#linuxcnc | Logs for 2013-11-13

[00:00:00] <kwallace1> Along with the power input and motor terminals there are two for a braking resistor.
[00:00:27] <kwallace1> During braking the VFD shorts the motor through the resistor.
[00:00:40] <MacGalempsy> oh. is that healthy for the drive?
[00:00:58] <kwallace1> and turns the braking energy into heat.
[00:01:22] <kwallace1> It's designed to do that within limits.
[00:01:28] <MacGalempsy> maybe someday after it all works, I can try the fancy stuff :P
[00:02:06] <MacGalempsy> but right now I am on a mission to add enable and fault for each amplifier
[00:02:33] <MacGalempsy> and the zbrake power
[00:03:24] <kwallace1> If you put to much current trough the shorting transistors the brake circuit cuts out and the motor coasts to a stop with out harming anything.
[00:04:00] <RyanS> Is it simply a matter of connecting a resistor module into those terminals or do you need some fancy circuit going to the motor?
[00:04:15] <kwallace1> The Z brake is just to hold the Z while the power is off?
[00:05:03] <MacGalempsy> yes
[00:05:26] <MacGalempsy> looking through the motion pins
[00:05:33] <kwallace1> The braking resistor needs to have enough wattage and cooling to handle the braking load.
[00:06:31] <MacGalempsy> the z brake is actuated through a relay, so I need to send an out signal
[00:07:11] <RyanS> If you have a, 1.5 kW motor and you need more than that for the resistor?
[00:09:13] <RyanS> *do yo, rather
[00:09:51] <kwallace1> No, it depends on how fast you want to slow the motor and how much inertia it has. Many VFD manuals have a sizing guide.
[00:12:09] <RyanS> These resistors are actually modules designed for vfds or you can simply get an off-the-shelf resistor with enough power?
[00:13:19] <kwallace1> This shows the one I made with four resistors (in gold) from Digikey: http://www.wallacecompany.com/cnc_lathe/HNC/00024-1a.jpg
[00:14:16] <RyanS> What's the Mitsubishi thingo?
[00:14:57] <RyanS> You have two VFDS?
[00:15:34] <kwallace1> The little VFD is for the coolant pump.
[00:16:00] <MacGalempsy> kwallace1: how would I go about adding a reset that I can toggle to ground when the fault light comes one?
[00:16:01] <RyanS> This stuff would be a no-brainer for electrical engineer to install? My friend is one
[00:17:16] <kwallace1> You can also get an idea of the resistor Ohms and Wattage by using the DC bus voltage and braking transistor amperage limit. V=IR and W=VA.
[00:19:08] <KimK> RyanS: Maybe a little explanation would be useful? Braking resistor action in a VFD (for a 3-phase motor) is a little bit different than braking resistor action for DC motors. For DC motors, you just load the motor with the resistor, the motor acts (directly) as a generator, heats the resistor, and comes to a stop.
[00:19:51] <kwallace1> MacGalempsy: I suppose a small relay or solid state relay or opto-coupler could work.
[00:20:36] <MacGalempsy> so I could just permanently gound the signal
[00:21:12] <MacGalempsy> automatic reset every 200us if grounded
[00:22:12] <RyanS> I really just want variable speed. How was it ever efficient to step drill with a belt drive when you are limited to steps in speed and to do it properly, you are supposed to what... change belts 4 times for 1 hole?!
[00:22:27] <MacGalempsy> so can I set up linuxcnc to detect the fault, then completely shut down and not reset, even though the amp manually resets?
[00:23:19] <MacGalempsy> I will just try that. I think it will be easiest to get to the next point.
[00:23:32] <KimK> But in a VFD, the motor when braking acts as a generator and raises the DC bus voltage powering the three totem pole drivers (six semiconductors, be they transistors, FETs, or whatever). So if braking is desired, there must be a "seventh" transistor, to gate the braking resistor on and off the DC bus, and some control circuit to watch the DC voltage level.
[00:24:05] <kwallace1> You can reset the VFD from the front panel I think.
[00:24:37] <KimK> Sometimes this extra stuff is supplied with the drive, and sometimes the resistors, 7th transistor, and control circuit are all in a separate box. It depends.
[00:25:37] <KimK> s/resistors/resistor(s)/
[00:27:37] <KimK> I think step drills are a fairly recent invention. Stepped pulleys have been around for a *long* time. Since line shafts were in use, at least.
[00:27:55] <kwallace1> Fortunately, all my VFDs have had the the braking transistor built in. I think the smaller ones usually do.
[00:29:09] <kwallace1> Often there would be a bank of drill presses, one for each operation.
[00:30:04] <KimK> Hi Kirk, good to chat with you. Yes, often the smaller ones have everything, even a minimum-sized resistor built in. With external resistor terminals in case their built-in one is too small for your application.
[00:32:09] <KimK> RyanS: Yes, sometimes folks will pull off their stepped pulleys for that reason and go 1:1 and VFD, but the lower gears (and higher torque) can be useful sometimes, depending on your machine.
[00:32:39] <kwallace1> KimK: How are things in Witchita? Cold enough yet?
[00:36:09] <KimK> kwallace1: It's getting there, around freezing at night lately, but may warm up later in the week.
[00:38:20] <KimK> Back in a bit, have to reboot.
[00:41:08] <RyanS> Sorry by step drilling, I meant progressing up in drill bits until you get to the target hole size
[00:42:01] <RyanS> The bewildering array of abrasive products for angle grinders is doing my head in
[01:19:06] <MacGalempsy> how would I make a generic output pin to signal the servo amplifier is on?
[01:23:18] <MacGalempsy> there is a motor enable that x-amp-enable that appears to go to the motor control, but I would like to do one that gets a 5v signal from the to tell the amp entire deal to enable
[02:00:17] <_DJ_> moin
[02:23:53] <MacGalempsy> morning dj
[02:24:24] <_DJ_> hoi MacGalempsy
[03:29:48] <MacGalempsy> DJ can you give me a clue as to why halscope will not show a wave form when attempting to PID tune?
[03:44:21] <archivist> because you are looking at the wrong pin ?
[03:49:51] <MacGalempsy> let me go look again, but pretty sure
[03:50:30] <MacGalempsy> my default P is set to 1, should I increase that?
[03:53:22] <archivist> I have never tuned a servo yet, see others recommendations
[03:58:24] <MacGalempsy> tried to use john's tutorial, but still cant get it to work. definately looking at the right pins
[05:06:25] <MacGalempsy> zzzzzzzzz
[05:48:52] <jthornton> where are we at MacGalempsy ?
[05:49:21] <MacGalempsy> estop- check dro-check LIMITSWITCHES-check
[05:49:38] <jthornton> nice
[05:49:53] <MacGalempsy> got the amplifier wired up, enabled light on, but cannot get the halscope to read the waves for pid tuning
[05:50:16] <MacGalempsy> and dro has correct values btw, that was exciting
[05:50:34] <jthornton> so if you move the axis 1" the dro reads 1"
[05:51:05] <MacGalempsy> yes, i moved y the entire length and it went 12.111" and y is 7.145"
[05:51:33] <MacGalempsy> oops x=12
[05:51:40] <jthornton> did you check that the dro reads +- in the right direction for each axis
[05:51:56] <MacGalempsy> yes, all three are correct
[05:52:15] <jthornton> +X the spindle moves to the right or the table moves to the left etc
[05:52:47] <MacGalempsy> I put the table all the way to the right, and that is 0, move it all the way to the left and that is 12
[05:53:09] <MacGalempsy> push y all the way to back is 0 and all the way forward is 7
[05:53:28] <MacGalempsy> I have to check z again
[05:53:29] <jthornton> that is backwards it should be -7
[05:53:52] <jthornton> all the way up is Z0 and down is Z-
[05:54:20] <MacGalempsy> ok. working on 6am rpts. mean to get back out there in about 20
[05:54:31] <jthornton> ok
[06:23:24] <MacGalempsy> finally!
