#linuxcnc | Logs for 2014-10-01

[00:00:12] <Jymmm> better be for $1200 =)
[00:01:04] <Jymmm> HERE WE GO http://sfbay.craigslist.org/sby/for/4691956315.html
[00:01:15] <ssi> :D
[00:01:19] <ssi> http://sfbay.craigslist.org/sfc/for/4688195262.html
[00:01:20] <zeeshan|2> that has turned into #cncsewing
[00:01:21] <zeeshan|2> :D
[00:01:28] <XXCoder> lol
[00:01:32] <zeeshan|2> :D
[00:01:34] <ssi> we can get off topic on ANYTHING
[00:01:47] <Jymmm> http://sfbay.craigslist.org/sby/bfs/4685494322.html
[00:02:20] <ssi> there ya go
[00:02:39] <Jymmm> 220VAC isn't it?
[00:02:48] <ssi> doubt it
[00:02:54] <ssi> looks like a similar motor and stand to mine, and mine's 120
[00:04:15] <Jymmm> Hmmm http://sfbay.craigslist.org/sby/art/4682333249.html
[00:04:32] <Jymmm> looks commercial, never heard of the brand though
[00:04:45] <ssi> probably worth the gamble at that price
[00:05:08] <Jymmm> I have nfc on repairing sewing machines
[00:05:21] <Jymmm> if it was electical problem, in a heartbeat
[00:06:21] <Jymmm> http://sfbay.craigslist.org/sby/hsh/4681294598.html
[00:08:52] <Jymmm> Sounds rough, but for $60 ??? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WEJVcarFuIE
[00:10:51] <Jymmm> FUCK ME!!! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7U9XFGr9Pfc
[00:11:16] <Jymmm> 5000 stitches per minute?!
[00:11:17] <zeeshan|2> i didnt know sewing machines were that expensive
[00:11:41] <Jymmm> zeeshan|2: Some are $4000+
[00:11:47] <Jymmm> USD
[00:13:09] <zeeshan|2> damn
[00:13:13] <zeeshan|2> speaking of money
[00:13:21] <zeeshan|2> i finally got my first CNC Lathe paying job
[00:13:21] <zeeshan|2> :D
[00:13:31] <Jymmm> congrats!
[00:13:43] <zeeshan|2> http://i.imgur.com/F6c4yqb.png
[00:13:48] <zeeshan|2> guy wants 2 of these
[00:14:38] <zeeshan|2> its like 4 1/2 od
[00:14:42] <zeeshan|2> "
[00:15:16] <zeeshan|2> img.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/files/2014/09/drinking.png
[00:15:28] <zeeshan|2> http://img.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/files/2014/09/drinking.png
[00:17:59] <Jymmm> Ewww, that's icky... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tldR-wMwnU0
[00:18:42] <zeeshan|2> rofl
[00:18:45] <zeeshan|2> i have that electric motor
[00:18:50] <zeeshan|2> wit hthe clutch mechanism
[00:18:54] <zeeshan|2> its 3 phase though 240v
[00:20:18] <zeeshan|2> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SCsZurNJyRc
[00:20:27] <zeeshan|2> i made that video a while back
[00:20:48] <XXCoder> careful guy might not want you to share design pictures
[00:21:05] <zeeshan|2> XXCoder: haha fak that
[00:21:09] <zeeshan|2> i made the design for him
[00:21:15] <zeeshan|2> he jus told me what he wants
[00:21:21] <zeeshan|2> and when he needs it buy
[00:21:23] <zeeshan|2> and what material
[00:21:40] <XXCoder> interesting. well I definitely cant share any I made lol its all boeing conifental stuff
[00:21:56] <zeeshan|2> im sure you can take a picture of the part
[00:22:01] <zeeshan|2> just not the detail drawings
[00:22:02] <XXCoder> nope
[00:22:16] <zeeshan|2> do it anyway
[00:22:17] <zeeshan|2> :D
[00:22:35] <XXCoder> lol its all boring anywa
[00:22:56] <XXCoder> very challenging to make for me, but boring result
[00:25:14] <XXCoder> one somewhat interesting part was first made in lathe then it was my turn. very low tol and its a fuel part. unknown how its used
[00:25:36] <XXCoder> its 2 in diameter pipe that turns out to face so it can be mounted into something
[00:25:47] <zeeshan|2> you said you were on an internship
[00:25:56] <zeeshan|2> what are you trying to become?
[00:26:14] <XXCoder> cnc operator. maybe more - like design later
[00:26:30] <zeeshan|2> so draftsperson?
[00:26:47] <XXCoder> dunno right now its cnc operator internship
[00:27:22] <zeeshan|2> have you considered cnc programming
[00:27:27] <zeeshan|2> and cam programming
[00:27:44] <XXCoder> indeed
[00:27:57] <XXCoder> I already use mastercam but only to export .NC file
[00:27:58] <zeeshan|2> they make good money :P
[00:28:09] <zeeshan|2> haha that doesnt count man!
[00:28:14] <XXCoder> then to alter it so it works for machine im using. and also to make it more convient
[00:28:27] <XXCoder> I mean, its zero point is way too far for me to change parts lol
[00:28:46] <zeeshan|2> slap the programmer
[00:29:03] <XXCoder> it always defaults to 0,0,0
[00:29:07] <XXCoder> which is annoying
[00:29:14] <XXCoder> buit literally minute to code this
[00:29:22] <XXCoder> g0 g90
[00:29:31] <XXCoder> g53 x9. y16.
[00:29:40] <zeeshan|2> at this one company _____ canada inc
[00:30:03] <zeeshan|2> the machine operators were responsible for changing tools, cycle starting, and doing spc measurement checks
[00:30:07] <zeeshan|2> and made 18 bux an hour
[00:30:14] <zeeshan|2> to 22 (depending on years)
[00:30:41] <zeeshan|2> then there were operations technicians that were responsible for machine break downs, training machine operators, making program changes, robots etc
[00:30:50] <zeeshan|2> $28/hr
[00:30:53] <XXCoder> interesting. I do everything myself too
[00:31:03] <XXCoder> tools, setup, everything
[00:31:11] <zeeshan|2> then there were millwrights that were responsible for machine moving, hardcore repair (like a spindle bearing change etc)
[00:31:14] <zeeshan|2> $36/hr
[00:31:15] <XXCoder> I do have to check part then send it to buy off
[00:31:37] <XXCoder> No idea why they call it buy off. almost sounds bribish
[00:31:43] <zeeshan|2> and the manufacturing engineers/managers were around the 42-45bux range
[00:31:52] <zeeshan|2> basically my point is, learn as much as you can :D
[00:32:16] <zeeshan|2> whats a buy off
[00:32:17] <XXCoder> nice indeed. 18 buk a hour is basically doube what I make now at min wage
[00:32:25] <XXCoder> inspection
[00:32:29] <zeeshan|2> XXCoder: but you're doing your internship
[00:32:33] <zeeshan|2> so they can rip you off :P
[00:32:35] <XXCoder> place i work at is very strict on accuracy
[00:32:39] <XXCoder> of course
[00:32:46] <zeeshan|2> oh like it goes to the CMM machine?
[00:32:55] <XXCoder> no theres people
[00:32:58] <zeeshan|2> ah
[00:33:06] <XXCoder> specialist that check and stamp paperwork
[00:33:31] <XXCoder> ironically yeserday both myself and one of those buyoffs fucked up
[00:33:41] <XXCoder> one part ended at .08 and was accurate
[00:33:42] <zeeshan|2> if you have interest and time
[00:33:49] <zeeshan|2> if you havent done this already
[00:33:53] <zeeshan|2> try to download the manuals for your cnc controller
[00:33:54] <XXCoder> well I didnt check back end which was at 0.1 and way fucking off
[00:33:59] <zeeshan|2> and schematics for the machines you run
[00:34:16] <XXCoder> and surpise! buyoff person missed it
[00:34:24] <XXCoder> so i ran all 9 parts
[00:34:36] <zeeshan|2> prolly didnt have coffee :D
[00:34:40] <zeeshan|2> or didnt care haha
[00:35:00] <XXCoder> well my mentor had to come in and help me fix it and it was due today. way fucking headache trying to finish all within 2 hours lol
[00:35:12] <XXCoder> setup to finished
[00:36:07] <XXCoder> probably former because last time I had some mistake it was very minor - one curve of part wasn't deburred
[00:36:15] <XXCoder> and she caught it
[00:36:28] <XXCoder> same person missed the 0.1 error lol
[00:37:24] <zeeshan|2> cant you check the dimensions yourself
[00:37:30] <XXCoder> yeah usually she is very good. no idea why
[00:37:40] <XXCoder> I did. I said both myself and her fucked up
[00:37:52] <zeeshan|2> oh
[00:38:10] <XXCoder> yeah
[00:38:32] <XXCoder> well in least it wasnt 0.07 or lower
[00:38:44] <XXCoder> that'd be unrepairable and job would have to be restarted and late
[00:39:04] <zeeshan|2> removing material no problem
[00:39:07] <zeeshan|2> adding material big problem
[00:39:08] <zeeshan|2> :-)
[00:39:11] <XXCoder> indeed
[00:39:23] <XXCoder> thats why I aim for 0.084 or so
[00:39:41] <XXCoder> all fixtures (most common job for machine I use) have that dim
[00:40:10] <XXCoder> tol is 0.01 so below 0.09 to above 0.07 is fine but better close to 0.08
[00:41:11] <zeeshan|2> "?
