#linuxcnc | Logs for 2012-10-02

[02:03:17] <DJ9DJ> moin
[05:09:21] <oxomoxo> Hi there, first time here ..
[05:09:53] <Valen> quick lets all act alloof and stuff
[05:10:20] <Valen> ground rules are dont ask to ask a question
[05:10:30] <Valen> dont ask if somebody knows about X
[05:10:32] <Valen> just ask
[05:10:40] <Valen> also hang around if you want an answer
[05:10:48] <Valen> other than that, welcome oxomoxo ;->
[05:11:15] <oxomoxo> Thanks for welcome :D I'm trying to drive two joints on same axis
[05:11:31] <Valen> your on your own! lol
[05:11:50] <Valen> some kind of gantry machine?
[05:11:52] <oxomoxo> 've been reading about simply setting same source in stepconf but ...
[05:12:11] <oxomoxo> yep a gantry ;P
[05:12:25] <Valen> steppers?
[05:12:31] <oxomoxo> doesn't work the 'simple' way ..
[05:12:37] <oxomoxo> yep steppers
[05:12:58] <Valen> the 2 options i'm aware of are gantrykins and just setting them the same
[05:13:14] <Valen> whats not "simple" about it?
[05:14:14] <oxomoxo> tried the 'same source' in stepconf but one joint only actually responds ... is that a bob issue or is this info a
[05:14:34] <oxomoxo> known to be tricky ?
[05:14:42] <Valen> shouldn't be tricky
[05:14:59] <oxomoxo> ... mmmh ... sounds like a bob issue ?
[05:15:00] <Valen> i've never used stepconf though so i'm just feeling blindly
[05:15:17] <Valen> try changing which output your using perhaps see if it then works?
[05:15:33] <Valen> i mean, check to see if you can actually drive both motors individually
[05:15:48] <oxomoxo> I've tried various combinations of 2 joints binding but no success ...
[05:16:06] <Valen> don't bind them
[05:16:07] <oxomoxo> all motors are ok individually
[05:16:15] <Valen> driving from EMC?
[05:16:35] <Valen> IE you dont change the wiring at all (just software) and you can make them all move
[05:16:41] <oxomoxo> nope from "test this axis" in stepconf
[05:16:53] <Valen> thats still EMC then ;->
[05:17:15] <Valen> I dunno about using stepconf, I'd take a look at the ini and hal files and see what they say
[05:17:17] <oxomoxo> all motors are on independent drivers / pins and all work ok alone
[05:17:35] <Valen> unfortunatly most of the people are asleep here
[05:17:40] <Valen> what country are you in?
[05:18:35] <oxomoxo> France :D .. hehe I'll mess around for a while and will be back later with more infos (hal,ini)
[05:19:16] <Valen> pretty early there?
[05:22:53] <oxomoxo> It's noon here ;) where are you ?
[05:24:22] <Valen> sydney
[05:24:30] <Valen> if its noon there archivist may be around
[05:44:20] <jthornton> oxomoxo, if this is say the Y axis select Y axis step and direction on the 2 pins for each motor. test this axis may not work but the configuration should run
[05:46:58] <jthornton> http://imagebin.org/230612
[05:48:08] <oxomoxo> ... this is exactly what I did pin stepper 1 <- dir/step X and pin stepper 2 <- dir/step X
[05:48:13] <oxomoxo> Symptoms :
[05:49:28] <oxomoxo> (in stepconf test) stepper 1 step ok dir fail and stepper 2 step fail dir fail
[05:50:36] <jthornton> I don't understand your ascii art but test this axis may not work in stepconf
[05:51:33] <oxomoxo> whatever combination of stepper / axis .. when more than 1 stepper is fed with an axis source, test fails
[05:51:58] <oxomoxo> i'll try it out at runtime and tell ...
[05:53:35] <jthornton> I do know that it connects the pins correctly but the test this axis was not written for two steppers so the code might choke on it
[05:54:29] <oxomoxo> okok ... thanks for the info ... since it failed I didn't went thru ..
[06:29:34] <oxomoxo> Ok guys it seems that in the end the test routine was broken ... config is running ok in linuxcnc :D
[06:30:13] <jthornton> maybe not broken but not designed to do that
[06:34:46] <oxomoxo> Thanks for sorting that out ... I'll be back when setting up gantrykin for homing the gantry correctly ;P
[06:35:17] <pilla_> hi :)
[06:35:39] <pilla_> Really new to all of this... How do you make a CNC miller that's connected to LinuxCNC actually "stop" when it reaches home?
[06:36:18] <jthornton> how are you making it "go"?
[06:36:45] <pilla_> Machine -> home -> home x-axis, home y-axis, home z-axis? ^
[06:36:50] <pilla_> ^^
[06:37:29] <archivist> wire and configure limit switches correctly
[06:38:28] <pilla_> This is the first time I have ever seen a CNC milling machine, let alone touch it. Could you point me in the right direction to do that? ^ ^
[06:39:28] <jthornton> what happens when you home an axis?
[06:39:46] <pilla_> The machine, uh, "clicks"
[06:40:11] <pilla_> and keeps on clicking until I hit the emergency stop :)
[06:40:20] <archivist> http://www.linuxcnc.org/docs/html/config/ini_homing.html
[06:40:34] <jthornton> can you pastebin your ini file?
[06:40:35] <pilla_> Ty!
[06:40:52] <pilla_> which ini file :)
[06:41:01] <archivist> I remember someone not reading from yesterday :)
[06:41:35] <jthornton> there is only one ini file per config
[06:46:26] <theos> pilla_ your name means puppy in my language :D
[06:46:50] <pilla_> :D cute
[06:46:57] <priscilla> also, pastebin here : http://pastebin.com/NbzvngH5
[06:47:43] <pilla_> what language? :)
[06:47:59] <r00t4rd3d> http://i.imgur.com/h1eIy.jpg
[06:48:20] <jthornton> will your axis move at 900mm/min?
[06:49:26] <pilla_> Vel = 452
[06:49:50] <jthornton> MAX_VELOCITY = 8.48214285714
[06:49:58] <jthornton> HOME_SEARCH_VEL = 15.000000
[06:52:09] <pilla_> My x-axis has a vel of 508.926 on maximum settings if I try to manual control it... is that OK? What you said is in my ini, right? no idea what to do/fix :)
[06:52:43] <jthornton> change HOME_SEARCH_VEL = 8 and try that
[07:05:13] <mazafaka> What a reason machine need Homing procedure? Is it only for moves to check the encoders?
[07:05:50] <jthornton> to set the soft limits and put the machine in a known position
[07:17:19] <RussianKid> if you have decent limit switches itll give you a precise datum to work from
[08:00:07] <gmouer> Is this level of quiet the norm for the linuxcnc channel? New here and wondering
[08:00:42] <jdh> it is for this time of day.
[08:01:21] <gmouer> ah, I watched for a while a few times over the last day. When is it most active?
[08:02:36] <theos> gmouer when you start talking :P
[08:02:46] <jdh> we wait for you to leave, then talk about you.
[08:02:54] <theos> that too
[08:03:32] <jdh> usually more evenings US timezones, but lots of .eu people at their 'normal' times too.
[08:04:00] <jdh> but, if you have a question, ask... someone might answer it, check scrollback.
[08:04:09] <gmouer> been years since I played with irc, bringing back memories though, 50 people or more logged in and dead quiet
[08:05:02] <JT-Shop> 113 people waiting for your LinuxCNC question...
[08:05:29] <archivist> or actually doing something
[08:05:39] <jdh> <- working.
[08:05:47] * JT-Shop working
[08:06:29] <gmouer> figured I might learn a few things watching with the morning coffee
[08:06:57] <JT-Shop> might try reading the forum with your coffee
[08:07:11] <gmouer> lol read just about every post there
[08:07:29] <JT-Shop> speed reader
[08:08:02] <gmouer> I did find it funny that there have only been maybe 20 threads in the lathe section over 5 years or so
[08:09:02] <jdh> perhaps it works so well that nobody has problems?
[08:09:15] <Jymmm\AE> O_o
[08:09:31] <gmouer> it does work well indeed, but for newcomers the learning curve is quite steep
[08:11:01] <gmouer> I am a mach convert, crossed over a couple months ago after getting fed up with mach lathe
[08:11:19] <jdh> I'm planning on converting a lathe when it gets colder.
[08:11:44] <jdh> which, I guess, would have been a few months ago for rochester.
[08:12:53] <gmouer> I got a 14x40 I retrofitted to mach, then a couple months ago a american-way machine came along that I could not resist. Its about identical to a omniturn GT75, the AW lathe I retrofitted using mesa boards, just finished up last week
[08:13:23] <jdh> that's a bit bigger than what I had in mind :)
[08:13:41] <gmouer> 65 yesterday, 50 today, but yes, inside hobby time is just about here
[08:13:55] <gmouer> did a 7x lathe too but sold that one
[08:14:15] <gmouer> also did a bridgeport V2E3 mach retrofit
[08:14:17] <jdh> got any writeup or anything on the 7x?
