#linuxcnc | Logs for 2014-05-07

[02:07:50] <Deejay> moin
[02:52:48] <witnit> mojn!
[07:41:35] <eren_basturk> can i define EMCMOT configuration in .hal file?
[07:44:10] <eren_basturk> do you have an idea about that?
[07:44:13] <_methods> arm and amd getting in bed together?
[07:44:19] <_methods> http://linuxgizmos.com/amd-surprise-pin-compatible-arm-and-x86-cpus/
[07:44:50] <_methods> intel might need to look out
[07:48:22] <skunkworks__> eren_basturk, can you explain more what you are trying to do?
[07:50:06] <eren_basturk> ok
[07:50:23] <eren_basturk> ı want to test stepgen
[07:51:50] <eren_basturk> I don't want to prepare .ini file and want to test it with only .hal and .xml file(my gui)
[07:53:20] <skunkworks__> ok
[07:53:35] <eren_basturk> did you understand me?
[07:53:44] <eren_basturk> if want i can give more information
[07:53:52] <skunkworks__> so you want to setup threads and such in the hal file.
[07:54:05] <eren_basturk> yes exactly
[07:55:03] <skunkworks__> http://www.linuxcnc.org/docs/2.5/html/man/man9/threads.9.html
[07:56:50] <skunkworks__> http://www.linuxcnc.org/docs/2.5/html/hal/tutorial.html
[08:01:06] <eren_basturk> I have already read then i applied for siggen
[08:01:22] <eren_basturk> but i couldn't use it for stepgen
[08:02:06] <eren_basturk> for instance, here is the stepgen test example which i work on
[08:02:08] <eren_basturk> http://erenbasturk.com/wp-content/uploads/myproject.hal_.txt
[08:02:34] <eren_basturk> it doesn't run
[08:05:13] <eren_basturk> here is the my siggen.hal file
[08:05:15] <eren_basturk> http://erenbasturk.com/wp-content/uploads/siggen.hal_.txt
[08:05:28] <eren_basturk> it works directly when i run with halrun
[08:06:36] <eren_basturk> but stepgen is slightly different than siggen
[08:10:08] <skunkworks__> this is on the beagle bone?
[08:11:36] <skunkworks__> must be.. I don't think you will have much luck with the software stepgen on the beagle bone. You would want to use the stepgen that is in the pru.
[08:12:22] <skunkworks__> you need 2 threads - fast and slow. the beagle bone can only really handle the servo thread (1khz) and then the fast stuff is in the pru
[08:13:30] <skunkworks__> unless 500hz is fast enough..
[08:18:34] <eren_basturk> yes
[08:19:08] <eren_basturk> do you have an experience on BBB pru?
[08:19:13] <skunkworks__> no :(
[08:20:04] <eren_basturk> as I see, you have an wide experience on linuxcnc
[08:20:18] <eren_basturk> and i would like to ask a question to you?
[08:20:34] <eren_basturk> i have one month experience on linuxcnc
[08:20:49] <eren_basturk> and i would like to build a 3 axis cnc machine
[08:21:21] <eren_basturk> do you think how can I complete this project?
[08:22:18] <eren_basturk> you can say estimated time :D
[08:40:49] <SpeedEvil> BBB PRU seems damn near custom-made for driving steppers and stuff
[09:12:47] <micges> SpeedEvil: probably encoder inputs also
[09:13:11] <SpeedEvil> Indeed.
[10:30:50] <narogon> hi
[10:33:49] <malcom2073> Hi
[11:04:30] <malcom2073> What does P64 tolerance actually mean for the A axis? With metric, P64 is a mm value, but the A is in degrees
[11:06:53] <archivist> excellent timing of your question :)
[11:07:35] <cradek> it is not carefully defined, and also I don't know what the reference implementation does
[11:08:28] <malcom2073> archivist: I'm in -devel as well, didn't want to interrupt there though :)
[11:09:44] <malcom2073> Mainly because I don't understand half of what's going on :P But it did remind me of that question heh
[11:13:58] <malcom2073> Forgive me for being an idiot here: when given a G1 command with multiple axis, it times things so all axis's reach their end point at the same time, right?
[11:14:45] <cradek> yes
[11:15:31] <cradek> that's what we call "coordinated" motion
[11:16:40] <archivist> malcom2073, that is how I cut helical gears
[11:16:42] <malcom2073> Ok, another assumption: if different axis have different maximum accelerations, it accelerates them in such a way so as to not go over the maximum of any of the axis, and still maintain the path?
[11:16:55] <cradek> yes
[11:17:22] <bedah> very interesting.. please go on :)
[11:17:37] <malcom2073> So if one axis's acceleration is abnormall high (the A axis), it likely won't be achieving that acceleration, because the others would not be able to keep up?
[11:17:53] <malcom2073> max acceleration*
[11:18:44] <cradek> that really depends on the move
[11:19:15] <cradek> g0a999 certainly will; g0x.01a999 probably will too
[11:19:49] <skunkworks> it will accelerate as fast as it can without violating any of the individual axis max acceleration settings
[11:19:54] <malcom2073> Ah ok, but large linear movements with small radial movements probably won't
[11:20:03] <malcom2073> Which makes sense
[11:20:07] <cradek> yes you have a good feel for it
[11:24:24] <malcom2073> Is it possible to have different P64 path tolerance values on different axis?
[11:25:25] <malcom2073> Since the A axis has a much higher acceleration in my case, it doesn't need as large of a path tolerance as say, the X and Y to maintain a decent feed rate.
[11:25:30] <malcom2073> if I'm understanding things right
[11:55:49] <deMimsy> Has anyone had an success implementing callback functions for the signal "focus-in-event" ?
[12:16:34] <IchGuckLive> hi all B)
[12:21:23] <IchGuckLive> malcom2073: you can change G64 Pxx as you like inaside your gcode keep in mind interpreter as above 2.5.x will read 3 lines ahead
[12:22:31] <malcom2073> IchGuckLive: right, but that applies to all axis's
[12:23:05] <IchGuckLive> yes as a calculation ahead to the point is made it needs more thn one axis
[12:23:54] <malcom2073> I want one axis to have less path tolerance than the others
[12:24:11] <IchGuckLive> you might change your strategie from xyz to a Rotation xyt
[12:24:22] <malcom2073> it's xyza atm
[12:25:53] <IchGuckLive> did you consider the interpreter v direct towards Rotation axis on Geometrie
[12:26:06] <malcom2073> I haven't a clue what that means :/
[12:26:35] <IchGuckLive> in the ini file you tell the interpreter the geometry prefert to use
[12:27:05] <IchGuckLive> if you stand a first it will display a better geometry and also effect the interpreters G64 behavier
[12:28:19] <IchGuckLive> so Axyz in the display geometrie section forces the on load interpreter to get a better internel movement
[12:28:35] <malcom2073> I should say,this is a 3d printer
[12:28:39] <malcom2073> where A, is the extruder
[12:28:52] <malcom2073> So A does not affect the workpiece's orientation
[12:29:18] <IchGuckLive> ok then forgot all i said
[12:30:02] <IchGuckLive> malcom2073: what comp for the extruder are you using
[12:30:10] <malcom2073> comp?
[12:30:41] <IchGuckLive> to get the filament moving it needs a gcode or did you interact on axis movement
[12:31:15] <IchGuckLive> 3D printer has been my today spezial
[12:31:20] <malcom2073> The gcode gives it a distance in millimeters, and my steps per revolution reflect that conversion
[12:31:54] <IchGuckLive> i got a chance to get a look inside the 3D print shop here with 115 3D printer runing in one rom incredible
[12:32:23] <malcom2073> cool
[12:32:53] <IchGuckLive> 10 printers me and my students where told are only to reproduce printers
[12:33:08] <malcom2073> Eww, I </3 reprap heh
[12:33:13] <malcom2073> not too fond of it
[12:33:20] <IchGuckLive> it has been quite hot inside
[12:33:23] <malcom2073> Hence why I'm using linuxcnc on mine
[12:34:10] <malcom2073> My system as a whole works, I'm trying to figure out why it's overextruding in the corners. Best guess I've been able to come across so far, is that the extruder acceleration isn't coming close to its maximum, because it's trying to keep in tolerance with the other axis.
[12:34:10] <IchGuckLive> the printers have been realy small about 4x4 inch table size
[12:34:33] <malcom2073> Slow extruder acceleration can lead to ove rand under extrusion when there are head velocity changes
[12:39:55] <pcw_home> you need the delay comp so the extruder can 'look-ahead"
[12:44:25] <malcom2073> pcw_home: What's that?
[12:46:25] <archivist> to remove the material travel time between extruder and place where it should be
[12:48:04] <SpeedEvil> If the extruder has a delay of 1s in speeding up and slowing down - then if you slow down the xy head and the extruder at the same moment, the head will continue to flow too much for a second
[12:48:28] <archivist> which reminds me of "in flight time" in a hops weighing machine I once maintained
[12:48:32] <SpeedEvil> You need to turn down the extruder 1s before the xy head slows
[12:50:33] <malcom2073> SpeedEvil: makes sense, also the extruder has pressure which wil continue to extrude for a moment even after you stop stepping it'd be good to have it lookahead like that, is that possible, or is that something that should be worked into the gcode?
[12:50:55] <SpeedEvil> Well - it depends.
[12:51:14] <SpeedEvil> you can put it in gcode if the device can't do it - or it can do it itself without gcode hacks
[12:51:40] <Connor> malcom2073: I know on steppers and reprap that they back drive the stepper to reduce the pressure.. to help eliminate fine threads across gaps and stuff..
[12:51:41] <malcom2073> Can linuxcnc do that?
[12:51:59] <malcom2073> Connor: This is on a change of acceleration though, no retracts possible
[12:52:07] <malcom2073> this isn't on a start/stop of extrusion
[12:52:18] <archivist> delay xy so the extruder has moved some material out before xy start moving
[12:52:18] <Connor> Ah. Sorry. Didn't read the whole conversation..
[12:53:28] <malcom2073> Mainly an issue when slowing down to go around a corner
[12:53:37] <malcom2073> I'm not 100% convinced that's the problem, but I'm running out of ideas :)
[12:54:05] <Connor> are you sure you have the acceleration correct on the extruder ?
[12:54:13] <malcom2073> Connor: I have it really high
[12:54:53] <Connor> You tried turning it off for the extruder ?
[12:55:07] <malcom2073> Connor: turning what off?
[12:55:15] <Connor> acceleration.
[12:55:19] <malcom2073> You can do that?
[12:55:26] <Connor> what value do you have?
[12:55:32] <malcom2073> 3000mm/second^2
[12:55:46] <Connor> in your ini file ?
[12:56:02] <malcom2073> Connor: I assume it's there, I used stepconf to make the ini file
[12:57:44] <archivist> you can also do correction on the fly, here is an example http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?LaserBeamCompensation
[13:02:14] <IchGuckLive> im off BYE
[13:10:16] <witnit> _methods 4500 parts before grind with my other machine
[13:10:57] <malcom2073> archivist: Thanks, I may look into that if I feel like diving into code :/ heh
[13:12:05] <_methods> man that's really good for just coated drills
[13:16:46] <Connor> _methods: ??
[13:17:04] <_methods> was talking to witnit
[13:17:10] <Connor> oh
[13:17:26] <_methods> he's been gettin cheap drills and getting them coated
[13:17:38] <_methods> and getting really good life out of them
[13:17:49] <Connor> Ah.
[13:17:52] <witnit> before i was getting 250 parts :P
[13:18:06] <witnit> its 5x deep too connor!
[13:18:13] <Connor> Damn. What kind of coating ?