[00:41:13] <zeeshan|2> mm?
[00:41:19] <XXCoder> "
[00:41:23] <XXCoder> american compamy
[00:41:26] <zeeshan|2> thats a loose tolerance
[00:41:35] <XXCoder> yeah its not that critical
[00:41:55] <XXCoder> couple features has close tol at 0.005
[00:42:04] <zeeshan|2> thats fairly tight
[00:42:05] <zeeshan|2> :D
[00:42:18] <XXCoder> closest I ever did was that fuel thing
[00:42:20] <XXCoder> 0.001
[00:42:23] <zeeshan|2> do you guys do stastical process control (SPC)
[00:42:25] <zeeshan|2> on the parts
[00:42:33] <zeeshan|2> or is it a different part all the time
[00:42:44] <XXCoder> making vice go too tight would ruin part, yet too loose = EM boom
[00:42:58] <XXCoder> my mentor broke one em. I managed to do all without issue. whew
[00:43:16] <XXCoder> SPC dunno its big company
[00:43:36] <XXCoder> 130 parts total in 2 jobs lol no breakage
[00:43:36] <zeeshan|2> wow im so tired
[00:43:42] <zeeshan|2> i spelt statistical wrong
[00:44:02] <zeeshan|2> nice
[00:44:02] <XXCoder> yeah i figured thats what you meant lol
[00:44:10] <zeeshan|2> carbide cutter?
[00:44:29] <XXCoder> most seems to be dark metal or brass type
[00:44:34] <XXCoder> coloring dunno what type
[00:44:45] <XXCoder> so i guess no
[00:45:49] <zeeshan|2> if its golden
[00:46:05] <Tecan> whats a good way to interface linuxemc to a sata port ?
[00:46:08] <zeeshan|2> thats prolly a titanium nitride coating
[00:46:27] <XXCoder> yeah machine I use has 2 that color
[00:46:30] <zeeshan|2> i guess you;d have to weigh it
[00:46:36] <zeeshan|2> to figur eout if its carbide or non carbide
[00:46:41] <zeeshan|2> or just look at the shank of the em
[00:46:47] <XXCoder> short one and very long one thats really loud when its cutting
[00:46:57] <zeeshan|2> prolly viibrating to shit
[00:46:58] <zeeshan|2> haha
[00:47:02] <XXCoder> by loud I mean vibrating so hard yes
[00:48:10] <zeeshan|2> sleep time
[00:48:21] <ssi> https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xfp1/t31.0-8/1273558_10100489798108172_5430486084508652685_o.jpg
[00:48:25] <ssi> rear seatback covers are done
[00:48:26] <XXCoder> night
[00:48:36] <ssi> need new foam and then I can stretch them on the frames and sew 'em up
[00:48:41] <ssi> they're not perfect, but lots of lessons learned
[00:48:41] <XXCoder> nice
[00:48:51] <ssi> gotta make the rear seat bottoms next, by the time I get to the fronts I'll be a pro
[00:48:59] <XXCoder> that reminds me
[00:49:04] <XXCoder> I need to get seat covers
[00:49:07] <ssi> lul
[00:49:10] <XXCoder> my van seats suck
[00:49:27] <XXCoder> its very good condition but its not confortable to sit on for some reason
[00:49:42] <ssi> heheh
[00:49:51] <XXCoder> I guess some design feature cuts across middle of seat so I can feel it while driving
[00:49:57] <XXCoder> so it gives me "legburn"
[00:51:23] <XXCoder> I will probably use some thick seat cover. dunnp
[00:54:46] <XXCoder> I leave you with this ssi https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xap1/v/t1.0-9/1497699_368556409964253_4207830487880564306_n.jpg?oh=b524998b57bbe87784c69c3e40c9da07&oe=54B8CF8A&__gda__=1422424259_37ac759e431da6eb99020d9e7c8a3c3e
[00:55:00] <XXCoder> night
[00:55:28] <ssi> ... thanks?
[00:55:29] <ssi> :D
[02:10:24] <Deejay> moin
[07:55:03] <wear> my ground came off my dc servo and voltage fed back through my encoder casing and into my controller, after finding what happened I disconnected the controller and drove the servo. I tried my voltmeter and read 0 dc voltage out; yet when i switched the voltmeter to AC it read 40v. *case to earth* as the motor spun down, the voltage lowered
[07:55:16] <wear> Can anyone explain?
[07:57:13] <wear> or link me to an explaination :)
[07:58:35] <SpeedEvil> pwm?
[07:58:43] <wear> yes
[07:58:57] <wear> is it just reading a phase of the signal dc?
[07:59:04] <wear> or pwm
[07:59:58] <wear> i dont see why it would go out though, short in the motor? or is that fairly common?
[08:04:11] <jdh> sounds like a short to me.
[09:28:16] <skunkworks__> CaptHindsight, did you get camunits-emc working on wheezy?
[09:28:30] <skunkworks__> (or whatever it is called..)
[09:31:51] <FinboySlick> skunkworks__: Who are you calling a communist?!
[09:32:14] <skunkworks__> heh - my spelling isn't that bad... well..
[09:33:06] <FinboySlick> It'd work better with a Regan-era four star general indignation tone.
[09:33:41] <FinboySlick> Reagan I mean.
[09:34:52] <skunkworks__> 'YOU CAN"T HANDLE THE TRUTH!"
[09:46:53] <archivist_herron> bomb the b...
[09:52:19] <gonzo_> (kenney everet)
[09:54:11] <skunkworks__> must be a britsh thing...
[09:54:52] <skunkworks__> British even..
[09:57:23] <gonzo_> it was indeed
[10:42:22] <archivist> you forgot Reagans gaff at some studio?
[10:42:26] <ssi> hooray, I got my watch
[10:45:54] <archivist> skunkworks__, http://www.deseretnews.com/top/103/5/We-begin-bombing-in-five-minutes-Ronald-Reagans-10-best-quotes.html
[11:12:22] <CaptHindsight> skunkworks__: no, I just backed up PSHA's repos in case they become unreachable due to the recent conflicts
[11:14:01] <skunkworks__> yeck
[11:14:10] <skunkworks__> (conflict)
[11:14:12] <CaptHindsight> http://www.wired.com/2014/10/cody-wilson-ghost-gunner/ he's selling a $1200 cnc mill now
[11:15:00] <zeeshan|2> this guy is going to bring negative spotlight
[11:15:05] <zeeshan|2> to hobby machinists :-(
[11:16:34] <CaptHindsight> skunkworks__: the testing (squeeze) package installed in Wheezy but I haven't configured it yet
[11:17:10] <skunkworks__> neat
[11:20:26] <jdh> lame article
[11:20:41] <jdh> you can finish an 80% lower with a drill press and some jigs
[11:20:57] <CaptHindsight> Jerry Brown, who wrote that he “can’t see how adding a serial number to a homemade gun would significantly advance public safety.”
[11:21:00] <jdh> and you can buy a complete finished lower for $35
[11:21:14] <CaptHindsight> but it's scary
[11:21:22] <CaptHindsight> and we lose some control
[11:21:46] <CaptHindsight> that's the actual issue
[11:22:10] <zeeshan|2> lol jdh
[11:30:07] <ssi> lose control of what?
