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[00:02:42] <zeeshan> the heck
[00:02:46] <zeeshan> its already 12:40 am
[00:03:01] <furrywolf> lol
[00:15:18] <zeeshan> http://i.imgur.com/MCkRDza.png
[00:15:25] <zeeshan> interesting way to look at the pressure vs strain vs time depedance
[00:19:10] <furrywolf> insuffient references to determine the 3d shape.
[00:19:23] <zeeshan> ??
[00:19:52] <furrywolf> it's ambiguous. multiple different datasets would give that same graph.
[00:20:07] <furrywolf> it needs a projection onto each plane, or color-coding, or something.
[00:20:20] <zeeshan> looks good to me :-)
[00:20:32] <furrywolf> that's because you already know what the data is.
[00:21:42] <furrywolf> look at the first half of it... it could easily be a 45 degree line of pressure/time with strain=0... or strain/pressure with time=0...
[00:22:01] <zeeshan> :P
[00:22:08] <zeeshan> its for me to visualize it!
[00:22:19] <furrywolf> a standard solution is to graph little vertical lines down making its height at each spot obvious, as well as its projection.
[00:22:28] <zeeshan> my brain isn't working today
[00:22:29] * furrywolf googles for an example
[00:22:40] <zeeshan> i know what 3d pprojections look like
[00:22:45] <zeeshan> im not gonan waste time doing that on this graph
[00:22:50] <zeeshan> when it's for me to visualize!
[00:23:25] <zeeshan> man what am i doing.............................. grr
[00:23:31] <zeeshan> strain vs time is nonlinear
[00:23:35] <zeeshan> pressure vs time is linear
[00:23:40] <zeeshan> i want it to be the other waya round!
[00:25:06] <furrywolf> https://statmethods.files.wordpress.com/2012/01/3dscatter-ex2.jpeg like that
[00:25:27] <zeeshan> that looks messy in my opinion
[00:25:56] <furrywolf> but lets you, you know, actually get useful data from it... :P
[00:26:23] <zeeshan> http://www.doka.ch/3Dscatterplot.jpg
[00:26:25] <zeeshan> i like that
[00:26:33] <furrywolf> without some extra reference like that, you can't tell where a point is in 3d space from a 2d image.
[00:26:33] <zeeshan> http://www.originlab.com/doc%5Cen/Tutorial/images/3D_Scatter_with_Colormap/3D_Scatter_with_Colormap.png
[00:26:34] <zeeshan> better
[00:27:20] <furrywolf> yes, that's a projection onto each plane, one of the suggestions I gave. :P
[00:27:55] <furrywolf> and color coding, one of the other suggestions I gave... :P
[00:33:21] <furrywolf> http://33.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lh7mgvduYL1qa0uujo1_500.gif
[00:35:25] <zeeshan> lol
[00:42:20] <furrywolf> bbl, wolfy bedtime
[00:42:24] <zeeshan> cya
[02:44:02] <Deejay> moin
[06:37:34] <jthornton> morning
[06:56:37] <Tom_itx> morning
[06:58:09] <Deejay> good afternoon ;)
[07:00:23] <jthornton> dang bicycle ride will be wet this morning or muddy can't make up my mind
[07:21:11] <Tom_itx> yeah, looks like rain here too
[07:27:41] <Deejay> sunshine here, neighbour is harvesting rapeseed (?)
[07:35:07] <jthornton> just built my first QT program... dang a bit complicated compared to python
[07:38:56] <MrSunshine> Deejay you called?
[07:39:26] <Deejay> lol, nope, at least it was not my intention to wake you up
[07:39:29] <Deejay> sorry ;)
[07:39:55] <MrSunshine> :P
[07:40:13] <MrSunshine> i thought you wanted me to rape your neighbours
[07:41:19] <Deejay> lol
[07:41:21] <MrSunshine> gah trying to sand away small ridges from the tool on a 3d routing ...
[07:41:30] <MrSunshine> frekkin hell on earth
[07:44:09] <JT-Shop> it's freaking muggy outside
[07:45:07] <MrSunshine> hate it when that happends ... frekin muggers jumping out from everywhere
[07:53:10] <JT-Shop> it cracks me up when customers toss out that they are going on a trip can you get this to me before I leave
[08:30:58] <Simonious> know anything about flatcam?
[09:12:12] <_methods> never even heard of it
[09:16:03] <archivist> I think its a chalk mark on the metal
[09:16:11] * archivist ducks
[09:17:57] <_methods> no that's mancam
[09:18:26] <_methods> or nocam lol
[09:19:11] <archivist> insiderearofskullcam is the upgraded version for 2015
[09:19:19] <CaptHindsight> http://flatcam.org/ Free and Open-source PCB CAM
[09:20:11] <_methods> i'd settle for pcb software that would spit out a clean dxf
[09:20:22] <_methods> i don't need it to do any cam for me thank you
[09:21:38] <CaptHindsight> _methods: just mention that in reprap or similar, you'll get several devs telling how to do that without even using a PC
[09:22:18] <archivist> I avoid repcrap channels :)
[09:22:26] <_methods> i've yet to find a pcb program that will spit out a clean dxf
[09:23:02] <_methods> a lot of them will make a dxf where they use diff line thicknesses to represent traces
[09:23:07] <archivist> since moving to PC design of pcbs never made one myself
[09:23:14] <_methods> which is basically useless for milling
[09:23:43] <_methods> it just looks like the correct size trace lol
[09:23:46] <archivist> a gerber is a line and thickness too
[09:24:13] <archivist> up to the mill program to know that
[09:24:36] <_methods> yeah there are programs that do it
[09:24:44] <_methods> and they "work" more or less
[09:25:06] <_methods> i would just rather have a dxf and use my own cam software to do it
[09:26:11] <CaptHindsight> "I can do that with with <100 lines of code on a scavenged toasted oven micro" :)
[09:26:16] <_methods> heheh
[09:26:53] <archivist> when the new stuff is so cheap why do they bother scavenging
[09:27:21] <_methods> well because you can has always been a good excuse for me lol
[09:27:36] <_methods> sometimes it's fun to make do with some junk
[09:27:54] <CaptHindsight> also their time seems to be practically worthless
[09:27:57] <archivist> my last probe part I ordered just got here from china under £4
[09:28:18] <CaptHindsight> weeks of coding time are worth saving $100
[09:29:36] <archivist> I like scavenging and reusing but only for proper stuff
[09:29:54] <_methods> zlog
[09:31:02] <CaptHindsight> that's the main reason I hear for reinventing Linuxcnc
[09:31:34] <_methods> because i can?
[09:31:35] <archivist> now I have to decide what to transmit from the probe to pc, force on the probe, or just, it has enough force
[09:31:39] <CaptHindsight> the hardware costs too much and Linuxcnc is too complicated
[09:31:44] <_methods> oh
[09:31:49] <_methods> well that's good i like filters
[09:31:55] <_methods> keeps the riff raff out
[09:33:45] <archivist> also need to think about the press tool for the spring, need a "certain" pressure to the clamp
[09:34:17] <_methods> some things aren't "easy"
[09:35:27] <archivist> I get a wrinkle like
http://www.collection.archivist.info/archive/DJCPD/PD/2013/2013_10_11_Smart_Brown_Press_repaired/IMG_1671.JPG
[09:35:57] <_methods> ahh around the eges
[09:35:59] <_methods> edges
[09:36:00] <archivist> but that wrinkle is outside in the dont care region
[09:36:13] <_methods> i believe that is normal and is typically cut away in a second op
[09:36:24] <_methods> so you would design your blank to account for that
[09:36:37] <archivist> I need it flat as I wand to clamp it there
[09:36:38] <_methods> man i want that press so bad
[09:36:56] <_methods> there's an auction next month not far from here and the have a small obi press i'm going to try and get
[09:37:01] * archivist adds extra locks to the garage
[09:37:05] <_methods> hahah
[09:37:23] <_methods> that press is awesome
[09:37:42] <archivist> something of a fetish for presses
http://www.collection.archivist.info/searchv13.php?searchstr=press+pd
[09:38:41] <archivist> from 8213 on on that page are all here :)
[09:38:43] <_methods> do you own all of those smaller ones?
[09:38:48] <_methods> kk
[09:38:49] <archivist> yup
[09:39:02] <_methods> man nice
[09:39:19] <archivist> never found out what the swiss one was for
[09:39:28] <_methods> i think those unknown lever presses are old unipunches
[09:40:45] <archivist> unipunches look more solid after a quick google
[09:40:49] <_methods> yeah
[09:40:58] <_methods> if it is they are very old unipunches
[09:44:08] <archivist> there may be some english maker that its from
[09:44:38] <CaptHindsight> http://www.ebay.com/itm/KENCO-PUNCH-PRESS-4-Ton-/271924911674 the one to the right of this looks similar to the ^^^
[09:46:20] <CaptHindsight> archivist: how is yours driven?
