#linuxcnc | Logs for 2012-10-19

[02:05:54] <DJ9DJ> moin
[02:33:24] <Loetmichel> mornin
[02:38:18] <Jymmm> Heh, somebody is getting fired from google
[02:40:08] <Loetmichel> ?
[02:47:09] <Jymmm> someone released the quarterly report 3 hours early (before the market closed); Stocks dropped and they lost about $3 Billion dollars.
[04:08:41] <alex_joni> Jymmm: ouch
[04:12:02] <alex_joni> Google Inc. blamed printer R.R. Donnelley & Sons Co. for filing the company.s quarterly statement with the Securities and Exchange Commission more than three hours ahead of schedule.
[04:17:15] <Jymmm> https://www.google.com/finance?q=RR+Donnelley&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=we
[04:19:25] <Jymmm> https://www.google.com/finance?authuser=0&q=goog&ei=sReBUMjqKISSlAPHeg
[04:22:24] <Jymmm> My bad... $22 Billion. The 9 percent drop in shares of Google Inc., owner of the largest Web-search engine, wiped more than $22 billion from its market capitalization in minutes
[04:22:59] <mazafaka> My Google search history is 'Ca m'enerve, tap drilling, the Resume form'
[04:23:06] <Jymmm> That's with a 'B'. Not 'M', but 'B'
[04:23:54] <mazafaka> That's because all their money are a fake.
[04:25:05] <mazafaka> If they would have sheets of metal in the stock they couldn't lose the money.
[04:30:15] <mazafaka> I mean, all this advertisement and the stuff doesn't really worth money. It's such activity admitted to be useful, and its arrangment should worth something, but the situation is wonky.
[07:36:55] <maximilian_he> hey
[07:37:09] <maximilian_he> there is a dead link on the linuxcnc.org website
[07:37:17] <maximilian_he> have a look at http://www.linuxcnc.org/index.php/english/documentation
[07:37:47] <maximilian_he> the link for 'Becoming a contributor' is dead, it delivers a 404
[07:37:53] <maximilian_he> for this page http://www.linuxcnc.org/content/view/50/13/
[08:08:01] <MattyMatt> will #5423=[#5423 MOD 360.0] cancel the accumulated rotations cleanly?
[08:10:52] <MattyMatt> I'd use G92 but it'd hit the machine axis limits eventually
[08:14:19] <mhaberler> you might want to look into fix, fup, round: http://www.linuxcnc.org/docs/devel/html/gcode/overview.html#sub:Unary-Operation-Value
[08:15:38] <MattyMatt> I don't think so, I just want to remove multiples of 360 leaving the float remainder
[08:16:53] <MattyMatt> so I don't have needless rotations when I do G0 A0 when A is at 3600 degrees etc
[08:26:32] <MattyMatt> MOD says it works with floats presumably like fmod() but my question is more about #5423. is that the absolute value of the A axis and will changing it cause any crazy feedrates etc in co-ordinated moves that follow?
[08:32:11] <cradek> that parameter is read-only. if you use your rotary mostly as an indexer, perhaps you want to use WRAPPED_ROTARY mode
[08:33:29] <MattyMatt> cheers I'll look into that
[08:37:30] <MattyMatt> meh, that won't help, because I'm doing G1 A5400 X6 to mill a helix
[08:38:35] <MattyMatt> G92 A[#5423 MOD 360.0] will do the job until I hit the axis limit tho?
[08:40:28] <MattyMatt> axis limit is +/- 99999 so for 12 pulleys in a row that should do me
[08:59:29] <r00t4rd3d> http://i.imgur.com/rdTsC.jpg
[09:01:09] <jdh> you are the one on the right?
[09:02:26] <r00t4rd3d> FIRE!
[09:02:51] * r00t4rd3d needs TP for his bunghole
[09:03:25] <r00t4rd3d> im gonna cut that in oak.
[09:08:21] <jdh> you could cut it in platinum.
[09:08:45] <jdh> maybe find a rich 12 year old to buy it?
[09:09:52] <r00t4rd3d> I dont think my machine could cut platinum.
[09:12:08] <cradek> MattyMatt: just add a few more nines. you can turn 5400 degrees in wrapped mode, just use G91. or I guess you could just use G91 anyway if you don't care what the DRO says.
[09:14:47] <archivist> this is the problem I have mentioned before :)
[09:15:24] <cradek> maybe I'm not getting it
[09:15:36] <cradek> but I see several ways to handle it just fine
[09:19:37] <archivist> after n degrees/turns you need a simple go to nearest 0 which is a less than 180 degree move, not in wrapped mode though, in a free turning rotary there is NO limit
[09:42:42] <MattyMatt> yeah that'd be most useful, putting it in the -180 to +180 range
[09:44:19] <MattyMatt> or even an arbitrary centre, so if you're gonna resume at A=90 say, have a way to reset within 180 deg of that
[11:03:02] <mrsun> an angle shelf in aluminium should be sufficient for a small milling machine shouldnt it? :)
[11:03:18] <mrsun> or what is it called?
[11:06:36] <Jymmm> a table?
[11:07:14] <mrsun> no ... the thingies you set on the table to get a right angle up =)
[11:07:18] <mrsun> with slots so you can clamp to it
[11:07:29] <JT-Shop> got a photo?
[11:07:45] <Jymmm> 123 blocks?
[11:07:56] <jdh> angle plate
[11:07:59] <mrsun> http://shop.otdtools.se/public/img/user/992275.jpg
[11:08:01] <syyl> an angle block
[11:08:02] <syyl> ..
[11:08:04] <syyl> eh
[11:08:06] <syyl> angleplate
[11:08:07] <syyl> sry
[11:08:07] <mrsun> yeah
[11:08:13] <mrsun> angle plate =)
[11:08:35] <syyl> https://dl.dropbox.com/u/24396704/aufspannwinkel/IMG_0618.jpg
[11:08:41] <syyl> i made that one from a casting :)
[11:08:49] <jdh> cool
[11:08:49] <Jymmm> a piece of string and 4000yo Egyptian Architect?
