#linuxcnc | Logs for 2013-01-13

[00:03:59] <tjtr33> iirc i uploaded a deb to .... not sure this is where, it was one of the devs back in Apt360 days.... i found something here https://m21.hyte.de/blog/heekscad%200.14.1
[00:06:24] <tjtr33> hey,its in synaptic,for 10.04 anyways
[00:07:19] <tjtr33> gnite all
[01:14:05] <JesusAlos> hi
[01:21:08] <JesusAlos> I have a problem execution installation heekscad
[01:21:19] <JesusAlos> in linix 10.04
[01:52:01] <JesusAlos_> hi
[02:21:30] <devilindisguise> hello!
[02:38:16] <DJ9DJ> moin
[02:38:38] <devilindisguise> hi DJ9DJ
[02:39:03] <DJ9DJ> hi there
[03:17:41] <IchGuckLive> morning from Germany
[03:18:33] <IchGuckLive> what is the best halpin to get the actuall position foem the coordinate system we are on (G94)
[03:18:51] <IchGuckLive> from B)
[03:47:32] <JesusAlos_> IchGuckLive: I try intall Heekscad in ubuntu 10.04
[03:47:51] <JesusAlos_> but can't execute. have problem execution
[03:48:11] <IchGuckLive> im on your hal right know
[04:33:49] <JesusAlos_> Cant run the last livecd linux cnc in 32 and 64 bits computer?
[05:20:09] <bedah> gmorning
[05:23:29] <devilindisguise> well
[05:23:48] <devilindisguise> is there a mirror of jeff epplers blog?
[05:23:52] <devilindisguise> somewhere?
[05:24:12] <bedah> waybackmachine?
[05:24:45] <bedah> http://archive.org/web/web.php try it
[05:24:56] <devilindisguise> bedah: thought about it, but the archive doesnt preserve code. or does it? i take a look
[05:27:24] <devilindisguise> bedah: yes! it does archive pde's too :)
[05:27:32] <devilindisguise> http://web.archive.org/web/20120311033927/http://media.unpythonic.net/emergent-files/01198594294/halintf.pde
[05:27:34] <devilindisguise> :)
[05:28:13] <devilindisguise> and of course the more interesting: http://web.archive.org/web/20120311033907/http://media.unpythonic.net/emergent-files/01198594294/arduino.py
[05:29:02] <bedah> fine fine :)
[05:44:40] <devilindisguise> ok, i tried to run the linuxcnc 2.5.1 sim within a install of 10.04 based linuxcnc and i get a USRMOT: ERROR: command timeout
[05:44:50] <devilindisguise> within qemu
[05:46:39] <devilindisguise> ok, had to do with she sample configs
[05:46:53] <devilindisguise> seems to work :)
[06:45:55] <IchGuckLive> hi all
[06:46:44] <IchGuckLive> does the hal know the point where to go
[09:34:08] <JT-Shop> dgarr: ping
[09:54:58] <tjtr33> mhaberler, i guess that m250.ngc is part of a multi-file example, is that yours? Where is 'top' file, so i can study?
[09:55:20] <mhaberler> what is a m250.ngc file=
[09:55:26] <mhaberler> ?
[09:55:59] <tjtr33> in the /nc_files dir, i thought it was yours, seems to have a way to pass many parms to a custom mcode, not just P Q
[09:56:20] <tjtr33> sorry, i dont know who authored it
[09:56:20] <IchGuckLive> call
[09:56:34] <IchGuckLive> tjtr33: call takes 30 parameters
[09:57:30] <tjtr33> argc = 30? didnt know that, thx
[09:58:01] <IchGuckLive> #1 to #20
[09:58:06] <IchGuckLive> #30
[09:58:31] <IchGuckLive> i use this on plasma for patttern
[09:58:43] <mrsun> http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v606/OzRinger/6%20inch%20vice/vicealignment014Custom-1.jpg hmm is that camelback made out of aluminium ?
[09:59:19] <mrsun> looks like it on the casting :P
[10:00:07] <IchGuckLive> big casing
[10:02:05] <archivist> or just been sand/bead blasted
[10:02:18] <mrsun> http://i1031.photobucket.com/albums/y373/dreeewman/cnc%20mill/001-2.jpg omg! =) i love that machine*!
[10:02:27] <mrsun> i just fell in love ... =)
[10:03:00] <archivist> it's only little :)
[10:03:06] <mrsun> yes! =) its cute!
[10:04:11] <archivist> is he making it from scratch or modding something
[10:04:43] <mrsun> dont know realy, it was slapped in a thread about dovetail masters
[10:04:52] <AR__> i've spent over $500 on hardware parts for a new machine in the last 3 weeks.....................................................................
[10:05:00] <AR__> and it is still in pieces
[10:05:05] <mrsun> looks like the top part has been replaced by something homemade atleast
[10:05:07] <mrsun> the spindle
[10:05:08] <AR__> dont have a frame yet
[10:05:12] <AR__> dont have spindle yet
[10:05:14] <AR__> holy fffff
[10:05:36] <mrsun> ...
