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[09:16:23] <CaptHindsight> WalterN: the Casewell dyes are water (polar) dyes, the food coloring is also water based and will break down most quickly under UV exposure
[09:21:23] <CaptHindsight> WalterN: whats is tricky with water based dye baths and the sealing process just right, so that they dye fills the pores well and doesn't wash out during sealing, that's why anodizers tend to stick to old formulas or complete chem systems from suppliers
[09:23:40] <pcw_home> http://www.ebay.com/itm/YOKOGAWA-DB5C-015G-2B9A4G2-DIRECT-DRIVE-SERVO-ACTUATOR-MOTOR-/370855795697?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item5658ba5bf1
[09:23:41] <pcw_home> That is a nice direct drive index table motor
[09:25:05] <pcw_home> (at HGR, looks like they may have the drives as well)
[09:25:36] <CaptHindsight> WalterN: let me rephrase that first part, what is tricky is getting the dye bath and sealing solutions at the best temp and pH or you won't get deep colors
[09:27:35] <CaptHindsight> pcw_home: nice find
[09:30:02] <pcw_home> www.yokogawa.com/ddm/catalog/bu/BU71M01A00-04EN.pdf
[10:11:51] <CaptHindsight> WalterN:
http://www.pfonline.com/articles/duplex-sealing-with-nickel-acetate-and-di-water
[10:13:11] <CaptHindsight> WalterN:
http://aluminumsurface.blogspot.com/2010/03/how-to-decide-what-kind-of-sealing-has.html http://aluminumsurface.blogspot.com/2009/04/why-sealing-process-is-so-important.html
[10:50:35] <cbjamo> Is it possible to drive a difference motor based based on the toolchange command?
[10:50:52] <cbjamo> difference -> different
[10:52:31] <JT-Shop> you can do just about anything you want in classicladder
[10:52:50] <archivist> or a comp in hal
[10:53:29] <cbjamo> The 3d printer we are building will have 4 extruders, I was planning on using the three rotational axis to controll a stepper each for each extruder, but if I could instead assign each to a tool that would be a cleaner solution, I think.
[10:55:28] <cbjamo> How would i want to do that? have classicladder enable and disable motors based on need?
[10:58:25] <cbjamo> Are these the latest docs?
http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?ClassicLadder_Ver_7.124
[11:00:12] <skunkworks_> http://www.linuxcnc.org/docs/
[11:03:42] <cbjamo> thanks
[11:23:25] <WalterN> CaptHindsight: reading :3
[11:29:41] <WalterN> CaptHindsight: so its mostly PH level? what if white distilled vinegar was used for the PH?
[11:35:59] <WalterN> or am I understanding this correctly
[12:11:31] <cbjamo> what is the best way to interepret custom mcodes?
[12:21:00] <IchGuckLive> hi all
[12:22:02] <cpresser> cbjamo: depends. if you are polling something, make them exit instantly and call them in a loop
[12:22:30] <cpresser> cbjamo: why and when do you want to interrupt them?
[12:24:51] <cbjamo> not interrupt, interpret. For example M104 sets the temperature of a heater, so when I get a M104 S220 I need to send a message to my heater controller to change the temp to 220C
[12:27:02] <andypugh> I don't _think_ you can necessarily use S with an M-code
[12:27:53] <andypugh> However, if you are not actually running a spindle, you may be able to use just S to set the temperature.
[12:28:48] <andypugh> http://linuxcnc.org/docs/html/gcode/m-code.html#sec:M100-to-M199 says P and Q
[12:29:16] <cbjamo> andypugh: *shrug* thats how the reprap people do it, I have do idea what the industry standard is. The trouble with using just S is that I have 5 heaters.
[12:30:16] <andypugh> I think you are going to have to use M101 P100 M102 P120 M103 P-300 etc.
[12:32:21] <cbjamo> that isn't a problem, and actually, looking at the gcode example i have from my slicer, it gives M104 P220 T0, M104 P220 T2, and M104 P200 T4
[12:32:53] <cbjamo> It looks like it uses Tn to select the heater and Pnnn to set the temp
[12:33:22] <andypugh> Ah, OK. You would need to use Q for T, I think.
[12:34:05] <cbjamo> OK, I can have a script run when the gcode is loaded and have that change it, yes?
[12:34:09] <andypugh> (And, wouldn't ut be more logical to set the Temperature with T and the heater with P?
[12:34:12] <CaptHindsight> WalterN: here is an example based on MetaDye Dye
http://metadye.com/dyeing_process
[12:34:29] <andypugh> cbjamo: Yes, you can set up an input file filter.
[12:34:30] <cbjamo> of course it would, but who is logical these days?
[12:35:29] <CaptHindsight> I'd be careful with using Reprap for a future standard since it's such a shortsighted tech
[12:36:08] <cbjamo> CaptHindsight:
[12:36:17] <cbjamo> oops: why do you think that?
[12:36:48] <CaptHindsight> GGG has a very limited scope in additive manufacturing
[12:37:16] <cbjamo> GGG?
[12:37:39] <CaptHindsight> and lots of the devs were kids who thought they had a better idea when it came to wrting machine control software and the UI
[12:37:46] <CaptHindsight> glorified glue gun
[12:38:15] <cbjamo> they do seem to have a habit of re-inventing the wheel, yes
[12:38:49] <WalterN> CaptHindsight: would distilled water work? or does it have to be deionized?
