#linuxcnc | Logs for 2014-04-09

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[02:03:11] <Deejay> moin
[04:05:38] <skroon> hi
[10:06:16] <Jymmm> I picked up a 220V impulse sealer cheap. If I plug it into 110V then measure the voltages at the secondary of the xfmr, will it be linear (can I just 'double' the output voltages when looking for a replacement xfmr)?
[10:07:45] <skunkworks> yes
[10:08:36] <skunkworks> why not run it on 220?
[10:09:09] <Jymmm> Ok cool, and just double the wattage too (plus a tad more) ? I dont have a invertor
[10:10:21] <Jymmm> It's not an industrail sealer, just a commercial one.
[10:10:46] <Jymmm> But $5 beats $130 =)
[10:12:01] <skunkworks> you don't have 220v?
[10:12:04] <pcw_home> sure the transformer doesn't have a 110/220 input option?
[10:12:20] <Jymmm> skunkworks: only the oven and dryer.
[10:12:51] <Jymmm> pcw_home: No, this is SUPER cheap chinese thing. no dual voltage option
[10:12:52] <skunkworks> you live in california - don't you? you don't need a dryer..
[10:13:26] <Jymmm> skunkworks: LOL, well we also have this thing called killer mold too =)
[10:14:04] <skunkworks> watts is watts.. if you get a transformer that takes 110v in and the right voltage out - same wattage should work.
[10:14:50] <Jymmm> pcw_home: BTW... the flashlight we have... the "newest" version does NOT have memory no matter what the description says.
[10:15:08] <pcw_home> A 110/220 autotransformer will do as well (or a 110/110 isolation transformer)
[10:15:24] <pcw_home> I need a new one
[10:15:27] <Jymmm> pcw_home: I don't have either of those =)
[10:15:36] <Jymmm> pcw_home: broke your old one?
[10:16:53] <pcw_home> lost it
[10:17:06] <Jymmm> oh man, that sucks
[10:17:18] <Jymmm> pcw_home: you want a nice toy?
[10:18:08] <Jymmm> pcw_home: If you don't mind doing the mod for protected cells... http://www.kaidomain.com/product/details.S022116
[10:19:07] <Jymmm> pcw_home: Mod = 6 flat washers, 4" piece of 12ga solid wire, and a soldering iron
[10:19:49] <Jymmm> pcw_home: IT doens't NEED 3 batteries, but can use UP TO 3 batteries
[10:20:11] <Jymmm> for longer run time, or to be charger
[10:22:41] <Jymmm> HEH... a piece of plastic is a FELONY under federal law and a 10 year sentence!
[10:25:47] <Connor> Why do you need to mod if for protected cells ?
[10:26:02] <Jymmm> Connor: 3mm too short.
[10:27:41] <Connor> and, what the heck is a impulse sealer ?
[10:27:58] <Jymmm> Connor: heat seals plastic bags.
[10:27:59] <CaptHindsight2> it works! \0/
[10:28:07] <Connor> OH. I have one of those.
[10:28:23] <Connor> 110v.. I think I payed $8 for it.
[10:29:00] <Jymmm> Connor: http://www.uline.com/BL_2253/Tabletop-Poly-Bag-Sealer-Impulse
[10:29:02] <skunkworks> CaptHindsight2, great! what?
[10:29:23] <Connor> Jymmm: Yup.. That's exactly what I got..
[10:29:38] <Connor> I think I've used it maybe twice in the 4 or 5 years since I picked it up.
[10:31:01] <CaptHindsight2> skunkworks, always happy when a new install on a new machine works
[10:31:11] <skunkworks> heh
[10:31:25] <CaptHindsight2> now to spend the day getting all the configs right
[10:32:31] <CaptHindsight2> unfortunately the SBR's from China have a few square bearings in them :(
[10:33:03] <Connor> ?
[10:33:49] <CaptHindsight2> if they don't quiet down after a mile of travel I'll have to replace them (SBR = supported bearing rail)
[10:34:19] <CaptHindsight2> or are bearings supposed to sound crunchy?
[10:34:38] <Connor> Any sort of lube ?
[10:35:04] <Connor> I use the silicon stuff used for sliding glass doors on SBR (for wood working machines)
[10:35:11] <Connor> no liquid because machine made out of MDF
[10:36:39] <CaptHindsight2> this one runs Gentoo with preempt_rt
[10:37:01] <Connor> CaptHindsight What did you get in ?
[10:43:35] <CaptHindsight2> Connor, these are coated with moly grease and synthetic 90W
[10:43:57] <Connor> CaptHindsight Umm.. Okay.. What did you get anyway ?
[10:44:11] <Connor> some sort of Chinese router like a 6040 ?
[10:44:29] <CaptHindsight2> so probably a few square-ish bearings and maybe some foreign particles while being assembled
[10:54:19] <CaptHindsight2> Connor, yes, reworking a China 4530 45cm x 30cm
[10:54:47] <CaptHindsight2> was hoping to find a source that was good for more than just the frame
[10:55:11] <Connor> Are you reselling them or something ?
[10:58:44] <CaptHindsight2> Connor, I bui;d all sorts of custom machines
[10:59:59] <Connor> That one from Automation Direct ?
[11:01:20] <Connor> If so, doesn't look like they used bearing blocks...
[11:04:15] <CaptHindsight2> this is from automation technologies
[11:04:29] <Connor> Yup.. So, no bearing blocks for the ball screws ?
[11:04:38] <Connor> Just using the coupler and stepper motor?
[11:05:03] <CaptHindsight2> unfortunately they are all just too poorly made
[11:05:21] <CaptHindsight2> the wost part are the bearings
[11:05:46] <Connor> AT is good company.. I would complain to them.
[11:06:00] <CaptHindsight2> dtents or sound like they have sand inn them, probably from a bearing factory that very dirty
[11:06:29] <CaptHindsight2> Connor, I know the owner
[11:06:36] <Connor> Ah.
[11:06:47] <Connor> Well.. tell him to stop importing crap then. :)
[11:06:51] <CaptHindsight2> that's just how they are made
[11:07:05] <CaptHindsight2> he did, he only has a few left on special sale
[11:07:24] <Connor> What's he got to replace them ?
[11:07:29] <CaptHindsight2> nothing
[11:08:13] <Connor> Not made correctly either.. the rails for the gantry should be mounted sideways.. not on the bottom.. I know, I made the same mistake.
[11:08:39] <CaptHindsight2> it's not a very good router design
[11:08:47] <CaptHindsight2> it has lots of flex
[11:09:00] <CaptHindsight2> it's fine for non-contact applications
[11:09:14] <CaptHindsight2> like a printer
[11:10:15] <CaptHindsight2> no, they aren't made with linear servos and crossed roller bearings
[11:10:31] <CaptHindsight2> but only $700
[11:11:00] <Connor> It's cheaper than the one I build.. and mine was made from MDF.
[11:11:18] <Connor> but, mine uses bearing blocks. :
[11:11:19] <Connor> :)
[11:16:08] <CaptHindsight2> when Linux first comes up the LPT Pin #1 (STROBE) signal defaults to a LOW
[11:16:51] <CaptHindsight2> that could be exciting if you tie #Spindle Enable to that line :)
[11:42:22] <Tom_itx> skunkworks, you around?
[11:42:30] <skunkworks> yes?
[11:42:31] <Tom_itx> how do i download that new TP code to test?
[11:42:48] <Tom_itx> do you have a git line i can use?
[11:43:13] <skunkworks> which one do you want? the machinekit one or the linuxcnc one?
[11:43:18] <Tom_itx> i'm not very git savvy
[11:43:27] <Tom_itx> the one mhaberler posted yesterday
[11:44:02] <Tom_itx> for the pause resume
[11:48:21] <skunkworks_> this is how I did it for sim
[11:48:23] <skunkworks_> http://pastebin.ca/2693555
[11:48:36] <atom1> ok
[11:48:58] <Tom_itx> how hard would it be to make a config run under it?
[11:49:28] <skunkworks> well - it is based on master - It should run your configs just fine..
[11:49:30] <Tom_itx> i was gonna start working on MPG code for it to see how hard that would be
[11:49:54] <skunkworks> you will want to add the [traj] section items for the new tp
[11:50:11] <atom1> ahh yes, i have notes on that somewhere..
[11:50:35] <skunkworks> as far as the jog while paused - you need to look at the samlpe config he posted
[11:50:50] <atom1> i think i have those links
[12:02:10] <atom1> skunkworks, are you talking about the jog-while-pause9.ini?
[12:05:05] <skunkworks> yes
[12:10:18] <Deejay> namd
[12:10:46] <atom1> leave off the --enable-run-in-place if i'm gonna go live with it?
[12:11:34] <IchGuckLive> hi all B)
[12:11:40] <skunkworks> atom1, yes
[12:11:50] <skunkworks> atom1, wait
[12:12:18] <skunkworks> sorry
[12:12:24] <skunkworks> it should be that for realtime
[12:12:31] <atom1> which?
[12:13:18] <skunkworks> ( simulator should be --enable-simulator)
[12:13:32] <skunkworks> --enable-run-in-place is for realtime
[12:13:36] <atom1> ok
[12:13:54] <atom1> so you need one or the other
[12:15:31] <skunkworks> right
[12:16:07] <Tom_itx> what if you don't give it any options? just ./configure
[12:43:49] <Jymmm> pcw_home: I got a flashlight for ya! lmao
[12:43:56] <skunkworks> Tom_itx, I don't know...
[12:44:43] <Jymmm> pcw_home: PCW http://usd.dx.com/product/e-smart-cree-xm-l-q5-230lm-3-mode-white-zooming-mace-flashlight-black-1-x-18650-3-x-aaa-901301371
[12:45:37] <pcw_home> Ha!
[12:46:10] <Jymmm> pcw_home: Thought you might like that =)
[12:52:30] <Jymmm> pcw_home: Battery Up! http://usd.dx.com/product/e-smart-baseball-style-cree-xm-l-q5-230lm-3-mode-cold-white-flashlight-black-1-x-18650-3-x-aaa-901301904
[12:54:24] <XXCoder> In case you wanna play baseball in nights.
[12:54:50] <Jymmm> XXCoder: ...yeah, with someone's skull
[12:54:57] <XXCoder> lol
[12:55:03] <Jymmm> (seriously)
[12:55:29] <XXCoder> still lol
[12:55:37] <Jymmm> assuming there is some weight in the end of it
[12:55:45] <zeeshan> that actually looks good to inspect bores with
[12:55:48] <zeeshan> on the lathe
[12:56:01] <zeeshan> but it eats 4.2A so thats really not economical tusing battries
[12:56:22] <Jymmm> zeeshan: 4A on a 18650 is no biggy
[12:56:29] <Jymmm> they are rechargeable
[12:56:34] <zeeshan> yea but recharging sux
[12:56:39] <zeeshan> =[
[12:57:07] <Jymmm> I have only recharged mine 3 times in a year
[12:57:39] <XXCoder> I have old led flashlight thats on its third set of batteryu
[12:57:42] <zeeshan> dealextreme gets shipped outta china
[12:57:43] <zeeshan> rigbht
[12:57:48] <XXCoder> it's over 12 years old
[12:58:36] <Jymmm> the links I gave are out of the US, but yes they have HK too
[13:09:45] <Loetmichel> zeeshan: my pocket flashlight empties an 18650 in less than 40 minutes ;-)
[13:10:20] <Loetmichel> batteries are not useful tehre
[13:10:24] <Loetmichel> there
[13:13:09] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=14733
[13:13:26] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=14757
[13:13:28] <`Nerobro> Loetmichel, what flashlight is that?
[13:13:29] <Loetmichel> :-)
[13:13:43] <`Nerobro> Mine.. burns through an 18650 in 2 hours or so.
[13:13:53] <Loetmichel> http://www.ebay.de/itm/360817420129
[13:14:00] <`Nerobro> aaah, I see now.
[13:14:26] <Loetmichel> its BRIGHT for its size:
[13:14:36] <`Nerobro> Yeah, mine draws 4.5 watts
[13:14:44] <`Nerobro> and puts out enough light to ride my bicycle at 18-20mph
[13:14:49] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=14742
[13:14:51] <automata> has anyone worked with mesa 7i90 card?
