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[00:00:36] <Tom_itx> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=11WW5KAzV7A
[00:01:30] <zeeshan|2> nice
[00:01:51] <Tom_itx> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ztwu_kPnq60
[00:01:58] <Tom_itx> that one should have been first
[00:02:30] <Tom_itx> http://www.sheffield-pottery.com/KILN-BRICK-REPAIR-KIT-p/lmgbkit00.htm
[00:04:04] <Tom_itx> http://www.paragonweb.com/files/manuals/im234_firebrick_repair.pdf
[00:04:17] <Tom_itx> gnite
[00:04:22] <zeeshan|2> nite
[00:04:25] <zeeshan|2> ty!
[00:04:30] <Tom_itx> uh huh
[00:21:26] <trentster> howdy all
[00:22:46] <trentster> Just been tramming the new spindle I have put in and testing deflection force on bit when I push or pull a gantry side as hard as I can.
[00:24:24] <trentster> the spindle tram is accurate to 0.0004 of an inch and the force movement on the gantry is about 0.002 are these numbers considered good/bad acceptable?
[00:24:46] <trentster> both of those values were rounded up to the nearest decimal btw
[01:16:02] <FAalbers_> Hello, Do you use G Wizard a lot ? Is it worth the investment ?
[01:16:39] <XXCoder> hey FAalbers_ dunno just discovered it too
[01:21:24] <XXCoder> nice read!
http://makezine.com/2012/04/13/cnc-panel-joinery-notebook/
[01:25:35] <FAalbers_> XXCoder, I was reading up on this
http://www.cnccookbook.com/CCCNCMillFeedsSpeeds.htm
[01:26:09] <FAalbers_> They try to promote G Wizard, but if you ignore that part, there is a lot of info in there
[01:26:20] <XXCoder> yeah
[01:26:28] <XXCoder> cam is still bit of sore point for me'
[01:26:38] <XXCoder> hard to find anything useful for me :(
[01:27:27] <XXCoder> hmm
http://mecsoft.com/freemill/
[01:27:44] <XXCoder> bah
[01:27:46] <XXCoder> not free
[01:28:10] <XXCoder> also windows :(
[01:29:43] <FAalbers_> XXCoder, That is really cool page there about joining panels ! Thanks a bunch !
[01:29:49] <XXCoder> no plm
[01:30:29] <FAalbers_> plm ?
[01:30:39] <XXCoder> short for problem
[01:30:46] <FAalbers_> Does it HAVE to be Linux ?
[01:31:29] <XXCoder> I suppose not, as I probably will have to setup a windows vitual pc to dedrm my kindle ebooks as dedrm dont work in linux.
[01:31:47] <FAalbers_> I love Linux way more then Windows to develop on. But windows just to run CAD CAM is fine
[01:32:17] <FAalbers_> I have dual boot
[01:32:56] <FAalbers_> Just bought me a copy of CamBam and Cut Viewer
[01:33:14] <XXCoder> http://ecam.altervista.org/
[01:35:33] <FAalbers_> XXCoder, Only intended for vision ... does that mean it doesn't greate GCode ?
[01:35:46] <XXCoder> dunno, trying it now
[01:35:51] <XXCoder> hopefully it works in wine lol
[01:36:51] <FAalbers_> I'll have a go also , looks intersting for beginners , like us :)
[01:40:24] <Flipp_> where do people commonly go to buy gears?
[01:40:33] <Flipp_> mcmaster? sdpsi? somewhere else?
[01:40:45] <Flipp_> the first two seem super expensive...
[01:44:08] <XXCoder> chinese site aliexpress though expect low quality
[01:44:18] <XXCoder> or ebay which probably is similiar quality,.
[01:45:05] <FAalbers_> OK , bed time ... Gnite y'all !
[02:52:32] <Deejay> moin
[03:09:53] <archivist> trentster, 2 thou I assume is pushing against something, mount dti mid table rest in on the spindle nose, measure deflection in any direction you can when pushing/bending the spindle housing
[03:27:49] <MikkoP> Yea, don't think this is going to work...
http://i.imgur.com/GHPqTpe.png
[03:28:06] <XXCoder> whats wrong with it
[03:28:22] <MikkoP> I need longer travel distance vertically than CNCs normally do because I want to use it as the frame for a 3D printer too...
[03:28:41] <MikkoP> Well, look how tall it is hand how heavy it is in the front
[03:28:48] <MikkoP> where the spindle is
[03:29:13] <XXCoder> you can do back-front design
[03:29:22] <XXCoder> beam is set on back
[03:29:40] <XXCoder> so weight is closer to gantry center
[03:29:49] <trentster> archivist: I am not following you there, the sentence was a tad confusing
[03:29:55] <trentster> could you clarify please?
[03:30:43] <XXCoder> MikkoP: can also set gantry to slant backwards (but with cross top countering the angle)
[03:30:53] <XXCoder> so much of mass is centered on gantry center
[03:30:59] <XXCoder> so it is balanced
[03:32:53] <XXCoder> MikkoP: I also saw a variant where motor is mounted on other side but I'm not too sure if that loses precision due to coupling or not
[03:32:57] <archivist> trentster, needs diagrams
[03:34:10] <MikkoP> XXCoder: If I moved the horizontal beam backwards I'd have to widen the machine. The motor and the ballscrew wouldn't fit otherwise.
[03:34:47] <MikkoP> Yea and moving the motor might lose precision because it's not directly connected.
[03:35:11] <XXCoder> its just attaching horzonal beam on back face rather than front
[03:35:19] <archivist> trentster, here are some in a textbook on testing machine tools
http://www.collection.archivist.info/archive/DJC/BK/BK3151/
[03:35:20] <XXCoder> ah I see problem
[03:35:45] <XXCoder> my machine just directly attaches motor on the side of gantry and ball screw goes though ut
[03:35:56] <XXCoder> so it was fine, not in your case though
[03:36:59] <archivist> MikkoP, think about how bendy those beams are
[03:37:43] <MikkoP> archivist: 100x50x6 mm steel box section was something I thought of using
[03:37:45] <XXCoder> archivist: just few of small 45 degree angles would stiff that just fine
[03:37:49] <ReadError> MikkoP why not put the Y rails with more separation
[03:38:01] <ReadError> and cut a channel between them for the conenction to ballscrew
[03:38:03] <archivist> MikkoP, also you carriages are not as far apart as would be anything like ideal
[03:38:38] <archivist> XXCoder, gantry has poor torsional stiffness
[03:38:51] <XXCoder> twising reistance?
[03:38:55] <XXCoder> *twisting
[03:38:57] <archivist> yes
[03:39:15] <MikkoP> ReadError: That could work. Then I wouldn't need to build any additional feet for the machine to stand on.
[03:39:28] <XXCoder> its steel beams, and he mostly will work on alum and wood
[03:39:35] <XXCoder> if I recall correct anyway
[03:39:53] <MikkoP> Yea it's steel
[03:40:27] <archivist> I am looking at that from a structural point of view
[03:41:42] <XXCoder> MikkoP: whats size anyway? that looks like 2 feet something
[03:42:01] <archivist> the carriages are probably the greatest source of error due to lack of spacing between on each axis
[03:42:34] <MikkoP> XXCoder: The rails are 600 mm long so that sets the size
[03:42:49] <XXCoder> so close to 2 feet. guess I got scale right lol
[03:42:55] <MikkoP> archivist: Even the ones up in the gantry?
[03:44:44] <trentster> archivist: thanks
[03:46:28] <trentster> that is a lot of text there ;-)
[03:46:57] <trentster> I guess what I was after is to try and gauge for DIY cnc stuff what is considered good and acceptable.
[03:47:35] <trentster> I understand if I bought a HAAs the tolerances would be tighter and less forgiving
[03:48:08] <trentster> Also does anyone know how many gallons or litre container is a good volume size for cyling a 2.2KW spindle coolant
[03:48:56] <trentster> I was testing today with about 2.5 Litres and using a little radiator and the water was noticably getting warmer after about 15 minutes of the spindle at about 20k rpm
[03:49:25] <trentster> So not sure if I need a bigger pump or bigger volume of water - any suggestions / recommendations
[03:49:58] <XXCoder> trentster: does it spray into tank?
[03:50:01] <XXCoder> might be way to cool
[03:50:47] <XXCoder> anyway bigger pump wouldnt it mean more heat? probbably wrong lol
[03:51:42] <archivist> trentster, ask Loetmichel2 when he wakes up as he runs one
[03:52:05] <archivist> MikkoP, the Z ones especially
[03:52:59] <gonzo_nb> I would have thought that if the pump were too small, there woyld be a bigger temp diff between the coolant and the motor
[03:53:01] <MikkoP> archivist: Why's that the biggest problem?
[03:53:41] <gonzo_nb> if it's just the whole system warming up, then is the cooling (rad) not too small
[03:53:55] <gonzo_nb> (or insufficient air flow)
[03:53:57] <archivist> any play can be magnified at the cutting point
[03:54:36] <gonzo_nb> I'm not a spindle expert, but have worked on cooling systems
[03:54:41] <archivist> MikkoP, simple lever effect
[03:55:01] <MikkoP> Yea, that's true. I just wonder how much is tolerable. I'm already switched from 20 mm plywood to 100x50 mm steel box section of 6 mm thickness. :D
[03:55:19] <MikkoP> I've*
[03:55:44] <trentster> XXCoder: it goes from tank to spindle —> out spindle —> to a mini radiator —> then back into tank/container
[03:56:08] <MikkoP> So would this be better for the base?
http://i.imgur.com/sFTwS31.png
[03:56:35] <archivist> yes but I thought you were looking for some precision if you had an error 0f 1 thou at a carriage then at the cutting point it could be much more
[03:56:42] <trentster> The pump is pretty small but has a pump lift height of 3Metres
[03:57:25] <archivist> add fan to radiator, then dont care how big the tank is
[03:57:25] <trentster> and a Static flow rate : 240L/H
[03:57:27] <MikkoP> archivist: Yea. Did you mean the horizontal spacing between them or the vertical?
[03:57:35] <archivist> vertical
[03:57:37] <XXCoder> archivist: that does seem simplest
[03:57:42] <MikkoP> Yea that's an easy fix though
[03:57:54] <XXCoder> bigger radatior too maybe
[03:58:14] <XXCoder> the longer it travels while being actively cooled means it are cooler at exit
[03:58:24] <MikkoP> Because that axis is easy to change. The other axis have the rails the other way around so the maximum spacing is limited by the beam width
[03:58:26] <archivist> trentster, that text is the one all the older textbooks refer too
[03:58:34] <XXCoder> grab a car radator lol (sorta kidding(
[03:58:37] <MikkoP> archivist: How much do you think there should be space in between?
