#linuxcnc | Logs for 2014-11-15

[02:20:27] <Deejay> moin
[04:52:32] <SpeedEvil> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/horizontal-metal-band-saw-/291293328087?pt=UK_Hand_Tools_Equipment&hash=item43d26f72d7
[04:52:37] <SpeedEvil> how to take pictures of machinery
[04:56:12] <archivist> 5 quids worth of scrap with an image like that
[05:16:11] <syyl_> that picture was taken with an potato.
[05:16:13] <syyl_> thats sure
[06:20:08] <IrrerIvan> hi there, can anyone help me with custom m codes for controlling a hotend via serial
[06:48:09] <kengu> ..
[06:55:19] <jthornton> we just ask the question around here
[08:36:32] <Karl> Hello all Here i am Karl from Austria :) does anyone can help me in german to fix some problems with the new 2.6 plese
[08:51:35] <_methods> Karl: there are usually several german users in here that will be able to help you
[08:51:57] <archivist> best to ask the real question though
[08:52:06] <_methods> it's IRC though so youu're best bet is just to ask
[08:52:15] <_methods> what he said lol
[08:54:01] <Karl> oh is linuxcnc onli for englisch speking peple? sorry i dont know
[08:54:50] <_methods> no lots of people use linuxcnc from all over the world
[08:58:44] <Karl> i am working with emc of 2011 and have no customs components done there but nuw i want to update linuxcnc 2.6 with debian
[09:00:18] <Karl> nuw i want to fit up a litte bit custom switches some i have realize but now it will be complicatet^^
[09:54:44] <Karl> enjoy the silence :)
[09:58:35] <archivist> we are waiting for the real question :)
[10:03:35] <rob_h> something to watch while u wait,... can u tap holes this quick ;) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G-KO3V8FSD0&index=4&list=UUnCM2g5eW5K6IgY9x22-O4g
[10:08:08] <Karl> oh my goodness sorry :) my mistake
[10:11:34] <CaptHindsight> rob_h: not by hand
[10:12:08] <archivist> damned slow toolchange for a brother machine
[10:12:49] <Karl> i will try to explain right now
[10:13:01] <archivist> rob_h, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4XYakTeQahA
[10:13:18] <Karl> i am running emc of 2011 on my computer at the machine
[10:13:42] <Karl> some hardware erros are last time so i must upgrade de computer
[10:14:05] <Karl> now i see there is debian with actual software
[10:14:14] <Karl> ubuntu 12 donst runs smoth
[10:14:28] <Karl> so now debian and 2.6 runs fu
[10:14:50] <Karl> fine but i dont like the 2 sliders for feed and quick feed
[10:15:22] <Karl> i want to make one slider oder encoder for all feed
[10:15:32] <Karl> i have reat but i dont understand it
[10:16:01] <Karl> it was difficult to get the rpm into the machine but now it works fine
[10:16:09] <mozmck> oder = or
[10:16:29] <Karl> thank you
[10:16:56] <Karl> i have now i dear ho to programm it i am seeking for verry verry big help i cant do it alone
[10:17:28] <Karl> i have try the Gmoccapy in sim its fine but i cant install it on the real machine
[10:17:36] <Karl> i take 2 reasons
[10:17:53] <Karl> one slider or gmoccapy :)
[10:18:01] <Karl> sorry for textwall :(
[10:19:24] <CaptHindsight> Karl: just to be clear you are now running Debian Wheezy with 2.6?
[10:19:42] <Karl> i run 2.6.4
[10:19:56] <CaptHindsight> on Wheezy?
[10:20:09] <CaptHindsight> Debian Wheezy
[10:20:15] <Karl> http://www.linuxcnc.org/media/kunena/attachments/19810/Bildschirmfoto-2014-11-15-103551.png
[10:20:22] <Karl> yes debian
[10:20:32] <Tom_itx> is anybody using 2.6 on real hardware yet?
[10:20:52] <mozmck> I'm not sure how easy it is to change the interface in Axis - using gmoccapy might be easier, but I don't know how to set that up yet.
[10:21:37] <CaptHindsight> most of us have to read the docs when we want to modify either Axis or Gmoccapy
[10:22:45] <CaptHindsight> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Gmoccapy
[10:22:50] <zeeshan> CaptHindsight:
[10:22:53] <Karl> when your language is neat native to english is fine
[10:22:58] <zeeshan> must i use a DLP projector?
[10:23:01] <CaptHindsight> "f you are using the actual DEBIAN Wheesy Linuxcnc iso, you will have to install some more packages "
[10:23:05] <Karl> but most i dont understand
[10:23:28] <CaptHindsight> Karl: have you tried using Google Translate?
[10:23:51] <Karl> i have tryed thos what you say but an error happens at point make
[10:24:02] <Karl> no such file or directory :(
[10:25:24] <CaptHindsight> Gmoccapy has been tested on UBUNTU 10.04 and 12.04 and DEBIAN Wheesy, if you use other versions, please inform about problems or solutions on the forum: in German [Peters CNC Ecke]
[10:25:48] <CaptHindsight> http://www.cncecke.de/forum/showthread.php?t=78549
[10:25:53] <Karl> i take the iso von linuxcnc site
[10:26:13] <CaptHindsight> looks like that is the German Gmoccapy forum
[10:26:48] <Karl> i have tanke the computer here i will make then right now fresh with the iso and try again
[10:27:02] <CaptHindsight> Karl: people from all over the world contribute to linuxcnc
[10:27:11] <Karl> but why is this done to make to feed slider
[10:27:45] <CaptHindsight> Gmocappy was a project that somebody wrote for themselves and then contributed it to Linuxcnc
[10:28:12] <CaptHindsight> so you'll need the Gmocappy developers help
[10:29:17] <CaptHindsight> zeeshan: you need to trigger polymerization with UV to ~420nm light
[10:29:36] <Karl> ok i must not use this i only want one feed slider for all speeds this is all i want but i dont know HOW sorry i cant program hal i only must du what people write and sy
[10:30:00] <zeeshan> uv might destroy my polymer
[10:30:00] <CaptHindsight> zeeshan: DLP projectors typically use a mercury lamp and a UV filter
[10:30:02] <zeeshan> :/
[10:30:27] <zeeshan> will the photopolymer "bond" with the substrate?
[10:30:32] <zeeshan> substrate polymer that is
[10:30:38] <CaptHindsight> so very little under 380nm make it past the lens
[10:30:47] <Tom_itx> is this out of date? : http://www.linuxcnc.org/index.php/german/download?task=view
[10:31:26] <CaptHindsight> zeeshan: depends on the polymer
[10:31:27] <Tom_itx> oh nevermind
[10:31:29] <Tom_itx> LinuxCNC 2.6.4 is released!
[10:31:29] <Tom_itx> There are no translations available.
[10:32:03] <zeeshan> how much will the powder cost me? :P
[10:32:07] <zeeshan> i want to try it
[10:32:30] <CaptHindsight> zeeshan: I can send you ~100ml to try
[10:32:49] <CaptHindsight> shipping to CA is pretty low
[10:32:51] <zeeshan> base polymer is a copolymer.. urethane
[10:33:01] <archivist> go to the local painters, they have the oven needed
[10:33:03] <zeeshan> so whatever "sticks" to it would be the best solution
[10:33:18] <CaptHindsight> heh, then I can send you one with urethane
[10:33:30] <zeeshan> WHITE please!
[10:33:36] <CaptHindsight> similar polymers like to bond to each other
[10:34:03] <Tom_itx> zeeshan white uv paint?
[10:34:15] <zeeshan> i will be trying paint too
[10:34:23] <zeeshan> but i suspect the solvent in my paint hurts it
[10:34:24] <Tom_itx> i use that on my programmer boxes with a fishtank UV light
[10:34:28] <zeeshan> unless i look into waterborne paints
[10:34:39] <zeeshan> well i liked the dlp idea..
[10:34:46] <Tom_itx> got a sample of it from the local sign company
[10:34:51] <zeeshan> because i can project a speckle pattern from the projector
[10:34:55] <zeeshan> and have it cure on the sample
[10:35:01] <CaptHindsight> depends on how much adhesion you want
[10:35:14] <zeeshan> CaptHindsight: i honestly cant quantify that right ow
[10:35:20] <zeeshan> im making a 1/8" dimple
[10:35:51] <zeeshan> http://i.imgur.com/ZGgDoQz.png
[10:35:56] <zeeshan> i dont know if you can see the dimple in this pic
[10:36:04] <CaptHindsight> use a cnc hot melt glue gun with .005" nozzle :)
[10:36:16] <zeeshan> notice how big droplet of paint cracked
[10:36:30] <CaptHindsight> snowflakes
[10:36:37] <pcw_home> You could also make a speckle negative and contact print onto your sample
[10:37:26] <zeeshan> pcw_home: how does that work
[10:38:10] <CaptHindsight> zeeshan: do you have a silk screen supplier in the area?
[10:38:32] <zeeshan> http://www.yellowpages.ca/search/si/1/Screen+Printing/Hamilton+ON
[10:38:33] <zeeshan> :D
[10:39:32] <CaptHindsight> a UV cured emulsion is used to make the screens, you could try a bit of that if they are local
[10:39:38] <Tom_itx> the silkscreen actually interferred with my lettering a bit
[10:40:38] <pcw_home> you make a photograph (or photoplot) onto a photographic negative and expose the photopolymer through the negative
[10:40:40] <pcw_home> to UV (sunlight will work)
[10:40:41] <CaptHindsight> but then you still need a mask to expose it
[10:40:44] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.ddns01.com:81/~webpage/boards/USBTiny_Mkii/silkscreen/uv_paint.jpg
[10:40:49] <Tom_itx> that's what i used
[10:40:56] <Tom_itx> along with the paint sample there
[10:41:22] <pcw_home> there must be places that will photoplot for you
[10:41:35] <Tom_itx> print it on a clear mylar sheet
[10:42:09] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.ddns01.com:81/~webpage/boards/USBTiny_Mkii/silkscreen/exposure.jpg
[10:42:12] <Tom_itx> that's all i did
[10:42:15] <Tom_itx> worked great
[10:42:28] <zeeshan> Tom_itx: what liquid is that
[10:42:30] <CaptHindsight> 405nm blu ray laser will also cure it
[10:42:37] <Tom_itx> zeeshan which liquid?
[10:42:40] <zeeshan> the green
[10:42:50] <Tom_itx> the mask from the previous pic i posted
[10:43:03] <Tom_itx> then you wash off the unexposed
[10:43:21] <zeeshan> "diazo photo emulsion"
[10:43:31] <Tom_itx> btw that was the first time i'd ever done any kind of mask. so anybody can do it
[10:43:31] <CaptHindsight> that is silk scree emulsion, photopolymer emulsion in water
[10:43:56] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.ddns01.com:81/~webpage/boards/USBTiny_Mkii/silkscreen/lettered.jpg
[10:44:00] <Tom_itx> turned out 'ok'
[10:44:04] <zeeshan> Tom_itx: can you scratch off the cured emulsion
[10:44:07] <zeeshan> with a finger nail
[10:44:10] <Tom_itx> no
[10:44:25] <Tom_itx> it gets pretty hard
[10:44:34] <CaptHindsight> .005" dots will be a challenge
[10:44:37] <Tom_itx> i've scrubbed it with a brush too
[10:44:39] <zeeshan> CaptHindsight: forget the dots!
[10:44:41] <zeeshan> i want to do a speckle pattern
[10:44:43] <zeeshan> like this:
[10:44:47] <Tom_itx> the problem is the size of the silkscreen
[10:45:18] <zeeshan> https://azttm.files.wordpress.com/2011/04/kinect-pattern.png
[10:45:19] <zeeshan> or even
[10:45:22] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.ddns01.com:81/~webpage/boards/USBTiny_Mkii/silkscreen/materials.jpg
[10:45:29] <Tom_itx> i made my own frame and everything
[10:45:33] <zeeshan> http://images.lowes.com/product/converted/042369/042369075527.jpg
[10:45:34] <zeeshan> like that
[10:45:44] <zeeshan> but finer in comparison to the second pic
[10:45:59] <zeeshan> actually the best comparison is the pic i posted
[10:46:00] <zeeshan> http://i.imgur.com/ZGgDoQz.png
[10:46:05] <zeeshan> see the smallest speckles?