[13:18:16] <_methods> 4500 holes is great
[13:18:17] <witnit> balzers
[13:18:19] <_methods> tialn
[13:18:56] <Connor> Who do you send them off to for coating ?
[13:18:59] <witnit> http://www.oerlikon.com/balzers/en/products-services/balinit-coatings/balinit-futura-top/
[13:19:25] <witnit> I belive the minimum order is 150, worth every penny
[13:19:29] <_methods> 4500 out of coated hss drill is pretty damn good i think
[13:19:37] <Connor> $150.00 ? or 150 units ?
[13:19:42] <witnit> $
[13:20:58] <Connor> My Dad had a .223 Gun barrel coated/treated one time.. Don't know what the coating was.. but, it increase the accuracy and kept the barrel a bit cooler... should last 10x longer too.
[13:20:59] <witnit> The coating was 28 per drill for me, I payed 25 for the drills each and they aare 41/64 diameter by about 5 inches of flute that gets coated
[13:21:10] <witnit> nice
[13:21:32] <jdh> mine is coated with chrome
[13:21:55] <jdh> (on the inside)
[13:22:14] <Connor> Yea.. it was something special they did in Oak Ridge or something...
[13:22:19] <Connor> been over 20 years ago probably.
[13:23:29] <jdh> hey, I worked in Oak Ridge 20 years ago.
[13:23:56] <jdh> damn, I must be old.
[13:24:23] <_methods> either that or you were a child sex slave there
[13:24:45] <jdh> I dont' talk about taht.
[13:24:49] <_methods> hehe
[13:31:57] <witnit>
[13:32:03] <witnit>
[13:33:48] <witnit> The material never did build up on the -landings- of the drill the edge broke down before the coating did. So, it seems the bootlenck is in the the drill quality now and not the coating.
[13:33:54] <witnit> bottleneck*
[13:36:35] <witnit> also the drill is getting oil from behind instead of coolant thru.
[14:15:25] <DaViruz> soo, what's the verdict on the 600x400 chinese cnc routers?
[14:15:39] <DaViruz> or are there any alternatives?
[14:15:42] <DaViruz> i want a nice one
[14:32:53] <jthornton> didn't know they were up for a vote
[14:33:50] * jdh votes Maybe.
[14:34:10] * jthornton votes probably not
[14:34:11] <jdh> the carving-cnc one has a better rep. .de-d00d has a random ebay one and likes it.
[14:34:40] <jdh> I actually sold a bunch of crap, got my $2000 (including shipping) and was going to buy one but I jsut can't bring myself to spend that much cash on a chinese router.
[14:34:59] <jdh> so I'm going to blow the $ on a new bike
[14:35:13] <jthornton> powered or pedal?
[14:35:17] <jdh> pedal
[14:35:28] <jthornton> must be a nice one then
[14:36:13] <jdh> well, it's expensive anyway
[14:36:18] <jdh> Specialized Roubaix
[14:37:20] <jthornton> my buddy has a Specialized mountain bike
[14:37:37] <jthornton> I just have a cheap Giant mountain bike
[14:38:32] <jdh> I have a cheap hybrid. I really have 11 more lbs to go before I buy it.
[14:38:48] <jthornton> I know that feeling
[14:42:20] <jdh> I still want the router, but that's a lot of money for chinese metal
[14:42:55] <jdh> guess I'm buying chinese carbon this way.
[14:46:28] <skunkworks__> we have giant bikes.. (pretty decent for the price)
[14:46:45] <jdh> yeah, the Defy was a contender
[14:46:51] <jthornton> yea, I like mine
[14:47:52] <jthornton> I kept breaking the spokes on the rear wheel of my 24" one... heres your sign
[14:49:00] <witnit> Dont buy a china machine.
[14:49:04] <witnit> imo
[14:49:52] <jdh> do you have an alternative?
[14:49:58] <jdh> taht isn't "build your own from scratch"
[14:50:55] <witnit> I heard alot of talk of these machines and not once did I ever hear the words reliable, accurate, true or ridgid.
[14:51:20] <jdh> "enough"
[14:51:38] <jdh> I would plan on replacing the wiring and electronics
[14:51:57] <SpeedEvil> It does depend.
[14:52:14] <witnit> I dont know of any prebuilt systems that are affordable and of quality jdhg
[14:52:19] <SpeedEvil> If you're engraving - you've got a whole different spec to if you want to run a 5" endmill through HSS
[14:52:25] <jdh> right, so why not get teh chinese one
[14:52:36] <jdh> it's there, amazingly cheap for the parts.
[14:53:09] <jdh> I asked for a pic of the ballscrew bearing mounts a few days ago... they just said "sorry, we don't have any. I'm a sales person not an engineer"
[14:53:52] <SpeedEvil> That's the problem.
[14:54:07] <SpeedEvil> If you actually need to know that, you need to speak chinese.
[14:54:19] <SpeedEvil> And be in china, and likely be willing to actually walk into the factory
[14:55:02] <jdh> well, it costs $1500. I coudn't buy the parts for that.
[14:55:19] <jdh> I just wanted to see if it had actual metal bearing blocks.
[14:55:25] <Loetmichel> witnit: reliable: depends. had some shaft coupler break, that was all. true: after adjusting it a bit: perfect. rigid: not so much, but sufficient for milling aluminium with small carbide bits up to 1/2" so i cant complain. got a 4 axis CNC router for less than 2000 eur including shipping. and it works at the company for more than a year now without any complaints (besides the broken couplers)
[14:55:54] <Loetmichel> so _I_ am satisfied with what i got for the buck
[14:56:31] <SpeedEvil> It really depends if you are expecting flawless, or a preassembled kit
[14:56:56] <witnit> Good :)
[14:56:57] <Loetmichel> tha latter fits the machines better ;-)
[14:57:49] <Loetmichel> the only thing tant bbugs me is the free flying ball rails on the gantry
[14:58:30] <Loetmichel> there it would have been great to invest the extra 50 eur for SBRs
[14:58:43] <Loetmichel> to gain MASSIVE in rigidity
[14:58:53] <Loetmichel> but thats chi9nese construction
[14:59:23] <jdh> they are unsupported?
[14:59:47] <SpeedEvil> jdh: they have 4 rubber feet
[15:00:15] <Loetmichel> otherwise: ballscrews on all axes, no backlash at all anywhere (exept the circular axis, which has about 0,5° play in the worm drive)
[15:00:28] <Loetmichel> jdh: in the gantry: yes
[15:00:40] <Loetmichel> the lon axis is SBR
[15:00:56] <Loetmichel> +g
[15:01:00] <jdh> and they are mounted 'outboard'? not up/down?
[15:01:42] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=14682
[15:02:04] <Loetmichel> the long (x) axis ist mae with sbr
[15:02:11] <jdh> oh, that's better than what I was thinking
[15:02:29] <Loetmichel> the y axis is made with rounf bars, screwed between the gantry sideplates
[15:02:52] <Loetmichel> you can see the two black allen screws on the right
[15:03:02] <jdh> could you retrofit with SBR?
[15:03:09] <jdh> is there somethign to mount to on the back?
[15:03:38] <Loetmichel> no, only a Z-shaped 3mm extrusion ;-)
[15:03:42] <jdh> damnit, now I want to buy one again.
[15:03:54] <DaViruz> i'm really just looking touse it as a router, not a milling machine
[15:04:00] <DaViruz> i have a 4000kg VMC for that
[15:04:04] <jdh> me too. Almost all plastics
[15:04:08] <Loetmichel> DaViruz: it CAN mill aluminium, though
[15:04:20] <DaViruz> plywood and G10 mostly
[15:04:38] <jdh> you added the limits?
[15:04:43] <DaViruz> i would like to get one without electronics
[15:04:46] <jdh> is that a dust-shoe frame?
[15:04:53] <Loetmichel> DaViruz: caution, second part is LOUD-> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9u_ChO1AKYY
[15:04:58] <jdh> DaVirus: carving-cnc sells a frame-only (with steppers) version
[15:05:02] <Loetmichel> jdh: what?
[15:05:13] <Loetmichel> on the spindle?
[15:05:18] <jdh> yeah
[15:05:30] <Loetmichel> no, that is tha second holder for the vaccum hose when the duist shoe is mounted
[15:05:52] <Loetmichel> look at the video i just pasted, secon half is that dust shoe in action ;-)
[15:06:01] <jdh> can't really do vid here
[15:06:18] <DaViruz> Loetmichel: i didn't know you guys hade one of those, i was expecting some fancy machine based on the parts i've seen :)
[15:06:59] <jdh> what is the wood on teh sides?
[15:06:59] <Loetmichel> hrhr
[15:07:07] <Loetmichel> wood?
[15:07:27] <jdh> that's not wood in the picture?
[15:07:27] <Loetmichel> ah, the MDF
[15:07:52] <Loetmichel> look at the back: that were rails to put in some perpex as a swarf shield
[15:08:02] <witnit> Loetmichel the reason I cant justify buying a chinese cnc router is because of deals out there like this, www.ebay.com/itm/271448821780 Imagine a machine one third this size, one third its price. The deals are out there. Just need to be a little patient in the search.
[15:08:15] <DaViruz> Loetmichel: what size is that machine? the 600x400 one?
[15:08:34] <jdh> I'd have to buy a new place to put in that thing
[15:08:42] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=14766 <- there the back and the right one are installed
[15:08:46] <DaViruz> i live in sweden, there are no such deals here.. :)
[15:08:48] <Loetmichel> yes, 6040
[15:09:10] <Loetmichel> but in reality the travel is more loke 570 by 397 ;-)
[15:09:18] <DaViruz> well not true actually, i got the vmc for something like $500
[15:09:20] <jdh> we don't get deals on moose jerky here.
[15:09:56] <DaViruz> Loetmichel: that's fine though, i could probably make do with something like A4 size
[15:10:15] <jdh> the smaller 3040/3020 seem to be much lesser quality
[15:10:19] <Loetmichel> DaViruz: let me tell you: you cant
[15:10:27] <Loetmichel> jdh: MUCH lesser quality
[15:10:51] <DaViruz> yeah, that's minly why i'm looking to the 6040
[15:11:16] <Loetmichel> ah, btw: to put thins right: the cheap watercooled spindle starts to make a strange "chirping" sound sometimes in the last weeks
[15:11:30] <DaViruz> Loetmichel: the small machine i have today does like 120x350, and i make do.. :)
[15:11:33] <Loetmichel> but that is after more than a year daily use.
[15:11:47] <Loetmichel> DaViruz: i build a big one for my ex boss
[15:12:10] <Loetmichel> 1500mm*1020mm*160mm travel.... and it was STILL to slamm sometimes ;-)
[15:12:13] <Loetmichel> small
[15:12:27] <DaViruz> i'd like a plasma table of that size
[15:12:47] <Loetmichel> DaViruz: would be not goot, made tha machine out of "wood"
[15:12:49] <Loetmichel> ;-)
[15:13:00] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=4935
[15:13:20] <DaViruz> i think you could probably make it work as lon as it isn't a solid wood bed.. :)
[15:13:48] <Loetmichel> 300kg of marine grade 21mm plywood and more than one 1000pack of spax 5mm*50mm ;-)
[15:14:30] <Loetmichel> DaViruz: inside of the bed with the bottom plate removed : http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=4053
[15:14:40] <DaViruz> with clever construction 300kg of marine plywood is boud to be pretty sturdy
[15:14:52] <SpeedEvil> I've been wondering about that
[15:15:02] <SpeedEvil> But full sheet
[15:15:17] <DaViruz> Loetmichel: that looks pretty darn sturdy
[15:15:19] <SpeedEvil> yeah - geometry is way more important than material in many ways
[15:15:35] <DaViruz> you could cast concrete in it possibly :)
[15:15:39] <Loetmichel> that WAS pretty darn sturdy ;-)
[15:15:44] <DaViruz> non shrinking concrete if you want it to remain straight
[15:15:44] <SpeedEvil> That ^3 term in beam stiffness helps lots
[15:16:29] <Loetmichel> the only error i made was the side walls of the gantry
[15:16:42] <witnit> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Gerber-Dimension-200-CNC-Router-Engraver-Sign-Maker-/360928455179?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item5409032a0b too expensive and too small?
