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[00:53:04] <jesseg> I can't believe it... heekscad actually compiled on slackware 13.37 with only 1 dirty hack and two soft hacks!!
[01:08:10] <jesseg> Of course it's crashy/
[01:13:35] <ju-emb> long time ago (1 year or so) I tried to compile it too, but it was a PITA, and it didn't run stable on ..ix based systems.
[01:13:37] <ju-emb> Now I'm using Freecad, blender and blendercam
[01:14:09] <jesseg> How's freecad?
[01:14:29] <jesseg> I guess if freecad or blender were great for the task you wouldn't be using them both ;)
[01:14:34] <ju-emb> suffi for the things I'm doing
[01:15:46] <ju-emb> I switched to freecad after heeks got out of the way, so I became used to it
[01:16:11] <ju-emb> FreeCad is more CAD like, blender more modeling like
[01:16:18] <jesseg> Does freecad provide what you need to draw up a part and then produce gcodes?
[01:16:49] <jesseg> I wonder if I can get freecad to compile in slackware
[01:17:11] <ju-emb> Freecad doesn't have cam yet
[01:17:40] <ju-emb> If you compile heeks on slackware, freecad shouldn't be a problem
[01:17:40] <jesseg> Ahh.. I've heard of openscad - but that may have a purely text command based inputmode
[01:18:19] <ju-emb> that's more programming than construction
[01:18:20] <jesseg> But freecad won't do me any good if I can't produce gcode files, right? or is there a third party path for that?
[01:19:03] <ju-emb> freecad can export mash's and that fit's in nearly every CAM
[01:19:29] <jesseg> mash's?
[01:19:37] <jesseg> not familier with those
[01:19:41] <ju-emb> latest version of blender has defined units
[01:19:50] <ju-emb> sorry mesh's
[01:19:59] <jesseg> Oh, those I've heard o
[01:20:00] <jesseg> f
[01:20:22] <jesseg> so does LinuxCNC import said meshes, then?
[01:20:28] <ju-emb> .stl is a mesh format
[01:20:42] <jesseg> right
[01:21:03] <jesseg> so then I'd still need a program to convert the mesh to the gcode for LinuxCNC
[01:21:48] <ju-emb> Let me tell you the entire story:
[01:22:03] <jesseg> *listens*
[01:22:22] <ju-emb> Blender noe has units, so you can do a modelling on blender and blendercam does g-code
[01:22:52] <jesseg> cool
[01:23:39] <ju-emb> freecad is better for construction, so if you do sketch's modify them with constraints and form 3D
[01:23:55] <ju-emb> all that works in blender now
[01:24:37] <ju-emb> so lately I used more blender than freecad
[01:24:44] <jesseg> interesting
[01:25:12] <ju-emb> only if I have some work done in freecad and like to modify them I use freecad
[01:25:35] <ju-emb> new stuff I try to do complete in blender
[01:25:56] <jesseg> I see
[01:26:02] <ju-emb> Blender doesn't work if you need 2D prints
[01:26:50] <ju-emb> but convert your pieces in g-code and feed it into lcnc works great
[01:28:05] <ju-emb> and if you know a bit of Python, you can tweek blender to optimize your g-code
[01:28:12] <jesseg> yeah anything can be used to make 2d prints
[01:28:34] <jesseg> a "bit" is about all I know of pythong :P
[01:28:38] <ju-emb> anything but blender
[01:28:45] <jesseg> yeah
[01:29:18] <ju-emb> I'm just learning it and there are always fights and screams at night
[01:29:35] <ju-emb> Python is like Woman
[01:30:11] <ju-emb> a lot of beauty words but really hard to understand
[01:30:26] <jesseg> LOL yeah
[01:30:31] <ju-emb> most you only guess
[01:31:32] <jesseg> 99% of my python experience was used in writing a statemachine for logging data and sending via cellular modem on an embedded cell modem module.. and because the built in cpu had so little memory, they stripped out floating point support from the python :P
[01:32:48] <ju-emb> there is no alternative to a compiler
[01:33:15] <Jymmm> ASM FTW
[01:33:35] <ju-emb> the compiler you can tell what you want and he just does it
[01:34:05] <ju-emb> a interpreter you are in hands of the guys who wrote it
[01:35:29] <jesseg> Woah!! I just downloaded blender (precompiled binary) and ran it on Slackware..
[01:35:31] <jesseg> and it ran..!!
[01:35:48] <ju-emb> congrat's
[01:35:56] <jesseg> Of course I don't know how to use it, but I know someone who does amazing things with it
[01:36:08] <ju-emb> search for blendercam
[01:36:08] <jesseg> is blendercam a different project from another site?
[01:36:10] <jesseg> ok
[01:36:42] <ju-emb> it's a plugin to blender, but you can get it as complete binary
[01:38:07] <ju-emb> first you can do easy is, take a cube, subtract a cylinder out of the middle and pass it to cam
[01:39:11] <ju-emb> the basic blender tutorial should give you an idea, and will cost you 1/2 hour or so
[01:39:40] <jesseg> yeah
[01:39:49] <ju-emb> if you are familiar with 3D design ideas it's easy
[01:40:04] <jesseg> I guess starting cold with no experience on anything, blender's probably as good as one to invest time in learning
[01:40:33] <jesseg> I'm familiar with 3D objects... not familiar with any method of inputing those into the computer :P
[01:40:47] <ju-emb> that's what I think now about blender
[01:41:40] <ju-emb> but you shouldn't focus on curves, there you'll not find the right mill bit's for it
[01:42:10] <ju-emb> that was related to the 3d objects
[01:43:38] <ju-emb> long time I ignored blender, because my idea was, that it is for games or animations
[01:44:03] <ju-emb> now I know that it is good for more useful things too
[01:44:46] <jesseg> yeah
[01:45:10] <ju-emb> did you find blendercam?
[01:45:24] <jesseg> Found t his:
http://blendercam.blogspot.com/p/download-and-installation.html
[01:45:54] <ju-emb> that's all you need
[01:47:13] <ju-emb> BTW blendercam has 3Axis LCNC machines predefined
[01:48:09] <jesseg> coool
[01:48:10] <ju-emb> and the animation feature you can use to simulate your cut's
[01:48:42] <jesseg> wow blendercam is big.. oh.. is that blender precompiled with it?