[12:39:44] <CaptHindsight> WalterN: DI is best
[12:39:51] <cbjamo> What is your prefered additive method?
[12:39:56] <CaptHindsight> never use tap water
[12:40:05] <IchGuckLive> i change the heat on my whirercut be Sxxx M3
[12:40:13] <WalterN> well yeah, tap water has all kinds of stuff in it
[12:40:41] <cbjamo> IchGuckLive: what does the M3 signify?
[12:40:46] <WalterN> in the cities, chlorine and minerals and stuff
[12:41:00] <CaptHindsight> cbjamo: thats like asking what the best tool, it depends on what you want to do
[12:41:05] <WalterN> in well water, even more minerals
[12:41:15] <IchGuckLive> cbjamo: it changes the interpreter values
[12:41:29] <WalterN> cbjamo: laser sintering gives you the most material options
[12:41:30] <IchGuckLive> cbjamo: are you in the USA
[12:41:43] <IchGuckLive> im in Germany
[12:42:31] <cbjamo> CaptHindsight: I agree, but then why do you think FF is a poor method, it, like the others has its advantages and disadvantages.
[12:42:38] <CaptHindsight> cbjamo: I work with all of them and try to develop new techniques as well, just about every printer is a hybrid
[12:42:39] <cbjamo> IchGuckLive: Yes, I'm in the US.
[12:43:19] <cbjamo> CaptHindsight: You mean a hybrid between FF and SLS? how do you pull that off?
[12:43:41] <IchGuckLive> cbjamo: ok M3 gives you a Spindel on a S you can do a hold till head is on temerature on this
[12:43:45] <CaptHindsight> GGG is good for extruding some plastics and composites, but it's slow a low res
[12:44:12] <cbjamo> CaptHindsight: Also, do you control any of your printers with linuxcnc?
[12:44:21] <CaptHindsight> DLP SLA is faster but also not very good for metals
[12:44:35] <IchGuckLive> cbjamo: for example net spindle-ready <= spindle-at-speed.out => motion.spindle-at-speed
[12:44:47] <IchGuckLive> thi wil hold the motion til tamp is in range
[12:44:54] <CaptHindsight> cbjamo: yeah, that's the plan, Linuxcnc unless it gets to be a problem
[12:45:03] <cbjamo> I've never heard of people doing dlp with metals before
[12:45:24] <CaptHindsight> cbjamo: composites with metals and polymers
[12:46:08] <CaptHindsight> or DLP to create molds for casting metals
[12:46:44] <cbjamo> IchGuckLive: That would be useful, but I have 5 heaters, is there a way to control them idependently this way?
[12:46:57] <CaptHindsight> a DLP can print a sacrificial mold in minutes
[12:47:09] <cbjamo> CaptHindsight: How many printers do you have/work with?
[12:47:30] <CaptHindsight> or inkjet to print a sand cast mold in minutes
[12:48:01] <cbjamo> and, if you don't mind saying, who do you work for?
[12:48:15] <IchGuckLive> cbjamo: yes AND is your friend
[12:49:07] <CaptHindsight> we make 3D printers in China, the problem is the US are the patent trolls
[12:49:12] <IchGuckLive> if heater 1 and 2 and 3 and 4 and 5 motion.spindle-at-speed
[12:49:14] <CaptHindsight> is/in
[12:50:32] <CaptHindsight> I wish the GGG makers would cooperate on an open standard for machine control software but most seem out to make a quick buck on the fad
[12:50:51] <cbjamo> CaptHindsight: yeah, that is annoying, luckily my work is research oriented, so we don't have to worry about it quite so much.
[12:51:04] <CaptHindsight> and that the printrun UI would die
[12:51:27] <cbjamo> What, you don't like printrun? cmon, it works, sometimes.
[12:51:58] <CaptHindsight> repetier at least had a UI that had a wire frame of the parts to be printed
[12:52:08] <CaptHindsight> a bit cluttered but in the right direction
[12:53:41] <cbjamo> CaptHindsight: Yeah, I'm not really happy with any of them, and I don't think printrun is in active development anymore. At least it is all open source, if only I had the time to work on that stuff too, ya know?
[12:53:51] <CaptHindsight> something like Axis but with more than one level of user
[12:54:56] <cbjamo> Do you mean for acess control or for something else?
[12:55:25] <CaptHindsight> http://reprap.org/mediawiki/images/5/5c/RepetierHostStartpage.png
[12:55:49] <CaptHindsight> levels of user expertise
[12:56:42] <CaptHindsight> mom mode (what would Apple do) and expert mode
[12:57:02] <cbjamo> ah, right now I think we kinda have to assume a minumum technical compitency that is pretty high. It'll get beter with time, but every printer I've ever used was finicky in some way or another.
[12:57:40] <cbjamo> I also want beter integration between the slicer and the host.
[12:58:41] <CaptHindsight> a frankenprinter kit made from threaded rod is one thing but a complete turn key printer should come with an easy to use UI
[12:59:14] <fragalot> CaptHindsight: both pronterface and YARRH have a wireframe preview.
[12:59:42] <fragalot> CaptHindsight: and once the Slic3r settings are set, it also slices it for you in the background.
