Back
[00:26:05] <Jymmm> I love these things, it's for everything you wouldn't use a pair of scissors on
http://www.toolup.com/wiss_v10_10-14-duckbill-combination-pattern-snips.aspx
[00:26:39] <Jymmm> they look weird, but cut like crazy
[00:27:47] <Jymmm> the ones I have are much older though, might be different now.
[00:29:31] <Jymmm> mine say 'drop forged' on the handles
[01:06:02] <alex4nder> so what's up with the bug I logged not getting any feedback?
[01:06:07] <alex4nder> even when I submitted a patch
[01:06:51] <alex4nder> this is some non-sense.
[01:07:46] <Jymmm> life beyond emc? Venus?
[01:09:16] <alex4nder> I don't believe.
[01:16:49] <Thetawaves> anybody here built a circuit with rs485?
[02:11:14] <DJ9DJ> moin
[02:20:51] <DJ9DJ> moin
[02:26:34] <mrsun> didnt take much force at all to move the lathe bed ... i thought it would be tougher then that ... but didnt even feel it in the wrench =)
[03:05:29] <Loetmichel> mornin#
[03:05:32] <Loetmichel> '
[03:08:48] <Jymmm> g
[03:12:57] <Jymmm> Somebody fax me some teflon wire
[03:13:52] <Loetmichel> hrhr, how a bit sorting and some boxes/shelves can change a room... ->
http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=13290 ... yesterday mornin that was a pile of messy cardboxes with NO system in it ;-)
[03:14:12] <Valen> looks spensive
[03:14:20] <Jymmm> I go ya beat =)
[03:14:34] <Valen> jamie of mythbusters has everybody beat
[03:14:47] <Jymmm> no, I got him beat too
[03:15:08] <Loetmichel> Valen: such a plastc box costs 2.99 Eur
[03:16:18] <Loetmichel> not expensive, just the 2 ppl 1 day soring is expensive. i hope the co-workers are now respecting that and will sort the incoming package material in the according boxes
[03:16:32] <Loetmichel> and not just drop it somewhere
[03:16:49] <Loetmichel> s/soring/sorting
[03:17:07] <Jymmm> Loetmichel:
http://i53.tinypic.com/212wxtt.jpg
[03:17:29] <Jymmm> It's on a rolling rack =)
[03:18:37] <Loetmichel> hrhr
[03:19:08] <Loetmichel> the "delivery corner" is in the company i work for, not at hom
[03:19:11] <Loetmichel> e
[03:19:14] <Jymmm> I have 4 more of those chrome racks too.
[03:19:26] <Loetmichel> THERE is a lot of sorting still to do...
[03:19:29] <Loetmichel> <- messie
[03:19:54] <Jymmm> I could never find shit, that's why I did that. Each box is labeld with it's contents.
[03:20:25] <Jymmm> the other 4 racks have the jamie sized containers on them
[03:23:56] <Loetmichel> i am cleaning up at home... the last 3 weeks. 'til now i have discarded about 2 cubic meteres of trash... and sorted most of my tools... the room doesent look any less messy :-(
[03:24:19] <Loetmichel> ... and why the hell hso i have about 10 PCB side cutters?
[03:24:22] <Loetmichel> ;-)
[03:24:34] <Loetmichel> s/hso/do
[03:25:15] <Jymmm> you need yourself soem of these =)
http://i29.tinypic.com/17daon.jpg
[03:25:49] <Jymmm> aka, toolbox #2 =)
[03:26:32] <Loetmichel> i am a cheapskate, i solve that different:
http://www.cyrom.org/palbum/main.php?g2_itemId=12727
[03:27:06] <Jymmm> and THATS why it still looks messy =)
[03:27:28] <Loetmichel> company had some spare PC PSU boxes... so i made a shelf for them
[03:27:31] <Jymmm> Besides, that was FREE! Gotta love craigslist =)
[03:27:52] <Loetmichel> hrhr
[03:28:04] <Jymmm> I did give them some nice cookies though
[03:28:12] <Jymmm> as a thank you
[03:28:34] <Jymmm> ppl give away good stuff
[03:28:37] <Loetmichel> i simply havent got enouth storage to sort away all my stuff.
[03:28:48] <Loetmichel> shoud do more discarding .
[03:29:17] <Jymmm> the trick is to have a place to put it all
[03:29:38] <Jymmm> like that 6 draw cabinet, the chrome racks, etc
[03:30:24] <Jymmm> when I move, I'm just gonna shrink wrap the whoel rack and roll it on the moving truck.
[03:31:03] <Jymmm> no packing, no boxing, no stacking.
[03:48:40] * Tom_itx wonders if Jymmm eve sleeps
[03:48:57] <Tom_itx> ever*
[03:54:46] <Jymmm> Tom_itx: When I'm dead
[03:55:05] <Tom_itx> that's my philosophy
[03:55:59] <Jymmm> In the meantime, I'll just keep working on this heating element =)
[03:57:51] <Jymmm> finally found some springs that'll work, but had to cut them in half
[03:58:54] <Jymmm> when I get done, should be good for around 1000F of spot heat
[03:59:12] <Valen> i dont know why, but i read that as a heating *helmet*
[03:59:33] <Jymmm> Well, it sorta kind looks like a helmet =)
[03:59:38] <Tom_itx> blame it on venus
[04:00:04] <Jymmm> the shield that is
[05:15:11] <jd896> Is pcw in?
[05:15:50] <Valen> he's probably asleep
[05:16:19] <jd896> Course what time z is he in
[05:16:55] <Valen> america somewhere i think
[05:20:52] <jd896> Yeah it's 6.10 in florida
[05:20:55] <jthornton-2> it's 3am at pcw's house
[05:21:20] <jd896> Where is he from then or have I guessed wrong
[05:22:01] <jthornton-2> left coast
[05:22:43] <jd896> J Thornton is that big John t ?
[05:22:49] <jthornton> aye
[05:23:32] <jd896> How do from the uk mate
[05:24:17] <jthornton> just opening my eyes for a new day
[05:24:23] <jthornton> 5am here
[05:26:24] <jd896> Morning in that case
[05:35:30] <jd896> John what are we looking for when adding I in the pid pcw told me to do p ff1 I d I have done the p and ff1 it following down during cruse
[05:36:17] <jd896> I mean the following is good during cruse but how will I effect the scope reading
[05:37:30] <jthornton> I'm not that sharp on it and had to do my CHNC by trial and error... add a little watch the trace
[05:37:38] <jthornton> how close are you now?
[05:39:06] <jd896> 0.08 is perhaps the largest spike
[05:39:12] <jthornton> I mainly focused on the accel and decel part and the cruse seemed to take care of it self for me
[05:39:21] <jthornton> mm?
[05:39:29] <jd896> Yes
[05:39:55] <jthornton> iirc a plasma?
