#linuxcnc | Logs for 2015-12-09

[02:18:16] <Deejay> moin
[05:22:33] <jthornton> morning
[05:59:53] <XXCoder> anomynous: your video view is top down?
[06:00:02] <XXCoder> er sorry wrong person ding
[06:02:38] <_methods> so you still have a job XXCoder ?
[06:02:50] <malcom2073> Morning
[06:02:52] <XXCoder> yeah they definitely was not happy at all
[06:03:01] <_methods> well you survived your first crash lol
[06:03:12] <XXCoder> but they gave me lecure about the rule of theirs
[06:03:17] <XXCoder> the anti-crash policy
[06:03:30] <_methods> hahah no crash policy
[06:03:31] <malcom2073> Heh, anti-crash policy? I'd like to see a pro-crash place
[06:03:45] <XXCoder> basically if change tools, always dead slow and confirm right tool at right place
[06:03:48] <_methods> the pro crash guys all go out of business pretty quick lol
[06:03:53] <XXCoder> I usually do, but forgot yeserday
[06:03:56] <XXCoder> indeed lol
[06:04:27] <_methods> most places won't fire you for crashing
[06:04:33] <_methods> they know it happens
[06:04:38] <XXCoder> unless its a habit
[06:04:42] <_methods> yeah
[06:05:05] <_methods> don't do it 2x in a year and you should be fine lol
[06:05:28] <XXCoder> anyway guy fixed the fixture by removing 3 supports, the facing it off
[06:05:36] <XXCoder> then re-adding supports after deburring em
[06:05:56] <XXCoder> then reset then made new index hole since supports cant be placed exactly same place.
[06:06:20] <_methods> you better bring that guy some beers
[06:06:31] <XXCoder> I should but dunno who did lol
[06:06:37] <XXCoder> day shift
[06:07:06] <XXCoder> my boss's boss come by and pointed to the sign on machine
[06:07:57] <XXCoder> the sign on many machines that states the anticrash policy lol
[06:09:09] <_methods> wow it's supposed to be 77F here on saturday lol
[06:09:22] <XXCoder> HEAVY thunderstorm here
[06:09:44] <XXCoder> in least I think so, sky flashes is odd
[06:09:59] <XXCoder> reminds me of that silly horror movie lol
[07:02:01] <Tom_itx> zeeshan wanna make spare funds? start making some of these: http://www.moroso.com/eb/catalog/navigationPath//1::Moroso%20Performance%20Products/100000::Accumulators/%7B14041%7D::Accumulator,%203%20quart%20capacity.html
[07:03:10] <Tom_itx> morning jthornton
[07:03:36] <jthornton> morning Tom_itx
[07:03:53] <jthornton> going to get warm and wet here this weekend
[07:04:20] <Tom_itx> friday high 68
[07:04:40] <Tom_itx> says snow sunday
[07:06:23] <zeeshan> why tom
[07:06:28] <zeeshan> moroso makes good ones
[07:06:45] <Tom_itx> brain dead simple thing for $250
[07:06:53] <zeeshan> hehe
[07:07:24] <zeeshan> i got an interview today
[07:07:27] <zeeshan> ahhh
[07:07:31] <zeeshan> and tomorrow
[07:07:32] <zeeshan> i hope they go well
[07:07:36] <zeeshan> one place is 8 min down the road
[07:07:38] <Tom_itx> good luck
[07:09:48] <zeeshan> thanks :D
[07:45:59] <MikkoP> Hi! Got my motors today :D
[07:51:13] <MikkoP> We talked about powering those earlier but don't remember what was the result. So my steppers take 3 A and my drivers take 42 V max. So we talked 36 V would be good but the amperage was a little unclear. Should I have at least 9 A to drive those simultaneously or what?
[08:13:54] <Tecan> yellow jb weld clear epoxy is amazing for plastic or ceramic
[08:14:10] <Tecan> you can let it setup for 2 min and pull off a patch if you want too
[08:18:42] <enleth> XXCoder: your story reminds me why I always liked articulated arm robots better than cartesian machines
[08:20:09] <enleth> their movement is so complex that they absolutely require full knowledge of the geometry of the arm and any attachments at all times and it's way more enforced than with machining equipment
[08:22:23] <enleth> if you order a VMC to rip apart its own table, it will happily proceed to do that, if you order a 6R robot to self-collide, it will, at best, suggest the closest safe approach and refuse to move
[08:59:20] <ssi> morn
[08:59:41] <SpeedEvil> oon
[11:15:01] <PetefromTn_> SICK_AS_A_DOG...............GAAH
[11:15:43] <toastydeath> any of you guys ever use a rheometer?