[06:23:35] <MacGalempsy> back to the garage heh.
[06:26:27] <MacGarage> so JT, pushing the table all the way to the back is not zero?
[06:28:28] <jthornton> for Y axis when the table moves back (the spindle move toward you) that is a - move
[06:29:42] <MacGarage> ok inverted the encoder from -50000 to 50000
[06:29:46] <MacGarage> its fixed
[06:30:07] <jthornton> are you jogging yet?
[06:30:34] <MacGarage> no when trying to pid it, cannot get waves to halscope
[06:31:12] <jthornton> will the axis move when you press the jog keys?
[06:31:31] <MacGarage> i dont see any jog keys
[06:31:41] <MacGarage> but the enable is going on
[06:31:54] <MacGarage> joint following error
[06:33:05] <jthornton> in Axis you select the axis on the Manual Control tab then press the + or - with your mouse or look at Help Quick Reference for the keyboard assignment
[06:33:07] <jthornton> s
[06:33:46] <MacGarage> when I click + the "joint 0 following error" is triggered
[06:34:36] <jthornton> you will need to loosen up the following error for the axis until you tune it
[06:34:53] <MacGarage> start with 1?
[06:35:48] <jthornton> if your working with the X axis that is AXIS_0
[06:36:02] <MacGarage> no i mean 1 for ferror
[06:36:19] <MacGarage> the other thing is, shouldnt max output be more than 1?
[06:36:36] <jthornton> increase FERROR to say 0.5 and MIN_FERROR to 0.5
[06:36:59] <jthornton> you just want it big enough so you can jog while you tune
[06:38:41] <MacGarage> max output is set to 1
[06:38:48] <MacGarage> should that be higher?
[06:39:55] <MacGarage> when I click + the velocity blips but the dro doesnt change
[06:40:42] <jthornton> looking to see what that does
[06:41:47] <jthornton> I'm not sure that is even used, comment it out and see if the config runs
[06:43:00] <archivist> have you connected the signals to drive and enable the motor
[06:43:01] <MacGarage> so I click + and the velocity goes to 5.8 but there is no movement
[06:43:41] <MacGarage> I did, when using the halmeter on the enable port, it goes to true
[06:43:47] * archivist hugs real scope to test wires and signals
[06:44:42] <jthornton> what does the analogout0 pin show when you jog?
[06:45:34] <MacGarage> 0
[06:46:15] <MacGarage> motion.enable = true
[06:47:55] <jthornton> I would think that analogout should show something when jogging
[06:48:17] <MacGarage> maybe I dont have it enabled properly
[06:48:30] <MacGarage> but the green light is on on the amplifier
[06:48:55] <MacGarage> the enable and faults on the drive are grounded, and it is powered w 70v
[06:49:07] <jthornton> what does axis.0.motor-pos-cmd show when you jog the X axis?
[06:49:47] <MacGarage> .4
[06:49:57] <MacGarage> then increases
[06:50:06] <MacGarage> I think it just needs more juice sent
[06:52:48] <jthornton> what does pid.0.output show?
[06:53:38] <MacGarage> .4
[06:54:40] <jthornton> that looks right but analogout0 should be the same...
[06:54:50] <MacGarage> they are the same
[06:55:12] <jthornton> then the axis should move
[06:55:36] <jthornton> is the axis servo holding the axis in position?
[06:55:56] <MacGarage> how would I check?
[06:56:21] <MacGarage> i can move it by hand
[06:57:17] <jthornton> if you can move it by hand when the amp is energized
[06:57:19] <MacGarage> something is backwards because I just move the x axis and the ydro readout
[06:57:35] <jthornton> yea, something wrong there
[06:58:33] <MacGarage> so the encoders are backwards
[07:00:43] <jthornton> sounds right
[07:02:08] <MacGarage> swapped and pushed the x and it counted right
[07:02:41] <MacGarage> but velocity is still firing up, but no movement
[07:02:53] <MacGarage> i have the tachs wired into the motor terminals like instructed
[07:04:15] <MacGarage> now x-amp-enable is false
[07:04:22] <MacGarage> so I need to turn that back on some how
[07:04:51] <jthornton> when you press F2 the amps should be enabled
[07:09:37] <jthornton> I can test that the config moves an axis on my BP after while
[07:10:11] <MacGarage> i saw one problem. there were two net amp-enable-out
[07:11:08] <jthornton> that could be ok to use the same signal name twice
[07:12:53] <jthornton> yes but they are for different axes axis.0.amp-enable-out, axis.1....
[07:13:09] <MacGarage> net x-axis-enable hm2_5i25.0.7i77.0.1analogena does not exist
[07:13:28] <MacGarage> the physical pin
[07:14:42] <jthornton> should be net x-axis-enable hm2_5i25.0.7i77.0.1.analogena
[07:15:18] <MacGarage> ok yes
[07:32:43] <MacGarage> you dont think I need to give it more than a .4v nudge?
[07:35:20] <archivist> you said something earlier, you can turn the motors by hand when enabled is this still true
[07:35:43] <MacGarage> yes
[07:36:26] <archivist> is the amp really enabled
[07:36:47] <MacGarage> the green light is on to say its good to go
[07:37:18] <MacGarage> when I do a continuity test on the enable+and enable- there is no connection
[07:37:32] <archivist> its sitting there in a happy state but probably not enabled
[07:38:04] <archivist> have you driven the enable pins
[07:41:23] <MacGarage> ok in the servo amp manual it says the enable and disable need to be grounded to enable
[07:42:04] <MacGarage> so that means the analogena needs to go to analogena-inv
[07:42:09] <MacGarage> sound right?
[07:54:51] <MacGarage> how do I inverse the logic on the enable command show ground when enable and volt when disable?
[07:57:57] <archivist> its what the inv means
[07:58:33] <MacGalempsy> when I do a show pin, that analog does not show an analogena-inv
[08:00:06] <archivist> there is also an invert comp iirc
[08:03:07] <MacGalempsy> what is invert comp?
[08:04:01] <MacGalempsy> in halmetet it showed a parameter analogena-invert
[08:04:19] <archivist> then use that
[08:05:49] <MacGalempsy> i tried, then it said it wasnt recognized
[08:06:14] <MacGalempsy> i will try again
[08:09:46] <MacGarage> not recognized
[08:10:42] <JT_Shop> I don't see any invert for analoga
[08:11:02] <JT_Shop> crap lost my mouse got to reboot
[08:11:47] <archivist> http://linuxcnc.org/docs/html/hal/components.html#_logic_and_bitwise_components_a_id_sec_realtime_components_logic_a
[08:11:56] <archivist> see not for an invert
[08:19:08] <Tom_itx> or can he just invert the signal with invert_output ?
[08:20:08] <Tom_itx> http://www.linuxcnc.org/docs/html/drivers/hostmot2.html#_parameters_2
[08:21:02] <MacGarage> net x-axis-enable not.hm2_5i25.0.7i77.0.1.analogena comes back with pin does not exist
[08:21:29] <Tom_itx> don't put the not in front of it
[08:21:52] <Tom_itx> is it a GPIO?