[10:05:40] <mrsun> $500 isnt that much
[10:05:41] <mrsun> :P
[10:05:50] <AR__> relatively
[10:06:01] <mrsun> just the computer that runs my mini mill has parts for about $1000
[10:06:05] <AR__> but just spending $500 on 'something'
[10:06:07] <archivist> mrsun, anyway that was big http://www.archivist.info/cnc/works2008/P1010217.JPG
[10:06:17] <AR__> something that isnt functional yet
[10:06:18] <AR__> lol
[10:06:30] <mrsun> archivist, maw =)
[10:07:39] <archivist> mrsun, but here is one of a similar size http://www.archivist.info/cnc/works2008/P1010206.JPG
[10:08:02] <mrsun> so cute little things =)
[10:09:31] <mrsun> these rails that is often used in machiens today, with bearing blocks, how is the stiffness in those compared to a dovetail or a box thingie? :)
[10:10:09] <tjtr33> wow, i got the 1st one in the basement, its a hardinge built for the navy, used on board, but the idea of replacing the horz boring part with the mill head is sweet
[10:11:21] <archivist> mrsun, depends on what they are bolted too
[10:11:34] <mrsun> ahh true
[10:11:43] <mrsun> but with a cast iron base, just remove the dovetails and slap rails on it insted
[10:12:08] <mrsun> http://image.made-in-china.com/2f0j00qvrEkCAIZBba/Linear-Rail-System-SBG-Series-.jpg its those thingies im talking about =)
[10:12:44] <archivist> I slapped them on my lathe base when it became the column for the mill
[10:14:43] <tjtr33> in taiwan, the rails were butted against an edge, maybe 1mm hi, then taper head screws along outside of rail squeezed rail against precision edge, and thats how it was 'straight'
[10:14:48] <mrsun> isnt that type of rails pretty much standard in cnc machines these days?
[10:15:19] <archivist> mrsun, I think it also depends on how many carriages you have per rail
[10:15:31] <tjtr33> yeh, its a lot cheaper, and pretty accurate
[10:16:27] <archivist> I got a pair off ebay with 6 on each rail, which will be used on the next version of the mill
[10:17:52] <IchGuckLive> tjtr33: mrsun there are more cheeper ones
[10:18:25] <tjtr33> i used star (DE) and hiwin(TW)
[10:33:29] <mrsun> you all know your materials, if i have a piece of cast iron, then cut it .. do i need to reaneal it after to release tensions etc in the piece? :)
[10:36:49] <IchGuckLive> iron does not neet reaneal Stal is different O.O
[10:37:35] <archivist> mrsun, for best, rest cast iron for a year out doors before use
[10:40:03] <archivist> company my dad worked for left stuff out for a long while before they machined for use in large engines
[10:41:34] <tjtr33> he did nc it http://s1031.beta.photobucket.com/user/dreeewman/media/cnc%20mill/003-2.jpg.html
[10:42:29] <tjtr33> yeah, begin apprenticeship, bury angle plate, finish apprenticeship, grind plate
[10:47:00] <tjtr33> and he put turcite? on the ways http://s1031.beta.photobucket.com/user/dreeewman/media/cnc%20mill/DSCN2337.jpg.html
[10:48:49] <mrsun> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y8NqeD73ZZ4&list=UU4h0VCL37WHGGzp8gwY1fow&index=4
[10:49:31] <JT-Shop> anyone seen my solder sucker?
[10:50:03] <archivist> where you left it!
[10:51:49] <jthornton> should be down here IIRC
[10:57:17] <jthornton> underneath a box in the last place I looked
[11:08:49] <archivist> I spent 3/4 of an hour searching for a tap I had got in specially on thursday, was just carefully put in a draw...the wrong one
[12:57:14] <mrsun> hmm touching freezing metal was a stupid mistake :/
[13:19:58] <IchGuckLive> after yesterday posting maraton ok it wars suturday today its come here
[13:27:22] <gene__> Hi guys, where can I get that Rockhopper Web Server from?
[13:29:04] <gene__> Ah, found it, near the bottom of the wiki page
[13:46:10] <gene__> How is the best way to troubleshoot rockhopper? It is acting like it has not found the .ini file, but is not complaining either
[13:51:49] <cncbasher> gene__:python ./LinuxCNCWebSktSvr.py /home/david/emc2-dev/configs/sim/axis/axis.ini
[13:52:04] <cncbasher> thats my start script line
[13:52:24] <cncbasher> it should pop up in terminal saying rochopper is running
[13:52:37] <gene__> I am getting the linuxcnc configuration page at either FQDN:8000/ or localhost:8000/, saying it is ready to load configuration
[13:53:06] <cncbasher> ok
[13:53:40] <cncbasher> give me a min
[13:53:53] <cncbasher> need to boot spare pc
[13:53:54] <gene__> it was launched as shown in the instructions, with the path argument of /home/gene/linuxcnc/configs/my-lathe/my-mathe.ini (in think)
[13:55:30] <gene__> Ahh, got it, I left out a directory level :(
[13:55:41] <cncbasher> arh great
[13:55:54] <cncbasher> i'm just looking at it too
[13:58:35] <gene__> everything now works except the graph, its a blank screen, do I need to reboot to bring in some stuff, or run ldconfig?
