#linuxcnc | Logs for 2015-06-08

[00:01:22] <XXCoder> mill more 2.5d but yeah
[00:01:59] * furrywolf points xxcoder at a 5-axis mill
[00:06:05] <XXCoder> furrywolf: I know, im talking about typical mill
[00:14:03] <toastyde2th> 2.5d refers to a very specific type of servo drive on milling machines that most machines do not have
[00:14:53] <toastyde2th> (not that it super-matters here but just for general knowledge)
[00:16:38] <norias> what's the difference?
[00:17:20] <toastyde2th> 2.5d controls have 2 servo drive cards and a matrix switch
[00:17:32] <toastyde2th> so they have 3 axes but only 2 drivers
[00:17:57] <toastyde2th> and a line of g-code may contain only two axes of control
[00:18:22] <norias> huh.
[00:18:34] <norias> so, the machine itself is really 2.5d, then
[00:18:37] <XXCoder> interesting. I was reffering to fact that mills can do "top part" of sphere
[00:18:38] <toastyde2th> yup
[00:19:02] <norias> i've heard of machines that were only 2.5d, but i never knew why
[00:19:05] <toastyde2th> you'll also see it written 2+1 sometimes, but the "+" notation usually refers to a non-cutting axis
[00:19:14] <toastyde2th> rather than a non-contouring axis
[00:19:40] <norias> i've seen more 3+1
[00:19:44] <toastyde2th> it's way more common in multiaxis machines, you'll often see cheaper 5 axis mills as 3+2
[00:19:49] <norias> or even 3+2
[00:19:56] <norias> yeah
[00:19:58] <toastyde2th> where there are a full 5 servo control cards
[00:20:14] <norias> so, it's to save on cards?
[00:20:15] <toastyde2th> but the axis can only rapid move
[00:20:28] <toastyde2th> the 2.5d is for cost, yes
[00:20:30] <norias> i've been told on some machines
[00:20:39] <norias> it's the motors are not continuous duty rated
[00:20:45] <toastyde2th> 3+1 or 3+2 is for either cost savings, or for high accuracy
[00:20:58] <norias> hmm. ok
[00:21:00] <toastyde2th> an indexing table is farrrr more accurate than a contouring table
[00:21:02] <chopper79> pcw_home: Upgrade worked now it shows the smart serial tab. thank you sir
[00:21:09] <furrywolf> speaking of multi-axis... for cncing a rotary table, I always see ones with manual locking clamps... I assume these have too much slop unlocked to be cnced usefully?
[00:21:11] <norias> i can see the logic there
[00:21:21] <toastyde2th> furrywolf, generally yesw
[00:21:45] <toastyde2th> you CAN cnc with them as long as you don't change direction; you basically have to treat it like you would any non-backlash-nut leadscrew axis
[00:21:59] <toastyde2th> also avoid climb milling and so on
[00:22:06] <furrywolf> so where do I get an affordable good-for-cnc 6" table? heh
[00:22:24] <toastyde2th> good luck, unfortuantely
[00:22:52] <XXCoder> furrywolf: jst a table
[00:22:53] <XXCoder> ?
[00:23:07] <toastyde2th> if you can find an older rotary table *with* backlash adjustment, it will work
[00:23:08] <XXCoder> can do curb hunting find some old kitchen table or something lol
[00:23:23] <toastyde2th> there are also older rotabs with drive nuts on them
[00:23:28] <furrywolf> XXCoder: please read more than just a few words out of a line. :P
[00:23:28] <toastyde2th> that were actually built to be driven
[00:23:38] <XXCoder> I did
[00:23:51] <XXCoder> wasnt sure what you meant "good for cnc 6" table"
[00:23:57] <toastyde2th> if you plan on keeping it light, even a shitty rotab will cnc
[00:24:13] <furrywolf> so what part of "for cncing a rotary table" turned into "some old kitchen table or something"? lol
[00:24:14] <toastyde2th> just don't reverse direction, don't climb mill, and give light thumb pressure on the brake
[00:24:50] <chopper79> When configuring the pncconf. I have 1 encoder enabled, and I want to use that for the THCAD300 signal in. what should I select out of the available options?
[00:25:06] <XXCoder> ahh
[00:25:48] <furrywolf> I'm guessing any kind of direct belt drive without a worm reduction would be too sloppy and chatter?
[00:26:11] <XXCoder> what about those umm toothed belt type?
[00:26:16] <toastyde2th> furrywolf, far too sloppy
[00:26:55] <furrywolf> I have some worm boxes, but none have adjustable backlash
[00:27:13] <furrywolf> only thing I have with adjustable backlash is subaru windshield wiper motors. :)
[00:27:21] <toastyde2th> most decent older worm-driven rotabs have backlash adjusters
[00:27:23] <furrywolf> (because subaru liked overengineering everything)
[00:27:25] <toastyde2th> they're also heavy as fuck
[00:27:31] <XXCoder> wiper motor cnc ;)
[00:28:17] <zeeshan> spin it one way
[00:28:17] <zeeshan> :p
[00:28:46] <furrywolf> zeeshan: did you see the ring end gap measurements?
[00:28:52] <zeeshan> yes massive
[00:28:55] <XXCoder> oh yeah!
[00:29:04] <XXCoder> zeeshan: I checked oil cap thing
[00:29:16] <zeeshan> what did you find out
[00:29:17] <XXCoder> vacuum thats constant
[00:29:27] <zeeshan> can you feel strong pulses?
[00:29:30] <XXCoder> nope
[00:29:35] <zeeshan> hm
[00:29:53] <zeeshan> if youre feeling vacuum
[00:29:58] <zeeshan> that means your pcv is working too
[00:29:58] <zeeshan> lol
[00:30:18] <XXCoder> oxy sensors?
[00:30:30] <zeeshan> well you said its blue smoke
[00:30:35] <zeeshan> oxy sensors will give you black smoke
[00:30:39] <zeeshan> from running too rich
[00:30:43] <XXCoder> no, only light gray and small amount
[00:30:48] <zeeshan> bad o2 sensors
[00:30:50] <XXCoder> not very often either
[00:30:55] <zeeshan> well its a 96+
[00:31:05] <zeeshan> youd get an engine light if sensor failed
[00:31:28] <XXCoder> only lights I get is p0400 flow problem with egr
[00:31:39] <zeeshan> b/s code :p
[00:31:43] <toastyde2th> lol
[00:31:49] <toastyde2th> any p04xx
[00:31:56] <toastyde2th> "welp, could be literally anything"
[00:32:00] <XXCoder> I wish it said 401 or 402
[00:32:03] <furrywolf> egr stuck open can cause rich condition, but you'd usually end up with a fuel trim code.
[00:32:04] <toastyde2th> "turns out my tire wasn't bolted on properly"
[00:32:12] <XXCoder> not 400 which means either underflow or too much
[00:32:23] <zeeshan> fak egr and nox reduction!
[00:32:26] <XXCoder> furrywolf: it passed test so not sure whats going on
[00:32:36] <zeeshan> i'd drive it and monitor your oil level
[00:32:38] <XXCoder> it stalled with vacuum too early
[00:32:41] <zeeshan> after you put 500 miles on it
[00:32:52] <zeeshan> if your oil level hasn;'t gone done by a lot, i wouldnt worry about it :P
[00:33:04] <XXCoder> im not sure if its major problem
[00:33:15] <furrywolf> worn valve guides will cause oil burning with no blowby issues
[00:33:19] <zeeshan> yea
[00:33:25] <zeeshan> i personally think its a valve steam seal
[00:33:33] <zeeshan> those nissans destroy them all the time
[00:33:35] <XXCoder> it is 190k mile van after all so probably
[00:33:37] <furrywolf> if you're bored, pull your spark plugs and see if they're oil fouled or not.
[00:33:46] <XXCoder> furrywolf: hmm old ones was
[00:33:47] <zeeshan> fak im stupid
[00:33:49] <zeeshan> thats a GOOD one
[00:33:55] <furrywolf> the best option, however, is just to drive it until it becomes an actual problem. :P
[00:34:09] <zeeshan> were they soaked in oil on the electrode?