[10:46:12] <zeeshan> its gotta be consistently that size
[10:46:13] <zeeshan> all around
[10:46:32] <Tom_itx> you're confined to the grid on the silkscreen
[10:46:51] <Tom_itx> which for most things is pretty darn fine
[10:47:05] <zeeshan> as long as i can make 0.005" speckles
[10:47:06] <zeeshan> i think ill be ok
[10:47:15] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.ddns01.com:81/~webpage/boards/USBTiny_Mkii/silkscreen/materials.jpg
[10:47:18] <zeeshan> 0.08-0.12 mm
[10:47:19] <Tom_itx> well you can see it there
[10:47:22] <Tom_itx> judge for yourself
[10:47:52] <Tom_itx> it's cheap to test it...
[10:48:10] <Tom_itx> the sign company actually let me see how they did it
[10:48:17] <Tom_itx> they just had a much larger UV table
[10:48:24] <zeeshan> is that silkscreen porous?
[10:48:34] <Tom_itx> yes
[10:49:37] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.ddns01.com:81/~webpage/boards/USBTiny_Mkii/silkscreen/screen_top.jpg
[10:49:46] <Tom_itx> you can see thru it on my nice clean workbench
[10:50:02] <zeeshan> im a bit confused about that
[10:50:10] <zeeshan> so do you cut that screen out or something
[10:50:20] <Tom_itx> look thru all those pics
[10:50:23] <zeeshan> to allow the paint to go through?
[10:50:34] <zeeshan> or is that screen there to distribute the paint evenly
[10:50:47] <zeeshan> emulsion i mean
[10:50:53] <Tom_itx> you paint a mask on it and then once you have your pattern exposed you apply paint thru the mask
[10:51:05] <Tom_itx> allows the paint thru
[10:51:09] <CaptHindsight> the cured emulsion blocks the ink from going through the screen
[10:51:28] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.ddns01.com:81/~webpage/boards/USBTiny_Mkii/silkscreen/text.jpg
[10:51:30] <Tom_itx> there
[10:51:38] <zeeshan> holy shit
[10:51:39] <zeeshan> howd you do that
[10:51:42] <Tom_itx> :D
[10:51:52] <Tom_itx> that's what it's for
[10:52:14] <zeeshan> howd you get the lettering on?
[10:52:21] <zeeshan> you couldnt havent done that by hand :P
[10:52:23] <Tom_itx> i told you above
[10:52:34] <Tom_itx> i printed it on a clear mylar
[10:52:41] <Tom_itx> then exposed that to the mask
[10:52:50] <zeeshan> okay look
[10:52:54] <zeeshan> i understand you printed it
[10:52:56] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.ddns01.com:81/~webpage/boards/USBTiny_Mkii/silkscreen/art_in_place.jpg
[10:53:01] <zeeshan> but i dont understand how it transfered from the print to the screen
[10:53:08] <Tom_itx> layed a clear glass over it to keep it flat
[10:53:16] <Tom_itx> i'm showing you
[10:53:22] <CaptHindsight> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZayHkSiPxv8 How To Make a Silkscreen
[10:53:43] <Tom_itx> hell, i didn't even need a youtube to do it.. it's that easy
[10:54:11] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.ddns01.com:81/~webpage/boards/USBTiny_Mkii/silkscreen/lid_cutout1.jpg
[10:54:17] <Tom_itx> then i made a frame to hold my lids
[10:54:25] <jasen> use aluminium frame , glue the screen using pneumatic strecher , applay the emulsion using gel coater , scrap the exeed from the printing side , and you will get sharp image.
[10:54:34] <CaptHindsight> screen comes is a wide range of mesh
[10:54:37] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.ddns01.com:81/~webpage/boards/USBTiny_Mkii/silkscreen/lid_cutout2.jpg
[10:54:54] <Tom_itx> yeah i got the finest mesh i could find locally
[10:55:03] <CaptHindsight> he wants 5mil features, nit easy for the beginner
[10:55:15] <zeeshan> this is why capt's technique was easier for me
[10:55:24] <zeeshan> i could just project a speckle pattern image off a dlp projector
[10:55:29] <zeeshan> and wipe off the excess powder
[10:55:30] <zeeshan> done :P
[10:55:43] <CaptHindsight> it's a liquid
[10:55:46] <jasen> for this application use screen 120-140 T/cm , bether yellow
[10:55:50] <zeeshan> liquid even better
[10:55:52] <zeeshan> easier to apply
[10:55:58] <zeeshan> evenly
[10:56:14] <zeeshan> Tom_itx: sorry for the dumb question again
[10:56:26] <zeeshan> bu t how did you transfer the text from the mylar
[10:56:28] <zeeshan> to the screen
[10:56:42] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.ddns01.com:81/~webpage/boards/USBTiny_Mkii/silkscreen/exposure.jpg
[10:56:44] <Tom_itx> just like that
[10:56:52] <zeeshan> ahhhhhhhhh
[10:56:59] <zeeshan> gotcha!
[10:57:02] <zeeshan> finally LOL
[10:57:04] <Tom_itx> look close and you see the letters
[10:57:13] <zeeshan> okay so i'd need a mylar sheet
[10:57:18] <zeeshan> with random speckles on it
[10:57:21] <zeeshan> and then light to cure
[10:57:46] <Tom_itx> i used nearly everything i had on hand except the screen and emulsion
[10:58:01] <Tom_itx> even got a doorscreen rubber to hold it in place free
[10:58:24] <zeeshan> where do you get the transparent mylar
[10:58:32] <zeeshan> is that just transparencies?
[10:58:37] <Tom_itx> yes
[10:58:40] <Tom_itx> nothing special
[10:58:52] <Tom_itx> you may wanna find some for laserjet
[10:58:56] <zeeshan> wood frame, stretch silk screen (fine mesh)
[10:59:01] <zeeshan> emulsion
[10:59:09] <zeeshan> light, and transperency
[10:59:17] <Tom_itx> use a roller to squeeze the screen rubber in the slot
[10:59:30] <Tom_itx> it serves to tighten the mesh
[10:59:34] <Tom_itx> and hold it
[10:59:44] <zeeshan> they use silk screen printing on bottles dont they?
[10:59:50] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.ddns01.com:81/~webpage/boards/USBTiny_Mkii/silkscreen/materials.jpg
[10:59:51] <zeeshan> which you can deform by hand
[11:00:00] <zeeshan> and it doesnt ruin the silk screen printed text
[11:00:03] <Tom_itx> they probably ink spray lettering nowdays
[11:00:24] <Tom_itx> like your 'born on' dates etc
[11:02:22] <zeeshan> http://www.proplasticbottle.com/images/printing.jpg
[11:02:22] <zeeshan> yep
[11:02:27] <zeeshan> those are silk screen printed
[11:02:34] <zeeshan> so its a pretty flexible coating
[11:02:50] <Tom_itx> depends on the paint you use too
[11:03:03] <Tom_itx> i looked for paint that would adhere the very best to the plastic
[11:03:10] <Tom_itx> and they suggested UV paint
[11:03:19] <Tom_itx> so i went hunting for that
[11:03:33] <Tom_itx> got the free sample from the local sign company
[11:03:45] <Tom_itx> since i wouldn't be using much at all
[11:04:03] <Tom_itx> i've only used probably a spoonfull of paint so far
[11:04:33] <zeeshan> is ther eanother way to cur eit
[11:04:36] <zeeshan> instead of uv?
[11:04:46] <Tom_itx> not if it's UV paint
[11:04:51] <Tom_itx> sunshine i suppose
[11:04:59] <Tom_itx> but it would take longer
[11:05:09] <zeeshan> what about non uv curing
[11:05:13] <zeeshan> like specific wavelength
[11:05:15] <zeeshan> like red or blue
[11:05:36] <Tom_itx> you'd have to come up with that solution yourself just like i did
[11:05:49] <Tom_itx> i went to nail salons looking for UV lamps
[11:06:05] <Tom_itx> found a friend that was replacing his fishtank bulbs and got those free too
[11:06:06] <Karl> does anyone know an competive user who can help me for my solution in german please?
[11:06:11] <Tom_itx> i had to buy a ballast for it
[11:06:24] <zeeshan> we have a uv lamp
[11:06:35] <zeeshan> but it'll change the properties of the specimen im trying to study
[11:06:37] <zeeshan> :P
[11:06:47] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.ddns01.com:81/~webpage/boards/USBTiny_Mkii/silkscreen/silk_batch_cure.jpg
[11:06:48] <zeeshan> that is why i am trying to avoid that type of curing
[11:06:54] <Tom_itx> there's my homebrew exposure lamp
[11:07:10] <Tom_itx> 2 bulbs
[11:07:11] <zeeshan> that looks cool :D
[11:07:20] * zeeshan should just take it to a tanning salon
[11:07:22] <Tom_itx> smells like ozone the second you turn it on
[11:07:32] <Tom_itx> i run the exhaust fan while doing it
[11:07:49] <Tom_itx> those bulbs are probably the wrong wavelength
[11:08:13] <Tom_itx> the sign company even offered to cure them for me
[11:08:23] <Tom_itx> but i told them i wouldn't be making them all at once
[11:09:09] <Tom_itx> their conveyor table was probably 3'x5' or so
[11:09:16] <Tom_itx> in one side and out the other
[11:09:18] <zeeshan> im going to talk to a silk screen company
[11:09:20] <zeeshan> and see whats up
[11:09:47] <Tom_itx> i first went to an art supply to get the silk and emulsion
[11:10:12] <Tom_itx> sortof a 'professional art' supply
[11:11:07] <Tom_itx> the guy there was very helpful and told me to go see his friend at the sign company
[11:11:18] <Tom_itx> for the paint
[11:11:38] <Tom_itx> i really didn't wanna order a gallon of uv paint
[11:13:54] <pcw_home> http://www.ebay.com/itm/1pc-PCB-UV-Curable-Solder-Mask-Repairing-Paint-White-100g-/180917242119?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2a1f820907
[11:14:57] <Tom_itx> cool
[11:14:58] <CaptHindsight> Shipping to other Countries 20 - 35 days international shipping fun
[11:15:47] <pcw_home> most PCBs use similar stuff for the legend
[11:15:49] <CaptHindsight> that will cure with UV or sunlight, probably not a projector
[11:16:03] <Tom_itx> pcw_home, i wasn't sure what kind of paint they used
[11:16:06] <CaptHindsight> don't know which pi they used
[11:16:28] <CaptHindsight> probably drops off >380nm
[11:16:40] <mozmck> this Labtool looks pretty neat for $130, with open source software. The LPC4370 chip it's based on looks quite powerful.
[11:16:42] <mozmck> http://www.lpcware.com/content/project/Mixed-Signal-Logic-Analyzer-Oscilloscope-Lab-Tool-Solution
[11:17:42] <pcw_home> Is that the ARM with 80 Ms/s A-D?
[11:17:54] <mozmck> looks like it is
[11:18:55] <pcw_home> Looked at those a year or so ago for something
[11:19:16] <mozmck> http://www.nxp.com/products/microcontrollers/cortex_m4/lpc4300/LPC4370FET100.html
[11:22:11] <mozmck> Looks like one of the cheapest mixed signal usb scope/analysers I've seen.
[11:24:17] <pcw_home> The whats funny is you cannot buy a 12 bit 80 ms/s A-D as cheap as the LPC
[11:26:12] <mozmck> heh, so you just buy the LPC if you need that fast A-D I guess. Make the firmware so the chip looks like an SPI A-D chip if you want to use a different micro for the main controller?
[11:28:15] <pcw_home> Just pointing out that the integrated A-D is a bargain
[11:28:32] <mozmck> sounds like.
