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[02:21:16] <Loetmichel> mornin'
[02:26:11] <DJ9DJ> moin
[06:04:50] <archivist> andypugh, I just turned a sleeve inner/outer at one setting for a hob reducer, clamping grip being enough to hold
[06:05:43] <archivist> also on the horizontal I dont think I have seen people using keys much if at all
[06:22:11] * jthornton wonders why you would want to have a dual boot with mach and emc?
[06:22:42] <archivist> cos he crazy
[06:23:06] <skunkworks> jthornton: I read that. there really isn't anything that works for both unless he goes printer port and breakout board.
[06:23:18] <archivist> how to be polite and say mak cannot handle the servos :)
[06:23:22] <jthornton> yea I know
[06:23:31] <jthornton> that too
[06:23:52] <archivist> he would have to replace his drivers for step dir
[06:24:01] <skunkworks> the mach side has been trying to get the 5i20 to work - but as far as I know it only works for i/o
[06:24:20] <skunkworks> and even that I am not sure.
[06:25:04] <skunkworks> biab - going to work
[06:29:43] <jthornton> looks like andypugh bit
[06:34:15] <archivist> jthornton, those tabs on that site are much like the button bar on a site I did for a window company
[06:35:00] <jthornton> you got a link?
[06:36:01] <archivist> has some horrid fading though
http://www.herronwindows.co.uk/ customer wanted
[06:36:32] <archivist> that us a ul list with css images
[06:36:44] <jthornton> cool
[06:36:56] <jthornton> I'm reading up on that now
[06:37:52] <archivist> the fading does steal a lot of cpu
[06:51:19] <tjb1> I need to go to bed :(
[06:51:29] <DJ9DJ> good night, tjb1
[06:51:43] <tjb1> 7:40 am
[06:51:49] <DJ9DJ> hrhr
[07:32:40] <skunkworks> andypugh, the kflop + kanalog
[07:33:22] <skunkworks> $249+$249
[07:34:14] <skunkworks> and as always...
[07:34:21] <skunkworks> Do I need to be a C Programmer to use your Controller?
[07:34:21] <skunkworks> Yes. Certain operations such as Controller initialization and Homing involve User C Programs that Execute in KFLOP. So some modification of C Programs is required. We do this because it is the most powerful and flexible approach. It isn't necessary to be a C expert, but basic programming knowledge is helpful. Download the software and go to the C Programs Screen to get an idea the level of difficulty.
[07:45:12] <cncbasher> kflops not a bad board works well
[07:48:12] <skunkworks> have you seen one in use? It seems well thought out. (but you are stuck with whatever has been implimented within the kflop)
[07:48:36] <cncbasher> i have 3 of them
[07:48:50] <skunkworks> wow
[07:49:14] <skunkworks> are you strickly using them step/dir?
[07:49:22] <cncbasher> no
[07:49:53] <cncbasher> i have one driving old baldor servo drives
[07:50:04] <skunkworks> are you using their gui or mach?
[07:50:06] <cncbasher> one on stepper
[07:50:25] <skunkworks> neat
[07:50:27] <cncbasher> i use their gui , never needed to use mach
[07:52:05] <cncbasher> one i use just the kflop and stitched it to a triac mill ( which is getting replaced shortly ) for a 5i20
[07:52:47] <cncbasher> the kflop and kanalog ii have on a laser
[07:52:54] <skunkworks> so - then why switch?
[07:53:10] <cncbasher> i need functions linuxcnc gives
[07:53:23] <cncbasher> otherwise i would not change it
[07:53:43] <skunkworks> understood. can I ask the functions?
[07:54:08] <cncbasher> gear cutting etc sync spindle to rotary etc
[07:54:50] <cncbasher> although i have no doubt i could write a script for the kflop to do it
[07:55:56] <cncbasher> iv'e used the kflop for oh about 4 years now , never been a problem at all
[07:56:21] <skunkworks> Tom seems very knowledgeable..
[07:56:37] <skunkworks> (from reading posts on cnczone and such)
[07:56:41] <cncbasher> i just need more flexibility
[07:57:10] <cncbasher> yes Tom's a good guy to know , helped me out in the early days
[07:57:12] <skunkworks> It is too bad he didn't use a more 'realtimey' interface - I am sure he could have dumbed his interface down for linuxcnc
[07:58:44] <cncbasher> all the realtime is dumped in the fpga on the kflop
[07:58:50] <skunkworks> rigfht
[07:58:52] <skunkworks> right
[07:59:03] <cncbasher> with a usb type server in the middle
[08:00:04] <cncbasher> which is the way most commercial systems go anyhow
[08:06:22] <Jymmm> Re: "skunkworks: Do I need to be a C Programmer to use your Controller?" Would be fun if it was in BF instead =)
[08:08:53] <skunkworks> cncbasher, I don't know if pcw_home would agree with you ;)
[08:10:37] <cncbasher> well it works and never gave me any problems , therefore it works
[08:11:23] <cncbasher> but no doubt if i wanted to dig deep i'd find something
[08:11:52] <skunkworks> Oh - I am not talking about that - I am talking about the commercial systems going usb...
[08:12:20] <cncbasher> but as the fpga is loaded at boot time similar to 5i20 etc , it's flexiable enough to keep up to date
[08:13:17] <cncbasher> arh yea i'd agree , but if they wont fit anything better than usless USB to pc's theirs not much option for some people
[08:13:48] <cncbasher> unless you want to tear the pc apart of course
[08:14:05] <skunkworks> with hobbiest it seems to come down to - 'but I want to run my machine with a laptop...'