[00:34:12] <zeeshan> or the threads
[00:34:17] <furrywolf> the best way of prioritizing problems is to wait and see which ones get worse. :P
[00:34:43] <XXCoder> electrode, one thing is cyl #4 sparkplug is in "danger zone" for stripping
[00:34:50] <XXCoder> it was so hard getting it out and in
[00:35:06] <XXCoder> so less remove/reinsert the better
[00:35:07] <zeeshan> check all the others
[00:35:08] <zeeshan> lol
[00:35:10] <furrywolf> so someone crossthreaded it
[00:35:12] <zeeshan> except that one :P
[00:35:25] <XXCoder> fur likely. its not quite all way in
[00:35:28] <furrywolf> they just spin freely except for the last/first half turn
[00:35:32] <XXCoder> I'd guess few mm short
[00:35:43] <furrywolf> if they don't, they're dirty or crossthreaded.
[00:35:53] <zeeshan> http://www.dragstuff.com/images/plugs/110505-909-n3.jpg
[00:35:55] <zeeshan> did it look like this
[00:36:04] <XXCoder> dirtier
[00:36:11] <zeeshan> wetter?
[00:36:19] <XXCoder> not sure its been a bit
[00:36:22] <XXCoder> but darker yes
[00:36:27] <XXCoder> cyl 4 was so bad
[00:36:30] <furrywolf> speaking of oil fouling plugs, the generator managed to completely black glop the spark plug in the 15 mins I ran it.
[00:36:49] <zeeshan> http://www.carbasics.co.uk/spark_plug_inspection_1.jpg
[00:36:55] <zeeshan> this is what a normal running plug should look like
[00:37:07] <furrywolf> so you have an old engine that burns some oil. as long as you can see out your back window, and don't need to refill it every time you get gas, keep driving it. :P
[00:37:13] <XXCoder> 3 was like that just little bit blacker
[00:37:22] <furrywolf> a quart of Lucas can also work wonders
[00:37:24] <XXCoder> LOT more miles I guess
[00:37:27] <XXCoder> LUCAS?
[00:37:50] <XXCoder> zeeshan: #4 had some goop, could rub bit off
[00:37:58] <XXCoder> other 2 has thin coating of it
[00:38:12] <XXCoder> remaining 3 just bit more black than your good one
[00:38:18] <furrywolf> http://lucasoil.com/products/engine-oil-additives/lucas-heavy-duty-oil-stabilizer
[00:38:50] <zeeshan> XXCoder: if its a valve steam seal
[00:38:57] <zeeshan> you'll eventually start mis firing
[00:38:58] <zeeshan> ;p
[00:39:21] <furrywolf> it won't misfire until it completely fouls the plug.
[00:39:28] <zeeshan> oh trust meeeeee
[00:39:33] <zeeshan> when that shit drowns in oil
[00:39:36] <zeeshan> it'll complain
[00:39:38] <zeeshan> :D
[00:39:49] <XXCoder> I wonder if "pissed idle" is slight misfires
[00:39:59] <zeeshan> youll get a code
[00:40:12] <zeeshan> i think you need like 4 misfires in a certain crank rotation to throw a code
[00:40:12] <furrywolf> I've driven vehicles with severe oil consumption issues, including valve guides. it won't misfire until the plug isn't sparking.
[00:40:16] <XXCoder> pissed off idle is one thing I want to stop, I hate it
[00:40:35] <zeeshan> XXCoder: when do you notice the smoke
[00:40:47] <XXCoder> not sure its hard to catch
[00:40:58] <XXCoder> its so thin if vans moving it dont shpw up
[00:41:06] <XXCoder> and when its parjked after drive it dont show up
[00:41:08] <zeeshan> if its valve steam seals
[00:41:18] <zeeshan> youll notice it right away @ cold start
[00:41:47] <furrywolf> consider a 2-stroke will happily burn a 10:1 fuel:oil mix... the equivalent of burning over a gallon of oil with every tank of gas... it takes a lot of oil burning before it directly causes misses.
[00:41:57] <XXCoder> probably not then since its pissed off idle only when warmed up
[00:42:09] <zeeshan> furrywolf: im referring to fouled plugs
[00:42:11] <zeeshan> causing misfire
[00:42:18] <zeeshan> not direction oil mixture causing misifire
[00:42:22] <zeeshan> direction = direct
[00:42:30] <furrywolf> if it's intake valve stem seals, you'll notice a puff when you first accelerate after coasting down a long hill using engine braking. if it's rings, it'll smoke worst at full throttle, continually.
[00:42:53] <furrywolf> zeeshan: and like the 2-stroke that runs happily, it takes a while to foul a plug. :P
[00:43:02] <zeeshan> furrywolf: what do you think is the reason that you get a shit load of oil burning
[00:43:05] <zeeshan> when you're off throttle
[00:43:06] <XXCoder> definitely not rings, it never snokes at trottle as well as passing case vacuum test
[00:43:08] <zeeshan> coasting
[00:43:21] <zeeshan> im almost positive my burning oil stuff was the turbos
[00:43:33] <zeeshan> cause if i drove around nromally not hitting boost
[00:43:38] <zeeshan> there would be no oil burning.
[00:43:41] <furrywolf> zeeshan: continual high vacuum sucks the most oil down the intake valve guides.
[00:43:50] <zeeshan> but asap i hit boost, there would be oil burning after 4500 rpm
[00:44:00] <furrywolf> coasting causes the highest vacuum
[00:44:02] <zeeshan> and then asap i let go of throttle, it'd leave a nice trail
[00:44:11] <zeeshan> thats why i never thought it was valve seals for me
[00:44:27] <furrywolf> closing the throttle at high rpms also creates a really high vacuum. :)
[00:44:42] <zeeshan> yes, but if i revved to 6000 without boost
[00:44:43] <furrywolf> and the valves are stroking quickly, so moving more oil down with them
[00:44:44] <zeeshan> i had no burning
[00:45:01] <furrywolf> dunno. I've never owned a boosted vehicle.
[00:45:07] <zeeshan> isnt your subie boosted
[00:45:13] <furrywolf> no
[00:45:17] <zeeshan> why
[00:45:21] <zeeshan> !~
[00:45:25] <furrywolf> I just put in a newer, larger engine.
[00:45:47] <furrywolf> what I really want more of is low-end grunt, which a turbo wouldn't even help with. lol
[00:46:01] <XXCoder> im considering seafoaming my van, then do oil change after 50 miles then add lucas
[00:46:02] <furrywolf> I miss the torque curve of my old engine, peaking at 1800. new engine is 4500 or something.
[00:46:15] <furrywolf> seafoam is an excellent way to make hidden problems into not-hidden problems.
[00:46:28] <XXCoder> yeah that is my concern
[00:46:37] <furrywolf> just drive it. lol
[00:46:46] <furrywolf> how many miles does it take to use a quart of oil?
[00:47:00] <XXCoder> unknown, checked and its "bit low"
[00:47:06] <XXCoder> but then havent oil changed for a bit
[00:47:29] <furrywolf> anything over 1000 is considered acceptable. most car manufacturers won't consider a warranty claim for oil consumption unless it's worse than that.
[00:48:13] <furrywolf> the lucas product I pasted works quite well for vehicles with leaky valve guides.
[00:48:36] <furrywolf> ignore all the marketing claims... what it really does is make the oil stringy and tacky, so it doesn't get sucked down the guides.
[00:49:21] <XXCoder> ok
[00:49:48] <zeeshan> wtf 1:30am
[00:50:04] <furrywolf> you can get similar products with names like "nosmoke" and "motor honey", but the lucas seems to work somewhat better.
[00:50:14] <furrywolf> yeah, I'm getting ready for bed.
[00:50:38] <XXCoder> thanks for advice guys
[00:50:52] <XXCoder> looks like oil change then lucas in my van future
[00:50:58] <XXCoder> it need to last 2 more years
[00:51:12] <XXCoder> till I get elio
[00:51:21] <furrywolf> lucas is also good for transmissions and transfer cases... I run my truck's transfer case off a 50/50 mix of it and gear oil. the stringy, tacky oil leaks through the bad seals (of which the transfer case has entirely) slower.
[00:51:40] <norias> hmm
[00:51:58] <norias> i wonder what bob the oil guy
[00:52:02] <norias> thinks of lucas
[00:53:15] <XXCoder> wonder what george lucas think of lucas
[00:54:18] <norias> heh
[00:54:30] <furrywolf> lucas has a lot of marketing hype about making engines last longer, etc, etc... I don't know about any of that. I suspect a lot of it is marketing. it does, however, work excellently at reducing oil consumption, by thickening the oil and making it stringy.
[00:56:19] <furrywolf> even pouring it, it's like hot pizza cheese... you go to pull the bottle away from the oil filter, and it stays connected by long strings... if there's wind, they'll blow out several feet before they break...