[11:33:37] <zeeshan> CaptHindsight: it's not too scary
[11:33:44] <zeeshan> because those unregistered guns are still illegal
[11:33:44] <ssi> it's not scary at all
[11:33:49] <ssi> no, no they're not
[11:33:53] <zeeshan> if they get caught with em
[11:33:54] <ssi> and it's not a "loophole"
[11:33:55] <zeeshan> they'll get owned
[11:34:00] <ssi> it's always been legal to manufacture your own guns
[11:34:00] <zeeshan> trying to commit a crime
[11:34:23] <ssi> what's scary is that nanny state morons freak out about stupid crap like this
[11:34:43] * zeeshan is glad he doesnt live in america :D
[11:34:52] * ssi is glad zeeshan doesn't live in america
[11:34:59] <zeeshan> the land of shoot first, question later
[11:35:01] <zeeshan> :)
[11:35:17] <ssi> yeah, but only with respect to the cops
[11:35:23] <zeeshan> haha
[11:35:26] <zeeshan> you do that for home protection too
[11:35:35] <zeeshan> if someone is on your property illegaly, you can kill em
[11:35:49] <ssi> you're ill informed about your propoganda
[11:36:01] <zeeshan> you guys can even kill a black kid
[11:36:03] <zeeshan> and it's okay!
[11:36:24] <ssi> again, only the cops
[11:36:32] <ssi> http://www.cnn.com/2014/09/25/justice/south-carolina-trooper-shooting/
[11:36:37] <ssi> how's that for shoot first, ask questions later?
[11:37:21] <zeeshan> New York Penal Law section 35.15 effectively ordains that:
[11:37:21] <zeeshan>
[11:37:21] <zeeshan> "A person may... use DEADLY physical force upon another person" "when and to the extent he reasonably believes such to be NECESSARY to defend himself or a third person from what he reasonably believes to be .... a kidnapping, forcible rape, forcible sodomy or ROBBERY; or (c) ... a burglary...."
[11:37:21] <zeeshan>
[11:37:35] <zeeshan> lol @ burglary
[11:38:06] <ssi> yeah, which is why I have laser turrets protecting the cinci, remember?!
[11:38:16] <zeeshan> here if you kill someone for burglary
[11:38:19] <zeeshan> you'll be in prison
[11:38:40] <zeeshan> if someone has a gun to you, and you kill them, it might be justifable
[11:38:46] <zeeshan> you'll still have to go through the court process
[11:38:53] <ssi> that's not any different than here
[11:39:05] <ssi> anyway, I don't have time to argue with your entitled socialist ass today :)
[11:39:19] <ssi> I have a machine to unload
[11:39:23] <CaptHindsight> ssi: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xwRtll3jjU4 no number is scary :)
[11:39:53] <ssi> CaptHindsight: what about the serial number makes it magically less scary?
[11:40:46] <ssi> I can jam a shotgun shell in a piece of black iron pipe and hit the primer with a tack hammer
[11:40:54] <ssi> should we start regulating iron pipe and tack hammers?!
[11:40:58] <ssi> it's just lunacy
[11:41:15] <CaptHindsight> ssi: exactly, so why would someone representing the state of Ca make an announcement like that?
[11:41:17] <zeeshan> no, but they should be regulatinng the shotgun shell..
[11:41:24] <ssi> ban 3d printers cause you can 3d print stupid useless plastic lowers
[11:41:30] <ssi> ban cnc mills cause you can mill parts
[11:41:33] <ssi> ban hacksaws and files
[11:41:50] <zeeshan> ban them if you're making them to make weapons!
[11:41:57] <zeeshan> *using
[11:42:00] <ssi> ban mechanical engineers
[11:42:04] <ssi> you can use them to design weapons!
[11:42:36] <CaptHindsight> sure it's all nuts, that's the point, start educating people vs keeping people ignorant and voting against themselves
[11:42:42] <zeeshan> my problem with guns has been with the fast that people feel the need to make/own semi-automatic weapons
[11:42:47] <zeeshan> *facty
[11:42:55] <ssi> CaptHindsight: I suppose I'm not 100% clear on your position on all this :)
[11:43:05] <zeeshan> and even a mentally unstable person like SSI can own a gun
[11:43:05] <zeeshan> !
[11:43:48] <ssi> ugh fine
[11:43:53] <ssi> I should just take pete's advice
[11:43:54] <ssi> and block you
[11:44:10] <zeeshan> thank u
[11:44:15] <CaptHindsight> ssi: I'm pointing out how it's been working so well to keep people scared and ignorant in order to control them
[11:44:20] <ssi> CaptHindsight: I see
[11:44:26] <ssi> it certainly is working
[11:44:37] <ssi> but they don't have to work very hard to keep people ignorant
[11:44:41] <jdh_> fear is good
[11:45:01] <zeeshan> http://d16ao1gdhk6qlj.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/rufus.jpg
[11:45:01] <CaptHindsight> I find the comments in the video ridiculous
[11:45:08] <zeeshan> http://a3.ec-images.myspacecdn.com/images02/150/594e67a791ce43679b56d5fd3707f5a8/l.jpg
[11:45:21] <zeeshan> https://encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRQM7zKQNmFKsvLoFyLpkEQkUIuCccB2aJUiYFFMU_EHs-FtkYYCg
[11:45:27] <zeeshan> do you really want people like this owning guns? :P
[11:45:36] <zeeshan> especially semi-automatic ones? :D
[11:45:46] <ssi> do you really think you can stop them?
[11:45:50] <jdh_> vs. not semi-automatic?
[11:45:51] <CaptHindsight> but all they have to do is come on TV and scare people with how there's no serial number and anyone cane make one
[11:46:03] <ssi> jdh_: he has no clue what "semi-automatic" even means
[11:46:04] <CaptHindsight> and most people fall for it
[11:46:11] <zeeshan> with at least non semi-automatic
[11:46:14] <gonzo_nb> in the uk, we have some of the tightest gun laws in the world. but they can still be brought illegally. So banning/limiting has little effect, even here
[11:46:19] <zeeshan> he/she can take out a few people
[11:46:21] <zeeshan> before getting caught
[11:46:27] <jdh_> gettign caught by whom?
[11:46:29] <zeeshan> ssi hahah okay buddy
[11:46:34] <zeeshan> jdh authorities
[11:46:40] <ssi> "authorities"
[11:46:42] <jdh_> heh
[11:46:44] <ssi> like that cop in south carolina
[11:46:48] <ssi> who shot an unarmed man four times
[11:46:50] <jdh_> right. they will come save people!
[11:46:50] <ssi> and only hit him once
[11:46:51] <ssi> in the hip
[11:46:54] <ssi> from less than 10 feet away
[11:46:55] <zeeshan> youre looking at 1 mistake
[11:46:56] <zeeshan> out of 2139012389023189213098231329108
[11:46:58] <ssi> "authorities"
[11:47:02] <zeeshan> non mistakes.
[11:47:03] <zeeshan> relax
[11:47:25] <ssi> you don't know what you're talking about, so just stop
[11:48:06] <jdh_> it's nice you have the authorities to do that.
[11:48:12] <jdh_> do they follow you around?
[11:48:23] <zeeshan> usually when the weapon is completely discharged
[11:48:28] <zeeshan> even a local hero can step in
[11:48:33] <zeeshan> and subdue the person
[11:48:58] <jdh> good one!
[11:50:11] <ssi> "In tonight's news, local hero zeeshan stepped in and subdued an active shooter by asking him to calculate the deflection of a beam, but only once the shooter's non semi-automatic weapon was fully discharged, eh"
[11:50:51] <zeeshan> "in tonight's news, ian mcmahon kills 10 with his faulty plane crash"
[11:51:10] <zeeshan> we can keep this going :)
[11:51:32] <zeeshan> if you have any negative comments, you can send them to me in pm, and i will return them in pm. let's keep them out of the public channel
[11:52:16] <ssi> what about what I said was negative?
