#linuxcnc | Logs for 2016-03-21

[01:12:06] <newcnc22> Hi, I have not found the entry of the stepconf in the hal or ini file in order to eliminate this entry to work just with the hal and ini file? So when I start linuxcnc it produces an error. Unfortunately I have updated to 2.8. My machine that was working just fine has produced an error after updating...
[01:14:20] <newcnc22> I cannot edit this stepconf to my needs, because I have the five axis machine that is not listed in the configuration
[02:08:02] <archivist> newcnc22, you edit the config files directly not the stepconf one
[02:08:44] <newcnc22> Yes....
[02:09:25] <newcnc22> Yes, I want to just use the both files mentioned above
[02:11:15] <archivist> you have not stated what your error is
[02:12:04] <newcnc22> archivist: I really don't understand why a previously working program doesn't work when you update
[02:13:06] <pink_vampire> hi
[02:13:11] <archivist> there can be syntax changes between versions
[02:13:27] <XXCoder> hey human hunter
[02:13:37] <newcnc22> archivist: there are many many problems actually because I have to edit three files. The problem is that I want to eliminate the entry in the ini or hal file for the stepconf
[02:14:01] <pink_vampire> XXCoder: lol
[02:14:40] <newcnc22> archivist: I see, but I just want to work with the two files and delete the stepconf
[02:14:55] <archivist> newcnc22, stepconf only leaves a comment
[02:15:11] <pink_vampire> I did half of "the part"
[02:15:24] <newcnc22> archivist: but where and how does it look?
[02:15:29] <archivist> you can ignore the stepconf file completely it is not used
[02:15:50] <archivist> it is only used by stepconf
[02:16:12] <newcnc22> archivist: that's exactly what I want but I suspect that the error comes from the entry of the stepconf
[02:16:24] <archivist> you are not looking in the right place for your problem
[02:16:54] <archivist> show us the real actual error
[02:17:43] <newcnc22> archivist: I suspect linuxcnc finds an entry somewhere to look for the stepconf at the start up that causes the fault
[02:18:51] <archivist> please tell us the real error message
[02:20:04] <newcnc22> archivist: i'm on my phone right now so I cannot paste The dump. But it says something like cannot find parport 4. Because I have manually edit the fourth axis into both ini and hal file
[02:20:46] <archivist> that is not looking for stepconf!
[02:21:03] <archivist> it is looking for a non existant parport
[02:22:22] <newcnc22> archivist: yes, I think it's verifying if it is configured correctly somewhere else and at least in the both files it is correctly configured
[02:22:41] <FloppyDisk> newcnc22: I don't know anything about 2.8, but from 2.6 to 2.7 there were some significant changes and I had to manually
[02:22:54] <FloppyDisk> edit the Hal file to remove some items for the hardware that I was using.
[02:23:21] <FloppyDisk> I don't know the details, but the trajectory planner and I'm guessing Host mot driver changed (quite a bit) from one version
[02:23:22] <FloppyDisk> to the next.
[02:23:33] <archivist> I think there was a change to the port finding not too long ago, see the change log
[02:23:44] <newcnc22> archivist: yes, it's looking for a non-existing parport but I have edit it correctly into the mentioned to files
[02:24:06] <maxcnc> morning from Germany
[02:24:10] <maxcnc> its raining
[02:24:21] <maxcnc> newcnc22: hi
[02:24:23] <FloppyDisk> morning, about to hit the hay here..
[02:24:42] <maxcnc> did you remove the probe parport in your config after updating to 2.8
[02:24:49] <newcnc22> archivist: Aha, that's a good idea hello maxcnc
[02:25:01] <maxcnc> 2.7 is recomended as 2.8 is the master
[02:25:21] <maxcnc> i had lots of mashine trouble on 2.8
[02:25:38] <maxcnc> even lost 1 plasma for 2weeks
[02:25:45] <newcnc22> maxcnc: no, I have even read that you have to add a probe
[02:26:39] <maxcnc> probe is differend to probe parport exists
[02:26:52] <newcnc22> maxcnc: so do I have to remove the parprobe, and if so how do I do it?
[02:27:04] <archivist> 2.7 changes parport: removed probe_parport component
[02:27:17] <maxcnc> #loadrt probe_parport
[02:27:49] <newcnc22> maxcnc: ini or hal? Where is it located and how does it look like?
[02:27:54] <maxcnc> is it a 5axis parport only
[02:28:29] <maxcnc> its in the hal lokated on the top
[02:28:48] <newcnc22> maxcnc: yes, it is only five axis
[02:29:11] <maxcnc> on one parport or 2
[02:29:46] <newcnc22> maxcnc: right, I will try that thank you very much. Just one
[02:30:13] <maxcnc> cool keep in mind to set the rotation axis to 16/17 pins
[02:30:32] <maxcnc> to keep the main data pins for the Real movement
[02:30:45] <newcnc22> maxcnc: right, it is five and 17 actually.
[02:31:15] <maxcnc> you dont use the china 5axis TB65xx versions arent you
[02:31:19] <newcnc22> maxcnc: nice
[02:31:52] <newcnc22> maxcnc: yes I do....
[02:32:25] <newcnc22> maxcnc: I have the China crap that would work just super in the past
[02:32:59] <maxcnc> Where are you i our buitifull world
[02:33:22] <maxcnc> works fine but is not the best to go with
[02:33:30] <newcnc22> maxcnc: I am located in Hembrook Germany
[02:33:41] <newcnc22> Hamburg
[02:33:44] <maxcnc> Dann können wir ja auch deutach
[02:34:03] <maxcnc> klick mal auf meine nick
[02:34:16] <newcnc22> maxcnc: as far as I know not here
[02:34:16] <maxcnc> ich sitz in Zweibrücken
[02:34:37] <newcnc22> Ich glaube das geht nicht hier
[02:34:50] <maxcnc> ok
[02:35:23] <maxcnc> so im promise you to edit the hal and in i directly
[02:35:31] <newcnc22> maxcnc: I think we have to open it private chat
[02:35:47] <newcnc22> maxcnc: but I don't know how to do it on my phone
[02:36:02] <maxcnc> ok
[02:36:21] <maxcnc> you shoudt use chatzilla üplugin on mozilla
[02:36:27] <maxcnc> that got it
[03:08:04] <pink_vampire> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dPxeCSh4jTQ
[03:24:42] <Deejay> moin
[03:28:38] <pink_vampire> morning Deejay
[03:28:58] <Deejay> hi pink, XXCoder
[03:31:14] <pink_vampire> someone know about way to transfer photos from the cellphone to the computer?
[03:31:27] <pink_vampire> without the cable.
[03:38:27] <pink_vampire> Deejay: ?
[03:42:24] <pink_vampire> http://i.imgur.com/Wc8bgID.png
[03:42:41] <pink_vampire> Deejay: ^
[03:44:51] <pink_vampire> XXCoder: http://i.imgur.com/Wc8bgID.png
[03:45:16] <XXCoder> looks decent start but why stopped?
[03:45:23] <Deejay> pink_vampire, nice
[03:45:44] <pink_vampire> XXCoder: I need to flip it.
[03:45:48] <XXCoder> oh
[03:46:17] <pink_vampire> and I'm using 3/4" so maybe I will have to sand it abit.
[03:48:26] <XXCoder> not bad really
[03:49:13] <XXCoder> that crurve is under the breast correct?
[03:50:35] <XXCoder> *curve
[03:50:38] <pink_vampire> correct
[03:51:28] <Deejay> ^^
[03:52:18] <SpeedEvil> pink_vampire: what cellphone?
[03:52:27] <SpeedEvil> I just let mine mirror them to google
[03:52:54] <pink_vampire> it's android.
[03:53:05] <pink_vampire> motorola
[03:55:57] <Jymmm> breast curve mirroring... WTH?!
[03:56:23] <XXCoder> its porn with mirror fetish
[03:56:29] <XXCoder> lol
[04:00:07] <pink_vampire> I have an idea
[04:00:48] <pink_vampire> to make it in graphite, and then sink edm it to some super alloy.
[04:08:01] <XXCoder> its porn with mirror fetish, Jymmm
[04:08:08] <XXCoder> boring.
[04:08:56] <Jymmm> XXCoder: is that like self-loving porn?
[04:09:39] <XXCoder> didnt look into it
[04:10:15] <Jymmm> XXCoder: Then how did you know it was boring if you didn't look into the mirror?
[04:10:29] <XXCoder> I made it up, thats why heh
[04:11:07] <Jymmm> Or... you just bored yourself making you own porn, which would be very sad indeed!
[04:11:21] <XXCoder> indeed. lol
[04:11:48] <Jymmm> only 4 more reboots to go.... sigh
[04:11:59] <XXCoder> fresh windows install eh
[04:12:19] <Jymmm> I said 4, not 400 reboots.
[04:12:26] <XXCoder> thats true lol
[04:14:20] <Jymmm> Getting ready to upgrade from 10.7 to 10.11. So, did TM, then created a 7gb partition, restored install image to make it bootable. Created another partition on the balance of the 1TB for existing content...
[04:15:45] <Jymmm> Booted from ext hdd, then imaged int hdd to ext.... 6 hours later... reboot to ext image and tested (prev reboot), now back in int hdd, getting redy to clean up files then upgrade to 10.11
[04:17:03] <Jymmm> Would rather do a clean install, but I have so much stuff tweeked, that if the upgrade fubars, I can always retore prev setup
[04:17:30] <XXCoder> why not just do sparse DD to image file
[04:17:35] <XXCoder> offsite save that
[04:18:29] <Jymmm> Not 'file', but to ext 1tb hdd, then I can boot/restore as I need to
[04:18:42] <XXCoder> okay that would work yeah
[04:19:46] <Jymmm> I 'could' restore from TM (TimeMachine), but you can't BOOT from that.
[04:22:25] <Jymmm> They why I have done it, I can either boot from ext hdd, restore from ext hdd, or boot and do a fresh instal from ext hdd. No other media is needed todo whatever you want.
[04:22:55] <XXCoder> yeah pretty effective
[04:23:08] <Jymmm> PLUS.... I still have a TM I can restore from as well.
[04:24:49] <Jymmm> Yeah, it's a computer, things fuck up when you least expect them to. I've been doing this shit for way too long not to cya anymore.
[04:25:04] <XXCoder> indeed
[04:27:57] <pink_vampire> making chips!
[04:29:00] <Jymmm> A long time ago, I was working on one of the EE's laptops. HAd to do a clean install, so I (at the time) grabbed the tape backup drive, made sure it had the latest firmware, tested a backup, restore, and verify on a different machine, all good. Got his machine, did a backup with verify, when I went to restore, total FAIL. Thus while cradek loves tape backup, I never will.
[04:30:43] <XXCoder> geez
[04:31:09] <Jymmm> When I say a "different machine", I mean an exact same model as he had, with even the exact same BIOS and HW versions.
[04:32:19] <Jymmm> I mean, I did my due diigence, I checked EVERYTHING, I didn't skip one step, and it still fubar'ed. *shrug*
[04:34:23] <minibnz> jymmn i used to "run up" pc's and we purchased 1500 machines all the same, and started to load the image onto them, 1450 worked fine but 50 failed for unknown reasons. it happens something is a little different in those machines, we just sent them back.. not quite the same thing but sometimes shit just wont work..
[04:35:04] <minibnz> i dont do PC work anymore i just use them..
[04:35:18] <minibnz> new job has me qorking on a windows machine and it sucks...
[04:35:29] <Jymmm> minibnz: Yeah, that's why if I can't verify, forget it.
[04:36:14] <minibnz> all i would do as a check would be to try the restore a second time then give up.
[04:36:36] <Jymmm> It's funny, every corp uses tape backup, but maybe 5% actually do a full restore from those tapes on a weekly basis to verify everything is working as it should.
[04:36:50] <pink_vampire> mach3 kill it :(
[04:37:03] <minibnz> a tape is not a backup until you verified it works..
[04:37:25] <Jymmm> minibnz: fuck that, I HATE tape
[04:37:38] <XXCoder> do anyone use tape now?