[03:58:50] <archivist> as much as you can fit in
[03:59:40] <archivist> always try for max spacing, yes I know this works against travel distances
[03:59:52] <MikkoP> trentster: Not sure what kind of tubes you have and what radiators for this purpose cost, but if the tubing allows it a radiator designed for computers might be a cheaper and better option. For 100 euros you can get a 480 mm long radiator that fits four 12 cm fans on both sides
[03:59:52] <gonzo_nb> a bigger tank would just give more thermal mass. So it would take longer to get warm. But in equilibrium it woyld not change the max temp
[04:00:10] <trentster> archivist: I am not even sure if this can be considered a radiator I guess more like a heat sink <img src="
https://monosnap.com/file/138WCI0bCosuVm4XpnCAuQL6wUf4wa.png">
[04:00:29] <trentster> its pretty tiny Size: 40 x 40 x 12mm
[04:00:30] <MikkoP> archivist: Yea it does but if I get longer rails I can somewhat combat that
[04:00:40] <XXCoder> trentster: too tiny I think but then dunno
[04:00:44] <gonzo_nb> (a bigger tank may give more radiating area and have a small cooling effext, but prob not much compares to the rad)
[04:00:44] <trentster> I guess I could add a cpu heatsink and fan onto it.
[04:00:56] <XXCoder> grab a old car radator lol
[04:00:57] <archivist> add heatsink and fan
[04:01:02] <trentster> I could probably weld one on with solder if flux will join it
[04:01:18] <XXCoder> or pelter
[04:01:36] <archivist> peltier are not a lot of use
[04:01:41] <trentster> XXCoder: I have never used a pelter - arent they energy hogs?
[04:01:57] <archivist> yes the use more than they move
[04:02:33] <XXCoder> heh theres such thing as stirling fan, it USES heat to turn fan to cool
[04:02:40] <XXCoder> but I dont know where it is buyable
[04:02:41] <archivist> I was using peltier fridge, now gone and got a proper fridge
[04:03:17] <XXCoder> http://regmedia.co.uk/2008/02/29/msi_eco_3.jpg
[04:03:45] <gonzo_nb> that rad looks like a PC water cool sink. Poss worth trying one of the radiators that the PC cooling people use
[04:04:02] <archivist> XXCoder, that looks like a wet dream
[04:04:11] <gonzo_nb> Looking like a small car rad, and they usually have 100mm fan mount points
[04:04:30] <XXCoder> archivist: its actual product, but didnt sell much if I understand
[04:04:35] <MikkoP> How's this?
http://i.imgur.com/Klnvbg0.png
[04:05:10] <archivist> better now look at the other axes
[04:05:19] <XXCoder> trentster: you can always do cpu heat sink and fan on BOTH sides
[04:05:24] <XXCoder> pump heat out much faster
[04:05:50] <XXCoder> honestly I'd go larger radatior, expecially type with thin pipes and fins
[04:05:55] <MikkoP> archivist: There's not much I can do there because the steel box sections are too narrow to widen the gap
[04:05:57] <trentster> xxcoder i think I need a bigger radiator, I got plenty of heatsinks and fans lying around
[04:06:11] <XXCoder> or car junkyard
[04:06:33] <XXCoder> theres tiny ones for tranmission fluid cooling lol
[04:06:37] <archivist> the heater radiator from a car is about right
[04:07:01] <XXCoder> heat core?
[04:08:05] <trentster> yeah I will look for a tiny one, I definately dont have room for a full size car radiator plus there is no way my pump will deal with that
[04:08:17] <XXCoder> it dont have to
[04:08:25] <XXCoder> make it dump to bin
[04:08:30] <archivist> there is a second radiator on the water cooling circuit to heat inside the car
[04:08:57] <XXCoder> yeah that small one
[04:09:42] <trentster> I need to add some coolant additive as well right, something like antifreeze but not antifreeze as I heard it can damage spindles
[04:10:24] <archivist> one ok for aluminium I think
[04:10:35] <trentster> is this what a small car radiator looks like?
https://discuss-assets.s3.amazonaws.com/58173b7902e619c801a43f949185d32a768c85ae6b41.jpg
[04:11:04] <archivist> that looks just right
[04:11:25] <XXCoder> looks good size, was thinking around that size
[04:11:37] <XXCoder> with fan it should cool just fine
[04:11:53] <archivist> I have one in my scrap pile in the garden from a car old 30 years ago
[04:12:17] <trentster> archivist: pity we are not neighbours ;-)
[04:12:35] <archivist> 12miles to post, hell no
[04:12:39] <archivist> 12k
[04:12:57] <XXCoder> lol was thinking "huh just 12 miles?"
[04:13:18] <archivist> other side of the planet
[04:15:16] <MikkoP> Where do you live?
[04:19:08] <trentster> Australia
[04:19:39] <MikkoP> Nice :) I'm in Finland
[04:22:43] <trentster> I envy you - its damn hot here at the moment
[04:22:52] <trentster> I would kill for some snow and cold weather
[04:27:48] <MikkoP> 8 degrees celsius, 10 m/s wind and rainfall 2 mm/hour so it's terrible weather outdoors :D
[04:28:19] <trentster> Nice ;-)
[04:29:37] <MikkoP> How stiff does the vertically sliding axis need to be in that design? Now I've drawn that using the same steel beam but I wonder if my motor can even lift that
[04:29:57] <MikkoP> It would have to move 10 kg vertically
[04:41:09] <SpeedEvil> You need to work out all your forces, dynamic - due to cutting and movement - and static - due to weight
[04:41:37] <SpeedEvil> Static forces will cause members to bend, live forces make them vibrate.
[04:41:52] <SpeedEvil> You start out with your tool force.
[04:42:24] <SpeedEvil> Now, work out how much this can deflect from the workpiece without causing major issues for your machining.
[04:42:32] <SpeedEvil> This gives you the required stiffness.
[04:43:07] <SpeedEvil> Now, you can compute the needed stiffnesss and compliance of all joints and members.
[04:43:25] <SpeedEvil> Often very simple simulations - 1D or 2D can give a good approximation
[05:43:11] <MikkoP> Ok, so I need to do some reading to figure those out.
[05:51:26] <archivist> MikkoP, as an example my mk1 mill, the spindle moved about 6 thou with a kg force
[05:52:22] <archivist> so if there was that much cutting force it could easily chatter or dig in and snap tools
[05:53:55] <archivist> that would be regarded as a roughing cut in those days, and only to be done conventionally, no climbing cuts allowed
[05:54:35] <archivist> I added a lot of stiffening to the column soon after
[05:56:04] <archivist> mk1
http://www.collection.archivist.info/thumbs/archive/DJCPD/PD/2008/2008_02_03_cnc/P2030012_T.JPG
[05:56:57] <archivist> mk2
http://www.collection.archivist.info/archive/DJCPD/PD/2009/2009_07_10_cnc_with_LCD_P4/IMG_0268.JPG
[05:59:45] <SpeedEvil> 100kg is a not untypical cutting force.
[06:00:03] <SpeedEvil> for a 'proper' machine.
[06:19:20] <trentster> The first person who can figure out how to standardise and make decent machines modular and easy to understand for new builder or people coming into the maker space will make a lot of money :-)
[06:19:49] <trentster> It will happen eventually, its inevitable. Right now its a shame its so overly complex for folks
[06:19:56] <archivist> a complex subject is complex
[06:20:38] <trentster> I mean just figuring out what kind of Linear rails and slides to buy for a certain application is boggling there are so many many different types and sizes etc etc, it is boggling for a newcomer.
[06:21:02] <trentster> Granted if you have a mechanical engineering or architectural / industrial design background its a lot easier :-)
[06:21:35] <archivist> often the choice is between junk and quality, and most are chasing cheap
[06:22:06] <trentster> archivist: most are pursuing cheaper as they don't have the money for professional.
[06:22:19] <trentster> Lets not make it sound like its a choice
[06:22:37] <trentster> For most people the cost of the best is prohibitive
[06:22:58] <archivist> wait a bit longer till you have the funds or retrofit some real iron
[06:23:10] <Sync> ^
[06:23:10] <trentster> but - you will see the cost of stuff will come down as more people get involved and competition increases
[06:23:47] <archivist> unfortunately the competition is price driven
[06:23:58] <trentster> At the moment the industry is grown fat and complacent reeming big business for equipment
[06:24:23] <Sync> huh
[06:24:28] <trentster> There is no way they are going to be able to sustain 40X Margins on kit anymore
[06:24:28] <Sync> machines have never been cheaper
[06:24:45] <archivist> try designing and making something good and only making 50 of them
[06:24:51] <trentster> There is no logical reason why a set of linear rails and bearing blocks should cost $400
[06:25:11] <Sync> then make them cheaper
[06:25:28] <trentster> Sync: I dont, need to - time will make them cheaper.
[06:25:37] <archivist> you need to go through the design to production process to realise the upfront spend
[06:25:41] <Sync> then don't complain
[06:25:48] <Sync> and precision will never be really cheap
[06:25:52] <trentster> Other industries have already dropped a lot, this stuff will follow in the next few years
[06:25:53] <Sync> due to the involved hassle
[06:27:14] <trentster> Yeah, I ehar ya - and do agree design and prototyping stuff is expensive and takes a lot of resources
[06:27:44] <trentster> but this is not inventing the wheel here, linear stuff has been around for many decades
[06:27:58] <trentster> it should be an off the shelf commodity item
[06:28:08] <archivist> actually the wheel is a straight line on an axis :)
[06:28:29] <trentster> There should be the very best which comes at a premium and there should be affordable stuff that is 50% as good for the rest of folks
[06:28:33] <archivist> and truly straight is not easy
[06:28:47] <trentster> archivist: :P Drone strike
[06:33:56] <trentster> archivist: what do you mean by "real iron"? Like a used industrial mill and do a cnc conversion on it?