[08:14:51] <JT-Shop> gmouer: are you using ngcgui with your lathe?
[08:15:09] <gmouer> no, the 7x was a radical retro, linear rails/ground screws/ worked great
[08:15:44] <gmouer> no, have not used ngcgui yet, but a friend I dragged to linuxcnc is using it and loves it
[08:16:08] <JT-Shop> most of my subs are here http://gnipsel.com/shop/hardinge/hardinge.xhtml
[08:17:21] <gmouer> oh.... Jt is BigJohnT ! your subs are a must have from what I have seen. They are next on the list as soon as I get some tool holders made up
[08:17:46] <jthornton> this is me too
[08:18:12] <gmouer> read your whole webpage too LOL, took special note of the BP 308 that fits through a garage door
[08:19:28] <jthornton> it's fixing to come out of the garage this week and move over to the shop
[08:20:29] <gmouer> your posts have been a big help in the learning curve, thanks much John
[08:20:44] <jthornton> your welcome
[08:21:09] <skunkworks> gmouer, how is the virtual tach working?
[08:21:47] <gmouer> hi Sam, it seems to work great. I halscope tuned the servos over the weekend, had done a prior coarse tune before
[08:24:28] <skunkworks> great! tuning is still something I am not comfortable with...
[08:25:46] <gmouer> yes, there is a lot to understanding tuning. I have a few servo retrofits under my belt now so it does get a lot easier
[08:26:20] <gmouer> I can say that linuxcnc's internal pid loops are much nicer to tune than anything I ever did in Mach3
[08:27:01] <jthornton> tuning the BP servos was too easy the MPG made up for that
[08:28:12] <gmouer> I setup a contour shuttle pendant for jogging, that was a hoot, but worked out fantastic. Big time Hal learning experience
[08:28:43] <skunkworks> heh - jthornton did the ilowpass solve it?
[08:28:57] <jthornton> yep, works as expected
[08:29:06] <skunkworks> gmouer, you will be making your on hal comps soon ;)
[08:29:15] <gmouer> My bridgeport is getting re-retrofitted to linuxcnc down the road also, already bought the atom computer for the job
[08:30:07] <gmouer> yea right sam, I have now learned enough to know what I don't know, which is a lot!
[08:30:15] <skunkworks> The K&T was the first real world application of servo tuning for me. Lots of help from here.
[08:31:16] <gmouer> my bridgeport was a servo machine from the factory, my 14x40 lathe I did with kelling servos, the american-way gang lathe is also a factory servo machine
[08:32:47] <gmouer> servo tuning under linuxcnc is a much easier beast to tame than under mach3, end result is far superior
[08:33:40] <skunkworks> Great - we like to hear that. (nice having all the configureing in one place too
[08:33:48] <skunkworks> )
[08:34:42] <gmouer> well, that is not totally the case with the AW lathe, there is the velocity loop on the drive board itself, another learning point, think I got the grasp of it though
[08:34:57] <skunkworks> sure.
[08:37:02] <gmouer> ? for bigJohn, curious why your lathe routines are all in IPM feed mode when most lathes are programmed in IPR mode?
[08:38:11] <jthornton> easier for me to understand I assume
[08:39:05] <gmouer> just wondering, from what I have seen, it seems IPR is the norm in the lathe world.
[08:39:45] <jthornton> I have no formal training on CNC equipment so often I guess at what to do
[08:40:07] <jthornton> I didn't even think of using G95 on the lathe till you mentioned it
[08:40:12] <gmouer> your guesses are darned good too
[08:40:42] <jthornton> often the first guess is not as good as the last guess
[08:41:09] <jthornton> G95 would make it easy to control the chip depth
[08:41:25] * jthornton is off to a customer now
[08:41:35] <gmouer> I have my other lathe set up in diameter mode and IPR feed right on startup
[08:45:42] <skunkworks> I actually did IPR on the K&T when I was boring some holes.. worked great (easier for me to think - I want to take .001 per rev)
[08:46:48] <gmouer> for the lathe it seems to be the norm, as is diameter mode, It is a lot easier to relate to I found
[08:47:38] <skunkworks> that is normally how the dials are calibrate on a manual lathe...
[08:48:07] <gmouer> yes, on a manual the power feed charts are in IPR usually
[08:48:18] <skunkworks> sure
[08:49:48] <gmouer> I look forward to getting linuxcnc setup on my bridgeport. Its a ways off yet though, the other lathe is more important to get done.
[08:50:58] <gmouer> I put a servo on the knee of the bridgeport also, I send the tool length offset to the knee and do normal Z cutting moves with the quill.
[08:51:11] <gmouer> makes up for only 5" of quill travel
[08:51:58] <skunkworks> I bet it is nice to be able to thread and to IPR and css... (really though - all you would have to have done was wait for M4)
[08:52:23] <skunkworks> Neat
[10:12:45] <mazafaka> jthornton: this machine when it's turned on and homed finds the coordinates precisely enough if the CNC-software (some weirdo in Windows 98) works OK.
[11:50:54] <tjb1> JT-Shop: http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc6/222003_4391654905506_288311715_n.jpg
[11:57:43] <BHSPiMonkey> Steppers and belt: ordered. Controller: ordered.
[11:57:55] <BHSPiMonkey> Just gotta find a power supply and a few tools...
[12:02:30] <V0idExp> hi everyone!
[12:02:34] <V0idExp> a rapid question :)
[12:02:43] <V0idExp> does it matter if I install RT-Linux or RTAI?
[12:03:39] <V0idExp> rt-linux is kept better in synch with main linux tree... but rtai is shipped by default with Ubuntu iso downloadable from linuxcnc web site
[12:07:15] <pcw_home> I though rt-linux was dead
[12:08:00] <gentoox_> is it not?
[12:08:11] <pcw_home> with Yodaiken moving on to bigger and better things
[12:08:16] <V0idExp> latest stable is 3.4.11
[12:08:29] <V0idExp> https://rt.wiki.kernel.org/index.php/Main_Page
[12:08:44] <V0idExp> maybe we're talking about different things
[12:10:04] <pcw_home> Ahh you're talking about rt-preempt
[12:10:22] <V0idExp> it's not suitable for linuxcnc?
[12:11:07] <gentoox_> no, there a few articles explaining rtai vs rt-preempt
[12:11:24] <IchGuckLive> Hi all
[12:12:23] <gentoox_> I have been doing research on the differences between rtai,xenomai, and rt-preempt for a while now
[12:13:36] <V0idExp> and only rtai is supported by linuxcnc?
[12:15:07] <pcw_home> rt-preemt is workable but has somewhat worse latency than RTAI
[12:15:09] <pcw_home> (there are a number of developers that have LinuxCNC running under rt-preemt)
[12:19:23] <V0idExp> does the main 2.5.1 tree works with rt-preempt out of the box?
[12:21:43] <pcw_home> I dont think so (you could ask micges whats needed to get it running when he's around)
[12:22:21] <pcw_home> or ask on the LinuxCNC developers list
[12:22:39] <V0idExp> ok, thank you
[12:25:03] <tjb1> Any specialize in getting data sheets?
[12:28:02] <tjb1> Id love it if someone could find the data sheet for this IKO Linear Motion Roller Guide "LWL15C1R108"
[12:50:11] <IchGuckLive> tjb1: did you look at pbcliniar
[12:54:54] <IchGuckLive> tjb1: what do you exactly need the datasheet pdf?
[12:56:20] <IchGuckLive> https://ikowb01.ikont.co.jp/technicalservice/ikoc0130.php?from=html&lang=en&FLG=LWL
[12:59:26] <IchGuckLive> kb8wmc: Hi B)
[13:03:36] <kb8wmc> hello sir, how have you been?
[13:03:40] <kb8wmc> IchGuckLive: have you kept yourself busy sir?
[13:08:16] <IchGuckLive> kb8wmc: yes we harvested 5.000tonns of corn last 4 days
[13:08:39] <tjb1> I would like the exact dimensions for the hole pattern IchGuckLive but the website doesnt have any files
[13:08:42] <tjb1> They all fail download
[13:09:00] <IchGuckLive> oh bad
[13:09:02] <tjb1> Well none of them exist
[13:13:24] <pcw_home> Here's a song to cheer you up:
[13:13:26] <pcw_home> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iEXgqsrxE4g
[13:13:52] <kb8wmc> IchGuckLive: you certainly have been buse
[13:15:36] <IchGuckLive> tjb1: the pitch is 40mm and the end are 20mm
[13:15:55] <tjb1> What are you talking about IchGuckLive ?
[13:16:08] <archivist> tjb1, seems to download here ok
[13:16:20] <tjb1> The datasheet for it?