[08:21:53] <MacGarage> tom right now it is sending voltage, and I need it to send ground
[08:21:56] <Tom_itx> or analog?
[08:22:12] <MacGarage> analog I guess
[08:22:47] <Tom_itx> i think otherwise but could be mistaken
[08:23:15] <MacGarage> the strange thing is the other analog outs have the ability to be inverted
[08:23:53] <Tom_itx> net x-axis-enable hm2_5i25.0.7i77.0.1.analogena.invert_output 1
[08:24:24] <Tom_itx> also see is_output and is_opendrain
[08:24:29] <Tom_itx> for other options
[08:25:18] <Tom_itx> i'm going under the asumption it's a GPIO enable pin
[08:25:24] <MacGarage> that line comes back to does not exist
[08:26:17] <Tom_itx> there _is_ a way but i'm not sure what it is
[08:26:27] <Tom_itx> i have no analog cards here
[08:27:51] <MacGarage> let me look at the board datasheet and see if I can move some jumpers to reverse
[08:28:45] <cncbasher> hi can i help at all , just joined mid conversation
[08:31:15] <MacGalempsy> ok now there is an enable, and a pos enable
[08:31:43] <MacGalempsy> the enable enables the amplifier and can be jumped to either 5v or gnd
[08:31:50] <MacGalempsy> it is set at gnd.
[08:32:00] <MacGalempsy> the pos enable is gnd only
[08:37:20] <JT_Shop> finally
[08:37:44] <somenewguy> you think
[08:39:13] <MacGalempsy> wb
[08:42:21] <jdh> thanks
[08:43:12] <JT_Shop> MacGalempsy, I see what is missing in the sample config
[08:44:14] <MacGalempsy> john do you think that the enable on the amplifier needs to be grounded to enable is a problem?
[08:44:55] <JT_Shop> no, there is no amp enable in the sample config
[08:45:49] <PetefromTn> Morning Folks.... BRRRRrrrrr it is cold here this morning. I saw 17 degrees on my vans overhead display.
[08:45:54] <MacGalempsy> morning pete
[08:46:04] <jdh> Pete: move south!
[08:46:15] <MacGalempsy> net x-axis-enable hm2_5i25.0.7i77.0.1.analogena that is not an enable command?
[08:46:17] <PetefromTn> Morning Mac sounds like it is moving along there thats good.
[08:46:18] <Loetmichel> per: i saw -2°c this morning ;-)
[08:46:23] <Loetmichel> PetefromTn
[08:46:40] <JT_Shop> for the 7i77 card yes
[08:46:42] <PetefromTn> jdh: I'm tryin man got the house up for sale now LOL..
[08:46:49] <PetefromTn> Loetmichel: Hey man morning
[08:47:01] <JT_Shop> # Servo Drive
[08:47:01] <JT_Shop> net power-on hm2_5i25.0.7i77.0.0.output-00 <= motion.motion-enabled
[08:47:28] <JT_Shop> that is the output I use for my BP your output pin may be different
[08:47:53] <PetefromTn> Downloading drivers for my printer for the new computer so I can print my plywood cutlist for this new cabinet job I am working on.
[08:48:18] <PetefromTn> Supposed to be done by the time Santa cranks up his sleigh..
[08:49:03] <jdh> then you have lots fo time!
[08:49:27] <PetefromTn> Not for a built in that is almost 20 feet long and nine feet tall I don't LOL
[08:52:45] <MacGalempsy> i am confused....
[08:54:29] <archivist> so are we
[08:54:36] <JT_Shop> your amps need an enable output and that line above turns on an output pin when you press the power button
[08:57:38] <MacGalempsy> but you have it coming out of the outs, and this one should be coming off the 4wire drive terminal going to the amp
[08:58:42] <JT_Shop> not sure what a 4 wire drive terminal is, but in any case I have to leave now
[08:59:16] <MacGalempsy> ena+ goes to /pos enable on the amp. the amp requires gnd to enable, or voltage/open ot inhibit
[08:59:33] <MacGalempsy> thank you for your help
[09:03:26] <PetefromTn> God I hate printers...
[10:03:46] <pcw_home> MacGalempsy: if the drives need an active low enable (GND to enable),
[10:03:47] <pcw_home> you connect the ENA+ to the drive enable line and the ENA- to GND
[10:06:12] <pcw_home> the drive enable lines (ENA+ and ENA-) are OPTO coupler outputs (basically switches)
[10:06:13] <pcw_home> so you always need to use both (and pay attention to polarity)
[11:17:47] <tjtr33> CaptHindsight, http://www.popsci.com/article/gadgets/3-d-printed-hand-cranked-computer
[11:17:59] <tjtr33> if you print 2 is it dual core ? :)
[11:36:45] <Loetmichel> re @ home
[11:48:49] <IchGuckLive> hi all B)
[12:38:20] <IchGuckLive> all quit today
[12:44:21] <PetefromTn> Just taking lunch here...ripped up about a dozen sheets of furniture grade plywood so far today.
[12:54:28] <jasen_> forming diferential pwm on fpga board and transmiting it to the converter(adum board) , converting it to +_10v powered by the inverter
[12:56:48] <IchGuckLive> jasen_: what fpga
[12:57:31] <IchGuckLive> PetefromTn: 95% of US roofs are on bitumen so take your time its getting whorse
[12:57:33] <jasen_> sorry , wrong window
[12:59:09] <PetefromTn> IchGuckLive: HUH,, Dunno what you mean here man.
[12:59:59] <IchGuckLive> if you are renovatring your house
[13:00:32] <PetefromTn> Oh no man I build custom cabinetry from my shop. Just started a new job here this morning.
[13:00:51] <archivist> method, read one word and jump to wrong conclusion
[13:01:03] <IchGuckLive> O.O
[13:01:32] <archivist> lurk in channel, realise what person does...profit
[13:01:48] <IchGuckLive> profit is good
[13:02:06] <PetefromTn> PROFIT?? Hey what's that?
[13:02:31] <IchGuckLive> what yoiu hopefuly live of
[13:02:45] <archivist> if I had it the bailiffs would stay away
[13:03:41] <PetefromTn> I honestly don't do enough work around here to show anything resembling actual Profit LOL But I am tryin'!!
[13:04:08] <IchGuckLive> more metal less wood
[13:04:30] <IchGuckLive> TN is a hard state
[13:05:56] <PetefromTn> I hear ya man... I am tryiing to get the metal paying off but so far it is tough nut to crack. I do actually have some customers right now wanting some metal parts and some ideas for at least a short run product for sale here. Right now truth be told the cabinetry makes me MUCH more money than the metal ever has...UNFORTUNATELY>
[13:06:49] <IchGuckLive> Thats how live goes
[13:07:04] <PetefromTn> yes exactly..
[13:07:33] <IchGuckLive> i got a butcher that now solds more metal sheeds than sausiches
[13:08:02] <PetefromTn> I have been drawing some parts in the Cad software here recently and gonna try to make them in the evenings..
[13:08:16] <PetefromTn> whats a metal sheed or a sausiches?
[13:08:35] <IchGuckLive> almost night here
[13:09:24] <IchGuckLive> Oh TN is on steaks
[13:09:52] <IchGuckLive> or there are lots of germany in TN
[13:10:04] <IchGuckLive> and germany like BRATWURST
[13:11:29] <PetefromTn> so you are saying your butcher is from Tennesse and loves bratwurst LOL?