[00:57:15] <furrywolf> s/filter/filler
[00:57:27] <XXCoder> heh thanks for warning
[00:58:05] <norias> rumor is
[00:58:10] <norias> it's just 50w oil
[00:59:34] <furrywolf> norias: no, it's not. it's much, much thicker.
[00:59:42] <furrywolf> if it's cold, you can't even get it out of the bottle.
[00:59:57] <furrywolf> I had to warm a gallon jug of it in a gas station sink once. :)
[01:01:00] <furrywolf> I don't know about its use in a properly functioning engine, but it definitely makes the oil leak slower.
[01:01:37] <norias> yeah, by raising the viscosity at operating temp
[01:01:44] <norias> not necessarily a good thing
[01:02:04] <norias> changes the parameters of properly engineered oil in the car
[01:02:17] <norias> and dilutes the ppm of any good additives in a good oil
[01:05:03] <furrywolf> and makes it not go down valve guides. :P
[01:05:11] <furrywolf> or leak out bad seals
[01:05:17] <norias> i think that making your oil heavier
[01:05:25] <norias> will give you trouble at startup
[01:05:36] <norias> plus, if it's really an unmodified natural oil
[01:05:38] <furrywolf> let's put it this way... I only add it to vehicles with oil consumption issues.
[01:05:54] <norias> it won't have the correct viscosity / temp curve
[01:05:56] <XXCoder> mine dont seem that bad
[01:06:19] <furrywolf> no, yours you should just drive, like we've all already told you.
[01:06:52] <XXCoder> yeah
[01:07:06] <XXCoder> oil changes in future though its been a while since last change.
[01:07:06] <furrywolf> norias: I suspect it's more complicated than that. it really behaves stringy and almost stretchy. not like just thick oil.
[01:07:22] <norias> on a positive note
[01:07:29] <norias> i found out lowes and home depot
[01:07:34] <norias> have a veterans discount
[01:07:44] <furrywolf> are both going out of business? yay!
[01:07:48] <furrywolf> ... oh. they're not.
[01:07:48] <furrywolf> bleh
[01:07:58] <furrywolf> you said it was positive!
[01:08:16] * furrywolf doesn't like either one, especially not home depot
[01:08:31] <XXCoder> lowes isnt bad
[01:08:36] <XXCoder> better than walmart thats for sure
[01:08:50] <norias> i have... a few choices
[01:08:52] <furrywolf> bbl, wolfy bedtime
[01:09:02] <norias> lowes, home depot, busy beaver and true value
[01:09:09] <norias> lowes and home depot seem better stocked
[01:09:11] <furrywolf> find a local independent store?
[01:09:28] <norias> i just listed my options
[01:09:40] <furrywolf> heh. I have no idea what a busy beaver is...
[01:09:49] <norias> yeah...
[01:09:56] <norias> well
[01:10:01] <norias> oh,and 84 lumber
[01:10:08] <norias> which is sort of a local place
[01:10:17] <norias> or irwin builders supply
[01:10:36] <norias> another really local chain that really targets companies
[01:11:00] <furrywolf> you probably have no other choices because home depot intentionally eliminates them. when they open a new store, they set their prices well below all the local stores, even if it's below their cost. they're big enough they don't mind losing money, and can afford to do so for quite a long time. once all this dumping causes the local places to lose customers and go out of business, then they jack prices back up to normal.
[01:11:32] <norias> eh
[01:11:46] <norias> i don't know if that's totally true
[01:12:04] <norias> i think there's a world with a good eco system for big box stores (that have advantages)
[01:12:08] <norias> and smaller local stuff
[01:12:37] <norias> the local stores just need to be able to provide what the big boxes can't
[01:12:48] <norias> niche items, better technical advise
[01:13:00] <norias> like, say plastering tools
[01:13:10] <furrywolf> the local stores can't provide running a store at a loss for an indefinite period until the competition goes away. only big chains can do that.
[01:13:10] <norias> i'll never buy plastering tools at lowes or home depot
[01:13:19] <norias> because the ones they stock are terrible
[01:13:34] <furrywolf> everything they stock is terrible. :P
[01:13:39] <norias> not true
[01:13:49] <norias> the plastering supplies
[01:13:56] <norias> are the exact stuff i grew up with
[01:14:09] <norias> now, the really oddball plastering supplies aren't there
[01:14:17] <norias> but, basic stuff is
[01:14:24] <norias> and it's reasonably priced
[01:15:00] <furrywolf> ... didn't you just say it was terrible?
[01:15:11] <furrywolf> also, I typed that as tribble the first time. I need to get to bed.
[01:15:14] <XXCoder> specific items was terrible, he said
[01:15:36] <norias> i said the tools were terrible
[01:15:42] <norias> the supplies are good (materials)
[01:17:12] <furrywolf> ah
[01:18:16] <furrywolf> bbl
[01:19:43] <norias> lates
[01:34:01] <chopper79> quick question.... does anybody know what program will open he .KO modules? i need to modify one for a configuration I am working on.
[01:34:14] <chopper79> *he - the
[01:34:20] <chopper79> =
[01:35:13] <chopper79> I need to make a gantry comp file for homing to square the gantry
[01:42:41] <archivist> hal comps are compiled you go back to the source
[01:44:44] <archivist> but check first you may just need to edit your homing sequence in the ini for the gantry
[01:50:06] <chopper79> already did that, but using mesa electronics and need to intercept the signals
[01:52:52] <chopper79> # ----- Tandem Homing
[01:52:52] <chopper79> # y-axis gantry
[01:52:53] <chopper79> ###net x1pos-cmd gantry.0.joint.00.pos-cmd => hm2_5i25.0.stepgen.01.position-cmd
[01:52:53] <chopper79> ###net x1pos-fb gantry.0.joint.00.pos-fb <= hm2_5i25.0.stepgen.01.position-fb
[01:52:53] <chopper79> ###net x2pos-cmd gantry.0.joint.01.pos-cmd => hm2_5i25.0.stepgen.02.position-cmd
[01:52:53] <chopper79> ###net x2pos-fb gantry.0.joint.01.pos-fb <= hm2_5i25.0.stepgen.02.position-fb
[01:52:53] <chopper79> ###net xpos-cmd gantry.0.position-cmd <= axis.0.motor-pos-cmd
[01:52:54] <chopper79> ###net xpos-fb gantry.0.position-fb => axis.0.motor-pos-fb
[01:52:54] <chopper79> ###net xenable axis.0.amp-enable-out => hm2_5i25.0.stepgen.01.enable hm2_5i25.0.stepgen.02.enable
[01:52:55] <chopper79> ###setp gantry.0.search-vel [AXIS_0]HOME_SEARCH_VEL
[01:52:55] <chopper79> # ---setup home / limit switch signals---
[01:52:56] <chopper79> # debounce the y-axis switches and connect them to signals
[01:52:57] <chopper79> ##net switches-x1 <= limit in (Pin)
[01:52:57] <chopper79> ##net switches-x2 <= limit in (Pin)
[01:53:52] <chopper79> did not expect that much text..sorry. But I need to do something like this but needs to go through a comp file.
[02:14:23] <archivist> then connect the nets to the pins of the comp
[02:20:09] <Deejay> moin
[02:20:56] <XXCoder> yesno
[02:21:39] <Jymmm> maybe
[02:22:17] <Deejay> does not matter
[02:23:06] <Jymmm> We are ALL matter, and flesh, and bone, and guts, and stuff!
[02:23:34] <Deejay> but matter is just energy
[02:24:06] <Deejay> E=mc²
[02:24:08] <Jymmm> and what is energy?
[02:24:20] <Deejay> hmm, not sure about that
[02:24:27] <XXCoder> e=mc2
[02:24:44] <Deejay> now we are back on topic :)
[02:25:03] <Jymmm> e=mcHammer
[08:15:22] <cthompson> sent an email to one of our developers that, paraphrased, was "Do you want A, B or C?"
[08:15:25] <cthompson> I swear to god, he replied "Yes."
[08:15:50] <furrywolf> That happens.
[08:16:33] <furrywolf> You need to either pick one, in which case it'll be the wrong one and be all your fault, or do all three, in which case it'll cost three times too much and take three times too long, and be all four fault.
[08:16:44] <furrywolf> s/four/your
[08:16:56] <cthompson> he's getting A
[08:45:28] <dirty_d> how should i fix a small gouge in a crankshaft sealing surface made by a grinder cutting wheel?
[08:45:42] <dirty_d> just weld and file down then sand and polish?