[06:34:29] <archivist> yes exactly that
[06:35:16] <archivist> to me the biggest joke on ebay is
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/310562732677
[06:35:17] <anomynous_> i know. Chromium surface ground s355 isnt that expensive and plastic can be excellent bearing surface. It is also cheap. Theres pom with teflon mixed in it ;D (not trying to be an ass... im just wondering how long it would last and how well it would work :)
[06:35:45] <archivist> anomynous_, it comes with built in rattle
[06:35:58] <anomynous_> archivist, ;D
[06:36:01] <XXCoder> very small, probably comes with solid gold dilio
[06:36:13] <archivist> anomynous_, I have some samples of it
[06:36:17] <trentster> archivist: haha that ebay item is a joke - it must be :P
[06:36:26] <trentster> I wonder if anyone is dumb enough to buy it
[06:36:44] <XXCoder> its really fancy
[06:36:48] <XXCoder> has tool holders
[06:36:51] <archivist> trentster, should I make public the MDs reply :)
[06:37:01] <XXCoder> maybe worth it if it was 1/10 price
[06:37:17] <archivist> XXCoder, the accuracy spec cannot be met
[06:37:33] <XXCoder> 400 shipping
[06:37:36] <Jymmm> archivist: I kinda like the estop right under/behind the echain
[06:37:45] <XXCoder> Jymmm: yeah noticed same
[06:37:56] <XXCoder> it will be rubbed on by drag chain often
[06:38:27] <archivist> they use C6 screws and claim Accuracy/Repeatability: 0.01mm I call bullshit
[06:38:43] <Jymmm> XXCoder: I was hoping it trap your hand/wrist bethween the chain and column as you are reaching the estop, kinda like a a haha fuck you
[06:38:58] <XXCoder> estop requires blood
[06:39:05] <Jymmm> EXACTLY!
[06:39:27] <XXCoder> 0.01 mm wont happen with that tool
[06:39:35] <XXCoder> its runout probably is .1 mm or more
[06:40:06] <trentster> archivist: yes please do, also why did you try and contact them?
[06:40:30] <Sync> anomynous_: igus dry lin
[06:40:36] <Jymmm> "Shipping price added during checkout includes 4 to 5 hours installation and initial training followed by free email and telephone support"
[06:40:41] <archivist> because in this country we have a law against false claims
[06:41:05] <trentster> so what was his/her response?
[06:41:29] <XXCoder> 400 added is that, or is it ADDED on checkout?
[06:41:51] <Jymmm> I like the 4-5 hours of training included =)
[06:41:57] <archivist> trentster, We build using Class 5 precision rolled ballscrew, preloaded...assembled with matched sets of preloaded end bearings
[06:42:17] <archivist> c5 is way bellow .01mm
[06:42:24] <Sync> > precision rolled
[06:42:32] <archivist> and only rolled screws at that
[06:42:37] <trentster> precision rolled lol
[06:42:47] <trentster> its either precision ground or rolled - no?
[06:42:56] <Sync> nah
[06:43:01] <Sync> you can get good rolled screws
[06:43:08] <Sync> but they will never be as good as ground ones
[06:43:11] <trentster> rolled sucks I know
[06:43:26] <archivist> C5 says how good the resulting screw is though
[06:43:29] <anomynous_> Sync, "Glider made from iglide® J200" <- = "Glider made from some plastic®"?
[06:43:32] <anomynous_> or what do you mean
[06:43:39] <trentster> sync what I am saying is you either get "precision ground" or you get "rolled"
[06:43:47] <trentster> I have never heard of precision rolled
[06:44:00] <trentster> Thats like saying a precision bellyflop
[06:44:09] <archivist> ball screws are precision compared to allthread
[06:44:17] <Sync> anomynous_: the glider is some teflon infused shits
[06:44:22] <anomynous_> ok
[06:44:38] <archivist> anomynous_, friction is rather high too
[06:44:42] <Sync> trentster: well, the accuracy grade is usually put on them after measuring
[06:44:50] <Sync> so you can actually get selected rolled ones
[06:44:58] <anomynous_> vink.fi lists POM-C GLD160 to have teflon in it. Now go use it! :D
[06:45:05] <Sync> and some people have their rolling processes better under control than some others
[06:45:10] <archivist> C5 being at the cheap end of ballscrew
[06:46:13] <SpeedEvil> archivist: Lies!
[06:46:18] * SpeedEvil looks at his threaded rod.
[06:46:19] <archivist> trentster, he also said Our figure have been independently verified by the worlds largest measuring machine company....we produce machines for this Company!
[06:46:24] * SpeedEvil dreams of ball-screws.
[06:47:13] <archivist> SpeedEvil, I did measure some 6mm threaded bar, not pretty
[06:47:16] <trentster> archivist Sync: I would be interested to hear about what you think of this machine in terms of design and claimed specifications, it uses neither linear bearings nor ballscrews.
http://www.grunblau.com/PlatformCNC.htm
[06:47:59] <XXCoder> trentster: screws both side
[06:48:03] <trentster> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_s8dfMKvmJQ
[06:48:10] <XXCoder> that takes careful stepper sychonization
[06:48:13] <trentster> there is the first part of the build video
[06:48:19] <XXCoder> or gantry gets into angle
[06:48:24] <trentster> its superbly designed the guy is meticulous
[06:48:35] <trentster> He has an architecture / industrial design background
[06:48:41] <XXCoder> trentster: he loves light gray on white
[06:48:44] <XXCoder> I cant read anything
[06:49:11] <XXCoder> good thing I have special script to blacken any site
[06:49:26] <XXCoder> and very dark gray on black is easily readable
[06:49:37] <trentster> xxcoder sorry I thought youtube put in captions algorithmically - he has a running music track in the background perhaps that is messing up your captions
[06:49:59] <Sync> looks like a pos to me trentster
[06:50:00] <XXCoder> trentster: I was talking about website you linked, grunblau
[06:50:01] <archivist> he means on the website
[06:50:32] <XXCoder> guys if you want, here is "url" javascript:(function(){var%20newSS,%20styles='*%20{%20background:%20black%20!%20important;%20color:%20grey%20!important%20}%20:link,%20:link%20*%20{%20color:%20#0000EE%20!important%20}%20:visited,%20:visited%20*%20{%20color:%20#551A8B%20!important%20}';%20if(document.createStyleSheet)%20{%20document.createStyleSheet("javascript:'"+styles+"'");%20}%20else%20{%20newSS=document.createElement('link');%20ne
[06:50:33] <XXCoder> wSS.rel='stylesheet';%20newSS.href='data:text/css,'+escape(styles);%20document.getElementsByTagName("head")[0].appendChild(newSS);%20}%20})();
[06:50:44] <XXCoder> set it as favorite and you can blacken any site
[06:50:46] <archivist> only as square as the table it is put on
[06:50:55] <XXCoder> texts will be inversed too, but not pictures
[06:51:14] <trentster> XXCoder: website works fine for me
[06:51:26] <XXCoder> trentster: you got good eyes then
[06:51:42] <Sync> looks fine to me too
[06:52:08] <XXCoder> my eyes while good on sharp view and night vision, sucks on contrast apparently
[06:52:24] <archivist> needlessly poor text contrast
[06:52:30] <XXCoder> indeed
[06:52:43] <Sync> could be worse
[06:52:49] <Sync> yellow on white or something
[06:53:00] <XXCoder> I cant tell you guys how many times I use "url" above to fix websites
[06:53:04] <XXCoder> Sync: nah
[06:53:07] <XXCoder> blue on red
[06:53:13] <XXCoder> or other way
[06:53:16] <Sync> blue on red is pretty good
[06:53:34] <XXCoder> I can read blue on red but painful for eyes lol
[06:53:45] <XXCoder> red-green sucks too lol
[06:53:46] <anomynous_> archivist, if i made a linear thing of plastic and some stuff, what kind of tolerance should i use minimum to make sure it doesn't jam or something.
[06:53:51] <trentster> XXCoder: my eyes actually suck - I have one eye that had a corneal flap disintegrate from bad lasik in my twenties
[06:54:07] <trentster> but I wear special lenses and I do see rather well with them
[06:54:25] <XXCoder> trentster: ow. my eyes actually is very good for my age apparently, its just contrast that sucks
[06:54:26] <archivist> anomynous_, I wouldnt go there :)
[06:54:30] <anomynous_> ;D
[06:54:40] <XXCoder> I cant see anythinbg if car lights is too bright and passes my car
[06:54:49] <archivist> not for machining of any sort
[06:54:49] <XXCoder> I have many workgrounds
[06:55:24] <XXCoder> that giant machine is so cheap I can by 5 for price of that tiny machine that comes with solid gold dilio
[06:56:47] <trentster> XXCoder: there ya go
https://monosnap.com/file/tcw3x8umqBU4gMuJKAvrwEwrMEASzK
[06:56:50] <trentster> better?
[06:57:00] <XXCoder> I already read site
[06:58:07] <trentster> archivist: so no opinions on it?
[06:58:22] <archivist> I wonder if he uses cropped edges for the rails or machines them
[06:58:54] <trentster> archivist: does youtube work on your computer?
[06:59:09] <archivist> yes but
[06:59:10] <trentster> I recall you saying something previously about disabling stuff
[06:59:33] <archivist> I now dont get annoying ads on ebay :)
[06:59:42] <trentster> Platform CNC Kit Assembly | Base, Part 1
http://abn.me/pcnc1
[06:59:43] <trentster> Platform CNC Kit Assembly | Base, Part 2
http://abn.me/pcnc2
[06:59:43] <trentster> Platform CNC Kit Assembly | Gantry, Part 1
http://abn.me/pcnc3
[06:59:43] <trentster> Platform CNC Kit Assembly | Gantry, Part 2
http://abn.me/pcnc4
[06:59:43] <trentster> Platform CNC Kit Assembly | Z Axis
http://abn.me/pcnc5
[06:59:54] <trentster> There is a neat build link for you
[06:59:54] <archivist> or anywhere using that advertisers url
[07:00:56] <archivist> xchat does not see those as links
[07:01:10] <XXCoder> it works fine here
[07:01:21] <XXCoder> hexchat which is offshoot of xchat
[07:01:51] <trentster> its not an advertisers url, its my own link shortening service I setup. I hate sharing long url's they are messy
[07:02:11] <XXCoder> whats wrong with many short services like goo.gl?
[07:05:26] <trentster> nothing really, just not as flexible / useful as mine - for me at least ;-)
[07:05:31] <XXCoder> cool
[07:07:26] <archivist> trentster, you might have an odd white space
[07:07:56] <trentster> archivist: where?
[07:09:03] <archivist> just before the http
[07:09:03] <trentster> you still having issues clicking on links?
[07:09:25] <archivist> it is an a0 not a 20
[07:09:30] <XXCoder> archivist: I dont see any special charactor?
[07:09:33] <trentster> http://abn.me/pcnc1
[07:09:33] <trentster> http://abn.me/pcnc2
[07:09:33] <trentster> http://abn.me/pcnc3
[07:09:33] <trentster> http://abn.me/pcnc4
[07:09:34] <trentster> http://abn.me/pcnc5
[07:09:48] <archivist> I know how to cut and paste :)
[07:10:01] <trentster> :P phew
[07:10:05] <archivist> just telling you about a bug
[07:10:22] <trentster> I had this mental image of you using this 1980's square tower PC thing ;-)
[07:10:39] <archivist> a tower yes
[07:13:18] <archivist> you probably used an instead of a plain space chr
[07:13:45] <trentster> yeah - I dunno, it was a cut and paste of the YouTube titles verbatim
[07:16:19] <anomynous_> trentster, do you track how many people click your links?