[08:14:45] <cncbasher> yes .. next thing will be with a Iphone 4
[08:14:49] <skunkworks> heh
[08:14:56] <cncbasher> in a large plant
[08:15:24] <archivist> moving to network interface makes more sense for both groups I would have thought
[08:15:43] <skunkworks> yes - peter is close I think....
[08:15:46] <cncbasher> while the operator sits in his chair , having lunch
[08:16:43] <cncbasher> have visitors so must fly , back later
[08:19:01] <skunkworks> cncbasher, thanks for the insite
[08:25:53] <cncbasher> anytime
[08:26:00] <cncbasher> back later
[08:41:29] <jthornton> archivist, a sample page I made this morning playing with tabs and tables
http://gnipsel.com/linuxcnc/tabs/page1.html
[08:44:32] <archivist> coming on :)
[08:45:08] <archivist> some shifting happening, is there a width difference on some of the images
[08:48:13] <archivist> or border/padding/margin
[08:48:19] <JT-Shop-2> it's just one image
[08:48:37] <JT-Shop> what browser are you using?
[08:48:37] <Jymmm> http://gnipsel.com/linuxcnc/tabs/tabs.gif
[08:49:22] <archivist> ye olde firefox
[08:49:53] <JT-Shop> shifting when you select a tab?
[08:50:40] <JT-Shop> ah the selected tab is causing the shift
[08:50:42] <archivist> yes a pixel or few not a lot
[08:51:32] <archivist> I see some is done in em's and some in pixels
[08:53:39] <JT-Shop> where is that at?
[08:54:44] <archivist> mainly the height settings
[08:55:05] <archivist> in the css
[08:56:12] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: I think it's the padding at the very bottom of the css and/or other elements
[08:56:21] <Jymmm> padding 4px
[08:56:50] <Jymmm> then I see padding 10px elsewhere
[08:57:14] <IchGuckLive> hi all B)
[08:57:20] <archivist> there is an em sized padding in the top div
[08:58:30] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: Looks nice and clean
[09:00:36] <JT-Shop> Jymmm: how do you see the padding?
[09:00:56] <Jymmm> hmm?
[09:00:57] <archivist> look in the css
[09:01:30] <JT-Shop> oh, you just opened the css file
[09:01:42] <Jymmm> yeah
[09:02:07] <Jymmm> view-source:
http://gnipsel.com/linuxcnc/tabs/tabs.css
[09:02:22] <Jymmm> add the view-source:
[09:03:05] <JT-Shop> same as
http://gnipsel.com/linuxcnc/tabs/tabs.css
[09:03:06] <archivist> you can play with firebug in firefox too
[09:03:42] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: sure, but FF recognises view-srouce: as a link
[09:05:00] <archivist> in firebug you can hover over the html and see what it controls on the page
[09:05:24] <JT-Shop> ok
[09:07:56] <JT-Shop> I think it is the font-weight: bold; for ol#toc li.current a
[09:08:42] <archivist> yes that would do it
[09:08:44] <JT-Shop> yea that is what is moving it
[09:08:58] <JT-Shop> interesting stuff
[09:09:17] <archivist> I changed colour rather than weight to avoid that
[09:09:50] <JT-Shop> makes good sense to do it that way
[09:47:15] <JT-Shop> I removed the bold and it doens't jump around now... took a while for the server to cough up the new css
[09:52:56] <archivist> browsers like to use the css they have in the cache locally, force the refresh
[09:53:42] <archivist> I had to do a shift refresh here to get the updated css
[09:54:05] <JT-Shop> I changed computers! and it was still bold for a while
[09:55:15] <archivist> in between proxies cache too, can be a bit naughty
[10:09:17] <DJ9DJ> re
[10:21:16] <Jymmm> HAHAHAHAHAHAHAH I love it....
http://sfbay.craigslist.org/sby/dmg/3497934624.html
[10:24:44] <tjtr33> are there updated logs for the irc? i've used psha's for a long time, but he hasnt updated for a couple days. thx
[10:26:58] <pcw_home> yeah no 2013 in psha's logs
[10:27:09] <IchGuckLive> tjtr33: did you got your sim
[10:27:54] <tjtr33> IchGuckLive: yes thanks, will post url of wiki page
[10:28:50] <skunkworks> tjtr33, logger[mah]
[10:29:09] <IchGuckLive> tjtr33: no need
[10:29:18] <tjtr33> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?RotaryTable
[10:29:59] <IchGuckLive> tjtr33: why do you upload this CRAP
[10:30:15] <IchGuckLive> it is a hell of my miss
[10:30:29] <IchGuckLive> can you please remove this
[10:30:33] <tjtr33> why is it crap? if i wanted to know how to do 4 axis, i'd have to ask or look it up
[10:30:55] <IchGuckLive> there are files in that are more confusing than all others
[10:31:14] <IchGuckLive> there are 4 axis in the standard sim
[10:31:32] <IchGuckLive> that has nothing to do with toolchange eigther clamping
[10:32:00] <tjtr33> ok, criticism is ok, but stay cool, will look into killing it, no it has to do with 4th axis
[10:32:38] <IchGuckLive> the files i send you where never ever sopost to be published onto wiki as there has to be clear infos NO CRAP
[10:32:42] <tjtr33> who mentioned toolchange or clamping, sorry you are confused
[10:33:04] <IchGuckLive> thee is XYZA in the sim and also a STEPPER
[10:33:06] <tjtr33> as iu said before will try to remove, stay cool
[10:33:10] <IchGuckLive> and this is good
[10:33:31] <IchGuckLive> everything else is in the INTEGRETER MANUAL
[10:34:17] <IchGuckLive> so no need to get here this to rotary table
[10:34:36] <IchGuckLive> Rotory table is by far more then A,C
[10:34:48] <IchGuckLive> so please get this off !
