#linuxcnc | Logs for 2015-12-30

[01:15:14] <pink_vampire> skunkworks: - amazing!
[02:29:25] <Deejay> moin
[02:51:46] <pink_vampire> hi Deejay
[03:08:19] <Deejay> hi pink_vampire
[03:08:32] <pink_vampire> how are you?
[03:09:36] <Deejay> fine, thanks. and you?
[03:26:15] <pink_vampire> working on the pcb for the stacklight controller.
[03:26:47] <pink_vampire> it's so awesome to see it work
[03:29:23] <pink_vampire> Deejay: ^
[03:29:37] <Deejay> :)
[03:42:17] <pink_vampire> almost done half of the pcb..
[05:47:52] <XXCoder> finally home
[05:48:11] <Deejay> home sweet home
[05:48:50] <XXCoder> yep
[06:07:14] <XXCoder> wow
[06:07:16] <XXCoder> this is weird
[06:07:17] <XXCoder> http://futurism.com/links/ford-files-patent-car-converts-unicycle/
[06:07:27] <XXCoder> workable maybe once we get better batteries,
[06:30:45] <renesis> this is so no
[06:31:04] <renesis> theyll do hub motors probably, because ease of mass production assembly
[06:31:19] <renesis> but hub motor handling will be so much ass
[06:31:39] <renesis> like, you dont have to deal with unsprung weight in animes
[06:34:13] <enleth> that's why we need room temperature superconductors
[06:34:31] <enleth> imagine hub motors made of that
[06:35:03] <Jymmm> http://www.technologyreview.com/view/429203/room-temperature-superconductivity-found-in-graphite-grains/
[06:35:32] <XXCoder> enleth: one sci fi book has power nodule, it has no max limit, so if you input one gram worth of power, it is gram heavier
[06:35:46] <XXCoder> whole usa uses around 2 1/2 grams of power a year.
[06:36:19] <XXCoder> heh as polot there was one nodule thats been charging for decades. its weight was well over a KG
[06:36:27] <XXCoder> *plot
[06:37:42] <Jymmm> BloomBox http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=6816773n
[06:37:57] <enleth> same kind of idea as Mass Effect's, well, mass effect
[06:38:42] <XXCoder> enleth: sounds to me that it's full of this common element bullshitium
[06:39:20] <XXCoder> but same time its in realm of possibility
[06:39:29] <enleth> XXCoder: which sci-fi isn't, save for the most hardcore?
[06:40:12] <enleth> at least ME's add-ons to relativity are internally consistent and maintain the suspension of disbelief
[06:40:30] <Jymmm> Safe Nuclear https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bbyr7jZOllI
[06:41:30] <enleth> it's much worse when the authors don't get any physics right and try to invent their own on top of nothing
[06:41:39] <XXCoder> enleth: never read mass effect but yeah definied rules is awesome.
[06:41:47] <XXCoder> actually different physics is fine
[06:41:54] <XXCoder> just internally consisent
[07:00:43] <Jymmm> physics? physics?! We don't need no stinkin physics!
[07:01:54] <XXCoder> reminds me of that book
[07:01:57] <XXCoder> k-space something
[07:02:07] <enleth> XXCoder: FYI there are some books in the franchise already but ME is primarily a video game series
[07:02:16] <XXCoder> guy got physics so wrong that its funny
[07:02:20] <XXCoder> ]but then its 1960s book
[07:02:28] <Jymmm> XXCoder: K-Pak ?
[07:02:37] <XXCoder> pretty enjoyable for such an ancient book
[07:03:14] <Jymmm> XXCoder: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0272152/
[07:03:32] <XXCoder> hardly. lol
[07:03:36] <XXCoder> its a rare boojk
[07:04:00] <Jymmm> XXCoder: I'll wait for the movie to come out ;)
[07:04:14] <XXCoder> good luck finding a book to make movie out of. lol\
[07:04:32] <XXCoder> hopefully I still have it, most of my books is in boxes.
[07:05:03] <Jymmm> XXCoder: </sarcasm> I'm not actually waiting
[07:05:22] <XXCoder> I know. I replied with sarcasm too lol
[07:05:51] * Jymmm burns XXCoder books and grabs the marshmellows
[07:06:09] <XXCoder> NOOOO lol
[07:06:25] <XXCoder> I do look forwrd to getting a book scanner
[07:06:38] <XXCoder> so I can have more ebooks and legit too
[07:07:57] <archivist> I want a book scanner
[07:08:00] <XXCoder> enleth: old books is very cheap
[07:08:07] <XXCoder> scan em and you get cheap ebooks
[07:08:10] <archivist> just spent an hour scanning a manual
[07:08:20] <XXCoder> archivist: you missed a indiegogo on it
[07:08:42] <XXCoder> https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/czur-scanner-build-your-own-digital-library#/
[07:09:21] <XXCoder> oh its in demend mode, you can still get whatever still aviliable apparently
[07:09:29] <archivist> useless website mostly white screen
[07:09:59] <archivist> web2 fsckup
[07:10:01] <XXCoder> you just need to enable indoegogo script. rest of scripts is useless
[07:10:20] <archivist> I and never disabled scripts
[07:10:29] <archivist> and/have
[07:10:44] <XXCoder> odd
[07:10:56] <archivist> people are useles in site writing theses days
[07:11:01] <archivist> useless
[07:11:02] <XXCoder> would be funny if noscript helped make readable site for me
[07:13:26] <XXCoder> archivist: I see trend of including more and more domains scripts in websites
[07:13:34] <XXCoder> meaning sites is getting slower and slower.
[07:13:39] <XXCoder> noscript helps hell of a lot.
[07:13:53] <XXCoder> indiegogo may be worse yet, looks like over 40 domains
[07:14:15] <XXCoder> nah not that bad but huge count
[07:14:16] <archivist> I have started adding 3rd party domains to my hosts file
[07:14:49] <XXCoder> just use noscript
[07:14:59] <archivist> it means the main site works but you never have to load anything from the 3rd party
[07:15:29] <archivist> eg it fixes ebay properly
[07:19:57] <XXCoder> nice
[07:20:07] <XXCoder> for me just need to enable ebay script and one other
[07:20:10] <XXCoder> and it works fine
[07:20:58] <archivist> not just scripts you need to fix, cookies as well as the tracking images
[07:22:11] <XXCoder> yeah noscript dont block all of those but not too worried
[07:23:09] <XXCoder> oh here it is a video https://youtu.be/crhnYFKpWdI
[07:23:40] <archivist> I did a count one day, ebays advertisers had put 360 odd cookies on my machine
[07:23:57] <XXCoder> yummy lol
[07:24:06] <XXCoder> dang that many
[07:26:12] <Jymmm> Settings: Do not accept 3rd party cookies
[07:26:23] <archivist> remember some of the adblockers are in bed with some of the advertisers
[07:26:54] <archivist> I set that and deleted all the crap cookies
[07:27:03] <ReadError> ublock origin
[07:27:55] <Jymmm> What I'm curious about is HOW there are detecting ABP is running
[07:28:50] <archivist> ABP is sending you ads!
[07:29:10] <archivist> no such thing as a free lunch
[07:30:09] <Jymmm> I have that "allow some ads" turned off.
[07:30:30] <archivist> I bet it tracks for the sites
[07:30:39] <Jymmm> probably
[07:30:40] <XXCoder> heh I dont use any ad block
[07:30:45] <XXCoder> I rarely see any ad
[07:31:25] <ReadError> Jymmm depending on how the content is requested
[07:31:40] <XXCoder> anyway laters
[07:31:40] <ReadError> they can use a unique code and check to see if its been requested/pulled
[07:31:53] <Jymmm> ReadError: ah
[07:33:47] <archivist> I catch those tracking calls to certain ad tracker sites:)
[07:34:34] <ReadError> def take a look at ublock origin
[07:34:43] <ReadError> much more efficient
[07:34:54] <ReadError> https://github.com/gorhill/uBlock/wiki/uBlock-vs.-ABP:-efficiency-compared
[07:35:15] <Jymmm> ReadError: But how effective compared to ABP?
[07:35:43] <Jymmm> I have a hellva personal filters in place (2MB worth so far)
[07:35:49] <ReadError> works the same as far as I can tell
[07:35:53] <ReadError> no youtube ads etc
[07:36:23] <ReadError> it supports the same filters, so you can just paste them in
[07:36:39] <ReadError> 'One filter per line. A filter can be a plain hostname, or an Adblock Plus-compatible filter. Lines prefixed with ‘!’ will be ignored.'
[07:36:57] <Jymmm> ah, cool
[07:37:34] <archivist> my server just returns a 404 no need for external code
[07:37:44] <ReadError> using a proxy?