[11:29:03] <pcw_home> (also true on the ~$3 stm32f303 with 4X 12 bit 5 MS/sec A-Ds)
[11:29:33] <mozmck> I haven't used any of the ST chips, are they pretty good
[11:29:34] <mozmck> ?
[11:32:04] <mozmck> I've looked some at the freescale kinetis - I guess the main difference between the companies cortex-m chips are the peripherals and libraries.
[11:32:27] <pcw_home> Ive just played a bit with the STM discovery boards
[11:32:47] * JT-Shop just sold an air filter kit for the Can Am Spyder to Turkey :)
[11:33:02] <pcw_home> I intend to start using the for more capable sserial remotes
[11:33:38] <mozmck> I see. I've used NXP chips a good bit now.
[11:33:42] <pcw_home> we sell a fair amount of stuff to Turkey
[11:34:04] <Tom_itx> JT-Shop will it arrive?
[11:34:09] <JT-Shop> that's good to know
[11:34:11] <mozmck> pcw_home: what compiler IDE do you use for the ST chips?
[11:34:23] <Tom_itx> don't ship to dubai etc
[11:34:28] <Tom_itx> or india
[11:34:36] <JT-Shop> it takes about 3-4 weeks to get to Australia I'd assume the same to Turkey
[11:34:42] <Tom_itx> approx yes
[11:35:03] <JT-Shop> why is that?
[11:35:11] <Tom_itx> slow boat to...
[11:35:30] <JT-Shop> I use USPS 99.9% of the time
[11:35:33] <Tom_itx> alot of times it sits in their customs a long time
[11:35:44] <Tom_itx> JT-Shop, same here
[11:36:11] <mozmck> maybe you should put an extra $100 in the package for the customs agent :)
[11:36:15] <pcw_home> I have only messed about with EM:Blocks
[11:36:17] <Tom_itx> canada is bad about customs too
[11:36:28] <pcw_home> canada is the worst
[11:36:46] <LeelooMinai> mozmck: Don't know about PCW, but I use this as the toolchain (it's pretty nice with latest gcc support): https://launchpad.net/gcc-arm-embedded
[11:36:54] <SpeedEvil> Canadian customs are fine. It's just you've gotta say 'eh' a lot.
[11:37:02] <LeelooMinai> It's from ARM guys
[11:37:25] <mozmck> pcw_home: interesting, I haven't heard of EM:Blocks until now.
[11:37:38] <mozmck> LeelooMinai: I use use that as well
[11:37:50] <LeelooMinai> + Eclipse, ARM Plugin, register view plugin, jlink clone
[11:38:03] <mozmck> with eclipse and the gnu-arm plugin.
[11:38:30] <LeelooMinai> RIght, that's my setup too - it works prett well
[11:38:33] <Tom_itx> JT-Shop, some of mine to turkey were ~13 days
[11:38:41] <mozmck> LeelooMinai: heh, similar setup it seems. I haven't heard of the register view or jlink clone.
[11:39:01] <mozmck> Haven't used jtag much at all so far.
[11:39:03] <LeelooMinai> mozmck: by register view I mean embsysregview plugin - don't tell me you don't use it:)
[11:39:18] <mozmck> Nope - haven't heard of it!
[11:39:53] <mozmck> I do most of my debugging by toggling pins and reading with a scope, reading through my code, etc.
[11:39:59] <LeelooMinai> mozmck: Man... install it - it shows all the μC register when you breakpoint - cannot live without it:)
[11:40:16] <LeelooMinai> And I don't mean just CPU registers - all the peripheral ones
[11:40:25] <mozmck> That means I would have to use JTAG.
[11:40:42] <LeelooMinai> No, swd is ok
[11:41:20] <LeelooMinai> mozmck: Looks kind of like this: http://a.fsdn.com/con/app/proj/embsysregview/screenshots/219110.jpg
[11:41:41] <mozmck> ah, that's true. I often use every pin on a project, and haven't really spent that much time in debugging.
[11:42:04] <mozmck> Usually I can toggle a pin or read through my code and find the problem pretty quickly.
[11:43:05] <LeelooMinai> Yes, well, the plugin shines when you deal with hardware in a more direct way
[11:43:22] <mozmck> Freescale recently released a free dev environment based on eclipse/gcc-arm-embedded.
[11:44:05] <mozmck> I'm sure it does. I may have to try some of those more fancy debugging tools someday :)
[11:44:45] <LeelooMinai> mozmck: Btw, I also wrote software for tracing arm execution: https://www.flickr.com/photos/100017731@N03/15267769128/
[11:44:59] <mozmck> pcw_home: I see that EM:Blocks is based on Code::Blocks, which I have used a good bit.
[11:46:17] <mozmck> LeelooMinai: neat! is that sold somewhere?
[11:46:34] <LeelooMinai> mozmck: No, I wrote it for me, myself and I:)
[11:46:59] <mozmck> ok
[11:47:34] <LeelooMinai> Hmm, that 80 Msps μC costs $8 or so - pretty crazt
[11:47:37] <LeelooMinai> crazy*
[11:47:51] <LeelooMinai> With all that stuff it has on board
[11:48:21] <SpeedEvil> LeelooMinai: yeah - that the one with a dozen low speed ADCs too?
[11:48:37] <mozmck> what gui library did you use for that trace program?
[11:48:39] <LeelooMinai> SpeedEvil: http://www.nxp.com/products/microcontrollers/cortex_m4/lpc4300/LPC4370FET100.html
[11:49:12] <SpeedEvil> LeelooMinai: yeah
[11:49:17] <LeelooMinai> mozmck: Eclipse platform - SWT/JFace + the timeline view now is implemented in OpenGL
[11:49:24] <SpeedEvil> someone really needs to get their shizzle on with that and make a scope
[11:50:01] <mozmck> SpeedEvil: you mean like this one? http://www.lpcware.com/content/project/Mixed-Signal-Logic-Analyzer-Oscilloscope-Lab-Tool-Solution
[11:50:36] <mozmck> $130 at mouser: http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Embedded-Artists/EA-XPR-202
[11:51:01] <mozmck> Open source software: https://github.com/embeddedartists/labtool
[11:52:02] <mozmck> LeelooMinai: I've done very little with Java. Minimal C++ is more my style. https://github.com/mozmck/flpcui
[11:53:02] <LeelooMinai> mozmck: What is it?
[11:53:22] <mozmck> a gui for lpc21isp - a command line ISP tool for NXP arm chips
[11:53:43] <LeelooMinai> I use C++ sans exceptions. templates, etc., all the unnecessary stuff, for my μC code
[11:54:32] <mozmck> I use FLTK for stuff like that - statically linked it adds about 400K to the binary, and there are no extra dependencies other than system libraries.
[11:54:38] <mozmck> cross platform too!
[11:55:30] <LeelooMinai> THat's why I like that ARM toolchain - can use all the C++11 features no problem
[11:56:43] <mozmck> That's true. I've used C++ in one uC project, but a lot of mine are pretty small.
[11:57:13] <SpeedEvil> mozmck: I was meaning me kinda.
[11:57:26] <mozmck> do you write your own peripheral libraries?
[11:57:49] <mozmck> SpeedEvil: I see! I may have to get one of those Labtools for that price.
[11:57:52] <LeelooMinai> Hmm, I shall probably now go to work on my CNC - yesterday I tore down all the limit switches, because they could not properly hold NC state:/
[11:58:09] <SpeedEvil> mozmck: I want to make a ~10 channel 1Msps or so scope,which logs to some RAm on a 10s loop, and then if it gets a trigger, dumps it to flash
[11:58:23] <SpeedEvil> mozmck: basically as a crash recorder for electronics
[11:58:30] <LeelooMinai> Crappy Chinese one, but were cute and tine. Now I will use Omron ones that are 5 times bigger, but at least work
[11:58:34] <mozmck> Sounds interesting.
[11:58:45] <SpeedEvil> mozmck: so you could get the last tenth of a second of your switch-mode PSUs life
[11:59:01] <SpeedEvil> And find out why it actually died, not guess
[11:59:20] <SpeedEvil> Or, of course, motor driver or ...
[12:54:40] <Loetmichel> *harhar* $me just hanged the laundry on the line... my woofe has a pair of trousers in "urban camo"?!? *looked again* oh, ist just a pile of leaves printed on that in different shades of gray. but looks TOTALLY like american urban camo uniform trousers ;-)
[12:55:32] <Loetmichel> s/woofe/wife
[13:13:01] <PetefromTn_> Well got two of the four pieces of ductwork cut out and ready to be bent. Working on the other two :D
[13:45:44] <CaptHindsight> http://www.custompartnet.com/calculator/turning-surface-roughness
[15:17:03] <JT-Shop> guess it it time to take the old computer off the desk... it keeps shutting down
[15:21:46] <Tom_itx> blow it out with the air hose
[15:21:58] <Tom_itx> wiggle the connectors
[15:22:04] <Tom_itx> it'll be good for another 10
[15:22:40] <Tom_itx> maybe re'cap it
[15:23:02] <Tom_itx> had to do that to a couple here
[15:25:02] <renesis> kill it with fire
[15:25:35] <renesis> or if you have space just hide in a corner and maybe 1 days youll need like 5% of it
[15:26:17] <renesis> at the very least, it has all the right screws for a pc build
[15:44:46] <andypugh> Two different and valid viewpoints.
[15:46:12] <andypugh> I tend to always advise everyone else to buy new, and keep my own old stuff running for fun.
[15:48:08] <PetefromTn_> it has become so cheap to buy or build a computer nowadays there is litttle reason to keep an old one running unless you just dig that sort of thing.
[15:49:26] <andypugh> I currently have Roland DXY880 plugged in to my iMac.
[15:49:44] <JT-Shop> I have so many old computers laying about that I trip over them
[15:49:56] <andypugh> (It might be the only USB 880 in the workd :-)
[15:51:03] <PetefromTn_> Honestly after I went to staples today and had them print out the large format drawings I did
[15:51:13] <PetefromTn_> I would probably enjoy having one
[15:51:38] <PetefromTn_> Especially if I could add a drag knife to it and cut plastic adhesive backed materials
[15:52:22] <andypugh> For a while I lived with a friend who has a bad old-Mac habit. The spare room I lived in had a stack of 24 PowerPC 6100
[15:52:38] <SpeedEvil> ...
[15:53:00] <andypugh> On his sideboard in the living room is a stack of 6 Lisas
[15:53:00] <PetefromTn_> http://knoxville.craigslist.org/sys/4694826047.html This looks cool... and cheap
[15:53:41] <andypugh> (And these are just the machines that won’t fit in the storage room, loft, or garage..,
[15:54:04] <JT-Shop> the Lisa was the first computer to use a mouse?
[15:54:20] <JT-Shop> cost like 10k because of the memory IIRC
[15:55:02] <SpeedEvil> JT-Shop: no
[15:55:10] <SpeedEvil> perhaps the first mass market one
[15:55:52] <andypugh> PetefromTn_: My DXY880 was fitted with a drag knife, I wrote code to slice STL and convert to HPGL to cut out label-paper to make these patterns to make pannier brackets for my bike: https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/tjht3D69CSp25i9tYwD7dtMTjNZETYmyPJy0liipFm0?feat=directlink
[15:56:37] <JT-Shop> ah the first to offer a graphical user interface
[15:56:45] <JT-Shop> I knew it was something or other
[15:56:54] <andypugh> JT-Shop: Not that either.
[15:57:03] <PetefromTn_> andypugh Is it a big deal to add the drag knife to these things?
[15:57:15] <JT-Shop> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_Lisa
[15:57:31] <PetefromTn_> not following how you made panniers?
[15:57:43] <PetefromTn_> oh you said pannier brackets.
[15:57:56] <andypugh> But, much like the iPhone didn’t have anythign that hadn’t been seen before, it put a lot of things together and made them actually work properly.
[15:59:09] <PetefromTn_> can you load a small piece into these things easily or does it all have to be from large format sheet?
[16:01:28] <andypugh> The flat-bed plotters will write on an arbitrarily small piece of paper, and then on the bed of the printer when the paper is too small :-)
[16:01:58] <PetefromTn_> is yours a flat bed?
