#linuxcnc | Logs for 2016-05-06

[02:20:41] <Deejay> moin
[02:30:45] <Vq> Good morning
[05:26:52] <XXCoder> did anyone have starky answer to rootb_n's question heh
[05:28:10] <malcom2073> XXCoder: I would've told him it would cost him significantly more than $40 to get those made heh
[05:28:25] <XXCoder> <RootB_n> anyone here a machinist?
[05:28:38] <XXCoder> thats last thing I saw
[05:29:05] <malcom2073> [21:17:53] <RootB_n> Uhm, I'm trying to get this part made
[05:29:05] <malcom2073> [21:17:58] <RootB_n> https://improbable-construct.myshopify.com/products/shapeoko-2-mid-span-support
[05:29:09] <malcom2073> That's pretty much what he wanted
[05:29:29] <XXCoder> lol
[05:29:36] <XXCoder> $5 if he does it himself
[05:29:46] <XXCoder> or maybe less.
[05:29:54] <XXCoder> shop rates its far more heh
[06:04:35] <XXCoder> malcom2073: whats the hand controller for cnc called
[06:04:44] <XXCoder> has selectors and encoder wheel
[06:04:45] <malcom2073> pendant?
[06:04:50] <XXCoder> ah thanks
[06:05:27] <malcom2073> np
[06:05:43] <XXCoder> I'm buying one
[06:05:48] <XXCoder> keyboard control sucks
[06:06:02] <XXCoder> spoiled by machines at work LOL
[06:08:31] <malcom2073> Haha yeah
[06:13:38] <XXCoder> uhh
[06:13:43] <XXCoder> wish I'm an electrician
[06:13:53] <XXCoder> encoder wheel is lot cheaper than prices I'm seeting
[06:13:56] <XXCoder> seeing
[06:14:00] <XXCoder> $90 to $100
[06:14:13] <malcom2073> Sounds about right for a cheap pendant
[06:14:26] <XXCoder> encoder wheel 5 bucks
[06:14:35] <malcom2073> Where are you finding an encoder wheel for $5?
[06:14:47] <XXCoder> hm someone here linked to one long while ago
[06:14:51] <XXCoder> may have misremembered
[06:16:07] <_methods> hah damn nice spacex pulled it off again
[06:16:41] <malcom2073> Eh, $20: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Eletronic-Hand-Wheel-Pulse-Encoder-100PPR-4-Terminal-CNC-Mill-Router-Manual-/181514188369
[06:16:43] <malcom2073> Not bad though
[06:16:51] <malcom2073> Probably feels cheap as hell though
[06:16:52] <XXCoder> indeed.
[06:17:06] <XXCoder> well
[06:17:06] <malcom2073> XXCoder: You don't have to be an electrician. Wire that into your parallel port and let HAL to the magic for you
[06:17:10] <XXCoder> my machine is tiny
[06:17:19] <XXCoder> all I really need is wheel
[06:17:23] <XXCoder> I can click axis on pc
[06:17:29] <XXCoder> true
[06:17:59] <malcom2073> I want a wheel, jog increment select, axis select, and axis touchoff buttons on a pendant
[06:21:57] <XXCoder> indeed
[06:25:48] <Sync> XXCoder: you want it on the pendant, otherwise you will hate your life very quickly
[06:26:00] <XXCoder> indeed
[06:26:06] <XXCoder> I probably will just buy existing one
[06:26:17] <XXCoder> though I wonder about reliablity of usb ones
[06:26:25] <malcom2073> You get what you pay for
[06:26:33] <malcom2073> Though I have zero experience with pendants heh
[06:36:25] <XXCoder> well
[06:36:35] <XXCoder> I could use my nes usb gamepad for that
[06:36:37] <XXCoder> much smaller
[06:37:11] <XXCoder> + for usual X/Y, and A and B button for Z
[06:38:25] <Sync> nothing beats a nice smooth and heavy encoder to turn
[06:38:34] <XXCoder> yeah
[06:38:42] <XXCoder> I use em all time at work
[06:38:54] <XXCoder> some is bit annoyingly fixed to control board
[06:38:59] <XXCoder> and some has actual pendants
[06:39:47] <Sync> you mean, your boss was too cheap to buy the pendant
[06:40:02] <XXCoder> Sync: if machine supports it at all
[06:40:06] <XXCoder> most machines is too old.
[06:40:11] <XXCoder> like fadal 88
[06:40:27] <Sync> nah, they usually support it
[06:40:33] <Sync> it would be really uncommon if they did not
[06:43:29] <XXCoder> interesting
[06:43:38] <XXCoder> well usually one on board works fine
[06:43:51] <XXCoder> though sometimes its bit annoying when I need a real close look
[08:21:51] <Polymorphism> http://www.omiocnc.com/products/x6-2200.html
[08:21:51] <Polymorphism> hey all
[08:22:00] <Polymorphism> omio just updated their whole line of controllers///cncs
[08:22:06] <Polymorphism> can anyone comment on this new controller?