[08:46:34] <SpeedEvil> http://www.yotatech.com/f188/using-jbweld-front-crank-sealing-surface-246059/ seems legit
[08:47:59] <dirty_d> i dont think i'd trust jbweld
[08:48:11] <dirty_d> i could tig braze silicon bronze rod i guess
[08:48:34] <dirty_d> that would reduce heat at least
[08:48:38] <SpeedEvil> Weld and then machine is probably the best option
[08:48:58] <SpeedEvil> Avoiding the hot-spotting issue by going all the way round
[08:49:34] <SpeedEvil> Of course - you have checked if the nick actually is on the bit used by the seal, and not just next to it?
[08:50:19] <dirty_d> yea
[08:50:41] <dirty_d> its a small gouge, like 1/16" wide and 1/4" long
[08:50:47] <dirty_d> but it would tear up a rubber seal
[08:51:04] <dirty_d> i think it would be easy enough to fix it by hand
[08:51:10] <dirty_d> i dont have the tools to machine it anyway
[08:51:22] <dirty_d> just needs to be smooth enough for the seal
[08:51:33] <dirty_d> nothing needs to fit that part perfectly
[08:52:22] <dirty_d> never tig brazed, but it looks very pleasant https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F2_hXQ4ABrg
[08:53:07] <SpeedEvil> Do you have tig?
[08:53:30] <furrywolf> weld, file to slightly larger, then shape with emery cloth pulled from the other side so it becomes nice and smooth
[08:53:47] <SpeedEvil> Silver solder even I guess too
[08:54:21] <SpeedEvil> As a stupid comment - lead.
[08:54:25] <furrywolf> I'd worry about the wear properties of anything other than more steel. consider the oil seal wears a groove in the nice hard steel... it'll go right through softer metal.
[08:54:30] <SpeedEvil> I'm not sure thaat wouldn';t work
[08:54:34] <SpeedEvil> furrywolf: I guess
[08:54:55] <SpeedEvil> I was thinking for a moment it was a clean oil film, but it's not quite
[08:56:17] <furrywolf> steel is harder than braze which is harder than solder which is harder than lead which is harder than jbweld :P
[08:57:38] <dirty_d> yea ill just weld it
[08:57:47] <dirty_d> ER70S will do?
[08:57:53] <dirty_d> not sure what the crank is made of
[08:58:09] <furrywolf> dunno. for that small of a ding, probably doesn't matter.
[08:58:26] <dirty_d> yea i wouldnt think so
[08:58:41] <dirty_d> maybe ill get to try out my hf arc starter https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m4ulbshPJcU
[08:58:41] <ssi> morn
[08:59:47] <furrywolf> I need a TIG setup... need to weld a bunch of alu one of these days.
[09:00:28] <dirty_d> yea me too
[09:00:35] <dirty_d> i had a DC tig, but it broke
[09:00:42] <dirty_d> ive just been connecting it to my arc welder
[09:01:06] <dirty_d> hopefully my AC inverter will be done by this weekend though
[09:01:49] <dirty_d> grab some of these and throw one together http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-Hitachi-MBM200GR6-N-Chan-Dual-Pack-IGBT-200A-600V-Power-Module-Transistors-/351418136775?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item51d22738c7
[09:02:52] <furrywolf> I have some 600V 400A darlingtons... need a project for them one of these days. :)
[09:03:08] * furrywolf has been tempted to build an overly large audio amp
[09:03:17] <dirty_d> how do those compare to IGBTs?
[09:03:23] <dirty_d> same just current driven?
[09:03:39] <furrywolf> yes
[09:03:53] <dirty_d> what kinda base current are we talking for 400A?
[09:04:08] <SpeedEvil> depends - probably an amp for power darlingtons
[09:04:17] <SpeedEvil> Hfe for small signal ones hits >10K
[09:04:19] <furrywolf> 3A if I remember right. they're three-stage darlingtons.
[09:04:29] <SpeedEvil> But big high voltage ones are terrible
[09:04:47] <dirty_d> not so bad
[09:04:49] <furrywolf> http://fw.bushytails.net/transistor.jpg I have 12 of those...
[09:05:20] <dirty_d> high side supply might be a pain
[09:06:13] <SpeedEvil> dirty_d: not really.
[09:06:29] <dirty_d> whats the easiest way?
[09:06:35] <dirty_d> besides a battery
[09:06:35] <SpeedEvil> If you don't much care about compactness, a conventional linear transformer supply is easy
[09:06:51] <dirty_d> yea
[09:07:03] <SpeedEvil> Then an opto, and a suitable gate driver chip or transistors
[09:07:27] <SpeedEvil> Especially if you already have a pile of suitable transformers
[09:07:59] <furrywolf> if I built an audio amp out of four of them, I'd be very tempted to skip the big transformer... just rectify and filter the incoming mains.
[09:08:17] <dirty_d> i also like to live dangerously
[09:08:20] <furrywolf> the incoming 240V mains, of course. :P
[09:08:21] <ssi> lol
[09:08:37] <SpeedEvil> I have a partially built direct-off-line amp
[09:08:39] <dirty_d> i tested my HF arc starter on myself
[09:08:41] <dirty_d> i lived
[09:08:47] <SpeedEvil> it was intended to be class D
[09:09:02] <dirty_d> it successfully just burns the surface of my skin
[09:09:31] <furrywolf> these transistors are actually intended for switching applications... they have an impressively fast switching time. in the sub-10us range. I don't remember what it is off the top of my head though.
[09:09:33] <dirty_d> if i put my finger in the arc it just follows the contour of my finger
[09:10:16] <furrywolf> I could build a very, very large class D amp, instead of just a very large class AB amp...
[09:10:40] <ssi> those transistors are probably more suited to D
[09:10:45] <ssi> they're probably nonlinear as shit
[09:10:56] <dirty_d> the 200A IGBTs i got are sub 1us
[09:11:26] <dirty_d> doesnt matter though since its only switching 200Hz max
[09:11:43] <furrywolf> ssi: that's what feedback is for. :)
[09:11:55] <dirty_d> i think im just gonna set it to 150Hz 75% duty cycle and that will probably just do
[09:24:32] <SpeedEvil> dirty_d: IGBTs don't do sub 1us
[09:24:37] <SpeedEvil> I thin you're reading it wrong
[09:24:47] <SpeedEvil> Or I'm confused again.
[09:26:05] <ssi> got the RV back together and flew it last night
[09:26:06] <ssi> https://scontent-atl1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xaf1/v/t1.0-9/11406462_10100699332080412_9077317612844909026_n.jpg?oh=21eef63b0a30999f98f1964247b02940&oe=55F473DA
[09:26:10] <ssi> hooray
[09:26:51] <dirty_d> SpeedEvil, sure they do
[09:27:54] <dirty_d> typical rise and fall times of these are 200ns
[09:28:44] <dirty_d> delay times are 600ns
[09:28:55] <dirty_d> dont really care about the delay though
[09:29:14] <dirty_d> smaller IGBTs are a lot faster
[09:30:28] <SpeedEvil> I guess I was thinking of speed in comparison to MOSFETs
[09:30:49] <SpeedEvil> and that some large ones are slow enough that ~20khz or so means you have too high inear dissipation
[09:34:10] <dirty_d> yea
[09:49:17] <JT-Shop> I have 4 bottles of 242 on the shelf, I should toss one out I think
[09:52:09] <FinboySlick> dirty_d: I opened the 600V 200A transistor you linked and was thinking: Hmm, you could make a very very inefficient calculator with a few hundred of these.
[09:52:25] <dirty_d> lol
[09:53:29] <ssi> reminds me of this
[09:53:30] <ssi> http://www.engadget.com/2006/06/26/all-tube-digital-clock-seven-years-in-the-making/
[09:53:38] <CaptHindsight> add a few hundred vacuum tubes and contactors for storage
[10:01:06] <SpeedEvil> FinboySlick: http://www.sparkbangbuzz.com/flame-amp/flameamp.htm
[10:01:20] <englishman> hay ssi
[10:01:23] <englishman> i passed my checkride
[10:01:25] <englishman> <-- ppm
[10:01:28] <englishman> ppl*
[10:01:29] <englishman> :)
[10:01:46] <englishman> im happy.
[10:01:48] <SpeedEvil> Is a ppm a millionth of a pilot?