[16:02:07] <andypugh> Yes
[16:02:33] <PetefromTn_> what is the capacity?
[16:02:58] <andypugh> Here is a picture of one: http://i.vimeocdn.com/video/58136752_1280x720.jpg
[16:03:03] <andypugh> A3 size
[16:03:48] <andypugh> I wouldn’t recommend buying one now, unless you want to write your own driver.
[16:03:53] <PetefromTn_> cool...so it is a pen type plotter that grabs the different color pens
[16:04:07] <PetefromTn_> what software do you run it with?
[16:04:22] <andypugh> They speak an obsolete language, and are serial-only
[16:05:14] <PetefromTn_> figures
[16:05:28] <andypugh> I wrote code in Octave (free Matlab) that converted STL to HPGL strings then sent them out of the USB port to the USB-serial converter that I put inside the printer and soldered to the motherboard.
[16:05:50] <PetefromTn_> sounds like a pain in the ass
[16:05:53] <andypugh> (It was a Project :-)
[16:06:10] <PetefromTn_> I can see the beauty of having one tho
[16:06:30] <PetefromTn_> even if it was just for making paint masks and full sized templates like I am doing here
[16:07:15] <andypugh> I wanted to use it last week to cut some stencils from Inventor in Windows, but eventually gave up and laser-printed them and used a scalpel.
[16:07:33] <PetefromTn_> that bad huh.
[16:07:42] <andypugh> That was a one-off job, so not worth the time to sort it all out.
[16:08:19] <andypugh> If I had three to do, I would have figured it out.
[16:08:59] <pcw_home> That reminds me I need to get rid of the Versatec CE3000 in the back room
[16:12:03] <andypugh> Here is the code that slices an STL and creates a Postscript file of each layer (which I never used) and also controls the plotter to cut out the parts. It is really not very much code. Slicing STL in Matlab/Octave is really very easy. http://pastebin.com/JtCRXWrM
[16:14:41] <andypugh> This is almost magic: I1 = find(sum((Z>z),2) == 1); % Index of faces with 1 vertex greater than z
[16:14:47] <PetefromTn_> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lzfd0jsw0Ro Well just found another reason to build a larger format CNC router..
[16:16:03] <andypugh> (one line of code to import the STL, then that line of code gives a list of all all faces which have one vertex above the slicing plane and two below.)
[16:17:41] <PetefromTn_> sounds complicated. so this pannier mount is sliced and then reassembled...pretty cool
[16:19:00] <andypugh> The assembly process was gruesomely tedious. One of those jobs where your legs hurt and you want to hit something. Or is that just me?
[16:19:45] <Deejay> gn8
[16:20:14] <PetefromTn_> looks like that big CNC router with a drag knife and thicker layers might have been easier no?
[16:20:24] <andypugh> It is worth noting that the “drag knife” in that video is not a drag knife, it is on an active axis.
[16:20:57] <PetefromTn_> thats what I thought but it looks like the tip of the knife is actually penetrating causing the rotation.
[16:21:19] <andypugh> LinuxCNC doesn’t currently export the “heading” of the next move, it would be really nice if it did.
[16:22:51] <PetefromTn_> how do they accomplish that then some special software I suppose
[16:23:09] <andypugh> I did write a “tangentkins” that can be used, which is a kinematics file that tells a C axis where to point, but that is a kludge and the info really ought to come from Motion.
[16:23:20] <pcw_home> it also looks like it made multiple plunges on sharp corners
[16:23:51] <andypugh> It can be done with knife-aware CAM.
[16:23:58] <PetefromTn_> that looks like a sweet foam airplane too.
[16:24:19] <andypugh> In fact, CAM is the best place to do it.
[16:24:28] <PetefromTn_> yeah I would think so
[16:24:50] <PetefromTn_> kinda would sorta work like terrible backlash comp hehehe
[16:24:57] <andypugh> G0 C moves when out of the material, and coordinated G1 C-moves for curves.
[16:26:04] <andypugh> I think Viesteurs has used tangentkins for plasma kerf commpensation.
[16:27:05] <ssi> I was actually just thinking about that problem the other day
[16:27:10] <ssi> the "knife heading" problem
[16:28:31] <andypugh> It is easy to do it badly in a kinematics module.
[16:28:43] <PetefromTn_> Damn man my wife made shrimp stir fry and I just had my first taste of WASABI sauce.... My nose is STILL on fire LOL
[16:28:59] <andypugh> It can be done better in the motion module, but hasn;t been.
[16:29:16] <andypugh> But it can be done best of all in a preprocesor.
[16:35:16] <pcw_home> Hmm neighbor has just placed a tanning bed on the curb with a sign reading "Free tanning bed, all new bulbs"
[16:35:18] <pcw_home> bit hard to repurpose I guess
[16:38:05] <SpeedEvil> PCB exposer
[16:40:07] <syyl_> maybe put a sign on it
[16:40:11] <syyl_> "free skin cancer!"
[16:41:44] <pcw_home> :-)
[16:42:20] <ssi> https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B2g_4QpIIAA-LDb.jpg:large
[16:42:21] <ssi> getting closer!
[16:44:31] <andypugh> I found this last week, a newspaper blindly followong the idea that Radon is good for you. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/travel/article-2255288/Holidays-Austria-Sitting-Radhaus-mountain--thats-real-gas.html
[16:48:22] <roycroft> andypugh: my district has a perpetual candidate for congress who is a scientist and advocates embedding radioactive waste in the foundations of houses, as he believes that low level radiation is a health benefit
[16:48:34] <roycroft> he also believes that public schools are child abuse
[16:48:46] <SpeedEvil> Public schools can be child abuse
[16:48:53] <SpeedEvil> but - probably not in the sense he means
[16:48:56] <roycroft> and he sends me letters asking me to send him my urine on a regular basis
[16:49:26] <XXCoder> Radium. "The Radium Water Worked Fine until His Jaw Came Off"
[16:49:27] <SpeedEvil> err?
[16:49:41] <roycroft> an odd fellow he is, that is certain
[16:49:56] <renesis> roycroft: does he give a reason for the urine request?
[16:50:01] <roycroft> he wants to study it
[16:50:03] <renesis> or he just kind of slips it in
[16:50:10] <renesis> just, in general?
[16:50:15] <roycroft> at his "research institute"
[16:50:20] <SpeedEvil> Why yours?
[16:50:22] <renesis> his kitchen?
[16:50:24] <roycroft> not just mine
[16:50:25] <renesis> =(
[16:50:27] <roycroft> lots of people's
[16:50:34] <XXCoder> his piss must be tasty
[16:50:36] <SpeedEvil> Is it known he does this?
[16:50:37] <roycroft> he sends these letters to everyone who is not a registered democrat
[16:50:37] <renesis> he wants a PeeDB
[16:50:41] <roycroft> yes
[16:50:47] <roycroft> it is well known
[16:50:52] <roycroft> rachel maddow loves to talk about him on her show
[16:51:00] <renesis> i <3 her
[16:51:04] <renesis> they make her so cute for the show
[16:51:24] <roycroft> his name is art robinson
[16:51:28] <roycroft> in case you're curious
[16:51:47] <roycroft> in the last election campaign he had a debate with the incumbent, peter defazio
[16:51:52] <renesis> ill resist the urge to look it up as ive blown enough time on the internets today
[16:51:59] <renesis> and the sounds like a rabbit hole of sorts
[16:52:05] <renesis> ^that
[16:52:05] <roycroft> peter stood at the podium with one of art's books in hand and read passages directly from it
[16:52:20] <roycroft> art's retort was "if you will quit telling lies about me i'll quit telling the truth about you"
[16:52:21] <renesis> haha awesome
[16:52:41] <renesis> wow @ 'lies' from his own book
[16:52:45] <roycroft> peter said "i'm reading your book"
[16:53:05] <roycroft> my little corner of the world can be amusing at times
[16:53:33] <renesis> what part do you live in?
[16:53:39] <roycroft> western oregon
[16:53:45] <renesis> oh nice
[16:53:56] <renesis> you guys do some awesome and then some totally gooky things
[16:54:01] <roycroft> art is also a major climate change denier
[16:54:05] <roycroft> yes
[16:54:07] <renesis> when cali breaks off, i want you guys to come with us
[16:54:13] <renesis> whole pacific ring of fire
[16:54:14] <XXCoder> western washington here. hey WO from WW
[16:54:29] <roycroft> what's going to happen in california is scarier than most people think
[16:54:42] <renesis> when people start leaving?
[16:54:43] <roycroft> the western side of the san andreas fault is actually sliding northwards
[16:54:58] <roycroft> in a few million years los angeles will be due west of san francisco
[16:55:02] <roycroft> which is the scary thing
[16:55:08] <renesis> right so LA and the bay eventually connect
[16:55:20] <renesis> not a big concern right now
[16:55:32] <renesis> also i live far from big scary faults now
[16:55:40] <renesis> just dead volcanos now
[16:55:51] <roycroft> i don't leave near any major faults, but also not too far from them
[16:56:00] <roycroft> and we're way way way overdue for a really big earthquake
[16:56:14] <renesis> i lived in souther california until a few months ago
[16:56:17] <roycroft> we don't get little 5.x stress relievers like much of cali does
[16:56:20] <Tom_itx> we've been getting them here lately
[16:56:25] <renesis> yeah they just stopped talking about the big one
[16:56:50] <roycroft> seattle had a decent size one a few years ago, but it's still overdue for a really big one
[16:56:57] <renesis> because northridge was not the big one, and if it happened even an hour later, hundreds or thousands dead
[16:57:04] <Tom_itx> never before, but the last couple years
[16:57:07] <renesis> and they found mad faults like that one all over LA basin
[16:57:15] <roycroft> are you in oklahoma, tom_itx?
[16:57:23] <Tom_itx> ks
[16:57:31] <roycroft> same difference, in context
[16:57:35] <Tom_itx> yep
[16:57:37] <renesis> so like, san andreas is overdue, but there are tons of northridge size faults that could fuck everything up too
[16:57:39] <roycroft> and fracking has absolutely nothing to do with it, right? :)
[16:57:48] <XXCoder> fracking frack
[16:58:15] <roycroft> your tap water catching on fire is unrelated to fracking as well
[16:58:20] <renesis> well it would be kind of amusing if they traced californias lack of quakes to fracking
[16:58:26] <XXCoder> yeah water naturally gets on fire
[16:58:30] <renesis> those vids are so awesome
[16:58:35] <roycroft> well in ohio it used to ...
[16:59:02] <roycroft> the cuyahoga river caught on fire several times during the '70s
[16:59:07] <renesis> =(
[16:59:19] <roycroft> but that was unrelated to the high levels of pollution in the river
[16:59:33] <roycroft> it was a miracle
[16:59:52] <roycroft> speaking of whichi
[16:59:54] <roycroft> i could use one
[17:00:00] <renesis> ask the jezus
[17:00:15] <roycroft> i could use a machinist coming over right now and drilling and tapping the ss cap i need to deal with
[17:00:20] <roycroft> because i hate machining ss
[17:00:39] <roycroft> and i have to run a 1/2" npt tap through a cap that's about 0.250" thick
[17:00:42] <Tom_itx> what kind?
[17:00:46] <roycroft> 304
[17:00:51] <roycroft> the not worst kind but not best kind
[17:00:55] <Tom_itx> shouldn't be so tough
[17:01:05] <Tom_itx> constant feed
[17:01:12] <roycroft> i've done it before and it is not fun
[17:02:10] <roycroft> the hardest part is clamping the cap tightly enough
[17:02:18] <roycroft> it's a 2" circle
[17:02:34] <Tom_itx> stick it in the lathe chuck and drill it
[17:02:48] <roycroft> my lathe is way too wimpy to do this job
[17:02:54] <roycroft> and it's not the drilling that's a problem - that part is easy
[17:03:01] <roycroft> it's running the tap down after that is a hassle
[17:03:09] <roycroft> especially since it's a tapered tap
[17:03:25] <Tom_itx> well don't work harden it with the drill...