[07:37:56] <archivist> no this is a server anyway
[07:38:45] <archivist> I just set up a few things in the default virtual host
[07:39:54] <archivist> sometimes for speed it returns a 1 px image or empty file to the caller in the web page
[09:17:36] <JT-Shop> looks like my shielded wire will be here today...
[09:53:39] <Tom_itx> what size?
[10:11:23] <JT-Shop> 24ga
[10:15:12] <os1r1s> JT-Shop Or is there a description for your turret example on your website?
[10:30:30] <JT-Shop> no, just a simulator example and comments in the hal file
[10:41:15] <os1r1s> JT-Shop I'm trying to build a carousel type tool changer that would be rotated via a stepper. I wasn't looking to put switches on it, though a home one is a possibility.
[10:41:47] <os1r1s> JT-Shop The hal code makes sense to me, its the ladder logic one that is more difficult to understand
[10:42:47] <JT-Shop> have you viewed the ladder tutorial on my web site?
[10:47:50] <os1r1s> JT-Shop I had followed it a while ago, but I probably need to run back through it. I'll take that path and figure out if that gets me close.
[10:49:15] <JT-Shop> do you have a question?
[10:52:13] <os1r1s> JT-Shop I was trying to figure out if that would get me close the the stepper based toolchanger I mentioned above
[10:56:05] <JT-Shop> the tool change part should be similar only what you do during the tool change would be different
[10:57:29] <os1r1s> JT-Shop Gotcha. I'm going to wire it up and follow the tutorials, then try that one out
[10:58:49] <bensbenz> Is there something special I have to do in order for arcs to work correctly?
[10:58:57] <JT-Shop> I find it helps me to sort out ladder by writing each step and the condition that exits that step down in pseudo code first
[10:59:09] <JT-Shop> input the correct coordinates
[10:59:14] <bensbenz> for example i have: G2 X0.4993 Z-0.5451 I-0.0432 K-0.0502
[10:59:20] <Loetmichel> *meh* i should have invested a bit more money for that desk chair. I AM SIIIINKIIIING!!!!111 ... ( the gas lift cylinder isnt up to my weight, sometimes it slowly descents to the bottom)
[10:59:22] <bensbenz> but it shows up as circles
[11:00:15] <JT-Shop> what is the starting position?
[11:03:43] <bensbenz> that section is: Z-0.5211 F0.01
[11:04:31] <bensbenz> this is out of my cam, I dont know enough to do it by hand.
[11:04:42] <JT-Shop> what is the X position?
[11:04:52] <bensbenz> X0.464
[11:05:49] <JT-Shop> a lathe?
[11:05:56] <bensbenz> yes sir
[11:06:24] <JT-Shop> I get a radius error
[11:06:57] <enleth> Loetmichel: I know your pain
[11:07:24] <bensbenz> on mine all the arcs are inverted its strange.
[11:07:33] <JT-Shop> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Simple_LinuxCNC_G-Code_Generators#Arc_Generator
[11:07:48] <JT-Shop> take a look at the arc generator for lathe
[11:07:50] <enleth> The Ikea Markus chair is awesome for its price but the cylinder gets wonky after being used by domeone heavy fkr a long time
[11:08:04] <enleth> *for, ffs
[11:08:32] <Loetmichel> enleth: the "new" chair i have was even cheaper.
[11:08:34] <bensbenz> if I use a post that outputs radius then it works fine, but that post doesnt have g76, i guess i need the cam people to take a look
[11:09:12] <bensbenz> I have been told the post with the arcs works fine on pathpilot which is why I though maybe it was just a config thing
[11:09:37] <Loetmichel> http://i.ebayimg.com/images/i/251810896552-0-0/s-l140.jpg <- 37 eur
[11:11:00] <Loetmichel> i like that "net" construction. the last one was (artificial) leather... a few hours in it and your back is damp :-(
[11:35:25] <bensbenz> JT-Shop: it was just a setting...
[11:36:34] <bensbenz> JT-Shop: had to set RS274NGC_STARTUP_CODE = G18 G20 G90 in the INI file
[11:36:55] <bensbenz> Dont know why when you setup a machine choose lathe, that setting wouldnt be added.
[11:37:47] <archivist> you need to put sensible settings to make sure your machine is in the right mode, other gcode could have set something else
[11:38:14] <archivist> always have preamble in your gcode
[11:40:16] <bensbenz> archivist: I do have those
[11:40:39] <bensbenz> archivist: but I guess you need the ini change for it to display correctly in axis
[11:42:57] <bensbenz> archivist: its in the manual to add it, just curious as to why it doesnt get added automatically when you run stepconf and you tell it your using a lathe
[11:44:48] <archivist> stepconf is only a tool to get your started, best to edit after that
[11:45:24] <archivist> it cannot know all possible options
[11:46:34] <bensbenz> archivist: But that seems like a no brainer... In anycase I have learned that, theres no way it could have done my setup
[11:47:26] <bensbenz> just one more bug to work out for me, I posted on the forums, but I guess it takes a while for a moderator to approve the post.
[12:31:43] <JT-Shop> bensbenz: I don't see any posts that need approval
[12:43:02] <pink_vampire> 99% done!
[12:44:41] <Deejay> then go for the last percent!
[12:47:32] <jdh> the second 99% takes longer than the first 99%
[12:47:49] <Jymmm> jdh: exactly!!
[12:48:19] <Jymmm> jdh: Also... of that last 1%, you only get to 99% of it
[12:48:31] <Jymmm> lather rinse repeat
[12:48:49] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: How many acres you on?
[12:49:17] <Deejay> hmm, like reaching the speed of light, isn't it?
[12:49:33] <Jymmm> Deejay: LOL, I was just thinking that.
[12:49:40] <JT-Shop> 9
[12:49:40] <Deejay> ;-)
[12:50:04] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: Got a new use for your tractor https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-CZfnxwJBwc
[12:50:26] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: It's a mobile wood rack for 9 cords
[12:51:17] <JT-Shop> I have a stationary wood rack for 4 cords
[12:52:36] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: He has been using a wood boiler for 30+ years, got bigger one and is lazy. the boiler is on one end, the spliter on the other.
[12:54:23] <Jymmm> Pros and Cons of an outside wood boiler (it's heating three houses PLUS an indoor lap pool) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T-3RdNMN9Qw
[12:56:26] <CaptHindsight> Jymmm: have you run the numbers for this winter for LP vs natural gas costs for heating?
[12:56:29] <JT-Shop> if you heat with wood your not lazy
[12:57:15] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: It's more wood vs LP vs electric, there is no NG up here
[12:57:30] <CaptHindsight> just wondering, thanks
[12:58:28] <CaptHindsight> was looking at operating cost for a NG vs LP furnace for casting
[12:58:37] <JT-Shop> it would have been neat if he had a walking beam to move the firewood
[12:58:54] <pink_vampire> it's render it..
[12:59:45] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: I'm SO sick of re-handling wood... they dump the cords, you stack the cords, bring a wagon laod off the stack to get rid of critters plus dry out a bit, then bring in the house. I came up with log carriers instead, saves on the back =)
[13:00:01] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: Or even wheels on those racks
[13:02:03] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: The bigger issue is the heat pump when below 40F. It runs longer and goes into defrost cycle more freqquently. I've been supplementing it with propane heat, big difference.
[13:02:32] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: When in defrost, the $$$$$$$$$$$$ electric heating elements kick in too.
[13:03:28] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: But for your original questions, I've been looking at the cost per btu of all three.
[13:04:36] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: Are you buying or c/s/s/ wood from your property?
[13:05:03] <JT-Shop> I cut my own wood
[13:05:31] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: how many cords a season do you go thru?
[13:05:46] <JT-Shop> http://gnipsel.com/images/splitter/splitter-28.jpg
[13:05:55] <JT-Shop> at my neighbors house
[13:06:02] <JT-Shop> depends on the weather
[13:06:13] <JT-Shop> http://gnipsel.com/images/splitter/
[13:06:16] <Jymmm> hardwood?
[13:06:25] <JT-Shop> aye
[13:06:46] <Jymmm> What is that? http://gnipsel.com/images/splitter/First%20Pile%20of%20Splits.jpg
[13:07:18] <JT-Shop> first pile of splits from the splitter I built
[13:07:19] <SpeedEvil> plus 'vs electric' - electric heatpump has several times the output thermally per watt. But is much more expensive to install.
[13:07:34] <SpeedEvil> Also - insulation
[13:07:38] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: species?
[13:07:52] <JT-Shop> dunno
[13:07:52] <SpeedEvil> Insulation/air-sealing/air-air heat exchanger/...
[13:08:23] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: =)
[13:08:52] <bensbenz> JT-Shop: thats the message that I got, said post submitted but that a moderator needs to approve it
[13:09:06] <JT-Shop> where did you post it?