[13:16:29] <tjb1> I get this - http://www.facebook.com/l.php?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ikont.co.jp%2Feg%2Fcatalog%2Fpdf%2Flwl.pdf&h=JAQELinMD
[13:16:30] <IchGuckLive> yes
[13:16:45] <tjb1> The data sheet for - LWL15C1R108
[13:16:45] <IchGuckLive> https://ikowb01.ikont.co.jp/technicalservice/ikoc0130.php?from=html&lang=en&FLG=LWL
[13:17:28] <IchGuckLive> lwl is the typ 15 is the size C1 is the edge cshape and R108 is the length
[13:17:42] <tjb1> I was here - https://ikowb01.ikont.co.jp/technicalservice/download/cad_data/dl_cad.php?from=html&language=english
[13:17:50] <tjb1> And couldnt get any CAD data...
[13:18:12] <IchGuckLive> download the LWL datasheet from the link
[13:18:39] <IchGuckLive> CAT-1552(2)E catalog number
[13:19:30] <IchGuckLive> 3td line Download colon
[13:20:31] <tjb1> Found it thanks
[13:20:36] <tjb1> Trying to find the hole size now :)
[13:21:56] <IchGuckLive> table 3.3
[13:24:47] <IchGuckLive> tjb1: 3.1 gives the same numbers
[13:29:10] <IchGuckLive> im off By
[13:29:33] <FinboySlick> Would you guys trust this to still be accurate? http://www.ebay.ca/itm/Starrett-no-20-Master-Precision-Square-Wood-Case-6-inch-/221132539350?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item337c86c5d6
[13:30:21] <FinboySlick> (It's a heck of a bargain compared to new)
[13:36:16] <andypugh> It's pretty easy to test a square
[13:36:40] <andypugh> It just needs to read the same both ways. (similarly with a spirit level)
[13:37:14] <archivist> turn a precision square
[13:37:41] <cradek> the answer to your question is you should probably trust no square to be square unless you test it
[13:38:14] <FinboySlick> andypugh: Well, I plan to test it if I get it. I'm just wondering if there's a situation where a solid square like that could become inaccurate. I don't expect them to bend a whole lot.
[13:38:20] <archivist> and that one looks well used
[13:38:48] <archivist> it has been rusty at some stage
[13:39:18] <archivist> box does not look like it has lived with that square
[13:40:57] <FinboySlick> These are supposed to have accuracy to .0001" every 6". I assume rust spots on the base could mess that up.
[13:40:57] <L84Supper> the seller even says that he made the case for it and you can see the "staining in the pics"
[13:41:45] <andypugh> Have you priced up the same thing new? You might be surprised
[13:42:02] <FinboySlick> It's listed at 286$ new.
[13:42:47] <andypugh> Really? The stainless variant is £85
[13:43:36] <FinboySlick> I think it's the 'Master Precision' bit that makes it that expensive.
[13:43:56] <FinboySlick> Their 'machinist precision' squares are way more affordable.
[13:44:28] <andypugh> And which do you need?
[13:44:52] <FinboySlick> Hehe, I'd need to lease the master one for a week? ;)
[13:45:34] <FinboySlick> I blame OCD and my mill column not being straight.
[13:46:03] <andypugh> It's almost certanly as square as you need. And it it isn't. sell it on eBay.
[13:46:04] <archivist> I rarely need that type of square to be accurate I use box squares with levels for accuracy
[13:46:26] <andypugh> But a square isn't the way to set a mill head.
[13:46:43] <FinboySlick> andypugh: I need to line up the column before the head.
[13:46:54] <FinboySlick> The travel isn't perpendicular to the table.
[13:47:03] <FinboySlick> Then I can tram.
[13:47:18] <andypugh> A cube would be better. And a dial-indicator in the chuck.
[13:47:35] <archivist> FinboySlick, this is the toy you should be able to find a cheaper one http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/HILGER-WATTS-8-Precision-Square-Block-Level-Machine-Level-/170707152364?pt=UK_Measuring_Tools_Levels&hash=item27bef06dec
[13:48:16] <archivist> I have a spare one by cooke troughton sims uncased
[13:49:06] <FinboySlick> andypugh: I'm interested... Obviously with a cube I could adjust both axis, since this is tightening/shimming and messing one axis is very likely to affect adjustments on the other.
[13:49:38] <archivist> about 50-100 pounds usually
[13:54:39] <FinboySlick> andypugh: My plan was to set the square on the table, attach an indicator to the head or chuck, travel along the square to adjust the travel first. Then put an indicator in the chuck and tram to the table surface to adjust the head.
[13:58:24] <tjb1> Haha Fastenal wanted $3.81 for 20 - M3x10mm SHCS, its $4 for 100 at mcmaster carr
[13:58:52] <FinboySlick> tjb1: Another win for the free market.
[13:59:13] <FinboySlick> tjb1: Fight the metric screw cartel!
[13:59:22] <tjb1> They didnt have the other bolt I wanted
[13:59:32] <tjb1> but i bet fastenal does!
[14:01:01] <archivist> FinboySlick, before you assume too much, first measure the table for parallel and squareness to the base
[14:02:54] <archivist> remind me, what make of machine
[14:04:21] <FinboySlick> archivist: Syil X5 Speedmaster (linear rails). Indicator on the table and full travel is a single measure on both X and Y axis.
[14:04:36] <Tugge> IS somebody familiar with pcb2gcode? I'm a noob what comes for linux and I don't fully understand how to use the software via terminal. Simple step by step would be great. The software is already installed.
[14:07:23] <archivist> FinboySlick, another thing you can get is a test bar to put in the spindle, mount an indicator on the table you can test runout and if the spindle is parallel to the z rails
[14:08:45] <FinboySlick> archivist: That's one I ought to keep in mind.
[14:09:08] <archivist> I remember..at that price you get them to fix it if you find any fault
[14:10:07] <tjb1> SOrry I bet Mcmaster has the bolt I want...
[14:10:10] <FinboySlick> archivist: I was too much of a noob to find out when I bought it (just assumed the error was me not being very good) and they're too far to do on-site service.
[14:10:39] <archivist> what error, it may be in spec
[14:11:06] <FinboySlick> archivist: As in me drilling holes and them not being exactly where I put 'em.
[14:11:41] <FinboySlick> It's very much a hobby machine for me so it really doesn't get a whole lot of use.
[14:12:07] <FinboySlick> It's sort of an outlet for my OCD ;) I'm more interested in tweaking it perfect than getting production out of it.
[14:13:08] <archivist> holes being in the wrong place could just be technique, drills wander if there is no pilot dimple
[14:13:22] <FinboySlick> archivist: Yes, that was my initial assumption.
[14:13:32] <archivist> how far out
[14:14:20] <FinboySlick> 0.003 on a #1 center drill. Appears to be exactly the same ammount each time.
[14:14:56] <archivist> their claim is 2 tenths for positional accuracy
[14:15:44] <FinboySlick> archivist: Well, I'm pretty sure it's spot on in relation to the centre drill.. Problem is my indicator is longer than the drill so it's not measured from the same Z axis.
[14:16:04] <FinboySlick> That's how I figured the Z axis is tilted.
[14:16:56] <FinboySlick> :s/the same Z axis/the same position on the Z axis/
[14:18:06] <archivist> mount an indicator in the spindle offset from its axis pointing at the table rotate , ;oser till you touch the table and set 0, then rotate, should remain at the same figure
[14:18:28] <archivist> lower till you touch
[14:18:43] <FinboySlick> archivist: Isn't that tramming?
[14:19:21] <archivist> yes
[14:19:35] <FinboySlick> I have significant error there.
[14:19:54] <FinboySlick> But that didn't tell me if it was just the spindle being tilted or the axis itself.
[14:20:18] <FinboySlick> So I also measured travel offset on both sides of a square (to make up for square error).
[14:20:33] <FinboySlick> That gives me ~0.0035 every 4 inches of Z travel.
[14:20:39] <archivist> go back a step
[14:21:31] <archivist> without rotating the spindle, move x and y see if the the table tapered
[14:22:07] <FinboySlick> archivist: That was the first test of all. This one is spot on both X and Y.
[14:23:07] <archivist> did you have to mount the column on the bed?
[14:23:15] <Jymmm\AE> FinboySlick: http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1v/R-202025674/h_d2/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10053&langId=-1&keyword=punch
[14:23:19] <FinboySlick> No, it came pre-assembled.
[14:24:34] <FinboySlick> Jymmm\AE: I think this is a bit past just the drillbit walking.
[14:24:58] <FinboySlick> Jymmm\AE: But good one regardless.
[14:25:21] <Jymmm\AE> FinboySlick: Same one at Enco is $25
[14:25:44] <Jymmm\AE> http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INPDFF?PMPAGE=663&PARTPG=INLMK3&PMITEM=505-0415
[14:25:56] <archivist> Jymmm\AE, unrelated to his problem
[14:26:16] <Jymmm\AE> k
[14:26:21] <skunkworks> https://mtxone.com/shop/matrixone7S.html
[14:26:47] <FinboySlick> archivist: I called the Keith (the salesperson) today. He didn't seem surprised with what I described... Though his initial answer to adjust for backlash in Mach3 made me scoff a bit.