[13:11:31] <IchGuckLive> yes
[13:11:39] <IchGuckLive> but more Beer
[13:12:22] <PetefromTn> not a beer drinker but I know you guys really love the stuff LOL....
[13:13:42] <IchGuckLive> there are 8.3% Germans in Tennessee
[13:15:24] <PetefromTn> There's a lot of scotch Irish around here I know that..
[13:16:03] <IchGuckLive> Irisch (9,3%)
[13:16:40] <IchGuckLive> 60% Rep
[13:18:26] <IchGuckLive> PetefromTn: you got a picture of your cabinets
[13:18:56] <PetefromTn> I might have some....hang on.
[13:19:09] <IchGuckLive> marquetry cutters are well pait
[13:20:05] <IchGuckLive> inlaid sarpenter
[13:20:50] <IchGuckLive> inlaid carpenter,joiner
[13:21:44] <IchGuckLive> and the US people like there sign logo ... all over
[13:22:02] <IchGuckLive> laser engraver on wood is a goal to be meet
[13:25:09] <Tom_itx> PetefromTn you must not be in a very industrial area
[13:25:36] <PetefromTn> No not really, I live not far from the entrance to the Great Smoky Mountains national Park.
[13:25:46] <IchGuckLive> Tom_itx: we all live in the outback therfore we use LINUX O.O
[13:26:04] <PetefromTn> Hell even KNoxville is not what I would call an industrial complex LOL
[13:26:51] <IchGuckLive> PetefromTn: is there indian summer in Great Smoky Mountains national Park
[13:28:00] <Tom_itx> IchGuckLive not true... some of us live near civilization
[13:28:01] <IchGuckLive> the area you live looks exactly like here Mountain bike tarain
[13:28:16] <IchGuckLive> Tom_itx: im realy not
[13:28:47] <IchGuckLive> ok im off for today BYE
[13:28:56] <Tom_itx> buy
[13:29:42] <pcw_home> by
[13:30:39] <Tom_itx> pcw did you ever happen across a 'used' 7i84?
[13:31:13] <pcw_home> send me your address I'll send a blem or two
[13:31:21] <Tom_itx> pm?
[13:35:19] <Jymmm> pcw_home: Define blem? comes in 4 pieces? =)
[13:35:46] <Jymmm> pcw_home: "Magic Smoke Not Included"
[13:38:09] <Jymmm> pcw_home: "Guess the random broken trace(s)"
[13:43:19] <pcw_home> usually works but dont know where its been
[13:43:53] <Jymmm> pcw_home: Partying on the wrong side of town? Financial District?
[13:44:53] <Jymmm> pcw_home: It's been performing lewd acts with a thunderbolt port?
[13:45:43] <pcw_home> well we dont know...
[13:45:54] <Jymmm> lol
[16:28:22] <_DJ_> gn8
[16:47:50] <Jymmm> quiet in here... is it summer and I didn't get the memo?
[16:48:47] * WalterN flails at Jymmm
[16:49:30] <jthornton> pcw_home, when I see MacGalempsy in the morning I'll pass along the info on enabling
[16:49:31] <Jymmm> WalterN: youtube it!
[16:50:06] <WalterN> youtube what?
[16:50:24] <Jymmm> your flailing
[16:51:07] <WalterN> alright
[16:51:09] <WalterN> Jymmm: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tv4KQbDaCfM
[16:51:35] <Jymmm> WalterN: you're looking a lil green these days
[16:51:47] <WalterN> on my screen, you are green
[16:51:49] <WalterN> heh
[16:52:06] <WalterN> of course my screen is the only one that matters
[16:52:15] <Jymmm> That's mono, go get a shot or vga, your choice.
[16:53:18] <WalterN> hmm
[16:53:26] <WalterN> I should stuff
[16:53:53] <WalterN> http://www.netfirms.com/netfirms/web-hosting/
[16:56:25] <WalterN> no IMAPS
[17:00:46] <PetefromTn_> Well I think my $75.00 commercial wood shaper is gonna work out just fine. I managed to get it all wired back up and everything installed on the new custom built wood cabinet I made for it from an old sheet of OSB flooring material and some furniture plywood LOL.
[17:02:43] <WalterN> unless they mean IMAP includes IMAPS... not much reason to exclude it because they have SSL certs
[17:02:56] <PetefromTn_> I degreased the top and scrubbed the little rust spots off of it and it is decently smooth now. I have a tongue and groove paneling cutter to test it with but I gotta order me some new cabinet door cutters and a panel raiser cutter so I can make these doors. I know it is not as exciting as a new CNC mill or something but I am pretty happy with it. These machines are USUALLY around $2k bucks.
[17:11:12] <WalterN> http://blog.solidconcepts.com/industry-highlights/worlds-first-3d-printed-metal-gun/
[17:12:41] <WalterN> the barrel is probably pretty rough
[17:22:41] <PetefromTn_> Interesting, I wonder how long it took the machine to actually make all the parts for the gun.
[17:24:17] <andypugh> I want to 3D-print a Gnu.
[17:24:38] <CaptHindsight> we need a new Gnu
[17:25:44] <CaptHindsight> "The gun is composed of 30+ 3D Printed components with 17-4 Stainless Steel and Inconel 625"
[17:26:37] <andypugh> So, it's basically a metal gun in a 3D-printed surround.
[17:27:00] <CaptHindsight> http://www.solidconcepts.com/technologies/direct-metal-laser-sintering-dmls/
[17:27:17] <andypugh> I rather suspect that it would be funcitional but uncomfortable without the 3D parts
[17:27:20] <CaptHindsight> sintered powdered metal
[17:27:41] <andypugh> Yeah, DMLS is cool.
[17:28:11] <CaptHindsight> http://fast.wistia.net/embed/iframe/eqpzzledcq?autoPlay=true&controlsVisibleOnLoad=true&playButton=false&plugin[socialbar-v1][buttons]=embed-email-twitter-linkedIn-googlePlus-facebook&popover=true&version=v1&videoHeight=360&videoWidth=640&volumeControl=true#
[17:29:04] <andypugh> I admit I came in late and just assumed that this was more GGG Gun-making hysteria in the media.
[17:31:27] <CaptHindsight> they left all the secondary processing steps required out of the story
[17:32:03] <andypugh> The other process I have seen included braze-impregnating it.
[17:32:37] <CaptHindsight> they only use 1 laser and layer times are in the several seconds so the total time was probably 100+ hours for all 30 parts
[17:33:26] <CaptHindsight> unless they used a larger bed and printed different parts at the same time using one printer
[17:33:54] <CaptHindsight> but all the secondary steps added several hours
[17:34:19] <CaptHindsight> they might have also secondary machined the inside of the barrel
[17:35:20] <CaptHindsight> it's mentioned but the PR is not supposed to expose the weakness of their tech, just capitalize on peoples assumptions
[17:35:54] <CaptHindsight> sorry, the secondary steps are not mentioned
[17:36:46] <jthornton> yea QCad CAM now works with points to drill holes
[17:37:03] <jthornton> I wonder how I can make it generate tapping code?
[17:37:27] <Tom_itx> jthornton does it support canned cycles?
[17:40:06] <jthornton> tapping is not a canned cycle in LinuxCNC :(
[17:40:38] <jthornton> I assume you could make it do canned cycles but why if it generates the G1 down and the G0 up
[17:41:05] <jthornton> IMHO canned cycles only help the hand programmer in most cases
[17:44:00] <andypugh> JT_Shop: Actually, tapping _is_ a canned cycle, we just don't admit to it in the docs.