[01:50:18] <ju-emb> yes, it's a complete blender with the CAM plugin
[01:50:29] <jesseg> What's a measly 100mbytes
[01:50:48] <ju-emb> you should install it in another folder than the blender
[01:51:12] <ju-emb> so you can use both independent
[01:51:19] <jesseg> yeah
[01:51:34] <jesseg> it's a couple minor versions older than the plain blender I got
[01:51:55] <jesseg> eh, one minor version older :P
[01:52:29] <jesseg> Ahh, this is layed out a tad different
[01:52:39] <ju-emb> but it' hase units , that's the important part
[01:52:55] <ju-emb> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=No4XrqG0HaM
[01:54:50] <jesseg> watching video
[01:55:33] <jesseg> So do you design and then render to gcode in blendercam, or do you design in plain blender, then load up the file in blendercam
[01:56:16] <ju-emb> depends on what I'm doing
[01:56:33] <ju-emb> for 3d print I make all in blender
[01:57:19] <jesseg> instead of blendercam?
[01:57:22] <ju-emb> for machine parts I have lot of parts done in freecad, so I do an import
[01:57:29] <jesseg> oh I see
[01:57:42] <jesseg> Oh, so you can import meshes from freecad into blendercam?
[01:57:58] <ju-emb> yes, that's the big deal
[01:58:24] <jesseg> But I guess my question is whether blendercam is missing the object creation functionality of the vanila blender
[01:59:05] <ju-emb> no, it's just changing the perspective or how it is called in blender
[01:59:13] <ju-emb> let me see
[02:00:05] <ju-emb> it's all there
[02:00:28] <ju-emb> Menu add
[02:00:40] <ju-emb> then a cube or so
[02:01:00] <jesseg> K let me try that
[02:01:12] <ju-emb> then face mode and change
[02:01:18] <ju-emb> the size
[02:02:35] <jesseg> What is "face mode?"
[02:02:45] * jesseg brand new to blender & doesn't see "face mode"
[02:03:51] <ju-emb> it's actually called "edit mode" and then you have choices of object, vertex, or faces
[02:03:56] <Jymmm> jesseg: Try #blender
[02:04:02] <jesseg> oh good idea:P
[02:04:08] <jesseg> ju-emb, is
http://sourceforge.net/projects/free-cad/ the freecad you're talking abuot?
[02:04:32] <jesseg> will the folks in #blender laugh at me for using blendercam? :P
[02:04:34] <ju-emb> yes. that's it
[02:05:17] <ju-emb> It's Open source, so nothing to laugh
[02:05:28] <ju-emb> but they will not understand CAM
[02:05:40] <jesseg> exactly :P
[02:06:11] <ju-emb> so it's a good idea to have installed both versions
[02:06:15] <jesseg> yeah
[02:06:17] <jesseg> I do have
[02:06:24] <ju-emb> me to
[02:08:07] <ju-emb> once you learned to go with blender making some objects you come back to blendercam and do the CAM
[02:08:24] <ju-emb> later you can do all in blendercam
[02:08:37] <jesseg> oh cool that's what I was hoping for
[02:10:26] <jesseg> Hmm. My little xyz axes indicator is gone.
[02:11:06] <ju-emb> ther is a little symbol to click to get it back
[02:11:30] <jesseg> Well, I see the one in bottom left of screen.. But I can't find the one that lets me move the cube
[02:11:48] <jesseg> but as Jymmm suggested, maybe I shouldn't be spamming this channel off topic;)
[02:11:50] <ju-emb> you should know that all in blender are objects, that little xyz is one of them
[02:12:20] <ju-emb> you have to go to object mode
[02:13:40] <ju-emb> object mode to move the cube
[02:13:42] <ju-emb> edit mode to change the proportions
[02:14:04] <jesseg> Ahh
[02:15:03] <ju-emb> right click on the face or vertex, then move the arrow
[02:15:21] <ju-emb> in edit mode
[02:16:57] <jesseg> I'm not seeing any arrow in blendercam
[02:17:03] <jesseg> had no problem in blender
[02:17:40] <ju-emb> let's do it together from scratch
[02:18:00] <ju-emb> change to object mode
[02:18:23] <jesseg> Okay. (other topic - I tried freecad. It has a bunch of dependancies that I don't feel up to fixing tonight :) I give up on it for now..)
[02:18:25] <ju-emb> press x and select delete
[02:18:32] <jesseg> hold on let me close and start fresh on blendercam
[02:19:07] <jesseg> OK. Fresh Blender 2.68a, blendercam running.
[02:19:26] <jesseg> Done.
[02:19:34] <jesseg> But there wasn't anything to delete that I could see.
[02:19:38] <ju-emb> so you are better than I 2.67
[02:20:03] <ju-emb> that's right, blendercam starts with no objects
[02:20:19] <ju-emb> click menu add mesh cube
[02:20:35] <jesseg> done
[02:20:49] <ju-emb> with arrows right?
[02:20:55] <jesseg> oh, now I see the RGB arrows in the middle of the screen AND tinier in the bottom left..!
[02:21:09] <ju-emb> that's it
[02:21:11] <jesseg> I must have messed something up before..
[02:21:40] <ju-emb> clicking on the arrows in the middle moves the cube around
[02:21:54] <jesseg> yeah! cool! I was doing that in blender vanila
[02:22:07] <ju-emb> so change to edit mode
[02:22:12] <jesseg> right-click+drag also moves it in two axis at a time
[02:23:46] <jesseg> okay I get it. cool
[02:23:56] <jesseg> Thanks very much for all your help!
[02:24:16] <ju-emb> that's what we are here for
[02:24:40] <jesseg> So is it hard importing from freecad to blendercam?
[02:24:57] <ju-emb> absolute not
[02:25:02] <jesseg> okay cool
[02:25:17] <ju-emb> in freecad you export .stl
[02:25:39] <ju-emb> in blender you say import mesh
[02:25:45] <jesseg> cooool
[02:25:49] <jesseg> I have so much to learn!
[02:26:01] <jesseg> But.. it's past my bedtime.
[02:26:04] <ju-emb> all we have
[02:26:34] <ju-emb> so dream of freecad and blendercam
[02:27:41] <Deejay> moin
[02:28:25] <ju-emb> Deejay: that sounds german
[02:29:39] <Deejay> it is :)
[02:29:46] <Deejay> good morning :)
[02:30:13] <ju-emb> Ich kann auch Deutsch
[02:32:02] <Deejay> :-)
[06:56:06] <mseidl> has anybody ever heard of jet milling machines?