[11:09:22] <mrsun> i would so want to cast it in cast iron insted but do not have crucibles big enough :P
[11:09:26] <syyl> https://dl.dropbox.com/u/24396704/aufspannwinkel/2012-04-30_13-39-23_901.jpg
[11:09:36] <syyl> and that one is made from toolsteel, ground and bolted together
[11:09:50] <syyl> but it gets more use on the surface plate as on the milling machine
[11:10:48] <JT-Shop> nice one
[11:11:07] <mrsun> and i need to make a new "stand" for the column on the mill :/
[11:11:15] <mrsun> stupid seig cant do anything straight
[11:11:20] <syyl> also made those blocks...
[11:11:20] <syyl> https://dl.dropbox.com/u/24396704/aufspannwinkel/2012-05-18_13-34-06_876.jpg
[11:11:21] <syyl> :D
[11:11:36] <mrsun> have put "shim bolts" in it to be able to get it straight .. its like 1mm off from the front to back ...
[11:13:23] <tjb1> JT-Shop: Is that sodium nitrite/physan 20 have any antifreeze properties?
[11:15:49] <Jymmm> tjb1: glycerin's do
[11:16:42] <Jymmm> Those jsut seem to control the inhibition of microbial growth
[11:17:12] <JT-Shop> and stop rust
[11:17:55] <Jymmm> salt peter
[11:18:05] <tjb1> Looks like im running without water in winter
[11:18:38] <jdh> why
[11:19:02] <JT-Shop> put a pond heater in the holding tank
[11:19:36] <tjb1> That would get pretty expensive to run all the time
[11:19:48] <JT-Shop> they are only a few watts
[11:19:58] <tjb1> I have a block heater here but I wonder how long it would take to heat the table
[11:20:13] <Jymmm> Glycols are in the alcohol family, and alcohol displaces water.
[11:20:14] <JT-Shop> you just want it above freezing
[11:20:53] <tjb1> This block heater is 1500w and about 6" long
[11:21:16] <jdh> that's a lot of heat.
[11:21:21] <Jymmm> 1500W is too much
[11:21:38] <Jymmm> you'll get a 600+ electric bill
[11:22:29] <Jymmm> They have brake line anti-freeze
[11:22:54] <tjb1> I didnt say run it all the time, just before I go to use it
[11:22:58] <jdh> I got my ebay gas regs. They are really nice. Came with high pressure braided stainless hose and some 6000psi stainless quick-connects
[11:23:22] <tjb1> Jymmm: Thats all alcohol based and the concentration I need is nearly 50/50
[11:23:23] <Jymmm> tjb1: for what purposes?
[11:23:35] <tjb1> The water in my water table on the plasma
[11:23:39] <Jymmm> tjb1: then use glycol
[11:24:15] <Jymmm> tjb1: you can even get free glycerin from those bio-disel producers as it's a byproduct
[11:24:15] <tjb1> Glycol is flammable too :P
[11:25:08] <Jymmm> since when?
[11:25:16] <Jymmm> it's antifreeze
[11:25:35] <Jymmm> it's swet, and toxic, but not flammable
[11:26:22] <tjb1> Was looking at ethylene glycol...
[11:26:29] <tjb1> :)
[11:26:43] <Jymmm> you could also run the pump periodically with a super tiny heater.
[11:27:08] <Jymmm> I mean like 10-40W
[11:27:10] <tjb1> Are you talking about ethylene glycol?
[11:27:36] <Jymmm> tjb1: go light your radiator on fire
[11:27:46] <jdh> http://www.nexternal.com/armynavy/images/single-burner.gif
[11:27:54] <jdh> put that under it before you use it
[11:28:40] <tjb1> Jymmm: ethylene glycol has a flash point of 231.8F in a closed container and autoignition of 770F
[11:28:56] <Jymmm> tjb1: go light your radiator on fire
[11:30:51] <tjb1> Yeah and plasma arcs are near 50,000F....
[11:32:05] <TekniQue> 16:13:44 < Jymmm> it's swet, and toxic, but not flammable
[11:32:09] <TekniQue> it is too
[11:32:22] <TekniQue> given enough heat, it burns like any other alcohol
[11:32:53] <TekniQue> it's just not very volatile, that's why it doesn't burn readily when cold
[11:34:16] <Jymmm> I said glycol, tjb1 said ethylene glycol, not the same thing.
[11:35:48] <JT-Shop> I think it is time for a Nathan's Famous and some cheese
[11:35:51] <tjb1> Are you talking about propylene?
[11:37:15] <tjb1> Propylene glycol is also flammable
[12:15:44] <IchGuckLive> Hi all B)
[12:44:32] <jthornton> http://imagebin.org/232504
[12:46:52] <andypugh> That's getting quite detailed.
[12:47:02] <jthornton> thanks
[12:47:07] <jthornton> hows the arms race?
[12:47:32] <andypugh> I am not sure, they may have given up for the time being, but it has rained all day.
[12:47:32] <jthornton> does it look like anything is missing?
[12:48:03] <jthornton> that will dampen their spirits
[12:48:11] <andypugh> No, they didn't get anything on any attempt.
[12:48:46] <jthornton> I mean from the thread calculator LOL
[12:49:27] <andypugh> One thing missing from that table. tip - to - root depth. Would be handy for G76. Note that isn't the same thing as nominal diameter to minor diameter.
[12:50:01] <andypugh> (One day I will manage a thread that works first time)
[12:50:17] <jthornton> ok, because of the nose radius of the cutting tool?
[12:50:51] <andypugh> Yes, and the tip rounding on the threads too. (or tip flat on these new-fangled thread stabdards)
[12:51:50] <jthornton> so h3 in this http://mdmetric.com/tech/thddat2.htm
[12:55:19] <andypugh> Yes. Though I have a problem with that drawing as d and D are not as listed.
