#linuxcnc | Logs for 2013-02-02

[01:16:27] <Jymmm> Connor: Why do you ask?
[02:08:53] <DJ9DJ> moin
[02:24:20] <JesusAlos_> hello people
[02:32:53] <alex4nder> hey
[02:33:12] <JesusAlos_> I trying my new 7i77 card
[02:33:38] <JesusAlos_> and when comunicate with linuxcnc, there are a green led blinking
[02:33:44] <JesusAlos_> is normal?
[03:16:44] <JesusAlos_> hello
[04:17:43] <mrsun> hmm watching a video where a guy single point threads ... and it has me a bit worried ... as he threads i can see the difference in the "ridge" width of the screw he makes ... i guess it could be due to runout in the part or something or is this a fenomenon that comes with screw cutting in a lathe ?
[05:13:42] <Loetmichel> mornin'
[06:04:54] <jthornton> morning
[06:14:47] <Icekiller> !seen IchGuckLive
[06:14:48] <the_wench> Never heard of the entity you ask for
[06:15:13] <Icekiller> anyone here know any place that sells second hand ballscrews in europe? (benelux/germany)
[06:17:21] <fragalot> no idea about secondhand
[06:17:25] <fragalot> but here's the links he's given me
[06:17:30] <Jymmm> http://SecondHandBallscrews.de/
[06:17:47] <fragalot> http://stores.ebay.de/cnc-discount
[06:17:58] <fragalot> url dunwerk
[06:19:12] <jthornton> ngcgui in touchy http://imagebin.org/245192
[07:02:49] <sirdancealot1> Icekiller, http://aukro.cz/1x-kulickovy-sroub-16x5-255-vcetne-matice-cnc-i2997412028.html
[07:04:30] <sirdancealot1> i wanna buy an eshapeoko, done a research a few months ago, does anyone know if anything similarly sturdy and cheap turned up since then?
[07:04:35] <sirdancealot1> or is that offtopic here?:)
[07:07:34] <Tecan> usb 2-8: FTDI USB Serial Device converter now attached to ttyUSB0
[07:08:22] <sirdancealot1> Icekiller, oops, those are actually new.
[07:09:20] <Icekiller> sirdancealot1
[07:09:25] <Icekiller> how big are they in that add?
[07:09:28] <Icekiller> 255mm?
[07:09:43] <Icekiller> cause its pretty affordable
[07:09:50] <Icekiller> 40euro
[07:10:09] <sirdancealot1> yes 255
[07:10:44] <sirdancealot1> i dunno much about this stuff so dunno, but i bought some linear bearings from this guy
[07:15:36] <Icekiller> sirdancealot1
[07:15:37] <Icekiller> pm plz
[07:23:02] <Icekiller> anyone know if
[07:23:05] <Icekiller> ichgucklive is aregular
[07:28:50] <Valen> i get stuff from linearmotionbearings2008 off ebay
[07:33:27] <Icekiller> Valen thats chai right?
[07:33:45] <Valen> dunno, sounds vuagley familiar
[07:33:58] <Icekiller> what kind of ballscrews did you buy and wathc price?
[07:34:09] <Valen> rolled and cheap lol
[07:35:10] <Tecan> <elkng> http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p211/Bugbear2/42877x500jpeg.jpg is that for real ? lol
[07:36:16] <sirdancealot1> hahaah
[07:44:50] <Icekiller> hmm
[07:45:02] <Icekiller> Chai from linearmotionbearings2008 = 158usd incl shipping ><
[07:49:13] <Icekiller> anyone know why BK12's etc are so expensive xD
[07:53:57] <Jymmm> yes
[07:54:46] <Tom_itx> care to share your wealth of knowledge Jymmm bob
[07:55:08] <Jymmm> Sure, $20/each
[07:55:31] <Tom_itx> that's not a 'why' answer
[07:56:00] <Jymmm> Now, it'll cost ya $40 to find out.
[07:57:35] <sirdancealot1> ill rephrase it for $4
[07:58:05] <Jymmm> And I'll raise ya $80.
[07:59:24] <Jymmm> Do I hear $160 ???
[07:59:57] <sirdancealot1> does that mean you give me $80 to explain it?
[08:00:09] <Valen> have a spreadsheet with some fairly complex formulas in it, I'd like to make a graph of what happens to some outputs when i vary inputs over a range
[08:00:10] <fragalot> Jymmm: 80.01!
[08:00:16] <Valen> E something akin to a chart of the output of cell B4 when i vary cell A1 from 1 to 10 in increments of .5
[08:00:18] <Jymmm> As soon as I get $320 CBD
[08:00:18] <Valen> IE
[08:01:49] <sirdancealot1> ok look icekiller, when the nut moves in one direction, the screw must not move in the other. And you cant expect the stepper motor to hold that force. So theres not just a ball bearing in that stop. Am i right?
[08:02:19] <sirdancealot1> Valen, findafreelancer.com
[08:02:42] <Valen> I was hoping there was a button click solution to that problem sirdancealot1 ;->
[08:02:57] <sirdancealot1> "Pay with Paypal"
[08:03:03] <Jymmm> Valen: spreadsheet?
[08:03:37] <sirdancealot1> excel or something?
[08:03:38] <Valen> calculating acceleration of a mill with various motor, screw and gearing options
[08:03:42] <Valen> libreoffice
[08:03:47] <sirdancealot1> excel engineering
[08:03:59] <sirdancealot1> i suppose a few lines of scripting could do it
[08:04:09] <Valen> I have it working out single points, but I would like to see pretty graphs
[08:04:30] <Valen> yeah it probably could but I was thinking i cant be the first person to want to do this
[08:05:33] <sirdancealot1> thats why the script can probably be found online
[08:06:15] <sirdancealot1> lets see.
