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[00:00:05] <ssi> oh, no you can't have that
[00:00:12] <ssi> I love mesa more than I love my children
[00:00:14] <Gamma-x> lol but ill take a spare computer.
[00:02:37] <Gamma-x> what other brand motion control cards work with linuxcnc? maby i can find a cheapo on ebay
[00:03:47] <ssi> heh I'm not even going to attempt to answer t hat
[00:05:50] <Gamma-x> im broke... I need to make some parts asap!
[00:06:25] <ssi> to answer your question, with the mesa card in the machine, the nic does not show up in lspci
[00:06:44] <Gamma-x> must be some kinda of irq conflict..
[00:06:58] <ssi> those still exist? :P
[00:07:38] <Gamma-x> try lsdev
[00:07:45] <Gamma-x> see if there both in there?
[00:07:55] <ssi> heh I have to reboot and pull the card to install lsdev
[00:08:38] <ssi> the mesa card is showing up
[00:08:39] <ssi> shows up as:
[00:08:46] <ssi> DPIO module: Device 2718:5125
[00:08:49] <ssi> and just confirmed in manual:
[00:08:58] <ssi> VENDOR ID
[00:08:58] <ssi> DEVICE ID
[00:08:58] <ssi> SUBSYSTEM VENDOR ID
[00:08:58] <ssi> SUBSYSTEM DEVICE ID
[00:08:58] <ssi> 0X2718 0x5125 0x2718 0x5125
[00:09:21] <Gamma-x> but no nic underlsdev?
[00:09:29] <ssi> I told you, I have to install it
[00:09:33] <ssi> and I need network to do that
[00:09:49] <Gamma-x> u need to install lsdev?!
[00:09:59] <ssi> yes
[00:10:22] <Gamma-x> it should be built into linuxcnc
[00:10:28] <ssi> doesn't seem to be
[00:12:32] <Gamma-x> do you have a wireless nic such as a usb one?
[00:13:05] <ssi> not one that works in linux
[00:13:29] <Gamma-x> I always keep an alfa close at hand. have about 3 of them
[00:13:43] <Gamma-x> ssi your lathe working?
[00:13:47] <ssi> NO
[00:14:01] <Gamma-x> so serious
[00:14:01] <ssi> notihng I own works :(
[00:14:17] <Gamma-x> I wish I could come out to you and help get the lathe up and running
[00:14:59] <ssi> ok according to lsdev, eth0 is irq 27
[00:15:06] <ssi> lemme slam the mesa back in and reboot :P
[00:17:11] <ssi> mesa doesn't have anything that shows up in lsdev
[00:17:35] <GammaX> ssi are you hot swapping your pci things?!
[00:17:44] <ssi> hell no
[00:17:59] <GammaX> hahah the way you worded that I was like uhhhh theres your problem! haha
[00:18:20] <GammaX> ok so now you have both cards showing up in the system?
[00:18:23] <ssi> no
[00:18:27] <ssi> only one will ever show up
[00:18:43] <GammaX> how did your mesa card show up in your system?
[00:18:54] <ssi> DPIO module: Device 2718:5125
[00:19:09] <ssi> 0a:09.0 DPIO module: Device 2718:5125
[00:19:44] <GammaX> is that showing up now?
[00:19:47] <ssi> yep
[00:19:59] <GammaX> does lsdev still show your eth0 irq?
[00:20:01] <ssi> nope
[00:20:17] <ssi> ok did lspci -t, the mesa is hanging off the 82801 pci bridge
[00:20:23] <ssi> lemme reboot again and see where the tg3 lives
[00:21:19] <GammaX> ok
[00:21:33] <GammaX> sorry for your situation. im trying to help as much as I can
[00:21:45] <GammaX> might be worth checking in your bios...
[00:22:06] <ssi> already did
[00:22:14] <ssi> there's nothing remarkably configurable about the nic
[00:22:18] <ssi> I can disable it
[00:22:42] <GammaX> well configurable about the pci slots and irq's
[00:22:50] <ssi> nothing
[00:22:51] <ssi> heh
[00:22:56] <ssi> there's only one pci slot
[00:22:56] <GammaX> lol
[00:23:00] <ssi> also the nic is pcie
[00:23:04] <GammaX> oh
[00:23:07] <ssi> it's hanging off a different port of the pci bridge
[00:23:11] <ssi> it's pcie but built in
[00:23:14] <ssi> electrically pcie :)
[00:23:26] <GammaX> im a lil confused... lol
[00:23:32] <ssi> how can I clarify
[00:24:11] <ssi> this little stupid piece of shit computer has a PCI/PCIE riser in it
[00:24:16] <ssi> it has one PCI slot and one PCIEx1 slot
[00:24:24] <GammaX> lol
[00:24:24] <GammaX> ok
[00:24:27] <ssi> the pci bridge has three ports
[00:24:34] <ssi> 00:1c.0 pcie port 1
[00:24:44] <ssi> 00:1c.4 pcie port 5
[00:24:51] <ssi> 00:1e.0 pci port
[00:25:06] <ssi> the nic is a BCM5787 pcie gigabit nic
[00:25:09] <ssi> tigon3 driver
[00:25:25] <ssi> it's attached to 1c.4, the pcie port 5
[00:25:33] <ssi> when I put the mesa card in, it shows up as attached to 1e.0
[00:25:37] <ssi> but the nic goes away
[00:26:45] <GammaX> ah
[00:29:09] <ssi> yea I have no damn idea
[00:29:12] <ssi> this computer is a pile
[00:31:32] <GammaX> im questioning the fellows
[00:35:45] <ssi> I can't get the mesa driver to load either
[00:36:02] <GammaX> look at dmesg
[00:36:12] <GammaX> see if anything is popping up
[00:36:29] <ssi> unfortunately the hm2 drivers don't have useful error messages
[00:36:32] <ssi> it returns -1 on all failures
[00:36:39] <ssi> so all you end up getting is "unknown symbol in module"
[00:37:07] <GammaX> ssi that coming from dmesg?
[00:37:11] <ssi> ya
[00:37:22] <GammaX> jeaser
[00:38:20] <ssi> I'm really not having a productive evening :/
[00:38:42] <GammaX> i wish I lived closer man lol im sorry
[00:39:20] <ssi> and my stupid basement is a swimming pool :(
[00:39:27] <GammaX> ssi look in /var/log/syslog anything for device detection?
[00:41:29] <ssi> nothing interesting
[00:41:51] <GammaX> does it have any info on any devices in there?
[00:41:53] <GammaX> mesa or nic
[00:41:55] <ssi> no
[00:42:00] <ssi> I'm done with it
[00:42:20] <ssi> it'll get fixed when either pcw pops in and tells me exactly what's wrong or when I throw this out the window and buy a new machine
[00:43:34] <GammaX> ssi try resetting your bios to default settings if possible. one last thing id try fore the night.
[00:44:01] <ssi> there's nothing in the bios
[00:44:06] <GammaX> it cant hurt
[00:44:12] <ssi> yea it can
[00:44:41] <GammaX> lies
[00:46:24] <GammaX> how much do you think steel or aluminum square tubing goes for? small stuff 1/8 x1'
[00:46:28] <GammaX> 1"*
[00:46:31] <ssi> steel is much cheaper
[00:46:43] <ssi> steel 1x1 16ga wall is about $11/20'
[00:46:53] <GammaX> damn!
[00:47:00] <GammaX> im doin steel then!
[00:47:02] <ssi> yeah
[00:47:04] <ssi> what for?
[00:47:23] <GammaX> Well I got an rf 45 and I wanna make it as much of a machining center I can...
[00:47:30] <ssi> for an enclosure?
[00:47:36] <GammaX> wanna make a MUCH bigger enclosure
[00:48:11] <ssi> you have a metal supermarket nearby?
[00:48:22] <GammaX> yeah they deliver for free too
[00:48:34] <ssi> I've never tried to get them to deliver
[00:48:44] <ssi> but I always was under the impression that you have to buy a fair bit to get delivery
[00:48:51] <GammaX> is there realy a place called metal supermarket?
[00:48:58] <ssi> yes
[00:49:03] <GammaX> lol
[00:49:10] <ssi> oh you were being a smartass
[00:49:12] <GammaX> i have MANY distributors in denver.