[12:55:47] <andypugh> (Major diameter is less than nominal diameter on any bolt that you measure)
[12:57:23] <jthornton> the machinery handbook has all the details about it... I'll look it up and add that info
[13:00:07] <jthornton> it even has metric bits http://imagebin.org/232507
[13:00:14] <jthornton> still working on metric taps
[13:08:39] <skunkworks> heh http://imagebin.org/index.php?mode=image&id=232509
[13:08:49] <skunkworks> finally updated the laptop to 12.04
[13:20:55] <awallin> running linux so you can run both xp and win7 in VMs? ;)
[13:21:22] <skunkworks> why not?
[13:21:25] <skunkworks> :)
[13:21:39] <skunkworks> I rarely use them - but nice to have
[13:25:13] <r00t4rd3d> did you get linuxcnc installed on that ?
[13:29:58] <ReadError> is that version of autocad from like 1995 ?
[13:31:24] <skunkworks> acad 12 :)
[13:31:30] <skunkworks> still works for what I need.
[13:31:42] <Jymmm> dos?
[13:32:19] <skunkworks> r00t4rd3d, no... (well - On 10.04 I had sim.. Used it to write my comp for the K&T)
[13:32:54] <skunkworks> Jymmm, no - windows. - we started witht he dos version of 12 and switched to the windowws version
[13:33:05] <Jymmm> ah
[13:33:31] <Jymmm> I woouldn't mind having a DOS version of acad
[13:33:56] <skunkworks> I have no clue if we still have it.
[13:34:25] <Jymmm> Oh, heh. I kinda meant if they ever released the dos version to the semi public domian.
[13:34:37] <Jymmm> or found one in a surplus store or somethng
[13:34:43] <Jymmm> or whatever ;)
[13:35:10] <Jymmm> skunkworks: Do you remember what it would run on? 486? 8MB ram?
[13:37:08] <skunkworks> I think they where 486's
[13:37:22] <skunkworks> might have even been 386's
[13:38:23] <andypugh> I used AutoCAD on a Mac very briefly. About 20 minutes before giving up.
[13:38:47] <andypugh> It was _hopelessly_ slow. A very, very, bad port that should never have been released.
[13:39:03] <r00t4rd3d> gotta please the fan boys!
[13:39:33] <tjb1> r00t4rd3d >:(
[13:39:36] <andypugh> It didn't please this one.
[13:39:51] <andypugh> The Mac version of Fusion is pretty slick though.
[13:40:24] <tjb1> andypugh: You know of anything better than draftsight that is free for mac?
[13:40:43] <andypugh> Fusion?
[13:40:54] <andypugh> It's not a full CAD package though
[13:41:02] <tjb1> I just need CAD not the parametric
[13:41:09] <andypugh> It's in the App store
[13:41:15] <tjb1> I thought Fusion was used to take DXF to solids?
[13:41:17] <skunkworks> being raised on acad make it hard for me to use any parametric drawing programs
[13:41:43] <andypugh> I started with Acad and was ecstatic to break away into paramteric
[13:43:01] <skunkworks> I have not given myself time..
[13:43:46] <andypugh> If you make a 3D model then you can't get the drawing wrong.
[13:44:03] <andypugh> You know, dimension to the wrong line for example :-)
[13:44:18] <tjb1> I thought my teacher said fusion worked off drawings and you couldnt draw in it but I guess he was wrong :) downloading now!
[13:47:44] <andypugh> I just made a cube :-)
[13:48:05] <andypugh> (drew a square in a sketch, dimensioned it, extruded it)
[13:49:40] <tjb1> Someone asked how fusion was different from inventor
[13:50:13] <jdh> how is it different?
[13:50:25] <jdh> isn't it inventor fusion or something like that?
[13:50:30] <andypugh> It can't do nearly as much stuff. For example as far as I can see I can't re-dimension my sketch and have the extruded solid update.
[13:50:55] <jdh> that seems kind of lame.
[13:51:18] <tjb1> jdh there is inventor and inventor fusion
[13:52:59] <andypugh> It's for different things. It's what they call "direct modelling". It has differnet sorts of tools. For example I just grabbed a face of my cube and tilted it in two direction to make a funny shape. I would not have any idea how to make that shape in Inventor.
[13:57:08] <andypugh> Actually, it has more power than I thought. It just let me put a countersunk hole in my angled face.
[14:06:42] <mazafaka> Do you know anyone using Unigraphics?
[14:55:24] <Loetmichel> hmmm
[14:55:53] <Loetmichel> is there a way to tell the machine to do a reference move every x gcodes or so?
[14:56:39] <Loetmichel> my machine looses some steps in x... i know why, the "/(§$"(§&$ PMMA swarf... but i have to make another 3 parts before i have time to take her apart...
[15:29:30] <r00t4rd3d> Basket weave side panel for a pbox Im doin:
[15:29:30] <r00t4rd3d> http://i.imgur.com/lQyfp.jpg
[15:47:43] <r00t4rd3d> well that was brief
[15:48:19] <Loetmichel> *grrr* *knack* there goes the last 6mm 2 flute TC bit... agail 25 eur for the bin :-(
[15:49:03] <r00t4rd3d> Ive yet to break a bit
[15:49:13] <r00t4rd3d> all i cut is wood though
[15:50:08] <Loetmichel> pmma
[15:50:20] <r00t4rd3d> what is that?
[15:50:27] <Loetmichel> but i had some step loss and it just tried to mill 25mm deep in PMMA
[16:02:00] <mazafaka> r00t4rd3d: What do you think of such mudflaps? http://a.d-cd.net/f2290au-960.jpg
[16:02:56] <r00t4rd3d> looks retarded to be honest.