[13:10:17] <bensbenz> adavanced config
[13:10:47] <JT-Shop> it's been approved
[13:11:25] <bensbenz> JT-Shop: ok I will check on it later thanks.
[13:12:00] <JT-Shop> I deleted the duplicate post
[13:12:08] <bensbenz> ok no problem
[13:12:20] <bensbenz> I didnt see the message the first time, thought I just lost it somehow
[13:13:16] <CaptHindsight> Jymmm: how deep is the frost line at your location?
[13:17:25] <ReadError> pcw_home or PCW around?
[13:26:27] <pink_vampire> I need new computer...
[13:30:03] <pink_vampire> rendering DONE
[13:31:33] <pink_vampire> http://i.imgur.com/rCM4Eyo.png
[13:31:59] <pink_vampire> my stack-light controller
[13:32:19] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: Can't find it atm, will research later.
[13:33:01] <pink_vampire> Deejay: jdh archivist XXCoder
[13:35:21] <pcw_home> ReadError: yes
[13:35:51] <ReadError> pcw_home, was wondering if its possible to add something to an existing order
[13:35:56] <ReadError> or should i just place another
[13:38:03] <pcw_home> its probably best to make aadditional order, we can combine them physically and adjust the shipping downwards
[13:39:35] <ReadError> pcw_home, thanks, do you all have the 26 pin -> 25 db-25 cables anywhere on the store?
[13:39:43] <ReadError> errr -25 sorry
[13:41:00] <ReadError> http://store.mesanet.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=74_81&product_id=273 ahh this must be it
[13:42:08] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: Are you including this on the "frost depth" lol http://i.imgur.com/KiVn2Aw.jpg
[13:42:13] <Jymmm> in*
[13:43:17] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: That is ice crystals that have grown from the ground up to apx 1.5" tall in my front yard =)
[13:44:24] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: Else, I'm thinking about 10"
[13:46:27] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: I have this entire ice crystal forest for 1/8" tall midgets all over the place!
[13:52:39] <Jymmm> Wood gasification boiler https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Rp1yBpP3xE
[14:11:56] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: The reason for my questions is that I was wondering how much land is needed to have enough dead wood to harvest each season that is sustainable over many years.
[14:12:59] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: Ex: you burn 4 cords of well seasoned hardwoods per year.
[14:13:49] <SpeedEvil> Doesn't neat to be dead
[14:13:56] <SpeedEvil> cutting live wood works fine
[14:14:03] <SpeedEvil> see willow coppicing, for exampel
[14:16:42] <JT-Shop> I get wood from anywhere I can not just my land
[14:17:15] <jdh> tree poaching!
[14:17:36] <jdh> I have a few I'd be happy for you to take away after you cut them down.
[14:17:43] <XXCoder> pink_vampire: nice
[14:19:35] <pink_vampire> thanks :)
[14:20:07] <pink_vampire> now i need to finish the other controllers...
[14:20:17] <pink_vampire> and also get some sleep..
[14:21:06] <JT-Shop> it's only poaching if you get caught
[14:21:20] <jdh> I got some modular stack lights with ungodly annoying beepers I need to put on some machines at work
[14:22:22] <XXCoder> nah, YOU know it is poaching, so it is still poaching.
[14:22:25] <SpeedEvil> I am now imagining hard-hats with those lights and beepers for particularly incompetent employees
[14:27:25] <pink_vampire> Bed time. :)
[14:29:07] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: SPI (Sierra Pacific Industries - logging) has a *LOT* of land up here. You see trucks going down the road all the time. They do allow you to harvest stuff for like $20 permit, for n number of cords iirc.
[14:53:57] <JT-Shop> you can get permits from the us forest service to cut trees that have fallen down
[14:54:04] <JT-Shop> usually they are rotted
[14:57:01] <Jymmm> ah
[14:57:22] <Jymmm> Around here is difficult to tell which is forestery/blm and SPI
[14:58:56] <Jymmm> But you usually see ppl on the side of the road selling truckloads all the time, already cut/split =)
[14:59:27] <Jymmm> Just got to avoid the soft and infested woods =)
[15:01:54] <membiblio> Afternoon everyone. Great news for our Routech the first reliable repeatable automatic tool change: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jo8bNegifAk
[15:02:39] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: Even though I swept the chinmey and it was already clean to begin with, had a blockage. weather hasn't been good enough to get on the roof and inspect it all yet. Have you ever heard of cresote build up just within 4 months to cause such a thing? all straight double-wall 6" pipe.
[15:04:52] <Jymmm> 6" ID, 8" OD
[15:18:08] <XXCoder> wonder if its not burning off hot enough so plenty of paracle matter to clog
[15:19:49] <JT-Shop> seems hard to believe you could build up enough creosote to plug the chimney...
[15:47:51] <_methods> no one could figure out at work why this computer kept having BSOD's
[15:47:54] <_methods> https://www.dropbox.com/s/iq82j7igb8mmtsh/2015-12-28%2013.34.50.jpg?dl=0
[15:48:55] <_methods> https://www.dropbox.com/s/6tybglqiwohtib4/2015-12-28%2013.35.14.jpg?dl=0
[15:48:56] <_methods> lol
[15:49:41] <XXCoder> thats not even the worst dusted system I ever saw
[15:49:53] <XXCoder> the worse I saw was computer that has smoker cancer
[15:50:10] <_methods> that's all metal lol
[15:50:10] <XXCoder> I call that gummy dust that is conductive computer smoke cancer
[15:50:22] <_methods> metal and garnet
[15:50:29] <XXCoder> metal dust dang
[15:51:00] <XXCoder> in least its not as toxic as computer smoke cancer
[16:02:29] <bensbenz> smokers computers are nasty, sticky yellow dust
[16:04:03] <XXCoder> and conductive
[16:04:50] <XXCoder> when I used to go around repairing people pcs, I keep telling people who smoke in front of pc that they are giving pc cancer.
[16:05:16] <XXCoder> pcs that people smoke in front of, and has front intake tend to last maybe 2 years then die from cancer
[16:05:20] <bensbenz> lol, they dont care about giving themselves cancer im sure they dont care about the pc
[16:05:40] <XXCoder> bensbenz: oddly enough over half would start smoking away from pc.
[16:05:58] <bensbenz> XXCoder: people are just stupid
[16:06:17] <XXCoder> but then pcs used to cost 1000 bucks for ok one
[16:06:34] <bensbenz> XXCoder: I saw a YT video on radiation, said smokers have insane levels of radiation in their bodies
[16:06:56] <bensbenz> XXCoder: never new that
[16:07:00] <bensbenz> *knew
[16:07:14] <XXCoder> interesting. wonder where source is
[16:07:25] <XXCoder> (I know, smokes but where do smokes get em)
[16:08:10] <bensbenz> from the tobacco
[16:08:32] <XXCoder> well I know.
[16:08:53] <XXCoder> tobacco and tons of fun stuff in it
[16:09:09] <XXCoder> very long list of fun chemicals aded
[16:09:38] <bensbenz> Apparently Polonium-210 and lead 210 accumulate and the sticky tar creates a build up
[16:10:13] <bensbenz> those two get into and on the leaves and stay even through processing
[16:10:25] <bensbenz> so I wonder if the computers are also radioactive?
[16:10:45] <XXCoder> actually lots are, but to degree that dont matter
[16:10:51] <XXCoder> hell, WE are radioactive.
[16:11:02] <bensbenz> well yea, but I meant more so because of the smokers death dust
[16:11:22] <XXCoder> I love that xkcd chart
[16:11:29] <XXCoder> probably so
[16:11:43] <XXCoder> radioactivity can flip bits if done right way
[16:11:57] <XXCoder> and it being conductive can also mess with signals
[16:12:37] <anomynous> i always wondered who is turning the bits around inside computer. Its radio actives.
[16:13:36] <XXCoder> :P
[16:13:53] <anomynous> =)
[16:14:23] <anomynous> gotta go to sleep
[16:14:26] <anomynous> bye
[16:15:29] <Jymmm> XXCoder: I start fires to burn very hot, but at night I damper them back to last longer in the night.
[16:15:44] <XXCoder> probably not it then
[16:17:06] <Jymmm> XXCoder: Burning 4year well seasoned oak (season cracks and bark peeling away by 1/8" inch) and some cedar to get rid of it mostly as I have 2 cords of it.
[16:18:12] <XXCoder> Jymmm: reading one site it says it may be because cold air is cooling gas from fire too fast
[16:18:34] <XXCoder> http://americanpreppersnetwork.com/2011/11/solving-wood-stove-chimney-creosote.html
[16:18:43] <Jymmm> XXCoder: That is one reason I start fires hot, to get that updraft going.