[00:49:26] <ssi> http://www.metalsupermarkets.com
[00:49:34] <ssi> No minimum order
[00:49:34] <ssi> Over 8,000 Metal Products, Shapes and Grades
[00:49:34] <ssi> Highest Quality of Metal Products
[00:49:34] <ssi> Unsurpassed Service!
[00:49:34] <ssi> Cut to size
[00:49:36] <ssi> Fast Delivery or Local Pickup!
[00:49:39] <ssi> we don't have what you need we'll source the material for you.
[00:49:41] <ssi> see, they deliver
[00:49:42] <GammaX> and the place I bought a 2x5x12' bar of 6065 t6 delivered it for free
[00:49:44] <ssi> i thought you were serious :P
[00:49:48] <GammaX> cost me about 240?
[00:50:00] <ssi> yea not surprising
[00:50:04] <ssi> that's a big heavy hunk of aluminum
[00:50:30] <GammaX> yeah nutin near me
[00:50:33] <ssi> I buy stock for them for some of my qty jobs
[00:50:39] <GammaX> no i think they will deliver anything the next day for free...
[00:50:39] <ssi> and I get them to cut it to length for me too
[00:50:47] <ssi> cause their bandsaw cuts nice and square
[00:50:53] <ssi> and they don't charge extra for the cuts
[00:50:57] <GammaX> yeah I wish mine did.
[00:51:10] <ssi> I buy 2" roundbar 6061 at 2-3/8" lenghts
[00:51:13] <ssi> 100pc at a time
[00:51:34] <ssi> and they even deburr every cut :P
[00:52:31] <Jymmm> and the cost per piece?
[00:52:35] <ssi> not cheap
[00:52:38] <ssi> about $4.50 I think
[00:53:09] <GammaX> I lied before.
[00:53:14] <Jymmm> well, think of the labor you're saving
[00:53:17] <ssi> Jymmm: exactly
[00:53:22] <GammaX> I paid 300 for 145 pound bar of alum 6061
[00:53:37] <Jymmm> so $4.5 CTL and deburred, not bad at all
[00:53:40] <ssi> and since someone's paying me to make the parts, it's cheaper for them if I have the supplier cut them
[00:53:53] <ssi> plus my workholding is fiddly on that job
[00:53:59] <Jymmm> is it clean alum?
[00:54:14] <ssi> it's held in a 2" step chuck collet only .25" deep
[00:54:16] <Jymmm> like soapy clean?
[00:54:20] <ssi> so it really needs to be square
[00:54:24] <ssi> Jymmm: uhm, I don't think so?
[00:54:27] <ssi> it's raw extruded round bar
[00:54:31] <Jymmm> ah
[00:54:53] <Jymmm> what I call "mill clean" =)
[00:56:39] <GammaX> anyone have some suggestions on how to get work for grand opening machine shop?
[00:56:48] <GammaX> and how much to charge...
[00:56:58] <ssi> Jymmm:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BJeqdJrCYAAkn0L.jpg:large
[00:57:09] <ssi> as I receive it from the supplier, finished product
[01:01:30] <archivist> having a local cnc cutting metal supplier is useful :)
[01:25:48] <toastydeath> Gamma-x, what kind of work are you doing
[01:26:02] <toastydeath> how much experience do you have, etc
[01:33:07] <archivist> Gamma-x, work out how much you want to earn a year add your overheads, divide by the number of real working days(about 240) and then you have a day rate add a bit for profit, investment etc
[01:34:06] <archivist> it then you find out why larger companies charge so much per hour
[01:34:23] <toastydeath> our shop rate was 60-75/hr depending on what was being done
[01:34:28] <toastydeath> grinders cost more per hour than mills, etc
[01:35:27] <toastydeath> (cost of machine time)
[01:36:32] <toastydeath> also the reason experience is important is because if you don't accurately know how much time a job is going to take, you can't quote
[01:38:44] <ssi> that's the hardest part
[01:40:01] <archivist> working out the quote can take a significant time, a one man shop is not making stuff while quoting (unless he has lots of cnc)
[01:41:27] <Loetmichel> mornin
[01:41:38] <toastydeath> what do you tell the customer when they ask for the price, though
[01:41:57] <archivist> depends :)
[01:42:16] <toastydeath> like, both shops I've been at billed for everything
[01:42:25] <toastydeath> the quote and all office work, the machining, etc
[01:42:45] <toastydeath> it was just balled into the shop rate
[01:43:39] <archivist> yes that is the overheads I was talking about, rent phone, tax etc
[01:44:05] <toastydeath> right, i wasn't disagreeing, i was confused about why you were bringing up that he's not making anything while quoting
[01:44:27] <toastydeath> how do you get work without the ability to price parts
[01:44:29] <archivist> losing while quoting
[01:44:45] <archivist> advertising too
[01:44:51] <toastydeath> losing what while you're quoting
[01:44:57] <archivist> breakdown time
[01:44:59] <toastydeath> you're not losing money, you're billing that time into the job
[01:45:20] <archivist> a percentage of quotes you do not get
[01:45:22] <toastydeath> plus a factor for lost quotes
[01:45:47] <archivist> I would love a ballpark number for that
[01:46:05] <toastydeath> ?
[01:46:08] <Loetmichel> *grrr* that wasn't a good idea to let the 50ccm motorcycle "sleep" outside for 5 months... just bought a new insurance and charged the battery... (8,7Ah into a 5 Ah battery: THAT was EMPTY!) now tried to start it... *IGGIGIIIGGIGIGIGIGIGIGIG*... *IGGIGIIIGGIGIGIGIGIGIGIG* ... nothin, not even a single ignition... :-(
[01:46:10] <toastydeath> what do you mean, you have all the data
[01:46:32] <toastydeath> # of drawings that came in, time spent on the drawings, # of contracts won and the average profit per contract
[01:47:07] <toastydeath> over a year it's pretty stable
[01:48:14] <toastydeath> i haven't worked for but I've talked to some guys who ran repair who were able to just charge by however long it took, but they had a reputation
[01:48:38] <toastydeath> i guess if you're a one man shop and had the experience that would be the way to go
[01:50:59] <archivist> if your work is vary varied your quote to actual job ratio varies too, never had an average I could use yet
[01:53:19] <Jymmm> ssi: Damn, that's not bad at all
[01:55:20] <archivist> Loetmichel, had a similar problem yesterday, spectrum analyser not been switched on since 2009, had to reseat connectors to get the 5v working
[01:56:23] <ssi> Jymmm: yea I've always been happy with what I get from them
[01:56:37] <Loetmichel> archivist: thats less work than draining all the fuel out of the motorcycla, cleaning the spark plugs and disassemble the carburetor and put it in the ultrasound ;-)
[01:58:02] <Jymmm> ssi: Take the hint
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Clear-Silicone-Keyboard-Cover-Skin-for-imac-US-Version-Apple-Desktop-PC-/250910069917?pt=US_Keyboard_Protectors&hash=item3a6b67d49d
[01:58:18] <Jymmm> ssi: workgreat too
[01:58:58] * Loetmichel will drive his wife to the airport soon (a week philly again for the company) and then start working on the motorcycle... the weather over here in german should be better now they say in the radio ;-)
[01:59:15] <Loetmichel> +y
[01:59:22] <Jymmm> Loetmichel: Are oyu gonna clean the house EARLY this time?
[01:59:44] <Loetmichel> maybe ;-)
[01:59:58] <Jymmm> How much trouble dod you get into last time?
[02:00:10] <Jymmm> and how late were you picking her up?
[02:00:18] <Loetmichel> not much. a bit of angry looks ;-)
[02:00:26] <Loetmichel> seh took a cab ;-)
[02:00:28] <Loetmichel> she
[02:00:51] <Jymmm> Loetmichel: You better bring her flowers this time =)
[02:00:55] <ssi> Jymmm: lol
[02:01:07] <Loetmichel> why?
[02:01:18] <Jymmm> Loetmichel: Dude, bonus points
[02:01:58] <Jymmm> Loetmichel: ya fucked up last time, she's gonna expect it this time, This is your chance to earn extra credit =)
[02:02:00] <Loetmichel> flowers would just makle her suspcious ;-)
[02:02:15] <Jymmm> Loetmichel: That's ok, let her be.