[09:46:36] <CaptHindsight> have a side view?
[09:47:16] <archivist> that press in my pics I never brought home so not mine
[09:47:41] <archivist> impossible to take a side pic where it was
[09:48:07] <CaptHindsight> just wondering
[09:48:59] <archivist> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Toggle-Press-Smart-Brown-H5-2-Tons-Capacity-Nice-Condition-75-00-vat-/252023298483
[09:50:10] <archivist> the smart and brown came in a number of sizes
[09:50:36] <archivist> mine is the little H3
[09:51:11] <archivist> side view
http://www.collection.archivist.info/showresult.php?prog=1&srcprog=searchv13.php&srcdata=title&Type=PD&Accn_no=9283&subject=26617
[09:51:47] <CaptHindsight> lever operated
[09:52:09] <MrFluffy> Cute little thing...
[09:52:34] <archivist> I think some used a pneumatic cylinder off that lever
[09:53:25] <archivist> I need to make the proper lever like
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Smart-Brown-Toggle-Press-Adjustable-Stroke-/221802750843
[09:53:54] <_methods> http://www.ebay.com/itm/SMART-BROWN-TOGGLE-PRESS-MODEL-H5-BENCH-TOP-MANUAL-MADE-IN-ENGLAND-/350908788762
[09:53:58] <_methods> one in canada
[09:54:20] <archivist> a bit pricey
[09:54:52] <CaptHindsight> imported from England
[09:55:00] <_methods> yeah i'm gonna try and pick up this little obi next month
[09:55:08] <_methods> hopefully i can get it for nothing
[09:55:12] <_methods> no one wants presses anymore
[09:55:31] <archivist> I think mine was about £30
[09:55:44] <_methods> yeah that's a great deal
[09:55:49] <_methods> i'll give you 40
[09:55:53] <_methods> lol
[09:56:00] <archivist> erm /me says NO
[09:56:05] <_methods> you gotta pay shipping though
[09:56:12] <_methods> hehe
[09:56:42] <MrFluffy> I want a new press, but it should need a hiab to move at minimum :)
[09:58:09] <archivist> just checking my email and some presses in the latest spam from www.apexauctions.co.uk
[09:58:27] <MrFluffy> I have one of those little 30t ones and its flexing with some of the crank work
[09:58:36] <_methods> there are like 20 or so presses at this auction i'm going to
[09:58:43] <_methods> but they're all monster
[09:58:46] <archivist> hiab wont lift
https://www.apexauctions.co.uk/auction/itemDetails?lotId=168225&utm_source=Mailchimp&utm_medium=Email&utm_campaign=Renold_Power
[09:59:20] <MrFluffy> that'd do me, except the transport over the channel would be 1200e min
[09:59:53] <archivist> I know a lorry driver
[10:00:17] <MrFluffy> its something like 600e for the crossing at the moment
[10:00:41] <MrFluffy> cheapest way is backload on a low loader from barringtons or denbigh freight or something
[10:00:53] <MrFluffy> denbigh will bring two 7t jcb's for 1200e...
[10:01:05] <_methods> http://www.biditup.com/auction/953/ASSETS+FORMERLY+OF+EMR+INC+COMPLETE+STAMPING+TOOL+ROOM+FACILITY
[10:01:16] <_methods> that's the auction i'm hittin
[10:01:33] <_methods> http://www.biditup.com/auction-photo.php?id=54674
[10:01:38] * MrFluffy not allowed to go to auctions with the credit card after some unfortunate incidents
[10:01:42] <_methods> that's that little press i'm tryin to get
[10:02:09] <MrFluffy> theres somethign similar but older on ebay at the moment
[10:02:14] <MrFluffy> I assume youve seen it and its too dear...
[10:03:55] <MrFluffy> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/E-W-Bliss-size-20-press-/161768919698?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item25aa2dd292
[10:04:11] <MrFluffy> thats not a bad price yet is it?
[10:04:37] <MrFluffy> Id go rehome it if it was here...
[10:09:59] * MrFluffy snaps himself out of looking at presses big enough to accomodate a car on the local free ads pages...
[10:10:08] <_methods> heheh
[10:11:44] <archivist> I should be looking for a car rather than toys
[10:12:59] <MrFluffy> I have to dispose of two, maybe it could be a investment for a large press
[10:14:19] <MrFluffy> somehow I cant see much of a market for a rotten mk3 transit lowline, and a rather defunct pajero swb
[10:14:45] <MrFluffy> Maybe I can use the pajero chassis to build something useful instead.
[10:15:32] <archivist> mondeo estate deseasal is all I need
[10:15:59] <MrFluffy> or petrol and lpg, I ran a mondeo estate lpg for years
[10:16:48] <MrFluffy> donut tank in the wheel well, it popped the head gasket at 160,000 and I swapped the engine out as a precaution, and when we stripped it, the insides were like new because it had ran on lpg its whole life
[10:18:04] <archivist> I dont trust the availability of lpg all over the place
[10:18:19] <MrFluffy> then you can run on plain petrol :)
[10:19:08] <archivist> I want the extra mpg of diesel
[10:19:31] <MrFluffy> is diesel still loads more expensive than petrol there though?
[10:19:42] <MrFluffy> you get lower mpg on lpg than petrol too... less calorific value
[10:19:42] <robinsz> im not sure diesel is any better these days
[10:20:05] <robinsz> but when you factor in that diesel costs more ...
[10:20:21] <Simonious> in CamBAM, is there a way just to key the # of degrees you wish a part to rotate?
[10:21:10] <robinsz> im not sure which costs less to tun anymore in diesel and modern petrol, I suspect it is very close
[10:21:46] <MrFluffy> we replaced it with a td galaxy, but it sort of balances out, Id rather have the mondey back personally
[10:21:47] <greg_> diseasel, lol is that from memory or do youhave younger children?
[10:21:53] <_methods> no idea i think petefromtn is the local cambam guru
[10:22:21] <MrFluffy> but both are the wife's car technically, so I dont get to choose
[10:23:56] <Simonious> I should really be able to 10key the # of degrees of rotation :/ seems I only get mouse drag options so even getting a 90 degree rotation is a bitch (with snap to grid turned on).
[10:26:45] <greg_> I scanned the manual quickly, in transform you have rotate
[10:27:00] <Simonious> yeah.. i can spin the part, but the snap to grid doesn't seem to work
[10:27:07] <Simonious> so i can't lock in on 90 degrees
[10:28:10] <greg_> yeah it goes on the say it's mostly useless
[10:28:14] <Simonious> if I could just 10 key in the angle and hit enter.. that would be awesome
[10:28:41] <greg_> make another coordinate system in SW and eport it using that
[10:28:47] <MrFluffy> can you rotate the original in cad then re-process it?
[10:28:47] <Simonious> greg_: yeah.. totally useless, it's like a canteen with no water in it. It offers the promise of what you want, but doesn't deliver.
[10:28:49] <greg_> export
[10:28:59] <Simonious> greg_: yeah, that's what I'm going to have to do.
[10:29:24] <greg_> This is the 5 axis video I was trying to find yesterday
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H-lx6zkYxFQ
[10:33:17] <HoloPed> Hey all. Is anyone familiar with FSL laser cutters? I have a problem and FSL won'
[10:33:19] <HoloPed> t help
[10:35:18] <HoloPed> I have a problem with a FullSpectrumLaser unit. During raster engraving the laser stops and the driver goes crazy and the mouse starts jumping all over the screen. It stops when I disconnect the laser. FullSpectrumLaser don't answer emails and won't approve my post on their forums.
[10:35:43] <cpresser> HoloPed: just ask your question. the worst that can happen is that no one answers
[10:36:21] <HoloPed> thanks cpresser , just did
[10:37:02] <cradek> sounds like some kind of interference
[10:37:14] <cradek> did you check wiring/grounding/shielding?
[10:38:11] <archivist> a scope and a length of wire may pick it up
[10:39:00] <HoloPed> what should I be looking for ?
[10:39:04] <HoloPed> unsheilded wires ?
[10:39:42] <cradek> did it previously work?