[06:56:24] <jthornton> y7ea
[06:56:29] <mseidl> are they any good?
[06:57:01] <jthornton> depends on your definition of "good"
[06:57:25] <jthornton> probably better than a chinese mill
[06:57:48] <jthornton> IIRC they are/were made in Taiwan
[06:57:50] <skunkworks> jet made milling machines? we have a jet bandsaw iirc
[06:58:26] <jthornton> morning
[06:59:01] <skunkworks> Good Morning!
[06:59:05] <jthornton> http://www.jettools.com/us/en/c/metalworking-milling/230
[06:59:14] <jthornton> you guys snowed in?
[06:59:27] <mseidl> 8 degrees here(c)
[06:59:42] <skunkworks> no - only aboyt 4 inches here over the last few days
[07:00:19] <jthornton> we got 18" Friday on top of 1/2" if sleet so nothing much moved
[07:00:34] <skunkworks> Wow!
[07:00:48] <skunkworks> north of us got those amounts
[07:00:48] <mseidl> I was looking at converting a vertical mill to cnc, but all the cheap ones have really crappy working areas
[07:01:08] <skunkworks> mseidl, look for a cnc with a dead control...
[07:01:10] <jthornton> roads will clear today with sunny skies and 37F
[07:01:20] <mseidl> skunkworks: what do you mean dead control?
[07:02:04] <skunkworks> to convert to linuxcnc. That way you have decent ballscrews/servo setup..
[07:02:14] <mseidl> ok,
[07:02:24] <skunkworks> maybe even a tool changer
[07:02:35] <skunkworks> coolant control...
[07:02:50] <jthornton> I converted my BP knee mill that had a 3 axis Anilam CNC conversion on it to LinuxCNC
[07:02:54] <skunkworks> and you can usually get them for not much more than a manual machine
[07:04:11] <mseidl> what would be the minimum machine require to mill titanium :)
[07:04:14] <jthornton> saves a ton of money to start with a CNC mill than trying to convert a manual mill
[07:04:21] <mseidl> skunkworks: how much are you taking here?
[07:04:46] <jthornton> what size parts?
[07:06:15] <mseidl> hummm, in titanium?
[07:07:03] <mseidl> ideally my machine working size would be about 30x36x15cm
[07:07:12] <mseidl> i dont think I would make titanium parts that big
[07:13:16] <Tom_itx> 12 F clear
[07:14:43] <jthornton> danimal makes titanium chain rings on a BP knee mill
[07:15:01] <Tom_itx> fairly thin material though
[07:18:25] <mseidl> i also have the problem of not having a garage with power
[07:26:07] <skunkworks> crank cnc?
[07:26:19] <jthornton> lol
[07:26:20] <mseidl> hah
[07:26:31] * mseidl reminds himself to double his dose of steroids
[07:47:46] <CaptHindsight> mseidl: lots of cnc deals on fleabay currently
[07:51:51] <mseidl> thanks CaptHindsight , is there aything I should search for?
[07:51:56] <mseidl> (that would be available in europe?)
[07:56:35] <jthornton> latest version of the mill G code generator is up
http://gnipsel.com/files/g-code-generator/
[07:59:33] <CaptHindsight> 380789191410 Bridgeport Series 1 CNC Mill, Unfinished project, Needs Attention
[08:00:21] <skunkworks> heh - 3d printing..
[08:00:21] <mseidl> how much would a restoration cost?
[08:02:07] <mseidl> why is this called a knee mill?
[08:03:01] <mseidl> i dont think that would fit into my apartment ;)
[08:03:17] <CaptHindsight> you need a bigger place
[08:03:25] <mseidl> you're tellin gme!
[08:04:37] <mseidl> what kidn of accuracy/repeatability can you get from a series 1?
[08:05:22] <CaptHindsight> "the main spindle motor has cracked mounting flange but may repair quite easily" heh 261345957133
[08:05:28] <CaptHindsight> or maybe not
[08:07:18] <ju-emb> http://gnipsel.com/files/g-code-generator/
[08:07:20] <ju-emb> folder is there
[08:07:21] <ju-emb> http://gnipsel.com/files/g-code-generator/mill1.5.zip
[08:07:24] <ju-emb> gives 404 Error
[08:07:30] <CaptHindsight> mseidl: it depends on the condition of the bearings and ways
[08:07:47] <gonzo__> it's called a knee mill, as the lower platform can be raised and lowered to set the working height. Bit like beinging your knee up?
[08:08:17] <gonzo__> I'm doing a retro fit to a manual series one
[08:09:30] <gonzo__> but if that has the same screws as mine. Then the first job would be to put some decent ballscrews in
[08:09:48] <CaptHindsight> gonzo__: so it's not because that what part of your body bangs into the Z handle when you walk by? :)
[08:10:03] <mseidl> CaptHindsight: that was my first though,
[08:10:42] <CaptHindsight> mseidl: what do you have room for?
[08:10:50] <gonzo__> hehe, mine is in the walkway in the garage, and usually the knee is left set higher. So you band summut else on there! And that's exactly what you say too!
[08:11:05] <gonzo__> bang
[08:11:29] <mseidl> maybe a 2x4' machine, but i live in the top floor of an apartment so it can't weigh 1 ton
[08:11:58] <gonzo__> my manual S1 is about 1-1/4ton
[08:12:09] * mseidl thinks it might be time to buy a house :)
[08:12:25] <gonzo__> would be fine in a flat. Though it could pick up some speed on the way down if the floors give
[08:12:33] <jthornton> ju-emb, I just renamed the file
[08:12:36] <jthornton> folder
[08:13:19] <jthornton> just use
http://gnipsel.com/files/g-code-generator/
[08:13:51] <CaptHindsight> 121228655009 Denford Triac CNC XYZ Milling Machin
[08:14:53] <jthornton> nice
[08:15:49] <mseidl> could you mill titanium on that ? :)
[08:17:27] <jthornton> archivist, if I buy that would you email it to me?
[08:18:25] <ju-emb> jthornton: but you need your own domain e-mail address, hotmail will just cloudspace it
[08:18:43] <CaptHindsight> jthornton: does your ISP have a weight cap on email?
[08:19:20] <mseidl> why in the heck does that thing have a cassett player?