[08:22:31] <Polymorphism> if this update is nice, this might be the push I needed to just go with this turn key option
[08:23:55] <jdh> buy one
[08:24:38] <Polymorphism> you didnt even look
[08:24:41] <Polymorphism> the entire controller has changed
[08:24:45] <Polymorphism> and runs gcode itself now or something
[08:24:54] <Polymorphism> this is a major change that affects if I should still consider this unit
[08:25:05] <Polymorphism> maybe it means nowe the decision is clear! looks like it might not be tied to wiondows + mach3 anymore
[08:27:32] <Polymorphism> wtf, lots of changes
[08:27:36] <Polymorphism> the work area is different now
[08:27:38] <Polymorphism> more x less y
[08:27:45] <Polymorphism> and z has been reduced to 80mm travel
[08:27:47] <Polymorphism> still 140mm clearance
[08:29:48] <Polymorphism> theyre trying to tell me in the 3d printing channel that a 2.2kw 120v spindle will blow fuses
[08:29:57] <Polymorphism> I was under the impression it wouldnt be using the full 2.2kw
[08:30:00] <Polymorphism> possibly ever
[08:30:44] <jdh> they are chinese watts
[08:31:27] <gregcnc> just make sure you plug it into a 2.2kw outlet
[08:31:39] <Polymorphism> If my house burns down I'm holding you accountable gregcnc
[08:32:00] <gregcnc> as long as you have a 2.2 chinese kW outlet things will be super
[08:36:15] <Polymorphism> so whaty do tyou think of the new controller gregcnc
[08:36:19] <Polymorphism> or are you the troll?
[08:36:30] <Polymorphism> Because this is not the same question I've been asking, nobody could argue that
[08:36:35] <Polymorphism> this is an entirely different controller now
[08:36:38] <Polymorphism> and new machine specs
[08:36:49] <Polymorphism> I was settled on this as my tyurn key option
[08:36:51] <Polymorphism> but now theyve changed it
[08:36:58] <Polymorphism> and I'm not sure where it stands anymore
[08:37:07] <gregcnc> I have no opinion about the control. I don't buy anything that new myself, let someone else figure out it doesn't work
[08:37:18] <Polymorphism> =\
[08:39:29] <gregcnc> if the company was known for very good support i might take a chance
[08:40:59] <Polymorphism> I think theyre known for the opposite
[08:41:09] <Polymorphism> some people have prompt replies, some dont get replies at all
[08:41:22] <Polymorphism> which does worry me, but if it works I could just deal with an issues on my own if they happen
[08:41:36] <Polymorphism> I doubt some guy in china can do much beyond ship a replacement part
[08:41:40] <archivist> why would any of use recommend a non linuxcnc thing
[08:42:05] <gregcnc> linuxcnc you can fix on your own because you set it up on your own
[08:42:05] <Polymorphism> ?
[08:42:17] <Polymorphism> it looks like its not windows or mach only anymore
[08:42:22] <Polymorphism> I figured linuxcnc would like it better now
[08:42:27] <Polymorphism> it appears to run gcode on the controller
[08:42:32] <Polymorphism> freeing it from requiring any pc
[08:42:48] <gregcnc> it doesn't use anything it's a stand alone control
[08:42:50] <archivist> no, if it has its own controller is is anti linuxcnc
[08:43:22] <Polymorphism> so its actually potentially worse that they changed the controller like that
[08:43:23] <Polymorphism> and not better
[08:43:33] <archivist> someone has not been learning, just looking at the pictures
[08:43:44] <Polymorphism> tha'ts not true
[08:43:45] <_methods> hahah
[08:43:46] <Polymorphism> I've learned a lot
[08:43:49] <Polymorphism> make a test for me
[08:43:49] <_methods> how many weeks is this now
[08:43:52] <Polymorphism> 6
[08:43:57] <Polymorphism> or 7
[08:44:04] <Polymorphism> too many
[08:44:15] <archivist> or elebentymillion
[08:44:30] <jdh> fail
[08:44:59] <Polymorphism> why would they have changed the z travel
[08:45:38] <Polymorphism> oh
[08:45:43] <Polymorphism> they are just writing it differently now
[08:45:51] <Polymorphism> if you remove the dust cover you still have the fuill 140mm z travel
[08:46:03] <Polymorphism> if anything its more honest now
[08:59:46] <Polymorphism> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=er416Ad3R1g&list=RDevBia_HRrv4
[08:59:52] <Polymorphism> (not cnc)
[09:00:10] <Polymorphism> going to go check out some 3d printers in person, as well as hopefully the cnc at a local school, bbl
[10:42:30] <monsterblabla> Hi whats up
[11:39:05] <Jymmm> VFD http://www.aliexpress.com/item/110V-1-5kw-VFD-Variable-Frequency-Drive-Inverter-VFD-Input-1or3HP-110V-Output-3HP-110V-frequency/32388091138.html
[11:40:31] <Jymmm> 220 VFD http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Free-shipping-2-2KW-380V-Frequency-Inverter-400HZ-VFD-VARIABLE-FREQUENCY-DRIVE-VFD/442419357.html
[11:44:51] <enleth> Jymmm: FYI I've got this on the bridgeport: http://aliexpress.com/item/GD10-2R2G-S2-B-Invt-Goodrive10-Series-Inverter-1-Phase-220V-240V-2-2KW-2200W-50Hz/1148062067.html?isOrigTitle=true
[11:45:59] <Jymmm> enleth: Cool I dont have anything that uses 220 or 3ph, so no need for a VFD, just passing on the info for those that might =)
[11:46:32] <enleth> there's a vector version too
[11:47:20] <enleth> overall I'm quite satisfied with this VFD, it could use more I/O but it's easy enough to integrate
[11:51:50] <awallin__> blah, no bids for my servo+drive yet... anyone??? :)
[11:51:51] <awallin__> www.ebay.de/itm/121973721621
[11:51:51] <awallin__> and
[11:51:51] <awallin__> www.ebay.de/itm/121973733946
[12:04:22] <unfy> inexpensive chinese 'lead screws' came in. 'T8' stuff. with some longer than most of the other seller's brass carriage nuts. there is some very slight visible lash in them. am at work and haven't been able to grab an indicator to find out the exact amount, yet.