[10:39:54] <archivist> breaks in shields too, the sort of failure you would get on a flexible cable to the head
[10:40:34] <HoloPed> cradek, we just got it (our makerspace) so I don't know if this is a new issue, or has always been there. The owner didn't use it much
[10:40:42] <cradek> ah
[10:41:04] <cradek> so you may have the bits together wrong, or missing bits, or who knows what
[10:41:23] <HoloPed> on the other hand, Laser cutting (not raster) seems to work ok
[10:41:27] <cradek> we assumed broken bits because we assumed it worked previously
[10:41:28] <HoloPed> even with long runs
[10:41:34] <archivist> cables are a comon problem where movement occurs
[10:41:50] <HoloPed> the laser doens't move
[10:41:56] <HoloPed> mirrors move
[10:42:16] <HoloPed> no cables on the moving parts, except one stepper motor
[10:42:36] <cradek> I don't think you're going to get useful help anywhere except from someone at the machine troubleshooting it
[10:43:04] <archivist> stepper motor cable fault can produce huge electrical noise, enough to kill a driver
[10:43:12] <HoloPed> ok
[10:43:16] <HoloPed> I will check all wires
[10:43:18] <HoloPed> thanks guys
[10:43:25] <cradek> while it's working, poke at everything
[10:43:38] <HoloPed> with my tongue
[10:43:38] <skunkworks_> and remember it is high voltage....
[10:43:39] <cradek> seems like something is mechanically different when doing raster
[10:43:54] <HoloPed> cradek, it is different
[10:43:59] <cradek> ?
[10:44:03] <HoloPed> it scans back and forth, like a fax machine
[10:44:12] <HoloPed> with the laser going on/off very quickly
[10:44:41] <cradek> the on/off could sure make some kinds of interference
[10:52:40] <pcw_home> yeah the modulation of the HV could certainly cause a HF noise issue (maybe some corona somewhere)
[10:53:27] <skunkworks_> whoo hoo - shipping confermation from mesa!
[10:53:30] <CaptHindsight> beer? :)
[10:57:43] <Simonious> how well does CamBAM's height map generator work?
[11:39:29] <Simonious> Hmm.. I was able to generate tool paths once in cambam, but I'm not sure why I can't get it to go now.
[11:40:01] <Simonious> I need to find a cambam expert to screenshare with, or to set up some paths for me, so I can look at what they did.
[11:41:29] <MrSunshine> conventional cutting must be better when cutting perpendicular to the grain in wood right ?
[11:41:34] <MrSunshine> and climb when cutting with the grain ?
[11:43:19] <andypugh> Simonious: I have CamBam, but not with me now in this hotel room
[11:44:32] <Simonious> PM andypugh
[16:32:23] <jdh> idle much?
[16:32:39] <PetefromTn_> vroom Vroom
[16:33:31] <Deejay> gn8
[16:43:52] <PetefromTn_> furrywolf
https://knoxville.craigslist.org/tls/5136100412.html !!
[17:27:55] <Valen> oooh
http://imgur.com/gallery/r0k9hdN
[17:29:01] <Tom_itx> that's different than the ones used here
[17:30:52] <Tom_itx> http://pop.h-cdn.co/assets/cm/15/05/54c7ff43b5c02_-_3-31.jpg
[17:31:51] <Tom_itx> http://www.northlandchippers.com/stump/images/bandit-2800XP-stump-grinder.jpg
[17:31:59] <Tom_itx> better pic
[17:40:54] <JT-Shop> my stump machine
http://gnipsel.com/images/splitter/splitter-28.jpg
[18:06:47] <Valen> I imagine that one would be pretty quiet though
[18:07:01] <Valen> I just love the torque it must be applying
[18:07:56] <malcom2073> It looks like it's hammering
[18:09:26] <Tom_itx> just catching on the stump i think
[18:17:55] <PetefromTn_> That thing looks pretty impressive... I honestly don't see how it is any better than the large circular saw style... And it seems like it takes a MUCH larger and heavier machine to control that impressive torque
[18:20:45] <PetefromTn_> So today I spent some more time painting on the CNC lathe carcass... This time I took a page from that FADAL video that I posted yesterday and used one of those small rollers and a brush for the very tight areas. This seems to work quite well and I was able to get a lot more of the machine in primer. Tomorrow I will be doing the other side of the carcass and hopefully get it completely in primer.
[18:21:16] <PetefromTn_> Then I can paint this thing the final color and as in the video will have to move the carriage to get underneath the area that is currently covered.
[18:21:42] <PetefromTn_> Did not want to completely tear apart the machine just to paint the body perhaps I am lazy for that but it should work fine.
[18:22:05] <PetefromTn_> Once I finally get this thing painted then I can start putting it back together and mounting components.
[18:22:13] <PetefromTn_> Still lots of work to do...
[18:32:47] <jdh> can't tape it up and spray it?
[18:33:24] <PetefromTn_> jdh Honestly I would LOVE to just tape it up and spray it but there are so many nooks and crannies that is not really possible
[18:33:50] <PetefromTn_> also there is the fact that when you spray this kind of machine the overspray will find its way into basically everything
[18:34:32] <PetefromTn_> I USUALLY spray everything I paint as I have been using PRo spray guns for decades now so believe me I would rather spray it.....this is just an easier way to get into these cracks...
[18:35:07] <Valen> roller will probably give you a better texture anyway
[18:35:39] <PetefromTn_> I am using those small detail rollers and yeah I was kinda surprised at the finish it does not look too bad really...
[18:36:04] <PetefromTn_> The larger sheet metal pieces I am spraying tho because it is just easier to take them off...
[18:49:49] <furrywolf> last time I had to remove stumps, I dug and sawed all the outside roots, then yanked the stump with my truck, breaking the underside roots.
[18:51:03] <furrywolf> PetefromTn_: heh, that shoptask isn't identical to mine, but very similar.
[18:52:04] <PetefromTn_> yeah man I thought you would like that photo..
[18:52:54] <PetefromTn_> I must say that while it is not the best machine I ever had I did enjoy having mine years ago.. If I knew what I know now about CNC I would probably have enjoyed it a lot more. Would make a kickass little gang tooled CNC lathe at least...
[18:53:17] <furrywolf> roots are surprisingly tough. I had to use two heavy-duty slings for extra length so I could get enough momentum up to snap the bigger roots under the stumps...
[18:53:48] <furrywolf> and that's with a 6500lb truck and 1500lbs of crap in the bed.
[18:54:46] <furrywolf> also, don't use a chainsaw to cut roots. even when you think you have all the dirt clear, you don't, and you trash both your chain and your bar instantly.
[18:54:57] <PetefromTn_> some tree trunks are really too big to pull out with anything but a large piece of heavy equipment..most of the time it is easiest to just cut away most of it with one of these machines and then spray root eating compounds on what remains underground.
[18:55:13] <furrywolf> I found some 14" "pruning" blades for my sawzall that worked excellently. slowly, but execellently.
[18:55:41] <PetefromTn_> Yup I use my sawzall for a lot of stuff like that..
[18:55:56] <furrywolf> never underestimate the power of momentum. :)
[18:56:14] <furrywolf> 8000lbs going 20mph has a lot of stored energy.
[18:57:00] <PetefromTn_> we used my daughter's F350 Diesel Dually 4x4 to rip the old shrubs out of the front of our house recently and a snatch strap worked quite well for that.
[18:57:40] <furrywolf> probably similar to my truck in terms of weight and axles... you have more horsepower, though.
[18:57:48] <jdh> I thought your kids were like 10
[18:57:49] <PetefromTn_> I was quite stunned at the extent of the roots system on those damn things. I cut one or two out myself with the sawzall and a matticks
[18:58:09] <PetefromTn_> I have two stepkids both of whom are adults now...
[18:58:16] <furrywolf> my truck is labeled at 1.5ton, but has a dana 70 rear dana 60 front, which is very similar to the 10.25/10.5 sterling rear and dana 60 front ford uses.
[18:58:28] <PetefromTn_> My son is finishing basic training for the US Navy soon..
[18:58:46] <jdh> I have some weed shrubs I cut/pull/dig up every other year
[18:58:59] <jdh> damned things will not die
[18:59:01] <PetefromTn_> He has been attached to the USS George H W Bush Aircraft Carrier...
[18:59:42] <furrywolf> jdh: try killing himilayan blackberries if you want plants that won't die.
[19:00:02] <jdh> I slept on a carrier once. Id probably die after 2 nights
[19:00:05] <PetefromTn_> furrywolf Yeah I would say that is accurate.. the sterling axles are quite heavy and similar in most respects to those in your truck
[19:00:41] <PetefromTn_> really then you would have HATED living on board the US Coast Guard Cutter Steadfast I was stationed on LOL
[19:00:59] * furrywolf doesn't like boats, planes, or other moving things
[19:01:23] * PetefromTn_ thinks furrywolf doesn't like ANYTHING...
[19:01:34] <jdh> they are all good if you leave them before sleeping
[19:01:52] <PetefromTn_> I actually slept quite well in my rack on the cutter..
[19:02:01] <PetefromTn_> unless it was REALLY rough
[19:02:04] <furrywolf> PetefromTn_: but that would mean I like not liking things.
[19:02:16] <PetefromTn_> then we would have to strap ourselves into our racks
[19:02:21] <PetefromTn_> that is not so much fun
[19:02:53] <furrywolf> I get seasick/airsick/carsick pretty easily.