[05:40:03] <jthornton> that's pretty close
[05:40:04] <jd896> Yeah
[05:41:35] <jthornton> I've been trying to follow along on the forum as I have a tuning job coming up when I pull the plug on my Anilam control on the old BP knee mill here soon
[05:53:32] <jthornton> wow only one spammer tried to register last night
[05:57:01] <jd896> Register to the forum
[05:57:16] <jthornton> yea
[05:57:33] <jthornton> at one point there was 50-60 a day
[05:57:59] <jthornton> 98% using gmail accounts
[05:58:18] <jd896> Wow there spam bots I imagin not individuals
[05:58:57] <jthornton> it's hard to say how they get past the captia thingy
[05:59:35] <jd896> Yeah thatsc
[06:00:07] <jd896> That's what there there for to stop the bots
[06:00:38] <jd896> Ai must be on the up
[06:01:50] <jthornton> most of them come from Russia, China, and India
[06:02:51] <jthornton> I get the IP of everyone that registers and compare that to what country they put on the form if the name sounds anything legit
[06:04:19] <jd896> At 50 to 60 a day that's a whole morning job there mate
[06:06:26] <archivist> isnt .08 close enough for plasma?
[06:06:58] <archivist> considering iirc you mentioned some backlash
[06:07:33] <jthornton> yea, that was a pain but most of them used names that gave them away easy to delete and ban the IP
[06:08:03] <jd896> Ah the backlash is on the other axis that's still away off yet I'm not sure of the accuracy that these are ment to hold
[06:08:48] <archivist> I dont know the accuracy of plasma cuts anyway
[06:09:07] <Valen> they have a taper too
[06:09:28] <Valen> it depends on alot of stuff how accurate you can make a plasma cut
[06:09:59] <jd896> If the torch is at the right hight and speed then the edge can rival a flame cut
[06:10:17] <jthornton> the main thing I pushed for on my plasma was acceleration so I could keep the speed up when rounding a corner
[06:12:35] <Valen> thats what seem to be underestimated most with CnC
[06:12:51] <Valen> everybody espouses their rapids, bit not the acceleration as much
[06:13:51] <archivist> they dont all have all the clue :)
[06:14:11] <jthornton> some used to claim the rapid speed of both X and Y combined
[06:15:47] <archivist> often one sees a user chasing the wrong metric
[06:17:47] <jthornton> I have a couple of subroutines for the plasma one trims off the sheet along the X axis and one for a square
[06:20:59] <jthornton> I like this counter bore subroutine I created yesterday
[06:21:56] <jthornton> I need to pull the plug on the Anilam and get the BP knee mill converted to LinuxCNC
[06:22:48] <archivist> big step :)
[06:23:34] <archivist> I hate the knowledge one cannot use a tool for a period
[06:23:43] <jthornton> I've got all the wires traced out and I run the spindle now with LinuxCNC so it's just a matter of adding the axes
[06:23:57] <jthornton> yea, that is the sticky part
[06:28:09] <jd896> jd896 I'm supprised you used the functioning control at all I'd have thought it'd have only been bought to be retro
[06:28:31] <jthornton> The Anilam?
[06:28:45] <jd896> Yeah
[06:29:01] <Valen> i hate needing to use the tool to make the tool
[06:29:02] <jthornton> I've had it for quite some time and it was my first CNC machine
[06:29:45] <jthornton> I used it to make my plasma after I discovered that I could actually load EMC onto a computer with the LiveCD
[06:29:58] <archivist> Valen, that requires mid work reassembly !
[06:30:14] <jthornton> every attempt at using the BDI failed
[06:30:17] <jd896> Ah so it was before emc even got a look in
[06:30:23] <jthornton> yea
[06:30:46] <jd896> Bdi ?
[06:31:16] <jthornton> that was the Brain Dead Installer for EMC before the LiveCD
[06:31:49] <jthornton> I guess my brain was dead back then dunno or my hardware was not right or something
[06:32:25] <jd896> Oh take it that's why emc's now on Ubuntu for the live cd or has it always been ubuntu
[06:32:43] <archivist> installing stuff in the brain just takes longer with age :)
[06:33:15] <jthornton> iirc the BDI was not ubuntu
[06:33:57] <jd896> Must admit Ubuntu makes Linux usable for most people
[06:34:50] <jd896> Most people don't know windows even has a command line never mind using command in Linux
[06:35:04] <jthornton> yes it does, I can't wait for cad and cam to catch up to ubuntu
[06:36:04] <jd896> Yeah that's pretty much all it needs to maybe catch solid works and autocads attention
[06:36:10] <jthornton> I started out with a 286 on DOS 4 or 5 I can't remember now
[06:36:33] <jthornton> yea that would be real nice to have a ubuntu solidworks
[06:37:24] <archivist> or an open source solidworksalike
[06:37:34] <jd896> That was most Likly before I got started John I'm only 21
[06:38:01] <jthornton> yea, that was a long time ago for sure
[06:38:37] <jd896> First one I had was a cast off 98me 2 machine
[06:38:47] <jthornton> a blank green screen with C:> burned into the left upper corner
[06:39:47] <jd896> Sounds like the old control for this esab I'm on
[06:39:54] <jthornton> mine was the deluxe model with a 10 mb hard drive and a 5 1/4 floppy and 512 mb of memory
[06:40:16] <archivist> bah you lot making me feel old...Science of Cambridge MK14 then a Commodore PET
[06:40:40] <jthornton> the Anilam motherboard is a 286 or 386
[06:40:54] <jd896> Ha I do remember those floppys that actually where floppy
[06:43:06] <jd896> S o c mk14 is that the Sinclair that was a kit ?
[06:44:21] <archivist> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MK14
[06:44:43] <archivist> iirc we had a KIM1 at work at the time
[06:45:59] <archivist> hmm 1977, that does date me somewhat :)
[06:58:06] <jd896> As I said before my time
[07:00:10] <jthornton> this was my first
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_XT
[07:00:26] <norias> yum
[07:00:29] <jthornton> I bought it where I worked at making nails to keep track of inventory
[07:00:32] <norias> XT was a 286, right?
[07:00:45] <jthornton> iirc yea
[07:00:52] <norias> yeah
[07:00:56] <norias> i started with a clone
[07:01:08] <norias> had a 286
[07:01:18] <norias> i want to say 10 MB HD
[07:01:31] <jthornton> nope 8088
[07:01:40] <norias> oh, wow
[07:01:59] <norias> good stuff
[07:02:13] <norias> did you have the FPU?
