#linuxcnc | Logs for 2013-10-08

[02:03:39] <minibnz> hey does anyone know how to gcode an arc? i have tried to do this a few times now and everytime EMC spits the dummy and complains saying that my Radius to end points dont match up.. i have used gwizzard to view my backplot and it looks exactly like i want but EMC is just crapping out.. is this expected operation or am i doing something wrong?
[02:04:12] <minibnz> G1 X48.8356 Y24.953 F100
[02:04:13] <minibnz> G2 X43.7886 Y16.2114 I-1.9481 J-4.703
[02:04:13] <minibnz> G2 X35.047 Y11.1644 I-4.0386 J-3.0989
[02:04:14] <minibnz> G2 X24.953 Y11.1644 I-5.047 J-0.664400000000001
[02:04:14] <minibnz> G2 X16.2114 Y16.2114 I-4.703 J1.9481
[02:04:14] <minibnz> G2 X11.1644 Y24.953 I-3.0989 J4.0386
[02:04:15] <minibnz> G2 X11.1644 Y35.047 I-0.664400000000001 J5.047
[02:04:47] <minibnz> its complaining about the 6th line which is the 5th arc in a series of connected arcs.
[02:05:18] <minibnz> is my problem that i am starting multiple arcs from other arcs as a start point?
[02:05:58] <minibnz> so the errors are compounding enough by the time it draws the 5th arc, to trip the tollerance settings in EMC?
[02:17:13] <minibnz> ok does anyone know how or if its possible to define a part of a circle by using some other fields like R instead of IJK?
[02:18:45] <minibnz> or ami stuck
[02:19:04] <minibnz> and have to manually code the arcs into lots and lots of very small striaght lines..
[02:21:09] <minibnz> if i have to do that once i might as well write my own gcode generator.. i was thinking about paying for GwizardE but if its output doesnt match what EMC can do there is no point..
[02:25:08] <DJ9DJ> moin
[03:08:11] <archivist> minibnz, some generators can be told more decimal points(improve accuracy)
[03:19:57] <MacGalempsy> so the spec sheet on my mill is that the dc servos are 30Ncm doesnt that seem a lot lighter than some of the nema23?
[03:22:40] <archivist> sellers vary the distance to make the numeric number seem larger
[03:23:11] <archivist> some specify cm others inch others a meter
[03:23:15] <MacGalempsy> perhaps I should wait until the machine gets here next week before speculating
[03:23:39] <MacGalempsy> I wish I could find a wiring diagram or schematic for this thing
[03:24:19] <minibnz> archivist i will see what i can find in the prefs. thanks for the help..
[03:24:31] <MacGalempsy> anyone a light machine corp/ intelitek dealer?
[03:24:52] <archivist> minibnz, it gets mentioned on http://linuxcnc.org/docs/html/gcode/gcode.html#sec:G2-G3-Arc
[03:24:59] <minibnz> EMC and Gwiz are both set to mm.. but i get what you are saying.. even thou they are both mm they may store the numbers with more points..
[03:27:03] <minibnz> ahhh i see.. i will follow this guide in future its based on EMC was following generic top of google results rather than the docs for the app i am using.. i hope i get there.. i have a mate checking my model to see if there is a problem with that... checking all my calcs right from the start is not a bad idea as well..
[03:27:14] <minibnz> cheers.. will let you know how i make out..
[03:30:15] <MacGalempsy> im trying to figure out what kind of breakout board will run 4 axii, VFD, and an ATC
[03:37:05] <MacGalempsy> ah c10, and c6
[11:23:53] <archivist> hmm just thought have I missed the exhibition... no http://www.meridienneexhibitions.co.uk/our-events-detail.php?id=0000000007
[11:40:01] <Saethor10> Hi there linuxcnc community. I'm new to linuxcnc and just desided to try it out because I have a FANUC 5axis robotic arm up my sleeve ;).
[11:41:03] <jdh> that sounds uncomfortable.
[11:41:09] <Saethor10> What is the best configuration for a 5 axis robotic arm like Fanuc LR MATE 100i.
[11:41:24] <Saethor10> Haha, true. It's hard to be a cyborg
[11:42:24] <archivist> see if someone has already written some kins near enough to adjust to fit your arm
[11:42:37] <Saethor10> And is there a good tutorial on how to implement some movement to start with.
[11:42:45] <Saethor10> ?
[11:44:19] <Saethor10> Would this be a good place to start?
[11:44:19] <Saethor10> http://linuxcnc.org/docs/html/man/man9/kins.9.html
[11:44:20] <archivist> I imagine you will need some form of interface to drive your servo amps and read position feedback, mesa cards probably
[11:44:47] <jdh> does it have a controller?
[11:45:41] <Saethor10> The robot comes with a drivers and a controller. But I want to connect it via serial rs232-c
[11:46:10] <archivist> cough...serial
[11:46:37] <Saethor10> Taking into account im new at this and probarly need as much help as i can get ;).
[11:46:38] <jdh> then you have no need for LinuxCNC
[11:46:55] <archivist> yet
[11:47:05] <archivist> till the controller dies
[11:47:59] <jdh> what will you do with your arm?
[11:49:09] <Saethor10> The goal is to use a webcam to track moveing object via opencv which i have been using, and the use sucktion to picking them up. So I need to use linuxcnc, ros and opencv. Just for starters I want to move the robot with linux cnc.
[11:49:49] <jdh> pest control?
[11:51:05] <jdh> I don't think you will have much luck with serial control via linuxcnc.
[11:51:19] <archivist> linuxcnc is the controller, but you already have a controller, you need to decide retrofit or not
[11:51:30] <jdh> you would need to speak directly to the amps/encoders
[11:52:00] <Saethor10> Okey, taken into account I will then use linux cnc as the controller
[11:52:30] <Saethor10> not pest control just moveing small fish to individual cases.
[11:54:20] <Saethor10> Where is the best place to start on using the linux cnc to control the robot.
[11:54:35] <jdh> decide how you want to interface
[11:55:03] <Saethor10> what do you recommend?
[11:55:24] <archivist> linuxcnc will expect to drive the servos, eg via mesa cards
[11:56:22] <jdh> sounds good to me.
[11:56:47] <jdh> You need to check the servo amps and see what kind of inputs they want. And what kind of encoder/feedback is available.