[17:44:18] <Tom_itx> is it coded but not used?
[17:44:53] <CaptHindsight> http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1638882643/diwire-the-first-desktop-wire-bender useful but overpriced
[17:45:19] <andypugh> G84 is a canned tapping cycle. http://git.linuxcnc.org/gitweb?p=linuxcnc.git;a=blob;f=src/emc/rs274ngc/interp_cycles.cc;h=e195664d1d96c7e50dc8cfaac5bb2c44b63a74e3;hb=HEAD#l234
[17:45:29] <jthornton> andypugh, does it work?
[17:45:33] <andypugh> I have never tried seeing what happens if you use it.
[17:45:45] <andypugh> Maybe try it with no tap?
[17:46:04] <Tom_itx> or try tapping butter
[17:46:06] <jthornton> yea, then with soap, then with plastic
[17:46:14] <jthornton> naw, eat the butter
[17:46:28] <CaptHindsight> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ghDhZxidomc http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YegMbA_lrN4 should have been kickstarter projects
[17:46:41] <Tom_itx> behavior is undefined...
[17:46:48] <jthornton> I can program the post processor to do what ever I want with points
[17:47:26] <jthornton> and pick by layer if you want G81 or G84 etc.
[17:48:51] <CaptHindsight> anyone know who made the wire benders? ^^
[17:49:50] <WalterN> thats cool
[17:57:01] <mpictor> CaptHindsight: judging from the user name on the first video, it was Acemi. Don't have an email address tho.
[17:57:25] <Tom_itx> Fadal G84 Right Hand Tap / G84.1 RH Rigid Tap Format1: (Q=THD. Lead, F=RPM) Format2: (NO Q, S=RPM, F=Feed)
[17:59:33] <CaptHindsight> mpictor: http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Acemi
[18:02:48] <CaptHindsight> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1cZUrg8wwuA
[18:02:48] <CaptHindsight> Button machine integrated with a CNC station. CNC head is controlled by EMC2
[18:03:19] <CaptHindsight> by the same guy
[18:12:21] <CaptHindsight> http://www.indiegogo.com/projects/minimetalmaker-a-small-3d-printer-that-fabricates-with-precious-metal-clay
[18:14:52] <CaptHindsight> metal clay is interesting since you can play with the layering and structure, metals + ceramics
[18:20:59] <andypugh> I was previously unaware of that stuff, and now I need some.
[18:22:45] <CaptHindsight> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ozQdGY2WnI Precious Metal Clay
[18:23:12] <andypugh> I just finished reading the Wikipedia page
[18:24:43] <CaptHindsight> diy with metal powder + PVA
[18:25:57] <CaptHindsight> the patent for that product uses a water-soluble cellulose binder
[18:26:04] <andypugh> I just emailed my sister to see if she was aware of it.
[18:26:30] <andypugh> She makes really nice things with modelling clay, but her day-job is as a jeweler...
[18:26:45] <WalterN> oh nice
[18:27:19] <CaptHindsight> methyl cellulose and/or ethyl cellulose
[18:27:41] <WalterN> my sister ended up joining the army
[18:28:12] <CaptHindsight> does she make military jewelry?
[18:28:27] <Loetmichel> WalterN: something about the hight illiterate rate in the army comes to mind...
[18:28:53] <andypugh> I have had a long-term plan to make a new case for a watch I have. I wonder if that would be a reasonable starting point to make a blank to machine.
[18:30:07] <CaptHindsight> "the content of the precious metal powder has been determined so as to range from 50 to 90% by weight."
[18:30:58] <andypugh> I tried to persuade my sister to lend me a lump of gold to make a CNC turning video with. (The idea being to give it all back for re-melting afterards :-)
[18:31:12] <WalterN> Loetmichel: what?
[18:31:23] <Tom_itx> haha, i bet she went for that...
[18:31:52] <WalterN> andypugh: ha... of course she said no
[18:32:03] <andypugh> She pointed out that it woild cost thousands for a big enough bit, and they didn't keep that sort of lump in stock.
[18:32:27] <andypugh> I think she would have gone for it if they had it.
[18:32:44] <WalterN> you could do silver quite a bit cheaper and it would still be considered classy
[18:33:28] <CaptHindsight> copper with <1um flash gold
[18:33:59] <Loetmichel> WalterN: nothing. i just hat the picture of a blonde navy seal with black paint in her face appearing before my inner eye, sorry.
[18:34:25] <WalterN> Loetmichel: oh lol... my sister is very not blond XD
[18:39:03] <WalterN> I still want to try anodizing... bleh
[18:39:07] <WalterN> been so busy
[18:40:19] <jthornton> I finally got enough stuff out of the way to finish setting up my anodizing line, now all I need is time
[18:40:40] <andypugh> My sister is blonde, and has a really cute little oxy-fuel welder: https://picasaweb.google.com/doltonsjewellers/Workshop#5032587453469365410
[18:41:28] <andypugh> I am not sure she ever manages to get her hands clean.
[18:41:36] <Loetmichel> nice. and my age for the looks of it...
[18:41:55] <andypugh> A year younger than me, so 45.
[18:42:01] <Loetmichel> wanna introduce me?
[18:42:02] <Loetmichel> ;-)
[18:42:37] <jthornton> she does jewelry?
[18:42:39] <Loetmichel> (just kidding, i am happily married ;-)
[18:43:09] <andypugh> jthornton: Yes, that's what jewellers do :-)
[18:43:13] <Loetmichel> andypugh: but can she weld "wood"?
[18:43:44] <jthornton> you have to use mahogany welding rods
[18:43:54] <Loetmichel> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=2812 <- thats me some 10 years ago ;-)
[18:44:07] <CaptHindsight> I wonder what the metal panel looks like on their blood work?
[18:44:13] <andypugh> Welding wood is hard graft.
[18:44:17] <CaptHindsight> https://picasaweb.google.com/doltonsjewellers/Workshop#5032587496419038450
[18:44:20] <Loetmichel> (chinese plastic christmas decoration with steel wires inside
[18:45:04] <CaptHindsight> working with nanoscale metal powders all the time
[18:45:10] <Loetmichel> ... which tends to break often)
[18:45:50] <andypugh> CaptHindsight: Ah, I only just iunderstood the question. Yes, I guess there is probably a lot of gold inside her.
[18:46:32] <Loetmichel> so, wife calls for being "ruffled to sleep"
[18:46:43] <Loetmichel> cu tomorrow morning ;-)
[18:51:18] <andypugh> I am looking at http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/RDGTOOLS-Boxford-Lathe-Change-Gear-Stud-with-Bush-/370397019303 and wondering if change-gear studs normally have a bronze bush or not?
[18:52:32] <archivist> I dont think I have ever seen a bronze bush in that application
[18:54:22] <MacGalempsy> evening everyone
[18:55:57] <andypugh> I am fairly sure that my dad's Smart and Brown has bushes. But I am not sure they are original.
[18:56:05] <andypugh> Hi MacGalempsy
[18:56:44] <CaptHindsight> anyone else following the "USB Camera for edge finder?" discussion on the ML?
[18:56:45] <archivist> even the Mikron hobbing machine at the old job and the one I have here do not
[18:56:47] <MacGalempsy> you guys have a nice day?
