#linuxcnc | Logs for 2015-12-24

[02:34:25] <Deejay> moin
[03:33:18] <_abc_> Hello. Concerning the latest hybrid live isos from linuxcnc.org : how well does it run from just a stick, with no install? I.e. live install only?
[04:35:45] <C_P-Away> Sup.
[05:21:44] <_abc_> supsup
[06:00:51] <jthornton> morning
[06:01:16] <_methods> bobo__: I don't need to go to a theater to see idiocracy anymore, all i have to do is turn on CNN
[06:05:03] <XXCoder> or fox
[06:05:30] <XXCoder> or any tv channel trump is on
[06:11:32] <archivist> renishaw parcel from usa made it to home
[06:13:17] <enleth> heh, safe spaces
[06:13:21] <enleth> I labeled a safe
[06:13:25] <enleth> bleh
[06:13:37] <enleth> I labeled a safe, as in, an armored cabinet, "safe space, SJWs welcome"
[06:13:50] <enleth> just couldn'r resist
[06:14:43] <enleth> must make a stencil and srpay it on to make it permanent
[06:16:07] <_methods> wtf is a safe space?
[06:16:13] <_methods> googling
[06:17:14] <_methods> i should have never googled that
[06:17:25] <enleth> _methods: supposedly a place where people who just can't cope with differing opinions and other aliments of reality can retreat to
[06:18:12] <_methods> i'm so glad i work in a machine shop
[06:18:38] <enleth> they will come for you too
[06:18:56] <_methods> nah we're safe
[06:19:08] <_methods> none of these kids want to have anything to do with getting dirty
[06:19:12] <_methods> all the dirty jobs are safe
[06:19:35] <archivist> looks like a nice chip for playing with encoders on this board http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/252184446663
[06:19:38] <enleth> but you defnitely have dirty jokes around there
[06:19:44] <enleth> you can't have that, oh no
[06:20:31] <_methods> yeah our workplace is extremely intolerant
[06:20:40] <_methods> racist and sexist also
[06:20:40] <_methods> lol
[06:20:57] <_methods> pretty much the opposite of this safe space
[06:21:37] <enleth> you know what language has had the most holocaust jokes created in it?
[06:21:42] <enleth> hebrew.
[06:21:54] <enleth> those guys have a sense of humor.
[07:44:29] <Frank__> guys, sorry to bother, but i have a little question regarding phase z encoder output from driver, the manual shows, besides the common phase z + - an Open collector output of phase Z signal , and im wiring to mesa cards, i believe that output shoulnt be wired right?
[07:46:01] <archivist> you want the z/index normally
[07:47:29] <Frank__> that means i just want to connect the phase z+ and phase z- right ? :) new to this stuff
[07:50:36] <archivist> if using the differential inputs connect both
[07:56:47] <Frank__> that means i should be using the 7i85s daughterboard right?
[07:57:08] <Frank__> 8 differential output plus 4 channel encoder interface says the manual
[07:57:35] <archivist> encoders go to inputs
[07:58:15] <archivist> I have been wondering why you keep saying output
[07:58:33] <Frank__> outputs from the driver, as manual refers
[07:58:50] <archivist> what driver
[08:15:48] <Frank__> sorry archivist, my internet is working really bad
[10:07:38] <Jymmm> When it's good, it's good. When it's bad, it's better!
[10:10:01] <ReadError> back to square 0 on mesa ;( saw the ethernet stuff only works with some cards
[10:10:08] <ReadError> considering the USB stuff now
[10:15:54] <ReadError> 7I61-16 a solid board?
[10:19:44] <archivist> usb is hardly solid, not sure if that is ever used in the linuxcnc environment except for hand controls
[10:20:17] <enleth> ReadError: yeah, you don't want USB
[10:20:45] <enleth> unless maybe you've got everything on USB3 and the root hub can work with USB2 emulation completely disabled
[10:21:15] <enleth> USB3 is much better when it comes to reliability, keeping timings and handling things in hardware
[10:24:35] <pcw_home> USB cannot be used for linuxCNC real time motion
[10:25:19] <pcw_home> (well its theoretically possible but reliable real time is very unlikely)
[10:34:05] <pcw_home> I would use the Ethernet card if you dont want to use a PCI or PCIE card
[10:34:09] <enleth> pcw_home: it would be interesting to try USB3, it may be capable of useful near-realtime
[10:34:30] <enleth> much more is done in hardware by the root hub
[10:34:56] <ReadError> pcw_home compatability wise with the ethernet card in the host, is that list just ones that are confirmed working, or hard and fast 'only these work' ?
[10:34:57] <archivist> usb2 has the data rate just has a silly enumerate the devices time
[10:35:03] <enleth> but I'm not sure if any native USB3 serial or generic I/O expander device chips even exist
[10:37:57] <pcw_home> The Ethernet stuff should work on most systems though low end systems like Atom are marginal at 1 KHz
[10:39:31] <ReadError> hmm alright, I want to try it within a virtualized enviroment
[10:40:26] <pcw_home> well 50 Hz might work...
[10:40:55] <archivist> realtime under a vm?
[10:41:18] <Jymmm> WHISKEY TANGO FOXTROT
[10:42:36] <ReadError> yea I duno, I mean worst case I can put linux on this box
[10:42:54] <ReadError> or build up another
[10:43:14] <Jymmm> Computer hardware is cheap
[10:44:57] <ReadError> yea i have an old core2duo mobo/ram laying around
[10:45:12] <ReadError> maybe I can go full maker and try BBB headless
[10:45:55] <Jymmm> Why are you looking at everything else but "real" hardware?
[10:46:35] <Jymmm> http://www.ebay.com/itm/HP-dc7900-SFF-Intel-Core-Duo-2-E8400-3-00Ghz-2GB-Ram-DVD-DRIVE-No-Hard-Drive-/281892744997
[10:47:49] <Jymmm> $40 and free shipping
[10:48:05] <ReadError> the app im using actually interfaces with linuxcnc over the networking/socket stuff though
[10:48:36] <ReadError> I mostly need something to manage the servos/encoder stuff and get away from the horrible smoothie acceleration
[10:51:40] <Jymmm> ReadError: What is this "app" you speak of?
[10:51:52] <ReadError> openpnp
[10:53:25] <Jymmm> And how does it "interface" with lcnc?
[10:53:45] <ReadError> connection to port 5007
[10:54:06] <ReadError> hmm or 502
[10:54:10] <ReadError> https://github.com/openpnp/openpnp/blob/develop/src/main/java/org/openpnp/machine/reference/driver/LinuxCNC.java
[10:55:32] <ReadError> looks quite dated though
[10:57:41] <Jymmm> 5 years old, that's almost ancient in software time.
[10:58:57] <ReadError> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=30C1VRfbi9k
[10:59:03] <malcom2073> *insert comment about linuxcnc here*
[10:59:06] <ReadError> someone has it running on a fairly new build
[10:59:49] <Jymmm> ReadError: Maybe ask them about their setup and how it's been working for them?