[04:37:39] <minibnz> tape is the worst medium going...
[04:37:47] <Jymmm> for reason cited above =)
[04:37:56] <minibnz> just the companies stuck in the 60's
[04:37:57] <XXCoder> pink_vampire: not using linuxcnc>
[04:38:06] <Jymmm> XXCoder: Big corp do, and cradek =)
[04:38:44] <minibnz> with cost of harddrives now being so cheap i dont understand tape backups
[04:39:06] <Jymmm> XXCoder: I know cradek does, cause I came across a killer 20+ bay tape robot a ways back and got it into his hands.
[04:39:15] <pink_vampire> the program freeze for few secs, and the Z axis and it kill the part.
[04:39:28] <XXCoder> pink_vampire: mach3 is shit
[04:39:59] <minibnz> pink try the linuxcnc live cd and see if its any better
[04:40:11] <pink_vampire> now I need to flat the top of the part and glue replacement stock.
[04:40:19] <Jymmm> minibnz: hdd not good for long term storage, such as the required achieve for SOX compliance, etc
[04:40:39] <pink_vampire> minibnz: I don't know how to set it up.
[04:40:53] <minibnz> yeah this is true they are not for long term use but incremental use would be ok
[04:40:58] <XXCoder> Jymmm: some company invented method to store data that it lasts millions of years
[04:41:09] <XXCoder> almost like cd but million times more stable
[04:41:12] <XXCoder> and hella tough
[04:41:14] <minibnz> in cyrstals like in superman
[04:41:23] <Jymmm> XXCoder: And as soon as that statement is verified, I'll consider it.
[04:41:40] <XXCoder> not market yet,a nd MANY stuff I read about never go to market.
[04:42:07] <minibnz> pink its not that hard. there is a wizzard that asks you 90% of the stuff you need. if you are using a standard board to drive it the pins are not hard to setup
[04:42:15] <Jymmm> minibnz: that would be bubble memory,https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bubble_memory
[04:42:27] <XXCoder> Jymmm: http://www.cnet.com/news/a-360tb-disc-that-holds-data-for-more-than-1-million-years/
[04:42:57] <XXCoder> minibnz: apparently youre right
[04:43:32] <minibnz> yeah i read that on slashdot last month
[04:44:07] <XXCoder> LOL http://www.ancient-code.com/researchers-find-a-250-million-year-old-microchip-in-russia/
[04:44:14] <pink_vampire> WTF!
[04:44:15] <XXCoder> probably actually some form of life
[04:44:32] <pink_vampire> Z axis motor on 60 deg C
[04:44:42] <pink_vampire> the driver on 68 deg C
[04:44:42] <XXCoder> that site is full of shit
[04:45:07] <pink_vampire> something wrong go with my Z axis,
[04:45:18] <XXCoder> that hot
[04:45:44] <Jymmm> XXCoder: That was 2013, AND in SJ conference. So either a) it failed, or b) someone bought the IP and took it off the market
[04:45:59] <XXCoder> Jymmm: it takes long time to market if at all
[04:46:06] <XXCoder> more likely latter
[04:46:09] <pink_vampire> it's super hot
[04:46:17] <Jymmm> XXCoder: Not in Silicone Valley =)
[04:46:18] <pink_vampire> the other 29-30.
[04:46:28] <pink_vampire> I have to setup the sensors,
[04:46:34] <archivist_herron> motors are not unhappy to get hot
[04:47:25] <pink_vampire> how I can cool it down?
[04:47:48] <Jymmm> XXCoder: "Dude, I lost the microchip in the time machine 250M years ago!"
[04:47:55] <minibnz> turn down the current but then you might loose steps
[04:48:11] <archivist_herron> 50-60 deg c is ok
[04:48:18] <minibnz> is you slides nice and smooth and not locked?
[04:48:21] <archivist_herron> just add heatsink
[04:48:28] <Jymmm> lol
[04:49:22] <pink_vampire> archivist: it's more than 2 times more then the others.
[04:49:48] <minibnz> My Z axis motor gets warm/hot 40'c+ even when i am not using it.. the holding current gets it to warm up, because its not moving as much as the other axis it just jets warmer, no movement to consume the energy so it gets converted into heat
[04:49:48] <pink_vampire> i touch it and it's leave a mark on my hand.
[04:51:06] <minibnz> thats probably not so good. steppers are made to run hot to the touch but if its started to do this all of a sudden then it might be and indication of a problem, like lack of oil on the slides?
[04:52:13] <minibnz> i just installed my X axis ballscrew and its not happy.. there is a scrapping feel to it.. i took the screw off the machine and the nut alone does not run smooth.. i think i might have done something to it..
[04:52:29] <minibnz> might have gotten some grit in there when machining them to fit..
[04:53:17] <minibnz> it rolls ok but its not really perfect like the Y axis.. contemplating pulling it fully apart and seeing if i can clean and replace the balls...
[04:53:33] <pink_vampire> in some spots it's over 65!
[04:54:00] <minibnz> does it turn if you tell it to move?
[04:54:35] <pink_vampire> yes,
[04:54:58] <pink_vampire> but it's off now.
[04:55:31] <minibnz> oh i mean does it turn when you to a G1 Z10 F50
[04:57:14] <pink_vampire> yes.
[04:57:25] <pink_vampire> I think the gib is to tight.
[04:57:49] <pink_vampire> anyway.
[04:58:01] <pink_vampire> I know the mass of the motor is 2KG.
[04:58:16] <pink_vampire> and the mass of the rotor is 2 kg.
[04:58:22] <pink_vampire> the motor is iron.
[04:58:32] <pink_vampire> the rotor is copper.
[04:58:40] <minibnz> ok leave it off, point a fan at it to cool it quicker then oil up the gibs.. then just turn on the steppers, dont ask the motor to move just hold the one spot and see if it heats up, then tell it to move and then see if that gets it hot and steamy
[04:59:28] <pink_vampire> how I can calculate the energy of the heat that it hold?
[04:59:53] <pink_vampire> minibnz: it's a servo.
[05:00:07] <pink_vampire> and the driver can push up to 20A 72V
[05:00:24] <pink_vampire> that 1440W
[05:00:32] <minibnz> if it gets hot when just sitting there holding you might have a problem with the driver.. if it only gets when you tell it to move then there might be a issue with the gib or the motor and encoder
[05:00:39] <minibnz> thats a lot..
[05:00:45] <pink_vampire> I know.
[05:01:29] <SpeedEvil> pink_vampire: Order of magnitude for steel is 1000J/Kg/K
[05:01:39] <SpeedEvil> So ~1-2c/s
[05:01:45] <minibnz> seeing as its a servo you might be able to use a clamp meter. its a multimeter that has a ferrous/hall effect clamp that you can put over a conductor and see the current
[05:02:22] <pink_vampire> minibnz: I have on my table about 50 sensors,
[05:02:54] <SpeedEvil> pink_vampire: correction - 500
[05:02:59] <minibnz> if you have a current meter that will do 20+ amps you can stick that inline with the servo wires
[05:02:59] <SpeedEvil> So 2-4c/s
[05:03:01] <pink_vampire> no....
[05:03:07] <SpeedEvil> though order of magnitude is technically accurate
[05:03:42] <pink_vampire> SpeedEvil: what is c/ s?
[05:03:58] <SpeedEvil> centigrade per second
[05:04:57] <pink_vampire> but how do I calculate the joules?
[05:05:19] <pink_vampire> 4kg of steel that go from 60C to 30C
[05:05:27] <SpeedEvil> 1W/s=1J
[05:06:31] <pink_vampire> i'm lost.
[05:06:58] <pink_vampire> 1000J/Kg/K this is what?
[05:07:05] <pink_vampire> per 1C?
[05:07:10] <minibnz> correct me if i am wrong here.. if i have a 1kg block of steel and heat it up 1'c in 1 second it should take 1000J.. and the same in reverse? if 1kg of steel drops 1'c in 1s i have lost 1000J ?
[05:07:11] <SpeedEvil> 1000 joules per kilogram per kelvin.
[05:07:20] <SpeedEvil> A kelvin = 1C, sorry
[05:07:35] <SpeedEvil> minibnz: yes
[05:07:42] <pink_vampire> so it 1000*30?
[05:07:45] <SpeedEvil> minibnz: though '1 second' is irreelvant
[05:07:52] <SpeedEvil> pink_vampire: no - change in temeprature
[05:08:54] <minibnz> oh ok i see so it doesnt matter how fast the heat is lost/assorbed its still 1000J..
[05:09:32] <SpeedEvil> yes. Though in reality if it's slow, heat will escape by conduction/...
[05:10:09] <pink_vampire> I don't care how fast it will cool down or heat up.
[05:10:58] <SpeedEvil> pink_vampire: If you want to know how hot it gets - then weight is irrelevant
[05:11:01] <pink_vampire> I want to know the energy that it hold if it heat up for 30C
[05:11:37] <pink_vampire> 4kg block of steel that heat from 30 to 60C
[05:11:38] <SpeedEvil> Then you simply multiply weight by specififc heat capacity by 30C
[05:12:01] <pink_vampire> so it 1000*4*30?
[05:12:23] <pink_vampire> 120,000J?
[05:12:24] <SpeedEvil> In that case, 500J/Kg/C (earlier 1000 was off) = 500J*4Kg*30 = 60KJ
[05:12:41] <SpeedEvil> Or 1500W for 40 seconds.
[05:13:33] <pink_vampire> I want to see when I stoped it.
[05:14:04] <minibnz> or 85.3 Btu seeing as though we are talking heat here :)_
[05:14:12] <SpeedEvil> Sorry - I haven't read backscroll.
[05:14:21] <SpeedEvil> I should probably do that, but not enough coffee.
[05:14:55] <pink_vampire> about 15 min
[05:15:26] <minibnz> pink has a servo that is getting hot and she would like to see whats causing this.. so she thought using the heat/temp she could work out the power being used to make the heat and see if the servo is actually doing anything or just heating up..
[05:15:29] * Jymmm puts a tourniquet on SpeedEvil and prepares the quad shot espresso mainline IV...
[05:15:35] <SpeedEvil> ah
[05:15:44] <minibnz> there you speedevil a quick update for ya
[05:16:26] <SpeedEvil> 60C may not be unreasonably hot for an operating servo
[05:17:11] <SpeedEvil> Best thing is probably to continually monitor the temperature, and see if it levels off at 60C, or carries on climbing.
[05:17:12] <minibnz> pink_vampire is the servo getting warm only just starting now or has it always been getting hot?
[05:17:30] <pink_vampire> so 60KJ for 15 min.
[05:17:36] <pink_vampire> it's about 66 W
[05:17:52] <pink_vampire> so about 0.9 - 1 A
[05:18:06] <SpeedEvil> pink_vampire: Was this stationary and heating up?
[05:18:07] <pink_vampire> that about 3 times more than the X Y axis.
[05:18:34] <minibnz> Z does have some weight on it so it might have actually been doing work to hold the mill head up.
[05:18:58] <pink_vampire> and we didnt count the heat dissipation
[05:19:22] <pink_vampire> so the currant was very high.
[05:19:34] <SpeedEvil> It's possible that you can also get oscillations in the PID or whatever you're getting that is trying to keep it in a precisely fixed posiiton
[05:19:58] <SpeedEvil> this can lead to high power seeking with 'zero' amplitude and get things quite hot
[05:20:06] <minibnz> and if the gib is locked it would make a lot of heat..
[05:20:28] <pink_vampire> normally the Z axis is on 0.2A on holding position.
[05:20:45] <pink_vampire> so I'm sure there is gib issue here.
[05:21:27] <Jymmm> Just move drive/motor to a different axis as see if the issue follows the electrical or the mechanical
[05:21:46] <pink_vampire> yes,
[05:21:54] <pink_vampire> the gib was stack.
[05:22:03] <minibnz> ahh binding..