[11:52:28] <ssi> I was praising your heroism
[11:53:29] <zeeshan> http://bennetttruckrentals.com/flatbed.php
[11:53:30] <ssi> ugh now you've made me late
[11:53:36] <zeeshan> i wonder if i can use a truck like this to unload
[11:53:44] <zeeshan> just by tilting the bed
[11:58:05] <zeeshan> http://www.kijiji.ca/v-business-industrial/mississauga-peel-region/mori-seiki-tv-300-cnc-vertical-machining-center-drill-tap/1020099795
[11:58:10] <zeeshan> i bet this this eats aluminuim
[11:58:13] <zeeshan> like its nothing
[12:07:41] <archivist> zeeshan, needs a winch to be safe
[12:10:39] <archivist> or make up a hitch to two tie down points so you can attach a tirfor (come along) to a mid point to let it down
[12:11:23] <zeeshan> i dont think it has a hitch
[12:11:26] <zeeshan> er winch
[12:11:49] <zeeshan> im torn between my two options
[12:11:55] <zeeshan> if i get a hydraulic flatbed, its going to cost
[12:12:16] <zeeshan> $210 in diesel, and $366 in rental fees
[12:12:18] <zeeshan> roughly
[12:12:34] <zeeshan> if i get a box truck, itll cost 150 in diesel, and $250 in rental fees
[12:13:19] <archivist> box truck should use more deseasal, it has to push more air
[12:13:33] <zeeshan> youre right
[12:13:39] <zeeshan> but the flatbed is about 150 miles out of the way
[12:13:40] <zeeshan> to get it
[12:13:49] <zeeshan> while the box truck is 5 miles away
[12:15:56] <archivist> exceedingly difficult to load/unload a box truck with a heavy lump
[12:16:07] <zeeshan> yes =/
[12:16:19] <zeeshan> he said he can load it easily to it
[12:16:22] <zeeshan> but unloading might be a pain
[12:16:23] <zeeshan> haha
[12:19:03] <archivist> make bolt on wheel assembly so the mill becomes a trailer
[12:20:42] <Jymmm> Autonomous slef-driving, navigation., and collision avoidance.
[12:21:15] <archivist> needs to retrofit before it drives itself home then
[12:21:30] <Jymmm> self replicating?
[12:21:44] <Jymmm> / repairing
[12:22:53] <Jymmm> Mill and mini-mill (finger to corner of mouth)
[12:22:58] <archivist> I am thinking if the trailers that have two beams and end bogies that move large transformers
[12:24:10] <Jymmm> transformers as in mains or robots from outter space?
[12:27:35] <archivist> mains/power station
[12:29:11] <zeeshan> archivist: thats not a bad idea at all
[12:29:14] <zeeshan> im going to use the jack
[12:29:21] <zeeshan> bottle jack and machine dolies
[12:29:26] <zeeshan> and move it around on the truck
[12:29:38] <zeeshan> but guess what, i endded up just renting the flat bed
[12:29:41] <zeeshan> it'll save the hassle :P
[12:36:04] <zeeshan> YAY
[12:36:07] <zeeshan> i just called the place
[12:36:22] <zeeshan> theyre giving me 200 free km
[12:36:33] <zeeshan> and a discounted rental rate
[12:36:39] <zeeshan> cause im putting 1100 km on the truck
[13:02:55] <zeeshan> http://www.shars.com/files/products/404-7164/404-7164C.jpg
[13:03:08] <zeeshan> is there a good reason why these boring bars are flat
[13:03:44] <zeeshan> http://i.imgur.com/PzvIoGH.jpg
[13:03:49] <zeeshan> when i was making that part on the lathe
[13:04:02] <zeeshan> the flat face was rubbing along that inner feature =/
[13:04:41] <skunkworks__> angle it a bit...
[13:04:48] <zeeshan> can't
[13:04:56] <zeeshan> ill lose my tool positions for the parting tool
[13:04:57] <zeeshan> and other tools
[13:05:07] <skunkworks__> ah
[13:05:34] <skunkworks__> it is then the wrong tool for this situation
[13:07:34] <Tom_itx> new virus out that affects bash
[13:07:44] <Tom_itx> fwiw
[13:08:14] <Tom_L> http://www.electronicproducts.com/Software/System/New_Shellshock_virus_considered_1_000_times_worse_than_Heartbleed_bug_could_affect_at_least_500M_computers.aspx
[13:08:25] <skunkworks__> Tom_itx, link? (to the article - not the virus..)
[13:08:30] <skunkworks__> thanks
[13:08:32] <Tom_L> ^^
[13:12:10] <zeeshan> so does it only effect computers
[13:12:13] <zeeshan> that also have apache installed?
[13:12:49] <Tom_itx> dunno, i'm just the messenger
[13:12:52] <zeeshan> hehe
[13:32:42] <Tom_itx> there is a patch for it
[13:33:17] <Tom_itx> <LeoNerd> The underlying problem was a very flawed design of a little-used little-understood feature hardly anyone ever wanted
[13:41:28] <jdh> any at&t uverse knowledge? vs. TW cable?
[13:42:03] <Jymmm> jdh: such as?
[13:42:45] <jdh> speed? latency? reliability?
[13:44:11] <Deejay> choose 2 ;)
[13:44:23] <Jymmm> reliaility is good, only down for maintaince on sundays at 1am for a couple of hours periodically. Only had two major outagges in 4 years for less than 8 hours
[13:44:45] <Jymmm> Their DNS sucks, use your own.
[13:45:27] <Jymmm> latency, eh, probably not for gaming, but I suspect that's a DNS thing more than anythign else.
[13:45:37] <Jymmm> I can stream netflix fine.
[13:46:01] <jdh> do you use their teevee stuff?
[13:46:10] <Jymmm> nope
[13:46:18] <Jymmm> just data
[13:46:40] <Jymmm> I had it for 90 days in the beginning, it waas fine.
[13:47:23] <Jymmm> What's the difference between regular and cable tv? It just take syou longer to find out there's STILL nothing on =)
[13:47:51] <jdh> my wife watches tv
[13:47:54] <Jymmm> I don't even have cable anymore, I put up an antenna
[13:48:07] <jdh> first time we have ever had a choice between TimeWarner/RR and anything else.
[13:48:44] <Jymmm> You can stream so much stuff these days it's crazy.... crackle.com free movies
[13:49:40] <Jymmm> $100 to put up an antenna. Paid for itself in 90 days.
[13:49:51] <jdh> not much around here.
[13:50:09] <Jymmm> The transmittes here are 50 miles away.
[13:50:28] <jdh> not much within 90 miles of here
[13:50:41] <Jymmm> have you checked?
[13:50:48] <Jymmm> there are maps
[13:51:04] <jdh> nope. what maps?
[13:51:39] <jdh> in a 50 mile radius, over half is ocean, another 20% swamp/river
[13:51:46] <Jymmm> http://www.antennapoint.com/
[13:51:48] <Connor> jdh: PetefromTn_ Just ordered the stock for the ballscrew mounts, column and head extension.
[13:52:23] <jdh> cool
[13:52:31] <jdh> I'd think you would be able to find scrap around there.
[13:53:47] <jdh> jymm: cool, but not much here. Only 5 and one is PBS. and ION, wtf that is.
[13:54:06] <Jymmm> ION is pretty cool.
[13:55:46] <roycroft> i mostly watch pbs, discovery, and the history channel
[13:55:59] <roycroft> i get basic cable, which includes those channels, for $3/month
[13:56:13] <Jymmm> jdh: THIS is the one I was talking about I couldn't remember http://tvfool.com/
[13:56:22] <roycroft> it's actually $13/month, but i have cablemodem service, and they discount the internet bit $10/month if you have ctv as well
[13:56:25] <Connor> jdh: Probably is getting out to find them.. was just easier to order.
[13:56:40] <Connor> jdh: Err. Problem not Probably.
[13:56:47] <Jymmm> roycroft: So, what is your total monthly bill?
[13:56:51] <roycroft> i don't know
[13:56:54] <roycroft> my boss pays it
[13:56:54] <Jymmm> lol
[13:56:59] <Jymmm> ah
[13:57:00] <roycroft> since i work from home a lot
[13:57:09] <jdh> I had a 25% off $100 from onlinemetals
[13:57:16] <roycroft> i think it's a bit over $100/month - cablemodem service is expensive
[13:57:38] <jdh> $45/month here for roadrunner
[13:57:46] <jdh> plus $100 in misc other cable crap
[13:57:58] <roycroft> oh, i watch the daily show and the colbert report too
[13:58:06] <roycroft> so i guess add comedy central to my list
[13:58:07] <Jymmm> I pay NOTHING a month for cable =)
[13:58:22] <roycroft> i think it's worth $3/month for what i get
[13:58:26] <PetefromTn_> Connor Sounds good man glad you finally got what you needed.
[13:58:26] <roycroft> i would not want to pay more though
[13:58:36] <Jymmm> $50/mo for 18/2 data for uverse
[13:59:07] <Connor> PetefromTn_: $133.37 total to the door.
[13:59:14] <roycroft> i pay $30/month for unlimited data on my ipad
[13:59:23] <PetefromTn_> does that include the big stuff
[13:59:31] <roycroft> and i use very little bandwidth on the ipad
[13:59:39] <roycroft> 3g is too slow for streaming stuff
[13:59:44] <Jymmm> roycroft: It's never "unlimited" =)
[13:59:46] <Connor> Yup. The cast iron and the 3" x 5" x 8" Alumn spacer block
[13:59:46] <roycroft> so i only stream to it when i'm at home on my wifi network
[13:59:50] <roycroft> mine is, jymmm
[13:59:56] <roycroft> it's the old grandfathered rate
[14:00:02] <roycroft> i'm afraid to drop it because of that
[14:00:03] <Jymmm> roycroft: Yeah, 4g?