[16:03:09] <r00t4rd3d> but what ever keeps you dry
[16:03:53] <r00t4rd3d> just the metal ones would look better but pretty much useless cause of the length.
[16:05:09] <mazafaka> and this one:
[16:05:15] <mazafaka> wait
[16:05:31] <r00t4rd3d> what is that material you have hanging ofd there?
[16:05:34] <r00t4rd3d> off*
[16:05:37] <mazafaka> http://a.d-cd.net/473e0au-960.jpg
[16:06:11] <r00t4rd3d> i can see the front one getting melted
[16:06:15] <mazafaka> plastic, cellophane
[16:06:19] <r00t4rd3d> stuck to the header
[16:06:42] <mazafaka> where, and what is hanging off there?
[16:06:58] <r00t4rd3d> off the bottoms of each fender
[16:07:05] <mazafaka> resin
[16:07:23] <r00t4rd3d> its not gonna flap in the wind?
[16:07:27] <mazafaka> no
[16:07:41] <mazafaka> it's bend and relatively thick
[16:07:47] <mazafaka> *bent
[16:08:07] <r00t4rd3d> what happens if you pop a wheelie?
[16:08:17] <r00t4rd3d> or a good bump
[16:08:34] <mazafaka> nothing, it would bend back off the wheel, or go between the wheel and fender
[16:09:55] <mazafaka> And this one is way more interesting, and left standard: http://a.d-cd.net/f5d10au-960.jpg
[16:10:09] <mazafaka> And RC models of bikes:
[16:10:24] <r00t4rd3d> you in germany?
[16:10:52] <mazafaka> no, i'm in Russia/
[16:10:55] <r00t4rd3d> whats that blue one?
[16:11:21] <r00t4rd3d> BISHOLTAY!
[16:11:24] <mazafaka> Ural M67 https://www.google.ru/search?q=Ural+M67&hl=ru&newwindow=1&client=firefox-nightly&hs=sH0&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:unofficial&prmd=imvns&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=K7-BUJKyDKrf4QTEy4HYDA&ved=0CCkQsAQ&biw=1280&bih=707
[16:11:27] <r00t4rd3d> im not sure how to spell it :D
[16:11:52] <mazafaka> 'BIS hotel' maybe...
[16:11:53] <r00t4rd3d> ahh the mighty ural
[16:12:16] <mazafaka> it's heavy, about 250 kg dry
[16:12:38] <r00t4rd3d> needs a paint job and side car
[16:12:52] <mazafaka> for wet ground words, and thoose 'metallic' Jupiter is about 180 kg dry
[16:13:07] <mazafaka> No, sidecar is wrong, although i have one
[16:14:03] <r00t4rd3d> lol
[16:14:08] <mazafaka> Ural will not be anyhow modified, it only will have a long seat.
[16:15:54] <r00t4rd3d> I hope you have a german army helmet and vintage flying goggles for when you ride that.
[16:15:55] <mazafaka> Full-driven Ural M67: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=p1S0b4LTZFQ
[16:16:25] <mazafaka> I have this: http://a.d-cd.net/eb2732u-960.jpg
[16:17:16] <r00t4rd3d> you need this: http://www.buymotorcyclehelmets.com/assets/images/products/flatblackspike.jpg
[16:17:36] <r00t4rd3d> and these: http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/graphics/13-06310.jpg
[16:18:05] <r00t4rd3d> and smoke a pipe
[16:18:26] <mazafaka> no, but the ones like 'little aviator' are good
[16:20:44] <DJ9DJ> gn8
[16:21:20] <mazafaka> good night, too
[16:23:44] <andypugh> Talking about flying helmets:
[16:24:28] <andypugh> http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/oct/17/spitfire-planes-burma-excavation
[16:55:17] <jp_> andypugh, how does the mesa uart hal driver work? is it for smart serial only?
[18:11:51] <andypugh> jp_: Sorry, I am putting my garage back together. The answer is no, it just appears on 2 pins of an FPGA card and can go to anything. I have it communicating with an Arduino.
[18:12:27] <andypugh> (2 pins on 5i23, 2 wires, 2 pins on Arduino. That simple. 1Mbps over a distance of 2"
[18:25:32] <r00t4rd3d> what does the arduino do?
[18:26:34] <r00t4rd3d> some kind of LCD readout?
[18:26:59] <Tom_itx> maybe it reads his hall sensors
[18:36:29] <jdh> or resolvers.
[18:50:24] <mutilator> so, two questions, why when idle my steppers get quite hot and make some awful noise>
[18:50:44] <alex4nder> what's your drive?
[18:51:00] <mutilator> i have a g540 controller and http://www.automationtechnologiesinc.com/docs/manuals/KL23H2100-35-4B.pdf
[18:51:07] <mutilator> those
[18:51:23] <alex4nder> yah, I have one
[18:51:51] <alex4nder> a g540 that is.. steppers get hot, and mine make a hissing sound at idle
[18:52:06] <mutilator> like hard to touch hot?
[18:52:34] <alex4nder> yup
[18:52:55] <mutilator> ok
[18:53:56] <mutilator> If your motor is rated
[18:53:56] <mutilator> at 3.5A or above you can safely not use a current set resistor; however, your G540 will not go into current standby mode which
[18:53:56] <mutilator> will result in increased motor heating.
[18:54:01] <mutilator> i see that in the docs for the 540
[18:54:16] <mutilator> but i didnt think increased heating would mean hard to touch
[18:56:15] <jdh> hot is normal
[18:59:44] <Tom_itx> my 203v's keep my steppers cool
[19:03:48] <jdh> does it do low current standby
[19:03:53] <Tom_itx> yes
[19:05:02] <mutilator> it does w/ a resistor aparently
[19:05:16] <mutilator> perhaps i could just jumper it
[19:05:27] <mutilator> wo resistor
[19:05:49] <Tom_itx> maybe the resistor sets the current
[19:06:04] <mutilator> yea it does
[19:06:15] <mutilator> the doc says if the motor is 3.5A or more then you dont need it though
[19:06:15] <Tom_itx> for standby?