[05:22:08] <minibnz> that will do it :)
[05:22:17] <Jymmm> Simple as 3.1415926535897932384626433832795028841971693993751058209749445923078164062862089986280348253421170679821480865132823066470938446095505822317253594081284811174502841027019385211055596446229489549303819644288109756659334461284756482337867831652712019091456485669234603486
[05:22:23] <pink_vampire> binding?
[05:22:47] <pink_vampire> them now 46C.
[05:23:15] <minibnz> when the axis is locked due to something in the slides jamming it up.. also known as binding
[05:23:22] <Jymmm> PEBKAC
[05:23:55] <pink_vampire> I need to add chip cover.
[05:24:24] <minibnz> im off to take my ball screw nut appart and clean it..
[05:24:37] <Jymmm> minibnz: kinky
[05:24:38] <minibnz> otherwise i have to play pot luck and order a new one
[05:24:45] <pink_vampire> 14C per 49 min!
[05:25:45] <pink_vampire> I need to kill about an hour to be able to power it again :(
[05:26:00] <SpeedEvil> why?
[05:26:15] <SpeedEvil> If it's only at 60C, and you monitor it, it's not an issue at all.
[05:26:26] <SpeedEvil> Especially if you point the worlds tiniest fan at it
[05:27:43] <pink_vampire> it melt the whole ice pack!
[05:28:18] <Jymmm> SpeedEvil: top left http://images.hardwarezone.com/upload/files/2010/04/f2f22ee89d.jpg
[05:28:39] <pink_vampire> AWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW
[05:28:41] <SpeedEvil> That is pretty close.
[05:28:46] <pink_vampire> that SOOO cute!!!
[05:28:55] <miss0r> omfg
[05:29:00] <miss0r> that is damn tiny
[05:29:09] <SpeedEvil> http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=961876
[05:29:11] <miss0r> what the hell is the purpose of that size anyway?
[05:29:14] <SpeedEvil> 225mg R/C plane
[05:29:26] <SpeedEvil> minibnz: cooling a processor, for example.
[05:29:45] <miss0r> a rediculously small processor
[05:29:48] <SpeedEvil> minibnz: Sometimes stuff is in _very_ confined spaces with no real other way to cool it.
[05:29:55] * miss0r is mr. watercoolant
[05:30:00] <SpeedEvil> half a watt of heat removal can make all the difference
[05:30:07] <miss0r> indeed
[05:30:26] <pink_vampire> I want to take 1000 of them
[05:30:38] <pink_vampire> and make thin fan.
[05:30:41] <Jymmm> SpeedEvil: LOX =)
[05:30:48] <SpeedEvil> pink_vampire: they will have very low throughput
[05:32:59] <SpeedEvil> http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__24273__600mm_Flybarless_High_Quality_Carbon_Fiber_Main_Blades_.html
[05:35:02] <XXCoder> I remember reading about heat sink fan that uses heat to run
[05:35:10] <XXCoder> no electricity. stirling based
[05:35:36] <XXCoder> pretty amazing really if blackout it will keep cooling till it cant run anymore, chip its on is well under overheat by then
[05:36:44] <XXCoder> http://images.dailytech.com/nimage/7445_msiecolution.jpg it was a test, never made it to market
[05:36:56] <pink_vampire> ok, part is flat.
[05:38:38] <XXCoder> all related to that is in 2008 or so, olviously failed market
[05:39:42] <SpeedEvil> XXCoder: yeah - it's stupid
[05:39:56] <pink_vampire> I'm going to glue the new stock.
[05:39:56] <SpeedEvil> XXCoder: If power fails on a chip, then it never ever gets hotter
[05:40:13] <XXCoder> SpeedEvil: in some applications it'd be perfect, like projector cooling
[05:40:46] <XXCoder> projector can kill bulb if its not turned off properly (aka turn off light but not machine till it cools area)
[05:43:37] <SpeedEvil> hmm
[05:43:53] <SpeedEvil> I think it's more likely to be hot bulb kills stuff in projector
[05:44:08] <SpeedEvil> though I'm unsure of higher power stuff
[05:44:37] <XXCoder> light source has heat sinks but if its suddenly powered off it is off but still too hot and damages bulb
[05:44:49] <minibnz> its the uncontrolled cooling of the pcb's the warp as one section cools faster than another.. this breaks/stresses the solder joins then it leads to eventual failure
[05:45:04] <XXCoder> minibnz: that can happen too
[05:45:15] <minibnz> oh my projector is led not bulb :)
[05:45:22] <XXCoder> normal projectors (not led ones) gets very hot
[05:50:04] <SpeedEvil> On the amusing side.
[05:50:13] <SpeedEvil> the black body temperature of LEDs is ridiculous.
[05:50:26] <SpeedEvil> It is not quite insane to have an optical window into a kiln
[05:56:12] <minibnz> 17balls per race and three race's per nut... 51 balls to go..
[06:00:33] * Loetmichel2 did it again... always the left thumb... 8 stiches... slipped off with the deburr tool... :-( -> (caution, some blood) http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=16188&g2_imageViewsIndex=1
[06:02:47] <pink_vampire> how????????????????????????????????
[06:02:50] <pink_vampire> how????????????????????????
[06:04:54] <pink_vampire> Loetmichel2: you can use the cnc for deboring..
[06:05:50] <pink_vampire> and if it slip, you press it too hard.
[06:06:31] <Loetmichel2> had deburr tool
[06:06:33] <Loetmichel2> hand
[06:06:40] <Loetmichel2> slipped of an edge
[06:06:49] <pink_vampire> use the CNC!!!
[06:06:59] <pink_vampire> you can do the same on the cnc.
[06:07:02] <Loetmichel2> the CNC does the next two plates
[06:07:26] <pink_vampire> show me the part.
[06:08:03] <pink_vampire> http://www.aksteknik.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/08/FDTSX0.jpg
[06:08:13] <pink_vampire> you can use something like that.
[06:08:18] <MrSunshine> the big day has come, square up the column at a friend then home and start putting the little milling machine on the plate! =)
[06:08:25] <pink_vampire> or simple brush.
[06:08:54] <Loetmichel2> pink_vampire: the machine is un use. no time to do deburring in it
[06:09:43] <pink_vampire> but you can run it on max feed rate for deburring..
[06:09:52] <pink_vampire> what is you rapid feed?
[06:11:00] <Loetmichel2> F4000
[06:11:08] <pink_vampire> mm/min?
[06:11:23] <Loetmichel2> yes
[06:11:28] <pink_vampire> so..
[06:11:30] <Loetmichel2> still: the machine is in USE
[06:11:42] <Loetmichel2> it makes the next 2 plates
[06:12:50] <Loetmichel2> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=16182 <- the right one with the 2 big and the shitload small holes
[06:13:18] <Loetmichel2> thats 4mm sheet aluminium btw
[06:14:20] <pink_vampire> you need to do the minor things. like sand stuff abit, not push hard on deburring stuff. if you need chamfer edge, just use the tool for it.
[06:14:59] <pink_vampire> I can't see any thing that need to be deburr by hand.
[06:15:14] <pink_vampire> and you have high speed spindle!
[06:15:17] <pink_vampire> use it!!
[06:15:31] <Loetmichel2> i have no tool changer...
[06:15:35] <XXCoder> he said machine is running meanwhile so he cant
[06:15:49] <Loetmichel2> that on top of it
[06:16:44] <pink_vampire> Loetmichel2: just to the stuff right, not fast.
[06:17:36] <pink_vampire> you can always clamp the part again in the machine. and run deburr cycle.
[06:17:59] <XXCoder> at same time thats not effecient
[06:18:06] <XXCoder> better to deburr while its running
[06:18:48] <Loetmichel2> i should just avoid hitting myself with the deburr (hand) tool
[06:18:54] <pink_vampire> XXCoder: but it's just tracing the part in full speed.
[06:19:19] <pink_vampire> use gloves.
[06:19:21] <Loetmichel2> i would have to write a program for that
[06:19:34] <Loetmichel2> wich takes longer than deburring the part by hand
[06:19:41] <pink_vampire> Loetmichel2: trace + offset.
[06:20:31] <pink_vampire> you need the offset for working with the middle of the tool and not with the tip.
[06:22:18] <pink_vampire> Loetmichel2: what cam program are you using??
[06:22:24] <Loetmichel2> none
[06:22:31] <pink_vampire> WTF!
[06:22:38] <pink_vampire> why?!
[06:22:47] <XXCoder> cam tend to be... expensive
[06:23:15] <pink_vampire> Loetmichel2: you can make a gcode for my 3d machining,
[06:23:23] <Loetmichel2> i draw cin coreldraw and then iuse something like DXF2gcode (called BoCNC fur windows) to generate some Gcode
[06:23:45] <pink_vampire> Loetmichel2: you can use hsm express
[06:23:51] <pink_vampire> it's free,
[06:24:05] <pink_vampire> also F360
[06:27:47] <pink_vampire> Loetmichel2: what do you build?
[06:27:59] <pink_vampire> it's look like a server.
[06:29:55] <MrTrick> I'd like to build some simple MDF planetary gears. Any suggestions on ensuring CNC-ability, eg if I assume 3mm endmill?
[06:30:33] <minibnz> make sure your lobes of the gears are bigger than your cutter..
[06:30:33] <pink_vampire> MrTrick: just make the them round.
[06:30:41] <minibnz> and make them round.
[06:30:44] <pink_vampire> one sec I will show you..
[06:31:04] <pink_vampire> it's very easy to draw.
[06:31:17] <minibnz> just cut the profile. i have done a few attempts at this but my axis had too much backlash so it was egg shaped.
[06:31:22] <pink_vampire> MrTrick: http://i.imgur.com/paEAjWC.png
[06:31:28] <MrTrick> yup makes sense on both counts. I've got a particular sun->planet distance I need to have, and sun teeth == planet teeth.
[06:31:35] <minibnz> now i am working on the ball screws.. i have 17 out of 51 balls in place..
[06:31:41] <MrTrick> Otherwise not too concerned about how big the teeth are, etc.
[06:31:57] <minibnz> correct
[06:32:02] <pink_vampire> minibnz: I did it also!
[06:32:03] <MrTrick> pink_vampire: nifty.
[06:33:00] <minibnz> i have some drawn up that have 2mm lobes.. i cut it with a 2mm cutter and it was not that great, cut it with a 1mm cutter and better but still not round due to backlash
[06:33:27] <MrTrick> any tips on making them inside a CAD tool like solidworks?
[06:33:43] <minibnz> cut and past will be fun.. :)
[06:33:52] <MrTrick> (and by 'like solidworks', I mean 'solidworks'. The rest of the assembly is in solidworks. ^_^)
[06:34:12] <minibnz> i had problems getting each lobe to join to the next for extruding. other than that its pretty easy
[06:34:24] <pink_vampire> MrTrick: if you want 10 tooth gear you make 20 circles 10 become the teeth and 10 the space between them
[06:34:39] <MrTrick> pressure angle engagement etc etc etc?
[06:36:00] <pink_vampire> if you want to make the gear that I show, you make the circles in the diameter on your bit,
[06:36:14] <minibnz> circular lobes dont have that to worry about
[06:36:55] <minibnz> everything should mesh together correctly so there is always rounded surfaces running on a round groove.
[06:37:12] * MrTrick gives it a try
[06:37:40] <pink_vampire> you make all the circles on the one main one, and make all the small ones tangent, and equal.
[06:37:55] <pink_vampire> then you set the diameter. to one of them.
[06:38:34] <pink_vampire> and the main one need to change the diameter. according to the other,
[06:39:45] <pink_vampire> MrTrick: do you want me do show you the sketch?
[06:41:21] <pink_vampire> MrTrick:
[06:41:23] <pink_vampire> here
[06:41:31] <pink_vampire> http://i.imgur.com/atZzGXD.png
[06:42:02] <pink_vampire> MrTrick: ??
[06:42:35] <MrTrick> sorry had to bring in the washing
[06:43:01] <pink_vampire> o-k...
[06:43:11] <MrTrick> ah okay, nice - so two gears with tangential circles will mesh
[06:43:27] <pink_vampire> yes.