[11:00:30] * Jymmm returns to his 4 hour movie...
[11:01:08] <FinboySlick> Jymmm: The life of Jesus?
[11:01:27] <FinboySlick> You're supposed to watch that one on Easter, not Christmas
[11:02:50] <Jymmm> FinboySlick: Alexander: The ultimate cut
[11:04:37] <archivist> sooo, complain to ebay seller or just give crap feedback and repair it :)
[11:07:13] <archivist> description "may be incomplete", one part was removed from machine by a saw by the look of it thus making it near useless to many
[11:07:18] <os1r1s> ReadError Have you talked to arthur or wolfman about your accel issues?
[11:08:25] <ReadError> os1r1s ive asked about the s-curve stuff
[11:08:34] <malcom2073> os1r1s: GL with that, I've had that conversation with them
[11:08:35] <ReadError> it just seems really unsmooth ;/
[11:09:56] <malcom2073> If you have high speed steppers, or need fast high mass accelerations, you're significantly better off with linuxcnc
[11:09:59] <os1r1s> Interesting. I don't have that issue with my smoothies.
[11:10:24] <ReadError> the servo drivers accept step/dir control
[11:10:27] <ReadError> I may try that
[11:10:57] <os1r1s> Linuxcnc brings a wealth of other features. But accel is a pretty basic feature that smoothie seems to do ok with.
[11:13:31] <malcom2073> ReadError: That may work, give it enough follow error that it can catch up when smoothie overshoots the acceleration
[11:14:12] <os1r1s> Anyone cnc a G0704 here?
[11:14:47] <archivist> a number have, just ask the real question
[11:17:12] <os1r1s> archivist Just curious how many people have had good success with it. And how much work was required to get it cleaned up and usable. There seem to be quite a few forum entries about unfinished parts and problems.
[11:20:24] <archivist> I think the problems show why some of us recommend getting old industrial iron
[11:21:35] <malcom2073> If you have the space, you really can't beat buying old iron
[11:21:42] <malcom2073> Space and capability or money to move it
[11:22:37] <os1r1s> archivist And more to the point, I have a fairly well equipped Taig, but am always looking at the next step up. Tormach's seem expensive and problematic. The g0704 has a lot more machining area than I expected.
[11:24:37] <archivist> all depends more on what you want to make, use the right tool for the job
[11:24:50] <_methods> doesn't that hoss guy have a 0704 build log?
[11:25:12] <archivist> yes but
[11:38:25] <ReadError> malcom2073 or os1r1s , yall messed with those tmc2100's ?
[11:39:35] <os1r1s> ReadError No
[11:39:55] <malcom2073> Nope
[11:46:25] <os1r1s> This looks pretty cool about 7 minutes in ... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aIygRynDR38
[11:47:36] <zeeshan> weak sauce
[11:47:36] <zeeshan> :P
[11:47:47] <zeeshan> im kidding
[11:47:51] <zeeshan> that is some good material removal
[11:47:54] <zeeshan> what size end mill is that
[11:47:55] <os1r1s> zeeshan It was a g0704 link that popped up :P
[11:47:56] <zeeshan> i cant tell
[11:48:23] <os1r1s> I'm thinking 3/8s or slightly smaller
[11:48:33] <zeeshan> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vXCIRc1wM7A
[11:48:35] <os1r1s> The removal rate is pretty interesting
[11:48:39] <zeeshan> heres my baby using a 3/4 end mill
[11:48:41] <zeeshan> i think 1/4" doc
[11:49:05] <os1r1s> But I don't think you can do nearly that depth of cut with a 1/8 or 1/4" end mill
[11:49:07] <zeeshan> i know its conservative numbers cause i can do the same in steel!
[11:49:49] <os1r1s> zeeshan Pretty cool
[12:06:08] <Roguish> zeeshan: is that an insert tool?
[12:06:43] <archivist> but, your mill is best part of 10-20 times the weight :)
[12:08:54] <Roguish> zeeshan: speed, feed, etc?????
[12:31:29] <CaptHindsight> OpenPnp with Linuxcnc? How does that work? I though that they were mutually exclusive
[12:31:50] <CaptHindsight> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=30C1VRfbi9k referring to this video
[12:32:38] <Sync> why would they?
[12:32:43] <Sync> openpnp outputs gcodes iirc
[12:33:04] <CaptHindsight> I recall openpnp being the motion controller
[12:33:24] <CaptHindsight> it's just the gcode gen?
[12:34:55] <CaptHindsight> or does it have both?
[12:35:27] <Sync> it can talk to smoothieboards and the like, and it uses gcodes for that iirc
[12:36:07] <CaptHindsight> how would it talk to smoothie? via gcode?
[12:36:42] <CaptHindsight> same as marlin. sprinter etc
[12:38:40] <CaptHindsight> wow another project with an expressive writing disorder
[12:59:31] <zeeshan> Roguish: yes
[13:00:03] <zeeshan> 3 flute, i think i was doing 30 ipm
[13:00:11] <zeeshan> 2500 rpm
[13:00:23] <zeeshan> nm 3000 rpm
[13:02:43] <t12> i dont quite understand building home pnp
[13:02:48] <t12> seems like easier to buy a used unit
[13:02:52] <t12> (if its gonna be that big)
[13:04:25] <Tom_itx> sup zee?
[13:04:46] <zeeshan> packing up
[13:04:47] <zeeshan> you? :D
[13:04:54] <Tom_itx> back from work
[13:05:01] <Tom_itx> moving?
[13:05:09] <zeeshan> no
[13:05:11] <zeeshan> vacation
[13:05:21] <Tom_itx> you do those in the summer
[13:05:27] <zeeshan> :P
[13:05:41] <Tom_itx> i usually go in Feb
[13:05:43] <Tom_itx> :)
[13:06:00] <zeeshan> im winging this one
[13:06:06] <zeeshan> no plans on hotels or anmything
[13:06:06] <zeeshan> haha
[13:06:11] <Tom_itx> heh
[13:06:12] <zeeshan> just gonna randomly stay at random places
[13:06:14] <Tom_itx> good luck with that
[13:06:22] <Tom_itx> where you headed?
