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[00:11:11] <t12> can you limit a pneumatic die grinders top speed by limiting air flow or pressure?
[00:20:15] <L84Supper> yes, if they are pneumatic
[00:44:25] <LeelooMinai> When they write "rails are not supported" what does that mean?
[00:44:40] <LeelooMinai> Or "unsupported rails"
[00:52:58] <LeelooMinai> Ok, never mind - asked in ##electronics and they knew:p
[01:34:43] <sadara> for our applicatioin, in general if you want to cut anything, unsupported rails = bad
[01:40:30] <LeelooMinai> Right, I found some more info and I get an idea now that the whole axis just hangs on them which seems to be bad...
[01:42:14] <sadara> rigidity suffers a lot, esp for long axis
[01:42:29] <LeelooMinai> Would a 400-something oz-inch stepper be sufficient if I wanted to do some light aluminum-cutting work (light in the sense, not too many items, and not some crazy speeds.)
[01:42:31] <LeelooMinai> ?
[01:43:19] <LeelooMinai> I can see bigger ones, but they seem to be monstrious... like 1600
[01:43:36] <LeelooMinai> monstrous*
[01:43:47] <sadara> What is your motion? Ballscrew?
[01:43:51] <LeelooMinai> Yes
[01:44:00] <sadara> lead?
[01:44:36] <LeelooMinai> Well, I am buying the stuff - I see they have 10 turns per inch mostly... but there may be some options
[01:45:04] <sadara> 2.54mm.... wow, what dia?
[01:45:12] <LeelooMinai> 16mm
[01:45:37] <LeelooMinai> Well, actually, it just saus lead 10
[01:45:39] <LeelooMinai> says
[01:45:45] <LeelooMinai> So maybe that is metric
[01:45:59] <sadara> thats more like it
[01:46:34] <sadara> 2.54 mm lead, 400oz inch(2.82Nm) = 640kilograms force
[01:47:00] <sadara> 10 mm lead, 400oz inch(2.82Nm) = 160kilograms force
[01:47:02] <LeelooMinai> Which I presume is a lot?
[01:47:12] <LeelooMinai> Not sure what force I want for aluminum cuts
[01:47:46] <sadara> both allowing for 90% ballscrew efficiency
[01:47:51] <LeelooMinai> I would also want more precisions than speed
[01:48:23] <sadara> 1500 pounds or 350 pounds respectivly
[01:48:42] <LeelooMinai> 640kg sounds scary:)
[01:49:23] <LeelooMinai> I mostly want to make sure I don't buy mismatched stepper
[01:49:44] <sadara> with a 10mm ballscrew, and a 200 step / rev stepper, your looking at 2 thou
[01:49:52] <LeelooMinai> From what I see 200-something are most popular, 400 more expensive, and 1600 are some nema34 monsters
[01:50:09] <LeelooMinai> Yes, 2 though is ok - that's like 10um
[01:50:25] <sadara> Pick metric or imperial
[01:50:38] <sadara> these unit conversions are annoying
[01:51:05] <LeelooMinai> Mm, actually - 1 mil is 25 um and 1 mm is 40 mil
[01:51:34] <LeelooMinai> So 2 mil is 50 um - that's not so great
[01:51:56] <sadara> ok, so you can microstep or pick a smaller leadscrew
[01:51:59] <LeelooMinai> If I want more precision, what am I looking for? Smaller lead?
[01:52:03] * sadara picks metric
[01:52:55] <LeelooMinai> Right... but I presume microstepping is not as good as direct angle to linear conversion?
[01:54:08] <LeelooMinai> The mostors sometimes come with sets of drivers - I see a lot of some Chinese Wentai brand - are they acceptable, or will they explode:), or cause problems with cnc software?
[01:54:34] <LeelooMinai> I can also make my own pcbs, but not sure if it's worth the effort
[01:54:47] <sadara> it depends what your trying to do, lower lead = more torque, but less speed
[01:55:11] <sadara> stepper drives are cheap, and they are almost all the same
[01:55:25] <LeelooMinai> http://www.aliexpress.com/item/USA-Ship-Free-Ship-to-USA-3-Axis-Nema23-Wantai-Stepper-Motor-425oz-3-0A-driver/696969706.html
[01:55:30] <LeelooMinai> They look like this
[01:55:46] <LeelooMinai> They can do 128 microstepp apparently
[01:55:58] <LeelooMinai> I presume that they will be compatible with linux cnc software
[01:56:13] <sadara> emc2 yes
[01:56:36] <LeelooMinai> Also, why is there so many people here, and no one ever talks?
[01:56:44] <sadara> you will still need a parallel
[01:56:55] <sadara> It's cause they are all retarded ;)
[01:57:24] <sadara> Most ppl are either afk or monitoring
[01:57:27] <LeelooMinai> It's a bit weird... I thought CNC got popular in recent years
[01:57:40] <sadara> yeah, but IRC less so
[01:58:15] <sadara> it is a bit like been in a library, lots of ppl, no talking
[01:58:40] <LeelooMinai> Well, it's my first CNC - I will probably make some mistakes, but the parts are not cheap, so I don't want to make too big mistakes:)
[01:58:51] <sadara> everyone is studing or working on there own thing, the only reason I answered is I'm waiting on a FEM to finish
[01:59:10] <LeelooMinai> Right, lucky me...
[01:59:14] <sadara> If this is your first CNC, don't try to aim to do steel
[01:59:31] <sadara> even ali will be difficult
[01:59:32] <LeelooMinai> Aluminum - mostly small pieces though
[02:00:28] <LeelooMinai> My plan is to buy those rail/ballscew sets and motor/driver from China/aliexpress and then build some stiff frame from parts I can get locally, as they are too have to order
[02:00:32] <sadara> size is not an issue, for a hobby project, you can always machine light cuts, but even ligth cuts in steel will stress most hobby machines
[02:01:01] <LeelooMinai> Well, steel is stell... I do not plan on doing that - aluminum is much softer
[02:01:33] <sadara> what material are you planning on using for your frame?
[02:01:46] <LeelooMinai> All aluminum I think
[02:01:53] <LeelooMinai> Extrusions
[02:02:22] <sadara> I'm currently building a machine from concreate, polystyrene and fibreglass
[02:02:40] <LeelooMinai> Are you sure that it's CNC, not a house? :p
[02:03:35] <LeelooMinai> Though I saw some people making tables from concrete...
[02:03:41] <sadara> yeah, i know. but believe it or not, it should be able to do steel, and faster than a steel frame router
[02:04:09] <sadara> Just using it as a suggestion, don't limit yourself to ali construction
[02:05:06] <LeelooMinai> It seems to have good balance of stiffness/price... fibreglass seems a bit exotic (I have bike frame made of carbon though - I know it can be stiff:)
[02:05:57] <sadara> for your first router, you can build from plywood/mdf/lumber and then upgrade each part to ali as you understand its function
[02:06:55] <LeelooMinai> Yes, I thought about, it, but I figured I have some tools that will manage alu, so I may skip the mdf step - it kind of feels weird to have mdf frame and try to cut alu to me
[02:07:02] <sadara> fibreglass foam construction is what I am familier with, so it is what I'm going to use. Concrete is cheap...
[02:07:56] <LeelooMinai> Fibreglass foam... And what parts would be made out of that?
[02:08:15] <sadara> in my case, the gantry
[02:08:37] <LeelooMinai> Hmm... never saw anything like this - it must be some novel idea:)
[02:08:56] <sadara> not really, you only see it in the really $$$ machines
[02:09:22] <LeelooMinai> And it's good because it's stiff and light at the same time, right?
[02:09:28] <sadara> yes
[02:09:42] <LeelooMinai> I guess with moving gantry that makes sense
[02:09:56] <sadara> the top speed you most hobby machines is not relevent to the application
[02:10:17] <sadara> ie, most of the time is spent accelerating/decelerating
[02:10:18] <LeelooMinai> I am not sure yet if make the gantry moving... maybe for thew first one I should make moving table?
[02:11:25] <LeelooMinai> I know it will take a bit more space... but at least I would not have to worry that I attach some heave tool to the z axis... probably
[02:11:59] <sadara> It's up to you, moving table is easier, but slower, it's also difficult to tune for max performance (as the changing weigth of the work makes turning the x axis harder) but these arn't concerns for your first machine
[02:12:52] <sadara> The maching I'm mahing is 1.6m x 2.7m x 600mm working volume, so I'm going with a fixed table
[02:13:07] <LeelooMinai> Right, well, will think about it. I also thought that if I can make alu parts, I can upgrade the machine, by making the upgrade parts with it
[02:13:25] <sadara> fair enough, what sie is your machine?
[02:13:30] <sadara> s/sie/size
[02:14:08] <LeelooMinai> That will be determined by the rail/bakkscrew set I buy - I see they have reasonably prices 60cm/100cm/30cm sets
[02:14:29] <LeelooMinai> I don't think larger than that
[02:15:13] <sadara> make sure you subtract around 100mm from each axis if buying from china, as they don't deduct the end machining from the length of the ballscrew
[02:15:41] <LeelooMinai> Right, I know - to be honest this is already oversized for my needs
[02:16:06] <LeelooMinai> But since I invest some money, I don't want to goo too tiny
[02:16:30] <sadara> for that size maching, a moving bed is much easier
[02:16:59] <sadara> It's better to have a very nice small machine, than an "ok" medium sized
[02:17:02] <LeelooMinai> Right, no, I am not building some monster machine that will make wooden furniture or anything like that:)
[02:17:44] <LeelooMinai> And medium sized is what?
