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[02:18:26] <_DJ_> moin
[02:55:31] <RyanS> Not sure if I can be bothered converting my three-phase drill press myself. I was quoted about $500 to have it done. Doesn't sound too bad
[04:42:00] <dchevak> hello
[04:42:49] <dchevak> just checking if I had everything installed right
[04:43:52] <dchevak> I guess I will try again later
[09:36:59] <jmasseo> the emco pc50
[09:37:05] <jmasseo> i guess this thing is ONLY for training?
[12:12:12] <IchGuckLive> hi all B)
[12:20:39] <_DJ_> hoi
[12:22:56] <IchGuckLive> its snowing outside
[12:23:16] <Tom_itx> yes it is
[12:23:33] <pcw_home> is not
[12:23:46] <Tom_itx> is so
[12:24:21] <pcw_home> only wind-ing here
[12:25:00] <Tom_itx> 24° F Light Snow
[12:25:25] <IchGuckLive> i got -1Deg C
[12:25:31] <Tom_itx> low Sat 14 F
[12:26:23] <Tom_itx> that's like 30 F isn't it?
[12:26:48] * Tom_itx <- didn't do the math
[12:28:11] <WalterN> bleh
[12:28:20] <WalterN> complicated parts
[12:28:28] <WalterN> they want a quote
[12:28:46] <pcw_home> 60F and 25 MPH winds
[12:29:01] <WalterN> a 5-axes CNC mill would be great for this
[12:29:29] <Tom_itx> how complicated?
[12:29:55] <WalterN> its a tool holder of some sort, for the logging industry
[12:30:19] <IchGuckLive> WalterN: 5 axis is always gread but only for spare parts and noone is gone pay that price
[12:30:52] <Tom_itx> anonimasu makes stuff for that industry
[12:31:00] <Tom_itx> haven't seen him in quite a while
[12:31:07] <WalterN> I'm having a bit of trouble building a 3D model in my head based on the drawings
[12:31:31] <Tom_itx> maybe you don't need a full 3d model
[12:31:35] <Tom_itx> just throw tools at it
[12:31:44] <Tom_itx> profile with tools
[12:32:00] <WalterN> the problem is that if I cant build it in my head it cant exist :P
[12:34:11] <Tom_itx> bad drawings?
[12:34:23] <WalterN> the drawings seem fine
[12:34:30] <WalterN> just complicated
[12:34:45] <WalterN> a lot of angles and little cuts
[12:34:46] <Tom_itx> i hate when engineers reference dimenstions from stupid locations
[12:35:29] <Tom_itx> then you gotta sit there and calculate a bunch of stuff just to get what they want
[12:35:30] <IchGuckLive> WalterN: you got a profechenol CAD CAM
[12:35:49] <WalterN> oh hey, I spy a profile thats not specified
[12:36:41] <WalterN> or wait, did they just define the radius?
[12:36:42] <Tom_itx> anymore here the companies send you the model and if it disagrees with the print you use the model
[12:37:58] <WalterN> that is such an insanely stupid way to define a hole
[12:38:19] <Tom_itx> engineer tryin to outsmart ya?
[12:38:28] <WalterN> I cant really tell for sure if thats what its supposed to define, but I dont see anything else that it could be defining
[12:40:57] <WalterN> they want it out of 4140 and then heat treated
[12:41:12] <WalterN> to 36-40RC
[12:41:22] <archivist> engineer that never used a machine too designs stuff like that
[12:42:12] <Tom_itx> i sometimes think they should be requied to work in our shoes at least for a week or two
[12:43:29] <WalterN> well
[12:43:46] <WalterN> its some parts this company has made by this one guy for years
[12:43:58] <WalterN> I guess last week that one guy died
[12:43:59] <Tom_itx> did he retire?
[12:44:04] <Tom_itx> woops
[12:44:16] <WalterN> yeah
[12:44:47] <WalterN> I dont think prints existed for this stuff before the guy died and they were going off of sample parts?
[12:44:51] <WalterN> or something
[12:44:56] <IchGuckLive> thick snow outside the hell of connecting towards town
[12:45:28] <WalterN> but anyways, we are getting another lathe today
[12:45:38] <WalterN> an older okuma
[12:45:51] <Tom_itx> this isn't a lathe part is it?