[06:43:34] <MrTrick> I see you left some wiggle room on the cutter dia
[06:43:47] <pink_vampire> yes,
[06:44:05] <pink_vampire> the cutter is 3.175
[06:44:18] <MrTrick> oh okay, not that much - I expected metric.
[06:44:25] <pink_vampire> and i did it 3.18
[06:44:35] <MrTrick> hmm.
[06:44:45] <MrTrick> I need to pick a distance and make the gears fit.
[06:44:56] <pink_vampire> if it's too close I can remove more material...
[06:45:08] <pink_vampire> 0.1-0.2mm
[06:45:15] <pink_vampire> is more then fine.
[06:45:33] <pink_vampire> make a test..
[06:45:38] <pink_vampire> it's 5 min to do it.
[06:45:56] <MrTrick> I suppose machining-wise one could do all the inside curves as drills
[06:46:54] <pink_vampire> I try to use minimum tools.
[06:47:13] <pink_vampire> so if anyway I'm going to use 1/8" end mill I will use it.
[06:47:43] <pink_vampire> it will be more accurate to use end mill. drill can slip to the side.
[06:47:58] <Loetmichel2> meh... the local numbing wears off.. it becomes uncreasiongly difficult to conxcentrate on work... :-(
[06:48:03] <pink_vampire> and you have to use spot drill before.
[06:48:43] <pink_vampire> Loetmichel2: what do you make?
[06:49:01] <minibnz> there are the usual rules about planetary gear sets..
[06:49:01] <minibnz> yay only 17 more to go..
[06:50:19] <pink_vampire> minibnz: what do you mean?
[06:50:28] <pink_vampire> what king of rules?
[06:50:28] <Loetmichel2> pink_vampire: the aluminium enclouse you have seen above.
[06:50:31] <Loetmichel2> times three
[06:50:51] <pink_vampire> but what is going to be?
[06:51:22] <Loetmichel2> RF shielding for a 2U 19" crypto server
[06:52:18] <MrTrick> pink_vampire: hmm, the tangent between small circles is not on the diameter of the large circle
[06:52:18] <minibnz> with planetary gearboxes there are certain numbers of combinations that will work.
[06:53:34] <minibnz> aaahh thats better.. i got all 51 balls back in to my nut and it spins much nicer on the nylon mandrel, now lets hope it runs well on the screw..
[06:54:26] <pink_vampire> you make a main circle then make on in the small circles (the center point of the small circle is coincident to the main circle.
[06:55:13] <pink_vampire> all the circles are equal, and the edge of them tangent to each other,
[06:55:24] <Tom_itx> so the tangent would be on the 4.76 OD
[06:55:51] <Tom_itx> err whatever the larger circle is
[06:55:57] <pink_vampire> the main circle have to be free to change diameter.
[06:56:28] <pink_vampire> Tom_itx: if your cutter is 4.76mm so the small circle is on that size.
[06:56:55] <Tom_itx> so you divide the circumference by the number of 'teeth' you want and by 2 to get the D for the small ones
[06:57:24] <Tom_itx> unless it has to be a certain 'pitch'
[06:57:33] <Tom_itx> then you are limited
[06:57:35] <pink_vampire> no...
[06:57:36] <MrTrick> yeah I had them 180degree - didn't quite work.
[06:57:52] <pink_vampire> solidworks do it for you.
[06:57:58] <Tom_itx> i wrote a macro for my cad to draw gears
[06:58:36] <Loetmichel2> pink_vampire: its an RF-shielding enclosure for a 2u 19" rack-crypto-server
[06:59:00] <Tom_itx> Loetmichel2 haven't you made enough of those already? :)
[06:59:14] <Loetmichel2> Tom_itx: its my job
[06:59:15] <pink_vampire> crypto-server?
[06:59:25] <Loetmichel2> so no, not until my retirement is trhere ;)
[06:59:30] <Tom_itx> he stores cryptonite in it
[06:59:57] <Loetmichel2> pink_vampire: linux server wioth some hardwired crypto cards in it
[07:00:08] <Loetmichel2> encrypt/(decrypt
[07:00:39] <pink_vampire> it's a product that you develop?
[07:00:52] <Loetmichel2> no, we only make the shielding
[07:00:59] <Loetmichel2> its an ultimaco HSM
[07:01:19] <Loetmichel2> but thats not "quiet" as to european standards
[07:01:54] <Loetmichel2> so it needs additional shieleding to fir into "secret" and "nato secret" enviroments
[07:02:03] <pink_vampire> ultimaco HSM is the brand?
[07:02:16] <Loetmichel2> ultimaco is the company that makes it
[07:02:27] <Loetmichel2> HSM is the produict
[07:03:14] <Loetmichel2> https://hsm.utimaco.com/de/cryptoserver/cryptoserver-sdk/ <-right side down
[07:03:51] <pink_vampire> nice!!!
[07:04:35] <pink_vampire> how did they found you?
[07:04:49] <Loetmichel2> ?
[07:04:56] <Loetmichel2> they didnt
[07:05:53] <Loetmichel2> we do that as a customers order. cutomer wants the servers to be "sdip-27 level B" so we do whats neccessary to pass the (inhouse) measurement chamber
[07:07:12] <pink_vampire> so you took a server and rebuild it?
[07:07:23] <Loetmichel2> no
[07:07:31] <Loetmichel2> i cant even open it. it ssealed
[07:07:40] <Loetmichel2> u out an enclosure AROUND it
[07:07:49] <Loetmichel2> i put
[07:08:26] <Loetmichel2> "box in a box" design
[07:09:21] <pink_vampire> the original box is that bad?
[07:12:43] <Loetmichel2> its not bad
[07:13:11] <Loetmichel2> but the levels of RF EMI thats allowed at that level of tempest shielding is SO low...
[07:14:04] <pink_vampire> I need to make it to my servo motors
[07:14:22] <pink_vampire> that make sooo much noise.
[07:16:09] <pink_vampire> they*
[07:17:34] <pink_vampire> 9gag.com/gag/ab0BMnO
[07:17:36] <Loetmichel2> we have to meet ~ -80dBµV in 1 meter distans at certain frequencies...
[07:17:53] <Loetmichel2> thatsd not doable in "normal" enclosures
[07:18:08] <Loetmichel2> you need a bunch of filters and stuff to go there
[07:19:13] <pink_vampire> how do you measure the rf noise?
[07:20:13] <Loetmichel2> we have two measiurement chambers with Spectrum analyzers
[07:20:51] <Loetmichel2> we are certified to do BSI Zone and sdip27 Measurements
[07:22:15] <pink_vampire> do you have any idea how to lower the rf from DC servos?
[07:22:42] <Loetmichel2> filters
[07:22:52] <Loetmichel2> INductor and ferrite bead
[07:23:15] <Loetmichel2> and of course generously Capacitors in the drivers/psu
[07:24:19] <pink_vampire> I have 4 10,000 uf capacitors,
[07:25:09] <pink_vampire> the noise come from the brush in the dc motor,
[07:25:34] <pink_vampire> on the holding position the noise is very high.
[07:33:28] <minibnz> ahhh much better now.. just took all the balls out and cleaned the nut and balls then repacked them and greased them all up with lithium grease and she slides so nice now.. lets hope the backlash test is as good :)
[07:34:47] <minibnz> its so nice and smooth to crank the handle.. i have to wait for a coupler to connect my stepper motor up before i can test it.. i also have to cut the shaft down by 25mm so i can connect the stepper.. but thats all good for now.. very happy with the way the axis feel
[07:35:30] <pink_vampire> minibnz: what kind of ballscrew are you using?
[07:35:45] <minibnz> was getting worried i wasn't going to be able to put it all back together again.. and no i didn't take any photos and no im not taking it apart again for photos..
[07:36:03] <minibnz> umm let me find the link that i got them thru
[07:37:13] <minibnz> http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/291665155964?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
[07:37:36] <minibnz> all they say is TAIWANESE 1605-400mm 16mm
[07:38:59] <minibnz> much nicer than the stock leadscrews i had in there.. they had 0.58mm of backlash...
[07:39:50] <minibnz> thats why when i was trying to cut gears they would bind up when i turned them in the housings. everything was egg shaped.
[07:40:04] <minibnz> now i hope i will get near perfect circles
[07:41:40] <minibnz> it wouldnt have been too bad if i was cutting bigger gears but these ones i was trying were pretty small some 15mm others 19mm and the big one about 40mm
[07:42:43] <minibnz> i even tried tweaking my tooltable to oversize/undersize them but still no full rotation was possible even with a crap load of hand filing/shaping
[07:43:46] <pink_vampire> minibnz: look the same as mine.
[07:44:01] <minibnz> personally i think they all look alike.
[07:44:15] <pink_vampire> they have about 0.01 of less backless.
[07:44:17] <minibnz> i cant tell the difference between a good one and an ugly one.
[07:44:33] <pink_vampire> you can get it better with over size balls.
[07:44:48] <pink_vampire> for home machine is more then fine.
[07:44:55] <minibnz> i bought into their marketing about shipping them in a big box ect..
[07:45:40] <minibnz> i measured 0.02mm last night on the Y axis have to wait for the coupler to arrive tommorrow or the next day before i can do a proper test
[07:46:11] <minibnz> that axis 'Y' is belt driven so that might explain the extra 0.01
[07:46:35] <Sync> if everything is tight, the belt should not add much
[07:46:51] <minibnz> its pretty tight
[07:47:01] <minibnz> cant quite pluck a note on it but its tight
[07:47:48] <Sync> hm, those are not preloaded
[07:48:17] <pink_vampire> is there a reason that you using belt drive??
[07:49:56] <minibnz> was to keep the handle in place without it sticking out too far. and i can add a bigger pulley to easily change the ratio if i need more drive.
[07:50:44] <pink_vampire> why do you want handle??
[07:51:00] <minibnz> i like to be able to free hand a part
[07:51:23] <minibnz> good for when i want to use it as a drill press
[07:53:47] <minibnz> when i get a lathe i will CNC that but will also keep the handles..
[07:54:32] <minibnz> as looking at the C3 from seig. i can have one at my door for ~$1300au
[07:55:49] <pink_vampire> what kind a machine is that??
[07:56:21] <pink_vampire> and you can do "free hand" stuff from the controller.
[07:57:04] <minibnz> http://www.ausee.com.au/shop/category.aspx?catid=52
[07:58:35] <pink_vampire> minibnz: DON'T
[07:58:42] <pink_vampire> it's junk!
[07:58:57] <minibnz> yeah i could freehand with the controller but its not the same.. im not a qualified machinist and what machine work i have done on a mill has been by feel.. and guess work
[07:58:58] <minibnz> so with that said i need to learn how hard i can push a cutter thru different materials on my mill
[07:59:09] <pink_vampire> it's the same one that HF sell and I had it at the past. soooo junk!
[07:59:10] <minibnz> oh really i read it was ok..
[07:59:27] <pink_vampire> no! it is junk.
[07:59:32] <minibnz> ok i will take your word over what i have read..
[07:59:47] <Sync> that thing is suprisingly expensive over there
[07:59:50] <Sync> but it is okay
[08:00:18] <pink_vampire> also 14" is too small, the chuck take and the tailstock.
[08:00:26] <minibnz> i really have questions and would like to handcrank one to see how it feels. they have them at hare n forbes (where i got my X2 clone)
[08:00:57] <pink_vampire> the gibs,, soo junk.
[08:01:07] <minibnz> the only really long things i have ever made on a lathe has been illeagal so there is no real loss if its short :)
[08:01:18] <Sync> nothing that you can't fix
[08:01:20] <pink_vampire> you have to super close them to make is cut something.
[08:01:22] <minibnz> but if the bed and slides are crap thats a no deal for me.
[08:01:36] <Sync> they all are on the chinese lathes
[08:01:41] <Sync> expect to scrape it
[08:01:41] <pink_vampire> Sync: I have the same problem with my Z axis.
[08:02:01] <pink_vampire> but on the lathe it's not taperd,
[08:02:13] <Sync> well, take the gib out and scrape it
[08:02:18] <Sync> a little goes a long way
[08:02:36] <minibnz> scrape it? i have heard this is how they did things in the old days, bascially scraping a bit of toolsteel over all the gibs and slides to get it nice and flat.