[02:18:12] <sadara> 60cm/100cm/30cm
[02:18:22] <sadara> What are you going to be making?
[02:18:38] <sadara> 60cm/100cm/30cm is pretty big, if you think about it
[02:19:23] <LeelooMinai> I am doing a long of hobby EE projects. So probably some PCB experiments, but also enclosures for projects, maybe some robotic stuff - protptyping parts mostly, nothing for production
[02:19:26] <sadara> almost all my work would fit in a 300/300/300 mm cube, or is very large, like 1000x100
[02:19:28] <LeelooMinai> long=lot
[02:19:51] <sadara> s/1000x100/1000x1000 mm
[02:20:45] <LeelooMinai> RIght, for me 30cmx30cm is probably enough... though there's no huge difference between prices of those rail/screw sets...
[02:21:05] <LeelooMinai> So though that maybe I should oversize it a bit... don't know
[02:21:11] <sadara> no, but the rigidity of the machine will bt 10x better
[02:21:18] <sadara> s/bt/se
[02:21:47] <LeelooMinai> True... unless I make the alu parts oversized too
[02:21:51] <sadara> that may enable you to do light steel milling
[02:22:37] <LeelooMinai> That sounds like something that would wear down the machine pretty fast
[02:22:43] <sadara> I'm just trying to make sure your clear on what your goal is
[02:23:15] <LeelooMinai> Well, as I said - at most some light aluminium cutting/milling
[02:23:26] <LeelooMinai> And I want some good precision for other stuff
[02:23:32] <LeelooMinai> Speed not important really
[02:23:32] <sadara> ok
[02:24:49] <LeelooMinai> I like alu as material for enclosures, so that's that, and the other part is, as I wrote, to make some parts for the CNC itself using it
[02:25:28] <LeelooMinai> But steel... I don't know - that's a bit hard core:)
[02:25:29] <sadara> then I would suggest 20mm 5mm lead ballscrews, 3.5Nm (400-600 oz inch) steppers, with no microstepping unless more precision is needed on light jobs (ie PCBs)
[02:26:00] <LeelooMinai> O, ok, that's good info - thx
[02:32:22] <sadara> I might go slightly larger on the bed stepper, just so that x and y axis can accelerate at the same rate
[03:04:19] <DJ9DJ> moin
[03:06:29] <sadara> morning
[03:06:51] <sadara> PCW / pcw_home , are you up yet?
[03:10:46] <ProxDem> anybody know JT-Shops homepage URL?
[03:14:05] <cncbasher> gnipsel.com
[03:15:11] <ProxDem> maybe I'm confusing him with someone else
[03:15:31] <ProxDem> I think it was him who linked me a CNC tutorial URL that was interesting
[03:15:41] <cncbasher> 1 min
[03:16:03] <ProxDem> nvm
[03:16:05] <ProxDem> found it
[03:16:09] <ProxDem> =)
[03:16:12] <ProxDem> thanks cncbasher
[03:16:24] <cncbasher> it';s all their it's just finding it haha
[03:16:31] <cncbasher> glad u managed it
[03:17:05] <ProxDem> yeah was my bad
[03:34:02] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: What ya think?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HX7VaDYKZ30
[05:54:23] <R2E4_> Lianne is bad ass!!!
[06:08:38] <jthornton> I think I over slept
[06:11:56] <cncbasher> hell i wish i could sleep
[06:13:15] <archivist> hmm bed...warmest place here
[06:14:15] <cncbasher> yea usual wet and windy here
[06:14:44] <archivist> snow and slush here
[06:15:38] <cncbasher> not had any snow here at all
[06:15:51] <cncbasher> so you have a bonus
[06:24:39] <jthornton> we got a couple of inches of snow
[06:25:27] <archivist> where is this Spring then!
[06:25:54] <micges> not here
[06:34:59] <sadara> Can anyone here help me with servos?
[06:36:06] <archivist> ask a better question because many can
[06:37:12] <sadara> I'm trying to figure out if a servo is compatible with a drive
[06:37:26] <sadara> I don't have the complete servo datasheet
[06:38:15] <sadara> anyone?
[06:38:46] <archivist> still nothing in the question anyone can answer
[06:38:52] <cncbasher> what servo and which drive ?
[06:38:55] <sadara> drive manual
http://www.mesanet.com/pdf/motion/8i20man.pdf
[06:39:13] <sadara> servo partial datasheet:
http://www.electromate.com/db_support/downloads/APIBT171SERIES.pdf
[06:39:59] <sadara> one of the servos I have is an BT-0172ERA-R1LN
[06:40:13] <sadara> which has a resolver, not a quadrature encoder
[06:40:36] <sadara> so I would need a mesa resolver interface as well
[06:41:57] <sadara> I know I also need other items from mesa to make it all work, however I'm only concerned with the servo drive atm
[06:42:59] <sadara> That is the best datasheet I can find
[06:43:35] <cncbasher> on first look it should be ok , but i would send the data sheet to mesa and they can check
[06:44:05] <cncbasher> you probably would need the 7i49 resolver add on card
[06:44:37] <sadara> and a 422 card as well
[06:44:49] <sadara> from looking at the datasheet, the servo is expecting around 230Vrms
[06:44:53] <cncbasher> they will be able to match up the products much quicker for you
[06:45:31] <sadara> That is the only low cost drive I can find the is suitable for that servo
[06:46:05] <sadara> that drive is 2.2KW, the servo is only 50W
[06:46:27] <sadara> are there any smaller HV drives around? even with a step dir interface
[06:46:43] <cncbasher> do you not have any origional drives
[06:46:48] <sadara> all the chinese drives seem to be limited to 80vdc
[06:46:57] <sadara> No, I don't have the original drives
[06:47:27] <Jymmm> Anyone know how much difference there is between .22lr and .25 pistols (and dont say 3 ya dumbass)?
[06:47:39] <sadara> I got the servos really, really cheap without the drive
[06:48:22] <cncbasher> yes it's usualy the case , if you get both the price is increased
[06:48:23] <sadara> .22lr was never meant as a pistol round, need long barrel
[06:48:52] <Jymmm> sadara: why?
[06:48:58] <sadara> .25 was designed as a semi-accurate pistol round
[06:49:19] <sadara> Jymmm: lots of reason, powder burn time
[06:49:25] <Jymmm> sadara: There are .22lr kits for my gliock
[06:49:32] <Jymmm> glock
[06:49:32] <cncbasher> for that very reason they work together and match
[06:50:11] <sadara> cncbasher: but a servo for $10, + a drive for $180 is still very cheap
[06:50:15] <cncbasher> new servo motors are 80v or their abouts , old servo's 180v etc
[06:51:12] <sadara> Jymmm: .22lr round was designed as a plinking rifle round
[06:51:22] <sadara> cncbasher: That explains a lot
[06:52:27] <cncbasher> and the fact that older drives use resolvers where the newer use quad encoders
[06:52:53] <cncbasher> so you tend to have to match old servos with older drives
[06:53:09] <sadara> newer servos use resolvers too, the resolver is actually better in a lot of ways
[06:53:14] <cncbasher> but if they are in working order thats usualy not a problem
[06:53:54] <cncbasher> but any faulty ones stay away .. the capacitors normaly require replacing
[06:53:56] <sadara> the problem is, most of the really old drives have a propritory interface
[06:54:25] <cncbasher> the majority have + - 10v analog somewhere
[06:54:43] <cncbasher> which is an industry standard
[06:56:31] <cncbasher> the fanuc properierty interface is a nightmare so keep away from that , as their is little known about the format
[06:57:06] <cncbasher> have you looked at automationdirect .com
[06:57:22] <sadara> looking now
[07:01:06] <sadara> the smallest amp they do is still 400W, and is $480, and not compatible with resolvers
[07:02:18] <sadara> I'm probably a bit optimistic expectiing to pick up amps for $100 a channel
[07:04:38] <cncbasher> yes amps are prob around $200 - 300
[07:05:14] <cncbasher> but dont discount mesa , they will soon come up with a solution
[07:05:40] <cncbasher> they have more than what is on the website and can truly advise
[07:06:25] <sadara> yeah, I must say, the mesa solution looks pretty awsome, and I'm happy with the price
[07:07:24] <cncbasher> look on ebay but it is advisable to buy them as a pair , rather than seperate in this case
[07:07:46] <skunkworks> I am a very happy mesa customer
[07:07:52] <cncbasher> me too
[07:08:02] <skunkworks> (and linuxcnc)
[07:08:13] <Jymmm> skunkworks: quit sucking up to PCW =)
[07:08:42] <cncbasher> i'll join skunk and we can suck together
[07:08:59] <skunkworks> here here!!
[07:09:08] <Jymmm> lol
[07:09:10] <sadara> is anyone in the US? What time is it where MESA are?
[07:09:21] <Jymmm> 0455
[07:09:41] <sadara> I might try and call them on the telephone... (wow, it felt weird saying that)
[07:10:14] <sadara> also, I find americans very hard to understand
[07:10:27] <skunkworks> heh - so do we
[07:10:58] <cncbasher> send an email and attach your spec
[07:11:11] <cncbasher> i'm sure you'll get a responce
[08:22:47] <r00t4rd3d> sadara, PCW should come alive soon.
[08:44:40] <cncbasher> JT?
[08:50:09] <JT-Shop> que?