[11:57:54] <Saethor10> I should find that in the datasheet of the robot?
[11:58:58] <archivist> I am wondering if you just want a script between your current controller and opencv
[11:59:51] <jdh> to capture a moving fish with serial latency?
[12:00:43] <pcw_home> Yeah If the current controller works and its just for pick/place you probably just need some glue, not a whole retrofit
[12:01:09] <Saethor10> The objective is to fill 96 small pods with fish from an aquarium. The aquarium has a mininimal depth and the fish would be taken up by suction
[12:02:50] <Saethor10> A script between the current controllen and opencv. Would that do the trick?
[12:04:04] <archivist> dunno without research...and that is above my pay grade
[12:06:04] <Saethor10> I
[12:07:05] <Saethor10> I
[12:11:21] <t12> are you doing zebrafish work
[12:12:26] <Saethor10> Just a student project, and yeas they are zebrafish
[12:13:13] <IchGuckLive> hi all B)
[12:15:28] <IchGuckLive> someone has heard about kthk Business has been effected by the powerfull typhoon
[12:40:30] <jthornton> there must be something magical about the number 60
[12:40:44] <IchGuckLive> i guess its 69
[12:41:02] <IchGuckLive> as you can turn it and its the same :D
[14:16:56] <mrsun_> the ISO taper is that also called BT taper or am i totaly off here? :)
[14:45:13] <awallin> ISO and BT differ in the details (drawbar, drive-keys etc) but the tapers are same afaik
[14:46:04] <mrsun_> ahh .. hmm
[14:48:25] <JT_Shop> there is a web page that sells different holders and has drawings of them
[14:49:02] <mrsun_> http://www.tools-n-gizmos.com/specs/Tapers.html been looking there but do not find one called "ISO" =)
[15:17:09] <joebog> morning all, anybody running Qcad/cam with linuxCNC ?
[15:22:37] <cradek> mrsun_: I believe ISO and NMTB are the same thing
[15:23:07] <cradek> awallin is right that the taper on ISO, NMTB, CAT, BT are all the same but similarities end there
[15:26:55] <tjtr33> joebog, i didnt know qcad was really open source, as in, some use librecad for that reason.
[15:26:56] <tjtr33> the webpage sez .org, but the page sez 'customer' :| dunno.
[15:27:44] <joebog> yep we have Librecad as well
[15:28:15] <tjtr33> the ability to run the 2d thru a matix [ tilta, tiltb, tiltc ] temps me , esp if gcode output reflects the tilt of the plane.
[15:28:16] <joebog> BUT we did buy the latest version of Qcad and for the $100 it costs its excellent !!!!
[15:28:51] <tjtr33> so is it open or pay for? ( I _think_ those 2 are opposed )
[15:29:03] <joebog> the add on CAM bit is another $60 or so and it generates the G-code
[15:29:21] <joebog> its open in version 2.7 we bought ver 3.3.3
[15:29:37] <joebog> the open version DOESNT have the users manual !!!!!
[15:30:41] <tjtr33> have you written any ecmascript 'wizards' ?
[15:30:54] <joebog> its very similar to any other CAD though so guys that can already use a cad for mechanical ( I have used the free version for many years for electronic schematics)will have no problems
[15:31:22] <joebog> ecmascripts ???
[15:31:46] <tjtr33> they boast it is scripted and uses ecmascript ( ~= javascript )
[15:31:54] <joebog> remember im NOT a machinists bootlace :D
[15:32:30] <mrsun_> BT30 seems to have metric pullstud threads atleast
[15:32:30] <tjtr33> well it looks interesting, thanks for posting that info
[15:33:24] <joebog> I am ordering up another driver board for the 4th axis today and was wondering if anybody has any experience with these
[15:33:36] <joebog> http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Promotion-Cheap-2-4-phase-Nema34-Stepper-motor-driver-256micsteps-7-8A-/271275429567?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3f29468ebf
[15:40:21] <joebog> Librecad is a spinoff from Qcad I beleive BUT I may be wrong.
[16:04:10] <joebog> so has anybody any experience with these modules ?
[16:04:28] <joebog> http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Promotion-Cheap-2-4-phase-Nema34-Stepper-motor-driver-256micsteps-7-8A-/271275429567?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3f29468ebf
[16:11:51] <mrsun_> http://www.sorotec.de/shop/product_info.php/language/en/info/p1544_werkzeugwechsler-fuer-kress-fme-1050---fme-800-v2.html/
[16:11:53] <mrsun_> cool!
[16:12:05] <mrsun_> only costs about 1/2 what my machine costs =)
[16:13:30] <joebog> yah that can be a problem sometimes :)
[16:14:19] <MacGalempsy> greetings is it fair to say servos have finer step intervals than steppers?
[16:14:57] <mrsun_> but its not bad
[16:15:04] <joebog> what steps ?
[16:15:07] <mrsun_> realy, for having an ATC its not bad at all =)
[16:15:15] <joebog> servos are perfeclty linear I thought ?
