonna move down by redneckpete now?
[17:52:21] <RedneckZee> no
[17:52:22] <andypugh> RedneckZee: The way to move a canoe is tradititionally by use of a river
[17:52:28] <RedneckZee> andypugh: lol
[17:52:35] <malcom2073> andypugh: But then all his trendy canoe friends won't see him
[17:52:41] <malcom2073> he's gotta drive it through the city
[17:52:57] <andypugh> Ah, it’s like a Harley Davidson?
[17:53:05] <RedneckZee> http://imgur.com/NjSpIH1
[17:53:13] <RedneckZee> i think the taco can handle this
[17:53:15] <RedneckZee> :D
[17:53:17] <malcom2073> andypugh: best damn clothing store that ever sold bikes
[17:53:24] <Tom_itx> nothing compares to a ner-a-car though
[17:53:26] <RedneckZee> andypugh: those are the types of roads..
[17:53:33] <RedneckZee> about 70 km of it before i can even unload the canoe
[17:53:51] <roycroft> the proper way to move a canoe around here is on top of a suburu 4wd with bernie stickers on the back
[17:54:28] <andypugh> I was going to suggest an enduro bike for that type of road, but those are sub-optimal for moving a canoe.
[17:54:30] <malcom2073> roycroft: Hence my confusion at z getting rid of the subaru
[17:54:57] <roycroft> i sometimes wonder if suburu offer canoes as a dealer-insgtalled option
[17:55:08] <andypugh> Messing about in Wales it is astonishing how much faster bikes are than 4x4 cars on the rough stuff
[17:55:56] <roycroft> really, the only disagreement in these parts about canoe moving is thule vs yakima racks
[17:56:45] <RedneckZee> http://cdn2-b.examiner.com/sites/default/files/styles/image_content_width/hash/23/2f/232fb98fdd326508af4fa42ead5cc040.jpg?itok=_-GS5DIb
[17:56:46] * RedneckZee smiles
[17:56:52] <roycroft> and there is the occasional canoe-laden suburu with a hillary sticker
[17:56:58] <roycroft> but there are outliers everywhere
[17:57:23] <JT-Shop> mountain bikes?
[17:58:25] <jdh> thule of course
[17:58:38] <roycroft> yakima are pretty popular around here
[17:58:45] <RedneckZee> http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/attachments/tow-rigs-trailers/684834d1342566442-towing-tacoma-img_2263.jpg
[17:58:45] <RedneckZee> rofl
[17:59:07] <roycroft> the roof rack for my new beetle is thule
[17:59:11] <jdh> http://static4.businessinsider.com/image/5616d99269bedd825f07c190/isis-loves-toyota-trucks.jpg
[17:59:14] <RedneckZee> roycroft:
[17:59:25] <roycroft> but that's only because a sporting goods chain closed right after i bought the car and i got a great deal on it
[17:59:27] <RedneckZee> holy shit you drive a beetle and you were giving me shit about calling my toyota a truck
[17:59:30] <RedneckZee> GAHAHAHAHHAHAAHHAHAA
[17:59:53] <roycroft> i never called my beetle a truck either
[18:00:46] <roycroft> the beetle had a tdi engine though
[18:01:42] * roycroft wonders if his shop is tolerable yet
[18:01:47] <roycroft> it's 34 degrees outside
[18:01:59] <roycroft> which means the shop was more like 40-42 when i went out there this afternoon
[18:01:59] <JT-Shop> http://gnipsel.com/images/blast-cabinet/Blast%20Cabinet%2010.JPG
[18:02:06] <roycroft> i've had the a/c on for over an hour now
[18:02:30] <andypugh> I know this road fairly well. An enduro bike (or, in fact, a mountain bike, on the downhill bits) can do 20-30mph without too much bother. Mainly because they can stay upright. https://youtu.be/bb8wNOcHNXg?t=1m35s
[18:03:18] <andypugh> I have to confess I had _real_ problems getting the bike _up_ 4:10
[18:03:22] <roycroft> welding/blasting/grinding in the same room as turning machinery?
[18:08:15] <andypugh> Some of us only have the one room.
