#linuxcnc | Logs for 2012-10-05

[01:05:30] <Loetmichel> mornin'
[02:09:48] <DJ9DJ> moin
[06:17:55] <jthornton> can a bad power supply cause a computer to shut down randomly?
[06:21:33] <Valen> yes
[06:23:29] <jthornton> It just came to me that might be the problem with my dell desktop shutting itself off
[06:23:47] <jthornton> I'll swap it out and see
[06:24:35] <Valen> bad caps can cause blue screens and other "undefined" behaviour
[06:24:50] <Valen> does it just "power off" or freeze or something else?
[06:25:25] <jthornton> I'm not sure, I have to press and hold the power button and it seems to boot back up
[06:25:41] <Valen> press and hold to get it to boot?
[06:25:44] <Valen> thats odd
[06:25:48] <Valen> how old?
[06:26:16] <jthornton> I'm not sure but at least ~5-7 years old
[06:26:50] <Valen> yeah, I'd swap the psu and see if that fixes it
[06:27:01] <Valen> throw something like a burnin test at it
[06:27:09] <Valen> thrash the hdd and load the CPU
[06:27:41] * jthornton searches for burnin test
[06:27:56] <Valen> is it windows or linux?
[06:28:37] <jthornton> linux
[06:28:46] <jthornton> ubuntu 10.04
[06:28:48] <Valen> bonnie for the hdd
[06:29:07] <Valen> lol i don't know anything off the top of my head for CPU lol
[06:30:21] <jthornton> and bonnie is in the synaptic package manager :)
[06:31:53] <Valen> 's why i use it lol
[06:32:06] <Valen> see if you can cause it to crash
[06:32:11] <Valen> then you know you have fixed it
[06:32:26] <Valen> does it ever have problems booting? thats also often a high load time
[06:32:38] <jthornton> no, it boots every time
[06:32:59] <Valen> I'd be looking at psu or motherboard caps
[06:33:33] <Valen> http://www.facilitateit.com.au/Capacitors.htm
[06:33:39] <Valen> paticularly around the cpu
[06:35:23] <jthornton> bonnie does slow this computer down when running lol
[06:35:43] <jthornton> I'll put the caps under the microscope when I change the power supply out
[06:36:01] <Valen> nah you don't need a microscope, just look at them and have a feel
[06:37:59] <Tom_itx> Valen, that's what she said
[06:38:44] <Valen> lol
[06:39:12] <jthornton> this computer http://pastebin.com/LRqF56YS
[06:40:35] <Valen> yeah it doesn't actually test anything, it just writes a bunch of files and changes them
[06:40:47] <Valen> idea being if you could crash the computer
[06:40:57] <Valen> then you would know when you had fixed it ;->
[06:41:34] <jthornton> gotcha
[06:42:50] <Loetmichel> na ja, find ich eigentlich gut
[06:42:57] <Loetmichel> sorry, wrong channl
[06:45:04] <jthornton> hmm Ubuntu has a disk utility built in with benchmark tests
[06:45:32] <Tom_itx> off to the millworks
[06:58:54] <gmouer> I wonder if G68 / G69 has been looked at further? Cradek discussed it here http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?CoordinateSystemRotation
[06:59:14] <gmouer> I think G68 G69 are usually toggles to turn that rotation on and off
[07:00:12] <gmouer> Seems this is how modern controllers handle front/rear turrets on lathes
[07:03:16] <jthornton> so your implying that LinuxCNC is an ancient controller?
[07:04:46] <gmouer> no, Linuxcnc does darned good keeping up with the new hardware out there as it appears
[07:10:45] <jthornton> it did read like kindergarten logic...
[07:11:20] <jthornton> you can implement now in master with remapping
[07:11:33] <jthornton> implement it now
[07:12:31] <gmouer> G68/G69 is a toggle to the rotation, so it wouldn't be a remap of the G10 rotation function
[07:13:18] <jthornton> remap G68/69
[07:14:14] <gmouer> perhaps, just wondering if anything is already in the works in relation to this
[07:14:39] <jthornton> if it was it would be in master
[07:15:12] <jthornton> I see G68/69 are available for remapping
[07:16:55] <gmouer> yes, I seen that too
[07:17:49] <gmouer> I researched quite a bit, that is how I found that coordinate system rotation is the common method for handling front/rear lathe tooling
[07:37:16] <jthornton> hey Sam http://imagebin.org/230976
[07:53:50] * Loetmichel has just smirked over a logitech mouse. seems to be a little light, so the developers have put in soome iron ;-) -> http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=13552
[12:17:44] <IchGuckLive> Hi all B)(
[12:17:56] <IchGuckLive> :D :O
[12:24:49] <IchGuckLive> 2days to go for operation stratos at roswell
[12:37:23] <IchGuckLive> hi kb8wmc
[12:41:05] <BHSPiMonkey> not to spam or anything, but any shapeoko owners/fans in here are invited to join us in #shapeoko
[12:41:27] <BHSPiMonkey> we're trying to get a community going in there, and we have a few regulars so far
[12:46:43] <kb8wmc> IchGuckLive: Hello there sir, how are you doing today?