[08:19:42] <ju-emb> to listen music while working
[08:20:01] <ju-emb> made in GB
[08:21:05] <mseidl> haha,
[08:37:21] <ju-emb> jthornton: looks good the g-code-generator, I like it
[08:38:29] <JT-Shop> ju-emb: I don't use hotmail...
[09:44:04] <skunkworks> pcw_home,
http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/dmg-mori-seiki-gildemeister-maho-cnc/fix-your-maho-thread-270525/index3.html#post2176405
[09:45:07] <skunkworks> The guy was scared away from linuxcnc because of the comments about it being slow. Poor guy
[09:47:15] <cradek> is that a really fast machine?
[09:49:44] <archivist> the comment "Another reason for me to keep Camsoft is the fact that it has 5 axis machining right out of the box. And I guess it will be a long time until that is "plug_and_play" in LinuxCNC? "
[09:49:58] <archivist> needs a stir
[09:54:59] <CaptHindsight> when did they start selling full size 14-17" laptops without optical drives?
[09:57:19] <skunkworks> Guy at work just bought one without. He didn't notice it untill he tired to install some of his software :)
[09:57:29] <CaptHindsight> sneaky
[10:20:13] <flughafen> cd-roms are so 2008
[10:29:02] <CaptHindsight> yeah, now we need a Live SD-Card installer
[10:29:12] <gonzo__> or sw on cassettee
[10:42:15] <mozmck> It's not hard to put the .iso image on a usb thumbdrive, and it installs *much* faster from there as well.
[10:42:39] <archivist> you should be putting the code in on toggle switches like we used to do in the olden days
[10:43:37] <mozmck> Running from a usb stick also has the advantage of allowing you to save your settings, documents etc on the thumbdrive. You can run from the thumbdrive just like it was a hard drive except it is slower.
[10:44:32] <CaptHindsight> mozmck: yeah, not a problem with Linux, I was just thinking about win7 installs over win8
[10:45:09] <mozmck> Oh, I don't use those. XP is the latest I have and it is running under virtualbox on my linux host.
[10:45:53] <mozmck> I don't think they want you to be able to un-install or re-install win$ though
[10:46:38] <mozmck> Isn't that the whole point of the new UEFI bios?
[10:46:44] <archivist> these days it comes on the hard disk in a partition
[10:47:28] <mozmck> Yes, and if the HD crashes you're supposed to buy a new laptop.
[10:48:42] <CaptHindsight> well it's not M$'s time or $ that gets wasted
[10:48:51] <mozmck> found a terminal called finalterm that looks promising.
[10:49:23] <archivist> large companies have a terrible attitude to the customers purse
[10:50:15] <CaptHindsight> it's really evil genius, have no real security, malware or virus protection and when your PC slows down it must be worn out so buy a new one
[10:50:23] <mozmck> ? they love the customers purse!
[10:50:33] <mozmck> They want everything in all of them!
[10:51:25] <archivist> it is a shame so many users let them get away with it
[10:51:34] <CaptHindsight> I wish my CAD packages ran well on linux
[10:51:42] <mozmck> Mine do.
[10:51:58] <mozmck> but I don't use CAD much :)
[10:52:13] <mozmck> FreeCAD, Kicad, etc
[10:52:31] <Deejay> qcad :D
[10:52:39] <mozmck> that too
[10:53:24] <CaptHindsight> Cadence Allegro, Orcad, Pads, NX, Catia, SW, MasterCAM etc
[10:55:45] <CaptHindsight> most do run on virtualbox but without video accell
[10:57:00] <CaptHindsight> or even wine
[10:58:36] <mozmck> We switched from Orcad to Kicad
[10:59:35] <mozmck> Did you enable Direct3D in the guest additions install? That and checking the 3D and 2D in the main VBox setup might help the videa accell?
[11:02:25] <CaptHindsight> keeping all the pricey CAD packages happy is really a support nightmare, we have actually gone with multiple win7 installs on the workstations to keep them isolated
[11:31:47] <JT-Shop> well splicing an extra SATA connector on the power supply seems to work
[11:32:30] <Tom_itx> no reason it shouldn't
[11:33:41] <Tom_itx> i didn't get a chance to look at the updates you did yet
[11:33:54] <JT-Shop> it's been one thing after another trying to get the LinuxCNC desktop computer back up
[11:34:18] <JT-Shop> there might be another one since you downloaded
[11:35:16] <Tom_itx> does the finish pass add to the final depth or subtract from it?
[11:35:27] <Tom_itx> you should indicate that somehow
[11:36:01] <JT-Shop> the finish pass is at final depth
[11:36:36] <JT-Shop> for example if you have a total z of .250 and steps of .1 and final of .05 then there will be 3 passes
[11:36:49] <Tom_itx> right but what if i give it a z depth of .500 and a finish of .020?
[11:36:54] <JT-Shop> one at -.1 one at -.2 and one at -.25
[11:36:58] <Tom_itx> will it be .520?
[11:37:09] <JT-Shop> no
[11:37:30] <Tom_itx> do i enter a depth or a cut value there?
[11:37:40] <Tom_itx> ie .500 or .010?
[11:37:55] <JT-Shop> if you just give it a z depth of .5 and a finish of .02 then two cuts will be made one at -.48 and one at -.5
[11:38:04] <Tom_itx> that could somehow be clarified there imo
[11:38:19] <Tom_itx> yeah that's kinda what i figured
[11:38:20] <JT-Shop> lol it's clear to me
[11:38:24] <Tom_itx> i'm sure
[11:38:31] <JT-Shop> did you look at the info tab?
[11:38:31] <Tom_itx> i'm playing devil's advocate
[11:38:45] <Tom_itx> oh hell no :D
[11:38:46] <JT-Shop> I know and thanks
[11:40:00] <Tom_itx> you know.. if you reverse the order of those 2 and maybe call the Z final Z finish it may be more self explanatory
[11:40:23] <Tom_itx> so Z Depth is the _last_ entry
[11:40:43] <Tom_itx> something about mericans reading from left to right up to down :D
[11:43:00] <Tom_itx> then visually, Z Safe, Z Top, Z Finish, Z Depth are in order of depth
[11:44:00] <jthornton> I can reverse the last two
[11:44:15] <Tom_itx> i write stuff all the time i never expect others to see or understand... i don't worry so much about anything then
[11:46:04] <jthornton> ok, download .4
http://gnipsel.com/files/g-code-generator/
[11:46:19] <jthornton> err .3
[11:46:47] <Tom_itx> it was .5 yesterday :)
[11:46:52] <Tom_itx> are we regressing?