[08:07:42] <Tecan> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=suYz5SHFHyA << Seagulls on Laxatives Prank
[08:08:02] <sirdancealot1> hm. it does use VB..lol
[08:08:12] <Valen> don't worry about it too much sirdancealot1
[08:08:23] <Valen> I'll just boolean search it ;->
[08:08:34] <Valen> theres like 6 interrelated variables anyway
[08:08:46] <sirdancealot1> Valen, http://suite101.com/article/using-macros-to-automate-openoffice-calc-a58918
[08:08:46] <sirdancealot1> cool
[08:08:52] <Valen> hmm
[08:08:58] <jdh> I see 32f here
[08:09:02] <jdh> <urk>
[08:09:07] <Valen> theres 2 outputs, acceleration and top speed
[08:09:28] <Valen> inputs are screw lead, and gear ratio
[08:09:39] <sirdancealot1> mmm electric fly swatter
[08:09:54] <Valen> well I've got the mill pulling 4G at the moment lol
[08:10:18] <Valen> going from the 2kgcm rotating motor to the .7 has made a rather large difference
[08:10:20] <jdh> that seems high
[08:10:21] <Valen> (inertia)
[08:10:56] <Jymmm> Valen: http://www.twospoke.com/forum/f41/building-motor-spreadsheet-5491/
[08:11:06] <Valen> thats a 3.6NM motor pushing a 30KG table with a 2:1 gear reduction on a 10mm lead
[08:11:25] <Valen> I'm not building the motor
[08:11:28] <Jymmm> Valen: http://www.cameronsoftware.com/ev/EV_CalculateMotorSize.html
[08:11:29] <Valen> i'm selecting the motor
[08:11:57] <Jymmm> Valen: http://www.amphibike.org/index.cgi?page=pages/3_wheels/mr2/analysis
[08:12:42] <Valen> jdh: with a more powerful motor (7.2NM but 2.05kg/cm) I'm seeing less acceleration (1.6G) , I need to check
[08:12:46] <Valen> Jymmm: stop
[08:12:56] <Jymmm> Valen: http://www.diyelectriccar.com/forums/showthread.php/dc-motor-charts-ev-performance-spreadsheet-41565.html
[08:13:09] <Valen> Jymmm: stop
[08:13:33] <Jymmm> Valen: http://www.electricmotors.machinedesign.com/guiEdits/Content/bdeee1/bdeee1_2.aspx
[08:14:01] <Valen> somebody tell me when Jymmm has stopped, i just put him on my blocklist
[08:14:25] <jdh> I have a simplistic understanding of 'G' in this context. but, 1.6G is 51.2ft/s^2.... so if you accelerate at 1.6G for 1 second, you move really far?
[08:14:51] <Valen> jdh 15 meters
[08:14:59] <Valen> sorry
[08:15:07] <Valen> yes
[08:16:28] <Valen> half that actually
[08:16:53] <Valen> so 7 meters
[08:17:45] <Valen> though that sounds in the ball park, imagine a 1HP motor lifting a 30KG weight
[08:17:50] <Valen> (bag of concrete)
[08:18:25] <Valen> now imagine you are maxing out that 1HP motor, so its actually putting out more like 2.5HP
[08:20:45] <Valen> it'd lift that concrete up 2 stories in a second or so
[08:28:01] <Valen> though of course you cant actually hit that speed
[08:28:20] <Valen> you hit the top speed of the screw/motor pretty damn fast
[08:29:01] <Valen> .8 of a second to 17 meters a minute lol
[08:36:38] <jdh> 17meters/second
[11:18:06] <r00t4rd3d> My network consumed 81.5gb of data last month
[11:18:31] <IchGuckLive> hi all B)
[11:20:06] <IchGuckLive> i need a english translation of a Electricel issue as i cand under stand it as it is written
[11:20:29] <IchGuckLive> Normally open. Dry contact closure when the arc transfers.
[11:20:31] <IchGuckLive> 120 VAC/1 A maximum at the machine interface relay or switching device
[11:20:32] <IchGuckLive> (supplied by the customer).
[11:21:16] <IchGuckLive> dies this mean the relay inside the Plasma its a powermay 45 takes my 24V on the one plug and puts it back on the other
[11:21:56] <pcw_home> Yes
[11:22:03] <IchGuckLive> AH THANKS
[11:22:50] <IchGuckLive> so it is so easy as it shoudt be
[11:24:51] <pcw_home> yeah its just a mechanical switch as far as interfacing goes
[11:25:28] <IchGuckLive> pcw_home: Thanks one more question on the BOB side as im now runing low on pins
[11:26:18] <IchGuckLive> i got 5 Amps on 2 output pns i want to go for pin 1 to activate all via a 5V relay
[11:26:47] <IchGuckLive> the same protected module as i showed yesterday 24V
[11:28:31] <IchGuckLive> how do i conect the isoladet opo pin 1 to the relay to activate the amps AMPS wirering is clear 5V to ENA+ ENA- to Relay com and NO to Gnd
[11:30:31] <IchGuckLive> i guess its 5V to A1 of the Relay and A2 to the parport pin (optocopler)
[11:35:21] <IchGuckLive> we shoudt realy have this info in our wikipage
[11:35:27] <pcw_home> will the optocoupler drive the (5V) relay?
[11:35:34] <IchGuckLive> yes
[11:35:42] <IchGuckLive> 25mA
[11:38:06] <pcw_home> Which BOB? it may be marginal to drive a 5V relay via a optocoupler (that may have ~1V drop if its a Darlington type coupler)
[11:38:49] <IchGuckLive> Yes BOB
[11:39:29] <IchGuckLive> i got 2 Amps one one BOB optokopler pin
[11:40:08] <pcw_home> Amps meaning step drive?
[11:40:27] <IchGuckLive> yes leadshine M542
[11:41:15] <IchGuckLive> so 5V to realy coil relax coil to the pin
[11:41:55] <pcw_home> I don't really understand, why are you using a relay here?
[11:42:13] <IchGuckLive> can i go for all 6Amps to one optocopler
[11:42:48] <IchGuckLive> i dont think so
[11:43:04] <IchGuckLive> i need one output freed
[11:43:13] <IchGuckLive> for the ARC Start
[11:43:29] <pcw_home> Maybe, so the leadshine and ENA+ and ENA -?