[14:27:34] <FinboySlick> When I showed I had done at least some homework he told me more about how they adjust it in house... Apparently 'tweaking required' is part of the deal... Just not written anywhere.
[14:28:02] <jdh> do they provide direction for how to do so?
[14:28:26] <archivist> at that price I would expect tweaking to be done
[14:28:27] <FinboySlick> jdh: Loosen/tighten bolts, see if it helps. If not, shim.
[14:29:28] <FinboySlick> archivist: Me too. But the denial and disappointment phases are behind me now. I'm more focused on fixing it.
[14:29:47] <archivist> the fun part :)
[14:30:21] <archivist> do you have a lathe and a good micrometer
[14:30:32] <FinboySlick> archivist: I'm seeing it as an adventure. Though I hope I'm not too annoying with my insecurities. I'm really trying to soak up as much knowledge as possible even though it's no substitute for experience.
[14:31:06] <jdh> if it were perfect out of the box, you would not have this opportunity to gain experience!
[14:31:17] <FinboySlick> archivist: My Sherline mini-lathe is in a terrible state. I have a good micrometer in the 0-1" range.
[14:31:48] <archivist> FinboySlick, make a circular square, turn a 3" bar exactly parallem
[14:32:08] <archivist> exactly parallel with a concave end
[14:32:37] <archivist> that is your precision square
[14:34:13] <FinboySlick> archivist: Sit it on the table and measure up and down its side?
[14:34:17] <tjb1> What are you adjusting FinboySlick
[14:34:25] <archivist> FinboySlick, yup
[14:34:48] <FinboySlick> tjb1: 1- Z travel perpendicularity to the table and 2- tramming.
[14:34:49] <archivist> as it is round you also have front and rear
[14:34:56] <tjb1> On what machine?
[14:35:06] <FinboySlick> archivist: And I know it isn't conical by measuring both ends.
[14:35:38] <FinboySlick> tjb1: One that doesn't have such adjustments :P Syil SpeedMaster X5.
[14:36:13] <FinboySlick> archivist: Could I use tubing to save weight if I machine the side too?
[14:36:14] <archivist> concave on the ends and parallel is most important
[14:36:21] <tjb1> Cool looking little machine
[14:36:58] <archivist> tube may bend under the chuck holding pressure
[14:38:13] <sliptonic> JT-Shop: Time for a quick question?
[14:38:53] <sliptonic> I'm working from your 5i25/7i77 config and haven't done much to tweak it yet.
[14:39:06] <sliptonic> I've got limit switches and servo amps wired though.
[14:39:34] <sliptonic> When I go off e-stop and enable, the X axis move very quickly in the negative direction and then gets a following error.
[14:39:58] <sliptonic> I know what the following error is but I don't know why the axis is moving in the first place.
[14:40:04] <FinboySlick> archivist: Good point. One thing bothers me a bit tough... Since the column might be nodding forward/back (actually, I know it does), wouldn't that mess up my sideways measurement?
[14:41:09] <archivist> some flex is normal, that is yet another measurement
[14:41:21] <FinboySlick> archivist: I don't mean flex.
[14:42:02] <archivist> there should be no play if that is what you mean
[14:42:13] <archivist> adjust, fix
[14:42:24] <FinboySlick> archivist: Say my indicator is exactly at the tangent of the cylinder at Z1, it might be somewhere else around the perimeter at Z2.
[14:42:58] <FinboySlick> like at 89°
[14:43:45] <archivist> move xy so it is right in line
[14:43:51] <FinboySlick> This would exagerate the measure of the axis I'm trying to adjust because of misadjustment in the axis I'm not yet trying to adjust.
[14:44:27] <archivist> but learning to fix one error at a time is the right idea
[14:44:55] <archivist> hmm could be cake time
[14:45:03] <FinboySlick> archivist: Correct, which is why I think I'd be better off with a flat surface parallel to the axis I'm trying to adjust.
[14:47:16] <FinboySlick> archivist: If it's birthday cake, happy birthday ;)
[14:48:09] <archivist> no just a freebee from a neighbour
[14:53:56] <archivist> you can use a collimator with a mirror and prism too
[14:54:02] <mk0> is it enough ./configure --enable-run-in-place --enable-simulator and make to compile simulator? i get an error on linking rtlib/abs.so
[14:56:54] <tjb1> archivist: What do you think - http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc6/222003_4391654905506_288311715_n.jpg
[14:59:30] <archivist> is there another slide under the plate that the ball screw drives
[15:00:07] <tjb1> Those 2 holes in the plate are where the nut goes
[15:00:14] <micges> mk0: hi
[15:00:21] <tjb1> The nuts with no bolts in them
[15:00:33] <mk0> micges, Hi
[15:00:37] <micges> mk0: please use pastebin to show what error do you have
[15:01:01] <mk0> it's in russian ^(
[15:01:07] <mk0> :-\
[15:01:58] <mk0> 5 min i'll translate
[15:02:29] <tjb1> archivist: Those 2 linear slides are for the floating Z for plate touch off
[15:02:48] <FinboySlick> tjb1: I was going to ask about 'em.
[15:03:10] <FinboySlick> tjb1: How will they be actuated?
[15:03:19] <tjb1> They arent
[15:03:22] <tjb1> They float
[15:03:39] <tjb1> I might have a spring to ensure it always stay completely down but the torch weight should be enough
[15:04:47] <tjb1> There will be a microswitch somewhere down there that one of the slides will trip for the probing sequence.
[15:04:54] <andypugh> mk0: --run-in-place is default, and might even be a problem now.
[15:04:59] <andypugh> Try without it.
[15:05:45] <mk0> http://pastebin.com/jfGqMkwL config.log
[15:05:54] <mk0> i tried several times
[15:06:03] <mk0> then googled but nothing
[15:07:39] <micges> mk0: please paste console output
[15:07:53] <micges> few lines with error with it
[15:07:55] <mk0> in 1 minute
[15:14:34] <mk0> http://pastebin.com/DWKTJWLf
[15:16:45] <andypugh> Hmm, no idea.
[15:17:23] <andypugh> I wonder if it is a localisation error?
[15:18:27] <mk0> i don't think so. i'll try to reinstall ubuntu tomorrow to be sure
[15:21:24] <andypugh> x86.get_pc_thunk doesn't appear anywhere in my repository.
[15:21:50] <andypugh> I have one instance of i686.get_pc.thunk in Makefile.
[15:21:56] <micges_> mk0: is it 32 bit ubuntu?
[15:22:02] <andypugh> So it may be dynamically created or something.
[15:22:08] <mk0> yes, definitely
[15:22:18] <andypugh> Did you make clean?
[15:22:23] <mk0> yes
[15:22:28] <andypugh> Also, why Simulator?
[15:24:20] <mk0> it's 12.04 ubuntu, i installed on home machine.
[15:24:38] <mk0> maybe 12.04 does not suite
[15:25:46] <djdelorie> mk0: I was unable to build a plain simulator with 2.6 recently too, on Fedora
[15:26:21] <andypugh> You can get the 12.04 simulator from the Buildbot: http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org
[15:26:59] <mk0> yep, in manual i saw links only for hardy and lucid.
[15:28:32] <andypugh> deb http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org/ precise v2.4_branch-sim
[15:29:05] <mk0> why not master?
[15:29:41] <tjb1> Anyone have a Hypertherm Powermax 45 handy?
[15:31:22] <JT-Shop> sliptonic: you still around?
[15:34:14] <tjb1> JT-Shop: Did you see the picture of my floating Z?
[15:34:19] <JT-Shop> no
[15:35:04] <tjb1> http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc6/222003_4391654905506_288311715_n.jpg
[15:35:06] <tjb1> So far
[15:36:37] <sliptonic> JT-Shop: Yeah, I'm here.
[15:37:01] <JT-Shop> did you sort out your problem?
[15:37:09] <sliptonic> No, not yet.
[15:37:28] <JT-Shop> tjb1: looks kinda like mine
[15:37:50] <JT-Shop> sliptonic: is the drive just wandering off on it's own
[15:38:15] <sliptonic> Seems to be. I'm not commanding any movement.
[15:39:16] <JT-Shop> when you power up the drive is Linuxcnc in control of the drive?
[15:39:42] <sliptonic> Yes.
[15:39:56] <sliptonic> Does linuxcnc initialize with a commanded position of zero?
[15:40:35] <JT-Shop> sounds like something is crossed up like encoder feedback and velocity direction
[15:40:59] <JT-Shop> when you turn the axis by hand does the DRO read properly?
[15:41:31] <sliptonic> Let me check on that..