[10:57:43] <r00t4rd3d> http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=39c_1363906119
[10:58:10] <r00t4rd3d> bet that wasnt fun to setup
[11:01:45] <sadara> anyone in the U S of A awake yet?
[11:04:39] <JT-Shop> yup
[11:04:48] <cradek> it's 11am
[11:05:21] * sadara slaps PCW around a bit with a large trout
[11:05:43] <cradek> just ask your question!
[11:07:32] <JT-Shop> what cradek said ^^^
[11:07:35] <sadara> si this servo :
http://www.electromate.com/db_support/downloads/APIBT171SERIES.pdf compatible with an 8I20, also i
[11:07:50] <sadara> is this servo :
http://www.electromate.com/db_support/downloads/APIBT171SERIES.pdf compatible with an 8I20
[11:08:48] <sadara> or does mesa make a smaller 300vdc brushless ac drive, like around 100w
[11:09:30] <sadara> that would be the 4th time I've asked in channel btw
[11:09:53] <pcw_home> No, we dont make any small HV drives
[11:10:12] <sadara> it speaks =D
[11:12:32] <sadara> I realize I need a resolver interface as well, but the datasheet I have for the servos is not complete, and this been my first servo project, I just wanted confirmation, or at least a second opinion, that the drive is compatible with the servo
[11:16:52] <sadara> Who is the mesa dealer for australia?
[11:17:54] <skunkworks> your australian? And you can't understand americans?
[11:18:05] <skunkworks> you're
[11:18:48] <sadara> I can understand cockney Irish better than merican...
[11:19:14] <skunkworks> heh
[11:19:28] <sadara> You've heard americans speak right?
[11:20:20] <Connor> I have. They have a wide range of accents..
[11:21:10] <sadara> Connor: true, I personally only have trouble with a few
[11:21:15] <L84Supper> http://tinyurl.com/b755mwl $7k for a 93 in working condition
[11:22:24] <L84Supper> speaking uhmerikan is not required, even to become president
[11:23:30] <sadara> It's weird though, I can watch american tv shows and not have a problem, but speaking to Americans over the phone I honestly only understand 1 word in 2
[11:23:53] <L84Supper> sadara: what parts of the USA do you call?
[11:24:15] <L84Supper> accents vary widely
[11:25:37] <sadara> louisiana
[11:25:38] <sadara> ummm...
[11:25:52] <Err> and actors practice speaking clearly - whereas most people in general do not
[11:26:07] <Err> ha! yeah, Louisiana is not going to sound like the "normal" american accent on TV
[11:26:29] <sadara> Texas
[11:27:15] <sadara> and california
[11:27:17] <Connor> Oh my. That's not American, Louisiana is Cajun. and Texas is DEEP south..
[11:27:29] <Connor> California, you should have been fine with.
[11:27:41] <JT-Shop> Texas is Amexican
[11:27:51] <sadara> CA is better than everywhere else
[11:27:55] <Connor> JT_Shop that too.
[11:28:02] <L84Supper> a Bridgeport for only $700
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Bridgeport-J-Head-Vertical-Milling-Machine-/221204862466?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3380d65602
[11:28:47] <sadara> I wonder how much Air express would be
[11:29:07] <L84Supper> ~$1/lb at that weight
[11:30:31] <L84Supper> sorry $1.5K + $1/lb, but I think it would have to be partially disassembled to meet the size requirements for DHL or Fedex
[11:31:04] <L84Supper> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Leadwell-MCV-610P-w-Mitsubishi-Control-CNC-mill-22-X-travel-/290797528613?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item43b4e22625
[11:31:34] <sadara> thats nice
[11:31:35] <Connor> L84Supper: Why are you listing random machines from ebay ?
[11:31:57] <jdh> and worse, from Hicksville
[11:32:04] <L84Supper> posting good deals, feedback
[11:32:13] <sadara> be nice, he may live in hicksville
[11:32:36] <Connor> jdh: knows exactly where I live. :)
[11:32:55] <L84Supper> is school out today? spring break?
[11:32:56] <jdh> different hicksville :)
[11:33:04] <skunkworks> Connor, how is pete doing?
[11:33:08] <jdh> L84: starts here today
[11:33:48] <jdh> I don't think I could ever free up enough space for a bridgeport
[11:34:04] <Connor> skunkworks: Not heard from in since we got his motor working... I think he's waiting on more electrical components.. a few relays and a din mount bus bar etc..
[11:34:14] <skunkworks> ah
[11:34:27] <sadara> with the mesa cards, with a 6axis machine with a basic atc, is there any reason to buy a FPGA card with more gates than the absolute minimum you need, assumeing you are never going to add to the machine?
[11:35:15] <Connor> Still can't believe I helped him get that working over the phone and me never doing anything with mesa, or that servo controller.. :) still patting my self on the back for that one.
[11:35:22] <jdh> with that much money invested, is there any reason to try to save a fractional percent by buying a cheap card?
[11:36:30] <sadara> I'm not trying to buy a cheap card, just wondering if it's worth spending an extra cpl hundred now
[11:37:06] <skunkworks> sadara, you always want more.... :)
[11:37:40] <sadara> I know, but I can't figure out how I could use more, even if I wanted too
[11:38:07] <skunkworks> probing, automation, coffee maker...
[11:38:49] <Connor> Letting someone in the US turn on/off your shop lights... (like in big bang theory)
[11:39:59] <sadara> are the ethernet cards compatible with EMC?
[11:40:24] <skunkworks> only one of mesa's cards is in beta.. otherwise no.
[11:40:32] <sadara> for motion control, not just accesories
[11:42:39] <skunkworks> linuxcnc is the realtime controller... at the moment - it requires a realtime connection to the hardware. (so pci, printer port, epcie, pcie, (and ethernet seems possible) all work great - usb does not.
[11:42:44] <Connor> WOW... Adobe To Australians: Fly To US For Cheaper Software
[11:43:52] <sadara> Connor: atm it's cheaper for me to fly out of the country, buy a 2 week supply of cigerettes, and fly back here, than it is to buy them here
[11:44:06] <Connor> WTF ?
[11:45:01] <sadara> Australia is _VERY_ expencive
[11:45:05] <jdh> even cheaper to not buy them!
[11:45:29] * sadara just quit smoking, the air travel was killing me
[11:45:43] <jdh> and really, it's 2013... we still don't know everything, but I think cigarettes are a known life failure.
[11:46:10] <tjtr33> sadara install linuxcnc, then browse the config directory to see implementations using different combinations of products. ( or run the live cd )
[11:46:17] <tjtr33> you'll get ideas fer sure
[11:46:22] <skunkworks> I didn't know that duke of duke univeristy was the inventer of the modern cigarett rolling machines..
[11:46:43] <Connor> I don't smoke, never have, never will.. wish I could get my mother to stop.. she has COPD because of it...
[11:46:57] <sadara> COPD?
[11:47:06] <Connor> Chronic obstructive pulmonary disease
[11:47:15] <skunkworks> I like how the comercials for copd meds say nothing as to why you have copd...
[11:47:27] <Connor> I.E. emphysema
[11:47:42] <sadara> ahh, why is everything renamed?
[11:47:59] <Connor> CPOD is a broader term..
[11:48:27] <Connor> Can cover all kinds of different more specific problems....
[11:48:37] <jdh> my stepmother has emphysema, smoked for 40 years and now has to carry o2 around with her... she still says it isn't from smoking.
[11:50:24] <sadara> jdh, it's not all bad, next time your hung over, take oxygen for 20mins
[11:50:34] <jdh> I don't drink.
[11:50:59] <sadara> you don't drink, you don't smoke.... you do cnc
[11:51:43] <jdh> I do have 40,000l of o2 in the garage
[11:55:23] <sadara> there is a 7i43 driver in EMC, the 7i43 has a USB interface... am I missing something? Or is it just experimental?
[11:56:40] <cradek> LinuxCNC talks to the 7i43 over EPP which is a realtime parallel port based protocol
[11:56:56] <Connor> Don't EVEN think about using USB..
[11:57:12] <cradek> see
http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Mesa_Cards
[11:57:24] <sadara> I figured, Linux doesn't has sync USB drivers
[11:57:33] <zq> trademark dispute, wtf
[11:57:38] <sadara> cradek: I'm reading it
[11:58:21] <Connor> zq ??
[11:58:28] <zq> " Due to a trademark dispute, after EMC 2.4 the project will be referred to as LinuxCNC - A longer but more descriptive name. "
[11:58:29] <sadara> ahhh, the 7i43 comes in two versions, usb and parallel
[11:58:53] <jdh> comes in small & large fpga alos
[11:59:02] <Connor> za Yea. Thanks the people @ www.emc.com for that..
[11:59:15] <Connor> err. zq I mean.
[11:59:23] <jdh> linuxcnc is a much better name, except for typing it here.
[11:59:38] <Connor> I liked EMC.
[11:59:51] <zq> i grew up with emc < 2.0.0
[12:00:08] <sadara> wtf, emc has been around for decades
[12:00:13] <jdh> I grew up with ... no computers :(
[12:00:34] <Connor> No money to fight the lawyers.. better to just give in I guess..
[12:00:42] <zq> hm, where'd jmkasunich go
[12:01:09] <cradek> Connor: compare a google search for EMC to a search for LinuxCNC and see some of the benefits of the name change
[12:01:46] <Connor> I always searched using EMC2
[12:01:48] <cradek> also,
http://www.emc2acne.com/how-emc2-works.html
[12:01:59] <jdh> the worst name I've run across lately is "EtherNet/IP"
[12:02:24] <sadara> lol
[12:02:35] <Connor> EMC2 results in 2nd place..