[13:15:11] <zeeshan> Loetmichel: ROFL
[13:15:13] <zeeshan> thats a laser man
[13:15:19] <zeeshan> you dont need that as a flash light :P
[13:15:23] <Loetmichel> first dark, second full power wide angle, third is max zoom
[13:15:42] <automata> I am trying to locate the branch that may have the hal drivers for the mesa 7i90 FPGA Card
[13:17:04] <Loetmichel> zeeshan: thats my work flashlight, always in the pocket/on the belt
[13:17:07] <Loetmichel> ;-)
[13:21:30] <IchGuckLive> Loetmichel: is it the orig or did you mod it
[13:25:34] <Loetmichel> IchGuckLive: orig exept of the silvery part on the cap
[13:26:02] <Loetmichel> where i used the lthe to remove a corner that was extremly unnerving when desinging a belt clip for it
[13:27:06] <IchGuckLive> and the holder
[13:27:21] <IchGuckLive> to the realy growing stomeg !
[13:27:38] <Loetmichel> ?
[13:27:46] <IchGuckLive> Gürtelclip
[13:28:16] <Loetmichel> thats made from 3mm pvc foam (called Bastelplatte) from the "baumarkt"
[13:28:36] <IchGuckLive> ok so 3D prionter work !
[13:28:45] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=14754&g2_imageViewsIndex=1
[13:28:50] <Loetmichel> no, cnc mill
[13:30:22] <IchGuckLive> Lot can you provide the DXf for theflashlight holder
[13:31:03] <Loetmichel> no, because i have to correct a few mistakes first
[13:31:04] <Loetmichel> ;-)
[13:31:18] <IchGuckLive> O.O
[13:31:38] <IchGuckLive> i will order one of this for catching the Chicken at night
[13:34:14] <IchGuckLive> ok im off bye
[13:35:02] <Loetmichel> grrr
[13:35:24] <Loetmichel> now that i made the effort to upload the dxf... http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=14829
[13:35:30] <Loetmichel> ...he quits :-(
[14:12:14] <Jymmm> YAY! My rail light came in =)
[14:19:18] <pcw_home> automata:
[14:19:20] <pcw_home> http://git.linuxcnc.org/gitweb?p=linuxcnc.git;a=shortlog;h=refs/heads/hm2-7i90-3
[14:52:35] <KreAture> weeeeeeeeeeeee!
[14:52:39] <KreAture> I got my cnc parts
[14:52:44] <KreAture> 1 month sooner than expected :)
[14:53:17] <Deejay> gn8
[14:54:03] <KreAture> SBR20 stuff + ballnut stuff
[14:54:05] <KreAture> and rods
[14:58:11] <humble_sea_bass> the best part of this channel is that it is always christmas somewhere
[15:08:45] <KreAture> :)
[15:08:49] * KreAture takes inventory pic
[15:17:05] <KreAture> smoooooth
[15:17:07] <KreAture> :)
[15:17:19] <KreAture> http://kreature.org/projects/cnc/linear_kit_itm301115860502.jpg
[15:17:24] <KreAture> pic or didn't happen :)
[15:30:18] <Connor> KreAture: So double ball screws for the gantry ? You have a design drawn up yet?
[15:32:58] <KreAture> yes
[15:33:01] <KreAture> yes
[15:33:02] <KreAture> :)
[15:33:09] <KreAture> But I am not done
[15:33:35] <KreAture> http://kreature.org/projects/cnc/cnc2_12.png
[15:33:40] <KreAture> I may use full length legs
[15:33:48] <KreAture> and I am not done figuring out the axis yet
[15:34:24] <Connor> Oh yea. I remember that one..
[15:35:04] <KreAture> I am not done though, want to find the tightest and smoothest setup
[15:35:07] <humble_sea_bass> das a lot of 8020 mane
[15:35:48] <Connor> Yea.. I was thinking the same thing.. Got to be a better way to build that without using so much... and still have the same strength and easy of build
[15:36:17] <witnit> the 80/20 place is about 30 miles from my house
[15:36:22] <witnit> well one of them :P
[15:36:46] <witnit> they do some serious business
[15:36:52] <humble_sea_bass> don't mean you gotta go on an 8020 bender
[15:37:27] <KreAture> it is 6030 not 8040
[15:37:44] <KreAture> 60/30 fits with the mounting holes, 8040 and 8020 does not
[15:37:54] <Connor> huh?
[15:37:54] <KreAture> also, it's cheaper than alu plates here
[15:38:10] <KreAture> The rails come with the perfect holeset predrilled
[15:38:14] <KreAture> 30mm spacing
[15:38:18] <Connor> 80/20 is the company who makes the extrusion like that..
[15:38:27] <KreAture> no
[15:38:29] <Connor> comes in 1" and 1.5" profiles...
[15:38:47] <KreAture> 8020 isa profile from many suppliers 80/20 is the company
[15:38:52] <KreAture> :p
[15:39:02] <KreAture> I use 6030 from a german firm
[15:39:18] <witnit> I would expect you to be able to accomplish the same thing with using steel and then maybe overlaying it with linear bearing rails and just make backets to butt the ends it would be
[15:39:21] <witnit> cheaper
[15:39:34] <KreAture> no
[15:39:35] <KreAture> not here
[15:39:37] <KreAture> Norway
[15:40:18] <KreAture> also the sides of the gantry is muuuch stiffer in profile than in plate and I get the profiles precision cut for free
[15:40:29] <KreAture> I may use a single tilted profile though
[15:40:40] <KreAture> a single profile is much stiffer than a full size plate
[15:40:59] <KreAture> you can stiffen the plate but that doesn't look very nice and it's an additional item
[15:41:09] <KreAture> I am however looking into how to lean it down
[15:41:14] <Connor> I would use a single profile at angle vs the staggered arrangement any day..
[15:41:17] <KreAture> Oh and yes the pofiles are lighter than the plate would be too
[15:41:24] <KreAture> yeh
[15:41:34] <KreAture> only reason I have not yet is it doesn't fit with the fastener systems
[15:41:42] <KreAture> also it will not square up automatically
[15:42:24] <witnit> choosing the correct linear bearing system would allow you use the rail as a key structural point
[15:42:33] <KreAture> yeh
[15:42:37] <witnit> or larger polished shaft rails
[15:42:52] <witnit> dual instal of one, so you can avoid twisting
[15:42:55] <witnit> and succh
[15:42:55] <KreAture> that is another thing I wondered about but I wanted to use the fully supported ones as I wanted to preload all axis
[15:43:26] <KreAture> right now the z is not preloaded
[15:43:31] <KreAture> x and y are
[15:44:13] <witnit> what materials are you cutting with this?
[15:44:28] <KreAture> I am pondering moving the Z rails to the back of the Y so they can be preloaded in same manner and offset on back of gantry
[15:44:34] <bedah> work in progress: http://imgur.com/i9Ta2tO :D
[15:44:37] <KreAture> mostly wood and some alu (I hope)
[15:44:54] <KreAture> It's overengineered for wood but I wanted it to be rigid
[15:44:57] <KreAture> hehe
[15:45:05] <KreAture> also I got a deal on the rails
[15:45:37] <KreAture> if I use the backside for the Z I can get the Z closer to the Y and reduce the overhang
[15:45:41] <Connor> bedah: Those standoff's pass-through ?
[15:45:46] <KreAture> That drops one of the beams for the offset too
[15:46:14] <KreAture> oooh another cnc being born ?
[15:46:15] <witnit> hmm, I think 50% of your crossbeams could be relocated to the gantry for better support and less vibration in the cutting head
[15:46:16] <KreAture> :)
[15:46:39] <KreAture> waddya mean ?
[15:46:44] <zeeshan> thats a lot of aluminum
[15:46:45] <witnit> it almost seems like too much down low and not enough for as high as it goes
[15:46:46] <zeeshan> for motor mounts
[15:46:46] <bedah> pardon me, i'm not that good in english.. standoff? pass-through? these are mountings for steppers for a cheap proxon mf70 mill
[15:46:46] <zeeshan> lol
[15:46:50] <KreAture> There is lots not shown in model zeeshan
[15:46:53] <Connor> bedah: If so, not sure how well they'll do.. they could torque a bit..
[15:47:09] <zeeshan> if you have that much aluminum
[15:47:09] <zeeshan> send me some
[15:47:12] <zeeshan> i could use
[15:47:13] <zeeshan> :)
[15:47:21] <Connor> bedah: the brass colored parts.. bolt go through them, or screw into them ?
[15:47:32] <KreAture> zeeshan the gantry is going to be boxed or a standing member fills out the room between the two flat ones
[15:47:33] <bedah> bolt goes through
[15:47:49] <bedah> needed some spacers, and i found these in a drawer
[15:47:58] <zeeshan> KreAture: not you!
[15:47:59] <KreAture> zeeshan you can see the y leadscrew through the gap now but the gap is filled
[15:48:01] <KreAture> :)
[15:48:03] <zeeshan> bedah
[15:48:03] <zeeshan> :)
[15:48:05] <KreAture> oh
[15:48:06] <KreAture> hehe
[15:48:12] <zeeshan> http://i.imgur.com/i9Ta2tO.jpg
[15:48:13] <witnit> those are pretty bedah but those screw heads may come loose after usag
[15:48:16] <zeeshan> ^ referring to that pic
[15:48:27] <Connor> bedah: You might want to redesign then.. make your own stand off where bolts screw into them.. less likely to twist (torque) under load from the steppers..
[15:48:44] <bedah> yes.. found this brass skrews in another drawer ;D
[15:48:48] <zeeshan> those will definitely twist
[15:48:51] <Connor> It probably will work.. just letting you know.
[15:48:57] <witnit> make small tapers for them
[15:48:59] <zeeshan> backlash fail :P
[15:49:06] <witnit> and drop in the hole :P
[15:49:08] <bedah> aluminium is quite cheap, as scrap <5EUR per kilo
[15:49:20] <zeeshan> do you have a welder?
[15:49:25] <Connor> I made my own with lathe.. drill out, and tap.
[15:49:35] <zeeshan> Connor: make me some
[15:49:36] <zeeshan> im lazy
[15:49:40] <Connor> the bolted the steppers to them.
[15:49:55] <Connor> zeeshan: It's a little 7x10 lathe.. and it's in parts right now..
[15:49:56] <bedah> http://www.proxxon.com/en/micromot/27110.php this is a really small mill
[15:50:03] <zeeshan> honestly i dont like these stand off type mounts
[15:50:06] <bedah> maximum diameter 1/8" / 3mm
[15:50:06] <witnit> oohhhh
[15:50:10] <witnit> it is very small hahah
[15:50:24] <bedah> :D
[15:50:25] <Connor> probably be okay then. :)
[15:50:35] <witnit> you could write a program to give your wife manicure with it
[15:50:41] <bedah> hehe
[15:50:47] <witnit> :P
[15:51:00] <Connor> you laugh.. My wife would love that.. program it to do nail art...
[15:51:11] <witnit> i know im genius like that
[15:51:14] <zeeshan> http://www.aliexpress.com/item-img/Free-shipping-10Pcs-Nema-17-Stepper-Motor-Mounting-L-Bracket-Mount-Step-Stepping-for-Nema17-motor/1500320374.html
[15:51:16] <zeeshan> i like these
[15:51:24] <zeeshan> =D
[15:51:25] <witnit> like the post-it note printer...
[15:51:31] <bedah> maybe i can mill some parts for a bigger cnc
[15:51:31] <witnit> omg million dollar idea
[15:51:51] <Connor> bedah: What you using this machine for? PCB milling ?
[15:51:54] <Connor> learning ?
[15:52:24] <bedah> some aluminium, some pcbs, wood. it's for my local hackerspace
[15:52:30] <bedah> and learning
[15:52:40] <witnit> or... automated dog tag engraver via paypal/with php tag designer automated mailing attavhment and stamping, w/ video for end user to watch their dog tags being made
[15:52:54] <witnit> and sent automatically
[15:52:55] <bedah> got an old pentium4 with parallelport
[15:52:56] <witnit> :)
[15:52:59] <witnit> pro ideas
[15:54:27] <witnit> Connor you have free time, help me be a millionair with a couple of those idea
[15:54:43] <bedah> i want to mill some cases for circuits, and then i need some parts for a small robotic project. 3d printing sucks a bit.
[15:54:43] <witnit> we'll buy everyone in here mesa cards
[15:54:44] <Connor> No. I don't have free time. :(
[15:54:47] <witnit> lies
[15:54:53] <witnit> you are here, you are free
[15:55:08] <XXCoder1> lol
[15:55:12] <Connor> I'm am multi tasking.