[15:42:11] <tjb1> JT-Shop: Im gonna make the plate tonight and probably EDM the torch clamp next week
[15:45:21] <sliptonic> It seems to be reversed. The encoder and the input to the amp are wired the same as Y which is working correctly.
[15:45:39] <gentoox_> i built rtai on ubuntu 12.04
[15:45:52] <gentoox_> with linux kernel
[15:46:05] <gentoox_> rtai-3.9
[15:46:32] <JT-Shop> sliptonic: reverse the sign of your scale on that axis and see if it goes the correct way
[15:47:24] <mk0> gentoox_, it means release with precompiled linuxcnc is possble on 12.04?
[15:47:27] <JT-Shop> I just made my clamp from some 6061
[15:47:56] <gentoox_> Yes not with a v3.0 kernel though
[15:48:25] <gentoox_> this is WillenCMD or Gabe_W im installing gentoo so i am on the live cd don't know how tho change my name on this text base irq program
[15:48:37] <lwizardl> hello\
[15:49:01] <mk0> "nick lalala"
[15:49:14] <lwizardl> I was wondering on a emc based cnc machine. if there would be any way to make clean cuts in heavy card stock
[15:50:26] <WillenCMD> alright
[15:50:32] <WillenCMD> thanks mk0
[15:51:00] <WillenCMD> rtai-3.9 is being a pain in the ass in gentoo
[15:52:18] <sliptonic> JT-Shop: That corrected the direction but not the movement.
[15:53:20] <WillenCMD> r00t you on here?
[15:59:30] <FinboySlick> WillenCMD: What kernel are you trying to patch?
[15:59:47] <WillenCMD> i don't know i tried with no luck
[16:00:01] <FinboySlick> Last I tried it was very picky.
[16:00:03] <WillenCMD> no im going to follow the emc instructions see if that works
[16:00:08] <WillenCMD> now*
[16:00:10] <FinboySlick> I don't think you'll go beyond .32
[16:00:55] <JT-Shop> sliptonic: can you jog the axis? does it go in the right direction when you do?
[16:01:24] <sliptonic> I can't jog. It starts moving as soon as I enable.
[16:01:50] <WillenCMD> what driver are you using?
[16:02:01] <sliptonic> It moves about 1/10th of an inch and then gets the following error. I haven't done anything to calibrate though.
[16:02:38] <WillenCMD> sliptonic: Stepper motors?
[16:02:54] <sliptonic> WillenCMD: Nope, servos.
[16:03:10] <WillenCMD> are you using lcnc to close the loop?
[16:03:20] <djdelorie> another servo fan! :-)
[16:03:25] <WillenCMD> or do you have drives?
[16:03:59] <sliptonic> This a retrofit of a Supermax mill. Servodynamics amps and motors.
[16:04:34] <WillenCMD> using step pulses to the drive?
[16:04:42] <WillenCMD> or pwm?
[16:05:04] <sliptonic> Mesa 5i25+7i77 analog servo driver.
[16:05:24] <WillenCMD> ahhh.. sorry if you answered these questions earlier
[16:05:56] <sliptonic> No sweat. I've used linuxcnc for stepper based systems before but this is my first go at a servo system.
[16:06:08] <WillenCMD> does Axis DRO show movement when you try to jog?
[16:07:13] <sliptonic> If I move manually, the DRO shows correct movement. As soon as I enable, it tries to move the X axis rapidly in the negative direction. It goes too fast and disables after getting a following error.
[16:07:37] <cradek> enable what?
[16:08:27] <WillenCMD> i would assume jog
[16:08:32] <cradek> don't assume
[16:08:35] <sliptonic> I start linuxcnc, disable e-stop, and toggle machine power. As soon as I toggle machine power, off she goes.
[16:08:36] <cradek> enable what, how?
[16:08:47] <WillenCMD> sounds like an encoder issue
[16:08:57] <cradek> you mean like press f2 in the gui? or some hardware enable?
[16:08:58] <djdelorie> or hal isn't resetting the "I'm here" encoder value
[16:09:04] <WillenCMD> I have had that happen when i had A and B crossed
[16:09:38] <PCW> Most likely you have feedback reversed
[16:09:46] <WillenCMD> that was where i was getting at
[16:09:49] <cradek> > If I move manually, the DRO shows correct movement.
[16:10:09] <cradek> maybe *command* reversed
[16:10:46] <cradek> or maybe pid isn't disabling when not axis.N.amp-enable-out
[16:10:56] <cradek> that's why I wonder what he is enabling/disabling exactly
[16:10:58] <WillenCMD> i would suggenst setting PID.0.maxvelocity to keep it from running away
[16:11:12] <cradek> it's clearly not under sane pid control so that won't help
[16:11:36] <cradek> (and there's no such setting)
[16:11:39] <PCW> did you verify that your drives work first?
[16:11:54] <WillenCMD> maxoutput
[16:11:56] <WillenCMD> my bad
[16:12:00] <WillenCMD> had to double check
[16:12:12] <sliptonic> PCW: verify how?
[16:12:16] <PCW> that is 0 input makes them just creep along an the fastest
[16:12:25] <PCW> at the fastest
[16:12:33] <andypugh> mk0: Just got back. There are builbot sims of the three main branches for recise.
[16:12:39] <andypugh> (Precise)
[16:13:57] <PCW> and that you can drive them slowly in each direction with a say 1.5V battery on the analog in
[16:13:58] <WillenCMD> how do i get cvs.gna.org/cvsweb..... hal-linux patch from cli?
[16:14:08] <mk0> andypugh, smth is wrong with installation. it does not want to install any of them. i'll download 12.04.1 again and install english
[16:14:36] <WillenCMD> mk0: do you want realtime or just the sim?
[16:14:49] <PCW> when you test with a battery note which direction it moves VS input polarity
[16:14:50] <andypugh> The buildbot isn't working, you mean?
[16:15:01] <sliptonic> PCW: I'm 95% certain they're o.k. but I'll verify now.
[16:15:05] <mk0> WillenCMD, no, just sim
[16:15:20] <mk0> andypugh, synaptic does not let install
[16:16:01] <mk0> and apt-get. they both say some dependencies are not met
[16:16:07] <WillenCMD> just download the source from the git repository and make install it
[16:16:21] <WillenCMD> i have always had good luck with that
[16:16:36] <mk0> nope, that was the initial problem :(
[16:16:46] <WillenCMD> what error are you getting?
[16:16:48] <djdelorie> WillenCMD: I can't build "just sim" from git either
[16:17:25] <andypugh> That's odd.
[16:17:36] <andypugh> I don't know enough to know what the problem might be.
[16:17:37] <WillenCMD> i have installed the source on Xubuntu 12.04, lubuntu 12.04 and plain Ubuntu 12.04
[16:17:50] <mk0> WillenCMD, i rebooted. the link to pastebin in log
[16:18:00] <djdelorie> it really, desperately, definitely, wants a realtime kernel with extensions, even just for the sim.
[16:18:19] <mk0> djdelorie, YES!
[16:18:47] <WillenCMD> Is there a reason you need ubuntu 12.04? do you need drivers offered from the v3.0 kernel?
[16:19:15] <WillenCMD> i can easily wip up an realtime install instruction
[16:19:18] <djdelorie> "just the sim" shouldn't need any drivers, kernel or otherwise...
[16:19:34] <PCW> once you know which direction they move for which polarity, connect up again but leave the motor disabled
[16:19:36] <PCW> now jog and the 7I77 analog output voltage polarity should be in the direction that would move the motor in the jog direction
[16:19:38] <PCW> if it does good but if it move in the other direction you will need to reverse the output polarity (there are a couple of ways to do this)
[16:19:44] <WillenCMD> i just installed it on ubuntu 12.04 minimal this week
[16:19:49] <mk0> WillenCMD, nope, just wanted to install new system on home PC
[16:20:09] <WillenCMD> try this
[16:20:29] <mk0> 12.04.1?
[16:20:39] <mk0> or first 12.04?
[16:20:57] <WillenCMD> it shouldn't matter
[16:21:25] <WillenCMD> are you on it right now?
[16:22:20] <mk0> nope, win8 :) i rebooted before sleep
[16:22:51] <WillenCMD> add http://www.linuxcnc.org/lucid lucid base to your /etc/apt/sources.list
[16:22:59] <DJ9DJ_> gn8
[16:23:42] <WillenCMD> run # echo deb http://www.linuxcnc.org/lucid lucid base >> /etc/apt/sources.list
[16:23:57] <WillenCMD> run # echo deb-src http://www.linuxcnc.org/lucid lucid base >> /etc/apt/sources.list
[16:24:10] <WillenCMD> then you need to get the key from the key server
[16:24:36] <mk0> doesn't it get automatically?