[12:48:02] <IchGuckLive> fine i put lots of walpaer to the wall as sopost to be
[12:48:53] <IchGuckLive> BHSPiMonkey: nice idee to get smale mashines
[12:49:19] <IchGuckLive> wallpaper kb8wmc
[12:50:09] <kb8wmc> very good, what wall and wallpaper?
[12:50:29] <IchGuckLive> all standard but roof 45deg
[12:50:41] <BHSPiMonkey> hmm?
[12:50:49] <IchGuckLive> i shot them 27 rolls on ebay
[12:51:49] <kb8wmc> IchGuckLive: I bet you are happy to have the job behind you now
[12:52:01] <IchGuckLive> BHSPiMonkey: we most have big mashines
[12:52:19] <IchGuckLive> kb8wmc: my arms are burning
[12:53:00] <BHSPiMonkey> IchGuckLive: German is your first language?
[12:53:24] <IchGuckLive> http://mechmo.de/lothar/cnc_4.JPG
[12:53:28] <IchGuckLive> BHSPiMonkey: yes
[12:53:42] <BHSPiMonkey> Nice. I plan to travel there in a few months
[12:53:48] <IchGuckLive> BHSPiMonkey: last link is a picture of my education mashines
[12:54:20] <kb8wmc> IchGuckLive: nice, what size motors are you using?
[12:54:21] <IchGuckLive> i will be in CA in Feb for edelbrook recoding
[12:54:42] <BHSPiMonkey> IchGuckLive: looks nice. What is the size of the usable area?
[12:54:48] <IchGuckLive> Nema23 out of epson laserprinters
[12:55:03] <IchGuckLive> 165x165x55mm
[12:55:20] <IchGuckLive> 350Euros in total all included
[12:55:40] <BHSPiMonkey> ah, tiny
[12:55:53] <BHSPiMonkey> close to the shapeoko
[12:56:01] <IchGuckLive> fits a standard school table with the pc
[12:56:07] <BHSPiMonkey> looks a lot more rock-solid though
[12:56:23] <IchGuckLive> 30x30 AL
[12:56:41] <IchGuckLive> 1m in total
[12:57:05] <kb8wmc> IchGuckLive: hmmm, very nice
[12:57:20] <IchGuckLive> i got 28 of this know
[12:57:49] <IchGuckLive> as some of the 99 Steppers are not running i tryd to get 30
[12:58:03] <kb8wmc> IchGuckLive: are all of your students going to have their own?
[12:58:25] <IchGuckLive> 26 places with 2 students
[12:59:24] <kb8wmc> IchGuckLive: okay
[12:59:50] <BHSPiMonkey> that's really cool
[13:00:23] <BHSPiMonkey> if you're near frankfurt, maybe I'll stop by to check them out when I visit :P
[13:00:37] <IchGuckLive> i'm building lathes know at max 400x300 place size
[13:00:58] <IchGuckLive> Ramstein Kaiserslautern
[13:02:15] <IchGuckLive> 140km to Frankfurt
[13:16:47] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/cnc/Lathe/thread1.jpg
[13:18:12] <IchGuckLive> nice at what RPM
[13:20:05] <IchGuckLive> Whow unamployment to the US drop below 8%
[13:20:14] <IchGuckLive> nice job mister president
[13:21:47] <skunkworks__> Tom_itx: next wood?
[13:22:16] <archivist> why the run out groove linuxcnc does not need that :)
[13:23:25] <skunkworks__> manual lathe... (for me a takes coordination to pull out the same each time)
[13:24:36] <archivist> there are some knock out tool holders for manual lathes
[13:26:10] <IchGuckLive> im off by
[13:27:02] <andypugh> I did 5" of 1/2" Whit last night pulling out manually. (on a manual Colchester Student)
[13:27:46] <andypugh> I didn't want a groove, it was a brake actualting rod.
[13:30:12] <andypugh> https://plus.google.com/u/0/108164504656404380542/posts
[13:31:45] <archivist> fire engine spares for the use of :)
[13:32:29] <archivist> old bit of wrought iron by the look of it
[13:32:30] <andypugh> Odd how it lasted 96 years, then suddenly broke.
[13:32:58] <archivist> wrought is like that, it needs annealing
[13:33:14] <archivist> looks like a brittle fracture
[13:33:54] <andypugh> Ductile fracture, and no sign of significant fatigue crack growth.
[13:34:17] <archivist> I cant see any necking
[13:35:59] <andypugh> No, there wasn't any to speak of, but the fracture surface wasn't typical of brittle fracture.
[13:36:09] <archivist> we had a stud fail on a traction engine someone was just needle gunning to clean after the gland was removed and it snapped
[13:36:59] <archivist> that is why old wrought lifting gear had to be annealed every x months
[13:57:30] <L84Supper> http://www.irm.org/ if you ever want to ride, see and touch some old steam engines
[13:58:36] <L84Supper> are there any old train museums in the UK where you can ride on old steam engines?
[13:58:47] <andypugh> Dozens
[13:59:19] <L84Supper> any you'd recommend?
[13:59:40] <archivist> hundreds probably
[14:00:06] <andypugh> Off the top of my head, Keighley and Worth Valley, Bluebell, Isle of Wight, Tallylyn, FFesstiniog,
[14:00:21] <andypugh> Embsay
[14:00:55] <andypugh> Bridgnorth
[14:01:09] <L84Supper> do they have any 19th century engines still in operation?