[15:16:54] <SpeedEvil> What was the cutting capacity?
[15:16:57] <Loetmichel> and that was corrected on the even bigger version i helped making for MarkusBec ;-)
[15:17:10] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=11205
[15:17:17] <DaViruz> Loetmichel: so what would it cost me to hire you to build me one?
[15:17:19] <DaViruz> :)
[15:17:24] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=11175
[15:17:32] <Loetmichel> i am to expensive
[15:17:47] <Loetmichel> especially when travelling across europe to get to you ;.-)
[15:17:51] <SpeedEvil> Purplz.
[15:18:36] <DaViruz> i'll come pick it up, i've always wanted to visit germany anyway :)
[15:18:57] <Loetmichel> SpeedEvil: in 2 sheets 3mm thick FR4 i moved a 2mm diamnod toothed diamond dust clad bit with F2400
[15:19:12] <Loetmichel> so 6mm deep cut
[15:19:14] <DaViruz> those boxed gantry sides look nice
[15:19:24] <DaViruz> most routers i've seen have such wimpy gantry sides
[15:19:32] <SpeedEvil> Box girders are really stiff - done right
[15:19:42] <SpeedEvil> As is that central box
[15:20:18] <SpeedEvil> Twice as thick (in linear dimension as an aluminium section - and you're approaching the same stiffness
[15:20:20] <Loetmichel> the gantry and the gantry sides had a \/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/ inside before closing it
[15:20:44] <SpeedEvil> yeah - you need to understand the bending moments
[15:20:54] <DaViruz> like wellpapp
[15:21:09] <Loetmichel> but sideways
[15:21:37] <DaViruz> oh, obviously
[15:22:22] <DaViruz> either way, i think ive decided on a 6040
[15:23:10] <Loetmichel> nice thing of this construction is seen here: (notice that tere is NO lagging of the free gantry side at all!) -> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=11178
[15:23:14] <Loetmichel> (avi video)
[15:23:55] * SpeedEvil sighs.
[15:24:28] <SpeedEvil> I would here link to a nice program outlining the construction of a 'proper' house using little more than a full-sheet CNC router and a hammer.
[15:24:35] <SpeedEvil> But the video has been pulled.
[15:25:00] <SpeedEvil> Basically make 8'*1'*4' boxes, which clip together.
[15:25:48] <Loetmichel> SpeedEvil: uploaded it to youtube, just for you : http://youtu.be/KgOD4uny5wg
[15:25:49] <Loetmichel> ;-)
[15:26:15] <Loetmichel> better?
[15:26:45] <Jymmm> YAY DAD!!! http://www.guppylake.com/nsb/headjob.html
[15:26:48] <Jymmm> and the pic... PRICELESS
[15:27:43] <cradek> ok, I know what a nose job is...
[15:28:16] <DaViruz> i remember when my 400MHz celeron did youtube just fine, now my core2duo 7500 can't seem to manage
[15:29:05] <Loetmichel> DaViruz: i just installed xubuntu 12.04 on an old IBM X21
[15:29:23] <Loetmichel> (700mhz P3, 384MB ram) ... try youtube there.
[15:29:26] <Loetmichel> i did.
[15:29:34] <Loetmichel> gruesome ;-)
[15:29:58] <DaViruz> this is an x61 actually
[15:30:29] <SpeedEvil> http://vimeo.com/20103388 - CNC routed house
[15:30:33] <SpeedEvil> DaViruz: Sigh
[15:30:33] <Jymmm> Loetmichel: Impress me, install RH 4 on a X240 =)
[15:30:41] * SpeedEvil wishes there were later 4:3 thinkpasds
[15:31:09] <SpeedEvil> @1:10
[15:31:27] <Loetmichel> SpeedEvil: i have a T61p and a x60s
[15:31:37] <SpeedEvil> Loetmichel: So do I
[15:31:45] <Loetmichel> after that, lenovo made a seep decline in my opinion
[15:31:51] <Loetmichel> steep
[15:32:27] <DaViruz> with super-glossy widescreen monitors
[15:32:31] <SpeedEvil> :/
[15:33:39] <SpeedEvil> Loetmichel: that is damn near a clone of what i was thinking of making - though I hadn't seen any similar machine
[15:33:42] <cradek> I don't understand the glossy
[15:34:00] <SpeedEvil> They are higher contrast if you can set them up right
[15:34:17] <cradek> but who cares if you can only see your own face
[15:34:25] <SpeedEvil> Indeed
[15:34:37] <SpeedEvil> Stupid hack for tablets.
[15:34:48] <SpeedEvil> Wear a black t-shirt, tilt it so that that reflects.
[15:35:22] <cradek> I only sort-of understand tablets
[15:35:46] <SpeedEvil> They are great for consumption.
[15:37:00] <Loetmichel> 7" tablets are great as "tacke it with me everywhere" conputers
[15:37:12] <Loetmichel> because they fit the jackets inner pocket
[15:37:14] <cradek> my phone is that, and it goes in my pocket
[15:37:24] <Loetmichel> but the bigger ones are a bit less useful
[15:37:26] <cradek> it has internet all the time
[15:37:29] <Loetmichel> i have my share of them...
[15:37:33] <_methods> it's my shitter computer
[15:37:45] <_methods> my poop top lol
[15:37:46] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=13406
[15:38:19] <cradek> there's probably a size of rectangle you don't have yet
[15:38:21] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=14274 <- aaand this one
[15:38:26] <_methods> i use my old nexus7 as a remote control for my htpc stuff and streaming to my chromcast too
[15:38:33] <DaViruz> many of my friends prefer phones and tablets for everyday web browsing to computers
[15:38:43] <DaViruz> personally i can't stand phone browsers
[15:38:51] <DaViruz> but i guess i'm old and grumpy
[15:39:05] <Loetmichel> ... aaand this one: http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=14418
[15:39:06] <Loetmichel> ;-)
[15:39:34] <SpeedEvil> I question the use of a 10" tablet - but 7" is a nice spot
[15:39:46] <SpeedEvil> I would really like a decent 4:3 12" notebook
[15:39:49] <Loetmichel> DaViruz: of course i have a samsung note on my belt
[15:39:50] <SpeedEvil> - x60s
[15:39:50] <_methods> my 10" one is my book basically
[15:39:56] <_methods> i keep it on the night stand
[15:40:14] <SpeedEvil> I find reading on 7" quite enough - 10" would just be harder to hold
[15:40:24] <SpeedEvil> - unless it's got complex diagrams - then it's limited
[15:40:25] <Loetmichel> SpeedEvil: ask my wife
[15:40:27] <_methods> well i used to use the 7" for the book
[15:40:31] <Loetmichel> on my nightstand is the acer
[15:40:34] <_methods> but replaced with 10
[15:40:38] <Loetmichel> on hers is a chinese 10"
[15:40:45] <_methods> i'm diggin the extra room
[15:40:59] <Loetmichel> ... which is why she has a problem with her wrists at the moment
[15:41:00] <SpeedEvil> Android is depressingly limiting
[15:41:13] <DaViruz> so your wife prefers 10" to 7"? frankly that's a bit too much information
[15:41:16] <_methods> never heard that complaint lol
[15:41:42] <SpeedEvil> Well - Loetmichel was just bragging on his 48" tool.
[15:42:00] <DaViruz> (i hope i didn't cross a line) :)
[15:42:04] <Loetmichel> (too much mahjong in bed)=
[15:43:06] <Loetmichel> DaViruz: 10"? can you even see that? ;-)
[15:43:51] <DaViruz> sure, unless the belly is in the way :)
[15:44:15] <Loetmichel> DaViruz: YOU are old and grumpy? what i am supposed to say then??
[15:44:34] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=14295 <- thats me at the company ;-)
[15:45:13] <DaViruz> just imagine how grumpy i will be when i get old for real
[15:47:04] <DaViruz> about 1600 eur shipped for a 6040 from the uk
[15:47:10] <DaViruz> that's cheaper than i thought
[15:49:18] <DaViruz> Loetmichel: does the central X drive work well? no binding and such when working at the ends of Y travel and such?
[15:49:37] <DaViruz> maybe i just mixed up X/Y
[15:49:39] <Loetmichel> no binding, no bending as far as i can tell
[15:50:04] <Loetmichel> x and y depemds on the way you mount it in front of you ;-)
[15:50:25] <DaViruz> i tend to call the long axis x, but it seems they call it y
[15:50:45] <DaViruz> probably some router convention
[15:50:51] <Loetmichel> DaViruz: depends on where you sit ;-)
[15:51:00] <Loetmichel> if you sit on the sort side long is y
[15:51:18] <Loetmichel> if you sit on the long side like me, long is x ;-)
[15:53:16] <DaViruz> i'm gonna need a larger hobby room
[15:56:27] <Deejay> gn8
[15:56:36] <Loetmichel> DaViruz: tell me about it
[15:57:02] <SpeedEvil> DaViruz: See my vimeo link - get your CNC router up and running, and buy a stack of ply
[15:57:21] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=9033&g2_imageViewsIndex=2 <- thats a 360 of my (messy) hobby room ;-)
[15:57:55] <Loetmichel> SpeedEvil: we are not in southern califonia. over here there is something called "weather"
[15:58:19] <Loetmichel> that probits 1:1 plywood kits of houses to be build
[15:58:24] <SpeedEvil> WBP is good for a surprising amount of weather, just painted
[15:58:25] <Loetmichel> +hi
[15:58:29] <DaViruz> yeah i don't think i'd trust that to swedish climate :)
[15:58:37] <SpeedEvil> Though you can clad it of course
[15:59:00] <Loetmichel> in "good old europe" houses tend to be mace from concrete and bricks ;-)
[15:59:05] <Loetmichel> ... for a reason ;-)
[15:59:12] <SpeedEvil> History.
[15:59:13] <Loetmichel> made
[15:59:50] <SpeedEvil> Well - Beeeg CNC concrete mixer and printer :)
[16:00:20] <SpeedEvil> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-yv-IWdSdns
[16:00:46] <Loetmichel> and if they are made from wood ( i was born in the "bergisch land" area of germany, so i know a LOT of half-timber houses) they are made of massive beams instead of plywood ;-)
[16:01:44] <SpeedEvil> I'm more thinking of passivehaus type designs, rather than traditional
[16:01:57] <DaViruz> Loetmichel: true, i don't really need a larger hobby room, i need a better sense of orderlyness
[16:02:02] <DaViruz> mine is strikingly similar
[16:02:28] <DaViruz> i need to learn to throw stuff away as well
[16:02:51] <DaViruz> "i just know i will find a use for this box of 20 ISA network cards one day!"
[16:03:17] <SpeedEvil> DaViruz: 10base2?
[16:04:01] <SpeedEvil> they usually have isolated 5V-9V converters, which can be useful
[16:04:07] <DaViruz> most of them are 10base-t, 10base2 and aui combos
[16:04:41] <DaViruz> (3x509 i believe)
[16:04:44] <DaViruz> 3c
[16:04:53] <DaViruz> SpeedEvil: oh.