[19:03:00] <PetefromTn_> furrywolf I would say that is a MOST precise statement
[19:03:11] <PetefromTn_> I kinda laugh about that now..
[19:03:23] <PetefromTn_> I remember a time when I used to think only SOME people get seasick
[19:03:40] <PetefromTn_> then I spent two and a half years aboard that coast guard cutter in the carribbean
[19:04:26] <PetefromTn_> and watched SEASONED Chiefs vomiting over the side that have more time on the crapper than I have aboard ship and realized that EVERYONE gets seasick in the bad stuff
[19:04:28] <DaViruz> i've never felt even the slightest tendency toward sea sickness. i'd like to think i'm immune
[19:04:39] <DaViruz> but maybe i just haven't been in seas rough enough
[19:05:25] <furrywolf> for me it tends to be steady medium-sized rocking, not violent seas...
[19:05:39] <PetefromTn_> I remember being on the bridge and watching waves crash over the bridge wings decks which are over 30 feet above the water line easily
[19:05:44] <furrywolf> the constant movement is much worse than a period of large jolts
[19:06:45] <PetefromTn_> you honestly get used to kind of bouncing off the walls when you walk down a hallway it makes it easier to handle the movement
[19:07:38] <PetefromTn_> and you learn to eat certain things that help you to not feel the movement of the water so much but at the end of the day if it gets real bad there is nothing you can do but try to deal with it.
[19:08:00] <PetefromTn_> Usually after I threw up I felt a lot better and honestly fighting it was not really helping.
[19:08:14] <PetefromTn_> we did have a seaman get stationed aboard one time.
[19:08:18] <PetefromTn_> he was a REALLY cool guy
[19:08:25] <PetefromTn_> and was very excited to be aboard
[19:08:48] <PetefromTn_> he was great the whole time we were in port painting and preparing the ship for our next tour
[19:08:59] <PetefromTn_> then the DAY we got underway
[19:09:14] <PetefromTn_> he was on the forecastle when we started pulling lines in
[19:09:21] <PetefromTn_> and I could see he started to turn green
[19:09:42] <PetefromTn_> they kept him on board for three weeks and he NEVER got better no matter what they gave him
[19:10:02] <PetefromTn_> He was finally discharged from the ship and I think they gave him a land station job or something.
[19:10:23] <PetefromTn_> I remember the day they flew him off the ship in the HH60J
[19:11:31] <furrywolf> yeah, I was on a boat once, just a sightseeing tour, with a woman who had to dope herself up with so many pills she couldn't walk, and was still seasick. heh.
[19:11:54] <furrywolf> and patches, too
[19:24:05] <PetefromTn_> yeah things like that will work for a day trip or even a couple day cruise but for extended living aboard a ship forget it. They are not real good for you either
[19:34:02] <furrywolf> I don't think she was consious enough to remember being there. heh.
[19:34:55] <PetefromTn_> woah that must have sucked LOL
[19:40:47] <SpeedEvil> Just get a cabin at the centre of mass of the ship
[19:40:51] <SpeedEvil> With a gimbal
[19:41:12] <furrywolf> it doesn't work that way. lol
[19:41:41] <PetefromTn_> hehe I should have asked for that I guess.... hard to work and do search and rescue and fisheries patrols that way tho
[19:50:42] <PetefromTn_> http://i.imgur.com/saIv90N.jpg http://i.imgur.com/2l77JJv.jpg USCGC Steadfast....my home for 2.5 years LOL
[19:50:51] <zeeshan> has anyone here adjusted a maho / deckel / mikron for "knod"
[19:51:57] <zeeshan> "tramming"
[19:58:49] <CaptHindsight> zeeshan: did you drop it?
[19:58:56] <zeeshan> no
[19:59:00] <zeeshan> its out by 2 thou
[19:59:02] <zeeshan> need to readjust
[19:59:15] <zeeshan> i also got an oscilloscope from my school
[19:59:21] <PetefromTn_> this is with your vertical head installed right
[19:59:23] <zeeshan> going to hook it up the the encoder today and see whats up
[19:59:28] <zeeshan> PetefromTn_: yes
[19:59:41] <zeeshan> PetefromTn_: you make a good point
[19:59:44] <zeeshan> i should remove the vertical head
[19:59:48] <zeeshan> and mount the dial indicator directly to the ram
[19:59:52] <zeeshan> and see if i have the same prob
[19:59:55] <CaptHindsight> zeeshan: is this the one with the encoder/scale problems?
[19:59:56] <zeeshan> that way i can isolate the problem
[20:00:00] <zeeshan> CaptHindsight: yes
[20:00:25] <PetefromTn_> not sure I understand how can you test the tram with a fixed point?
[20:00:28] <CaptHindsight> did you solve that? just wondering
[20:00:48] <zeeshan> no im gonna do that today
[20:01:24] <zeeshan> PetefromTn_: you mount the mag base on the face the vertical head mounts to
[20:01:27] <zeeshan> then move the ram in and out
[20:01:43] <zeeshan> that'll show if it's something to do with the mating surfaces of the vertical head and ram
[20:02:10] <PetefromTn_> thats right that is your Y axis correct?
[20:02:47] <zeeshan> my Y axis isn't parallel to the table
[20:02:49] <zeeshan> is the problem
[20:04:23] <PetefromTn_> and the table is your Z axis goes up and down.. Have you checked/adjusted the gibs on the knee if the knee is loose it will lean away from the column but I don't know much about your machine really
[20:04:45] <zeeshan> no i havent checked that
[20:04:55] <zeeshan> if it was the Z axis
[20:04:56] <zeeshan> er
[20:04:59] <zeeshan> z axis on the table
[20:05:08] <zeeshan> when i indicate along the y axis
[20:05:10] <zeeshan> wouldn't it change?
[20:05:46] <PetefromTn_> if your table is leaning away from the colum and you travel the Y away from the column it would change in Z height as it goes away I think..
[20:06:00] <zeeshan> yes
[20:06:04] <zeeshan> but you're saying the table droop
[20:06:06] <zeeshan> is a static thing?
[20:06:09] <zeeshan> so no matter what z height im at
[20:06:12] <zeeshan> it's leaning forward
[20:06:25] <zeeshan> (i didnt check which way it's leaning -- i should check)
[20:06:26] <PetefromTn_> I am not saying anything just thinking out loud...
[20:06:33] <zeeshan> yea :)
[20:06:35] <PetefromTn_> I don't know your machine very well at all
[20:06:36] <zeeshan> okay first problems first
[20:06:41] <zeeshan> i ened to fix the encoder issue
[20:07:01] <PetefromTn_> good luck
[20:07:04] <zeeshan> :D
[20:07:58] <furrywolf> only coast guard boats here are little aluminum rescue boats
[20:08:29] <PetefromTn_> not so little LOL... the 47 Motor lifeboats are up there in Cape Disappointment washington
[20:08:38] <furrywolf> and they end up doing most rescues by helicopter anyway!
[20:09:10] <furrywolf> there's so little actual marine rescues around here, they're always sending the choppers around to rescue hikers and the like just to keep everyone practiced.
[20:09:18] <PetefromTn_> actually the USCGC Steadfast is in Orgeon or washington now they refreshed the ship shortly after I got off and moved it to the NW
[20:09:19] <zeeshan> rofl PetefromTn_
[20:09:25] <zeeshan> someone mentioned something funny on the web
[20:09:31] <zeeshan> guess how they corrected for the "Droop"
[20:09:38] <PetefromTn_> furrywolf actually that is not true at all
[20:09:39] <zeeshan> they software compensatied
[20:09:40] <zeeshan> :D
[20:10:12] <PetefromTn_> I served at the USCGAS Sacramento on the C130 aircraft and we were constantly doing search and rescue operations off the coast
[20:10:14] <Valen> tram is making the spindle perpendicular to the XY axis of the machine
[20:10:49] <furrywolf> PetefromTn_: I'm 6 hours from sacramento, so unless USCGAS Sacramento isn't near sacramento...
[20:10:50] <Valen> not the same thing as getting the axies perpendicular and straight
[20:11:06] <PetefromTn_> they usually involved the C130 doing the searching, followed by the helis heading out to load the people and or a small boat leaving the coast out of several different stations to do closer in shore rescues etc.
[20:11:33] <Valen> boats are also going to be useful when you want to get 30 people off a cargo ship
[20:11:40] <PetefromTn_> 6 hours is nothing for a C130 or heli and there are small boat stations all along the coast
[20:11:47] <Valen> or if its balls weather and the heli's aren't going to fly
[20:11:56] <PetefromTn_> ^^
[20:12:53] <furrywolf> http://www.uscg.mil/d11/staHumboldtBay/ the small boat station here
[20:13:10] <PetefromTn_> the helis can only fly so far on thier fuel load actually and the larger cutters or navy vessels have to refuel them offshore to extend their range and if the ships are close enough they will go instead but nothing beats an aircraft intercept
[20:13:26] <PetefromTn_> YUP
[20:13:30] <PetefromTn_> the 47MLB
[20:13:34] <PetefromTn_> that is an amazing boat
[20:13:40] <CaptHindsight> Valen: how concerned are you of the Indonesians invading anytime soon?