[18:57:31] <archivist> CaptHindsight, I did at the beginning
[18:58:16] <CaptHindsight> I using a $10K zoom microscope lens and high res camera to not only detect edges but defects on surfaces and store their positions
[18:59:03] <CaptHindsight> then going back over them with tools, lasers or inkjet nozzles
[18:59:30] <andypugh> I used to design machines for chip inspection and mechanical testing. Those had good optics.
[18:59:36] <archivist> I saw a camera used to get a 3d model of a self tapping screw yesterday (Nikon)
[18:59:48] <MacGalempsy> whats the significant difference between the usb camera and the $10K microscope?
[18:59:59] <MacGalempsy> ther than about $9550
[19:00:03] <andypugh> I wonder if this is a bargain? http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Sogenique-Societe-Genevoise-Chesterman-Electronic-Height-Gauge-/360638515651?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item53f7bb09c3
[19:00:13] <CaptHindsight> archivist: how did they scan the part?
[19:00:13] <andypugh> MacGalempsy: Good optics.
[19:00:21] <WalterN> good optics is bloody expensive
[19:00:22] <archivist> lens and mounting on the usb stuff is less than good
[19:00:34] <CaptHindsight> MacGalempsy: we resolve down to ~1um
[19:00:37] <MacGalempsy> sure, but an hd webcam with a lense would be about the same, right?
[19:00:44] <MacGalempsy> wow
[19:00:53] <archivist> CaptHindsight, depth and by use of focus
[19:00:59] <MacGalempsy> by lense, I mean add-on
[19:01:00] <CaptHindsight> MacGalempsy: from 1cm away
[19:01:11] <MacGalempsy> ah, yes, the distance
[19:01:25] <MacGalempsy> focal length can be a bugger
[19:01:42] <archivist> as usual I have my littl gears or parts in my pocket to try
[19:02:24] <archivist> they use focal length to advantage in the 3d surface reconstruction
[19:03:06] <CaptHindsight> are there any low cost ethernet HD cameras? They seem to be looking for <$100 solutions that "just work"
[19:03:52] <archivist> best usb camera I have seen is about £200
[19:04:48] <CaptHindsight> they were ruling out USB due to real time issues, where the machine is vs where the camera was vs is
[19:04:55] <WalterN> yeah
[19:05:32] <MacGalempsy> I have an extra axis network cam you could part out
[19:05:36] <WalterN> I've always wanted to make a high speed high resolution camera for recording things like bullets flying in front of it
[19:05:54] <MacGalempsy> the PT is broken, but the camera sent signals
[19:05:58] <WalterN> 1000+ frames/second in 1080p color or better
[19:06:01] <MacGalempsy> but it is not hp
[19:06:03] <MacGalempsy> hd
[19:06:14] <MacGalempsy> wow. now that would be impressive
[19:06:20] <CaptHindsight> at least the ethernet cameras have a determined latency
[19:06:22] <archivist> CaptHindsight, fleabay 200604763701
[19:07:20] <archivist> I think one needs to stop take image move on so usb would be ok
[19:07:20] <MacGalempsy> unfortunately, a HD network cam will be about $3k
[19:08:05] <archivist> real speedy cameras were at the show, but dont ask the price :)
[19:08:31] <CaptHindsight> yeah, move the machine to the area near the edge, get it in frame
[19:08:32] <WalterN> the PCIe 3.0 buss is fast enough to handle the throughput for such a highspeed camera
[19:08:38] <andypugh> CaptHindsight: The operative search term is "Ip Camera"
[19:08:54] <CaptHindsight> take a measurement, move the machine, remeasure
[19:08:59] <WalterN> but I'm not sure if the memory in a computer is fast enough... heh
[19:09:10] <WalterN> for dumping raw image data
[19:09:12] <andypugh> I have one in my workshop.
[19:09:36] <andypugh> (on a shelf, turned off)
[19:09:41] <CaptHindsight> andypugh: I was not using that term since it tends to mean more of a low cost security cam vs precision optics and sensor
[19:10:12] <archivist> but any system has latency if you stop while you check your image you get rid of motion blur and dont care about latency
[19:11:14] <MacGalempsy> one possibility would be to use an HD analog cam, then use a converter to move the image. the older analog cams are cheaper, and there are a variety of different lens
[19:11:16] <CaptHindsight> WalterN: a new PC is
[19:11:28] <archivist> live streaming whatever method is really delayed a bit
[19:11:42] <CaptHindsight> not an old 100mhz pentium with ISA bus
[19:12:02] <andypugh> I suspect that Keyence will have something, at a price :-)
[19:12:28] <WalterN> CaptHindsight: so DDR3 1600mhz would handle the throughput?
[19:12:40] <WalterN> I kinda assumed it would, just never calculated it
[19:12:59] <MacGalempsy> I am amazed by some of the resolution that some of the reprappers get looking at their .1mm layer heights
[19:13:18] <WalterN> I did calculate the PCIe buss, as well as the kind of rad data I would be pulling from the camera
[19:13:35] <WalterN> talk about working the computer IO over... heh
[19:14:23] <andypugh> My USB camera does actually cause realtime delay messages on my controller.
[19:14:44] <andypugh> (Well, one of the several that I have does, anyway)
[19:15:29] <CaptHindsight> we were doing real time capture and DSP processing back in the 80's on PC-AT's, ISA was just for control and power, we had a separate backplane/bus for the image data
[19:16:07] <CaptHindsight> 30 fps at 512 x 512 8b per pixel
[19:16:09] <archivist> the fast camera I saw yesterday was showing slowmo of race car test crash on the nose
[19:17:32] <CaptHindsight> WalterN: did you find a sensor fast enough?
[19:17:49] <archivist> looked like they grabbed it in the camera then passed it back
[19:18:55] <WalterN> CaptHindsight: thats something that I couldent find out... can a CCD just be probed that fast?
[19:19:03] <CaptHindsight> the last high speed camera I built was back in the 90's, we used several sensors along with spinning mirrors to get the speeds
[19:20:04] <CaptHindsight> WalterN: depends on the design, Kodak and few other had the sensors but didn't always sell them as a component, you had to buy the $250K system
[19:20:07] <archivist> heh photron 1 megapixel at 13500 fps just found it in the show guide
[19:20:34] <WalterN> I mean, when you take a picture, you get a shutter speed of less 1/1000s without a problem...
[19:20:52] <CaptHindsight> we built them for monitoring blasting at strip mines
[19:21:34] <CaptHindsight> the main cost is the explosives so they have to optimize the blasts
[19:21:50] <WalterN> or is there a 'cool down' time for CCDs?
[19:23:05] <WalterN> thats what I couldent find any information on
[19:23:06] <CaptHindsight> the CCD's were sensitive to count single photons, but the bandwidth was limited by the buffers
[19:24:18] <WalterN> so its not the actual sensor thats slowing everything down
[19:24:50] <CaptHindsight> back then it was the A/D and the speeds you could clock the buffers/latches
[19:25:02] <mpictor> speaking of high speed cameras, do any of you remember reading an article about a high speed camera on a satellite telescope?
[19:25:37] <mpictor> femtosecond comes to mind, but surely it wasn't *that* fast!
[19:26:08] <CaptHindsight> http://www.stanfordcomputeroptics.com/applications/iccd-methods/ultra-high-speed-imaging.html
[19:26:28] <CaptHindsight> "The motion of a 250 femtoseconds Laser pulse captured by the ICCD camera 4 Picos"
[19:26:44] <WalterN> o.0
[19:26:47] <mpictor> yea
[19:27:05] <CaptHindsight> watching light in flight
[19:27:18] <mpictor> the one I'm thinking of used some exotic semiconductor process that was extremely expensive, extremely fast, and extremely sensitive
[19:28:33] <WalterN> wouldent need to if its in a bose einstein condensate :P
[19:29:25] <WalterN> CaptHindsight: where is a good place to get thermal imaging sensors?