[08:03:05] <pink_vampire> minibnz: if you want to get something go with the 22"
[08:03:11] <OdinYggd> Its a lost art, if you can get good at it you can make a lot of money
[08:03:12] <minibnz> isnt there a modern way to do this?
[08:03:18] <OdinYggd> But you won't have any wrists left
[08:03:35] * OdinYggd looking to hire a scraping expert to fix a 72" HBM way
[08:03:52] <pink_vampire> http://grizzly.com/products/10-x-22-Bench-Top-Metal-Lathe/G0602
[08:04:23] <minibnz> http://www.ausee.com.au/shop/item.aspx?itemid=252
[08:05:34] <minibnz> i think yours is a better option.. now to find a AU reseller
[08:06:26] <pink_vampire> minibnz: it's also very famous for conversions
[08:07:44] <minibnz> sweet it looks much nicer..
[08:07:59] <minibnz> getting it up my stairs will be a challenge..
[08:08:36] <pink_vampire> http://www.tormach.com/product_lathe.html
[08:09:21] <pink_vampire> minibnz: but you know that if you have 3axis cnc machine you can just add rotory axis.
[08:09:25] <minibnz> this is the replacement http://www.machineryhouse.com.au/L149 from hare n forbes for the grizly
[08:09:34] <minibnz> i have the 4th axis
[08:10:10] <pink_vampire> minibnz: so why do you want also a lathe?
[08:10:40] <minibnz> my mill/4th axis is not a lathe.
[08:11:04] <minibnz> its not as good as a lathe..
[08:11:12] <minibnz> but its better than a lathe :)
[08:11:49] <minibnz> i have seen where people add a lathe head to their mill but my mill is too small for those shinanigans.
[08:12:20] <minibnz> its good to be able to turn up a mandrel for the 4th axis
[08:12:48] <pink_vampire> ok..
[08:13:30] <minibnz> also its good to be able to size down a peice of stock so it fits in the 4th axis.
[08:13:59] <Sync> minibnz: there is not
[08:14:12] <pink_vampire> I need to find a way to mount arduino mega on a pcb..
[08:14:17] <Sync> usually fine milling or grinding gets you there, but for the ultimate surface contact scraping is the only way to go
[08:14:46] <minibnz> i see..
[08:15:07] <Sync> the neat thing is, it is cheap and easy
[08:17:05] <pink_vampire> ?
[08:17:25] <minibnz> what sort of mega?
[08:18:10] <minibnz> i think you can get the 644 in a dip package
[08:18:37] <minibnz> you might be able to buy a bare board tha
[08:18:41] <pink_vampire> minibnz: I want the whole arduino board to connect to a pcb.
[08:18:42] <minibnz> that is a breakout
[08:19:14] <minibnz> oh use header pins.
[08:20:05] <minibnz> if you google you can get tech drawings of the hole spacing so you can etch and drill one
[08:20:09] <minibnz> or mill one.
[08:22:28] <minibnz> im not sure if they fixed it but the original mega's were not compatible with vero strip board.
[08:22:55] <minibnz> you could also buy a proto board that has dot board with all the right spacing to mate up on to and arduino
[08:23:26] <minibnz> like this http://www.jaycar.com.au/Kits%2C-Science-%26-Learning/Electronic-Project-Kits/Computer-%26-Programming/ProtoShield-Short-for-Arduino/p/XC4248
[08:23:37] <pink_vampire> I need to make arduino mega with terminal blocks.
[08:24:20] <minibnz> there are terminal block sheilds already..
[08:24:30] <pink_vampire> minibnz: I did something with the nano at the past..
[08:24:49] <pink_vampire> so I want to do the same with the mega.
[08:24:57] <pink_vampire> http://i.imgur.com/rCM4Eyo.png?1
[08:25:09] <pink_vampire> do you see how the nano go on the board?
[08:25:46] <minibnz> which mega ?
[08:25:58] <jdh> check out the cheap RBBB kits
[08:26:43] <minibnz> like this https://www.google.com.au/search?q=terminal+block+arduino&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjqjb_M6tHLAhVk56YKHaxSD-sQsAQIGw&biw=1051&bih=559
[08:27:28] <minibnz> actually this link.. https://www.tindie.com/products/duanebenson/universal-screw-block-proto-shield-system-for-arduino/
[08:27:59] <Simonious> Got it finally yesterday: https://goo.gl/photos/JrAbVieuTkkaLsdN9
[08:28:26] <Simonious> My next challenge is to cut away everything except the image here: https://goo.gl/photos/EZRDxrDhW5rEDzzt5
[08:29:59] <pink_vampire> minibnz:
[08:30:08] <pink_vampire> I wikk just invert it.
[08:30:13] <pink_vampire> will*
[08:31:56] <pink_vampire> I have better idea
[08:32:14] <pink_vampire> to mount to arduino up side down
[08:33:14] <MrTrick> pink_vampire: some success. :-)
[08:34:17] <MrTrick> http://i.imgur.com/wyOGyf6.png
[08:34:46] <Simonious> MrTrick: why not go with 3 or 4 planetary gears?
[08:34:50] <pink_vampire> GOOD!
[08:35:30] <MrTrick> because. :-)
[08:35:35] <minibnz> just make one more gear nothing else chanaged
[08:35:36] <minibnz> s
[08:35:42] <MrTrick> (sun and ring and one planet have fixed axles.
[08:35:46] <pink_vampire> that look so awesome! I'm proud of you!
[08:36:08] <MrTrick> pity I need to redo the ring gear slightly, but otherwise all good. ;-)
[08:36:11] <MrTrick> now sleep time.
[08:36:13] * MrTrick zzzz
[08:36:21] <Simonious> the ring has no axle..
[08:36:38] <pink_vampire> good nighq MrTrick
[08:37:32] <pink_vampire> any idea how to mount a pcb in 90 degrees?
[08:38:13] <minibnz> you can get right angle pins and sockets but that will only do half the board easy
[08:38:38] <Simonious> 3d print a mount? http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:20870
[08:38:38] <pink_vampire> I mean with screws.
[08:39:14] <pink_vampire> that not bad!!
[08:39:34] <pink_vampire> I have din rails mounts.
[08:44:02] <minibnz> bedtime for me... got work tomorrow
[08:44:17] <pink_vampire> good night,
[09:09:22] <Loetmichel2> maaaan, i would wish the CNC would speed up a bit... still a few parts togo before i can go home today... and the painkissers dont work any more... :-(
[09:10:18] <pink_vampire> better motors?
[09:12:22] <Loetmichel2> -ss+ll
[09:12:48] <pink_vampire> ????
[09:14:40] <pink_vampire> I need a wrench for M2 nuts.
[09:15:02] <pink_vampire> that drive me nuts
[09:23:02] * archivist_herron shudders at mdf gears
[09:24:11] <pink_vampire> archivist: do you like brass
[09:24:16] <pink_vampire> I know..
[09:24:32] <archivist_herron> brass is easy to cut
[09:24:40] <pink_vampire> I
[09:24:52] <pink_vampire> I've got 2 sheets of brass.
[09:24:54] <archivist_herron> ok for clock gears and other light work
[09:25:01] <pink_vampire> I need to go and get more.
[09:25:17] <archivist_herron> not all brass is suitable
[09:25:22] <pink_vampire> do you know a good way to connect aluminum to brass?
[09:25:44] <archivist_herron> fasteners
[09:27:16] <Loetmichel2> archivist: could be nice. if the MDF is vacuum-infused with 2k resin
[09:27:21] <pink_vampire> one sec I will show you
[09:28:06] <Loetmichel2> pink_vampire: get some brass tubing and an M2 nutor three and make one
[09:28:11] <pink_vampire> http://i.imgur.com/3sBfKBr.png
[09:28:49] <Loetmichel2> pink_vampire: http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=11795
[09:28:58] <pink_vampire> back is 1/8" aluminum and the letters are 1/16" brass.
[09:29:02] <Loetmichel2> thats a tube wrence fopr M3
[09:29:15] <Loetmichel2> made by simply pressing the tube onto a nut
[09:29:28] <pink_vampire> cool!
[09:29:41] <archivist_herron> a glue can hold the letters on
[09:30:27] <pink_vampire> what kind?
[09:30:34] <archivist_herron> epoxy
[09:31:02] <archivist_herron> depends on expected lifetime
[09:31:20] <pink_vampire> 50 years
[09:31:37] <archivist_herron> then dont use two different metals
[09:31:58] <archivist_herron> you will get electrolytic corrosion
[09:32:42] <pink_vampire> how I can prevent it?
[09:34:31] <archivist_herron> a lacquer possibly but will need redoing every few years
[09:35:02] <pink_vampire> what about grease?
[09:35:23] <Loetmichel2> put a layer of photocopy foil between the parts
[09:35:24] <archivist_herron> hardly the right material for a sign
[09:35:32] <Loetmichel2> and use nylon screws
[09:36:02] <Loetmichel2> so that the two metals have nowhere any direct contact and are insulated from each other
[09:36:07] <Loetmichel2> electrically
[09:36:23] <Loetmichel2> no current path: no galvanic corrosion
[09:37:02] <OdinYggd> Keeping a film of grease between them would insulate them against the low voltages of galvanic corrosion
[09:37:10] <OdinYggd> But if moisture gets in there instead of grease, goodbye charlie
[09:37:28] <pink_vampire> double sided tape..
[09:37:29] <archivist_herron> if out doors shit collects on it causing the conductive path
[09:37:50] <pink_vampire> it's on the top of the electrical panel.
[09:37:58] <pink_vampire> is the name of the machine.
[09:38:13] <archivist_herron> the machine wont last that long :)
[09:38:33] <pink_vampire> what do you mean?
[09:38:38] <OdinYggd> Bird droppings are corrosive too
[09:38:49] <OdinYggd> If its outdoors nature will reclaim that which it rightly owns
[09:39:52] <lair82> Good morning all, what is the name of the file that I need to modify to add "radeon.modeset=0", it's something like grub.cfg-conf-????. I added to the grub boot line, but I must need to add it directly to the file because it was not there when I re-booted the machine.
[09:41:50] <pink_vampire> lair82: #linux
[09:51:09] <cradek> lair82: on my debian machine it's /etc/default/grub
[09:51:31] <cradek> GRUB_CMDLINE_LINUX_DEFAULT I guess
[09:58:22] <CaptHindsight> I'm glad that they fixed grub2 and made it easier to make persistent changes
[10:01:23] <CaptHindsight> lair82: is kernel mode setting broken on your machine?
[10:09:19] <lair82> CaptHindsight, I don't follow, last week I had some problems on a fresh install of wheezy with RT faults, the only thing that fixed it was adding radeon.modeset=0 to the end of the grub line that starts with "linux,,,,,,", but when I re-booted this morning, I had a RT fault when I started linuxcnc, so I re-booted again, and realized that I did not see that at the end of that line, so I barely recall needing to actually modify a
[10:09:19] <lair82> grub file from another build a long time ago
[10:10:03] <lair82> but what cradek said, is starting to ring a bell
[10:11:48] <FinboySlick> lair82: With grub2, the config is auto generated from templates. Modifying the config directly won't last. You have to edit the templates as cradek suggested.
[10:14:37] <Crom_> morning
[10:14:39] <CaptHindsight> lair82: fresh Wheezy 2.7.4 ISO from Linuxcnc?
[10:21:55] <CaptHindsight> I haven't tried the latest Wheezy with RTAI 5. But maybe paulo already broke it
[10:22:48] <CaptHindsight> lair82: please let me know the exact version of the ISO and I'll confirm weather or not RTAI is broken again
[10:25:04] <CaptHindsight> weather/whether
[10:30:28] <lair82> CaptHindsight, here is a screen grab, https://app.box.com/s/meznvljzqk50p6vtlnkf18obbhmq4ore,
[10:31:21] <lair82> I couldn't tell you exactly how old the iso on my thumb drive is
[10:39:28] <CaptHindsight> anyone recognize which version linuxcnc uses that kernel version?