[12:45:59] <Tom_itx> we had an Okuma Kadet
[12:46:05] <WalterN> no, its all mill
[12:46:05] <Tom_itx> i kinda liked it
[12:46:22] <Tom_itx> we did most of the lathe jobs as MDI parts
[12:46:30] <Tom_itx> then saved them back from the machine
[12:49:55] <Tom_itx> i still have the pocket reference to the kadet if you have questions
[15:27:14] <andypugh> Well, I just changed the earspeaker in this iPhone, and it still doesn't work.
[15:35:28] <Jymmm> http://thebladebrownshow.wordpress.com/2013/11/13/lawsuit-paid-in-full-samsung-pays-apple-1-billion-sending-30-trucks-full-of-5-cent-coins/
[15:35:57] <kengu> Jymmm: again
[15:36:16] <Jymmm> ?
[15:37:33] <kengu> http://www.theguardian.com/technology/blog/2012/aug/29/apple-samsung-trucks-nickels-fake
[15:38:25] <mrsun_> a dust collector that always stays on Z zero ... an extra stepper that manges that maybe? :P
[15:38:58] <Jymmm> mrsun_: spring loaded
[15:41:44] <mrsun_> hmm true
[15:41:45] <mrsun_> i gues
[15:41:47] <mrsun_> guess
[15:42:25] <mrsun_> https://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-frc3/996636_10152015648853648_1233040468_n.jpg got one of those mounted to the spindle today ... got about 30mm of "shroud" and damn its nice to get rid of the mdf dust flying everywhere!
[15:56:42] <andypugh> Jymmm: Do you think that there really are 80 nickels in existence for every person in the US>
[15:57:32] <Jymmm> andypugh: No idea, I'm not a US Mint =)
[15:58:10] <andypugh> That would mean having more nickels than brain cells.
[15:58:46] <Jymmm> no clue, I didn't do the math
[15:58:56] <Jymmm> Aw fudge
http://www.theguardian.com/technology/blog/2012/aug/29/apple-samsung-trucks-nickels-fake
[15:59:19] <kengu> mrsun_: where you you get those
[15:59:26] <kengu> (;
[15:59:32] <kengu> nice construction or likes
[16:00:08] <kengu> i did break a 6mm bit today.
[16:02:42] <kengu> mrsun_:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/cxa37q386mssxwc/20130916_003.jpg work in progress..
[16:07:48] <mrsun_> kengu, =) get what ?
[16:09:08] <kengu> mrsun_: the (; was supposed to be on the same line
[16:09:24] <kengu> as in where can I buy those (;
[16:09:59] <kengu> but yeah. i have to go shopping for some brushes as the plasma is now working and it is again time to focus on router
[16:10:13] <mrsun_> kengu, buy what?
[16:10:26] <kengu> mrsun_: your construction
[16:10:35] <mrsun_> huh ? homebuilt? :P
[16:10:49] <kengu> yes. it sure looks like homebuilt.
[16:10:50] <mrsun_> the brushes are slaughtered paintbrushes
[16:10:55] <kengu> i can see that
[16:11:01] <kengu> the joke went. ok.
[16:11:05] <mrsun_> haha :P
[16:11:11] <kengu> it is late here
[16:11:14] <kengu> 23:55
[16:11:27] <kengu> and I am still running the router atm
[16:18:33] * JT_Shop gets a kick out of mhaberler's response to "it don't work any one have any ideas?" type of question
[16:20:12] <_DJ_> gn8
[16:22:11] <kengu> mrsun_: do you have recommendations on those brushes. some properties to look for except the lenght ofcourse
[16:24:10] <mrsun_> nah, its my first dust collection thingie
[16:24:15] <mrsun_> i just took what i had and trying it out =)
[16:25:11] <mrsun_> i wanted em somewhat stiff so they do not just suck into the vacuum hose, and still flexible enough to not lift the Z axis if to many stands straight down at the same time =)
[16:25:16] <mrsun_> and paint brushes felt just right :P
[17:01:38] <andypugh> I think I would have just bought brush-strip. Call me old-fashioned.