[07:17:01] <XXCoder> of course he did heh
[07:17:04] <XXCoder> so simple
[07:22:21] <trentster> anomynous_: The software I use can do that of course its a open source project called
http://yourls.org/
[07:22:51] <XXCoder> nice
[07:23:52] <jthornton> anyone have an idea how to program an applet for the panel on linux?
[07:24:05] <jthornton> google keeps showing up java
[07:25:33] <jthornton> I found something
[07:32:25] <archivist> the thing I dislike about url shorteners is they can be to bad urls and I want to know where the end url is
[07:34:29] <MikkoP> jthornton: Applets are Java programs so that's probably why :)
[07:34:29] <trentster> archivist: you can use Curl to check where it redirects before using them in a browser
[07:34:51] <archivist> trentster, too much work easier to ignore
[07:34:52] <MikkoP> trentster: Quite a lot of work
[07:35:01] <MikkoP> too slow ;(
[07:35:44] <trentster> hah - well I did paste the youtube link as well :P - for the more paranoid folks
[07:36:11] <archivist> a lot of better end urls have a shorter form to get there
[07:36:34] <trentster> I just use the short forms for myself, I can remember them - so if I am at a friends house and want to show them something I can just recall it directly
[07:37:17] <anomynous_> smart fixture
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BLD4dFoXC7o
[07:37:56] <XXCoder> anomynous_: I remember that video
[07:38:00] <XXCoder> pretty awesome
[07:49:37] <MikkoP> Starting to look like a CNC:
http://i.imgur.com/qhv004P.png :D
[07:50:15] <XXCoder> looks like you moved motor to side of gantry
[07:50:30] <XXCoder> looks definitely rigid
[07:51:54] <XXCoder> though you still need to change part that connects X screw nut to gantry
[07:51:56] <MikkoP> It was there before but I moved the horizontal beam backwards. Because the ballscrew + motor combo can't fit between the vertical supports I'd need to cut out a hole in the support
[07:52:09] <XXCoder> still thin and long
[07:52:38] <XXCoder> since theres now a gap ypu could use a beam to cross and make gantry "square"
[07:52:45] <MikkoP> Yea. I could use 50x50 mm steel box section for that but I worry this thing is getting too heavy for the motors
[07:52:59] <XXCoder> nema23s?
[07:53:03] <MikkoP> Yea
[07:53:36] <MikkoP> They are 300 Ncm or 425 oz in for you others :D
[07:53:51] <XXCoder> forgot what mine are lol
[07:53:52] <archivist> check max weight for the rails
[07:53:56] <trentster> MikkoP: why is the gantry so high? are you planning on milling huge material?
[07:54:00] <XXCoder> mines probably wont move anything lol
[07:54:41] <MikkoP> trentster: No but I'm making the drill bit removable so I can replace it with a 3D printing head and use it as a printer too :D
[07:56:51] <MikkoP> archivist: I don't see any mentions of that on the eBay page but there's something about loads on the blocks. 774 kgf of dynamic and 1180 kgf static.
[08:03:20] <XXCoder> MikkoP: can always move to nem34 for X
[08:03:29] <XXCoder> X is one axis that has to carry all others
[08:04:10] <MikkoP> XXCoder: I ordered the motors already so I'm going with these. If needed I'll change the frame
[08:04:49] <XXCoder> cool
[08:05:39] <MikkoP> Great, the ballbearings I ordered from eBay seem to have sold out even though there were a lot of them available when I ordered them. Now it says only three were sold. The seller took them out. And now it also says the seller hasn't specified any shipping methods to Finland. I wonder what happens to my order, it hasn't been marked as shipped yet
[08:07:41] <XXCoder> thats odd
[08:07:44] <archivist> MikkoP, try to find an original maker of that rail typr
[08:07:46] <MikkoP> I'm always a little scared to order from eBay. I usually go with products that have a lot of sold units and a lot of them available. I also use sellers that have good ratings but...
[08:08:37] <archivist> I get ebay crap when it suits me to have cheaper or secondhand real
[08:09:17] <XXCoder> MikkoP: I have seen BIG sellers at other site fall apart
[08:09:21] <XXCoder> it happens
[08:09:26] <archivist> some second hand bargains are real :)
[08:09:42] <MikkoP> archivist: eBay listings just say unbranded
[08:11:15] <MikkoP> XXCoder: Thankfully I used PayPal and eBay even has this money back quarantee. I've once dealt with PayPal about this kind of situation and it only took 8 hours after I sent the message that I saw my money on my bank account again.
[08:21:09] <Sync> trentster: I'm liking the design design but mechanically it is shitty
[08:27:47] <trentster> Sync: how so?
[08:28:13] <trentster> from a tolerance perspective cause of backlash?
[08:28:37] <trentster> by the fact that ballscrews were not used?
[08:28:42] <Sync> no real linear slides and as always the gantry sides are lacking reinforcement
[08:28:49] <Sync> he obviously thought about it
[08:28:55] <Sync> but they need to be box section
[08:29:38] <archivist> as a wood router it is probably reasonable
[08:30:12] <archivist> no dirt protection for the rails in that application though
[08:32:44] <MikkoP> Are you talking about this one I'm designing here?
[08:33:05] <archivist> no that orange day glow thing
[08:33:33] <MikkoP> Didn't know if Sync had said something earlier when I was gone.
[08:33:36] <archivist> MikkoP, something for you to think about too :)
[08:34:14] <archivist> hide rails under some protection
[08:34:40] <Sync> and you should close the ends of your boxes
[08:34:54] <Sync> that increases torsional rigidity dramatically
[08:35:18] <MikkoP> Yea I'm going to have something that protects them from dirt. I was also thinking about adding a pipe to connect a vacuum cleaner to. This way most of the dirt gets sucked up
[08:35:48] <MikkoP> Sync: That's true too, I will weld steel plates in the end
[08:37:43] <MikkoP> I think this would be good for the bottom axis but still worried about weight:
http://i.imgur.com/rYulF9f.png
[08:40:16] <archivist> oops, that has a nasty twist flex due to the single ball screw
[08:41:07] <MikkoP> So there should be one on each side?
[08:41:16] <archivist> there is a reason better gantries have two screws moving the gantry along the bed
[08:42:20] <MikkoP> That requires a fourth motor too
[08:42:57] <archivist> is you push against the gantry at one side it rocks and bends the screw underneath
[08:43:02] <archivist> is/if
[08:43:46] <archivist> to the limit of the gantry stiffness on the slides
[08:44:05] <MikkoP> What do you mean if I push one side?
[08:44:39] <archivist> along the axis of the gantry support rails
[08:45:14] <archivist> eg cutting force when the spindle is far left or right
[08:45:39] <MikkoP> But doesn't the X axis rails prevent that?
[08:46:02] <archivist> nothing is completely solid
[08:47:25] <archivist> as you rotate the gantry, the side rails bend inwards as a spring
[08:48:20] <archivist> add spreaders between the support tubes to make it stiffer
[08:48:52] <archivist> that orange thing had the spreaders if you watched it
[08:50:17] <MikkoP> Well nothings completely straight and stiff. The thing is what is within tolerances.
[08:50:47] <MikkoP> And for the rails, if I use supported rails as in the picture wouldn't that reduce any bending significantly?
[08:50:53] <archivist> it will make one of the ally extrusion things look like rubber :)
[08:51:09] <SpeedEvil> If something is straight and stiff for more than 4 hours, consult a physician.
[08:51:19] <MikkoP> SpeedEvil: haha :D
[08:51:23] <archivist> stop taking that tablet
[08:52:16] <MikkoP> Where was that orange thing?
[08:56:34] <MikkoP> archivist: Did you mean adding spreaders to the bottom?
[08:57:47] <archivist> MikkoP, after a few minutes of
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_s8dfMKvmJQ
[08:58:14] <archivist> the black web between the extrusions
[08:58:49] <archivist> probably also support the base board
[08:58:54] <SpeedEvil> As a random point.
[08:59:09] <SpeedEvil> Screwing around with structures made from card can teach you a lot.
[08:59:27] <SpeedEvil> And give you feeling for how structures move, and can be stiffened
[09:00:08] <MikkoP> archivist: Black web? ummm
[09:07:33] <archivist> MikkoP, sorry 6 mins in on the base vid
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vvWhUu0sVVg
[09:11:02] <MikkoP> Ah yes, those. But in my design should I put them as low as possible?
[09:12:17] <MikkoP> well I can't really have them anywhere else because of how I move the X axis
[09:15:42] <MikkoP> archivist: Like this
http://i.imgur.com/6bZga8B.png
[09:17:13] <archivist> yup that helps
[09:18:55] <MikkoP> Uhh, just the steel box sections alone for this machine would weight 70 kg at this point :D
[09:20:27] <JT-Shop> 30°F this morning a bit warmer than yesterday
[09:20:59] <MikkoP> Almost 40 kg for the gantry
[09:23:23] <MikkoP> Have to go now, bye!
[10:14:04] <zeeshan|2> hi
[10:14:59] <archivist> lo
[10:15:26] <zeeshan|2> archivist: see my ingots?!? :D
[10:15:51] <archivist> nope
[10:16:17] <zeeshan|2> http://imgur.com/a/xHzVy
[10:16:26] <zeeshan|2> was a great way to spend saturday w/ friends
[10:16:58] <archivist> ingots of what
[10:17:03] <zeeshan|2> al
[10:17:13] <zeeshan|2> melted some of the scraps of 606
[10:17:15] <zeeshan|2> 1
[10:17:37] <archivist> test machine the result
[10:17:40] <zeeshan|2> i did!!
[10:17:58] <zeeshan|2> it chips like cast alumiunum parts on car
[10:18:01] <zeeshan|2> like intake manifolds/oil pans
[10:18:06] <archivist> and how long did the cutter last
[10:18:11] <zeeshan|2> no idea
[10:18:17] <zeeshan|2> im pretty sure most of the silicon floated up :)
[10:18:51] <zeeshan|2> i need a bigger ladle
[10:19:19] <archivist> I should show my lead ingots I made a "while" ago
[10:19:26] <zeeshan|2> show
[10:19:30] <zeeshan|2> ive been looking for lead
[10:19:33] <zeeshan|2> had to order from ebay
[10:19:36] <zeeshan|2> no one locally sells any
[10:19:38] <archivist> would have to find one!
[10:20:34] <archivist> made a plaster mould, lasted for about 7 ingots iirc, had writing on too
[10:20:47] <zeeshan|2> i want to make some hammers!