[13:58:52] <cncbasher> try a reboot
[14:03:13] <gene__> ldconfig can't find a trace of grphviz
[14:03:48] <cncbasher> i had to load in graphwiz-dev
[14:03:51] <gene__> ldconfig can't find a trace of graphviz
[14:04:34] <cncbasher> also pygraphwiz-1.1
[14:08:36] <cncbasher> http://graphviz.org/Download..php
[14:09:21] <cncbasher> http://pypi.python.org/pypi/pygraphviz
[14:10:28] <gene__> I did that, rockhopper starts and shows everything but the gfx
[14:11:53] <gene__> what starts the python-graphviz stuff?
[14:13:19] <cncbasher> i'm thinking back too when i installed , should have made notes .. i ran the pygraph examples from terminal
[14:13:55] <cncbasher> then i noticed an error pointing me to install graphwiz-dev
[14:14:14] <cncbasher> all all worked from that point
[14:15:35] <gene__> Ahh, I'll check that out
[14:16:52] <gene__> installing
[14:17:01] <cncbasher> fingers crossed
[14:17:53] <gene__> no good, need another reboot?
[14:19:48] <gene__> I noticed that any time I change tabs, it reverts back to custom.hal which is an effectively empty file, and that file would be a blank screen
[14:20:53] <cncbasher> are you using run in place or installed lcnc
[14:21:21] <gene__> installed, but it is notrunning atm
[14:21:42] <cncbasher> ok
[14:22:30] <gene__> I'm going to take that reference to the unused custom.hal file out of the ini & reload it
[14:25:17] <gene__> didn't help either
[14:26:15] <gene__> major catastrophe, coffee cup empty, brb
[14:28:10] <gene__> fixed
[14:28:24] <gene__> Now what?
[14:31:22] <cncbasher> i knew it was too good to be true , now i dont get the graphs
[14:33:12] <gene__> cncbasher: that link above isn't the same as the apt-get install on that web page, do I need to do your version too? Some #$%*&% update broke us?
[15:11:23] <Jymmm> http://video.foxbusiness.com/v/2000862202001/
[15:15:49] <Jymmm> phuking guberment
[15:20:31] <ReadError> holy cow
[15:20:40] <ReadError> anyone see this show bering sea gold?
[15:20:58] <Jymmm> Just a big drama fest
[15:21:12] <ReadError> this guy in the last episode
[15:21:14] <ReadError> what a nutjob
[15:21:21] <Jymmm> like I said
[15:21:31] <ReadError> noone can be THAT off
[15:21:33] <ReadError> i think its fake
[15:22:22] <Jymmm> I watched like one episode when it first came on
[15:36:31] <Tom_itx> a bit hyper?
[16:07:55] <MercuryRising> im guessing this isn't related directly to linuxcnc: but midway into a job, the graphics driver freaked out and froze, switching to another tty gives me output similar to this:
[16:07:57] <MercuryRising> [ 817.#####] [drm:radeon_ib_schedule] *ERROR* radeon: couldn't schedule IB(0)
[16:07:59] <MercuryRising> [ 817.#####] [drm:radeon_cs_ioctl] *ERROR* Failed to schedule IB !
[16:14:10] <DJ9DJ> gn8
[17:10:21] <tandoori> erm, pardon my ignorance...but what sort of works can i expect to create with a 4 axis like this: http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Low-price-high-quality-3020-4-axis-mini-pcb-cnc-milling-machine/612311017.html
[17:11:22] <ReadError> a guy, scribblej got one from china like that
[17:11:24] <ReadError> bigger though
[17:11:43] <tandoori> eh? I should get larger?
[17:12:08] <ReadError> 1.7k is a bit high for that i think
[17:12:13] <tandoori> what kind of mill is displayed in this picture: http://www.rolanddga.com/products/milling/mdx540/
[17:12:47] <tandoori> i suck at terminology
[17:13:10] <ReadError> not sure, rotary mill?
[17:13:30] <tandoori> is that some kind of add on? or is it designed that way?
[17:13:53] <ReadError> that one appears to be designed that way
[17:14:00] <tandoori> ah
[17:14:02] <ReadError> but you can add a 4th axis to pretty much any mill
[17:16:00] <tandoori> i mainly want a mill for fine pcb work, but I would like to design works like that...maybe learn to macine parts for a car or something such as a solid diff count for a car
[17:17:10] <ReadError> well if you wanted to do that, you should get a mill instead of a router
[17:17:34] <tandoori> youre speaking to a greenie here
[17:17:35] <tandoori> lol
[17:19:13] <ReadError> im a noob myself, probably not in a position to advise
[17:19:20] <ReadError> might want to wait on an old head to come around
[17:22:15] <tandoori> aye
[17:24:26] <ReadError> give it 30 mins someone will pop up
[17:37:02] <Valen> tandoori: those things generally sell for $400
[17:37:39] <ReadError> i think scribble got his huge one for 1.7k
[17:37:46] <tandoori> huh
[17:37:57] <tandoori> http://www.aliexpress.com/item/4-Axis-CNC-3020Z-DQ-ROUTER-ENGRAVER-DRILLING-MILLING-MACHINE-CNC-ROUTER-upgrade-from-CNC-3020T/664780927.html
[17:38:03] <tandoori> how about that one?
[17:38:06] <was> sind auch deutsche
[17:38:12] <ReadError> that thing is tiny tandoori
[17:38:14] <was> hier
[17:38:16] <ReadError> are you in america?