[10:35:46] <IchGuckLive> Holy shit my 9axis sim crap as a Example i cand belive
[10:36:29] <IchGuckLive> archivist you have been wright yesterday no privat querry
[10:37:41] <IchGuckLive> tjtr33: you only need a HAL and a INI no more
[10:38:23] <IchGuckLive> tjtr33: you uploaded 12 files for a simple AXIS_3 -> AXIS_5 change
[10:39:06] <JT-Shop> Jymmm: that is funny
[10:40:35] <IchGuckLive> JT-Shop: beleve someone reads this
[10:41:07] <IchGuckLive> Therefor im with the devels to get partel access to the wiki
[10:41:12] <tjtr33> cant read it now, all gone
[10:41:21] <IchGuckLive> not public for everyone
[10:41:32] <IchGuckLive> tjtr33: Thanks
[10:41:41] <tjtr33> you are welcome
[10:42:52] <IchGuckLive> tjtr33: you can do this No problem BUT te Wright way
[10:52:08] <JT-Shop> tjtr33: not really gone
[11:04:18] <tjtr33> no, back, i've wiped the files with null files, all gone
[11:07:33] <JT-Shop> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?action=browse&id=RotaryTable&revision=3
[11:19:56] <tjtr33> 0 byte files
[12:17:00] <dgarr> testers wanted for a latency histogrammer: wget
http://www.panix.com/~dgarrett/stuff/lhisto.tcl
[12:17:00] <dgarr> some examples:
http://www.panix.com/~dgarrett/stuff/screenshots/
[12:17:05] <dgarr> usage,in a terminal: chmod +x lhisto.tcl then ./lhisto.tcl --help
[12:17:05] <dgarr> please post (imagebin.org) screenshot if it works, or terminal errors if it fails, thanks
[12:24:41] <tjtr33> dgarr running
[12:44:37] <cncbasher> dgarr: here you go
http://imagebin.org/241579
[12:45:33] <dgarr> thanks -- you might want to try with glxgears etc running too
[12:45:54] <cncbasher> hell i have 5 things running as it is
[12:45:58] <cncbasher> haha
[12:46:07] <dgarr> you can annotate for conditions using the --text option
[12:46:14] <cncbasher> ok
[12:46:24] <cncbasher> still figuring it all out
[12:46:39] <archivist> scrolling text in an editor window was better than glxgears on one pc
[12:47:38] <cncbasher> highest i'm getting is 1E2
[12:47:56] <cncbasher> thats on peaks
[12:48:55] <dgarr> the additional pos bins (in red) indicates latencies beyond display range. you can increase bins (--sbins) and/or binsize (--sbinsize) to increase range
[12:50:37] <cncbasher> http://imagebin.org/241580
[12:51:14] <tjtr33> does --sbins set the value (absolute) or add to the existing value (relative) ?
[12:51:43] <cncbasher> now we need it to go green on a good value , and a message to say this pc is scrap please recycle
[12:52:20] <dgarr> absolute
[12:52:50] <dgarr> maybe i should add a button to start glxgears
[12:53:45] <tjtr33> if absolute , how to tell the current value so user can insert a larger/smaller value
[12:54:54] <tjtr33> cncbasher, your latency is so small the lines go from pencil lines to a bargraph
[12:55:03] <dgarr> the value in use is the rightmost radio button value on the line "Display +/- bins..."
[12:56:10] <tjtr33> ok, I was maxed at 250, so restart with --sbins 500 (or so )
[12:58:51] <dgarr> yes (it will update more slowly with more bins) for similar update rates, you can increase binsize while keeping same number of bins
[16:10:26] <DJ9DJ> gn8
[16:28:26] <JT-Shop> what does Refurbished really mean?
http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/B00ABNP28Q/sr=/qid=/ref=olp_tab_all?ie=UTF8&colid=&coliid=&me=&qid=&seller=&sr=
[16:45:00] <PCW> windex?
[16:53:09] <L84Supper> 30 Day Warranty
[16:53:26] <L84Supper> vs 1 -2 years
[17:44:37] <Tom_itx> JT-Shop, is that just touch screen?
[17:45:14] <Tom_itx> there were 4-6 17" here i could have gotten for $65 ea last year
[17:49:38] <JT-Shop> well I think it is just a touch screen
[17:50:09] * JT-Shop tries to get the time machine to start...
[17:50:11] <Tom_itx> i had one i wanted to use but the lcd got cracked shipping to me
[17:50:16] <Tom_itx> the touch part is new
[17:50:44] <Tom_itx> i got a spare sent with it
[17:50:44] <JT-Shop> I hate when that happens
[17:50:56] <Tom_itx> it still works but with a big spider in the corner
[17:51:31] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/SBC/lcd_spot.jpg
[17:52:11] <JT-Shop> that sucks
[17:52:19] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/SBC/lcdpanel.jpg
[17:52:26] <Tom_itx> that's how it arrived
[17:52:32] <JT-Shop> yikes
[17:52:34] <Tom_itx> it was all free but still
[17:52:44] <Tom_itx> i replaced the touch glass on it
[17:52:55] <JT-Shop> that didn't make it past the package manglers
[17:53:11] <Tom_itx> the guy didn't pack it very well
[17:53:57] * JT-Shop goes back to trying to get close enough to the table saw to cut a new door for the CHNC
[17:59:26] <JT-Shop> screw it, I'll dig it out tomorrow
[17:59:45] <JT-Shop> Tom_itx: did you see the html tabs thing I was playing with?