[16:19:09] <Jymmm> XXCoder: usually burning 2-3 newspaper is enough to get the updraft properly.
[16:19:29] <anomynous> hmm. I cant open a file made with libreoffice with openoffice.
[16:19:32] <anomynous> cool.
[16:19:40] <anomynous> im really going to sleep now.
[16:19:46] <XXCoder> isnt you supposed to skeep lol
[16:19:52] <anomynous> yes :D
[16:19:55] <Jymmm> XXCoder: But this is actually some sort of blockage - as in smoke leaking from between the box on the ceiling and the pipe.
[16:20:40] <Jymmm> XXCoder: And that was only after I determined the firebox was having some sort of issue.
[16:21:20] <Jymmm> XXCoder: HINT: have 50lbs of sand at the ready to extinguish fire =)
[16:21:37] <XXCoder> good idea
[16:22:21] <Jymmm> XXCoder: and 50lbs of sand fit PERFECTLY in a 5gal bucket
[16:22:34] <Jymmm> just add an old soup can for a scoop
[16:22:55] <Jymmm> #30 mesh sand
[16:23:20] <XXCoder> there may be dead animal, or maybe dead human there lol
[16:23:37] <Jymmm> 6" wide hu-mon ?
[16:23:53] <XXCoder> heh dwarf
[16:23:56] <Jymmm> lmao
[16:24:03] <XXCoder> anyway yeah gonna check it over ehj
[16:24:42] <Jymmm> Yeah, I might just pull ALL of the pipe, inspect, reseal (silicone), and reinstall.
[16:25:07] <Jymmm> But thats not till spring
[16:25:17] <XXCoder> man up and take the cold
[16:25:20] <XXCoder> heh
[16:26:00] <Jymmm> have a metal snow roof, 5/12 pitch, and melting snow. YOU get your ass up there after singing the liability release waiver for when you fall and break your neck =)
[16:26:10] <Jymmm> signing*
[16:26:49] <Jymmm> XXCoder: and it you fall, there will be a pit bbq honoring you, with a nice cianti
[16:26:53] <Jymmm> if*
[16:31:02] <XXCoder> lol
[16:58:21] <PetefromTn_> https://greenville.craigslist.org/tls/5338897144.html ;) Nice bandsaw
[16:58:33] <Deejay> gn8
[16:58:43] <XXCoder> PetefromTn_: nice and deep too
[16:58:47] <XXCoder> looks like 2 foot
[16:59:03] <XXCoder> 36 in it says
[16:59:14] <PetefromTn_> yup
[17:05:48] <bensbenz> newb question, how do I start a program at a certain line? I tried highlighting the line and execute next line, but it just goes to the top.
[17:09:27] <cradek> highlight the line and then right click
[17:09:33] <cradek> "run from here" I think it says
[17:11:35] <PetefromTn_> I usuallly just go to the top drop down and click run from this line or whatever it is called I can't remember offhand LOL
[17:12:48] <bensbenz> oh sweet, i was looking for a button
[17:12:50] <bensbenz> thanks guys
[17:28:08] <andypugh> A machining challenge: How to machine the surface highlighted in red? https://picasaweb.google.com/108164504656404380542/Holbrook#6234215675290716930
[17:28:39] <andypugh> (I didn’t intend to mean to, but too much paint ended up in there in the core box!)
[17:29:37] <andypugh> I did find a way, I am wondering if there are any other ways.
[17:29:50] <malcom2073> Go in from the right with a boring bar?
[17:29:57] <malcom2073> like an offset one
[17:30:03] <malcom2073> ?
[17:30:29] <andypugh> That was my first thought, but it would have had to be a two-cornered one.
[17:31:24] <andypugh> The through-bore is 49mm at the narrowest point and the red surface is 85mm diameter
[17:31:42] <enleth> chuck a cutter on a long arbor through the hole?
[17:31:44] <andypugh> So, quite a reach, too.
[17:31:45] <malcom2073> Or two different boring bars
[17:31:48] <malcom2073> one for each corner
[17:32:04] <malcom2073> huh
[17:32:41] <andypugh> enleth: Like this you mean? https://picasaweb.google.com/108164504656404380542/Holbrook#6234216221017108498
[17:32:54] <enleth> andypugh: yeah
[17:33:13] <enleth> you lowered the arbor in there first, then mounted the cutter, right?
[17:34:04] <andypugh> Yeah, I had to assemble everything in-situ, then do a helical interpolation, then take it all apart again to measure.
[17:34:23] <andypugh> I had to make the arbor too.
[17:35:58] <andypugh> I would make the shaft to go in there next, except I hadb’t realised that I don’t have any 62mm dia material.
[17:41:43] <enleth> now that's a perfect spot to fuck up if your power goes down, you're in a hurry and you have a mill that must home in axes on startup, beginning with retracting Z, so usually you think nothing on it and hit the button
[17:42:10] <enleth> *of it
[17:42:23] <XXCoder> yeah hurco would also retract on pause
[17:42:34] <XXCoder> not very good idea
[17:43:15] <enleth> no way to disable that?
[17:43:32] <enleth> I can imagine those dovetail cutters and dovetails ruined by this
[17:43:33] <XXCoder> good question I was little more than button pusher operator then
[17:43:48] <XXCoder> heh worse ones was tube side slot cutter
[17:44:01] <XXCoder> if paused it would tool impact on holder and break tool and part too
[17:44:24] <XXCoder> if blackout happened it would be nasty manually taking it out I bet
[17:44:55] <Frank___> hi coder!
[17:45:03] <Frank___> hi everyone
[17:45:37] <Frank___> here i am asking questions again haha
[17:46:16] <Frank___> this time: Servos and steppers, Good mix?? is it doable 1 stepper on z and 3 servos on X and Y ?
[17:46:37] <XXCoder> I dont know if there is controller that can do mix? dunno
[17:48:01] <enleth> I suppose you could fit two different daughter cards to a Mesa controller
[17:48:09] <Frank___> haha its okey, its not the best time for answers right now thanks anyway
[17:48:23] <Frank___> my servo drives take step+dir inputs too
[17:48:32] <Frank___> thats why i was guessing i could
[17:48:50] <enleth> Isn't that kind of missing the point of having servos?
[17:49:08] <enleth> I always assumed the step/dir input on servo controllers is just a "crutch mode"
[17:49:28] <enleth> So you're not SOL if it turns out you absolutely must run stuff like that
[17:50:18] <Frank___> the 7i85S mesa card can do pwm/dir and step/dir on same outputs
[17:50:42] <Frank___> pwm/dir is still crutch mode?? haha
[17:50:48] <Duc> At least it would be easier to setup. Tuning my servos has been a fun exceting time
[17:51:00] <Frank___> they are not 10v
[17:51:03] <Frank___> +- analog
[17:52:32] <enleth> ah, ok
[17:52:54] <Frank___> i still have to tune them up :/
[17:53:36] <Frank___> i should have gone with just steppers T_T
[17:53:40] <Frank___> wood router
[17:54:49] <XXCoder> wood dont need all that much precision
[17:57:24] <Duc> not even close
[17:58:34] <XXCoder> 0.001" is very precise for wood
[17:58:51] <XXCoder> I hope my machine reaches .005" in least
[18:00:07] <Duc> .010 is even overkill
[18:00:15] <Duc> the wood will shink and expand that much
[18:00:41] <XXCoder> sure but I want nice and smooth 3d art
[18:04:41] <Frank___> yea, tell me now, i bought the servos haha T_T
[18:05:26] <_methods> http://www.theregister.co.uk/2015/12/30/ian_murdock_debian_founder/
[18:07:29] <malcom2073> Heh, that's why I converted to steppers
[18:07:42] <malcom2073> took me about three hours to get them installed, wired, and up and running
[18:17:13] <Duc> what kind of servos
[18:20:11] <Frank___> sorry i was away
[18:20:22] <Frank___> pwm panasonic incremental encoders
[18:20:35] <Frank___> i must leave, thanks for the help anyway duc
[18:20:39] <Frank___> ur awesome..
[18:22:14] <Duc> have a good night
[18:34:20] <mark_____> hello
[18:35:02] <mark_____> looking for some help with a lathe config. trying to get ipr feed working
[18:41:40] <Mark_____> anyome here
[18:42:54] <andypugh> No, noibody here :-)
[18:43:41] <andypugh> Hmm, have we been talking abou this on the fotum
[18:43:45] <andypugh> (forum)
[18:44:55] <Mark_____> just trying to get it going. I have some work avaiable if I can get it threading
[18:45:35] <andypugh> Do you have a spindle encoder, with index ?
[18:45:41] <Mark_____> yes
[18:46:18] <Mark_____> hal scope picks it up and the gui??? shows me my spindle rpm
[18:46:27] <andypugh> And does that encoder read exactly one turn per turn, and one rpm per rpm?