[17:03:30] <roycroft> i'll try not to
[17:03:41] <roycroft> and i know the routine - slow speed, heavy feed
[17:04:43] <SpeedEvil> roycroft: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6YzZ4lfjN1A - amusing. (art)
[17:05:12] <roycroft> what is really scary is that my boss is friends with art
[17:05:24] <roycroft> and art has showed up at my office many times, so i know him fairly well
[17:05:45] <andypugh> Latest project, heat-treatment furnace. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/travel/article-2255288/Holidays-Austria-Sitting-Radhaus-mountain--thats-real-gas.html
[17:06:06] <andypugh> Oops, let me get the right URL, that was the previous one
[17:06:38] <andypugh> Heat-treatment furnace : https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/kOXgwXHGQ_6kUm_7og3egtMTjNZETYmyPJy0liipFm0?feat=directlink
[17:07:21] <roycroft> you can see i'm not lying, speedevil
[17:08:00] <andypugh> Looking in at 820C (1500 F) https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/0KBnb_gsIAVDxe1ALNSTsNMTjNZETYmyPJy0liipFm0?feat=directlink
[17:08:59] <SpeedEvil> I bought several of http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/271481533974?_trksid=p2059210.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
[17:09:08] <SpeedEvil> I want to make a leeeetle furnace with them
[17:09:17] <SpeedEvil> Just need to work out the element
[17:09:45] <SpeedEvil> They were bought for battery prototypes - but I can't work out how to make it not possibly explode
[17:10:20] <andypugh> SpeedEvil: That is the _exact_ auction that mine was made from.
[17:10:30] <SpeedEvil> hah
[17:11:37] <SpeedEvil> What're you using for the heater?
[17:13:02] <andypugh> I found a reel of Brightray wire in a skip years ago. You need 10m per crucible to make a 2kW element.
[17:13:22] <andypugh> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brightray
[17:14:15] <SpeedEvil> ah
[17:14:49] <roycroft> i have a front loading kiln that i use for heat treating metals
[17:15:23] <andypugh> I knew I should have taken photos, I used to be a metallurgist and rewound a few furnaces.
[17:16:21] <andypugh> SpeedEvil: Would you like me to post you enough wire for a winding?
[17:16:43] <andypugh> The process is:
[17:16:53] <SpeedEvil> That would be awesome!
[17:18:54] <andypugh> 1) Make a big loop from a foot away from the tube, to the tube, round the back, back to the end, and back to the tube. Then twist that with a cordless drill to make a triple-strand infeed tightly wound to the end of the tube.,
[17:19:46] * SpeedEvil reads.
[17:19:47] <andypugh> Then wind the 10m of element at 3mm pitch round the tube (I used the CNC lathe, but hand will work).
[17:20:08] <andypugh> Then do the same triple-braid thing to finish it off.
[17:20:51] <andypugh> Then smear Pyruma fire cement from B&Q over the whole thing.
[17:20:57] <SpeedEvil> I think I understand how that works.
[17:21:01] <SpeedEvil> And power slowly
[17:21:26] <SpeedEvil> I guess glassfibre insulation will work to several hundred C, then something more exotic is needed
[17:22:45] <andypugh> Then wrap it all up in: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/251457038075?_trksid=p2059210.m2749.l2649&var=550368906852&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
[17:23:04] <SpeedEvil> yeah - I'd been looking at that and similar
[17:23:16] <SpeedEvil> Iwas speccing a battery box for a 450C battery.
[17:23:33] <SpeedEvil> But can't work out how to make it not explode and keep it cheap - so that projects been shelved for the moment
[17:23:37] <andypugh> Insulate the tails with http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Ceramic-Porcelain-Insulating-Beads-size-3-Insulator-x-50pcs-trade-price-or-Offer-/231391048902?
[17:23:57] <SpeedEvil> I think I have some of those somewhere - can test them for temperature I guess
[17:24:19] <andypugh> And connect to the controller with http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/331183823241?_trksid=p2059210.m2749.l2649&var=540381133491&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
[17:25:01] <SpeedEvil> I don't suppose you know anything about the rate of solution of lithium and lead if you put them on top of each other at 450C :)
[17:25:13] <SpeedEvil> I suspect the answer is 'way too fast'.
[17:25:31] <SpeedEvil> The energy is enough to heat all the battery components to 2000C
[17:25:45] <andypugh> Hard to say. The density is so different that they might resist mixing.
[17:25:51] <SpeedEvil> yeah
[17:26:02] <SpeedEvil> I guess it's one of those need to test things.
[17:26:14] <SpeedEvil> Will the molten salt layer reform spontaneously
[17:26:20] <SpeedEvil> or will it carry on 'boiling'
[17:26:29] <andypugh> No idea, sorry :-)
[17:26:48] <SpeedEvil> molten metals, flourine, what could go wrong? :)
[17:27:01] <SpeedEvil> I think I'll test it with chlorides only if I do.
[17:27:13] <SpeedEvil> In a teeny vial
[17:31:07] * jthornton learned an old trick just now shift + insert will paste into the terminal window :)
[17:34:07] <_methods> anyone know what a suitable modern equivalent to cup grease would be?
[17:35:01] <andypugh> Interesting question.
[17:35:23] <Tom_itx> you want a synthetic?
[17:37:05] <andypugh> Is that a semi-fluid grease? Spheerol EPL 0 is what the Enfield guys use in their gearboxes. http://www.silmid.com/getattachment/98c30315-46d2-4ef9-8faf-996850bd8343/Castrol-Spheerol-EPL1.aspx
[17:39:53] <_methods> i'd use anything i guess
[17:40:13] <Tom_itx> http://www.mscdirect.com/browse/tn/Lubricants-Coolants-Fluids/Lubricants-Lubrication-Equipment/Lubricants/Grease/?008=-99&pcrid=24430225144&007=Search&006=24430225144&005=17124041&004=5290409464&002=2167139&mkwid=sRamFvam2|dc&cid=ppc-google-Product+-+Lubricants%2C+Coolants+%26+Fluids+--+B_sRamFvam2_synthetic+grease_b_24430225144_c_S&026=-99&025=c&navid=12107439
[17:40:19] <_methods> i was reading that maybe white lithium is a suitable replacement
[17:40:42] <SpeedEvil> what's it for?
[17:40:51] <_methods> grease cups on a lathe
[17:41:17] <_methods> old atlas th42
[17:41:21] <_methods> f10d
[17:41:58] <_methods> all the other lube points call for some 10weight motor oil
[17:42:15] <_methods> but the bearing have grease cups and the manual says to use cup grease
[17:42:35] <_methods> which is apparently something so deadly and dangerous it just stopped existing
[17:46:06] <andypugh> http://www.easternpetroleum.in/cup_grease.html
[17:46:26] <t12_> my ears
[17:46:38] <t12_> is that a butter knife
[17:48:47] <_methods> hahah 180kg drums
[17:49:16] <_methods> i'll be a cup grease dealer
[18:07:09] <Shaun__> hi
[18:07:35] <shaun414> figured Id ask here, anyone know about restoring old too;s?
[18:08:34] <Tom_itx> no
[18:08:40] <Tom_itx> ask the real question now.
[18:08:48] <shaun414> how to remeove rust
[18:09:01] <Tom_itx> pickling
[18:09:07] <shaun414> salt and vinegar?
[18:10:07] <Tom_itx> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pickling_%28metal%29
[18:10:45] <shaun414> idk about using strong acids
[18:10:53] <andypugh> Molasses
[18:11:19] <shaun414> srsly?
[18:11:33] <andypugh> 10:1 mixture of molasses and water. Leave it to soak for 2 weeks.
[18:11:42] <shaun414> i dont have 2 weeks..
[18:11:47] <shaun414> and some of it has wood nearby
[18:11:49] <shaun414> cant soak
[18:12:22] <andypugh> Ah.
[18:13:15] <andypugh> Well, mollasses works well, is very gentle, and at the end is easy to dispose of.
[18:13:34] <shaun414> i dont have 2 weeks either..
[18:13:47] <andypugh> My experience is blogged here: http://bodgesoc.blogspot.co.uk/2014/04/1921-ner-car.html
[18:13:49] <Tom_itx> it took time to rust
[18:13:55] <Tom_itx> it takes time to undo it
[18:14:58] <XXCoder> unless you just plain grind it away
[18:17:59] <cradek_> I'm doing the opposite - trying to rust some hopeless screws out of a part
[18:18:01] <shaun414> anyo more?
[18:18:02] <shaun414> any
[18:18:11] <cradek_> (in an alum solution)
[18:20:59] <XXCoder> try soak in wd40?
[18:21:44] <XXCoder> lightly hit with hammer once a while hopefully vibration will help wd40 go even deeper in
[18:21:54] <XXCoder> im sure theres better solitions
[18:21:56] <XXCoder> solutions
[18:22:02] <shaun414> vinegar?
[18:22:38] <XXCoder> oh sorry it was to cradek shaun
[18:22:53] <shaun414> will vinegar work
[18:22:56] <shaun414> for rust removal
[18:22:58] <XXCoder> dunno
[18:23:32] <handmill> hi
[18:24:23] <handmill> Is there any special requirements for using a MESA card?
[18:25:05] <Tom_itx> parport, pci or ethernet
[18:25:48] <handmill> I didn't get one yet, and would like to know which one is better.
[18:25:59] <Tom_itx> for what?
[18:26:20] <Tom_itx> the 5i25 seems a popular choice
[18:26:27] <handmill> To control 5 AC servo motors.
[18:27:16] <handmill> I'll start with XYZ, but I'd like to be able to expand...
[18:27:21] <Tom_itx> pcw_home might be able to recomend a daughter card...
[18:28:05] <handmill> The daughter card is an expantion card?
[18:28:31] <handmill> expansion*
[18:28:54] <Tom_itx> purpose made for various things
[18:29:01] <Tom_itx> ie servo or stepper systems
[18:30:34] <pcw_home> The appropriate daughtercard depends on the available drive interface
[18:31:22] <handmill> What is better, Parallel, PCI or Ethernet?
[18:31:49] <Tom_itx> ethernet is still being tested i think
[18:32:36] <pcw_home> support of Ethernet connected Mesa cards is only available with LinuxCNC 2.7
[18:32:46] <pcw_home> (or later)
[18:33:06] <pcw_home> the PCI/PCIE cards are most common now
[18:33:38] <handmill> What are the differences between the 3 interface types?
[18:34:05] <Tom_itx> just that..
[18:34:49] <Tom_itx> parport was probably available first then pci/pcie
[18:35:21] <handmill> Which interface will have the best performance?
[18:35:40] <Tom_itx> probably all about the same
[18:35:51] <Tom_itx> the tasks are offloaded to the mesa card
[18:36:12] <pcw_home> Parallel connect to a PC parallel port (so you need a parallel port preferably a motherboard port)
[18:36:14] <pcw_home> PCI needs a PCI slot in the machine, PCIE needs a PCIE
[18:36:15] <pcw_home> Ethernet needs a dedicated Ethernet connection
[18:36:17] <LeelooMinai> Hmm, isn't 2.6.5 the latest?
[18:36:34] <LeelooMinai> Or is 2.7 some beta stage (?)
[18:37:00] <Tom_itx> i don't think it's that far along yet
[18:37:11] <Tom_itx> could be mistaken...
[18:37:15] <pcw_home> There are performance differences:
[18:37:16] <pcw_home> PCI/PCIE are the fastest
[18:37:18] <pcw_home> Ethernet is mid way
[18:37:19] <pcw_home> Parallel is the slowest
[18:37:37] <pcw_home> But for a normal 1 KHz servo thread all are fine performance wise
[18:38:19] <LeelooMinai> pcw_home: What is that about linuxCNC 2.7?
[18:38:27] <pcw_home> The only case where higher performance is important is whwre you need a high servo thread rate
[18:38:38] <handmill> So using MESA card the card get the code line by line, or does the card gets everything from the computer and than manage the milling by itself?