[14:00:04] <PetefromTn_> wow how did you manage that?
[14:00:13] <Connor> roycroft: ATT?
[14:00:14] <roycroft> the new $30 plan is limited
[14:00:15] <roycroft> yes
[14:00:20] <roycroft> the old at&t unlimited plan
[14:00:24] <Connor> I have 2 Iphones with the same plan.
[14:00:33] <roycroft> i bought my ipad two days before they ended the plan
[14:00:39] <Jymmm> ah
[14:00:40] <roycroft> it's 3g
[14:00:41] <Connor> only problem is.. they can throttle you after so many GIGs
[14:01:10] <roycroft> i don't think i could consume that much bandwidth in a month on their crappy 3g system, connor
[14:01:27] <Connor> I think it's like 5GB
[14:01:27] <roycroft> i mainly use the 3g connection to check email and do light web surfing when i'm away from home
[14:01:30] <Connor> But.. Don't recall
[14:01:42] <Jymmm> roycroft: To me 3g IS limited, speed wise.
[14:01:45] <roycroft> occasionally i have to vpn into a work network to fix something when i'm not home
[14:01:59] <Connor> I have my 4S Jailbroken and can use it as a WiFi hotspot
[14:02:29] <roycroft> my new iphone is on sprint (the old one was on at&t)
[14:02:40] <roycroft> and the sprint 3g network is way faster than the at&t one around here
[14:03:01] <roycroft> so i find myself tethering my macbook pro to my iphone more often than using the ipad these days
[14:03:10] <Connor> I'm still running iOS 5.0.1
[14:03:11] <Connor> :(
[14:03:17] <roycroft> i have the original ipad
[14:03:30] <roycroft> i have whatever the latest ios that runs on it is
[14:03:33] <roycroft> 5 or 6
[14:03:50] <Connor> I'll upgrade to the 6 as soon as iOS 8 is jailbroken.
[14:03:59] <Connor> iPhone 6 on iOS 7
[14:04:03] <Connor> er iOS 8
[14:04:49] <jdh> the steve would be sad if you JB it
[14:04:55] <roycroft> 5.1.1
[14:05:15] <_methods> http://xenbits.xen.org/xsa/advisory-108.html
[14:05:16] <roycroft> i haven't updated my iphone to ios 8 yet
[14:05:20] <Connor> iPad and iPhone only Apple products I own.. I'm not a Apple Fan Boy
[14:05:21] <_methods> if any of you are using xen
[14:05:26] <roycroft> i need to make sure my critical apps run on ios 8
[14:05:33] <_methods> they finally released that advisory
[14:06:19] <roycroft> i use macs, but i would not consider myself an apple fanboi
[14:06:23] <roycroft> i think by definition i'm not
[14:06:31] <roycroft> my ipad is 4 years old
[14:06:38] <roycroft> my iphone is a couple years old
[14:08:44] <roycroft> my mac pro is six years old
[14:08:54] <roycroft> my macbook pro was six years old before i just got a new one
[14:09:07] <roycroft> if i were a fanboi none of that gear would be more than a year old
[14:09:22] <roycroft> i've also never queued up outside an apple store to buy anything
[14:10:01] <Jymmm> lmao
[14:10:19] <roycroft> i also complain about apple stupidity a lot :)
[14:17:21] <roycroft> apple vs. microsoft is like democrats vs. republicans
[14:17:29] <roycroft> all you can do is choose the lesser of two evils
[14:17:41] <roycroft> so you pick what you pick and you stick by it, logic be damned
[14:18:15] <_methods> you mean you can't pick the right product based on your needs?
[14:18:28] <roycroft> not if the right product does not exist
[14:19:00] <roycroft> so you pick the product that you think will cause you to make the fewest compromises
[14:19:11] <_methods> you pick the right tool for the job
[14:19:19] <_methods> they're all tools
[14:19:21] <roycroft> yes, when that tool exists
[14:19:38] <_methods> i don't use bsd for my every day box
[14:19:47] <_methods> but i sure as fuck use it for my UTM/firewall
[14:19:49] <roycroft> when it doesn't you pick the tool that's closest to what you need
[14:20:24] <_methods> i'd use linux for everything if i could use solidworks and mastercam on linux
[14:20:39] <roycroft> i use linux as little as possible
[14:20:39] <Jymmm> VM's
[14:20:40] <_methods> but alas i'm stranded in windows land
[14:20:40] <roycroft> i hate it
[14:20:53] <roycroft> but i use openbsd for most of my servers
[14:21:38] <roycroft> i should qualify my linux dislike to say it's not linux per se that i dislike so much it's linux coders/maintainers and the linux culture that i dislike
[14:21:41] <_methods> yeah i use vm's i actually probably could go all linux at this point
[14:21:51] <roycroft> linux has actually gotten fairly decent
[14:21:55] <_methods> but 4 monitors on linux is still a pain in the ass
[14:22:03] <roycroft> in spite of the coders/maintainers
[14:22:25] <roycroft> when this gnu thing totally blows up linux is going to be a nightmare again
[14:22:43] <mozmck> I don't know much about the linux culture, but I sure don't like what I've seen of the windows or especially mac culture :)
[14:22:48] <roycroft> and i fully expect the a huge gnu blowup, after the bash bugs and how the fsf handeled them
[14:23:09] <roycroft> windows users are stubborn idiots
[14:23:13] <roycroft> mac users are helpless idiots
[14:23:14] <roycroft> for the most part
[14:24:19] <mozmck> :) and all software is junk!
[14:24:53] <roycroft> pretty much
[14:26:07] <rythmnbls> another bash patch released today
[14:26:19] <roycroft> no
[14:26:28] <roycroft> i just spent all day yesterday applying patches again
[14:26:34] <_methods> heheh
[14:26:37] <_methods> all distros?
[14:26:43] <roycroft> i've spent this morning making ksh behave like bash
[14:26:59] <rythmnbls> i dont think its security related, http://ftp.gnu.org/pub/gnu/bash/bash-4.2-patches/bash42-051
[14:27:01] <PetefromTn_> I talk to folks from several different camps... SSI for instance is a HUGE Apple junkie, Connor apparenlty can go either way with it, I have not really used anything but windoze but I am not programming shit every day either
[14:27:07] <roycroft> i have about 60 servers that i maintain
[14:27:18] <roycroft> running a mix of operating systems and versions
[14:27:26] <roycroft> i can't realistically just apply patches
[14:27:27] <PetefromTn_> Personally I would use apple or otherwise systems but it seems they are quite proud of them judging by their price tags.
[14:27:44] <roycroft> it's actually faster and easier for me to rebuild from patched source on all the machines
[14:27:48] <_methods> man bang for the buck it's a total rip off
[14:28:00] <_methods> you can get a way better machine for a fraction of the price
[14:28:02] <roycroft> and at least 75% of them are running bsd
[14:28:04] <PetefromTn_> My stepson bought a top level mac laptop awhile back
[14:28:08] <_methods> you're payin for shiny with apple
[14:28:18] <roycroft> so when i get ksh configured they way i want i can remove bash from 75% or so of the servers
[14:28:19] <PetefromTn_> and it was honestly cool and all aluminum and whatnot.
[14:28:24] <PetefromTn_> but it does not work now...
[14:28:26] * roycroft will not discuss the illusion of apple tax here
[14:28:38] <PetefromTn_> Did not last any longer than my windows8 laptop has.. and it still works.
[14:28:51] <PetefromTn_> what is BSD?
[14:28:58] <roycroft> it's a derivative of unix
[14:29:09] <roycroft> it dates back to about 1980
[14:29:12] <PetefromTn_> an operating system
[14:29:18] <roycroft> yes
[14:29:46] <PetefromTn_> talking to ssi he basically said that anything business runs on apple and apple products and programs
[14:29:53] <_methods> lol
[14:30:00] <roycroft> that is not in the least bit true
[14:30:08] <PetefromTn_> that may or may not be true but if it is then why do they not get support from the big cad cam systems?
[14:30:31] <SpeedEvil> It is in some industries
[14:30:39] <PetefromTn_> not calling him out or questioning him here understand
[14:31:00] <roycroft> yes, but "some industries" is not "anything business"
[14:31:12] <PetefromTn_> but It seems like everywhere I go I see windows systems on companies computers...