[10:21:35] <archivist> I scratched the hammer itch too
[10:22:16] <archivist> in the tool box
http://www.collection.archivist.info/archive/DJCPD/PD/2010/2010_07_27_tinware/IMG_0798.JPG
[10:23:15] <zeeshan|2> wher eis it!
[10:23:19] <zeeshan|2> i see maybe a round one
[10:23:57] <archivist> ball pein rear right
[10:24:10] <archivist> matchstick handle
[10:24:11] <zeeshan|2> oh
[10:24:14] <zeeshan|2> thats a baby tool
[10:24:17] <zeeshan|2> for a minion! :)
[10:24:52] <archivist> you need it for small locos
http://www.collection.archivist.info/archive/DJCPD/PD/2004/2004_05_08_7mm_loco/P1010109.JPG
[10:25:04] <archivist> better image of its head
[10:25:19] <zeeshan|2> wow
[10:25:20] <zeeshan|2> tiny stuff
[10:25:55] <archivist> was servicing that loco for someone
[10:27:08] <ReadError> archivist knew a guy
[10:27:12] <ReadError> he would take old batts
[10:27:19] <ReadError> and get the lead out of em
[10:28:04] <archivist> lead pipe from plumbing or roof work is better
[10:28:35] <archivist> modern car batteries have cadmium to annoy you
[10:31:11] <zeeshan|2> cadmium must be great for the body
[10:31:12] <zeeshan|2> :P
[10:34:45] <Tom_itx> ingots of gold.. i'd get excited
[10:36:43] <Tom_itx> i collected _some_ lead when they were moving some machines once that were leaded in and some cutoff from wing ballast
[10:37:24] <Tom_itx> made a pipe hammer with some of it ~70lb
[10:53:00] <zeeshan|2> NICE
[10:53:03] <zeeshan|2> i want that much lead!
[10:53:27] <JT-Shop> I have about 300lbs of lead
[10:53:35] <zeeshan|2> from where!!
[10:53:41] <zeeshan|2> its impossible to find here!
[10:57:29] <Jymmm> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GnD0gIaP_D4
[10:58:54] <Jymmm> are tire weights still lead?
[10:59:36] <CaptHindsight> Jymmm: yes
[11:00:03] <Jymmm> If so, I see a LOT of tire balancing neding to be done in zeeshan|2 area, especially around the mall parking lot =)
[11:00:48] <CaptHindsight> also a good way to generate tire balancing services for the local shops
[11:01:03] <Jymmm> archivist: What "Scale" is that pic?
[11:01:22] <Jymmm> CaptHindsight: I get free balancing for life, so eh.
[11:03:59] <CaptHindsight> http://bobsmodeltrains.com/Train%20Images/Train-Scales.gif if the pencil is an average pencil vs 1" dia
[11:04:41] <CaptHindsight> my final answer is N gauge
[11:05:22] <Jymmm> ah
[11:06:49] <CaptHindsight> does anyone under 60 still have hobbies like model trains
[11:07:22] <Tom_itx> hah, that's doubtful
[11:07:42] <Jymmm> Heh
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AqF0Q3-3YW8
[11:08:47] <CaptHindsight> hobbies in general disappeared with wages years ago, but I feel like I've walked into a time machine when I find a real hobby shop loaded with model trains and parts
[11:09:36] <archivist> Jymmm, which one....the one with a tape measure?
[11:11:22] <archivist> heh what a name for a car maker phanomobile
[11:12:26] <Jymmm> archivist: The one next to the pencil
http://www.collection.archivist.info/archive/DJCPD/PD/2004/2004_05_08_7mm_loco/P1010109.JPG
[11:13:42] <archivist> Jymmm, this has the ruler next to the tools
http://www.collection.archivist.info/archive/DJCPD/PD/2010/2010_07_27_tinware/IMG_0798.JPG
[11:13:46] <aventtini6> hello guys
[11:13:53] <aventtini6> zeeshan are you on?
[11:16:02] <cncbasher> my model trains are 3 1/2" minimum
[11:16:30] <zeeshan|2> hi
[11:16:46] <cncbasher> but i hit the mark at 60 lol
[11:17:09] <t12> mornin
[11:17:10] <CaptHindsight> cncbasher: HO?
[11:17:47] <CaptHindsight> cncbasher: or is that 3 1/2" the track gauge?
[11:18:11] <archivist> outdoor track size
[11:18:16] <cncbasher> yup
[11:19:01] <cncbasher> something you can get hold of , rather than put in your pocket
[11:19:55] <archivist> actually this shows the track too
http://www.collection.archivist.info/searchv13.php?searchstr=7mm
[11:20:36] <cncbasher> dont think my eyes could zoom in that far
[11:20:39] <archivist> the owner was a welder so this was his portable track for hotel room use
[11:22:30] <CaptHindsight> heh LGB model trains, my how acronyms change over the years :)
[11:23:15] <cncbasher> i'm too old to remember the acronyms
[11:23:32] <CaptHindsight> http://www.onlytrains.com/model/railroad/WLGB.html
[11:25:18] <CaptHindsight> my brother has HO track running though over half of his house
[11:26:42] <Tom_itx> could be displayed nice on a shelf along the walls
[11:26:48] <Jymmm> A track of Ho's... interesting
[11:27:52] <cncbasher> tom_itx> have you a 7i90 config available hal ini etc
[11:28:02] <Tom_itx> yes
[11:28:15] <cncbasher> would you be so kind as to email me it
[11:28:30] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/cnc/configs/sherline/
[11:28:41] <Tom_itx> that's the one i use
[11:28:48] <Tom_itx> steppers
[11:29:17] <cncbasher> great thanks
[11:29:29] <Tom_itx> CONFIG="num_encoders=2 num_stepgens=3 num_pwmgens=1 sserial_port_0=20xxxxxx"
[11:29:35] <Tom_itx> that's all you need now
[11:29:50] <Tom_itx> since the bitfile loads on the board
[11:30:00] <cncbasher> i presume the parport address too
[11:30:06] <Tom_itx> yes
[11:30:34] <Tom_itx> those files haven't been cleaned up...
[11:30:49] <Tom_itx> lots of commented code from switching boards around etc
[11:32:07] <Tom_itx> # only the 7i43 needs this, but it doesnt hurt the others
[11:32:07] <Tom_itx> # # # loadrt probe_parport
[11:32:11] <Tom_itx> in the hal
[11:32:18] <Tom_itx> but i'm not using that either
[11:34:11] <cncbasher> thanks
[11:34:38] <Tom_itx> the bitfile in the subdir may not be accurate
[11:34:50] <cncbasher> thats ok
[11:44:35] <MikkoP> What if I used aluminum instead of steel for the frame? Easier for the motors
[11:44:44] <MikkoP> The base can still be steel but the moving parts
[11:46:51] <__rob> anyone got any thoughts about putting something like a Tormach PCNC1100 on a mezzanine floor ?
[11:47:09] <__rob> the floor is rated for the weight, but just wondering if that is going to create all sorts of problems
[11:47:54] <cncbasher> probabable vibration / movement
[11:48:28] <cncbasher> or bolt it to the beams etc
[11:51:27] <__rob> right
[11:52:35] <__rob> starting to think its a bad idea. There are zero pictures on google of machines like that on raised floors
[11:53:01] <cncbasher> yep for a reason
[11:53:07] <cncbasher> it moves
[11:53:17] <cncbasher> so your cuts are not stable
[11:53:39] <t12> i suppose it depends in if the machine design depends on the floor for rigidity
[11:54:02] <cncbasher> i have all my machines bolted to concrete plynths
[11:54:17] <__rob> well thats what I am thinking. the actual mill is all as one piece
[11:54:37] <t12> can always put it on a plate
[11:54:52] <__rob> yea, was going to lay a 1/2" steel plate or something
[11:54:58] <__rob> and maybe put it on that
[11:55:08] <cncbasher> even leaning on a machine can put your tolerances way out
[11:55:24] <t12> i think it depends on what you need etc
[11:55:40] <t12> my lathe is on 100 year old wood floor and wobbles all over
[11:55:55] <t12> on sheet metal stand
[11:56:08] <t12> impacts surface i suppose
[11:56:29] <t12> just depends in what you expect out of the system?
[11:56:46] <__rob> well I'd like to achieve the rated 0.001" tolerance always
[11:58:01] <__rob> its one of those. without doing it I don't know how bad things will be, but I don't want to do it without having some idea if its going to be ok or not
[11:58:18] <t12> do yoy haveban alternative location
[11:58:39] <__rob> I do, but its a problem for a few reasons, but if there is no other option there is a concrete floor
[11:59:14] <t12> thats usually ideal
[11:59:21] <cncbasher> for those tolerances it wants bolting down to concrete
[12:00:51] <__rob> alright, concrete its gonna have to be
[12:02:15] <__rob> thanks for the advice!
[12:03:08] <archivist> it is easy to show with a level or DTI how bendy machines are
[12:03:49] <__rob> you mean just placing it on the table ?
[12:04:22] <archivist> yes and then leaning on almost any part
[12:04:27] <cncbasher> even worse on a table
[12:04:41] <cncbasher> even touchinng it with a finger
[12:04:50] <archivist> just walk across a floor and watch the level
[12:05:22] <__rob> I'm not so worried about the machining bending if its on a 1/2" steel plate
[12:05:27] <t12> first you need the expensive level...
[12:05:35] <__rob> more any potential vibration through the floor etc..
[12:05:38] <archivist> engineers level, not builders level
[12:05:43] <cncbasher> if the machine bends , so does your machining
[12:05:56] <t12> wood floor actually can dampen vibration depending
[12:06:15] <__rob> it would be that steel plate ontop of a thick ply floor
[12:06:28] <t12> .5 in playe bends more than youd think
[12:06:35] <t12> over a meter or two
[12:06:39] <t12> plate
[12:07:00] <cncbasher> put it this way , i would never put a machine on a wood floor
[12:07:13] <t12> but would warp and likely be stably warped after a while
[12:07:37] <__rob> http://www.tormach.com/uploads/738/UM10087_PCNC1100_Operators_Manual_1013A_web-pdf.html
[12:07:41] <t12> archivist: got that pic of the schaublin on wood floor?
[12:07:54] <__rob> so p16 is how it comes
[12:08:10] <__rob> p15, I have that stand too
[12:08:24] <cncbasher> i have a lathe thats about 3 tons , and it moved
[12:09:22] <cncbasher> but depends on if it's a production machine, and has to meet tolerances
[12:09:46] <cncbasher> if it is then theirs no other way than concrete
[12:09:55] <MikkoP> Is it important to push the shaft all the way in in a coupling?