[12:59:59] <fragalot> the reason why nobody does this for repraps is that there is too much variation in different printers.
[13:00:00] <cbjamo> CaptHindsight: true, I am very much in diy mindset rather than a consumer one.
[13:00:13] <fragalot> but yes, it's a major downfall
[13:00:36] <CaptHindsight> fragalot: the radar screen has to go
[13:00:51] <fragalot> CaptHindsight: why?
[13:00:52] <Heinz_60> Hi @ll
[13:00:56] <cbjamo> fragalot: And you are going to need to tweak the slicer setting between objects.
[13:01:08] <fragalot> CaptHindsight: perhaps move it to another tab, but it's there for a reason.
[13:01:13] <fragalot> cbjamo: indeed.
[13:01:18] <fragalot> cbjamo: except, not always
[13:01:37] <fragalot> if you go the stratasys style of printing, you just set the layer height & type of support material, and 2 or 3 infill settings (%)
[13:01:47] <fragalot> not a whole lot of options, just stuff that works
[13:01:55] <fragalot> it's dead slow and limited, but it's enough for most users
[13:02:10] <cbjamo> fragalot: true, What I want is things like infill type and density right there so I can easilly change them on the fly.
[13:02:55] <CaptHindsight> for DIY it might as well be all command line
[13:03:30] <CaptHindsight> that's why makerbot spent all that time on the new UI
[13:03:42] <cbjamo> CaptHindsight: eh, I like feedback for things like temps, and I hate ncurses with a firey passion.
[13:04:12] <cbjamo> very true, although, I don't think its very good.
[13:04:18] <fragalot> cbjamo: this could easilly be done with pronterface and a custom button or 2 to set the Slic3r command in the background
[13:06:05] <fragalot> there's no real need to make a new UI from scratch
[13:06:09] <fragalot> just edit what already exists
[13:06:12] <fragalot> this is why it's opensource
[13:06:22] <fragalot> instead of complaining about it, DO it. :)
[13:08:24] <cbjamo> I'd love too, except that I have a bunch of other, higher priority, projects.
[13:11:21] <CaptHindsight> there's lots of new development going on to make the software easier to use
[13:11:42] <cbjamo> CaptHindsight: on what projects?
[13:12:00] <cbjamo> or do you mean in general?
[13:12:21] <CaptHindsight> mostly closed or not yet open projects
[13:12:36] <CaptHindsight> http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/pirate3d/the-buccaneer-the-3d-printer-that-everyone-can-use for instance
[13:12:40] <cbjamo> ah, thats a shame.
[13:13:57] <cbjamo> pretty box at least.
[13:15:34] <CaptHindsight> industrial printers will end up with UI's similar to what Linuxcnc has
[13:16:27] <CaptHindsight> low cost consumer units will end up closer to a microwave or TV
[13:16:51] <CaptHindsight> pick your part, color and size and press print
[13:17:34] <cbjamo> CaptHindsight: You're probably right.
[13:20:17] <CaptHindsight> about 3-4 years ago linuxcnc worked fine for a 3-axis plastic extruder
[13:21:20] <CaptHindsight> the main complaint was needing a PC that you still needed after using an arduino instead of a PC
[13:22:19] <CaptHindsight> but I guess you weren't supposed to notice
[13:28:26] <WalterN> CaptHindsight: most processes that I'm reading say to use nickel sulfate for the sealing process... is it really necessary?
[13:38:50] <fragalot> CaptHindsight: the sst1200es from stratasys at work has a quite simplistic UI - load part, select density, hit print. it works, but I prefer to have the flexibillity that comes with my diy reprap.
[13:39:01] <fragalot> CaptHindsight: simple is good. locked down simple, isn't as much
[13:39:16] <fragalot> especially not if the backend supports a whole lot more than what it shows
[13:40:58] <fragalot> CaptHindsight: also - a lot of PC's these days don't have parallel ports. the only ones that do that I have are near to death. that's my reason for using a RAMPS 1.4 controller with an sd card and LCD hooked up to it
[13:41:28] <fragalot> (this frees up my laptop to do other things without having to worry about losing any timing resolution
[14:13:11] <CaptHindsight> Enco is fast, 1 day by truck!
[14:23:04] <CaptHindsight> JT-Shop:
http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?PARTPG=INLMKD&PMPXNO=3009582&PMAKA=803-0036 only $260 if you use the coupon, it's a one piece polycarbonate
[14:30:24] <JT-Shop> much to big for me, I got the bench top one from TSC
[14:45:42] <frallzor2> ahoyhoy
[14:47:37] <JT-Shop> howdy
[14:47:56] <frallzor2> bah stupid client to crash when i logged on
[14:48:02] <frallzor2> I want my real nick back =P
[14:48:34] <CaptHindsight> did you leave it somewhere?
[14:49:03] <frallzor> http://img826.imageshack.us/img826/20/ja44.jpg all done!
[14:56:01] <cbjamo> where do the scripts for user mcodes go?
[14:56:45] <cbjamo> never mind, I found it
[15:03:42] <JT-Shop> nice
[15:16:13] <benjamin__> hello, I'm a newbie by using linuxcnc (German user). I will try to install Heekscad. But I already have problems by doing the installation.
[15:16:48] <benjamin__> Who is able to describe the installation?