[13:06:24] <zeeshan> busiest time of the year :P
[13:06:51] <zeeshan> https://www.google.ca/maps/dir/Hamilton,+ON/Saguenay,+QC/@45.8605568,-74.4378561,6.25z/data=!4m13!4m12!1m5!1m1!1s0x882c986c27de778f:0x2b6aee56d8df0e21!2m2!1d-79.8660914!2d43.2500208!1m5!1m1!1s0x4cc02768304203bd:0xfe107b2c38d93d34!2m2!1d-71.0684923!2d48.4280529
[13:06:54] <zeeshan> i think
[13:06:58] <zeeshan> i might detour and go here instead
[13:07:24] <zeeshan> https://www.google.ca/maps/dir/Hamilton,+ON/Perc%C3%A9,+QC/@46.0169431,-76.552423,6z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m13!4m12!1m5!1m1!1s0x882c986c27de778f:0x2b6aee56d8df0e21!2m2!1d-79.8660914!2d43.2500208!1m5!1m1!1s0x4c99b08303de33b9:0x3aa94054274a9463!2m2!1d-64.2126801!2d48.524444
[13:07:28] <zeeshan> but its another 5 hours
[13:07:45] <Tom_itx> that's already a good 18-20ish hrs
[13:08:00] <zeeshan> http://www.sepaq.com/resources/images/pq/hgo/caroussel/mathieudupuis_hgo.jpg
[13:08:08] <zeeshan> im going to hike up w/ my telescope on this mountain
[13:08:11] <zeeshan> :D
[13:08:16] <zeeshan> hopefully i dont get raped by a black bear
[13:08:20] <Tom_itx> nice
[13:08:38] <Tom_itx> take a gold pan along :D
[13:08:42] <zeeshan> its supposed to be 53 F
[13:08:48] <zeeshan> so not too terrible
[13:08:54] <zeeshan> yea!
[13:10:29] <Tom_itx> water heater went out this am so i had to scramble to get parts before everybody closed
[13:10:37] <Tom_itx> between work
[13:10:58] <zeeshan> man thats the worse crap ever
[13:11:02] <zeeshan> taking a cold shower is death
[13:11:13] <Tom_itx> fought with the Dr yesterday
[13:11:15] <SpeedEvil> zeeshan: Protip: First get overheated
[13:11:27] <Tom_itx> he's an asswipe
[13:11:33] <FinboySlick> zeeshan: Shit man, you're going to be very close to me.
[13:11:51] <zeeshan> where are you FinboySlick
[13:11:54] <Tom_itx> maybe all the bad is behind me now
[13:11:54] <FinboySlick> I suggest you take the south side of the Gaspe, btw.
[13:12:14] <FinboySlick> North side is lovely for about 10 minutes, but then it's incredibly boring.
[13:12:26] <zeeshan> im leaning towards saguenay
[13:12:32] <zeeshan> and hautes gorges national park
[13:12:43] <zeeshan> cause its 5 hours les
[13:12:57] <zeeshan> ive been to new brunswick a couple times now
[13:12:59] <FinboySlick> zeeshan: Well, Gaspe is better in late summer.
[13:13:01] <zeeshan> but never north side of quebec
[13:13:12] <FinboySlick> Perce is beautiful.
[13:13:15] <zeeshan> FinboySlick: you live near there?
[13:13:18] <zeeshan> in the middle of no where? :D
[13:13:20] <FinboySlick> Yeah.
[13:13:31] <zeeshan> nice
[13:13:47] <FinboySlick> Let me know if you do, we'll have a beer or something.
[13:14:00] <zeeshan> will do
[13:14:05] <zeeshan> dont you have some cnc machines? :D
[13:14:35] <FinboySlick> Nothing worth seeing. Just a chinese mill.
[13:15:23] <FinboySlick> I strongly recommend (if you take the south side) that you go there: http://cimeaventures.com/en/ Going down the river there is a heck of a nice day.
[13:15:31] <CaptHindsight> FinboySlick: is there a mosquito season there?
[13:16:15] <FinboySlick> Well, no worse than anywhere else. That's what I liked most about the Cime Aventure thing though. None whatsoever.
[13:16:26] <FinboySlick> I'm not an outdoors kind of person.
[13:18:25] <FinboySlick> The Matapedia valley is a beautiful drive too (before you get to the Baie des Chaleurs). Winding road between mountains.
[13:19:24] <zeeshan> i dont theres even snow up there rirhgt now
[13:19:25] <zeeshan> :P
[13:19:44] <FinboySlick> There's snow, but it's raining today.
[13:19:45] <zeeshan> FinboySlick: i will only meet you if you have mesa hardware!!!
[13:20:00] <Tom_itx> hah
[13:20:14] <FinboySlick> Hah, I have a couple 5i25, but I haven't installed them yet.
[13:20:26] <zeeshan> lemme show you guys
[13:20:30] <zeeshan> the machine i helped move the other day
[13:20:32] <FinboySlick> If you insist though, I guess we can do that when you're around.
[13:20:33] <zeeshan> this thing is AWESOME
[13:22:03] <zeeshan> http://i.imgur.com/zatceMG.jpg
[13:22:10] <zeeshan> horizontal - vertical automatic change
[13:22:26] <zeeshan> then 40 tool atc
[13:22:36] <zeeshan> that can put the tool in both the horizontal or vertical spindle
[13:22:47] <zeeshan> monster machine
[13:22:48] <Tom_itx> Z doesn't look that high
[13:22:55] <zeeshan> oh it is!
[13:22:57] <FinboySlick> And a Tim Hortons cup on the table, to make tripple-sure that this is Canadian.
[13:23:00] <zeeshan> it goes up to 24"
[13:23:05] <zeeshan> haha
[13:23:08] <Tom_itx> nice
[13:23:28] <zeeshan> sorry 20" Z
[13:23:43] <zeeshan> 47" x, 24" y
[13:23:47] <Tom_itx> 40 taper?
[13:23:50] <zeeshan> yes
[13:24:12] <zeeshan> the machine is weird.
[13:24:15] <zeeshan> the table stays stationary
[13:24:19] <Tom_itx> odd tool changer arrangement
[13:24:20] <zeeshan> but the whole Z and Y axis moves
[13:24:21] <zeeshan> lol
[13:25:02] <Tom_itx> somebody had a better idea
[13:25:58] <Tom_itx> can't tell but it looks like the table could be repositionable
[13:26:06] <zeeshan> yes you are right
[13:26:09] <zeeshan> its on a massive keyway
[13:27:02] <Tom_itx> he gonna lcnc it?
[13:27:07] <zeeshan> yes
[13:27:09] <zeeshan> im helping him convert
[13:27:16] <Tom_itx> figures :D
[13:27:29] <Tom_itx> while your lathe sits idle
[13:27:41] <zeeshan> haha
[13:27:47] <bobo__> zeshan: neat deckel
[13:27:49] <zeeshan> i should prolly work on that thing eh?!?
[13:27:56] <zeeshan> bobo__: yes
[13:27:59] <zeeshan> too bad its not mine :(
[13:28:23] <Tom_itx> what era is that?
[13:28:31] <zeeshan> 1992
[13:28:55] <zeeshan> http://www.dialog5.com/FPCC%20Series/FP50CCT.jpg
[13:28:58] <zeeshan> this is what it looks like
[13:29:00] <zeeshan> with all teh enclosures on
[13:29:04] <zeeshan> which we prolly wont put on
[13:29:22] <Tom_itx> why not?
[13:29:33] <zeeshan> takes up too much space :P
[13:29:48] <Tom_itx> is he gonna do flood coolant?
[13:29:55] <zeeshan> probably not
[13:29:55] <FinboySlick> I guess that's a good design for very heavy parts.