[15:55:15] <witnit> see
[15:55:44] <XXCoder1> wonder how expensive that tiny cnc is
[15:57:27] <bedah> the mill: 250EUR
[15:57:41] <XXCoder1> interesting
[15:58:00] <XXCoder1> $500 roughly
[15:58:01] <Connor> XXCoder1: but, it's not CNC.
[15:58:07] <bedah> modified as cnc: double
[15:58:09] <witnit> why arent we mass producing micro mills and lathes
[15:58:14] <XXCoder1> oh
[15:58:36] <bedah> www.ebay.de/itm/271448882694 for example
[16:11:23] <zeeshan> http://i.imgur.com/Oi6baNi.jpg
[16:11:37] <zeeshan> im starting to load up all my alumnum solid/offcuts in one area
[16:11:44] <zeeshan> much more organized than having it lay all over the floor
[16:12:29] <XXCoder1> aw no more floor mess? heh
[16:12:40] <zeeshan> tired of floor mess !
[16:13:02] <zeeshan> archivist alive?
[16:13:04] <zeeshan> http://i.imgur.com/kE75jYJ.jpg
[16:13:08] <zeeshan> ever use this type of depth gauge?
[16:13:10] <zeeshan> brown & sharp
[16:13:31] <zeeshan> didnt come with multiple rods, but i've noticed that the one rod it does come with has index marks every 1"
[16:13:41] <zeeshan> you loosen the top screw and you can move the rod in/out
[16:14:00] <zeeshan> are you supposed to calibrate it every time using a surface plate and gauge blocks to make use of it?
[16:14:29] <zeeshan> i like this better than the starrett model i have because the rod is much smaller
[16:14:33] <zeeshan> you can actually fit it in o-ring grooves
[16:14:57] <zeeshan> also, anyone know what th eheck these 2 things are
[16:14:58] <zeeshan> http://i.imgur.com/ZzzhCCE.jpg
[16:15:20] <zeeshan> the long slender one says starrett. i thought it was some sort of scriber, but i dont see a pointy tip
[16:15:40] <zeeshan> and the fat round one is a brown and sharpe, can't tell what it is.. maybe a center punch?
[16:15:46] <zeeshan> shrug.
[16:16:33] <witnit> they put out a few things similar to those which were made to hold onto a radius gauge
[16:16:50] <witnit> so you could have your gauge on a stick for tight spots
[16:16:53] <zeeshan> hm i have a radius gauge set which uses a different type
[16:17:05] <witnit> maybe it has a similar purpose
[16:17:20] <zeeshan> i feel like you can unscrew the cap
[16:17:21] <zeeshan> but they're REALLY tight
[16:17:31] <zeeshan> before i go yanking on it, i wanna make sure it is what it is
[16:17:36] <witnit> whats are the numbers on it?
[16:17:40] <zeeshan> i can feel something rattling inside the thing
[16:17:45] <zeeshan> unfortunately, both dont have numbers on em
[16:18:03] <zeeshan> none that i can see at least
[16:27:42] <witnit> zeeshan
[16:27:53] <witnit> is there a hole in the cone of the fat one?
[16:27:57] <zeeshan> yes
[16:28:04] <witnit> put a small screwdriver there
[16:28:11] <witnit> and push in
[16:28:12] <witnit> hard
[16:28:16] <witnit> and see if it pops
[16:28:24] <witnit> I think thats a spring punch
[16:28:42] <zeeshan> okay ill try it out
[16:28:54] <witnit> you used a spring punch before?
[16:28:58] <zeeshan> yes
[16:29:01] <zeeshan> i have one import one
[16:29:02] <witnit> :) they are great
[16:42:22] <Swapper_> anyone have any ideas on how to control a +-10v servo as a spindle drive? cant find any examples where anyone have done it.
[16:43:39] <cradek> Swapper_: can you ask a more specific question? there's nothing unusual or difficult about that setup so it's hard to guess what help you need.
[16:43:51] <witnit> so like dc brush analog w/ tach feedback or what?
[16:43:55] <Swapper_> how do i handle the reversal of the spindle to send negative values ?
[16:44:05] <witnit> negative voltage
[16:44:18] <cradek> does your spindle go backward with negative and forward with positive input?
[16:44:27] <Swapper_> i can select whatever
[16:44:31] <Swapper_> in the drive
[16:44:47] <cradek> the spindle speed output from hal is just like that - you can simply hook it up
[16:45:54] <witnit> so the drive uses +/- 10v just output a scale of 0 no motion +1v clockwise 10% or say -5v is 50% counterclockwise
[16:46:02] <Swapper_> hum ok thaught that but i only got negative values when i tryed
[16:46:18] <cradek> maybe say more about what you tried?
[16:46:23] <witnit> what were you trying to do?
[16:46:26] <witnit> haha cradek
[16:46:28] <Swapper_> witnit: yea its comon on servoamps, all the axis run like this
[16:47:06] <Swapper_> ultimatley i want to attatch a pid to the spindle motor so i can get closed loop control over it
[16:47:09] <Swapper_> from linuxcnc
[16:47:22] <Swapper_> and after that get synced motion with the spindle running
[16:47:33] <Swapper_> but im lost at hal... :)
[16:48:31] <Swapper_> i got the other axies running and they are +-10v controlled (mesa 7i77) but the spindle dont seem to be configurable in pncconf as +-10v
[16:48:59] <cradek> you may have to stop using pncconf now that you have your basic setup working
[16:49:11] <Swapper_> yea i figured that
[16:49:11] <cradek> it's unlikely it will do absolutely everything you need
[16:49:40] <Swapper_> but then i had to ask if anyone had any good .hal examples for a +-10v spindle drive
[16:49:41] <cradek> if your drive is already velocity mode, I don't recommend using pid for speed control
[16:49:58] <WalterN> hmm
[16:50:16] <Swapper_> can i do syncronized moves without pid on the spindle ?
[16:50:22] <cradek> hook up motion.spindle-speed-out to your dac, scale it so it's about right, done
[16:50:25] <Swapper_> maybe the other axises syncs to it
[16:50:28] <cradek> yes absolutely
[16:50:34] <Swapper_> ahh ok
[16:50:34] <cradek> you need encoder feedback
[16:50:49] <Swapper_> yea i have the servo encoder hooked up
[16:50:56] <WalterN> what was that website that sold a nice little collection of cheap automation related stuff (ball screws, linear bearings, servos, steppers, drivers...)?
[16:51:12] <Swapper_> ebay.com ? :)
[16:51:45] <cradek> check out the motion man page: http://linuxcnc.org/docs/html/man/man9/motion.9.html
[16:52:00] <cradek> it talks about all the available hookups you might want to use
[16:52:30] <Swapper_> yea i tried understanding that...
[16:52:49] <cradek> have questions?
[16:52:59] * WalterN pokes CaptHindsight
[16:53:00] <Swapper_> whats the output for velocity called ?
[16:53:46] <cradek> find the one that says OUT and talks about spindle speed
[16:53:54] <cradek> there are actually two choices
[16:54:02] <Swapper_> net spindle-vel-cmd => hm2_5i25.0.7i77.0.1.analogout5
[16:54:02] <Swapper_> net machine-is-enabled => hm2_5i25.0.7i77.0.1.spinena
[16:54:03] <Swapper_> net machine-is-enabled => hm2_5i25.0.7i77.0.1.spinena
[16:55:28] <Swapper_> http://pastebin.com/0SiuH5eW
[16:57:06] <cradek> looks plausible
[16:59:21] <Swapper_> its only sending -10v so it always goes the wrong direction
[17:00:26] <witnit> both pin 20 and 24 on TB5 = -v?
[17:00:59] <witnit> which is drive 5 section of the 7i77
[17:01:57] <Swapper_> 20 is AOUT3
[17:02:02] <Swapper_> 24 is AOUT5
[17:02:16] <witnit> right
[17:02:27] <Swapper_> using 5 since it should have a individualy controlled enable pin
[17:02:30] <witnit> 24 I suppose send -v no matter the direction chosen right?
[17:02:42] <Swapper_> yea
[17:02:44] <Swapper_> exacly
[17:02:50] <witnit> I recally this issue
[17:02:59] <witnit> lemme try to see what I did
[17:03:15] <Swapper_> exelent if you cloud
[17:03:31] <Swapper_> could
[17:06:05] <witnit> http://linuxcnc.org/docs/html/examples/spindle.html
[17:06:09] <witnit> see the pwm options
[17:06:19] <witnit> in section two
[17:06:26] <witnit> compare to the section one
[17:06:33] <witnit> and see which you are trying to use
[17:10:05] <Swapper_> what i have does not look like tha t
[17:10:17] <witnit> well you should be using a pwm
[17:10:17] <Swapper_> seems like the hostmot drive have scaling ?=
[17:10:37] <witnit> like?
[17:10:40] <witnit> # Attach the pid to the scale, motion, and sum
[17:10:41] <witnit> net pid_feedback pid.0.feedback <= motion.spindle-speed-in <= scale.0.out
[17:10:41] <witnit> net pid_command pid.0.command <= motion.spindle-speed-out => sum2.0.in0
[17:10:41] <witnit> net pid_output pid.0.output => sum2.0.in1
[17:10:56] <Swapper_> loadrt hm2_pci config=" num_encoders=5 num_pwmgens=0 num_3pwmgens=0 num_stepgens=0 sserial_port_0=000xxxxx "
[17:11:05] <Swapper_> pwmgens=0
[17:13:24] <witnit> loadrt hm2_pci config="num_encoders=6 num_pwmgens=6 sserial_port_0=0XXX"
[17:13:36] <witnit> shouldnt it be like that or something?
[17:13:47] <Swapper_> no no dont have any pwm stepgens
[17:13:54] <Swapper_> only analog out
[17:14:01] <witnit> right being the 7i777
[17:14:05] <Swapper_> yea
[17:14:18] <witnit> but your just basically using another pwm and calling it a spindle instead of axis
[17:14:26] <witnit> but I think it MUST be on drive 5
[17:15:04] <witnit> this was well over a year ago :/ some of these guys would have you at the right documentation in 2 minutes
[17:15:26] <witnit> if I had my .hal here I would just send it
[17:15:33] <witnit> but its at the shop
[17:16:03] <Swapper_> hm2_5i25.0.7i77.0.1.analogout5 found the out pin
[17:16:18] <Swapper_> its connected to spindle-vel-cmd
[17:18:22] <Swapper_> weerd, when i command S300 the hm2_5i25.0.7i77.0.1.analogout5 gets a value of 300
[17:18:36] <Swapper_> feels like the scaling is off
[17:19:01] <Swapper_> but it is changing to negative as you said when i reverse
[17:19:53] <witnit> can you paste your full hal
[17:20:06] <Swapper_> shure
[17:22:26] <Swapper_> http://pastebin.com/HAsKc25f
[17:22:31] <Swapper_> the inifile is at the botom
[17:22:41] <Swapper_> so both files in same
[17:23:10] <Swapper_> i added MIN_OUTPUT = -10.0 so thats no use in the ini
[17:28:59] <witnit> you have someduplicate lines around 224
[17:29:26] <witnit> it seems like the enableamp is outputting to the pin instead of the actual scaled signal
[17:30:20] <witnit> I dont know enough about it anymore to say what to fix but im pretty sure its not getting the scaled values as a pwm
[17:31:34] <witnit> compare your two sections # ---PWM Generator signals/setup---
[17:31:34] <witnit>
[17:31:47] <witnit> for any axis vs your # ---PWM Generator signals/setup---
[17:31:47] <witnit> for the spindle
[17:32:00] <Swapper_> yea
[17:32:02] <Swapper_> will do that
[17:32:07] <XXCoder1> playing with cncsimulator. pretty cool, that.
[17:32:13] <Swapper_> i can now see the output value and its wrong
[17:32:20] <Swapper_> thank you a bunch!
[17:32:25] <witnit> I hope it works!
[17:32:33] <Swapper_> ill get there eventualy :)
[17:32:52] <witnit> yeah it was a long road for me and I dont even know what all I did but it works haahah
[17:33:14] <Swapper_> hehe im glad i got anyting moving )
[18:25:26] <XXCoder1> hey
[18:25:43] <R2E4> hey
[18:29:14] <WalterN> hey
[18:31:51] <R2E4> cncbasher around?
[18:33:07] * KreAture_Zzz need to finalize his cnc design
[18:33:12] <KreAture_Zzz> rails came 1 month early
[18:33:19] <KreAture_Zzz> now suddently I can build!