[17:02:28] <andypugh> http://www.ebay.com/itm/400399957452 as a random example
[17:50:02] <JT_Shop> odd, my GS2 lost the ramp configuration
[17:51:16] <PCW> it forgot?
[17:52:00] <JT_Shop> I guess, it went back to default settings
[17:53:29] <PCW> battery backed? (I would think EEPROM nowadays)
[17:56:04] <uw> andypugh, those things work great
[17:56:25] <uw> i have a 48" one thats a towbehind, BAMF
[18:02:52] <JT_Shop> doesn't seem to have a battery...
[18:13:18] * JT_Shop doesn't know why Rudy liked Tutti Fruity so much
[18:19:44] <uw> tutti fruity is over rated
[18:22:15] <PCW> bad EEPROM or insufficient write protection during power cycling
[18:22:16] <PCW> maybe (we have had some bad ones over the years
[18:22:18] <PCW> (you program them and they leak so a year later they've have dropped bits)
[18:26:51] <JT_Shop> I'll have to watch it to see, I rarely power it down
[18:42:44] <JT_Shop> say goodnight Gracie
[18:55:15] <Tom_itx> but Gracie! it's the weekend!!
[19:06:55] <Jymmm> Tom_itx: It's 5pm, 3 hours past JT_Shop / Groucho's bedtime
[19:07:41] <Jymmm> YAY finally sold the Speak and Spell! lol
[19:08:44] <andypugh> Past my bedtime too, I am going to try for a productive Saturday.
[19:08:49] <andypugh> Night all
[19:36:15] <jdh> are there any hobby-budget 3d printers that aren't just extruded plastic?
[19:41:12] <kengu> jdh: made of something else?
[19:41:26] <kengu> https://github.com/sgraber/Graber
[19:41:40] <jdh> made of whatever, 'print' witgh something ogther than hot plastic
[19:42:03] <Jymmm> jdh: Such as?
[19:42:27] <kengu> ok. or print with something else than what ever you can extrude
[19:42:29] <jdh> sintered metal, fused plastics, photopolymers?
[19:42:40] <kengu> as the machines do print ceramics and chocolate
[19:42:51] <Jymmm> jdh: photopolymers are plstic btw
[19:43:02] <Jymmm> jdh: there is powders
[19:43:22] <Jymmm> jdh: but that's more a laser fused sorta thing
[19:43:30] <Jymmm> or thermally fused
[19:43:30] <jdh> yeah, plastic is fine, just something other than extruded stuff by layer
[19:43:41] <Jymmm> jdh: application?
[19:43:43] <kengu> we tried laser sintering with our laser engraver. it did sort of work
[19:44:13] <Jymmm> kanzure: medium?
[19:44:35] <Jymmm> bah, kengu ^^^
[19:45:01] <Jymmm> I want to try sugar, but I'm not there yet on programming the Z on my laser
[19:45:41] <kengu> we used some "sintering powder" we got from a company or uni. no idea on what it was
[19:46:02] <Jymmm> Actually, not sure how I' going to program Z on mine
[19:46:12] <Tom_itx> http://the-sugar-lab.com/3d-printed-sugar
[19:46:23] <Jymmm> It's control manually via the serial port,
[19:47:41] <Jymmm> and I'm REALLY chicken to put a huge tub of powdered sugar in my laser
[19:47:55] <Tom_itx> sugar crisp
[19:48:58] <Jymmm> Tom_itx: powdered sugar + 950 CFM blower = VERY VERY BAD
[19:49:23] <GuShH> the sugar should be suspended in water, at least.
[19:49:42] <GuShH> you need a carrier and a bonding agent / mechanism, always.
[19:49:54] <Jymmm> laser IS the bonding agent =)
[19:50:12] <Jymmm> melts the sugar
[19:50:20] <GuShH> you don't really want to melt it
[19:50:25] <GuShH> in that photo, the sugar is not.
[19:50:33] <Jymmm> Melt, not char
[19:50:35] <GuShH> otherwise you get caramel.
[19:50:46] <GuShH> that has not seen high temperatures
[19:50:54] <GuShH> it's still in a crystal form
[19:51:09] <Jymmm> I have FULL control of what my laser can do... PPI, IPS, Resolution, etc.