[10:02:41] <englishman> the RV looks super slick
[10:05:32] <JT-Shop> ssi, do they still use imron paint for planes? I painted my Dad's 170 with that
[10:06:38] <JT-Shop> being in the ATC he had pull and got N170ET as his numbers, his initials was ET
[10:10:44] <ssi> JT-Shop: yeah imron is very common
[10:10:46] <ssi> it's expensive
[10:11:16] <ssi> I don't like my initials for tail numbers sadly
[10:11:21] <JT-Shop> all paint is expensive now a days
[10:11:59] <JT-Shop> he sold the 170 to a lady and she ground looped it an bent the gear box
[10:12:12] <ssi> daw
[10:14:28] <dirty_d> SpeedEvil, theres no way ill get any low frequency HV into my welder with this right? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m4ulbshPJcU
[10:14:36] <dirty_d> theres a schematic in the description
[10:15:04] <SpeedEvil> No
[10:19:13] <dirty_d> unless the capacitor broke down right?
[12:54:09] <Pudlo> Dumb question: Cheap spindles like these (http://www.aliexpress.com/item/1PCS-DIY-engraving-machine-300W-ER11-air-cooled-spindle-motor-power-supply-speed-controller-kit-GD006C/2048852156.html) say they can run from 12-48V. Should I be using a 48V supply for best performance, or does it not matter as long as I've got enough amperage?
[12:55:03] <Rab> Pudlo, you would want a 48V supply (or as close as you can get).
[12:56:13] <Rab> In a DC motor like that, voltage correlates to speed. So e.g. 36V will only get you so far up in the motor's speed range, regardless of how much current is available.
[12:56:34] <Pudlo> Gotcha. Cheap 48V supply it is.
[12:58:35] <Rab> The motor controllor works by PWM of the supply voltage. I theorize that 48V PWM would also give you greater efficiency and torque across the whole speed range than a lower voltage, but I don't know that for sure.
[13:29:26] <zeeshan> damn thats cheap
[13:29:34] <zeeshan> i bet that'd fit inside a cat40 tool holder
[13:41:56] <ssi> http://www.aliexpress.com/item/AC-220V-2-2kw-Water-Cooled-CNC-Spindle-Motor-2-2kw-CNC-Engraving-Milling-with-ER20/2046098295.html
[13:42:00] <ssi> I wonder if that's worth a shit
[13:51:38] <_methods> big forklift and tiny forklift
[13:51:40] <_methods> http://i.imgur.com/S41cMCn.jpg
[13:54:21] <FinboySlick> ssi: I seriously doubt it'll spin under a thousand RPM. I have a similar one and it only starts around 5000.
[13:55:49] <ssi> probably would be ok for a wood router
[13:56:07] <ssi> big forklift is big
[13:56:11] <ssi> 12,5k? or bigger?
[13:56:14] <_methods> 30k
[13:56:23] <ssi> dang
[13:56:25] <_methods> moving the big lathe in tomorrow
[13:56:28] <ssi> big forklif is very big
[13:56:35] <_methods> 36" swing 290" long
[13:56:49] <ssi> :o
[13:56:54] <_methods> heheh
[13:56:56] <_methods> big toys
[13:56:58] <FinboySlick> big lathe looks big too.
[13:57:15] <_methods> the big one isn't here yet
[13:57:16] <ssi> _methods: I got the rv in the air yesterday finally
[13:57:19] <_methods> going to get it tomorrow
[13:57:23] <_methods> ah nice
[13:57:26] <_methods> how'd it fly?
[13:57:30] <FinboySlick> So that's your 'little' lathe?
[13:57:30] <ssi> mostly good
[13:57:35] <ssi> it's running hot
[13:57:38] <ssi> need to look at the baffling
[13:57:40] <_methods> yeah that's one of our little lathes lol
[13:57:50] <ssi> plus it's got a bit of a stumble, need to check all the fuel screens and do an open ended flow test
[13:58:12] <_methods> that sounds like something yo don't want in the air lol
[13:58:23] <_methods> i don't like to stumble on the ground
[13:58:23] <ssi> that's why we test fly :P
[13:58:41] <ssi> the engine stumble, I don't really know what it is yet
[13:58:49] <ssi> it's not very significant... not even enough to make the tach needle bounce
[13:58:55] <ssi> but it's audible and you can feel it
[13:58:59] <ssi> so it may be an indication of an issue
[13:59:12] <ssi> maybe a fuel restriction, maybe carb jetting or mixture settings
[13:59:13] <ssi> dunno yet
[13:59:52] <_methods> mysteries in the air are probably not the best for your long term health
[14:00:29] <ssi> lol
[14:00:46] <ssi> it's not as bad as that
[14:00:51] <_methods> just watched the new episode of game of thrones now i want a dragon
[14:00:56] <_methods> screw an airplane
[14:01:01] <skunkworks> dad is thinking about getting one of those spindle+vfd combos for doing small cutter stuff on the k&t
[14:01:17] <_methods> skunkworks: make sure you get pics of that
[14:01:26] <ssi> I wouldn't mind getting a small ER11 spindle and trying to add live tooling to the HNC
[14:01:28] <_methods> hehe k&t with teeny tiny attached lol
[14:01:29] <ssi> that'd be awesome
[14:01:59] <_methods> does it have a turret?
[14:02:03] <_methods> or gang tooling?
[14:02:03] <ssi> yeah
[14:02:12] <_methods> the wiring might be fun
[14:02:17] <ssi> yeah heh
[14:02:24] <_methods> run it through the turret i guess
[14:02:31] <ssi> not really practical
[14:02:44] <ssi> and the turret only turns one way
[14:02:57] <_methods> oh no unwind lol
[14:03:00] <ssi> hahaha
[14:03:06] <_methods> encoder ring
[14:03:13] <_methods> whatever they call that
[14:03:16] <ssi> slip ring
[14:03:19] <_methods> yeah
[14:03:28] <_methods> slip ring it i guess at teh turret somewhere
[14:03:32] <_methods> be a nightmare with coolant
[14:03:38] <ssi> yeah it's not really practical
[14:05:33] <_methods> you could do the coolant live tooling
[14:05:54] <_methods> the turret stations do have coolant right?
[14:05:57] <ssi> no
[14:06:01] <_methods> oh
[14:06:02] <_methods> damn
[14:06:09] <_methods> well no live tooling for you lol
[14:07:33] <ssi> lol
[14:12:08] <JT-Shop> ssi, is the HNC an air hog like the CHNC?
[14:21:45] <Roguish> hey all. question about Gladevcp. I am trying to create a simple panel to display the axes following error. Which one of the hal python widgets is best? needs to display a float.
[14:22:15] <Roguish> the 'label' only links to a U32.
[14:39:27] <aventtini> hello
[15:02:22] <_methods> alloo
[15:04:09] <R2E4> Hi all.
[15:06:11] <R2E4> Is there anyway you can connect two 7i77 to a 5i25?
[15:13:22] <ssi> JT-Shop: yeah it is
[15:13:51] <ssi> R2E4: yes, you can use the internal 26 pin header with a parport breakout and run two 7i77
[15:17:04] <R2E4> ssi: so use the cable to a breakout board then hardwire into the two 7i77 with the connectors?
[15:18:29] <_methods> http://gizmodo.com/a-floating-observation-dome-gives-fish-a-glimpse-of-the-1709547254
[15:18:37] <_methods> helloooo kickstarter
[15:18:59] <R2E4> ssi: I see the internal 26 pin header on the 5i25.
[15:19:37] <ssi> not a breakout board
[15:19:39] <ssi> just a cable adapter
[15:20:09] <ssi> http://www.amazon.com/C2G-10338-Parallel-Adapter-Bracket/dp/B0002J1TGS/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1433793474&sr=8-4&keywords=parallel+port+adapter
[15:24:14] <Deejay> gn8
[15:25:57] <Guest86948> can anyone explain me why in etch-servo hal file there are 3 pwm pins for itch axis
[15:28:40] <Guest86948> hello
[15:37:31] <Roguish> where can I find the log of this channel?
[15:37:46] <Roguish> and the -devel channel?
[15:47:23] <Roguish> found the logs.
[15:51:49] <FinboySlick> Roguish: Please ignore all the nonsense Jymmm and I usually say.
[15:52:59] <_Roguish> well, just locked up again.
[15:54:28] <_Roguish> oh heck I don't care about all the jibber jabber.
[16:04:47] <skunksleep> http://www.cnczone.com/forums/cincinnati-cnc/272508-cnc.html
[16:09:41] <Tom_itx> _Roguish, zlog
[16:19:20] <tswartz> does it matter what encoder i use for spindle speed so long as it is an absolute encoder?