[07:03:16] <jthornton> too long ago to remember
[07:03:28] <norias> right on
[07:03:58] <jd896> Wow 4.77mhz
[07:04:10] <norias> yeah, today i will be explaining what irc is to one of the engineers i work with
[07:04:15] <norias> i think he will enjoy it alot
[07:05:38] <jd896> Tis a hidden gem this
[07:06:25] <norias> truly
[07:13:39] <jd896> Is pcw around yet
[07:14:01] <JT-Shop> he is sometimes up this early
[07:16:11] <Tom_itx> archivist i had a commodore if it makes you feel any younger
[07:16:47] <archivist> I think JT-Shop was a late starter :)
[07:17:30] <Tom_itx> i think my first 8088 is still in the closet
[07:17:53] <Tom_itx> gave the commodore to the mailman's kid
[07:18:37] <archivist> I still have my MK14 and PET
[07:21:02] <archivist> the was no way it could be sold
http://www.collection.archivist.info/archive/DJCPD/PD/2007/2007_05_01_PET_Computer/P4300006.JPG
[07:21:52] <Tom_itx> nice heater on a chilly morning
[07:22:35] <Tom_itx> my first graphic card did that pretty good as well
[07:26:17] <jd896_> http://www.raspberrypi.org/
[07:26:26] <jd896_> How things have come on
[08:19:13] <pcw_home> here now jd896
[08:26:38] <pcw_home> rats
[08:36:05] <jd896> Hi pcw as a continuation from the other day what am I looking for when adding I as I've noticed that it just seams to push the following error off
[08:38:56] <pcw_home> "I" should help but usually only when you are quite close
[08:38:58] <pcw_home> (it typically makes things worse with overshoots if the basic tuning is not close enough )
[08:40:30] <pcw_home> Do you have velocity mode servos?
[08:41:22] <jd896> Yes
[08:42:52] * JT-Shop collects another bit of servo tuning wisdom
[08:43:05] <pcw_home> for velocity mode servos its good to get FF1 dialed in first (this needs Halscope)
[08:44:39] <jd896> I did as you said and set p then ff1 I'm following during a cruse around 0.08
[08:45:27] <pcw_home> not so sure about wisdom, just slow osmosis after having done this a few hundred times
[08:46:07] <JT-Shop> much more experiance than my one time :-)
[08:46:39] <pcw_home> .08 inches or mm
[08:46:54] <jd896> And plenty more than my 0.5 times
[08:46:58] <jd896> Mm pcw
[08:47:00] <JT-Shop> when your tuning P and FF1 for a velocity drive what do you watch the acceleration part or the cruse part or both?
[08:47:23] <jdhNC> I have a bunch of Delta Tau systems with 'auto-tuning'. Not so great tuning.
[08:47:31] <pcw_home> FF1 is tuned by nulling the error during cruise
[08:47:43] <pcw_home> (for a velocity mode drive)
[08:48:30] <pcw_home> helps to have P low so the effect of FF1 is magnified
[08:50:43] <jd896> Yes the ff1 makes sense shal I post my latest scope to the forum
[08:51:07] <pcw_home> I would probably need a halscope plot of ferror/pidoutput/commanded and real velocity
[08:51:09] <pcw_home> to help much more
[08:52:23] <JT-Shop> jd896: what are you triggering on?
[08:52:24] <jd896> I'm looking for around 0.1 following if poss I'm at 0.4 ATM
[08:52:33] <jd896> I will do
[08:52:52] <jd896> Triggering on commanded velocity
[08:53:07] <JT-Shop> ok, just wondering
[08:53:37] <pcw_home> bbl doggy-walky
[08:53:57] <JT-Shop> me too
[09:05:16] <jd896> Posted to my thread
[09:12:16] <Jymmm> JT-Shop: Where you asking pcw_home to walk you too, or that you had to walk your dog too?
[10:28:44] <jd896> You back pcw ?
[11:27:07] <pcw_home> Yeah
[11:48:35] <jd896_fabshop> john and pcw around
[11:48:41] <jd896_fabshop> ?
[11:53:33] <archivist> best to ask the real question then they answer when at the console
[12:06:20] <mrsun> gah broke of the tool holder "stud" or whatever its called ... (the one that goes from the crossslide into the tool holder and have a nut on it .. like a T nut etc) .. aparently i cant even weld
[12:06:21] <mrsun> think im gonna give away all my stuff and just sit and stare into a wall soon
[12:12:50] <archivist> I think after a rest and a coffee you will repair it properly
[12:16:56] <archivist> machines of that age may have bolts/studs etc made of wrought iron, it breaks like cast iron if not annealed now and again, specially with a shock load
[12:17:33] <pcw_home> jd896_fabshop around
[12:18:32] <mrsun> archivist, it was my homemade thingie that broke
[12:19:51] <mrsun> aparently i did some porous welding and left only like 3mm square that held the stud in place, ground it all off, rewelded and what do you know .. its freakin off to to the side ... so it only grabs the T slot in the cross slide on one side and is like 1mm up in the air in the other side
[12:20:09] <mrsun> have to realy torque it down if it is to be sitting properly .. and i do not like doing that to T slots
[12:20:56] <IchGuckLive> Hi all on the Globe
[12:39:25] <IchGuckLive> havy poasting tonight
[12:41:53] <mrsun> archivist, ough you remember i was talking about making gears ? .. aparently the gears on my lathe is 15 degree ....
[12:42:12] <archivist> er 14.5 I bet
[12:43:32] <mrsun> reading about one making or looking for gears for the blomqvist lathe .. and aparently he had drawings and they said 15 degree =)
[12:43:54] <Connor> What's a good combination for a servo motor/driver to use as a spindle drive ? (For lathe/4th axis).. I can build my own servo using standard DC motor with H-bridge.. Just not sure if that's suitable for this or not.
[12:44:12] <Connor> Most of the motors I use are 12/24 motors for Power chair's .
[12:44:55] <IchGuckLive> MY1020 for Scooter is mutch better and cheeper
[12:45:09] <IchGuckLive> up to 1500W for 80USD
[12:45:31] <Connor> DC ?
[12:45:55] <Connor> What's the voltage ?
[12:46:24] <IchGuckLive> yes DC you can get them in 12/24/48V
[12:46:39] <IchGuckLive> look on ebay to MY1020
[12:47:34] <Loetmichel> hmmm
[12:47:44] <Connor> 2500 RPM ? That fast enough for lathe work?
[12:47:50] <archivist> mrsun, a new standard! or more like yet another gear standard, there are many
[12:47:54] <Loetmichel> is that suitable for a wheelchair (two of them)`?
[12:48:42] <Connor> okay.. I've found 24/36/48v versions.
[12:48:58] <Connor> Now to find a H-Bridge that can handle the voltage / amparage.
[12:49:42] <IchGuckLive> why not a Gecko 320
[12:50:34] <Connor> Maybe. not looked at Gecko's yet.
[12:50:54] <Connor> Do these have rear shafts on them for encoders ?