[16:16:13] <joebog> I guess that depends on linear feedback or some form of interupter digital
[16:16:27] <joebog> the digital will be the worse
[16:16:35] <joebog> JUST like a camera or audio
[16:16:41] <joebog> nothing beats linear
[16:19:38] <mrsun_> ok so about 600 euro i need to raise with the machine and get one of those tool changers :P
[16:19:46] <mrsun_> would be neat to be able to have atc on the router =)
[16:19:57] <joebog> I still use two spanners Mr Sun :D
[16:21:01] <joebog> Ill be adding a 4yth axix to the mill imconstructing
[16:21:13] <joebog> wow 4th axis
[16:21:31] <mrsun_> joebog, yeah but ive already found that i want to use like 3 tools on each thing i do =)
[16:21:53] <mrsun_> 1 90 degree V bit, one 60 degree and one straight for cutouts
[16:21:57] <joebog> prbably more for what Im doing
[16:22:14] <mrsun_> and thats just for some signs, and ive only done 3 signs so far since i built the machine :P
[16:22:14] <mrsun_> hehe
[16:22:23] <joebog> Im just converting a pantographic engraver into a mill for making small parts for guns
[16:23:16] <joebog> we are also gonna try to do graphics engravings on barrels and actions
[16:23:30] <joebog> like scrollwork and the oak leaves and acorns
[16:24:02] <joebog> plus do chequering on stocks etc
[16:24:08] <joebog> hence the 4th axis
[16:26:13] <joebog> so far all I have made using the 3 axis that work so far is thge "LinixCNC" Logo :D
[16:26:22] <joebog> but it cut perfect first try
[16:26:39] <joebog> even using a 45 degree router bit in the engraver chuck :D
[16:27:10] <joebog> I didnt use enough revs however and the timber tore a little
[16:27:39] <mrsun_> https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/578515_10151869321123648_1310246937_n.jpg
[16:27:45] <mrsun_> https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-frc3/1376979_10151894105803648_1026019175_n.jpg
[16:27:46] <joebog> I only ran it at 12,000 RPM,s as the belts are very old and started to fly apart even at that speed
[16:27:49] <mrsun_> my first stuffs out of my router =)
[16:28:26] <joebog> I didnt know horses could read :D :D
[16:28:26] <joebog> sorry
[16:28:29] <joebog> its very nice
[16:28:43] <joebog> welcome anyway :)
[16:29:38] <joebog> we will be attempting to go a bit further than that if we can to try and engrave whole hunting scenes into the gun action
[16:29:51] <joebog> BUT we will start with acorns and oak leaves
[16:30:18] <mrsun_> =)
[16:30:23] <joebog> the yanks are crazy about engraved weapons
[16:30:30] <DJ9DJ> gn8
[16:30:49] <joebog> actually I should re phrase that !! the yanks are crazy about ANY weapons
[16:31:00] <joebog> gn8
[16:32:21] <joebog> that small tablet you made is quite nice !!!!!
[16:33:09] <joebog> it has already tickled my interest in trying something like that and then to use different stains to "paint" more detail
[16:34:24] <joebog> I cannot read icelandic however :)
[16:34:41] <joebog> in fact I dont even know what you call your language
[16:35:12] <gonzo_> evening peoples
[16:35:35] <gonzo_> anyone know anything about the mesa 7i90 boards?
[16:35:59] <gonzo_> seem to be new, but can't see anythuing about linuxcnc support yet
[16:36:18] <joebog> HEAPS of suport here
[16:36:32] <mrsun_> joebog, im from sweden, but the tablet is for my sister and her horse is icelandic =)
[16:37:15] <joebog> I used some generic ripoffs of mesa boards and they worked first time
[16:37:46] <joebog> took me a week to order them from the states, build the power supply and c\"controller"
[16:38:16] <joebog> hook it up and it works " outa the box "
[16:38:28] <joebog> all the support I obtained right here
[16:39:08] <joebog> http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Promotion-Cheap-2-4-phase-Nema34-Stepper-motor-driver-256micsteps-7-8A-/271275429567?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3f29468ebf
[16:39:32] <joebog> thats the board Ill be buying from China today to add the 4th axis
[16:40:14] <joebog> I still have a 5th channel which I might try and add full control of the main cutter motor
[16:40:32] <joebog> 3/4 horsepower variable speed drive system
[16:40:41] <joebog> sqirrel cage motor
[16:40:59] <joebog> squirrel cage
[16:42:04] <gonzo_> joebog, I've hear that this is a good chan for help.
[16:42:44] <gonzo_> was wondering if there were any rumours of drivers for the 7190 cards, before I start ordering
[16:42:51] <joebog> its the best !!!
[16:43:02] <joebog> the guys here are just only too willing
[16:43:15] <joebog> its really the spirit of open source !!!!
[16:44:01] <joebog> hang on a sec
[16:44:04] <gonzo_> I'm pretty new to the subject. Been getting the mechanics of a mill conversion done. Now at the point of having to start putting some control on to it
[16:44:24] <gonzo_> so don't want to get an fpga card that has no drivers
[16:45:08] <joebog> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?LinuxCNC_Supported_Hardware
[16:45:13] <joebog> check that first
[16:45:26] <micges> gonzo_: 7i90 isn't supported atm
[16:45:55] <gonzo_> thanks, I was looking at that just a moment ago.
[16:45:57] <micges> but it will be for sure both in LPT and SPI mode
[16:46:13] <gonzo_> that was what I though
[16:46:34] <gonzo_> they are really cheap, so guess they will be popular
[16:46:50] <joebog> http://s80.photobucket.com/user/amp_mangler/library/linuxcnc_fitting
[16:46:53] <gonzo_> so support may not be liong in coming
[16:46:55] <micges> I agree
[16:46:58] <joebog> thats what Im working on
[16:47:10] <PCW> There is a branch with Sebastian patches that will work for EPP mode (really just bug fixes in the 7I43 driver)
[16:47:13] <joebog> I actually have another 30 or more photos to add
[16:47:50] <gonzo_> that's a retro fit for an existing cmc machine>
[16:47:54] <gonzo_> cnc
[16:48:24] <micges> PCW: maybe cradek will agree to add additional hm2_7i90 module for 2.5.x branch, and unified lpt driver will be on 2.6
[16:48:27] <joebog> yep
[16:49:02] <joebog> I ripped out the Moronsoft stuff and made up all new "controller" using Linux and it workrd first time
[16:49:19] <joebog> AFTER a few adjustments that the guys here helped me with
[16:50:05] <gonzo_> would be nice to see 7190 drivers, as that card seems ideal for what I need
[16:50:26] <gonzo_> I'm adding cnc to an old manual bridgeport
[16:50:28] <joebog> if ya wanna keep that photobucket addy, I will post up a heap more pics later today
[16:53:03] <joebog> the machine is a pantocut and the moronsoft software is $7500 for 5 ONLY fonts !!!!!!
[16:53:32] <PCW> micges: better still would be hm2_epp since there should be _no_ difference between the 7I90 and the 7I43 drivers
[16:53:34] <joebog> with linuxCNC it will be a 4 axis CNC mill for making gun parts
[16:54:05] <joebog> and the software is essentially free
[16:55:08] <jp_mill> joebog: I just built a stepper machine with those drivers. So far they are fine
[16:55:22] <micges> PCW: for 2.6 yes, for 2.5.x there can't be any required config changes (like hal driver rename)
[16:55:28] <joebog> and so far all the new breakout stuff and 5 channels of experimental drive boards has cost a grand total of $250 !!!!!!