[20:13:42] <Valen> heh I'm inaustralia and looked at buying one of those
[20:14:01] <PetefromTn_> and the rigid hull inflatable boats are really fast
[20:14:02] <Valen> indonesians not much at all, (well at least not as long as the F111's are still flying
[20:14:14] <Valen> china however, that is a real concern
[20:14:32] <PetefromTn_> they can take a pretty big wave too and of course are almost unsinkable due to their design
[20:14:34] <Valen> all the farmers here are going broke and the chinese govt is buying up the land
[20:14:58] <Valen> they then ship the food straight to china, there is no sale so no tax revenue
[20:15:31] <Valen> at some point somebody is going to try and "nationalise" those farms again, by which time china may well be dependant on them for food
[20:15:41] <Valen> that is probably going to be a bad day
[20:15:43] <furrywolf> and then we have
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coast_Guard_Air_Station_Humboldt_Bay
[20:15:50] <CaptHindsight> interesting
[20:16:02] <furrywolf> "Air Station Humboldt Bay consists of 3 MH-65C helicopters" and, as I said, just helicopters. lol
[20:16:27] <Valen> oh bugger, we aren't flying the F111 any more
[20:16:36] <CaptHindsight> oops
[20:16:36] <Valen> ok, now i am a little bit worried about indonesia
[20:16:54] <PetefromTn_> yup there are quite a few CGAS along the west coast
[20:17:15] <Valen> we are still flying FA-18's, but they don't have the hitting power at the distance of the 111
[20:17:22] <furrywolf> they don't get much actual use doing marine rescue, so they're always sending them to rescue hikers and the like, doubling as a general search-and-rescue service... which seems like a good idea to me, since it keeps the crews trained, while not needing to have a dedicated inland SAR team.
[20:17:24] <PetefromTn_> only two have C130 longer range aircraft as I recall
[20:17:53] <PetefromTn_> Coast Guardsmen respond to ALL SORTS of emergencies
[20:18:02] <PetefromTn_> as well as natural disasters
[20:18:08] <PetefromTn_> drug interdiction operations
[20:18:17] <PetefromTn_> you name it
[20:18:29] <CaptHindsight> Valen: "The Australian Government intends to buy at least 72 F-35A Lightning II aircraft to re-equip the RAAF's air combat force between 2014 and 2021"
[20:18:32] <Valen> A former PM of Indonesia has said that some of his more right wing people were getting grumpy with Australia but shut up when he pointed out that Australia's F111s could put a bomb on their table in an hour
[20:18:33] <furrywolf> every time they do a rescue it gets published in one of the sections of the local paper, and it's "stranded hikers rescued" most of the time. :)
[20:18:44] <Valen> CaptHindsight: friggin STUPID thing to do again
[20:18:45] <PetefromTn_> most people really do not understand the varied missions of the Coast Guard
[20:18:56] <Valen> F35 does nothing at all for any role we would wish to fill
[20:19:50] <Valen> as a multi role aircraft it sucks equally at everything
[20:19:57] <Valen> also it doesn't like flying in the heat
[20:20:05] <furrywolf> there was one real marine rescue last month I think it was... sailboat with both engines failed and sails shredded in high seas.
[20:20:09] <Valen> seems like a great plane for *Australia* to get
[20:21:09] <PetefromTn_> to be honest marine rescues occurred almost daily when I was stationed in Sacto
[20:21:18] <PetefromTn_> even if we were not involved
[20:21:18] <furrywolf> most of the rescues they do seem to be human error... let's go out on the ocean without remembering to get fuel first! oh dear, we're stranded, let's call the coast guard to give us fuel!
[20:21:32] <PetefromTn_> we always listened in and had to be ready to assist
[20:21:47] <PetefromTn_> yeah there is a lot of that...
[20:21:54] <PetefromTn_> irresponsible boat owners
[20:22:05] <PetefromTn_> intoxicated boat owners that are irresponsbile
[20:22:10] <PetefromTn_> ible
[20:23:02] <PetefromTn_> remember too that we protect the area all the way to Hawaii and beyond so any maritime emergency anywhere out there would be responded to
[20:23:57] <mozmck> Anyone in Conneticut?
[20:23:58] <furrywolf> I think the station here only handles local stuff, and with the demise of fishing, logging, and any imports or exports from our harbor, there's a lot less of it than there once was.
[20:24:08] <mozmck> http://dallas.craigslist.org/dal/bfs/5126984768.html
[20:24:55] <PetefromTn_> connecticut?
[20:25:00] <furrywolf> mozmck: 3,596,677 according to wikipedia
[20:25:55] <furrywolf> also, you don't want to do business with anyone dishonest enough to spam craigslist.
[20:25:59] <mozmck> yeah, mis-spelled it
[20:26:05] <CaptHindsight> Valen:
http://www.afr.com/news/politics/australian-fear-of-invasion-lowest-in-50-years-20150702-gi3ch7
[20:26:33] <CaptHindsight> Valen: just opinion?
[20:26:34] <mozmck> I see a number of machines from up north on dallas craigslist lately.
[20:27:05] <PetefromTn_> thats true people post machined from far distances on our local craigslist all the time.
[20:27:11] <Valen> I file it under the "people are stupid" factor
[20:27:24] <CaptHindsight> heh, just like here
[20:27:26] <Valen> I am also talking in 20-30 years
[20:27:51] <Valen> the terrorist attack thing is stupid
[20:28:02] <furrywolf> any post from out of the area on craigslist is from an asshole. usually because their price is stupidly high, and they're under the mistaken belief that the more people they spam it to, the more it will sell for.
[20:28:06] <CaptHindsight> yes, lost of problems ahead when the current generation of leaders have passed on
[20:28:31] <Valen> I mean I'm certain there will be, particularly given how much air time Big Tone is giving to the "death cult"
[20:28:41] <furrywolf> honest people follow the craigslist terms of use, and basic politeness, and don't spam.
[20:29:07] <Valen> but odds are it'll be a max of 100 people injured or killed (statically), 3x that many people die on the roads each year
[20:29:12] <PetefromTn_> ya know you say that but I can say that I am one of those nut jobs that will drive long distances for the right deal hehe
[20:29:43] <CaptHindsight> Valen: accidents, bacteria, stupidity etc
[20:29:48] <furrywolf> Valen: Won't someone PLEASE think of the children?!
[20:29:49] <Valen> correction 10x that number die on the roads each year
[20:29:54] <CaptHindsight> but those aren't as scary
[20:30:16] <Valen> TBH diabetus, cancer and road collision are my biggest fears
[20:30:58] <Valen> for the near term future anyway
[20:31:17] <PetefromTn_> looks like my ship is not located in Warrenton Orgeon just north of Portland hehe
[20:31:21] <CaptHindsight> yeah antibiotic resistant bacteria are more of threat than terrorists
[20:31:22] <PetefromTn_> now
[20:31:24] <Valen> invasion as a result of global economic collapse, that is something I see in the longer term future
[20:31:25] <furrywolf> don't live off crisps and soda, and the first one won't be a problem. :P
[20:31:37] <Valen> furrywolf: doesn't quite work like that ;-P
[20:32:32] <furrywolf> you sure? :P
[20:32:39] <furrywolf> that's what the news is always saying causes it...
[20:32:57] <Valen> I am also of the belief that australia does actually have a plan in place to rapidly develop an A bomb. All the people and facilities are picked out and it gets updated from time to time
[20:33:24] <Valen> though it'd be too slow to work like a damn these days
[20:33:50] <Valen> in the 60's-70's when it was developed you could have a few months warning that crap was going to go down
[20:34:40] <furrywolf> Of course they have a plan... a strategic alliance with people who already have them.
[20:36:27] <Valen> which worked out so dang well for the ukraine
[20:36:51] <furrywolf> lol
[20:37:14] <Valen> (America took all the old USSR nukes from the ukraine so they wouldn't fall into "the wrong hands" with the assurance that the USA would protect them from Russian aggression in the future
[20:38:42] <CaptHindsight> Valen: I guess there no concern from Malaysia since they can't seem to keep flights in the air :)
[20:39:12] <CaptHindsight> oh I just kid the Malaysians
[20:39:34] <furrywolf> I'd rate israel as far more likely to start a nuclear war than the ukraine.