[12:51:08] <IchGuckLive> no
[12:51:23] <IchGuckLive> let me look i got a 350 in the E-Bike
[12:51:40] <IchGuckLive> how they made the frame
[12:53:04] <Connor> I think you want the encoder on the shaft of the motor, not the spindle for this would you not ?
[12:53:54] <IchGuckLive> it is closed frame as i epected cause thats outside
[12:54:35] <IchGuckLive> as the motor is a very god live one you coudt desamble it and make a shaft into it
[12:57:36] <IchGuckLive> Connor: still here ?
[12:57:40] <Connor> yea
[12:58:21] <IchGuckLive> get the my1020 into google there you can see the diagramm and the other modells
[13:03:38] <IchGuckLive> slightly unsave ->
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U3UCgX_jMWA
[13:16:36] <IchGuckLive> by have a nice day
[13:30:53] <Connor> Looking to build one like this..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=295Phu8GnjE
[13:55:10] <mrsun> hmm, chatter in the lathe ... reasons ? .. to high rpm ? to much tool sticking out ?
[13:56:07] <archivist> also above center, too much overhang from chuck
[13:56:35] <archivist> loose headstock bearings
[13:56:50] <mrsun> got a 60mm thick piece in the chuck, with outstick about 50mm .... should be good ? :)
[13:56:58] <mrsun> archivist, headstocks bearings is more on the tight side
[13:57:17] <mrsun> (gets a bit hot when running :P)
[13:57:39] <archivist> try lower cutting speed
[13:57:40] <mrsun> tool holder (old one on the lathe) isnt the best tho ... seem to be right on center as it doesnt leave a small peg on the piece
[13:57:53] <mrsun> archivist, then i need to engage the broken backgears ... :/
[13:58:05] <mrsun> or cutting speed as in feed or rpm ? :)
[13:58:12] <archivist> yes
[13:58:22] <mrsun> sounds good when im about 10mm from the center, then the shatter stops
[13:58:41] <archivist> also tool geometry effects it
[13:59:38] <archivist> as I cannot hear it, its hard to guess what the cause is
[14:00:42] <mrsun> its a very very high pitch sound =)
[14:00:50] <archivist> whistle, tool
[14:00:58] <mrsun> i wll try tomorrow with lower rpm
[14:01:08] <mrsun> tho the gears doesnt sound to good with broken off teeth :P
[14:01:18] <archivist> put a finger on the tool does it stop
[14:01:29] <mrsun> yeah stupid person that had the lathe before made a tool holder from a round pipe to hold the small tools in
[14:02:00] <mrsun> not very rigid
[14:02:04] <mrsun> so i would guess its the tool =)
[14:02:04] <archivist> sounds like tool resonance then
[14:02:20] <archivist> shorter is better
[14:02:42] <mrsun> had no shatter at all with the new tools (16mm solid steel) but its the nut for that tool holder im remaking :P
[14:02:48] <mrsun> so have to use the old thingie =)
[14:27:48] <jdhNC> am I the only one stuck working all day?
[14:29:37] <archivist> all of the UK was back at work today
[14:36:17] <andypugh> I was back _in_ work.
[14:45:00] <Jymmm> andypugh: As opposed to OUT of work?
[14:45:26] <Jymmm> laid off? Fired? end of contract? etc?
[14:45:44] <andypugh> As opposed to "at work" and it's connotations of actually doing work.
[14:45:52] <Jymmm> ah, heh
[14:48:27] <frallzor> omg best tool for alu-sheets ever!
[14:48:44] <frallzor> amana tools 1 flute cutter is THE shit
[14:49:27] <Jymmm> Ah, it's CRAP, gotit! ;)
[14:49:39] <frallzor> THE shiznits then? =P
[14:49:50] <Jymmm> lol
[14:50:09] <Jymmm> It's Kosher
[14:50:52] <frallzor> for real now, it was awesome
[14:50:57] <frallzor> not that expensive either
[14:51:08] <frallzor> even for me that have to import it
[14:51:21] <Jymmm> thickness? pics? Video?
[14:51:48] <frallzor> 2mm alu
[14:51:55] <frallzor> sticky kind
[14:52:13] <frallzor> 66% of 1/8 inch =P
[14:52:23] <frallzor> I hate imperial =(
[14:52:33] <Jymmm> i know what 2mm is
[14:52:49] <frallzor> surprisingly many dont =(
[14:52:58] <Jymmm> and 25.4mm too
[14:53:04] <Jymmm> == 1 "
[14:53:15] <Jymmm> but thats it
[14:53:42] <Jymmm> 13km 7 kg etc no clue
[14:54:11] <Jymmm> but I try =)
[14:55:06] <Jymmm> sorta, still using ounces, but only becuse I know what an ounce looks like
[14:55:12] <frallzor> =P
[14:55:22] <jdhNC> about 1/3rd of a baggie?
[14:56:08] <Jymmm> lol, actually no. I should have said fluid ounces.
[14:56:57] <Jymmm> and sadly if I was getting baggy, I wouldn't know by looking if I was getting ripped of or not =)
[14:57:06] <Jymmm> off
[14:57:31] <Jymmm> isn't three fingers an ounce or so?
[14:59:15] <jdhNC> three fingers probably weigh more than an ounce. Guess it depends on who had the fingers.
[15:00:20] <frallzor> sweet, allmost perfect fit!
[15:00:26] <frallzor> I hate the human factor when
[15:00:35] <frallzor> I have to measure things by hand =)
[15:16:28] <andypugh> archivist: Feeling affluent?
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=251078849199#ht_500wt_1413
[15:17:10] <andypugh> Actually, they might suit syyl_ too.
[15:17:56] <archivist> I need a job to feel affluent
[15:18:35] <andypugh> Surely you would be happy enough to have lots of money and no job?
[15:19:09] <archivist> first gimme da money
[15:20:46] <syyl_> i already got horn boring tools :P
[15:21:42] <archivist> I dont see 50 inserts as claimed
[15:22:03] <syyl_> i think i dont need 50 ;)
[15:22:12] <syyl_> they can be resharpened pretty easy
[15:22:59] <andypugh> I see 40
[15:23:02] <archivist> I usually grind up a bit of hss when doing the small stuff
[15:23:19] <archivist> I got to 42
[15:23:24] <andypugh> They have the advantage of being significantly stiffer, being all-carbide.
[15:23:25] <syyl_> but the hss is not that shiny :D
[15:23:44] <andypugh> And with a squirty-hole down the middle
[15:23:58] <syyl_> i set up shopair down that hole
[15:24:01] <syyl_> helps often
[15:24:09] <syyl_> to clean the chips out
[15:24:47] <andypugh> Perhaps you should go halves?
[15:24:57] <syyl_> hmm
[15:25:00] <syyl_> i think you need them :D
[15:25:12] <andypugh> But even then you would be spending money on something you woudn't otherwise buy.