[14:01:12] <andypugh> (these are just ones I have been on)
[14:01:28] <archivist> probably better to say what area as most have a preserved railway near
[14:01:47] <archivist> Sever Valley
[14:01:56] <archivist> Severn
[14:02:28] <archivist> Great Central
[14:03:22] <archivist> I have volunteered at some
[14:03:24] <andypugh> Lots of 18th century. http://www.nrm.org.uk/OurCollection/LocomotivesAndRollingStock/CollectionItem.aspx?objid=1975-7015&cat=steam&comp=All&ipp=12 for example
[14:03:50] <archivist> NRM has two sites
[14:03:51] <L84Supper> nice
[14:04:08] <andypugh> Sorry, that's 19thC
[14:05:19] <archivist> there are some reproduction locos that are run on a regular basis
[14:06:45] <archivist> nrm this year http://www.collection.archivist.info/archive/DJCPD/PD/2012/2012_07_27_York_Railway_Museum/IMG_1277.JPG
[14:07:06] <L84Supper> IRM only has a couple from the 1800's, and they are probably too fragile to move, more oxide than iron under a coat of black enamel
[14:08:00] <andypugh> The oldest one in steam in the UK is 1863. http://www.furnessrailwaytrust.org.uk/fr20.htm
[14:08:54] <L84Supper> it's interesting to be able to walk past several decades of innovation in an hour
[14:08:58] <andypugh> Basically, if you want to ride on steam trains, the UK is the place to be.
[14:09:37] <archivist> I shall be driving an 1849 stationary steam engine tomorrow :)
[14:10:01] <andypugh> The UK preserved railway list doesn't even fit on one page :-) http://www.heritage-railways.com/railways-a.php
[14:11:00] <L84Supper> I like the old engines with friction bearings that they had to service so often with a giant caulk type gun filled with a wax like lube
[14:11:01] <archivist> we had the inspector drop in at Rutland and he said it was in the hundreds
[14:11:57] <andypugh> The funniest is probably in Ireland though: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tnIN2bwvdPk
[14:12:25] <archivist> there are some private railways where an invite is needed
[14:12:41] <L84Supper> most of the old engines here are sitting and oxidizing away, some were donated to the museum for restoration
[14:13:43] <L84Supper> most ended up as scrap, or on display at parks or lodges
[14:13:51] <andypugh> Is this the time to bring up the Strategic Steam Reserve?
[14:14:08] <L84Supper> is this like the maple syrup reserve? :)
[14:14:50] <L84Supper> http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/northamerica/canada/9587835/Canadas-Maple-Syrup-reserves-recovered.html
[14:14:57] <andypugh> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strategic_steam_reserve
[14:15:55] <L84Supper> so that explains why so many are still around in the UK
[14:15:56] <archivist> http://www.statfoldbarnrailway.co.uk/
[14:17:08] <L84Supper> there would be complete chaos in the US if the power or diesel supply was interrupted
[14:17:18] <L84Supper> no steam backup
[14:19:55] <archivist> I have visited the museum near Chicago, Illinois railway museum
[14:20:26] <archivist> I did giggle at their claims of speed of their tram
[14:21:12] <andypugh> What was giggle-worthy?
[14:23:16] <archivist> the claim theirs was the fastest
[14:23:58] <archivist> I think it was trundling at about 10-15 mph
[14:25:02] <andypugh> Fastest in what sense?
[14:25:18] <andypugh> (like, who else was in the contest?)
[14:25:54] <archivist> the world iirc,
[14:26:28] <archivist> was back in 1990, so cant remember the exact words
[14:26:44] <L84Supper> they have about 5 miles of track, we were up to ~45mph a few weeks ago
[14:28:05] <andypugh> The Sheffield trams do 80kph (50mph)
[14:28:11] <andypugh> And they are fairly old.
[14:28:26] <archivist> we are limited here by the light railway regulations, but preserved locos to run on the mail railway network at proper speeds
[14:29:58] <archivist> fairly old would apply to the Isle of Man trams too
[14:30:28] <andypugh> No, htose are just Old.
[14:30:54] <archivist> 1900s :)
[14:31:54] <archivist> pre 1910 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manx_Electric_Railway
[14:35:53] <archivist> L84Supper, and we have some good museums, some with like steam like Manchester Museum of science and Industry
[14:36:04] <archivist> like/live
[14:39:48] <andypugh> In fact, we have so much old stuff that there is no room for new stuff :-)
[14:53:54] <L84Supper> most of it here was scrapped
[14:54:45] <L84Supper> just few museums here and there with steam engines or old machines from the 18th or 19th century
[14:56:21] <L84Supper> http://www.thehenryford.org/museum/index.aspx http://www.msichicago.org/ or the Smithsonian http://www.si.edu/
[15:58:03] <JT-Shop> Did you add halui?
[15:58:05] <JT-Shop> Did you add halui?
[15:58:07] <JT-Shop> Did you add halui?
[16:04:23] <Tom_itx> archivist, andypugh, skunkworks__, it was just easier to have the groove and it was turned in reverse to the tip. the spindle was still moving fairly quick so we decided it would be easier to thread it upside down
[16:04:54] <Tom_itx> his lathe will actually do 2 tpi which kinda surprised me
[16:05:22] <JT-Shop> the wood screw?