[18:01:26] <Tom_itx> i saw something about css yesterday
[18:01:29] <Tom_itx> but not yours
[18:01:45] <JT-Shop> http://www.gnipsel.com/linuxcnc/reference/page1.html
[18:03:57] <Tom_itx> looks good
[18:04:05] <JT-Shop> thanks
[18:04:41] <Tom_itx> easier than regular menus?
[18:05:00] <JT-Shop> the html and css is dead simple
[18:05:56] <Tom_itx> my page is due for a facelift but i'm not in the mood
[18:06:32] <JT-Shop> my CHNC needs a new lexan part for the door but I'm not in the mood either
[18:16:30] <JT-Shop> I need to build a log splitter
[18:19:04] <Tom_itx> i made one years back
[18:19:15] <JT-Shop> you still use it?
[18:19:20] <Tom_itx> no i sold it
[18:19:28] <Tom_itx> 2 stage hydraulic pump etc
[18:19:29] <JT-Shop> I've used a double blade axe all my life
[18:20:54] <Tom_itx> i had a used kolar engine i used on it
[18:23:29] <Tom_itx> err wisconsin...
[18:25:09] <Tom_itx> you probably have something with a PTO you could use
[18:26:42] <JT-Shop> yea, but I don't want to stand behind the tractor while it runs, the exhaust is in the back
[18:28:38] <Tom_itx> mine was on an old truck axle
[18:29:23] <ReadError> !!!
[18:29:30] <ReadError> this 3d mouse works PERFECT in hidcomp :)
[18:30:46] <andypugh> I decided on a solution to my arbor problem. I am making one from scratch.
[18:30:55] <JT-Shop> cool
[18:31:12] <JT-Shop> I want a log lift and a working table... I think
[18:31:30] <ReadError> http://i.imgur.com/bsJ9B.png
[18:32:22] <JT-Shop> something like this almost
http://www.arboristsite.com/attachments/firewood-heating-wood-burning-equipment/218798d1327158567-scan0004-1-jpg
[18:32:26] <andypugh> I spent most of this evening making a BT30 / ISO 30 / 30INT socket to screw on to the lathe spindle nose (I expect to make a fair bit of tooling) and got as far as making the taper. Should be finished tomorrow.
[18:32:56] <ReadError> hey if anyone in the USA wants to buy a discounted set of lathe stuff
[18:33:02] <ReadError> i just got some thats too big ;/
[18:33:04] <ReadError> never been used
[18:33:58] <Tom_itx> what is it?
[18:34:37] <ReadError> http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B005W16Z24/ref=oh_details_o03_s00_i00
[18:34:48] <ReadError> paid 67.97
[18:34:59] <ReadError> i might be able to make a bigger tool holder
[18:35:08] <ReadError> not sure if the stuff is too oversized for my little lathe though
[18:35:54] <dgarr> jthornton: what kind of trees do you cut for firewood in se mo?
[18:35:59] <TekniQue> I need to get my hands on a 3 jaw chuck for my lathe
[18:36:07] <JT-Shop> oak and hickory
[18:36:20] <Tom_itx> ever burn hedge?
[18:36:21] <JT-Shop> Hi!
[18:37:20] <JT-Shop> my tree smarts are just a little above there are two kinds of trees, pine trees and other trees :)
[18:37:23] <dgarr> are there persimmon tree s in the area?
[18:37:42] <JT-Shop> yes, I have several as well as black walnut
[18:37:43] <andypugh> ReadError: Looks pretty old-school. HSS toolbit holders and dogs for working between centres.
[18:38:00] <Tom_itx> you should use that for finish wood
[18:38:04] <andypugh> All potentially useful for special jobs I guess.
[18:38:35] <JT-Shop> I have one giant tree that is burled all the way up and it grows on a 15 degree angle
[18:38:55] <dgarr> persimmons are in the same genus as ebony (Diospyros) , i've always wanted to try some
[18:39:45] <JT-Shop> I'll check with Ricky and Joe to see if they have any cut up, what size are you looking for?
[18:40:32] <JT-Shop> http://imagebin.org/241621
[18:41:00] <JT-Shop> I'm not even sure what kind of tree that is...
[18:42:13] <dgarr> 10 in diam rounds or less, split through the pith
[18:42:25] <dgarr> a lot of woodturners would like those burls
[18:42:35] <ReadError> andypugh: well i was going to sell it for 50$ shipped or so
[18:43:06] <andypugh> No good to me, I am in the UK (and my lathe is fairly small too)
[18:43:11] <JT-Shop> what does "split through the pith" mean?
[18:43:44] <andypugh> Pith Helmets are poor protection against Orcs.
[18:44:36] <JT-Shop> my great uncle wore a pith helmet
[18:45:05] <dgarr> through the center, it may help reduce cracking on drying; turners often use chainsaw to rip through center
[18:45:31] <andypugh> I can see it might reduce shaking.
[18:45:36] <JT-Shop> dgarr: I'll let you know what I find
[18:46:03] <JT-Shop> rip it lenght wise like splitting firewood?
[18:46:04] <dgarr> sure -- no pressure:P
[18:46:12] <dgarr> yes
[18:46:36] <JT-Shop> Ricky says he does not have any... I'll keep on the lookout
[18:47:13] * JT-Shop retires to the cocina to make mexican food for dinner
[18:47:16] <JT-Shop> goodnight all
[18:50:15] <ReadError> well im pretty thrilled this 3d mouse works on hidcomp
[18:50:23] <ReadError> this would make a sweet pendant
[18:50:42] <tjb1> 3d connexion?