[12:10:11] <archivist> the base for the schaublin made it ok but the floor made it impossible to use a level easily we were on a 20ft span too
[12:10:26] <archivist> http://www.collection.archivist.info/archive/DJCPD/PD/2008/2008_10_07_Richards_of_Burton_clockworks/P1010232.JPG
[12:10:33] <cncbasher> mikkop > what type of coupling
[12:10:57] <__rob> thats on a raised floor archivist ?
[12:11:03] <cncbasher> so mong as it's resonabley past any screw or clamp point then no
[12:11:09] <MikkoP> http://www.ebay.com/itm/110897205808?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
[12:11:21] <__rob> nice looking bit of kit
[12:11:44] <cncbasher> if it's covering say the solid area then fine
[12:12:00] <archivist> schaublin is above
http://www.collection.archivist.info/archive/DJCPD/PD/2008/2008_10_07_Richards_of_Burton_clockworks/P1010227.JPG
[12:12:17] <MikkoP> cncbasher: Ok.
[12:12:31] <t12> for me moving over a foot moves .0001/10in level a div
[12:12:34] <archivist> __rob, yes it was in an old wooden church
[12:13:09] <__rob> thats good to know
[12:13:17] <archivist> boss dug out below and added beams to support the floor
[12:13:17] <__rob> this is 1/6 of the weight
[12:13:18] <cncbasher> MikkoP:they are meant to cope with a slight offset axialy , but try to get them in line as much as possible
[12:14:24] <archivist> __rob, average wooden floor will send a good level end to end when you walk about
[12:15:05] <MikkoP> cncbasher: Yea
[12:15:19] <__rob> the floor is ply on top of steels
[12:15:54] <CaptHindsight> it's like a drum skin
[12:15:59] <archivist> all metal and wood are springy to an extent
[12:16:09] <__rob> http://www.pdcconsultancy.co.uk/images/image1_large.jpg
[12:16:12] <__rob> something like that
[12:16:15] <__rob> not that tho
[12:16:25] <t12> ill also go out on a limb with
[12:16:42] <t12> that the 1100 stand might limit more than the floor?
[12:16:56] <archivist> __rob, make sure you are within design load for the floor
[12:17:31] <CaptHindsight> I think my floors are at least 10" reinforced concrete and surface treated with sodium silicate
[12:17:41] <archivist> I dont think anyone did calcs for the church floor :)
[12:17:45] <CaptHindsight> almost too slippery
[12:18:04] <archivist> I did have to jack up one beam
[12:18:38] <CaptHindsight> I can soap the floor with a mop and slide 5 ton machines around with a walk behind forklift
[12:18:44] <archivist> where I was working has sunk over an inch
[12:19:27] <__rob> almost temping to just get 4 vertical steels right underneath where its going
[12:21:42] <__rob> nightmare!
[12:22:08] <CaptHindsight> __rob: is the plywood placed directly in contact with steel?
[12:22:18] <__rob> yea
[12:22:42] <__rob> think so
[12:23:42] <Magnifikus> so if i run external stepgen (with pulsewidth) why should i not use 2ms servothread time?
[12:24:03] <CaptHindsight> flat steel floor with no gaps or does the plywood span between steel supports every 30cm or so?
[12:24:41] <CaptHindsight> Magnifikus: why not?
[12:25:19] <Magnifikus> anything speaking against it was the question
[12:25:32] <Magnifikus> just want to relax the poor pi abit
[12:25:36] <CaptHindsight> Magnifikus: Mesa moved it over with the hm2_eth cards
[12:26:04] <CaptHindsight> have you taken a look at how it works over ethernet?
[12:26:05] <Magnifikus> btw after some minor bugs its running cool now
[12:26:13] <Magnifikus> sure its not ethercat?
[12:26:42] <CaptHindsight> it's not
[12:27:04] <__rob> CaptHindsight, plywood over steel crossbeams
[12:27:30] <CaptHindsight> __rob: ah yeah then it's like a drum skin
[12:27:34] <Magnifikus> yeah with 2ms now the stepfrequency is much more stable
[12:28:45] <CaptHindsight> __rob: are you in a rental unit?
[12:34:15] <__rob> its a workshop
[12:34:18] <__rob> its not mine though
[12:34:21] <__rob> which is the problem with the space
[12:34:26] <__rob> and where my stuff goes
[12:35:01] <__rob> its really high, mabye 3 stories, just not much floor space
[12:43:25] <CaptHindsight> Magnifikus:
http://comments.gmane.org/gmane.linux.distributions.emc.devel/13671
[12:44:41] <CaptHindsight> Magnifikus: why I mentioned testing an ARM SOC with an integrated ethernet controller
[12:47:15] <CaptHindsight> which leaves imx6, a couple of Rockchip and some Allwinner
[12:49:52] <CaptHindsight> and some pricier variants like the Tegra
[12:59:33] <Magnifikus> hmm dunno
[12:59:51] <Magnifikus> next step for me would pulling the motion control closer not pushing it over ethernet
[13:00:49] <archivist> too much maths in that to move to hardware
[13:03:40] <CaptHindsight> you've reached the border of Linuxcnc then
[13:04:19] <CaptHindsight> other projects have put it closed to the motors and away from the PC/cpu
[13:04:25] <CaptHindsight> closed/closer
[14:30:10] <t12> https://www.dropbox.com/s/0bhm2j9f049t0vo/2015-12-06%2011.50.19.jpg?dl=0 dang thats a helluva peristaltic pump
[14:58:19] <Magnifikus> http://snag.gy/fk0o0.jpg
[14:58:27] <Magnifikus> totaly random
[14:58:37] <Magnifikus> during linear motion joint errors :/
[14:59:16] <Magnifikus> looks like overcompensation somehow
[15:00:51] <Magnifikus> http://snag.gy/lxMZ4.jpg but this spikes are everywhere
[15:14:21] <cpresser> Magnifikus: how does axis.1.pos-fb look? does it also have some spikes?
[15:14:42] <Magnifikus> need to check tomorrow
[15:14:49] <Magnifikus> just shut the stuff down in restroom :)
[15:15:30] <Magnifikus> will narrow down and add some debug pins to my stepgen
[15:15:45] <Magnifikus> but the stepfrequency is super clean on scope
[15:15:59] <Magnifikus> and the spi is errorfree (got crc32 over data)
[15:18:12] <Magnifikus> but this spikes look bad
[15:18:18] <Magnifikus> work for tomorrow :)
[15:27:31] <Magnifikus> but the spike in the other direction is the braking after the error i guess
[16:12:25] <Deejay> gn8
[16:50:56] <MrSunshine> https://scontent-ams2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpf1/v/t34.0-12/12346758_10153755846913648_82206625_n.jpg?oh=1626e1c13784bda21cefadc91c5a1717&oe=5666E31A
[16:51:03] <MrSunshine> well .. did not expect that to happend
[16:51:10] <MrSunshine> or i did . .but i ignored the warning signs :P
[16:51:38] <MrSunshine> https://scontent-ams2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xft1/v/t34.0-12/12358493_10153755856343648_256831546_n.jpg?oh=4365b18eda6660b43ed57a7f2b6e0563&oe=56663170 ... :P
[16:52:59] <andypugh> That’s one way to make shavung brushes, I suuppose.
[16:53:19] <PetefromTn_> sucked that shit up quick huh ;)
[16:53:33] <MrSunshine> just heard a bang .. then everything died
[16:54:08] <MrSunshine> lucky it was in the beginning of a sheet so i can use the remaining of the sheet for something else :P
[16:54:16] <andypugh> Never a good feeling. Especially if accompanied by smoke and a dark brown smell of fried electronics.
[16:54:42] <MrSunshine> thats what the breakers are for .. or .. the vfd should have cut of but it didnt :P
[17:04:49] <SpeedEvil> Why did it die?
[17:05:03] <SpeedEvil> I mean - why did it stop - it's clearly pulled out the collet
[17:18:42] <XXCoder> MrSunshine: ow
[17:18:50] <XXCoder> in least it wasnt your beard ;)
[17:23:31] <MrSunshine> hehe =)
[17:23:56] <MrSunshine> nah the colet was sound in the spindle .. i removed it to be able to remove the bristles =)
[17:26:56] <malcom2073> Pretty long bristles you got there heh
[17:27:08] <SpeedEvil> ah
[17:27:13] <XXCoder> well hung bristles
[17:27:27] <MrSunshine> malcom2073: yeah .. cut them down a bit now :P
[17:27:59] <MrSunshine> was nice with a new collet in the machine .. vibrations are gooone
[17:28:14] <XXCoder> aw no good vibrations lol
[17:28:15] <MrSunshine> and the collet locks in the spindle taper so i have to turn the nut out then give it a nudge to get it lose
[17:28:43] <Sync> doesn't the nut grab it properly?
[17:28:54] <Sync> usually it will come out with the nut
[17:28:54] <MrSunshine> yes ?
[17:29:02] <MrSunshine> yes it comes out with the nut
[17:29:22] <MrSunshine> but when nut is losened i need to turn it like half a turn then give it another nudge to release the collet from the taper
[17:29:27] <MrSunshine> the old one did not lock at all
[17:30:06] <XXCoder> I wonder why you need to do half turn to loosen collet from taper
[17:32:30] <MrSunshine> sigh
[17:32:51] <MrSunshine> its a taper .. the taper locks if it fits .. thats why the nut has a capture edge in it
[17:33:03] <XXCoder> cool
[17:35:49] <Sync> yeah
[17:35:55] <Sync> that's normal
[17:36:02] <Sync> and shows that the tapers mate well
[17:36:23] <XXCoder> does same apply to tapers on dril press?
[17:36:26] <XXCoder> drill
[17:37:10] <MrSunshine> morse tapers should lock like a SOB
[17:37:22] <MrSunshine> if they dont then they are damaged =)
[17:37:37] <malcom2073> Dril press tapers typically don't have a nut locking them either afaik
[17:37:44] <malcom2073> Unless they're intended for reversing
[17:40:54] <MrSunshine> morse tapers does not hold good when stuff vibrates tho =)
[17:41:07] <MrSunshine> my little X1 has morse taper and a drawbar to keep the taper engaged
[17:43:07] <Sync> that's common on MT mills
[17:54:24] <shaun415> hello
[17:54:40] <shaun415> would it be possible to control some stpper motors with a GRBL and linuxcnc?
[17:54:41] <zeeshan|2> MrSunshine: drawbar!
[17:54:48] <shaun415> can you script for linux cnc in python?
[17:54:56] <malcom2073> shaun415: Yes, and yes, and yes
[17:55:04] <malcom2073> You can control steppers with grbl or linuxcnc, and you can script for linuxcnc in python
[17:55:12] <shaun415> AWESOME
[17:55:21] <shaun415> well i got a grbl
[17:55:28] <shaun415> what would I use with that
[17:55:42] <malcom2073> That is a (crappy) alternative to linuxcnc
[17:55:49] <shaun415> its crappy?