[11:43:48] <IchGuckLive> yes
[11:43:50] <pcw_home> s/and/has/
[11:44:02] <pcw_home> so they are floating
[11:44:25] <IchGuckLive> all 5 amp ENA+ are at 5V
[11:45:17] <IchGuckLive> and 2 eatch togeter of the 6 are conected to a pin on the BOB
[11:46:19] <IchGuckLive> dont you think it will work with this relay conection
[11:46:40] <IchGuckLive> direct better to use a Transistor in between
[11:47:23] <IchGuckLive> as i plan also the ARC start must go thrue a relay
[11:47:27] <pcw_home> Yeah its an overload for a 25 mA opto to drive all in parallel
[11:48:00] <IchGuckLive> the opto takes 60mA acording to the datasheed
[11:48:40] <pcw_home> BOB opto? That depends on how hard the LED is driven
[11:48:52] <IchGuckLive> BOB opto
[11:50:00] <IchGuckLive> the led is driven by a HCT74014
[11:50:10] <IchGuckLive> i tink or a 74013
[11:50:21] <IchGuckLive> as a standard BOB uses this
[11:50:37] <pcw_home> So if they specify 25 mA max and M542 logic is spec'ed as 10 mA you can only legally drive 2
[11:50:39] <pcw_home> but a single NPN transistor would boost the current enough
[11:51:10] <IchGuckLive> ok
[11:51:37] <IchGuckLive> its 60mA on the opo alowed the relay got 25mA so i go for it
[11:51:41] <pcw_home> another option is to wire all the m542 enables in series (you have 6 right?)
[11:51:43] <pcw_home> and run from 24V
[11:52:18] <pcw_home> so now you only switch 10 mA
[11:52:31] <IchGuckLive> i hot no 24V only 5V in the system the 24V are only in the Limit and homeswich box
[11:53:20] <IchGuckLive> i will switch all the amps true a relay
[11:53:29] <IchGuckLive> this is the best way to do it
[11:53:30] <pcw_home> well NPN transistor and ~220 ohm base resistor will do as wel
[11:54:26] <IchGuckLive> but relay does not need PCB
[11:54:39] <IchGuckLive> just wire
[11:55:32] <pcw_home> Yeah but it may be questionable to drive a 5V relay with a Darlington OPTO
[11:56:04] <pcw_home> But worth a try
[11:56:21] <IchGuckLive> Thanks
[11:56:23] <pcw_home> as long ast its not more than the 25 mA or so
[11:56:30] <Tom_itx> how much current on the relay contacts?
[11:56:50] <pcw_home> 60 mA or so
[11:56:51] <Tom_itx> HE101 will drive from logic and has builtin diodes
[11:56:56] <IchGuckLive> i mesured today 24mA in direct meter connect
[11:56:58] <Tom_itx> pc mount
[11:57:08] <Tom_itx> hamlin relay
[11:57:30] <pcw_home> geez I should make a circuit board with 1 transistor
[11:58:34] <Tom_itx> hide it in a black box and charge a premium for it
[11:58:44] <pcw_home> OPTO-Boost (TM)
[12:02:03] <IchGuckLive> so ENA- -> C E-> GND
[12:02:15] <IchGuckLive> and B via 220Ohm to port
[12:02:58] <pcw_home> Is this a bare port pin?
[12:03:07] <IchGuckLive> no BOB
[12:03:33] <IchGuckLive> the standar BOB we all here using
[12:03:53] <IchGuckLive> C10 for instance
[12:05:41] <pcw_home> Yeah should work, If you have a good 5V signal from a BOB I would use 470 Ohms or so instead
[12:06:51] <IchGuckLive> http://www.mechapro.de/pdf/hsopto_doku_20.pdf THIS is the BOB
[12:08:11] <IchGuckLive> HCPL2630
[12:08:48] <pcw_home> 470 Ohm is ~9 mA base current so pretty much guaranteed 100 mA sink current at collector (2n3904 or equiv) if you use a 5V output
[12:09:53] <IchGuckLive> let me get the Tansitor box i stored 10years ago
[12:13:12] <anonimasu> http://ah.io23.net/ul/files/IMG0126A.jpg todays work :)
[12:13:57] <IchGuckLive> pcw_home: i got some BD135
[12:15:09] <IchGuckLive> Emitter-Base Voltage 5V that sounds write
[12:16:45] <IchGuckLive> pcw_home: what is the number i shoudt lock for bas curent
[12:16:58] <Loetmichel> hmm, wouldnt a BC547 or such be better for that?
[12:17:14] <IchGuckLive> i only got this NPN
[12:17:14] <Loetmichel> or a BC 337 if more power is needed
[12:17:15] <pcw_home> Oops those are open collector so you may need to put the base resistor as a pullup
[12:17:16] <pcw_home> I cant read the schematics but it looks like the optos have 4.7K pullups
[12:17:36] <pcw_home> BD135 should be fine
[12:18:05] <Loetmichel> pcw_home: bd135 has a HFE of 80 or so IIRC
[12:18:09] <Loetmichel> is that sufficient?
[12:18:59] <pcw_home> Yes just need to boost OPTO output to drive 60 MA (paralleled step drive enables)
[12:19:26] <IchGuckLive> thanks PCW i talk to loetmichel in german
[12:21:22] <pcw_home> base resistor goes from 5V to base BOB OPTO output connects to base directly (since BOB OPTO outputs are open collector with weak pullup)
[12:23:49] <IchGuckLive> i found a BC337 on a aplication board i will solder this to my new Enable Board
[12:24:01] <IchGuckLive> let me do a Eagle PCB shematic
[12:38:47] <IchGuckLive> pcw_home: http://imagebin.org/245237
[12:38:52] <IchGuckLive> is this ok so
[13:11:49] <pcw_home> You might put another 470 Ohm resistor from OPTO PIN 7 to 5V (since the OPTO is open collector so does not drive high)
[13:17:32] <Icekiller> anyone know if theres a way to use ballscrews without those expensives bk12's etc?