[02:02:32] <Loetmichel> i fuck up EVERY time, so thats nothing new to her ;-)
[02:02:35] <Jymmm> Loetmichel: doesn't have to be roses, daisies work too
[02:03:29] <Jymmm> ssi: They work great, have them on all the keyboards. just wash in the sink with soapy water and air dry
[02:03:50] <Jymmm> ssi: and this is in the garage too
[02:03:50] <ssi> probably wouldn't be a terrible idea
[02:03:53] <Loetmichel> and tha last 40 roses are still (dried up) on the window sill in the living room (= wifes work room)
[02:03:59] <ssi> *especially* in the garage
[02:04:05] <ssi> I ruin keyboards with coolant
[02:04:16] <Jymmm> ssi: keeps crap out of them too
[02:04:32] <Jymmm> Loetmichel: Yep, see she likes these things.
[02:05:01] <Jymmm> Loetmichel: EXTRA EXRA CREDIT??? jewelry
[02:05:12] <Loetmichel> do i look like rockefeller?
[02:05:13] <Loetmichel> ;-)
[02:05:33] <Jymmm> Loetmichel: might even get luckky too =)
[02:05:50] <Loetmichel> btw: SHE pays the rent here... she has about 3 times my paycheck ;-)
[02:06:03] <Jymmm> Loetmichel: It doens't matter.
[02:06:44] <Jymmm> Loetmichel: Find a oendant ro broach
[02:06:48] <Jymmm> pendant
[02:07:24] <Jymmm> Loetmichel: or one of those braclets with the little charms, then you can just add charms as you go
[02:07:36] <Jymmm> ssi: free shipping too
[02:07:53] <Loetmichel> Jymmm: occasionally i make them myself on the CNC mill
[02:08:09] <Jymmm> Loetmichel: gold? silver?
[02:08:16] <Jymmm> Loetmichel: platinum?
[02:08:31] <Loetmichel> and "to get lucky" i just have to be in bed while she is awake ;-)
[02:08:45] <Jymmm> Loetmichel: get a watch
[02:09:06] <Loetmichel> silver mostly, some stainless, and some Slate / bloodstone lately
[02:09:18] <Jymmm> Loetmichel: pics?
[02:09:47] <Loetmichel> none made
[02:10:15] <Jymmm> Loetmichel: you didn't take pics of what you made her?
[02:10:25] <Loetmichel> but a plain pendant, silver plate with a bloddstone heart in it
[02:10:29] <Jymmm> Loetmichel: WTH is wrong with you!?
[02:10:31] <Loetmichel> no, and she has it with her
[02:10:51] <Jymmm> Loetmichel: tsk tsk tsk
[02:11:09] <Jymmm> Loetmichel: what are we gonna do with you
[02:14:53] <ssi> Loetmichel: you definitely need to keep sugar mommas happy
[02:15:53] <DJ9DJ> moin
[02:19:05] <Loetmichel> ssi: ???
[02:20:59] <ssi> Loetmichel: if she makes the money, she has the upper hand
[02:21:01] <ssi> keep her happy :)
[02:21:13] <Loetmichel> ah, thats "sugar momma"
[02:21:25] <ssi> yep
[02:21:53] <Loetmichel> i make money, too, but much less than her... noting like being a manager for SAP to get a big paycheck ;-)
[02:21:56] <ssi> http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=sugar%20momma
[02:22:08] <ssi> yea SAP is a good way to make a ton of money for no good reason
[02:22:10] <Loetmichel> <- has only 2800 eur a month before taxes
[02:22:54] <Loetmichel> i keep her happy ;-)
[02:23:30] <Loetmichel> ... and for now her employer had done that. she had got her new company car just friday... BMW x1 ;-)
[02:23:39] <ssi> haha nice
[02:24:12] <Loetmichel> <- has to watch out not to put a scratch in it after bringing her to the airport ;-)
[03:19:21] <archivist> another spectrum analyser up and running :)
[03:23:44] <Valen> nice
[03:23:50] <Valen> what you analising?
[03:24:14] <Jymmm> archivist: Ship to: Jymmm, General Delivery USA
[03:24:46] <archivist> just having a tidy up and getting the electronics equipment back up and running (most not used since 2009)
[03:25:50] <archivist> this is the gear when it was at the last job
http://www.collection.archivist.info/searchv13.php?searchstr=electronics+portacabin
[03:27:18] <archivist> just fired up the HP 140S just worked, the systron donner yesterday needed the case removing and connectors reseating
[03:32:21] <archivist> I need it working so I can dare to quote/do stuff
[04:03:30] <mhaberler> hi ssi! great start on the hal_gpio
[04:25:54] <Gamma-x> archivist, thats one thing i never wanted to get in to, i go as far as o scope... lol
[06:13:01] <Valen> thats a pretty fair setup archivist
[06:13:04] <Valen> in the pics
[06:13:23] <mario_> Hallo zusammen. Kann mir jemand in deutsch beim installieren vom joypad helfen?
[06:20:00] <mk0_> was genau nicht tun können?
[06:21:59] <r00t4rd3d> engrish
[06:22:45] <mario_> Habe mir das file joypad.hal runter geladen und in der ini mit halfile eingebunden es kommt aber eine Fehlermeldung.
[06:23:14] <ReadError> yea, for sure mario_
[06:23:49] <jthornton> that's what I said
[06:24:45] <mario_> nach suchen habe ich gelesen das hal_joystick nicht mehr verwendet wird. richtig?
[06:26:24] <jthornton> correct
[06:27:10] <mk0_> you mean richtig? )
[06:27:31] <mario_> hal_input . correct?
[06:28:05] <jthornton> translating
[06:28:46] <jthornton> yes use hal_input
[06:31:17] <jthornton> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Simple_Remote_Pendant
[06:31:41] <mario_> loadusr hal_joystick -d /dev/input/js0 -p joypad = loaduser hal_input /dev/input/js0 -p joypad
[06:33:14] <jthornton> see the link, hal_input is different loadusr line
[06:33:31] <mario_> loadusr -W hal_input -KRAL Dual ?
[06:34:01] <jthornton> if your joypad name has Dual in it
[06:34:53] <jthornton> Step 1 Find out if your joypad is compatible Schritt 1 Finden Sie heraus, ob Ihr Joypad kompatibel ist
[06:37:07] <ReadError> http://hidcomp.sourceforge.net/
[06:37:08] <ReadError> this is good
[06:37:14] <mario_> I: Bus=0003 Vendor=046d Product=c219 Version=0111
[06:37:16] <mario_> N: Name="Logitech Logitech Cordless RumblePad 2"
[06:37:18] <mario_> P: Phys=usb-0000:00:1d.3-2/input0
[06:37:19] <mario_> S: Sysfs=/devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:1d.3/usb5/5-2/5-2:1.0/input/input7
[06:37:21] <mario_> U: Uniq=
[06:37:22] <mario_> H: Handlers=event5 js0
[06:37:24] <mario_> B: EV=20001b
[06:37:25] <mario_> B: KEY=fff0000 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
[06:37:27] <mario_> B: ABS=30027
[06:37:28] <mario_> B: MSC=10
[06:37:30] <mario_> B: FF=1 7030000 0 0
[06:46:41] <r00t4rd3d> wheres your brother luigi ?
[06:47:31] <ReadError> itsa maarrriiio
[06:48:25] <mario_> wollte eigentlich nicht zu Mach3 wechseln, aber mit Linuxcnc komme ich da einfach nicht weiter. Die Docs sind alle in englich und wenn man den Sinn nicht versteht hat das ganze zwecklos.
[06:49:02] <r00t4rd3d> mario, speak english if you want help
[06:49:31] <r00t4rd3d> there is only a couple people here who do german
[06:50:34] <r00t4rd3d> the majority of us here are redneck americans
[06:51:53] <jthornton> yea google translate only goes so far
[06:52:44] <jthornton> we have one chap in France that keeps the French documents translated but no German volunteers have offered to translate to German
[06:53:08] <r00t4rd3d> change all the W's to V's, done.
[06:53:42] <mario_> Übersetzungsprogramme sind Schrott das sie ja nur die Wörter übersetzen aber nicht den Sinn!!!
[06:54:13] <r00t4rd3d> sprechen Sie Englisch, um Hilfsidioten zu erhalten
[06:55:30] <jthornton> yep translation of technical manuals fails unless a human does it
[06:57:14] <mario_> jthornton yep yep (ja genau)
[07:02:52] <r00t4rd3d> 80f today :/
[07:03:05] <mk0_> afaik mahaberler is german speaker
[07:03:13] <mk0_> native
[07:04:39] <mk0_> mario_, Versuchen Sie, mhaberler fragen
[07:05:10] <mk0_> dass er übersetzt
[07:05:33] <mhaberler> nope, busy creating the stuff which should be translated
[07:17:37] <psha> r00t4rd3d: and U to Ü!