[18:47:19] <Mark_____> yes as far as I can tell. There is a little descepence between what the machine speed and linux displ;ays
[18:47:32] <Mark_____> descrepency
[18:47:47] <andypugh> So, you need to connect the motion.spindle-speed in to the encoder velocity, motion.spindle-revs to the encoder position and motion.spindle-index-enable to the encoder index. Three lines of HAL. Job done.
[18:49:08] <Mark_____> when I tried a g98 (I think css mode) it still fed in inches per min. Not inches per rev.
[18:49:23] <Mark_____> might have been g99
[18:50:01] <andypugh> CSS is not the same as feed-per-rev.
[18:50:44] <andypugh> G95 for feed-per-rev: http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.7/html/gcode.html
[18:51:26] <Mark_____> opps g95. I used the wrong one. I'll try again and brb
[18:51:33] <XXCoder> just curious
[18:51:42] <andypugh> I just read back, and earlier I meant motion.spindle-speed-in
[18:51:49] <XXCoder> does program adjust for surface speed as it cuts stock down into smaller diameter?
[18:51:57] <andypugh> Yes
[18:52:00] <andypugh> That’s the pont
[18:52:13] <XXCoder> interesting. thanks
[18:53:31] <andypugh> XXCoder: You can hear it here: https://youtu.be/nIYMfyf4jDI?t=30s
[18:53:44] <XXCoder> heh hear
[18:54:02] <andypugh> Ah. You can potentially see it here: https://youtu.be/nIYMfyf4jDI?t=30s
[18:54:45] <XXCoder> looked like it was speeding uo nearer to center
[18:55:11] <andypugh> I just realised how much I use sound to judge how happy the machine is.
[18:56:17] <gonzo_nb> smell is important too
[18:56:29] <XXCoder> noes, the 2 senses I dont have
[18:56:37] <gonzo_nb> (as is smoke, when I'm taking deep cuts!)
[18:56:43] <Duc> you cant smell either?
[18:56:52] <XXCoder> nah I have lots fun problems
[18:57:14] <XXCoder> like back so bad I got arthitis of back when I was 27. I will be 40 soon.
[18:57:24] <Duc> after tomorrow I may have a fun video for everyone if it works
[18:58:14] <gonzo_nb> you're eye ok though?
[18:58:25] <andypugh> Sympathy on the back, mine has been terrible the last week or so. Standing up is OK, but I can’t escape from seats, or reach the floor.
[18:58:37] <XXCoder> far better than average eyesight
[18:58:38] <Duc> should be shooting my 20mm rifle I built myself if it does blow up we will have it on the gopro
[18:58:54] <andypugh> 20mm?
[18:59:04] <gonzo_nb> Good, I hoped you were not trying to machoine by brail !
[18:59:04] <andypugh> Is that the bore or the barrel length?
[18:59:10] <_methods> jeebus
[18:59:11] <_methods> 20mm
[18:59:19] <Duc> bore
[18:59:20] <_methods> thats antitank size
[18:59:29] <XXCoder> not in terms of focus but big eyesight focus and "active" 180 degree vision which is annoying by itself
[18:59:49] <Duc> http://s158.photobucket.com/user/Patriot222/media/Aircraftguns00211.jpg.html
[18:59:51] <Duc> sizing
[19:00:32] <gonzo_nb> what side of the pond are you on Duc?
[19:00:43] <Duc> US
[19:00:59] <andypugh> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2_bore
[19:01:12] <gonzo_nb> XXCoder, you can still sit at the front seats in the cinema and not miss things
[19:01:32] <XXCoder> no captions are no fun
[19:01:33] <gonzo_nb> A bit easier to play shooting than in the UK
[19:01:44] <gonzo_nb> especially making your own stuff
[19:02:05] <XXCoder> and no, it does not work as everything is weirdly disorted by bad angle near front
[19:02:14] <Duc> yep none of that gun bullshit in AL
[19:02:28] <Duc> XXcoder texting had to be the best thing for you
[19:02:43] <XXCoder> Duc: no shit later 90s was great
[19:02:52] <XXCoder> finally, portable device works for deaf!
[19:02:56] <gonzo_nb> to make stuff in the uk you have to be a registered gun smith. Which they only give if you are really trade
[19:03:28] <XXCoder> tty was good from 60s to 90s but really its deaf tradition to just go to friend house and hope persons there
[19:03:39] <XXCoder> because phone line is expensive
[19:03:45] <Duc> and now you have tinder and online dating
[19:04:07] <Duc> gonzo_nb: Im somewhat in the trade anyways but I needed a way to justify the garage tools
[19:04:09] <gonzo_nb> ans carrying a mecahnical teletype is a bit difficult
[19:05:02] <gonzo_nb> hehe, I probably have a better workshop than most gunsmiths, but I'm not alowd to make stuff
[19:05:03] <XXCoder> heh 60s tty is a mini tank
[19:05:22] <gonzo_nb> I have a 1970's telex machine
[19:05:29] <XXCoder> weights around umm 800 pounds? kidding heh
[19:05:35] <gonzo_nb> it was in the living room till recently
[19:05:43] <XXCoder> I'm still sad my grandparents scrapped em
[19:05:51] <XXCoder> tank ttys is rare
[19:06:11] <gonzo_nb> I moved mine to the shed and it broke the wheel barrow!
[19:06:49] <Duc> LOL
[19:07:39] <gonzo_nb> late here. gn
[19:07:44] <andypugh> gonzo_nb: In practice you can make a gun if you want to. You just can’t let them find out.
[19:08:04] <gonzo_nb> min 5yrs jail
[19:08:17] <malcom2073> Emphesis on "can't" :P
[19:08:36] <andypugh> If they find out. How would they? And, anyway, you could always not make the firing pin.
[19:09:17] <gonzo_nb> cutting the chamber is an act of manufacture
[19:09:25] <Duc> they are really strict over there
[19:10:02] <andypugh> I wonder where I stand with this project? https://picasaweb.google.com/108164504656404380542/Sniper?authuser=0&authkey=Gv1sRgCJ6K36Pg5_T5ew&feat=directlink
[19:10:28] <andypugh> It’s a laser-tag rifle, but with a replica Lee-Enfield bolt action.
[19:10:28] <gonzo_nb> about the only homebrew gunsmithing op you can do is to drill the flash hole on a cannon
[19:10:41] <gonzo_nb> as they are not proof tested by law
[19:10:41] <Duc> what caliber
[19:10:49] <Duc> nice
[19:11:19] <DaViruz> in sweden you can make your own gun if you want to, but you have to apply for a owners license first. and assuming you are eligble to own weapons it isn't usually a problem
[19:12:50] <gonzo_nb> as long as it can't fire of be easilly adapted to fire, it's a replica gun, in uk law
[19:13:42] <Duc> this gun I had to apply for a destructive device before I could make the lower
[19:13:56] <gonzo_nb> you can't make usable stuff in the uk, even if you have a licence to own it
[19:14:56] <gonzo_nb> right GN people
[19:15:07] <Duc> time to move then
[19:18:17] <andypugh> Well, to be honest, I don’t feel that upset that I am not allowed to make a gnu.
[19:19:17] <malcom2073> Tbh, I only really one to make one because I'm not supposed to
[19:19:19] <Duc> Its a little different view living in the US but I only use guns for fun at the range
[19:19:45] <andypugh> Compared to, for example, the fact that two nice ladies turn up every morning to get my (geriatric, invalid) dad out of bed, and every night to put him back to bed, for no expense on my part or theirs.
[19:20:43] <malcom2073> Wait, aren't you like, ancient yourself?
[19:20:43] <malcom2073> :P
[19:21:08] <malcom2073> Ohh wait
[19:21:09] <malcom2073> that's archivist
[19:21:11] <malcom2073> not you, sorry
[19:21:23] <andypugh> You don’t want to go believing my Facebook age :-)
[19:22:12] <andypugh> I got so many “happy 99th birthday” messages on Monday :-)
[19:22:19] <malcom2073> Haha awesome
[19:28:24] <Mark_____> thanks andy. The G95 worked great. I also added in the homing switches and had to play around a little to get them right
[20:26:08] <Jymmm> andypugh: WOW! You look MUCH older than your age ;)
[20:27:01] <Jymmm> Does anyone use radiant floor heating (heated water tubes in floor) ?
[20:27:23] <andypugh> Yes
[20:27:33] <Jymmm> andypugh: How do you like it?
[20:27:37] <andypugh> Moderately common in the UK
[20:27:55] <andypugh> It works well, and you don’t have any vsible radiators.