[19:06:20] <mutilator> oh
[19:06:21] <mutilator> maybe
[19:07:07] <mutilator> and.. what is/should the pwm rate be set to??
[19:07:29] <mutilator> not sure what these settings arein the spindle configuration window
[19:20:46] <andypugh> jdh: Yes, the Arduino reads Resolvers.
[19:28:50] <andypugh> Imagine my pleasure to find at 1130pm that a hole in my security bracket things needed to be oval, and not only was the milling machine partially dismantled, it also was runniing a non-functional version of LinuxCNC. So I needed to reassemble, do some coding, recompile LinuxCNC to put the door back in a state where it could be locked.
[19:29:53] <skunkworks> andypugh: how far can you do 1mps?
[19:30:04] <skunkworks> Mbps
[19:30:12] <andypugh> I have absolutely no idea :-)
[19:30:16] <mutilator> hm
[19:30:17] <skunkworks> heh
[19:30:27] <mutilator> will the 540 turn green w/ no axis plugged in just the db25?
[19:30:39] <andypugh> I did it a couple of feet with just two random wires when testing.
[19:31:01] <andypugh> mutilator: You might need a working charge-pump
[19:31:47] <mutilator> ?
[19:32:10] <mutilator> its always fault when i have charge pump switched to on
[19:32:52] <andypugh> OK, so you have disabled the charge pump. Never mind.
[19:34:11] <jdh> 6 pins on a servo would most likely be a resolver, not encoder? (not the motor wires)
[19:34:52] <andypugh> jdh: Yes, probably.
[19:35:39] <jdh> does your arduino resolver interface have a speed limit?
[19:36:00] <andypugh> 5 would be encoder + power. 7 would be differential encoder + power or encoder + halls. 14 would be differential encoder and differential halls.
[19:36:14] <andypugh> jdh: Yes, and not a very high one.
[19:37:18] <jdh> they are old parker servos. not very hefty and might not even be functional
[19:37:25] <andypugh> It might not even make it to production. Pico and Mesa both do rather more industrial-strength ones.
[19:38:19] <andypugh> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?ResolverToQuadratureConverter
[19:47:01] <mutilator> i fixed it
[19:47:05] <mutilator> i had my charge pump on the wrong pin
[19:47:20] <jdh> does it work now?
[19:47:56] <jdh> there was a long thread somewhere about G540 not working correctly with LinuxCNC charge pump output (but working with Mach on same Hardward)
[19:53:17] <mutilator> yep it works
[19:53:34] <mutilator> trying to tweak all these settings
[19:54:45] <mutilator> what is table travel measured in?
[19:57:28] <jdh> inches or mm, depending on your setup.
[20:00:30] <mutilator> hm
[20:00:42] <mutilator> maybe i typed something wrong then
[20:05:11] <mutilator> no
[20:05:17] <mutilator> its limiting my travel
[20:05:18] <mutilator> wth
[20:05:57] <jdh> if it is moving at all and it doesn't do what you want, it is almost assuredly operator error :)
[20:06:15] <mutilator> i'm sure it is
[20:06:31] <mutilator> so.. if i have the tabel value set correct
[20:06:36] <mutilator> but its limiting my movement
[20:06:37] <mutilator> ..
[20:06:42] <mutilator> to a super small spot
[20:06:48] <jdh> are you homed?
[20:07:05] <mutilator> i reset the home yea
[20:07:28] <mutilator> linuxcnc thinks its travelling all the way across the tabel
[20:07:29] <mutilator> table
[20:07:35] <jdh> scale is wrong
[20:07:37] <mutilator> but in reality its moving like an inch
[20:07:41] * mutilator looks
[20:07:52] <skunkworks> it is in steps/unit
[20:09:26] <mutilator> hm in where?
[20:10:17] <jdh> step_scale, in each [axis] in the .ini
[20:12:03] <L84Supper> did I miss some big EMC vs Mach3 drama a few years ago? I keep running into people that generally use Linux but prefer to use Mach3 when it comes to machines
[20:12:16] <jdh> that would be odd.
[20:12:28] <mutilator> so
[20:12:31] <mutilator> what should it be?
[20:12:31] <L84Supper> it sort of like the old story about nvidia drivers being better than ATI
[20:12:55] <jdh> mutilator: steps per rev * microstepping * pitch * starts
[20:13:13] <jdh> what kind of screws are you using?
[20:13:33] <jdh> or easier, is it off by 10?
[20:18:18] <Tom_itx> yeah i bet it's microstepping
[20:18:27] <Tom_itx> mult the step factor by 10
[20:18:29] <jdh> g540 does 10x
[20:18:37] <Tom_itx> so do mine
[20:36:32] <mutilator> well
[20:36:33] <mutilator> 200 managed to make it move half the distance every direction
[20:36:41] <andypugh> L84Supper: News to me, but I wasn't playing then
[20:36:43] <mutilator> across the table*
[20:37:37] <andypugh> Just tweak the scale till it works. Only worry if the numbers seem properly random.
[20:38:16] <mutilator> i keep getting join # error
[20:38:44] <jdh> scale is 200?
[20:39:19] <mutilator> well trying numbers above 200
[20:39:21] <mutilator> 200 seems to work fine
[20:39:31] <mutilator> but it only travels half way in every direction
[20:39:51] <jdh> steppers? G540?
[20:40:10] <mutilator> http://www.automationtechnologiesinc.com/docs/manuals/KL23H2100-35-4B.pdf
[20:40:11] <mutilator> this stepper
[20:40:14] <mutilator> w/ g540
[20:40:19] <jdh> 200 would only be 1/10 of a rev
[20:40:38] <Tom_itx> mine is 40000
[20:40:42] <Tom_itx> per inch
[20:41:39] <Tom_itx> mutilator, what pitch is your lead screw?