[14:31:17] <mozmck> I program and do electronics design almost exclusively on linux.
[14:31:29] <roycroft> not that autocad is a "big cad" system (it's actually an entry level professional cad system)
[14:31:32] <PetefromTn_> I know linux has a HUGE following for programmer types
[14:31:38] <roycroft> but autocad does run on mac os again now
[14:31:47] <roycroft> i don't know why they withdrew from that market in the first place
[14:31:54] <PetefromTn_> autocad used to be a giant in industry
[14:32:05] <_methods> autodesk still is
[14:32:08] <PetefromTn_> in some ways they still ar
[14:32:09] <PetefromTn_> are
[14:32:12] <roycroft> autocad is widely deployed
[14:32:24] <roycroft> it easily has the biggest installed base of any cad software
[14:32:25] <_methods> inventor, 3dsmax, maya
[14:32:31] <PetefromTn_> so yeah does it get support on an apple product?
[14:32:33] <roycroft> but it's still pretty basic stuff, from a professional level
[14:32:35] <_methods> i'd say they are major players still
[14:32:37] <mozmck> apple probably has a lead in media industries still. I worked at a place that had a press, and the design guys all used macs
[14:32:40] <roycroft> yes, autocad runs on os x
[14:33:22] <PetefromTn_> I think if you are into any sort of graphics design or media like TV or video gaming then yeah the apple systems excel.
[14:33:27] <PetefromTn_> apparently anyways..
[14:33:33] <mozmck> Yes, but that's certainly not all industry.
[14:33:48] <roycroft> actually, mac os was not until recently a good gaming development system
[14:34:11] <roycroft> but for graphic design and for film editing it has always been the preferred platform
[14:34:13] <PetefromTn_> I am not talking about PLAYING games on it.
[14:34:24] <roycroft> even moreso since sgi went under
[14:34:49] <mozmck> It was not even really an option for industrial stuff either as far as I know - probably still isn't.
[14:35:38] <roycroft> i remember touring a large nuclear-equipped navy ship a few years ago
[14:35:46] <roycroft> that was running windows nt to control everything
[14:35:54] <mozmck> scary
[14:35:55] <roycroft> and i was on the bridge and saw a bsod
[14:36:04] <PetefromTn_> Interesting.. He seemed to think that if you use apple products there is a seamlessness to working between them that is missing on other options.
[14:36:21] <roycroft> this is true, petefromtn_
[14:36:31] <Connor> PetefromTn_: Who?
[14:36:32] <roycroft> apple excel at intergrating their various products
[14:36:42] <PetefromTn_> that there are always patches and downloads necessary to use windows and android stuff..
[14:36:48] <PetefromTn_> ssi
[14:36:56] <roycroft> i use apple products for serveral reasons
[14:37:22] <roycroft> 1. user interface computers to me are just tools these days - i'm way past being intersted in tinkering with them
[14:37:23] <PetefromTn_> so he may have a point about that aspect of it then.
[14:37:30] <roycroft> and i can buy a mac, plug it in, turn it on, and start working
[14:37:44] <roycroft> 2. mac os x is a mach kernel with a bsd userland - it's unix under the hood
[14:37:55] <roycroft> i've been a unix user since 1977, so it's very familiar to me
[14:38:15] <roycroft> 3. in spite of what people say about cost, apple hardware/software is a good value
[14:38:46] <PetefromTn_> I do not have that much apple experience really so I honestly don't know... It is interesting to see differing viewpoints.
[14:38:49] <roycroft> i like high quality hardware, and pricing equivalent quality peecees i find they're similar to apple
[14:39:04] <roycroft> apple are a little more on some things, but not by a huge amount
[14:39:22] <roycroft> and the convenience of just opening the box and starting work is worth a little more money to me
[14:39:23] <PetefromTn_> it depends I suppose on the item in question.
[14:39:32] <PetefromTn_> some of their laptops are quite expensive.
[14:39:51] <roycroft> my current mbp was about $2500
[14:40:13] <PetefromTn_> what does a top of the line brand new MBP cost fully equipped?
[14:40:47] <roycroft> it has a 1TB ssd, 16GB of ram, and a beautiful 15" retina display (2880x1800)
[14:40:53] <roycroft> mine's pretty much top of the line
[14:41:13] <roycroft> 2.3GHz 8 cores
[14:41:14] <PetefromTn_> my last laptop was a 17+ incher and I REALLY liked that larger screen
[14:41:43] <roycroft> and i can tell you, solidworks absolutely screams when doing rendering on this mbp
[14:41:44] <PetefromTn_> My current one is a toshiba and it is not as large and I kinda wish I got that larger screen sometimes.
[14:41:49] <roycroft> it's wicked wicked fast
[14:42:04] <PetefromTn_> yeah wish I could afford Solidworks
[14:42:10] <roycroft> people say they can get a 15" windows laptop for $400
[14:42:13] <roycroft> and i say yeah
[14:42:23] <roycroft> but it's not going to be anything like my mbp
[14:42:25] <roycroft> not even remotely
[14:42:26] <_methods> a fool and his money are soon parted
[14:42:31] <_methods> that's another saying
[14:42:41] <PetefromTn_> meaning?
[14:43:04] <roycroft> solidworks was a big chunk of change - fortunately work paid for my license
[14:43:12] <roycroft> i think it cost about $6k
[14:43:31] <roycroft> but we got a contract that paid for the license
[14:43:49] <PetefromTn_> what kind of work do you do that you are in charge of all these servers yet you need solidworks paid for by your employer?
[14:44:22] <roycroft> my boss won't pay for maintenance, though
[14:44:34] <roycroft> i'm a fiber optic designer, and i do both engineering and it work
[14:44:50] <PetefromTn_> sounds interesting
[14:44:58] <roycroft> much if it is very mundane
[14:45:07] <roycroft> occasionally it's interesting
[14:45:11] <PetefromTn_> let me know if you need any CNC machine work LOL
[14:45:20] <roycroft> and i could have done the work for that job in autocad
[14:45:25] <roycroft> but i wanted solidworks
[14:45:32] <SpeedEvil> roycroft: as in comms or lasers?
[14:45:36] <roycroft> comms
[14:45:37] <PetefromTn_> solidworks is awesome for usre
[14:45:38] <SpeedEvil> err
[14:45:42] <SpeedEvil> power
[14:45:50] <PetefromTn_> sure
[14:45:56] <roycroft> i do mostly underground fiber backbones
[14:46:02] <CaptHindsight> roycroft: do you design lamps like these? http://www.sz-wholesale.com/uploadFiles/Product_78/Blue-Fiber-Optic-Lamp-SZSP191078.jpg
[14:46:11] <roycroft> so it's more civil engineering than fiber engineering
[14:46:16] <roycroft> no, capthindsight
[14:46:21] <PetefromTn_> LOL I love those lamps hehe
[14:46:23] <roycroft> without even bothering to look at the url i know i don't :)
[14:46:57] <roycroft> we had a job for a municiplality doing some outside plant work
[14:47:00] <_methods> need a lava lamp with that
[14:47:18] <PetefromTn_> I got my daugher a cool lava lamp
[14:47:20] <_methods> lavalamp fiber lamp combo
[14:47:27] <roycroft> and there were several areas that had tons of utilities in the ground, and we had to do some fairly fancy design to weave our stuff around the existing stuff
[14:47:34] <PetefromTn_> we seldom use it for fear of how hot it gets LOL
[14:47:48] <roycroft> i could have done it with autocad 2008, but i really needed 3d capability to do it right
[14:47:54] <roycroft> and 3d on acad 2008 sucked
[14:48:11] <roycroft> interestingly, i evaluated inventor and solidworks
[14:48:21] <roycroft> thinking inventor would be better since it's an autodesk product
[14:48:35] <roycroft> but i found that i could import my dwg files into solidworks a lot more easily than importing them into inventor
[14:49:08] <CaptHindsight> I've used NX, Catia, Solidworks and few others but never got the hang of Autocad
[14:49:13] <PetefromTn_> huh.. I never had any problems importing .dxf files into solidworks when I had access to it.
[14:49:30] <roycroft> autodesk were also not helpful in transitioning us from acad to inventor
[14:49:35] <roycroft> as in, they wanted full retail for inventor
[14:49:44] <roycroft> which was around $5500, iirc
[14:49:54] <roycroft> solidworks professional was only a few hundred dollars more
[14:50:06] <_methods> a pro seat was only $6k?