[17:55:52] * MrSunshine draws his bar and smacks zeeshan|2 over the head with it
[17:55:54] <zeeshan|2> youre an alternative to linuxcnc malcom
[17:55:58] <malcom2073> grbl is basically marlin
[17:56:08] <shaun415> the grbl sheild I mean
[17:56:10] <malcom2073> Except for generic CNC
[17:56:30] <shaun415> gsheild?
[17:56:31] <malcom2073> shaun415: the grbl shield is meant to be used with grbl firmware installed on an arduino
[17:56:38] <shaun415> ah ok
[17:56:45] <shaun415> is that usable?
[17:56:51] <malcom2073> grbl firmware is basically the equivalant to marlin, you send it gcode over USB serial,and it moves your machine
[17:56:52] <malcom2073> usable? Sure
[17:56:54] <shaun415> my dumb teammates bought it without asking me
[17:57:04] <malcom2073> Oh for your battery changer thing?
[17:57:09] <shaun415> well I need to python script it..
[17:57:14] <shaun415> thats quite important
[17:57:29] <malcom2073> You can have python send gcode commands, look at the source code for pronterface
[17:57:31] <malcom2073> that's what pronterface does
[17:57:36] <shaun415> Ok
[17:57:37] <malcom2073> zeeshan|2: Shup foo :P
[17:57:41] <shaun415> so i can use the grbl
[17:58:02] <malcom2073> Sure, if this is for your battery changer, that should work fine
[17:58:08] <shaun415> ok cool, yes it is
[17:58:47] <shaun415> thanks malcom2073
[17:59:26] <andypugh> LinuxCNC isn’t going to be part of this system. But that’s fine, what works, works.
[18:00:02] <shaun415> yeah, i just need to be able to have python send commands
[18:00:08] <shaun415> and move the motors
[18:00:11] <malcom2073> from what I've read of linuxcnc, classicladder would probably be able to do what you need as well, but really linuxcnc is a level of complexity you don't need
[18:00:19] <malcom2073> As an alternative to python
[18:00:31] <shaun415> nice
[18:00:38] <shaun415> grbl and python then
[18:01:34] <Sync> zeeshan|2: invent a FEM solver that calculates quicker!
[18:01:35] <andypugh> Surely all the cool kids are using Golang rather than Python now :-)
[18:01:37] <malcom2073> I'd stick with that for your project really, it's simple enough that grbl should work fine, make one motor X, one Y, and one Z, and go to town
[18:01:41] <malcom2073> andypugh: +1
[18:01:52] <malcom2073> shaun415: Why are you using something as outdated as python anyway?
[18:02:01] <shaun415> its outdated?
[18:02:28] <malcom2073> Yeah, it's pretty old school
[18:02:29] <shaun415> and because pixhawk has a python api
[18:02:41] <andypugh> It’s not cool to use any programming language with more than 100 users, or more than 500,000 lines written :-)
[18:02:52] <shaun415> lol
[18:03:05] <malcom2073> pixhawk has apis for almost every language
[18:03:08] <zeeshan|2> Sync: fem solver
[18:03:11] <zeeshan|2> is easy peezy
[18:03:12] <shaun415> nah
[18:03:17] <shaun415> just android, java and python
[18:03:20] <zeeshan|2> butttttttt, its the meshing that gets nasty
[18:03:22] <malcom2073> Yeah, I wrote a generator for Qt bindings :)
[18:03:33] <malcom2073> And it by default has c++ bindings
[18:03:43] <malcom2073> There are also c#, vb.net, etc
[18:03:56] <zeeshan|2> i have a nickname for all of you btw
[18:04:04] <zeeshan|2> would you like to see how i view you all?
[18:04:11] <malcom2073> zeeshan|2: Do we care?
[18:04:12] <malcom2073> :P
[18:04:14] <shaun415> no
[18:04:18] <zeeshan|2> "dr andy 'biker' pugh"
[18:04:32] <zeeshan|2> malcom "im a programmer" 2073
[18:04:44] <shaun415> me?
[18:04:49] <malcom2073> heh
[18:04:52] <zeeshan|2> sync 'i love mitsubishi!"
[18:05:00] <malcom2073> What about CaptHindsight?
[18:05:01] <zeeshan|2> shaun "question guy" 415
[18:05:04] <shaun415> lol!
[18:05:15] <zeeshan|2> Capt "Polymer" Hindsight
[18:05:22] <zeeshan|2> :D
[18:05:35] <shaun415> zeeshan "the insulter" |2
[18:05:44] <zeeshan|2> how is this insults
[18:05:46] <malcom2073> zee 'move-out-while-you-know-everything' shan
[18:05:46] <zeeshan|2> its how i view you
[18:05:56] <andypugh> Jymmm “Weird and best ignored”
[18:05:56] <zeeshan|2> no i view myself as
[18:06:01] <zeeshan|2> andypugh: ROFL
[18:06:17] <zeeshan|2> zee "anti-tormach" shan
[18:06:29] <zeeshan|2> im seriously starting a t-shirt compaign
[18:06:35] <zeeshan|2> i hope you guys buy my anti tormach shirts
[18:06:51] <zeeshan|2> one shirt will be like this:
[18:06:54] <malcom2073> I like tormach, could never afford one, but I like what I've seen
[18:07:16] <zeeshan|2> a sun rise picture, with a rainbow made out of 7i77's
[18:07:22] <zeeshan|2> under it will say
[18:07:29] <zeeshan|2> "i saw the light"
[18:07:32] <zeeshan|2> :D
[18:07:48] <malcom2073> Except tomach uses 7i77's
[18:07:53] <malcom2073> so they'll think it's a pro-tormach shirt :P
[18:08:09] <zeeshan|2> next shirt -- ss of tormach interface "I created linuxcnc"
[18:08:11] <zeeshan|2> :D
[18:08:35] * zeeshan|2 is just a hater
[18:08:41] <malcom2073> zeeshan the hater
[18:09:03] <XXCoder> hater the zeeshan|2
[18:09:33] <zeeshan|2> the first time i came across a tormach was in college
[18:09:41] <malcom2073> So like, two weeks ago?
[18:09:44] <zeeshan|2> ill be honest, i was completely new to machining
[18:09:49] <zeeshan|2> nahh like i think 8 years now
[18:09:58] <zeeshan|2> i thought mach 3 looked bad ASS
[18:10:08] <zeeshan|2> we had to make 4 parts that had to fit together
[18:10:11] <zeeshan|2> 4 different groups
[18:10:21] <zeeshan|2> the parts ofcourse didnt fit together
[18:10:31] <zeeshan|2> but it was the first time i saw aluminum machining
[18:10:55] <zeeshan|2> (parts didnt fit together cause of nub g-code)
[18:11:24] <zeeshan|2> class had no cad software, you had to write g-code from scratch
[18:11:32] <XXCoder> yummy
[18:11:40] <SpeedEvil> Were there many spanging noises?
[18:12:27] <zeeshan|2> SpeedEvil: i think i put a 1.357
[18:12:31] <zeeshan|2> instead ot a 1.375
[18:12:37] <zeeshan|2> it was a long time ago, i dont remember
[18:12:39] <zeeshan|2> it was silly like that
[18:22:15] * Tom_itx wonders what his name is
[18:23:27] <SpeedEvil> Rapunzel?
[18:23:29] <zeeshan|2> Tom "Catia expert" Itx
[18:23:39] <Tom_itx> not yet
[18:23:43] <zeeshan|2> Speed "Walking dictionary" Evil
[18:24:13] <zeeshan|2> tom im kidding about yours
[18:24:16] <zeeshan|2> you already know yours
[18:24:22] <zeeshan|2> Tom "project manager" itx
[18:24:23] <zeeshan|2> :D
[18:25:21] <Tom_itx> i just like learning
[18:25:38] <zeeshan|2> good
[18:25:43] <zeeshan|2> better than playing video games :P
[18:25:52] <Tom_itx> i don't do that
[18:25:54] <andypugh> I spent today wiring and mounting parts:
https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/picihr1TDZpJAjUJA6KlBNMTjNZETYmyPJy0liipFm0?feat=directlink
[18:26:20] <andypugh> This is twice as big as the first box, and still probably should be bigger.
[18:26:21] <Tom_itx> andypugh did you get your brake resistor figured out?
[18:26:28] <Tom_itx> i assume that's what it was...
[18:27:17] <Tom_itx> looks nice n compact
[18:27:47] <zeeshan|2> what is this beautiful setup i see
[18:27:55] <zeeshan|2> massive relay :)
[18:27:58] <andypugh> Using Neutrik speaker connectors for the motor connections.
[18:28:36] <zeeshan|2> whats all this ethernet
[18:28:46] <Tom_itx> it's the new rage
[18:28:47] <andypugh> There are two SSRs under the RJ45 sockets which are under the Neutriks
[18:29:15] <zeeshan|2> what are those cards?
[18:29:19] <andypugh> 8i20
[18:29:35] <zeeshan|2> brushless servo drives
[18:29:36] <zeeshan|2> ah
[18:29:39] <Tom_itx> not too noisy there for them?
[18:29:49] <zeeshan|2> wheres the air flow!
[18:29:51] <andypugh> I think they will be making the noise
[18:30:17] <andypugh> Airflow is why I am thinking I might need more space
[18:30:22] <andypugh> But we will see
[18:30:49] <andypugh> The 8i20 outputs card temp to HAL, so it’s easy to monitor
[18:30:50] <Tom_itx> what's the enclosure from?
[18:30:52] <zeeshan|2> andypugh: youre using the serial interface
[18:30:56] <Tom_itx> or did you make it
[18:31:00] <zeeshan|2> that covers the a b c phase wires?
[18:31:14] <zeeshan|2> uvw
[18:31:15] <zeeshan|2> whatever :P
[18:31:30] <andypugh> It’s not fuly wired in the photo.
[18:31:54] <zeeshan|2> what made you go with a 8i20
[18:31:57] <andypugh> The main motor cables and their common-mode choke are missin
[18:31:59] <zeeshan|2> vs say a amc drive
[18:32:20] <andypugh> The 8i20 is a perfect for to resolvers
[18:32:28] <andypugh> (perfect fit)
[18:32:40] <zeeshan|2> i dont see any resolver inputs?
[18:32:49] <zeeshan|2> i guess they go to another card
[18:32:52] <zeeshan|2> and you talk over serial?
[18:33:22] <andypugh> To make the motor turn it is literally “net angle hm2_5i24.0.resolver.00.angle => hm2_5i24.0.8i20.0.0.angle
[18:33:50] <andypugh> Instant sinusoidal commutation.