[16:56:42] <joebog> yep jp-mill this setup works fine too
[16:57:04] <joebog> the pics acvtually show how the machine was butchered before it was purchased
[16:57:31] <joebog> the pics are just my tests to confirm that all the motors and bearings were still working
[16:58:02] <joebog> I will completely rewire the machine so it doesnt have the eagles nest layout :D
[16:58:12] <gonzo_> my bridgeport was brought as a 'pig in a poke', and as I dug into it, it was a pig!
[16:58:28] <gonzo_> but lots of work and it's looking sweet now
[16:58:57] <joebog> all I had to do was identify alla the wiring that had been cut out
[16:59:06] <joebog> for what reason we never found out
[16:59:28] <gonzo_> PCW, so the 7i43 drivers (if I have the correct term) should work for the 7i90?
[16:59:37] <joebog> BUT we suspect it was distressed stock from somebodys bankruptcy and they made sure nobody was gonna use it
[17:00:01] <gonzo_> shame when that happens
[17:00:09] <joebog> yup
[17:00:31] <joebog> beaifully made english machine weighs almost a ton of cast iron
[17:00:32] <gonzo_> what sort of gun parts are you making?
[17:00:53] <gonzo_> accessories or full frames/receivers
[17:01:19] <joebog> the guy who owns the machine is a gun maker so it will make all sorts of stuff, but mostly the small fidly bits like triggers and hammers
[17:01:40] <joebog> plus he wants to engrave the stocks , actions and barrels
[17:01:48] <joebog> do gold inlay and such
[17:01:51] <gonzo_> I'm in the UK, such things are really restricted
[17:02:00] <joebog> yep here too
[17:02:11] <gonzo_> you in UK?
[17:02:29] <joebog> australia !!! no guns here without MAJOR headaches with authorities and all sorts of UBER stoopid laws
[17:03:15] <joebog> I am a semi retired hardware eng thats used unix for last 35 years or so
[17:03:42] <joebog> used to make mainframe SCADA systems
[17:03:44] <gonzo_> a friend was over there for a few years, a target shooter. He said it was similarly silly to UK laws
[17:03:56] <joebog> correct
[17:04:10] <joebog> cant have automatic or semiauto
[17:04:21] <joebog> but can have belt feed manual
[17:04:25] <gonzo_> ditto, apart from 22lr
[17:04:28] <joebog> how stupid is that ??????
[17:05:51] <joebog> the last gun he made ( just finished it last week ) is 50 cal Jeffries Safari Magnum !!!!!!
[17:05:56] <joebog> go figure that one
[17:06:07] <joebog> 98 pounds recoil into your shoulder !!!!!!
[17:06:40] <joebog> whole cartridge is some 4 1/2 inches long !!!!
[17:07:01] <joebog> same shell as 50 cal auto from aircraft
[17:07:13] <uw> that would be bmg
[17:07:19] <gonzo_> have fired an 8bore paradox (part rifled) double elephant gun. That was.... interesting
[17:07:21] <joebog> nope
[17:07:23] <joebog> jeffries
[17:07:31] <joebog> only goes 150 yards
[17:07:42] <joebog> 35,000 lbs muzzle pressure !!!!
[17:07:56] <joebog> barrel is like 2 inches diamtere
[17:08:32] <gonzo_> I can feel the chan being taken over by exited gun talk!
[17:08:37] <joebog> Jeffries was origionally made for hunting elephants in India!!!!
[17:08:46] <joebog> sorry gonzo :)
[17:08:53] <gonzo_> why sorry?!
[17:08:55] <uw> hmm never heard of .500 jefferies
[17:09:05] <uw> meh, it's half power of the bmg 50 though....
[17:09:07] <joebog> actually Im out to fit 4th aix and order more parts
[17:09:16] <uw> energy, not power
[17:09:16] <joebog> I will post more pics later today
[17:09:16] <uw> sorry
[17:09:19] <joebog> bye all
[17:09:45] <joebog> cause your right gonzo
[17:09:51] <joebog> its cnc channel not gun channel :D
[17:09:55] <joebog> bye fer now
[17:38:01] <MacGalempsy> hi andypugh
[17:38:09] <andypugh> Hi
[17:38:10] <MacGalempsy> hows it going today:?
[17:38:11] <ries> Hey Guys, I was writing a little program to make from a square stock of weed a round stock efficiently, starting at corners and making them round.. But one thing that leads to a other, so now I can manage 'projects' and seperate operations per project and I am starting to write a little tool to create your own operations. this is a screenshot:
[17:38:12] <ries> http://skitch.rvantwisk.nl/~rvt/bmk/tmp/java-20131008-172233.jpg
[17:38:28] <andypugh> Pretty well, I spent all evening milling a tool for a friend.
[17:38:48] <ries> the idea is that it's a little toolbox to create your own general operations, things you need to do often.
[17:38:59] <ries> COuld that be handy for others, does something already exists like this?
[17:39:24] <MacGalempsy> sounds exciting. what kind of tool?
[17:39:26] <andypugh> I think that ngcgui might be like that, but I have never used it, so I am not sure :-)
[17:39:37] <andypugh> I like that your tool runs on OSX :_)
[17:40:05] <ries> andypugh: it will run on Linux windows and OSX
[17:40:22] <andypugh> Yeah, but I spend most of my time sat at an OSX machine.
[17:40:38] <andypugh> (Or stood at a Linux machine) :-)
[17:40:49] <ries> MacGalempsy: The idea is that it's a toolbox, you can add your own operations and you can make it (fairly easy) programmable. so if you have something special in yoru own toolshop. Then you can create a quick wizard for yoruself
[17:41:47] <ries> andypugh: I am currently developing it on OSX… so I will ensure it will work on that, OSX is also my workhorse
[17:42:14] <ries> But just like the python script that you can open, the idea is that you can also open this tool from LinuxCNC, select a project, change some parameters and mill away
[17:42:34] <andypugh> I finally now have my mill set up with coolant and all the tools measured (in the special tool-measuring / tightening station that I built into the table-end casting). It as all rather convenient now. Except I find myself wanting the machine to "just know" when I have changed the tool. I wonder how to do that?