[07:23:53] <mario_> r00t4rd3d< That comes out everything in translation: Idiots in Germany is a dirty word for people who have no clue. You understand me?
[07:25:31] <r00t4rd3d> lol dumbass translates to that :D
[07:25:49] <mario_> Google Translater
[07:26:13] <r00t4rd3d> babylon
[07:27:29] <r00t4rd3d> hilfsidioten doesnt even translate back :/
[07:27:54] <JT-Shop> you guys are having too much fun
[07:27:59] <r00t4rd3d> not really
[07:28:50] * r00t4rd3d crawls back to a dark corner
[07:32:49] <mario_> JT-Shop< Fun is different. Is rather sad.
[07:36:26] * jthornton tries to figure out the php error
[07:37:03] <Tom_shop> jt did you get your G10 problem figured out?
[07:37:33] <jthornton> nope it is a bug
[07:40:19] <jthornton> yuck the forum is stuck
[07:40:58] <Tom_itx> is the wiki on a different server from the forum?
[07:41:08] <Tom_itx> i noticed it was quite slow last night
[07:41:18] <Tom_itx> could have been me though
[07:41:19] <jthornton> I don't remember
[07:42:48] <Tom_itx> i was looking at logic or lut5 to redo my spindle logic
[07:42:58] <Tom_itx> not sure those would be appropriate or not
[07:43:16] <jthornton> what does it not do correctly
[07:43:36] <mario_> No one uses the LinuxCNC from Germany. Too bad. I am otherwise very happy with it.
[07:44:09] <jthornton> there are many that use LinuxCNC from Germany but they may not be on the IRC
[07:44:10] <Tom_itx> i'm gonna have to sit down today and figure that out exactly. i think during auto mode it will allow a restart after a pause with the spindle still off
[07:44:26] <Tom_itx> but there may be another condition that axis doesn't like as well
[07:44:42] <Tom_itx> it does seem to hang axis when it happens
[07:44:56] <jthornton> mario_, there is a German section on the forum
[07:45:35] <jthornton> Tom_itx, I'd think that is normal
[07:45:41] <Tom_itx> lately i've just avoided using the spindle button
[07:45:49] <Tom_itx> well axis doesn't like it at all
[07:46:06] <jthornton> a restart with the spindle off?
[07:46:16] <Tom_itx> i think that will trigger it, yes
[07:46:28] <Tom_itx> machine is off atm or i'd check
[07:48:55] <mario_> jthornton< have you been there? An entry of 2010! Not very encouraging
[07:49:17] <Tom_itx> not a restart, but a continue after a pause in auto mode with the spindle off
[07:49:49] <jthornton> mario_, it's worth a shot
[07:50:21] <jthornton> if you can speak Russian there is an active LinuxCNC forum in Russia
[07:51:54] <psha> really active
[07:52:00] <psha> and they also have translated docs :)
[07:52:58] <Tom_itx> or even if i'm in manual mode and using a wiggler to set the x y offsets. turning the spindle on and off there will cause axis to hang and take up to 2 min to save the offset values to the table
[07:54:48] <jthornton> turning the spindle on and off with your pendant?
[07:54:58] <Tom_itx> yes
[07:57:24] <Tom_itx> i wonder if 'toggle' is messing with the logic since it's a push on push off function
[07:58:34] <jthornton> I wouldn't think so, I have coolant set up like that on my lathe and I can use either the Axis check box or the pyvcp button and they stay in sync
[07:59:11] <Tom_itx> pyvcp may be different than a hardware button
[07:59:24] <Tom_itx> i don't know how all the software layers interact
[08:00:24] <jthornton> it should be the same as a hardware button once it gets to hal
[08:08:02] <jthornton> Yea! I fixed my broken php
[08:09:30] <Tom_itx> i'll start on mine after some caffine
[08:10:17] <jthornton> finished my 2 cups
[08:10:27] <jthornton> just waiting on some break fast now
[08:10:43] <Tom_itx> then a mid morning nap?
[08:10:57] <jthornton> might wait till noon
[08:42:59] <r00t4rd3d> life is too short to nap it away
[08:55:08] <pcw_home> crap, another deer stuck in the backyard
[08:58:06] <r00t4rd3d> kill it with a fork
[08:58:07] <jthornton> stuck in the mud?
[08:59:28] <r00t4rd3d> probably jumped his fence and now is too stupid to jump back over
[08:59:52] <pcw_home> Yep
[09:00:16] <r00t4rd3d> i get younger ones trapped some times
[09:00:22] <pcw_home> or forgot where
[09:01:51] <pcw_home> I do not want a repeat performance of what happened last time (let out Charlie, Charlie runs down hill Deer panics and jumps into fence breaking neck)
[09:02:08] <r00t4rd3d> free meat
[09:02:48] <ReadError> how did you know my nickname?
[09:03:32] <pcw_home> I dont like them hanging around either because they bring tics and can catch MCF from the sheep
[09:04:19] <r00t4rd3d> is that a STD?
[09:04:36] <pcw_home> No buts its nasty
[09:04:58] <r00t4rd3d> so your a sheep farmer?
[09:05:26] <r00t4rd3d> and solder up mesa boards on the side
[09:05:36] <pcw_home> we have a little flock for weed abatement
[11:06:15] <Tom_itx> pcw_home, just get a pet tiger
[11:11:46] <pcw_home> that would help with the deer (and sheep ) abatement but then I would be stuck with the weeds again
[11:11:48] <pcw_home> (complete with hungry hungry tiger hiding is said weeds)
[11:33:36] <ktchk> How is the torque of a 6 wire 2 phase motor driver by 1 pulse per step to 2 pulses per step?
[11:45:15] <ktchk> torque of stepper motor 1/2 micro step compare to no microstep
[11:48:57] <cradek> half stepping works much better than full stepping
[11:49:16] <cradek> full stepping has bad resonance problems
[11:49:28] <pcw_home> 1/2 step has a little higher torque but its uneven (more when 2 windings are energized)
[11:50:33] <pcw_home> I think hardly anyone uses full stepping because of the resonance problems
[11:52:32] <pcw_home> Raising the ustep ratio reduces the resonance problem (and noise)
[11:53:35] <ktchk> slow turning need torque so half step is the best?
[11:58:23] <pcw_home> Dont know, full step is probably bad, 1/2 to 1/256 step may be better depending on what your drive can do
[11:58:25] <pcw_home> 1/2 step average torque will be a little bit higher than higher ustep ratios but will suffer more from resonance
[11:59:42] <pcw_home> in other words, try it with your hardware and see :-)
[12:01:19] <ktchk> thanks
[12:01:41] <ktchk> I found
http://www.romanblack.com/stepper.htm
[12:13:34] <ssi_> pcw_home: did you see my mesa/eth0 struggle last night?
[12:20:49] <IchGuckLive> hi all B)
[12:26:21] <pcw_home> No
[12:27:28] <ssi> pcw_home: I have this junky lenovo SFF machine, and it's got a broadcom tg3 onboard ethernet... when I install the 5i25, the ethernet goes away
[12:27:35] <ssi> no longer shows up in lspci
[12:27:54] <ssi> also I can't make the hm2_pci driver load with the '25 in the box
[12:28:10] <ssi> just wondering if you have any sage magic words before I chuck it out the window and drive 2 hours to buy a different machine
[12:30:49] <IchGuckLive> i use IBM or fujitsu mashines there are cheep working and always avaylable
[12:31:34] <ssi> I'm probably going to buy another dell 755, as i just used one and it worked well
[12:31:44] <pcw_home> No idea (I didn't know Lenovo made motherboards)
[12:32:11] <ssi> alright, out the window it goes then :D
[12:32:23] <ssi> I'm hoping microcenter will have some refurb dells in stock
[12:32:24] <IchGuckLive> dell is triky 2 as they manafacture the same number with different parts
[12:32:36] <ssi> if not, I'll have to drive to tigerdirect, and it's maybe 3 hours one way
[12:33:11] <IchGuckLive> ssi: isent there a secondITstore selling with shipmant
[12:33:18] <pcw_home> If its a real incompatibility (and not just bad) I would like to know
[12:33:43] <ssi> pcw_home: ok... let me know what info I can gather for you
[12:34:20] <ssi> pcw_home: also, what state should the LEDs be in on the 5i25 in normal operation?