[16:04:59] <Loetmichel> DaViruz: i think my box holds about 15 of these ;-)
[16:05:11] <Connor> I love 3com Ethernet Cards.. they rocked
[16:05:17] <Loetmichel> abd about 2 dzn 100mbit pci ;-)
[16:05:58] <DaViruz> i have a 200mbps internet connectino and a 100mbps nic
[16:06:02] <DaViruz> that's a bit silly
[16:06:17] <Connor> 200Mbps Intenet Connection? WTF ?
[16:06:38] <SpeedEvil> My internet could easily fit down one of those ISA NICs :/
[16:06:48] <DaViruz> the house next door has 1000mbps
[16:06:54] <DaViruz> (per apertment)
[16:06:57] <Connor> Where do you live ?
[16:07:02] <DaViruz> sweden
[16:07:07] <Connor> AHH.
[16:09:54] <Loetmichel> DaViruz; geniue envy over here ;-)
[16:11:10] <DaViruz> i don't really care much, as long as it's flatrate i'm fine
[16:11:12] <_methods> yah i thought i was doing good with 50
[16:11:59] <Connor> Unlimited is going the way of the doodoo in the US.. Damn greedy a$$ sons of b!tche$
[16:12:57] <DaViruz> the latest craze here is internet through the crappy celluar network
[16:13:17] <DaViruz> all the providers advertise it like crazy, even though they can't handle the traffic and it doesn't work
[16:13:48] <DaViruz> hell you can't even get a phone call through half of the time
[16:14:19] <DaViruz> probably works better in the larger cities though, live in a really small town
[16:14:45] <Connor> your internet via Fibre, Cable, or DSL ?
[16:14:59] <DaViruz> cable
[16:15:13] <Connor> what's the upload speed?
[16:15:21] <DaViruz> 20mbps i think
[16:15:53] <DaViruz> we could get fibre, but the average age in this apertment building is probably something like 70, and we need a majority
[16:16:15] <Connor> Mine is 35mb down/ 6mb up
[16:16:33] <Connor> and I have a backup DSL link which is 1.5mb / 384k
[16:16:43] <Loetmichel> wah
[16:16:52] <DaViruz> i was on 24/8 until about a year ago
[16:17:10] <DaViruz> i didn't realize i could upgrade, and even after i did i didn't really bother for a few months
[16:17:14] <Loetmichel> i am in the middle of germany, in 10km distance to frankfurt am main... and all i get is 16M down/1m up :-(
[16:17:51] <Connor> I remember the days of ISDN.. 64k and 128k .. Wohoo!
[16:18:03] <DaViruz> a friend of mine had isdn
[16:18:06] <DaViruz> i was sooo envious
[16:18:25] <Loetmichel> i still have
[16:18:30] <DaViruz> dual phone lines so he could use internet without locking up the phone
[16:18:41] <Loetmichel> because of two "real" telephone lines
[16:18:52] <Connor> I was Senior Sys Admin for a local ISP.. I remember when we upgraded from ISDN (providing dialup for like 4 or 5 modems) to a T1..
[16:19:02] <Loetmichel> because my wife works from home on the telephone
[16:19:32] <Connor> and then later on went to 2 then 3 T1's then finally a T3.
[16:20:26] <DaViruz> i worked a little for a local isp tat set up wireless network links
[16:20:34] <DaViruz> to households
[16:21:08] <DaViruz> when the 802.11 specification was still just a draft, and we pretty much had prototype equipment
[16:21:21] <Connor> Yup.. I did it all except for Cable... I did.. Analog, ISDN, T1, T3, Wireless..
[16:21:42] <Connor> Fractional T1's, PRI's...
[16:21:46] <DaViruz> but at least it got me out of the 56k dark ages.. :)
[16:21:50] <Loetmichel> hrhr
[16:21:52] <Connor> DSL, ATM..
[16:22:02] <DaViruz> until DSL started to appear
[16:22:04] <Loetmichel> userfriendly.org comes to mind, DaViruz
[16:28:13] <DaViruz> the nostalgia
[16:29:15] <Connor> Yup.
[16:33:54] <DaViruz> This item already be equiped NEW 1605 ball screws. Anti-blackflash,
[16:34:02] <DaViruz> wow, anti-backflash, i got to have one!
[16:39:41] <Loetmichel> hrhr
[16:39:49] <Loetmichel> but the ballscrews are good
[16:41:22] <zmi> hello, i could install linuxcnc i can see the program now i have other problem i think ubuntu no working well the video i mean screem no good resolution and i cant connecty to internet no wifi no nothing
[16:57:43] <zmi> caphindsight i could installed but no working well i have other problems
[17:09:23] <zeeshan> DaViruz: they are bad ass :D
[17:11:52] <zmi> install ubuntu 12.04 linuxcnc3-i386, seems to have no network drivers, the screen does not look good, I did this,
[17:11:52] <zmi> sudo ipconfig-a
[17:11:52] <zmi> sudo ipcongif pan0 up
[17:11:52] <zmi> also this other pppoeconf sudo command does not work either. any solution?
[17:20:50] <zeeshan> bah
[17:20:59] <zeeshan> gotta learn a completely new software for acaedmic research
[17:21:00] <zeeshan> abaqus
[17:21:12] <zeeshan> looks nicer than ansys, but damn it, gotta relearn :{
[17:21:18] <zeeshan> grrr
[17:21:38] <_methods> that's good
[17:21:51] <zeeshan> nahh man
[17:21:55] <zeeshan> means ill be useless for a month
[17:22:08] <_methods> took me a long time to figure out that all cad/cam programs do the same thing
[17:22:16] <_methods> they all draw circles, points, and lines
[17:22:21] <zeeshan> thats true for cad cam
[17:22:24] <zeeshan> not finite element analysis
[17:22:33] <_methods> they all do the same thing too
[17:22:39] <zeeshan> no
[17:22:55] <zeeshan> abaqus has some advanced algorithms from non-linear problems
[17:22:58] <zeeshan> and visco-elastic modelling
[17:23:14] <zeeshan> that i can complement with experimental data
[17:23:25] <zeeshan> and write a subroutine in python to interact w/
[17:24:14] <zeeshan> the best way i can compare the two is like this
[17:24:17] <zeeshan> Matlab vs excel
[17:24:23] <zeeshan> both can do the same stuff
[17:24:30] <zeeshan> but matlab can do it better and get more advanced!
[17:26:02] <_methods> autocad vs catia
[17:26:14] <_methods> circles, lines, points
[17:26:23] <zeeshan> youre comparing 2d w/ 3d!
[17:26:24] <zeeshan> :P
[17:26:34] <_methods> all boils down the same
[17:26:45] <_methods> all your fea programs do is add and subtract
[17:26:54] <zeeshan> wut
[17:27:09] <_methods> lol you kids
[17:27:35] <_methods> one day you'll look back at this and go oh shit he was right
[17:28:06] <zeeshan> i've used solidworks, inventor, siemens nx
[17:28:15] <zeeshan> and i can tell you confidentally, they're not equally the same
[17:29:00] <_methods> haha
[17:29:01] <zeeshan> solidworks and ansys communicate parametrically
[17:29:05] <zeeshan> whereas inventor and ansys cant
[17:29:19] <zeeshan> so i can change a bolt size parametrically
[17:29:30] <zeeshan> it'll regenerate the model in solidworks, update ansys
[17:29:31] <_methods> you're getting wrapped around the axle man
[17:29:43] <zeeshan> and bam rerun the analysis in one click!
[17:29:52] <DaViruz> i do all my cad with bara equations with pen and paper
[17:29:56] <DaViruz> it's all just math anyway
[17:30:08] <_methods> ^^
[17:30:08] <zeeshan> DaViruz: you should get fired if you work at a company!
[17:30:09] <zeeshan> :P
[17:30:27] <_methods> addin and subtractin
[17:30:30] <DaViruz> i do, but they can't fire me
[17:30:35] <DaViruz> i'm the only onie who does cad
[17:31:09] <zeeshan> _methods lets see some of your work
[17:31:13] <zeeshan> mr. + and -
[17:31:24] <DaViruz> you should see when i do CAM
[17:31:25] <zeeshan> thats your new nickname :P
[17:31:27] <_methods> what work
[17:31:34] <zeeshan> fea work
[17:31:40] <_methods> i don't do fea
[17:31:41] <zeeshan> or cad
[17:32:06] <zeeshan> then how can you make comment about how similar the software is?
[17:32:17] <zeeshan> that its like adding and subtracting
[17:32:20] <DaViruz> welcome the the internet, where anyhing is possible
[17:32:23] <_methods> because it is
[17:32:24] <zeeshan> that's just a belittling comment
[17:32:59] <_methods> it's not belittling
[17:33:08] <_methods> don't over think it man
[17:33:10] <zeeshan> it is especially when you don't have any background in it
[17:33:16] <_methods> you'll be happy you learned new software
[17:33:21] <_methods> or you
[17:33:40] <ds3> isn't inventor NURBs based?
[17:33:40] <_methods> where do you work?
[17:34:09] <zeeshan> as of today
[17:34:14] <_methods> yeah
[17:34:27] <zeeshan> mcmaster innovation park
[17:34:32] <zeeshan> specifically mcmaster automotive resource center
[17:34:35] <_methods> whatever i really don't care i'm not gonna get in a pissin match
[17:34:42] <ds3> that would along make inventor not compareable to solidworks
[17:35:08] <zeeshan> ds3 i think youre thinking of autodesk alias
[17:35:14] <DaViruz> this discussion seems NERD based
[17:35:23] <_methods> ^^
[17:35:47] <ds3> zeeeshan: is alias what they used to call 123D?
[17:36:03] <ds3> I do get the autodesk stuff mixed up though
[17:36:04] <zeeshan> wassat
[17:38:45] <zeeshan> inventor, solidworks and most of the main stream modelling use 'brep'
[17:38:49] <zeeshan> 'boundary representation'
[17:39:01] <zeeshan> limit based approach
[17:39:14] <zeeshan> nurbs modelling is wayyyy more advanced :P
[17:39:34] <zeeshan> all based on basis functions
[17:39:42] <zeeshan> i remember having to do it by hand, it sucked
[17:40:17] <zeeshan> actually now that i think about it
[17:40:30] <zeeshan> i bet inventor, solidworks and the big boys use some propiertary stuff
[17:40:34] <zeeshan> that we'll never know about :P
[17:42:04] <CaptHindsight> is there any other CAD software other than NX? :)
[17:42:34] <_methods> people still use nx
[17:42:42] <_methods> lol
[17:42:50] <ds3> http://www.123dapp.com/
[17:42:56] <ds3> that's the free offering from autodesk
[17:43:02] <ds3> AFAIK, it is NURBs
[17:43:34] <zeeshan> wow
[17:43:36] <zeeshan> they make a free software!
[17:43:37] <zeeshan> nice
[17:43:56] <ds3> Caveat - I was never able to get it to work on any system of mine
[17:44:07] <zeeshan> oh god
[17:44:10] <zeeshan> it looks so similar to alias
[17:44:11] <zeeshan> please kill me
[17:44:30] <ds3> tried it on an intel graphics card, nVidia graphics card, and that bastard graphics card from imagination
[17:44:31] <zeeshan> definitely looks nurbs based
[17:44:36] <zeeshan> i can tell by the way the curves look
[17:44:49] <ds3> heh
[17:44:50] <zeeshan> you can tell the surfaces are generated by b-rails
[17:45:00] <CaptHindsight> everything I come across is either NX or Catia, oh and the industrial designers still prefer Creo/ProE
[17:45:02] <ds3> if I wanted nurbs, I'd go with rhino
[17:45:31] <_methods> haha i didn't even know they changed their name to creo
[17:45:32] <zeeshan> i had to draw a car body using alias
[17:45:37] <zeeshan> nurbs modeling SUX!