[16:05:37] <Tom_itx> the wood screw made from aluminum
[16:05:57] <JT-Shop> lol, you gave up on wood?
[16:06:22] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/cnc/Lathe/thread1.jpg
[16:06:33] <Tom_itx> yeah it would be easy if you had a live tool to cut it
[16:07:04] <JT-Shop> my Samson will do 1-28 TPI (just looked)
[16:07:27] <JT-Shop> bet that will hold better than any old wood
[16:07:53] <Tom_itx> yeah
[16:08:23] <Tom_itx> he'd gotten a few gears surplus and just happened to have what we needed
[16:08:47] <Tom_itx> just got back from test fitting it and the threads are great
[16:09:21] <Tom_itx> the rough finish on the dowel end isn't a problem since it's gettin epoxy anyway
[16:09:58] <Tom_itx> so now we can make one more
[16:24:11] <DJ9DJ> gn8
[16:49:37] <andypugh> Anyone know their way round Makefiles?
[16:50:07] <JT-Shop> I know how to screw up a submakefile, does that help?
[16:50:19] <andypugh> It might: http://pastebin.com/d81CULBw
[16:51:59] <micges> andypugh: you must add line to Makefile.inc
[16:52:41] <micges> CONFIG_LCD=m
[16:54:23] <JT-Shop> http://motorworks88.webs.com/apps/photos/photo?photoid=84185177
[16:54:59] <andypugh> I like in-situ machining
[16:55:38] <JT-Shop> yep, had to rig something up like that for my boom on the backhoe, I used a bigger drill...
[16:55:45] <andypugh> thanks micges, that looks like it was the problem
[16:56:24] <andypugh> I have only just realised that, actually, I haven't written a component in C before. Everything else ahs been comp or a Hostmot2 sub-driver
[17:01:49] <andypugh> (Hence this has not been a problem before)
[17:02:35] <andypugh> I checked my source tree for the CONFIG_STEPGEN string, but didn't actually have the Makefile.in added to the project.
[17:42:17] <gmouer> in remapping a unused Gcode, in the ngc file pointed to, can the text be G10 L2 P0 R180 ? or must the L/P/R parameters be handled differently, can't get it to work
[17:45:33] <gmouer> actual remap code in RS274 section of ini file is : Remap G68 modalgroup=1 ngc=G68 and in the linuxcnc/ngc_files folder I have a file name G68.ngc which has only one line of code G10 L2 P0 R180
[17:45:39] <gmouer> does not work
[17:45:47] <gmouer> no error messages
[17:46:11] <JT-Shop> and your running master?
[17:46:35] <gmouer> 2.6.0
[17:47:03] <JT-Shop> put a msg in there to see if it is getting called
[17:47:19] <gmouer> went to that ver to get chris morleys latest fixes for pncconf
[17:47:23] <JT-Shop> does the ngc file need to be executable
[17:47:51] <JT-Shop> and you made a subroutine in the file?
[17:48:01] <gmouer> I have no idea, have the remap doc on the other puter , it seems like I got it right
[17:48:22] <gmouer> no subroutine, just the one line of code in the .ngc file
[17:48:27] <JT-Shop> just scanning the docs and I think you need a proper subroutine in the file
[17:48:40] <JT-Shop> yep
[17:48:57] <JT-Shop> look at the m400 example
[17:49:54] <gmouer> the m400 example line is about the same except it uses argspec and I did not
[17:50:09] <JT-Shop> http://linuxcnc.org/docs/devel/html/remap/structure.html#_the_em_argspec_em_parameter_a_id_remap_argspec_parameter_a
[17:50:11] <gmouer> you must mean in the ngc file pointed to?
[17:50:14] <JT-Shop> look at 3.3.1
[17:51:48] <JT-Shop> http://pastebin.com/yc6NRmqS
[17:52:11] <gmouer> confusing doc, I am not trying to pass any parameters like the example
[17:53:09] <gmouer> the doc says 3.3.1 is for named parameter passing
[17:53:16] <JT-Shop> http://pastebin.com/yc6NRmqS
[17:54:02] <JT-Shop> but you still need the first line, the next to last line and the last line and your code
[17:54:05] <gmouer> I will go try it per your sample
[17:54:33] <gmouer> your saying a subroutine is mandatory?
[17:54:39] <JT-Shop> yep
[17:55:03] <gmouer> K, machine is right next to me so we will know in a couple mins
[18:00:58] <gmouer> unknown gcode used both for G68 and G69
[18:04:03] <gmouer> ini file rs274ngc line REMAP=G68 modalgroup=1 ngc=G68
[18:06:01] <JT-Shop> let me see if I have master on the computer next to me
[18:10:53] <gmouer> I do not have a SUBROUTINE_PATH set in the RS274 section, according to the doc it should default to (Display) PROGRAM_PREFIX which is where I put the ngc files
[18:12:52] <JT-Shop> if you type o<G68> call in the MDI window it works?
[18:13:17] <JT-Shop> The file myprocedure.ngc is expected to exists in the [DISPLAY]NC_FILES or [RS274NGC]SUBROUTINE_PATH directory.
[18:13:38] <JT-Shop> so yep
[18:14:33] <gmouer> let me try o<G68> in the mdi window
[18:14:48] <JT-Shop> and it says argsepc is optional...