[17:43:32] <ries> andypugh: WOuldn't even the manual toolchange not keep track of that?
[17:43:34] <andypugh> I think JT_Shop might be working on something slightly like that.
[17:43:37] <ries> I never used that myself
[17:44:11] <ries> manual tool change that is...
[17:45:12] <andypugh> Well, I don't even have manual toolchange set up now. if I type M6 T4 G43 then it returns immediately. This will of course need to change when I put tool-changes in G-code. Hopefully I will remember.
[17:46:07] <ries> a couple of years ago; I tried this myself
[17:46:18] <MacGalempsy> that sounds pretty cool. how do you come up with this stuff?
[17:46:37] <andypugh> The next job, though, is likely to be a new bottom bearing housing with an oil seal. I don't like the way that the current setup (oil above grease) drools and flings.
[17:46:41] <ries> But the manual toolchange isn't 'that smart' because you also need to touchoff, at least for me that was a manual step, and till today I have no idea if that's possible
[17:46:52] <ries> MacGalempsy: that was for me?
[17:47:51] <andypugh> ries: I have all my tools numbered and measured. With T1 as the probe I just need to probe the workpiece and all the tool lenghts and siamters Just Work :-)
[17:48:09] <MacGalempsy> no 2 andy
[17:48:31] <ries> andypugh: I only have a simple collect, I don't think I can do this
[17:49:05] <andypugh> ries: No. But have you seen the tool-change-with-auto-measure thing that mah set up?
[17:49:45] <andypugh> If you install a tool-measuring station it can all be automagic.
[17:51:11] <kwallace2> Tool length offsets should work for manual tool change, if one has tool holders.
[17:51:21] <ries> andypugh: I should take a look at that then…. I simply gave up on it a couple of years ago, and it's something I only do in weekend
[17:51:45] <andypugh> kwallace2: Yes, that is exactly what I have.
[17:52:21] <andypugh> But I would rather like to be able to press the tool-release, swap the tools, and have the system automatically know what I did and change the tool parameters.
[17:52:51] <JT_Shop> what
[17:53:04] <kwallace2> Without waiting for a prompt?
[17:53:24] <andypugh> Yes.
[17:53:42] <andypugh> Some form of barcoding, maybe?
[18:06:26] <Tom_itx> andypugh do you keep the length offsets in the tool table?
[18:06:31] <Tom_itx> or set them one at a time
[18:06:41] <andypugh> Tool table.
[18:06:45] <Tom_itx> i preset all mine and added them to the table
[18:06:57] <Tom_itx> did you get your PSU fixed?
[18:07:49] <andypugh> Oh, that reminds me. Interesting bug-let. You can only open tooledit from Axis if you do it quickly. After a while, nothing happens when you try.
[18:08:02] <andypugh> Yes, the servo PSU is now working fine.
[18:08:35] <andypugh> Something else is wrong, I am not sure what, but the system has a tendency to do a hard restart if I try to open a web browser...
[18:08:55] <Tom_itx> i try not to run anything else while milling
[18:09:00] <Tom_itx> maybe the IRC client
[18:11:15] <andypugh> Yeah, though there was an element of "I wonder if that happens every time" about it.
[18:14:09] <Tom_itx> even though you rigorously test the latency with load doesn't mean you gotta mill wiht it :)
[18:21:54] * JT_Shop takes the rest of the day off
[18:24:07] <MacGalempsy> so the other night we were talking about the benchman xt. and the guy came back to me after the auction was over and asked if I was interested
[18:24:53] <MacGalempsy> it will be here early next week and so there is a lot of anticipation going on. and a few questions too
[18:25:58] <MacGalempsy> i have never used linux, and am curious to know more about the software package.
[18:27:04] <PCW> Andy: on my ~12 uSec latency test machine I get <100 ns jitter on the DPLL
[18:29:07] <MacGalempsy> will linuxcnc handle thread milling?\
[18:29:55] <Tom_itx> yes
[18:31:15] <andypugh> MacGalempsy: Is this the guy who laughed at a 5k offer? What offer ddn't he laugh at?
[18:31:34] <MacGalempsy> yeah, he didnt laugh when I reoffered the 5k
[18:31:43] <andypugh> Result!
[18:32:12] <MacGalempsy> yep. he tried to get more, but he didnt know what he had going on
[18:32:37] <MacGalempsy> he is also throwing in the rest of the tooling that came with the lot
[18:32:55] <andypugh> Tom_itx: How do you do thread-milling? Is it G3 PN or is there another way?
[18:34:16] <Tom_itx> andypugh, i've never done it yet but i presume G3 would do it
[18:34:47] <Tom_itx> program a helix
[18:35:20] <andypugh> Yes, multi-turn G3 ought to be OK, I was just wondering if there was a dedicated G-code. (where you give pitch and depth, rather than depth and turns)
[18:35:34] <Tom_itx> i checked into those thread mills but they're rather costly. until i need one i think i'll wait
[18:35:44] <Tom_itx> not that i know of
[18:35:49] <MacGalempsy> ive never used a linux system and have been wieghing the linux cnc and mach3 choice. since this is ground zero, can you guys give me unbiased insight?
[18:35:52] <andypugh> Actually, pitch and depth would be a really easy G-code remapping excercise.
[18:35:54] <Tom_itx> how do they do rigid tapping?
[18:36:15] <Tom_itx> i guess that wouldn't be quite the same
[18:36:41] <Tom_itx> you need to get the root diameter right
[18:36:42] <MacGalempsy> the video on thread milling showed the difference.
[18:36:50] <MacGalempsy> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rDnavOlGcdc
[18:36:53] <andypugh> You can rigid tap to single-point a thread.
[18:37:22] <Tom_itx> with rigid tapping there's no circular movement though
[18:38:02] <Tom_itx> unless you used a boreing tool and offset it for the hole
[18:38:38] <andypugh> Like this you mean? http://youtu.be/i4fTythQj5s?t=1m5s
[18:39:21] <Tom_itx> yep
[18:39:57] <Tom_itx> you'd be better off moving it away from the work instead of retracting it though so it only cuts one way
[18:40:11] <andypugh> MacGalempsy: I suspect that we can't give unbiased advice about LinuxCNC and Mach3.
[18:40:38] <MacGalempsy> ha. ok.