[17:38:19] <tandoori> looks like the 4th axis is detachable?
[17:38:33] <tandoori> ReadError: aye, sure am
[17:38:49] <ReadError> look into the Taig
[17:38:57] <ReadError> i, and several others here have them
[17:39:03] <ReadError> ive done PCB work on it just fine
[17:39:36] <ReadError> http://deepgroove1.com/cncmill.htm
[17:39:59] <Valen> what do you want to actually do tandoori?
[17:40:45] <was> is some body from german
[17:42:32] <tandoori> Valen: I would like to primarily mill pcbs with high accuracy. 24mil traces is unacceptable. 12 is aceptable. I also would like to design other items of interest as well closer to 3D ish which is why that 4th axis is so attractive. mostly things cylindrical in shape. maybe mill car parts from solid blocks of metal...
[17:42:35] <tandoori> stuff like that
[17:42:54] <Valen> those things wont do metal
[17:43:09] <tandoori> ah i want one that can do metal!
[17:43:23] <Valen> also why do you want to mill fine PCBs?
[17:43:49] <tandoori> because i am a serious EE enthusist
[17:44:18] <Valen> i mean why milling over etching
[17:45:10] <tandoori> hmm? oh because i have seen the results of work and they are awesome. no need to use chemicals and i want to make the most use of my milling machine
[17:46:15] <Valen> we milled this http://www.vapourforge.com/jake/temp/milled-pcb-for-spinzster.jpg
[17:47:14] <tandoori> valen: i have a LOT of plans for that cnc mill. im pretty good with 3d design you see
[17:47:41] <tandoori> Valen: mmm that pic is pretty sweet
[17:48:03] <Valen> its not trivial to get the PCB flat
[17:48:11] <tandoori> i understand
[17:48:20] <tandoori> there are ways to make it flat however
[17:48:35] <Valen> http://www.cnczone.com/forums/general_metal_working_machines/118358-phenolic_basalt_head_our_hm45.html
[17:48:42] <Valen> thats our mill
[17:49:24] <tandoori> i would like to make cylindrical shaped items such as displayed in this picture: http://www.rolanddga.com/products/milling/mdx540/
[17:49:31] <L84Supper> wow thats been 2 years!
[17:49:34] <tandoori> Valen: very nice mill!
[17:49:45] <L84Supper> Valen: how is it holding up?
[17:49:47] <Valen> not really
[17:49:55] <Valen> L84Supper: which bit?
[17:49:58] <tandoori> i just need help selecting the right mill for me that would be able to do the things that i have mentioned above
[17:50:05] <L84Supper> the epoxy resin
[17:50:07] <Valen> we have replaced the bearings in the spindle a few times
[17:50:10] <Valen> that bits fine
[17:50:21] <tandoori> as i know nothing about cnc mills, this would be my first!
[17:50:22] <L84Supper> seems like you posted that just yesterday
[17:50:54] <Valen> lol that was ages ago L84Supper and the bearings are crap and in a crap mounting
[17:51:10] <Valen> the origional bearings were probably ok, but they were aligned the same way
[17:51:35] <L84Supper> if you need anything from China let me know
[17:51:55] <tandoori> well do any of you lot have suggestions for me? ;-)
[17:52:23] <Valen> I'm concerned about doing steel with our mill tandoori
[17:52:35] <Valen> it has done it, even stainless
[17:52:42] <Valen> but the spindle isn't really up to it
[17:52:42] <tandoori> steel? why not aluminium?
[17:52:49] <Valen> does Al all the time
[17:53:06] <Valen> but steel is harder, i'm giving you an idea of the capabilities
[17:53:29] <tandoori> yeah, if i want my crap done in steel, i can just mill an Al part and recast it
[17:53:41] * tandoori is also a metalsmith
[17:53:45] <tandoori> ;-)
[17:53:55] <tandoori> yes i know, i have too much stuff
[17:53:58] <Valen> cast steel is usually crap in comparison
[17:54:21] <tandoori> orly? not if its done properly
[17:54:46] <Valen> so your saying cast steel is as strong as a part milled from a forged billet?
[17:55:04] <tandoori> i never said that
[17:55:21] <Valen> so its crap in comparison ;-P
[17:55:23] <tandoori> but more about mills!
[17:55:29] * tandoori pokes Valen
[17:55:47] <ReadError> tandoori, check out the taig
[17:55:52] <ReadError> im pretty happy with him
[17:55:54] <ReadError> mine*
[17:56:10] <tandoori> ReadError: can it do the stuff i mentioned?
[17:56:12] <Valen> taig is a good place to start
[18:00:59] <tandoori> Valen: lacks the 4th axis
[18:01:07] <Valen> so add one
[18:01:14] * tandoori frowns
[18:01:15] <tjb1> About to order a nice 12" caliper…
[18:01:19] <tjb1> There goes a ton of money
[18:03:17] <tandoori> Valen: i dont mind ordering chinese stuff, especially if it comes ready to go
[18:03:44] <Valen> everybody i know who has baught one of those 3040 systems has been screwed over at every stage
[18:03:46] <tjb1> Interesting - http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?PMAKA=327-9548&PMPXNO=22606071&PARTPG=INLMK32 &&& http://www1.mscdirect.com/cgi/NNSRIT2?PMAKA=84177716&PMPXNO=22339968&cm_re=ItemDetail-_-ResultListing-_-SearchResults
[18:03:53] <ReadError> mitutoyo ?