[18:50:47] <ReadError> yea
[18:50:52] <ReadError> http://i.imgur.com/bsJ9B.png
[18:51:01] <ReadError> guess i posted it before you came
[18:51:09] <ReadError> but everything got picked up perfect
[18:51:10] <tjb1> I have one of them
[18:51:28] <ReadError> oh word
[18:51:34] <ReadError> yea bit of a learning curve it seems
[18:51:40] <ReadError> but im getting pretty decent with it
[18:53:29] <ReadError> you try it on your plasma yet ?
[18:58:09] <alex4nder> he
[18:58:10] <alex4nder> y
[19:00:36] <ReadError> sup alex4nder
[19:01:33] <ReadError> http://lh3.ggpht.com/_aNjK3CTQ0DE/TS329yqS80I/AAAAAAAAMxI/TXU0r73znsg/s1600-h/pzich21%5B3%5D.jpg
[19:01:39] <ReadError> you see that i posted the other day?
[19:02:06] <jdh> looks too clean.
[19:02:30] <ReadError> its not mine ;)
[19:03:10] <jdh> I need some 7.5" OD, 7.25" ID rigid tubing of some sort
[19:03:54] <AR_> too bad
[19:05:07] <AR_> whose is that, ReadError ?
[19:05:14] <AR_> looks like what i'm working on building
[19:05:20] <AR_> or dreaming about, anyway
[19:06:06] <ReadError> it was on the cartertools blog
[19:06:31] <ReadError> super riced up taig
[19:19:52] <ReadError> i should put a condom or some type of wrapper over this thing when i cut with it
[19:19:58] <ReadError> dont want to get chips and stuff inside it
[19:20:02] <ReadError> maybe some saran wrap
[20:21:37] <gmouer> anyone real familiar with the mesa 7i77 ? I want to use one of the 32 inputs for analog, the mesa manual says it can do that but I suspect hostmot does not handle it with this particular board.
[20:22:28] <skunkworks> that would probably be a question for pcw and or andypugh
[20:22:30] <andypugh> I think it ought to be possible
[20:22:37] <skunkworks> heh
[20:23:08] <andypugh> Let me look at the manuals...
[20:23:17] <gmouer> hi andy, the manual says it can be done in data mode 1 or mode 2, I "suspect" the standard hm2 interface for that board is mode 3
[20:23:23] <gmouer> look at pg 19 andy
[20:26:13] <andypugh> loadrt hm2_pci config="sserial_port_0=30000000" should do the trick.
[20:27:02] <andypugh> (or whatever mode you fancy)
[20:27:04] <gmouer> does that line of code put the board in mode 3?
[20:27:51] <andypugh> It puts the sserial device on channel 0 in mode 3. I am fairly sure that will be the 7i77 if it is on the D-sub
[20:28:10] <andypugh> It's an edit of the HAL file
[20:28:29] <andypugh> man hostmot2 for details..
[20:28:48] <gmouer> I already have the 7i77 operational using pncconf, just wanted to add a pot using one of the inputs if possible
[20:29:13] <gmouer> will have to research what mode pncconf loads the hm2 code in by default
[20:29:32] <gmouer> don't want to screw up everything else that is setup and working presently
[20:29:50] <andypugh> mode3 gives you encoder inputs too, might be better than a pot depending on what you want it for (very cheap 16-pulse rotary switches exist)
[20:30:08] <andypugh> Default is mode 0
[20:30:35] <andypugh> incrementing the mode just adds pins, so shiouldn't break anything.
[20:30:41] <gmouer> have to see what mode pncconf loads hm2 in
[20:31:20] <andypugh> I think PNCConf leaves the config blank, but as I have never used it....
[20:31:34] <gmouer> I looked around my hal pins for hm2 and did not find any analog pins for the 32 inputs at all, only bit values
[20:32:08] <gmouer> looked around the parameters for hm2 also and didn't see anything that hinted at analog useage on the 32 inputs
[20:32:43] <andypugh> Yes, default is mode zero as PNCConf has no idea how many modes any particular card supports, and has no way to find out. (we need to fix that)
[20:33:21] <gmouer> I think I am getting the picture
[20:34:01] <andypugh> The magic invocation is the sserial_port_0 thing, which is described here:
http://www.linuxcnc.org/docs/html/man/man9/hostmot2.9.html#Smart%20Serial%20Interface
[20:34:05] <gmouer> so if I edit the hal to loadrt in mode 3, then would some additional pins appear supporting analog? (non bit?)\
[20:34:14] <andypugh> Not, I admit, very clearly
[20:34:22] <andypugh> Yes.
[20:35:02] <gmouer> well, it does not sound too bad on the surface, guess I have enough info to experiment a bit now
[20:35:08] <andypugh> This is the section that describes the card mode:
http://www.linuxcnc.org/docs/html/man/man9/hostmot2.9.html#config%20modparam
[20:37:13] <andypugh> What do you want the pot for?
[20:37:32] <gmouer> feed rate override and spindle override
[20:38:39] <andypugh> You probably want encoders, not pots. Something like
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/5PCS-12mm-Rotary-Encoder-Switch-with-Keyswitch-with-2-bit-gray-scale-/300669235752?pt=UK_BOI_Electrical_Components_Supplies_ET&hash=item4601487228
[20:39:14] <andypugh> (note that Mode 3 has some MPG-style low perforamnce encoders)
[20:39:35] <gmouer> yea, I seen that mpg function and pete mentioned it a while back
[20:40:03] <andypugh> 2-bit gray code == quadrature
[20:40:20] <Tom_itx> i got a couple of those from mouser recently
[20:41:01] <andypugh> They bounce if you spin too fast, but that isn't actually a disaster with manual controls.