[18:33:23] <KreAture_Zzz> http://kreature.org/projects/cnc/linear_kit_itm301115860502.jpg
[18:33:24] <XXCoder1> awesom
[18:33:27] <KreAture_Zzz> love the kit
[18:33:43] <KreAture_Zzz> maybe not ideal with only sbr's but I think it will be good
[18:33:49] <XXCoder1> whats sizes? I guess its 300 900 1200
[18:33:50] <XXCoder1> mm
[18:33:51] <KreAture_Zzz> just need to utilize em well and preload all
[18:34:00] <KreAture_Zzz> 1000x700x300
[18:34:08] <XXCoder1> cool
[18:34:11] <KreAture_Zzz> no wait
[18:34:15] <KreAture_Zzz> 1100x700x300
[18:34:19] <KreAture_Zzz> I remember now
[18:34:20] <KreAture_Zzz> hehe
[18:34:23] <XXCoder1> lol ok
[18:34:36] <XXCoder1> how much was it if you dont mind?
[18:34:45] <KreAture_Zzz> I got em to set up a custom ebay
[18:34:50] <KreAture_Zzz> http://www.ebay.com/itm/301115860502
[18:34:56] <KreAture_Zzz> Really happy with the shipping
[18:34:59] <KreAture_Zzz> faster than expectedf
[18:35:03] <KreAture_Zzz> and I am in NOrway
[18:35:03] <KreAture_Zzz> hehe
[18:35:13] <XXCoder1> lol ok
[18:35:14] <KreAture_Zzz> Got package today
[18:35:51] <KreAture_Zzz> I paid 6'th march
[18:35:58] <XXCoder1> :) cant wait to start buying actual physical parts lol
[18:36:21] <KreAture_Zzz> I have been planning based on the rail dimensions
[18:36:55] <KreAture_Zzz> aka, hole distance is 30mm, predrilled, so I will be using 60x30 profile that will allow me to use the t slots for mounting
[18:37:16] <XXCoder1> nice!
[18:37:24] <XXCoder1> if I had more money I'd have went for 8020 also
[18:37:35] <XXCoder1> right now I'll just use scrap wood and stuff lol
[18:37:40] <KreAture_Zzz> Not happy yet though, trying to use profiles as much as possible as I get those precut for free and precision ground
[18:37:50] <XXCoder1> I gopt lucky and found high quality lamated wood in trash
[18:37:58] <KreAture_Zzz> my curent plan: http://kreature.org/projects/cnc/cnc2_12.png
[18:38:22] <XXCoder1> hmm one of rails is upside down isnt that bad
[18:38:41] <KreAture_Zzz> not when preloaded
[18:38:56] <XXCoder1> ok. definitely need to learn about that.
[18:38:57] <KreAture_Zzz> The plan is to "clamp down" by boxing the designs
[18:39:12] <KreAture_Zzz> That should allow rails to work with minimum slop and max smoothness
[18:39:23] <KreAture_Zzz> I do the same on the sides of the table
[18:39:51] <KreAture_Zzz> The gantry clamps to preload the guides
[18:40:31] <KreAture_Zzz> Bed will need to be a tad longer though, or travel will be limited by legs
[18:40:39] <KreAture_Zzz> hehe
[18:40:47] <XXCoder1> makes sense
[18:43:09] * KreAture_Zzz sleeps on it
[18:44:31] <XXCoder1> heh
[18:44:37] <XXCoder1> make cnc large enough to make bed
[18:44:42] <XXCoder1> and BE a bed lol
[18:45:54] <R2E4> Anyone have a post for Aspire with toolchanger?
[18:50:43] <XXCoder1> heh my kerbial ship is finally orbiting and lanbding in kerbin. those kerbians havent seen their homeworld for uyear
[18:59:14] <XXCoder1> KreAture_Zzz: whats you use to make those pics
[19:17:19] <R2E4> Thats something like inventor or google sketch
[19:17:29] <XXCoder1> hmm ok
[19:18:03] <R2E4> Did youbuild yours yet XXcoder
[19:18:14] <XXCoder1> nah it'll be while
[19:21:10] <R2E4> I have decided to upgrade my old BOSS 8 controll on my bridgeport for LinuxCNC. LinuxCNC just fucking works. ITs incredible.
[19:21:20] <XXCoder1> yeah? cool :)
[19:21:36] <XXCoder1> too damn bad theres no cam that good and free like linuxcnc
[19:21:37] <PetefromTn_> yeah man I concurr..
[19:22:05] <R2E4> XXcoder: heeks is free
[19:22:11] <R2E4> Hey Pete
[19:22:12] <XXCoder1> it crashes
[19:22:20] <PetefromTn_> hey R2
[19:22:31] <XXCoder1> I nevrr could get it to run realiable. it keeps crashing when I modify stuff
[19:22:41] <R2E4> I just got a contract for 25 handbrake levers.
[19:22:48] <PetefromTn_> nice..
[19:22:55] <XXCoder1> cool :)
[19:23:23] <R2E4> I figured it would be like this. I want it finished completely.
[19:23:38] <PetefromTn_> I know what you mean.
[19:23:56] <R2E4> Howz your toolchanger coming along?
[19:25:24] <R2E4> The bridgeport control uses Incremental for corners, moves/stops/moves/stops..... pain in the ass. Takes twice as long.
[19:25:59] <PetefromTn_> I programmed five different parts in Mastercam today and machined them.... Wish I could find that kinda work for my machine
[19:26:54] <R2E4> That scope you did was badass...... I was amazed. Nice work.
[19:27:11] <R2E4> Cant you sell them to gun shops?
[19:27:20] <PetefromTn_> the scope wheel?
[19:27:30] <R2E4> yeah
[19:28:15] <PetefromTn_> thanks.. yeah I made a few of them but they are a kinda specialized niche item that does not sell in any real quantities,
[19:30:23] <R2E4> How did youdothe round portion of the gear looking outside profile? Just run a .75 ballnose through it?
[19:31:09] <PetefromTn_> you mean the outside edge detail?
[20:16:19] <Connor> Well.. crap.. upgrading my pump from the parts washer pump to the bilge pump.. parts washer was a 110v pump and was planning on using a SSR, but the new pump is 12v. I'll have to use something else for it.. use 12v from the PC Power supply...
[20:16:44] <Connor> I wonder if a Tip120 would be enough to drive the pump.. I think they pull around 2 or so amps and can spike to 5amps.
[20:22:14] <jdh> not a great application for a bilge pump
[20:22:45] <jdh> HF has smallish fountain pumps
[20:23:29] <Connor> Already have the pump.. why not a good application fro one ?
[20:23:33] <Connor> for oe
[20:23:38] <Connor> one. Dang it.. can't type.
[20:24:15] <jdh> they aren't made for head pressure
[20:24:18] <Connor> Good for fresh or salt water, and it's a impeller driven pump.
[20:24:37] <jdh> how high does it have to pump?
[20:24:56] <Connor> Depends on the line size..
[20:25:00] <Connor> let me get a picture.. brb
[20:25:36] <Connor> http://www.cnczone.com/forums/attachments/f164/231748d1397091194-connors-g0704-mill_04_09_14_05-jpg
[20:25:41] <Connor> can you open that?
[20:26:14] <witnit> You are not logged in or you do not have permission to access this page. This could be due to one of several reasons:
[20:26:28] <Connor> crap. let me ftp the files up to my server.
[20:27:30] <jdh> is that the fox-whatever stand?
[20:27:32] <Connor> from the 3/4pvc it goes to 3/8" ID cleave flex line.
[20:27:49] <Connor> the base? Yes. From grizzly.
[20:27:56] <Connor> but, fox shop brand I think
[20:28:10] <Connor> http://www.ivdc.com/cnc/mill_04_09_14_05.jpg
[20:28:29] <jdh> which size is the stand? sturdy enough?
[20:28:40] <Connor> after it makes it up to the 3.5' mark in 3/4 PVC, it has to go up around 6'
[20:29:07] <witnit> cutting fluid or oil?
[20:29:12] <jdh> does it pump ok that high?
[20:29:16] <Connor> D2260A - Mini Mobile Base
[20:29:21] <jdh> thanks
[20:29:24] <Connor> Very sturdy.
[20:29:36] <Connor> Dunno yet.. I just got it plumped in.. Not fired up the pump yet.
[20:29:44] <Connor> If it doesn't the pump was only $11.00
[20:29:56] <Connor> it's 800GPH pump
[20:30:12] <witnit> alot of cutting oil tends to make plastics brittle
[20:30:50] <witnit> I would expect that to be the most likely problem over 2 years
[20:31:00] <Connor> witnit: Just water soluble coolant
[20:31:01] <Tom_itx> so then he can spend another $11
[20:31:06] <jdh> I use 1500's on my boat. They derate by half for 1ft head
[20:31:23] <Connor> jdh: Are you kidding? Dang.
[20:31:37] <PetefromTn_Andro> Yeah dang...
[20:31:42] <Tom_itx> get a fuel pump
[20:31:51] <jdh> still 400gph!
[20:32:29] <Connor> http://www.harborfreight.com/620-gph-submersible-fountain-pump-68393.html
[20:32:39] <Connor> says head lift is 11.5'
[20:32:51] <Connor> Not sure of thats 620 at 11.5'
[20:33:54] <Connor> jdh: Doesn't head height depend on the diameter of the pipe etc ?
[20:35:15] <jdh> yeah. bilge pumps assume hose of whatever size the fitting is.
[20:35:21] <Connor> I'm also a little concerned that my water tank is too small.. I think it's around 3 to 3.5 gallons
[20:35:24] <jdh> so,small line might be fine
[20:35:47] <Connor> Well.. since it's going from 3/4" to 3/8" around 3.5' mark.. maybe I'll be okay..
[20:36:10] <Connor> I'll have it hooked up by the weekend for testing.. way before I build the control circuit to run it from the PC.
[20:42:59] <zeeshan> connor no
[20:43:00] <zeeshan> its 11 ft at 0 gph
[20:43:02] <zeeshan> and who knows what head @ 620gph
[20:43:03] <zeeshan> can't tell without a flow chart for the pump
[20:43:10] <Connor> I'm going to be pretty ticked off if this pump doesn't work better than the cheap a$$ pump for the parts washer..
[20:43:43] <zeeshan> itll work
[20:43:44] <zeeshan> you know what head is right?
[20:43:44] <Connor> Figures.
[20:43:55] <zeeshan> it refers to the fluid height level it can pump to
[20:44:00] <zeeshan> not the length of the pipe youre running
[20:44:03] <Connor> The height above the pump
[20:44:06] <zeeshan> yes
[20:44:12] <zeeshan> you'll be okay
[20:44:16] <zeeshan> that thing looks beefy enough
[20:44:34] <Connor> That's the harbor freight model. that's NOT the one I have..
[20:44:37] <Connor> I have this one..
[20:44:39] <zeeshan> o
[20:45:16] <Connor> http://shoreline-marinedevelopment.com/products-bilgepump
[20:45:27] <Connor> SL52259Bilge Pump 800 GPH 3/4"
[20:45:33] <zeeshan> that looks even fancier
[20:45:33] <zeeshan> :p
[20:46:07] <Connor> jdh: (Who has a boat and dives allot) said bilge pumps really not designed for allot of head.
[20:47:14] <Connor> I know very little about pumps.
[20:48:01] <zeeshan> http://www.watcopumps.com/images/2_11/chart_2.gif
[20:48:11] <zeeshan> usually pumps come with a pump curve like that
[20:48:20] <zeeshan> which pretty much answers will it work or not :P
[20:48:36] <jdh> the impeller on bilge pumps is usually not so tight to handle trash/debris
[20:48:43] <Connor> yea, higher end ones.. I don't think the ones at harbor freight or those cheap bilge pumps would
[20:48:54] <zeeshan> cheap fuel pumps come with those curves
[20:48:58] <zeeshan> the way you choose a pump is like this
[20:49:14] <zeeshan> first you determine your system curve (based on what type of pipe you're running, how long it is, how many fittings there are etc)
[20:49:23] <zeeshan> and throw that info into the energy equation
[20:49:30] <zeeshan> http://www.mcnallyinstitute.com/18-html/18-images/18-3.gif
[20:49:32] <zeeshan> red curve
[20:49:39] <zeeshan> then you have the pump curve
[20:49:45] <zeeshan> and you see if its possible :P
[20:49:59] <zeeshan> or you can do it with trial and error =D
[20:50:07] <Connor> But, does that take into account changes in hose sizing ?