[15:25:23] <syyl_> i just bought a tig welder
[15:25:26] <andypugh> I bought 20 the other day.
[15:25:37] <syyl_> thats enough for this month :D
[15:27:12] <syyl_> http://gtwr.de/wig1.jpg
[15:27:13] <syyl_> :P
[15:27:53] <archivist> floor too clean error at line 1
[15:28:13] <syyl_> i wet wipe the shop floor!
[15:28:37] <andypugh> I bought my TIG from eBay.de It seems that Germans bid lower than brits. :-)
[15:28:51] <syyl_> also a chinese unit?
[15:29:02] <andypugh> Yes
[15:29:10] <andypugh> But labeled "Felzer"
[15:29:41] <syyl_> i cant tell the difference between a esab, ewm, lorch or the chinese one.. :D
[15:31:33] <syyl_> but it gets the work done Oo
[15:31:33] <syyl_> http://gtwr.de/wig2.jpg
[15:31:39] <Jymmm> what archivist said!!!
[15:32:00] <andypugh> I wanted this one, but could't justify it:
http://www.rehm-online.de/index.php?id=37&L=1
[15:32:14] <syyl_> rehm is also a good choise :D
[15:32:24] <Jymmm> andypugh: It's "cute"
[15:32:35] <syyl_> the price isnt
[15:33:05] <Jymmm> that's the interior designers markup
[15:33:20] <syyl_> more the name
[15:33:29] <syyl_> a ewm triton is also about 2,5k euro
[15:33:42] <syyl_> and that doesnt have the slick design :d
[15:34:14] <andypugh> The Rehm is also little, so motorbike-transportable.
[15:34:22] <Jymmm> lol
[15:34:34] <Jymmm> andypugh: got a genny outpur on the bike?
[15:34:36] <syyl_> the argon tank could be a problem on the bike
[15:34:54] <syyl_> ;)
[15:34:54] <andypugh> I have disposables for that.
[15:34:57] <syyl_> ah, ok
[15:41:41] <mrsun> welding stuff sucks ... it gets krooked as soon as you turn on the mig welder
[15:41:42] <mrsun> :P
[15:44:22] <syyl_> no problem
[15:44:33] <syyl_> just have a big deadblow hammer by hand :D
[15:49:13] <archivist> mrsun, learn to tag weld to hold it straight when final welding
[15:50:05] <mrsun> tag weld ?
[15:51:03] <mrsun> syyl_, problem is to hold the stuff to give it a wack :P
[15:51:30] <mrsun> im hoping i can counteract the little twist by having the two pieces in different configurations when i weld the other stuff to it =)
[15:51:42] <mrsun> sure it will have stresses but what doesnt after welding :P
[15:52:39] <frallzor> punktsvetsa
[15:52:45] <frallzor> loppor
[15:53:22] <frallzor> or in english; tag weld; beads =)
[15:53:49] <gene77> Silly Q guys: g21 doesn't convert the axis dro's to metric, is there a quick & dirty way to do that?
[15:53:51] <mrsun> well i did that :P and it looked straight ...
[15:53:52] <mrsun> =)
[15:54:11] <mrsun> but ended up with pretty much the exact same twist in both pieces :P
[15:54:20] <mrsun> curse of not having a full workshop with big welding table i guess :P
[15:55:06] <andypugh> gene77: Doesn't it?
[15:55:12] <mrsun> frallzor, men det är väll "tack" ? :)
[15:55:16] <mrsun> tack welding
[15:55:19] <mrsun> tack it down
[15:55:21] <mrsun> etc :P
[15:55:52] <mrsun> tag stands for tungsten active gas :P
[15:56:30] <frallzor> yeah yeah =P
[15:56:45] <frallzor> anyone into riveting?
[15:56:58] <mrsun> riv eating
[15:57:01] <andypugh> Yes. When appropriate
[15:57:15] <frallzor> will a rivet of 6.2mm hold 4mm of sheets?
[15:57:20] <fragalot> mrsun: there's a massive welding table @ one of the workshops @ work... found out it's warped last week
[15:57:21] <syyl_> you mean the old "beat the crap out of it"-riveting?
[15:57:23] <fragalot> >.<
[15:57:23] <andypugh> I work on a 1916 vehicle, so do a fair bit of it.
[15:57:38] <frallzor> I have no idea on how much material needed to hold
[15:57:39] <archivist> frallzor, yes/no /maybe
[15:57:53] <mrsun> fragalot, hehe =)
[15:57:59] <frallzor> its pretty much just "hold" pieces together
[15:58:08] <fragalot> frallzor: if it's just to hold it together, yes
[15:58:30] <andypugh> frallzor: 6.2 is fairly large for that thickness. The material will break first.
[15:58:49] <frallzor> I went for the longest yet not biggest I could find
[15:58:51] <archivist> depends on the head size too
[15:59:05] <frallzor> seemed pretty decent
[15:59:33] <andypugh> Well, yes, I was meanign that it will pull through rather than break.
[16:02:30] <archivist> my favourite riveting is hidden rivets
[16:05:41] <andypugh> Please elaborate?
[16:08:02] <gene77> No, and a .7 pitch metric thread is being cut at about 7 tpi
[16:08:19] <archivist> andypugh, clock dial repair
http://www.collection.archivist.info/searchv13.php?searchstr=clock+dial+norfolk
[16:11:00] <gene77> 1916 what Andy?
[16:12:02] <andypugh> 1916 Dennis Fire Engine
[16:12:49] <gene77> Anyway, how do I put this in metric mode, dro and all. Now that puppy has to be one of a kind since its now 95 years old!
[16:13:22] <andypugh> Actually, there are several about. I know of at least 6
[16:13:37] <gene77> I'll be dipped. :)
[16:13:51] <andypugh> http://union.ic.ac.uk/rcc/rcsmotor/
[16:15:11] <andypugh> Actually. 21 that we know of :
http://union.ic.ac.uk/rcc/rcsmotor/archive/surviving-n-types
[16:16:35] <andypugh> gene77: Menu. View - Display mm
[16:16:35] <gene77> Considering their age, they actually look fairly modern!
[16:18:16] <gene77> That works, didn't know it was there. Now how do I get it to calculate the threads by the reciprocal of .7?
[16:18:35] <gene77> .7mm that is
[16:18:54] <syyl_> 0,7mm of pitch is pretty uncommon
[16:18:59] <syyl_> Oo
[16:19:06] <syyl_> sure it isnt 0,75mm?
[16:19:30] <gene77> std 4mm metric machine screw...
[16:19:43] <syyl_> arr damn :D
[16:19:46] <syyl_> right
[16:19:48] <syyl_> thats 0,7
[16:20:04] * syyl_ runs away and screams
[16:20:11] <andypugh> I just use an I of .7.