[20:42:16] <mutilator> hm
[20:42:24] <mutilator> 5.08mm/rev
[20:42:39] <mutilator> for the x/y and 2.1167 for z
[20:45:01] <mutilator> ah
[20:45:03] <mutilator> man
[20:50:03] <mutilator> there is something i'm missing somewhere..
[20:50:04] <mutilator> ugh
[20:52:10] <Tom_itx> your units are mm?
[20:52:13] <mutilator> yea
[20:52:18] <mutilator> yea the gui is telling me the axis scale should be 78.7
[20:52:30] <mutilator> so i have something wrong somewhere
[20:52:32] <Tom_itx> so how many rev per mm?
[20:52:34] <jdh> you are entering 200 steps per rev, and 10x microstepping?
[20:52:38] <Tom_itx> .508?
[20:52:48] <mutilator> 5.08mm/rev
[20:52:58] <mutilator> 200 steps per rev
[20:53:01] <Tom_itx> no, you want the inverse
[20:53:08] <Tom_itx> how many rev per mm
[20:53:12] <Tom_itx> .508?
[20:53:12] <mutilator> oh
[20:53:37] <Tom_itx> .508 * 200 * 10
[20:53:49] <mutilator> i was going based on the docs
[20:53:55] <mutilator> Leadscrew Pitch - Enter the pitch of the leadscrew here. If you chose Inch units, enter the number of threads per inch If you chose mm units, enter the number of millimeters per revolution (e.g., enter 2 for 2mm/rev). If the machine travels in the wrong direction, enter a negative number here instead of a positive number, or invert the direction pin for the axis.
[20:54:04] <Tom_itx> see what that does
[20:54:11] <mutilator> put in .508?
[20:54:12] <Tom_itx> i use inch so it's not the same for me
[20:54:23] <Tom_itx> you didn't answer the question
[20:54:29] <Tom_itx> how many rev per mm?
[20:54:56] <mutilator> 1/5.08
[20:55:58] <Tom_itx> 393.7007874015
[20:56:00] <Tom_itx> try that
[20:56:05] <Tom_itx> for your scale
[20:56:42] <Tom_itx> (1/5.08)*200 * 10
[20:56:58] <Tom_itx> that may be wrong but it's a start
[20:58:11] <mutilator> yea thats pretty dang close
[20:58:15] <mutilator> i can live with that
[20:58:24] <andypugh> Math fail here
[20:58:29] <Tom_itx> do the same with z
[20:58:39] <andypugh> The inverse of 5.08 is _not_ .508
[20:58:45] <mutilator> heh
[20:58:47] <Tom_itx> nope
[20:58:53] <mutilator> so why does the gui do a weird calc?
[20:59:01] <Tom_itx> i'm multitasking here
[20:59:06] <Tom_itx> ignore it
[20:59:09] <andypugh> The Gui is trying to help :-)
[20:59:15] <Tom_itx> ignore it
[20:59:27] <Tom_itx> you go from your UNITS
[20:59:33] <Tom_itx> and figure back from that
[20:59:48] <Tom_itx> mine are inch so my scale is 40000
[21:00:03] <Tom_itx> on my 20tpi screw at 200 steps with 10 microstep
[21:00:28] <andypugh> Yes, exactly. What really matters is how many step pulses from your computer you need to move your inch, foot, mm, rod pole or perch.
[21:00:49] <mutilator> heh
[21:01:03] <mutilator> well the z axis that way didnt work
[21:01:14] <mutilator> when i set the scale to 933 or whatever it was
[21:01:20] <mutilator> i get a join 2 error
[21:01:24] <mutilator> when i try to jog it
[21:01:28] <mutilator> joint 2*
[21:01:38] <Tom_itx> your limits aren't configured
[21:01:53] <mutilator> yea, they are
[21:02:09] <Tom_itx> is it turning the right direction?
[21:02:17] <Tom_itx> you may need a - negative on the scale
[21:02:22] <Tom_itx> to reverse it
[21:02:46] <mutilator> yep, i figured that out earlier
[21:02:55] <mutilator> it goes the correct direction
[21:03:01] <mutilator> when i home it sets the z to -39
[21:03:07] <mutilator> when i jog its going to the positive
[21:03:13] <mutilator> but stops at ~33
[21:03:20] <mutilator> er
[21:03:22] <mutilator> -33
[21:03:22] <andypugh> -39 is a strange home
[21:03:25] <mutilator> when the limit is set to 68
[21:03:35] <mutilator> andypugh: i dont know why it puts it negative
[21:03:40] <mutilator> i have it set to 0 in the config
[21:03:46] <mutilator> all the axis are like that
[21:03:49] <andypugh> It's a value from the INI file.
[21:03:51] <mutilator> that offset by a random number
[21:04:01] <mutilator> ini doesnt have any negatives
[21:04:11] <andypugh> press #
[21:04:21] <Tom_itx> SCALE = -40000
[21:04:21] <Tom_itx> MIN_LIMIT = -8.4
[21:04:21] <Tom_itx> MAX_LIMIT = .10
[21:04:26] <mutilator> ha
[21:04:28] <mutilator> whts # do?
[21:04:30] <Tom_itx> is mine
[21:04:43] <andypugh> Switches to machine coordinates
[21:04:51] <mutilator> ah well then
[21:04:56] <mutilator> it switched to mm when i did that
[21:05:05] <mutilator> so.. yea z goes from 0 to 9
[21:05:06] <andypugh> (i think, it's been a while since I ran a whole machine)
[21:05:09] <mutilator> then i get that error
[21:05:46] <mutilator> i wonder..
[21:05:52] <mutilator> could the acceleration have something to do with it?