[20:50:11] <zeeshan> yea
[20:50:17] <zeeshan> everytime you have a fitting change
[20:50:23] <zeeshan> you have an associated "k" factor
[20:50:30] <jdh> they also derate for elbows/etc
[20:50:38] <zeeshan> basically that tells you how much head loss you'll have
[20:50:43] <zeeshan> anytime you have a fitting size change
[20:50:52] <zeeshan> doesnt matter if its going up or down in size, you will always have head loss
[20:51:02] <zeeshan> due to recirculation zones
[20:51:25] <Connor> a 90, a T, another 90, another 90, another 90, and yet another 90. to get it into chip tray.
[20:52:08] <Connor> http://www.ivdc.com/cnc/mill_04_09_14_05.jpg
[20:52:21] <Connor> shows the T and 2 of the 90's. the other 3 90s are in the back.
[20:52:25] <zeeshan> that looks nice :D
[20:53:11] <Connor> those little wood blocks the straps are screwed too are glued in place too.. so I don't have to worry about re-positioning them if I have to take it apart.
[20:53:46] <Connor> I'll run a 3/4" clear flex hose from the pump up to that fitting.
[20:53:57] <Connor> Those things are so dang tight.. do you even need a hose clamp ?
[20:54:25] <zeeshan> the plastic nipple?
[20:54:27] <zeeshan> with the barbs?
[20:54:33] <zeeshan> i'm lost :P
[20:54:34] <Connor> the barbed connectors
[20:54:45] <zeeshan> the grey one?
[20:54:58] <Connor> the one DEAD center of the screen.
[20:55:05] <zeeshan> so the grey one
[20:55:07] <zeeshan> :P
[20:55:11] <zeeshan> yea those need hose clamps
[20:55:14] <Connor> it's milky white. but okay. :)
[20:55:59] <Connor> the connector on the left is for my water hose hookup to wash out the chip tray..
[20:56:02] <zeeshan> http://www.fastflowpump.com/images/bilge-upper-lower-impeller.gif
[20:56:09] <zeeshan> if its that type of impeller
[20:56:18] <zeeshan> i think it can easily handle small debris
[20:56:19] <Connor> I may have to down size that to a 3/8" ID line with maybe a air hose sprayer or something.
[20:56:23] <jdh> most bilge pumps are centrifgul
[20:56:42] <Connor> It has a impeller in the bottom of it..
[20:56:45] <Connor> visiable.
[20:56:51] <Connor> visible.
[20:57:02] <jdh> it just flings water to the output
[20:57:07] <zeeshan> oh
[20:57:10] <zeeshan> interesting
[20:57:29] <zeeshan> just try it out :P
[20:57:35] <zeeshan> it s a little late to be sitting and doing calcuations
[20:57:38] <Connor> plan on it.
[20:57:54] <Connor> zeeshan: I'm a try it and see if it works kinda person on some things..
[20:59:12] <Connor> Need to wait for the pvc cement to dry up.. man that stuff globs up inside the pipe.. I think it's the kind I'm using.. I don't remember the other stuff doing that..
[20:59:31] <zeeshan> that shit dries up pretty instanteously
[20:59:32] <Connor> The old stuff was clear.. the new stuff is kinda milky clear..
[20:59:45] <Connor> it's thicker...
[20:59:51] <zeeshan> i used the grey kind for my central vac pipes
[21:00:18] <Connor> okay. Need to go throw something in the oven..
[21:00:23] <Connor> back on my ipad in a bit.
[21:00:35] <Connor> http://www.ivdc.com/cnc/mill_04_09_14_02.jpg
[21:00:46] <Connor> reworked with the top rail moved to the bottom so I don't bang my head
[21:04:06] <Connor_iPad> Yo. On ipad now. I miss anything?
[21:04:15] <XXCoder1> yeah
[21:04:24] <XXCoder1> someone went off rail
[21:04:28] <XXCoder1> jk
[21:04:38] <Connor_iPad> You? :)
[21:06:08] <XXCoder1> heh
[21:06:20] <XXCoder1> cncsimulator dont seem to like cambam files
[21:06:33] <PetefromTn_Andro> Looking real nice Connor..
[21:07:13] <Connor_iPad> Thanks PetefromTn_Andro
[21:07:25] <XXCoder1> fake machine went off borders fir some reason. I'm beginning to know why though, it works around zero and it was at corner
[21:07:25] <Connor_iPad> You get your encoder mount made?
[21:08:16] <PetefromTn_Andro> LOL nope had daughter's birthday party last weekend and some other stuff pop up.
[21:08:51] <PetefromTn_Andro> At the rate I am going this bitch will never be finished
[21:10:30] <Connor_iPad> Yea. When you work and only have weekends to do stuff. And stuff fills those up. Stuff doesn't get done.
[21:10:30] <PetefromTn_Andro> I did manage to rigid tap 1/4-20 5/8 deep into tool steel parts today 40 times without any problems tho LOL....at work.
[21:10:44] <witnit> nice
[21:11:11] <witnit> i always try for 1/4 -28 option
[21:11:21] <R2E4> On the HAAS?
[21:11:37] <Connor_iPad> Why 1/4-28?
[21:11:40] <R2E4> IS it a VF-2?
[21:11:52] <witnit> easier to tap the fine threads
[21:11:53] <PetefromTn_Andro> Well my wife is normally off on Friday's but they asked her to work this Friday so the kids are in school and I will be home by myself. Should be able to get something done then LOL.
[21:12:12] <Connor_iPad> Nice
[21:12:17] <PetefromTn_Andro> Yeah on HAAS VF2..
[21:12:43] <humble_sea_bass> what is this team fighting garbage
[21:13:07] <Connor_iPad> humble_sea_bass: Huh?
[21:13:07] <PetefromTn_Andro> Never rigid tapped tool steel before and thought sure as hell I would hear the snap crunch sound..
[21:13:10] <humble_sea_bass> whoops wrong channel
[21:13:20] <witnit> hahaha I figured as much humble
[21:14:49] <PetefromTn_Andro> It amazes me how they cut stuff at work. I mean I know the calculators are supposed to be spot on but even in tougher materials they make some impressive cuts at times..
[21:15:05] <XXCoder1> lol
[21:15:27] <XXCoder1> way you stated it made it seem that they use calculators as cutting tool :P
[21:15:50] <humble_sea_bass> yeah. HP47 calculators can rigid tap
[21:16:15] <PetefromTn_Andro> LOL no it seems like each Guy there uses a different method to find speeds and feeds.
[21:16:26] <Connor_iPad> Really?
[21:16:45] <Connor_iPad> Do they all come up with the same value In the end ?
[21:17:01] <toastyde1th> wut
[21:17:10] <witnit> my method is " looks good" run it there
[21:17:18] <toastyde1th> The only difference in speed and feed calculation is what sfm and chip load you're shooting for
[21:17:19] <toastyde1th> that's it
[21:17:36] <toastyde1th> the actual calculation is the same no matter who is doing it
[21:17:57] <PetefromTn_Andro> I have used the FSwizard for awhile but I mostly cut aluminum which is butter in comparison but I find it matches pretty closely to what the guys come up with most of the time but they are always pushing faster than I am comfortable with due to my experience level.
[21:18:23] <toastyde1th> if you have carbide tooling, aluminum will cut as fast as you want to go
[21:18:35] <humble_sea_bass> i keep a speeds and feed manual handy at all times http://irclo.gr/i/143933/BkzYc2UIQAAbdSI.jpg
[21:18:40] <witnit> the problem with aluminum is you can run it REALLY fast but most guys here dont have the machine to hold onto the workpiece
[21:18:52] <PetefromTn_Andro> Yeah I know....they proved that to me several times now hehe
[21:18:53] <XXCoder1> toasty wouldnt too fast and such make bit too er hot?
[21:19:07] <witnit> you can actually make the part cooler by cutting faster
[21:19:28] <witnit> because if you take away the material at a high enough rate the heat stays in the shavings
[21:19:30] <toastyde1th> XXCoder1, not really
[21:19:35] <XXCoder1> guess by ejecting hot recently cut er swarf?
[21:19:35] <witnit> and not passing into the material
[21:19:37] <toastyde1th> the faster you cut, the higher proportion of heat stays in the chip
[21:19:44] <toastyde1th> also
[21:19:57] <Connor_iPad> That's feed not rpm.
[21:20:01] <PetefromTn_Andro> I just don't have the experience cutting steels that they do and I am really surprised at what is possible.
[21:20:04] <toastyde1th> no, that's rpm
[21:20:13] <witnit> feed
[21:20:15] <Connor_iPad> Too much rpm and not enough feed will melt your material.
[21:20:16] <witnit> haha
[21:20:22] <witnit> yeah
[21:20:37] <toastyde1th> when you're talking about cutting aluminum at extremely high speed, you ARE melting the metal
[21:20:48] <witnit> ?
[21:20:57] <toastyde1th> the chip comes off the tool interface molten
[21:21:02] <toastyde1th> and solidifies within a few inches
[21:21:48] <PetefromTn_Andro> They have one or two machines with 10k spindles they run aluminum parts on and it is like stupid fast feed rates if they are making more then a few of the same parts.
[21:22:23] <Connor_iPad> I need to get some carbide cutters for alumn. Everything I have is HSS
[21:22:40] <witnit> I like seco stuff
[21:22:44] <Connor_iPad> Picking cutters is hard for a novice. Way too many options.
[21:22:45] <toastyde1th> 10k rpm and a 5" facemill
[21:22:45] <witnit> for inserts
[21:22:53] <toastyde1th> throws some chips
[21:22:58] <PetefromTn_Andro> In steels they are using these Korean altin coated mills called v7 or something. Apparently they rs quite reasonable and kick ass from what I have seen.
[21:23:19] <toastyde1th> Connor_iPad, hss is far better for home shop
[21:23:27] <toastyde1th> easier to resharpen well, and is shock resistant
[21:23:59] <toastyde1th> carbide tends to be a waste of money for home use
[21:24:04] <witnit> you should have a couple finishing and roughing insert holders imo
[21:24:16] <witnit> rlly?
[21:24:17] <PetefromTn_Andro> I was making passes full depth of part
[21:24:26] <toastyde1th> i'd rather grind bits for home use by hand any day
[21:24:40] <witnit> I use carbide insterts often
[21:24:48] <XXCoder1> advanges of owning shop and having skills I guess
[21:25:06] <witnit> much better system for boring bars too is inserts
[21:25:07] <toastyde1th> not really, a bench grinder is like 80-100 bucks from harbor freight
[21:25:12] <toastyde1th> it's crappy, but gets the job done
[21:25:13] <PetefromTn_Andro> .625 deep with a .060 width of cut at like 23 IPM in that tool steel today. Sounded smooth and cut clean as hell. .005 finished pass
[21:25:21] <toastyde1th> and HSS tooling on lathes will take MUCH more of a beating
[21:25:28] <XXCoder1> toasty ahh so skills with basic tool it is then lol
[21:25:39] <toastyde1th> yeah, but you get those skills by doing it
[21:25:40] <Connor_iPad> toastyde1th: I don't have a good bench grinder. The one I have is a mini grinder and I need to replace the wheel. And I don't know how to sharpen end mills.
[21:25:54] <toastyde1th> yeah don't resharpen end mills on your own, that requires a seperate machine
[21:25:59] <witnit> taps are tough without a tapgrinder
[21:26:01] <toastyde1th> you can rig it
[21:26:02] <XXCoder1> I do have one of those grinder/polisher maching
[21:26:06] <witnit> I use a hybco
[21:26:07] <XXCoder1> it has two wheels
[21:26:08] <toastyde1th> but you have to build an air grinding fixture
[21:26:25] <toastyde1th> not hard if you have a lathe
[21:26:28] <toastyde1th> but time consuming
[21:26:33] <XXCoder1> I suppose cnc lathe could automate it lol
[21:26:38] <toastyde1th> not really
[21:26:44] <toastyde1th> i'd rather do it on a manual lathe
[21:26:46] <PetefromTn_Andro> Even with my RF45 I used carbide threw flutes from maritool in aluminum and they kicked ass... never really cares for hss mills.
[21:27:03] <XXCoder1> cool
[21:27:15] <XXCoder1> too bad my friend never used his machinist skills
[21:27:21] <Connor_iPad> See, that's just it. End mills are really a personal preference
[21:27:23] <toastyde1th> cnc is nice if you're making one part with a bunch of complicated geometry or twenty of something
[21:27:26] <XXCoder1> he got health issues that got worse after graduating
[21:27:39] <toastyde1th> but most of the time, under ~5 parts it's faster on a manual machine
[21:28:04] <witnit> toasty what lathe do you use?
[21:28:12] <toastyde1th> a bunch of them?