[11:45:02] <Loetmichel> toastydeath: whats that?
[11:46:54] <archivist> google rheology
[11:47:26] <archivist> another name would be viscometer
[11:47:38] <Loetmichel> got it
[11:47:42] <Loetmichel> no, nevr used one
[11:48:11] <Loetmichel> i measured the viscosity of oils with a glass tube, a steel ball and a stopwatch
[11:48:21] <Loetmichel> but not with a real measurement device
[11:49:38] <archivist> although the ultimate has to be https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pitch_drop_experiment
[11:51:45] <archivist> and dont use thixotropic grease on your gears on a stepper system, its funny/messy
[11:57:45] <CaptHindsight> toastydeath: like this? http://media.americanlaboratory.com/m/20/article/38508-fig2.jpg
[12:00:03] <CaptHindsight> toastydeath: or do you need to measure shear?
[12:00:30] <CaptHindsight> are the fluids newtonian?
[12:05:12] <toastydeath> (i'm stuck on a conference call but I am reading)
[12:10:12] <toastydeath> the fluids are overwhelmingly newtonian; the idea of having a heated cell for plastics is appealing but an abstract advantage
[12:11:19] <CaptHindsight> what's your actual question?
[12:30:57] <toastydeath> I'm interested in a) the limitations and benefits to a rheometer vs a viscometer, and what I need to look for in a rheometer to make sure it's functional if i buy it
[12:31:12] <toastydeath> I'm measuring fluid viscosity before doing other experiments
[12:31:22] <toastydeath> to control the data for dynamic viscosity
[12:31:33] <toastydeath> medium weight oils, mostly
[12:32:23] <toastydeath> CaptHindsight: there is the potential I'd want to use a heated cell to look at plastics but that's not a guarnatee yet
[12:32:40] <toastydeath> it is a remote, minor wishlist item
[12:32:51] <toastydeath> versus what I really need which is the actual viscosity of an unknown oil
[12:33:17] <toastydeath> before using it for other experiments
[12:34:20] <Jymmm> LICK IT, then see how far and long your tongue will slide
[12:35:33] <toastydeath> "Quantative analysis of shear forces in a liquid via gustational analysis"
[12:36:07] <toastydeath> I have a bunch of veritcal wicking tests I am going to be doing, and the material to be wicked is oil
[12:36:16] <MikkoP> Would I be able to use this kind of power supply to operate my stepper drivers? http://www.ebay.com/itm/251929195856
[12:36:28] <Jymmm> toastydeath: Why dnt you talk to those places that you send in used motor oil into.
[12:36:49] <toastydeath> because this is going to be a recurring need
[12:36:57] <toastydeath> and i also like scientific equipment and learning how to use it as a hobby
[12:37:08] <MikkoP> I know it has way too much power for my needs but is that type suitable for such use
[12:37:16] <Jymmm> toastydeath: No no, I mean for thoughts/ideas on a device, not theri services
[12:37:19] <CaptHindsight> http://www.brookfieldengineering.com/download/files/Viscometer%20vs.%20Rheometer.pdf
[12:37:20] <membiblio> Where is the default axis.ngc file located? Can that initial 'splash' nc file be specified?
[12:38:08] <membiblio> And - when other gui's are launched - are they looking for additional configuration data?
[12:38:24] <toastydeath> CaptHindsight: awesome, ty
[12:38:30] <membiblio> While axis launched - other gui's throw errors and do not launch.