[15:19:30] <benjamin__> I read that I have to use a script to make a new compilation, but I haven't done a compilation in Linux until now.
[15:20:50] <benjamin__> what kind of tool do I have to use!? cmake!? which tool have to used for the script?
[15:20:54] <frallzor> is heekscad related to linuxcnc?
[15:21:14] <archivist> you do not need to compile if you use the live cd
[15:21:36] <archivist> heekscad is no relation
[15:22:24] <benjamin__> I have done a full installation without a live cd. or do you mean a live cd for heekscad?
[15:24:49] <archivist> we dont support heekscad in here, better off on the heekscad mailing list
[15:25:24] <benjamin__> ok... sorry I won't to desturb
[15:25:28] <archivist> its support on linux is not so good at the moment
[15:26:22] <benjamin__> I saw that the support isn't realy the best, but the tool looks good and easy
[15:28:39] <benjamin__> for me it is more interesting how I can compile a bash script in linux
[15:29:01] <archivist> !seen danheeks
[15:29:01] <the_wench> last seen in 2011-08-01 18:34:53GMT 838:59:59 ago, saying Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier.
http://miranda-im.org
[15:29:21] <benjamin__> in that way i can follow the description
[15:31:23] <archivist> you do not compile bash scripts
[15:50:38] <andypugh> It's been a long time coming, but my Mill is now wearing all three motors.
[15:51:33] <Tom_itx> need pics
[15:52:49] <Tom_itx> !seen damimal
[15:52:49] <the_wench> Never heard of the entity damimal you ask for
[15:52:58] <Tom_itx> !seen danimal
[15:52:59] <the_wench> last seen in 2011-02-17 00:01:29, seems to have quit or joined and I dont have a message
[15:54:13] <andypugh> Kind of miss Danimal
[15:54:19] <Tom_itx> yep
[15:56:52] <syyl> when men go out for shopping ;)
[15:56:53] <syyl> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/24396704/Gewindeschneidfutter/IMG_2115.JPG
[15:57:12] <syyl> and a nice set of deckel collets...
[15:57:15] <PCW> danimal showed up under a different handle a few months ago
[15:57:26] <andypugh> Ah!
[15:58:36] <Tom_itx> gotta get my new router configured, hopefully i can figure out all the rules it needs
[16:02:18] <andypugh> Tom_itx: Pics!
https://plus.google.com/photos/108164504656404380542/albums/5901688686374813281
[16:03:09] <frallzor> aww no nudie pics =(
[16:03:46] <Tom_itx> you're holding the ballnut and moving the screw?
[16:03:55] <andypugh> If you want nudie pics of me you are a seriously sick puppy.
[16:04:28] <andypugh> Tom_itx: Yes. For some reason I am fond of rotating-screw arrangements.
[16:04:39] <andypugh> It means that the motors don't move around.
[16:06:52] <Tom_itx> what holds the screw to the end piece?
[16:07:01] <Tom_itx> pressed into a ballbearing?
[16:07:24] <Tom_itx> or shoulder with a nut on the end
[16:07:42] <andypugh> I had a trantorque coupling of just the right size.
[16:08:38] <AR_> FUCK
[16:08:43] <AR_> just crashed my center finder
[16:09:06] <AR_> forgot to change back to incremental mode
[16:09:08] <andypugh> In fact, you can see it in one of the pictures. Loosen the coupling and insert a handle in the end of the screw (there is a chess-castle style clutch machined in the end of the screw) and it works manually. Tighten the coupling and the screw is solidly locked to the casting.
[16:09:40] <andypugh> AR_: I guess it is no longer very good at finding centres?
[16:09:53] <AR_> lmao
[16:09:55] <AR_> nope
[16:10:02] <AR_> and i should say edge finder
[16:10:10] <AR_> that's the end that snapped off
[16:11:11] <andypugh> AR_:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Renishaw-TP20-Med-Force-Module-Kit-Probe-Module-CMM-/190870802906?pt=UK_Measuring_Tools_Levels&hash=item2c70c951da
[16:11:39] <cradek> andypugh: did you have to grind away the bottom of the table a bit?
[16:11:56] <andypugh> Yes, and what a filthy job that was.
[16:12:00] <Tom_itx> andypugh, that's a nice size shell mill there
[16:12:21] <andypugh> Only about 2mm on each rib, it went pretty quicly with the angle grinder.
[16:13:17] <andypugh> Bottom speed on that machine is 45rpm, I reckon it could handle a _very_ big shell mill.
[16:13:53] <Tom_itx> all torque and no rpm
[16:14:00] <syyl> iso 40?
[16:14:22] <andypugh> Absolute top speed is 1000rpm. I have plans for a speed-up fitting.
[16:14:49] <Tom_itx> unless you plan on cutting steel i sure would
[16:14:59] <andypugh> It was 30INT, then I converted to BT30, and then I got a lot of tooling cheap in SK30, so now it is SK30 with BT30 pull-studs :-)
[16:15:23] <syyl> *scratches his head*
[16:15:31] <syyl> thats unusual ;)
[16:15:43] <Tom_itx> you do with what you can get :)
[16:16:08] <andypugh> I make my own pull-studs, so it's no big deal.
[16:16:23] <Tom_itx> you wrote a lathe program for em?