[11:46:56] <jthornton> 1.5.3
[11:47:03] <jthornton> taking smaller steps
[11:47:04] <Tom_itx> oh
[11:47:06] <Tom_itx> heh
[11:50:19] <Tom_itx> that is the damndest thing... it shows up here but not in linux
[11:50:25] <Tom_itx> if i enter the filename it's there
[11:50:35] <Tom_itx> but not in the dir list
[11:50:55] <jthornton> shows up for me on every computer I have
[11:51:07] <IchGuckLive> hi all B)
[11:51:33] <jthornton> IchGuckLive, yes there is a README... now
[11:51:42] <IchGuckLive> thanks
[11:51:44] <Tom_itx> i closed ff and reopened it now it's there
[11:51:49] <Tom_itx> odd one for sure
[11:51:53] <jthornton> http://gnipsel.com/files/g-code-generator/
[11:52:05] <jthornton> new link ^^^
[11:54:06] <Tom_itx> oh, you don't have the 4 corners and center in the dialog working yet...
[11:54:14] <Tom_itx> left rear
[11:54:36] <jthornton> right, not even sure I need that, what do you think?
[11:55:48] <Tom_itx> of course you do
[11:55:56] <Tom_itx> i always start from the right end :D
[11:56:06] <IchGuckLive> jthornton: what is DOC
[11:56:17] <jthornton> Depth Of Cut
[11:58:29] <Tom_itx> if you start from the left front it will throw the chips at you
[11:59:47] <jthornton> IchGuckLive, I can add tool tip text to the entry boxes but that might get annoying once you know how
[11:59:58] <Tom_itx> it doesn't make alot of sense to have x y 0 in the center but i'm sure someone would disagree
[12:00:36] <jthornton> lol I have to agree that someone would disagree for sure
[12:00:51] <Tom_itx> either rear corner i can see
[12:00:57] <Tom_itx> i seldom indicate off the front
[12:01:00] <jthornton> that would require quite a bit of coding to implement
[12:01:34] <jthornton> I could see jogging to the approximate center and calling that X0 Y0 and wanting to face a part
[12:01:52] <IchGuckLive> jthornton: testing
[12:02:25] <Tom_itx> i see this as a tool to square blocks for first op
[12:03:02] <Tom_itx> but not everybody has cad cam and would see it alot differently
[12:03:09] <jthornton> did you notice the "*" indicating a required value?
[12:03:19] <Tom_itx> yes
[12:03:41] <Tom_itx> you may want to put a little space between the boxes so it stands out more
[12:03:56] <Tom_itx> | * | instead of |*|
[12:04:29] <Tom_itx> or have them blink in purple for us numb skulls
[12:04:52] <jthornton> lol
[12:05:09] <Tom_itx> or if you really wanna get fancy, show the dialog in red until it's satisfied then turn to green
[12:05:38] <jthornton> yea, that is fancy
[12:05:41] <cradek> graying out OK until preconditions are met is a usual way
[12:05:58] <cradek> aside from being really nonstandard behavior, depending on red/green color vision is always a bad idea
[12:06:06] <Tom_itx> i was exagerating a bit...
[12:06:26] <jthornton> what is it about 15% of males are red color blind
[12:06:34] <cradek> I've heard 10% - but yeah, lots
[12:06:50] <jthornton> so goes the memory too
[12:06:53] <cradek> red/green specifically (the colors of our traffic lights, duh)
[12:07:19] <jthornton> but they compensate by the position I'd think
[12:07:31] <cradek> sure, which works unless it's dark
[12:07:46] <Tom_itx> maybe that explains all these idiot drivers..
[12:07:57] <cradek> Tom_itx: oh no. way more than 10% of men are idiots.
[12:08:06] <Tom_itx> hah
[12:10:15] <Tom_itx> got all my limits moved over to the sserial card now
[12:10:28] <Tom_itx> starting on the pendant next
[12:19:07] <jthornton> is zig zag even useful for facing?
[12:20:55] <Tom_itx> i would use it
[12:21:18] <cradek> always face from the right side so the chips go away from you
[12:21:20] <Tom_itx> that's generally what we did but we usually used the MPG
[12:21:36] <cradek> yeah nothing wrong with zigzag
[12:21:39] <Tom_itx> unless there were an awful lot of blocks to clean up
[12:22:01] <Tom_itx> cradek i mentioned starting from the right for the same reason
[12:22:15] <Tom_itx> err starting from the left for the wrong reason :)
[12:22:46] <jthornton> I guess the only thing bad about zig zag is you switch back and forth from climb to conventional
[12:23:14] <Tom_itx> i don't think that plays too much a part on a facing op
[12:23:25] <jthornton> IIRC conventional cutting wears the sides of the end mill faster due to the rubbing
[12:23:34] <Tom_itx> not too many mills will take a .250 cut
[12:23:41] <Tom_itx> i've seen a few
[12:24:36] <Tom_itx> i try to climb as much as possible but don't really think about it when facing
[13:24:33] <IchGuckLive> im off BYE
[13:44:08] <Guest46748> Hi Group. I've sucessfully retrofitted a Tree knee mill to linuxcnc with mesa boards, amc drives, and stock motors. I'm looking at a bed mill with more rpms and all around better machine. Its already been retrofit to mach3 with viper drives. Having used mach3 I really like having the encoders feed back to the controller. Is there a solution for getting encoder feedback to linuxcnc while keeping step/dir drives?
[13:45:00] <Guest46748> sorry thats not very clear. should be: having used mach3 I like how linuxcnc has the encoder feed back all the way to the controller rather than just to the drive
[13:47:45] <andypugh> Guest46748: The solution to this is typically to use the step rate from LinuxCNC to the drives as a velocity control (a LinuxCNC-end change) and to run a PID based on encoder position inside HAL. The LinuxCNC step-generator can output step rate (velocity-mode) rather than distance (position-mode)
[13:52:35] <skunkworks> andypugh, how is rt_preempt working?
[13:52:50] <andypugh> I haven't touched it since last night.
[13:53:00] <Guest46748> Hi Andy. Thanks for the reply. I think the drives require encoder feedback. Do I somehow slip the signal and feed it to linuxcnc also?