[12:38:30] <CaptHindsight> toastydeath: the spindles and the meter usually come separately
[12:39:34] <toastydeath> yeah, i have noticed that on the viscometers
[12:39:58] <CaptHindsight> toastydeath: http://www.brookfieldengineering.com/img/products/accessories/spindles/lv_spindles.gif
[12:40:04] <toastydeath> the rheometers seem to be parallel disk measurement for the most part but it's hard to tell if the entire column is intact
[12:40:21] <toastydeath> my main concern is that a viscometer is dead simple to operate
[12:40:38] <toastydeath> I can pick up either a rheometer or a viscometer for about the same price but the rheometer is a lot more complicated
[12:40:51] <CaptHindsight> if they are newtonian then you just need a viscometer
[12:41:14] <toastydeath> sold
[12:42:15] <CaptHindsight> non newtonian fluids like housepaint or lotions with suspended particles are different
[12:42:33] <membiblio> No one knows about axis and axis.ngc? :)_
[12:43:21] <maxcnc> membiblio: look at open_file in the references ini
[12:43:38] <maxcnc> you can load what ever you want
[12:43:44] <maxcnc> from whereveryou want
[12:44:37] <maxcnc> membiblio: http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.5/html/config/ini_config.html#sub:DISPLAY-section
[12:44:41] <membiblio> maxcnc axis.ngc is not shown in any of the config files, I'd like to load another 'splash' nc file on startup
[12:45:04] <maxcnc> OPEN_FILE = /full/path/to/file.ngc
[12:45:20] <maxcnc> what ever you want what ever name it says
[12:45:36] <membiblio> so Open_file is not there by default, so axis.ngc is hard coded into axis?
[12:45:38] <maxcnc> or woudt you like to modify the original
[12:45:49] <maxcnc> no
[12:46:06] <membiblio> No - it is not there by default and is hard coded into axis?
[12:46:16] <maxcnc> in defferent versions the file is named different
[12:46:31] <maxcnc> what version are you using
[12:47:33] <membiblio> In my version 2.6.4 it open axis.ngc by default.
[12:48:02] <toastydeath> CaptHindsight: one last question, and this is a shot in the dark
[12:48:24] <membiblio> But I have yet to find axis.ngc - everyone always says ALL the config info in in your working directory but that is not quite true.
[12:48:30] <toastydeath> I have seen a few torsion balance viscometers
[12:48:33] <toastydeath> like this one: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Fisher-MacMichael-Viscometer-MDl-90-P-N-602661-30-Day-Guarantee-Used-/400861914629
[12:48:43] <toastydeath> I'd much rather spend 200 on this than 500 for a digital one
[12:48:52] <toastydeath> but I am not sure how it's read out
[12:49:11] <toastydeath> and i'm looking at that rod and can't tell if it's supposed to be that way or is damaged
[12:51:06] <maxcnc> membiblio: yust press edit file and save it to your name you want
[12:52:02] <skunkworks> membiblio, http://git.linuxcnc.org/gitweb?p=linuxcnc.git;a=blob;f=src/emc/usr_intf/axis/scripts/axis.py;hb=00581f61750f2b94bc3515da0f89f0cfd8a14c4e#l3300
[12:52:09] <membiblio> maxcnc - You are not making sense. What file? Yes I CAN edit ANY file but that does not help me.
[12:52:39] <membiblio> skunkworks - What is that link for?
[12:52:54] <maxcnc> there is your axis.ngc
[12:53:43] <membiblio> That is axix.py from git - the python source for the axis gui - how does that help me - I already have that on machine?
[12:54:22] <maxcnc> membiblio: http://git.linuxcnc.org/gitweb?p=linuxcnc.git;a=tree;f=share/axis/images;h=66a21028ddf26a3a135906d75e2960a64c62fd1c;hb=HEAD
[12:54:48] <maxcnc> there is axis.ngc
[12:54:55] <maxcnc> but its also on your mashine
[12:55:32] <maxcnc> "sudo find \ -iname 'axis.ngc'
[12:56:25] <skunkworks> ok - backup - if you want to open a different gcode file - edit your ini and add the open_file = in your display section
[12:56:26] <skunkworks> http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.7/html/config/ini-config.html#_display_section
[12:56:47] <membiblio> max - yes I know - easy basic xnix - I thought someone here might be integrating like us - but I guess not. Thank you anyways.