[13:30:17] <Tom_itx> the enclosure helps keep the mess contained
[13:30:37] <zeeshan> its really up to him
[13:30:40] <zeeshan> i wish i bought this machine
[13:30:43] <zeeshan> but ididnt have the space
[13:30:45] <zeeshan> i referred him to it
[13:30:48] <zeeshan> 6000 bux for it
[13:30:57] <zeeshan> got to see it running
[13:31:06] <zeeshan> nothing wrong with it, shop just needs floor space
[13:31:11] <Tom_itx> nice
[13:31:30] <FinboySlick> $6k for that monster?
[13:31:30] <zeeshan> his words yesterday
[13:31:34] <Tom_itx> so the control still works
[13:31:35] <zeeshan> "im glad i didnt buy a fucking tormach"
[13:31:37] <zeeshan> pardon the french
[13:31:41] <zeeshan> but i was quoting exact words
[13:31:42] <zeeshan> haha
[13:31:54] <zeeshan> FinboySlick: yes
[13:31:55] <FinboySlick> Holy crap. I so jelly.
[13:32:03] <zeeshan> 2800 to move it
[13:32:07] <zeeshan> so still cheaper than a tormach
[13:32:50] <zeeshan> a lot of big machines seem to go cheap
[13:32:53] <Tom_itx> if the control still works why's he gonna convert it now?
[13:32:54] <zeeshan> cause theyre a pain in the ass to move
[13:33:06] <zeeshan> Tom_itx: likes linuxcnc
[13:33:12] <zeeshan> and the ability to work w/ universal parts
[13:33:19] <zeeshan> and not limited to file sizes
[13:33:24] <Tom_itx> yeah
[13:33:32] <Tom_itx> you could DNC it
[13:33:42] <bobo__> zeeshan many people could use and information of /from that machine , rom chip listings -photos -etc
[13:34:03] <zeeshan> bobo__: they can call me and find out all they want
[13:34:07] <zeeshan> the old controll will be for sale soon
[13:35:51] <bobo__> are their any manuals for that deckel
[13:35:55] <zeeshan> yes
[13:35:57] <zeeshan> all in german
[13:36:19] <zeeshan> its got mechanical diagrams
[13:36:21] <zeeshan> and wiring diagrams
[13:36:36] <Jymmm> Spekenzee Swedish?
[13:37:16] <Jymmm> zeeshan: You should take hi-res photos
[13:37:54] <Jymmm> especiall om manuals/diagrams
[13:38:28] <Loetmichel2> *boooarpssss*... that was 2 hours of fondie... with a tuna dip to die for... i am sooo short of bursting... :-)
[13:39:25] <Loetmichel2> fondue
[13:39:29] <bobo__> my personal thought , you could get a lot of help on your Mikron by scaning the manuals and rom chips of that deckel
[13:39:59] <bobo__> zeeshan ^^^
[13:42:11] <zeeshan> help with my mikron how
[13:42:15] <zeeshan> my mikron doesnt need help!
[13:42:16] <zeeshan> :D
[13:42:30] <zeeshan> my mikron does need an overboard arm though!
[13:46:22] <bobo__> zeeshan locating a overboard/(that isn't what it's called but I can't think of the name either ) arm
[13:48:43] <bobo__> also you may be needing stuff later for the mill and lathe
[13:55:13] <bobo__> zeeshan sure would be something if you could do a compare/contrast of the old diaglog control to linuxcnc
[13:56:33] <bobo__> post the results on Pratc Mach
[14:00:24] <bobo__> think the name is overarm support , my bet is their is one some where in europe
[14:01:04] <Tom_itx> would cost a fortune to ship though
[14:02:56] <bobo__> think the maho overarm support is about 40Lbs ,mikron should be similar
[14:06:58] <bobo__> maho 600e overarm support = about 40Lbs , think zeeshans mikron mill overarm support would be about the same
[15:15:27] <enleth> any thoughts on overdriving a synchronous 3ph AC motor with a VFD that can do more than 50/60Hz?
[15:15:55] <enleth> as in how to determine the limits of the motor, what to look out for, what are the failure modes
[15:17:02] <enleth> I can do 3750RPM maximum on my bridgeport as is, I wonder if bumping that by 35% to a bit over 5k with the VFD is safe
[15:17:23] <enleth> assuming bearings would be OK with that
[15:17:41] <enleth> the ones I have supposedly go all the way up to 7-8k with no ill effects
[15:18:11] <enleth> The motor is 1400RPM by itself on 50Hz
[15:19:05] <enleth> and it's designed to work at 60Hz too, it's the standard dual voltage 2hp Bridgeport motor that was also used on the US market
[15:20:20] <enleth> the VFD can output 400Hz but I'm pretty sure the motor would end up all over the place if I tried that
[15:20:56] <enleth> or maybe in a single place but far, far away from the mill, possibly disregarding any walls on the way there
[15:28:58] <rob_h> would be down to how well it is balanced, and how good the bearings are on the shaft, if its balanced and good quality it might take a bit of punishment but id not like to recomend a safe limit..
[15:29:26] <rob_h> some machine has a speed increasing gearbox, planatry gear set to double the speed etc
[15:31:45] <archivist> 35 % overspeed seems reasonable to me, listen to it and feel for vibration
[15:33:01] <archivist> I think under speed hurts motors more than over
[15:33:25] <enleth> archivist: well I feel it should be reasonable too, and 5k is starting to be in the carbide ballpark
[15:33:59] <rob_h> torque might fall off sharp tho
[15:34:05] <archivist> when very low speed they are taking more current but not going fast enough for the fan to cool them
[15:34:47] <rob_h> yea i would force air cool it if running under fixed speeds like archivist says
[15:36:08] <enleth> but motors being motors, I wouldn't dismiss the posissibility of some eddy currents fuckery going on when the magnetic field is rotating faster than the motor can, heating it up like all hell or something
[15:37:26] <enleth> what I intend to say is: I know enough about motors to be aware that it's a complicated subject and I'm probably not even aware of 90% of what's happening inside one outside of the normal operating range, and I know too little to quickly catch up on the subject
[15:38:03] <archivist> back emf at high speed will reduce current and torque and probably eddy currents
[15:38:53] <enleth> good point
[15:38:55] <archivist> just that the poor thing was never designe for the mechanical stress of spinning that fast
[15:41:25] <zeeshan> enleth: hi
[15:41:29] <enleth> and that's not only a problem with bearings, right?
[15:41:34] <zeeshan> what motor is it
[15:42:01] <enleth> I mean, I can't just replace bearings with better, beefier ones designed for those speeds and expect it to be fine - it would be too easy
[15:42:37] <archivist> enleth, yes the rotating mass is a larger diameter than a high speed motor would be
[15:43:09] <enleth> zeeshan: standard 2HP Bridgeport motor, CNC version (external shaft is longer, but otherwise the same thing as manual mill 2HP motor)
[15:43:18] <zeeshan> does it have fins
[15:43:58] <enleth> what kind of fins?
[15:44:02] <Roguish> don't push the motor too fast. carbide needs a very RIGID machine, and a standard BP is not really that.