[18:40:45] <Tom_itx> well i can say i like it better than my previous software package
[18:40:48] <andypugh> Tom_itx: And how would I move it away from the work?
[18:41:19] <andypugh> That casting was the balls nut and motor mount for the X axis :-)
[18:41:21] <Tom_itx> i suppose you could stop the spindle at the index mark then move the x or y axis
[18:41:36] <Tom_itx> other than that you wouldn't know where the tool stopped
[18:42:25] <andypugh> MacGalempsy: If I recall correctly that machine you bought runs +/-10V servo drives + encoders?
[18:43:38] <MacGalempsy> andypugh: I believe so dc servo drives
[18:43:56] <MacGalempsy> the torque seemed kind of weak,
[18:44:06] <MacGalempsy> 41oz/in
[18:45:05] <andypugh> To the best of my knowledge Mach3 can't drive anything other than stepper motors (or certain servo drives that take stepper-like inputs). So, unless you want to rip out all the motors and drives, I think LinuxCNC is the only game in town for you.
[18:46:31] <andypugh> 41oz.in is probably the continuous rating. Servos always look weak compared to steppers.
[18:47:07] <MacGalempsy> after looking at a lot of wiring diagrams I think I can handle rewireing everything to a new breakout board
[18:47:08] <andypugh> That is because people selling steppers quote the biggest number, and the number they quote doesn't tell you very much.
[18:47:42] <MacGalempsy> but if ther eis only one game in town, Im willing to playball
[18:48:09] <andypugh> MacGalempsy: I would say just get the Mesa 5i25 / 7i77 combination board and wire it up to the existing connector. It should be rather easy.
[18:49:15] <MacGalempsy> I hate to sound like such a noob
[18:49:26] <PCW> There are analog servo motion controllers that work with Mach (CSMIO etc)
[18:49:26] <MacGalempsy> computer recommendation?
[18:49:55] <MacGalempsy> gecko has servo drivers, I would think they would go for mach support
[18:50:24] <andypugh> PCW: Does that do the servo loop in the hardware?
[18:52:17] <andypugh> MacGalempsy: The Gecko servo drives take step-direction input. But you already have servo drives matched to the motors and the power supply, so why would you change them?
[18:52:44] <andypugh> MacGalempsy: Do you have a PC available?
[18:52:48] <MacGalempsy> you are right, no need to change what already works.
[18:53:14] <MacGalempsy> I have a workstation that I do my stuff on, but I figured getting a new pc will be required
[18:53:18] <MacGalempsy> dedicated
[18:53:20] <PCW> andypugh yes in a dsp
[18:53:22] <andypugh> The Gecko servo drives take step-dir exactly because they are interested in the Mach3 market.
[18:53:36] <MacGalempsy> wanted to wait until I got a gameplan before starting to buy the electronics
[18:55:13] <joebog> gday again, anybody here used lathes.co.uk recently ???
[18:55:29] <joebog> wondreing as no answer to emails from a couple ofg weeks ago
[18:55:40] <andypugh> I have put a bare motherboard in the machine case along with all the other electronics: https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/AXPmMc9GjIwEuk-7UFsH6dMTjNZETYmyPJy0liipFm0?feat=directlink
[18:56:09] <andypugh> joebog: I read part of it every day, but I have not tried to get any sort of reply.
[18:56:28] <joebog> I ordered new belts a couple of weeks ago
[18:56:35] <joebog> no answer at all ????
[18:56:42] <joebog> thanks andy
[18:56:59] <andypugh> That's a bit off. Especially as I think it was me who recommended them.
[18:57:08] <joebog> yes :D
[18:57:34] <joebog> it vwas hehe hehe but I wont hold it against you :D considering all the wonderful help youve supplied
[18:58:08] <andypugh> I am not sure what the preferred motherboard is at the moment. It used to be the D525MW but those are pretty hard to find now, long out of production.
[18:58:45] <joebog> I think I explained that I engraved the LinuxCNC logo at 12,000 revs into timber and all the belts started toi schred so I need new ones
[18:59:08] <joebog> plus I need collet chucks for a manual Alexander engraviung machine as well as belts
[18:59:44] <andypugh> Some odd sort of chuck is it?
[19:00:44] <joebog> nope just a standard collet chuck with flats on two opposite sides
[19:01:01] <joebog> about half inch
[19:01:22] <andypugh> MacGalempsy: The Atom boards have tended to give good latency. You probably want something cheap and simple. Super-mega-gaming machines are generally not great.
[19:01:37] <andypugh> Picture?
[19:02:37] <joebog> .623 X .528 actually
[19:02:52] <joebog> havent got any old ones at all
[19:02:53] <andypugh> Not the style at the bottom of this page? https://www.cromwell.co.uk/publication_page_pdfs/1428/164.pdf
[19:03:01] <joebog> and havent found em on net yet
[19:04:37] <joebog> nope, different the actualo collets are tapered in the drive shaft
[19:04:56] <joebog> the book has them as C31M
[19:05:06] <MacGalempsy> Since the CAD and CAM will be done on the workstation, i am open to whatever it takes
[19:05:35] <joebog> then 3.2 then 3.3M then 3.5M etc
[19:05:38] <joebog> up to 10
[19:05:45] <MacGalempsy> the machine also has and atc, what kind of board do you think will take to run that?
[19:06:50] <joebog> I "think" the 3.1 is equivelent to 1/8"
[19:06:57] <andypugh> There should be plenty enough GPIO on the 7i77 for the ATC.
[19:07:21] <Tom_itx> andypugh, how did those threads turn out?
[19:07:46] <andypugh> It's holding up so far. My entire X axis hans on it :-)
[19:07:54] <Tom_itx> i'm not sure it would be necessary to back the tool off, it was just an idea
[19:08:45] <andypugh> I am half expecting to snap it off at some point and have to replace it with an inserted steel part.
[19:11:47] <joebog> andy, have you tried Qcad/cam with linuxcnc ?
[19:12:19] <joebog> I have purchased the latest Qcad for the CAD part of the system
[19:13:25] <joebog> and was looking at the CAM part to write the G-code
[19:14:27] <joebog> it handles photography well so the advertising says
[19:17:02] <andypugh> I actually do pretty much all my CAM by hand, with a text editor.