[14:50:16] <roycroft> right, petefromtn_ - it was easy importing into solidworks
[14:50:21] <roycroft> i think so
[14:50:26] <roycroft> i didn't buy it - my boss did
[14:50:30] <_methods> well you got a real good deal then
[14:50:31] <roycroft> but he was negotiating with them
[14:50:37] <_methods> pretty sure basic is $6k
[14:50:48] <roycroft> well i know i have 2012 pro
[14:50:52] <PetefromTn_> damn thats a lot of money..
[14:50:55] <_methods> pro is depending on all the modules you get can be quite a bit
[14:50:58] <CaptHindsight> do they sell through dealers or just direct?
[14:51:13] <_methods> usually a bare pro seat is $8-10k
[14:51:30] <PetefromTn_> what makes pro pro?
[14:51:42] <roycroft> they knew we were looking at inventor too
[14:51:44] <_methods> some features
[14:51:49] <_methods> sheet metal feature
[14:51:52] <roycroft> perhaps they had some kind of switch promot
[14:51:53] <_methods> imports
[14:51:59] <roycroft> yeah, i have sheet metal
[14:52:06] <PetefromTn_> for instance if I just wanted the 3d modeling and could give a shit about FEA and other stuff does that still mean pro?
[14:52:09] <roycroft> and the parts/weldments library
[14:52:09] <CaptHindsight> isn't it the simulation and evaluation tools that make it Pro?
[14:52:14] <_methods> no there are some things in sheet metal you can only do with pro
[14:52:23] <roycroft> i don't use most of that stuff
[14:52:35] <_methods> a lot of pro features are in importing
[14:52:41] <roycroft> i was doing a lot of pipe layout with it
[14:52:47] <_methods> featurworks
[14:53:02] <roycroft> lunch time
[14:53:07] <PetefromTn_> I don't do any sheetmetal or FEA of pipe or weldments with it.
[14:53:19] <_methods> yeah then you'd be fine with basic
[14:53:24] <PetefromTn_> I would only need to be able to model 3d parts
[14:53:32] <_methods> dude inventor is free
[14:53:34] <PetefromTn_> for CNC milling and turning.
[14:53:37] <zeeshan> roycroft: have you tried inventor sheet metal
[14:53:40] <zeeshan> vs solidworks sheet metal
[14:53:41] <PetefromTn_> free how?
[14:53:46] <_methods> just go to student
[14:53:50] <_methods> they don't even check
[14:53:57] <_methods> you don't even need a .edu
[14:54:12] <PetefromTn_> ah
[14:54:14] <_methods> http://www.autodesk.com/education/free-software/all
[14:54:51] <zeeshan> who needs inventor
[14:54:58] <zeeshan> i can hook them up with a college pass
[14:55:00] <_methods> damn 3 year license free now lol
[14:55:10] <_methods> used to be 1 year
[14:55:18] <_methods> now they give you a 3 year free license sweet
[14:56:15] <zeeshan> i love inventor sheet metal
[14:56:27] <zeeshan> its so easy to use
[14:58:11] <_methods> http://www.solidworks.com/sw/products/3d-cad/3d-cad-matrix.htm
[14:58:18] <_methods> that's the diff between the solidworks versions
[14:58:59] <zeeshan> standard isnt even worth it
[14:59:05] <_methods> why not
[14:59:20] <zeeshan> you get none of the awesome stuff
[14:59:24] <zeeshan> like pipe routing
[14:59:29] <zeeshan> wire haneses
[14:59:32] <zeeshan> i use motion analysis a lot
[14:59:40] <_methods> that's great
[14:59:43] <_methods> most people don't
[14:59:47] <_methods> they just need to make parts
[14:59:47] <zeeshan> i dont think it even comes with the toolbox
[14:59:50] <_methods> and make sure it fits
[14:59:56] <zeeshan> with a hardware database
[15:00:03] <zeeshan> if youre just doing that
[15:00:05] <zeeshan> why not use inventor
[15:00:08] <zeeshan> or freecad
[15:00:15] <zeeshan> something cheaper
[15:00:29] <_methods> can you mate parts in freecad?
[15:00:34] <zeeshan> i dont know, i havent used it :P
[15:00:45] <_methods> as far as i know you can't
[15:00:54] <zeeshan> how can it call itself a cad software then
[15:00:55] <zeeshan> :-(
[15:00:55] <_methods> unless they've added that functionality recently
[15:01:20] <zeeshan> _methods: are you a hardcore solidworks user?
[15:01:22] <_methods> it works fine for a free solution to parametrically model parts
[15:01:28] <_methods> yeah i use solidworks every day
[15:01:37] <zeeshan> do you know the escape trick?
[15:01:40] <zeeshan> and last command?
[15:01:41] <_methods> nope
[15:01:47] <zeeshan> so when you're drawing a line
[15:01:54] <_methods> i don't use half it's features or shortcuts lol
[15:01:57] <zeeshan> usually it forces you to continue drawing it right?
[15:02:01] <_methods> no
[15:02:05] <_methods> i double click
[15:02:08] <PetefromTn_> actually yes Freecad can mate parts and there is an assembly branch now that is somewhat working.
[15:02:28] <_methods> ah then freecad is an even better legit option then
[15:02:33] <zeeshan> do you double click
[15:02:37] <zeeshan> and then press the line button
[15:02:42] <zeeshan> on the navigator?
[15:02:44] <_methods> yeah i double click to end line
[15:02:49] <_methods> no i just hit l
[15:03:03] <zeeshan> try this one
[15:03:05] <zeeshan> escape
[15:03:07] <zeeshan> then enter
[15:03:13] <zeeshan> enter repeats the last command
[15:03:22] <zeeshan> so you dont have to specifically pick what you're trying to draw again
[15:03:33] <zeeshan> also if you wanna use less clicks
[15:03:42] <zeeshan> you can also draw the line while holding the left mouse button the entire time
[15:03:44] <zeeshan> and release it
[15:03:50] <zeeshan> and it'll allow you to draw a line else where
[15:05:16] <zeeshan> how about this opne
[15:05:32] <zeeshan> if you want a plane thats offset from the front plane
[15:05:44] <zeeshan> press left ctrl and select the plane and drag it out
[15:53:54] <zeeshan> all tool offsets working
[15:54:08] <zeeshan> i think for me personally, the best to to setup tool offsets is manually
[15:54:43] <zeeshan> you have your reference tool that is zero'ed relative to your lathe centerline
[15:54:59] <zeeshan> then youi load the the other tools, check out how much you need to offset them by
[15:55:04] <zeeshan> ssi's technique works
[16:37:41] <Deejay> gn8
[18:26:46] <mblaszkiewicz> Hi everyone. I have a quick question. I'm tuning my servos and wondering where the p value ussually is. I'm upto 50 with no oscilation
[18:27:25] <PCW> depends on output scaling
[18:28:43] <mblaszkiewicz> I have 1 to 1
[18:28:44] <PCW> if scaling is "normalized" (so output is scaled in machine unit per second of velocity)
[18:28:46] <PCW> its easier to compare
[18:29:14] <mblaszkiewicz> direct drive from the servo motor to the ball screw
[18:30:08] <PCW> the scaling I mean is the analog output scaling
[18:30:18] <mblaszkiewicz> my ini file shows outpt scale at 10.0
[18:31:54] <mblaszkiewicz> what would a good start point be for adjusting the p value
[18:32:37] <PCW> right, that volts which really doesn't make much sense
[18:33:10] <PCW> No way to know unless you first normalize your scale
[18:33:33] <mblaszkiewicz> how do i do that
[18:36:28] <PCW> first you need to know how fast your axis move at 10V
[18:41:38] <mblaszkiewicz> 3000 rpm .2 per rev
[18:43:47] <mblaszkiewicz> 780 ish ipm per the manual
[18:47:31] <mblaszkiewicz> upto 200 and no ossilation
[18:47:41] <mblaszkiewicz> does that sound right
[18:53:11] <mblaszkiewicz> Are you still here pcw
[19:02:13] <PCW> Yeah so if you want comparable PID values you would set the
[19:02:14] <PCW> [AXIS_0]OUTPUT_SCALE 780
[19:02:16] <PCW> [AXIS_0]OUTPUT_MIN_LIMIT -780
[19:02:18] <PCW> [AXIS_0]OUTPUT_MAX_LIMIT 780
[19:02:19] <PCW> assuming a inch machine
[19:03:38] <PCW> oops replace 780 with 13 (its IPS)
[19:04:50] <PetefromTn_> PCW... Why does the minimum limit need to be negative?