[19:51:23] <GuShH> the carrier was removed by heat most likely, but the sugar remains crystaline
[19:51:39] <GuShH> Jymmm: so, give it a try
[19:51:59] <GuShH> seems you don't have FULL control over your blower though
[19:52:04] <Jymmm> Yeah, and gum up my lenses/mirrors
[19:52:06] <jdh> http://www.dive-xtras.com/cart/pc/viewPrd.asp?idproduct=120&idcategory=27
[19:52:14] <GuShH> Don't use it at all then, just stare at it.
[19:52:19] <jdh> something that would make things like that
[19:52:22] <GuShH> keep it for when you're dead.
[19:53:02] <Jymmm> jdh: you and your thousand dollar dive lights
[19:53:23] <Jymmm> jdh: Gimme the $1000 and I'll make ya a hell of a dive light
[19:53:39] <GuShH> capable of burning all the living creatures.
[19:53:42] <GuShH> and your retinas.
[19:53:50] <Jymmm> Nah
[19:53:56] <GuShH> the money is just about right for it
[19:54:03] <GuShH> leaving marketing out of the picture.
[19:54:13] <GuShH> otherwise we would only have $5 to spend on the light itself
[19:54:14] <Jymmm> batterys will be $$$
[19:54:35] <GuShH> depends on the desired runtime, in this case we only need a few seconds after that he won't notice, his eyes won't work!
[19:54:35] <jdh> I sold a bunch of excess dive gear so I could buy a chinese laser to play with or a non-glue-gun 3d thing
[19:55:11] <Jymmm> chinese laser imported or alredy in the US ?
[19:55:31] <jdh> keling ships them from chicago
[19:55:52] <jdh> a used non-cheap-chinese would be nice.
[19:56:04] <Jymmm> lol
[19:56:10] <jdh> thousand dollar dive lights would sell well...
http://www.dive-xtras.com/cart/pc/viewPrd.asp?idproduct=197&idcategory=43
[19:59:32] <Jymmm> jdh: Only thing, you have to charge each battery individually =)
[20:00:05] <kengu> http://www.peachyprinter.com/
[20:00:16] <jdh> my lights have battery cannisters machined out of delrin rod.
[20:12:32] <GuShH> couldn't find a cheaper plastic to use?
[20:12:37] * GuShH pokes jdh
[20:13:38] <jdh> others have been used with varying success. The Delrin ones are quite robust and I don't know of any failures due to the material.
[20:13:58] <GuShH> it's good stuff for how cheap it is
[20:15:41] <jdh> this type of dive gear is usually made by proficient amatuers that need it, but don't really know engineering, design, strength of materials, etc. The $2000 light is an exception and somewhat absurd, even for me.
[20:16:48] <GuShH> jdh: did you seal the canisters with a single point thread followed by an o-ring?
[20:17:18] <GuShH> what's the 2k light rated for, how deep anyway
[20:17:42] <jdh> there have been a few that are threaded, bugt usually a single o-ring and a pair (or 3) locking clasps
[20:18:12] <jdh> 180m depth rating
[20:18:21] <Tom_itx> or both like a mag light?
[20:18:48] <GuShH> that's not much
[20:19:04] <GuShH> even though the forces are, but given the price!
[20:22:43] <jdh> I'm sitting in a $40/night motel room with $20k worth of dive gear trying to save $67 on a propeller/hub by buying a $1000 3d printer
[20:27:57] <Jymmm> jdh: dont ya hate when that happens =)
[20:28:52] <GuShH> jdh: using their wifi?
[20:28:58] <Jymmm> jdh: And you know the first garage sale you drive by tomorrow will have a case of what you want for $20 for the the whole box
[20:29:02] <Tom_itx> money well spent :D
[20:29:03] <GuShH> a shady looking guy is already on his way for the 20k worth of gear
[20:29:37] <jdh> it's a $40 motel, there are plenty of shady looking guys
[20:29:39] <Jymmm> GuShH: ...and will be looking down a shark shot when he arrives =)
[20:30:31] <Jymmm> jdh: do those shark shots use regular 12ga shells?
[20:30:48] <jdh> never seen one.