[10:39:35] <Simonious> I need help with my next challenge: https://goo.gl/photos/wGLQ5zQQMo2tXYi56 <- I created this in Inkscape from an image - now it's obviously in fusion360, but so far I haven't been able to generate any toolpaths - what did I miss?
[10:40:29] <Simonious> Hmm engrave works I guess.. I want the image itself to be left standing up and everything else removed
[10:41:05] <Simonious> how do I make it go around the outside of the line?
[10:41:10] <Simonious> instead of on the inside?
[10:49:17] <lair82> How can I find out which version is on my thumb drive?
[10:51:01] <__rob> how tights do you normally go with an ER collet?
[10:51:22] <__rob> just clamped a 10mm long endmill, as tight as I can, and it hanging off at an angle
[10:51:23] <CaptHindsight> 20 ft lbs
[10:51:34] <lair82> CaptHindsight, what I have on my thumbdrive was downloaded and created on July 22, 2015
[10:51:41] <lair82> If that helps
[10:51:43] <CaptHindsight> measured by hand, not a torque wrench
[10:52:02] <__rob> how do you measure by hand ?
[10:52:14] <__rob> think i'm over tightening
[10:52:25] <__rob> this one as it was a long end mill showed it badly
[10:52:36] <CaptHindsight> after tightening bolts for 40 years you sort of get a feel
[10:53:29] <CaptHindsight> __rob: something bend or get scored?
[10:53:31] <gregcnc> ER16 is speced at ~40ft-lb
[10:54:29] <gregcnc> clean everything. the nut too. is it a decent collet?
[10:56:49] <__rob> Capt, yea, well the collet looked ok
[10:56:57] <gregcnc> I've had cheap collets with burrs on the ID
[10:57:01] <__rob> but the end mill tip was flying around
[10:57:04] <__rob> like 1mm runout
[10:57:09] <__rob> managed to cut a wavey profile, lol
[10:57:17] <__rob> not ideal
[10:57:33] <pink_vampire> https://onetesla.com/oneTesla_User_Manual.pdf
[10:57:57] <CaptHindsight> time to throw out some bad collets?
[10:58:33] <SpeedEvil> sure the spindle isn't bent?
[10:58:37] <OdinYggd> Excess tool length?
[10:58:41] <pink_vampire> __rob: what is your original shank?
[10:58:44] <SpeedEvil> probably less likely than the ...
[10:58:52] <OdinYggd> How much of the endmill was hanging out
[10:58:57] <OdinYggd> 10mm isn't as stiff as it looks
[10:59:30] <pink_vampire> what type of spindle are you using?
[10:59:59] <gregcnc> tormach in a tts holder?
[11:00:00] <__rob> shank is 10mm
[11:00:13] <__rob> just put it in a 10mm set screw
[11:00:15] <__rob> its fine
[11:00:23] <__rob> but yea, assumed collet would be ok
[11:00:26] <__rob> that was really bad
[11:00:56] <gregcnc> did you span the flat well in the collet?
[11:02:31] <CaptHindsight> if a 10mm end mill is spun in a set screw collet offset 1mm from center, what size path with it cut? (answers are on back of card)
[11:03:37] <pink_vampire> pics..
[11:05:18] <SpeedEvil> CaptHindsight: do you include the path cut by the flying shards?
[11:05:24] <cradek> "it depends"
[11:06:49] <FloppyDisk> Simonious - not sure w/ fusion, but I would export that as dxf, then import to sW's into a sketch. Then extrude and then use hsmxpress to create outside tool path.
[11:06:52] <cradek> it at least depends on how many flutes there are and which way they point
[11:07:10] <cradek> I think it may cut more or less than 10mm or not really cut at all
[11:07:29] <Simonious> FloppyDisk: fusion360 <-> hmsXpress
[11:07:46] <Simonious> FloppyDisk: I prefer the route of F360, because it supports 3D toolpaths and because it isn't integrated into SW
[11:08:06] <Simonious> it's pretty much the same animal anyway from what I'm told - same guts as HMS
[11:08:35] <FloppyDisk> Understood- not trying to convert at all, just don't know f360 or the work flow for that. Just a suggestion.
[11:09:22] <Simonious> *nods* Thanks!
[11:09:48] <CaptHindsight> cradek: if you install a 9 month old version of Wheezy Linuxcnc and then run All The Updates will you then be running the equivalent of a new install of 2.7.4?
[11:09:50] <OdinYggd> Biggest advantage of F360 is it doesn't require a high end GPU
[11:10:07] <OdinYggd> Its cloud-based 3D modelling- all of the number grunting is done on their cloud system
[11:10:18] <OdinYggd> You only need enough of a PC and internet connection to display the results
[11:10:21] <FloppyDisk> pink_vampire- my buddy works at Tesla, this was his weekend ride: http://www.ijohnsen.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2016/03/20160319_113759.jpg
[11:10:27] <FloppyDisk> that's me....
[11:10:57] <OdinYggd> soldworks gets to be a whiny little snot about having a supported GPU, and will not run right if you don't
[11:11:13] <cradek> I think the answer is yes, but your question tells me you might have a misunderstanding: we do not make a new cd image for every linuxcnc release. installing the wheezy image and running the updates is the ONLY way to get an up-to-date install.
[11:12:20] <cradek> CaptHindsight: if you have an older wheezy+linuxcnc image you can easily get a new one (downloading only differences) using zsync
[11:12:42] <cradek> CaptHindsight: http://www.linuxcnc.org/docs/html/getting-started/getting-linuxcnc.html#_download_using_zsync
[11:13:13] <pink_vampire> someone recognize the component here?
[11:13:14] <pink_vampire> http://www.ebay.com/itm/For-Arduino-AVR-PIC-KEYES-KY-010-Photo-Interrupter-Module-GM-/262136736004?hash=item3d08912904:g:QXwAAOSwuAVWy-IX
[11:13:14] <CaptHindsight> cradek: yeah, it's been a while since I used a ISO from Linuxcnc, looks like early 2014
[11:13:43] <lair82> So, I ran all the updates that synaptic wanted last week when I made my new ssd, so my machine should be good to go?
[11:13:44] <cradek> if it's from the 2.6 era you may have to change the sources to 2.7, but it will update fine
[11:14:26] <CaptHindsight> heh, it was the hybrid ISO
[11:14:52] <cradek> al the wheezys are hybrid (meaning ok for dvd or memstick)
[11:14:56] <cradek> all
[11:16:42] <CaptHindsight> these have notes on them from Jepler and seb, these must have been tests
[11:17:14] <CaptHindsight> I want to test what lair82 is having problems with
[11:17:38] <CaptHindsight> either KMS or RTAI has broken something
[11:19:06] <lair82> The latency on a 1ms servo thread went from mid 70's to around 4 grand after I put that radeon.modeset=0 into the grub line.
[11:22:31] <CaptHindsight> I was just putting anew mill together and was going to try the latest Wheezy install anyway and I have similar AMD hardware
[11:39:09] <Simonious> how do I locate/get rid of this error? https://goo.gl/photos/BjCTAu7z8vdqHybV8
[11:40:32] <Not-Renny> Hey, this is a thing.
[11:45:40] <Simonious> ahh, finally foundit
[11:45:40] <FloppyDisk> Simonious - looks like you don't have connected points on your curves/lines. PIA...
[11:45:46] <FloppyDisk> good! what was it?
[11:45:57] <Simonious> no idea.. but I retraced it with spline and removed the original
[11:46:03] <Simonious> the one tiny part..
[11:46:30] <Simonious> it was in orange-red, but it was so small it took a while to spot it.
[11:52:17] <Crom_> doing some laser engraving right now
[11:52:34] <Simonious> awesome
[11:57:57] <maxcnc> Hi all
[11:58:09] <maxcnc> cool things going on here
[11:58:23] <maxcnc> Simonious: do you got a dxf of the dragon to share
[11:58:49] <maxcnc> or only a png jpg
[11:59:10] <Simonious> maxcnc: it's a griffin, I'll ask the owner
[11:59:54] <maxcnc> Np
[11:59:58] <maxcnc> no need for
[12:02:05] <maxcnc> many in the net
[12:07:26] <Simonious> maxcnc: it's a good question though, needs to be asked - I'm doing this for SCA, if you are familiar.
[12:08:03] <maxcnc> do you shade it
[12:08:31] <maxcnc> http://de.123rf.com/lizenzfreie-bilder/ph%C3%B6nix.html
[12:08:55] <Simonious> I don't know what that means - are we talking variable depth? not as such, I'm not planning to raster cut it, I'm planning to etch it, so that it stands up while the background is cut away
[12:09:42] <maxcnc> if you make parts double laser then it geths more depth
[12:09:52] <Simonious> I'm doing this on a CNC router
[12:10:28] <Loetmichel2> re @ home. maaan, what a relief.. 2* 25mg diclofenac and the pain disappears ;) for once its nice to have a wife with a bad hip...(and strong painkillers on medication)
[12:13:49] <Jymmm> Loetmichel2: if you weren't in .de, you could just get her some weed
[12:25:52] <maxcnc> Simonious: http://landauer-weihnachtscircus-gmbh.de/grif_pic.png
[12:26:11] <maxcnc> just some minutes from pic grapped in inet to dxf gcode
[12:26:23] <maxcnc> via gimp and incscape to qcad
[12:26:32] <Simonious> cool :) I'm pretty slow and novice at this stuff yet
[12:27:31] <maxcnc> the picture hoster do now use Gray 128,128,128 for there savty overlays in BW so its the easiest thing to grap
[12:27:56] <maxcnc> as gip color grap at 48-52 % knocks this off
[12:28:05] <maxcnc> one paint in black
[12:28:12] <maxcnc> invert paint in white
[12:28:18] <maxcnc> and you are on
[12:28:26] * Simonious nods
[12:28:37] <maxcnc> same as on openclipart at 2000x200 pixels
[12:29:14] <maxcnc> the keybordbutton screen capture gets you in line is your
[12:29:18] <Simonious> that's fast and it looks great
[12:30:10] <maxcnc> https://rfclipart.com/image/big/33-bd-cc/heraldic-griffin-Download-Royalty-free-Vector-File-EPS-96753.jpg
[12:30:14] <maxcnc> from here
[12:30:20] <maxcnc> screen capture
[12:30:47] <maxcnc> yeah incscape got a BIGblueSAW output
[12:30:58] <maxcnc> way better then the conventionel DXF
[12:31:16] <maxcnc> its tiny ol 1inchby 1inch but qcad scale is amazing
[12:32:00] <maxcnc> ok im off till later bye 1hr to work
[12:45:27] <pink_vampire> ?
[13:00:46] <pink_vampire> http://www.ebay.com/itm/140864347618
[13:01:40] <pink_vampire> can I do drag knife with them without servo spindle?
[13:14:11] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: Um, OUCH... http://reltekllc.com/productlist/b45b45thadhesive,coatingsystempotting.aspx
[13:15:02] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: 50ml = $66 USD, 1.5gal = $768 USD
[13:15:18] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: 30gal = $7623 USD
[13:17:56] <pink_vampire> and why you need it?
[13:17:58] <pink_vampire> http://9gag.com/tv/p/aG1o4n/this-process-of-building-a-fast-pc-watercooled-liquid-artsy-porno?ref=tcr
[13:18:11] <pink_vampire> look nice all the cnc parts.
[13:19:10] <maxcnc> Hi back and finish work for today
[13:20:17] <maxcnc> Simonious: ?
[13:21:08] <Simonious> hmm?
[13:21:18] <maxcnc> engraved
[13:21:31] <maxcnc> your griffin
[13:21:45] <Simonious> I'm working on other things at the moment!
[13:21:56] <Simonious> but I want the griffin to stand up while everything else is cut aay
[13:22:13] <Simonious> found the image I started from: http://northshield.org/Resources/graphics/griffin.jpg - I bet you can have it in a clean DXF in under 3 minutes :P
[13:22:36] <maxcnc> Thanks
[13:24:35] <pink_vampire> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Lot-10pcs-HSS-Endmills-4Flute-Cutting-Dia-1-5mm-Shank-Dia-6mm-End-Milling-Cutter-/111931068794?hash=item1a0f9c917a:g:pGAAAOxyi3FRzEfG
[13:25:00] <pink_vampire> what do you think about that for brass, aluminum and mild steel?