[21:06:03] <mutilator> if i jog in slow increments it goes fine
[21:06:07] <mutilator> but if i hold it down it does that
[21:06:07] <andypugh> mutilator: Do you want mm or inches? It doesn't really matter because G-code can switch.
[21:06:17] <mutilator> i'm using mm
[21:06:34] <andypugh> Good choice, rational units :-)
[21:06:39] <Tom_itx> pfft
[21:06:57] <andypugh> Is this a trivkins machine, or a gantrykins?
[21:09:41] <mutilator> no?
[21:10:08] <mutilator> yea i cvant get it to get rid of the "joint 2 following error" when i hold down the jog
[21:10:19] <mutilator> but i can do it in increments and it will stop at its maxes
[21:12:28] <andypugh> You need the stepgen accel to be higher than the axis accel in the INI.
[21:12:37] <Tom_itx> is the switch bouncing?
[21:13:17] <andypugh> It might also be that your max speed is higher than what your base thread can pulse at.
[21:13:47] <andypugh> What is your base thread rate, what is your scale, and what is your max velocity?
[21:14:11] <andypugh> And I just remembered I didn't turn my Argon off.. Back in a tick.
[21:20:09] <jp11> andypugh: how could i send commands out my mesa 485 ports?
[21:20:19] <mutilator> 2.1167mm/rev is the z
[21:20:32] <mutilator> i had the scale set to 944.86
[21:20:41] <mutilator> and step accel to 300
[21:22:35] <Tom_itx> 944.86700996834695516606037700194
[21:22:41] <andypugh> 2.1167mm rev = 0.472433 rev/mm = 94.48 motor steps/mm = 944.867
[21:23:46] <andypugh> The think is that that stepgen accel needs to be higher than the axis accel. Or the stepgen lags and you get f-errors
[21:23:59] <mutilator> i tried setting to 1000, 1200, 1400
[21:24:04] <mutilator> same thing no matter the accel
[21:24:11] <andypugh> jp11: Can you elaborate on the question?
[21:24:24] <Tom_itx> MAX_ACCELERATION = 51
[21:24:24] <Tom_itx> STEPGEN_MAXACCEL = 77
[21:24:28] <Tom_itx> is mine
[21:24:53] <mutilator> hm
[21:24:56] <mutilator> i didnt change max accel
[21:24:59] <mutilator> just stepgen accel
[21:25:03] <andypugh> mutilator: I suspect that it might be a velocity issue though.
[21:25:18] <jp11> how could i send a serial command out a 7i44 and read the response back
[21:25:39] <andypugh> What is your max velocity, and what is your base thread period?
[21:25:55] <mutilator> velocity is 200 base period is 23000
[21:26:26] <andypugh> 200mm/sec and 23uS?
[21:27:26] <andypugh> OK, 200mm/sec x 944 = 188kHz. 23uS = 43kHz
[21:28:24] <mutilator> ..
[21:28:29] <jdh> 200mm/sec is pretty speedy
[21:28:30] <andypugh> So, there is no way that software stepgen can drive your axis at 200mm/sec
[21:29:17] <mutilator> so it needs to be slower?
[21:29:38] <andypugh> You would need to go to 1/4 microstep, and that isn't an option on the G540
[21:30:24] <jdh> what kind of machine is this?
[21:30:50] <andypugh> Yes, either you need to go to 45mm/sec max speed, change the gearing or buy a hardware stepping card.
[21:31:11] <mutilator> k 40 moved more
[21:31:15] <mutilator> but still died off
[21:31:17] <mutilator> trying slower
[21:31:19] <andypugh> TBH I think you will probably find that a slow Z isn't desperately bad.
[21:31:44] <mutilator> yea its not a lot of movement regardless
[21:31:50] <mutilator> that works
[21:31:53] <mutilator> set it to 30
[21:31:56] <jdh> that's almost 500 IPM
[21:31:57] <mutilator> and its smooth as butter
[21:32:37] <andypugh> You hit the limit on how fast it is possible for software to make pulses.
[21:32:42] <mutilator> my x/y are set to move ~524mm/sec
[21:33:10] <andypugh> Yes,m but what are their steps/mm scales?
[21:33:29] <mutilator> yea
[21:33:34] <mutilator> 2x as much
[21:33:37] <mutilator> 2.5x
[21:33:43] <mutilator> alrite
[21:33:49] <mutilator> much gratitude andypugh
[21:33:51] <mutilator> appreciate the help
[21:34:10] <andypugh> You are sounding like a candidate for hardware step generation.
[21:34:31] <jdh> I'd like to see 524mm/sec
[21:34:45] <andypugh> Are you running out of IO? Would you like to run the spindle from an analogue voltage?
[21:35:51] * Tom_itx waits for the sales pitch
[21:36:22] <andypugh> I am about to sound like a Mesa salesman, but for $200 the 5i25/7i76 combo will give you far more step speed and IO than you could want.
[21:36:37] <jp11> second that
[21:37:07] <Tom_itx> 3rd that
[21:37:31] <andypugh> it isn't a sales pitch, all I get from Mesa is negative spare time. :-)
[21:37:42] <Tom_itx> if i hadn't gotten the parport ones and the 5i25 were available i'd have one
[21:37:43] <jp11> lol
[21:38:08] <jp11> i want the new enet one
[21:38:16] <andypugh> ie, Pete gives me hardware I have no personal use for, so I write frivers I don't need.
[21:38:17] <r00t4rd3d> the motor on my 12" disk sander was working fine this morning, now I plug it in and all it does is buzz.....
[21:39:05] <andypugh> r00t4rd3d: Brush motor?
[21:39:10] <r00t4rd3d> i turn the pulley by hand and I can hear shit like wire scratching around
[21:39:37] <r00t4rd3d> andy, not sure :?
[21:39:47] <andypugh> Hand-held or not?
[21:39:57] <r00t4rd3d> no
[21:40:00] <r00t4rd3d> table
[21:40:09] <andypugh> SIngle phase?