[13:24:27] <skunkworks> Icekiller, make your own?
[14:14:00] <r00t4rd3d> time to see if i can stuff ubuntu 10.04 on a 2gb ssd
[14:14:53] <r00t4rd3d> probably have to start out with the minimum net install
[14:15:03] <r00t4rd3d> or lubuntu
[14:38:34] <anonimasu> what would e-470 steel be named in the US?
[14:42:24] <Loetmichel> pcw_home: hrhr, i just wanted to blame you for the ichgucklives query, until i saw he made that decision himself instead of being asked by You. :-)
[14:51:17] <r00t4rd3d> fuck me, the ssd i ordered has a 2mm usb header on it instead of the standard 2.54mm usb header
[14:52:42] <r00t4rd3d> now i gotta make a custom header
[14:58:03] <andypugh> Seems odd
[14:58:20] <andypugh> it isn't "close enough" in any sense?
[15:03:25] <r00t4rd3d> no
[15:07:45] <jdh> http://www.logicsupply.com/products/usbhdr200254
[15:10:51] <jdh> I finally put my new D525 box on my router... [ 390.161635] RTAPI: ERROR: Unexpected realtime delay on task 1
[15:13:58] <pcw_home> what thread times?
[15:15:43] <jdh> 20000 base, 1000000 servo
[15:15:55] <jdh> task 1 is base?
[15:16:00] <chopper79> Got a quick question, well I hope its quick anyway. Everytime I make a I make a change in my .hal or .ini and try to restart EMC2 I receive an error report. Tracking it down it seems to be loosing the parport adress or parport in general and will only allow me to start EMC2 again after I restart my computer. I have also noticed this to be on multiple different computers and not one particular motherboard or hardware setu
[15:17:21] <chopper79> The next question I have is that EMC2 will freeze up sometimes or just shut down in the middle of a gcode run. Not sure why it would randomly shut down and be at my desktop and then I can not start EMC2 again unti I reboot. Any ideas on both questions
[15:18:01] <pcw_home> jdh : Dont know about tasks. Did you do the isolcpus trick? (since 50 KHz base thread is pretty high)
[15:19:11] <jdh> haven't tried isolcpus. That involves grub config?
[15:19:26] <pcw_home> chopper79: sounds like a hardware issue
[15:19:33] <andypugh> chopper79: What is the error report?
[15:19:51] <jdh> emc/axis just exited, but everything else was running?
[15:21:05] <andypugh> jdh: I get that if the webcam is plugged in. Otherwise my Atom board is very solid.
[15:21:18] <jdh> just ignore it?
[15:21:31] <jdh> I have no USB in use. I do have a pci wifi card though
[15:22:01] <andypugh> I don't think those cause a problem, though you could try seeing if it still happens without it.
[15:22:04] <chopper79> The error after a .hal or .ini change is my-mill: 8 which comes down to the parport. When EMC2 crashes there is no report
[15:22:34] <andypugh> chopper79: What is the exact wording?
[15:23:01] <andypugh> You could try accessing the parport by index, rather than base address, too.
[15:23:55] <jdh> live-cd install or something else?
[15:24:03] <pcw_home> also look at dmesg after a crash
[15:24:26] <jdh> and/or run linuxcnc from a terminal window
[15:24:34] <andypugh> chopper79: It sounds like LinuxCNC might not be exiting correctly before restarting. What happens is you just pretend to edit the HAL / INI?
[15:28:25] * anonimasu yawns
[15:28:36] <anonimasu> I hope I find a dead accurate old vmc sometime soon.
[15:28:38] <anonimasu> with enclosure!
[15:31:59] <chopper79> @andy.... I dont remeber the exact message, but I know it will happen only after and .hal or .ini change and its always my-mill.hal : 7 which is line 7 in the .hal and is the parport address line in that .hal file. Takes a restart to get it going again. If I pretend to make a change it will still do it, such as open the .hal file after I close EMC and then restart. I feel its something with shut down or startup of the pr
[15:33:26] <andypugh> It does sound like a shutdown/exit bug really
[15:34:03] <andypugh> Either hal_parport not exiting, or lp or some other system parport module loading on the second go.
[15:34:17] <andypugh> Try blacklisting lp?
[15:35:24] <chopper79> I have not
[15:36:22] <andypugh> As a starting point, start and exit LinuxCNC, then do an lsmod to see if anything parport-y is still loaded
[15:37:19] <chopper79> If it is then?
[15:40:08] <jdh> then rmmod it if you can
[15:40:34] <jdh> I added isolcpus and changed base time to 25000 and it hasn't delayed.
[15:40:50] <andypugh> rmmod them, then see if that lets LinuxCNC start, and if so consider blacklisting the offending module. Unless you plan on using the parport for a printer...
[15:42:26] <jdh> novel concept
[15:46:04] <chopper79> @andy.... Sounds good I will give it a shot. Any clue on EMC crashing in the middle of a gcode run? The computer is still up, but when EMC crashes I have the desktop and can not restart EMC until reboot?
[15:46:36] <cradek> chopper79: look in dmesg for an error in that case. also, run memtest overnight because you probably have a hardware problem.
[15:52:09] <chopper79> @cradek....I understand. the only thing is I have tried multiple hard ware congiurations and some are better then others, but still the problem is there. No common between any of the hardware setups.
[15:52:27] <andypugh> Anyway, sleep time. Night all
[15:52:35] <pcw_home> 'nite
[15:52:36] <chopper79> Night... thank andy
[15:52:40] <cradek> then definitely look for the error in dmesg
[15:53:21] <chopper79> I will copy the whole message monday and I will post it up here fo ryou all to look at and see what I am overlooking if that ok?
[15:53:44] <cradek> sounds good, best way to share that is to use pastebin.com
[15:53:57] <chopper79> ok will do.
[15:55:10] <chopper79> Well off to go hang some drywall in my workshop at home. Thanks everyone and I will post the message monday.