[13:25:16] <pink_vampire> archivist: ? XXCoder?
[13:25:24] <pink_vampire> SpeedEvil: ?
[13:29:30] <CaptHindsight> Jymmm: it's a highly flexible epoxy, flexible cost more $ for raw components
[13:29:54] <cradek> I think: maybe, probably not, nope
[13:30:05] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: That's bent over no lube pricing though
[13:30:54] <CaptHindsight> Jymmm: the 30 gal price isn't too bad, the problem with small quantities is that you have to buy your raw components by the 200Kg (55gal) drum
[13:31:34] <gregcnc> what do I need to know about shipping a 2000Lb machine?
[13:31:37] <maxcnc> Simonious: http://www.heimwerkermarkt-tretter.de/griffin.zip DONE including NGC
[13:31:43] <gregcnc> pink www.ebay.com/itm/381185118044
[13:32:38] <cradek> gregcnc: rent a forklift at both ends, have a nice long crowbar and rollers, use uship.com
[13:32:53] <maxcnc> Simonious: 8min with nc code
[13:32:58] <CaptHindsight> gregcnc: don't try to lift it yourself
[13:33:03] <gregcnc> how do you get a forklift at home?
[13:33:04] <maxcnc> im not that fast today
[13:33:19] <cradek> rent it from a machinery rental place
[13:34:24] <CaptHindsight> gregcnc: tilt bed trailer
[13:35:09] <CaptHindsight> winch em up, slide em down
[13:35:14] <pink_vampire> gregcnc: thanks, but I'm limited to 1000 rpm :(
[13:35:27] <CaptHindsight> rollers and or a pallet jack for the last few feet
[13:35:32] <cradek> then you can't really use cutters that small
[13:35:33] <pink_vampire> this is why I want the 4 flutes
[13:35:34] <gregcnc> I have a trailer avail, but not tilt we moved the ~1200lb emco on a paller jack like that, but it was a bit hairy coming down
[13:36:08] <cradek> yes the couple of feet from the ground to trailer and back are the hardest part of the move
[13:36:25] <CaptHindsight> without a trailer you need a crane or forklift
[13:36:34] <gregcnc> going up was easy with the winch
[13:36:47] <CaptHindsight> or backhoe or similar
[13:37:38] <CaptHindsight> gregcnc: Whiteys has moved a few for me
[13:37:49] <CaptHindsight> they are by the skating rink
[13:38:16] <gregcnc> well since they will load for free I'll figure it out on this end I do know someone with a larger skid steer and forks
[13:38:21] <CaptHindsight> oh, it was Anchor
[13:38:47] <pink_vampire> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Carbide-Burs-FG557-Friction-Grip-Midwest-Type-Made-by-Kerr-4-burs-/141558175876?hash=item20f5865884:g:P3QAAOSw8d9Uyn1s
[13:38:58] <pink_vampire> that bit look very nice.
[13:39:12] <pink_vampire> but it's friction grip.
[13:39:32] <pink_vampire> I'm not sure how good it will be for a cnc.
[13:39:44] <gregcnc> the machine isn't local or a tow would be great
[13:39:51] <CaptHindsight> gregcnc: build up a ramp made of sand and wood, like the pyramid builders
[13:40:10] <gregcnc> I'll consider it
[13:40:24] <CaptHindsight> slaves are optional
[13:40:51] <maxcnc> Simonious: here the gcode test on camotics http://foengarage.de/camogriffin.png
[13:43:02] <CaptHindsight> gregcnc: http://www.edsrental.com/forklift-3000-lb-capacity
[13:43:03] <maxcnc> today i ordert first time TBL rails insted of SBL its now nearly the same price for double stiffness
[13:44:01] <maxcnc> Simonious: no back command on the looser 8min work flow
[13:44:10] <CaptHindsight> well worth it
[13:44:38] <gregcnc> was looking at that, you have to rent a trailer to move it too?
[13:44:43] <CaptHindsight> gregcnc: there's a guy with a 80 ton crane I rent from in Waconda
[13:45:18] <CaptHindsight> gregcnc: Ed's is pretty good about cutting you a deal on the trailer and the lift if you can drive it
[13:45:42] <gregcnc> OK good to know
[13:46:02] <CaptHindsight> i rent their scissor lift from time to time
[13:46:23] <CaptHindsight> the overnight rate is also the 3 hour rate
[13:46:33] <pink_vampire> http://www.ebay.com/itm/100pcs-Tungsten-carbide-burs-FG-557-/161471648020?hash=item259875d114:g:xqIAAOxy79JSYj2A
[13:46:53] <CaptHindsight> but it's from 5pm and it has to be back by 7am
[13:47:10] <pink_vampire> 25% from the cost of "end mill"
[13:47:11] <gregcnc> oh that's good to know too
[13:48:51] <pink_vampire> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Trephine-Bur-Drill-4-0mm-Diameter-Dental-Implant-Surgery-Tool-Bone-Graft-/221580216954
[13:48:59] <pink_vampire> that look soo cool.
[13:49:53] <CaptHindsight> imagine the jaws it bores into!
[13:50:29] <gregcnc> I was googling for something completely unrelated and google images turned up photos of dental implant procedures
[13:50:34] <CaptHindsight> why is it that the same guys that do surgery can't hang shelves at home?
[13:51:07] <Crom_> yay just won an auction. logitech wireless kb and mouse $20.49 including shipping
[13:51:10] <pink_vampire> http://www.mdtdental.com/htmls/article.aspx?c0=14539&bsp=12487
[13:51:37] <pink_vampire> so I need collet for 1.6mm and 2.35mm
[13:51:39] <maxcnc> Crom_: bad for RT cnc
[13:51:52] <Crom_> http://www.ebay.com/itm/262335160655
[13:51:59] <maxcnc> use cable belts its more reliable
[13:52:00] <pink_vampire> and I will get endless small endmills.
[13:52:10] <gregcnc> I have a strong stomach, but the thought of drilling into a jaw almost made me lose my lunch
[13:52:33] <pink_vampire> gregcnc: just drilling in to the bone..
[13:52:48] <maxcnc> pink_vampire: always good to have a stock pile of less then 1mm bits
[13:53:03] <CaptHindsight> gregcnc: I've moved some good sized machines with this as well http://www.edsrental.com/trailer-large-landscape
[13:53:11] <pink_vampire> dental burrs are soo cheap
[13:53:21] <gregcnc> the old man has a car hauler
[13:54:17] <Crom_> actual;ly that kb mouse is for raspberry pi
[13:54:44] <maxcnc> ame behav as runing lcnc
[13:55:44] <CaptHindsight> gregcnc: I once bought a vertical mill from an old machinist, when I got there to pick it up he had already dolled it out of his garage onto the driveway by himself (~120lbs wet) using rollers
[13:56:00] <CaptHindsight> dolled/rolled
[13:56:18] <gregcnc> the power of the wheeel
[13:56:52] <pink_vampire> sooo unfair. r8 1/16" http://www.ebay.com/itm/SHARS-0006-PRECISION-R8-ROUND-COLLET-1-16-NEW-/300694653491?hash=item4602cc4a33:g:eksAAOSwg8FVAgSN
[13:57:06] <pink_vampire> but I need 1.6 mm :(
[13:57:25] <CaptHindsight> I tend to get complete collet sets from pawn shops for <$200
[13:59:06] <pink_vampire> CaptHindsight: but 1.6mm is not normal size for collet..
[13:59:18] <pink_vampire> i have a set of 12
[13:59:19] <gregcnc> then get tools with a normal shank size
[13:59:29] <pink_vampire> from 1/8 to 7/8
[14:00:40] <pink_vampire> gregcnc: but for 60 cents per endmill, I want to be able to hold it in my chuck.
[14:01:08] <Crom_> pink 1/16" is a 1.6mm
[14:01:16] <Crom_> look for a 1/16" collect
[14:01:20] <Crom_> look for a 1/16" collet
[14:01:40] <pink_vampire> 1.5875mm
[14:01:48] <pink_vampire> not 1.6
[14:02:09] <maxcnc> take up the vel and you wil get 1.7
[14:02:23] <CaptHindsight> 1/16 = 0.0625", 1.6mm = 0.629"
[14:02:23] <pink_vampire> vel?
[14:02:24] <maxcnc> or bit break O.O
[14:02:32] <maxcnc> velocity
[14:02:36] <Crom_> it'll spread to 1.6mm
[14:02:56] <maxcnc> and make a tiny curve of the straight
[14:03:16] <Crom_> pink_vampire, what size outside? er-??
[14:03:25] <maxcnc> take a hammer and knock the spindle to offset
[14:03:50] <pink_vampire> Crom: ?
[14:04:18] <pink_vampire> I want to fit FG dental burrs in the R8 collet,
[14:04:19] <Crom_> you want a R8 collet? or a er-11
[14:04:29] <maxcnc> pink_vampire: why not a 1.5 and mill it to the needed messurments
[14:04:39] <gregcnc> http://www.harveytool.com/ToolTechInfo.aspx?ToolNumber=73059
[14:04:40] <Crom_> get a r8 to er-11 adapter
[14:04:56] <pink_vampire> my main shank is R8
[14:05:06] <CaptHindsight> lets see how long this discussion can be dragged out
[14:05:08] <pink_vampire> the shank of the burr is 1.6mm
[14:05:24] <CaptHindsight> coming up on 10 minutes
[14:05:30] <gregcnc> we'll see probably longer than the program would run with a 2 FL endmill
[14:06:15] <pink_vampire> CaptHindsight: evil!
[14:06:24] <maxcnc> Simonious: still on ?
[14:06:29] <OdinYggd> >holding an endmill in a chuck
[14:06:38] <Simonious> maxcnc: yes
[14:06:40] <OdinYggd> I've had older machinists throw things at me for doing this
[14:06:55] <maxcnc> OdinYggd: better then in the hand or fingers
[14:07:00] <OdinYggd> you don't want to hold an endmill in a chuck cause it will slip and ruin the chuck. Endmills belong in collets or dedicated toolholders
[14:07:03] <gregcnc> it's OK if it's for a youtube video
[14:07:07] <pink_vampire> OdinYggd: no, I want to use the original collet.
[14:07:10] <maxcnc> Simonious: no response to my work ;-)
[14:07:11] <pink_vampire> R8
[14:07:22] <OdinYggd> Okay. R8 collet is a good idea for an endmill
[14:07:25] <Simonious> maxcnc: which?
[14:07:28] <OdinYggd> Usually anyway, there are exceptions
[14:07:39] <maxcnc> the griffin in 8min
[14:08:22] <maxcnc> Simonious: dident you get the posts
[14:08:31] <Simonious> I see it now, Dling and opening
[14:09:04] <pink_vampire> OdinYggd: the problem is to find R8 collet for 1.6 mm or 2.35mm
[14:09:32] <maxcnc> isent there a 3.17 standard
[14:09:50] <OdinYggd> I think the problem is mm. I've got bins full of R8 collets, but they're all in inches
[14:10:04] <OdinYggd> Not sure if any new machines are built using R8 anymore
[14:10:38] <gregcnc> capt thanks for the ideas
[14:10:43] <CaptHindsight> they are still a very popular size
[14:11:07] <pink_vampire> 1/16" is close to 1.6mm and 3/32" is close to 2.35mm
[14:11:08] <maxcnc> but obertaken by ER11
[14:11:30] <Simonious> maxcnc: I'm not looking at the gcode, but the DXF looks pretty reasonable :)
[14:11:47] <maxcnc> <- smiles
[14:12:03] <Simonious> inkscape I presume?
[14:12:08] <Crom_> hmm ER-11 2mm collet has a size range of .079" to 0.058" and 1.6mm is 0.0630"
[14:12:08] <maxcnc> yes
[14:12:28] <maxcnc> bigbluesaw is my fav on that outlines
[14:12:43] <Simonious> bigbluesaw?