[15:44:29] <zeeshan> http://www.connex-electric.com/img/OWP.png
[15:44:37] <zeeshan> like that
[15:44:39] <enleth> Roguish: it's a CNC BP, ISO30 taper, quite a bit sturdier than your garden variety manual BP
[15:44:44] <zeeshan> i know a bridgeport is cframe
[15:45:08] <Terlo_> sorry, i recconect my internet is working awfully
[15:45:21] <Terlo_> someone answered : D? can copy paste?
[15:45:34] <Roguish> i have a series II BP with 4 HP motor. wish i could do more than 3000 rpm, but i don't want to over work the motor, vee-belt, or gearbox.
[15:45:36] <enleth> zeeshan: ah, the cooling fins on the outside of the stator shell - yes, they are encosed by an additional sheet metal shell and air is pulled through them
[15:45:48] <zeeshan> okay
[15:45:49] <enleth> *enclosed
[15:45:57] <zeeshan> btw, i wouldn't worry about your electric motor bearings
[15:46:10] <zeeshan> they're okay
[15:46:14] <zeeshan> its your spindle bearings id worry about
[15:46:33] <Terlo_> this connection is making me sick,
[15:46:38] <archivist> Terlo, we have not seen a question I think
[15:46:44] <Terlo_> oh,
[15:46:51] <Terlo_> i copyed it just in case
[15:46:52] <Terlo_> hi guys, im frank, do you happen to know the difference between the mesa 7i85S and 7i85? manual difference says one has eight channel differential output and the other one is five channel RS-422 serial
[15:47:06] <enleth> zeeshan: I looked up the specs, the main bearings should be OK for up to 8kRPM. But generally bearings are the easiest thing to replace there, I think
[15:47:21] <Terlo_> i dont understand, i thought rs-422 and differential connection was the same thing
[15:47:57] <Terlo_> the board looks the same..
[15:50:00] <archivist> you can have differential signals not working to rs422, I think you are confusing standards
[15:50:13] <Roguish> enleth: are you speaking of the nameplate rpm of the motor? or the final rpm of the spindle?
[15:51:46] <Roguish> my 4 hp is 1730 on the nameplate, but the spindle goes up to double that (best case). variable vee belt and gearbox drive train.
[15:53:25] <Terlo_> okey, the manual says the encoder outputs are differential and in () says they are rs422 equivalent
[15:54:24] <Terlo_> and the input pulse train (position control) says : Differential input; parameter-selectable (1) Positive/Negative 2) Phase A/Phase B 3) Command/Direction)
[15:54:50] <Terlo_> im guessing im gonna need the 7i85S right? with the 8 channel diff outputs?
[15:54:53] <enleth> Roguish: 1400something on the nameplate
[15:54:59] <enleth> Roguish: the drivetrain can double that
[15:55:21] <Terlo_> im talking about the servo driver
[15:55:24] <enleth> Roguish: so the final max RPM is about 3750
[15:57:09] <Roguish> ok, just remember to consider everything in the drive train, not just the motor. also, read the vfd manual carefully before purchasing the vfd. make sure it all works together. (from a lesson learned the hard way...)
[15:57:26] <Roguish> and good luck.
[15:58:36] <enleth> Roguish: on the other hand, the drivetrain needs a very serious overhaul because the motor shaft is out of round and gouged from wear in a few spots, belt pulleys are also out of factory geometry
[15:59:04] <enleth> so while it's definitely not safe to overdrive it, I can try it for fun when I get replacement parts
[15:59:38] <zeeshan> if it makes you feel any better
[15:59:43] <zeeshan> i run my mikron motor from the rated 50hz
[15:59:46] <zeeshan> at 150hz.
[15:59:52] <zeeshan> and have been doing this for a long time
[16:00:05] <zeeshan> but i have not exceeded the total rpm of the spindle
[16:01:31] <enleth> oh, the other thing I could try is a pneumatic spindle speeder, right?
[16:26:14] <Roguish> enleth: good call. go slow and easy, and don't blow anything up. personally I stop and tell myself 'don't be stupid' quite often. saves on frustration, busted knuckles, and money.
[16:29:06] <zeeshan> happy christmas to everyone
[16:29:08] <zeeshan> <3
[16:29:15] <zeeshan> bye!!
[16:37:21] <Deejay> gn8
[16:56:40] <C_P-Away> Sup...
[17:00:39] <malcom2073> Hi
[17:01:55] <malcom2073> Roguish: Yeah, I've always heard that most motors, especially the 1700rpm kind can be spun twice as fast (since they use similar stuff for the 1.8 and 3.6 motors), but the spindle on the other hand...
[17:02:12] <malcom2073> I plan on underdriving my varidrive, then overdriving the motor to give me more torque through a wider range, but still can't take the spindle over 4k
[17:26:00] <enleth> malcom2073: what's actually going to break first if you did?
[17:27:54] <malcom2073> I don't really know, first guess would be the varidrive belt melting, it gets really hot as is
[17:30:33] <malcom2073> I would assume the bearings are good to a good percentage higher than they run at, but who knows how worn out they are
[17:35:40] <Contract_Pilot> Got my other mesa card today
[17:36:39] <jdh> mesa xmas
[17:54:35] <Contract_Pilot> thanks to gregcnc mesa been out for 4 going on 5 months
[17:54:47] <Contract_Pilot> Still need another one.
[18:45:48] <FloppyDisk> @ contract_pilot: why thanks to gregcnc? He's building a ton of machines?
[18:50:20] <enleth> well I snatched the last 7i77 in stock this week
[19:34:26] <Duc> enleth: that must be a good feeling
[19:37:20] <PetefromTn_> Hey Folks Merry Christmas :D
[19:38:01] <Duc> litte warm for christmas but awesome for garage work
[19:38:40] <PetefromTn_> yeah man we are in the 70's here!
[19:38:47] <PetefromTn_> its FREAKING FANTASTIC!!
[19:38:58] <Duc> yep AL is the same way
[19:39:43] <Duc> which is good since I forgot to buy more propane for the garage
[19:40:39] <PetefromTn_> hopefully tomorrow is beautifully warm again and we can take our Christmas Kayaks out on a local lake and enjoy some Fishing!!
[19:42:05] <Duc> its suppose to be
[19:43:13] <Duc> guess its time to power up the mill to see if I wired the other 2 servos correctly
[19:43:30] <PetefromTn_> good luck LOL
[19:45:54] <Duc> just hoping the I/O were exactly the same. I did spot checks but there is always the one wire
[19:50:39] <Duc> PetefromTn: Have you been to the industrial recycler by your area?
[19:50:50] <PetefromTn_> no not really
[19:51:24] <Duc> Ive heard about it but 2 hr each way would suck if its was over priced or bad
[19:55:01] <PetefromTn_> Not sure what you are talking about really
[20:02:30] <enleth> Duc: sure it is
[20:05:34] <Duc> enleth: hell I was estatic when fedex delivered mine on monday
[20:06:09] <enleth> I'm expecting the delivery within 2 weeks
[20:06:10] <Duc> PetefromTn: Ill find the link to the place
[20:06:50] <enleth> PetefromTn_: are you in the US?