[20:27:57] <t12> i got the tiniest boring bar
[20:28:00] <t12> https://www.instagram.com/p/_8E7yBACtw/
[20:28:02] <Jymmm> andypugh: electric elements or liquid filled?
[20:28:07] <andypugh> Water
[20:28:29] <Jymmm> andypugh: any drawbacks or cavets you've found?
[20:29:48] <andypugh> My parent have it. We have had a couple of leaks with their (proprietary, no longer in business) system. Luckily all at the manifold not in the concrete
[20:30:19] <Jymmm> andypugh: Ah, ok. At first glance, wood fired with propane backup seems ideal for us
[20:30:47] <andypugh> t12: I see your huge boring bar and suggest: https://picasaweb.google.com/108164504656404380542/CNCUnsorted#6057493351291797154
[20:31:10] <t12> nice
[20:31:12] <t12> all in one lot?
[20:31:41] <andypugh> Yeah, eBay. £50
[20:31:50] <t12> nice
[20:31:53] <t12> i saw a lot of like
[20:31:58] <t12> 30 axa's go up
[20:32:02] <t12> for alot of money
[20:32:04] <t12> then sell instantly
[20:32:35] <Jymmm> andypugh: I came across this wood gasification boiler, not that I think I need THAT much... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Rp1yBpP3xE
[20:33:10] <Jymmm> andypugh: Would rdianting heating work in the shop without mucking with the floor? Maybe on the wall or something?
[20:33:46] <andypugh> i would like underfllor for machine tools, it would keep the tools warmer than the air.
[20:34:43] <Jymmm> andypugh: Sure, I'm just not gonna muck with any concrete work at this time. I thought some radiator'ish thing might do on the wall.
[20:34:57] <andypugh> t12: P H Horm make a boring bar of 0.2mm holes.
[20:35:12] <andypugh> (P H Horn, I mean)
[20:35:17] <t12> that is
[20:35:20] <t12> very itty bitty
[20:35:49] <andypugh> I think they make it to show off. I can’t think of an application.
[20:36:40] <t12> i've been thinking of getting a little LWD microscope-usb thing now for the lathe
[20:36:48] <t12> so i dont have to get my face all up in the lathe
[20:36:57] <Jymmm> andypugh: They make pex-al-pex (HDPE-Aluminum-HDPE layered tubing) now too this is even certified for air lines , 120PSI iirc.
[20:36:59] <t12> but really i want one thats just hdmi out to a panel
[20:37:28] <Jymmm> t12: got a android tablet?
[20:37:36] <t12> not on hand but could
[20:37:41] <t12> is there a good tablety one?
[20:37:44] <Jymmm> t12: hang on...
[20:39:01] <Jymmm> t12: They make them in 1 to 15m in length, cheaper off ebay... http://www.amazon.com/BlueFire-Android-Endoscope-Phones-Function/dp/B013HZCYXK/
[20:39:05] <andypugh> Jymmm: Yes, the Kee system we used (triple tube, quite neat, and a goood idea) has basically been replaced by HDPE barrier piping. http://www.wavin.co.uk/web/solutions/heating-cooling/underfloor-heating/manifolds-and-controls-hep2o.htm
[20:39:30] <t12> oh cool
[20:39:36] <t12> thats awesome
[20:39:56] <Jymmm> t12: I thought you could just get a cheap 7" tablet and use as the screen mounted on a gooseneck off the lathe
[20:40:07] <t12> yeah
[20:40:11] <andypugh> t12: A chap I know uses a microscope on his lathe because he makes tiny things.
[20:40:12] <t12> maybe cheap amazon tablet
[20:40:24] <Jymmm> t12: They even have "right angle" mirrors you can attach to the tips
[20:40:37] <andypugh> Not sure what he uses. But he spends a lot of money on his hobby.
[20:40:50] <t12> i got some grade 2 ti to turn
[20:40:55] <Jymmm> t12: When I say cheap tablet, I mean like $24USD =)
[20:40:56] <t12> i wonder how terrible/not terrible this will be
[20:41:18] <Jymmm> t12: I think Loetmichel2 has one on his, ask him
[20:41:19] <t12> i wionder what the cheapest ip67 ish tablet is
[20:41:34] <Jymmm> t12: ziplock bag = IP67 =)
[20:42:06] <andypugh> Pictures 6-onwards here are from his lathe microscope. Yes, he really is making O-rings smaller than you can buy… http://www.f1-2000.co.uk/index.php?f=fuel_injectors
[20:42:39] <Jymmm> andypugh: I know where to get orings from =)
[20:42:56] <Jymmm> andypugh: they'll even custom make them
[20:43:22] <andypugh> Too late, he already made his own..
[20:43:51] <t12> lol:
[20:43:51] <Jymmm> andypugh: OH, zoning... how do you keep the water hot from beginning to end?
[20:43:52] <t12> You soon realise that you’re onto a hiding to nothing with your 30 quid Jacobs chuck and start learning lots of new words like “Albrecht” and “Schaublin”.
[20:44:33] <Jymmm> andypugh: If it's 120F going in and 90F coming out as example.
[20:44:36] <t12> why bother making a fullsize f1.... when you can make a 1/4!
[20:45:02] <t12> might as well ebeam mill it at some point
[20:45:04] <andypugh> Jymmm: Well, the Kee system had three tubes side-by-side extruded as a set, and you ran the outers one way and the inner the other, so it kind of evened-out.
[20:45:23] <Jymmm> andypugh: Ah, makes total sense.
[20:45:34] <Jymmm> andypugh: three???
[20:45:58] <andypugh> Yes, not sure why three and not two.
[20:46:12] <Jymmm> andypugh: Heh, okey we're thinkng the same on that =)
[20:47:02] <Jymmm> andypugh: We think the wood fired stove might have been making the birds sick. So looking at alternatives.
[20:47:24] <Jymmm> very sensative respritory systems (aka canary in a coal mine)
[20:48:00] <andypugh> We like it, in my parents house. if I was (like them) in a situation where my house had no floors, I would probably install it.
[20:48:56] <Jymmm> andypugh: This is a mobile home, so I can install UNDER the existing flooring in the crawlspace, then insulate under that.
[20:50:16] <Jymmm> andypugh: then I dont have to muck with the existing flooring
[20:50:41] <Jymmm> ...and do a little bit at a time
[20:50:59] <Jymmm> with nobody screaming "are you done yet?" lol
[20:52:55] <andypugh> You need to have a lot of insulation under the pipes to send the heat the right way. My parents’ floor is hardcore, blinded with sand, then a membrane, then 3” of poly-something foam, then 4” of concrete, them the pipes, then a screed, then the flor covering.
[20:53:23] <andypugh> Int their case the floor covering is 2” of stone flags, but that’s a local peculiarity.
[20:58:56] <Jymmm> andypugh: Ah, yeah. Well in this case I suspect it's particalboard flooring, so have the tubes underthat, and sheet insulation under that.
[21:00:19] <Jymmm> andypugh: I have seen these aluminum extrusions that the tube sit in to act as radiators and heat spreaders.
[21:01:02] <Jymmm> andypugh: http://www.builditsolar.com/Projects/SpaceHeating/DHWplusSpace/P1060005.JPG
[21:01:31] <andypugh> I have only seen those for electrical versions, but then I haven’t really been looking. When it is all in concrete and under stone then spreaders are pointless anyway.
[21:02:02] <Jymmm> http://www.radiantec.com/pricing/heat_transfer_plates.php?PRINTERFRIENDLY=ON
[21:02:24] <Jymmm> with stone, yeah
[21:08:00] <Jymmm> andypugh: Are they usually "dumb" systems? Meaning that each zone is fixed?
[21:08:09] <Jymmm> temperature wise
[21:09:30] <andypugh> One zone per room, in their system. But it was put in 20 years ago. I keep wanting to rip out all the current controls and put relays, indicators and an Arduino on DIN rail.
[21:10:10] <Jymmm> I was thinking of using https://www.sparkfun.com/products/245
[21:10:33] <Jymmm> then you can really monitor/tweek areas
[21:11:03] <andypugh> Aye, something like that would be part of my installaion, if i went that way.
[21:11:56] <Jymmm> and a big ass deep cycle battery for backup of the electronics, pumps, acuators.
[21:13:48] <Jymmm> andypugh: does it snow where you are using it?
[21:15:16] <andypugh> Sometimes, but rarely indoors.
[21:15:23] <_methods> lol
[21:26:12] <malcom2073> lol
[21:26:14] <malcom2073> rarely, but not never
[21:26:35] <malcom2073> Jymmm: I may be lucking into a pallet of unused, but 5 year old deep cycle gel cell batteries
[21:26:42] <malcom2073> Would be a good start to a battery backup for my house
[21:29:01] <Jymmm> malcom2073: If you get them, I can let you in on how I revived most of mine.