[16:20:41] <gene77> no need, I've asked far dumber questions here
[16:21:29] <syyl_> ;)
[16:21:33] <andypugh> Sorry, I don't mean I.
[16:21:45] <gene77> My code takes an input when in inches mode, of tpi, finds the reciprocal which is the movement per turn
[16:21:59] <andypugh> P is distance per rev. SO you use p 0.7
[16:22:39] <andypugh> Ah, in that case you need to use a pitch of 36.2857142857143 tpi
[16:23:38] <andypugh> Or, depending on if the code converts to metric of uses G21, you might want a pitch of 1.42857142857143 teeth per mm.
[16:23:55] <gene77> I thought the G21 would make it do those calcs in mm, but apparently not.
[16:24:12] <andypugh> It probably does. But what does your code do?
[16:25:35] <gene77> I wrote it in inches, it takes some input figures and calculates all the vars g76 runs with
[16:26:25] <gene77> I'll try the other non-metric entries just for S&G, brb
[16:27:17] <andypugh> So, what number did you put in for the pitch?
[16:29:05] <gene77> .7 originally, i just tried the 36,etc and g76 spits out k must be greater than j error.
[16:29:26] <gene77> so i'll try tge 1.42etc
[16:29:43] <andypugh> That's the most likely.
[16:30:16] <andypugh> Better still, edit the generated G-code to say 0.7
[16:31:22] <gene77> lemme see what a debug says
[16:32:46] <gene77> Ok, now I have a #<pitch>=0.7000000
[16:34:43] <gene77> looks like you hit it.
[16:35:47] <gene77> I'll let it complete & check the fit, too tight, run x to 0.002 & touch off, repeat till it fits
[16:46:18] <andypugh> I keep meaning to write a "tweak thread" routine, to save watching it cut air for 5 minutes.
[16:49:59] <frallzor> name a good Al alloyr for machining
[16:50:04] <frallzor> * -r
[16:50:22] <syyl_> one with lead in it
[16:50:58] <gene77> Andy, I've done that for those encoder wheels. Interesting side effects of the code doesn't do things in the right order. :)
[16:52:44] <andypugh> Seems like Ray Bradbury has finished writing :-(
[16:53:09] <djdelorie> Asimov's death didn't stop his books...
[17:04:33] <gene77> That is another pair of shoes that go on the top shelf, alongside Clark's & Smiths
[17:06:00] <gene77> And I just found you can't raise the cutting spindle speed, the bits lag varies & the bottom of the thread groove widens.
[17:06:37] <Tom_itx> when you touch off your tools one will have a zero offset. Does it need to be called from the program or just set in the table? I was considering using a 'dowel pin' like we used to do to set up the fixture offsets and zero for the tool offsets and sticking it high up in the tool table then referencing all the other tools from that.
[17:07:29] <Tom_itx> or does the zero offset tool need to be called in the program or does it need to be the first tool called?
[17:13:54] <gene77> Yup, I slowed the spindle back down to where I started and that is cleaning up the bottom of the threads. Purty even.
[17:16:15] <andypugh> Hilarious: Internet Explorer can't open the site htttp://uk.msn.com/ (that being the default homepage for a new install of XP)
[17:17:32] <gene77> I'd bet that is a flame worm hijacked site then.
[17:18:01] <Tom_itx> i get a picture of the queen
[17:18:04] <Tom_itx> it loaded here
[17:18:33] <Tom_itx> ie7
[17:19:33] <andypugh> Yes, I think it struggles with IE6 then.
[17:19:52] <andypugh> Not that I actually care, you understand.
[17:20:00] <Tom_itx> me either, i quit using it
[17:20:34] <andypugh> I don't really use Windows.
[17:20:44] <gene77> Got it Andy, perfect fit, maybe enough room for some locktite or superglue
[17:20:56] <gene77> Thanks. A bunch.
[17:21:04] <andypugh> But I am submitting a new version of an old DesignSpark PCB, so rather than try to learn gEDA...
[17:24:39] <andypugh> Would you expect a PC to do anything at all with no memory and no drive? Just wondering, like.
[17:25:14] <andypugh> I get a new DN2800MT today. It's remarkably thin. But I forgot to buy any memory for it.
[17:25:32] <andypugh> (got, not get).
[17:25:51] <andypugh> But I couldn't resist seeing if my wall-wart had the oomph to run it.
[17:28:00] <andypugh> In other news I bought a totem-pole opto for making a PWM-voltage converter today. Soon I should have PC control of the mill spindleon the new machine.
[17:36:24] <Tom_itx> it might get thru post
[17:36:49] <Tom_itx> run off 12v?
[17:38:59] <andypugh> Yes
[17:41:40] <andypugh> I wonder if this would hold my controller PC box?
http://www.tesco.com/direct/tesco-lcd-8i-10-to-23-inch-tilt-swing-tv-bracket-wall-mount/208-7351.prd?skuId=208-7351&pageLevel=
[17:42:26] <Tom_itx> one of the heavy duty ones would
[17:42:34] <Tom_itx> dunno what mount size that is
[17:42:57] <Tom_itx> that one looks a bit light maybe
[17:43:14] <Tom_itx> find one for over 23"
[17:43:32] <Tom_itx> they would be heavier and have the larger mount
[17:44:31] <Tom_itx> you could always weld one up from some square tubing
[17:45:26] <andypugh> Bathroom scales say that my PC is 2st6.5lbs
[17:45:33] <andypugh> (Metric? me?)
[17:46:50] <andypugh> Which is about 16kg. But likely to be a lot further from the bracket than in the case of a TV
[17:47:16] <Tom_itx> it may hold it..
[17:47:52] <Tom_itx> why do you need the pc on a mount and not just maybe the monitor and keyboard?
[17:48:07] <andypugh> Yes, but I think prodding the buttons and screen might lead to wobbles.
[17:48:56] <andypugh> It's all one unit.
https://picasaweb.google.com/108164504656404380542/CNCUnsorted#5586611443242826466
[17:50:51] <Tom_itx> what interface is that?
[17:51:03] <andypugh> Touchy
[17:51:15] <Tom_itx> is that strictly for touch screens?
[17:51:23] <andypugh> Yes, really.
[17:51:36] <andypugh> It works with a mouse.
[17:51:40] <Tom_itx> i'd have one but the display got cracked in shipping
[17:51:57] <Tom_itx> i had a spare touch pad to replace it with but not the lcd
[17:53:39] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/SBC/lcd_spot.jpg
[17:54:41] <andypugh> Vaguely pretty, if annoying.
[17:54:48] <Tom_itx> heh
[17:54:50] <Tom_itx> yeah
[17:55:00] <Tom_itx> i tried to find an lcd surplus here but no luck
[17:55:18] <theorbtwo> Humans aren't terribly good at using touch screens that are vertically in front of them. Much better when flat or at a slight angle, which will mean that the screen / computer has more leverage on the mount then otherwise.