[20:08:00] <enleth> PetefromTn_: well I guess so by the temperature given in F, so if you don't mind, I have a question I've actually been asking for a long time of different people on the internet and never got a definitive answer.
[20:08:19] <enleth> Why do some American English speakers capitalize random words in their sentences?
[20:08:27] <enleth> Like "Fishing" in this case.
[20:09:21] <PetefromTn_> Just to annoy you foreigners ;)
[20:09:29] <CaptHindsight> wEll It CoUld be WorSe :)
[20:09:33] <enleth> It appears to be some kind of old mannerism, as the whole US Constitution is written in that manner and I think the Brits also did that a long time ago, but I'm pretty sure this is not a rule in any kind of modern English
[20:09:54] <enleth> People just... do this.
[20:09:56] <enleth> For some reason.
[20:10:28] <toastydeath> enleth, english has become more standardized over the years - there's no governing body, it's governed entirely by usage
[20:11:07] <toastydeath> the older capitalization seems to appear when the speaker is referring to An Idea or general concept rather than the plain meaning
[20:11:15] <enleth> And every time I see it, it reminds me of the US Constitution and I imagine George Washington saying that while reading the draft out loud.
[20:11:30] <toastydeath> the random capitalization is actually coming back, as well
[20:11:33] <enleth> toastydeath: yeah, that does seem to be in line with past usage
[20:12:07] <toastydeath> i personally like it because it helps make one's meaning clearer
[20:12:12] <CaptHindsight> where is the example of this randomization that you are referring to?
[20:12:23] <enleth> CaptHindsight: well it's not "random" of course
[20:12:29] <enleth> I can see the pattern
[20:12:54] <enleth> But some people take this to a ridiculous extreme
[20:12:57] <CaptHindsight> have a link or was it something posted in the channel?
[20:12:57] <toastydeath> CaptHindsight, Ben Franklin is a really notable example of someone who does it
[20:13:03] <toastydeath> http://www.shmoop.com/autobiography-benjamin-franklin/writing-style.html
[20:13:26] <Duc> PetefromTn_: Im trying to find the location again
[20:13:37] <enleth> CaptHindsight: PetefromTn_, his comment on Fishing
[20:13:47] <enleth> CaptHindsight: that's what reminded me of this now
[20:14:28] <CaptHindsight> oh, thats just for IRC
[20:15:04] <CaptHindsight> it's pretty laid back and casual in here, spelling and grammar are pretty lax
[20:15:15] <toastydeath> the resurgance of things like that are actually a big emerging topic in linguistics
[20:15:20] <PetefromTn_> I love that it annoys :D
[20:15:32] <CaptHindsight> but in the 200 year old example it's a different example
[20:15:46] <toastydeath> it's being used in a very similar way in historical examples as it is on irc
[20:16:44] <toastydeath> and, oddly enough, it was much more prominent in letter writers than in novelists
[20:16:51] <enleth> CaptHindsight: well I'm not expecting anyone to be following Webster to the letter here, but at the same time, one wouldn't really do that if they weren't somewhat accustomed to that
[20:16:52] <CaptHindsight> plus English is always evolving, the "rules" as taught in schools are not permanent rules
[20:16:57] <toastydeath> so there are a ton of interesting parallels
[20:17:03] <enleth> CaptHindsight: I'm just curious about how it works
[20:17:53] <toastydeath> the "formal"/perscriptivist attitude towards english removes a large oppertunity for conveying tone and inflection
[20:18:34] <toastydeath> there is a push to study IRC/letter-writing english differently than archival/novelist english
[20:18:53] <Duc> its no different then formal french or spanish in school but in the real world its different
[20:19:10] <enleth> toastydeath: what's interesting that some groups of native English speakers do that, others don't and I *think* it's more of a US thing in modern communication
[20:19:43] <enleth> Being a non-native, I'm interested in things like that, as it helps me understand how the language is used by native speakers
[20:19:55] <toastydeath> i side with the linugists who think it goes deeper than that, where the view is that communication-written english is completely different and should be viewed as its own language like ASL
[20:20:00] <enleth> *is that
[20:20:25] <toastydeath> i.e. that people who assert that the language used on IRC and similar is somehow "incorrect" are actually unable to speak the language
[20:20:28] <CaptHindsight> it's interesting how English is taught in foreign countries
[20:21:19] <toastydeath> for instance, personally: I grew up on the internet, and a huge amount of my communication was via text from a fairly early agea
[20:21:21] <toastydeath> *age
[20:21:41] <toastydeath> when someone insists on speaking in full sentences, with punctuation and capitalization... they sound autistic to me.
[20:21:56] <enleth> toastydeath: I'd draw the line at being unable to spell shit and form a complex sentence, you can really see whether someone just doesn't give a crap at the moment or really is unable to use proper English
[20:22:12] <toastydeath> oh, sure - i'm not excusing flagrant disregard for clear communication
[20:22:17] <toastydeath> "lol how r u bby"
[20:22:18] <PetefromTn_> Well Merry Christmas everyone good night..
[20:22:32] <CaptHindsight> I had a friend in China that used to always say " In my mind" rather than "I think"
[20:22:45] <enleth> Not giving a crap at the moment is perfectly OK, I switch back and forth between this and writing what I think is proper English all the time
[20:23:06] <toastydeath> enleth, i think it's more serious than that
[20:23:11] <enleth> CaptHindsight: I guess that's just how they say it in Chinese
[20:23:30] <CaptHindsight> enleth: nah, they were just taught wrong
[20:23:34] <toastydeath> I'm goin to type the same sentence two different ways - read them and tell me if you can tell the difference
[20:23:40] <toastydeath> this is a very serious sentence
[20:23:44] <toastydeath> This is a very serious sentence.
[20:23:55] <CaptHindsight> <-- will read it while frowning
[20:24:00] <toastydeath> hahaha
[20:24:05] <enleth> CaptHindsight: sometimes you can tell someone's native language just reading their English, with no other data
[20:24:28] <enleth> I can spot most Slavic language users that way and tell some of them apart.
[20:24:37] <toastydeath> i love foreign speakers, because they bring new ways of using the same words
[20:24:51] <toastydeath> that i would not have thought of
[20:25:23] <toastydeath> using different grammatical structure and syntax
[20:25:40] <CaptHindsight> some people have a way with words and others well ... not have way
[20:25:46] <toastydeath> hahaha.
[20:26:05] <enleth> Unfortunately, Polish people butcher English in ways that I just cannot comprehend by any sensible standard, even Russians produce more coherent English when they try to use it and don't know shit.