[13:53:01] <andypugh> I have moved on to the next thing :-)
[13:53:43] <andypugh> Guest46748: Yes, just take the feedback to both. There might even be a pass-through on the Viper cards.
[13:54:50] <Guest46748> Ok. Nice simple answer I can wrap my mind around. I'll check out the machine.
[13:56:26] <skunkworks> 3 amc drives off ebay might be cheaper ;)
[13:56:54] <skunkworks> *less hasle...)
[13:57:37] <Guest46748> skunkworks, i got amc drives from ebay for my last retrofit, i hate to take a working machine and pull it apart
[13:57:55] <skunkworks> no - I mean buy some more :)
[14:04:51] <tjtr33> re heekscad heekscam, theres .debs for ubuntu here
http://code.google.com/p/heekscnc/downloads
[14:27:54] <jthornton> Tom_itx, I just did another update
http://gnipsel.com/files/g-code-generator/
[14:28:50] <jdh> github
[15:02:05] <Jymmm> USAF Band flash mob:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gIoSga7tZPg
[16:32:13] <Deejay> gn8
[18:14:39] <andypugh> Night all
[18:31:02] <Tom_itx> JT-Shop, what's new this round?
[18:33:07] <Tom_itx> you broke the corner diagram
[18:33:50] <JT-Shop> well it should still work?
[18:34:06] <Tom_itx> looks better for sure
[18:34:08] <JT-Shop> I'm adding some images and fixing a few things
[18:34:29] <JT-Shop> I'm going to remove the radio buttons for position
[18:35:57] <Tom_itx> you might want a tiny bit more space between the * and the X Start etc at the bottom. someone could confuse that as being for the X Start
[18:36:30] <Tom_itx> those boxes don't need to be near that big
[18:41:02] <JT-Shop> I don't have much control over the size of widgets... the only thing I dislike about Gtk
[18:41:21] <Tom_itx> hmm
[18:41:22] <JT-Shop> let me get a copy on this box so I can follow along
[18:42:36] <Tom_itx> is your drill routine a peck cycle?
[18:42:48] <Tom_itx> under hole ops
[18:43:10] <Tom_itx> looks like it is
[18:43:11] <JT-Shop> no, but I can add that option
[18:43:34] <Tom_itx> you have a peck entry value there
[18:45:37] <Tom_itx> i would also copy the drill cycle entry over to the tap page so you can dril and tap right on one page
[18:45:49] <Tom_itx> and leave it on the other one as well
[18:46:07] <Tom_itx> have it as a checkoff if you want it enabled
[18:46:28] <Tom_itx> since you list all the drill sizes there
[18:48:06] <Tom_itx> or move the tap routine over to the hole ops page
[18:51:22] <JT-Shop> you have to visit several tabs to set up a hole routine so tapping is kinda busy so I left it on it's own page incase you just want to drill
[18:51:54] <Tom_itx> i assume the coordinate list is for all the drill ops. under that assumption i would add 2 boxes there as checkoffs for each coordinate for tapping and reaming. so if it's checked off, the hole will be drilled then the 2nd op performed after the list is drilled
[18:51:55] <JT-Shop> trying to keep the overall size small so it can run beside Axis
[18:52:20] <JT-Shop> I'm not following
[18:52:33] <Tom_itx> on the coordinate page where you enter x and y values
[18:52:39] <JT-Shop> the coordinates are for any ops that are checked off as enabled
[18:52:48] <Tom_itx> add 2 checkoff boxes for each coordinate in the list
[18:52:59] <Tom_itx> one for reamer and the other for tapping
[18:53:12] <Tom_itx> i presume each hole will need to be drilled first
[18:53:13] <JT-Shop> it would take 5 check boxes that way for every hole
[18:53:19] <Tom_itx> ok
[18:53:40] <JT-Shop> it just depends on what your working with, you may have pre-drilled holes
[18:53:59] <Tom_itx> you're only going to do a maximum of 3 ops on any given hole
[18:54:07] <Tom_itx> drill, tap, chamfer
[18:54:11] <Tom_itx> drill, ream
[18:54:12] <Tom_itx> drill
[18:54:26] <Tom_itx> drill, chamfer, ream
[18:54:31] <JT-Shop> you might want a more precise hole than drilling so you ream
[18:54:39] <Tom_itx> right
[18:54:59] <JT-Shop> you might spot, drill, ream, chamfer, then tap
[18:55:01] <Tom_itx> so you drill it first then it goes back thru the list looking for a reamer checkoff
[18:55:17] <Tom_itx> then it goes back thru looking for tap etc
[18:55:26] <JT-Shop> the order is spot, drill, ream, chamfer, then tap
[18:55:33] <Tom_itx> i could see how that would get a bit busy
[18:55:34] <JT-Shop> if enabled
[18:55:53] <JT-Shop> busy in what way?
[18:56:04] <Tom_itx> what i was suggesting
[18:56:27] <Tom_itx> maybe not such a good idea
[18:56:51] <Tom_itx> i'm still thinking in cad cam :)
[18:56:52] <JT-Shop> oh all the check boxes on the Coordinates tab?
[18:56:57] <Tom_itx> yeah
[18:57:03] <g_mouer> how do I post a screenshot here when getting help?
[18:57:11] <Tom_itx> imagebin
[18:57:18] <JT-Shop> imagebin.org or com I forget
[18:57:26] <g_mouer> thanks
[18:57:29] <JT-Shop> or ca
[18:57:57] <JT-Shop> http://imagebin.org/
[18:58:19] <Tom_itx> doing the single ops like you are doing may be simpler
[18:58:58] <Tom_itx> i'm just thinking like cad cam where i'd add a drill, tap reamer etc for each hole, order them up and process it
[19:01:04] <g_mouer> getting a error message from pncconf (5i25 / 7i77) if anyone can help
http://imagebin.org/281755
[19:01:32] <Tom_itx> those that can, will
[19:02:07] <JT-Shop> g_mouer, the best place for pncconf support is the forum, the author is there daily and seldom here
[19:02:25] <JT-Shop> have you seen my sample configs for 7i77
[19:02:31] <g_mouer> thanks John, didn't know if Chris comes here
[19:02:57] <JT-Shop> not very often, and I don't understand the error
[19:03:01] <g_mouer> I had a 7i77 setup before, doing it on another system months later
[19:03:25] <tjb1> Anyone here NC'd a G0704
[19:03:42] * JT-Shop hears the dinner bell
[19:03:59] * Tom_itx just came from the feed trough
[19:03:59] <JT-Shop> talk to you guys later, thanks for the feedback Tom_itx
[19:04:06] <g_mouer> thanks, off to the forum
[19:04:08] <Tom_itx> np
[19:04:23] <Tom_itx> JT-Shop,
[19:04:39] <Tom_itx> on the facing i would at least offer the 2 rear corners as start points
[19:04:48] <Tom_itx> or a way to enter coordinates for them
[19:21:33] <g_mouer> posted a problem in forum on pncconf but noticed Chris Morley has not been on in 8 days. Everything ok with him?