[17:45:44] <zeeshan> ill never do it!!
[17:45:52] <_methods> i kept sayin proe to some guy and he was like wtf are you talkin about
[17:46:18] <ds3> but nurbs models are more 'organic'
[17:46:18] <CaptHindsight> http://www.ptc.com/product/creo/
[17:46:19] <ds3> :D
[17:46:24] <zeeshan> yea man
[17:46:29] <zeeshan> you can make some amazing stuff in it
[17:46:34] <zeeshan> but it takes an artist
[17:46:39] <zeeshan> im no artist
[17:46:43] <zeeshan> =D
[17:46:58] <ds3> what is that stuff that animators use? blender is suppose to based off that
[17:47:05] <DaViruz> i got a solid model once to manufacture
[17:47:06] <ds3> is that nurbs?
[17:47:10] <DaViruz> from a guy who is an amazing 3d artist
[17:47:12] <zeeshan> no idea
[17:47:47] <DaViruz> but his methods didn't really lend themselves to exactly defining the shape of something
[17:48:16] <DaViruz> (he does tv stuff normally)
[17:49:38] <ds3> hmmm so it wasn't me... it was irritating trying to draw stuff in rhino
[17:55:04] <zeeshan> MSI GT70 2OL
[17:55:06] <zeeshan> wtf
[17:55:08] <zeeshan> cad laptop $5499
[17:55:09] <zeeshan> haha
[17:55:28] <zeeshan> thats a bit out of my budget. :{
[17:59:00] <zeeshan> for that much money, im gonna grab my computer mid-tower case around
[17:59:00] <zeeshan> !
[18:18:38] <CaptHindsight> zeeshan: I think that they mean a laptop designed with CAD. Otherwise it would be silly to say that the laptop is specifically designed to run CAD applications.
[18:18:53] <zeeshan> well
[18:19:01] <zeeshan> that video card is priorpietry cad card
[18:19:28] <CaptHindsight> NVIDIA® Quadro® K4100M
[18:21:05] <CaptHindsight> for the right price I'll be happy to integrate any of the FirePro cards into your laptop
[18:21:13] <CaptHindsight> http://www.amd.com/en-us/products/graphics/workstation
[18:24:09] <CaptHindsight> http://www.nvidia.com/object/mobile-workstation-gpus.html I see that they use these MXM GPU cards
[18:24:55] <jp_mill> what gives better higher speed torque bipolar series or parallel?
[18:25:59] <CaptHindsight> parallel if they wound it properly
[18:27:32] <CaptHindsight> sorry I was backwards
[18:27:40] <CaptHindsight> http://www.designworldonline.com/improving-high-speed-performance-of-hybrid-stepper-motors/
[18:28:02] <CaptHindsight> more voltage, not current, increases the torque above the critical step rate.
[18:29:10] <CaptHindsight> but at higher speeds parallel
[18:30:01] <CaptHindsight> http://www.designworldonline.com/uploads/ImageGallery/apr-mc-9a.jpg
[18:30:28] <CaptHindsight> http://www.designworldonline.com/uploads/ImageGallery/apr-mc-8a.jpg
[18:30:47] <CaptHindsight> http://www.designworldonline.com/uploads/ImageGallery/apr-mc-7a.jpg
[18:31:43] <jp_mill> thanks
[18:32:08] <CaptHindsight> zeeshan: they sure mark that laptop up after adding that GPU module
[18:32:28] <zeeshan> yea =/
[18:32:44] <zeeshan> CaptHindsight: build me a laptop with firepro + i7
[18:32:45] <zeeshan> 1000$
[18:32:46] <zeeshan> !
[18:33:34] <CaptHindsight> zeeshan: whats the rule of thumb for fuel injector lbs or Kg/hr vs HP?
[18:33:55] <zeeshan> 1lbs/hr = 10hp
[18:39:45] <PetefromTn_> Ever have one of those days....??
[18:41:02] <PetefromTn_> Ya know one of those days where you think you would rather cut off both of your arms then go back to work again at your workplace...LOL
[18:41:39] <PetefromTn_> well....today was one of those days for me.
[18:41:43] <zeeshan> =/
[18:41:46] <zeeshan> what happened
[18:42:00] <PetefromTn_> Oh nothing bad really...
[18:42:16] <PetefromTn_> just a really frustrating day and everyone was feeling it over there.
[18:42:44] <PetefromTn_> Lots of stupid mistakes by everyone and materials being misordered or forgotten to order.
[18:43:07] <PetefromTn_> tools and cutters not ordered for jobs that needed it.
[18:43:23] <PetefromTn_> Everything is late and everything is hurry hurry
[18:43:36] <PetefromTn_> and they expect you to perform miracles.
[18:43:57] <PetefromTn_> with dull tools and improper fixtures and no time to do it in.
[18:44:40] <PetefromTn_> It was just one of those days that makes me really think about just how important to me making my own shop work is.
[18:45:18] <PetefromTn_> So I do not have to rely on other people to determine my destiny.
[18:45:39] <PetefromTn_> Maybe I am just venting here but it is what it is.
[18:45:39] <zeeshan> PetefromTn_: when you leave
[18:45:46] <zeeshan> make sure you leave with a couple of end mills
[18:45:48] <zeeshan> and measuring tools :D
[18:46:36] <PetefromTn_> naah man I will just leave and smile.
[18:46:47] <PetefromTn_> Actually I WILL be leaving for the summer
[18:47:10] <PetefromTn_> I do not wish to pay for ridiculous day care prices so someone else can take care of my kids.
[18:47:47] <PetefromTn_> I have some prospects for parts to make on my machines that will hopefully allow me to make what I need to.
[18:48:10] <PetefromTn_> If it does not work out I can always take another custom cabinet job and build it in my shop.
[18:48:40] <PetefromTn_> Always have people wanting me to build custom kitchens or built ins for them.
[18:49:15] <PetefromTn_> I ordered that damn Kurt Vise yesterday evening and did not receive a verification email from the seller yet.
[18:49:32] <PetefromTn_> I expected to get something from them once business opened today.
[18:49:47] <zeeshan> PetefromTn_: i dont even know why you left cabinet making
[18:49:49] <PetefromTn_> they do have 100 percent positive feedback so I am not worried.
[18:49:52] <zeeshan> i thought that profession had $$$$$
[18:50:00] <zeeshan> cause only the 'big boys' want fancy cabinets
[18:50:01] <zeeshan> :D
[18:50:17] <PetefromTn_> I did it for over 20 years man.
[18:50:21] <PetefromTn_> Needed a break LOL
[18:50:35] <PetefromTn_> honestly I really like CNC machining and making cool parts.
[18:50:43] <PetefromTn_> Just trying to turn it into a living of some sort.
[18:51:13] <zeeshan> i hope it works out
[18:51:14] <zeeshan> !
[18:51:18] <PetefromTn_> I can always make custom cabinets but my shop is not really large enough to do what I need to.
[18:51:32] <PetefromTn_> me too LOL
[18:51:37] <PetefromTn_> no guarantees.
[18:51:52] <PetefromTn_> but I do enjoy it and have made some cool stuff already.
[18:52:05] <PetefromTn_> Got a couple more orders today for parts I made before.
[18:52:37] <PetefromTn_> and some parts I am desigining for that race shop has the potential to sell quite a bit hopefully.
[18:53:00] <PetefromTn_> Crossing my fingers guys like you that are RX7 junkies will not be able to live without it hehehe
[18:53:19] <PetefromTn_> plus it can be adapted to fit other tuner cars relatively easily.
[18:53:35] <PetefromTn_> what are you up to?
[18:54:22] <CaptHindsight> it's either management or customers
[18:54:32] <zeeshan> getting organized for the new job/masters
[18:55:13] <PetefromTn_> nice.
[18:55:20] <PetefromTn_> how long til you are there?
[18:55:32] <zeeshan> monday next week
[18:55:43] <zeeshan> prof gave me the grand tour today
[18:55:45] <zeeshan> its interesting stuff
[18:56:06] <zeeshan> i wanna learn more!
[18:56:47] <PetefromTn_> always nice to learn new stuff especially if you are interested in it of course.
[18:57:51] <zeeshan> apparently ill be researching in a topic with not much research done to it before
[18:57:54] <zeeshan> for 3M
[18:58:07] <zeeshan> i wish he gave me more details
[18:58:16] <zeeshan> he gave me like 150 pages of journal articles to read
[18:58:18] <zeeshan> =/
[18:58:42] <PetefromTn_> better than breakin rocks man. enjoy it.
[18:59:08] <zeeshan> i wanna just dive into doing sdomething
[18:59:09] <zeeshan> not read
[18:59:09] <zeeshan> haha
[18:59:16] <zeeshan> make some dies!
[18:59:23] <PetefromTn_> yeah I know how you feel.
[18:59:53] <PetefromTn_> At work I really enjoy the programming and Cad Cam work but sometimes like today just gotta make parts... boring repetitive parts.
[19:00:14] <zeeshan> unfortunately most jobs are like that
[19:00:16] <zeeshan> production ones
[19:00:28] <zeeshan> at least you get variations
[19:00:29] <PetefromTn_> thats the thing, this is not a production shop.
[19:00:37] <zeeshan> at gates it was a frigging f150 trans pump stuff
[19:00:39] <PetefromTn_> we make anything and everything.
[19:00:39] <zeeshan> EVERYDAY!!!
[19:00:54] <PetefromTn_> which is the only reason I am still there.
[19:01:15] <PetefromTn_> I have learned a great deal just watching and doing different parts every day.
[19:01:42] <PetefromTn_> For them a production run is like 3-500 parts.
[19:02:04] <PetefromTn_> not many thousands day in and day out like a production shop.
[19:02:19] <PetefromTn_> That would drive me absolutely insane.
[19:02:21] <zeeshan> we made 700 a day
[19:02:25] <zeeshan> but it was the same thing :P
[19:02:32] <PetefromTn_> yeah man I CANNOT do that.
[19:02:38] <zeeshan> thank god i wasn't a machine operator
[19:02:39] <zeeshan> !
[19:02:41] <PetefromTn_> I am not made for that kinda work.
[19:03:50] <PetefromTn_> I tell my wife about how it sucks when we do a small production run and she says she would actually enjoy NOT having to think just do something that makes the time go by.
[19:04:12] <PetefromTn_> I am like I could not stand it I have to be thinking and doing something or I go nutz.
[19:04:23] <zeeshan> lol
[19:04:28] <zeeshan> how can she enjoy that
[19:04:31] <zeeshan> thats robotic work
[19:04:33] <PetefromTn_> I dunno...
[19:04:43] <zeeshan> and robotic means person's replaceable
[19:04:43] <PetefromTn_> some people like that kinda work tho.
[19:04:52] <PetefromTn_> I do not know how.
[19:05:42] <PetefromTn_> for me I am sure at some point I will have some kinda light production work in the shop but I think it is easier when you know you are making good money with the parts runs.
[19:06:21] <PetefromTn_> I look at it like when I made custom cabinets.
[19:06:45] <PetefromTn_> There are times when you just have to hand sand doors all damn day long to get the job done but once it is done you get the paycheck.
[19:07:05] <zeeshan> ;]
[19:07:06] <PetefromTn_> It is what it is.
[19:07:25] <zeeshan> at least at home
[19:07:28] <zeeshan> you just gotta push a button!
[19:07:34] <zeeshan> cause that's all CNC is
[19:07:37] <zeeshan> pushing a button
[19:07:47] <zeeshan> (sorry joke from a couple days ago from a guy)
[19:07:55] <PetefromTn_> yeah and at home I can watch TV on my big screen while the machine is running and listen to the music I want to listen to..