[12:06:03] <archivist> use two nuts with an adjustment in between to remove the play
[12:07:00] <unfy> indeed. this was a purchase to find out what they're like. being inexpensive and all
[12:07:16] <unfy> "for the price", i'm fine with them.
[12:08:10] <unfy> basically, exploring / hands on / etc. i'm fine with integrating lash elimiation into the carriage.
[12:08:50] <archivist> older gear used springs for play removal
[12:09:38] <unfy> seen a lot of spring builds indeed. but then rigidity comes down to strength of spring ? i was gonna set up some screws to push/pull two nuts together or apart
[12:10:13] <unfy> or if there's a pre-built carriage adapter that does 'something' for it, then i was gonna just use that.
[12:10:35] <archivist> the springs can be very high rate (disc springs)
[12:11:48] <archivist> bah, have no cash and someone has obviously offered cash http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/252378330919
[12:12:42] <unfy> alright, busy busy at work, just wanted to give first impressions of the stuff
[12:12:49] <Sync> oh neat archivist
[12:12:51] <unfy> tnx again etc o/
[12:12:54] <Sync> I'd work with that
[12:13:40] <archivist> on one of my lathe lathes the force on the slide in is direct solid metal, the retract is by spring
[12:14:43] <CaptHindsight> disc spring rate/preload vs cutting force and spindle/gantry inertia
[12:15:15] <archivist> http://www.collection.archivist.info/searchv13.php?searchstr=bechler see last but one
[12:16:21] <archivist> slides tops off, springs in the slide bases
[12:19:27] <archivist> best thing about restoring old machines is discovering how things worked
[12:22:26] <gregcnc> virtual cnc? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vdLSYhMUoiE
[12:23:53] <archivist> do that with linuxcnc and the simulator
[12:28:43] <CaptHindsight> but it should deduct cash from your account when you crash it and make you stay 2 hours after work
[12:29:53] <maxcnc> hi from first summer day here in Germanyx
[12:29:56] <archivist> I have no cash
[12:30:42] <CaptHindsight> then it should make you have to read the backlog without any ignores
[12:31:12] <maxcnc> Jymmm: hyanyang spindle workes fine for now 2years here every day use
[12:31:26] <gregcnc> it should go down for a week until it can be fixed
[12:34:16] <archivist> unrealistic price error http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Societe-Genevoise-SIP-MUL-300-Universal-Length-Measuring-Machine-/152080215405
[12:35:23] <CaptHindsight> archivist: you should list your collection of machines all with an extra 0 on the end and see what sells
[12:36:08] <Sync> the price is actually not incredibly bad archivist
[12:36:09] <gregcnc> I looked at my half .com list today and saw a $100 book for 1.09. I hope it shows up
[12:37:10] <archivist> sync many thousands times my bank balance
[12:37:33] <archivist> it has been on there for some months
[12:39:13] <archivist> ew allowed to rust http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/A979-Horizontal-Omtimeter-OPTICAL-Measuring-TOOL-Metrology-OMT-Vintage-/291757203496
[12:41:15] <archivist> I could restore that, but not for that money
[12:42:23] <gregcnc> I was just reading about how if you raise the price of something gradually there is always someone out there who bites because they don't want to pay more
[12:42:59] <Sync> oh that's pretty neat archivist
[12:43:27] <archivist> I have a couple of OMT things, was a very good company
[13:12:06] <maxcnc> Gn8
[13:46:17] <Crom> sheeeshz when did the kernel source get to 9.5GB?
[14:05:41] <FinboySlick> Crom: Around year 2145.
[14:09:17] <MrSunshine_> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y-da3qg7bDk so finaly got the changes done to the machine .. now its running quite a bit better =)
[14:13:15] <awallin__> ever thought about a dust collector ? ;)
[14:14:21] <MrSunshine_> what is that ?'
[14:15:01] <MrSunshine_> that cut is in 22mm mdf =) 2 steps =)
[14:15:04] <MrSunshine_> wroom wroom =)
[14:15:23] <malcom2073> It's something that stops you from breathing the nasty stuff MDF is made of :)
[14:15:54] <MrSunshine_> mm sounds dangerous
[14:17:33] <Jymmm> MDF dust is explosive too =)
[14:20:21] <MrSunshine_> im going to add dust collection again .. right now im just testing some cutting for a friend =)
[14:20:28] <MrSunshine_> got some dustshield stuff to do still etc also =)
[14:56:30] <Jymmm> Was someone needing a USB-to-RS485 adapter?
[15:01:06] <enleth> have you found one?
[15:01:11] <enleth> they always come in handy
[15:09:02] <Crom> usb to rs485 isn't a dmx adapter?
[15:09:35] <MrSunshine_> enleth: yeah specialy when your bike breaks down in the woods
[15:30:08] <Jymmm> Crom: ?
[15:43:41] <_methods> did you say crom with your arnold voice
[15:43:43] <_methods> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBMY3VV5AMA
[15:59:46] * Jymmm is making a PC PS adapter to benchtop PS doohickey =)
[16:12:40] <Crom> hehe nah I was reading the Conan stories WAY back in the 70's
[16:14:29] <Crom> i only say 'Fuck you asshole' in a Awnold voice
[16:15:33] <Crom> wooo hit 43.47C
[16:15:34] <neckro23> live with me if you want to come
[16:22:19] <Deejay> gn8
[18:17:15] <andypugh> Nearly there. Both axes move, one axis homes. (Z needs me to drill the target hole for the sensor)
[18:17:16] <andypugh> https://picasaweb.google.com/108164504656404380542/Holbrook#6281710819317309698
[18:17:17] <andypugh> https://picasaweb.google.com/108164504656404380542/Holbrook#6281710922662065538
[18:22:23] <DaViruz> what a clean installation
[18:24:14] <Sync> zeeshan|2: did you see my amazing probe? :D
[18:25:09] <malcom2073> https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/2c/2nd_Ford_Probe_GT.jpg
[18:25:11] <malcom2073> Sync: ^^
[18:25:53] <Sync> no
[18:26:25] <malcom2073> hehe
[18:28:07] <andypugh> DaViruz: I have gone to considerable (excessive?) lengths to not have wires and motors on-display.