[12:34:28] <ssi> I get an INIT, /DONE flash, then they go out
[12:34:31] <ssi> which I think is correct
[12:34:32] <ssi> and then no lights
[12:34:35] <pcw_home> off
[12:34:38] <ssi> ok
[12:36:05] <pcw_home> One person had a bad PS and got both on (theres a 3.3V reset chip that needs at least 3.1V or so to get out of reset)
[12:36:39] <pcw_home> what is the broadcom chip PN?
[12:37:13] <ssi> BCM5787
[12:37:33] <ssi> I just put the '25 back in the box
[12:37:47] <generic_nick|2> ouch, hangover
[12:38:00] <ssi> it shows up in lspci as 0a:09.0 DPIO module: Device 2718:5125
[12:38:43] <ssi> now my cursory testing just involves running halcmd, and doing a loadrt hm2_pci config=""
[12:38:46] <ssi> and that fails
[12:38:53] <pcw_home> Hm BCM5787 is PCIE not sure how we can interfere with it unless its maybe a BIOS issue
[12:38:55] <ssi> but maybe I need to do more than that
[12:40:13] <pcw_home> you need to loadrt hostmot2 first
[12:40:26] <ssi> doh right
[12:42:38] <ssi> yeah that worked with less complaining :P
[12:45:08] <ssi> pcw_home: got any details on where there was info about configuring the '25 to drive g540 with a chargepump stepgen?
[12:45:21] <ssi> if I config="", I get stepgens 0-3, and 5-9
[12:45:36] <ssi> and it looks like 9 is an output only (no dir), and that's supposed to be the chargepump one
[12:45:42] <ssi> but I'd rather only have 0-3 and 9, and I'm not sure how to do that
[12:47:51] <pcw_home> you want to enable 5 stepgens (0 through 4)
[12:48:40] <pcw_home> 4 should be the chargpump one
[12:48:42] <pcw_home> (what does dmesg say)
[12:48:46] <ssi> looks that way
[12:48:51] <ssi> #4 has no direction line
[12:49:05] <ssi> and I seem to have gotten a pair of encoders out of the deal too
[12:49:08] <ssi> which I don't need...
[12:49:16] <pcw_home> right it for chargepump use
[12:49:21] <pcw_home> its
[12:49:27] <ssi> yeah... excellent
[12:49:34] <ssi> how does it know I don't want five full stepgens?
[12:49:44] <ssi> I guess it assumes in the g540 firmware that I know what I'm talking about
[12:50:05] <pcw_home> you will have 5 stepgens
[12:50:07] <IchGuckLive> pcw_home: does the 2.5.2 lnuxcnc now got the driver and pin fpr the 5i25 7i76 card
[12:50:29] <IchGuckLive> or still neded sidepackets
[12:50:33] <pcw_home> it has since 2.5.0
[12:50:48] <pcw_home> other than pncconf
[12:51:40] <generic_nick|2> is it normal for my pid values to be like 2,1,.005 on my 4th axis when the same motor and drive was 140.90, and 4 on my x,y, and z axes?
[12:51:42] <IchGuckLive> o
[12:51:55] <ssi> there we go... thanks pcw :D
[12:52:11] <pcw_home> Yes if you don t normalize the PID
[12:52:31] <generic_nick|2> i assume the pid values are related to the unit of measure, tight? so being in degrees instead of inches?
[12:53:05] <pcw_home> Yes
[12:54:01] <generic_nick|2> gotcha
[12:54:15] <pcw_home> You normalize the PID in linear axis by setting the PWM/DAC scale to machine units per second
[12:55:00] <generic_nick|2> should i do that, or does it not really matter?
[12:55:34] <pcw_home> probably need to set the PWM/DAC scale to degrees per second on a rotary axis but thats a WAG
[12:55:52] <generic_nick|2> it's being somewhat of a pain to tune...
[12:56:33] <generic_nick|2> WAG?
[12:56:51] <pcw_home> it does not matter, just makes it easier to guess PID values with inch/mm/degree axis
[12:56:59] <generic_nick|2> gotcha
[12:57:03] <pcw_home> Wild Assed Guess
[12:57:06] <generic_nick|2> ah
[12:57:49] <generic_nick|2> when the servo comes to a stop, it kinda occilates to a stop
[12:58:20] <pcw_home> If you dont normalize for example a machine in MM will have 25x lower PID gains
[12:58:21] <generic_nick|2> like it overcorrects a bunch of times, but a little less each time
[12:58:42] <pcw_home> Velocity or torque mode?
[12:59:09] <generic_nick|2> hmm good question, i dont recall. the drives are digital and you change that in the software
[12:59:25] <generic_nick|2> ill have to find the serial cable and download the software to check it
[12:59:46] <pcw_home> makes a big difference to how the LinuxCNC side tuning is done
[12:59:53] <IchGuckLive> have a nice sunday im off BY
[13:00:00] <generic_nick|2> the motor on my 4th axis is the old motor and drive from my x axis
[13:00:47] <generic_nick|2> it had a decent tune, but then i swapped the 7i33 out for the 7i48 and everything changed
[13:02:34] <generic_nick|2> ill go dig up the cable and try and find the software again
[13:03:14] <generic_nick|2> there are pid gains in the drives as well, changed via software
[13:15:52] <generic_nick|2> found the cable, but i sure wish i had a computer with a serial port lol
[13:21:41] <Tom_itx> would a typo like this: "toggle.0.in < or2.0.out" instead of the <= cause the toggle input not to work or is the < included as an alternate assignment symbol?
[13:22:12] <Tom_itx> it seemed to work but maybe it was just dumb luck
[13:22:30] <pcw_home> none of the <,=, or > do anything
[13:22:57] <Tom_itx> maybe i found my glitch then
[13:23:25] <pcw_home> they are just dropped by the hal file parser
[13:23:41] <Tom_itx> it seemed to be working with the typo
[13:24:30] <pcw_home> yes, none of those characters affect anything
[13:24:31] <generic_nick|2> i never use the arrows
[13:25:07] <pcw_home> They are just for readability for oomans
[13:25:26] <Tom_itx> the = was missing
[13:25:40] <pcw_home> makes 0 difference
[13:25:43] <Tom_itx> ok
[13:25:59] <Tom_itx> how does it determine what to assign to what then?
[13:26:22] <Tom_itx> i realize the .in is obviously an input..
[13:26:27] <pcw_home> by the pin direction
[13:26:33] <generic_nick|2> same way electricity does
[13:26:36] <pcw_home> (hal pin property)
[13:26:40] <Tom_itx> yeah
[13:26:41] <Tom_itx> ok
[13:26:54] <Tom_itx> even if the order is mixed up in the hal line?
[13:27:03] <generic_nick|2> dont think that matters
[13:27:07] <Tom_itx> it seems to work it out
[13:27:10] <pcw_home> order is unimportant
[13:27:28] <pcw_home> (except first is signal name)
[13:27:32] <Tom_itx> right
[13:27:52] <generic_nick|2> the <= are not diodes lol
[13:27:58] <Tom_itx> i should keep looking for bugs then
[13:28:55] <pcw_home> with the right foo you could take the output of halcmd show pin and munge it into a gedit tag file
[13:28:58] <pcw_home> so outputs, inputs, parameters and pins where all colorized
[13:29:23] <pcw_home> s/where/are/
[13:30:07] <pcw_home> (for your specific config)
[13:30:54] <Tom_itx> well i'm working on a spindle issue with my pendant
[13:32:41] <pcw_home> BBL
[13:32:42] <pcw_home> Cant believe I need a coat on to go outside, it was in the 80's last week
[13:33:02] <Tom_itx> yep we've had similar weather here
[13:33:14] <Tom_itx> had a bit of sleet a couple days ago
[13:33:24] <Tom_itx> before that it was 70f
[13:42:10] <pcw_home> well I was going to do some gardening but its raining now :-(
[13:42:24] <generic_nick|2> i went to the beach yesterday, it was nice out lol
[13:42:39] <generic_nick|2> a little overcast right now, but still warm
[13:49:58] <L84Supper> pcw_home: are you going to make the cnc fest?
[13:52:21] <generic_nick|2> where is it this year?