[18:38:41] <pcw_home> (like with torque mode drives)
[18:39:18] <pcw_home> All trajectory planning is handled by linuxcnc (in real time)
[18:39:25] <Tom_itx> on the pc
[18:40:16] <handmill> So I should use the fastest interface for best performance?
[18:40:33] <Tom_itx> if you think you'll need it
[18:40:42] <Tom_itx> i'd personally go with pci or pcie now
[18:40:51] <Tom_itx> it wasn't quite available when i did mine
[18:41:19] <handmill> So you used parallel?
[18:41:29] <Tom_itx> yep
[18:41:42] <Tom_itx> 7i43 with a 7i47
[18:41:54] <Tom_itx> i'm using steppers though
[18:43:06] <pcw_home> performance will not be affected by the low level interface performance, _unless_ you
[18:43:07] <pcw_home> need a faster than normal servo thread. Typically for velocity mode servos, theres not a big advantage
[18:43:09] <pcw_home> in running faster than 1 KHz though , in which case all interfaces behave the same
[18:43:13] <Tom_itx> mesa is definitely the way to go though at any interface level
[18:44:16] <handmill> So which PCI/PCIe is recomended to support 5 AC servo motors, limit switches, touch probe, tool length, etc..?
[18:44:53] <Tom_itx> what drivers do you have for the servos?
[18:45:46] <handmill> Which ones should I get?
[18:47:50] <handmill> The motors need to be atleast 1.5 n/m and the Z axis should be atleast 4 n/m..
[18:48:36] <pcw_home> LeelooMinai: 2.7 is the next linuxcnc release candidate (master has moved on to 2.8 now)
[18:49:00] <pcw_home> I think 2.7 is fairly close to release
[18:49:14] <pcw_home> (but thats just a guess)
[18:49:25] <LeelooMinai> I see. When it's released will it be updateable from Debian ISO?
[18:50:13] <pcw_home> normally you update by getting the latest package (no need to re-install)
[18:53:34] <pcw_home> The latest ISO was remade recently because there was a kernel update that fixed a serious USB bug in Baytrail based motherboards
[18:55:45] <pcw_home> That is, the old kernel had a bug with USB on Baytrail MBs
[19:01:47] <andypugh> handmill: See what drives you can find, then if they take +/- 10V input use 5i25 / 7i77 and if they take step / dir then use 5i25 / 7i76.
[19:02:56] <Tom_itx> sounds like he doesn't have the servos yet either
[19:02:59] <handmill> Which driver would you get (any recomended store?)
[19:03:01] <andypugh> Unless you need something unusual, like Resolvers, in which case you need one of the 50-pin Mesa cards rather than the 25=pin D-sub stylke.
[19:03:19] <andypugh> Do you have the motors?
[19:03:57] <handmill> No, I'm just starting off with a manual milling machine that I'd like to convert to CNC.
[19:17:54] <andypugh> In that case, scour eBay for likely motors and drivers, then choose the interface hardware to suit later.
[19:20:26] <andypugh> (I found three motors on eBay for £50 which were such a bargain that I ended up spending £1000 on a machine to suit them, and months writing drivers for brushless motor drives and Mesa resolver cards. The good news is that that is now done, and brushless motors and/or resolvers are no longer a problem)
[19:31:05] <andypugh> handmill: What make/model of milling machine are you converting?
[19:31:28] <handmill> G0704
[19:32:21] <handmill> andypugh: ^
[19:32:40] <andypugh> A common and popular conversion.
[19:33:53] <handmill> Do you know of someone that did this conversion and used AC servos?
[19:35:31] <andypugh> I haven’t paid much attention. I converted something similar with no reference to anyone, and then decided to have nothing more to do with Chinese iron.
[19:36:20] <jdh> some one here has a servo version. different label on mill though
[19:36:20] <andypugh> Anything else I convert is going to have been made in Yorkshire (or possibly Colchester)
[19:37:05] <PetefromTn_> I just helped my friend Connor here making some mounts and parts for a Stepper Conversion of that machine LOL
[19:39:30] <andypugh> FA-Parts on eBay has a lot of used sets. http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/251323643029 has drivers, motors, mains filter, connectors and even a parallel ort breakout (which you probably wouldn’t use).
[19:39:51] <PetefromTn_> http://imgur.com/b1cH2in,65yvceN#1 I am definitely NOT a sheetmetal guy but I managed to get the ducts made without a brake or shear and got it screwed together this afternoon. Whaddya think?
[19:40:13] <zeeshan> that looks great man
[19:40:20] <andypugh> Functional :-)
[19:40:30] <PetefromTn_> yeah I know it ain't pretty
[19:40:33] <PetefromTn_> but it should work fine
[19:40:36] <zeeshan> what
[19:40:40] <PetefromTn_> Once it is screwed to the existing duct
[19:40:41] <zeeshan> thats what hvac stuff looks like
[19:40:45] <zeeshan> even in that video
[19:40:48] <zeeshan> using that fancy brake
[19:40:48] <PetefromTn_> it should be a lot more solid too
[19:40:53] <zeeshan> it was a floopy noodle
[19:41:07] <PetefromTn_> that's true
[19:41:18] <PetefromTn_> I thought it came out decent really considering
[19:41:22] <andypugh> Pop-rivets might look nicer inside than self-tappers, but no-one else will ever see the inside.
[19:41:31] <PetefromTn_> The templates worked fine
[19:41:34] <zeeshan> andypugh: hvac they use sheet metal screws
[19:41:39] <zeeshan> =P
[19:41:42] <zeeshan> i have yet to see rivets!
[19:41:55] <PetefromTn_> I had pop rivets but drilling thru the two pieces is kind of a bitch
[19:42:02] <PetefromTn_> I tried it in a couple spots
[19:42:09] <zeeshan> self tapping screwz
[19:42:45] <PetefromTn_> Using the butterfly impact driver 3/8 inch and the self tapping screws it went rather quickly
[19:43:04] <andypugh> My furnace is uglier than your duct sheet-metal-wise: https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/kOXgwXHGQ_6kUm_7og3egtMTjNZETYmyPJy0liipFm0?feat=directlink
[19:43:07] <PetefromTn_> It actually seems like it should fit and work great.
[19:44:23] <PetefromTn_> the round ring kinda tweaked a bit but once the flexible duct is installed onto it you are supposed to use these HUGE zip ties and the aluminum tape to lock it on. Should make it more round again.
[19:44:26] <andypugh> (worked well though, all the gears and nuts are now hardened and tempered)
[19:44:42] <PetefromTn_> andypugh That looks pretty nice tho mna.
[19:44:43] <zeeshan> what temps can you hit?
[19:44:43] <PetefromTn_> man
[19:44:58] <andypugh> I have had it up to 850C (1500F)
[19:45:06] <zeeshan> wow
[19:45:24] <PetefromTn_> what is the heating element?
[19:45:26] <zeeshan> are you using nichrome?
[19:45:37] <andypugh> I am thinking I can put it on the end and melt aluminum and brass in it too.
[19:46:28] <andypugh> Yes, 10m of Brightray alloy wrapped round an alumina tube for a 2kW element, then all wrapped in ceramic wool blanket.
[19:47:00] <andypugh> The camera sees colours differently: https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/0KBnb_gsIAVDxe1ALNSTsNMTjNZETYmyPJy0liipFm0?feat=directlink
[19:47:17] <zeeshan> wow dude
[19:47:19] <zeeshan> that looks bad ass
[19:47:26] <zeeshan> i dont see why you cant melt aluminum in it
[19:47:34] <PetefromTn_> that looks pretty damn hot LOL
[19:47:53] <zeeshan> you can even put hotdogs inthere
[19:47:58] <zeeshan> and get em nice and crispy!
[19:48:31] <PetefromTn_> https://plus.google.com/photos/108164504656404380542/albums/5747722155741347649/5685341572125920082?pid=5685341572125920082&oid=108164504656404380542 Damn Andy I did not know you were loaded with GOLD!!
[19:49:02] <XXCoder> heh always wanted to try my hand in melting alum
[19:49:10] <zeeshan> XXCoder: dont melt your h and
[19:49:45] <andypugh> That ingot is actually White Metal, we used it to re-make the big-end bearings on the 1916 fire engine.
[19:50:07] <XXCoder> weird https://seattle.craigslist.org/see/art/4763160481.html
[19:50:14] <zeeshan> whitemetal?
[19:50:18] <zeeshan> aka babbit?
[19:50:34] <handmill> I'm located across the pond.. 220 V stuff wouldn't work on our 120 V grid..
[19:50:53] <zeeshan> It is preferred over the term "white metal", because the latter term may refer to various bearing alloys, lead- or tin-based alloys, or zinc die-casting metal.
[19:50:55] <zeeshan> okay same thing
[19:50:55] <zeeshan> :D
[19:50:56] <handmill> andypugh: ^
[19:51:01] <XXCoder> wonder if pottery kilnb would get hot enough to melt alum
[19:51:35] <pcw_home> Yep
[19:52:01] <zeeshan> handmill: wut
[19:52:39] <XXCoder> well finally cant go any futher up mountain lol
[19:52:58] <XXCoder> barely entered mountain foot
[19:53:09] <handmill> andypugh sent me a link for drivers that require 220V AC, I'm in the US where the standard electric is only 120V AC...
[19:53:14] <andypugh> handmill: For 120V you would still need 10m of wire (current density and power limits) but you would have to add an extra lead-out in the middle and common the ends. (or use thicker wire than the spool I found in the skip years ago, of course :-)
[19:55:11] <andypugh> handmill: Ah, for the servo-drives you would need to find the manuals to see if they work on your effette US electricity.
[19:57:04] <andypugh> Anyway, time to sleep. I have a trip on the Ner-a-Car planned for tomorrow, and that means an early start.
[20:03:28] <ssi> hrm
[20:09:32] <PetefromTn_> Woohoo my wife is surprising us with some of her world famous home made soft pretzels!!
[20:09:46] <PetefromTn_> ;)
[20:10:11] <XXCoder> if its world famous why dont I know it??
[20:10:14] <XXCoder> heh
[20:10:45] <PetefromTn_> you must live out in the boondocks or something hehe It is Famous in the KNOWN world anyways..
[20:10:58] <XXCoder> yeah thats true. tacoma, wa is really out of way
[20:10:59] <PetefromTn_> the only world that matters...
[20:11:06] <PetefromTn_> my living room
[20:11:11] <PetefromTn_> hehehe
[20:11:17] <XXCoder> lol
[20:39:26] <roycroft> so the threading the ss cap is done, and it went better than expected
[20:39:52] <roycroft> if i had real machinery it would have gone even more easily
[21:08:46] <Aero-Tec2> NEED HELP
[21:08:50] <Aero-Tec2> OOPS
[21:09:03] <Aero-Tec2> was programming
[21:09:16] <Aero-Tec2> caned gcode for lathe
[21:10:24] <shaun414> GCODE
[21:10:28] <shaun414> CODEG
[21:10:30] <Aero-Tec2> get error message G18 not possible without Y axis
[21:10:51] <Aero-Tec2> I have no G18 in Gcode
[21:11:54] <zeeshan> is this a new retrofit/setup?
[21:12:10] <zeeshan> G18 is xz plane
[21:12:15] <zeeshan> not sure why youre getting something about Y axis.
[21:13:40] <Aero-Tec2> ok the G18 is in the startup INI code
[21:13:57] <Aero-Tec2> and it is a lathe so G18 should be there
[21:14:46] <Aero-Tec2> no new retro
[21:14:51] <Aero-Tec2> but is a retro
[21:15:26] <Aero-Tec2> been using it and running the G18 INI code for other Gcode and had no problems
[21:15:55] <Aero-Tec2> but first time running a canned Gcode instruction
[21:16:48] <Aero-Tec2> I test code on a sim machine
[21:17:32] <Aero-Tec2> so linuxCNC running in sim mode on a computer in the programming lab
[21:17:51] <Aero-Tec2> have not tried in the the real thing yet
[21:18:02] <Aero-Tec2> but have not seen this error before
[21:18:28] <Aero-Tec2> G73
[21:18:38] <Aero-Tec2> should I do a G83?