[18:28:41] <DaViruz> i'm glad you did, it looks great
[18:28:50] <Sync> should have gone for some higher quality encoders andypugh
[18:29:15] <DaViruz> original handwheels on the encoders would have been cool, though possibly not very practical
[18:30:03] <andypugh> I can change them pretty easily if I want to. I have no idea how coolant-proof those are, for a start.
[18:30:09] <malcom2073> andypugh: that's slick, I *really* like the keyboard
[18:30:52] <andypugh> I am half-expecting the Holbrook folks to think that the keyboard is the original threading table.
[18:31:01] <cradek> I love the position of the wheels
[18:31:10] <malcom2073> I thought it was a threading or gearing table at first heh
[18:31:14] <malcom2073> until I zoomed in
[18:31:41] <andypugh> This is the original threading table: https://picasaweb.google.com/108164504656404380542/Holbrook#6154759470807055490
[18:31:55] <andypugh> It took me _ages_ to find a keyboard nearly as small.
[18:32:02] <cradek> I'm a little surprised you have a keyboard at all
[18:32:07] <malcom2073> Nice, it does
[18:32:43] <DaViruz> oh, i didn't realize how much the carriage had changed
[18:32:49] <DaViruz> is that castings?
[18:32:56] <Sync> yes
[18:33:36] <andypugh> cradek: It will probably live out of the way and be taken out as and when needed for the things that need a keyboard, like editing files and googling for answers :-)
[18:34:17] <cradek> heh yeah
[18:34:42] <cradek> I guess I have a laptop two yards from my vmc with touchy and no keyboard/mouse
[18:34:50] <cradek> I edit there a lot
[18:35:54] <andypugh> DaViruz: The whole carriage below the slide-level is new, and the Z-feed box is also all-new. Iron castngs: https://picasaweb.google.com/108164504656404380542/Holbrook#6230479127730875154
[18:36:04] <malcom2073> Hand scraped?
[18:36:40] <DaViruz> the z-feed box i knew about!
[18:36:47] <andypugh> The slideways are all original. But I had to make a new Z-gib as the original had been lost, and that was hand-scraped.
[18:36:55] <malcom2073> nice
[18:37:14] <cradek> what amazing work
[18:37:38] <andypugh> I just hope it’s a good lathe after all this effort.
[18:38:03] <cradek> yikes, yeah
[18:41:43] <CaptHindsight> andypugh: how well were those cast? Did you notice any bubbles after machining them?
[18:41:45] <andypugh> And then I can try to sell the Chinese Lathe/mill. Which might actually be pretty useful to somebody making small stuff out of delrin and/or cheese.
[18:42:05] <andypugh> CaptHindsight: No porosity or inclusions at all.
[18:42:14] <CaptHindsight> nice
[18:43:00] <andypugh> There was quite a lot of flash, but all the casting faults were excess metal type ones, not the reverse.
[18:47:18] <Sync> andypugh: didn't you measure the geometry before retrofitting?
[18:47:28] <Sync> somebody here in germoney made the error
[18:47:46] <andypugh> How do you mean?
[18:47:55] <Sync> found out that the bed was worn by 15/100 after he retrofitted the thing
[18:48:30] <andypugh> My bed is a little worn. I need to see how much it matters. Re-scraping is something I know how to do. But would prefer not to have to.
[18:49:59] <andypugh> I couldn’t really tell when I got it because the Z gob had been lost.
[18:50:04] <andypugh> (Z gib)
[18:51:14] <andypugh> I probably only have £2000 in cash spent on the job. And an awful lot of time.
[18:51:45] <enleth> that's an interesting "only"
[18:53:22] <Sync> yeah the cash is not so bad
[18:53:49] <Sync> well, you don't really need the gib for testing the wear
[18:55:12] <andypugh> You do for testing it in the barn where you are buying it :-)
[18:57:47] <enleth> andypugh: heh, I was testing my bridgeport in a literal barn too to decide if it's worth buying
[18:57:59] <enleth> small piles of hay all over it and all
[18:58:46] <Sync> it's not a machine with just box ways, so you can move the carriage anyways
[18:59:09] <Sync> I took a straight edge, a knife edge and a precision angle with me when scouting out a lathe for a friend
[19:00:11] <andypugh> To be honest, lathes are very different things to mills. They can’t help but make things round, and they have to be pretty far-gone to not make them parallel too. It’s the fundamental geometry of the things.
[19:01:01] <enleth> but bed wear will get you unwanted diameter changes
[19:01:11] <andypugh> Something like this makes perfectly round things, after all. http://www.camdentownshed.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/01/pole-lathe-at-Green-Fair.jpg
[19:01:13] <enleth> or unwanted jamming
[19:01:39] <enleth> have you seen the Matthias Wandel's lathe?