[19:08:01] <zeeshan> that is true
[19:08:27] <PetefromTn_> If I need to go pick up my kids or want to take them to the park for lunch or something I just do it.
[19:08:50] <PetefromTn_> honestly even if I made less money in the end that alone is worth it to me.
[19:09:08] <PetefromTn_> really the hardest part has been the times when I did not have work.
[19:09:18] <PetefromTn_> When I have work I actually do quite well with wood or metal.
[19:09:27] <zeeshan> thats what i was trying to explain to another person here
[19:09:34] <zeeshan> 'i rather have a day job and a side job'
[19:09:36] <zeeshan> (personally)
[19:09:47] <zeeshan> because my side job isn't consistent as is..
[19:10:00] <PetefromTn_> I almost think I might ask them if I could work part time there and full time here.
[19:10:01] <zeeshan> and i can only imagine how bad it'd get if i tried to survive off it
[19:10:13] <zeeshan> yea!
[19:10:14] <zeeshan> that's a great idea
[19:10:16] <PetefromTn_> after the summer.
[19:10:24] <zeeshan> so you ALWAYS have a consistent pay cheque.
[19:10:49] <PetefromTn_> initially they asked me if I wanted to work full or part time.
[19:10:50] <zeeshan> but.. then again, i think a part time person is also easy to lay off
[19:11:03] <PetefromTn_> I said full because I wanted to learn
[19:11:07] <PetefromTn_> That is fine with me man.
[19:11:28] <PetefromTn_> Honestly it is days like today that will MOTIVATE me to get the damn work into the shop.
[19:11:42] <PetefromTn_> Beat the damn ground until I have something to make here to make money with.
[19:12:02] <PetefromTn_> the occasional slow time is inevitable even in a big shop.
[19:12:58] <PetefromTn_> When I do not have work for customers I plan to keep making the parts I make and sell them.
[19:13:43] <PetefromTn_> I noticed that kurt D688 comes with a kinda vise guard that goes down the center.
[19:13:59] <PetefromTn_> apparently it keeps chips off the leadscrew.
[19:14:12] <PetefromTn_> Funny NONE of the ones in the shop have this guard.
[19:14:33] <PetefromTn_> It is either something new or they just tossed them or something.
[19:15:50] <PetefromTn_> Well its dinner time cya guys later.
[19:19:02] <zeeshan> dude
[19:19:06] <zeeshan> ah damn
[19:19:09] <zeeshan> ill ask when you come back
[19:19:10] <zeeshan> :P
[19:45:27] <jdh> PeteInTN: http://raleigh.craigslist.org/bfs/4459323662.html
[20:13:37] <PetefromTn_> jdh Nice man where was it when I needed it LOL
[20:14:11] <PetefromTn_> That is a pretty huge machine tho. Probably has a slow spindle too. but Cat50 probably has some balls.
[20:25:20] <toastyde2th> cat 50 machines are generally pretty serious, considering a cat50 holder is like twice the size or more of a cat 40 holder
[20:34:20] <PetefromTn_> I know the cat50 holders are larger but I did not think they were twice the size. Have to look at some again tomorrow.
[20:34:59] <PetefromTn_> They have a large horiztontal mill that uses cat50 and it is indeed huge tho.
[20:37:40] <toastyde2th> I started on a cat 50 machine and when I saw cat40
[20:37:49] <toastyde2th> i thought it must surely be cat30 or cat20
[20:45:03] <PetefromTn_> hehe I can see what you mean.
[20:45:56] <PetefromTn_> I am happy with my cat40 mill tho. It would cut pretty much anything I am gonna want to cut. If someone brings me some inconel I will just gnaw on it awhile LOL
[20:54:17] <zmi> hello i could installed it, ubuntu linuxcnc but i have other problem now, the network and imagen on the screem is bad no working well
[20:55:04] <zmi> how can i do with that?
[20:58:56] <toastyde2th> PetefromTn_, tbh it's all about tool size and overall machine quality, not necessarily taper
[20:59:06] <toastyde2th> with a 40 taper you can cut any damn thing if the machine itself is solid
[20:59:13] <toastyde2th> what a 50 taper buys is big ass tools
[20:59:22] <PetefromTn_> yup.
[20:59:30] <PetefromTn_> BIG ASS tools..
[20:59:35] <ChuangTzu> asstools
[20:59:36] <ChuangTzu> big ones
[20:59:38] <toastyde2th> hauling ass with a 15" facemill or a 5" drill
[20:59:53] <PetefromTn_> thats nutz.
[21:00:01] <toastyde2th> there's also cat60
[21:00:09] <PetefromTn_> We have a six incher at work and it is crazy big to me.
[21:00:12] <toastyde2th> but very very few machines have it and they're all very very large
[21:00:15] <ChuangTzu> what do gantry mills use?
[21:00:21] <ChuangTzu> cat60?
[21:00:21] <toastyde2th> depends on the gantry
[21:00:26] <toastyde2th> no, most use cat40
[21:00:28] <ChuangTzu> damn
[21:00:48] <toastyde2th> a lot of gantry work is bulky, not necessarily high power, heavy cutting
[21:01:05] <toastyde2th> now a bridge mill, that's more likely to be 50 or 60 taper
[21:01:16] <PetefromTn_> I like Cat40, a huge chunk of cat50 when it is released by the power drawbar could smash your hand underneath it from the weight LOL
[21:01:16] <toastyde2th> much much much heavier than a gantry machine
[21:01:36] <toastyde2th> ya, I always stood on the table and got my shoulder under the tool
[21:01:42] <toastyde2th> when i hit the drawbar
[21:01:58] <toastyde2th> towel around it
[21:02:02] <ChuangTzu> so the things that look like gantry mills but are room size are called bridge mills?
[21:02:29] <toastyde2th> nah, gantry machines generally have a static table
[21:02:36] <toastyde2th> and all xyz movement occurs on the gantry
[21:02:58] <ChuangTzu> bridge mills have movable beds?
[21:03:01] <toastyde2th> a bridge mill usually has yz on a static bridge, and the tabel moves
[21:03:07] <toastyde2th> the bridge usually also has a W axis
[21:03:08] <ChuangTzu> wow
[21:03:12] <toastyde2th> to raise and lower the bridge itself
[21:03:30] <toastyde2th> they have much smaller workspaces but a much much more powerful (on average)
[21:03:34] <toastyde2th> 50-300 hp milling heads
[21:03:46] <toastyde2th> mostly for forge work
[21:03:48] <ChuangTzu> http://www.jorgensonmachinetools.com/cincinnati-6-axis-gantry-bridge-mill
[21:03:51] <ChuangTzu> i was thinking of that
[21:04:10] <toastyde2th> looks nice, but def a gantry machine
[21:04:17] <toastyde2th> most gantries aren't as solid as that one
[21:04:32] <XXCoder> holy shit
[21:04:34] <XXCoder> tjays big
[21:05:26] <toastyde2th> also many bridge mills will have the cat-50 bolt pattern
[21:05:39] <toastyde2th> some facemills get bolted to the spindle instead of drawbar
[21:05:43] <Jymmm> ChuangTzu: If you get that, could you mill me a coupel of cars please
[21:06:11] <Jymmm> ChuangTzu: or a house
[21:06:35] <toastyde2th> there are horizontal boring mills with 10 meter y axes
[21:06:57] <ChuangTzu> lol
[21:06:59] <toastyde2th> mill a small office building
[21:07:35] <toastyde2th> size and power tend to be inversely related in large machines, with the notable exceptions of blanchard grinders and VBMs
[21:08:16] <Jymmm> Is the building included in the sale price?
[21:08:27] <toastyde2th> hahaha
[21:09:00] <toastyde2th> you could probably negotiate that considering the building probably costs a tenth of the machine
[21:13:57] <zmi> the driver to network and video dont work so i was in channel ubuntu but they say that channel is no for suport for linuxcnc because this ubuntu is the linuxcnc
[21:25:50] <ramkam2014> Hi there, i'm a newbie in cnc. Is there a good intro guide ? Especially on the choice of milling bits, rotation and displacement soeeds ? Cheers
[21:26:07] <ramkam2014> Speeds
[21:42:05] <humble_sea_bass> pick up Machinery's Handbook, a copy from the 90's will do
[22:03:21] <zeeshan|2> man
[22:03:27] <zeeshan|2> the abaqus environment is awesome!
[22:04:23] <zeeshan|2> doesn't look like it can communicate with inventor or solidworks :{
[22:11:42] <jdh> have you used HSM express? or wtf it is called?
[22:13:14] <zeeshan|2> briefuly
[22:13:20] <humble_sea_bass> abaqus can do some amazing things, but it lives in its own world
[22:13:22] <zeeshan|2> felt similar to nx
[22:13:50] <zeeshan|2> humble_sea_bass: do you know if you use paramaterized models from solidworks or other popular 3d software
[22:13:55] <zeeshan|2> and make a link between the two
[22:14:06] <zeeshan|2> so if i update a parameter in abaqus, it updates in solidworks automatically?
[22:14:17] <zeeshan|2> i could do that in ansys, but from the looks if it
[22:14:20] <zeeshan|2> its not possible in abaqus
[22:14:27] <humble_sea_bass> I was never able to get pro/e or sw models into it with meaningful parametrization
[22:14:56] <zeeshan|2> .. google foound this
[22:15:00] <zeeshan|2> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3SJyMqxZFoQ
[22:15:02] <humble_sea_bass> iges or some other shit format
[22:15:04] <zeeshan|2> basically need an addon
[22:15:33] <humble_sea_bass> in 20010 they hadn't even though of this
[22:16:40] <humble_sea_bass> anyways, enjoy abaqus, only package that didn't make me cry when I tried to simulate inflatable beams and/or melting fuel rod assemblies
[22:17:09] <zeeshan|2> unfortunately im not doing linear analysis =/
[22:17:19] <zeeshan|2> mainly non-linear stuff
[22:17:30] <zeeshan|2> i think itll be headache regardless :{
[22:17:51] <humble_sea_bass> inflatable beams are nonlinear, that's probably why you're using abaqus
[22:18:17] <zeeshan|2> oh
[22:19:04] <zeeshan|2> humble_sea_bass: can you do multiple studies
[22:19:06] <zeeshan|2> on the same geometry
[22:19:13] <zeeshan|2> without having to start a new project?
[22:19:28] <zeeshan|2> like in ansys, i can make a new study and link the fact that i want the mesh to be the same..
[22:19:37] <zeeshan|2> but then i can individually change the boundary condition (ie forces)
[22:19:46] <zeeshan|2> and perform the study simultaneously
[22:19:49] <humble_sea_bass> i don't remember ever doing multiple studies in one file
[22:20:02] <zeeshan|2> do you have tutorials saved? :P
[22:20:36] <humble_sea_bass> I'll have to look on my old thinkpad x60, that is where "the past" lives
[22:20:56] <humble_sea_bass> and I am fairly certain i had a few painful manuals and tutorials
[22:21:11] <zeeshan|2> haha
[22:21:19] <zeeshan|2> what class was this for??
[22:21:47] <humble_sea_bass> Professor's Lab Bitch 301
[22:21:54] <zeeshan|2> lol
[22:22:04] <zeeshan|2> im suprised they taught us ansys undergrad
[22:22:13] <zeeshan|2> and for grad theyre making me use a completely diffeerent software
[22:22:15] <zeeshan|2> makes no sense..