[18:08:36] <roycroft> i have to use one of my shops for multiple purposes
[18:08:42] <roycroft> but i have big tarps to cover things
[18:08:55] <roycroft> i do brewing/woodworking/machining in one shop
[18:09:07] <roycroft> grinding/welding/blasting in another
[18:09:16] <roycroft> and i set up a temporary paint booth when needed
[18:09:29] <JT-Shop> I brew in the Florida room
[18:09:45] <JT-Shop> your song for the day https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DgJwm9erBaQ
[18:10:12] * roycroft heads out to see if the shop is tolerable yet
[18:10:24] <roycroft> my office and my shop are the only two air-conditioned rooms in my house
[18:10:47] <roycroft> and it's up to 35 outside now
[18:10:47] <JT-Shop> and you live?
[18:10:58] <roycroft> in western oregon, if that's what you're asking
[18:11:05] <roycroft> and we've set an all-time high for this day
[18:11:07] <JT-Shop> yep
[18:11:21] <Duc> any one play with 5 axis linuxcnc. Normal XYZ with a encoder on the knee and a rotary table?
[18:11:28] <JT-Shop> down here in swamp east missouri...
[18:11:50] <Tom_itx> JT-Shop how'd you fill that shop up so fast?
[18:11:52] <JT-Shop> lots of folks have
[18:12:02] <roycroft> our all time high for the month of june is 39 degrees
[18:12:14] <JT-Shop> I'm not sure one day it had an echo and ...
[18:12:20] <roycroft> we may get close to that tomorrow, and it's only the beginning of the month
[18:12:34] <andypugh> Duc: Not sure what you mean by encoder on the knee
[18:13:23] <Duc> andypugh: placed a linear encoder on the bridgeport knee so I can get a read out on its position. Later on I may added a motor to it
[18:13:45] <andypugh> That’s sort-of 4.5 axes then
[18:13:57] <JT-Shop> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YjryaU7xKqU
[18:14:02] <andypugh> (you could actually connect both encoders to Z feedback)
[18:14:28] <JT-Shop> that's an interesting thought
[18:14:48] <Tom_itx> JT-Shop done any oops programming?
[18:14:50] <Duc> andypugh: yes 4.5 axis. The bridgeport only has 5 inches of travel on the Z and is a pain when you which to longer tools
[18:15:06] <JT-Shop> a little
[18:15:20] <JT-Shop> Duc: know what you mean I have BP series 1
[18:15:50] <Tom_itx> fun trying to convert inline code to oops for sure
[18:16:14] <JT-Shop> lol I need to get past the start line first
[18:16:17] <Duc> I couldnt resist installing a Heidenhain glass scale for 50 dollars
[18:16:38] <Tom_itx> i'm struggling on it a bit
[18:17:35] <JT-Shop> I'm just glad it's Saturday night and I'm not the chef de jour
[18:18:08] <JT-Shop> I wonder sometimes about oop if it is really needed in many cases
[18:18:35] <Duc> Im hoping this will save a oops later on when I have to change knee height for a different tool length
[18:20:03] <JT-Shop> I've only had to move the knee for different parts...
[18:20:49] <Duc> drill cycles I have to move it alot
[18:20:56] * JT-Shop wanders inside
[18:21:23] <JT-Shop> I use screw machine drills...
[18:21:47] <Duc> mounted into a ER32 collet?
[18:22:40] <JT-Shop> I have quick switch so I can set each tool
[18:23:08] <Frank_5> anyone knows a good pdf about motor sizing? i wanna know how much power my machine will want to draw, thanks
[18:23:20] <Frank_5> cant find one with rack and pinion
[18:23:30] <Duc> the system wants to start then failes with a "emcTraSetAxes failing: axismask=10f"
[18:23:56] <Duc> the system wants to start then failes with a "emcTraSetAxes failing: axis=4 mask=10f"
[18:24:27] <andypugh> Duc: It should be possible to set things up so that you can wind the knee up and down and the tool follows it at a constant height above the table. You might have to actively drive the soft-limit pins, though.
[18:25:30] <Duc> andypugh: How would you switch between different length tools then?