[16:24:39] <WillenCMD> no
[16:24:41] <mk0> the key i mean
[16:24:47] <mk0> oh, okay
[16:25:19] <WillenCMD> gpg --keyserver pgpkeys.mid.edu --recv-key 8F374FEF
[16:25:53] <WillenCMD> gpg -a --export 8F374FEF | sudo apt-key add -
[16:26:17] <WillenCMD> then just sudo apt-get update
[16:26:23] <WillenCMD> and open synaptics
[16:26:28] <WillenCMD> or use cli
[16:26:47] <mk0> luscid base in precise, right?
[16:27:06] <WillenCMD> yes i know its not exactly made for it, but it works
[16:27:11] <mk0> deb line. install linuxcnc-sim?
[16:27:28] <djdelorie> all that doesn't help me on Fedora, though...
[16:27:45] <mk0> oh, man! why did you say it!
[16:27:47] <mk0> ))
[16:28:18] <djdelorie> after all, it's linuxcnc, not ubuntucnc ;-)
[16:28:31] <WillenCMD> im with you djdelorie
[16:28:57] <mk0> i'd get angrey if not jack
[16:28:58] <WillenCMD> i sent the #ubuntu a nice message yesterday told them i was breaking up with them
[16:29:02] <alex4nder> building the software from scratch isn't that hard
[16:29:05] <mk0> jack daniels!
[16:29:22] <djdelorie> alex4nder: only when it works...
[16:29:24] <WillenCMD> alex4nder: it is if your new to linux in general
[16:29:38] <alex4nder> djdelorie: obvious statements are obvious
[16:29:44] <alex4nder> but it took me no time at all
[16:29:56] <WillenCMD> its weird to think i have gone back in time and actually prefer cli now
[16:30:01] <alex4nder> WillenCMD: if you're new to Linux, you shouldn't be worried about which distribution you're using.
[16:30:20] <lwizardl> anyone know if an EMC based cnc machine can be used to cut cardboard boxes ? and be able to produce smooth edges on the cuts?
[16:30:21] <djdelorie> in my case, the build failed for various reasons, some stupid (NULL undefined?) and some subtle (dependencies on RTAI for "just the simulator")
[16:30:24] <WillenCMD> im not, any more very familiar with it now but when i started i was new
[16:30:46] <WillenCMD> lwizardl: i wouldn't see why not
[16:30:50] <djdelorie> lwizardl: that's up to the machine, not the software. Also, "emc" is now called "linuxcnc" instead
[16:31:08] <WillenCMD> or "LCNC"
[16:31:15] <mk0> lwizardl, i think the question is in hith rpm
[16:31:19] <mk0> high
[16:31:21] <lwizardl> djdelorie, okay thanks for the update on that
[16:31:27] <mk0> sbout 20000 per min
[16:31:28] <djdelorie> or choosing a knife or laser based solution
[16:32:16] <WillenCMD> a 2 flute endmill should suffice keep the feeds up, don't let it rub
[16:32:33] <WillenCMD> you'll see smoke if you do
[16:32:36] <lwizardl> well I just bought the book for building a CNC machine. so I'm completely new to the process.
[16:32:59] <djdelorie> do you *only* want to cut cardboard?
[16:33:16] <lwizardl> this book http://www.amazon.com/Build-Your-Machine-Technology-Action/dp/1430224894
[16:34:02] <lwizardl> djdelorie, no I want to do other stuff also. but I would like to be able to create boxes to store stuff in, like Arcade PCB game boards etc
[16:34:37] <djdelorie> I built my own without a book: http://www.delorie.com/photos/cnc/
[16:34:56] <WillenCMD> nothing wrong with research though :)
[16:35:02] <djdelorie> it has interchangable heads so I can change cutter types, I probably could put a knife/laser on it if I had such things...
[16:35:04] <WillenCMD> it pays off in the long run
[16:35:26] <djdelorie> sure. In my case, I had a friend over who had already gone through the process :-)
[16:35:32] <WillenCMD> i read about everything, hell i don't by a toothbrush without reading the reviews
[16:36:05] <mk0> oh, that's not interesting )
[16:36:20] * djdelorie makes a note to try cutting cardboard with the 56,000 RPM spindle...
[16:36:47] <lwizardl> djdelorie, yeah that cnc machine so far (from the pictures) looks nice. how much room does that take up ?
[16:37:05] <djdelorie> it's about 3ft by 3.5ft
[16:37:06] <sliptonic> PCW: That got it. For some reason, X axis needs polarity reversed relative to the other two axis. It moves!!
[16:37:31] <lwizardl> djdelorie, how much it cost you to build it?
[16:37:51] <djdelorie> sliptonic: I went through that on my cnc machine, ended up drawing the axes and origin right on the cnc table so I could keep track of what it was supposed to be doing
[16:38:06] <djdelorie> lwizardl: hard to say, it was mostly built from scrap and surplus we already had
[16:38:15] <JT-Shop> sliptonic: yea
[16:38:20] <WillenCMD> djdelorie: i would say your above the "average" person building a cnc
[16:38:37] <djdelorie> perhaps for the electronics and software, but not for the machine itself :-)
[16:38:50] <WillenCMD> afterall you did build your own servo drives, and write the code. I would imagine thats not in his book
[16:39:19] <lwizardl> yeah i bet not
[16:40:03] <lwizardl> but the book guy does have a website about it http://buildyourcnc.com/
[16:40:07] <WillenCMD> pricing is has a huge spectrum and its all very relevant to what you wnat to achieve
[16:40:14] <WillenCMD> want*
[16:40:15] <djdelorie> sure, the servo drives are good to 0.00...001 inches, but the plywood still moves by a visible amount!
[16:40:29] <djdelorie> WillenCMD: speaking of that, I still owe you source code for the drives
[16:40:41] <WillenCMD> no i got it...
[16:40:43] <djdelorie> I eventually rewrote the core control loops, they work very nicely now
[16:40:45] <WillenCMD> unless you have updated it
[16:41:12] <WillenCMD> im actually using it right now i built a stepper drive that runs on rectified ac mains
[16:41:13] <djdelorie> I updated it. Full park/clark PID loops with all the trimmiings now.
[16:41:53] <djdelorie> the drives are pretty much dead silent and low current until you try to move them, then they lock up solid :-)
[16:41:54] <WillenCMD> its going to be closed loop
[16:42:34] <WillenCMD> its one of my many projects... i tend to bounce around with them as i get bored
[16:42:57] <WillenCMD> im addicted to writing programs right now, so its all i want to do lately
[16:43:34] <djdelorie> I should make more boards, send you one, and let you write my software then :-)
[16:44:12] <WillenCMD> lol, i'll take a few boards. Do you still have the cad for the boards?
[16:44:18] <djdelorie> I do
[16:44:30] <djdelorie> I was thinking of adding a +-10 VDC analog input, too, though.
[16:44:31] <WillenCMD> hmm i wonder how much a batch of say 50 would cost
[16:44:40] <djdelorie> just boards, or populated?
[16:44:54] <WillenCMD> you can buy them populated?
[16:45:13] <djdelorie> no, but you have to figure the cost of parts
[16:45:23] <WillenCMD> oh just the boards
[16:45:41] <WillenCMD> i would be willing to put some money in if your thinking about buying some
[16:46:02] <djdelorie> it's 3.1 by 4.8 inches, currently two layer but I should redo it as four - had problems with EMI
[16:46:14] <WillenCMD> i remember you saying that
[16:46:40] <WillenCMD> i also think your microcontroller is a bit pricey
[16:47:02] <djdelorie> $6 ?
[16:47:07] <WillenCMD> oh
[16:47:13] <WillenCMD> lol i thought it was $90
[16:47:16] <djdelorie> it's the inverter that's pricey
[16:47:27] <djdelorie> that sounds more like a per-board BOM cost
[16:47:40] <WillenCMD> the inverter is $20.00 bucks
[16:47:43] <WillenCMD> that not bad
[16:48:27] <djdelorie> I think I figured $100 per board "actual cost" with a $200-$300 equivalent retail cost
[16:48:39] <andypugh> 50 boards is likely to be $160 for 4" x 6". Less if smaller, more if bigger.
[16:48:42] <WillenCMD> andy sent me some arduino code, i used on the fiarchild inverter first. pretty cool
[16:49:04] <andypugh> (bare boards, from that China)
[16:49:05] <djdelorie> I let the magic smoke out of one of those inverter chips and it *kept working* afterwards.
[16:49:24] <WillenCMD> thats the break in smoke
[16:49:41] <WillenCMD> now its running smoothly
[16:50:45] <WillenCMD> i used to laugh at how cheap the "electronic hobbiest where" untill i got into it. I thought $10.00 bucks for a mosfet thats cheap... well when you burn 6 up in a afternoon it hit me pretty fast
[16:51:30] <WillenCMD> not to mention there is only one local place that has a decent selection otherwise i have to wait 3 days for newark or digikey
[16:54:06] * djdelorie doesn't even have a "local place"
[16:54:37] <WillenCMD> the one here is only open untill 5 and 45mins away from where i live. closed on sundays
[16:55:08] <WillenCMD> but man do they have a ton of stuff i mean wall to wall buttons,old scopes, motors, batteries i mean it looks like a junk store
[16:55:53] <WillenCMD> they keep the expensive components behind the counter though
[16:55:59] <WillenCMD> i wonder why....