[19:29:44] <archivist> alicona uk ltd also had and interesting camera derived system for looking at surface profile
[19:29:49] <CaptHindsight> what wavelength and resolution?
[19:30:31] <archivist> a certain thermal camera company tried to rip us off at a previous company
[19:31:16] <CaptHindsight> WalterN: check out their buyers guides http://www.photonics.com/ http://www.photonicsspectra-digital.com
[19:32:07] <WalterN> wavelength... heat is typically perceived at about what CO2 lasers are at I think
[19:32:36] <CaptHindsight> WalterN: but you can't work on them until you've anodized something and used the laser to sinter some plastic powder :)
[19:32:49] <WalterN> yeahyeah
[19:33:04] <WalterN> so many projects, no money to work on them with
[19:33:12] <WalterN> or time
[19:35:34] <WalterN> heh, space lasers
[19:35:41] <WalterN> makes me think of that song..
[19:36:09] <WalterN> space unicorn http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=17o1OlroNSE XD
[19:37:00] <CaptHindsight> http://www.hamamatsu.com/eu/en/product/alpha/C/4214/S11510-1106/index.html IR-enhanced CCD area image sensor
[19:37:52] <CaptHindsight> http://www.hamamatsu.com/eu/en/product/alpha/C/4214/index.html these are all sensitive up to ~1100nm
[19:48:32] <CaptHindsight> http://www.ptgreystore.com/usb-30 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JhkA-GjFKio this would make a nice machine vision alignment camera, but i think they want a CMOS camera with a plastic lens for $25
[19:50:59] <archivist> ew login or register to view prices.....
[19:52:07] <MacGalempsy> this morning, I was trying to get the enable command to the 7i77 to enable the amp. The amp requires a ground to enable. in the 7i77 manual it talks about "Active high drive enables, ENAN+ goes to the psu and the ENAN- is used to enable input to control power ground" does that make sense?
[19:52:54] <archivist> MacGalempsy, did you see the message from pcw to you about that
[19:53:04] <MacGalempsy> oh, no
[19:53:08] <MacGalempsy> let me look back
[19:53:32] <CaptHindsight> ~10 hours ago
[19:55:24] <MacGalempsy> ah yes I see that
[19:55:31] <MacGalempsy> so the way I had it hooked up was correct
[19:55:33] <MacGalempsy> ...
[19:55:48] <CaptHindsight> I have a 7i77 here, but it's not hooked up right now :)
[19:56:26] <archivist> yes but can you scope your connections and see if the meet the spec and are changing
[19:58:53] <CaptHindsight> yeah, page 14 of the manual, they try to explain in simple language how to hook it up vs an equivalent schematic of the circuit
[19:59:21] <CaptHindsight> For active high drive enables, ENAN+ should go to the appropriate positive power supply and ENAN- to the drive enable input.
[19:59:42] <CaptHindsight> For active low enable drives, ENAN+ should go the the drive enable and ENAN- to control power ground.
[20:01:26] <CaptHindsight> MacGalempsy: if ground or a zero (0) or (active low) is the enable for your amp
[20:01:55] <CaptHindsight> then ENAN+ should go the the drive enable and ENAN- to control power ground
[20:03:02] <CaptHindsight> and they caution you not to swap the + and - lines
[20:05:46] <CaptHindsight> MacGalempsy: so the 7i77 acts as a switch that is open when the drive is not enabled
[20:06:07] <CaptHindsight> MacGalempsy: the switch closes to enable you servo drive
[20:07:18] <CaptHindsight> the voltage comes from your servo drive at a +, when the 7i77 enables the drive it closes a switch that pulls the + voltage from the servo drive down to ground or -
[20:08:47] <MacGalempsy> strange is that when I power them up the ena+ and ena- both show 5v
[20:09:06] <MacGalempsy> and the pin value is true
[20:09:22] <MacGalempsy> oh, let me check them when I jog
[20:09:29] <CaptHindsight> what servo amp/drive is it? lets check the specs
[20:17:21] <CaptHindsight> MacGalempsy: how are you measuring the + and - for the drive enable?
[20:19:28] <MacGalempsy> ok back. let me get the link to the datasheet
[20:20:02] <MacGalempsy> http://www.copleycontrols.com/motion/pdf/4122.pdf
[20:22:17] <CaptHindsight> ( Default function with JP-1 on pins 2-3. For +5V enable and GND inhibit, move JP1 to pins 1-2 )
[20:22:19] <MacGalempsy> so when i check the voltage, I put the + on the ena+ and the grnd on the common groundbar.
[20:22:26] <CaptHindsight> how do you have the jumpers set?
[20:23:09] <MacGalempsy> ok. I have enable and reset on common grd
[20:23:27] <MacGalempsy> enapos to ENA+ and enaneg to _
[20:23:30] <MacGalempsy> -
[20:23:39] <MacGalempsy> ENA-
[20:24:05] <CaptHindsight> how about JP-1 on the drive?
[20:24:19] <MacGalempsy> jumpers are 2-3
[20:24:19] <CaptHindsight> is it on pins 2-3 or 1-2?
[20:24:46] <MacGalempsy> the green light on the drive is on because enable and reset are grounded
[20:25:01] <CaptHindsight> has it been set there the entire time that the 7i77 was hooked up to it?
[20:25:15] <MacGalempsy> yes
[20:26:06] <MacGalempsy> from what I put together, the /POSenable and /NEGenable on the drive go to ENA+ and ENA- on the 7i77
[20:26:35] <MacGalempsy> but the /POSenable and /NEGenable are transmitting 5v, and they need to show ground instead
[20:27:32] <CaptHindsight> /Reset ground for self-reset every 200 ms.
[20:27:40] <MacGalempsy> and ref (+) goes to pwr and ref(-) goes to gnd
[20:28:01] <CaptHindsight> so you have a self rest every 200ms right now
[20:28:43] <MacGalempsy> yes
[20:29:34] <MacGalempsy> take that off gnd and try?
[20:30:02] <CaptHindsight> yes, since you are generating a reset 5 times per second right now
[20:30:57] <CaptHindsight> I'm still trying to interpret what "/POS enable, /NEG enable Gnd enables positive or negative output currents." is supposed to mean
[20:31:48] <CaptHindsight> but there's a diagram on the next page
[20:33:45] <CaptHindsight> Reset should be normally OPEN
[20:34:08] <MacGalempsy> pg4 has the definitiions and basically, it says that a load on posena and and negena will inhibit the drives
[20:34:17] <MacGalempsy> and right now those lines are getting 5v each
[20:34:44] <MacGalempsy> what I cannot figure out is how to have those lines connect to gnd instead
[20:36:38] <CaptHindsight> tie them to GND pin 10
[20:37:06] <MacGalempsy> physically or through the card?
[20:38:26] <CaptHindsight> pin 10, 12, 13 tied together and pin 10 to 7i77 ENAN - and Pin 11 to ENAN +
[20:39:47] <MacGalempsy> ok
[20:39:53] <CaptHindsight> /POSenable and /NEGenable have awful descriptions in that spec
[20:40:16] <MacGalempsy> do I need to change the jumpers on jp1?