[20:32:20] <Jymmm> jdh:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Powerhead
[20:34:17] <jdh> yeah, there are lots of those around.
[20:34:55] <jdh> most spear guys here use .357mag, some .223 also
[20:44:06] <jdh> last kickstar
[20:45:22] <RyanS> I read somewhere "this saving money stuff is expensive"
[20:53:34] <Tom_itx> jdh similar to hammer gun shots?
[20:53:44] <Tom_itx> basically blanks
[20:54:02] <jdh> blanks are expensive. Plain ammo + fingernail polish is cheap
[20:54:36] <Tom_itx> pull the lead out?
[20:54:46] <jdh> why not just leave it.
[20:55:08] <Tom_itx> i didn't know that it might gum up the 'barrel'
[20:56:13] <Tom_itx> must be a hefty barrel
[20:56:33] <Tom_itx> alot more pressure backed up pushing the rod out instead of just a lead slug
[20:56:50] <RyanS> Any idea why a lot of people seem to use auto reversing tapping heads on CNC mill. Why not just program the spindle to reverse and use a rigid tapping chuck?
[20:57:18] <Tom_itx> not all spindles are capable
[20:58:18] <RyanS> Specifically, I am seeing a Tormach tapping head... It has a VFD that can surely reverse
[20:58:56] <Tom_itx> you need a brake as well
[20:59:12] <jdh> I could imagine a tapmatic type thing being more forgiving than rigid tapping
[21:00:27] <RyanS> Anyhow, I got myself a three phase and drill press, which I am going to add a VFD. A brakecapacitor is cheap but I would have thought it would be easy to break the tap when you press the reverse switch
[21:02:10] <RyanS> So you're holding the quill handle and manually feeding the tap. Press the reverse switch. Then what?
[21:04:39] <RyanS> Does the quill push back up so you know when to release the pressure on the handle or does the tap break if you're not careful
[21:05:04] <Tom_itx> takes some finesse
[21:05:51] <Tom_itx> if the tap is small enough it will surely break
[21:05:56] <RyanS> Have you used it on any machines? Is it worthwhile
[21:06:06] <Tom_itx> used what?
[21:06:09] <Tom_itx> tapmatic?
[21:06:10] <Tom_itx> yes
[21:06:26] <Tom_itx> it's been quite a while
[21:06:51] <RyanS> VFD with a brak capacitor
[21:06:57] <Tom_itx> nope
[21:07:40] <RyanS> hmm. Might as well get the module... not expensive
[21:11:42] <skunkworks> *resistor
[21:12:42] <RyanS> Yes, resistor, oops :P
[21:13:40] <RyanS> Okay, it seems it's easier to program a CNC using an autoreverse tapping head rather than rigid
[21:17:56] <RyanS> http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=CkTo46ov7FA#t=352
[21:24:18] <skunkworks> eh - I like rigid tapping
[21:24:44] <Tom_itx> yep, works good if your machine is set up for it
[21:25:05] <skunkworks> and you can peck tap..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jAcFeVlftrw
[21:25:23] <skunkworks> all it takes is an encoder... :p
[21:25:48] <RyanS> Maybe tormach are just trying to sell extra accessories...
[21:26:04] <skunkworks> mach3 doesn't rigid tap
[21:26:30] <skunkworks> (unless you buy some expensive motion cards)
[21:27:04] <RyanS> Can't you just write your own tapping cycle?
[21:27:28] <skunkworks> ?
[21:27:46] <RyanS> in gcode
[21:27:49] <Tom_itx> you can write your own 'linuxcnc' if you feel so inclined
[21:27:55] <Tom_itx> not many have
[21:28:46] <skunkworks> you need an encoder on the spindle and the cnc controller that can 'gear' the axis to the spindle.
[21:29:07] <RyanS> cant you just have to do tell it to reverse and at what rpm and feed rate?
[21:29:07] <Tom_itx> yep, they must run in sync
[21:29:44] <RyanS> That didn't make sense... I meant can't you just program the parameters required
[21:30:44] <jdh> if you have an intelligent motion controller (or linuxcnc)
[21:31:15] <RyanS> Program forward, reverse, RPM, z-feed
[21:31:49] <Tom_itx> the spindle must be in sync with the feed axis
[21:32:10] <Tom_itx> if it starts feeding before the brake has had time to stop you will brake the tap
[21:33:18] <RyanS> yeah, but doesn't EMC then also require encoders and what not?