[19:01:54] <Sync> well, you can get roundness errors if your bearings are shit, but yeah
[19:02:21] <Sync> but the diameter errors are easy to spot, and if it turns dishes or spheres in X
[19:02:39] <andypugh> Bed-wear gives you second-order diameter changes, it doesn’t affect the diameter directly, it changes the tool-height. (I guess it could rock the saddle fore and aft too)
[19:03:04] <enleth> yeah, tool height was exactly what I had in mind
[19:03:38] <enleth> second-order or not, that's bad and it's not a trivial fix
[19:04:32] <enleth> probably still much easier than doing the same thing with mill ways, but not trivial
[19:05:24] <andypugh> I have seen that wooden lathe, yes. It is one of those projects I don’t really “get” as he could use other materials, in many cases more easily.
[19:05:59] <enleth> I think he just makes a point of using wood for things not meant to be made of wood
[19:06:37] <enleth> and sometimes you wonder if they really weren't, like the belt sander of his, a really nice and useful design
[19:06:39] <andypugh> “And now, the wooden girlfriend, Pinocchionette”
[19:07:39] <Sync> yeah, me too andypugh
[19:07:54] <enleth> as soon as I get a table saw, I'm making that belt sander
[19:08:32] <andypugh> Yes, that looks handy. I use my hand-held 1/2” belt sander a lot.
[19:10:01] <andypugh> Mr Clickspring uses a bench version too. But I also rather like his filing machine. https://youtu.be/B8Y146v8HxE?list=PLZioPDnFPNsETq9h35dgQq80Ryx-beOli
[19:10:12] <enleth> incidentally, I do have the same scrollsaw Clickspring uses, and - well, you just mentioned him
[19:10:19] <enleth> anyway,
[19:10:36] <enleth> that scrollsaw with a good belt sander can do wonders, if you have the skills
[19:11:02] <enleth> and the Wandel's sander has replaceable belt backers that can be shaped
[19:12:06] <andypugh> Wandel and CLickspring both have really good production.
[19:12:50] <enleth> by the way, that scroll saw is not cheap, actually made in Germany and all
[19:13:25] <enleth> but what it's capable of is amazing
[19:13:30] <andypugh> Clickspring is definitly not afraid of paying for tools.
[19:14:00] <enleth> if you ever need one - it's manufactured by Hegner
[19:14:56] <andypugh> I often want one, then can’t see a space for one.
[19:15:27] <andypugh> Though getting rid of the Chinese LatheMill would help.
[19:15:48] <enleth> they make scrollsaws, sanders and wood lathes
[19:16:11] <enleth> of which scrollsaws are their primary business
[19:18:45] <andypugh> enleth: Making a belt sander would be much easier with 2” steel box and a welder.
[19:20:09] <enleth> I guess it wouldn't be for him, as he's experienced with wood, and less so with steel
[19:20:36] <andypugh> enleth: I was responding to your earlier plan to copy the design.
[19:21:36] <enleth> ah, well, I might do some mix-and-matching depending on what's at hand, but I'm actually more likely to get some extra plywood than some extra steel tubing
[19:24:56] <enleth> besides, I'm not a good welder
[19:25:49] <andypugh> So, you need parctice?
[19:26:05] <enleth> sure I do, but there's always something more important to do
[19:26:38] <Sync> the problem with welding for me always is that I get all the practice I need but then don't weld much for 2 years
[19:27:10] <andypugh> Actually, being able to get close enough to see well, and being able to focus at that distance, and having good enough mask optics is more important than most folk realise.
[19:27:27] <enleth> I'll be probably making a stand for a new lathe out of steel tubing soon, so that's some practice coming
[19:27:58] * Jymmm hands andypugh four glass Coca Cola Bottles
[19:28:23] <enleth> but what's essentially a weird table won't mind sloppy welding as long as it holds, I can grind the legs back to make it stand upright without wobbling around
[19:29:13] <enleth> a belt sander that needs all the belt rollers and guides aligned properly seems a lot less forgiving
[19:31:46] <enleth> fortunately I do have good eyesight and a good mask, but it's still like drawing - you know what to do, you see where it needs to go, but it just won't be what you wanted even though you tried to move your hand like the guy in the video
[19:33:16] <Sync> andypugh: true, although I don't have a lot of problems with seeing what I am doing, but rather being consistent in what I do
[19:34:00] <enleth> maybe if I had a MIG welder, supposedly they are trivial to weld with right off the bat with minimal training, but all I have is a TIG/stick
[19:34:40] <andypugh> Yes, MIG is pretty easy.
[19:38:46] <enleth> I'm not sure if that's a thing in English, but in Polish, bad, splattered and porous welds made by beginners are usually called "snots", with the act of producing them usually getting called appropriately
[19:40:34] <andypugh> That’s relatively polite. For some reason bad welds when I was a lad were compared to the excrement of pigeons.
[19:40:40] <enleth> so I could say I am capable of snotting stuff together, but calling the results "welds" is going a bit far
[19:42:06] <enleth> you know, the thermal discoloration and soot around a bad stick weld actually might look a bit like a splat of pigeon shit
[19:43:27] <enleth> http://www.weldreality.com/bad-weld-01a08.gif - like this one
[19:44:45] <andypugh> The last thing I welded was some galvanised conduit. I was half expecting to feel unwell the next day, but got away with it. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metal_fume_fever
[19:45:40] <andypugh> enleth: The last time I saw a weld like that it was holding the ladder I had just climbed to the wall :-)
[19:46:31] <Jymmm> andypugh: Why WELD conduit?