[21:29:26] <malcom2073> Cool, yeah if I can't, I'm gonna recycle them for the money, but I'd love to be able to use them
[21:30:08] <Jymmm> malcom2073: I dont think you can recycle AGM's
[21:30:23] <malcom2073> Jymmm: Yeah I found a guy who pays for them, not as much as lead cells, but he'll still pay
[21:30:30] <Jymmm> malcom2073: Get one of these http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__10080__Turnigy_130A_Watt_Meter_and_Power_Analyzer.html
[21:30:49] <Jymmm> malcom2073: If you wait on that page for 15 minutes a discount popup will come up
[21:30:59] <malcom2073> Jymmm: I have a battery load tester
[21:31:07] <Jymmm> malcom2073: one of those?
[21:31:14] <malcom2073> No, an actual car battery tester
[21:31:20] <Jymmm> get oen of those
[21:31:22] <malcom2073> It does up to 500A loads
[21:31:41] <Jymmm> doesn't measure watts draw does it?
[21:32:00] <malcom2073> It loads the battery, and can tell if the battery is any good
[21:32:13] <Jymmm> malcom2073: Yeah, no. that's nto what oyou want.
[21:32:18] <malcom2073> To tell if they're good?
[21:32:32] <Jymmm> To REVIVE the battery
[21:32:37] <malcom2073> Ohhhh
[21:32:38] <malcom2073> yeah
[21:32:44] <Jymmm> this takes like two weeks to do
[21:32:44] <malcom2073> If they're toasted yeah
[21:33:21] <Jymmm> put anderson power poles on each end too
[21:34:20] <malcom2073> I like those connectors
[21:34:24] <Jymmm> malcom2073: Per this specification... http://www.qsl.net/w2vtm/powerpole.html
[21:34:34] <malcom2073> Yeah
[21:35:16] <Jymmm> malcom2073: I have all kinds of jumpers, adapters using that spec and PP (power poles)
[21:35:22] <malcom2073> Yeah we use them at work
[21:35:29] <Jymmm> malcom2073: you do?
[21:35:36] <Jymmm> malcom2073: what amperage?
[21:37:06] <malcom2073> Mainly their 30A stuff, but some of our larger equipment uses the 120A ones
[21:37:26] <Jymmm> malcom2073: Dude! Buddy, Pal O Mine!!!
[21:37:38] <malcom2073> But I was thinking: use this battery pack to run my gas furnace
[21:37:44] <malcom2073> Then I'd not need to run my generator overnight
[21:37:53] <Jymmm> malcom2073: I need some 120A stuff =)
[21:37:56] <malcom2073> Only every couple hours to keep the fridge/freezer cold
[21:38:01] <malcom2073> haha, I can't take any of it, it's all govt. property :P
[21:38:04] <malcom2073> inventoried and crap
[21:38:21] <malcom2073> I can probably crimp them for ya though if you need
[21:38:30] <Jymmm> malcom2073: I'll take the crap that doens't pass QC =)
[21:38:47] <malcom2073> We're R&D, if it doesn't pass QC, you wouldn't want it
[21:38:59] <Jymmm> malcom2073: the hell I wouldn't =)
[21:39:05] <malcom2073> Lol
[21:39:23] <Jymmm> malcom2073: I want 120A for jumper cables for the car, plus maybe for the inverter
[21:40:49] <malcom2073> They're not *terribly* expensive, something like $20 each conector including contact
[21:41:04] <Jymmm> malcom2073: and if you have any spare 30A contacts that just get swept off the floor, I'll be happy to sort thru the dirt pile =)
[21:41:47] <malcom2073> I wish
[21:41:47] <Jymmm> malcom2073: Yeah, times 4, plus the shells. and that's if I dont fuck up crimping them the first time =)
[21:41:51] <malcom2073> Nothing good ever gets thrown out
[21:42:06] <malcom2073> 20 includes the shells, so $80 per connectio nset heh
[21:42:23] <Jymmm> malcom2073: I can open the hood of my car for that =)
[21:43:11] <Jymmm> malcom2073: Actualy, I have the shells, just need the terminals.
[21:43:39] <Jymmm> malcom2073: how many watts is your gas furnace?
[21:43:44] <malcom2073> only 4kw
[21:43:48] <Jymmm> and is the blower 110 or 220 ?
[21:44:04] <malcom2073> 110 only :( I wish it was 220 to run my waer pump
[21:44:04] <Jymmm> 4KW?! for GAS ?!???????????
[21:44:05] <malcom2073> water*
[21:44:23] <malcom2073> ?
[21:44:30] <malcom2073> oh hahah
[21:44:31] <malcom2073> furnace
[21:44:32] <malcom2073> I read generator
[21:44:35] <malcom2073> I haven't a clue
[21:44:52] <Jymmm> then how do you know how much power you need for it?
[21:45:15] <malcom2073> Because it only has a 200w water pump, and a <1a ignitor
[21:45:23] <Jymmm> and a blower
[21:45:26] <malcom2073> No
[21:45:30] <malcom2073> Hot water baseboard
[21:45:34] <malcom2073> Hence, the water pump
[21:45:36] <Jymmm> oh radiate heat
[21:45:40] <malcom2073> yeah
[21:45:59] <malcom2073> Totally silly to run my generator just for that
[21:46:04] <malcom2073> batteries would be much better
[21:46:08] <Jymmm> so 200W / 120V = 2A
[21:46:23] <Jymmm> That's a cheap inverter easily
[21:46:28] <malcom2073> Indeed!
[21:46:39] <malcom2073> That's the plan, cheap inverter + high power battery charger
[21:46:50] <Jymmm> no need for hight power charger
[21:47:00] <malcom2073> Eh, so it can top off the bank during the occasional generator running
[21:47:11] <malcom2073> Tbh, I don't even need a battery bank
[21:47:26] <malcom2073> how long would a 60AH car battery run on say, 400watts draw?
[21:47:32] <malcom2073> assuming terrible inverter efficiency
[21:47:37] <Jymmm> http://www.autozone.com/test-scan-and-specialty-tools/battery-charger/schumacher-75-12-2-amp-fully-automatic-battery-charger-engine-starter/989_0_0/?checkfit=true
[21:47:58] <Jymmm> malcom2073: 30 hours less loss of the inverter itself
[21:48:04] <malcom2073> Yeah
[21:48:24] <malcom2073> I could probably get by with 1-2 batteries, + charging during the once every few hours the generator is on for a bit
[21:48:47] <Jymmm> No, let the battery charger operate it 24/7/365
[21:48:58] <malcom2073> I mean when the power is off
[21:49:06] <Jymmm> me too
[21:49:24] <Jymmm> Then it's a backed system hands off.
[21:49:33] <malcom2073> Oh, yeah it would be
[21:49:45] <Jymmm> at the cost of extra KW running it for years
[21:50:09] <malcom2073> Meh, I'd get myself a charger that can switch between fast charge and float as needed
[21:50:11] <Jymmm> But, I'd rather have heat all on it's own
[21:50:20] <malcom2073> OH
[21:50:25] <malcom2073> you mean run the furnace off the batteries all the time
[21:50:27] <Jymmm> read the link... FULLY AUTOMATIC
[21:50:27] <malcom2073> yeah
[21:50:43] <malcom2073> Fully automatic means it goes from full charge to trickle, almost never the other way around
[21:50:46] <Jymmm> actually, that one is WAY over kill
[21:51:03] <Jymmm> it will, if the battery is low
[21:51:25] <Jymmm> and an inverter will suck the life out of batteries =)
[21:51:39] <Jymmm> NEVER EVER trust the "low battery" shutoff on inverters =)
[21:51:44] <malcom2073> I actually already have a AC switching setup that will flip the furnace over to the batteries in case of a power loss designed and half built
[21:53:13] <Jymmm> Shit, I got brand new still in the box inverters, and deep cycle battery I just topped off ready to use and a car battery charger ready to go =)
[21:53:20] <malcom2073> Lol
[21:53:32] <malcom2073> There ya go! you're set... but do you have a radiant heat furnace? :P
[21:53:42] <Jymmm> malcom2073: It's the 3KW inverter I need to make cables for =(
[21:53:50] <malcom2073> Yowch heh
[21:53:53] <Jymmm> malcom2073: Fuck you and the boiler you rode in on!