[12:57:16] <archivist> toastydeath, if it is torsion I would expect to see a vertical wire
[12:57:33] <archivist> odd that it is not central
[12:58:16] <maxcnc> membiblio: we make better gcosde for owr own shops
[12:58:26] <archivist> toastydeath, and I bet the spring will need to be changed for differing ranges
[12:58:46] <toastydeath> archivist: that's my fear
[12:59:10] <toastydeath> i'm usually willing to take a risk for 200 bucks but this one has one too many indicators it's broken
[12:59:41] <toastydeath> and i don't have enough shit to manufacture my own torson rods
[13:00:35] <archivist> a bit like the torsion springs in 400 day clocks
[13:01:20] <toastydeath> i was thinking it could maybe be a steel cable rather than a rod but that seems unlikely
[13:01:26] <toastydeath> best to just bite the bullet and buy the digital one i guess
[13:03:24] <archivist> I like measuring toys but never needed viscosity yet
[13:03:53] <maxcnc> archivist use a ketchup one
[13:04:08] <toastydeath> I'm doing a bunch of experimentation with e-cigarette/vaping stuff
[13:04:28] <toastydeath> this is the first stage of trying to figure out actual values for other studies
[13:05:04] <toastydeath> right now all the studies are basically inventing their own methodology wholecloth without any sound backing
[13:05:21] <toastydeath> so I'm trying to come up with a consistent, deterministic method
[13:15:55] <CaptHindsight> aren't vape liquids just propylene glycol, gylcerol and nicotine acid?
[13:16:22] <Loetmichel> CaptHindsight: and some aromes
[13:16:40] <toastydeath> yep
[13:17:42] <CaptHindsight> toastydeath: do you really need actual viscosity numbers or just relative?
[13:18:10] <CaptHindsight> 220cPs vs just thicker/thinner
[13:18:38] <toastydeath> the relative difference matters a lot, so it doesn't need to be absolute but it needs to be quantitative difference
[13:18:49] <toastydeath> "this is 10 ToastyUnits thicker"
[13:19:03] <toastydeath> the most practical way for me to get that is just using cP
[13:19:10] <toastydeath> on an actual absolute measurement
[13:19:17] <CaptHindsight> maybe just get a Zahn cup
[13:19:53] <toastydeath> that's a possibility, i also may use a glass capillary viscometer
[13:21:15] <CaptHindsight> depends on how wide a range you'll be in
[13:22:45] <CaptHindsight> vape juice is ~$5/L to make in low volume
[13:24:21] <CaptHindsight> what do they charge for 20mL? $5
[13:24:44] <toastydeath> 30 mL is around 20-30 USD
[13:25:30] <toastydeath> sometimes cheaper
[13:26:04] <maxcnc> did the gas price drop as the oilprice dropped today in the USA as well
[13:26:07] <CaptHindsight> http://www.vistavapors.com/kiwi-watermelon/ 32mL plastic bottle $7.50
[13:26:17] <CaptHindsight> maxcnc: yes
[13:26:23] <maxcnc> ;-)
[13:26:37] <CaptHindsight> they are trying to kill the shale oil producers
[13:27:02] <maxcnc> what did donald say about it maybe on his advise it came along
[13:27:21] <toastydeath> CaptHindsight: the issue is that it's actually pretty hard to come up with a flavor that isn't god awful
[13:27:48] <maxcnc> Gn8
[13:27:52] <toastydeath> the very inexpensive fluids are aimed at people who have just switched over from cigarettes on a very inexpensive ecig
[13:27:52] <CaptHindsight> $7.50 x 31 = $232
[13:28:10] <toastydeath> so most people are willing to pay a lot more because you don't go through a whole shitload of it
[13:29:12] <CaptHindsight> $20 x 31 = $620, quite a profit margin
[13:29:17] <toastydeath> very large
[13:29:28] <toastydeath> if only you can sell it
[13:29:39] <toastydeath> it's a lot like perfume, in that many people try, and almost everyone fails
[13:29:54] <toastydeath> once you're in, you're a made man
[13:31:16] <toastydeath> the startup costs are also very large
[13:31:59] <CaptHindsight> to build a brand yes, to make juice nope
[13:32:14] <toastydeath> no, just to make the juice
[13:32:32] <CaptHindsight> where does the expense come in?