[20:26:27] <toastydeath> Russians are great, imo
[20:26:35] <toastydeath> because the mistakes make a beautiful sense
[20:26:46] <CaptHindsight> you can never trust the Russians :)
[20:27:01] <enleth> In both cases, those people are actually still using their native language, just substituting English words
[20:27:31] <toastydeath> sure, but i think that's amazing because there is a flow to it
[20:27:56] <toastydeath> they're still completely eloquent and expressive, just in a new and different way
[20:28:07] <enleth> Yeah, Russian English is funny in its own way but quite logical
[20:28:40] <toastydeath> i think that is the core of writing for real-time communication; there is no prescriptivism, you're not bound by "commas go here, this is capitalized"
[20:28:49] <toastydeath> you can use those elements to create an effect instead
[20:28:58] <CaptHindsight> so what's everyone up to for xmas eve?
[20:29:07] <toastydeath> ...sitting on irc talking about language =(
[20:29:42] <enleth> Ate a lot, drinking a beer to help all that pass through now.
[20:30:23] <CaptHindsight> Santa should be over eastern South America by now
[20:31:45] <Duc> probably going for a walk to see the christmas lights soon
[20:32:25] <CaptHindsight> it's been to warm for snow here recently
[20:32:59] <toastydeath> i wore a t-shirt today
[20:33:03] <CaptHindsight> we got about 12" in mid November and nothing since
[20:33:09] <toastydeath> we're supposed to be tits deep in snow
[20:33:12] <toastydeath> and i'm in a t-shirt
[20:33:17] <toastydeath> i may turn the AC on
[20:33:46] <CaptHindsight> down to 40F here now
[20:34:13] <CaptHindsight> hasn't it been the same for Europe
[20:34:26] <CaptHindsight> on the warm side all fall
[20:35:54] <CaptHindsight> I recall being taught all sorts of rules that had all sorts of exceptions
[20:36:10] <CaptHindsight> I before E except in words like .........
[20:36:25] <toastydeath> except in over half the words where that happens
[20:39:56] <enleth> Oh - I got a bunch of those metal puzzle thingys where you have to separate two pieces and then get them back together
[20:40:13] <enleth> I'm really impressed with the manufacturing quality
[20:43:01] <enleth> The casting, grinding and machining effort they must have taken to make lives up to industrial standards
[20:46:06] <toastydeath> enleth, link?
[20:47:14] <enleth> They're made by Hanayama
[20:47:50] <CaptHindsight> this year they are playing It's a Wonderful Life on Christmas eve
[20:50:46] <CaptHindsight> http://www.hanayama-toys.com/
[20:51:04] <toastydeath> cool
[20:51:06] <toastydeath> looks die cast
[20:51:07] <enleth> toastydeath: I'm playing with Hanayama Quartet right now
[20:51:53] <enleth> the damn thing has hairline tolerances
[20:52:19] <enleth> and whatever enamel they used, it's rock hard
[20:55:37] <toastydeath> #thatswhatshesaid
[20:56:30] <enleth> toastydeath: you wish
[20:56:37] <enleth> if they make enamel finish dildos maybe
[20:56:49] <toastydeath> i imagine there'd be thermal problems with that
[20:56:55] <toastydeath> not sure
[20:56:58] <toastydeath> ...science?
[20:57:24] <enleth> there was this "How it's made" episode where they show a dildo factory
[20:57:41] <enleth> that's some pretty serious technology going into making them
[20:57:57] <enleth> it's somewhere on YT I think
[20:58:41] <toastydeath> i love that show
[20:58:48] <toastydeath> i wish they did hour-long episodes on single things
[20:58:49] <toastydeath> and went more into it
[20:59:07] <enleth> there was this enormous machine pulling out dozens of huge violet rubber dicks out of a gigantic vat of liquid silicone
[20:59:14] <enleth> every second
[20:59:18] <toastydeath> dps
[20:59:21] <toastydeath> dicks per second
[21:01:03] <enleth> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_9-qTGDxncA - those are some takes from this video, I can't find the original
[21:01:34] <toastydeath> that must be so surreal to work there
[21:02:22] <enleth> also, this: https://i.imgur.com/b6MHs6m.jpg
[21:02:31] <enleth> speaking of surreal
[21:02:38] <toastydeath> hahahaha
[21:02:41] <toastydeath> that's so weird
[21:03:19] <enleth> so many questions, so little answers
[21:03:39] <enleth> all of them boild down to WHY? though
[21:04:38] <enleth> seriously though, they surely do have to replace the dies from time to time
[21:04:43] <toastydeath> "the dick mold wore out"
[21:04:44] <enleth> and they do end up somewhere
[21:04:59] <enleth> I'd pay a lot for that truckload
[21:05:06] <enleth> just to use them as decoration
[21:05:32] <enleth> I can't think of a better party conversation starter
[21:05:57] <toastydeath> hahah people only come over once.
[21:05:59] <toastydeath> never twice.
[21:06:04] <toastydeath> "The guy with all the dicks"
[21:15:31] <os1r1s> Contract_Pilot What are you buying up from Mesa?
[21:18:05] <pink_> hi
[21:19:24] <Contract_Pilot> 7I76 need 1 more
[21:21:43] <os1r1s> Contract_Pilot I have a brand new one that I got from mesa 2 months ago sitting in a box.
[21:21:52] <os1r1s> I think I'm going to go in a diff direction
[21:21:58] <os1r1s> If you are interested
[21:22:57] <pink_vampire> I need some advice about spindle.
[21:23:31] <CaptHindsight> pink_vampire: just ask
[21:27:42] <pink_vampire> I want to add high speed spindle to my machine
[21:27:46] <pink_vampire> something like that http://www.airturbinetools.com/spindles/specs/602js.html
[21:27:51] <pink_vampire> but electric, not air based.
[21:31:01] <os1r1s> pink_vampire What kind of machine?
[21:31:29] <pink_vampire> G0704..
[21:31:54] <pink_vampire> we talk before..
[21:32:05] <CaptHindsight> http://www.grizzly.com/products/Drill-Mill-with-Stand/G0704
[21:32:09] <pink_vampire> I have pink long nails..
[21:34:39] <os1r1s> Yes. I recall
[21:36:39] <pink_vampire> just before few days I start to work on the machine again..
[21:37:15] <os1r1s> pink_vampire What speed are you looking for?
[21:37:16] <os1r1s> RPM
[21:37:42] <pink_vampire> 30K and up
[21:37:51] <CaptHindsight> where would you mount the air spindle?
[21:37:57] <os1r1s> I've used Wolfgang spindles that go 25k
[21:38:10] <pink_vampire> I don't want air,
[21:38:11] <os1r1s> Not seen ones higher. Not sure how you would mount it, but they are relatively inexpensive
[21:38:15] <pink_vampire> just electric.
[21:38:20] <os1r1s> Wolfgang is electric
[21:38:41] <pink_vampire> and it is go in to the collet?
[21:38:52] <CaptHindsight> do you want to add the new spindle or replace the old spindle with the new one?
[21:39:03] <CaptHindsight> add vs replace
[21:39:07] <pink_vampire> I dont want to connct extra spindle from the side.
[21:39:30] <CaptHindsight> what do you want to do?
[21:40:19] <pink_vampire> to get electric spindle that will fit like the air turbine spindle
[21:40:35] <CaptHindsight> where do you want to mount it?