[18:03:56] <Valen> 1) the mill they get is half the size of the one they order
[18:03:56] <tjb1> Same thing…almost $130 cheaper at enco
[18:04:06] <Valen> 2) the electrics to drive them are undocumented
[18:04:20] <ReadError> shit, almost 500 ?
[18:04:22] <tjb1> Yes ReadError, I buy mitutoyo
[18:04:24] <Valen> 3) when you get it working you realise the included electrics are crap and replace them with geckos
[18:04:40] <AR_> anyone have any idea how this 'spindle' was used?
[18:04:41] <ReadError> that one i posted tandoori
[18:04:41] <AR_> http://www.ebay.com/itm/NSK-Barden-Custom-Thru-Hole-Machining-Spindle-Dual-Support-Bearings-Solyndra-/170966251651
[18:04:46] <ReadError> comes with the gecko controller
[18:04:48] <ReadError> its race ready
[18:05:23] <tjb1> Anyone know any other places to buy calipers?
[18:05:35] <tjb1> Ill check Travers but the catalog I have from them it was expensive
[18:06:42] <ReadError> amazon ;)
[18:07:26] <Valen> spendy tjb1, sure they are worth it?
[18:07:34] <tjb1> Why wouldn't be?
[18:07:40] <tandoori> ReadError: that is even smaller than the chinese made ones
[18:07:57] <Valen> I'd be tempted to get a handful of cheaper ones ;->
[18:08:04] <tjb1> I have a junk one from harbor freight
[18:08:09] <tjb1> The price says it all ;)
[18:08:19] <tjb1> You move it to fast it skips like 6 inche
[18:08:25] <tjb1> You blink and it changes numbers
[18:08:38] <Valen> perhaps that one is too cheap ;->
[18:08:49] <ReadError> tjb1, i got a set of 30$ ones from amazon
[18:08:51] <ReadError> and they work awesome
[18:09:11] <tjb1> You cant talk me out of mitutoyo :P
[18:09:11] <ReadError> im rough on stuff
[18:09:16] <ReadError> yea i want a pair
[18:09:19] <ReadError> but not the 500$ ones ;)
[18:09:21] <tjb1> I just wanted to know if there was another place I could price check
[18:09:31] <Valen> google shopping?
[18:10:04] <ReadError> http://www.amazon.com/Mitutoyo-ABSOLUTE-500-196-20-Stainless-Resolution/dp/B001C0ZPNO/
[18:10:13] <ReadError> probably get those eventually
[18:10:25] <ReadError> tandoori, how can you compare
[18:10:29] <ReadError> its a mill vs. router
[18:10:48] <tjb1> Its only $40 more for an ip67 version
[18:11:28] <ReadError> ip67 ?
[18:11:41] <tjb1> waterproof
[18:11:42] <ReadError> http://www.amazon.com/Carrera-Precision-CP9806-TF-Electronic-Fractional/dp/B003119EDE/ref=pd_sbs_indust_2
[18:11:46] <ReadError> those are what i got now
[18:11:47] <ReadError> cheap
[18:11:50] <ReadError> but work pretty good
[18:12:04] <tjb1> You know im buying 12" right?
[18:12:38] <ReadError> yea
[18:13:13] <tjb1> Eh, its $450 on amazon
[18:13:50] <tjb1> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Brand-New-in-case-Mitutoyo-Digimatic-Caliper-12-500-754-10-/181060721437?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2a280f5b1d lol
[18:14:19] <Valen> https://www.google.com.au/#q=Mitutoyo+Digimatic+Caliper+12&hl=en&safe=off&tbo=d&source=lnms&tbm=shop&sa=X&ei=2UrzUN-FJYmjkQWt_IFo&sqi=2&ved=0CAkQ_AUoAA&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_cp.r_qf.&bvm=bv.1357700187,d.dGI&fp=5bcc6a91d06d540&biw=1920&bih=942
[18:14:53] <tjb1> Enco it is then…isn't Enco part of MSC?
[18:15:11] <Valen> hah http://au.element14.com/jsp/displayProduct.jsp?sku=1667281&CMP=e-2072-00001000&gross_price=true $1500
[18:15:58] <tandoori> ugh i dont know what to get anymore, oh well. soon i will get something
[18:17:32] <tjb1> http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?PMAKA=606-4740&PMPXNO=951938&PARTPG=INLMK32
[18:19:56] <tjb1> Can someone tell me the difference between these? http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?PMAKA=PU606-4770 &&& http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?PMAKA=PU606-4750
[18:20:26] <jdh> point length
[18:20:49] <tjb1> The cheaper one has a longer point
[18:20:57] <jdh> nope.
[18:21:41] <tjb1> It does in their catalog
[18:21:59] <tjb1> The complete set at least
[18:22:16] <jdh> it doesn't on the two links you just pasted.
[18:22:20] <jdh> long $135, short $95
[18:22:47] <tjb1> Ok look at the catalog for complete sets
[18:22:57] <jdh> no.