[14:12:47] <Simonious> hmm? is that software?
[14:12:48] <Crom_> so get a R8 to ER-11 adapter and run an er-11 collet
[14:12:57] <CaptHindsight> I use ER16 collets to spin 200mm discs to 24K rpm
[14:12:59] <maxcnc> its the plugin for incscape
[14:13:15] * Simonious nods
[14:13:20] <Simonious> I'll try to look into that later on
[14:13:31] <Simonious> gotta go blow up some electronics right now o/ thanks
[14:13:39] <maxcnc> NP
[14:13:45] <pink_vampire> I'm look for it now.
[14:14:15] <gregcnc> capt how was the balance on that?
[14:14:59] <CaptHindsight> don't even notice
[14:15:16] <maxcnc> CaptHindsight: where is the 200mm disc from
[14:15:21] <CaptHindsight> the mass is so low that I don't bather balancing
[14:15:35] <CaptHindsight> maxcnc: 200mm silicon wafer
[14:16:02] <gregcnc> what does the chuck weigh?
[14:16:43] <CaptHindsight> few oz
[14:17:04] <maxcnc> CaptHindsight: for coding or dotting
[14:17:23] <CaptHindsight> maxcnc: reducing the coating thickness
[14:17:25] <gregcnc> hat spindle must have decent tolerance on the threads
[14:17:28] <maxcnc> why 24k rpm not clear
[14:18:06] <CaptHindsight> maxcnc: the faster it spins the thinner the coating
[14:18:20] <maxcnc> sent it a time issue
[14:18:30] <Crom_> higher rpm the coating will get thinner from centrifical force
[14:19:09] <maxcnc> more time on same amout of code will turn the rest off also
[14:19:34] <CaptHindsight> at 1k rpm the coating might be 25um, at 24k rpm it might be 3um
[14:19:39] <maxcnc> ok i get you
[14:19:43] <maxcnc> im off Gn8
[14:25:58] <pink_vampire> what is the tolerance that R8 can be usable?
[14:26:33] <pink_vampire> for the tool diameter.
[14:26:39] <CaptHindsight> http://www.laurell.com/support/spin-speed-calculator.php
[14:29:18] <CaptHindsight> that collet you posted is rated at .0006" http://www.ebay.com/itm/SHARS-0006-PRECISION-R8-ROUND-COLLET-1-16-NEW-/300694653491
[14:30:01] <pink_vampire> the 0.0006 is the runout,
[14:30:14] <pink_vampire> not the holding tolerance.
[14:30:28] <CaptHindsight> R8 collapses down to 1/32"?
[14:30:51] <CaptHindsight> from rest
[14:31:30] <CaptHindsight> so ~32 thou of range
[14:31:44] <pink_vampire> CaptHindsight: I mean how small can I squeeze it and it's still be usable?
[14:31:59] <CaptHindsight> ^^
[14:32:31] <pink_vampire> how much is thou ?
[14:32:37] <FinboySlick> 0.001"
[14:33:04] <gregcnc> I wonder if the feed and speed are the same for brass, AL, and steel as bone?
[14:34:00] <CaptHindsight> so 0.032"
[14:34:16] <pink_vampire> bone is calcium alloy..
[14:35:01] <pink_vampire> gregcnc: it's a carbide end mill
[14:36:00] <CaptHindsight> gregcnc: I do my best to keep my body parts free so I don't find out :)
[14:37:39] <cradek> a 1/16 R8 collet should only be used for 1/16 shank tools
[14:37:46] <pink_vampire> you can try to machine the leftovers from a drumsticks
[14:37:50] <cradek> for smaller tools it's normal to have all 1/8 shanks
[14:37:58] <cradek> like those end mills you found earlier
[14:38:10] <gregcnc> If you're not bleeding, you're not trying
[14:38:46] <pink_vampire> gregcnc: I have to much marks on my hands..
[14:38:56] <gregcnc> but 1/8th shanks are too practical
[14:39:17] <CaptHindsight> directly quote from the "DIY surgery kit"
[14:39:35] <pink_vampire> all the normal people use them..
[14:39:56] <gregcnc> dare to be different
[14:40:49] <pink_vampire> Loetmichel2 has alot of experience with "DIY surgery kit"
[14:45:33] <pink_vampire> cradek: do you think that 1.6 end mill will work in 1.58 collet?
[14:46:41] <cradek> I bet both of those are metrifications of 1/16" and so they are equivalent
[14:47:07] <CaptHindsight> but will they work :p
[14:47:38] <CaptHindsight> oh wheezy download is done, be back next week
[14:48:47] <CaptHindsight> failed :(
[14:49:54] <cradek> in the metric world the standard "pretty small" size for tool shanks is 3mm
[14:50:24] <cradek> so I doubt "1.58" or "1.6" tools are actually metric
[14:50:33] <cradek> but I'm only guessing
[14:56:29] <pink_vampire> cradek: the 1.6mm is dental burr, and I want to use it with 1/16" collet.
[14:56:54] <pink_vampire> http://www.nexadental.com/digital-catalog/download/S20CarbideDiamondBurs.pdf
[14:57:10] <cradek> I bet it is actually 1/16 so it will work perfectly.
[14:57:38] <pink_vampire> but it's all metric.
[14:57:46] <pink_vampire> look at the table.
[14:58:20] <pink_vampire> I'm talking about the FG
[14:58:43] <pink_vampire> 314 Friction grip (FG)
[14:59:15] <cradek> huh, weird sizes
[14:59:23] <cradek> I'm changing my answer to I don't know
[14:59:39] <pink_vampire> look at the tool 57L
[15:00:08] <pink_vampire> this is 1mm end mill that you can get for 60 cent!
[15:01:06] <pink_vampire> some distributors sell them as disposable stuff.
[15:02:09] <pink_vampire> cradek: now jump to page 5
[15:02:26] <pink_vampire> 331/1931 1558/1958 557/2057
[15:04:49] <pink_vampire> http://www.ebay.com/itm/100pcs-Tungsten-carbide-burs-FG-169L-/161464353193?hash=item25980681a9:g:o~UAAOxyni9TGT0Q
[15:05:00] <pink_vampire> cradek: ^
[15:36:16] <MrSunshine> trying my hand at angle grinder scraping a piece :P
[15:40:13] <pink_vampire> MrSunshine: what do you mean?
[15:44:59] <CaptHindsight> wouldn't this be faster and work as well? https://img0.etsystatic.com/000/0/5917672/il_570xN.300702858.jpg
[15:46:14] <MrSunshine> pink_vampire: marked with sand paper then grind away high spots
[15:46:25] <CaptHindsight> https://img0.etsystatic.com/000/0/5917672/il_570xN.300702858.jpg
[15:46:44] <CaptHindsight> http://www.dapra.com/biax/scrapers/
[15:46:49] <MrSunshine> tried to mill the piece today but the milling machine i have access to was to small
[15:47:00] <MrSunshine> yes biax scrapers .. well i do not have one nor can i afford one :P
[15:47:37] <CaptHindsight> modified sawzall
[15:47:38] <pink_vampire> i need to remove 0.02mm..
[15:47:43] <pink_vampire> yeah sand paper!
[15:48:03] <pink_vampire> I want to get an air brush.
[15:59:41] <Sync> CaptHindsight: a modified sawzall will work suprisingly shitty
[16:00:10] <CaptHindsight> never blame the tool for operator error :p
[16:01:34] <Sync> pfft
[16:03:13] <CaptHindsight> speaking of which, how do you spell the sound of a spitting kitty?
[16:03:38] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: "You Bitch!"
[16:19:57] <_methods> hahah
[16:21:44] <pink_vampire> how do you paint the parts from the machine?
[16:23:55] <pink_vampire> someone here use airbrush?
[16:31:16] <Crom_> I have used air brush for repainting machinery
[16:40:59] <Deejay> like this? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DDMe6wlEyIk
[17:03:49] <Deejay> gn8
[18:48:42] <OdinYggd> gahhh, stress analysis in solidworks is awesome
[18:49:08] <OdinYggd> Just for the heck of it I exported a .step of one of my designs and put it in solidworks, and squished it with 3000 PSI
[18:49:12] <OdinYggd> It... didn't survive
[18:49:21] <OdinYggd> That would have been an ugly prototype failure
[18:52:29] <enleth> won another auction for Copley Controls 423 drives
[18:52:40] <enleth> I'll be gettin 4 of those for $97.11
[18:52:44] <enleth> *getting
[18:57:45] <Valen> OdinYggd: keep in mind without a bunch of qualification its results are going to be indicative only
[18:59:03] <OdinYggd> Still beats doing the same analysis in MS Excel
[18:59:10] <OdinYggd> Which is how I've done it for the past 12 yeras
[18:59:12] <OdinYggd> *years
[18:59:18] <CaptHindsight> Copley Controls 423 DC Brush Server Amplifier? You are using brushed servos?
[18:59:39] <OdinYggd> My charts only cover the basic stuff though. I can't factor in things like stress concentrations around boltholes and stuff
[18:59:50] <OdinYggd> that's what bit me when simulating this solid model, it rips apart around the mounting holes
[19:00:52] <Valen> not saying it's not useful, lol, your result will probably be somewhere between half and double the real world ;->
[19:01:22] <OdinYggd> I had meant to use it as a quick check okay is there anything I didn't account for
[19:01:37] <Valen> it's good for showing the concentrations and the like, where you can make simple savings
[19:01:40] <OdinYggd> And in this case there was, because the part geometry had some stess concentrations appear in it that made it exceed deformation stress
[19:01:56] <OdinYggd> It would have deformed and expanded till it got stuck and ruined the machine
[19:02:09] <Valen> that would have probably been a bad day :-<
[19:02:57] <OdinYggd> Would have been some interesting fireworks though
[19:03:11] <Valen> whats the part/machine?
[19:03:32] <OdinYggd> Prototype engine
[19:03:58] <OdinYggd> I found a way to make a piston engine with only a fraction of the moving parts normally found
[19:04:04] <OdinYggd> the part I squished in solidworks was one of hte pistons
[19:04:05] <Valen> oooh, yeah probably don't want to break bits of those
[19:04:23] <OdinYggd> It stretches around the lightening holes and retaining pins, and would have deformed enough to smear on the cylinder- or seize up
[19:05:21] <OdinYggd> But there's large sections of analysis on this design that I am straight up guessing because none of the equations i know can model them
[19:05:22] <Valen> I have always wanted to make a free piston engine
[19:05:31] <OdinYggd> Solidworks would at least let me ballpark how close I am on those areas
[19:05:37] <Valen> just a magnet in a coil for the "crank"
[19:21:22] <enleth> CaptHindsight: yeah
[19:21:58] <enleth> CaptHindsight: SEM MT30H4-44
[19:22:34] <enleth> brushes are still fine and I can replace them anyway so I'm OK with that
[19:40:12] <CaptHindsight> http://www.plccenter.com/en-US/Buy/SEM%20SERVO%20MOTORS/MT30H444 heh $4588
[19:53:38] <enleth> that's a little bit excessive
[19:53:47] <enleth> especially for a unit this dirty
[19:55:05] <enleth> in fact that's like 4x more than I paid for a machine with 3 of those
[21:33:52] <pink_vampire> the part is DONE
[21:33:57] <pink_vampire> XXCoder: !!
[22:20:08] <joem_> when threading, why is the crossfeed set at 29 degrees
[22:20:20] <joem_> why not just dig the 60 degree bit directly into the material
[22:21:33] <cradek> so just the one side cuts. if you cut both sides it takes a lot of pressure and the chips smash into each other and have nowhere to go
[22:21:41] <joem_> ahhhhhhhh
[22:21:55] <joem_> thats good advise for more than just threading, thanks
[22:21:56] <cradek> just try both ways, and you'll get a feel for it
[23:28:11] <MrTrick> archivist_herron: you were talking about wooden gear wear - check out https://woodgears.ca/gear/wear.html https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h_mLG4KwbLA