[18:15:03] <JT-Shop> don't forget the call part
[18:16:47] <gmouer> o<G68> call gives msg unable to open file <G68>
[18:18:11] <gmouer> I can try adding SUBROUTINE_PATH to the rs274 section for the hell of it
[18:19:21] <JT-Shop> file name must be g68.ngc and the subrotine must be lower case as well
[18:19:55] <JT-Shop> http://linuxcnc.org/docs/html/gcode/o-code.html#_calling_files
[18:19:58] <gmouer> I have upper case for filename
[18:20:05] <JT-Shop> read the link
[18:20:15] <gmouer> a quit exit and try again, and read the link
[18:26:11] <gmouer> still get a unknown g code error, all is lower case now
[18:26:40] <andypugh> micges: If you look in the Makefile at lines 890 onwards, should every component have an entry there?
[18:27:07] <JT-Shop> different error
[18:27:14] <JT-Shop> you might have a typo
[18:27:31] <JT-Shop> try (msg, hi) instead of your g code
[18:28:00] <gmouer> g68 and g69 both throw unknown gcode error
[18:28:27] <JT-Shop> pastebin the contents of one
[18:28:55] <gmouer> never did pastebin either its all new
[18:29:19] <micges> andypugh: this is sections with hw drivers
[18:29:24] <JT-Shop> http://pastebin.com/
[18:31:01] <andypugh> micges: Are you sure? I see a number which don't access hardware (stepgen) and some that do (parport)
[18:32:10] <micges> lcd doesn't compile yet?
[18:32:31] <andypugh> It compiles fine. But not in --enable-simulator
[18:35:12] <gmouer> http://pastebin.com/KWeu77Dr filename is g68.ngc
[18:35:32] <gmouer> in linuxcnc/nc_files folder
[18:35:39] <micges> andypugh: pastebin your whole makefile
[18:38:20] <andypugh> I don't think this is necessarily a makefile problem: http://pastebin.com/kxmxXxJ9
[18:39:12] <JT-Shop> try this http://pastebin.com/index/KWeu77Dr
[18:40:36] <gmouer> JT, isn't that the identical pastebin I just posted?
[18:41:00] <gmouer> same link
[18:42:44] <JT-Shop> that didn't work
[18:42:57] <JT-Shop> replace the g code with (msg, hi)
[18:43:00] <JT-Shop> and try that
[18:43:17] <gmouer> is that the exact format (msg, hi)
[18:43:24] <JT-Shop> yea
[18:43:29] <gmouer> ok
[18:44:08] <Nick001-Shop> Can X Y Z be renamed Z1 Z2 Z3 for programing purposes?
[18:47:22] <JT-Shop> no
[18:48:19] <Nick001-Shop_> solves that one -)
[18:48:19] <gmouer> unknown g code message
[18:51:25] <gmouer> lets get more basic, I will postbin the first part of my ini file so you can see the remap lines etc.
[18:51:28] <JT-Shop> gmagno: I'm out of time... your missing something basic
[18:51:50] <JT-Shop> if you can't run it from the MDI window I don't think you can use it for remap
[18:51:56] <gmouer> thanks for trying, if you didn't see anything wrong I am in trouble
[18:52:18] <JT-Shop> read the o codes and get that to work
[18:53:08] <JT-Shop> don't feel bad I can't get the remap to work either
[18:53:16] <gmouer> oh great LOL
[18:53:36] <JT-Shop> in any case get the subroutine to work then move on from there
[18:53:51] * JT-Shop heads inside now
[18:53:59] <gmouer> I wonder if they changed something about remap and didn't update the doc
[18:55:35] <gmagno> JT-Shop, that was for gmouer, right?
[18:56:23] <gmagno> I also do that all the time...
[19:11:33] <andypugh> micges: I was never sure where the compiler was finding do_div, and it seems unable to do so in simulator. TBH I would be perfectly happy for the simulator to just not make it.
[19:15:34] <skunkworks__> why oh why do people have so may problems burning/booting linuxcnc?
[19:16:02] <skunkworks__> I think I have had 2 or 3 computers that I just could not get to work out of hundreds
[19:17:40] <PCW> Also with linux you can usually just move a hard drive around and it will just work on whatever hardware try that with windows
[19:21:12] <Tom_itx> skunkworks__, there was an issue with either too much ram or being connected to the interweb during install
[19:21:31] <Tom_itx> PCW, i've done that with windows a number of times
[19:22:58] <PCW> My experience is that if you change major hardware under windows it blue screens at boot
[19:22:59] <andypugh> PCW: Do you think that a multi-turn resolver should modify the scale?
[19:23:16] <skunkworks__> pcw: sure - done that...
[19:23:53] <skunkworks__> Tom_itx: I have had a XP move work about 20% of the time
[19:24:29] <andypugh> I am going to add a cycles-per-rev parameter to the resolver driver, so it only gives one index per rev. I am trying to decide whether I should incorporate that into the scale calcs, or leave that to the integrator?
[19:24:35] <skunkworks__> Tom_itx: the current livecd was fixed. (and 8.04 didn't have that issue iirc)
[19:24:53] <PCW> andypugh: Im not sure. if this is for LAIR his situation is that his resolver is geared up from the spindle so threading index does not work
[19:25:31] <andypugh> So presumably his scale is not the normal 65535.