[18:23:12] <tjb1> 606-4751 is
[18:35:18] <Jymmm> Bah, can't find any 250V inline fuse holders
[18:35:48] <AR_> anyone think this could be converted into a milling spindle? http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=170966251651
[18:35:53] <jdh> http://www.citizenschwartz.com/nation-still-reeling-after-rush-limbaugh-r
[18:35:53] <jdh> evealed-to-be-30-year-long-andy-kaufman-prank/
[18:35:58] <jdh> urk.
[18:36:16] <AR_> i emailed the seller and they said the only info on it is what is posted, but he thinks it would probably be ok for light to medium milling
[18:43:43] <Valen> hard part would be putting a chuck on it accuralty
[18:50:40] <tandoori> zomg i want THIS: http://www.microproto.com/DSLSrot.htm
[18:51:06] * tandoori pinches Valen's cheek
[18:51:44] <tandoori> that looks to be so high quality
[18:52:09] <tandoori> when i become adept, i could make suff and sell em and make a return on my investment, aye?
[18:53:31] <tandoori> "Complete MicroMill DSLS System with 4th Axis DSLS Rotary Table and Adjustable Tailstock" = 3.695K USD. Its a lot, but It definitely appears to be worth it
[19:21:15] <tandoori> mmmh. Yes. That mill should be able to do just about anything I could ever want it to do
[19:35:17] <Valen> you know ours was $1500 australian and about that again in CnCing it
[19:35:25] <Valen> 750x200 work area
[19:37:00] * Valen pokes tandoori
[19:37:24] <tandoori> hmm?
[19:38:12] <Valen> that mill is expensive
[19:38:34] <Valen> I suggest if you are in a post industrialised country to look for a second hand mill
[19:38:42] <Valen> except australia
[19:38:54] <Valen> what little stuff we see is overpriced crap
[19:41:32] <tandoori> id rather have new stuff
[19:45:29] <ReadError> taig and call it done.
[19:45:40] <ReadError> unless you want a grizzly
[19:45:51] <ReadError> but i think they are pretty advance to setup
[19:45:57] <tandoori> that is a tiag, right?
[19:48:57] <ReadError> its a taig with a 4th axis
[19:49:03] <ReadError> but like 2x the price
[19:49:29] <ReadError> if thats where you got the 3.695k from
[19:49:44] <ReadError> if you are doing pcbs
[19:49:48] <ReadError> why on earth do you want a 4th axis
[19:50:26] <tandoori> ReadError: because i have other things I want to use it for
[19:50:29] <tandoori> not just PCBs
[19:50:40] <tandoori> really? that is overpriced?
[19:52:21] <tandoori> ReadError: if i can get all that for 1/2 price i would be very happy
[19:53:05] <jdh> taig with servos
[19:56:35] <tandoori> jdh huh?
[19:57:14] <jdh> the link
[19:57:45] <jdh> was a taig with servos. Hence the 'overpriced' part.
[19:59:33] <tandoori> servos are good?
[20:00:04] <jdh> sure, but I'd think overkill for a taig
[20:00:53] <ReadError> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/25091878/Photo%20Jan%2013%2C%208%2046%2001%20PM.jpg
[20:00:58] <ReadError> just pulled that top one off
[20:01:08] <ReadError> surface finish looks better irl
[20:01:16] <ReadError> but still not super mirror finish
[20:01:42] <Valen> Al for a quad? bit heavy ReadError?
[20:02:01] <ReadError> Valen, around 35g per arm
[20:02:16] <ReadError> which towel bar minus motor mounts was like 30g
[20:02:24] <ReadError> and the mounts alone where 5g
[20:02:24] <Valen> any paticular reason to not go CF?
[20:02:32] <ReadError> CF....price
[20:02:41] <Valen> pshaw, CF is cheap these days
[20:02:51] <ReadError> i got 72" of this aluminum for 28$...
[20:02:52] <ReadError> enough to do like 18 arms
[20:03:04] <ReadError> last (only) sheet of CF I got was 50$
[20:03:07] <ReadError> for 12x12"
[20:03:12] <tandoori> jdh: are they very precise?
[20:03:34] <ReadError> tandoori, i did those arms on the taig
[20:03:37] <ReadError> but im a horrible machinist
[20:03:37] <Valen> get it in fabric form
[20:03:42] <Valen> around $45 a meter
[20:03:43] <jdh> on a taig that cost half as much
[20:03:55] <tandoori> no no, i meant the servos on the taig
[20:04:17] <ReadError> Valen, it still needs to be layered up doesnt it?
[20:04:22] <tandoori> ReadError: what are those things?
[20:05:00] <ReadError> quad rotor arms
[20:05:07] <Valen> yes, but you don't make layers then cut them out
[20:05:24] <ReadError> wouldnt i need a mold?
[20:05:26] <Valen> make a mould, lay CF into it, the loads your dealing with a single layer would do
[20:05:32] <ReadError> yea
[20:05:39] <Valen> CnC AL makes for great moulds ;->
[20:05:47] <ReadError> i just do this for fun
[20:05:55] <ReadError> i wont be terribly upset if its no good
[20:06:01] <Valen> we are going to make a CF gantry for our new mill
[20:06:28] <ReadError> this frame is going to be sexy
[20:06:46] <Valen> get a buffing wheel ;->
[20:06:55] <Valen> *everything* looks like sex when its shiny lol
[20:09:18] <ReadError> Tom_itx will sell ya on some servos ;)
[20:09:25] <jdh> that's entirely up to you.