[20:41:27] <Tom_itx> http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/ALPS/EC11E15244B2/?qs=%2fha2pyFadugMG2RDp45gzKwS2iwzGZk6yHguutpgbopbylGI2VEmmg%3d%3d
[20:41:39] <Tom_itx> those have a pushbutton as well
[20:42:35] <andypugh> (the ebay one also has a pushbutton, though I have not decided what you would use it for)
[20:43:14] <gmouer> the encoder would prohibit a panel calibration markings such as 0% 50% 200% and such though
[20:43:17] <Tom_itx> reprappers use them for menu selection
[20:43:24] <Tom_itx> encoder to scroll and button to select
[20:45:18] <andypugh> gmouer: Yes, but there is an issue with feed-override and suchlike which have GUI controls too. It's very hard to make the GUI and switch agree, whereas with an incremental switch they can cooperate more easily.
[20:46:36] <gmouer> I have the pot method on my lathe, interfaced though a usb game controller, and it is not objectionable how it works with the gui
[20:47:07] <gmouer> the gui indiciator follows the pot position
[20:48:21] <andypugh> The cool thing is, you can use either method. PCW makes nice toys.
[20:48:23] <gmouer> if, you move the gui slider, that grabs control and overrides the pot setting
[20:48:49] <gmouer> PCW sure does make nice toys, I am 100% sold
[20:49:49] <PCW> The 7I77 aux encoders are only there if you have the latest 7I77 firmware
[20:49:52] <andypugh> I do prefer the encoder for overrides though, as after the GUI has changed it, an encoder can change it back from the current value. What happens if you move the pot after a GUi change>
[20:49:58] <gmouer> I came over from the mach3 world, it took 3 boards to approach what the 7i77 does, and still not even come close, and the 7i77 is a lot cheaper too
[20:50:26] <PCW> (so mode 3 may not be there depending on firmware version)
[20:51:10] <andypugh> PCW: Ah!, so that clown who has been messing about with a firmware flasher needs to pull his finger out?
[20:51:23] <gmouer> Pete, to use one of the 32 analog inputs for a pot only needs mode 1 or 2 though, right?
[20:51:26] <PCW> I didnt say a thing
[20:51:37] <PCW> Yes mode 1 or 2
[20:52:00] <gmouer> and.. is mode 1 or 2 on all the firmware versions?
[20:52:10] <PCW> Yes
[20:52:38] <gmouer> ok great, so if I edit to loadrt hm2 in mode 2 then some pins for analog useage will appear?
[20:53:09] <PCW> Yep (well thats the theory anyway)
[20:53:34] <gmouer> oh no! you mean I am going to blaze that territory?
[20:54:43] <PCW> how about this: "Its very likely to work"
[20:55:12] <gmouer> lol, that give me personally about a 10% chance then, which I am used to
[20:55:35] <skunkworks> I love this place
[20:55:47] <gmouer> now that is the truth Sam !
[20:55:56] <PCW> actually the driver _could_ print put the available mode names
[20:56:10] <PCW> s/put/out/
[20:56:32] <gmouer> I told a woman that once, got slapped silly
[20:56:43] <PCW> lol
[20:56:51] <andypugh_> PCW: Yes, and I guess that there is no reason not to, except that no-one ever reads the dmesg anyway...
[20:57:12] <Valen> I did :-<
[20:57:15] <PCW> only people who complain about pin numbers
[20:58:25] <gmouer> I am betting it will work nicely, I have trust in mesa and Pete
[20:58:34] <andypugh> Am I still here? I am getting confused
[20:58:40] * Valen just had a 1tb drive die :-< lost 1/4 of my tv recordings
[20:58:49] <gmouer> you are making me dizzy andy, sit down and stay put
[20:58:52] <Valen> going to have to download burn notice lol
[20:58:54] <skunkworks> gmouer: explain how the analog on the joystick interacts with the gui slider?
[20:59:43] <skunkworks> like what happens after you move the gui slider - then touch the analog..\
[21:00:04] <gmouer> ok Sam, I remoted a couple pots from the game controler to the from panel for spindle override and fro
[21:00:26] <andypugh> gmouer: The mode support is down to the driver writer, and he is notoriously unreliable. I think it works though.
[21:01:15] <gmouer> sam, when the pot is turned, the onscreen gui slider follows
[21:01:40] <Tom_itx> what happens when you move the gui slider?
[21:01:41] <gmouer> then if you grab the onscreen slider and move it, it grabs control
[21:01:48] <Tom_itx> the pot value will not follow
[21:01:58] <andypugh> Valen: Have you tried extreme hackery, such as buying an identical drive and swapping logic boards?
[21:02:00] <gmouer> then... if you touch the pot at all it regains control
[21:02:06] <Tom_itx> i think an encoder would be ideal there
[21:02:07] <skunkworks> right - but what happens if you move the gui all the way to the opposite direction as the analog? when you touch the analog - would it not be stuck?
[21:02:14] <Tom_itx> since it doesn't have a 'value' per se
[21:02:17] <Valen> andypugh: I do have identical hdds
[21:02:34] <skunkworks> or does the gui then pop to wherever the pot is?
[21:02:39] <Valen> but I'm not sure its worth the risk of loosing 2 drives worth of data lol
[21:02:53] <gmouer> sam, yes the slider immediately pops back to the pot position
[21:03:09] <skunkworks> that could be 'interesting'
[21:03:12] <Valen> it is an electrical issue i'm pretty sure, feels like a line driver
[21:03:14] <Tom_itx> yeah
[21:03:31] <ReadError> Valen, ZFS ?