[21:18:46] <Aero-Tec2> G81
[21:18:56] <Aero-Tec2> not sure whats up here
[21:24:39] <Aero-Tec2> are all canned cycles not possible on a lathe?
[21:24:50] <Aero-Tec2> threading must be possible
[21:25:13] <zeeshan> you can do em
[21:25:40] <Aero-Tec2> so why the error for G73?
[21:25:53] <Aero-Tec2> is this just a sim glitch?
[21:26:43] <zeeshan> i dont know sorry :P
[21:26:47] <zeeshan> ive only done threadsing cycles
[21:27:03] <Aero-Tec2> what do you do for drilling?
[21:27:30] <Aero-Tec2> you only do ext threads?
[21:28:08] <Aero-Tec2> BTW thanks for the help
[21:29:09] <Aero-Tec2> will se if it loads on the real thing
[21:29:12] <zeeshan> drilling is done by hand
[21:29:54] <cradek> what motion do you want to have when you do the g81?
[21:31:11] <cradek> the error you probably saw was precisely "G18 canned cycle is not possible on a machine without Y axis"
[21:31:39] <cradek> ... which is correct, because if you are in G18 mode and you program G81, it means you want to drill along Y
[21:32:23] <cradek> if you want to drill with Z program G17; if you want to drill with W program G17.1, etc
[21:46:40] <Aero-Tec2> thought G18 was lathe mode
[21:46:58] <Aero-Tec2> is G17 lathe node?
[21:47:04] <Aero-Tec2> mode
[21:47:24] <zeeshan> neither is lathe mode
[21:47:31] <Aero-Tec2> BTW the lathe had same error
[21:47:32] <zeeshan> they selection plane selection of movement.
[21:48:01] <zeeshan> what cradek was saying
[21:48:09] <zeeshan> when you have g18 youre selection XZ plane.
[21:48:16] <Aero-Tec2> I have been using G18 when running the lathe
[21:48:22] <zeeshan> so when you issue a g81 it drills in Y axis.
[21:48:27] <zeeshan> i understand that
[21:48:33] <zeeshan> you gotta call g18 for all your lathe moves
[21:48:37] <Aero-Tec2> cradek, your right about the error message
[21:48:44] <zeeshan> but you need to call g17 before you drill
[21:48:55] <zeeshan> and then swap back to g18 after you're done the drill cycle
[21:50:09] <Aero-Tec2> cool
[21:50:33] <Aero-Tec2> will have to lookup why that would be
[21:51:18] <Aero-Tec2> sound funny, but sure there is a good reason for it
[21:51:44] <Aero-Tec2> I really must be missing something
[21:53:03] <Roguish> hey all. I'm trying to get gmoccapy to run and get the following error. any clues would be helpful, i'm at a loss..
[21:53:04] <Roguish> Starting TASK program: milltask
[21:53:06] <Roguish> Starting DISPLAY program: gmocappy
[21:53:07] <Roguish> Can't execute DISPLAY program gmocappy
[21:53:09] <Roguish> Shutting down and cleaning up LinuxCNC...
[21:53:10] <Roguish> emc/task/emctask.cc 389: interp_error: Cannot restore context from invalid stack frame - missing M70/M73?
[21:53:12] <Roguish> Cannot restore context from invalid stack frame - missing M70/M73?
[21:53:13] <Roguish> emc/task/emctaskmain.cc 3003: can't initialize interpreter
[21:53:15] <Roguish> Killing task linuxcncsvr, PID=19029
[21:54:13] <Aero-Tec2> so in G17 mode do I still use Z for drilling the hole?
[21:54:35] <Aero-Tec2> is Z still Z in G17 when running a lathe?
[21:54:48] <Aero-Tec2> I am messed up here
[21:55:14] <Aero-Tec2> looked up G17 and am lost as to what is going on
[21:55:56] <Aero-Tec2> does Z become Y?
[21:56:17] <Aero-Tec2> brain feels like it is shorting out
[21:56:18] <Aero-Tec2> lol
[21:56:19] <Tom_itx> it shifts machine coordinates
[21:57:09] <Tom_itx> i'm lost to know why a lathe would need G17
[21:58:40] <Tom_itx> are you doing a 2nd op like a cross drill etc?
[21:58:46] <Aero-Tec2> for running canned Gcode
[21:58:53] <Aero-Tec2> no
[21:59:10] <Aero-Tec2> simple end drilling
[21:59:18] <Aero-Tec2> down the Z
[21:59:43] <Aero-Tec2> and I am glad I am not the only one not understanding this whole thing
[22:00:01] <Aero-Tec2> I wanted to run G73
[22:00:17] <Aero-Tec2> but complains there is no Y axis
[22:00:27] <Aero-Tec2> get error message
[22:00:39] <Aero-Tec2> but lathe has no Y axis
[22:00:48] <Aero-Tec2> not mine at least
[22:01:15] <Tom_itx> my Okuma lathe manual shows nothing for G17..19
[22:01:27] <Aero-Tec2> all I want to do is drill a hole
[22:01:37] <Tom_itx> so shove the tool in the hole
[22:01:44] <Aero-Tec2> lol
[22:01:44] <Tom_itx> S xxx F xxx
[22:01:49] <Tom_itx> linear move
[22:01:54] <Aero-Tec2> under CNC control
[22:01:56] <Tom_itx> or peck
[22:02:06] <Aero-Tec2> with peck
[22:02:08] <Tom_itx> i realize that. that's what htis channel is
[22:02:26] <Aero-Tec2> doing a loop to make G73 do peck
[22:02:51] <Tom_itx> i wonder what my cad cam spits out for a hole
[22:03:39] <Aero-Tec2> would guess linear moves
[22:03:50] <Aero-Tec2> not canned stuff
[22:05:01] <Aero-Tec2> I wanted to write a chunk of code that be changing a few values I could drill any hole, or most any
[22:05:46] <Aero-Tec2> deep or shallow and have auto peak start when hole was 3 times deeper then dis of drill
[22:05:56] <Aero-Tec2> dia
[22:09:45] <Tom_itx> it posts linear moves
[22:09:59] <Tom_itx> but that's a function of the post i set up for it
[22:10:19] <Tom_L> T05 M06
[22:10:20] <Tom_L> G97 S100
[22:10:20] <Tom_L> M03
[22:10:20] <Tom_L> M08
[22:10:20] <Tom_L> G17 G00 G90
[22:10:20] <Tom_L> G43 Z0.0 H5
[22:10:21] <Tom_L> G01 X3.45 F0.001
[22:10:21] <Tom_L> G00 X3.469
[22:10:21] <Aero-Tec2> well G17 works
[22:10:22] <Tom_L> G00 X0.396 Z3.581 M09
[22:10:42] <Tom_L> feeds etc aren't right... was a test
[22:10:49] <Aero-Tec2> go figure
[22:11:01] <Aero-Tec2> I am at a total loss as to why
[22:11:25] <Tom_itx> feature of that Gcode
[22:11:29] <Tom_itx> drill cycle
[22:11:45] <zeeshan> aerotech i explaed it to you
[22:11:47] <zeeshan> explained
[22:11:54] <zeeshan> g17 g18 don't select "lathe mode"
[22:12:09] <Aero-Tec2> yes
[22:12:09] <zeeshan> they select the plane of movement of canned cycles for example
[22:12:19] <zeeshan> yes its true that you use g18 most of the time for lathe
[22:12:25] <zeeshan> because youre moving in the XZ plane
[22:12:33] <zeeshan> but the drill cycle works in the XY plane
[22:12:40] <zeeshan> to drill in the Z direction
[22:12:43] <Aero-Tec2> but my lathe has no Y, so why do I need G17?
[22:12:52] <zeeshan> because thats how the canned drill cycle works
[22:13:03] <zeeshan> say you did G18 before G81
[22:13:09] <zeeshan> it'll think you want to plunge in the Y direction
[22:13:17] <zeeshan> if you did G17 before G81 it'll plunge in the Z direction
[22:13:22] <Tom_itx> it shifts the coordinates
[22:13:29] <Tom_itx> like i said earlier
[22:13:32] <Aero-Tec2> ok
[22:13:36] <zeeshan> i know its a bit confusing
[22:13:42] <Aero-Tec2> very
[22:13:46] <zeeshan> but the best thing is play around with the simulation like you are
[22:13:49] <Tom_itx> you just have to remember which is which
[22:14:06] <Aero-Tec2> I still am trying to understand it all
[22:14:18] <Tom_itx> another thing i find with cad is you need to know if it's a front or back tool machine
[22:14:38] <zeeshan> Tom_itx: that messes with me a lot
[22:14:38] <zeeshan> lol
[22:14:39] <Aero-Tec2> I understand what you said, just not sure as to why it needs to be that way
[22:14:50] <Tom_itx> it's da law
[22:14:54] <zeeshan> Aero-Tec because you need to specify which way the drill plunges
[22:15:12] <zeeshan> if you dont specify using g17 etc
[22:15:15] <zeeshan> how will it know?
[22:15:54] <Tom_itx> i wish i had a full post set up for my lathe package
[22:16:02] <Aero-Tec2> but drilling is mostly done along the Z
[22:16:07] <tjtr33> argh shoveling snow again
[22:16:12] <Tom_itx> it would be interesting to see what it puts out for some of the canned cycles
[22:16:23] <Tom_itx> Aero-Tec2 not if you're crossdrilling
[22:16:24] <Tom_itx> etc
[22:16:35] <Aero-Tec2> true
[22:16:51] <Aero-Tec2> mind warping
[22:18:01] <Aero-Tec2> will have to think about it more and see if I can get it to make seance so I can understand it more
[22:18:21] <Aero-Tec2> thanks for the help
[22:18:25] <tjtr33> do the canned cycles use g02 or g03, thats what G17/18/19 define, the plane in which circular interp occurs
[22:18:32] <Aero-Tec2> would have never got this one on my own
[22:18:42] <Tom_itx> draw your right hand rule on paper and see where z goes on a lathe compared to a mill
[22:19:00] <Aero-Tec2> well not with out risking a total melt down
[22:19:51] <Tom_itx> and write in the G17...19 orientation on the rule
[22:20:39] <Aero-Tec2> so this would explain why I got unexpected results from a G2 move, and had to do a G3 instead to get it to work
[22:21:12] <Tom_itx> G17 is the default
[22:21:17] <Aero-Tec2> did not make any sense at the time
[22:21:34] <Tom_itx> but good to call it out anyway
[22:21:39] <Aero-Tec2> but got it working
[22:21:57] <Aero-Tec2> cool
[22:22:29] <PetefromTn_andro> What kind of lathe are we talking about here man?
[22:23:06] <Tom_L> http://www.linuxcnc.org/docs/html/gcode/gcode.html#sec:G80-G89
[22:23:24] <Tom_L> All canned cycles are performed with respect to the currently-selected plane. Any of the six planes may be selected. Throughout this section, most of the descriptions assume the XY-plane has been selected.
[22:27:31] <Tom_itx> i think lathes assume G18 as default...
[22:29:15] <Tom_itx> my cam spits out a G18 at the top of the file...
[22:33:24] <tjtr33> yes in short, these cycles assume the tool axis is normal to the plane of circular interpolation. thes docs could say as much is as few words.
[22:34:43] <Tom_itx> also, on the Okuma at least the canned cycle Gcodes have been redefined to be something else
[22:35:06] <Tom_itx> G73 is still there
[22:36:05] <PetefromTn_andro> Tj. I think it was you that suggested I put a 1" square in the drawing yesterday
[22:36:26] <Tom_itx> good point of reference
[22:36:34] <tjtr33> oh yeah, nice round to rect transition, did the marker help?