[20:40:24] <Valen> Ukraine was actually rather more concerned with people stealing them and selling them just post the fall of the USSR
[20:40:57] <furrywolf> speaking of which, anyone here in ukraine want to fedex me an abandonned RTG? I keep hearing they're just lying around for the taking. :P
[20:41:06] <Valen> in terms of starting one today, yeah Israel
[20:41:38] <furrywolf> preferably one with the shielding not yet sold for scrap metal
[20:43:09] <Valen> you just want to put it under your bed to keep you warm right?
[20:43:14] <furrywolf> lol
[20:43:26] <furrywolf> I was thinking more of in my shed to keep the batteries charged.
[20:44:35] <furrywolf> I have enough things under my bed already. :P
[20:46:25] <furrywolf> (some of which have batteries that need charging, but still not putting the rtg under there with them)
[20:53:03] <zeeshan> man im failing at using an oscilloscope
[20:53:29] <furrywolf> lol
[20:53:46] <furrywolf> connect probes. select appropriate voltage and time divisions. select appropriate trigger settings.
[20:53:51] <zeeshan> dude
[20:53:54] <zeeshan> youre too far ahead
[20:53:57] <zeeshan> i cant even get the handle down
[20:53:57] <zeeshan> ROFL
[20:53:59] <zeeshan> in front of the screen
[20:54:19] <furrywolf> push pivot points of handle inwards
[20:54:30] <zeeshan> http://www.hamsterking.com/temp/pm3055-fullsize.jpg
[20:54:31] <zeeshan> this is the scope
[20:54:45] <zeeshan> i can see the pulses flash
[20:54:47] <zeeshan> when i move the encoder
[20:54:56] <zeeshan> but, they dissapear too fast
[20:55:32] <furrywolf> if you don't have a storage 'scope or a digital 'scope, that happens.
[20:55:57] <zeeshan> i saw the guy freeze it
[20:55:59] <zeeshan> at school
[20:56:04] <zeeshan> i'm not sure how he did it
[20:57:10] <cpresser> run/stop button
[20:57:23] <zeeshan> where do you see that
[20:57:57] <furrywolf> first of all, is that thing analog or digital? lol
[20:58:13] <zeeshan> analog i think
[20:58:18] <zeeshan> theres a crt!
[20:58:32] <furrywolf> yes, but older digital 'scopes had CRTs.
[20:58:45] <furrywolf> I'm downloading the manual now, but at 9MB, it'll be a while.
[20:59:23] <furrywolf> if it's what I suspect, an analog 'scope with digital controls tacked onto it, it might not have a way to store a waveform. if it's a digital scope, then it will.
[21:00:01] <furrywolf> the presence of the ALT/CHOP switch suggests analog and no way to save a waveform
[21:00:44] <zeeshan> there is a "Single shot mode"
[21:01:14] <furrywolf> are you sure the person at school wasn't just showing a continuous signal source?
[21:01:20] <zeeshan> maybe he was
[21:01:27] <zeeshan> he had it hooked to the test port
[21:01:29] <zeeshan> of the scope
[21:01:48] <furrywolf> lol
[21:01:53] <zeeshan> :)
[21:01:53] <furrywolf> yes, that's a continuous signal.
[21:02:23] * cpresser found the manual...
[21:02:29] <zeeshan> i dont even know what im trying to look at
[21:02:30] <cpresser> 1. press menu and keep it pressed
[21:02:30] <furrywolf> first part of the manual sure sounds like a plain analog 'scope, with no storage function. so there's not going to be any way to freeze a waveform for you to study.
[21:02:38] <cpresser> 2. press 'auto set'
[21:02:52] <cpresser> 3. display should show "1 2 AS 3"
[21:03:06] <cpresser> 4. to enter AS mode, press reset
[21:03:25] <cpresser> single-shot: to enter single-shot press 'v' of channel up-down
[21:03:50] <furrywolf> single shot trigger != continuing to show the same thing on the display after it triggers...
[21:04:06] <zeeshan> what kind of pos is this
[21:04:09] <zeeshan> that c an't show the waveform
[21:04:13] <zeeshan> after it's triggered lol
[21:04:32] <cpresser> stop, is way easier...
[21:04:43] <zeeshan> "stop"?
[21:04:51] <cpresser> just press TB-Trig-Mode multiple times. one of the modes is single
[21:05:19] <zeeshan> ok lemme try that
[21:05:20] <cpresser> and use 'reset' to re-arm the scope
[21:05:31] <zeeshan> i'm confused on what im trying to look for those
[21:05:34] <zeeshan> *though
[21:05:46] <zeeshan> these guys said inspect the input side of the interpolator (analot output of scale)
[21:05:56] <zeeshan> and inspect output of interpolator (digital output of scale)
[21:06:06] <zeeshan> i hooked it up to digital side and i can see square waves
[21:06:09] <zeeshan> nothing weird about em
[21:06:17] <zeeshan> at least on phase A
[21:06:23] <zeeshan> i haven't seen the analog side yet
[21:06:45] <furrywolf> cpresser: I think you're missing what he's asking. He wants to freeze a transient waveform on the display for analysis. being an analog non-storage 'scope, there's no way to do this.
[21:06:51] <cpresser> manual:
http://radioman64.e-monsite.com/medias/files/philips-20pm3055-20operating-20manual.pdf
[21:07:23] <cpresser> furrywolf: it seems to have single-shot. what use is single-shot when the scope cant store it?
[21:07:41] <furrywolf> cpresser: so you don't get a whole bunch of overlapping traces
[21:09:25] <cpresser> the basic function of a crt scope is to show overlapping traces. otherwise your eye would be to slow!?
[21:09:54] <furrywolf> no, the phosphors glow for a significant period of time
[21:10:39] <cpresser> afaik there are even 'static' screens which glow quite some time and require a wipe
[21:10:57] <furrywolf> yes, those are called storage 'scopes. that is not one.
[21:11:22] <cpresser> i cant recall how it was working with non digital scopes :)
[21:14:31] <furrywolf> they use some crt phosphor trickery to hold the display for a short period of time (a few minutes tops) for analysis. it's something like firing a continuous beam of electrons over the whole display and that keeps the glowing bits glowing. it slowly fades.
[21:16:16] <furrywolf> I still have my analog 'scope, and still know how to use it. lol
[21:16:20] <furrywolf> but I use my digital one for virtually everything.
[21:18:15] <furrywolf> I have a tek 465b (analog), a tek tds-210 (digital), and a tek 214 (analog, storage), that's broken and currently sitting on top of one of my living room speakers in way too many pieces to hope it's going back together.
[21:19:24] <furrywolf> the digital 'scope can do things no analog 'scope can do, like a negative trigger delay. show me what the waveform looked like 1ms BEFORE triggering.
[21:21:14] <zeeshan-mill> hi friends
[21:21:47] <furrywolf> make it work yet? :P
[21:22:40] <furrywolf> my suggestion would be running the mill at a very very slow feedrate back and forth from one end to the other, so you have a continuous signal to look at.
[21:23:49] <furrywolf> the slowest feedrate you can that results in continuous, even servo rotation.
[21:24:47] <zeeshan-mill> yea dude
[21:24:50] <zeeshan-mill> wtf ?
[21:24:56] <zeeshan-mill> the y axis isnt losing position anymore
[21:25:01] <zeeshan-mill> nor is it hunting anymore
[21:25:03] <zeeshan-mill> WTF
[21:25:19] <furrywolf> ah! you fixed it by threatening to attach test equipment. this is a very common repair.
[21:26:00] <zeeshan-mill> lol
[21:26:00] <PetefromTn_> Oh man that sucks....nothing worse than an intermittent problem
[21:26:03] <zeeshan-mill> whats going on here?
[21:26:07] <zeeshan-mill> maybe the connector was a bit lose?
[21:26:10] <zeeshan-mill> *loose
[21:26:26] <zeeshan-mill> that is all that changed..
[21:26:32] <furrywolf> connector could be loose. if the 'scope is currently attached, the additional capacitance could be hiding an analog issue.
[21:26:51] <zeeshan-mill> yea its still attached
[21:26:55] <zeeshan-mill> ts making pretty sine waves
[21:27:03] <zeeshan-mill> and you were right you cant store
[21:27:10] <zeeshan-mill> but cpresser's guide helped me set it up
[21:27:29] <zeeshan-mill> like i see a typical sine wave on the scope
[21:27:31] <zeeshan-mill> with no noise in it
[21:27:49] <furrywolf> attaching a 'scope can significantly alter a weak analog signal
[21:28:14] <furrywolf> check that the amplitude and dc offset are correct for the signal you're expecting
[21:29:48] <furrywolf> I've never had a machine with servos, so I have no clue what it should look like. heh.
[21:30:47] <zeeshan-mill> well
[21:30:49] <zeeshan-mill> i remove the scope
[21:30:51] <zeeshan-mill> and its still fine
[21:30:53] <zeeshan-mill> wtf :p
[21:31:15] <furrywolf> loose plug? :P
[21:31:19] <furrywolf> and/or you scared it into working.