[21:03:39] <gmouer> in practice, it works great because with the pot there is no reason to move the gui slider anyways, its only a indicator in actual use
[21:03:44] <Valen> using linux so no
[21:03:51] <ReadError> ZFS is on linux now
[21:03:54] <skunkworks> I guess if you know that is the behavior - then always use the pot :)
[21:03:57] <skunkworks> heh
[21:03:59] <Valen> outside of fuse?
[21:04:06] <ReadError> yea
[21:04:11] <Tom_itx> an encoder interface would solve that
[21:04:17] <Valen> now thats interesting
[21:04:22] <ReadError> guy at work uses it on ubuntu
[21:04:34] <ReadError> i use freenas though
[21:04:39] <gmouer> Andy, Pete, thanks much guys for the great help! always appreciated
[21:05:02] <Valen> I am in the process of de-virtualising a freenas server at the moment
[21:05:09] <Valen> bsd doesn't play nice inside KVM
[21:05:24] <skunkworks> I could see vibration causing the analog to take over at random times
[21:05:30] <Valen> like 300% cpu use on host when copying
[21:05:31] <ReadError> well i run my freenas inside of vmware esxi
[21:05:51] <Tom_itx> andypugh, how many counts were those encoders?
[21:06:00] <Tom_itx> iirc mine are 15 with 30 detents
[21:06:01] <andypugh> 16 I think.
[21:06:18] <gmouer> sam, never had a single issue, but my machines don't shake as much as yours ;)
[21:06:25] <skunkworks> heh
[21:06:27] <Valen> I had a spare machine sitting there so i figured why not
[21:06:31] <andypugh> I have not actually tried using one yet.
[21:06:46] <Tom_itx> did you get some?
[21:06:57] <andypugh> (and I might end up with a $400 resolver as a jogwheel.....)
[21:07:00] <Tom_itx> lemme know when you do, i have a spare or two to play with
[21:07:02] <Valen> you do any replication ReadError?
[21:07:05] <ReadError> yea
[21:07:06] <Tom_itx> i got a regular mpg
[21:07:10] <ReadError> i got 2 esxi servers
[21:07:20] <Valen> I meant between freenas
[21:07:24] <ReadError> yea
[21:07:30] <ReadError> freenas on both
[21:07:35] <andypugh> I have 10 of the rotary switches, but the machine doesn't use them yet.
[21:08:00] <Valen> I have it set up authenticating off an AD server, rsync seems to loose the windows file permissions when i used it, think zfs replication would preserve it?
[21:08:23] <ReadError> theres a flag for rsync that retains perms
[21:08:26] <ReadError> iirc
[21:08:30] <Valen> i set that
[21:08:33] <ReadError> but i think it might be linux perms only
[21:08:34] <Valen> didn't seem to do anything much
[21:08:43] <Valen> it does seem that way
[21:08:46] <ReadError> not sure
[21:08:55] <ReadError> ZFS is nice though
[21:09:02] <andypugh> It _does_ do rigid tapping though. (only the Z axis is done, Y is waiting on a firmware update on the 8i20, X is waiting on ballscrews, motor, castings, and a firmware update)
[21:09:03] <ReadError> not a huge fan of AD/windows stuff
[21:09:06] <Valen> zfs replication was proving too hard to set up
[21:09:16] <ReadError> even inside of freenas ?
[21:09:18] <Valen> me either, but "magic application" required it
[21:09:24] <gmouer> Andy: those rotary encoders you linked on ebay, is the 2 bit gray code the same thing as A and B outputs on standard encoders?
[21:09:28] <Valen> trying to go from 8.0.4 to 8.3
[21:09:59] <andypugh> gmouer: Yes. 2-bur Gray-code is identical to quadrature
[21:10:06] <Valen> the ssh key setup was proving a pain in the ass so i skipped it lol, I plan on trying it again tonight
[21:10:08] <andypugh> (2-bit)
[21:10:23] <gmouer> ok, thanks, now I understand
[21:12:23] <Valen> a linux freenas would be nice
[21:12:34] <Valen> (with zfs)
[21:13:01] <ReadError> they have one i think
[21:13:04] <ReadError> nas4free
[21:13:06] <ReadError> or somethin
[21:13:15] <Valen> i think thats still bsd
[21:13:22] <ReadError> some of the freenas devs branched off to make a linux one i thought
[21:13:41] <Valen> I saw that one too, but no zfs that I saw
[21:13:45] <andypugh> Quadrature can be seen as the second-simplest gray-code. 1-bit gray-code is just pulses, 2-bit is quadrature, 3-bit is what bldc hall-sensors output, 4-bit is the Fanuc Red-cap output. 5-bit might well be the pattern of pentaphase stepper motors, but by the time you get to 6-bits I think yiou are only in Gray-code land.
[21:13:47] <ReadError> ah yea that one is fbsd also
[21:13:51] <ReadError> fbsd is rock solid though
[21:13:59] <Valen> zfs + snapshots + windows shadow volume = goodness
[21:14:12] <Valen> tis, i just want it to play nice inside kvm
[21:14:23] <ReadError> bahhh kvm
[21:14:28] <ReadError> step it up to vmware esxi
[21:14:32] <Valen> how much of a performance hit do you think you are getting inside the VM?
[21:14:34] <ReadError> they have a free license
[21:14:42] <Valen> bah I like having big boy tools ;-P
[21:14:52] <ReadError> you played with esxi 5?