[19:25:42] <andypugh> 65536, I mean
[19:26:35] <andypugh> But for a generic multi-turn resolver it may want to be an additional factor on top of the scale.
[19:27:25] <PCW> I woulds just have it patch the index (with the warning that since the index is no longer absolute dot try re starting a treading job after reloading Linxcnc)
[19:27:40] <PCW> s/dot/dont/
[19:28:47] <PCW> he claims the resolver is 1:1 with spindle and that it is 1x speed but I think it must be geared up 1:2
[19:29:15] <andypugh> 4 pole motors often have 2-cycle resolvers.
[19:29:25] <PCW> Yes
[19:29:35] <andypugh> I think cradek had a 256 cycle one.
[19:30:24] <PCW> I have a I think a 256 cycle 3 phase resolver from a robot arm
[19:30:25] <andypugh> The "index" in the resolver driver just spots the wrap.
[19:31:02] <andypugh> So a 2-cycle resolver would show two indexes (indices?)
[19:31:23] <PCW> Yes (or one geared up 1:2)
[19:32:34] <PCW> this is the same issue with simulated index on encoders (its hard to patch around in HAL because index-enable is a bi-directional signal)
[19:34:49] <PCW> so you can fix this but you cannot guarantee that the threading wild start at the same place if you exit/re-enter linuxcnc
[19:35:14] <PCW> s/wild/will/
[19:35:31] <andypugh> No, but then you would deserve all you got if you tried :-)
[19:36:48] <PCW> maybe a more general solution would be a index mask input bit
[19:37:28] <skunkworks__> things like kflop don't use index - (he doesn't think it is necessary...)
[19:37:48] <PCW> (so for LAIRs case a external HAL flipflop would do)
[19:38:09] <skunkworks__> so everytime the machine is restarted - the index is in a different place.
[19:38:18] <andypugh> PCW: I don't think you can use a flip-flop, because of the bidirectionality.
[19:38:20] <Tom_itx> skunkworks__ i wasn't aware the 10.04 cd was fixed
[19:38:30] <skunkworks__> Yes - cradek did
[19:38:47] <PCW> thats OK for some things disasterous for others
[19:38:58] <skunkworks__> I don't like it.
[19:39:08] <skunkworks__> but it is a mach thing
[19:39:18] <skunkworks__> for the most part
[19:39:38] <PCW> andypugh the ff goes to the new index mask pin on the resolver driver
[19:40:07] <PCW> so a external hall or opto could be used as well
[19:40:41] <PCW> index mask is just an input
[19:42:50] <PCW> I guess it requires an index out bit as well for the FF clock
[19:42:52] <PCW> just though unbundling it would allow hardware index mask inputs
[19:42:53] <PCW> in addition to div by n
[19:44:14] <PCW> but it would require 2 new pins on the resolver hal interface (index-out, index-mask)
[19:46:33] <PCW> andypugh has fallen asleep...
[19:46:39] <skunkworks__> heh
[19:47:21] <PCW> I'm just about to fall asleep and he's 8 hours or so later
[19:47:36] <gmouer> hi Sam, any experience with remapping a unused g code? one is giving me fits, big John couldn't get it to work either
[19:48:14] <andypugh> Trying to get my new component to compile in both simulator and useful versions.
[19:48:17] <skunkworks__> gmouer: have not done that.. Might be just a little above my pay grade...
[19:49:09] <gmouer> I got the subroutine for the remap gcode so it runs from the mdi line, but the remap in the ini file apparently isn't calling it for some reason
[19:49:50] <PCW> does the simulator build have access to rtai includes?
[19:50:01] <andypugh> I am really not sure
[19:50:37] <andypugh> Well, I passed the tests, lets try building the debs...
[19:51:11] <PCW> you fixed the simulator build?
[19:52:25] <skunkworks__> gmouer: wait for mhaberler to be on - he is the one that did the remapping mod to linuxcnc
[19:53:16] <gmouer> thanks sam! I am writing that down LOL
[19:54:13] <skunkworks__> :)
[19:55:38] <andypugh> PCW: I can fix the sim build with an include that breaks the useful build
[19:57:03] <andypugh> I have tried to bodge round that with a #ifndef but it's a guess how that is meant to work
[20:01:15] <PCW> yuck. is it new includes that are causing the problem?
[20:01:57] <andypugh> It's the 64-bit division library that I am using to handle more than 8 digits of float
[20:02:17] <andypugh> It was a really ewasy solution in realtime...
[20:02:52] <andypugh> I think it just comes in as a side-effect of one of the standard realtime includes.
[20:05:07] <PCW> you would think that lots of things depend on "ifdef simulator" includes
[20:05:55] <PCW> not sure what a simulator build is good for...
[20:06:17] <andypugh> Making life really difficult.
[20:06:43] <andypugh> But it lets people run linuxCNC as an ordinarly application on a normal kernel
[20:07:13] <andypugh> Whether enough people who would want to do that know that they can do that and so do do that is a different question.
[20:07:17] <PCW> is there a userland library that includes similar math functions?
[20:07:33] <andypugh> How should I know? Do I look like a geek?
[20:08:02] <PCW> well...