[16:16:28] <syyl> nice to have a cnc lathe ;)
[16:16:35] <andypugh> Yes.
[16:17:05] <AR_> i'll try a fowler edge finder next i guess
[16:17:27] <AR_> this was a mitutoyo
[16:17:39] <syyl> sounds like a consumable ;)
[16:17:40] <andypugh> In fact, many of the SK30 toolholders came with a strange (and unidentified) pull stud that had a BT30 pull-stud hidden inside when I peeled of the extra metal.
[16:17:53] <Tom_itx> hah
[16:18:00] <syyl> does your spindle have drive dogs?
[16:18:24] <syyl> mh how are they calles, keys?
[16:22:02] <andypugh> Yes. In fact the SK30 conversion only involved shortening one key slightly.
[16:27:43] <cbjamo> what is a joint following error? I get one right at startup, which kills the machine.
[16:29:43] <andypugh> cbjamo: It means that the axis isn't moving in the direction it should, probably.
[16:29:55] <andypugh> Is this a servo system or a stepper system?
[16:29:59] <cbjamo> servo
[16:30:15] <cbjamo> why would it give the error if I'm not commanding it to move?
[16:32:10] <andypugh> Has it ever worked?
[16:32:52] <cbjamo> no, the machine is still being built.
[16:33:14] <andypugh> I suspect that the motor and encoder disagree about which way is left and which is right.
[16:33:58] <cbjamo> well, niether is hooked up at the moment.
[16:34:07] <andypugh> Even when you don't command a move the servo loop tries to hold the motor still, and if the motor moves a tad the wrong way, and the PID loop tries to correct by sending it further the wrong way, it very rapidly goes out of control.
[16:34:37] <andypugh> Ah, you will tend to get f-errors in that case, absolutely.
[16:35:11] <cbjamo> ok, is there something I can change in the hal file to let me do some testing?
[16:35:42] <cbjamo> specificly, I'm trying to test the mcodes we need.
[16:44:58] <andypugh> cbjamo: You could try setting the f-error limits very big indeed.
[16:45:34] <andypugh> (or possibly disabling the PID will do the trick)
[16:47:31] <DJ9DJ> gn8
[16:58:44] <cbjamo> andypugh: where are the f-error limits set?
[16:59:32] <andypugh> In the INI file
[17:05:04] <PetefromTn> hey fellas/ladies...
[17:05:14] <cbjamo> I tried setting both FERROR and MIN_FERROR to 100, not luck
[17:05:19] <cbjamo> not/no
[17:05:41] <andypugh> 100 what?
[17:05:53] <cbjamo> machine units are mm
[17:06:01] <andypugh> You can just short-circuit the feedback in HAL.
[17:06:35] <cbjamo> do you know off hand what that command is going to need to be?
[17:06:54] <PCW> did you set them on all axis?
[17:07:02] <fbx90_> i just called mesa.... why did they try to tell me i needed a daughter board to generate step/dirs for my probotix?
[17:07:02] <cbjamo> PCW: yes
[17:08:02] <PetefromTn> fbx90_: You do realize that PCW IS Mesa right LOL...
[17:08:26] <JT-Shop> lol
[17:08:29] <fbx90_> PetefromTn: then i'm asking in the right place at the right time :)
[17:08:30] <PCW> If the probotix interfaces to a parallel port pinout device you should not need a daughtercard
[17:08:55] <fbx90_> it does
[17:08:59] <fbx90_> i think
[17:10:21] <andypugh> You might still find that the daughter-board is useful for things like spindle VFD control.
[17:10:32] <JT-Shop> and tons of I/O
[17:11:13] <PCW> Depending on the desired step/dir pinout, you may need a custom bitfile
[17:11:14] <PCW> (take a look at the probrxf2.pin file and see if it matches your hardware)
[17:11:20] <cbjamo> andypugh: is this the line I'll need to change? net x1-pod-fb hm2_[HOSTMOT](BOARD).0.gpio.015.in => bldc.0.hall1
[17:11:59] <fbx90_> PCW, andypugh: thanks :)
[17:14:11] <andypugh> cbjamo: No, you would need to link the position command and position feedback pins directly.
[17:15:51] <PetefromTn> Anyone here bought bits from the company BitsandBits.com?
[17:15:55] <andypugh> Probably best to do it in the custom HAL, then you can take it out again easily.
[17:16:23] <cbjamo> would that be encoder.00.position and pid.0.output?
[17:16:42] <andypugh> Something like unlinkp axis.0.motor-position-fb // net x-command axis.0.motor-position-fb.
[17:17:01] <andypugh> Naturally you need to use signal names and pin names that actually exist in your HAL.
[17:17:27] <cbjamo> right, also I'm using ja3, so its joints for me rather than axis.
[17:18:16] <andypugh> What kins are you using? It might be entirely a kinematics problem if it is a complex one.
[17:18:46] <cbjamo> gentrivkins
[17:19:13] <cbjamo> with two parallel joints for each axis.
[17:20:37] <andypugh> Not much scope for that to go wrong then
[17:20:54] <cbjamo> nope, I'm fairly certain that is set up correctly.
[17:25:27] <PetefromTn> So nobody has bought from them. Oh well I just thought I would mention that I ordered three 1/4 inch 60 degree engraving bits with a .020 tip from them on Friday Afternoon and I JUST this afternoon got a shipping confirmation. Pretty damn slow on the uptake, hopefully they will be high quality bits to make up for the slow response.