[21:31:44] <zeeshan-mill> well dude
[21:31:46] <furrywolf> check for corrosion or loose contacts (spread wide, etc) on any plugs you touched during this process.
[21:31:47] <zeeshan-mill> when i saw the thing
[21:31:50] <zeeshan-mill> it looked a bit loose.
[21:32:03] <zeeshan-mill> it had about 1/8 gap
[21:32:07] <zeeshan-mill> to bottoming out
[21:32:13] <furrywolf> lol
[21:32:41] <furrywolf> and is it now bottoming out?
[21:33:02] <zeeshan-mill> yes
[21:33:08] <furrywolf> so... user error?
[21:33:13] <zeeshan-mill> on a bright note
[21:33:19] <furrywolf> also, why is it a non-locking plug?
[21:33:27] <zeeshan-mill> the y servo sounds like it did when i first started the machine
[21:33:31] <zeeshan-mill> and everything was working correctly
[21:33:35] <zeeshan-mill> no idea
[21:33:38] <zeeshan-mill> ask heidenhain
[21:33:47] <zeeshan-mill> its that shitty molex connection
[21:33:50] <furrywolf> was it sounding different before?
[21:33:51] <zeeshan-mill> that relies on friction or something
[21:33:53] <furrywolf> ah
[21:33:58] <zeeshan-mill> yea originally it sounded quiet
[21:34:03] <zeeshan-mill> lately it was making weird noises
[21:34:09] <furrywolf> yeah, molex plugs suck. they are, however, dirt cheap and available in small quantities.
[21:34:17] <furrywolf> I have three molex plug designer kits...
[21:34:17] <zeeshan-mill> this experience has made me realize
[21:34:26] <zeeshan-mill> that it would be nice to have encoders on the servos.
[21:34:33] <zeeshan-mill> this way you can cross check
[21:34:36] <zeeshan-mill> and ferror out
[21:34:39] <zeeshan-mill> and enver have a tool crash
[21:34:49] <zeeshan-mill> yea molex is cheap
[21:35:03] <zeeshan-mill> brb gonna reboot and see if things change
[21:35:15] <furrywolf> unplug it, and use a mini screwdriver to carefully squish the female pins (usually in the male housing) tighter. they're formed from stamped crap metal, and slowly spread with time.
[21:42:31] <zeeshan-mill> moment of truth
[21:43:21] <zeeshan-mill> yay it sounds the same!
[21:43:44] <ffurrywol> unplug it and use a mini screwdriver to squish the female pins (usually, but not always, in the male housing) slightly tighter. they're made from stamped crappy metal and slowly spread with time/cycles.
[21:44:04] <zeeshan-mill> ts fixed.
[21:44:17] <zeeshan-mill> i zip tied the wire
[21:44:20] <zeeshan-mill> to a zip tie mount
[21:44:22] <ffurrywol> it's not fixed. it still has molex connectors. it's just working. :P
[21:44:24] <zeeshan-mill> its not gonna move now
[21:44:27] <CaptHindsight> cpresser: phosphors used for CRT screens are available in different amounts of persistance, TV tubes used relatively fast ones since you wanted 60hz refresh
[21:44:56] <ffurrywol> CaptHindsight: I had a b&w TV with phosphors so slow you could draw on it with a flashlight. :P
[21:45:05] <zeeshan-mill> ok now to see the tramming issue
[21:45:07] <CaptHindsight> for scopes they can choose phosphores that are persistant in the several seconds
[21:45:13] <ffurrywol> my hercules monitor was even worse.
[21:45:30] <CaptHindsight> phosphors/phosphores
[21:46:34] <ffurrywol> I once got bored and showed someone that you could draw a smileyface on the hercules monitor with a maglight and it'd still be there 30 seconds later.
[21:46:51] <ffurrywol> it had a nice picture... but fast updates were not its strong point.
[21:47:00] <zeeshan-mill> PetefromTn_, you were right
[21:47:03] <zeeshan-mill> i think the table is drooping
[21:47:10] <ffurrywol> it was a portrait paper-white monitor. a serious rarity. :)
[21:47:17] <zeeshan-mill> its tilted forward if you were to look at the machine from the side
[21:47:25] <zeeshan-mill> i have the indicator mounted right to the ram
[21:48:18] <CaptHindsight> zeeshan: I think Monster Cable makes special pixie dust coated encoder cables :)
[21:48:25] <ffurrywol> lol
[21:48:45] <zeeshan-mill> rofl
[21:48:49] <zeeshan-mill> fak monster cable
[21:48:56] <zeeshan-mill> ricers run em!
[21:49:44] <ffurrywol> I have some monster cable 10AWG speaker cable... got it at a yardsale... I have it in a box, because it doesn't fit in either my speakers or my amps. lol
[21:50:00] <ffurrywol> while the #16 lamp cord fits great. :P
[21:50:13] <zeeshan-mill> nm
[21:50:17] <zeeshan-mill> the table is LIFTEd up
[21:50:19] <zeeshan-mill> from the front
[21:50:22] <zeeshan-mill> not drooping down
[21:50:27] * ffurrywol hands zee a big sledge
[21:56:25] * zeeshan-mill tries to setup tools
[21:56:38] * furrywolf needs a better machine
[21:56:51] <zeeshan-mill> shuddap
[21:56:56] <zeeshan-mill> make use of what you got
[21:57:00] <zeeshan-mill> im stuck with a shitty lathe
[21:57:02] <zeeshan-mill> i use it still though!
[21:57:25] <zeeshan-mill> cradek are you there
[21:57:27] <furrywolf> your idea of "shitty" is far better than anything I own. heh.
[21:57:42] <zeeshan-mill> we have a shoptask like yours
[21:57:45] <zeeshan-mill> at the makerspace
[21:57:49] <zeeshan-mill> ive made decent parts on it
[21:57:58] <zeeshan-mill> its not a great mill
[21:58:01] <zeeshan-mill> but its a very good lathe
[21:58:06] <zeeshan-mill> you like dildos
[21:58:08] <zeeshan-mill> make dildos.
[21:58:10] <zeeshan-mill> :-)
[21:58:12] <furrywolf> lol
[21:59:35] <furrywolf> I need to figure out cad/cam before I get a better machine. this machine is capable of most things I'm capable of writing by hand.
[22:00:03] <zeeshan-mill> what do you mean figure out
[22:00:10] <zeeshan-mill> like learn it?
[22:00:25] <furrywolf> find working, affordable software, then learn it
[22:00:31] <zeeshan-mill> waREZ
[22:00:36] <zeeshan-mill> student version
[22:00:38] <zeeshan-mill> :)
[22:00:43] <furrywolf> that runs on a usable operating system
[22:00:53] <zeeshan-mill> NX
[22:00:59] <furrywolf> ?
[22:01:02] <zeeshan-mill> siemens nx
[22:01:07] <zeeshan-mill> works in linux
[22:01:09] <zeeshan-mill> has cam and cad in it
[22:01:13] <zeeshan-mill> very high learning curve though
[22:01:18] <zeeshan-mill> but stupid powerful
[22:01:55] <furrywolf> I don't think there's cad software without a very high learning curve.
[22:02:01] <zeeshan-mill> there is
[22:02:05] <zeeshan-mill> solidworks
[22:02:09] <zeeshan-mill> and inventor
[22:02:17] <furrywolf> I mean, you're supposed to take two semesters to learn how to use a pencil and paper... :P
[22:02:22] <zeeshan-mill> i can give show you around the basics in about 2 hours
[22:02:30] <Praesmeodymium> autdesks fusion 360 is a free to hobbyiest version of inventor
[22:02:46] <zeeshan-mill> fusion 360 is also a pos
[22:02:57] <zeeshan-mill> :)
[22:03:10] <Praesmeodymium> not gonna disagree, for making simple stls for my3d printer it gets there
[22:03:24] <furrywolf> what about for a mill, not a glue gun? :)
[22:03:34] <zeeshan-mill> you can use it for a mill
[22:03:46] <zeeshan-mill> but its like they purposely made it so you'd commit suicide after 1 week of using it
[22:04:12] <furrywolf> lol
[22:04:25] <Praesmeodymium> yeah its not very smart, like you have to make and add joints in a very specific order to get them to move right
[22:04:45] <zeeshan-mill> Praesmeodymium, i dont understand why they made the mating so barbaric
[22:04:57] <zeeshan-mill> like almost all cad software have it working right
[22:05:04] <zeeshan-mill> these guys went through the hassle to make it harder to use
[22:05:28] <Praesmeodymium> I was trying to get a piston and rotor linkage modeled lol just say no in 360
[22:05:42] <furrywolf> according to their website, it's not free. also, their website fucking sucks. I haven't been able to find anything else about it yet, because it doesn't work.