[16:08:11] <r00t4rd3d> anyone ever see a USA supplier for these:
[16:08:11] <r00t4rd3d> http://pcpartsandcables.com//product_info.php?cPath=34&products_id=112&osCsid=489f0a3f7942f7560810b7154a39bca0
[16:13:09] <MercuryRising> so if i want to make a custom M code, i just name the file i want to execute the M code I want (like M110), and then put it on my path so linuxcnc can call it?
[16:13:24] <MercuryRising> then when the file exits, linuxcnc continues on its way?
[16:13:48] <cradek> MercuryRising: you put it in the gcode directory, not in your path. but otherwise, yes you are right
[16:14:29] <MercuryRising> what's the gcode directory? the directory that the gcode file with the custom m codes is in?
[16:24:02] <pcw_home> r00t4rd3d: the reverse adapter seems much more common :-(
[16:25:57] <Nick001-Shop> Using a 7i30 card,can I tap the +5v aux connection to drive a couple of small relays?
[16:28:06] <Jymmm> Nick001-Shop: Is this card in a computer?
[16:28:55] <r00t4rd3d> ya
[16:29:19] <Jymmm> Nick001-Shop: If so, why not just use one of the HDD power lines +5V supply? Usually they are rated at 20A and it's the RED wire, the YELLOW is +12V.
[16:29:44] <Nick001-Shop> hooked to a mesa 5i20 which is a pci card. The 7i30 card is also supplying +5v to the encoders
[16:30:23] <Nick001-Shop> didn't want to run another tap line outside the box
[16:32:31] <pcw_home> Depends on encoder power and flat cable length
[16:32:33] <pcw_home> probably 75 ma or so would be OK
[16:36:13] <Nick001-Shop> the relays are a 2 relay card - relays aren't marked for draw-just 5v drive. they measure about 1/2 x 3/4"
[16:36:18] <Jymmm> pcw_home: 75ma INCLUDING the encoders?
[16:36:43] <DJ9DJ> gn8
[16:39:10] <Nick001-Shop> flat cable is 24"
[16:44:58] <Nick001-Shop> If I draw more than the 75ma, will the card shut down or will it get damaged?
[16:48:52] <pcw_home> No but you may pull the 5V down enough that you will have problems with the encoders
[16:49:27] <pcw_home> (suggested max is 400 mA including encoders and < 3 ft cable)
[16:52:06] <Nick001-Shop> Do I just measure the 5v and if it's dropping - supply the 5v to the aux plug? Do I have to disconnect pin 49 somehow if I supply the 5v to aux
[16:52:31] <JesusAlos> Hi
[16:53:07] <JesusAlos> Is possible change PNP input 7i77 card to NPN?
[17:06:36] <pcw_home> Nick001-Shop Yes you dont need to disconnect if its from the same source (PC)
[17:06:38] <pcw_home> the 5I20 has a 5V terminal block you can steal it from (better than a DISK drive connector as its got a PTC)
[17:08:27] <pcw_home> JesusAlos: 7I77 digital outputs are PNP (drive grounded loads), inputs are NPN (need + source to indicate '1')
[17:16:32] <Nick001-Shop> getting the 5i20 manual - maybe - modem is dead slow
[17:32:17] <Nick001-Shop> Found that terminal block - How much ma can I draw from that? Dumb one - what's a PTC?
[17:46:17] <Jymmm> a resetable fuse
[17:46:31] <Jymmm> Nick001-Shop: PTC Fuse http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Resettable_fuse
[17:47:57] <Jymmm> Nick001-Shop: Not to be confused with: positive temperature coefficient (PTC) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Temperature_coefficient which are used in temp sensors
[17:51:27] <gene__> Hey guys, has the 0200 call [var] [var] syntax been changed recently?
[17:54:16] <gene__> I needed to cut a shelf, so I loaded up some code and modified it, but it reports unknown word where unary operator could be. IN line 51.
[17:54:48] <gene__> So I try to load a file that did work, maybe 8 or 9 months back, and get the exact same error
[17:55:05] <Nick001-Shop> Thanks for the info and link - identifies the gizmo on the card I was looking at.
[18:00:30] <cradek> gene__: pastebin your gcode.
[18:01:46] <pcw_home> Good for 3A or so
[18:05:47] <Nick001-Shop> That should drive 20 of these relays-)
[18:09:26] <gene__> cradek: http://pastebin.ca/2310154
[18:28:44] <Nick001> With the 5i20 in a PCI slot - do I still have the motherboard parport avilable for other uses?
[18:29:02] <gene__> yes
[18:31:56] <Nick001> good - that takes care other problems of output signals
[18:38:03] <gene__> cradek: I'm going to the house, frozen out for the night. I may just rewrite the whole thing
[18:38:49] <gene__> cradek: if you find it, reply on the list, and thanks a bunch for looking
[20:47:47] <ReadError> wow
[20:47:55] <ReadError> i cleaned out 3 massive spiders
[20:47:59] <ReadError> out of my linuxcnc box just now
[20:48:07] <ReadError> i need to make this into something sealed
[20:48:19] <ReadError> dont think this atom board makes much heat
[20:48:31] <ReadError> maybe some dust filters over the fans
[20:49:59] <Jymmm> You can have it your way at Burger King, sorta.... http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2271440/Burger-King-admits-selling-beef-burgers-Whoppers-containing-horse-meat.html#ixzz2JebzksUE
[20:57:38] <Connor> Anyone know much about safety relays?
[20:57:55] <Jymmm> why do you ask?
[20:58:17] <Connor> Looking at maybe using one instead of a SSR for Spindle.
[20:58:43] <Connor> Just don't know anything about them. They look rather large too.
[20:58:54] <Connor> I'm probably over thinking it.
[20:58:58] <ReadError> well crap
[20:59:09] <ReadError> ive managed to crash my box 2 times in a row now
[20:59:10] <Jymmm> Then, no I don't know nuttin bout em.
[20:59:15] <ReadError> editing and saving my .ini
[20:59:25] <ReadError> tainted gnome this last time
[20:59:35] <ReadError> may need to grab a SSD
[20:59:39] <ReadError> might as well get a new case...