[21:33:29] <Tom_itx> sure
[21:33:44] <Tom_itx> at least for something like that
[21:34:24] <RyanS> but mach3 can't do that? odd
[21:34:40] <skunkworks> it is limited..
[21:34:59] <jdh> windows isn't so great for reading encoder pulses
[21:36:30] <RyanS> ah
[21:39:26] <RyanS> hmm.. I want to get a CNC mill but don't really have the skills to convert manual ... Not much choice around its either Tormach or syill and I haven't read good things about the latter
[21:42:10] <RyanS> At least not in Australia
[21:49:15] <RyanS> I would be in the wrong channel therefore :p
[21:49:56] <jdh> It isn't that hard to convert a small mill if you don't have overly high expectations
[21:50:28] <RyanS> Expectations for the accuracy?
[21:51:52] <jdh> Mine suits my needs for now. It isn't a 'real' mill, but I have room for it in garage and my budget.
[21:52:35] <Tom_itx> jdh, i forgot what you have?
[21:53:26] <RyanS> I'm tired of some forums simply dismissing benchtop mills. Like anyone has the budget for a VMC
[21:55:26] <Jymmm> I doubt anyone dimisses mini mills, they serve their purpose, especialt in prototyping, R&D, dental, jewelry, modeling, etc
[21:55:43] <jdh> Grizzly G0704
[21:55:51] <Tom_itx> ahh yeah
[21:56:35] <Jymmm> Is there actually any US iron mini mills?
[21:56:38] <RyanS> they do on practical machinist... Somebody asks about tormach, for exampleand they instantly get shot down en masse
[21:57:09] <Jymmm> RyanS: They run BP's sized stuff, different venue.
[21:57:33] <Jymmm> That's like having a sports car question on a big rig truck forum
[21:57:34] <jdh> I woudl trade mine for a tormach
[21:57:44] <RyanS> I think that's mainly people who use the machines that their boss owns and forget how much they actually cost
[21:57:56] <Tom_itx> Jymmm they all do the same thing
[21:57:58] <Tom_itx> cut chips
[21:58:16] <Jymmm> Tom_itx: same with a sports car and a big rig truck
[21:58:26] <Jymmm> they both go down the orad.
[21:58:28] <Jymmm> road*
[21:59:01] <Tom_itx> i'd rather take the big rig down the freeway nowdays
[21:59:21] <Jymmm> with a NO-FAULT bumper =)
[21:59:31] <Jymmm> 16" thick rubber
[21:59:32] <RyanS> I don't know how many times I've read get a 'real' VMC... sure just remortgage the house
[21:59:52] <Tom_itx> if i had work for one, i'd probably have one
[22:00:01] <Jymmm> RyanS: Then start a new forum for the smaller stuff on PM
[22:00:10] <Jymmm> sub-forum if you will
[22:00:26] <RyanS> I don't post on it, I've just read some
[22:00:54] <Jymmm> Well, you can either bitch about it, or do something about it.
[22:01:09] <jdh> I prefer bitching, it's a lot less work.
[22:01:16] <Tom_itx> yeah let's just bitch a wile
[22:01:18] <Tom_itx> while
[22:01:27] <RyanS> I don't really care.... I'm just saying
[22:02:09] <RyanS> I find it kind of amusing, . That's all
[22:04:38] <RyanS> Anyhow, so a tormach 770 is something like 770
[22:04:45] <RyanS> oops
[22:04:55] <RyanS> $6800
[22:07:07] <RyanS> I don't think I could save all that much money converting a BF 20, for example.. $2k for the base machine, 1k for ballscrews and hardware, controller, steppers, more top of that, etc, etc
[22:09:01] <RyanS> You then have something that is also going to require a spindle upgrade for higher rpm?
[22:57:40] <RyanS> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y1IDHIcyHLY the turret looks interesting
[23:58:29] <NickParker> I believe that video has popped up in here a few times. general consensus was yes, that turret is pretty sexy.