[22:06:07] <zeeshan-mill> i usually don't endorse a software
[22:06:18] <Praesmeodymium> its free for a bunch of reasons, I just passed my first year and had to renew... still free
[22:06:25] <zeeshan-mill> but i really have used a couple cad software both professionally , for education and for hobby
[22:06:26] <furrywolf> do they simply not understand that not everyone has a gigabit internet connection?
[22:06:27] <CaptHindsight> NX totally rocks
[22:06:42] <CaptHindsight> even in the 90's
[22:06:44] <zeeshan-mill> nx, inventor, catia, solidworks, solidedge
[22:06:47] <furrywolf> I've been loading their website since someone first mentioned it, and it's STILL not loaded in any useful fashion.
[22:06:54] <zeeshan-mill> by far my favourite is solidworks
[22:07:08] <zeeshan-mill> after using the other software, my head usually is hurting
[22:07:10] <Praesmeodymium> thats the one all my pro friends swear by
[22:07:14] <malcom2073> furrywolf: forget about cloud software with DSL :P
[22:07:20] <zeeshan-mill> but after solidworks, it feels like you didnt even do any work
[22:07:24] <zeeshan-mill> and im not exagerrating
[22:07:34] <furrywolf> fusion 360 appears to be $40 a month (fuck that!), "cloud based" (so utterly worthless), and doesn't run on usable operating systems.
[22:07:49] <CaptHindsight> zeeshan: I rotate weekly bettween them. It keeps me freshly confused
[22:07:53] <malcom2073> furrywolf: Check out onshape :P
[22:07:57] <zeeshan-mill> CaptHindsight, haha
[22:07:59] <zeeshan-mill> between which?
[22:08:18] <furrywolf> their website also doesn't function on a 1024x768 screen. are they on drugs?
[22:08:28] <os1r1s> furrywolf: You can do the non-profit version of 360 for free for 3 year
[22:08:29] <os1r1s> s
[22:08:36] <malcom2073> furrywolf: Typically, if you're still running 1024x768, you don't have internet anyway
[22:08:37] <zeeshan-mill> can someone help me setup tools on a mill
[22:08:40] <zeeshan-mill> id greatly appreciate it
[22:08:48] <zeeshan-mill> step by step
[22:08:50] <zeeshan-mill> i learn better by doing
[22:08:56] <zeeshan-mill> i want to use the table + dowel method
[22:09:01] <zeeshan-mill> im in g53 right ow
[22:09:02] <CaptHindsight> SW has cut (add) and extrude (remove), NX has extrude to both add and remove
[22:09:16] <furrywolf> os1r1s: no, I can't do, because it's not for any operating systems I use, and apparantly is some worthless cloud garbage anyway, despite needing to download binaries.
[22:09:37] <os1r1s> furrywolf: It works ok. I've used the CAM side.
[22:09:54] <furrywolf> how can something both be cloud based AND need OS-specific binaries? isn't the entire point of cloud crap to NOT need local binaries?
[22:09:57] <os1r1s> furrywolf: Pretty sure it works on linux too
[22:10:18] <furrywolf> os1r1s: again, it's not going to work for me.
[22:10:19] <furrywolf> I'm not changing my operating system nor moving somewhere with broadband just to run a piece of software.
[22:10:37] <os1r1s> Ok
[22:11:52] <zeeshan-mill> .625
[22:12:14] <CaptHindsight> I get all my CAD software when in China for ~$2
[22:12:30] <furrywolf> if I try downloading it, I get "ur operating system is not supported. Fusion 360 is supported on 64-bit Windows 7 or newer and 64-bit Mac OS X 10.9 or new". yes, it's missing both the start and the end. because they're UTTERLY FUCKING INCOMPETENT and can't write a website that renders at 1024x768, nor CSS that lets text wrap instead of clipping.
[22:12:32] <malcom2073> Why buy pirate software? Just pirate it yourself for free?
[22:13:13] <furrywolf> I have a hard time imagining a company that can't master basic web design can write cloud software.
[22:13:48] <CaptHindsight> malcom2073: these are all from legit sites, Solidworkers, SeeMens, PTTTC etc :)
[22:14:13] <malcom2073> CaptHindsight: Certainly doesn't sound entirely legit :P
[22:14:26] <CaptHindsight> AutoDesking
[22:15:12] <CaptHindsight> it's just the translation, after all Chinese doesn't use the same alphabet :)
[22:15:16] * furrywolf writes a cad program and names it HeadDesk
[22:22:40] <furrywolf> NX doesn't seem to have anything on their website about either pricing or OS support. They do, however, have a working website, so I assume their product is far superior to Fusion 360. (really. first impressions matter. If your website fucking sucks, that's what everyone will think about you!)
[22:23:13] <CaptHindsight> zeeshan: you'll have to ping cradek in the morning, I don't think he's ever on this late
[22:26:54] <zeeshan-mill> ah
[22:28:16] <furrywolf> I don't see how companies don't realize that their website forms a customer's first impression of them, and thus try to make them not suck.
[22:30:30] <furrywolf> I'm sure if these companies had a physical showroom, it'd be shiny, clean, and functional. It wouldn't have broken furniture, doors to nowhere, sparking wires, etc. And yet that's how they run their websites...
[22:32:37] <furrywolf> NX is apparantly in the $30,000 price range, the linux version has fewer features than the windows version, and it requires hardware 3d acceleration. so.... no.
[22:35:23] <furrywolf> because obviously someone is going to spend the cost of a new sportscar for a piece of software.
[22:35:28] <furrywolf> or a new house.
[23:12:52] <furrywolf> argh. I emailed someone on craigslist about a pickup shell, asking what vehicle it fits. I got back "It fit any standard size truck bed ". Really? didn't even mention short or long? lol
[23:25:32] <spline> heh
[23:25:49] <spline> 'yeah I got tires for sale" "what size?" "I don't know. they fit on a car's wheel"
[23:26:24] <furrywolf> lol
[23:28:25] <furrywolf> I've had pretty much that exact conversation.
[23:28:42] <furrywolf> or you see things like "Set of tires. Fits Toyota."
[23:29:05] <furrywolf> Because, as we all know, toyota doesn't make an assortment of cars, trucks, etc, and only makes one thing with one size tire.
[23:42:10] <zeeshan-mill> yay all my tools defined
[23:42:16] <zeeshan-mill> ill find out this weekend if this tapping shit works
[23:42:21] <zeeshan-mill> along with tool offsets
[23:43:01] <zeeshan-mill> someoen correct me if im wrong, but after ive done defining all the tools at a single point with no g92 offsets as zero
[23:43:18] <zeeshan-mill> all i gotta do now is load a tool next time i turn on the machine using t2 m6 g43 for example
[23:43:25] <zeeshan-mill> and go do a g54
[23:43:30] <zeeshan-mill> and all the positions will be correct
[23:43:32] <furrywolf> dunno. send me a machine with a tool changer and I'll let you know.
[23:43:39] <zeeshan-mill> lol
[23:43:51] <zeeshan-mill> dude my buddy needs the plate with 216 10-24 holes
[23:44:10] <zeeshan-mill> i got so lucky, my floating tap holder has a collet for a 10-24 tap!
[23:44:12] <zeeshan-mill> dont have to buy one
[23:44:18] <furrywolf> 10-24 instead of 10-32? weirdo.
[23:44:25] <zeeshan-mill> yea they want coarse thread
[23:44:27] <zeeshan-mill> its for a table
[23:44:34] <zeeshan-mill> where the bolts will be taken out a lot
[23:44:37] <zeeshan-mill> so more so for service
[23:44:48] <zeeshan-mill> 10-32 has a higher chance to strip
[23:45:23] <furrywolf> I want to make tapping work on mine too, but it's going to take some kludging to work around my capacitor-start induction motors.
[23:45:31] <zeeshan-mill> im not sure if it works for mine
[23:45:42] <renesis> 10-24 are weird!
[23:46:01] <zeeshan-mill> whats weird about 10-24
[23:46:06] <renesis> 10-32 are rackmount, usually okay, sometimes stripped
[23:46:08] <zeeshan-mill> its a coarse version of #10
[23:46:16] <renesis> its not 10-32
[23:46:25] <zeeshan-mill> 10-24 is used all over electrical panels
[23:46:31] <renesis> i used 10-24 for a bunch of fixtures
[23:46:50] <furrywolf> the best part about 10-32 is you can put 8-32 screws in the holes - even if you're an aircraft mechanic!
[23:47:10] <renesis> but im around rack mount stuff a lot so 10-32 is normal
[23:56:27] <zeeshan-mill> ROFL furry
[23:59:13] <furrywolf> zeeshan: that happened on an airline flight... windshield blew out because the mechanic replaced it, installing new 8-32 screws in the 10-32 holes.
[23:59:25] <furrywolf> can't remember which one offhand, but I'm sure a google will find it.