[22:22:38] <zeeshan|2> basically so far i know my project consists of
[22:22:38] <humble_sea_bass> you can teach ansys fairly quickly
[22:22:59] <humble_sea_bass> Abaqus gives you so many means to shoot your face off and then crash
[22:23:05] <zeeshan|2> shape memory polymer + adhesive layer + steel
[22:23:12] <zeeshan|2> and ill be deforming them experimentally
[22:23:18] <zeeshan|2> and eventually have to simulate it
[22:23:23] <zeeshan|2> and come up with a model
[22:24:06] <zeeshan|2> when you try to do the same deformation with regular polymer, adhesive layer and steel
[22:24:12] <zeeshan|2> you basically get wrinkling
[22:24:20] <zeeshan|2> unless you control the forming parameters very precisely
[22:24:26] <zeeshan|2> but over time, the plastic 'sets'
[22:24:34] <zeeshan|2> and wrinkles will show up after a couple weeks
[22:24:34] <zeeshan|2> lol
[22:24:49] <zeeshan|2> we're hoping with smp, the problem is solved ;p
[22:31:49] <humble_sea_bass> sounds like a process problem
[22:32:05] <zeeshan|2> i thinkso
[22:32:27] <zeeshan|2> i think im gonna start by testing a few samples
[22:32:29] <zeeshan|2> see what happens
[22:32:33] <zeeshan|2> then try to make sense of it
[22:32:47] <zeeshan|2> make a model to predict the behaviour
[22:32:52] <zeeshan|2> fea, validate
[22:33:12] <zeeshan|2> patent the process
[22:33:12] <zeeshan|2> haha
[22:33:42] <humble_sea_bass> ok. the laptop only has my installed software for it, i'm gonna have to look in one of the old hard external drives
[22:33:54] <zeeshan|2> lemme know what 'version' its meant for
[22:34:00] <zeeshan|2> i m using 6.13
[22:34:09] <zeeshan|2> i dunno when they started it
[22:34:17] <zeeshan|2> but they have a proper gui environment now called 'cae'
[22:34:35] <zeeshan|2> 'Complete Abaqus Environmen'
[22:34:37] <zeeshan|2> t
[22:35:00] <zeeshan|2> apparently you can also install it in linux :D
[22:35:04] <humble_sea_bass> we were using it in 2009-10 so i think it was your version
[22:35:09] <humble_sea_bass> or close to it
[22:35:22] <zeeshan|2> any of your tutorials will help then
[22:35:30] <zeeshan|2> cause usually when theyre teaching students
[22:35:32] <zeeshan|2> they start with the very basics
[22:35:38] <zeeshan|2> (ie pointing out where stuff is!)
[22:37:46] <humble_sea_bass> Introduction to Computational Plasticity has abaqus implementations if you can find that book in your library
[22:38:17] <zeeshan|2> fak books !
[22:38:21] <zeeshan|2> i need a step by step tutorial
[22:38:21] <zeeshan|2> haha
[22:39:03] <zeeshan|2> wow
[22:39:10] <zeeshan|2> i have access to the e-book through remote mcmaster library
[22:40:19] <humble_sea_bass> RPI is one of the better engineering school here in the states so their tutorial is gonna be your tutorial
[22:40:22] <humble_sea_bass> http://homepages.rpi.edu/~des/Abaqus%20tutorial.pdf
[22:40:56] <zeeshan|2> you sir
[22:40:58] <zeeshan|2> are the fucking man.
[22:41:35] <humble_sea_bass> but for realsies, look at the book, it helped during dark times
[22:42:19] <zeeshan|2> im looking at it is
[22:42:27] <zeeshan|2> looks like a good book
[22:42:31] <zeeshan|2> it even talks about viscoplasticity
[22:44:07] <XXCoder> that huge mill - how much would it be lol when new http://www.jorgensonmachinetools.com/cincinnati-6-axis-gantry-bridge-mill
[22:44:39] <humble_sea_bass> ok gonna hit the sack. later gangsters
[22:44:52] <zeeshan|2> cya!
[22:44:53] <zeeshan|2> thanks for your help
[22:45:09] <ChuangTzu> what about this one
[22:45:11] <ChuangTzu> http://www.gearsolutions.com/media/uploads/assets/Images/News/October_12/1012_Mag_NB.jpg
[22:45:11] <XXCoder> later humble
[22:45:22] <XXCoder> thats awesome.
[22:45:42] <ChuangTzu> 100hp spindle
[22:45:48] <ChuangTzu> http://www.gearsolutions.com/news/detail/7396/mag-completes-first-giant-u6-portal-mill
[22:46:54] <ChuangTzu> https://d2n4wb9orp1vta.cloudfront.net/resources/images/cdn/cms/MMS_0410_Windustries_A.jpg
[22:47:11] <ChuangTzu> 240 feet y travel
[22:47:12] <ChuangTzu> lol
[22:47:24] <XXCoder> that looks like train engine
[22:47:43] <XXCoder> I saw half rebuilt engine when i was riding vend vans
[22:47:45] <XXCoder> damn
[22:47:46] <ChuangTzu> i think it's a ship engine
[22:47:54] <ChuangTzu> far bigger than a train engine
[22:48:01] <XXCoder> one piston was large enough to serve with food on top for family
[22:48:25] <ChuangTzu> http://www.blogcdn.com/www.autoblog.com/media/2011/07/largest-diesel-engine.jpg
[22:48:50] <ChuangTzu> wartsila
[22:48:53] <zeeshan|2> nice
[22:49:00] <XXCoder> I dont think thats largest. well depends. the largest period is shuttle movwe
[22:49:02] <XXCoder> mover
[22:49:17] <XXCoder> its max speed is brisky 4 mph when not carrying shuttle
[22:49:20] <ChuangTzu> how big is the engine on the shuttle mover?
[22:49:22] <XXCoder> around 2 when are
[22:49:43] <XXCoder> well earthmover wheel looks like tiny toy besides shuttle mover tire
[22:50:06] <ChuangTzu> this engine is almost 2000 liters per cylinder
[22:50:12] <ChuangTzu> they make them up to 14 cylinders
[22:50:52] <ChuangTzu> crankshaft weighs 300 tons
[22:50:55] <ChuangTzu> :D
[22:50:59] <XXCoder> cant find it dammit
[22:51:24] <XXCoder> http://www3.pictures.gi.zimbio.com/Space+Shuttle+Atlantis+Moved+Launch+Pad+Ahead+6IoR1kEOmfBl.jpg
[22:51:33] <XXCoder> look at its tire by cars
[22:51:41] <XXCoder> it look like it could easily roll over em
[22:51:51] <XXCoder> and barely notice.
[22:52:02] <ChuangTzu> it has 2 of these:
[22:52:21] <ChuangTzu> well, 2 alco train engines
[22:52:22] <ChuangTzu> of 2000hp each
[22:52:31] <ChuangTzu> one of those engines has as much output as one cylinder of the wartsila
[22:52:32] <ChuangTzu> :)
[22:52:38] <XXCoder> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crawler-transporter
[22:52:43] <XXCoder> thats nuts indeed
[22:53:17] <XXCoder> apparently it has 16 traction motors
[22:53:32] <XXCoder> 1 kW generator to power em all
[22:53:44] <XXCoder> so guess its not disel engine lol
[22:54:12] <XXCoder> oh and it has 1/126 mpg approx
[22:54:23] <XXCoder> as bad as my car is... its much better than that lol
[22:54:26] <ChuangTzu> wartsila crankshaft:
[22:54:27] <ChuangTzu> http://static.autoblog.nl/images/wp2008/Wärtsilä-Sulzer_RTA96-C_01.jpg
[22:54:29] <jmasseo> what do you do with a 10,000hp motor?
[22:54:36] <jmasseo> there are small engines that turn 1000hp.
[22:54:38] <XXCoder> dance!!
[22:54:39] <ChuangTzu> actually that's a camshaft
[22:54:50] <jmasseo> people turbocharge toyota engines to run 1200hp
[22:54:52] <ChuangTzu> jmasseo: ships
[22:54:56] <XXCoder> hm
[22:54:59] <XXCoder> just a logo?
[22:55:00] <ChuangTzu> the biggest ships
[22:55:17] <XXCoder> using fuel generators never made sense for me
[22:55:17] <jmasseo> of course these motors are engineered
[22:55:19] <jmasseo> not 'overclocked'
[22:55:24] <XXCoder> its moving slowly and with known distance
[22:55:29] <XXCoder> I'd have wired it
[22:55:32] <ChuangTzu> 5.6 million ft-lb of torque
[22:55:36] <ChuangTzu> at 102rpm
[22:55:47] <XXCoder> drag a wire. its not like it'd slow down. not with huge power
[22:55:53] <ChuangTzu> a 1200hp toyota engine has what, 600 ft-lb?
[22:55:59] <jmasseo> right
[22:56:05] <jmasseo> and will explode if you run it for 8 hours
[22:56:08] <ChuangTzu> heh
[22:56:21] <jmasseo> i think it's probably more like 900 ft lbs of torque
[22:56:23] <jmasseo> they are pretty meaty
[22:56:30] <jmasseo> but not ment for the long hault
[22:56:34] <jmasseo> they tend to pop
[22:56:43] <ChuangTzu> these are also really efficient
[22:56:52] <ChuangTzu> 171g/kWh
[22:56:55] <ChuangTzu> fuel consumption
[22:57:56] <ChuangTzu> 50% shaft efficiency
[22:58:57] <ChuangTzu> 25% or so for a run of the mill small gasoline car engine
[22:59:11] <ChuangTzu> a 1200hp toyota, probably like 5 :)
[22:59:51] <XXCoder> nuts
[22:59:55] <XXCoder> so much loss
[23:00:02] <XXCoder> guess it dont scale up well
[23:05:00] <zeeshan|2> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zFVeBgEfUg0
[23:05:02] <zeeshan|2> wtf
[23:05:06] <zeeshan|2> instead of using a v block
[23:05:14] <XXCoder> Z block? heh
[23:05:21] <zeeshan|2> he milled out his soft jaws
[23:05:21] <zeeshan|2> lol
[23:05:59] <XXCoder> it looks like adoptor
[23:06:08] <XXCoder> good idea of done very often
[23:06:13] <zeeshan|2> yea soft jaws can be replaced
[23:06:29] <zeeshan|2> but seems weird :P
[23:06:48] <XXCoder> man
[23:06:53] <XXCoder> I cant wait to have functional cmnc
[23:06:56] <XXCoder> cnc
[23:06:59] <zeeshan|2> me too !
[23:07:06] <zeeshan|2> i hope my ball screw shows up soon :D
[23:07:09] <zeeshan|2> im so closeee
[23:07:13] <XXCoder> my rails wont arrive for in least 3 weeks
[23:07:14] <XXCoder> china
[23:08:10] <XXCoder> guy probably makes that weird cyl thing often
[23:08:27] <zeeshan|2> i understand that
[23:08:37] <zeeshan|2> its just weird using a round surface to hold your part
[23:08:45] <zeeshan|2> because the contact points will be random
[23:08:53] <XXCoder> oh interesting
[23:09:01] <zeeshan|2> that why you use a v
[23:09:03] <zeeshan|2> cause it self sligns
[23:09:06] <zeeshan|2> *aligns
[23:09:13] <XXCoder> ahh I understand
[23:09:33] <XXCoder> no idea what that thing hes making is for
[23:09:40] <zeeshan|2> looks like a weird spacer :P
[23:09:42] <zeeshan|2> its nice!
[23:09:44] <zeeshan|2> sexy finish
[23:09:53] <XXCoder> definitely quality
[23:09:54] <zeeshan|2> a lot of people dont like machining marks
[23:09:56] <zeeshan|2> but i love em
[23:09:59] <zeeshan|2> when theyre in a nice pattern
[23:10:42] <XXCoder> I wonder if theres some fancy craver style toolpath generator
[23:11:02] <XXCoder> its easy to make fancy paths but not one that vary in depth
[23:11:25] <zeeshan|2> masteram does varying w/ depth tool paths
[23:11:44] <XXCoder> guessed so lol
[23:11:44] <zeeshan|2> ramp ones
[23:11:47] <zeeshan|2> helical ones
[23:11:53] <zeeshan|2> i cant remember em all!