[19:17:25] <andypugh> Don't go imaginign that I spend much time actually making stuff, I am too busy making the stuff to make stuff.
[19:18:16] <joebog> wow ???
[19:18:19] <joebog> ok :)
[19:18:44] <joebog> like me Im the engineer thats never made any parts either :D
[19:19:00] <joebog> just the wiring and power supplies
[19:19:24] <joebog> I do use Qcad for my electrocs schematics though
[19:19:35] <joebog> Ive never needed
[19:19:41] <joebog> CAM
[19:21:48] <andypugh> The bits of complex CAM that I have done, I have so far used PyCAM. Which works, but is _dreadfully_ slow
[19:22:19] <joebog> OK
[19:22:44] <joebog> I was gtonna purchase oine of these for my indexing head any comments ??
[19:22:48] <joebog> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Promotion-Cheap-2-4-phase-Nema34-Stepper-motor-driver-256micsteps-7-8A-/271275429567?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3f29468ebf
[19:23:19] <joebog> it "should" connect straight up to that breakout board I have
[19:23:45] <andypugh> Should be fine, I have been using what appears to be an almost identical driver on my lathe for years.
[19:23:58] <joebog> excellent :)
[19:24:05] <joebog> thanks for feedback again
[19:24:07] <andypugh> Parallel port?
[19:24:11] <joebog> yup
[19:24:14] <joebog> parr port
[19:24:26] <joebog> only need 4 axis and I actually have 5
[19:24:34] <andypugh> I think you will need to wire current-sinking and invert the step pulses
[19:25:00] <joebog> may play with complete speed control setup for main cutter motor with last free axis port
[19:25:24] <andypugh> See how they have a +5V for each signal, and then the signal terminal because there are nput optos?
[19:25:39] <joebog> heh heh heh dont worry !! Ill be pickin yer brains again when it arrives from China :D
[19:26:07] <joebog> yep I see that
[19:26:34] <joebog> I "should" be ok, but Ill scream if I run into probs :)
[19:26:57] <joebog> and you MUST let me know if theres anything I can do in return !!!!
[19:28:01] <andypugh> I might need advice on trapping wallabies? http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-leeds-23802777
[19:28:10] <joebog> ha ha ha ha
[19:28:17] <joebog> VERY difficult !!!
[19:28:22] <andypugh> Keeps turning up in my mum's garden.
[19:28:28] <joebog> we mostly use a rifle to trap them
[19:28:49] <joebog> they can rip you openh with 1" long nails on those back legs !!!!
[19:29:35] <andypugh> Even then, I think shooting it would not go down well with the owner.
[19:29:49] <joebog> if ya wanna try we use a "drop cage" ( door drops closed when wobbaly steps on trapdoor) use apple as bait
[19:30:23] <joebog> minimum wire cage mesh wire is 1/8"
[19:30:43] <joebog> DO NOT TRY pat it
[19:30:52] <joebog> moves faster than a bloo0dy snake
[19:31:10] <andypugh> I think it is quite a small one.
[19:31:17] <joebog> yep
[19:31:27] <joebog> and about 3 times stronger than you :)
[19:31:38] <andypugh> That's not saying much :-)
[19:31:45] <joebog> ssshhhhh
[19:33:23] <joebog> thinkin about that, I cant jump 6 feet fences in a single bound either !!!
[19:33:55] <joebog> they dont even need a runup !!!
[19:35:12] <MacGalempsy> andypugh: any direction on what I need to start reading up on for the LINUXCNC interface?
[19:35:22] <joebog> I just noticed that Newing Hall is in Leeds too !!
[19:35:30] <MacGalempsy> i see those boards you have mentioned are 240 buck.
[19:35:45] <andypugh> Yeah, they used to be <$100
[19:36:08] <MacGalempsy> that is for both, a cable and mounting bracket, so not horrible
[19:36:22] <MacGalempsy> still cheaper than full motor replacement
[19:36:30] <andypugh> Ah, you mean the 5i25 / 7i77 ? Yes, that's about $240
[19:36:39] <andypugh> I thought you meant the D525MW
[19:38:29] <andypugh> For eading matter: http://www.linuxcnc.org/docs/html/ perhaps System Requirements, Mesa Config Wizard, Running LinuxCNC...
[19:38:41] <MacGalempsy> does this one look acceptible? http://www.ebay.com/itm/Carputer-Car-PC-w-D525MW-2Gb-DDR3-M2-ATX-250Gb-HDD-/160562671119?pt=Desktop_PCs&hash=item256247ee0f
[19:39:56] <MacGalempsy> night andypugh
[19:40:04] <MacGalempsy> oops
[19:41:23] <andypugh> That Carputer looks like a good controller for a parallel-port based system, but the 5i25 / 7i77 needs a PCI slot.
[19:41:57] <joebog> heh heh heh MacGalempsy, ya gonna CNC yer car and write G-code as ya drive ???
[19:41:58] <joebog> :D
[19:42:18] <MacGalempsy> yeah, you know. machine bigger turbos
[19:42:29] <MacGalempsy> 500hp aint enough anymore
[19:43:24] <MacGalempsy> this one has a pci slot http://www.ebay.com/itm/1U-Supermicro-Intel-D525-Atom-Server-SSD-included-/250743449848?pt=COMP_EN_Servers&hash=item3a617968f8
[19:45:49] <andypugh> This ought to be OK: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16883265547
[19:46:29] <andypugh> Even has a second PCI cutout for the second port of the 5i25 if you ever need to use it.
[19:47:11] <joebog> ya will need to remove that huge virus it comes with :)
[19:47:52] <andypugh> Luckily there is an optical drive, you can boot directly from the liveCD and never even see Windows :-)
[19:48:09] <joebog> until it uses all the ram
[19:48:16] <andypugh> Eh?
[19:48:57] <andypugh> I was meaning Boot the LinuxCNC LiveCD and install over Windows the first time you power it up.
[19:49:19] <joebog> not if its got a recovery partition !!!
[19:49:28] <joebog> windowz wont let you
[19:49:54] <joebog> its even hidden to linux !!
[19:50:19] <joebog> I had to low level format my laptop to get rid of attemt number seven
[19:50:45] <andypugh> Yeah, that was what I was sugesting.