[19:46:54] <enleth> that's when you decide whether to let go of it and fall alone, or wait let the ladder join you on the way down
[19:47:00] <enleth> *wait and
[19:48:03] <andypugh> Jymmm: https://picasaweb.google.com/108164504656404380542/Holbrook#6281735385790066002
[19:48:23] <Jymmm> andypugh: private
[19:48:25] <andypugh> I needed a tight S
[19:48:32] <Jymmm> ah ok
[19:48:57] <andypugh> Shouldn’t be private. Can anyone else see it?
[19:49:00] <enleth> I can
[19:49:22] <Jymmm> enleth: must be logged in then
[19:50:00] <andypugh> Jymmm: Does this work: https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/TdszL_lIJkbwNw1GaVSQZtMTjNZETYmyPJy0liipFm0?feat=directlink
[19:50:19] <Jymmm> andypugh: No, but it's okey
[19:50:43] <andypugh> I actually want to find out the best way to link to Picasa images
[19:51:15] <andypugh> I think this one might work differently. https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-oI7z0I1oXdo/Vy01DSMErVI/AAAAAAAAGfA/JPDSefSatro-Ap68WoBQk4Rg0RTVKMWBACCo/s144/IMG_2495.jpg
[19:51:38] <andypugh> Like, by being stuoidly small.
[19:51:41] <Jymmm> andypugh: THAT I can see, but it's just a thumbnail
[19:51:51] <andypugh> https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-oI7z0I1oXdo/Vy01DSMErVI/AAAAAAAAGfA/JPDSefSatro-Ap68WoBQk4Rg0RTVKMWBACCo/s800/IMG_2495.jpg
[19:52:07] <Jymmm> 800x800
[19:52:28] <xxcodermill> heys
[19:52:38] <xxcodermill> machines running nicely
[19:52:44] <Jymmm> andypugh: 800x800
[19:52:45] <xxcodermill> been running for a hour
[19:52:54] <andypugh> I made the bend by slitting, bending and welding, then found it was too tight (and lumpy inside) to get the wires through, so had to cut it in half and re-assemble round the wires.
[19:53:00] <xxcodermill> fan blowing on controller tb6560
[19:53:10] <Jymmm> andypugh: ouch
[19:53:18] <xxcodermill> ow
[19:54:38] <Jymmm> Man, I hate square snap-in switches
[19:55:08] <Jymmm> it's a bitch finding the the right sized square drill bit!
[19:55:10] <andypugh> Jymmm: It’s no big deal. Though inconvenient when I found that somethign had gone wrong electrically inside the carriage, and had to slide the whole thing off the end of the lathe, trailing cables, cable chain, conduit and conectors behind me. That carriage is not a casual lift.
[19:55:51] <Jymmm> andypugh: What such a tight fit, asthetics?
[19:55:56] <Jymmm> Why*
[19:56:21] <andypugh> It’s what the conduit sho had.
[19:56:27] <andypugh> (shop)
[19:56:39] <xxcodermill_> hm might have big em issues from spindle lol
[19:57:03] <Jymmm> andypugh: Looks like it would have been easier to drill a hole 2" over instead =)
[19:57:35] <andypugh> Jymmm: Through the lathe bed, with nowhere for the drill to be?
[19:58:13] <Jymmm> andypugh: Are we not talking about the grey thing withe the cable tie on it?
[19:58:55] <andypugh> I guess with a 6-foot drill pit it would be possible to drill through the 3” of cast iron into the void inside the head. I actually considered it, so that’s why I know it wasn’t a possibility.
[19:59:20] <Jymmm> Oh, heh. nm then =)
[19:59:29] <andypugh> Jymmm: For your square switch holes, you need : https://www.amazon.co.uk/Q-Max-Square-Sheet-Metal-Punch/dp/B005LV1NT0/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1462581058&sr=8-2&keywords=square+q-max
[20:00:15] <andypugh> It’s what they are for, and they work brilliantly. You drill a pilot hole, assemble the punch, and tighten.
[20:00:34] <andypugh> I have a bunch of them. (bought second-hand)
[20:00:38] <Jymmm> andypugh: haha, it's literally ONE switch, in a thing cheap plastic box =)
[20:00:55] <andypugh> Ah, but will it be the last one you ever fit?
[20:01:09] <Jymmm> andypugh: Nice, I have a bag full of square switchs I've not used because fo that
[20:01:25] <Jymmm> of*
[20:01:47] <Jymmm> andypugh: I hope so, but doubtfull I'll never wire another switch =)
[20:01:56] <andypugh> Look on ebay for cheap and/or used versions.
[20:02:22] <enleth> indeed those punches are magic
[20:02:25] <andypugh> Q-Max is a UK brand, the US version is Green-something I think.
[20:02:36] <Jymmm> andypugh: I'm just making a lil PC PS adapter to mini benchtop PS, breaking out 3.3, 5, and 12V to spring termnals
[20:02:55] <Jymmm> Greenlee
[20:03:09] <Jymmm> I've used their punches MANY times
[20:03:59] <Jymmm> They have DB 9 and 25 too
[20:11:18] <andypugh> New Clickspring just out: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Nle33eb1Uo
[20:22:56] <andypugh> pink_vampire: Have you seen this guys videos? He makes really shiny things: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Nle33eb1Uo
[20:29:30] <pink_vampire> What does "probe trip during non-probe MDI command" mean?
[20:30:05] <andypugh> It means that the probe input pin has changed state when you were not doing a probing move.
[20:30:48] <pink_vampire> But the machine was moving at the time by a Probe Screen command...
[20:31:01] <andypugh> Possibly noise, possibly you touched the probe. I actually deliberately cause that message before I probe to make sure the probe is working.
[20:31:08] <Jymmm> andypugh: What material did he use for the screws that allowed him to heat blue it?