[21:53:57] <malcom2073> Lol
[21:54:23] <Jymmm> malcom2073: Yeah, I was thinking of making some using the 8ga cable I have a spool of
[21:54:37] <Jymmm> 8ga+8ga+8ga =)
[21:54:49] <Jymmm> that's about 4ga I'd guess
[21:55:04] <malcom2073> heh
[21:55:22] <Jymmm> good for 4.2 minutes on one battery =)
[21:55:34] <Jymmm> maybe 1.2 minutes =)
[21:55:37] <malcom2073> hah
[21:55:45] <malcom2073> bonus: battery will double as a heater afterwards
[21:56:03] <Jymmm> if the cables power ing dont start glowing first
[21:56:49] <Jymmm> Maybe I'll lok for broken jumper cables at a yard sale
[21:56:53] <Jymmm> look*
[21:57:46] <malcom2073> I still need to clean up the regulation on my generator, it's damn dirty
[21:58:18] <Jymmm> malcom2073: http://www.harborfreight.com/200-watt-continuous400-watt-peak-power-inverter-61478.html
[21:58:33] <malcom2073> I got one of those heh
[21:58:40] <Jymmm> how are you going to clean it up?
[21:59:05] <Jymmm> plug your furnce into that directly, but maybe get the bigger one
[21:59:08] <malcom2073> It's a 70's generator, probably just taking apart and cleaning up the governer would make it work a bit better
[21:59:33] <Jymmm> http://www.harborfreight.com/400-watt-continuous-800-watt-peak-power-inverter-66814.html
[22:00:12] <Jymmm> 2KW/4kw not too bad reviews http://www.harborfreight.com/2000-watt-continuous4000-watt-peak-power-inverter-69662.html
[22:00:44] <Jymmm> Still Modified sine wave, so be leary of that.
[22:01:15] <malcom2073> I'm doing research on actually replacing the bridge rectification circuit for the exciter
[22:01:19] <malcom2073> apparently those go a bit wonky as they get old
[22:01:40] <malcom2073> yeah modified sine is ugly, but would work
[22:01:47] <Jymmm> malcom2073: What I actually thought of doing is getting a quality inverter and wire that into one circuit inthe electric panel. then I ALWAYS have lights
[22:02:14] <malcom2073> Jymmm: Oh, have like backup lights always wired to the generator?
[22:02:17] <Jymmm> and in your case, your furnace too
[22:02:28] <Jymmm> malcom2073: No, like
[22:02:32] <malcom2073> They make panels with safeties to allow switchovers
[22:02:53] <Jymmm> malcom2073: In homes, the ceiling lights in the entire home are on one circuit (breaker).
[22:03:13] <malcom2073> Heh, lucky. Mine are on like, 5
[22:03:19] <malcom2073> old houses suck
[22:04:14] <Jymmm> malcom2073: the output of the circuit breaker would go to charge the batteries that powers the inverter. The output of the interver would be wired into the cuircut that would normally be connected to the output of the breaker
[22:04:24] <malcom2073> Ah gotcha
[22:04:45] <Jymmm> Basically a UPS
[22:04:52] <malcom2073> yeah
[22:05:00] <malcom2073> Ohhh there's a better idea
[22:05:03] <malcom2073> I have a 3kw UPS
[22:05:10] <malcom2073> I wonder how clean its inverter is
[22:05:11] <Jymmm> but semi-erm wired into one circuit in the breaker box
[22:05:33] <Jymmm> malcom2073: check with batteries connected AND disconnected
[22:05:44] <malcom2073> I have no batteries for it atm, gonna have to wait until I get some lol
[22:05:47] <Jymmm> UPS are usually sinewave
[22:06:05] <Jymmm> that big anyway
[22:06:11] <malcom2073> Yeah
[22:06:20] <malcom2073> It has bad batteries in it right now, weighs like 120lbs
[22:06:30] <Jymmm> An an APC UPS
[22:06:36] <Jymmm> 8 battereis
[22:06:49] <Jymmm> wired in 24/48v configuration
[22:07:19] <malcom2073> Hmm, 5000VA
[22:07:19] <malcom2073> http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=&sku=613890&gclid=Cj0KEQiAno60BRDt89rAh7qt-4wBEiQASes2tZuw31_8esyGKmOqzoNCVR2fQCXxqw5JQNcw_EGBdqIaAioP8P8HAQ&Q=&ap=y&is=REG&A=details
[22:07:21] <malcom2073> One of them
[22:07:40] <malcom2073> Except 110V input, which is *odd*, becuase that'd be more than a 20A circuit could handle
[22:07:58] <Jymmm> ( ( (12+12) + (12+12) ) + ( (12+12) + (12+12) ) )
[22:08:41] <Jymmm> malcom2073: 3000VA != 3KW =)
[22:08:59] <Jymmm> but I had 3KW 120V APC UPS too =)
[22:09:01] <malcom2073> Psh, my power factor is 1.0 beotch!
[22:09:12] <Jymmm> not even in your wet dreams!
[22:09:19] <Jymmm> maybe .1
[22:09:20] <malcom2073> haha
[22:09:52] <Jymmm> yeah, run that UPS as the output of your gen and you'ld have a killer setup
[22:10:46] <malcom2073> The generator has a 12VDC decent amp output for its exciter and for charging its lead cell starting battery, I wonder how many amps it actually is
[22:11:21] <malcom2073> The UPS won't run off the generator, few will
[22:11:38] <malcom2073> Especially APC's, they want clean power
[22:11:42] <Jymmm> I bet it will with batteries installed
[22:11:59] <malcom2073> I've had very little luck with them running off generators, and at work we've tried a lot :)
[22:11:59] <Jymmm> Then hell, they use the batteries to deliver clean power
[22:12:05] <malcom2073> That's what I thought!
[22:12:09] <Jymmm> malcom2073: really?
[22:12:14] <malcom2073> Yeah, they usually fault out
[22:12:21] <Jymmm> bastrds
[22:12:22] <malcom2073> Honda inverter generators *sometimes* will work
[22:12:31] <malcom2073> but a non inverter generator? hell no
[22:12:32] <Jymmm> eu2000i ?
[22:12:41] <malcom2073> And don't even *think* about running it on a modified sine wave inverter
[22:12:44] <malcom2073> yeah
[22:12:46] <Jymmm> hahaha
[22:12:54] <malcom2073> We have 1k, 2k, and 3k eu's
[22:13:03] <Jymmm> Cool, that's what I have now, but I have been looking at a propane powered one
[22:13:12] <malcom2073> Used to have a 6k, it disappeared after the last layoff, bastards
[22:13:22] <malcom2073> They make propane kits
[22:13:27] <malcom2073> I got one for my generator, it's pretty slick
[22:13:28] <Jymmm> malcom2073: whats that big box behind you I see ?
[22:13:41] <malcom2073> hah I wish
[22:13:49] <malcom2073> I wouldn't be using a 1970's 4kw if I had that :-D
[22:14:23] <Jymmm> malcom2073: There is a 4KW one too http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00LT8S7IY
[22:15:16] <Jymmm> malcom2073: 4KW propane http://www.amazon.com/dp/B009RBKGZC
[22:15:28] <malcom2073> Heh
[22:15:42] <malcom2073> I got a conversion kit for $80, made an aluminum adapter on the mill, and boom, mine is propane too
[22:15:44] <Jymmm> malcom2073: the only bitch I've seen is ppl dont like how/where the battery is , hard to get to
[22:16:08] <Jymmm> but that's easy to fix for us
[22:16:32] <malcom2073> 240/30a could do my water pump heh
[22:16:35] <Jymmm> malcom2073: they even include the regulator and hose
[22:16:43] <malcom2073> yeah
[22:16:44] <Jymmm> for propane
[22:16:58] <malcom2073> propane is *so* much more convenient than gasoline
[22:16:58] <Jymmm> and electric start
[22:17:12] <Jymmm> but still has pull start for backup
[22:17:22] <malcom2073> Heh, mine has no pull start
[22:17:29] <malcom2073> its electric start uses the generation motor
[22:17:35] <Jymmm> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZgKe9U4d7es
[22:21:24] <malcom2073> I think I'm gonna do that tomorrow, take apart this APC, stick it on a spare car battery, and hook it to the generator and see if it'll run
[22:21:39] <malcom2073> the battery warehouse near me has APC replacement batteries for a fraction of the cost, including the connectors
[22:22:36] <malcom2073> bedtime for me though, night
[22:29:25] <Jymmm> malcom2073: G'night, it'll need EIGHT batterys iirc.
[22:59:55] <XXCoder> http://www.smbc-comics.com/index.php?id=3953
[23:00:01] <Erant> Got my backlash down to 2 thou. I think the remaining 2 thou is going to have to come from backlash nuts and new gibs.
[23:00:48] <XXCoder> click red button when done reading heh
[23:23:38] <toastyde1th> ...or BALLSCREWS! :D
[23:57:03] * Jymmm smacks XXCoder with a reality check.... WHAT WERE YOU THINKING?! Oh wait, you weren't, nm.
[23:57:17] <XXCoder> :P'
[23:57:37] <XXCoder> sigh gonna love ' typo