[17:27:42] <cbjamo> ok, now it looks like I need to fake the homing or it won't let me run anything, how do I do that?
[17:28:01] <cradek> set all the velocities to zero and it'll home in place without doing anything
[17:28:37] <cbjamo> thanks
[17:32:04] <fbx90_> looks like my current machine config has pins 2-6 as alternating steps and directions
[17:32:14] <fbx90_> which is the same as in prob_rfx2.pin
[17:32:20] <fbx90_> i'm not using any other pins
[17:32:25] <fbx90_> so i should be good i guess
[17:35:42] <fbx90_> oh, and good news: we are throwing a servo on one of the axes!
[17:39:11] <fbx90_> so another question is, can the 5i25 keep running the steppers while a daughter board runs a servo?
[17:42:52] <cbjamo> nick cbjamo_away
[17:43:25] <cbjamo> every time
[17:43:40] <Tom_itx> PetefromTn, did you pay enough for them?
[17:44:11] <fbx90_> or can a 7i77 daughter board also output some step/dirs for me?
[17:44:19] <fbx90_> using it's I/O
[18:09:58] -barjavel.freenode.net:#linuxcnc- [freenode-info] channel flooding and no channel staff around to help? Please check with freenode support:
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[18:44:20] <Tom_itx> JT-Shop, you around?
[18:52:06] <jdh> I am.
[18:52:13] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/index.php
[18:52:17] <Tom_itx> can you see that?
[18:52:24] <Tom_itx> i'm working on my router...
[18:52:35] <jdh> yes, it's lovely.
[18:52:40] <Tom_itx> thanks
[18:52:41] <jdh> except, it's freezing.
[18:53:07] <Tom_itx> it is?
[18:53:19] <jdh> Outdoor: 32.0 (F) / 0.0 (C)
[18:53:27] <jdh> ^^ freezing
[18:53:28] <Tom_itx> oh those are disconnected :)
[18:55:22] <jdh> I need to add a few of those to my compressor monitor
[18:55:55] <jdh> I have a combo temp/RH sensor somewhere that should work.
[18:56:23] <jdh> and a TI i2c temp module I can attach to the output pipe.
[18:56:27] <Tom_itx> LM75
[18:56:32] <Tom_itx> is all those are
[18:56:51] <Tom_itx> goes to lmsensors
[18:56:56] <Tom_itx> via parport
[18:57:06] <jdh> i2c via pport?
[18:57:10] <Tom_itx> yes
[18:57:13] <jdh> cool
[18:57:30] <jdh> I'm using a Pi for this
[18:57:59] <jdh> does maxim do samples?
[18:58:35] <Tom_L> they used to
[18:58:50] <Tom_L> http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/temp/LM75/PPort_Brd_top.jpg
[18:59:47] <Tom_L> http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/temp/LM75/PPort_I2C_sch.png
[19:00:21] <jdh> what package do they come in?
[19:01:04] <Tom_L> msop
[19:01:14] <Tom_L> and a smaller one somebody got by accident
[19:01:20] <Tom_L> i had to make some tiny boards for him
[19:01:34] <Tom_L> oh soic and msop
[19:01:43] <Tom_L> http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/temp/LM75/lm75_soic1.jpg
[19:01:56] <Tom_L> http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/temp/LM75/lm75_msop1.jpg
[19:02:50] <jdh> I ahve some soic carrier boards somewhere
[19:03:15] <Tom_L> you gotta jumper the address on the board
[19:05:15] <jdh> hm. They are only 6pin boards.
[19:06:19] <Tom_L> i have the board layout somewhere if you want it
[19:08:15] <jdh> nah, thanks. I have one of the TI sensors alreay on a carrier board and the other temp/RH one has it's own board.
[19:20:28] <andypugh> fbx90: The 7i77 uses a second set of pins on the 5i25 (you will need a second DB25 breakout, but that is just a standard $2 parallel port plate)
[20:16:12] <spacka> sorry for all the dumb questions lately... does anyone have a link to a good primer on servo systems?
[20:24:23] <spacka> also, i would love a recommendation for a good book on motion control in general
[20:52:40] <spacka> i'm fbx90 for the record :)
[20:52:52] <jdh> make up your mind.
[20:53:00] <jdh> or don't. It's up to you.
[20:55:54] <spacka> nope, i'm both
[20:56:03] <spacka> for now anyway
[21:15:31] <skunkworks> last one - I swear ;)
[21:15:47] <skunkworks> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z_LxyosF2yc&feature=youtu.be
[21:15:48] <Tecan> (Z_LxyosF2yc) "emco lathe cutting 5/8 8 11 thread in aluminum with linux cnc program" by "SamsProjectShop" is "Tech" - Length: 0:02:41
[21:17:41] <spacka> skunkworks: nice
[21:20:30] <Mikegg> why is the toolpath preview different from the actual path?
[21:20:57] <spacka> is it?
[21:22:34] <Mikegg> yes
[21:22:47] <spacka> it looks the same to me
[21:23:03] * spacka looks again
[21:23:31] <Mikegg> well, the shape is the same, but the white lines should be where the pink lines are
[21:23:59] <jdh> someone should box up one of those emco's and send it to me.