[20:32:13] <andypugh> Jymmm: It’s drill rod / O1 / Silver steel. But you can blue any (non stainless) steel. It only looks good if it’s a steel that takes a good polish though.
[20:32:29] <Jymmm> andypugh: ah ok
[20:32:51] <Jymmm> andypugh: I HAVE seen SS heat "colored" before though
[20:35:58] <Jymmm> Hmmm, cant find a sample of it now =(
[20:54:24] <Sync> andypugh: what is the green cable there?
[20:54:31] <Sync> been looking for cool encoder cable
[20:54:45] <Sync> so far I seem to be settling on helukabel industrial ethernet stuff
[20:56:31] <andypugh> That’s LAPP encoder cable: Rapid have a whole section for drag-chain cable: http://www.rapidonline.com/drag-chain-cable
[20:58:35] <andypugh> Mine is 3 x 2 encoder/resolver + 2 x 0.5mm power + 4 x 0.2mm data.
[21:00:17] <andypugh> Sync: Did you see this picture? https://picasaweb.google.com/108164504656404380542/Holbrook#6217838146609796818
[21:00:31] <Sync> no
[21:02:48] <andypugh> There is the green insulation, then an overall braided sheath then a layer of paper/nomex/tyvek or similar then 3 pairs with a blacj sheath, kapton layer, overall braid + dran wire, and then the twisted pair. There is a nylon string for packing/ strength and then 2 x 0.5mm wires and 4 x 0.2mm wires.
[21:03:20] <andypugh> It’s a pain to strip and prepare.
[21:03:30] <andypugh> But is probably what you want.
[21:03:49] <andypugh> I have 40m spare, on the wrong continent.
[21:14:35] <XXCoder> man
[21:14:41] <XXCoder> machines running great
[21:14:48] <XXCoder> too bad wifi dongle decided to die!
[21:14:55] <XXCoder> probably due to huge EMF
[21:19:42] <Sync> hm, interesting andypugh
[21:20:34] <Sync> well, andypugh you are still connected to my continent by a tunnel
[21:20:40] <Sync> so I wouldn't say wrong
[21:20:46] <Frank__17> helloo
[21:22:16] <andypugh> Sync: Until the referendum in June, then we will fill the tunnel, put our fingers in our ears and hum “laa laa laa we can’t hear you”
[21:23:25] <Sync> well, you will still have to cut yourself loose from us
[21:23:39] <andypugh> Sync: I could send you some, but if you are in EU then Conrad sell the same as Rapid, also by the meter. So you can buy the one you want (for example the diameter to suit your Lemo collets)
[21:23:41] <Frank__17> guys, can u tell me if im measuring me flatness the wrong way? this is my setup, i put the 0.005 inch/feet level (starret) in the middle, and move it to the side im measuring about 3 inches at a time, and "calculate" how much it moved, then i move it again 3 inches and i see how it moves in reference with the middle reading, then add those meassures up, getting to the end,, confusing?
[21:24:55] <andypugh> Frank__17: You might get a better result with two matched rollers under the level.
[21:25:51] <Frank__17> uhmmm, what kind of rollers? thick bearings?
[21:26:20] <Frank__17> tricky, i dont have anything very precision made
[21:27:29] <Sync> yeah, andypugh, the helukabel is cheaper tho
[21:28:32] <andypugh> Sync: Check for oil resistance and flex rating if putting it in a cable chain. Mine is _specifically_ for resolvers and cable chains.
[21:29:16] <Frank__17> how about with 2 pieces of bronce shims on each end, anyway thanks, i "imply" that im kind of doing it correctly :D
[21:29:34] <Sync> it is PUR and has 4 pairs, so eh
[21:30:05] <Sync> I put non drag chain cable on X and Y, I figure it'll never break at my usage
[21:30:12] <Sync> if it does, I can order proper stuff
[21:35:02] <Sync> ah andypugh, there is someone selling that cable for 3€/m, that's pretty good
[21:36:40] <andypugh> Sync: The cable for the proxes on my Chinese lathe (running in a chain) have failed twice in 8 years. And that’s a machine that doesn’t even run every day.
[21:37:10] <Sync> hm
[21:37:26] <Sync> well, currently the plan is to not even run the cable in a chain
[21:37:36] <Sync> as the movement is pretty small
[21:37:38] <andypugh> Cheap proxes, super-cheap cable, don’t read too much into that
[21:37:43] <Sync> Y and Z are fixed
[21:37:48] <Sync> so no need for chain cable
[21:49:41] <Polymorphism> I think I will get ebay 6040 if I get any machine
[21:49:44] <Polymorphism> it will handle my simple needs
[21:50:05] <Polymorphism> I can get 6040 + 3d printer + laser cutter for $3000, same as one raptor
[21:50:21] <Polymorphism> I will start with laser cutter + 3d printer I think, and move to cnc if my needs require
[21:50:32] <Polymorphism> still researching though, this may change
[21:51:59] <MattyMatt> you should only need to buy one machine, then build the rest
[21:55:41] <MattyMatt> CNC doesn't spare you the need to have a workshop full of traditional tools. e.g. for a laser cutter you still need to cut up sheets of acrylic & plywood
[21:55:44] <andypugh> Polymorphism: Buy the one yiou want most now. Biy the others later. Unless you are about to retire, you are only going to get more wealthy in the future.