[20:59:55] <Jymmm> Yeah, cause those thigns prevent a mobo from crashing.
[21:01:43] <ReadError> lol
[21:01:57] <ReadError> not really but this drive is probably hrmm, 7 years old?
[21:02:26] <ReadError> http://pastie.org/pastes/6031912/text
[21:03:12] <ReadError> its a 150GB SATA
[21:03:28] <ReadError> i know its seen better days
[21:13:29] <tjb1> Hello fellas
[21:13:46] <ReadError> sup brah
[21:14:42] <ReadError> hey tjb1
[21:14:47] <ReadError> you using backlash compensation ?
[21:14:50] <ReadError> for your plasma
[21:15:05] <tjb1> no
[21:15:09] <tjb1> Its down at the moment
[21:15:24] <ReadError> well when you had it up
[21:15:30] <ReadError> how was the backlash ?
[21:16:03] <tjb1> I never checked it
[21:16:25] <tjb1> It wasnt up very long
[21:19:03] <ReadError> i was thinking about getting those inductive endstops
[21:19:12] <ReadError> but hes out of stock right now..
[21:19:37] <tjb1> Ugh, dont get me started on those
[21:19:54] <tjb1> I dont know if its because I have $2 chinese ones or if the other computer sucked but mine werent working
[21:21:28] <ReadError> his have the LEDs and all that fancy stuff
[21:21:31] <ReadError> but expensive
[21:22:13] <tjb1> Mine have LEDs but I cant justify the $134 for one
[21:22:16] <tjb1> Thats what they are right?
[21:22:33] <ReadError> nah its 134 for the entire set
[21:22:35] <ReadError> like 5 of em
[21:22:38] <ReadError> and wires and crap
[21:22:40] <tjb1> Are you sure
[21:22:41] <ReadError> or 124
[21:23:02] <tjb1> Oh wow
[21:23:05] <tjb1> $129...
[21:23:17] <tjb1> I could do that, hell I thought it was $129 for 1
[21:23:31] <ReadError> http://www.cncrouterparts.com/proximity-limit-switch-kit-p-215.html
[21:23:31] <tjb1> Maybe a quality prox sensor would take care of my problem
[21:23:35] <ReadError> yea
[21:23:47] <ReadError> i mean with the brackets, wiring, sensors *5
[21:23:50] <ReadError> its not that bad
[21:23:52] <tjb1> They must work since he has them like that
[21:24:06] <tjb1> A lot of people say its bad to have them like that
[21:24:25] <ReadError> like how?
[21:24:37] <tjb1> Where the carriage can physically hit them
[21:25:01] <ReadError> well it looks like thin metal
[21:25:08] <ReadError> so im sure it can give if something isnt right
[21:25:43] <tjb1> Im sure I could buy just 3 switches off of him
[21:26:22] <tjb1> Im gonna guess they are roughly $20 each
[21:26:24] <ReadError> well if you have 4
[21:26:30] <ReadError> you can completely center it
[21:26:36] <tjb1> 4?
[21:26:38] <ReadError> yea
[21:26:44] <ReadError> 2 for x and y axis each
[21:26:45] <tjb1> I use 4 but I have 1 per axis and one on the floating head
[21:26:58] <tjb1> Why do you need 4?
[21:27:00] <ReadError> so yea, 5 would get you good and proper
[21:27:02] <tjb1> I use 1
[21:27:11] <tjb1> Dont mount the switch to the machine
[21:27:21] <ReadError> http://www.cncrouterparts.com/proximity-limit-switch-instructions-p-216.html
[21:27:21] <tjb1> Mount it to the carriage and put two triggers on
[21:27:32] <tjb1> Thats dumb
[21:27:37] <ReadError> ah
[21:27:44] <ReadError> so a piece of steel sticking out?
[21:27:48] <r00t4rd3d> limit switches are for girls
[21:27:52] <tjb1> I used socket head cap screws
[21:27:55] <ReadError> your mom is a girl
[21:27:56] <ReadError> wait...
[21:27:57] <tjb1> Let me see if I can find a picture
[21:28:05] <tjb1> Some of us use machines that have over 12" travel ;)
[21:28:20] <r00t4rd3d> all my axis have over 12
[21:28:26] <tjb1> 12.5?
[21:29:25] <tjb1> http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/530587_4469490131338_930172937_n.jpg
[21:29:31] <tjb1> I have two triggers set for the one on the right
[21:29:52] <r00t4rd3d> i have a nice set of limit switches, still in the package.
[21:30:42] <tjb1> I know I took a picture of it…where it is, who knows
[21:30:52] <tjb1> But in this one you can see the mount for one of the prox sensors - http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/430006_4483057310509_1353068263_n.jpg
[21:31:51] <ReadError> see im paranoid about getting long steel like that
[21:31:56] <ReadError> im afraid it will be bent
[21:32:10] <ReadError> atleast if i get it from ahren i can hit him up and be like, man, its bent
[21:32:15] <tjb1> I'm paranoid about piecing together a bunch of little ones
[21:32:31] <tjb1> I'd never have something like that shipped
[21:32:33] <ReadError> yea, would be hard to get it all even and stuff
[21:32:51] <tjb1> Corners are sharp as hell though
[21:34:10] <jdh> I have some cheap chinese switches
[21:34:15] <ReadError> decided to go with the 48x48
[21:34:23] <ReadError> since it has 3060 on the Y
[21:34:28] <r00t4rd3d> http://i.imgur.com/ytH2x5K.jpg
[21:34:44] <tjb1> Did they die
[21:34:59] <r00t4rd3d> dont know
[21:35:11] <ReadError> doesnt look like it
[21:35:19] <r00t4rd3d> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ULOdhTJ3uBg&feature=youtu.be
[21:35:23] <r00t4rd3d> watch it
[21:35:46] <tjb1> ReadError: My gantry is only 3030
[21:35:59] <tjb1> But then again it has 4x1/4" flat stock bolted to it also
[21:36:09] <ReadError> but you arent putting a load on it
[21:36:16] <ReadError> im going to be doing some aluminum and stuff
[21:36:16] <r00t4rd3d> i need a piece of crs
[21:36:18] <tjb1> I was going to add a router
[21:36:19] <ReadError> so i want it pretty rigid
[21:36:35] <tjb1> That aluminum is pretty damn strong :)
[21:36:47] <tjb1> Is it really 3060 or just two pieces of 3030?