[12:02:43] <sadara> the servos I have are made by API motion
[12:03:26] <sadara> try searching for that, but I have to admit that "Ethernet/IP" Is the worst one I have seen in a while
[12:04:03] <Connor> jdh: What called EtherNet/IP ?
[12:04:25] <sadara> Connor: google for it, go on, I dare you :)
[12:05:17] <Connor> Oh Good greif.. Ethernet Industrial Protocol.. *boggle*
[12:07:29] <jdh> that's what happens when you let marketing name things
[12:08:13] <sadara> jdg: don't complain -> when engineers name things : BT-0172ERA-R1LN-NNN-02
[12:08:53] <Connor> http://www.wayengineer.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=193_190_197
[12:09:15] <Connor> These might be good for Stepper/Servo connectors.. and maybe even spindles too.. up to 15 Amps
[12:10:07] <Connor> http://www.wayengineer.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=193_190
[12:10:17] <Connor> They're calling them Aviation Plugs ??
[12:16:12] <Err> heh, from the designations on that page I assume that they're some standard in the aviation industry
[12:16:19] <Err> (but still a stupid name)
[12:16:43] <jdh> or, they just thought calling them aviation plugs made them seem less cheap'
[12:16:46] <Connor> If you look at some of them.. they're the ones we use that we call CB or XLR...
[12:17:18] <Connor> case in point..
http://www.wayengineer.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=193_190_191
[12:18:04] <Connor> They do have a Amp rating on them... 5A @250v
[12:18:12] <archivist> those are cheap CB mic connectors
[12:18:47] <Connor> http://www.wayengineer.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=193_190_192
[12:19:52] <Connor> archivist: They work good for Steppers up to 5amps.. Allot of DIY people using them..
[12:21:50] <jdh> someday, I will get around to putting the rest of mine on my panel bulkhead
[12:21:53] <skunkworks> sadara, what are you converting?
[12:23:42] <sadara> skunkworks: Building
[12:24:29] <sadara> a big gantry, 2600x1300x500 mm
[12:24:43] <skunkworks> ah
[12:24:56] <sadara> for foam grinding
[12:25:21] <Connor> grinding ?
[12:26:25] <sadara> A trick to get better surface quality on foam
[12:26:34] <sadara> try it :)
[12:26:50] <Connor> anything like sanding? Sounds like it would be VERY messy..
[12:26:56] <archivist> grinding is not just for steel, used for balsa fishing floats, rubber rollers and all sorts
[12:28:11] <skunkworks> Connor, have you tried milling foam? ;)
[12:28:21] <Connor> It's very messy too. :)
[12:28:47] <skunkworks> :)
[12:29:05] <Connor> sadara: What's the foam for?
[12:29:31] <sadara> Aircraft
[12:29:55] <Connor> Hobby, Drone, Production ?
[12:30:54] <sadara> UAV, custom production. The craft arn't for sale
[12:31:27] <Connor> Cool
[13:02:48] <Loetmichel> re @ home (jetzt stimmts)
[13:11:31] <Connor> What's a good top end RPM for a 4th axis in lathe mode ?
[13:14:38] <IchGuckLive> Hi all B)
[13:17:38] <IchGuckLive> Folks how is this insekt called in eng.
http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libellen
[13:17:49] <IchGuckLive> i cand find a good translation
[13:18:21] <Connor> Dragon fly
[13:19:09] <IchGuckLive> Thanks
[13:23:48] <Connor> IchGuckLive: Why you needing to know about Dragonflies ?
[13:25:44] <Connor> Also, what is normal.. 4th Axis on left, or right of machine?
[13:27:46] <IchGuckLive> LEFT
[13:27:57] <IchGuckLive> always to the Minus point
[13:28:24] <Connor> yea. Someone was saying in VMC's.. normally on the right due to Tool Changes being on the left..
[13:28:28] <IchGuckLive> Depends on your mashine config
[13:28:39] <IchGuckLive> your X shoudt work plus
[13:28:45] <Connor> Frankly, the right would be more consistent with a Lave.
[13:28:48] <Connor> Lathe.
[13:28:55] <Connor> damn it...
[13:29:06] <Connor> LEFT would be more consistent with a lathe.
[13:29:12] <Connor> I'll get it out in a minute..
[13:29:31] <IchGuckLive> the tool shoudt alqways stay in plus X on A Rotation
[13:30:12] <skunkworks> it doesn't matter which side as long as the rotation is correct
[13:31:03] <Connor> But we all agree that ATC and 4th axis on the same side probably not the best idea.. less room for tool clearance.
[13:33:49] <IchGuckLive> on ATC it is probably better to the other side
[13:37:02] <archivist> Connor, for me it is about travels and the jobs rather than the "right way"
[13:37:30] <Jymmm> http://shine.yahoo.com/healthy-living/woman-shocked-in-shower-wins--4-million-lawsuit--is-your-shower-safe--192310440.html
[13:43:23] <IchGuckLive> Jymmm: thats THE USA
[13:43:50] <Jymmm> IchGuckLive: and?
[13:49:02] <IchGuckLive> in germany she woudt get nothing as it is comen to watch out
[13:49:22] <IchGuckLive> therefor in the usa noone can inshure
[13:49:39] <IchGuckLive> in health system or car ...
[13:51:11] <Vq> IchGuckLive: Construction errors are excempted from the legal system?
[13:51:40] <IchGuckLive> no matter what she got 4mio
[13:55:23] <Vq> A hefty sum to be sure.
[13:56:12] <Vq> There is probably some reasoning to it that is missing in the article.
[13:58:57] <Vq> I recall the story about the woman who got a large sum of money after burning herself on McDonalds coffee, it was even written about in some swedish papers and it was presented in a slightly sensational way.
[14:00:09] <Vq> I understand why it sounds odd to us europeans but when reading about the details in that case it came of as relatively sensible to me.
[14:01:47] <IchGuckLive> Connor: Dragon fly g-code generated !
http://mechmo.de/dragonfly.png
[14:02:21] <IchGuckLive> Watch my plasma post on heeks M66 P0 L3
[14:05:10] <IchGuckLive> the tail looks to short i think i make it longer got 100x100 sheet
[14:17:24] <IchGuckLive> china reseves now itas own ubuntu version kylin !!
[14:18:36] <tttobi> Good evening to all! May I provide a minimum example about what goes wrong with my xyuv hotwire cutting machine?
[14:18:59] <IchGuckLive> ah yes
[14:19:55] <IchGuckLive> tttobi:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wT_ndXDZ0DU
[14:20:03] <IchGuckLive> im the man with the big foamcutters
[14:20:37] <IchGuckLive> tttobi: where are you from in the world
[14:21:13] <tttobi> That is nice! I came across your work last evening, when I was working on my issues!
[14:21:29] <tttobi> We could meet in my hometown, Bielefeld :)
[14:21:48] <IchGuckLive> so lets go querry and talk german
[14:22:32] <tttobi> okay, I'll try. This is my first IRC since 20+years..
[14:23:00] <IchGuckLive> you shoudt already see my name in red in the downbar someware
[14:23:06] <IchGuckLive> OK
[14:25:38] <tjtr33> anyone used absolute encoders? i picked this up
http://tinyurl.com/b6u4hel
[14:26:43] <tjtr33> the i/f seems to be serial (SD+ SD-) and the motors ac (UVW), have not gotten inside it yet, but got some docs on wiring
[14:29:07] <tjtr33> they're battery backed up, and i'd like to use that info and not home every boot
[15:12:12] <PCW> I know some Yaskawa drives us battery backed encoders that send serial
[15:12:14] <PCW> absolute at startup and then re-use the signals for normal quadrature when running
[15:13:03] <PCW> knowing the encoder manufacturer might help
[15:25:00] <andypugh> Those fiendish orientals!
[15:26:45] <tjtr33> PCW, thx, i'll know more when i get it cracked open.
[15:27:38] <PCW> well there are a lot of strange serial protocols used in late 80s and beyond motion controls
[15:28:14] <PCW> Fanuc and Mitsubishi being the more common examples
[15:29:34] <andypugh> Trying to imagine the most tortured serial protocol. I reckon text strings in rot13 with alternating characters encoded in ASCII, EBCDIC and Baudot.
[15:31:42] <tjtr33> well, i'll have to snoop it and see , then manuals i found
http://tinyurl.com/bc2pqfc
[15:31:55] <PCW> well odd number of bits, odd data rates, funny CRCs or checksums, stirred in with absolute lack of protocol documentation
[15:32:24] <tjtr33> sniff/snoop
[15:32:43] <PCW> Yeah if you have the whole thing
[15:35:26] <Nick001-Shop> Is there any current useful info using a linear scale with a stepper motor?
[15:36:09] <andypugh> If you know what data is in the protocol, then you can change the physical inputs and see what changes. There is probably a CRC at the end to confuse matters, though.
[15:36:26] <PCW> Been done (how exactly depends on linear scale resolution vs stepmotor resolution)
[15:37:55] <Nick001-Shop> 200 step motor and i think 5000 lin per inch scale
[15:38:08] <PCW> typically what is done is the stepgen is run in velocity mode with a PID loop setting the stepgen rate
[15:38:30] <PCW> so it simulates a velocity mode servo system
[15:39:19] <Nick001-Shop> how do i accomplish this? writeup anywhere?