[19:50:53] <andypugh> Anywhow, time to sleep here.
[19:51:16] <joebog> thanks again andy
[19:58:25] <MacGalempsy> thanks andy, ill just get that one
[20:38:15] <s1dev> is there a general cnc help channel?
[20:47:38] <ries> s1dev: I don't think so, but I believe it's ok to ask general CNC questions here
[20:51:02] <s1dev> I'm machining a (really simply) gear using a mill each tooth is an arc and it looks like tool diameter compensation isn't running, I'm machining it clockwise and using G41, the proper diameter is set in the tool table, and the proper tool was set with M6
[20:58:01] <s1dev> the code works fine with offset and all when run on a simulated mill
[20:59:53] <archivist> "a simulated mill" ?
[21:00:10] <CaptHindsight> spack: http://www.ebay.com/itm/ACROLOC-M-15L-VMC-/271286127724?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3f29e9cc6c
[21:00:40] <kwallace1> What is happening that makes you think that compensation isn't working?
[21:00:46] <s1dev> linuxcnc has a simulation feature
[21:01:59] <CaptHindsight> spack: http://www.ebay.com/itm/FNC40-LEBLOND-MAKINO-CNC-VERTICAL-MACHINING-CENTER-/321222228696?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4aca563ad8
[21:02:00] <s1dev> the teeth are too small and the cutouts between the teeth are too large
[21:02:32] <archivist> s1dev, are you the right side of the line
[21:02:33] <kwallace1> So you have cut material already?
[21:02:57] <spack> i don't understand how a company that sells tons of large machinery will not test a certain machine they have for sale
[21:03:02] <spack> CaptHindsight: thanks :)
[21:03:36] <s1dev> kawallace1: yes archivist: just to make sure that I was on the right side of the line, I swapped G41 with G42 with the same results
[21:03:52] <spack> CaptHindsight: that leblong looks nice
[21:04:39] <CaptHindsight> SPINDLE SPEED RANGE - 100-10,000 RPM
[21:04:56] <spack> yeah, that's pretty nice
[21:05:25] <spack> would need to take a good 20" off the top to get it into the garage :)
[21:05:31] <kwallace1> s1dev: So, my first guess is that G41/42 thinks your cutter radius is 0.
[21:05:45] <CaptHindsight> after I rebuild the Matsuura I'll look for something like the Leblond
[21:06:03] <spack> do you run all these machines, or sell them, or both?
[21:06:10] <CaptHindsight> spack: build a dormer in the garage :)
[21:06:23] <spack> hehe
[21:06:37] <s1dev> kwallace1 which is odd because I'm not sure what could cause it
[21:06:41] <spack> the ceiling actually isn't the issue, but i was trying to convince my friend to install a larger roll up door on the side
[21:06:43] <CaptHindsight> spack: I use them from time to time making protos
[21:08:39] <archivist> s1dev, have you loaded(set) the correct tool and has that tool got the right diameter in the table
[21:08:46] <s1dev> yes
[21:10:07] <CaptHindsight> spack: http://www.ebay.com/itm/DYNA-MECHTRONICS-DYNA-MYTE-2800-BENCHTOP-CNC-MILL-MILLING-MACHINE-/331021338322?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4d1268c6d2
[21:10:10] <CaptHindsight> heh
[21:10:40] <spack> heh
[21:10:59] <spack> that's interesting
[21:11:02] <archivist> s1dev, you have to have missed something http://www.linuxcnc.org/docs/2.4/html/gcode_tool_compensation.html#sec:Cutter-Radius-Compensation
[21:11:12] <spack> we have a roland micromill
[21:11:13] <spack> and a taig
[21:11:18] <CaptHindsight> the control is almost as big as the mill
[21:11:20] <spack> was hoping for something really big
[21:11:35] <spack> but somehow that is also a logical step up.
[21:11:44] <spack> i say go big or go home, though
[21:12:05] <CaptHindsight> must be why I'm home now :)
[21:18:45] <s1dev> http://pastebin.com/NFj98wv8
[21:18:51] <s1dev> can't think of anything I'm missing
[21:19:21] <s1dev> and looking at that link and comparing it, there's nothing that appears to be missing
[21:20:07] <kwallace1> s1dev: Another thing that comes to mind. I recall putting the G41/42 behind '/'. The forward slash makes the block optional so you can run the program through a sim config with and without compensation and see if the paths are different.
[21:20:18] <archivist> the tool table entry
[21:21:14] <archivist> has the sim and the real got the same tool table
[21:21:26] <s1dev> same entry for that tool
[21:21:40] <s1dev> and the number was changed for the slot
[21:23:27] <s1dev> with G41 commented it in the sim, it changes to the expected uncompensated toolpath
[21:23:35] <s1dev> *commented out
[21:23:59] <s1dev> could it be that the tool table wasn't commited to the machine?
[21:26:11] <kwallace1> So the path changed between uncompensated and compensated?
[21:27:03] <s1dev> on the sim it did, I won't be able to get to the machine until tomorrow
[21:27:20] <archivist> you can cut air on the real with/without g41 to prove too
[21:27:48] <s1dev> I was planning to chuck up a marker tomorrow
[21:28:42] <kwallace1> If you change the tool table, it will need to be reloaded.
[21:28:58] <s1dev> how is that done in CNCLinux?
[21:29:22] <archivist> there is a button on axis to reload the tool table
[21:29:56] <s1dev> thanks I'll try that
[21:30:56] <kwallace1> The tool editor can do it too: http://www.linuxcnc.org/docs/2.5/html/gui/tooledit.html
[21:32:52] <s1dev> how is it done in EMC2? the software that is used is based off of 2.4.3
[21:33:54] <cradek> it's on the file menu!
[21:34:25] <s1dev> nevermind, shouldn't be too difficult to figure out
[22:03:28] <somenewguy> so I have only been using linuxCNC for 24 hours now, but can I say for the record THANK YOU CONTRIBUTORS!
[22:04:15] <somenewguy> if the magical dxf=>gcode tool works I only have two quick items on the list tonight that I have to make, and after that I will elt myself play w/ configs again
[23:40:06] <somenewguy> newbie question here, but /proc/bus/input/devices wil show all recognized input devices, correct? not just ones plugged in over USB?