[18:34:33] <XXCoder> is it tool that suck or is he using too high IPM?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7IEzhfKpAbE
[18:36:21] <XXCoder> or too low rpm
[18:37:30] <andypugh> The tool has no relief angle
[18:38:06] <andypugh> But I think his feed is too high, and his rpm
[18:38:38] <XXCoder> autocaptions are basically nonsense so no idea what he speaks lol\
[18:40:09] <andypugh> Are not the autocaptions always nonsense? I tried them on my video and it was convinced I was talking about wrinkled popes
[18:40:20] <XXCoder> lol not always but most times
[18:40:27] <CaptHindsight> why all the hubub about Tormach?
[18:40:27] <XXCoder> best I have ever seen is goverment 60s videos
[18:40:38] <XXCoder> maybe one word error out of 20
[18:40:43] <shaun415> hi
[18:40:47] <andypugh> I do have a voice that computers can basically not understand
[18:40:52] <t12> lol that fly cutter
[18:41:06] <XXCoder> andypugh: really I dont need exact word for word captions
[18:41:14] <XXCoder> just same meaning as what youre saying
[18:41:58] <XXCoder> at around less than 1 second timing error
[18:42:08] <andypugh> My parent’s bank went to a phone system where you have to read out your account number. Neither of them can make it understand the way they say the number “four”
[18:42:50] <XXCoder> four = fuck over u' rudeness
[18:45:51] <XXCoder> new one
https://youtu.be/D7Mwk6rbzYs
[18:46:00] <XXCoder> never seen one where lathe controls stock
[18:46:06] <XXCoder> rather than head moving in
[18:46:30] <andypugh> Hmm, actually, the autocaptions on my video have got rather better. It still makes no sense at all, but it is less nonsensical nonsense.
[18:46:47] <XXCoder> andypugh: theres tool to edit caoptions
[18:46:50] <XXCoder> wanna see it?
[18:47:16] <andypugh> Can’t bo bothered, why should I care about the Deaf :-)
[18:47:36] <malcom2073> zing
[18:47:45] <andypugh> XXCoder: That lathe is what they call a “Swiss Lathe:
[18:47:56] <XXCoder> aww odd thing though
[18:48:03] <XXCoder> andypugh: 80% of caption users arent deaf
[18:48:44] <XXCoder> http://nomorecraptions.com/ I think, trying it now
[18:48:54] <andypugh> There is a headstock round the back that moves in Z, and then a collet at the front acts like a travelling steady on a conventional lathe.
[18:49:18] <XXCoder> interesting
[18:49:54] <andypugh> They are good at making watch and clock gears, they can make a shaft and wheel on one go.
[18:50:01] <XXCoder> yep above link works
[18:50:06] <XXCoder> it displays video
[18:50:18] <XXCoder> and on right thewres crapcaption and you can edit it below it
[18:50:27] <XXCoder> then you can save it and add it
[18:50:31] <XXCoder> assuming you own video
[18:50:54] <andypugh> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZhICrb0Tbn4 (see if ut makes any sense as it is)
[18:51:07] <XXCoder> okay I will try edit it. lol
[18:52:27] <andypugh> No, I am perfectly happy to edit it, I don;t say that much,
[18:52:45] <XXCoder> sure, just having fun with that site though lol
[18:52:47] <andypugh> It’s just worth seeing the gibberish before it gets over-written
[18:52:56] <zeeshan|2> XXCoder: its a person with abritish accent
[18:52:57] <zeeshan|2> :-)
[18:52:59] <zeeshan|2> that is aL:L!
[18:54:00] <XXCoder> ah SHIFT+ENTER to change captons text
[18:54:07] <XXCoder> I was wondering why my edits didnt take effect
[18:55:52] <andypugh> Hmm, the nomorecraptions site isn’t actually playing the video. Probably a Mac / No Flash thing?
[18:56:09] <XXCoder> maybe
[18:56:13] <XXCoder> linux here
[18:56:18] <XXCoder> abode is killing flash
[18:56:22] <XXCoder> so it will end soon
[18:56:48] <FinboySlick> XXCoder: Well, they renamed it. It isn't dead yet.
[18:57:03] <XXCoder> geez
[18:57:20] <XXCoder> 500 years laters we will have abode flash/whatever new name it is
[18:58:01] <XXCoder> andypugh: heh trying to fix captions from captions text dont really work
[18:58:44] <andypugh> I can imagine it is something of a puzzle
[18:59:19] <XXCoder> that site is only one I know of that does NOT require signup
[18:59:36] <XXCoder> is there third party flash for mac?
[19:01:07] <FAalbers_> http://blog.cncking.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/1-christmas-tree-cnc.jpg
[19:01:22] <XXCoder> thats nice :)
[19:01:37] <andypugh> Hmm, a zombie tree.
[19:01:40] <XXCoder> I really need to get mine working :( (working but no place to run machine)
[19:02:43] <andypugh> OK, work tomorrow, and I am not doing anything useful here. Goodnight chaps.
[19:02:49] <XXCoder> later
[19:02:58] <FAalbers_> bye andypugh
[20:50:04] <CaptHindsight> supposed "automation engineer" put cute little loops into the wires to the servo driver for the power, motor windings and encoders all in parallel on a 10HP VMC
[20:50:42] <CaptHindsight> I guess he knew learned about how inductors and transformers work
[20:50:50] <CaptHindsight> knew/never
[20:50:52] <PetefromTn_> wassamatta you don't like cute little loops ;)
[20:51:01] <zeeshan|2> PetefromTn_: where you been :P
[20:51:11] <PetefromTn_> whaddya mean?
[20:51:20] <zeeshan|2> havent seen you talk much :P
[20:51:25] <CaptHindsight> been BUSY
[20:51:26] <PetefromTn_> been online most of the day
[20:51:30] <zeeshan|2> o
[20:51:37] <PetefromTn_> was runnning machine too
[20:51:41] <PetefromTn_> most of the day
[20:51:47] <zeeshan|2> sweet
[20:52:35] <CaptHindsight> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lpEidTa5nPU
[20:58:12] <zeeshan|2> :)
[20:58:15] <zeeshan|2> blaaaaaaaaaaaaaah!
[21:28:07] <PetefromTn_> Man I suck at taking pictures
[21:30:20] <zeeshan|2> ?!?
[21:36:41] <PetefromTn_> aah I just have a hard time taking GOOD pictures of the stuff I make is all...
[21:41:26] <zeeshan|2> cellphone camera sux :P
[21:41:29] <zeeshan|2> need a real camera!
[21:41:34] <zeeshan|2> i almost bought one
[21:41:45] <zeeshan|2> but then had to spend my money on winter jacket :{
[21:50:11] <shaun413> hi
[21:54:01] <PetefromTn_> I have a decent digital camera actually the cellphone seems to take better picture
[21:54:23] <zeeshan|2> then the digital camera isnt decent :P
[22:03:48] <PetefromTn_> well when I take pictures of anything BUT my parts they look fantastic...
[22:12:02] <Jymmm> anomynous_: ???
[22:34:38] <trentster> PetefromTn_: 95% of the struggle of taking good photos is more about lighting than the camera used
[22:37:14] <Jymmm> Loetmichel: Why is there witch riding a broom on a Christmas work? That's some German thing, aint it ;)
http://dxf-world.de/en/weihnachten-14.html
[22:38:07] <Jymmm> Loetmichel: And dont get me started on pronouncing this
https://translate.google.com/#de/en/Weihnachtsaufsteller
[22:55:14] <Tom_itx> PetefromTn_ you didn't try using side lighting?
[22:55:22] <Tom_itx> with daylight bulbs did you?
[22:55:45] <PetefromTn_> yeah I have tried different lighting. I dunno..
[22:55:55] <PetefromTn_> I will try again tomorrow after work.
[22:55:59] <Tom_itx> send me one of your parts and i'll take a good pic of it
[22:55:59] <PetefromTn_> Gn8
[22:56:23] <PetefromTn_> I appreciate the offer but I need to figure this out myself. Thanks Tom
[23:02:18] <anomynous_> Jymmm, ?
[23:06:28] <Jymmm> anomynous_: ?¿ 2015-12-06.15:41:37 andypugh: Jymmm “Weird and best ignored”
[23:06:43] <Jymmm> anomynous_: sorry
[23:06:53] <Jymmm> anomynous_: All you A's look alike ;)
[23:07:50] <anomynous_> i just woke up. when was this?
[23:08:05] <Jymmm> anomynous_: It was andy, not you, my bad
[23:09:32] <FAalbers> Hello
[23:10:06] <FAalbers> What do you guys normally for CNC routing . Convebtional or climb cutting ?
[23:14:31] <anomynous_> probably climb
[23:14:50] <anomynous_> but idk if it makes much of a difference.
[23:16:03] <anomynous_> at least steel manual mills have backlash, and thats why its recommended to do conventional. Climbing a cut could yank the backlash
[23:17:26] <anomynous_> climbing makes the cutter sink into the material right away and lessen rub. It is also easier for it to exit the material when the chip is thin. But idk if this applies to wood :)
[23:20:45] <zeeshan|2> climb milling is better in every way
[23:20:50] <zeeshan|2> if you have a rigid enough machine
[23:21:11] <anomynous_> why rigid enough?
[23:21:39] <zeeshan|2> because with climb milling the cutter grabs is getting "grabbed" into the work piece
[23:21:45] <zeeshan|2> with the initial contact force being high
[23:22:01] <zeeshan|2> if you have any backlight or rigidity issues
[23:22:01] <anomynous_> so you mean a flimsy machine could be self-fed by the cutter? ;D
[23:22:07] <zeeshan|2> the cutter keeps banging on the work piece
[23:22:15] <zeeshan|2> in a haramonic manner
[23:22:20] <zeeshan|2> (its not the best description)
[23:22:23] <zeeshan|2> but i tried :P
[23:29:06] <shaun413> hi
[23:32:11] <anomynous_> hi
[23:52:27] <FAalbers> I asked about conventional or climb with routing because CamBam has it set to Conventinal as default. But if climb is better, which I also read in other places , I should probably change the default to climb
[23:52:54] <FAalbers> Thanks for the feedback anomynous_ zeeshan|2
[23:53:35] <XXCoder> if I recall, climb do give you smoother finish
[23:55:21] <FAalbers> That's what i read yeah ...
http://makezine.com/2014/03/21/cnc-routing-basics-toolpaths-and-feeds-n-speeds/
![https://monosnap.com/file/138WCI0bCosuVm4XpnCAuQL6wUf4wa.png">](https://monosnap.com/file/138WCI0bCosuVm4XpnCAuQL6wUf4wa.png">){kind=link}