[21:14:54] <ReadError> its slick man
[21:14:56] <gmouer> gray code is a new term to me, I have not come across that one before
[21:14:57] <Valen> I use ganeti which runs KVM and DRBD
[21:15:11] <ReadError> free for 1 physical cpu
[21:15:19] <Valen> so i get basically a network RAID setup, live migration and the like
[21:15:23] <ReadError> i got a xeon with 32gb of ram on one
[21:15:26] <ReadError> its a beast
[21:15:41] <ReadError> SSD
[21:16:12] <Valen> my "cluster" is a pair of dell R210II's 2x 1Tb sata, quad xeon 3Ghz, 32gb ram all in a short depth wall mount cabnet ;->
[21:16:23] <Valen> sticking freenas onto the 3rd R210
[21:16:49] <Tom_itx> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grey_codes
[21:16:55] <ReadError> HA is slick too if you have the license for it
[21:17:19] <andypugh> By the way, I have that New-Scientist article as a PDF, if anyone is curious.
[21:17:31] <ReadError> which article ?
[21:17:40] <Valen> I could do HA, but given the reliability of the computers, a HA setup is too much of a pain to get working well
[21:17:52] <Valen> so i just do it by hand
[21:17:53] <andypugh> the "not-eating might be good for you" one
[21:17:56] <ReadError> Valen, in vmware is all automagic
[21:18:02] <ReadError> you can literally migrate a guest with a mouse
[21:18:17] <Valen> migrating guests is easy enough with my setup
[21:18:28] <Valen> gnt-instance migrate somevm
[21:18:33] <ReadError> but this basically replicates the guest ram and stuff over on the fly
[21:18:38] <ReadError> through the backend network
[21:18:42] <Valen> there is a web interface for it all but i never bothered with it
[21:18:47] <ReadError> so it fires up and its like it never went offline
[21:19:34] <Valen> thats a live migration too, the disk replication is handled by DRBD so even if one node catches fire I can fire up the VM's on the second node and it just looks to the host like an unplanned power outage
[21:19:35] <ReadError> i wish work would give me a few spare r710s
[21:19:46] <ReadError> i could have some fun with them
[21:19:50] <ReadError> 192gb ram
[21:19:51] <ReadError> noms
[21:20:10] <Valen> heh I hate the ram in the 210s, ECC unbuffered
[21:20:13] <Valen> nobody makes that
[21:20:16] <Valen> max 32gb too
[21:20:40] <ReadError> plus, vmware supports VTd
[21:20:46] <ReadError> so you can give you guest direct hardware access
[21:20:50] <ReadError> to w/e you want
[21:20:58] <Valen> kvm supports all of that too ;-P
[21:21:04] <Valen> for free ;->
[21:21:10] <ReadError> yea this is free too
[21:21:15] <ReadError> (for 1 cpu ;P
[21:21:20] <Valen> except for the big boy parts like vmotion
[21:21:48] <ReadError> i want to build out openstack when i get some time
[21:22:01] <Valen> check out ganeti, its kinda in the middle
[21:22:21] <Valen> openstack seems pretty darn heavy in terms of requirements
[21:22:53] <ReadError> well you can actually build it out within KVM on a single machine
[21:22:56] <ReadError> if you wanted to test
[21:23:36] <Valen> I think I'd only really be interested in a push button install of it all
[21:23:40] <Valen> too many bits for me
[21:23:53] <ReadError> yea its pretty involved to setup
[21:24:00] <ReadError> but they have a distro made for it now iirc
[21:25:04] <andypugh> I had a Mac that used unbuffered ECC. (the only one, AFAIK). It was inconvenient.
[21:26:05] <Valen> I hear openstack is going to run off ceph, if they can get WAN replication for ceph working that would be awesome
[21:26:32] <Valen> nobody has yet solved "branch office" with access to head offices file server, in a good way
[21:30:39] <Valen> andypugh: I read the fasting article, and decided it wasn't worth it lol
[21:33:15] <andypugh> I think that the journalist rather over-states the effect of not eating for a day. I have occasonally done so by accident because I was too busy, and not noticed until I decided to sleep.
[21:34:22] <Valen> I often go to 5 or 6 PM before eating
[21:40:34] <ReadError> andypugh, link?
[21:41:51] <andypugh> i think you were here, but
http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg21628912.400-deprive-yourself-the-real-benefits-of-fasting.html
[21:42:47] <ReadError> it only has 2 paragraphs or so for me
[21:43:15] <ReadError> do you have the pdf up ?
[22:00:33] <andypugh> ReadError: Does this work?
https://docs.google.com/open?id=0BxjJW1-T6n7CbDgyYkViTUVESVk
[22:00:54] <ReadError> ah yea cool
[22:00:56] <Valen> works for me
[22:00:57] <ReadError> let me read this
[22:01:15] <Valen> what I'd really like newsci to do, is have a home page that I can view by date
[22:01:31] <Valen> I don't want to see stuff that came out after the mag that i'm up to
[22:02:56] <andypugh> Anyway, silly-late here. Time to sleep.
[22:03:04] <Valen> nighty night
[22:03:17] * Valen is off to the pool then an office to screw with computators
[22:04:25] <Jymmm> Fist it was secretaries, then admin, now computars
[22:04:35] <ReadError> lol
[22:04:50] <ReadError> SCREW ALLLL THE THINGS!
[22:06:41] <Valen> best part about that paticular office is the secretary is the admin is the hot blonde
[22:07:25] <Valen> not so much luck on the screwing though :-<
[23:18:52] <p0st4L> who starts 2 companies in the first week of 2013?
[23:18:54] <p0st4L> this guy
[23:18:56] <p0st4L> :)
[23:19:00] <p0st4L> fuck,
[23:19:02] <p0st4L> wrong chat
[23:19:19] <p0st4L> jay kay, el oh el