[21:28:22] <toastyde1th> i don't own any machines
[21:28:26] <toastyde1th> i was a machinist for a bit
[21:28:38] <PetefromTn_Andro> We have both manual mills and CNC vmcs of course in the shop. Certain things are done on each but most stuff is CNC....
[21:28:39] <witnit> once a machinist always a machinist!@
[21:28:40] <witnit> :P
[21:28:44] <R2E4> How far over do you go and down for a chamfer with a 90 degree bit? How do you calculate that?
[21:28:51] <toastyde1th> eyeball it
[21:29:13] <R2E4> I am running it in my cam and It dont show up....lol
[21:29:17] <witnit> pythagorian theory
[21:29:28] <PetefromTn_Andro> I program it based on the width of cut I need ...
[21:29:41] <witnit> im not being serious.. I dont think
[21:29:42] <witnit> hahgah
[21:29:42] <toastyde1th> on CNC i never chamfer with a seperate bit
[21:29:54] <toastyde1th> I program the chamfer into the toolpath finish pass
[21:30:17] <toastyde1th> if you can ballpark tool nose radius it'll be fine
[21:30:17] <Connor_iPad> How does that work?
[21:30:34] <toastyde1th> connor, what do you mean
[21:30:49] <R2E4> If you have specs and drawing you need to go by, you cant eyeball it....lol
[21:31:09] <toastyde1th> sure you can, if it's a breakedge just call it a .002 chamfer
[21:31:09] <Connor_iPad> What sort of end,I'll would you use for both chamfer and normal milling ?
[21:31:18] <toastyde1th> oh, for MILLING
[21:31:21] <toastyde1th> that's much easier
[21:31:23] <PetefromTn_Andro> I usually draw quick cad drawing of the tool bit and determined the depth of cut and engagement I need that way...it is quite easy.
[21:31:41] <toastyde1th> I use a countersink to chamfer on a mill
[21:32:04] <toastyde1th> what I do is set the tool offset to a radius of like .020"
[21:32:05] <Connor_iPad> Not talking turning. Talking milling. :)
[21:32:22] <PetefromTn_Andro> Then when I setup the tool length offset I raise it like .005 just to creep up on the face widtth.
[21:32:45] <toastyde1th> then, when touching the tool off, I bring the tool down, touch, and let the path run
[21:33:02] <toastyde1th> stop the machine, and drop the tool until the depth of the chamfer looks good
[21:33:23] <toastyde1th> send it home, move the tool length offset down however much i moved it, and rerun the pass
[21:33:35] <toastyde1th> this way you can recycle any toolpath you have as a chamfer pass
[21:33:57] <toastyde1th> and the tool, when sent to Z0, will chamfer to whatever depth you want
[21:34:26] <toastyde1th> if the drawing calls out specific chamfers, you set the Z0 height to just barely touching the edge
[21:34:51] <toastyde1th> and then you can just drop the thing down however much the drawing calls for - a .040" chamfer gets dropped .040", a breakedge gets dropped .002", etc
[21:35:43] <Connor_iPad> toastyde1th: Your wood router still going ?
[21:35:50] <toastyde1th> ....wood router?
[21:36:00] <Connor_iPad> I thought you made one.
[21:36:22] <toastyde1th> nope, not me
[21:36:28] <R2E4> PetefromTn_Andro: thats a good idea. I'll try that.
[21:36:43] <PetefromTn_Andro> There is a formula that works using the triangle geometry for the square root of 2 or 1.414 I think plus whatever face width you want or something like that.
[21:36:54] <toastyde1th> nobody calls out a chamfer by face width
[21:37:13] <toastyde1th> it's either depth X angle, or depth X depth
[21:37:15] <PetefromTn_Andro> Sure they do...
[21:37:44] <toastyde1th> that's not an accepted iso or ansi standard in mechanical drawing that i'm aware of
[21:38:07] <PetefromTn_Andro> We get it all the time on the drawings in the shop.
[21:38:12] <toastyde1th> that's horrifying
[21:38:31] <PetefromTn_Andro> Lots of metric stuff from places like density etc..
[21:38:39] <R2E4> .03 over and .08 down gives me a chamfer face of .0715. Theres a formula in there spomewhere....hehe
[21:39:03] <PetefromTn_Andro> Did you do it in cad?
[21:39:05] <toastyde1th> yeah, it's all basic trig, but it should be done by the drafstman and called out in one of the internationally understood ways
[21:39:17] <toastyde1th> not just some random thing that someone dreams up just because
[21:39:33] <R2E4> yeah, I did it in cad like you said. Works good. See how it does in real life....hehe
[21:39:35] <toastyde1th> i hate drawings with invented symbols and other shit on it
[21:39:59] <R2E4> What is the standard toastyde1th?
[21:40:07] <XXCoder1> r2 heh once I finally have working cnc lets see how well my cnc toolpaths work lol
[21:40:09] <R2E4> X,Y?
[21:40:17] <toastyde1th> either X,Y or depth X angle
[21:40:33] <toastyde1th> or just the chamfer symbol and a depth
[21:40:37] <PetefromTn_Andro> Yeah like I said set your TLO for surface but add like five thousandths and then creep up by rerunning that part of the code
[21:40:40] <toastyde1th> which is understood to be a 45 deg
[21:41:04] <R2E4> Yeah, you need the degree factor also.
[21:41:16] <Connor_iPad> So, how common is it to have a air blast line AND coolant?
[21:41:28] <toastyde1th> pretty common
[21:41:40] <R2E4> I have it on my machine
[21:41:48] <toastyde1th> coolant is good for hard roughing at slow speeds
[21:41:55] <toastyde1th> and air is for really high speed cutting with fragile tooling
[21:42:16] <PetefromTn_Andro> Remember lots of stuff is not necessarily 45 degrees some countersink screws are 38 degree and others as well. Gotta read the prints carefully.
[21:42:18] <R2E4> LEt me run this part
[21:43:12] <Connor_iPad> They use loc line for air too?
[21:43:20] <toastyde1th> connor, ya
[21:43:28] <Connor_iPad> I'll have to make another manifold. :(
[21:43:51] <toastyde1th> i mean you could use whatever you want
[21:44:00] <toastyde1th> one of our machines had a bunch of plain ass copper tubing
[21:44:05] <toastyde1th> just bent to convenient angles
[21:44:38] <zeeshan> okay
[21:44:45] <zeeshan> so tom lipton thinks those tools are a plumb bob
[21:44:49] <zeeshan> hm
[21:44:54] <toastyde1th> what tools?
[21:45:05] <zeeshan> http://i.imgur.com/ZzzhCCE.jpg
[21:45:09] <zeeshan> the bottom fat one
[21:45:09] <Connor_iPad> Just made my current on. 1 horizontal through hole and two button holes.
[21:45:17] <zeeshan> he thinks is a plumb bob, areally old one
[21:45:37] <toastyde1th> what's the tip look like?
[21:45:40] <jdh> NPT?
[21:45:41] <zeeshan> the top thing he thinks is some ID measurement tool
[21:45:43] <toastyde1th> just solid hunk of metal?
[21:45:45] <zeeshan> toastyde1th: its kind of blunt
[21:45:48] <zeeshan> no
[21:45:53] <zeeshan> you see the left side ?
[21:45:55] <toastyde1th> on the top thing, does the left end press in?
[21:45:56] <zeeshan> that pops off
[21:46:06] <zeeshan> toastyde1th: no it screws out
[21:46:15] <zeeshan> let me take a better pic.
[21:46:17] <toastyde1th> cool, that's definitely a telescope gauge
[21:46:21] <Connor_iPad> jdh: Yea. Made it out of alum. 1/4" NTP
[21:46:29] <toastyde1th> no idea what the bottom thing is if it's a solid chunk of metal
[21:46:40] <zeeshan> telescope gage?
[21:46:45] <toastyde1th> gauge, not gage
[21:46:46] <zeeshan> explain!
[21:46:58] <zeeshan> how is it supposed to work?
[21:47:00] <toastyde1th> gages are fixed-size reference artifacts
[21:47:09] <toastyde1th> gauges take relative measurements
[21:47:13] <toastyde1th> you put it in a bore
[21:47:16] <toastyde1th> and screw it out
[21:47:26] <jdh> I got a tapered NPT bit/reamer thing with a bunch of stuff. Makes taper tapping a lot easier.
[21:47:33] <zeeshan> so those tapered ends are supposed to screw?
[21:47:34] <toastyde1th> and move it around carefully to try and barely hit the apex
[21:47:36] <zeeshan> they seem sized.
[21:47:45] <toastyde1th> then you take a micrometer
[21:47:46] <zeeshan> *seized
[21:47:49] <toastyde1th> and measure the length of the bar
[21:47:58] <Connor_iPad> Jdh I just have cheap harbor freight npt tapes.
[21:48:16] <toastyde1th> screw-type telescoping gauges are rarer
[21:48:24] <toastyde1th> and are used more for go-no-go applications
[21:48:26] <Connor_iPad> Having to tap 4 holes in alumn sucked.
[21:48:38] <jdh> yea me too. Got some really nice ones with that bit thing though. npt sucks to tap in a straight hole
[21:49:11] <R2E4> hmmm. The chamfer doesnt show in the cam sim.
[21:49:15] <Connor_iPad> Yup. I guess the tapered reamer helps.
[21:50:01] <PetefromTn> We use a tapered endmill to clearance the hole before rigid tapping with the not.
[21:50:01] <XXCoder1> r2 you sure it wasnt just missing stock?
[21:50:08] <PetefromTn> Npt
[21:50:11] <Connor_iPad> I might just make another manifold same size as current one and stack them.
[21:51:00] <PetefromTn> R2 a lot of lower priced CAM packaged cannot simulate champfer mills or ball endmills.
[21:51:30] <XXCoder1> pete openscam seem to work just fine with ball endmill
[21:51:38] <R2E4> If I over exaggerate the cnhamfer it will show.
[21:51:40] <XXCoder1> no idewa on compfers
[21:52:24] <PetefromTn> Then if it shows with the exxageration then something else is probably wrong.
[21:52:24] <R2E4> I'm going to cut the part and set it up like toast said to see if it cuts anything.
[21:52:56] <PetefromTn> Good luck.
[21:53:04] <R2E4> .08 over and .08 down in cad cuts .05 chamfer face.
[21:53:47] <XXCoder1> with 45 angle?
[21:53:58] <R2E4> yes
[21:54:01] <Connor_iPad> PetefromTn: You need to come over sometime.
[21:54:11] <PetefromTn> Remember you don't usually want to cut right near the tip of the champfer tool because the flute depth is tiny and cannot take as much off.
[21:54:20] <Jymmm> Tungsten for sale - http://sfbay.craigslist.org/sby/mat/4415118668.html
[21:54:39] <PetefromTn> Connor...yeah I do man.
[21:55:09] <XXCoder1> just $1? wha?
[21:56:04] <PetefromTn> That is why I draw it in cad so I can see exactly what it is looking like. I also try to make the cut happen like an eigth to a quarter up the edge of the champfer mill depending on the profiles I need to follow.
[21:56:19] <zeeshan> toastyde1th: so i actually unscrewed the left end piece
[21:56:22] <zeeshan> and guess what came out?
[21:56:34] <zeeshan> a long rod, of roughly the same length of the tool
[21:57:00] <zeeshan> Jymmm: what are you supposed to do with that tungsten?
[21:57:01] <zeeshan> lol
[21:57:33] <zeeshan> make some dies i guess
[21:57:34] <PetefromTn> Well gnight all
[21:57:40] <toastyde1th> zeeshan, ya
[21:57:46] <toastyde1th> that's how it telescopes?
[21:58:00] <zeeshan> no..
[21:58:02] <toastyde1th> oh
[21:58:03] <zeeshan> this rod fell out
[21:58:12] <zeeshan> its not like an inside micrometer
[21:58:15] <toastyde1th> it doesn't hold it in any way?
[21:58:22] <zeeshan> nope, doesnt hold in any way
[21:58:27] <toastyde1th> welp, then i was wrong
[21:58:44] <zeeshan> going in my trade pile
[21:58:45] <zeeshan> :)
[21:58:50] <zeeshan> both these things
[22:01:40] <R2E4> Pete, I only have .1 to play jwith
[22:02:08] <zeeshan> any of you guys ever use a cylinderical square?
[22:05:03] <jdh> just a spherical one.