[22:36:51] <PetefromTn_andro> That turned out to be a great idea and make scaling the prints correctly a lot easier
[22:37:19] <PetefromTn_andro> So thanks for the tip man
[22:37:34] <tjtr33> i like sheet metal layout, was fun simple geometry
[22:37:36] <tjtr33> np
[22:38:19] <PetefromTn_andro> Yeah I kinda enjoyed making the transition ducting today and working with the drawings
[22:38:51] <tjtr33> no blood? ( sheet metal screws and sheet metal edges :)
[22:38:59] <PetefromTn_andro> Just wish I could do it in freecad like Zeeshan was able to do with the sheet metal module
[22:39:04] <Tom_itx> i did a similar on my furnace way back but it didn't involve square to round
[22:39:28] <PetefromTn_andro> Believe it or not I did not even get a nick
[22:39:50] <tjtr33> freecad has a sheet metal bend module? cool. bend allowance is tricky
[22:39:58] <PetefromTn_andro> I work with my thick leather welding gauntlets
[22:40:00] <Tom_itx> yeah
[22:40:18] <Tom_itx> we did bend allowance when making hydro blocks for stamping aluminum parts
[22:40:39] <tjtr33> hydroformiong? worked on that a bit up in CA
[22:40:39] <PetefromTn_andro> No I am not aware of one but it would be nice to have that is for sure
[22:40:46] <Tom_itx> yes
[22:41:13] <tjtr33> in London ONT I saw a line blow.
[22:41:24] <Tom_itx> heh
[22:41:27] <Tom_itx> not good
[22:41:46] <PetefromTn_andro> Tomorrow we Will be screwing the new ducting transitions to the existing ones under the house
[22:41:58] <tjtr33> it was like inflating square tubes into car frames
[22:42:12] <Tom_itx> pete, you're running a bit late on this project :)
[22:42:31] <tjtr33> snow here (CHI)
[22:43:04] <PetefromTn_andro> It would seem that the sheet metal module would also be able to make 2d templates from round tube joints in 3d drawings
[22:43:43] <PetefromTn_andro> Yeah I know man but the penny just dropped if you know what I mean
[22:44:20] <Tom_itx> wow, this manual has more M codes than G codes
[22:44:40] <PetefromTn_andro> You could probably get templates printed on your home printer for notching tubing
[22:44:51] <Tom_itx> 5 pages of M codes
[23:13:48] <Aero-Tec2> whats with all the snow talk, I am in Canada and no snow
[23:13:52] <shaun414> hi!
[23:14:05] <shaun414> ahh can you ship me one of them fancy baby moosese?
[23:14:08] <shaun414> mooses*
[23:14:35] <Aero-Tec2> could do, where do you want it sent?
[23:14:42] <shaun414> nj
[23:14:43] <shaun414> pls
[23:14:54] <shaun414> and some of that syrup
[23:15:04] <shaun414> maybe a hockeypuck
[23:15:45] <Aero-Tec2> BTW not sure if shooting baby ones is legal
[23:16:01] <shaun414> !
[23:16:04] <shaun414> o.o
[23:16:07] <shaun414> 0.o
[23:16:13] <shaun414> DONT SHOOT IT
[23:16:41] <Aero-Tec2> we are talking moose the animal right
[23:16:58] <Aero-Tec2> well sending a live one would be a big no no
[23:18:15] <Aero-Tec2> gov here frowns on wild things being caged
[23:18:49] <Aero-Tec2> so what where you asking me to send you?
[23:19:30] <Aero-Tec2> like a real live baby animal?
[23:21:33] <shaun414> yes pls
[23:21:39] <Aero-Tec2> lol
[23:21:41] <shaun414> what about syrup
[23:21:46] <shaun414> the real shit
[23:21:53] <Aero-Tec2> that would be something I can not do
[23:21:54] <shaun414> like from the tree
[23:22:05] <shaun414> WHAT, but you could send me a moose carcus?
[23:22:14] <Aero-Tec2> sure can do that no problem
[23:22:19] <shaun414> ...
[23:22:33] <shaun414> can you take some of your geese back?
[23:22:36] <shaun414> they suck
[23:23:47] <[cube]> My brother in law has a maple syrup farm (in Canada)
[23:24:10] <shaun414> bro! hook me up
[23:24:15] <[cube]> heh
[23:24:16] <[cube]> srsly?
[23:24:23] <shaun414> I want some syrup
[23:24:41] <[cube]> well, this stuff is the real deal
[23:24:44] <shaun414> yeah
[23:25:06] <[cube]> if ur ever seriously wanting for some, feel free to msg me and can work smth out
[23:25:36] <[cube]> he gave us a big jug of it
[23:25:38] <[cube]> like 2 yrs ago
[23:25:45] <[cube]> and theres still liek a 1/4 left :P
[23:26:21] <shaun414> ok
[23:26:23] <tjtr33> a good thing about winter: pancakes and real maple syrup Mmmmmmm
[23:26:28] <[cube]> mhmmmm
[23:28:10] <shaun414> YUM FUM
[23:28:16] <shaun414> in other news
[23:28:32] <shaun414> Im getting trained to use my schools machine shop soon
[23:28:33] <shaun414> :)
[23:29:19] <[cube]> what machines they got?
[23:30:39] <shaun414> tons
[23:30:45] <shaun414> a couple bridgeport knee mils
[23:30:54] <shaun414> a few lathes
[23:30:57] <XXCoder> he means single machine that weights 2 tons ;)
[23:30:59] <shaun414> cncs
[23:31:03] <shaun414> plasma cutters
[23:31:07] <[cube]> not bad
[23:31:27] <shaun414> XXCoder, the mill is the size of a car..
[23:31:39] <XXCoder> cool
[23:31:42] <shaun414> cnc lathe as well
[23:31:48] <shaun414> a huge one
[23:31:51] <[cube]> this a college?
[23:31:53] <XXCoder> I do work at shop. I sometimes run a router thats larger than car
[23:31:54] <shaun414> yes
[23:32:03] <[cube]> pretty nice for a college setup
[23:32:10] <shaun414> yeah
[23:32:14] <shaun414> its a big college
[23:32:26] <shaun414> but rarely anyone uses it..
[23:32:32] <[cube]> perfect
[23:32:36] <shaun414> yeah
[23:32:38] <XXCoder> it means you have easier time using em
[23:32:39] <[cube]> you have to book time on stuff?
[23:32:48] <shaun414> no, just swipe in
[23:33:05] <[cube]> crazy, who's stopping anyone from destroying anything carelessly?
[23:33:16] <shaun414> idk
[23:33:20] <[cube]> haha
[23:33:21] <[cube]> comforting
[23:33:51] <shaun414> http://www.dempseyandco.com/DSCN0322.JPG
[23:33:57] <shaun414> they have like 4 mills this size
[23:33:57] <shaun414> lol
[23:34:24] <[cube]> Cool.
[23:34:35] <[cube]> I'm plannign to upgrade to one of those at some point and retrofit
[23:34:48] <[cube]> maybe not a briggeport specifically
[23:34:52] <[cube]> waiting for a good deal
[23:35:16] <[cube]> issue is how the hell i get it in the basment
[23:43:01] <XXCoder> [cube]: build shop?
[23:43:08] <XXCoder> probably not a option'
[23:43:12] <shaun314> Hi
[23:51:11] <[cube]> XXCoder: not sure what you mean
[23:51:21] <XXCoder> build new place for your machines
[23:51:30] <[cube]> ah
[23:51:32] <[cube]> i've got a decent shop down there
[23:51:34] <[cube]> and could make room
[23:51:35] <shaun314> Sup
[23:51:44] <[cube]> its just getting the damn thing in the door ways and down the stairs
[23:51:57] <[cube]> probably have to disassemble, which i guess i'll have to do anyway
[23:52:05] <shaun314> Where you all buy your machine equip
[23:52:10] <shaun314> It's so expensive
[23:52:15] <XXCoder> heh expensive option would be build new ramp to your shop
[23:52:20] <XXCoder> with large doors
[23:52:23] <[cube]> all my stuff is amassed over many years
[23:52:30] <shaun314> Hm
[23:52:34] <shaun314> From where
[23:52:40] <XXCoder> many places im sure
[23:52:45] <[cube]> mostly woodworking tools down there atm
[23:52:46] <shaun314> Hm
[23:52:54] <XXCoder> the older you are the easier for you to have stuff thats old
[23:53:02] <XXCoder> im old enough tp experence that
[23:53:02] <[cube]> a lot from my dad
[23:53:10] <shaun314> I'm 20
[23:53:12] <shaun314> Lol
[23:53:17] <XXCoder> 38 here
[23:53:21] <[cube]> 28 hah
[23:53:25] <shaun314> I already have too much stuff
[23:53:48] <[cube]> keep collecting ;)
[23:54:06] <[cube]> using apublic space is cool but its fun havin gyou're own machine that you know all the ins an outs of
[23:54:23] <shaun314> Yes
[23:54:31] <shaun314> I hate public spaces anyway
[23:54:49] <shaun314> It's a hobby thing. I want to do it at my leisure
[23:54:50] <[cube]> luckily i've got a buddy with a big shop
[23:54:58] <[cube]> has like 8 haas machines
[23:55:01] <shaun314> And not need to follow hours. Drive.
[23:55:04] <shaun314> Ya know
[23:55:07] <[cube]> but i feel guilty asking for machine time :x
[23:55:10] <[cube]> so i dont ask him for much
[23:55:23] <shaun314> Does he use them
[23:55:31] <[cube]> yeah they run pretty much constantly
[23:55:42] <shaun314> Doing what
[23:55:48] <[cube]> manufacturing
[23:55:54] <shaun314> Ah
[23:55:56] <shaun314> ...
[23:56:03] <[cube]> everytime i visit it seems like he's just making heat sinks
[23:56:10] <shaun314> Ah ok
[23:56:10] <[cube]> massive...heatsink...enclosures
[23:56:16] <shaun314> Pretty neat
[23:56:25] <[cube]> they take forever to mill
[23:56:28] <[cube]> even on a haas
[23:56:29] <shaun314> Yeah
[23:56:33] <shaun314> Cc?
[23:56:36] <shaun314> Cnc
[23:56:42] <[cube]> yep
[23:56:46] <shaun314> Cool
[23:56:47] <XXCoder> surpised
[23:56:49] <[cube]> also has a couple of ENGEL injection molding setups
[23:56:59] <XXCoder> often see shopsmaking airplane parts
[23:57:00] <[cube]> and he's like a master mold maker
[23:57:00] <shaun314> Ohhh
[23:57:06] <XXCoder> almost all parts I make is airplane related
[23:57:16] <shaun314> I like airplanes
[23:57:18] <shaun314> A lot
[23:57:18] <[cube]> nice
[23:57:19] <XXCoder> few days ago I had very rare non-airplane parts
[23:57:29] <shaun314> What kind of airplane parts
[23:57:37] <XXCoder> boeing
[23:57:44] <XXCoder> behind that paperwork dont say
[23:57:52] <[cube]> bet they've got you on lockdown for those ;)
[23:57:58] <shaun314> In your personal shop
[23:58:01] <shaun314> ?
[23:58:07] <XXCoder> nah place I work at
[23:58:10] <shaun314> Ohh
[23:58:13] <shaun314> Cook
[23:58:13] <XXCoder> im an intern actually lol
[23:58:15] <shaun314> Cool
[23:58:18] <shaun314> For what
[23:58:21] <[cube]> i heard they're extremely secretive about source files etc
[23:58:23] <XXCoder> cnc milling stuff
[23:58:28] <[cube]> cause ppl kept knocking them off (poorly)
[23:58:34] <shaun314> The internship..
[23:58:43] <shaun314> Is for cnc?
[23:58:44] <XXCoder> cube yea cant bring paperwork out and such
[23:58:46] <XXCoder> no worries for me
[23:58:54] <XXCoder> milling in general shaun
[23:58:59] <[cube]> yeah i once had a contract at a military outfit
[23:59:05] <[cube]> had to get gov clearance
[23:59:13] <[cube]> and escorted to the goddamn bathroom :P
[23:59:21] <[cube]> i drink a lot of coffee...lol
[23:59:23] <shaun314> Oh cool
[23:59:50] <shaun314> Yeah I'll prob need clearances