[20:08:53] <andypugh> I certainly don't really know my way round the linux standard libraries
[20:14:14] <PCW> bbl ttgh
[20:24:39] <gmouer> Hi John, got the sub to run
[20:29:05] <gmouer> also think I figured out why a remap of G68 to a G10 command is not possible
[20:29:58] <andypugh> If it is G-code, I thought it was meant to be possible.
[20:30:20] <gmouer> nobody has had much luck on this one andy
[20:30:39] <andypugh> I admit I have not tried remapping anything.
[20:31:14] <gmouer> according to the remap doc, only gcodes in modalgroup 1 are supported, so I think that is why this one is giving us fits
[20:31:52] <gmouer> remap doc is a bit unclear on some of the finer points
[20:34:41] <andypugh> "Users familiar with Python will likely find it easier to write remapped codes, glue, O-word procedures etc in pure Python, without resorting to the somewhat cumbersome RS274NGC language at all."
[20:35:32] <gmouer> funny thing is that this is a real simple one-liner remap
[20:35:57] <andypugh> What modal group did you put your G68 into?
[20:37:08] <gmouer> bingo, that is my present concern, I used group 1 because that is all remap supports according to the doc, but.. a unassigned gcode does not really belong to a modalgroup at that point, does it?
[20:37:48] <andypugh> G68 is a version of G10, so I think it should be in Group 0
[20:38:34] <gmouer> I hope not... G10 is indeed group 0 I read, and only group 1 is supported by remap for g codes
[20:38:48] <gmouer> I think that is why it refuses to work
[20:39:25] <Tom_itx> what's another tooling fixture supplier aside from mcmaster?
[20:40:48] <gmouer> clear something up for me Andy, Why would unassigned Gcodes belong to any modalgroup? they are unassigned afterall????
[20:41:09] <gmouer> or does it go by the target codes it is being reassigned to?
[20:41:09] <Tom_itx> ahh, that's it.. carr lane
[20:41:15] <andypugh> The question is what group the _result_ belongs in.
[20:41:42] <gmouer> I had a hunch that was the case
[20:42:01] <gmouer> its only been a few weeks since switching to linuxcnc but I am learning
[20:42:05] <andypugh> gmouer: Which version of LinuxCNC are you running?
[20:42:35] <gmouer> 2.6.0 pre0
[20:43:04] <gmouer> got that because of fixes Chris Morley did to pncconf
[20:43:05] <andypugh> That would have been too easy, I guess
[20:43:56] <gmouer> close reading of the remap doc gives the answer I think, only modalgroup 1 gcodes are supported
[20:44:25] <Tom_itx> any of you guys ever use these: http://www.carrlane.com/catalog/index.cfm/27025071F0B221118070C1C512D020609090C0015482013180B041D1E173C3B28535B465D
[20:44:26] <Tom_itx> ?
[20:44:32] <gmouer> there is some common belief that any unused gcode can be remapped, its looking like that is not necessarily true
[20:50:30] <Tom_itx> I saw similar of these today on a clamping fixture and i must say they're pretty cool: http://www.carrlane.com/catalog/index.cfm/28025071F0B221118070C1C513E111D081B0006280B1713050245221E0107070F1A3C3B285352425A56
[20:50:38] <Tom_itx> various types
[20:51:44] <Tom_itx> these appear to be hydraulic though, what i saw wasn't but i can't seem to find em
[20:51:49] <skunkworks__> gmouer: be sure to ask mhaberler
[20:52:52] <gmouer> yea I will Sam, but is now looks like its just going to be a final comfirmation of no-can-do
[20:53:10] <andypugh> gmouer: I think you need some Python Glue, do you have that?
[20:53:18] <gmouer> I learned a lot more in attempting though.
[20:53:32] <skunkworks__> (he also likes a Challenge..) ;)
[20:53:53] <gmouer> andy, I am real new to linuxcnc, don't even know what python glue is just yet, seen the term in my ventures though
[20:54:18] <andypugh> I am just quoting from MAH's docs :-0
[20:57:01] <gmouer> with luck, maybe I can catch him and get some confirmations about the situation
[20:58:50] <mozmck> Maybe it's like Gorilla Glue?
[20:59:44] <andypugh> But longer?
[21:01:36] <Tom_itx> andypugh do you have a link to your retention knob drawbar?
[21:01:42] <Tom_itx> or drawing of it
[21:03:02] <andypugh> https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/Tad4D5FLiM1goCdswmXtddMTjNZETYmyPJy0liipFm0?feat=directlink
[21:04:29] <Tom_itx> thanks
[21:22:46] <r00t4rd3d> just won 25 bucks on a dollar scratch off :D
[21:24:19] <ReadError> yea but how many did you lose before that? ;p
[21:24:28] <r00t4rd3d> alot but that dont matter
[21:25:31] <r00t4rd3d> I got invited to a craft fair, lady says I can have my own table lol.
[21:26:17] <r00t4rd3d> fucking craigslist.
[21:28:01] <r00t4rd3d> I think I am going to email her back and tell her, sorry but I am smoking some crack that day.
[21:31:17] <ReadError> set up a table with a wooden gun arsenal
[21:31:39] <r00t4rd3d> lol
[21:32:00] <r00t4rd3d> around here i would probably sell them
[21:33:43] <r00t4rd3d> I gave a hunting freak friend the 9mm I made and I guess people ask about it all the time.