[22:05:43] <Valen> I'd get that tugnsten, but i have a feeling the shipping could be exxy
[22:08:55] <zeeshan> http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/MTAwMFg2NjY=/z/jQoAAMXQydtTLwbo/$_20.JPG
[22:09:02] <zeeshan> can you spot the cylindrical square? :D
[22:11:31] <witnit> R2E4 this part of the program I have finished, Im trying to figure out how to make it universal for the mesa card types, currently, it only supports two.
[22:11:54] <witnit> http://199.168.73.34/7ixx.zip
[22:12:59] <witnit> I have three more pieces that still need added to make it send all the pins to the correct places,
[22:13:19] <witnit> right now, it should not produce a schematic, just the data needed for it
[22:15:16] <R2E4> ah cool.
[22:16:14] <jdh> the first 1-2 miles to/from my house are pretty boring, but beats loading + driving
[22:16:17] <jdh> <urk>
[22:16:42] <witnit> if there is something its NOT listing that is a physical connection feel free to tell me Im still trying to build your machine in my mind :P
[22:17:07] <zeeshan> jdh did you get your X working?
[22:17:31] <witnit> and I think I have 90% of the connects but I need to query to 5ixx for encoders and drives and such
[22:20:42] <CaptLookback> what did I miss?
[22:25:48] <Connor_iPad> CaptLookback: Everything!
[22:27:54] <zeeshan> http://www.kijiji.ca/v-business-industrial/windsor-area-on/brown-sharpe-surface-grinder/582179942?enableSearchNavigationFlag=true
[22:27:55] <zeeshan> !
[22:28:00] <zeeshan> brown and sharpe surface grinder
[22:28:01] <zeeshan> 750$
[22:28:02] <zeeshan> :D
[22:31:00] <Connor_iPad> I need a horizontal band saw.
[22:31:07] <zeeshan> ill sell you mine
[22:31:10] <zeeshan> its a POS
[22:31:15] <zeeshan> i need to replace it with a better unit
[22:31:24] <Connor_iPad> What do you have?
[22:31:43] <zeeshan> http://www.busybeetools.com/products/BANDSAW-METAL-4IN.-X-6IN.-1%7B47%7D3-HP-CSA-CRAFTEX.html
[22:31:51] <zeeshan> that same frame but 0.5 hp
[22:32:00] <zeeshan> new ones only come with 1/3 hp motor
[22:32:10] <zeeshan> prolly cause they realized, how much of a pos it was and had to derate it
[22:32:14] <Connor_iPad> Yea. Same as harbor freight.
[22:32:23] <zeeshan> it works
[22:32:36] <zeeshan> but to give you an idea, it takes about 15 minutes to cut through 2" round bar steel
[22:33:17] <zeeshan> my friends hydraulic 1 hp horizontal bandsaw does it in like 1minute
[22:33:18] <Connor_iPad> You have a good blade?
[22:33:23] <zeeshan> yes
[22:33:24] <zeeshan> bimetal
[22:33:28] <zeeshan> starrett
[22:34:12] <Connor_iPad> Wonder why. Not enough power? Not enough weight? Coolant / lubricant ?
[22:34:14] <zeeshan> the problem with this bandsaw is this
[22:34:21] <zeeshan> 1. no hydraulic adjustment to force the blade down
[22:34:30] <zeeshan> 2. no coolant so blade wears out pretty quick
[22:34:37] <zeeshan> 3. underpowered
[22:34:55] <zeeshan> i tried to fix 3 by putting a 1 hp motor on it with a vfd
[22:35:03] <zeeshan> and guess what happens?
[22:35:09] <Connor_iPad> What?
[22:35:11] <zeeshan> the belt slips on the pulleys, no matter how hard to tension it
[22:35:15] <zeeshan> belt = blade
[22:35:23] <zeeshan> i tensioned it so much the blade broke :D
[22:35:31] <zeeshan> so i had to go back to .5 hp motor
[22:35:35] <Connor_iPad> Wow.
[22:35:46] <zeeshan> the pulleys arent big enough and the blade is small
[22:35:52] <zeeshan> so there isnt much contact area for tensioning
[22:36:19] <zeeshan> http://www.kingcanada.com/Products.htm?CD=169&ID=127
[22:36:21] <zeeshan> this is what my friend has
[22:36:27] <zeeshan> 1hp
[22:36:31] <Connor_iPad> Couldn't you add a gas spring or something to help with the down force?
[22:36:37] <zeeshan> typically goes for 500
[22:36:50] <zeeshan> it already has a spring adjustment mechanism to force the blade down
[22:36:55] <zeeshan> but the problem is, it flexes too much
[22:37:02] <zeeshan> and even when you really really tension it
[22:37:07] <zeeshan> the blade starts slipping on the pulleys
[22:37:14] <Connor_iPad> Pete has one like that. Just too big for my shop.
[22:37:14] <zeeshan> so you're back to square one
[22:37:28] <zeeshan> its not much bigger than one i posted
[22:37:34] <zeeshan> (mine)
[22:37:50] <zeeshan> puls you can prolly store it under your cnc enclosure
[22:37:54] <zeeshan> *plus
[22:38:15] <toastyde1th> zeeshan, how are the bandwheels on that thing
[22:38:31] <zeeshan> what do you mean how
[22:38:33] <Connor_iPad> I have a tool cart that goes under the left side. Computer will be on rails on right side.
[22:38:33] <toastyde1th> might want to get some bike tire and glue it to them
[22:38:47] <toastyde1th> like, are the bandwheels in good condition? Are they sticky-ish?
[22:38:51] <toastyde1th> or slick
[22:38:59] <toastyde1th> er, bike inner tube, sorry
[22:39:06] <toastyde1th> don't go gluing a mountain bike tire to your bandsaw.
[22:39:10] <zeeshan> i always clean them with brake cleaner before putting a blade on
[22:39:23] <toastyde1th> nah it's gonna get all kinds of shit on it anyway, no point in cleaning it
[22:39:26] <zeeshan> but iguess oil will get back on it
[22:39:35] <toastyde1th> but a good bandwheel has pretty soft rubber on it
[22:39:47] <toastyde1th> on small saws, anyway
[22:40:16] <toastyde1th> also the majority of the sawing force should be taken up by the blade bearings, not the bandwheels
[22:40:29] <toastyde1th> the wheels just keep the blade running true, the bearings provide the force
[22:40:52] <zeeshan> honestly i can just sell this one for 200
[22:40:56] <zeeshan> and pick up the bigger one for another 300$
[22:41:02] <toastyde1th> oh, didn't see that
[22:41:02] <zeeshan> itll have more power
[22:41:07] <toastyde1th> carry on
[22:41:17] <toastyde1th> get a semiauto doall
[22:41:18] <zeeshan> my friend owns a metal supermarkets
[22:41:18] <Connor_iPad> How does it do with alum stock?
[22:41:22] <zeeshan> Connor: it owns it
[22:41:24] <zeeshan> like butter
[22:41:29] <toastyde1th> power head and vice
[22:41:32] <zeeshan> toastyde1th: those are 1000$ :{
[22:41:37] <toastyde1th> lol more than that
[22:41:42] <Connor_iPad> That's typically what I'll be cutting.
[22:42:02] <zeeshan> http://www.kijiji.ca/v-power-tool/windsor-area-on/bandsaw-and-welder/568645658?enableSearchNavigationFlag=true
[22:42:05] <zeeshan> this is what ive been eyeing
[22:42:09] <toastyde1th> most saws will cut alum pretty easily, it's more a matter of picking a blade that isn't designed to cut what you're cutting
[22:42:27] <zeeshan> thats the nice thing about a vfd on the bandsaw
[22:42:30] <toastyde1th> I think i have run that EXACT saw before
[22:42:36] <zeeshan> you can really speed up the band speed
[22:42:39] <zeeshan> for aluminum
[22:42:48] <zeeshan> toastyde1th: i really like it!
[22:42:51] <toastyde1th> i don't really care about band speed so much on a saw
[22:42:56] <zeeshan> for 900, hes selling that
[22:42:57] <zeeshan> and
[22:42:57] <toastyde1th> as long as it's not too high for stgeel
[22:43:01] <toastyde1th> *steel
[22:43:15] <zeeshan> ac 220 welder and 12 ton press and torche set
[22:43:34] <toastyde1th> but i very often see people trying to cut solid bar stock with like a 10 tpi blade
[22:43:52] <toastyde1th> or vice versa, angle iron with a .5 tpi
[22:44:02] <toastyde1th> and then wondering why their saw is missing teeth
[22:44:12] <zeeshan> haha
[22:44:26] <zeeshan> the rule of thumb is you need 3 teeth engaged with the material at any given time
[22:44:29] <zeeshan> or something like that
[22:44:39] <toastyde1th> that's a good ballpark, 3 or 4 teeth
[22:45:09] <zeeshan> the school vertical doall bandsaw gets so abused
[22:45:21] <zeeshan> some guy was trying to cut sheet metal with a wood blade
[22:45:26] <zeeshan> at wood cutting speeds
[22:45:33] <witnit> pang pang pang pang
[22:45:36] <witnit> :P
[22:45:40] <zeeshan> the banging was so loud
[22:45:55] <toastyde1th> some people just confuse me
[22:46:04] <toastyde1th> it's like they don't have any idea that the horrendous noise isn't normal
[22:46:11] <toastyde1th> and then they jump when there's a perfectly normal loud noise
[22:46:20] <zeeshan> haha
[22:46:24] <witnit> and they give you the cow eyes hahaha
[22:46:31] <toastyde1th> I loved doing that in trade school
[22:46:31] <zeeshan> "BUT ITS CUTTING"
[22:46:47] <zeeshan> we're engineers using these machines
[22:46:51] <toastyde1th> would make the school's fancy schmancy cnc mill take huge cuts
[22:47:01] <zeeshan> so 90% of the people haven't touched a machine in our life before
[22:47:03] <toastyde1th> they were cutting things like plastic with itty bitty endmills on this giant mill
[22:47:17] <toastyde1th> and I'd make this enormous racket with a big ass facemill
[22:47:31] <toastyde1th> I once had an english class come running out of the room thinking there was an emergency
[22:47:35] <zeeshan> haha
[22:47:42] <toastyde1th> the whole class, 30 people
[22:47:47] <witnit> heavy fly cutter?
[22:48:03] <toastyde1th> nope, it was like a 5 or 6" facemill at 6k rpm
[22:48:12] <witnit> haahhah
[22:48:25] <toastyde1th> something like 6 teeth?
[22:48:32] <toastyde1th> .250 doc, and 120 IPM
[22:48:33] <witnit> put a side chair on that thing and the ladies would love you
[22:48:49] <toastyde1th> and the infeed per pass was something like two inches
[22:48:51] <toastyde1th> not the whole width
[22:48:57] <witnit> ohhh
[22:48:59] <toastyde1th> just surfacing a bunch of plates down to size
[22:49:34] <witnit> you seen that damper they make for those
[22:49:46] <toastyde1th> nope
[22:50:05] <topcyde> zeeshan: I have the conversation regularly....4 to 24 teeth engaged
[22:50:28] <toastyde1th> 24 teeth engaged if you want to take a good 10 minute smoke break before the cut finishes
[22:50:33] <zeeshan> lol
[22:50:43] <zeeshan> ive been told 3-4
[22:50:54] <zeeshan> and basically "use a fucking shear"
[22:50:58] <zeeshan> for sheet metal :P
[22:51:02] <toastyde1th> if you have a mechanical feed mechanism it doesn't even matter
[22:51:13] <toastyde1th> use a 1 tooth per blade revolution blade
[22:51:28] <toastyde1th> i wish we had a cnc saw, a lot of the shit I had to cut changed thickness
[22:51:31] <toastyde1th> we cut a lot of extrusions
[22:51:49] <toastyde1th> the cuts had to start really slow on feed and then crank the feed up
[22:52:03] <topcyde> that's good advice for sheetmetal
[22:52:24] <topcyde> snips though if it's light enough.
[22:53:01] <toastyde1th> hand work? never.
[22:53:21] <topcyde> toastydelth: cutting irregulars are always a trick
[22:53:42] <zeeshan> cnc saws are elite!
[22:54:28] <toastyde1th> i've done almost no sheetmetal
[22:54:43] <toastyde1th> i worked in a shop that did it briefly, but never got to learn to use the brakes or turret press
[22:55:07] <topcyde> all you've missed out on are more scars on your hands
[22:55:18] <toastyde1th> hahaha
[22:57:32] <topcyde> we don't run sheet in my shop but I've done(and still do) a bit of personal projects with it. I like the snips and hammer forming. It's fun to pummel the crap outof things sometimes. but would go crazy trying that in production.