[13:32:38] <toastydeath> it's exactly analogous to perfume - you wind up needing tons of flavors
[13:32:48] <toastydeath> the materials for any given bottle are cheap
[13:33:08] <toastydeath> having a starting palette where you're likely to make something where you don't immediately vomit is not cheap
[13:33:14] <CaptHindsight> then you are going about it wrong
[13:33:38] <toastydeath> i'm listening
[13:34:38] <CaptHindsight> flavorings are also low cost
[13:34:49] <CaptHindsight> sounds like propaganda
[13:35:03] <toastydeath> < toastydeath> the materials for any given bottle are cheap
[13:35:22] <toastydeath> the fact you need 2000 bottles is what sucks, it's not the fact the bottles are inexpensive per unit
[13:35:33] <toastydeath> the challenge here is to not throw up
[13:35:37] <CaptHindsight> 2000 bottles of what?
[13:35:48] <toastydeath> different flavorings
[13:35:51] <CaptHindsight> flavors?
[13:36:07] <CaptHindsight> who told you that?
[13:36:21] <toastydeath> Told me? I'm actually close to a shitload of people in the industry
[13:36:27] <toastydeath> I've seen it in person
[13:36:44] <toastydeath> the start up cost for an individual learning to make this shit is not cheap
[13:37:03] <toastydeath> if you want to make it for yourself, knock yourself out on whatever budget you want
[13:37:06] <CaptHindsight> you certainly don't need a viscometer
[13:37:11] <toastydeath> I'm not making fluids
[13:37:33] <toastydeath> none of what we're discussing with cost of fluid production relates to my project
[13:38:34] <toastydeath> (nor do i really want to make fluids, even though i may give it a shot briefly)
[13:39:42] <CaptHindsight> <toastydeath> I'm doing a bunch of experimentation with e-cigarette/vaping stuff so that was a non-sequitur
[13:40:18] <toastydeath> i am doing analysis on the mechanical properties of vaping equipment
[13:40:23] <CaptHindsight> or a tangent
[13:40:55] <toastydeath> i was responding to your questions about price and why the profit margins stay so high instead of crashing
[13:41:09] <toastydeath> so yeah, tangental to what i'm doing but still in the same industry
[13:41:11] <CaptHindsight> sorry I asked
[13:58:27] <Magnifikus> so today i milled with the spartan3 fpga stuff
[13:58:29] <Magnifikus> went well :)
[16:27:36] <andypugh> 4-way crimper, works for Lemo. as 10% of the cost of the real one. http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B007G5QBDC?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o01_s00
[16:40:18] <Deejay> gn8
[16:52:59] <MrSunshine> http://forumbilder.com/image/0O4 anyone know what this is? =)
[16:57:53] <andypugh> it’s a twirly thing
[16:58:34] <andypugh> Given that it has an encoder, I think it might be a coil winder.
[17:00:24] <MrSunshine> sure its an encoder? =)
[17:00:36] <andypugh> No.
[17:01:18] <andypugh> Could be a tacho, or an aluminium cased velociraptor for all I can tell from the photo.
[17:02:56] <gregcnc> It doesn't seem to have a convenient way of removing anything that might be wound?
[17:13:59] <CaptHindsight> maybe itsa clutch
[17:16:56] <CaptHindsight> MrSunshine: what do we win if we guess correctly?
[17:17:07] <andypugh> It’s a brushed motor.
[17:18:29] <andypugh> I go for it being a turboencabulator: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RXJKdh1KZ0w
[17:19:23] <CaptHindsight> looks like it's sitting on top of an induction cooktop
[17:23:12] <andypugh> Yes. Is that critical to the function?
[17:24:26] <MrSunshine> flux capacitor winder i think
[18:01:21] <JT-Shop> chargers rate by Ah and batteries rate by cold cranking amps, any way to figure out what the Ah of a battery is?
[18:02:24] <cradek> no, unfortunately, those two things are not particularly related
[18:03:09] <cradek> you can get big batteries and small batteries with the same CCA (ability to crank an engine when cold), but they will have very different Ah (total capacity - how long can they do it?)
[18:03:27] <cradek> by big/small I mean what you read on the tape measure
[18:03:34] <JT-Shop> that must be what the reserve minutes is
[18:03:40] <cradek> yeah possibly
[18:03:45] <cradek> I've never heard of that one
[18:03:51] <JT-Shop> 700 amps x 120 reserve minutes
[18:04:06] <cradek> I bet a lot of it is marketing mumbo jumbo
[18:04:13] <gregcnc> reserve minutes is related to Ah.