[15:40:41] <Nick001-Shop> I have the stepper running with stepcfg wizard now
[15:41:16] <PCW> There are people in the forum that have done it (and posted hal files)
[15:41:18] <PCW> basically you setup a normal servo system hal file with the only difference
[15:41:19] <PCW> being that the PID output drives the steggen rate instead of a analog output
[15:42:02] <Nick001-Shop> Is there a sample setup anywhere?
[15:43:03] <Nick001-Shop> I've been looking in the forum but haven't found anything really useful yet -
[15:44:51] <PCW> I know Gabe Willem (sp?) has done this
[15:49:55] <Nick001-Shop> has he posted anything in the forum?
[15:53:24] <PCW> Dont think so, mainly IRC and mailing list
[15:53:55] <tjtr33> 2012 log sez Willen "-!- WillenCMD [WillenCMD!~gabe@99-195-254-164.dyn.centurytel.net] has joined #linuxcnc "
[15:54:34] <tjtr33> someone said he'd done edm with linuxcnc, so i was looking also
[15:56:21] <Nick001-Shop> will parport handle all this or do I need cards?
[15:57:38] <PCW> parport will handle it with normal base thread limited step rate and encoder count rate
[15:58:07] <tjtr33> re Gabe, how'd i ever miss this ?
https://plus.google.com/photos/108420335892310746315/albums/5784211124086428513
[15:58:59] <Nick001-Shop> what card would I have to use with a 5i20?
[16:01:13] <tjtr33> re Gabe again: he used an arduino to spin a motor just to snoop on the resolver output :) ( me use hand drill , ugh!)
[16:03:31] <PCW> you dont need anything other then the 5I20 for stepgens and encoders (daughter cards provide 5I20 protection, encoder differential inputs, 5V drive step/dir etc)
[16:04:16] <PCW> Andy is the Arduino resolver guy AFAIK
[16:06:28] <tjtr33> oops yes that was andy did it, appy polly loggys
[16:08:46] <Nick001-Shop> what daughter card do I need - I have a 7i30 but that for servos I assume
[16:11:00] <andypugh> As PCW said, you don't necessarily need _any_ daughter card.
[16:11:37] <andypugh> My mill/lathe stepper machine has the step drives wired direct to the 7i43 board.
[16:12:23] <PCW> you could use the 7I30 encoder inputs, and bare 5I20 pins for the stepgen (or a purpose built daughtercard like a 7I47 or 7I52S)
[16:21:16] <andypugh> Nick001: These are really useful for connecting to Mesa cards.
https://uk.rs-online.com/web/c/?searchTerm=M20+crimp+housing&sra=oss&r=t
[16:21:45] <andypugh> (Don't be fooled by the pictures, they have up to 24 pins)
[16:22:28] <andypugh> You need to get the terminals separately, and need a very small crimping tool, but then you can connect individual signal wires in reconfigurable arrangements.
[16:24:55] <andypugh> See, for example, the pink wires connecting the Arduino to the 5i23 in this picture:
https://plus.google.com/photos/108164504656404380542/albums/5747722155741347649/5751794123114825714?banner=pwa
[16:36:50] <Connor> andypugh: What are those thin connector blocks on the DIN rail ?
[16:38:05] <jdh> looks like ganged terminal strips
[16:38:09] <Nick001-Shop> waiting for pics to load up
[16:38:45] <jdh> the top right ones anyway
[16:39:04] <Connor> What's the big black thing on the bottom next to the to tan ones ?
[16:39:17] <jdh> safety relay?
[16:41:32] <Connor> Are they feed through.. or a bus bar ?
[16:42:04] <jdh> there are center holes so you can run a bus through them for power distribution/etc
[16:42:31] <jdh> teh top ones have the connectors for each section, the bottom ones are individual
[16:43:07] <jdh> I have some 3 level ones in my mill, bottom is gnd, middle is +V, top is signal
[16:43:24] <Connor> Yea.. I didn't use anything like that..
[16:43:43] <jdh> I scrounged mine from trash
[16:44:11] <Connor> I just used cheap terminal barrier strips with a bridge clip.
[16:44:12] <jdh> the little single height ones are pretty cheap, $0.50/each or less
[16:44:42] <Jymmm> Gawd, viewing images on google plus is fucking annoying
[16:45:04] <Connor> the 2 and 3 tier would be good for single and 3 phase power distro,,,
[16:45:39] <jdh> I've only used them for DC
[16:46:54] <tjtr33> andypugh, i think that pic shows a 7i76 and the 'field i/o' is used. how does that work? thru serial? the pink cat cable?
[16:47:04] <Connor> I see the blocks all over.. where are the strips that links them together ?
[16:47:21] <jdh> those are in the center
[16:47:32] <jdh> some use comb looking strips
[16:47:46] <Connor> yea.. but, they don't come with the strips...
[16:47:52] <jdh> nope
[16:48:01] <jdh> gotta buy those also
[16:48:04] <Connor> where do you get those, or what are they called ?
[16:48:32] <jdh> you have to get ones that match the terminal strip. They are usually vendor specific
[16:48:37] <jdh> mine are all weidmuller
[16:50:16] <Connor> Stuff isn't very compact.. is it..
[16:50:39] <jdh> there are different sizes
[16:50:48] <jdh> compact ones are hard to work on
[16:51:07] <jdh> http://www.ebay.com/itm/300877466212
[16:51:48] <jdh> those are doubles... these are $0.25/each 400439530879
[16:52:49] <Connor> yea can get ones with fuses too.. cool.. still not found the strips...
[16:54:00] <tjtr33> the terminal strip jumpers (combs)
http://tinyurl.com/bdf57os
[16:54:37] <tjtr33> get the ones for your mfctr and your current
[16:54:49] <tjtr33> clip 'em to length
[16:58:12] <jdh> http://www.ebay.com/itm/290844889583 mine look mostly like those
[17:09:46] <tjtr33> jdh that style is new to me, proves you need the ones from your tstrip mfctr
[17:15:58] <DJ9DJ> gn8
[17:19:10] <andypugh> jdh: Yes, those are the ones. They leave you with terminals both sides, unlike the comb style
[17:20:13] <andypugh> tjtr33: No 7i76. There is a 7i64, 7i44 and 7i39 in that picture.
[17:20:59] <tjtr33> does tht use 'field i/o' ? and does 'field i/o need serial?
[17:21:10] <andypugh> 5i23-ribbon-7i44-CAT5-7i64
[17:21:26] <tjtr33> thanks
[17:21:44] <andypugh> 7i44 is an array of 25 isolated switches, and 24 isolated inputs.
[17:21:53] <andypugh> Sorry, 7i64 is that.
[17:22:59] <andypugh> So, the bottom left half of the 7i64 is wired yellow (12V) outputs, and the right half is orange (24V) outputs.
[17:23:25] <andypugh> You can mix and match voltages and voltage references with the 7i64, and it handles 48V.
[17:25:43] <tjtr33> i had looked at the 6i25 and 7i76 combo, but couldnt resolve 17 pins from 6i25 to the 48 field i/o unless some mux-ing or other control source like serial
[17:26:23] <andypugh> Yes, smart-serial.
[17:27:21] <tjtr33> thanks, where to readup on that?
[17:28:13] <tjtr33> i'll check on the mesa site, i just didnt connect :|
[17:29:11] <andypugh> It's in the back of each card manual, for example:
http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=7i73man&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&ved=0CDIQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mesanet.com%2Fpdf%2Fparallel%2F7i73man.pdf&ei=_NdMUcC4J4PU0QW5tYHQAg&usg=AFQjCNFLy2Q2g3F0FhJF6WPceUI2UZwjCg&bvm=bv.44158598,d.d2k
[17:29:35] <andypugh> Sorry, bad url.
http://www.mesanet.com/pdf/parallel/7i73man.pdf
[17:32:31] <tjtr33> okay, it appears as a port to read/written , kinda parport inbyte/outbyte like
[17:32:43] <tjtr33> thanks that looks really useful
[17:35:14] <PCW> Thats the theory, the firmware is supposed to hide a lot of details so the driver just has a relatively simple register level interface
[17:37:45] <tjtr33> so if i git this right, the field i/o connectors of the 7i76 are not used from the 6i25?
[17:38:21] <PCW> Yes they are
[17:39:46] <tjtr33> how do you get 48 i/o+ out of 17 control pins? i'm just not following
[17:40:28] <JT-Shop> what does the nml file do?
[17:42:11] <JT-Shop> sserial
[17:43:05] <tjtr33> the serial is provided thru the 6i25?
[17:43:39] <tjtr33> i mean thru the pci bus?
[17:43:46] <PCW> yes
[17:44:07] <tjtr33> ok makwes sense, sorry for being dense :)
[17:44:42] <PCW> with a 7I76x2 config there are 4 sserial channels in the firmware 2 for each 7I76
[17:45:22] <PCW> each 7I76 has a local sserial used for field I/O and an expansion sserial for whatever
[17:47:20] <tjtr33> sounds like super cheap loads of i/o points
[17:48:27] <PCW> Yes it allows using cheap PICs or other micros for remote realtime I/O
[17:49:41] <tjtr33> didnt think of that, i was speaking of the 48, but that makes it a real hub
[17:51:49] <PCW> Currently its limited to 96 bits in /96 bits out per remote and 32 remotes max
[17:52:41] <tjtr33> haha 'limited'
[17:54:58] <PCW> we just made some changes to allow the internal processor to run at its own speed (rather than the bus speed)
[17:55:00] <PCW> so we can probably increase the data per channel at some point
[17:56:47] <PCW> This also means running the remotes at 10 Mbaud (instead of the current 2.5 Mbaud)
[18:03:19] <andypugh> If you want more than 3072 IO pins you need a second PCI slot :-)
[18:03:26] <tjtr33> :) when you answer it always brings up huge new ideas... like theres a processor in the fpga!... and its programmble, and imagine what a remote is in this context...and 4x the data rate? at least 300 i/o points per xfer
[18:03:38] <tjtr33> so i can never keep up !