[21:39:43] <ReadError> says 3060
[21:39:48] <ReadError> not sure what the difference is
[21:39:52] <ReadError> i think theres more steel too
[21:39:56] <ReadError> since its taller
[21:39:58] <tjb1> 3060 is one piece
[21:40:03] <tjb1> 3"x6"
[21:40:16] <tjb1> Its not more steel, I think its 2" wide stuff
[21:40:30] <ReadError> either way
[21:40:38] <ReadError> im gonna take over r00t4rd3d's gun and box biz
[21:40:40] <ReadError> ;)
[21:40:54] <ReadError> wood guns and paradise boxes
[21:41:03] <tjb1> Heh
[21:41:11] <tjb1> Add a plasma and Ill cut your machine in half >:(
[21:41:46] <tjb1> I cant get a piece of plywood to workout on a 3d printer, I dont know how people build whole routers out of wood
[21:42:14] <ReadError> yea im not a fan of wood
[21:48:03] <r00t4rd3d> takes skill
[21:48:37] <ReadError> no worries tjb1
[21:48:43] <ReadError> im scared of high voltage and fire
[21:48:50] <ReadError> well, electrical fire
[21:50:33] <ReadError> i need to tear this mill down after i get my router done
[21:50:37] <ReadError> and give it some TLC
[21:54:28] <tjb1> highest voltage in my control panel is 120 :P
[21:54:50] <ReadError> yea but what about that plasma coming out?
[21:54:58] <ReadError> surely that would give me a good jolt/burn
[21:55:05] <tjb1> Duh :P
[21:55:12] <tjb1> Its like 50000F
[22:03:50] <r00t4rd3d> tjb1, you seen this?
[22:03:51] <r00t4rd3d> http://www.precisebits.com/products/equipment/dewalt_611_collets_nuts.asp#Dewalt_611_Collets
[22:04:10] <tjb1> Yeah I book marked it earlier but no use for it right now
[22:10:22] <ReadError> i cant decide what to go with
[22:10:24] <ReadError> router or spindle
[22:11:57] <tjb1> spindles are fair bit more complicated
[22:12:06] <tjb1> Much more than I would like to venture into at this time
[22:12:22] <ReadError> yea but with a VFD hooked up
[22:12:24] <ReadError> nommmss
[22:12:33] <tjb1> superpid the dwp611
[22:12:52] <ReadError> yea but for that price, you can get the spindle+VFD
[22:13:01] <tjb1> A cheap spindle and VFD
[22:13:15] <tjb1> You really want a chinese vfd in charge of your spindle?
[22:13:44] <r00t4rd3d> wheres the superpid come from?
[22:13:46] <jdh> sure
[22:14:56] <r00t4rd3d> odd to hear a hb lover shit talk chinese goods...
[22:15:08] <r00t4rd3d> hf
[22:15:16] <tjb1> hf?
[22:15:23] <r00t4rd3d> harbor freight
[22:15:31] <tjb1> Who loves hf?
[22:16:06] <ReadError> you see more grimey people at HF than you do walmart
[22:16:09] <ReadError> true story.
[22:18:18] <tjb1> I think r00t4rd3d is the HF lover
[22:23:56] <jdh> I like HF for cheap junk
[22:26:06] <ReadError> i cant stand the pace
[22:26:11] <ReadError> place*
[22:26:40] <jdh> I think I got propositioned by a hooker in the parking lot once
[22:29:25] <tjb1> ReadError: I have to trace the AUX3 pins on Ramps to make sure they are making it to the mega...
[22:29:52] <tjb1> If they are, either I have had two faulty LCD/SDs, the mega is bad or marlin is still screwed up
[22:31:28] <ReadError> did you compile it with support for it?
[22:31:34] <ReadError> uncomment the stuff in the cfg
[22:33:13] <tjb1> I did
[22:33:21] <tjb1> Repetier gives me sd init fail
[22:33:29] <tjb1> I am guessing that means it is screwed from the start
[22:33:34] <L84Supper> sorry to intrude, but what's HF?
[22:34:09] <L84Supper> sorry , <answer above>
[22:34:37] <ReadError> harbor freight
[22:34:44] <L84Supper> HF is actually a step up from China itself
[22:34:46] <ReadError> its where they sell super low quality tools
[22:34:53] <ReadError> from china...
[22:35:11] <L84Supper> went tool shopping in Beijing last week
[22:35:26] <L84Supper> most stores had Stanley as their top brand
[22:35:27] <ReadError> anything decent ?
[22:35:30] <ReadError> ah wow
[22:35:32] <ReadError> super cheap?
[22:35:54] <cjd406> i am working with tripod kinematics and have run into a problem
[22:35:55] <L84Supper> you have to order from the et
[22:36:02] <L84Supper> et/et
[22:36:06] <cjd406> where when i switch from joint to world view my steppers nuts and the back plot reads -nan for each axis
[22:36:08] <L84Supper> net
[22:36:32] <L84Supper> tools and parts are really low cost
[22:36:48] <L84Supper> plus you haggle for price
[22:37:57] <zultron> I hate all that haggling, so I always shop taobao when I'm in China.
[22:38:06] <L84Supper> and hardware stores are entire malls with 200+ stores all about 15 sq meters
[22:38:57] <L84Supper> zultron: yeah, but some days I needed things "right now"
[22:39:03] <zultron> Those markets are great, though, just to walk through.
[22:39:26] <L84Supper> the electronic malls are great
[22:39:31] <zultron> Nothing near equivalent in the US.