[16:21:22] <Tom_itx> probably not
[16:26:08] <SpeedEvil> Surely relative encoders are fine too
[16:26:32] <SpeedEvil> the important thing is the resolution, jitter
[16:27:00] <SpeedEvil> If the resolution is too high, it may limit top speed, too low, it may add instability
[16:32:46] <tswartz> SpeedEvil, i won't have to worry about high speeds on this thing lol
[16:33:06] <tswartz> i think my max is ~ 2400rpm
[16:34:11] <SpeedEvil> http://www.dx.com/p/speed-measuring-module-encoding-disk-set-for-smart-car-chassis-black-319982#.VXYFHfFVGRs
[16:34:24] <SpeedEvil> - not very serious
[16:34:25] <tswartz> SpeedEvil, if relative encoders are also ok, what kind of resolution is workable with linuxcnc?
[16:34:34] <SpeedEvil> Depends what you want to do with it
[16:34:52] <tswartz> threading and css
[16:34:54] <SpeedEvil> rigid tapping, for example, really would like to be able to control to a small fraction of a rev
[16:35:13] <tswartz> i don't have anything awesome enough for rigid tapping
[16:35:18] <SpeedEvil> Absolute encoders mean you don't need to go one whole rev
[16:35:43] <tswartz> and yeah, i've seen those tiny encoders, i have no idea how i would get that working with my spindle
[16:35:47] <SpeedEvil> Is rigid tapping the right word - I'm not properly awake - sorry
[16:36:30] <SpeedEvil> tswartz: Well, in principle, you can attach an encoder to any rotating bit - or use a non-contact gear sensor if you have a gear at an appropriate point
[16:37:19] <tswartz> this whole thing is homebrew from a g0602. i'm sure a lot of people in here will turn their noses up at me :P
[16:37:38] <guilherme3333> hello all I'm new to emc and trying to build mas own cnc from electronic garbage . based on some tutorial i saw , i'm trying to change the hal file on the etch-servo configuration but i notice that the pwm pin out dose not match the LMD18201T h-bridge that i have can some one help me or give me some clues
[16:37:52] <tswartz> i tested out mach3 on it and ran with an optical encoder and a CD that i cut out to fit the spindle, with 1 index mark in it
[16:38:12] <tswartz> 1 point per rev is some pretty shady resolution
[16:40:04] <tswartz> SpeedEvil, so for relative position you say a gear position say may do the trick eh?
[16:40:53] <SpeedEvil> There isn't a reason you couldn't add - say - 100 marks per rev, and get much better position
[16:41:00] <SpeedEvil> tswartz: yes
[16:41:17] <SpeedEvil> To be able to repeatably thread, you need some index of course
[16:42:20] <tswartz> i've been trying to wrap my head around a way to finish up with the CD method, but 100 marks all done by hand just doesn't seem reasonable to me
[16:42:32] <tswartz> maybe one day i'll gather up the patience for it
[16:42:59] <tswartz> and the sensor kit i have is a 2 channel so i'll cut a deeper index for that one
[16:43:51] <SpeedEvil> tswartz: Do you need an excuse to buy a dividing head?
[16:44:11] <tswartz> i started looking at them again yesterday ;)
[16:44:17] <guilherme3333> hello any one has servo experience by direct parallel port connection??????????????????
[16:44:35] <SpeedEvil> guilherme3333: not here
[16:47:13] <guilherme3333> thanks speedevil do you hv any idea of some one that can possible help me
[16:47:53] <JT-Shop> guilherme3333, do you just need to change what pin your using?
[16:51:30] <guilherme3333> JT-shop is not a question of pins as i'm using a bread board but i only need one pwm pin and another one 1\0 to tell diction to the h-bridge
[16:52:10] <guilherme3333> direction i mean
[16:53:36] <guilherme3333> for what i understand it has 2 alternetive pin for it and they are as pwm pins
[16:55:17] <skunksleep> http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.6/html/man/man9/pwmgen.9.html
[16:55:18] <JT-Shop> can you be a bit more specific, is this some piece of hardware your talking about or your LinuxCNC configuration files?
[16:55:43] <JT-Shop> skunksleep, is on it now :)
[16:55:59] <skunksleep> You configure the pwmgen to output pwm+dir
[16:57:53] <guilherme3333> so thats means tipe 1????'
[16:58:22] <chopper79> Howdy.....Ran into a road block on my config..... When I insert th following ----net spindle-on hm2_5i25.0.7i76.0.0.output-02--- I get an error when launching LCNC. Even if I use pncconf to generate the config the error still happens. am I forgetting to assign the 7i76 board somewhere?
[17:02:34] <chopper79> I should have posted the error..... hm2_5i25.0.7i76.0.0.output-02 does not exist
[17:04:27] <guilherme3333> ok thanks guys i gona try it . but i'll be back
[17:17:18] <chopper79> Ok ... did some checking and no matter what output I assign to spindle on I get the same error when launching LCNC. the error says the pin does not exist. hm2_5i25.0.7i76.0.0.output-00 does not exist
[17:19:26] <archivist> chopper79, run halshow to check what pins exist http://linuxcnc.org/docs/html/hal/halshow.html
[17:20:03] <chopper79> If I use the following ---hm2_5i25.0.gpio.022.out--- then LCNC will launch. Just not when using the 7i76 ouputs
[17:20:10] <chopper79> I will try that real quick
[17:21:45] <chopper79> Well.... I get no command for halshow
[17:22:03] <chopper79> which is weird as I have used that before (differnt install)
[17:22:21] <chopper79> I installed show
[17:22:26] <chopper79> and still no command
[17:22:30] <chopper79> hal
[17:25:53] <chopper79> when I get LCNC to launch I go to show hal configuration and I see the 5i25 GPIO but the 7i76 does not show up. Is it not being found?
[17:26:19] <chopper79> LCNC to launch by commenting out the line for spindle on
[17:29:29] <archivist> you need to ask PCW about the card not being seen
[17:30:30] <chopper79> Ok...thanks
[17:33:27] <chopper79> PCW: My configuration does not seem to see the 7i76 board. anytime I assign an input or output to the 7i76 I get an error when launching LCNC. ------hm2_5i25.0.7i76.0.0.output-02 does not exist ------ I can not seem to find the 7i76 in the show hal configuration either. Did I break something or is my system not recognizing the 7i76 smart serial port?
[17:35:08] <chopper79> if I use the following ---hm2_5i25.0.gpio.022.out--- then LCNC will launch. Just not when using the 7i76 ouputs
[17:35:20] <chopper79> or inputs
[17:40:19] <CaptHindsight> _methods: I want one that I can use to take my pet fish Erik out for a walk or a bike ride
[17:45:03] <CaptHindsight> http://upload.ecvv.com/upload/Product/20125/China_Portable_Spherical_Fish_Tank_Bowl2012515242311.jpg
[17:45:17] <CaptHindsight> https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/cd/f1/82/cdf1828fd67bed1583bab21c72ff7662.jpg
[17:45:22] <chopper79> Should the Sserial port have a number assigned? loadrt hm2_pci config=" num_encoders=1 num_pwmgens=0 num_3pwmgens=0 num_stepgens=4 sserial_port_0=0xxxxxxx "
[17:49:52] <_methods> heheh
[17:50:10] <_methods> was that from a movie
[17:50:42] <_methods> omg fishbowl backpack
[17:50:56] <_methods> that just made my day
[17:52:14] <CaptHindsight> https://youtu.be/pnq96W9jtuw?t=1m5s Fish License
[17:57:11] <_methods> thought i remembered that
[17:59:31] <CaptHindsight> _methods: we joke about this and often someone has already proposed it
[18:25:41] <PCW> chopper79: sounds like the 7I76 output side is not powered (or the 5i25/7i76 cable power jumpers dont match)
[18:30:52] <chopper79> PCW: I have field power going to the 7i76, W1 in left position, W2 in left position. W2 in left position should be getting 5v from 5i25 if I am not mistaken. On the 5i25 I have all jumpers up as it came default besides W2 which came down as default. should they be something different?
[18:31:48] <chopper79> I thought I did it right based on what looked at in the manual. I did not however change jumper W1 on 5i25 as it was up from default.
[18:33:03] <chopper79> 7I76 has both LED on CR1 and CR2. If I remove power from Field (orange plug pin 1 vin and pin 8 gnd) CR2 LED turns off. If I remove DB25 cable then CR1 turns off
[18:50:45] <chopper79> PCW: It is fixed now and LCNC will open. I had the THAD300 FO+ and FO- coming form the THCAD300 to TB3 on the 7i76 pins 7,8 for the encoder input. I take it that the FO outputs from the THCAD300 do not go to an encoder input. Where should they go as I need to bring the frequency into the cards somehow. I assumed (I know bad of me) that it would go here as the THC.comp file references Encoder A I do believe.