[18:04:04] <tjtr33> :)
[18:05:30] <PCW> I recommend you DO NOT look at the source code for the sserial processor as it will cause brain damage
[18:06:01] <tjtr33> rofl really rofl
[18:10:05] <andypugh> The LinuxCNC side of the transaction isn't too bad, it even has some comments.
[18:10:39] <andypugh> But it is all a bit clever because the cards tell LinuxCNC what pins they have, and what to call them.
[18:11:26] <tjtr33> nononono i wont look! (the ravenous bugblatter beast of trall )
[18:12:14] <andypugh> Have you ever played the tex adventure game of HHGTTG?
[18:12:25] <andypugh> Ooh it's evil.
[18:13:04] <tjtr33> wow, no, is it os? no again, i'm so far behind i NEED time travel
[18:14:02] <andypugh> "doors lead north, east and west" "go south" "you can't go south" "go south" "no, really, you can't go south, there is no door" "go south" "Oh, _that_ south. You go south. You are in the engine room of the Heart of Gold"
[18:14:58] <andypugh> It was written for the Infocom Interpreter by Douglas Adams himself, so it's like any classic adventure game, but written to be far harder than normal, and wierder.
[18:16:13] <andypugh> Here it is, in postmodern Java
http://www.douglasadams.com/creations/infocomjava.html
[18:16:51] <tjtr33> arrrgh! my fear sensitve sunglass just went off mid tapping #4's
[18:17:09] <andypugh> Then when you get bored of that, you can play MattMatt's games from the same era, and then mine :-)
[18:17:29] <tjtr33> no tea!
[18:17:45] <tjtr33> stop stop stop stop
[18:23:35] <jdh> HHGTTH was the first adv game I ever played
[18:24:48] <jdh> I need to make a 46mm pin spanner
[18:27:46] <andypugh> jdh: Save time next time, make an adjustable one.
[18:28:22] <jdh> I've only ever needed the one size
[18:28:31] <andypugh> http://www.tormach.com/store/index.php?app=ecom&ns=prodshow&ref=31118
[18:28:52] <jdh> oh, wrong direction
[18:28:56] <jdh> hook spanner? with a pin
[18:29:15] <andypugh> Ah, I filed a spare hook spanner round :-)
[18:30:38] <andypugh> Who was talking about corks yesterday?
http://www.tormach.com/store/index.php?app=ecom&ns=prodshow&ref=33112
[18:30:44] <jdh> I bought one, specifically for this brand of regulator. It is almost completely worthless
[18:30:54] <jdh> http://www.scubatools.com/images/Product/large/537.jpg
[18:31:19] <andypugh> I see no pin
[18:31:21] <jdh> it neds to wrap around another 45ish degrees
[18:31:26] <jdh> has different pin sizes
[18:31:42] <jdh> but, when you apply force , it just lifts teh pin out
[18:32:07] <jdh> (of the hole)
[18:33:26] <andypugh> Buy cheap:
http://www.belmontdepot.com/images/STANLEY%20VISE%20GRIP%20LONG%20NOSE.jpg then drill-weld pins into the jaws.
[18:34:16] <andypugh> I have a set of similar ones with strips of steel and an angle at the end for holding motorbike clutch baskets
[18:34:17] <jdh> the part is made of brass, that would destroy it
[18:35:13] <andypugh> No, you misunderstand. Buy the tool, destroy the tool by adding pins, make something that can _never_ slip put of the regulator pin-holes.
[18:35:36] <andypugh> Polish the jaws smooth if you want
[18:36:30] <jdh> I was really thinking of one that completely enclosed it, with a slit for tightening
[18:36:45] <andypugh> I made one of these by welding stuff to cheap mole-grips:
http://shop.1stmx.co.uk/ekmps/shops/andyhutch/images/clutch-holding-tool-260-p.jpg
[18:37:56] <andypugh> The Mole/Vise grips already have exactly the right mechanism, and cost peanuts.
[18:41:33] * pfred1 has come to gloat: http://i.imgur.com/OjNG078.png
[18:41:52] <Tom_itx> gloating allowed on friday only
[18:43:35] <pfred1> I finally got LinuxCNC to work on this PC
[18:44:08] <pfred1> axis opens up and everything
[18:44:31] <andypugh> pcw_home: I am trying to tell someone how to count motor poles on the forum, and I can't actually recall if a 2-pole is one detente per rev or two (at constant excitation)
[18:51:39] <pfred1> has anyone else noticed that something about RTAI breaks tload?
[18:53:00] <andypugh> exit
[18:53:08] <pfred1> stage right
[18:53:27] <andypugh> Ah, this isn't the halrun window?
[18:53:45] <andypugh> loadrt matrix_kb
[18:53:46] <pfred1> I just saw Hal running that a way and he was laughing!
[18:53:49] <andypugh> No, definitely not.
[18:55:10] <pfred1> well this machine doesn't like GL but it runs it
[19:00:58] <PCW> andy 2 pole is 1 detent
[19:02:12] <PCW> and rare 4, 6 and 8 poles are much more common
[19:02:51] <andypugh> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Refuelling.plan.black.buck.svg Is amazing. How you use 17 aircraft to get one aircraft from Ascencion to Port stanley and back again.
[19:04:56] <r00t4rd3d> i bought an mp3 today
[19:05:02] <r00t4rd3d> first time ever :/
[19:05:35] <r00t4rd3d> but only cause i got a $1 credit on amazon :)
[19:05:36] <pfred1> r00t4rd3d lay off the booze
[19:06:05] <r00t4rd3d> if you install one of the apps from the amazon app store today they give you a free $1
[19:06:10] <r00t4rd3d> its their birthday
[19:07:05] <r00t4rd3d> http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=amb_link_373311262_2?ie=UTF8&hidden-keywords=B007T9WVKM|B009EEFTMC|B004YXE438|B007BFSYMS|B004L07KWQ|B008L1DNGI|B006C1DH92|B0066T0BTO|B006OOHYIC|B005MKC9SE|B004XJHBCE|B008HSOT18|B004GYVYV0|B006R8GK2Q|B004SC3BLG|B0062U4HP6|B006SMLAMQ|B009NVH1CC&rh=i%3Amobile-apps%2Cn%3A2350149011&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_s=right-2&pf_rd_r=16X2NJJBGPQ3SDBSN5F8&pf_rd_t=1401&pf_rd_p=1519671702&pf_rd_i=1000620471
[19:07:13] <pfred1> tinyurl!
[19:08:23] <r00t4rd3d> deal with it and get a free $1
[19:08:29] <r00t4rd3d> plus a free app
[19:08:35] <r00t4rd3d> weather+ hd is good
[19:08:59] <pfred1> all my apps are free
[19:09:05] <r00t4rd3d> pirate
[19:09:14] <pfred1> no GNU
[19:09:20] <r00t4rd3d> no you!
[19:09:40] <pfred1> synaptic
[19:10:32] <r00t4rd3d> do you run ubuntu all the time?
[19:10:32] <pfred1> I run Debian
[19:10:55] <pfred1> I spent the last week running from Ubuntu figuratively
[19:11:15] <pfred1> glad i did too
[19:11:31] <r00t4rd3d> remind you how much it sucks
[19:12:25] <pfred1> I don't know I didn't actually install the LinuxCNC image onto this box but live it didn't run as good as what I have now
[19:13:20] <r00t4rd3d> i just fullscreen linuxcnc and pretend its something else
[19:13:42] <pfred1> well I want decent latency
[19:13:56] <pfred1> can't really fib with that
[19:19:52] <andypugh> pfred1: I don't care about Ubuntu. It siffices to start the LinuxCNC GUI of my choice. Nothing else matters.
[19:19:52] <r00t4rd3d> do you run linuxcnc on debian all the time?
[19:19:53] <pfred1> andypugh well I just think Ubuntu is a bit of a resource hog
[19:19:53] <r00t4rd3d> i can never find what i am looking for in unity
[19:19:53] <jdh> I run linuxcnc on single purpose boxes
[19:19:53] <pfred1> r00t4rd3d well you can change what window manager you use
[19:19:53] <jdh> so, resource hog is kind of meaningless
[19:19:53] <r00t4rd3d> really, how?
[19:19:53] <pfred1> r00t4rd3d install it and switch to it
[19:19:53] <r00t4rd3d> i was kidding
[19:20:02] <andypugh> Well, I am developing for LinuxCNC at the moment, but I am actually sat at a Mac, and editing the source in Xcode. Then I make and debug with ssh. So I am pretty much platform-agnostic.
[19:20:04] <pfred1> aptitude install fluxbox;echo "exec fluxbox" > ~/.xinitrc
[19:20:40] * jdh ponders a platform agnostic mac user.