[21:24:19] <spacka> oh yeah, i was wondering that too
[21:26:44] <spacka> can someone recommend an analog servo amp?
[21:27:27] <skunkworks> Mikegg: no clue.. Dad is goofing around.
[21:37:43] -calvino.freenode.net:#linuxcnc- [freenode-info] please register your nickname...don't forget to auto-identify!
http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#nicksetup
[21:38:54] <spacka> i can't connect the 7i77 to the 8i20?
[21:40:22] <spacka> or whatever amplifier i figure out will work best with the motor that i don't even have yet :)
[21:43:02] <Mikegg> spacka: I think not directly
[21:43:14] <Mikegg> the 7i77 is meant to interface with an analog servo amp
[21:43:30] <Mikegg> the 8i20 is not really analog in that sense
[21:44:08] <spacka> hmm
[21:44:26] <spacka> what does this mean then?
[21:44:27] <spacka> Even though it uses a 40 Mips DSP, the 8I20 is a 'dumb' amplifier suitable for integration in host based motion control systems.
[21:45:05] <spacka> it takes digital inputs from a servo controller?
[21:45:14] <Mikegg> have to ask PCW.... correct
[21:45:43] <Mikegg> as opposed to a +/-1 0 vdc analog signal
[21:46:34] <spacka> so which of these takes a +/- 10vdc analog input...
[21:46:43] <spacka> i'm being kind of bogged down in terminology here
[21:46:46] <Mikegg> the Mesa products?
[21:46:50] <spacka> yeah
[21:46:50] <Mikegg> none of them :)
[21:47:08] <spacka> oh
[21:47:13] <Mikegg> they are meant to interface with common analog servo drives
[21:47:17] <eric_unterhausen> the mesa servo amps are controlled over a serial line
[21:47:31] <Mikegg> like you would have in an existing machine you were retrofitting
[21:47:38] <spacka> ah
[21:48:15] <spacka> i'm replacing a stepper on a machine with a servo
[21:48:23] <Mikegg> or if you have some proprietary stuff you can't interface with, you can rip out the drive too and use a Mesa drive
[21:48:30] <spacka> the steppers are run off a 5i25 (or will be)
[21:48:49] <spacka> someone told me i could slap a 7i77 in to run the servo
[21:49:14] <Mikegg> indeed, but you will need a +/- 10 VDC analog servo drive
[21:49:19] <Mikegg> ebay
[21:49:21] <spacka> but i still have a missing piece of the puzzle
[21:50:03] <Mikegg> yes
[21:51:11] <Mikegg> something like this:
[21:51:11] <Mikegg> http://www.ebay.com/itm/AMC-BE12A6E-brand-new-servo-drive-/121143375395?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1c34b53623
[21:51:15] <spacka> here's where i'm getting bogged down in terminology
[21:51:32] <spacka> seems like some of these things incorporate multiple functions and some dont
[21:51:41] <spacka> drive/driver/controller/amplifier
[21:53:10] <Mikegg> look at the 7i39
[21:53:41] <Mikegg> if that is big enough for your motor, that is probably the most straightforward way to run a servo
[21:53:49] <Mikegg> all you need is a DC power supply
[21:54:34] <spacka> also, is a pwm servo drive different from one that accepts +/-10vdc?
[21:55:35] <Mikegg> PWM is how the drive develops the right voltage for each winding. Most drives will use that regardless of how they talk to the controller
[21:56:16] <Mikegg> PWM is also how the Mesa card sends the right voltage to the drive
[21:56:21] <Mikegg> as a control signal
[21:56:28] <eric_unterhausen> there are PWM input drives, you need to look at the data sheet to see if it can be driven with what you have
[21:56:54] <Mikegg> that could be. not something i've encountered
[21:57:18] <spacka> from what i was reading, pwm inputs base the output on the duty cycle, not the voltage
[21:57:34] <eric_unterhausen> ya
[21:57:35] <spacka> yet some are called pwm but seem to take a 10v input
[21:57:51] <spacka> :(
[21:57:52] <eric_unterhausen> pwm is pretty close to a 10v input
[21:58:33] <eric_unterhausen> AMC and maybe Copley have pwm drives
[21:59:21] <Mikegg> oh yeah, sure enough:
http://www.servosystems.com/amc_pwm.htm
[21:59:32] <spacka> that one that Mikegg just linked says "pwm servo drive" on the box, but in the description says COMMAND SOURCE: ±10 V Analog
[22:00:36] <spacka> since i have about 2 days experience with servo systems, this confuses me :)
[22:02:05] <Mikegg> I'd have to dive into the data sheet. I have a drive similar to that one. Mine says PWM on the front. Always thought they meant "We're PWM-ing the op-amps" Duh
[22:02:11] <eric_unterhausen> I don't think I would mess with that
[22:03:13] <spacka> what would you mess with? :)
[22:03:24] <eric_unterhausen> analog input drives
[22:03:30] <eric_unterhausen> I have a batch of them, actually
[22:03:33] <spacka> got any recommendations?
[22:03:50] <spacka> willing to part with any of them? :)
[22:04:49] <spacka> something like this?