[21:34:16] <r00t4rd3d> he hung it on his wall
[21:35:29] <r00t4rd3d> I could make a awesome one now
[21:35:36] <r00t4rd3d> fully detailed
[21:35:43] <r00t4rd3d> both sides
[21:37:02] <r00t4rd3d> Im gonna go fire up the machine and start another paradise box
[21:37:32] <r00t4rd3d> I got another one sold for 75
[21:37:40] <ReadError> a waaaah?
[21:37:47] <r00t4rd3d> a stupid little box
[21:38:03] <ReadError> whats it do?
[21:38:07] <r00t4rd3d> nothing
[21:38:12] <r00t4rd3d> sits therer
[21:38:16] <r00t4rd3d> -r
[21:38:23] <r00t4rd3d> http://i.imgur.com/S47Q5.jpg
[21:38:41] <ReadError> fancy
[21:38:50] <ReadError> im glad to see you stop using particle board
[21:38:55] <ReadError> make me proud, sir
[21:39:02] <r00t4rd3d> http://www.vectric.com/WebSite/Vectric/projects/march-2011/paradise-box.htm
[21:39:08] <r00t4rd3d> those plans
[21:39:19] <r00t4rd3d> I am cutting this next one in oak.
[21:39:28] <r00t4rd3d> walnuts stain
[21:41:19] <r00t4rd3d> this next one is getting some fish in the top lol
[21:43:01] <r00t4rd3d> like this:
[21:43:02] <r00t4rd3d> http://i.imgur.com/wmrQ8.jpg
[21:43:02] <ktchk> home position. Is it possible to home at the middle of the xy travel?
[21:43:14] <r00t4rd3d> sure
[21:43:19] <r00t4rd3d> i never home
[21:44:04] <ReadError> ktchk, you can setup switches
[21:44:06] <ReadError> and autohome
[21:44:10] <r00t4rd3d> ktchk, its in the menu, like File:Homing:Home X Axis
[21:44:29] <ktchk> soft home no switch
[21:45:24] <ReadError> uhhh
[21:45:29] <ReadError> impossibru
[21:45:34] <r00t4rd3d> i just zero everything to my material
[21:45:44] <r00t4rd3d> how ever the hell i clamp it in
[21:46:03] <r00t4rd3d> sometimes is a challenge
[21:46:09] <ktchk> that is g43
[21:46:55] <r00t4rd3d> off to the batcave!
[22:36:45] <r00t-Shed> i hate when i use a ramp toolpath and forget to set the plunge rate higher.
[22:43:07] <r00t-Shed> now i sit here cutting at half speed on a large part with no way to over ride
[23:39:37] <r00t4rd3d> lol, now even hulk hogan has a sex tape.
[23:47:41] <IAmWill> i'm not sure if this is the right place, but here goes: i am looking to purchase a mini cnc laser cutter. I currently have a cnc table that cuts 12"x18" and I am looking for the same rough size, and I want it to be compatible with emc. I do most of my designs in google sketchup, export to stl, and then use pycam to get my gcode. does anyone know of a linux compatible laser cutter? looking to spend around $2200.
[23:51:01] <r00t4rd3d> just add a laser to your current cnc setup
[23:51:19] <charlieMiller> two lasers
[23:51:42] <charlieMiller> two beam lasers at 90 degree angles ot each other, that will give you dead center :)
[23:51:59] <charlieMiller> One on the front/back of the mill and one on the left/right side
[23:52:30] <r00t4rd3d> he wants to cut with the laser not position with it
[23:52:39] <charlieMiller> doh
[23:53:19] <r00t4rd3d> IAmWill, also lookup phlatscript if you use Sketchup
[23:53:40] <IAmWill> okay... thanks
[23:53:49] <charlieMiller> I hope you enclose your cnc setup for that
[23:53:51] <r00t4rd3d> it converts your models to gcode so you could skip the pycam part
[23:53:56] <charlieMiller> and be careful what you cut
[23:54:19] <charlieMiller> i.e. I don't think pcv is too healthy for you
[23:54:34] <r00t4rd3d> IAmWill, on your cnc machine you have now, does it have a 4 axis controller?
[23:55:00] <IAmWill> no
[23:55:51] <IAmWill> i am using the fireball v90, i built the controller myself with the kl4030
[23:56:06] <IAmWill> i am almost positive it only has 3 axis
[23:56:39] <r00t4rd3d> you could use a 4th axis to turn the laser on and off
[23:56:48] <r00t4rd3d> i think
[23:56:51] <charlieMiller> Do you have a c10 card?
[23:57:14] <IAmWill> no
[23:57:35] <charlieMiller> Another parallel port breakout setup?
[23:57:41] <IAmWill> yeah
[23:58:07] <r00t4rd3d> http://www.microcarve.com/mcMV1.html
[23:58:20] <charlieMiller> The lasers I have used had a ttl trigger 0-5v.. I know you can control a spindle that way. I don't know why you would need a 4th axis?
[23:58:22] <r00t4rd3d> if you got 2k , buy that and slap a laser on it
[23:59:16] <r00t4rd3d> charlieMiller, just so he could use his current cnc machine with out too much work
[23:59:16] <IAmWill> http://www.probotix.com/FireBall_v90_cnc_router_kit/ <-- already have this one... shouldn't be to hard to strap laser to it