[13:53:13] <L84Supper> Wichita
[13:53:33] <generic_nick|2> middle of nowhere again lol
[13:54:48] <L84Supper> I've never been to one
[13:54:58] <generic_nick|2> me neither
[13:58:34] <pcw_home> L84Supper: I plan to
[14:05:38] <generic_nick|2> so the input scale on my 4th axis is like 682.6666666666666666666666666666666666666. any way to make the .666666 infinite so i dont have accuracy issues?
[14:08:28] <Gamma-x> Today I believe I will make my ps3 controller become my pendant...
[14:10:48] <cradek> generic_nick|2: no, and it doesn't matter at all in any practical sense
[14:12:13] <generic_nick|2> cradek: thanks.
[14:13:05] <Gamma-x> there a good program to turn pcb files into gcode?
[14:13:53] <generic_nick|2> i suppose i should try to dig up my serial to usb adapter so i can tune my servo
[14:14:24] <generic_nick|2> if i still have it that is.
[14:25:28] <Loetmichel> Gamma-x: target 3001
[14:25:31] <Loetmichel> ;-)
[14:26:08] <Loetmichel> ... whcih is a pcb design program. but with internal gcode export
[14:26:14] <Loetmichel> and a good one, too
[14:27:01] <Gamma-x> oh nice!
[14:27:22] <Gamma-x> next question.... is there a guide to hooking up an external controller such as a ps3 controller to use as a pendant?
[14:30:57] <cradek> people use all sorts of usb-connected game controllers
[14:31:13] <pcw_home> OK flight booked
[14:31:21] <cradek> yay
[14:34:45] <Tom_itx> wonder how many are coming for the whole week
[14:42:26] <mrsun> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YB3hVK1WTE&feature=fvwp&NR=1 how to destroy a shaper? :P
[14:42:27] <Tecan> (2YB3hVK1WTE) "Deutz Standmotor mit Hobelmaschine - Stationary Engine" by "Bidone1967" is "Tech" - Length: 0:04:31
[14:42:34] <mrsun> shouldnt that stroke be fixed and not intermittent? :P
[14:46:00] <JT-Shop> does a ps3 device even speak pc?
[14:53:59] <syyl_ws_> thats more like a hitnmiss shaper, mrsun ;)
[14:54:10] <mrsun> =)
[14:54:24] <mrsun> looks like they have tightened things up at the end but still :P
[15:18:03] <JT-Shop> I should be doing something but can't think of what it might be
[15:55:53] <generic_nick|2> cant seem to get the 4th axis tuned very good.
[16:08:22] <pcw_home> may need the drive tuned (if its in velocity mode)
[16:09:25] <pcw_home> a rotary axis probably has very low inertia so will be tough to tune in torque mode
[16:09:53] <generic_nick|2> i can rotate the servo about 10 degrees without any resistance from the servo
[16:10:01] <generic_nick|2> or at least very little resistance
[16:10:18] <generic_nick|2> after that it starts fighting back
[16:10:57] <pcw_home> Sounds like the drive is either in torque mode, or the gain is too low
[16:11:37] <generic_nick|2> i cant change the mode like i thought i could in the drive
[16:11:51] <pcw_home> Torque mode only?
[16:11:55] <generic_nick|2> i dunno
[16:12:02] <generic_nick|2> i cant use ff2 at all
[16:12:12] <generic_nick|2> i can put in a little ff1
[16:12:20] <generic_nick|2> doesnt do much though
[16:12:46] <cradek> if it's velocity mode it should feel stiff without ANY help from the position loop
[16:12:46] <pcw_home> Sounds like the drive setup is wrong
[16:13:05] <cradek> yeah
[16:13:23] <generic_nick|2> the drive has preconfigured setups for the motor
[16:13:33] <generic_nick|2> i just select the motor in the dropdown menu
[16:13:44] <cradek> does it have a tach?
[16:13:50] <generic_nick|2> nope, resolver
[16:13:58] <generic_nick|2> resolver goes to the drive
[16:14:36] <generic_nick|2> no hals or tach
[16:15:17] <pcw_home> At the minimum you need to know what mode the drive is in
[16:16:25] <pcw_home> lots of AC drives have velocity mode without tachs
[16:18:15] <generic_nick|2> i cant find any info on the mode
[16:18:48] <pcw_home> the tuning procedure on the linuxCNC side is completely different for the two modes
[16:20:08] <generic_nick|2> i dont know how to tell, there is nothing in the manual about the mode
[16:20:16] <cradek> is the manual online?
[16:20:24] <DJ9DJ> gn8
[16:21:46] <generic_nick|2> it says it can be torque or velocity mode, but i cant find how to change it
[16:21:58] <generic_nick|2> http://www.control-drive.com/Products/Servo_Drives/Danaher/PACIFIC_SCIENTIFIC_Servo_Drives.pdf
[16:22:05] <generic_nick|2> pc3400
[16:22:14] <generic_nick|2> more of a brochure, trying to find the manual
[16:23:09] <cradek> what motor model?
[16:23:50] <generic_nick|2> pmb33e-00200-00
[16:25:32] <cradek> Analog +-10V interface -- velocity or torque control
[16:28:01] <generic_nick|2> yea, i just dont see how to change it
[16:28:47] <generic_nick|2> ah i think i fingered it out
[16:28:50] <cradek> yeah I agree it doesn't say in here
[16:29:34] <mhaberler> ssi: around?
[16:30:34] <generic_nick|2> i think i got it cradek
[16:30:58] <generic_nick|2> huh wait a minute, it keeps changing back
[16:32:20] <generic_nick|2> ok got it
[16:32:29] <generic_nick|2> it had to be disabled first
[16:32:46] <generic_nick|2> it is now in velocity mode
[16:33:31] <cradek> does it feel stiff?
[16:34:21] <generic_nick|2> it did
[16:34:34] <generic_nick|2> then it started overcorrecting and it ferrored
[16:35:00] <cradek> set your linuxcnc tuning to all zeroes and see if it feels right
[16:35:39] <cradek> it shouldn't oscillate or otherwise freak out, it should just feel solid
[16:35:48] <generic_nick|2> it's creeping
[16:35:54] <cradek> that's ok
[16:36:10] <generic_nick|2> felt stiff in the one direction that it wasnt creeping in
[16:36:11] <cradek> there's probably a balance adjustment you can use to make it (nearly) stop
[16:37:23] <generic_nick|2> there's a setting for "required velocity command at that voltage (10v)"
[16:37:41] <generic_nick|2> im guessing that should be the max rpm of the motor?
[16:38:01] <generic_nick|2> to start anyways?
[16:39:37] <cradek> do you want your rotary table to turn that fast?
[16:39:52] <cradek> you should scale it so you're using 8-9v for your desired rapid speed
[16:40:30] <generic_nick|2> gotcha. yea, i want ot to spin as fast as possible (doing mass production work, every second counts)
[16:40:45] <cradek> then I guess so
[16:41:06] <cradek> rotaries don't have much mass so you can probably spin it pretty fast
[16:41:46] <generic_nick|2> yea
[16:44:30] <generic_nick|2> should i reduce the gains in the drive so i can add some in emc?
[16:44:54] <cradek> which gains are you talking about?
[16:45:34] <cradek> you should make the velocity response as stiff as possible without oscillation, and balance it, before you do ANY position mode tuning
[16:46:01] <generic_nick|2> position loop gain, damping, feedforward gain, and response
[16:46:16] <cradek> the numbers don't add or anything like that -- every loop depends on the loop(s) underneath to be tuned
[16:46:51] <cradek> pretty sure the drive doesn't even have a position loop in this mode...??
[16:47:32] <generic_nick|2> it has settings for it lol
[16:47:44] <generic_nick|2> but yea, doesnt make sense
[16:47:46] <cradek> well I've never seen this hardware, but that seems wrong
[16:48:02] <cradek> the drive might have step/dir mode option or something?
[16:48:53] <generic_nick|2> yes, and it's programable
[16:49:15] <cradek> guessing position loop tuning only applies to that setup, then
[16:49:23] <cradek> guessing :-)
[16:50:35] <generic_nick|2> it doesnt oscillate and it holds well
[16:51:19] <cradek> did you get it balanced so it is pretty much stopped when your dac output is 0?