[18:04:15] <JT-Shop> yea for sure
[18:04:36] <cradek> get the largest (by tape measure) battery that will fit in your car and that has the right connectors :-)
[18:04:41] <gregcnc> I think it's 20A load. so that would give 40Ah
[18:05:04] <vexation> 25A I think..
[18:05:17] <CaptHindsight> JT-Shop: the only way would be to test it yourself or get a battery where they have an Ah rating
[18:05:31] <gregcnc> maybe 25A I don't remember any more
[18:06:11] <JT-Shop> http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004LX3AS6?keywords=battery%20maintainer&qid=1449673431&ref_=sr_1_8&sr=8-8
[18:06:33] <JT-Shop> looking for a battery maintainer for my equipment and truck
[18:06:56] <JT-Shop> back hoe, crawler/dozer, tractors, etc.
[18:07:22] <CaptHindsight> looks like a good one
[18:07:44] <JT-Shop> I have the small one for my motorcycles and like it
[18:08:01] <gregcnc> I use a batteryminder
[18:10:58] <gregcnc> http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200332201_200332201
[18:12:25] <gregcnc> I have that one. The have new models, so Northern must be clearing them out.
[18:12:37] <JT-Shop> on a good note I got the siding up today
[18:12:54] <JT-Shop> I like the NOCO Genius
[18:17:40] <CaptHindsight> JT-Shop: did you reach 60 today?
[18:18:07] <toastydeath> I think fedex broke my new oscilloscope =(
[18:18:23] <toastydeath> "new"
[18:19:06] <JT-Shop> 64°F I think, tee shirt all afternoon
[18:21:17] <JT-Shop> yuck
[18:22:06] <JT-Shop> ordered a co2 tire filler and got a tire instead...
[18:22:53] <tiwake> turning aluminum \o/
[18:33:42] <JT-Shop> Very sorry for this error. We will ship you the correct item and you keep the tire as our gift to you for the error.
[18:35:53] * JT-Shop calls it a day
[18:36:00] <JT-Shop> say goodnight Gracie
[18:36:44] <cradek> yay you get to keep a single random tire
[18:36:52] <cradek> just what you need, I bet
[18:37:10] <cradek> maybe give it to someone for christmas
[18:54:20] <andypugh> I think CCA is a US thing. UK batteries seem to be rated by Ah. So, I go for marketing.
[18:54:53] <andypugh> Though, it has to be admitted that Ah is a strong function of discharge rate and temperature
[18:55:27] <andypugh> JT-Shop: What’s the tyre?
[18:56:20] <andypugh> This PDF has a table which lists CCA and Ah (at two discharge rates) for a range of batteries: http://www.budgetbatteries.co.uk/images/products/pdf/22245.pdf
[19:07:55] <malcom2073> CCA has to do with how much current you can pull at once when at the bottom of the temperature range I believe
[19:08:13] <malcom2073> Or some weird marketing bs like that
[19:31:04] <Valen> in .au they are rated in both
[19:31:13] <Valen> so you can get a small ah battery with lots of cca
[20:06:07] <Jymmm> Battery University http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/
[20:10:11] <Jymmm> Had a 20% off coupon, accidentally found this http://www.harborfreight.com/6-lb-splitting-maul.html and got it for under $18 out the door. Which is the EXACT same handle as this replacement handle, right down the injection molding marks, and is $15+tx http://www.homedepot.com/p/True-Temper-36-in-Replacement-Fiberglass-Handle-2036100/202057450
[20:23:43] <gregcnc> http://www.odysseybattery.com/faq.aspx
[20:27:25] <malcom2073> We have a set of odysseys at work, expensive batteries,
[20:30:11] <gregcnc> I had an Optima red top in a truck for a long time it was great.
[23:21:27] <RootB> Hey LINUXCNC, do you guys recommend a PCI-E or PCI parallel card to hook up LINUXCNC?
[23:31:06] <CaptHindsight> whatever matches your motherboard and if you need EPP a card that doesn't have broken EPP mode
[23:32:28] <RootB> EPP?
[23:32:52] <RootB> oh that