[22:40:03] <L84Supper> haven't found a good fastener place near Shanghai/suzhou/nanging yet
[22:40:26] <ReadError> i would go in pawn stars style
[22:40:36] <ReadError> "you are selling this for 100$, ill give you 50"
[22:40:45] <L84Supper> machine tools are easy, just drive to a factory
[22:41:12] <L84Supper> ReadError: they don't post prices
[22:41:38] <zultron> Ever been to Yiwu in Zhejiang province where all the factories show their wares to buyers?
[22:41:49] <ReadError> so you have to ask them?
[22:41:53] <zultron> I heard that's an incredible sight. Never been myself.
[22:42:13] <L84Supper> if I'm around the price is always higher, instant price bump for foreigners
[22:43:13] <zultron> Heh, yep, I always bring a Chinese at the more touristy markets, or I'll pay 3x.
[22:43:16] <L84Supper> zultron: thats about an hour or so south of Suzhou, I haven't been down there
[22:44:18] <L84Supper> sometimes I have to jump in and just say stop, it's not worth haggling for 15 minutes over 10 RMB ($1.5USD)
[22:44:44] <zultron> We went to buy some kites once, in Suzhou actually, and after we bought them, we had a conversation with the shop owner who said they simply wouldn't give a foreigner the same price they'd give their compatriots.
[22:44:55] <L84Supper> yeah
[22:45:13] <zultron> It sounded like it was a matter of honor or something. ha!
[22:46:33] <L84Supper> their time is worth very little
[22:47:02] <zultron> Well, especially the folks in the shop. They sit around most of the time.
[22:48:22] <L84Supper> it's nice to not get a 30 second commercial/upsell where ever you go, but at the same time waiters/bartenders/bellmen/salespeople tend to ignore you
[22:49:12] <zultron> Where do you get the upsells?
[22:49:32] <L84Supper> just about anywhere in the USA
[22:49:39] <zultron> Oh, got it.
[22:50:10] <L84Supper> "can i just pay and go please"
[22:50:20] <zultron> In China you have to get used to yelling at people.
[22:50:34] <zultron> Not angry yelling, just get their attention yelling.
[22:50:51] <L84Supper> and not wanting to strangle people
[22:50:52] <zultron> FUWUYUAN! MAI-DAN!
[22:51:22] <zultron> Heh, yeah.
[22:51:25] <L84Supper> just got back from Korea
[22:51:31] <L84Supper> was a nice break
[22:52:17] <zultron> Never been. Went to Japan for a while when I lived in Beijing, and that was great. Everyone is so polite and respectful.
[22:52:43] <L84Supper> japan has my vote except for the fallout
[22:52:47] <ReadError> i know a very rude guy in japan
[22:52:53] <ReadError> message 'dongs'
[22:52:58] <ReadError> and see how polite he is to you ;)
[22:53:02] <r00t4rd3d> http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=82a_1359822977
[22:53:05] <L84Supper> they are nice to you even if they don't like you
[22:53:16] <zultron> I had trouble communicating there, though, nobody speaks English, and I don't speak Japanese at all.
[22:53:26] <L84Supper> for the most part
[22:53:38] <L84Supper> zultron: what part of beijing?
[22:53:47] <zultron> Haidian District
[22:53:57] <zultron> Near Tsinghua U
[22:54:05] <r00t4rd3d> those drone videos were not meant to be shown
[22:54:23] <L84Supper> zultron: was there 3 weeks ago
[22:54:52] <zultron> Nice! There were some electronic component markets right there that I really miss.
[22:55:28] <L84Supper> zultron: I spent the week at a hotel at the convention center/Olympic park
[22:56:00] <zultron> Oh yeah, that's pretty close.
[22:56:07] <L84Supper> took the subway to Haidian District
[22:56:21] <zultron> I was there in 2008 actually. It was nuts.
[22:56:40] <L84Supper> they are building some new tower there
[22:56:50] <L84Supper> looks really interesting
[22:57:13] <zultron> Interesting shape? or...?
[22:58:01] <L84Supper> yeah, if the platforms are open it like the dubai hotel with the outdoor tennis court, only these are the big enough for soccer
[22:58:39] <zultron> They've got a weird mix of stuff over there. Bizarrely-shaped ultra-modern buildings, right next to traditional buildings hundreds of years old, right next to a construction site surrounded by workers' shanties.
[22:58:48] <L84Supper> http://www.eliterics.com/2012/04/beijing-olympic-park-observation-tower.html
[22:59:10] <L84Supper> that sums up the whole country :)
[22:59:17] <zultron> Whoa!
[22:59:47] <L84Supper> i have pics still in my camera
[22:59:52] <L84Supper> have to upload
[22:59:58] <zultron> Yeah, I guess it does. Impossible contrast wherever you look.
[23:05:29] <L84Supper> nice to only be 4 hours from Nanjing to Beijing by train at 300kph
[23:06:54] <L84Supper> zultron: http://imagebin.org/245293
[23:08:15] <L84Supper> the birds nest would be off the right 1km
[23:10:11] <L84Supper> nice to be back at home with real scotch :)
[23:11:00] <ReadError> you in america L84Supper ?
[23:11:14] <L84Supper> ReadError: yeah, now
[23:11:23] <ReadError> real scotch ?
[23:11:33] <L84Supper> from Scotland
[23:11:58] <L84Supper> they tend to change the stuff inside the bottles there
[23:12:09] <L84Supper> in China that is
[23:12:14] <ReadError> with cheaper stuff?
[23:12:22] <L84Supper> or water it down
[23:12:56] <ReadError> ew
[23:13:09] <ReadError> even at the liquor stores?
[23:13:46] <L84Supper> unless you go to a high end hotel like a Hyatt/Peninsula etc
[23:14:15] <L84Supper> most liquor stores only carry beer or rice wine/liquor
[23:17:03] <L84Supper> no OSHA there
[23:17:51] <L84Supper> walked through supplier factories with no guards on machines, open belts, motors, welders etc etc, don't slip!
[23:20:01] <L84Supper> not sure what they will do if automation replaces manual labor or if India starts to compete, they succeed by the sheer volume of cheap manual labor