[20:38:04] <dchevak> Hi there, and does anyone know of a youtube site for learning linuxcnc ?
[20:50:30] <skunkworks> dchevak: not that I know of. What sort of things are you looking for? The documenation is pretty good..
[20:53:57] <Jymmm> skunkworks: isn't it past your bedtime?
[21:02:29] <skunkworks> not yet.. getting close
[21:16:29] <dchevak> Just looking for adding tools and offsets and basicly getting more setup for my machine..
[21:17:46] <dchevak> I bought a sherline cnc because it was light to ship I live in Village in Chevak and shipping is expensive..
[21:18:49] <dchevak> I am looking at getting a bigger manual lathe 12Z and convert to cnc later
[21:19:45] <dchevak> from ihcnc.com
[21:39:13] <Tom_itx> dchevak mill or lathe?
[21:50:34] <dchevak> mill
[22:13:32] <uw> grissmill?
[22:13:36] <uw> sorry wrong chan
[22:58:17] <Mr_Mayhem> I just bought a Mesa Electronics 7I76-5I25 PLUG-N-GO KIT to interface with my yoocnc6040 driver boards. Should get here tommorrow. It consists of the 5I25 pci card, and the 7I76 STEP/IO Step&dir plus I/O daughtercard. Is there MESA guru around who can point me to a webpage or two for setting this up with LinuxCNC on a standard router mill?
[23:04:20] <Mr_Mayhem> I fried my parallel port, so i figured this was a wise fix and a good upgrade for the money (stepping done on fpga). I will bypass the original breakout card and use this setup instead. But the set up is something I need more info to complete. Amy useful links would be appreciated, thanks.
[23:04:23] <uw> those are selling like hot cakes
[23:04:50] <Mr_Mayhem> Yeah?
[23:07:24] <uw> yap i want one too i think you make a good choice
[23:07:25] <Mr_Mayhem> I looked at the Beagle board black with excitement as well, but they are out of stock everywhere. I bet the BBB will be a huge hit with Linuxcnc if the stepgen is clean and fast enough.
[23:07:39] <uw> well, the mesa part not the burning out the parallel port. that was prolly dumb
[23:07:49] <Mr_Mayhem> hehe
[23:08:08] <uw> Mr_Mayhem, i am getting one for xmas and cant wait
[23:08:30] <uw> BBB not mesa kit
[23:08:39] <Mr_Mayhem> Ah. Very cool.
[23:08:55] <uw> the mesa kit i will have to buy myself as my mom is buying the bbb
[23:09:12] <Mr_Mayhem> I think it is a game changer for sure. I want one just to get into it and make motors move.
[23:09:21] <Mr_Mayhem> I see.
[23:09:44] <uw> it does hav ealot of io but i dont like that the hispeed io is mapped to the onboard flash
[23:10:18] <uw> yea i try to keep it easy so she can buy from amazon. if i asked for the mesa kit shed probably get the wrong one
[23:10:56] <Mr_Mayhem> Does that mapping arrangement slow it down, or is the issue something else?
[23:11:48] <Mr_Mayhem> Yeah, cnc xmas planning is funny, "you want me to buy WHAT again?!"
[23:14:44] <uw> the high speed chan that is mapped to the headers is also used for emmc
[23:15:02] <uw> yea its the same here LOL
[23:15:06] <uw> it's just easier
[23:15:30] <uw> i plan to get the mesa thing when i get farther along on my big mill conversion
[23:17:25] <Mr_Mayhem> For the faint of heart, is the BBB setup mainly a matter of using an premade image file, or do you have to follow a crazy long setup procedure? I would start out with one with the linuxcnc already flashed I guess. I am a linux newbie...
[23:18:05] <uw> from what i've read it's not that hard. do you have a rasperry pi? to boot from sd it is similar
[23:18:59] <uw> for internal flash, it is still simmilar but with another step (ftping kernel/ramdisk/squash to the on board emmc)
[23:19:02] <Mr_Mayhem> No, but I am familiar somewhat with the basic procedure. I think I understand. Where I get lost is the apparent sea of conole commands.
[23:19:37] <uw> theres a lot of tutorials out there im sure and if you need help i'll have mine in a few weeks and can tell you if you need it
[23:19:50] <uw> i'm usually on here
[23:20:11] <Mr_Mayhem> Cool beans. Thanks, nice to know. What kind of cnc do you have?
[23:21:24] <Mr_Mayhem> I am running a YooCNC6040
http://www.carving-cnc.com/cnc6040-series/cnc-6040z-s80-new-router-engraver-drilling-and-milling-machine.html
[23:21:58] <Mr_Mayhem> My first cnc. I use it to do printed circuit boards and acrylic.
[23:22:40] <uw> cool i have a sherline thats cnc converter with bipolar steppers with a very old bipolar driver that i got working. i run it though the parallel port of my laptop (linux cnc)
[23:22:53] <uw> that engraving machine looks nice
[23:23:13] <uw> can that do metals like brass alum steel?
[23:24:10] <uw> i'm converting my mill drill right now and it will run these 400oz brushless servos that were cheap on ebay and have very little documentation
[23:24:36] <Mr_Mayhem> Its more rugged and precise than I expected. The probe pad was wired in reverse, and the electronics are subject to noise due to poor grounding, but I figure the MESA setup and better grounding/shielding will help.
[23:24:46] <uw> but i was able to find that they take standard +/-10v so the mesa kit that you have will work for me too i think
[23:24:55] <Mr_Mayhem> It can do light aluminum, like 1/4 inch slow.
[23:25:12] <uw> oh i see so it's a chinese import
[23:25:25] <uw> but hey sometimes (like you did) after a little tweeking they can be bine
[23:25:26] <uw> fine
[23:25:26] <Mr_Mayhem> But it excels at plastic and wood. Yes chinese.