[16:58:41] <WillenCMD> im having a hard time getting a cvs checkout of the hal-linux patch from gna.org
[17:00:50] <WillenCMD> never mind
[17:00:51] <WillenCMD> got it
[17:02:05] <WillenCMD> i have always wanted to hack in to something... like in the movies typing non stop never using a mouse
[17:02:17] <WillenCMD> someday...
[17:04:37] <andypugh> I _can_ get to RS or Rapid if I need to. (Rapid even open Sundays). But both are 40 miles.
[17:04:53] <WillenCMD> 2 places
[17:04:54] <WillenCMD> damn
[17:05:13] <WillenCMD> i went to radioshack and wow what a let down
[17:05:33] <lwizardl> hehe ratshack
[17:05:46] <lwizardl> or CellularShack now
[17:06:01] <WillenCMD> true... pretty soon there will only be one drawer of components
[17:06:10] <WillenCMD> i love when they ask if i need help
[17:06:55] <WillenCMD> sure could you help me select the right filter capacitor...
[17:07:06] <lwizardl> yeah my local one they have 1 guy there (about 50 years old and worked there for last 20+ years). I walk in ask if Ivan is there, if not I say nope and I walk back out
[17:07:38] <andypugh> Oh, I forgot Maplin, that's a couple of miles away. Not the same as the RS or Rapid counters, but they sell basic stuff.
[17:07:43] <lwizardl> the other 5 people there are cellphone one people
[17:08:31] <andypugh> http://www.maplin.co.uk/components
[17:09:22] <andypugh> They tend to only have one of most components though...
[17:11:05] <WillenCMD> one of each? that wouldn't work for me
[17:11:24] <WillenCMD> i have a 60% scrap rate
[17:11:27] <WillenCMD> lol
[17:12:13] <WillenCMD> things have inproved though since i bought i really nice soldering pencil... instead of that bulky weller gun my dad let me borrow
[17:12:34] <WillenCMD> my wrist would be dead after holding that damn thing for on pcb board
[17:34:19] <r00t4rd3d> http://new.weavesilk.com/
[18:07:29] <r00t4rd3d> http://i.imgur.com/rdfDr.png
[18:07:34] <r00t4rd3d> fking canadians
[18:26:08] <FinboySlick> r00t4rd3d: Worship the culd of Zamboni.
[18:26:14] <FinboySlick> cult
[18:53:49] <r00t4rd3d> http://news.cnet.com/8301-11386_3-57524063-76/report-3d-printed-handgun-project-faces-setback-with-revoked-printer-lease/
[19:08:29] <WillenCMD> has anyone built rtai for gentoo lately?
[19:10:03] <r00t4rd3d> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?EmcOnGentoo
[19:10:44] <tjb1> Almost finished Z
[19:10:44] <tjb1> http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/580257_4393785638773_1073429308_n.jpg
[19:11:05] <WillenCMD> i already tried that
[19:11:21] <WillenCMD> i was hoping you would be on root, i knew you used gentoo
[19:11:52] <r00t4rd3d> nah
[19:11:55] <r00t4rd3d> not in years
[19:12:01] <WillenCMD> the patches get error 404 not found when i ran
[19:12:07] <r00t4rd3d> and at the time i only "played" with it
[19:12:24] <WillenCMD> when i do ebuild manifest
[19:13:39] <r00t4rd3d> the link has probably changed
[19:13:48] <r00t4rd3d> to a different kernel
[19:15:17] <r00t4rd3d> http://cvs.gna.org/cvsweb/magma/base/arch/x86/patches/?cvsroot=rtai
[19:15:51] <WillenCMD> i downloaded the patches
[19:16:46] <WillenCMD> i guess ill try and build it my self
[19:16:58] <r00t4rd3d> well if you get 404 then your path is not correct or mis-spelled
[19:17:35] <WillenCMD> its attempting to download them from www.kernel.org
[19:18:05] <WillenCMD> patch-
[19:18:14] <r00t4rd3d> http://cvs.gna.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/magma/base/arch/x86/patches/hal-linux-;content-type=text%2Fx-diff;cvsroot=rtai
[19:18:54] <r00t4rd3d> is the one from the guide i believe
[19:19:38] <WillenCMD> i have that one
[19:21:37] <r00t4rd3d> seems like the guide is maybe wrong
[19:21:48] <r00t4rd3d> Next, download RTAI kernel patches from RTAI CVS [1], and save it under /usr/local/portage/sys-kernel/rtai-sources/files
[19:21:56] <r00t4rd3d> ebuild /usr/local/portage/sys-kernel/rtai-sources/rtai-sources- manifest
[19:22:03] <r00t4rd3d> its not the same path
[19:22:49] <WillenCMD> ah i see
[19:23:04] <r00t4rd3d> the whole /file thing
[19:23:13] <WillenCMD> ill cp it too the rta-sources dir
[19:24:15] <r00t4rd3d> that will probably resolve the 404
[19:25:14] <r00t4rd3d> im not sure how ebuild works though to be honest
[19:25:19] <r00t4rd3d> or where it looks for stuff
[19:26:08] <WillenCMD> the 404 errors are from teh http request
[19:26:12] <tjb1> Anyone explain why people put the bearings at an angle like this? - http://www.cnczone.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=39680&amp;d=1182868580
[19:26:20] <WillenCMD> moving the patch did not resolve it
[19:26:26] <WillenCMD> i'll just attempt to build it my self
[19:26:31] <r00t4rd3d> whats the http link?
[19:27:10] <WillenCMD> i cant paste into this stupid irq program
[19:27:23] <WillenCMD> irc*
[19:27:26] <r00t4rd3d> ctrl c , ctrl v
[19:27:42] <WillenCMD> lol come on man i diserve more credit then that
[19:27:47] <r00t4rd3d> :D
[19:27:54] <r00t4rd3d> right click, mark ?
[19:27:55] <WillenCMD> i tried ctrl+shift+v
[19:27:57] <JT-Shop> ctrl v works for me
[19:28:00] <WillenCMD> no right click
[19:28:05] <WillenCMD> im on the live cd
[19:28:12] <WillenCMD> its irssi
[19:28:47] <r00t4rd3d> yuck
[19:29:08] <WillenCMD> to hell with this i'll try and build it if it doesn't work i'll come back
[19:29:30] <r00t4rd3d> hope you got time
[19:29:34] <WillenCMD> i don't need linuxcnc anyway, i redid the make file, it only installs hal and its components
[19:29:38] <r00t4rd3d> more so with a live cd
[19:29:47] <WillenCMD> i already have all the steps done
[19:29:48] <andypugh> tjb1: They do it that way because other ways don't work as well.
[19:30:07] <WillenCMD> just trying to install rtai
[19:30:12] <andypugh> Does anyone know if locale.h exists on a liveCD install?
[19:30:24] <tjb1> andypugh: So putting two of them directly on top is worse? It would seem that with them at an angle like that they would always try to deflect out
[19:30:26] <WillenCMD> on the ubuntu?
[19:30:39] <andypugh> Ah, you mean the stagger?
[19:30:48] <andypugh> WillenCMD: Yes
[19:30:59] <JT-Shop> name that tune http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&feature=endscreen&v=LgsDWb0orSQ
[19:31:00] <r00t4rd3d> keeps the saw dust out from under the bearings too
[19:31:10] <andypugh> They stagger them so the nuts miss each other :-)
[19:31:17] <r00t4rd3d> which you will learn is a pain with cncrp carriages
[19:31:46] <tjb1> andypugh: No I mean how they are on the side of the pipe, those are the bearings holding the gantry up so the bearings arent directly supporting the weight
[19:32:21] <r00t4rd3d> its like a roller coaster
[19:32:46] <tjb1> Roller coasters I have been on have 3 bearings, top-bottom-side
[19:32:48] <tjb1> :)
[19:33:00] <r00t4rd3d> old school coaster
[19:33:02] <JT-Shop> is that lathe made from a stack of engine blocks?
[19:33:15] <tjb1> Ah nevermind…I figured it out
[19:33:20] <tjb1> Prevents lift...
[19:43:01] <WillenCMD> alright root got past it
[19:51:20] <WillenCMD> can anyone update the wiki?
[19:52:39] <WillenCMD> can anyone update the wiki?
[19:52:46] <WillenCMD> sorry for the double post
[19:52:51] <WillenCMD> sorry for the double post
[19:58:58] <Jymmm\AE> archivist: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mpkTHyfr0pM
[20:02:07] <Tom_itx> i wonder if i can set my lathe up to cut 3 tpi
[20:04:39] <WillenCMD> got it working!