[18:25:37] <andypugh> Duc: Do you have an INI section for [AXIS_4]
[18:26:05] <andypugh> Duc: The tool table ought to be able to cope.
[18:26:14] <andypugh> But I am just speculating.
[18:26:45] <andypugh> The knee is aoften set up as a W axis, but that is only partially helpful.
[18:28:09] <Duc> The knee I have as W right now
[18:28:16] <Duc> grabbing files now to upload them
[18:28:33] <andypugh> JT-Shop: Strangely drawn schoolgirls and very well-drawn motorcycles. It’s rather odd: http://www.crunchyroll.com/bakuon/episode-1-club-registration-702505
[18:30:00] <JT-Shop> lol
[18:30:44] <JT-Shop> the opening scene reminds me of the Sand Pebbles
[18:31:25] <enleth> Frank_5: someone linked to a nice PDF on that a few days ago
[18:31:30] <enleth> will try to find it
[18:32:18] <Duc> https://forum.linuxcnc.org/forum/12-milling/29997-bridgeport-boss5-stepper-to-servo?start=20#75511
[18:32:36] <Duc> as the ini file and hal. I need to run to dinner for a bit with the wife
[18:39:46] <roycroft> it's 39 in the shop
[18:39:48] <roycroft> i could not stand it
[18:41:07] <Duc> andypugh: nevermind I guess we are having PB&J so im not leaving
[18:47:25] <andypugh> [TRAJ]AXES = 4 and COORDINATES= XYZWA is inconsistent. If you have a W axis you need AXES=9 and also need a dummy [AXIS_N] section for all 9 axes. There is not a good reason for this, it’s just the way it is. It’s fixed in the JA branch.
[18:49:07] <XXCoder> not bad video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y1zbE21Pzl0
[18:49:12] <XXCoder> captions is junk thoughh
[18:50:33] <Duc> so the axis letters have to follow whats layed out in the INI page for it to work
[18:50:59] <Duc> I guess soon I will try to add all the blanks
[18:51:51] <Duc> but AXIS will display XYZABCUVW readouts?
[18:52:25] <andypugh> No, luckily Axis only displays the COORDINATES entries
[18:53:17] <Duc> ok had me worried
[18:54:19] <Duc> I wonder if the Gcode would pause till the W position is correct
[18:55:37] <XXCoder> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K53cPGRE1Kk nice too
[21:44:33] <RedneckZee> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cyxd91NzMUw
[21:44:34] <RedneckZee> wow
[21:44:34] <RedneckZee> lol
[21:44:38] <RedneckZee> thats kinda cool
[21:44:45] <XXCoder> looking
[21:45:20] <XXCoder> wood drill on alum?
[21:46:02] <RedneckZee> yea
[21:46:14] <XXCoder> crazy
[21:46:24] <XXCoder> worked but I can see how rough its running
[21:52:54] <Tom_L> too much side load on the shank
[21:53:14] <Tom_L> i bet it cut oversize
[21:53:19] <XXCoder> yeah
[21:53:27] <XXCoder> its runout probably was HUGE
[21:53:52] <Tom_L> RedneckZee, not cool... kinda stupid imo
[22:01:38] <XXCoder> hmm
[22:01:41] <XXCoder> I got bit issue
[22:01:55] <XXCoder> is it safe for EM to pluge cut on side of hole
[22:02:05] <XXCoder> in order to sink bolt head
[22:02:33] <XXCoder> hole is 5.3 mm
[22:02:47] <XXCoder> I want to make 9 mm countersink
[22:02:54] <XXCoder> I have 6 mm tool
[22:11:58] <Tom_L> if it's a centercutting EM
[22:12:09] <XXCoder> center dont hit stock
[22:12:18] <Tom_L> should be ok
[22:12:27] <Tom_L> plunge 1/2 normal feed
[22:13:02] <XXCoder> countersink is 9 mm, hole is 5.3 mm, there is ~2.5 mm roughly area where em cuts downwards
[22:25:12] <XXCoder> Tom_L: http://dpaste.com/1ZSGVD9
[22:25:51] <XXCoder> does it make sense?