[19:23:38] <pfred1> so every monitor maker uses one of those 4 manufacturers
[19:23:57] <andypugh> Do you buy cars purely on price and competence? Or do you buy the one you like?
[19:24:47] <r00t4rd3d> color mainly
[19:25:00] <pfred1> I paint cars so the color doesn't matter to me
[19:25:01] <jdh> and number of cup holders
[19:25:14] <andypugh> There you are. I _like_ anodized aluminium in my computers :-)
[19:25:18] <r00t4rd3d> heated seats are a bonus
[19:25:38] <pfred1> andypugh anodizing ian't hard I'm sure you can manage it
[19:25:41] <jdh> I have heated seats, they are kind of pointless here other than maybe 10 days a year
[19:26:03] <r00t4rd3d> here you dont use them 10 days a year
[19:26:12] <pfred1> I was looking at chrome plating last night
[19:26:18] <pfred1> I have some tools I need to plate
[19:26:26] <jdh> no chrome places near here anymore
[19:26:42] <pfred1> jdh DIY
[19:26:52] <andypugh> My computer is
http://www.maclife.com/files/u129772/imac27_full.jpg I own it because I wanted it. And that is all there is to the matter.
[19:26:53] <pfred1> there really isn't a whole lot to it
[19:27:15] <jdh> macs are nice hardware
[19:27:36] <jdh> I doubt you could convince crotechedy old guys with $5 computers of their worth :)
[19:28:04] <pfred1> jdh do you know how many PCs I can buy for what one Mac costs?
[19:28:19] <r00t4rd3d> 1 sweet one
[19:28:20] <jdh> 1 that was as good
[19:28:24] <jdh> heh
[19:28:33] <andypugh> Yeah, it's like having a 2.0L Mercedes and explaining why to the owner of a slightly faster 2.0L Hyundai owner.
[19:28:40] <r00t4rd3d> you can get video cards that cost more then a whole apple computer
[19:29:08] <pfred1> the way GL sucks up resources i could use one
[19:30:26] <andypugh> I seem to have used the word "owner" twice, and this is now about slavery, I guess. Why is it that youe can't own Canadians?
[19:31:04] <jdh> you can buy them around the border
[19:31:21] <pfred1> if you're a drunken sailor
[19:31:52] <jdh> http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc7/253709_10151325199971956_126558527_n.png
[19:32:31] <andypugh> jdh: The reference:
http://www.snopes.com/politics/religion/drlaura.asp
[19:32:46] <jdh> yeah, I know taht one
[19:33:02] <jdh> xtians don't usually take that well.
[19:33:04] <pfred1> is Dr. Laura still alive?
[19:33:39] <pfred1> she had her 15 minutes
[19:34:33] <pfred1> the only way I would have liked Apple is if I could have gotten in on their IPO
[19:34:41] <pfred1> I wanted to but I was pretty young
[19:34:51] <jdh> I don't believe you
[19:35:13] <pfred1> jdh they had a full page ad in Popular COmputing I believe it was
[19:35:32] <pfred1> when I saw it I knew I was missing out on something
[19:36:14] * pfred1 was a pretty astute child
[19:37:21] <pfred1> I foresaw the whole PC revolution and CGI
[19:37:59] <pfred1> I used to think how cool it would be to make movies of my favorite sci-fi stories
[19:38:03] <pfred1> now they do!
[19:41:06] <andypugh> A friend of mine bought some Apple stock in about 1993. $5 a share then, $461 now. I suspect he still has them though. I lodged wigh him for a while and there were 20 Macs in the spare bedroom. Those that wouldn't fit in the loft, or were too old to be in the front room and usable. He had (and still has, 10 years on) a stack of 6 Lisas on the sideboard)
[19:41:47] <pfred1> I hope he didn't pay full price for those Lisas
[19:42:18] <jdh> apple has had 3 or 4 2:1 splits
[19:42:24] <andypugh> No, I think he paid about £100 for the set.
[19:42:26] <pfred1> only Apple could put out a $10,000 PC
[19:42:57] <pfred1> which in about $30,000 in today's currency
[19:43:08] <andypugh> At the time they were only very expensive
[19:43:19] <andypugh> Much cheaper than a PDP11
[19:43:19] <pfred1> they cost $10,000
[19:43:45] <pfred1> I don't know I had a PDP 11/34 and when it was new it only cost $25,000
[19:44:03] <jdh> yuck, a unibus machine
[19:44:12] <pfred1> hey it was 7 feet tall!
[19:44:15] <andypugh> Yes, and I think that, in general, $25,000 > $10,000
[19:45:06] <andypugh> When Apple launched the Lisa computers were a lot more expensive.
[19:45:20] <jdh> indeed, and the Lisa was extraordinary
[19:45:41] <pfred1> it is not always good to be ahead of your time
[19:45:59] <jdh> I still have two pdp11/73s running... I win!
[19:46:06] <jdh> well, I guess I really lose.
[19:46:09] <pfred1> no one was going to shell out that kind of money back then or even now for a PC
[19:46:40] <andypugh> jdh: Indeed you do. The place I work retired the last PDP11 2 years ago,
[19:47:01] <jdh> I'm planning on replacing one this year.
[19:47:15] <pfred1> jdh Intel Atom?
[19:47:27] <jdh> nah, i5
[19:47:44] <jdh> with 3 2ghz digitizers
[19:47:44] <andypugh> Though it had been happily doing the same job (running an engine dynamometer) 24/7 since 1985.
[19:48:09] <jdh> mine have been running off the same floppy disk since the early 90s
[19:48:21] <pfred1> yeah you can't get a modern PC to last that many years
[19:48:42] <andypugh> Those Lisas still boot :-)
[19:49:07] <pfred1> I have an 8086 that still booted the last time I tried
[19:49:16] <pfred1> although I did have to spin up the HDD by hand on it
[19:49:35] <pfred1> it had a bit of a stiction issue
[19:49:46] <andypugh> zenek: How far is 7i80 from being merged? I am not up to date on the requirements.
[19:50:01] <pfred1> but you can access the spindle from outside it and get it with a pencil eraser like an indian starting a fire
[19:50:37] <Tom_itx> i had the lid off a 20meg segate to figure out why it wasn't working n all... turned out to be the power plug so i soldered it up, put the lid back on and it worked for another 6-8 yrs
[19:51:53] <pfred1> I found a PC called a Nirtostar? and it only has 2 5.35 floppy drives I bet if I had boot disks for it it might run
[19:51:58] <pfred1> Northstar
[19:52:14] <pfred1> when I fired it up it displayed a prompt
[19:53:01] <pfred1> it is a Z-80
[19:53:56] <andypugh> I had a Hitech-10 that I pulled out of a skip. As a comparision it cost exactly the same as a Lisa..
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whitechapel_Computer_Works
[19:55:02] <andypugh> You have to love a computer manufacturer that names models after HHGTTG (MG1 after the Milliard Gargantubrain) with an OS called 42-nix.
[19:55:08] <pfred1> that is it? the whole machine?
[19:56:31] <micges> andypugh: it will be not merged until xenomai port will be merged
[19:57:06] <andypugh> micges: Ah, so RTAI falls into the "too hard" category?
[19:57:07] <pfred1> is LinuxCNC going to use different realtime than RTAI?
[19:57:28] <micges> now 7i80 is xenomai only for now
[19:57:28] <pfred1> hey i just built RTAI and it was no picnic
[19:57:36] <andypugh> pfred1: Optionally, yes.
[19:58:38] <micges> andypugh: for now yes, I'll retry after next rtai version
[19:58:55] <pfred1> I couldn't even get the RTAI CVS to compile
[19:59:03] <pfred1> stuff is a mess
[19:59:31] <pfred1> they don't call it magma for nothing
[20:00:50] <pfred1> there does seem to be one fellow that is forking RTAI to a git now
[20:01:21] <andypugh> Does the 7i80 work through a switch? I am trying to imagine what the max pin count is..
[20:01:47] <micges> no idea, didn't test that yet
[20:02:47] <andypugh> At some point I guess you hit the Gigabit Ethernet / 1mS servo thread point. So I guess if you want more than a million pins you would need two ports.
[21:30:06] <jdh> I just broke 2 end mills :(
[21:30:29] <Jymmm> DO IT AGAIN! DO IT AGAIN!
[21:30:44] <jdh> I thought about it
[21:30:47] <Jymmm> oh wait... DONT DO THAT!
[21:31:00] <jdh> being cold and in a hurry leads to bad decisions
[21:36:13] <Tom_itx> keep your fingers away from those decisions
[22:32:54] <mgb_> Howdy. First time caller.... :)
[22:33:11] <mgb_> using livecd 10.04/parallel port driver
[22:33:23] <jdh> welcome to the show
[22:33:29] <mgb_> thanks.
[22:33:41] <mgb_> using stepconf to create initial config
[22:33:55] <mgb_> during that process there is a "test this axis" button.
[22:34:06] <jdh> and a fine button it is.
[22:34:28] <mgb_> I was hoping I could use that to verify the settings...but it doesn't seem to cause anything to happen....except some bit of noise....no movement
[22:34:37] <mgb_> so it seems everything is talking....just not in the right way.
[22:34:47] <jdh> are your step timing set correctly?
[22:34:55] <jdh> got docs for the drives?
[22:35:08] <mgb_> That is a bit of a puzzle...
[22:35:24] <archivist> do you have pull ups on the parallel port pins
[22:35:46] <mgb_> not sure what a pullup would look like...
[22:36:17] <jdh> what kind of drivers are you using?