[20:40:41] <CaptHindsight> no it should be the default 2-3
[20:40:48] <MacGalempsy> ok let me go try that
[20:41:30] <CaptHindsight> be sure the power is off
[20:42:28] <CaptHindsight> /Reset can be left on Ground or 0V to have it automatically clear faults every 200ms
[20:43:00] <CaptHindsight> when first read the spec it wasn't clear
[20:45:04] <CaptHindsight> the drive will signal a Green even if the /POSenable and /NEGenable are not set to Ground 0V
[20:47:26] <CaptHindsight> the /POSenable and /NEGenable seem to be there to limit the motor to only rotate in one direction
[20:50:25] <CaptHindsight> page 7 /POS & /NEG ENABLE INPUTS, HFC! who wrote this?
[20:55:00] <CaptHindsight> it's for torque limiting, so if you trigger the limit it lets the drive reverse direction only
[20:56:45] <CaptHindsight> not torque limit, it's for if the drive trips a limit switch, it's only lets the drive back out
[20:58:29] <CaptHindsight> nope looks like the first interpretation
[20:58:53] <CaptHindsight> thats why there are people called technical editors
[21:01:01] <MacGarage> still no movement
[21:01:26] <MacGarage> when enabled now the voltage on ena+ is .45v
[21:02:19] <MacGarage> when the machine is off, it has 5v
[21:04:19] <MacGalempsy> im thinking about changing jp1 to 1-2
[21:05:42] <MacGalempsy> nevermind, that would enable when off...
[21:06:24] <CaptHindsight> yes, now the /enable is active low so 0.45V is low
[21:07:04] <CaptHindsight> is the led Green on eht drive?
[21:07:10] <CaptHindsight> eht/the
[21:07:12] <MacGarage> no
[21:09:03] <CaptHindsight> how about if you wire pin 11 /enable to ground (pin 10) as well?
[21:10:27] <CaptHindsight> JP1 on pins 2-3, Pin 10, 11, 12 and 13 tied together should give you a Green
[21:11:14] <CaptHindsight> pin 15 /RESET also to Pin 10 for auto-reset
[21:21:23] <CaptHindsight> page 5 of the drive data sheet has the list of values for the components RH12 (peak current limit), RH13 (continuous current), CH14 (peak current time limit) and RH15, CH17 and CH16 for armature inductance that you have to have in place
[21:23:04] <CaptHindsight> have to go, BBL
[21:23:25] <MacGarage> k. thanks for the help.
[21:32:14] <CaptHindsight> if you had the Green before it should have ben set to go with the /POSenable and /NEGenable left open
[21:32:35] <CaptHindsight> so if it wasn't moving something else was wrong
[21:34:04] <MacGarage> all green now
[21:35:35] <MacGarage> when i gnd /POSenable it faults
[21:37:37] <MacGarage> however, when I put juice on /POSenable it goes green and should be ready
[21:39:24] <MacGarage> have to reboot
[21:45:49] <jdh> http://tinyurl.com/kmq6yoy anyone used one of these? Like a leadshine version of a G540
[21:49:19] <Jymmm> jdh: No, but Marris does soem pretty good shit
[21:50:47] <Jymmm> jdh: How many places will do a one-time swap if you fess up that you broke it.
[21:51:04] <Jymmm> mis-wired, is-configed, etc
[21:51:12] <Jymmm> mis-configed, etc
[22:16:02] <MacGarage> http://pastebin.com/fp5qeu5J
[22:16:06] <MacGarage> needed that for the other room
[22:26:48] <CaptHindsight> http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/11/13/3d-guns-atf_n_4269303.html Feds Printed Their Own 3D Gun And It Literally Blew Up In Their Faces
[22:27:16] <Tom_itx> so did their website
[22:29:08] <CaptHindsight> blowing stuff up is what they are good at :)
[22:29:28] <Tom_itx> seems so
[22:29:50] <Tom_itx> at great expense no less
[22:30:18] <Tom_itx> the private sector can always do a better job at much less cost
[22:30:30] <CaptHindsight> not always
[22:30:36] <CaptHindsight> depends on the goal
[22:30:50] <Tom_itx> ok 98% of the time
[22:31:43] <CaptHindsight> privatizing the roads, water supply, fire dept, military doesn't work out too well
[22:52:49] <MacGalempsy> yay it just moved
[22:52:58] <MacGalempsy> hit the limit and killed the program
[22:53:00] <RyanS> Any idea how long those E size Argon cylinders last for mig?
[22:54:26] <MacGalempsy> so it comes down that the /POSenable and /NEG enable need to be powered and grounded,
[22:54:43] <MacGalempsy> switching the polarity reverses the motor
[22:57:35] <CaptHindsight> RyanS: E size = ~25 cubic feet?
[22:58:04] <RyanS> Not sure
[22:58:23] <CaptHindsight> http://wagnerweldingsupply.com/pdfs/cylsize.pdf
[23:01:37] <CaptHindsight> if the reg is set to about 20C cfh a 20 cf bottle will last about 1 hr of welding, an 80 about 4 hrs
[23:02:27] <RyanS> And the disposable ones are rubbish I hear....
[23:02:57] <CaptHindsight> I have the big tanks >300CF
[23:03:16] <CaptHindsight> depends on where you get yours filled is the usual question
[23:03:35] <CaptHindsight> many places here will only swap their own tanks
[23:04:48] <RyanS> I just asked at a local place in Australia they won't touch Any other tanks
[23:06:15] <CaptHindsight> I have a place nearby that swaps any tanks I show up with, $100 L size tanks on Craigslist have worked out well for me
[23:06:47] <RyanS> actually my old mans welder... Of course they fail to mention to most people that you can't really weld aluminium without spool gun
[23:07:38] <RyanS> anyway, stainless steel is what I want to do so. No issue with that
[23:10:17] <RyanS> TIG looks much neato
[23:11:36] <CaptHindsight> I would want to get a 100CF min. tank if I was doing anything on a regular basis
[23:11:57] <CaptHindsight> they always seem to run out right before you're done with a project
[23:12:11] <CaptHindsight> so get 2 bottles
[23:12:34] <CaptHindsight> so you have one while you get the other filled
[23:13:29] <RyanS> $200 year rental ..
[23:13:44] <CaptHindsight> do they deliver?
[23:14:19] <MacGalempsy> CaptHindsight: the way it appear to work with the /POSenable and /NEGenable is, they need to be polar opposites to let current flow in one direction or the other. so if /POSenable is grounded, the motor spins in one direction, but both cannot be the same at the same time
[23:15:22] <CaptHindsight> MacGalempsy: figures, the writing is terrible for that section
[23:15:43] <MacGalempsy> therefore, I am considering switching JP1 to 1-2 for positive intead of ground, that way it can run on analog enable out
[23:16:09] <MacGalempsy> and power the drive, then the other two leads will have to go to outs with some logic
[23:16:40] <MacGalempsy> like clockwise is posenable + and negenable -.
[23:16:48] <MacGalempsy> does that sound correct?
[23:17:31] <CaptHindsight> your guess is as good as mine without having a schematic of that driver
[23:17:48] <MacGalempsy> k
[23:18:23] <CaptHindsight> if it works as you describe then what is all that talk about limits all about?
[23:20:58] <MacGalempsy> limit was end limit
[23:29:28] <MacGalempsy> CaptHindsight: do you use a 7i77?
[23:40:29] <CaptHindsight> MacGalempsy: I have one sitting here, I'll probably get back to using it next week