[21:55:56] <MattyMatt> hah
[21:56:16] <MattyMatt> I was richest I ever was at 18
[21:56:30] <MattyMatt> manic miner
[22:00:08] <MattyMatt> grandad was a toolmaker. he was never rich at all :p
[22:01:07] <MattyMatt> I never went to his work tho. that might have been his happy place
[22:04:06] <andypugh> MattyMatt: Yeah, you don’t count :-)
[22:06:05] <andypugh> Or, perhaps I should re-phrase that as “You were not typical"
[22:06:55] <MattyMatt> I was described by HMRC as "so rare as to utterly negligible"
[22:07:26] <MattyMatt> HMC&E as it was
[22:08:12] <MattyMatt> upside is they've left me alone. I don't have to fill in my tax returns with all £0000 anymore
[22:09:09] <Polymorphism> MattyMatt, good point
[22:09:17] <Polymorphism> I need a machine that cuts plywood + acrylic sheets
[22:09:38] <Polymorphism> if I want to use the laser cutter
[22:09:49] <Polymorphism> 3d printer gets me the furthest away from needing other tools
[22:09:53] <Polymorphism> some finishing files perhaps
[22:10:10] <MattyMatt> handsaw does fine, but you need somewhere to move the 8x4' sheet around where it's OK to get sawdust on the floor
[22:10:59] <MattyMatt> yeah 3d printer is closest to being office-friendly. all you need to worry about there is venting the stink
[22:12:04] <MattyMatt> me, I'd spend the $3000 on a piece of land, where I can melt metal etc
[22:12:38] <andypugh> MattyMatt: You were a one-off back then, certainly. Every kid with a Spectrum who had tgot as far as putting binary into a REM statement wanted to be you.
[22:12:45] <MattyMatt> lay a slab, build a bench out of tree trunks
[22:13:07] <MattyMatt> they thought they did :) I thought so too tbh
[22:13:58] <andypugh> MattyMatt: I got 1% of the way there, my game sold 20,000 copies.
[22:14:29] <MattyMatt> I'm thinking if I get my land up a granite mountain, that'll save me the cost of the slab
[22:15:35] <MattyMatt> what was it called?
[22:16:23] <MattyMatt> your game?
[22:17:46] <andypugh> Johnny Reb
[22:18:53] <andypugh> http://www.worldofspectrum.org/infoseekpub.cgi?regexp=^Andy+Pugh$
[22:19:48] <andypugh> I feel bad that I get the credit for “Redocats” I only did the loading screen, and signed it…
[22:22:10] <skunksleep> MattyMatt: are you comfortable?
[22:23:05] <Polymorphism> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=evqp5u9Hl6g
[22:26:45] <AndChat|144384> Wow. My Nexus locked up hard
[22:33:49] <MattyMatt> skunksleep in what regard? as a sofa (yes I am, well padded), in the palliative care sense (yes, no physical pain right now) or financially (no fucking way)
[22:34:40] <skunksleep> :) yes
[22:35:23] <skunksleep> 83 was a long time ago... (I was in 3rd grade)
[22:36:11] <skunksleep> Playing with my TI99/4a
[22:36:34] <skunksleep> Or maybe 4th grade
[22:40:26] <MattyMatt> was that after they were all sold off for $50?
[22:40:46] <MattyMatt> that was a strange machine :)
[22:42:48] <skunksleep> Yes. I remember dad going to Sears and getting 2
[22:43:38] <skunksleep> (Although I think the first one we bought was expensive.
[22:44:04] <pcw_home> I liked the TMS9900 (still remember bullwhip and ratwhip)
[22:45:43] <skunksleep> Wasn't it like the first 16ish bit processor?
[22:46:10] <pcw_home> one of the first single chip 16 bitters
[22:46:26] <MattyMatt> it accessed the video through a keyhole. that was the killer for me
[22:46:32] <pcw_home> with multiply and divide
[22:47:21] <pcw_home> thats the TMS99/4 (not a great implementation)
[22:47:42] <MattyMatt> arr, can't blame the chip for the machine
[22:48:17] <skunksleep> The story I remember is TI didn't let 3rd parties developer software. So they died
[22:48:52] <MattyMatt> and keyhole vid isn't as bad as I thought. MSX and nintendo managed with it
[22:49:10] <MattyMatt> as long as you have DMA assist
[22:49:24] <pcw_home> The 9900 was a bit like the uNova, a single chip implementation of a TTL or bit slice Mini
[22:49:49] <MattyMatt> TI minis were already quite niche
[22:53:23] <pcw_home> DX10 supported real time
[22:54:45] <skunksleep> pcw_home: see the 7i69?. http://electronicsam.com/images/matsuura/20160506_175211.jpg
[22:55:28] <pcw_home> I see a SCSI cable :-)
[22:59:30] <skunksleep> Won't be hurting for I/o
[22:59:58] <skunksleep> On either side
[23:02:42] <skunksleep> We used the existing wire that ran from the yasnic to the vfd for analog. Worked great. That is the only thing other than power and smart serial now that goes between the two sides
[23:03:15] <skunksleep> So much wire got pulled out.
[23:06:24] <skunksleep> (2 SCSI cables... :))
[23:08:40] <skunksleep> What is 'through a key hole'?
[23:12:02] <skunksleep> Serial?
[23:13:36] <pcw_home> probably means a small memory window
[23:40:34] <XXCoder> bah
[23:40:46] <XXCoder> machine worked wonderfully besides one problem
[23:40:52] <XXCoder> Y is drifting a little
[23:43:17] <XXCoder> what may be possible sources?
[23:48:06] <XXCoder> my current guess is power supply isn't giving enough power
[23:48:19] <XXCoder> last time it was quite rapid because controller was getting real hot
[23:48:25] <XXCoder> this time it lasted hours
[23:49:44] <XXCoder> quiet.