[18:51:58] <SpeedEvil> tswartz: http://www.dx.com/p/motor-speed-photoelectric-encoders-for-model-car-robot-brownish-yellow-black-10-pcs-389817#.VXYk9fFVGRs :)
[18:53:51] <chopper79> THC.comp refrences : THC Frequency Signal => Encoder #0, pin A (Input)
[18:54:10] <chopper79> I guess its not literally encoder A?
[18:54:43] <chopper79> Encoder 0 pin A sorry
[18:59:52] <PCW> Yes the THCAD frequency output goes to a encoder 'A' pin
[19:01:04] <chopper79> FO+ is the only one. do not use FO- ?
[19:01:45] <PCW> use both (and jumper the encoder input for differential)
[19:03:21] <chopper79> Ok.. so I should take FO+ and FO- and connect them to TB3 pins 7, 8 ? 7 being ENC+ and 8 being ENC-
[19:03:59] <chopper79> A+, A- i shoul dhave stated
[19:06:20] <PCW> yes, you can use a 4 wire cable to the THCAD from 6,7,8,9
[19:06:21] <PCW> so you have both 5V power and differential frequency signal
[19:06:23] <PCW> FO+ and FO- should be twisted
[19:13:45] <chopper79> PCW: That did it, I can launch LCNC and everything is plugged in a LED are on. I thank you all for the help. Now its time to see if I have some action
[19:15:34] <chopper79> I was pulling the 5v to power the THCAD300 from pins 22, 23 on TB3. Once I changed them from there to pins 6,9 on TB3 everything played nice together. I guess that using pins 22,23 were shorting it out?
[19:31:20] <PCW> not unless you had it backwards...
[19:32:02] <chopper79> nope... as it powered up just fine. LCNC just would not launch.
[19:32:17] <PCW> (the THCAD has a reverse polarity protection diode so _will_ short out your 5V supply if backwards)
[19:33:31] <chopper79> Would the THCAD still power up like normal though? I would not think it would if it was shorted
[19:34:34] <Tom_itx> PCW you think mine will make it out this week?
[19:34:34] <PCW> Probably unrelated (the 5V power is the same everywhere except the encoder power is protected with a PTC)
[19:34:43] <PCW> will try
[19:34:51] <chopper79> I am testing now to see if I can get a signal from the THCAD to the encoder in Hal Meter. I can not get a count signal,
[19:35:16] <PCW> you need to set the encoder to up/down mode
[19:35:49] <chopper79> setp hm2_5i25.0.encoder.00.counter-mode 1
[19:35:50] <Tom_itx> PCW i wonder why digikey showed those pericom chips as end of life
[19:36:34] <PCW> They are end of life (there are TI and Phillips equivs that are not)
[19:36:46] <Tom_itx> oh
[19:37:33] <PCW> but the Pericom ones were always cheaper (I think we have a 20K last time buy)
[19:39:58] <Tom_itx> are those in most of your anythingio cards?
[19:40:52] <PCW> SN74CBT16211A
[19:40:53] <PCW> yes most
[19:43:01] <PCW> Phillips CBT16211
[19:53:44] <chopper79> still no luck on getting a reading from THCAD. I have counter mode set to 1 and I do not see any activity in LCNC under hal configurations or hal meter. What would be the next thing to check?
[19:54:19] <chopper79> Maybe im not applying enough voltage to the inputs on the THCAD? im at 25vdc now
[20:02:54] <zeeshan> fak
[20:02:57] <micges> thcad is always output some frequency
[20:03:00] <zeeshan> i spent too much on a bandsaw blade :/
[20:04:01] <furrywolf> meh. spent $57 ordering generator parts today. rings, head bolts, an air filter, some minor parts for the choke linkage, oil drain plug washers, starter housing bushings.
[20:04:49] <furrywolf> the parts manager said he's had very bad luck with the chinese pistons, so I got rings for my current piston... for $25. because the california rings, SMALLER, cost double what the 49-state ones do.
[20:05:07] <chopper79> I kind thought it did have an output at all time, but not seeing anything in LCNC
[20:05:39] <SpeedEvil> furrywolf: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OsPluf2TZrQ - on torque wrenches
[20:05:44] <SpeedEvil> (not really)
[20:06:39] <furrywolf> sharpening blades?
[20:07:12] <SpeedEvil> I found it amusing, and it brought to mind the torque issues you were having.
[20:07:44] <furrywolf> what if you're not a manly man, for several reasons?
[20:07:53] <SpeedEvil> :)
[20:08:10] <zeeshan> i hate ave
[20:08:12] <zeeshan> guy is a moron
[20:09:07] <SpeedEvil> Please make an intelligent youtube channel, to which we can subscribe.
[20:09:11] <furrywolf> it's about 10% done downloading...
[20:09:30] <zeeshan> i thought he was okay in the beginning, i saw 2 videos
[20:09:36] <furrywolf> intelligent people write articles with text and pictures, because they're literate. other people feel the need to make videos of them talking.
[20:09:44] <zeeshan> then quickly realized, he's clueless
[20:09:47] <SpeedEvil> https://www.youtube.com/user/mikeselectricstuff - I mean - for example - is awesome
[20:09:49] <zeeshan> from the way he abuses his machines
[20:10:39] <SpeedEvil> And I quite agree in many ways that videos are a poor information source in some ways.
[20:10:52] * SpeedEvil realises he way overused the word way.
[20:11:04] <zeeshan> wow that guy is cool
[20:11:05] <zeeshan> mike's electric
[20:12:06] <furrywolf> is the person in the video actually an idiot, or just pretending to be?
[20:12:14] <zeeshan> both
[20:13:23] <SpeedEvil> He does some interesting teardowns - perhaps with questionable analysis.
[20:13:31] <SpeedEvil> ^certainly
[20:14:31] <furrywolf> why would you blur the grinder?
[20:14:56] <SpeedEvil> It's got his name on it
[20:15:37] <furrywolf> lol
[20:16:06] <furrywolf> where does it mention balancing?
[20:16:53] <furrywolf> I've never balanced a mower blade, but if you put balancing in the title, you should mention it...
[20:17:06] <SpeedEvil> he does - in that he puts it on a rod
[20:17:51] <SpeedEvil> I have also never balanced a mower blade,
[20:19:24] <furrywolf> I find they vibrate obnoxiously even from the factory, due to internal engine balance issues, and unless your blade is an inch longer on one side than the other, it's not going to be noticable...
[20:20:06] <SpeedEvil> I don't really have a lawn that is large enough to make IC pointful.
[20:21:33] <furrywolf> unless you live in an area where the grass grows a lot slower than it does here, you need an engine-powered lawnmower for any lawn, if you're not one of those obsessives who mows every weekend.
[20:22:15] <tswartz> furrywolf, grass has to be mowed every weekend where i'm at or it gets out of control
[20:22:39] <furrywolf> correct. which is why if you don't mow every weekend, you need a gas-powered mower. :P
[20:22:50] <furrywolf> electric ones do not have the power for more than a week's growth.
[20:22:54] <tswartz> you need a gas powered mower even if you do it every weekend lol
[20:23:00] <tswartz> electric mower? wtf
[20:23:43] <tswartz> if a 5.5hp gas engine has a hard time cutting grass, what kind of electric motor is going to do it?
[20:24:19] <furrywolf> speedevil seems to think electric is a good idea. :)
[20:24:37] <tswartz> SpeedEvil, you must not live in the south
[20:24:45] <SpeedEvil> furrywolf: My lawn is ~50m^2
[20:25:02] <SpeedEvil> not 50*50m
[20:25:07] <tswartz> well, that's not much, so maybe
[20:25:21] <tswartz> the grass here is just super thick, especially this time of year
[20:25:35] <furrywolf> brb
[20:48:03] <chopper79> JT-shop: you available for a question?
[20:52:15] <chopper79> If so.... I am using your 5i20 plasma config as a base config and it seems that the encoder raw count is stuck at one number regardless of voltage input. the meter is showing about 45.3 volts and the raw count is stuck at 65340. Not sure why it is stuck there and figured maybe you could fill me in on the potential issue.
[20:57:34] <PCW> No idea, sounds like wrong counter mode or input connections are wrong (the raw count is not of much use here but should of course change)
[21:00:05] <PCW> Note it may count down depending on the B state so you may need to jumper the B input for TTL mode and tie the B input low to get positive velocities
[21:01:24] <PCW> BTW, the encoder velocity pin is the useful signal
[21:02:06] <chopper79> shows a ste of 0
[21:02:09] <chopper79> state
[21:02:31] <PCW> so its not getting any signal
[21:02:41] <chopper79> hm2_5i25.0.encoder.00.velocity
[21:02:42] <Tom_itx> what sort of encoder?