[22:37:04] <mgb_> Yes. That is correct.
[22:37:20] <mgb_> not my gear...working on it for a friend...who has less knowledge than I
[22:37:39] <mgb_> Does tb6560 help?
[22:38:31] <jdh> 3 or 4 axis chinese tb6560 board?
[22:39:53] <jdh> make sure the pin-outs match your stepconfig settings (each axis step/dir), check timings (plenty of info on web for 6560 timings, be conservative)
[22:39:59] <mgb_> http://www.savebase.com/infobase/downloads/TB6560/TB6560_3axis_Driver.doc maybe helps?
[22:40:18] <jdh> do the motors lock-up when the board is powered?
[22:40:21] <mgb_> three axis
[22:40:57] <mgb_> although the manual controller looks like it has a fourth C-/C+ set of buttons...
[22:42:33] <jdh> they are generic
[22:42:47] <mgb_> it just dawned on me as I'm reading the info again, that possibly the amperage for the motors is not set right....
[22:43:17] <jdh> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?TB6560
[22:44:21] <mgb_> Thanks jdh...I'll start there.
[22:53:41] <mgb_> The tb6560 hal files go in the config dir, what about the rf* files?
[22:54:11] <mgb_> rf-30_1.hal and rf-30_1.ini to be exact
[23:12:00] <mgb_> What is the preferred driver board?
[23:12:58] <r00t4rd3d> tb6560 for cheap, Gecko 540 for better/more
[23:13:30] <mgb_> so lots of folks use the tb6560?
[23:13:41] <r00t4rd3d> yeah
[23:13:44] <r00t4rd3d> I do
[23:13:57] <r00t4rd3d> a few others here do
[23:14:05] <mgb_> any way I can manually control the board from within linuxcnc?
[23:14:14] <r00t4rd3d> yeah
[23:14:18] <r00t4rd3d> the arrow keys
[23:14:20] <mgb_> I just want to ensure that the software is talking to the board.
[23:14:43] <mgb_> you mean from the physically connected control device?
[23:14:53] <mgb_> or from the keyboard on the computer...
[23:14:57] <r00t4rd3d> keyboard
[23:15:35] <r00t4rd3d> arrow keys move your X and Y Page Up/Down controls your Z
[23:15:44] <r00t4rd3d> shift is turbo
[23:16:24] <mgb_> hmmmm...doesn't move the motors at all, no noise as if it is trying....
[23:16:43] <r00t4rd3d> second icon in from the left, red button
[23:16:55] <mgb_> Yep. Pressed that....
[23:17:06] <mgb_> then pressed the power looking button.
[23:17:16] <r00t4rd3d> where did you get the info for stepconf?
[23:17:33] <mgb_> did use it..downloaded config files from wiki
[23:17:41] <mgb_> didn't use it....
[23:18:08] <r00t4rd3d> you got the parallel cable and power hooked up ?
[23:18:22] <mgb_> yep.
[23:19:33] <mgb_> the manual controller that is hooked up has all lights on...that doesn't seem good.
[23:19:39] <r00t4rd3d> run stepconf again and check against these settings
[23:19:41] <r00t4rd3d> http://www.georgegardner.info/software/tb6560-ebay-3-axis-driver-and-linuxcnc-emc.html
[23:20:55] <r00t4rd3d> just choose to open your existing conf and find the ini file you first made with it
[23:21:13] <mgb_> I'll run stepconf with those settings.
[23:21:20] <r00t4rd3d> its what I used
[23:22:09] <r00t4rd3d> your xyz stuff will obviously be somewhat different
[23:22:57] <mgb_> do all the led lights from the blue manual controller come on when you are using yours?
[23:23:34] <r00t4rd3d> yeah
[23:23:43] <mgb_> k
[23:23:45] <r00t4rd3d> wait, i dont have the manual remote
[23:24:20] <r00t4rd3d> you talking about this?
[23:24:21] <r00t4rd3d> http://www.ebay.com/itm/5-Axis-Handle-Remote-Controller-For-5-Axis-TB6560-Stepper-Driver-Board-/221165453837?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item337e7d020d
[23:24:45] <mgb_> yep
[23:24:53] <r00t4rd3d> dont have it
[23:25:11] <r00t4rd3d> i personally would unhook that till i got just the board working
[23:26:05] <r00t4rd3d> dont ever unhook your motors when the board is powered either
[23:31:56] <mgb_> It doesn't work when the parallel port is active anyway.
[23:32:22] <mgb_> Changing the pinouts was the key.
[23:32:30] <r00t4rd3d> working now?
[23:32:40] <mgb_> How in the heck would I have ever figured out what pins were where?
[23:32:42] <mgb_> yes.
[23:32:52] <r00t4rd3d> they are listed in the maunual
[23:32:57] <mgb_> X Y and Z are wrong for the moment...
[23:33:07] <mgb_> no manual...only dorky CD.
[23:33:07] <r00t4rd3d> reversed?
[23:33:48] <r00t4rd3d> in the Parallel Conf part of stepconf you can invert the axis if they are reversed
[23:34:51] <mgb_> not reversed...X is Z, Y is X, etc.
[23:35:00] <mgb_> I can just change pinouts..no biggie.
[23:35:09] <mgb_> This is what I needed to keep moving forward.
[23:35:24] <mgb_> Thanks so much for the help and not saying RTFM....
[23:35:39] <mgb_> I'm willing to, just didn't know what I needed to be reading about!!! :)
[23:36:11] <mgb_> I'm going to see if I could have found the pinouts in the documentation that I have......now that I know what works.
[23:36:38] <r00t4rd3d> http://www.fozztexx.com/CNC/HY-TB3DV-M_3Axis_Driver.pdf
[23:36:47] <r00t4rd3d> that manual lists the pins right under the picture
[23:39:35] <AR__> oh that driver :)
[23:39:39] <AR__> i have one sitting right here
[23:40:47] <r00t4rd3d> id buy another one
[23:41:04] <r00t4rd3d> mines made me hundreds
[23:41:25] <AR__> :D
[23:41:30] <r00t4rd3d> not bad for $39.95
[23:41:41] <AR__> when i bought it, it was over $75 :(
[23:41:46] <r00t4rd3d> lol
[23:41:58] <AR__> about 2 years ago
[23:42:02] <r00t4rd3d> i got the newest revision at the time
[23:42:21] <AR__> the diy CNC scene has really blown up lately
[23:43:00] <AR__> i dont even know what the different revisions are or what mine is
[23:43:19] <AR__> i blew one of the tb6560s on it right when i first got it
[23:43:29] <AR__> but replaced it and it has worked fine ever since
[23:43:46] <AR__> until recently, the Z axis is not running smoothly in one direction
[23:43:49] <AR__> very strange
[23:43:54] <mgb_> Thanks again r00t
[23:44:16] <r00t4rd3d> np
[23:44:31] <r00t4rd3d> see the newest ones?
[23:44:31] <r00t4rd3d> http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-3-Axis-TB6560-Motor-Driver-Stepper-Board-Controller-With-Box-For-CNC-Router-/380604303957?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item589dc8ca55
[23:44:39] <AR__> it is definitely a problem with the driver board, because all other axis work fine with the same motor
[23:44:51] <AR__> and i tried with EMC and mach3
[23:45:28] <AR__> and the Z axis gets really choppy in one direction
[23:45:34] <mgb_> ok. Had I decifered the Mach3 manual information, I probably could have figured it out.... Just never looked in there cause I wasn't planning on using it.
[23:46:47] <r00t4rd3d> what machine do you have? DIY or a kit
[23:47:27] <AR__> they have evolved
[23:47:33] <r00t4rd3d> yeah
[23:47:49] <AR__> mine is the one pictured in te manual
[23:47:52] <r00t4rd3d> i like how the new ones estop and limit setup is
[23:48:04] <AR__> yeah
[23:48:29] <r00t4rd3d> i might try onhe
[23:48:30] <r00t4rd3d> one
[23:48:52] <AR__> i'd just buy geckos or something at this point
[23:49:34] <AR__> you can get the little ones for $65 per axis
[23:50:05] <r00t4rd3d> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Gecko-Diver-G540-4-Axis-Driver-/290884676661?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item43ba13ec35
[23:50:15] <r00t4rd3d> buy me that
[23:50:29] <AR__> yeah i wish
[23:51:17] <AR__> it's funny that even that only is limited to 3.5A output
[23:51:40] <AR__> so you cant use it for really big motors
[23:51:59] <r00t4rd3d> http://www.ebay.com/itm/gecko-g251x-stepper-motor-driver-4-cnc-milling-machine-mill-lathe-router-/160720512970?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item256bb067ca
[23:52:05] <r00t4rd3d> those the ones you talking about?
[23:52:11] <AR__> yeah
[23:52:52] <AR__> i mean if you are buying 3 you may as well just get a g540
[23:53:33] <r00t4rd3d> save almost 100
[23:54:16] <r00t4rd3d> how you hook them little ones to a parallel cable?
[23:54:36] <r00t4rd3d> nvm
[23:55:49] <AR__> just like the other geckos'
[23:55:57] <AR__> you need to break out the connections
[23:56:12] <AR__> that is what i like about the chinese tb6560 board
[23:56:15] <r00t4rd3d> tb6560
[23:56:18] <AR__> all in the parallel
[23:56:19] <r00t4rd3d> fk it
[23:56:21] <AR__> cable
[23:56:23] <AR__> lol