[21:40:50] <r00t4rd3d> Umm, yeah I plug it into a regular outlet
[21:41:16] <r00t4rd3d> http://i.oodleimg.com/item/2939529239u_1x424x360f?1331764605
[21:41:18] <r00t4rd3d> kinda like that
[21:41:41] <jp11> bad cap or bum run switch?
[21:41:48] <andypugh> I would guess that the centrifugal switch isn't living up to its name
[21:42:19] <r00t4rd3d> it hadnt been turned on in years i guess
[21:42:28] <andypugh> If you are feeling brave, try switching it on and giving it a hand start.
[21:42:35] <r00t4rd3d> i did already :D
[21:42:54] <r00t4rd3d> i can feel the cord buzzing too when i plug it in
[21:43:05] <andypugh> And it didn't start?
[21:43:09] <r00t4rd3d> nope
[21:43:33] <r00t4rd3d> im gonna have to replace it for now I guess
[21:43:38] <r00t4rd3d> i have another one
[21:43:43] <andypugh> The motor may have lost a winding then
[21:43:56] <r00t4rd3d> sounds like wires tumbling around in there
[21:44:09] <r00t4rd3d> fine wires
[21:44:50] <r00t4rd3d> probably is a winding
[21:45:18] <andypugh> I am sure that rewinding a motor would be a therapeutic and satisfying task. You might even end up with a working motor at the end, but I wouldn't like to guarantee it
[21:45:48] <r00t4rd3d> i have magnet wire already....
[21:45:58] <r00t4rd3d> probably not that right gauge though
[21:46:14] <r00t4rd3d> i have a roll of 18 sitting here
[21:46:29] <andypugh> hotrod sander!
[21:46:35] <r00t4rd3d> it is!
[21:46:42] <r00t4rd3d> scares me to use it almost.
[21:47:19] <r00t4rd3d> im not sure of the rpms but it flies
[21:47:27] <andypugh> Rewind for 6-phase, that has to be twice as good.
[21:48:16] <r00t4rd3d> i should take a pic of it
[21:49:35] <r00t4rd3d> it might be bigger then 12"
[21:50:30] <andypugh> So, today I have been making more of these: https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/3A7q9zo5XhrqVakkxGldzNMTjNZETYmyPJy0liipFm0?feat=directlink
[21:50:39] <jp11> andypugh: is raw read/ raw write a hostmot2 thing
[21:51:25] <r00t4rd3d> I been making these today : http://i.imgur.com/lQyfp.jpg
[21:51:33] <r00t4rd3d> lol
[21:51:43] <andypugh> But mounted a bit differently. Is it overkill that I drilled a hole and glued in a 3mm tunsten carbide rod (broken milling cutter) to defeat hacksaws?
[21:52:25] <andypugh> r00t4rd3d: That's very 1930s
[21:52:36] <andypugh> jp11: Yes
[21:52:50] <jp11> nice touch with the carbide
[21:54:06] <andypugh> jp11: What Hostmot2 function is linked to your 7i44 pins?
[21:54:40] <jp11> nothing yet i havent plugged it in yet
[21:54:55] <jp11> just tryi g to form a plan
[21:55:26] <andypugh> svua firmware might "just work"
[21:55:44] <jp11> just want to try to send a read command to the encoder
[21:55:51] <jp11> svua?
[21:56:00] <andypugh> You would need a custom comp to translate the return stuff.
[21:56:17] <jp11> yeah i figured that
[21:56:21] <andypugh> svua == servo uart
[21:56:33] <jp11> ah
[21:56:39] <andypugh> Have you looked at the sample UART comp?
[21:56:59] <jp11> at the code?
[21:57:05] <jp11> yes
[21:57:05] <andypugh> Yeah
[21:58:29] <andypugh> Hmm, no sign of an SVUA in the standard firmwares
[21:58:39] <andypugh> What PCI card are you using?
[21:58:49] <jp11> ill plug in the 7i44 tonight and play around with it
[21:58:57] <jp11> 5i23
[21:59:42] <andypugh> jp11: Does it make sense? It's not like any other Hostmot2 driver, you need to grab a handle to the particular port by name, then do "stuff" with it.
[22:01:24] <andypugh> Hmm, no UART firmwares in the Mesa downlod either.
[22:02:34] <andypugh> I have one that I use (for 5i23) but it's a horrid kludge as Smart Serial and UART disagree on register spacing.
[22:03:20] <jp11> wonder what pcw has in his bag of tricks
[22:03:45] <andypugh> I can probably build you a firmware as long as you don't want to mix UART and sserial.
[22:04:22] <andypugh> Or PCW can make you one with a better chance of working.
[22:04:52] <andypugh> You could consider building your own. It's not terribly hard
[22:05:07] <jp11> in the 5i23? i dont need ss for now the 5i23 is just on my test box
[22:06:00] <jp11> how would i get started on playing with firmware
[22:06:51] <r00t4rd3d> offer it candy and barbie dolls
[22:07:19] <jp11> not so funny
[22:07:37] <andypugh> I am trying to find it.
[22:10:33] <jp11> im wondering if a hacked up version of the modbus comp could work
[22:12:19] <andypugh> The UART como is likely to be better, as it does get data. All that is left is interpreting that data
[22:12:25] <andypugh> (comp)
[22:14:12] <andypugh> jp11: http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/emc/xilinx/xilinx_install_index.php
[22:15:21] <Tom_itx> i forgot
[22:15:24] <Tom_itx> :)
[22:17:07] <andypugh> I am not sure who's clues I followed. It wasn't yours, but yours came up early in Google and looked clear
[22:19:32] <andypugh> 4am. Time to sleep.
[22:19:36] <andypugh> Night all
[22:41:52] <r00t4rd3d> http://www.cutitoutcnc.com/images/Crab%20Carving.jpg
[22:42:09] <r00t4rd3d> that is cool