[20:09:25] <Valen> heh should have ball milled all the square corners to round it all off just for the giggles ;->
[20:09:42] * tandoori frowns
[20:09:43] <jdh> but, I don't think a taig with servos would be $1000 better than a taig with steppers
[20:09:49] <ReadError> Valen, thats an idea
[20:09:57] <tandoori> i dont want anything that i have to retrofit
[20:10:04] <ReadError> i can do a tracing toolpath
[20:10:09] <Valen> oh and don't forget to put a logo into it ;->
[20:10:14] <ReadError> ;O
[20:10:16] <Valen> what are you using for CAM ReadError?
[20:10:22] <jdh> http://tinyurl.com/a54arm5
[20:10:27] <ReadError> well, i _was/am_ using visualmill
[20:10:29] <ReadError> but this stuff here
[20:10:32] <jdh> ^^ my afternoon
[20:10:39] <ReadError> i used the free hsmxpress
[20:10:43] <ReadError> which is very nice
[20:10:45] <ReadError> for solidworks
[20:10:49] <ReadError> free cam :)
[20:11:00] <Valen> handy
[20:11:49] <ReadError> give it a shot
[20:11:52] <ReadError> its pretty decent
[20:11:58] <Valen> I use rhinocam and rhino
[20:12:02] <ReadError> ahh
[20:12:09] <ReadError> thats the same as visualmill i think
[20:12:11] <ReadError> same company
[20:12:17] <Valen> yes it is now you mention it
[20:12:21] <Valen> anyway better go, gotta rebuild my brakes
[20:12:57] <Valen> tandoori: anything you get is going to need work. If money isn't much of a problem look at tormach (sp?)
[20:13:08] <Valen> they do larger size stuff that can do real milling
[20:13:18] <ReadError> tomach or w/e is super expensive i think
[20:13:27] <Valen> not "super" expensive
[20:13:29] <Valen> just not cheap
[20:13:36] <ReadError> 8.5k iirc
[20:13:44] <Valen> but its the cheapest I've seen for a serious mill thats ready to run
[20:13:53] <Valen> that sort of ball park yes
[20:14:08] <jdh> is it really serious?
[20:14:21] <jdh> do they still
[20:14:22] <tandoori> valen, i dont care about assembly
[20:14:26] <Valen> eh good enough
[20:14:32] <jdh> do they still use steppers?
[20:14:32] <Valen> step down from there is something like a taig or an X3 with a CnC kit
[20:14:47] <Valen> i think so jdh, but theres nothing inherently wrong with that
[20:15:05] <Valen> I prefer servos but steppers are cheaper
[20:15:40] <jdh> I have steppers because they are cheaper, I would prefer servos
[20:15:44] <jdh> but... on a taig?
[20:16:05] <tandoori> well i definitely want one with the 4 axis like that
[20:16:08] <Valen> yeah, you're not going to hit high enough speeds to warrant servos i think
[20:16:17] <Valen> you can buy CnC 4th axies off the shelf
[20:16:25] <tandoori> valen even if i want to work with Al?
[20:16:31] <Valen> they just bolt to the table
[20:16:43] <Valen> servo's are mostly about speed and accuracy
[20:16:55] <tandoori> i want accuracy!
[20:16:59] <ReadError> lol
[20:17:05] <Valen> so gear your steppers ;-P
[20:17:34] <ReadError> taig has 20tpi screws
[20:17:36] <Valen> in about 6 months or so I hope to have a beta of the ideal mill for ReadError
[20:17:58] <Valen> only down side is it'll weigh 450Kg (900lbs) and be full of epoxy granite
[20:18:06] <Valen> and be in kit form
[20:18:06] <ReadError> lol
[20:18:39] <ReadError> i think a drug habit would cost less than my current ones
[20:18:41] <Valen> tandoori: you need to define what accuracy you want
[20:18:51] <Valen> as in +-.0xmm
[20:18:57] <Valen> also what repeatability
[20:19:05] <jdh> I think .0mm would be fine.
[20:19:11] <ReadError> lol
[20:19:23] <Valen> jdh: we use glass scales on ours for position feedback .001mm ;-P
[20:19:36] <Valen> anyway catchyers all later
[20:19:40] <jdh> bf20?
[20:19:45] <ReadError> i really wanted that cncrouterparts one
[20:19:51] <ReadError> 1.6k which i could totally do right now
[20:20:03] <ReadError> but everyone was like, rack and pinion gross, dont get it
[20:20:22] <tandoori> lol
[20:20:45] <jdh> teh router kit?
[20:20:49] <ReadError> ya
[20:20:51] <ReadError> hold
[20:21:24] <ReadError> http://www.cncrouterparts.com/crp2448-2-x-4-cnc-router-kit-p-164.html
[20:21:48] <ReadError> it looks solid
[20:21:53] <jdh> buy one
[20:21:55] <ReadError> next weekend or at work i need to fire up solid works
[20:22:10] <ReadError> and piece one together with acme screws and such
[20:22:15] <ReadError> and 80/20
[20:22:32] <tandoori> ReadError: so how much could i get that setup with the 4 axes with stepper motors?