[17:55:26] <Tom_itx> i should have gotten the other ones they had but didn't have the cash at the time
[17:55:30] <theorbtwo> That's actually quite pretty!
[17:55:48] <Tom_itx> 3 or 4 17" touch monitors for ~$65 ea
[18:01:26] <andypugh> theorbtwo: I have noticed that, but it is just something I will get used to, I think.
[18:01:53] <andypugh> I have the option of plugging in a keyboard at least.
[18:02:27] <Jymmm> Tom_itx: lcd monitor or for laptop
[18:03:14] <Tom_itx> it was on a gps tracking system for a fleet
[18:03:15] <Jymmm> Tom_itx: I have a source for NEW replacement lcd panels
[18:03:34] <Tom_itx> it's ok
[18:03:40] <Jymmm> k
[18:04:29] <Tom_itx> it was LVDS though
[18:05:01] <Jymmm> i found a pretty decent packaged curry today
[18:05:16] <Tom_itx> when i got it the hope was to use it on the cnc but not now
[18:05:31] <Tom_itx> it was free anyway, just paid the shipping
[18:07:01] <Tom_itx> along with 5 or 6 of these:
http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/SBC/inside_control.jpg
[18:07:38] <Jymmm> what is it?
[18:08:13] <Tom_itx> PC104 with a rabbit controller and gps
[18:08:23] <Tom_itx> it was the tracking system
[18:08:24] <Jymmm> k
[18:08:42] <Tom_itx> really too slow to be useful for much
[18:24:38] <Jymmm> Name crunchy food that doens't come out of a bag, ready GO!
[18:25:20] <syyl_> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pringles
[18:25:41] <Jymmm> heh
[18:25:46] <syyl_> :D
[18:25:49] <Jymmm> not what I meant, but ok =)
[18:26:04] <Tom_itx> chocolate covered bugs
[18:26:16] <Jymmm> I was trying to avoid the whole "chip" thing
[18:26:24] <syyl_> i knew ;)
[18:26:32] <Jymmm> Tom_itx: comes in a bag?
[18:26:42] <Tom_itx> couldn't tell you
[18:26:49] <Jymmm> heh
[18:26:51] <Tom_itx> never plan to be able to either
[18:26:57] <andypugh> Toffee
[18:27:08] <syyl_> burned steak
[18:27:20] <Jymmm> syyl_: NEVER
[18:27:27] <Tom_itx> celery
[18:27:31] <Jymmm> med rare
[18:27:46] <Tom_itx> carrots
[18:27:46] <Jymmm> carrots
[18:27:53] <Jymmm> crackers
[18:27:56] <andypugh> Apples
[18:28:09] <Jymmm> dried fruit/veggies
[18:28:17] <Jymmm> dried shrimp (ew)
[18:28:25] <andypugh> Dried banana especially.
[18:28:46] <Jymmm> andypugh: mini yellow hockey pucks
[18:29:01] <Jymmm> cookies
[18:29:23] <Jymmm> french fries, tator tots, hash browns,
[18:29:32] <Tom_itx> soggy
[18:29:47] <Jymmm> Tom_itx: If soggy, you're getting them from the wrong place =)
[18:30:45] <Tom_itx> mickee dees??
[18:30:51] <Jymmm> anything else? I've run out of ideas
[18:30:59] <Jymmm> pretzels I guess
[18:31:14] <Jymmm> Tom_itx: Oh, then get them fresh.
[18:31:28] <syyl_> a good full size pretzel issnt crunchy
[18:31:29] <Jymmm> garlic bread / toast
[18:31:44] <Jymmm> syyl_: True
[18:31:47] <syyl_> trust me, we bavarians know our pretzels :D
[18:32:22] <Jymmm> tempura? not really, sorta kinda.
[18:32:36] <Jymmm> blanched veggies
[18:33:23] <Jymmm> For the hell of it, I've given up meat for the month of June. But that kinda limits your choices of things.
[18:34:11] <Jymmm> and everything is mooshy so I have a crunchy craving!!!
[18:34:42] <Jymmm> and I can only eat so many radishes =)
[18:36:13] <andypugh> Pizza with sun-dried tomatoes. It's not crunchy, but its great.
[18:36:57] <Jymmm> pizza is good
[18:37:41] <Jymmm> I am eating eggs and dairy, just not real meat.
[18:38:11] <andypugh> Fallafel and Salad is OK, there is a bit of crunch in the lettuce. Add picked betroot for dripping-blood substitute.
[18:38:25] <andypugh> (pickled)
[18:38:45] <Jymmm> andypugh: sun dried tomatoes, frech spinache, zuccini
[18:38:50] <Jymmm> pickled what?
[18:38:56] <andypugh> beetroot
[18:39:17] <Jymmm> never seen beetroot, just beets
[18:39:35] <Jymmm> or is that he brit equiv?
[18:39:38] <Jymmm> the
[18:39:41] <andypugh> Not really.
[18:39:42] <andypugh> http://www.lovebeetroot.co.uk/
[18:39:43] <Jymmm> k
[18:40:23] <andypugh> Extremely red?
[18:40:40] <Jymmm> andypugh: Yeah, we just call them beets here in the states
[18:40:59] <Jymmm> andypugh: and the tops would be called "Beet greens"
[18:41:15] <Jymmm> mustard greens, collard greens, etc
[18:41:20] <andypugh> Right.
[18:41:25] <ve7it> beet-root, beet-top....
[18:41:35] <andypugh> "Beet" to me means sugar beet, or animal fodder.
[18:42:27] <Jymmm> pickled beets is what tey would be labeled as in the us
[18:42:29] <Jymmm> US
[18:42:42] <Jymmm> we have a few jars of them =)
[18:42:53] <Jymmm> pickled ginger is great!!!
[18:43:27] <andypugh> I would have put you a long way down the list of "folks most likely to give up meat for a month"
[18:43:45] <Tom_itx> heh
[18:44:17] <Tom_itx> sweet potato fries aren't bad
[18:44:24] <Jymmm> andypugh: I don't even know what gave me the idea actually. It wasn't any outside influence or anything, just figured I'd try something different is all.
[18:44:33] <Jymmm> Tom_itx: bags of em in the freezer.
[18:44:46] <andypugh> I did the same thing, about 5 years ago...
[18:44:58] <Jymmm> oh hang on, let me get the bag of something...
[18:45:01] <Tom_itx> no meat at all?
[18:45:23] <andypugh> Anyway, time to log off.
[18:45:28] <andypugh> Night all.
[18:45:32] <Tom_itx> night andypugh
[18:45:37] <Jymmm> night anonimasu
[18:45:43] <Jymmm> and andy too
[18:46:11] <Tom_itx> no meat at all?