[23:12:34] <XXCoder> heh I was talking about style, suppose I use V shape bit, I want to vary depth of etching for cool look
[23:12:46] <zeeshan|2> o
[23:13:24] <zeeshan|2> http://www.mfgnewsweb.com/archives/applying_tech/jan12/pics/Mastercam-Brad-Anderson-3.jpg
[23:13:25] <zeeshan|2> so sexy
[23:13:36] <XXCoder> for example S, deeper in middle and thinner in ends
[23:13:43] <zeeshan|2> oh
[23:13:44] <XXCoder> like fancy writing
[23:13:53] <zeeshan|2> you could prolly just model that how you want it
[23:14:00] <zeeshan|2> and let it follow the contour
[23:14:34] <XXCoder> guess so
[23:32:26] <FrankZappa> made a model of an exmet stair. http://i.imgur.com/OUsdtTU.png
[23:34:01] <FrankZappa> <ds3> if I wanted nurbs, I'd go with rhino
[23:34:03] <FrankZappa> amen brother
[23:35:29] <ds3> FrankZappa: not a fan of AOI?
[23:36:18] <FrankZappa> no, but that's because I don't know what it is
[23:36:30] <FrankZappa> pls teach me :)
[23:37:01] <FrankZappa> this is the first place I've found on freenode that even admits rhino exists
[23:37:14] <FrankZappa> and I pretty much masturbate with it every day
[23:37:23] <XXCoder> tmi
[23:38:53] <FrankZappa> looks like everyone enjoys aoi
[23:38:59] <zeeshan|2> FrankZappa: curious how long did that take
[23:39:00] <FrankZappa> never heard of it until just now
[23:39:07] <zeeshan|2> what software is that
[23:39:35] <XXCoder> sketchup I like but no way to specify sizes manually once set :(
[23:39:41] <XXCoder> so I can't change mind or something
[23:39:45] <zeeshan|2> lol
[23:39:48] <FrankZappa> zeeshan|2 no real idea. I started Sunday, spent a few hrs on it each day, had to learn new ways of doing things now, so future things will be faster... etc
[23:39:52] <zeeshan|2> thats as bad as autocad
[23:40:08] <FrankZappa> I never did that exmet mesh polyline, for example
[23:40:22] <zeeshan|2> did you mirror it
[23:40:32] <FrankZappa> also, had to find some answers on forum, but only after I had to think up the riught questions
[23:40:53] <FrankZappa> and additionally, I'll be making lots of these, so I took pains to parameterize everything
[23:41:10] <zeeshan|2> im just confused why youd use rhino to do this
[23:41:13] <zeeshan|2> looks like a pain :P
[23:41:14] <FrankZappa> I drew the steel shapes at 0,0,0 in 2d
[23:41:23] <FrankZappa> it was so fun
[23:41:32] <zeeshan|2> are you trying to learn the software
[23:41:37] <zeeshan|2> or its your main drawing software
[23:41:38] <FrankZappa> yes, ish
[23:41:45] <FrankZappa> yes, to the latter, now.
[23:41:48] <FrankZappa> I draw for me
[23:42:00] <FrankZappa> if I had to produce CAD 2d for a client, no.
[23:42:03] <zeeshan|2> just to give you an idea, thats about a 30 min job in parametric 3d modeling!
[23:42:20] <FrankZappa> heh no it really isn't
[23:42:26] <zeeshan|2> want me to prove it? :P
[23:42:33] <FrankZappa> sure.
[23:42:41] <zeeshan|2> you gotta give me some starting dimensions though
[23:42:42] <FrankZappa> be sure to add all AISC shapes for each
[23:42:46] <zeeshan|2> aisc?
[23:42:57] <FrankZappa> and exmet specs
[23:43:04] <zeeshan|2> ??
[23:43:09] <FrankZappa> yes
[23:43:15] <zeeshan|2> dunno what those means
[23:43:23] <FrankZappa> okay with my setup
[23:43:32] <FrankZappa> I can change any one or all of those member sizes.
[23:43:37] <FrankZappa> right now.
[23:43:44] <zeeshan|2> the angle iron sizes?
[23:43:46] <XXCoder> member size :P
[23:43:47] <FrankZappa> if I want to reduce thickness and increase depth, arbitrarily
[23:43:51] <FrankZappa> I can do that
[23:43:58] <FrankZappa> by cycling thru AISC shape catalog
[23:44:05] <FrankZappa> and member type
[23:44:13] <FrankZappa> and outputting final cost from my distriubutor
[23:44:32] <FrankZappa> Plus I have hourly work table estimates
[23:44:37] <zeeshan|2> thats fairly easy
[23:44:42] <FrankZappa> so "adding a member midspan" is a labor multiplier.
[23:44:43] <zeeshan|2> with solidworks if you use weldments
[23:44:47] <zeeshan|2> itll tell you the total weldment length
[23:44:51] <zeeshan|2> and you can get cost from that
[23:45:04] <FrankZappa> weldment adds or subtracts members?
[23:45:08] <zeeshan|2> yea
[23:45:13] <FrankZappa> based on what?
[23:45:15] <zeeshan|2> you can supress em
[23:45:23] <zeeshan|2> the middle members can be linked toghether
[23:45:31] <zeeshan|2> as a pattern
[23:45:47] <zeeshan|2> all you gotta do is supress or unspress it
[23:45:50] <FrankZappa> no I mean why are additional members just being shoved into an assembly by my software?
[23:46:01] <FrankZappa> What told it to do that?
[23:46:03] <zeeshan|2> what
[23:46:26] <FrankZappa> I mean why would it include any kind of series for span ratings of the sheathing?
[23:46:37] <FrankZappa> *unless I specified it*
[23:46:40] <zeeshan|2> you would specify why
[23:46:46] <FrankZappa> this is my point
[23:46:49] <zeeshan|2> it's easy
[23:46:51] <zeeshan|2> for something like this
[23:47:04] <zeeshan|2> it sounds like you wanna specify #of stairs, width of stair, height of stair
[23:47:15] <FrankZappa> I set everything up just like I want, parametrically, and you in no way, with no software, could do this in 30 mins with the same parameterizations I've set up
[23:47:18] <zeeshan|2> and based on the width of stair, you wanna add a mid section beam
[23:47:23] <FrankZappa> I even have unequal L angle leg tables.
[23:47:42] <zeeshan|2> if you're gonna make it all fancy
[23:47:46] <zeeshan|2> then you're spending more time on tables
[23:47:48] <zeeshan|2> then modelling
[23:47:51] <zeeshan|2> the model for this is about 30 mintes
[23:47:55] <zeeshan|2> *30 minutes
[23:47:55] <FrankZappa> Plus the exmet thing isn't even a real sheet dimension, I literally played around with a hex grid generator because I wanted "the look"
[23:48:05] <zeeshan|2> how you wanna generate the model based on your parameters, is gonna take longer
[23:48:17] <FrankZappa> you didn't say "the model"
[23:48:26] <FrankZappa> I agree you can slab up and array and trim
[23:48:42] <FrankZappa> you can't also have stack and real world tie in and parameters, though.
[23:48:53] <zeeshan|2> dunno those terms.
[23:48:57] <FrankZappa> Especially not with sane/specified work points.
[23:49:11] <zeeshan|2> to give you an idea
[23:49:12] <FrankZappa> do you know what "parametric" means?
[23:49:16] <zeeshan|2> i made a parametric model
[23:49:18] <zeeshan|2> for electrical enclosures
[23:49:27] <zeeshan|2> which would grow and shrink including its frame
[23:49:41] <zeeshan|2> and venting requirements, lifting lugs etc
[23:49:56] <zeeshan|2> with me inputting height, width, depth
[23:50:04] <zeeshan|2> all the weldments would update to the appropriate thickness
[23:50:14] <FrankZappa> based on what?
[23:50:16] <zeeshan|2> it was 2-3 hours of modeling from what i recall
[23:50:24] <zeeshan|2> and 2-3 hours of excel
[23:50:33] <zeeshan|2> to generate the formulas
[23:50:45] <zeeshan|2> and another hour of making the api
[23:51:15] <zeeshan|2> based on strength calculations
[23:51:25] <zeeshan|2> and what transformer was going within it
[23:51:44] <FrankZappa> That's lovely.
[23:51:51] <zeeshan|2> transformer gave me flow area
[23:51:51] <FrankZappa> I'm sure you're faster than me, or whatever.
[23:51:56] <zeeshan|2> its not about me being faster
[23:52:09] <zeeshan|2> its the fact that 3d modellers that don't use nurbs bs
[23:52:11] <zeeshan|2> are way faster
[23:52:13] <FrankZappa> Okay, your internet dick is not only longer, it is girthier and makes the women gasp
[23:52:28] <zeeshan|2> man i gotta stop commenting in here
[23:52:35] <zeeshan|2> and let people stick to their slow ass methods
[23:52:39] <zeeshan|2> and be less productive
[23:52:45] <zeeshan|2> and go through the headache
[23:53:08] <FrankZappa> it's none of the above
[23:53:18] <zeeshan|2> i've used alias
[23:53:22] <zeeshan|2> nurbs based bullshit
[23:53:25] <FrankZappa> What's really happening is, you're projecting.
[23:53:36] <FrankZappa> And I posted a screenshot of "this is what I made today"
[23:53:40] <FrankZappa> You can piss on it
[23:53:48] <zeeshan|2> i'm not pissing on it
[23:53:49] <FrankZappa> I'll keep drinking my Bombay, and making my money.
[23:53:51] <zeeshan|2> im suggesting a better way to make it
[23:54:03] <FrankZappa> You really aren't
[23:54:03] <zeeshan|2> its up to you to do it or not
[23:54:13] <FrankZappa> and you can't see that, because you can't grasp what I'm doing.
[23:54:24] <zeeshan|2> i know any parametric problem
[23:54:28] <zeeshan|2> doesn't matter what youre doing
[23:54:34] <zeeshan|2> is way faster using boundary layer rep
[23:54:38] <zeeshan|2> in comparison to nurbs curves.
[23:54:44] <FrankZappa> okie dokie then see answer #2, you're faster, let it go.
[23:54:56] <FrankZappa> You have all the answers and you're certain.
[23:55:03] <zeeshan|2> and at the end of the day, you can take advantage of built in features like weldments
[23:55:07] <zeeshan|2> and easily change weldments
[23:55:09] <FrankZappa> Notice you haven't asked a thing other than how long it took to make the model.
[23:55:16] <zeeshan|2> from square, round, angle , thickness etc
[23:55:29] <FrankZappa> You don't really have a clue what I'm "doing" in terms of goals.
[23:55:40] <FrankZappa> But you're so full of certainty.
[23:55:41] <zeeshan|2> FrankZappa: the reason i asked that is cause i wanted to grasp how painful that was
[23:55:44] <zeeshan|2> to make
[23:55:50] <FrankZappa> This tells me you are likely a terrible engineer.
[23:55:50] <zeeshan|2> and it sounds like it was quite painful
[23:56:04] <zeeshan|2> think what you want
[23:56:08] <zeeshan|2> enjoy!
[23:56:10] <FrankZappa> Now you're getting it.
[23:56:23] <zeeshan|2> i could care less after seeing your response on how you do it
[23:56:32] <zeeshan|2> and i bet you could care less about my suggestion
[23:56:36] <zeeshan|2> so lets end this conversation