[21:02:47] <chopper79> looking at this signal
[21:03:04] <PCW> or the scale is not right
[21:03:15] <chopper79> setp thc.scale-offset 119600
[21:03:30] <chopper79> setp thc.vel-scale -0.00037866834
[21:03:57] <PCW> if the raw counts dont change than theres no signal
[21:04:11] <chopper79> understood
[21:04:18] <chopper79> now to figure out why
[21:04:44] <PCW> (when viewed with halmeter or watch (not show))
[21:04:58] <chopper79> Im wired to the encoder input on TB3.
[21:05:24] <chopper79> hal meter show 0 also
[21:06:15] <PCW> is the THCAD rate LED blinking?
[21:06:49] <chopper79> yeah about 1 blink evey couple secs
[21:07:52] <PCW> counter mode set to 1? (check with hal show)
[21:09:30] <chopper79> hm2_5i25.0.encoder.00.counter is 0 in show
[21:09:40] <chopper79> but 1 in hal config
[21:09:50] <chopper79> setp hm2_5i25.0.encoder.00.counter-mode 1
[21:09:52] <furrywolf> getting to the timing belt on an eu2000i is way, way, way more work than it should be.
[21:10:18] <PCW> probably you have two setp commands
[21:11:42] <chopper79> just did a search and only one is in the hal
[21:12:35] <PCW> postgui.hal?
[21:13:22] <chopper79> yes, but it does not contain one either
[21:14:12] <PCW> so hm2_5i25.0.encoder.00.counter-mode is 0 if read?
[21:14:21] <chopper79> yes
[21:14:26] <chopper79> but 1 in hal config
[21:14:40] <PCW> maybe you are not running the hal file you think you are
[21:15:42] <chopper79> only config on pc besides 5i20 config and it does the same thing
[21:16:05] <chopper79> let me check something
[21:16:14] <PCW> pncconf puts the configs in a subdirectory IICRC
[21:18:18] <chopper79> even the 5i20 plasma config shows a 1 on count mode in hal and a 0 in hal meter
[21:19:52] <PCW> what version of linuxcnc?
[21:20:23] <chopper79> 10.04 2.5.4
[21:21:55] <PCW> hmm try setting it true
[21:23:53] <chopper79> no change
[21:24:19] <PCW> weird, works for me (just tried)
[21:25:34] <chopper79> what the heck... not sure what I am missing here.
[21:30:45] <chopper79> 3-23 11 (0 SMARTSERIAL-P0-RX) unused-sserial
[21:30:45] <chopper79> P3-25 12 (12 GPIO Input) unused-input
[21:30:45] <chopper79> P3-27 13 (13 GPIO Input) unused-input
[21:30:45] <chopper79> P3-29 14 (0 Quad Encoder-I) unused-encoder
[21:30:45] <chopper79> P3-31 15 (0 Quad Encoder-B) unused-encoder
[21:30:46] <chopper79> P3-33 16 (0 Quad Encoder-A) unused-encoder
[21:31:18] <chopper79> does p3-33 have naything to do with it since its unused?
[21:31:54] <Tom_itx> in quad mode it should
[21:33:27] <PCW> not sure those mean anything
[21:35:05] <chopper79> does the following ..... setp hm2_5i25.0.encoder.00.counter-mode 1.....need to be changed to somethnig like this .......hm2_5i25.0.7i76.0.0.encoder.00.counter-mode 1 or is the encoder not on the Sserial part of 7i76?
[21:35:36] <PCW> No, its not part of sserial
[21:36:01] <chopper79> ok... Just going through random things tryto find the issue
[21:37:01] <PCW> is the sserial I/O working?
[21:39:36] <PCW> that is, do the 7i76 pins show up
[21:40:45] <Valen> SpeedEvil: that is the funniest think I have seen in ages
[21:41:50] <Valen> my dad's mower is electric, had 24V of SLA in it, we replaced it when it wore out with the same AH worth of lipo, goes forever
[21:44:15] <chopper79> Yes Sserial inputs are working
[21:44:21] <chopper79> they also show up
[21:48:29] <Tom_itx> i don't know what encoder you're using but i had to add pullups to mine since it's open collector output
[21:49:17] <chopper79> Using the Mesa THCAD300 frequency card. Not really an encoder like on motors
[21:50:00] <Tom_itx> ok
[21:50:54] <PCW> bbl
[21:51:03] <chopper79> ok
[21:57:56] <Jymmm> Tubeless tire with broken bead? Ratching tie down strap works wonders!!!
[22:00:31] <Tom_itx> so does propane
[22:00:53] <Tom_itx> and it's more fun
[22:11:55] <Jymmm> Uh.... Nooooooooooooooo! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BZ651hdwCM4
[22:15:28] <Jymmm> I really do love my nitrogen tank, but I need to get a bigger on.
[22:15:30] <Jymmm> one.
[22:54:49] <rootB> Is linuxCNC better than MACH3?
[22:55:00] <rootB> I've seen a lot of pluggings for MACH3 but i pressume the LINUXCNC community is bigger right?
[23:00:08] <chopper79> PCW: I can not help but think I am on the wrong connector on the 7i76 for the THCAD300 FO+/-
[23:02:10] <chopper79> I know the THCAD is frequency out but if I put a volt meter on the FO pins I can get a small voltage reading that increases or decreases as I change voltage. This leads me to think that the output is working from the THCAD. they fact that it does not show up in hal show or anything as being active makes me think its the wrong input.
[23:06:02] <chopper79> Based on our discussion earlier though and going through which connector and inputs to use (TB3 ENCA- and ENCA+ or pins 7,8) makes me think its potentially in my config. The issue is its the 5i20 config that comes with LCNC, I tested it stock with no mods to the config except changing 5i20 to 5i25 and I get the same result as my config though. which puts me back to the inputs I am using on the 7i76 maybe.
[23:08:15] <chopper79> the one thing that is really weird if all else is ok is the fact that the following : setp hm2_5i25.0.encoder.00.counter-mode 1 is set in the hal file but yet when you go to show or meter is reads as 0
[23:16:33] <pcw_home> TB3 is correct, pins 7 through 15 are the encoder pins
[23:17:18] <chopper79> ok
[23:18:22] <chopper79> Just did something and got some changes. I used only the FO+ and if I loosen the set screw and pull the wire out a little and allow it to sit loose. I get a temporary change in hal show and on the GUI for LCNC
[23:18:56] <chopper79> I know that is not good on electronics but it proves that I do have things in some what working fashion.
[23:19:21] <pcw_home> is the 7i76 jumpered for differential inputs?
[23:20:27] <pcw_home> if its set for TTL and you connect differential inputs you wont get any signal
[23:21:13] <chopper79> W4,5,6 are all jumped to the right
[23:25:36] <pcw_home> sounds like somethings wrong with the interface (if you set the THCAD divider to divide by 64 or whatever the highest is you can debug the wiring with a voltmeter)
[23:27:03] <pcw_home> (the voltage across F0+ and F0- should be close to 0 and the voltage from either to ground should be like 2V)
[23:27:37] <pcw_home> (measured at the 7I76 ENCA+ and ENCA- pins)
[23:28:13] <chopper79> ummmm..... Well all i did was remove the jumper from F1 and put it on F128 and I have changes happening on their own.
[23:30:52] <chopper79> F/32, F/64, F/128 all allow changes to happen to the raw counts, velocity, etc. F/1 does nothing at all. Granted even though changes are happening the voltage reading is still way off
[23:31:44] <pcw_home> probably probably the pulse width is too narrow if the encoder filter is on
[23:32:08] <pcw_home> probably probably probably
[23:32:24] <chopper79> ok so where to even begin to change that?
[23:33:08] <pcw_home> setp blah blah blah .filter false
[23:33:45] <pcw_home> or just run at F/32
[23:34:23] <pcw_home> (and change the scaling)
[23:38:40] <chopper79> Added the filter and it now works on F/1
[23:38:46] <chopper79> thank you
[23:40:27] <chopper79> Unfortunately the scale must be way off. If I remove voltage volts rests at 45.3 volts and when power is applied voltage goes up to 101.5 volts with only 10.5 volts of actual input power.
[23:59:42] <chopper79> PCW: all good for now.... Thank you sir