[16:51:56] <generic_nick|2> no, there is no setting for bias
[16:52:08] <cradek> hmm weird
[16:52:31] <cradek> as long as it's minor the position loop will hold it, but you'll see minor dithering
[16:52:50] <cradek> no problem
[16:53:11] <generic_nick|2> yea i put .05 in p and it's holding fine
[16:53:19] <cradek> go ahead and work on tuning in linuxcnc now, it'll be P and FF1
[16:53:29] <cradek> yay, now you're on your way
[16:53:46] <cradek> nice to tune rotaries because they don't have ends of travel
[16:54:45] <generic_nick|2> haha i know, i love that part. no runaway table
[16:54:52] <generic_nick|2> thanks for the help.
[16:55:10] <generic_nick|2> it's spinning at 9000 degrees per minute so far, no problem
[16:55:13] <cradek> welcome
[16:56:05] <generic_nick|2> gunna bump up the velocity in the ini and see how close i can get to 50rpm
[16:56:30] <generic_nick|2> which is the max speed that the motor will push it due to gear reduction
[16:56:50] <cradek> hope you've got oil in your rotary table...
[16:57:33] <cradek> bbl
[16:57:37] <generic_nick|2> yep lol
[16:57:39] <generic_nick|2> adios
[17:22:33] <generic_nick|2> is the angle supposed to increase past 360 degrees as the rotary spins? or is it supposed to loop back to zero? not sure what the "standard" is.
[17:24:20] <SWPadnos> there's an option with the words "wrapped rotary" in it, which sets the wrap-around mode
[17:25:10] <generic_nick|2> cool ill look into it, thanks.
[17:25:17] <SWPadnos> in any case, I believe that if you do a single move that does multiple rotations, the angle will go past 360 (something like G1 X10 A3600 to do 10 turns of a 1 unit pitch screw)
[17:25:41] <generic_nick|2> should i just leave it as is?
[17:25:53] <generic_nick|2> not sure what most machines generally do
[17:25:53] <SWPadnos> no idea. I don't know how it is or how you want it :)
[17:26:29] <cradek> haha
[17:26:39] <generic_nick|2> lol
[17:26:51] <generic_nick|2> fair enough
[17:28:10] <generic_nick|2> seems like i got it tuned enough to run
[17:28:52] <cradek> I bet only AXIS has full support for wrapped rotary mode
[17:29:09] <cradek> the motion will be right, but I bet all the other guis will have incorrect DROs
[17:31:29] <generic_nick|2> found it
[17:31:35] <generic_nick|2> cool
[17:51:25] <GammaX-Shop> Hey all
[18:17:41] <generic_nick|2> hi
[18:20:10] <JT-Shop> hi
[18:25:07] <r00t4rd3d> why
[18:25:39] <jdh> because we like you!
[19:05:45] <GammaX-Shop> what are some normal type numbers for velocity and acceleration for steppers? Im having a VERY hard time tuning this
[19:07:04] <ssi> depends on the machine :P
[19:07:06] <ssi> what values do you have now?
[19:07:19] <GammaX-Shop> also it is not accurate at all and I put in all the information as per specs... leadscrew pitch 5.05
[19:07:29] <ssi> mhaberler: I'm back!
[19:07:35] <GammaX-Shop> step per rev 200, microstepping .5
[19:07:43] <mhaberler> hi ssi
[19:07:50] <ssi> hey
[19:07:55] <mhaberler> saw you question on kernel headers
[19:08:16] <GammaX-Shop> pulley 1-1, velocity 4 accell 75
[19:08:21] <ssi> oh right... I was asking because a lot of the OMAP_MUX defines are in headers in the kernel source
[19:08:25] <mhaberler> the userland threads flavors - (xenomai, rtpreempt) dont need them
[19:08:26] <ssi> and it'd be convenient not to have to recreate them
[19:08:52] <GammaX-Shop> im in test mode and told it to do a back and fworth 1 inch but it only goes about half an inch...
[19:09:25] <GammaX-Shop> 2 and a half turns maby?
[19:10:54] <mhaberler> you mean the port addresses are accessible only if you install kernel headers? I remember something similar with the rpi
[19:11:02] <ssi> mhaberler: no, that's not the case
[19:11:19] <ssi> mhaberler: I mean I have a bunch of defines with the register addresses in them
[19:11:20] <mhaberler> oh, ok
[19:11:26] <ssi> mhaberler: but those are already defined somewhere in kernel source
[19:11:46] <ssi> was just thinking that if linuxcnc already builds with kernel headers on the include path, I could eliminate some of that duplication
[19:11:49] <mhaberler> good enough for a start, we can get clever later
[19:11:52] <ssi> sure
[19:12:30] <GammaX-Shop> ssi: any thoughts on my situation?
[19:13:01] <mhaberler> so I understand you're coming to wichita too?
[19:13:14] <ssi> GammaX-Shop put in the numbers as you think they should be, and then jog the axis and measure the actual vs expected jog
[19:13:20] <ssi> do some math and correct the steps/inch
[19:13:23] <ssi> mhaberler: I'm going to try
[19:13:28] <mhaberler> super
[19:14:09] <GammaX-Shop> ssi: yeah im in the process of that now...
[19:14:52] <ssi> but that doesn't have anything to do with velocity/accel
[19:15:48] <GammaX-Shop> ssi: 2 problems.
[19:16:06] <GammaX-Shop> trying to fig our perfect vel accell and 2nd is my pitch must be off
[19:17:19] <ssi> get the pitch right first
[19:17:21] <ssi> set vel/accel low
[19:17:27] <ssi> 1ips, 2i/s/s
[19:17:59] <GammaX-Shop> the pitch is killing me. idk how its messed up at 5...
[19:18:19] <GammaX-Shop> motor steps per rev is 200... 1.8degree motor...
[19:18:50] <ssi> mhaberler: just sent you ssh key details
[19:18:57] <GammaX-Shop> i and i set the pitch to 5 as I put a caliper on there and 5 revolutions brings me to an inch
[19:19:02] <mhaberler> ah, good
[19:19:20] <ssi> 200 steps per rev, 5 revs per inch, is 1000 steps per inch
[19:19:26] <ssi> times your microstepping gives you pps
[19:19:32] <ssi> er, pulses per inch
[19:19:46] <ssi> mhaberler: I need to get to where I can build linuxcnc on the beagle
[19:19:59] <ssi> you said --with-threads=posix --enable-drivers right?
[19:20:00] <mhaberler> oh
[19:20:20] <mhaberler> using 3.8 vanilla, yes
[19:20:39] <mhaberler> add --with-platform=bb
[19:21:13] <mhaberler> it wont compile hal_gpio.c because thats rpi, but you'll find that easily in the Submakefile
[19:21:53] <ssi> thats fine
[19:22:01] <ssi> I was planning on actually starting with a hal_bb_gpio for now
[19:22:02] <GammaX-Shop> fixed it
[19:22:09] <ssi> and eventually we can merge them and make it autodetect based on platform
[19:22:10] <ssi> or whatever
[19:22:28] <GammaX-Shop> might need MICRO adjustments in terms or making pitch 10.008 or something.
[19:22:53] <ssi> GammaX-Shop: once you have everything running well, jog across the whole table
[19:22:54] <ssi> 30" or so
[19:22:58] <ssi> and measure your actual vs expected
[19:23:03] <ssi> actually you probably can't measure 30" accurately
[19:23:09] <ssi> jog the full distance of what you can measure accurately
[19:23:19] <ssi> 1" for an indicator or whatever
[19:24:23] <GammaX-Shop> i can say run 20 inches from one side and check the number values attached to the turning handle to see how far off it is?
[19:24:33] <ssi> sure
[19:24:48] <ssi> btw gamma, I bought an optiplex 320 today at microcenter for $129
[19:24:57] <ssi> so I can throw that lenovo piece of shit out the window :D
[19:26:43] <GammaX-Shop> you said youd ship me it for free! hahaha
[19:27:04] <ssi> shipping will cost you more than buying one locally :P
[19:31:46] <GammaX-Shop> is it core 2 duo mb?
[19:32:17] <ssi> dunno
[19:32:28] <ssi> it's a lenovo 8808-94U
[19:41:11] <GammaX-Shop> ssi: when it says max acell in / s2 does that mean s squared?
[19:46:18] <ssi> inches per second per second
[19:46:35] <ssi> yes, s squared
[19:48:35] <GammaX-Shop> ok
[19:48:37] <GammaX-Shop> gotcha thanks
[19:49:16] <GammaX-Shop> gonna be fun setting up modbus tomorow
[20:27:08] <ssi> hey pete
[20:27:32] <ssi> JT-Shop: around?