[22:59:02] <topcyde> zeeshan: if you learn to use a saw right you'll find it does all the work for you and short of chopping up 100 pieces of the same thing a cnc really does nothing.
[22:59:34] <zeeshan> topcyde: you can multiple pieces of different lengths
[22:59:36] <toastyde1th> it only helps in bizarre situations that don't normally crop up in cutoff
[22:59:36] <zeeshan> all on its own
[23:00:30] <toastyde1th> although the big saw i ran had a hydraulic feed and those can be straight retarded
[23:00:50] <zeeshan> http://i.imgur.com/Oi6baNi.jpg
[23:00:58] <toastyde1th> it would repeat to .002" but christ help you get it set to begin with
[23:01:00] <topcyde> yes but of the same material, as soon as you swap material it's useless you'r estill standing there punching buttons.
[23:01:02] <zeeshan> cutting those 2x2x1/8 angles took me 4 hours on my pos bandsaw
[23:01:03] <zeeshan> lol
[23:01:16] <toastyde1th> yeah something's not right
[23:01:39] <topcyde> how were you cutting them?
[23:01:42] <toastyde1th> if the band is srsly popping off there's got to be something wrong with the blade guides
[23:02:00] <zeeshan> lowest possible speed
[23:02:02] <zeeshan> 45 degree angles
[23:03:51] <toastyde1th> i did use a saw once that didn't actually have the guides in place
[23:04:01] <zeeshan> i should just plasti-dip both my band wheels
[23:04:04] <toastyde1th> which explains why I had so much trouble
[23:04:06] <topcyde> did you have them like this L or this ^ ?
[23:04:06] <zeeshan> and see what happens :P
[23:04:14] <zeeshan> ^
[23:04:25] <zeeshan> cutting em like L rapes the blade
[23:04:26] <zeeshan> lol
[23:04:27] <toastyde1th> zeeshan, take a pic of your blade guides
[23:04:46] <zeeshan> im embarassed to show my bandsaw
[23:04:49] <zeeshan> its been abused :)
[23:05:01] <toastyde1th> dude I used a cnc mill from the late 60s
[23:05:09] <toastyde1th> not much will offend me
[23:05:29] <toastyde1th> although in the end the machine itself was nice
[23:06:04] <topcyde> toastydelth: you should be lucky with such fancy schmancy new equipment
[23:06:55] <toastyde1th> i almost got to use a control that was straight paper tape
[23:07:00] <topcyde> the old tuff usually runs better, it was designed by engineers that new what they were doing and built by men who took pride in their work.
[23:07:06] <toastyde1th> but they ripped the control off to refit the machine before =(
[23:07:27] <toastyde1th> it was five full racks of crazy vacuum tubes and knobs and dials
[23:07:48] <topcyde> wow, I wish I could have gotten that rack of spare parts
[23:08:30] <zeeshan> http://i.imgur.com/5LnTGOm.jpg
[23:08:43] <zeeshan> http://i.imgur.com/GBXGepG.jpg
[23:09:11] <toastyde1th> weird
[23:09:28] <toastyde1th> and you say it's jumping off the wheels itself?
[23:09:37] <zeeshan> it doesnt jump off
[23:09:40] <zeeshan> it slips on the wheels
[23:09:44] <toastyde1th> ooooooh
[23:09:47] <topcyde> that's a nice saw
[23:10:08] <zeeshan> no way
[23:10:18] <zeeshan> no coolant, .5 hp motor, 100lb frame
[23:10:20] <zeeshan> weaksauce
[23:10:57] <zeeshan> i think if i increase the coefficienct of friction at the wheels
[23:10:59] <zeeshan> it might work better
[23:11:05] <zeeshan> w/ more power
[23:11:19] <toastyde1th> yeah, bike inner tubes.
[23:11:22] <toastyde1th> and some glue
[23:13:19] <topcyde> buy a mister system, they're usually in the vertical mill section of your favorite machine tool supply catalog.
[23:15:13] <zeeshan> mister system aint good for your lungs!
[23:15:25] <zeeshan> its cheaper/easier/faster to buy that used bandsaw
[23:16:53] <topcyde> what? are you sucking on the end of it?
[23:17:10] <zeeshan> no
[23:17:12] <zeeshan> it gets inthe air
[23:17:14] <zeeshan> and you breathe it in
[23:22:39] <topcyde> set it up to minimum spray. if you see fluid puddling on the part it's too thick. it's purpose is to inject a liquid into the air right at the cut increasing thermal efficiency and lubricity. you're not breathing it in. it's sticking to either the blade or the material and evaporating off. the same as flood coolant.
[23:24:54] <topcyde> with 3db less mess
[23:25:48] <zeeshan> http://www.ccohs.ca/oshanswers/chemicals/metalworking_fluids.html
[23:26:04] <zeeshan> everything on that website points to not using mist
[23:26:13] <zeeshan> i know mist is superior to flood coolant in terms of metal cutting
[23:26:18] <zeeshan> but its not superior when it comes to your health
[23:27:09] <zeeshan> i know at my last work place, the health guy recommended more ventilation cause our mist particles ppm even with flood coolant was higher than the recommended amount by OSH.
[23:27:38] <zeeshan> gnite!
[23:34:20] <shaun415> hey
[23:34:27] <shaun415> anyone here use manual equopment?
[23:34:31] <shaun415> Im looking to buy a lathe
[23:37:07] <topcyde> I use manuals. I've thought about selling my smithy if you're looking for something small. I've not used it in a while.
[23:38:07] <topcyde> or were you just looking for advice?
[23:39:32] <shaun415> Im looking for advice on what to get
[23:39:43] <shaun415> I dont want to spend too much, so I was looking at older models
[23:39:51] <shaun415> southbend and such
[23:40:24] <witnit> hardinge made a couple nice small ones for 5c collets
[23:40:41] <topcyde> which are you looking for more size or money?
[23:42:20] <shaun413_> Cheap
[23:42:33] <shaun413_> I don't really need size.
[23:42:44] <witnit> 110v only?
[23:42:49] <shaun413_> But was recommended to stay away from small lathes
[23:42:53] <shaun413_> Yes 110v
[23:43:39] <witnit> you need threading option?
[23:44:07] <shaun413_> Sorry a newbie, not sure what that means
[23:44:16] <shaun413_> This will be my first lathe
[23:44:29] <witnit> hmmm, I would look at a rockwell
[23:44:34] <witnit> and see about a phase converter
[23:44:39] <shaun413_> How much are they?
[23:44:49] <witnit> depends on condition, how much can you spend?
[23:45:09] <shaun413_> In was hoping to get something older and not too large for less than 1k
[23:45:27] <witnit> look at the rockwell, and try to find something similar
[23:45:29] <topcyde> shaun415 : ive got to check out. keep your eyes on the local auction sites and craigslist. as far as small lathes go I think they were referring to things along the sherline size. Good strt for education is this series http://www.youroldtimebookstore.com/product-p/l4l2.htm
[23:45:52] <shaun413_> Yeah like a sherline
[23:45:57] <shaun413_> Has no meat
[23:46:11] <shaun413_> And I can get something used for 600
[23:46:17] <shaun413_> That is likely better
[23:46:18] <witnit> yeah I would not waste my time on such things
[23:46:34] <witnit> I would go for toolroom style lathe
[23:46:52] <witnit> or sized lathe*
[23:47:00] <shaun413_> I hear the south bend is popular
[23:47:23] <shaun413_> I can't get something too large
[23:47:32] <shaun413_> Under 4ft or so would be ideal
[23:47:44] <witnit> rockwell or hardinge
[23:47:53] <witnit> would get you really close I think
[23:48:05] <shaun413_> No south bend.?
[23:48:18] <witnit> ehh
[23:49:06] <witnit> something small and affordable but not junk is what you want
[23:49:25] <witnit> you can spend alot of money trying to put together an old machine
[23:49:37] <witnit> try to get something that is complete when you get it
[23:50:08] <witnit> so just go with whatever is the most complete and ready to go
[23:50:24] <shaun413_> Ok
[23:50:41] <shaun413_> How much do you think a Rockwell or hardinge would run me
[23:50:43] <witnit> I dont think any of those brands will cause you too many problems and in a good deal you can get each for <750
[23:50:46] <shaun413_> With some tooling
[23:51:48] <witnit> it really depends where you buy, I got two of them one was loaded one was not for $500
[23:52:13] <shaun413_> Hmm
[23:52:19] <shaun413_> Where are you located
[23:52:22] <witnit> indiana
[23:52:23] <shaun413_> I'm in NJ
[23:52:38] <shaun413_> Cool where in indiana
[23:52:46] <shaun413_> Near Goshen?
[23:52:48] <witnit> near the fort
[23:53:04] <toastyde1th> Monarch 10ee is another option
[23:53:09] <shaun413_> Hmm
[23:53:14] <toastyde1th> can be hard to find them cheap though
[23:53:16] <witnit> yeah monarch 10ee is dream though
[23:53:21] <shaun413_> Yeah
[23:53:26] <shaun413_> I need cheap
[23:53:28] <witnit> like a collector car of lathes
[23:53:32] <shaun413_> I'm only 20
[23:53:35] <toastyde1th> wasn't real impressed with rockwell's tiny shit
[23:53:43] <toastyde1th> their bench lathes
[23:53:45] <witnit> seriously someone has a rockwell or a hardinge on its way to the scrap yard right now
[23:53:48] <toastyde1th> their floor lathes are decent
[23:53:59] <shaun413_> Really?
[23:54:04] <witnit> yeah floor model minimum
[23:54:05] <toastyde1th> yeah
[23:54:07] <shaun413_> Why are they bad ?:p
[23:54:09] <witnit> I wouldnt mess with benchtops
[23:54:12] <toastyde1th> flimsy as shit
[23:54:15] <witnit> yeop
[23:54:19] <witnit> they flex
[23:54:21] <toastyde1th> even by benchtop standards
[23:54:23] <toastyde1th> they're real flimsy
[23:54:23] <shaun413_> Oh lord
[23:54:32] <toastyde1th> they're not harbor freight flimsy
[23:54:34] <shaun413_> I don't have room for that
[23:54:40] <shaun413_> How big is it
[23:54:44] <toastyde1th> but i'd take a 20" atlas over a 40" rockwell bench lathe
[23:55:04] <shaun413_> I don't even know what I'd use the size for..
[23:55:20] <toastyde1th> imho that's the wrong way to look at it
[23:55:23] <shaun413_> I'd be machining things I could on a sherline
[23:55:29] <witnit> the distance between the chuck and the bed is usually most important
[23:55:33] <shaun413_> I see
[23:55:36] <toastyde1th> the reason nobody makes lathes that tiny is because it's hard to make a small, good lathe
[23:55:42] <shaun413_> Yeah
[23:55:43] <witnit> unless you are turning broomsticks daily
[23:55:45] <shaun413_> You need mass
[23:55:50] <toastyde1th> and all you need is one semi-long boring job to use up bed length
[23:55:58] <toastyde1th> because any boring operation needs twice the bore length
[23:56:03] <shaun413_> I see
[23:56:04] <witnit> yep
[23:56:11] <shaun413_> Makes sense
[23:56:27] <toastyde1th> that said, you can buy chuckers if you really, really know what your're going to be machining
[23:56:29] <witnit> seriously though, small floor model over any benchtop IMO
[23:56:42] <shaun413_> Well
[23:56:43] <witnit> its his first lathe
[23:56:45] <shaun413_> What's a good one
[23:57:00] <shaun413_> I can do a small floor model probably...
[23:57:01] <toastyde1th> some other companies make decent 20-30" lathes but they're heavy
[23:57:14] <shaun413_> Has to fit downstairs though
[23:57:46] <shaun413_> Unless I can take it apart
[23:58:16] <toastyde1th> if you aren't comfortable skidding a lathe down a flight of stairs you will probably have to go benchtop
[23:58:25] <shaun413_> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0PzPfzLeDa0&feature=youtube_gdata_player
[23:58:31] <shaun413_> Nothing this big
[23:58:56] <witnit> you can take the hardinge off its table and the rockwell can be taken from the legs too I think
[23:59:28] <toastyde1th> which hardinge?
[23:59:30] <shaun413_> I may have to make room in the garage ..
[23:59:34] <shaun413_> Hmm
[23:59:41] <toastyde1th> shaun413_, honestly the garage is where a shop should be
[23:59:49] <shaun413_> We keep cars there
[23:59:51] <shaun413_> Lol