[22:04:50] <spacka> http://www.ebay.com/itm/KOLLMORGEN-SILVERLINE-ANALOG-SERVO-AMPLIFIER-SO-4004-/360691012407?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item53fadc1337
[22:05:37] <eric_unterhausen> don't think I would mess with that one, but I would look at the data sheet first
[22:08:25] <spacka> spec sheet wasn't very helpful to me
[22:08:25] <spacka> it just tells you how to wire it up as part of some system it goes with
[22:08:28] <eric_unterhausen> the AMC drives all say PWM on them
[22:09:56] <eric_unterhausen> problem with AMC is they sand the part numbers off the chips
[22:10:01] <eric_unterhausen> so repair is pretty difficult
[22:10:03] <spacka> heh
[22:10:15] <spacka> i don't want to deal with a company like that
[22:10:21] <spacka> even second-hand
[22:10:56] <eric_unterhausen> prices on ebay are now out of my range, I have bought them for $20
[22:11:12] <eric_unterhausen> now I see broken ones going for $50
[22:13:04] <spacka> ebay only has 18 results for "analog servo amplifier"
[22:13:43] <eric_unterhausen> you don't want to search for that anyway
[22:13:50] <eric_unterhausen> nobody puts analog in the title
[22:14:01] <spacka> lots have pwm in the title
[22:15:59] <spacka> expanding the search to body text doesn't help very much either
[22:16:06] <eric_unterhausen> actually, for precision applications, there are analog output drives
[22:21:02] <spacka> well i'm pretty confused at this point
[22:21:31] <CaptHindsight> http://imagebin.org/264878 as viewed from the cutting face, which direction will loosen the tool? CW or CCW, it's seized at the moment
[22:22:16] <Tom_itx> ccw
[22:22:31] <Tom_itx> oh the bolt?
[22:22:43] <Tom_itx> yeah i'd still say ccw
[22:22:43] <CaptHindsight> yeah the bolt
[22:22:51] <eric_unterhausen> gotta be
[22:22:59] <Tom_itx> it will loosten _with_ the cut direction
[22:23:01] <eric_unterhausen> no reason for left hand thread
[22:23:23] <eric_unterhausen> it's just holding it on some bosses
[22:23:40] <CaptHindsight> the hex hole in the head is a bit worn as well
[22:23:42] <spacka> my guess was ccw too
[22:23:58] <CaptHindsight> hate to mess it up more
[22:24:22] <Tom_itx> why do you need to remove it?
[22:24:50] <CaptHindsight> it's an old tool, and it's currently on the wrong series holder
[22:28:13] <CaptHindsight> went to "5 and Under" for the first time the other day, picked up $5 yoga mats that make great drawer liners
[22:34:42] <CaptHindsight> it's on Cat-40 or -50 now and it's needs to be on BT-40
[22:46:10] <eric_unterhausen> brush drives are going for good prices
[23:05:02] <CaptHindsight> http://www.mayr.com/en/products/safety-brakes/roba-linearstop/ anyone ever use Mayr linear brakes for Z-axis E-stop?
[23:26:35] <tjtr33> the new logic analyzers are here, the new logic analyzers are here (S.Martin) the OpenBench arrived today from HongKong.
[23:26:41] <tjtr33> The client runs great. capturing data from the encoders now.
[23:26:48] <tjtr33> Wrote a bit o python to make the data legible.
[23:26:48] <tjtr33> now i gotta replicate the capture that Jepler did at the fest :)
[23:27:12] <tjtr33> no need to graph once its just 1s & 0s :)
[23:27:35] <CaptHindsight> http://www.sump.org/projects/analyzer/ are they similar?
[23:27:58] <tjtr33> yep, that sthe firmware in it
[23:28:23] <tjtr33> http://dangerousprototypes.com/docs/Open_Bench_Logic_Sniffer
[23:31:00] <CaptHindsight> yeah, a few years ago i was going to expand on it for emulating SPI Flash in PC motherboards
[23:32:21] <CaptHindsight> used the Xilinx Spartan-3E Starter Kit (HW-SPAR3E-SK-US) Xilinx Development Boards.
[23:33:20] <CaptHindsight> tjtr33:
http://www.mayr.com/en/products/safety-brakes/roba-linearstop/
[23:33:35] <tjtr33> some day i'll play with the papilio fpga board to learn something about fpga's
[23:34:11] <tjtr33> yep i stumbled on mayr but figgered that wasnt gonna be local or quick for you
[23:34:20] <tjtr33> look like calls equipment
[23:34:24] <tjtr33> class
[23:34:43] <CaptHindsight> I need them yesterday and also in a few months
[23:35:19] <CaptHindsight> http://www.automation4less.com/linearclamp-pneu.htm
[23:35:35] <tjtr33> local in chicago ? ( used to be the machine part center of western world )
[23:36:39] <CaptHindsight> Salisbury, NC now it seems
[23:38:05] <tjtr33> teher was a zimmer-kreim cnc edm at HGR, granite table, 16 posn atc, xyzc axis. i inspected it, but was outbidded by a SouthAmerican, still lookin for one
[23:41:26] <CaptHindsight> http://search.newport.com/?q=*&x2=sku&q2=RV240HAHLT picked up a NOS for $700 on fleabay
[23:53:42] <tjtr33> nice stage! and can be vert too
[23:56:11] <CaptHindsight> using it to tilt a trunnion