[20:46:40] <PetefromTn> hey man...sorry for delay taking out garbage LOL
[20:46:47] <ssi> no problem :)
[20:49:18] <ssi> I guess I get to do something fun like write a hal/ini configuration from scratch
[20:49:22] <ssi> weeee
[20:49:30] <PetefromTn> hehe..
[20:52:18] <andypugh> I wouldn't suggest doing the INI from scratch, it's easier to start wth a close-enough sample config.
[20:52:28] <PetefromTn> Hadta buy a new refridgerator today YIPPEE!!
[20:52:51] <andypugh> HAL from scratch is easier, but even then starting with a sample config is likely to save some time.
[20:53:41] <ssi> yea I'll probably start from a sample
[20:53:51] <ssi> do you know offhand if any of the sample configs have a slaved stepper axis?
[20:54:01] <ssi> this is for my plasma table, and the gantry X axis has two slaved motors
[20:54:50] <andypugh> sim/stepper/ganrty
[20:54:55] <ssi> cool thanks
[20:55:16] <andypugh> And on that note, goodnight all.
[21:19:45] <ssi> haha latency numbers on the bbb are ridiculous
[21:19:57] <ssi> 3.3ms
[21:20:16] <ssi> I guess not surprising with a vanilla kernel :)
[21:29:51] <r00t4rd3d> bbb?
[21:30:08] <ssi> beaglebone black
[21:31:57] <skunkworks> did we get a beaglebone black xenomi kernel yet?
[21:32:00] <tjb1> r00t4rd3d?
[21:32:05] <r00t4rd3d> ?
[21:32:19] <ssi> skunkworks: mhaberler is working on it... he thinks it'll be soon
[21:32:32] <tjb1> you making your mill wider or did you just order a huge extrusion?
[21:32:38] <skunkworks> neat -- I have not been following the mailing list that close
[21:32:45] <ssi> I'm working on a general gpio driver now
[21:32:46] <r00t4rd3d> wider and longer
[21:33:42] <tjb1> so basically rebuilding the whole thing?
[21:33:44] <r00t4rd3d> 2x4
[21:33:50] <r00t4rd3d> yeagh
[21:36:35] <tjb1> add a print head
[21:51:43] <PetefromTn> ..
[21:53:22] <ssi> yea?
[21:55:30] <PetefromTn> yeah wut?
[21:55:34] <ssi> yeah!
[21:55:51] <PetefromTn> my browser sometimes does not seem to lock on until I do that..
[21:56:22] <PetefromTn> just finished cleaning the sight window glass for my coolant troughs.
[22:01:23] <ssi> sweet
[22:10:47] <Valen> PetefromTn: install xchat ;-.
[22:11:07] <ssi> any developers on that know what magic words I have to say to get my new hal driver to start being built by the make system? :P
[22:12:35] <Valen> perhaps look in the make file?
[22:13:01] <ssi> gosh I hadn't thought of that :P
[22:13:50] <Valen> glad i could help ;-P
[22:13:59] <ssi> aha I think I know what I have to do
[22:14:40] <PetefromTn> using Quassel
[22:18:31] <ssi> ergh it's still not picking it up
[22:27:07] <ssi> yeah this isn't working... I hate makefiles so much
[22:27:11] <ssi> and these aren't exactly simple ones
[22:27:11] <ssi> :(
[22:31:50] <ssi> oh well, at least I have scotch
[22:42:12] <ssi> hm maybe it is working
[22:42:13] <ssi> heh
[22:44:34] <GammaX> Hey guys, Anyone use a hardinge varigrip?
[22:44:54] <GammaX> ssi everything workin now on your new pc?
[22:45:43] <ssi> yep!
[22:45:58] <ssi> not sure I'd be 100% thrilled with the latency numbers if I were software stepping
[22:46:02] <ssi> but I'm not, so nyah
[22:49:13] <tjb1> r00t4rd3d:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/fdo76zf0qw3zmvc/2013-05-02%2018.00.27.jpg
[22:49:43] <GammaX> ssi what kinda 5c closer do you have on your system?
[22:49:50] <ssi> GammaX: stock
[22:50:11] <GammaX> theres 2 on ebay im thinkin about picking up if they dont get crazy
[22:50:14] <ssi> tjb1: mine:
https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-frc1/577596_10100133843429202_1708616203_n.jpg
[22:50:36] <tjb1> ssi: which is that?
[22:50:45] <ssi> my own variation of the rostock
[22:50:52] <tjb1> very nice looking
[22:50:54] <ssi> thx
[22:50:58] <tjb1> done yet?
[22:51:02] <ssi> nah
[22:51:13] <ssi> I haven't bothered to put a bed or extruder on it yet
[22:51:16] <ssi> it's been sitting in my cube at work
[22:51:20] <ssi> mostly a conversation piece :)
[22:51:27] <tjb1> I just upgraded mine to an airtripper
[22:51:27] <ssi> there's a second one of my design floating around
[22:51:32] <ssi> my friend charles bought it from me
[22:51:33] <ssi> and his runs
[22:51:45] <ssi> also I noticed the reel rollers in your photo
[22:51:51] <ssi> wonder if they're the original or my updated model :P
[22:51:55] <ssi> http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:26931
[22:51:56] <ssi> haha
[22:52:08] <tjb1> http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:21435
[22:52:41] <tjb1> ah, counterbores….I need that
[22:52:45] <ssi> hahah :D
[22:53:16] <tjb1> I am waiting on my new acrylic bed so I can go without a heated bed
[22:53:43] <ssi> charles is supposed to be waterjet cutting me an acrylic bed for mine
[22:53:47] <ssi> or aluminum maybe
[22:53:52] <ssi> he has a techshop near him, lucky bastard
[22:54:03] <tjb1> I am going to try to print direct on the acrylic with hairspray or oil in between
[22:54:54] <tjb1> I have corner warp issues with blue tape
[22:55:06] <tjb1> but I cant get the damn parts off when done....
[22:55:15] <ssi> I use PET tape
[22:55:19] <ssi> and I've been very happy with it
[22:55:21] <ssi> and heat
[22:55:23] <tjb1> PLA?
[22:55:27] <ssi> ABS mostly b
[22:55:30] <ssi> but PLA works too
[22:56:08] <tjb1> I am trying to get away from the heated bed
[22:56:19] <tjb1> takes so long and usually isnt much better
[22:56:48] <ssi> two tips
[22:56:51] <ssi> 1: flip it over
[22:56:56] <ssi> traces up, much more heat per unit power
[22:57:00] <ssi> 2: insulate the bottom
[22:57:09] <ssi> no sense heating the air under the machine
[22:57:15] <tjb1> I only have to go to 55 though :P
[22:57:23] <tjb1> I could never wait for it to hit 100
[22:57:30] <ssi> mine hits 110 in a couple minutes
[22:59:03] <tjb1> You use like repetier or marlin?
[22:59:09] <ssi> marlin
[22:59:09] <tjb1> Or are you running linuxcnc
[22:59:13] <ssi> although I've been using repetier host
[22:59:27] <ssi> nah haven't tried using linuxcnc for printers yet
[22:59:30] <tjb1> I run repetier everything
[22:59:32] <ssi> more work than it's worth probably
[22:59:40] <ssi> on what hardware, ramps?
[22:59:44] <tjb1> The LCD move commands support delta movement
[22:59:46] <tjb1> ramps 1.4
[23:00:01] <ssi> if I get back into the delta, I might try to get your firmware
[23:00:06] <tjb1> Using an LCD with marlin and moving z only moved the z motor
[23:00:30] <ssi> I had johann's marlin patch working on the delta, and I had motion that worked ok
[23:00:47] <ssi> linuxcnc might be fun for the delta... is there a deltakins already written?
[23:01:29] <tjb1> The motion works just not when being controlled by an LCD
[23:01:38] <ssi> oh I see what you're saying
[23:01:55] <Valen> we might add a print head to our router
[23:02:09] <ssi> I want to add a spotdrill/engraving spindle to my plasma table
[23:16:09] <ssi> hrm
[23:40:54] <ssi> Loaded HAL Components:
[23:40:55] <ssi> ID Type Name PID State 32770 RT hal_bb_gpio ready
[23:40:58] <ssi> OOOOOOO