[19:06:56] <PCW> because we want bipolar (+ and -) outputs
[19:07:26] <PCW> [AXIS_0]OUTPUT_SCALE 13
[19:07:27] <PCW> [AXIS_0]OUTPUT_MIN_LIMIT -13
[19:07:27] <PetefromTn_> I am NOT good with servo tuning
[19:07:28] <PCW> [AXIS_0]OUTPUT_MAX_LIMIT 13
[19:07:45] <PetefromTn_> I need to check my Z out to see if that is what I have on it.
[19:07:55] <PetefromTn_> and X and Y for that matter
[19:09:16] <mblaszkiewicz> one other question. I changed my spindle to output number 5 as you suggested. I can't get it to start now
[19:11:16] <PCW> scaling correctly is a nicety but if you dont you cannot compare PID values from other machines
[19:11:17] <PCW> (a inch machine will have much lower PID values than a mm machine if not scaled)
[19:12:07] <PCW> analog out 5 has a separate enable pin (since its intended for spindle use)
[19:12:49] <mblaszkiewicz> at 150 got that bad vibration
[19:13:02] <mblaszkiewicz> and how do I enable pin 5
[19:13:59] <PCW> analog out 5 has a hal pin (might be called spinenable, dont recall off hand)
[19:16:06] <PetefromTn_> so the output scale for the axis should be the same as the max and min limits?
[19:16:20] <PetefromTn_> is that what you mean by normalized?
[19:17:26] <PCW> with a velocity mode drive, what i mean by normalized is the the output of the PID is in units of velocity (so if its a inch machine it in IPS)
[19:17:36] <PCW> that the
[19:17:57] <PetefromTn_> mine are all set to 10 on the X and Y
[19:18:07] <PetefromTn_> min limit, max limit etc.
[19:18:26] <PCW> yea so you have them set to volts (the pncconf default)
[19:18:57] <PetefromTn_> Okay so that is not the speed limit then is this correct?
[19:19:39] <PetefromTn_> The reason I am asking is that I have yet to conquer the Z axis issue I have
[19:19:50] <PCW> with those limits if the PID output is +10 you will get +10V out
[19:20:14] <PCW> (and -10V with -10)
[19:20:25] <PetefromTn_> I cannot set the max rapid more than about half of the X and Y max IPM or when it comes DOWN the column I will occasionally get a fault.
[19:21:13] <PetefromTn_> If I keep it around half the X and Y it works fine. This is actually plenty fast but I would like to know that it is working correctly and that max rapid is available in the future.
[19:21:56] <PetefromTn_> It is curious that is faults on the way down and not the way up. I can set the Z mad rapid for 700 plus and rapiding UP the column it just rips right up there but when I try to go down it faults.
[19:22:27] <PetefromTn_> Curiously enough it is not when it STOPS that it faults rather it is mid travel.
[19:22:58] <PetefromTn_> My friend Art seems to feel that it is a tuning issue but I am not good at tuning so I have no earthly idea how to remedy it.
[19:24:23] <CaptHindsight> skunkworks: I have the camview tab working in Axis on Wheezy
[19:24:45] <CaptHindsight> I'll update the wiki with a clear howto
[19:25:16] <PetefromTn_> is that for a spindle mounted camera SWEET!
[19:26:18] <CaptHindsight> yeah, just video for now, will add the crosshairs and auto home next
[19:27:25] <CaptHindsight> then maybe some image enhancement and auto edge detection
[19:27:53] <PetefromTn_> Awesome... I know Connor has one and was asking about that awhile back. Way to go man!!
[19:29:44] <mblaszkiewicz> ok got to 140 and got vibrations on x, backed down to 135. Is that correct
[19:31:34] <CaptHindsight> having it recognize parts and orient them will make pick-n-place easy with Linuxcnc
[19:42:19] <PCW> might want to go down to 100 or so for some margin
[19:43:40] <mblaszkiewicz> down to 110 on a long run it vibrated a bit
[19:44:05] <mblaszkiewicz> when I run the hal scope now nothing comes if for f-error
[19:44:12] <PCW> so maybe 80 then you adjust FF1 (in your case it should be close to one say between .5 and 1.5)
[19:44:38] <PCW> you have to scale ferror so you see it
[19:44:46] <PCW> bbl
[20:19:14] <mblaszkiewicz> ok back again
[20:19:50] <mblaszkiewicz> anyone know how to turn on port 5 on a 7i77
[20:20:13] <mblaszkiewicz> I changed my spindle over now it wont start :(
[20:25:01] <jdh> 19:54 < PCW> analog out 5 has a hal pin (might be called spinenable, dont
[20:25:12] <jdh> dmesg | grep -i spin
[20:25:18] <jdh> might turn up something
[20:34:05] <tjtr33> a vfd puts out 3 phases of variable amplitude. It can have single phase input.
[20:34:06] <tjtr33> can it be used to replace a 3 phase transformer? maybe drive a 3 phase transformer?
[20:35:45] <jdh> what's on the other side of the transformer?
[20:35:52] <tjtr33> big bridge for edm
[20:36:16] <tjtr33> not a motor
[20:37:01] <jdh> dunno. seems like an rpc would work fine
[20:37:55] <tjtr33> vfd cheap, clean & small too. 5hp motor maybe more $ than vfd
[20:38:04] <jdh> yeah and louder
[20:38:23] <tjtr33> but i love the idea of a pull start edm machine :)
[20:38:50] <zeeshan> variable voltage and frequency
[20:38:56] <tjtr33> yeah!
[20:38:56] <zeeshan> :D
[20:39:27] <zeeshan> you can find older 240v 3 phase motors for relatively cheap
[20:40:09] <jdh> A phase converting VFD must never be used to power a wire EDM because it contains electronics, thus capacitive loads. The PWM voltage of a VFD will damage these
[20:40:42] <zeeshan> did i misread something
[20:40:49] <zeeshan> i thought he was trying to drive a 5 hp motor
[20:41:02] <jdh> I assumed the 5hp fwas for teh RPC
[20:41:06] <zeeshan> OH
[20:41:12] * zeeshan needs glasses
[20:41:36] <tjtr33> ? the vfd would drives a traf, the 2ndry is isolated, what does it know about the load? wether its a stereo or canopener or edm?
[20:42:08] <tjtr33> and not wedm anyway
[20:42:12] <zeeshan> its been a while since i did phasors
[20:42:14] <jdh> http://phasetechnologies.com/phaseconverterinfo/phaseconverter_app_wireedm.htm
[20:42:26] <zeeshan> but you want to try to drive inductive loads only with vfds
[20:43:25] <tjtr33> jdh i see whatthey say, but dont see their reasoning.
[20:43:41] <tjtr33> zeeshan, yes i need to look at the inductiveload idea
[20:45:31] <tjtr33> hey thx! good info
[20:46:44] <Tom_itx> do they use those same digital phase converters on windmills and other power generating device to connect to mains?
[20:53:38] <tjtr33> dunno, but browsing 'digital phase converters' is a whole different price range than vfd's!
[20:54:36] <tjtr33> btw, jdh's url suggested 'digital phase converters' were suited to this application ( again thx!)
[20:56:09] <Tom_itx> more costly?
[21:04:52] <zeeshan> i think another name for "digital phase converters"
[21:04:54] <zeeshan> is inverters :P
[21:05:12] <zeeshan> ive seen the diy people use inverters with their wind mills
[21:09:14] <zeeshan> son of a
[21:09:26] <zeeshan> i accidently put my stock size to .5 instead of .625
[21:09:42] <zeeshan> first pass removed like .100 doc out of tool steel
[21:09:43] <zeeshan> whoops
[21:54:14] <skunkworks> CaptHindsight: cool! I can test it soon
[22:18:29] <zeeshan> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nlKatLB8vVY&list=UUy-Z-COl0WvPmSLXMOvtedg
[22:18:47] <zeeshan> anyone know why a 0.020" doc .006fpr, 100sfm
[22:18:55] <zeeshan> would chatter this bad
[22:19:00] <zeeshan> and the work piece really hot too
[22:19:09] <pcw_home> mblaszkiewicz: hm2_5i25.0.7i77.0.1.spinena
[22:19:11] <pcw_home> halcmd show pin | grep spin would work
[23:08:12] <XXCoder> pretty awesome http://www.3ders.org/articles/20140928-nanosteel-announces-crack-free-dense-steel-powder-for-your-3d-metal-printer.html
[23:19:03] <wear> zeeshan, it looks like rigidity to me, if you did that exact same test with a live center in the rear of part, it would be just fine, the length of the bar probably is creating a small resonance vibration in the whipping of the metal.