[21:41:25] <pink_vampire> something fast but not have to be super strong. 150-200W will be more than enough
[21:41:39] <pink_vampire> CaptHindsight: in the R8 collet..
[21:42:03] <os1r1s> pink_vampire I don't know if the bearings in that spindle are suited for 30k rpm
[21:43:12] <pink_vampire> the main spindle is off. it's just gonig to hold the high speed spindle in place. like regular emdmill
[21:48:16] <CaptHindsight> I wouldn't
[21:48:55] <toastydeath> if you're not opposed to air spindles you can get some fairly short, high speed spindles
[21:49:00] <CaptHindsight> plus you'll lose most if not all of your Z
[21:49:02] <toastydeath> electric is much harder to make short
[21:49:59] <toastydeath> that are specifically meant to be held in another spindle
[21:50:02] <toastydeath> when it's locked static
[21:53:34] <pink_vampire> CaptHindsight: I have 12" Z..
[21:54:59] <pink_vampire> toastydeath: something like rc motor with er8 collet at the ens will be fine. I jund need to find a way to hold it acurate in the main spindle .
[21:55:10] <pink_vampire> end*
[21:55:58] <toastydeath> there is a process to do this, actually, but i have never tried it with a small machine
[21:56:38] <toastydeath> what you do is clamp a pin to the table, however you want to do it, and then clamp the new motor/spindle to that pin on the table
[21:56:53] <toastydeath> the mount you make/have for the motor should be generally roughed in
[21:57:26] <toastydeath> mount a 2 or 3" grinding wheel in the mill, and put lots of tarp/plastic down
[21:58:00] <toastydeath> since the new motor can spin on its bearing, you crank the table close to the spindle, and rotate the new motor by hand to grind it
[21:58:31] <toastydeath> if you go slow, and have patience, the mounting pin you're grinding will be in line with the actual spindle bearings to a pretty close tolerance.
[21:58:54] <pink_vampire> toastydeath: you talk about use the machine as a lathe?
[21:59:05] <toastydeath> not a lathe, but as a cylindrical grinder
[21:59:16] <toastydeath> and you're spinning the part to be machined by hand
[22:00:38] <pink_vampire> there is over size collets for R8.
[22:00:50] <toastydeath> you don't need to make it bigger than R8
[22:01:02] <toastydeath> you can grind the holding post on the new grinder to any size you want
[22:01:06] <toastydeath> i'd recommend 7/8"
[22:01:07] <pink_vampire> http://rotagriponline.com/index.php?page=shop.product_details&product_id=9453&flypage=shop.flypage&pop=0&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=29
[22:01:19] <pink_vampire> 25mm to r8
[22:01:25] <toastydeath> because that's the largest natural bore R8 can hold, and is more rigid than an oversize collet
[22:01:39] <toastydeath> do not grind larger, because length matters more than diameter
[22:01:53] <pink_vampire> but in 40K with 0.8mm end mill..
[22:01:58] <toastydeath> uh
[22:02:13] <toastydeath> what the new spindle holds doesn't matter
[22:02:21] <toastydeath> how you are holding the new spindle does matter
[22:02:28] <pink_vampire> you dont need any rigidity, just a acuracy.
[22:03:01] <toastydeath> high speed machines actually need quite a deal of rigidity, and it does matter
[22:04:17] <toastydeath> there isn't a single benefit to holding the motor out further than you absolutely need
[22:04:22] <pink_vampire> I mean that the sub mm tool will deflect much more than the over size collet. or any part in the machine..
[22:04:32] <toastydeath> that is also not true
[22:04:39] <toastydeath> the majority of the flex in a machine comes from the frame, not the tool
[22:04:50] <toastydeath> because the flex is integrated over the load path
[22:05:13] <toastydeath> the tool is a very short load path, whereas the spindle, head, and riser are a long, long load path
[22:05:43] <toastydeath> if you put even a small tool in a load cell, and apply a hundred pounds of force, it does not flex very far
[22:06:02] <toastydeath> but if you mount that same load cell to the bed of the machine and apply the same force to the spindle nose, there's about two orders of magnetude more flex
[22:06:28] <pink_vampire> now I did some jobs wid dremel + duct tape, I was more than want I need..
[22:06:32] <pink_vampire> with*
[22:07:30] <pink_vampire> and I the duct tape was strong enough, I think anything will be just better..
[22:07:35] <toastydeath> so i'm not talking about "can you jury rig this"
[22:07:56] <toastydeath> i'm sure someone somewhere has used a hockey ticket and a pack of gum to machine something
[22:08:07] <toastydeath> what i am telling you is the best possible way to hold this sort of spindle
[22:08:36] <toastydeath> you can do it however you want, but every other way is inferior. you are welcome to build your machine however you'd prefer, using whatever methods you'd like - it's not my milling machine
[22:09:13] <toastydeath> but i do not understand using a worse method when the correct method is so easy
[22:09:24] <toastydeath> not my call to make, though.
[22:10:35] <pink_vampire> I want it come from the spindle becaus I see it as a tool. I dont want it to be permanent
[22:10:49] <toastydeath> i think there's miscommunication here because i'm not talking about a perminent tool
[22:11:02] <toastydeath> I'm talking about how you make a removable spindle that's held exactly in line with your main machine spindle
[22:16:07] <pink_vampire> http://medicool.com/dental/hp_35.php
[22:16:10] <pink_vampire> something like that will be fine for me.
[22:16:16] <pink_vampire> I just want it to be with a shank that go in the R8
[22:16:22] <toastydeath> o
[22:16:26] <toastydeath> *i'm telling you how to make the shank
[22:16:55] <toastydeath> maybe there's a misunderstanding here, but i'm describing how you hold that motor in an r8 spindle
[22:17:00] <toastydeath> using a collet
[22:17:07] <toastydeath> so that it is accurate
[22:17:31] <pink_vampire> I need a lathe of 3 jaw chuck
[22:30:08] <jdh> I have an R8 3-jaw lathe chuck
[22:32:04] <pink_vampire> on what machine?
[22:32:08] <pink_vampire> g0704?
[22:32:13] <jdh> yeah
[22:32:46] <pink_vampire> and how it feel?
[22:33:35] <jdh> awkward
[22:34:07] <jdh> just looks awkward spinning actually. seems to be fine though. Only used it a couple times
[22:35:13] <pink_vampire> I think to get junk lathe will be better and safer than use 3 jaw chuck on the G0704
[22:35:40] <pink_vampire> I LOST MY CALIPER!!!
[22:36:02] <pink_vampire> it freak me out
[22:52:59] <CaptHindsight> better than losing a mill
[23:10:46] <pink_vampire> maybe it's time for new one...
[23:15:55] <irontree9> anyone know a good place to get liner bearings or slides?
[23:26:42] <Tom_itx> http://www.pbclinear.com/
[23:30:44] <irontree9> cad models. nice :)
[23:31:06] <os1r1s> Tom_itx They are really high