[20:05:13] <WillenCMD> the wiki needs to be updated
[20:05:18] <WillenCMD> for the emcongentoo
[20:05:30] <WillenCMD> some of the patches don't exist in the manifest locations
[20:09:17] <Jymmm\AE> cradek: you might enjoy this too... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s1i-dnAH9Y4&feature=related ( archivist, this link is all parts)
[20:10:44] <WillenCMD> alright here goes nothing, i edited the linuxcnc makefile to only install hal and its components
[20:18:37] <tjb1> Hey JT-Shop can yours do this? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DoHJ_rVxjhw&feature=related
[20:26:04] <r00t4rd3d> nah, his just gets drunk and ends up on the front lawn, naked.
[20:26:22] <r00t4rd3d> oh wait, wrong video.
[20:28:11] <r00t4rd3d> WillenCMD, whats happening?
[20:28:28] <r00t4rd3d> do you see any smoke yet?
[20:32:18] <WillenCMD> well i got the rtai working
[20:32:29] <WillenCMD> now im going to update to rtai-3.9
[20:32:34] <WillenCMD> then install hal
[20:46:30] <Tom_itx> anyone familiar with the old sears atlas lathe?
[20:52:37] <tjb1> Im thinking I need to reverse my Z axis...
[20:53:53] <tjb1> Someone care to give input on this idea
[20:54:39] <tjb1> Current z-axis - http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/580257_4393785638773_1073429308_n.jpg and the current frame - http://a5.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/242348_4373987783839_52552144_o.jpg
[20:58:03] <Tom_itx> you mean reverse the direction?
[20:58:36] <tjb1> I mean put remove the plate holding the two linear rails
[20:58:53] <tjb1> and bolt the plate to the carriages instead of the extrusion to the carriages
[20:58:59] <tjb1> So the motor and everything move up and down
[20:59:11] <Tom_itx> why?
[20:59:44] <tjb1> To get the travel I need, I have to make these long aluminum plates…like the one the linear rails are on
[21:00:08] <tjb1> and currently if I switch to router, I will have to move the whole z axis assembly up or down
[21:01:02] <tjb1> The long down plate isnt a problem with plasma but with router I am having doubts that a piece of 4x1/2" aluminum will be strong enough
[21:01:22] <tjb1> Do you follow?
[21:01:32] <Tom_itx> not entirely
[21:01:48] <tjb1> let me take two pictures here and it should explain it
[21:03:35] <tjb1> http://www.facebook.com/images/spacer.gif
[21:03:41] <tjb1> Sorry not that link
[21:03:44] <tjb1> http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/320464_4394173648473_1602412952_n.jpg
[21:05:09] <tjb1> Mount that side to the carriages instead of the back extrusion and then mount the router/torch like this - http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc7/420447_4394172608447_148698795_n.jpg
[21:07:19] <tjb1> Do you follow now Tom_itx ?
[21:09:16] <tjb1> I would lose about 1.5" of Z clearance but it should be much strong as far as mounting the router goes
[21:11:42] <Tom_itx> hmm
[21:12:00] <Tom_itx> i'm not sure it would be more rigid either way
[21:12:14] <Jymmm\AE> WOOHOO! Got the Fire Control Computer video!!
[21:12:16] <tjb1> What it boils down to, I dont have to make drop plates to get past the acme screw support and everything
[21:12:29] <tjb1> plus all the travel I want/need
[21:12:39] <Tom_itx> moving the motor will fatigue the wires sooner
[21:12:45] <Tom_itx> are you gonna put them in a cradle?
[21:12:45] <tjb1> If I flip it, all the tools ride on the extrusion which is going to be stronger than any drop plate I make
[21:12:53] <tjb1> I have energy chain
[21:13:05] <Tom_itx> guess it's your call then
[21:13:16] <Tom_itx> i'd probably make the plate spacers myself
[21:13:33] <tjb1> Whys that?
[21:14:47] <Tom_itx> you'd be moving more mass for one thing
[21:15:11] <Tom_itx> if you flipped it
[21:15:14] <tjb1> The current way I am mounting it, I already have to drop the z assembly at least 1-2" for the floating Z to work. If I mount it like it currently is, the absolute bottom travel I can get is with everything extended
[21:15:23] <tjb1> The screw is a 1/2-10 single start
[21:15:40] <Tom_itx> i'm not sure
[21:16:10] <tjb1> Well I sure am glad the floating z plate holes match up to the extrusion :D at least I wont have to redo that
[21:16:36] <tjb1> Just really have to drill 6 holes to test this and get bolts
[21:17:39] <tjb1> My mounting plate is going to look like swiss cheese
[21:19:07] <toastyde1th> fixture plates usually wind up that way, yeah
[21:27:13] <FinboySlick> Holy expletive and curseword!
[21:27:25] <FinboySlick> My mill is a crummy design.
[21:30:33] <tjb1> Its always crummy when you find something better
[21:31:54] <FinboySlick> Ended up shimming about 0.012" under the Z axis to get it perpendicular in the X direction. An extra 0.007" to get it perpendicular in the Y direction. I'm all proud of myself, ~0.00025 deviation on both sides of the square...
[21:32:03] <FinboySlick> Then I check for tramming of the head.
[21:32:17] <FinboySlick> Zero adjustment in the X direction.
[21:32:30] <FinboySlick> None, zip. The thing is pinned and can't rotate.
[21:32:53] <tjb1> remove pin, problem solved
[21:32:59] <FinboySlick> The spindle is in a cast iron sleeve that's way too tight for adjustments.
[21:33:37] <FinboySlick> tjb1: That's for another day, yes.
[21:34:00] <FinboySlick> But I'm still pretty darn disappointed.
[21:43:58] <lwizardl> djdelorie, still around
[21:44:13] <djdelorie> yes you are
[21:45:23] <lwizardl> was it you that said you was making a note to test your machine on cardboard ?
[21:45:47] <djdelorie> not any time soon though ;-)
[21:46:07] <lwizardl> yeah I figured that, just was making notes on who it was to ask later
[21:46:28] <djdelorie> very much later, the way my schedule works...
[21:46:54] <lwizardl> thats cool it will be around tax refund time before I could work on building my machine
[21:47:06] <lwizardl> til then its just research
[22:05:49] <r00t4rd3d> learn cad/cam in the meantime
[22:13:44] <tjb1> Seriously what the f…cant stream 360p on college internet
[22:22:18] <lwizardl> r00t4rd3d, yeah trying to learn blender currently. I have about 300 video tutorials to watch and try
[22:23:56] <r00t4rd3d> why blender?
[22:35:13] <FinboySlick> The blender game engine is quite a bit of fun to play with.
[22:35:50] <mutilator> so..... i'm in the market for a home mill, like 2k budget, any recommendations?
[22:36:19] <Tom_itx> what do you want to cut with it?
[22:36:31] <mutilator> wood and plastics
[22:36:35] <mutilator> maybe aluminum
[22:40:04] <FinboySlick> mutilator: From another beginner: Aluminium is not a very good material to start milling on ;)
[22:41:57] <mutilator> yea i dont have any plans but maybe
[22:42:28] <jdh> big mill, little mill, router type of thing, new, used, homebuilt
[22:43:18] <mutilator> i figured a 2k budget would kind of guide the size/quality
[22:43:58] <mutilator> http://probotix.com/FireBall_v90_cnc_router_kit/
[22:44:00] <FinboySlick> mutilator: If you go cheap chinese: make sure you can adjust it!
[22:44:01] <mutilator> like this was recommended
[22:44:25] <mutilator> but the guy who recommended it had never used it, it was just his 'choice' after looking
[22:46:46] <r00t4rd3d> http://www.microcarve.com/mcMV1.html
[22:48:09] <FinboySlick> r00t4rd3d: That's a cute little thing.
[22:49:25] <r00t4rd3d> i got the plans for a simular design
[22:50:37] <r00t4rd3d> http://www.cnczone.com/forums/diy-cnc_router_table_machines/134221-microcarve_mv2_plans_files.html
[22:50:54] <r00t4rd3d> that could be made very easy
[23:08:55] <BHSPiMonkey> if I had a 2k budget, I'd blow it on a 3d printer instead :D
[23:09:14] <FinboySlick> BHSPiMonkey: But with a mill you can make one.
[23:09:36] <r00t4rd3d> i could build a 4'x8' cnc router for 2k
[23:09:45] <r00t4rd3d> and have change
[23:09:46] <jdh> I have less than $2k in my G0704
[23:09:56] <jdh> everything new
[23:13:18] <tjb1> Including the G0704? :D
[23:13:46] <jdh> yep
[23:14:01] <jdh> and ballscrews
[23:18:12] <tjb1> Wonder how the BP clone is
[23:18:19] <tjb1> http://www.grizzly.com/products/9-x-42-Vertical-Mill-w-Power-Feed/G9901