[23:26:01] <uw> i have a chinese indexer for my big mill and it's not great but does work so i'm glad i made the purchase
[23:26:36] <uw> plus it was $150 vs $xxxx for a US one
[23:26:43] <Mr_Mayhem> The finest part I think is the spindle. It is water cooled and very quiet compared to air cooled motors.
[23:27:03] <uw> oh wow a water cooled spindle sounds fancy
[23:27:09] <uw> does it have high rpm?
[23:27:18] <Mr_Mayhem> 25,000 RPM
[23:27:25] <Mr_Mayhem> Max
[23:29:25] <uw> sounds cool
[23:29:39] <uw> i want to get that too one day
[23:29:39] <Mr_Mayhem> I was concerned about it at first, but it is quite right in most respects. I mounted the pump to a tupperware box lid and filled it with water and antifreeze.
[23:29:53] <uw> real high speed spindle for making fine cuts
[23:30:08] <uw> cool did it come with pump?
[23:30:13] <Mr_Mayhem> Yes
[23:30:14] <uw> for watercooling?
[23:30:16] <Mr_Mayhem> Yes
[23:30:23] <uw> ah neat
[23:30:46] <uw> all said and done if thats a complete kit $1500 isn't a bad deal for what you get
[23:31:14] <Mr_Mayhem> Experts say to put a small ceramic capacitor across the leads at the pump to kill radio frequency noise, but I still have to do that.
[23:31:51] <Mr_Mayhem> Shipped to my home was about $1950.00 with shipping and duty was like $30.00
[23:32:03] <Mr_Mayhem> I am in Las Vegas.
[23:32:20] <uw> oh ok so not much more
[23:32:31] <uw> still not a bad deal really
[23:32:47] <uw> cnc has come down so much in price over the years its great
[23:33:33] <Mr_Mayhem> For the money it's great. I wish they did better electronics, but the drivers seem improved compared with the older "blue controller box" version. The breakout board was very minumal.
[23:34:55] <uw> neat indeed
[23:35:12] <uw> i see it came with the "auto tool setting" z setter
[23:35:23] <uw> just curious what do you cut with your machine?
[23:35:29] <Mr_Mayhem> By minimal I mean I had to solder the output wires to the board for the limit switches. That went ok. But I had some static later on, and the whole thing died. I think I fried the breakout or the parallel port. So on to Mesa boards...
[23:36:32] <Mr_Mayhem> Yeah, auto tool is noting more than a probe shorting signal. They wired it backwards (reverse polarity) Allagator clip was positive should be negative ground.
[23:37:15] <uw> ah yea thats the kinda shotty stuff that you can expect
[23:37:27] <uw> shouldnt be that big deal to change and then you have a cool feature
[23:37:46] <uw> i want one of them so i can do cleaner PCBs
[23:38:17] <Mr_Mayhem> So when the probe was just plugged into the back of the control box, it would make all kinds of interference with the steppers.
[23:38:20] <uw> the ones i make now arent very good and i think that z finder will help with cleaning them up
[23:38:59] <Mr_Mayhem> For pcbs I highly recommend you try autoleveler app. Saved me from z axis leveling headaches.
[23:39:21] <uw> do you have more info about the autoleveler app?
[23:39:30] <Mr_Mayhem> http://www.autoleveller.co.uk/
[23:39:32] <uw> i have set tram time and time again but i think it's the board that is slopy
[23:40:14] <Mr_Mayhem> Yeah, PCB boards are often warped or curved.
[23:40:58] <uw> yea ive been reading that. I've seen a similar program to this that was in python but i havent tried it out
[23:41:36] <Mr_Mayhem> To use autoleveler, you set up the grid of probes, then run the generated gcode and it will probe and then mill. Keep the total probe count below 200 to avoid linuxcnc error. The count is displayed in the app.
[23:41:37] <uw> so you just use your .gc and it out puts an offset .gc?
[23:42:19] <Mr_Mayhem> Not exactly. I asked the developer to do that, and we had long discussion in the forum there.
[23:42:38] <Mr_Mayhem> What it does is probe and mill from the file it makes from your file.
[23:43:33] <Mr_Mayhem> So each time you run the output file, it probes and then mills. Reboot if interruped is wise. Still in beta, but worked for me with real pcb milling.
[23:44:27] <Mr_Mayhem> When you run it, your tool should be 9mm or so above the copper.
[23:45:25] <uw> hm ok so you give this program your .gc, it takes that and uses that to decide where to probe, then it just runs the .gc and offsets what it has probed?
[23:45:46] <Mr_Mayhem> you have to set the probe boundaries to insure all probes hit copper, not outside. Or it will punch down too far with nothing to tell it to stop. Set probe depth to -2 works well for me. -1 gave me an error that it finised the move with no contact.
[23:47:17] <Mr_Mayhem> Yeah, the offsets are stored in local linuxcnc variables and then it mills using those stored offsets from the probing part of the run(the first thing is does is probe, then it pauses. Set the safe height to enough to leave room to change the tool!)
[23:47:46] <Mr_Mayhem> Then it mills using the offsets it just determined.
[23:47:53] <Mr_Mayhem> All in the same run.
[23:48:10] <uw> oh ok so it is more integrated into linuxcnc than i thought
[23:48:19] <uw> not bad way either
[23:49:02] <Mr_Mayhem> It works with Mach3 also.
[23:49:57] <uw> i saw that, but i was confused where it says "utoLeveller is not tied to any particular CNC control software"
[23:50:14] <Mr_Mayhem> I was asking the developer to make it save the probe cloud to a file for future use so the final run NC file would be leveled with no need to probe again. He is a busy guy, we will see.
[23:50:33] <uw> yes thats what i was thinking how it would work
[23:50:39] <uw> still good for him he did this work anyway
[23:50:45] <uw> it's better than nothing
[23:51:35] <uw> ok i got to go see you later Mr_Mayhem thanks for info
[23:52:02] <Mr_Mayhem> Yeah, its a big deal for hobbests to be able to correct z axis variations on their table or workpiece. I bought a probe from cnc4pc.com to be able to use it for long cuts on acrylic, not only pcb copper or aluminim.
[23:52:06] <Mr_Mayhem> ok
[23:52:11] <Mr_Mayhem> have a good one.
[23:55:09] <Mr_Mayhem> Autoleveler with a probe will rock for long pockets where z always varies too much.