[20:23:05] <ReadError> man personall
[20:23:06] <ReadError> y
[20:23:13] <ReadError> this stuff is much harder than you think
[20:23:17] <jdh> heh
[20:23:21] <ReadError> i came in with an "awww, this is going to be easy"
[20:23:23] <ReadError> let me tell you
[20:23:24] <ReadError> its not
[20:23:37] <ReadError> 'draw some stuff press some buttons and make parts"
[20:23:56] <ReadError> and i learned through trial and error that its not nearly that simple
[20:24:10] <ReadError> hence why i bug these guys all day about how to do certain things that i have never done
[20:25:03] <ReadError> theres some good ole machinist here
[20:25:17] <jdh> and electrical, and mechanical
[20:25:24] <jdh> and software
[20:25:26] <ReadError> andy, archivist,
[20:25:28] <ReadError> pfred
[20:25:32] <ReadError> yea
[20:25:34] <ReadError> its a good mix
[20:25:47] <ReadError> programmers, machinist, etc
[20:25:52] <ReadError> Tom_itx is pretty good
[20:26:07] <t12> hah
[20:26:12] <t12> people are actively promoting that pov though
[20:26:28] <t12> people continously tell me in the future you're gonna have a replicator and be like i want a blender and it will 3d print you one!
[20:26:34] <t12> i'm usually like um not really
[20:26:39] <jdh> heh, then try to figure out blender
[20:26:41] <ReadError> lol
[20:26:50] <t12> professors at work do that stuff all the time
[20:26:58] <t12> megahyped on 3d printers
[20:27:04] <ReadError> yea, you wont be able to print a 3d blender
[20:27:04] <t12> not so hyped on the cnc mill
[20:27:09] <t12> cause that requires you to develop skills
[20:27:12] <t12> and not print files
[20:27:25] <ReadError> yea
[20:27:31] <ReadError> 3d printing is pretty easy
[20:27:44] <t12> its pretty nice for prototyping
[20:27:50] <ReadError> yea
[20:27:55] <t12> and i imagine moldmaking
[20:27:57] <ReadError> tolerances and stuff are too hard to control
[20:28:05] <ReadError> since it shrinks and stuff
[20:28:08] <tandoori> i think those servos would come in handy when milling pcbs
[20:28:18] <ReadError> *sigh*
[20:28:19] <ReadError> get it then
[20:28:32] <tandoori> why the sign?
[20:28:36] <tandoori> *sigh
[20:28:43] <ReadError> you will probably need a mesa card too
[20:28:56] <tandoori> dunno what that is
[20:30:46] <tandoori> ok fine i will get the darn stepper motors, but i have no knowledge on what to purchase
[20:31:26] <jdh> tehn get teh servos
[20:35:32] <tandoori> that may be the best option
[20:36:54] <ReadError> whats your top dollar
[20:37:01] <ReadError> requirements and price.
[20:37:27] <ReadError> and by top dollar i mean, "the amount i can spend before my wife divorces me"
[20:37:56] <jdh> or the amount you will tell her you spent,.
[20:51:16] <atom1> oh i remember why now
[20:51:47] <atom1> permissions
[20:51:56] <atom1> the t10 is blinking now
[20:52:02] <atom1> avrdude -c avrisp2 -P usb -p t10 -v -U flash:w:/home/tom/avrtest/Tiny10_asm/t10blink.hex:i
[20:52:52] <atom1> woops
[20:52:54] <atom1> sry
[21:05:14] <r00t4rd3d> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Router-collet-1-8-X-1-4-brass-/170972676495?pt=Sanders_Sandblasters&hash=item27cec4018f
[21:05:26] <r00t4rd3d> anyone know of anything better then that?
[21:06:01] <r00t4rd3d> 15 bucks and they dont last
[21:10:17] <ReadError> how are you breaking them?
[21:12:08] <r00t4rd3d> they just wear out
[21:12:11] <r00t4rd3d> brass
[21:12:20] <r00t4rd3d> i just found these steel ones:
[21:12:21] <r00t4rd3d> http://www.mlcswoodworking.com/shopsite_sc/store/html/smarthtml/pages/bushing_ball_bearings.html
[21:12:32] <r00t4rd3d> $4
[21:15:22] <r00t4rd3d> with the brass ones after awhile I can tighten my collet as tight as it will go
[21:16:00] <r00t4rd3d> and the bit is still lose
[21:16:04] <r00t4rd3d> loose
[21:17:15] <r00t4rd3d> now i gotta use 1/4 bits and i hate that cause they make a damn mess
[21:18:34] <jdh> 2x the chips?
[21:18:43] <r00t4rd3d> yeah
[21:19:06] <r00t4rd3d> and i only have regular wood bits in 1/4 , no carbide ones
[21:19:58] <r00t4rd3d> I tried using my adapter one last time tonight, i put a piece of thread tape around my bit first
[21:20:07] <r00t4rd3d> it fell out
[23:01:15] <tjb1> That's amazing…something left Hong Kong on Saturday, is being delivered in Pennsylvania tomorrow
[23:14:20] <tjb1> Does anyone see anything wrong with this? http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INSRIT?PARTPG=INLMKD&PMPXNO=951516&PMAKA=606-4725
[23:40:23] <Connor> jdh: You still up?