[18:46:22] <Jymmm> These are AWESOME
http://www.freshgourmet.com/freshgourmet/retail/product_details.asp?type=crunchy_toppings&id=72
[18:46:45] <Jymmm> Found them at Smart and Final, in the produce area.
[18:47:08] <Jymmm> real strong ginger flavor
[18:51:54] <Jymmm> peanuts are crunchy!
[18:53:03] <alex4nder> hey
[18:53:07] <Jymmm> ho
[18:53:14] <alex4nder> sup Jymmm
[18:53:33] <Jymmm> alex4nder: crucnhy foods that dont come in a bag
[18:53:46] <alex4nder> nice
[18:53:59] <alex4nder> laf
[18:54:14] <alex4nder> I'm surprised I haven't gotten any feedback on the axis patch I double posted to the mailing list.
[18:54:22] <Tom_itx> did you give up bags as well as meat?
[18:54:46] <Jymmm> Tom_itx: bag == potato/tortilla chips
[19:04:46] <Tom_itx> ok, well i'm gonna have some chips anyway
[19:05:47] <Jymmm> go for it =)
[19:07:07] <alex4nder> ok
[19:07:30] <alex4nder> anyone feel like reviewing and pushing my change into the tree?
[20:06:53] <r00t4rd3d> nah
[20:17:55] <Tom_itx> why is 'RUN FROM HERE' greyed out?
[20:18:03] <Tom_itx> what mode do you ned for that to work?
[20:18:47] <Valen> probably out of estop i think
[20:19:04] <Tom_itx> can it be any line?
[20:19:10] <Valen> i dunno
[20:19:17] <Valen> i've only ever done it on G1s
[20:19:18] <Tom_itx> within sensible reason
[20:19:22] <Valen> but i dont see why not?
[20:19:37] <Tom_itx> doesn't estop require re homing?
[20:19:43] <Tom_itx> maybe not
[20:21:24] <Valen> you don't *need* to home for anything
[20:21:42] <Valen> entering and leaving estop is penalty free i believe
[20:21:46] <Tom_itx> ok why didn't the program stop for a tool change?
[20:21:54] <Tom_itx> do i not have a parameter set right for that?
[20:21:57] <Valen> we always go into estop so the servo drives shut down
[20:22:05] <Valen> tool changes are hinky
[20:22:23] <Valen> have you specified its a manual tool change?
[20:22:37] <Tom_itx> no i haven't done any tool change setup stuff
[20:22:46] <Tom_itx> that's why i'm test cutting air :)
[20:22:52] <Valen> i *think* just the gcode does it for you
[20:22:57] <Tom_itx> no
[20:23:02] <Valen> personally we split the gcode into sections
[20:23:10] <Tom_itx> i'm used to specifying a Tx M6 and that didn't work
[20:23:10] <Valen> i mean there are a number of tool change gcodes
[20:23:22] <Tom_itx> i always use that one
[20:23:48] <atom1> N319 G49 G28 Z0
[20:23:48] <atom1> N320 T2 M06 ( .0625 END MILL )
[20:23:48] <atom1> N321 G17 G00 G90 X-1.5785 Y-1.1843 S2800 M03
[20:23:48] <atom1> N322 G43 Z-0.9 H2
[20:24:35] <Tom_itx> but it didn't stop for the tool change
[20:26:50] <Tom_itx> http://www.linuxcnc.org/docview/html/gui/axis.html#sec:Manual-Tool-Change
[20:27:29] <Tom_itx> looks like i need to add that to my hal file
[20:28:11] <Tom_itx> i suppose most guys that do manual tool change also use touchoff
[20:28:21] <Tom_itx> i preset the tools and put them in the tool table
[20:28:44] <Tom_itx> as per what i'm used to on a 'real' machine environment
[20:29:49] <Tom_itx> so where do i find the sim files?
[20:30:04] <Tom_itx> i didn't copy any preconfigured configs that i know of
[20:33:35] <Valen> manual tool change with touch off is hard for emc i believe
[20:33:47] <Valen> as you cant jog during execution as a rule
[20:34:02] <Tom_itx> i don't need to
[20:34:19] <Tom_itx> it returns to Z zero where i insert another holder
[20:34:23] <Tom_itx> preset
[20:34:50] <Valen> as i said we just split the tools into seperate gcode files
[20:34:58] <Valen> its just easier lol
[20:35:13] <Tom_itx> i'll figure it out
[20:35:19] <Tom_itx> i hope
[20:35:24] <Valen> eventually we want to make a spindle
[20:35:32] <Valen> it will have automatic tool changing
[20:36:27] <Tom_itx> i wish somebody would fix the search page so the google results are at the top instead of after the left side bar
[20:44:36] <r00t4rd3d> the whole website needs professional work.
[20:45:01] <r00t4rd3d> or at least someone who knows what the hell they are doing
[20:47:33] <atom1> i wonder if those nets need to be loaded from a separate hal file
[20:47:52] <atom1> http://www.linuxcnc.org/docview/html/hal/hal-examples.html#_manual_toolchange
[20:47:59] <atom1> i can't tell
[20:48:12] <atom1> i copied those lines in and get errors
[20:52:32] <atom1> ok i must have had some other tool change lines defined
[20:52:41] <atom1> now to give it a try
[21:01:41] <Tom_itx> that did the trick
[21:05:08] <Tom_itx> it pops up a dialog box with a button to continue
[21:05:22] <Tom_itx> as advertised
[21:05:42] <Tom_itx> Valen, you should try it
[21:05:57] <Tom_itx> unless you have to change collets and can't
[21:09:00] <Valen> we have collets so need to re-zero anyway
[21:09:14] <Tom_itx> wouldn't help you then
[21:09:23] <Tom_itx> unless you switch to tool holders
[21:18:42] <atom1> mmm, it doesn't like my G49 at the end of the file
[21:21:20] <atom1> i better fix that in the post template
[22:06:47] <uw> hello question about half stepping and full stepping for steppers. The motor driver has two pins that when driven low are high can associate STEP pulses as quarter, half or full, depending on the input
[22:07:38] <uw> say 0-0 = full step , 0-1 = half step , 1-0 = quarter step, 1-1 = no step
[22:08:29] <uw> I have them assigned as "I/O output" on the step config wizard, pins 14 and 16 of my parallel port
[22:09:10] <uw> So, my question is how can i drive them low to enable table movement?
[22:09:30] <uw> as it stands now they are floating (1-1) so the table doesnt move
[22:10:01] <jdhNC> you can put pulldowns on them
[22:10:14] <uw> i would normally just physically tie them to ground with wire and that worked, but I am looking for a software solution if possible
[22:10:23] <Valen> why?
[22:10:38] <Valen> why not just tie them to quater step?
[22:10:45] <jdhNC> do you have some need to switch stepmodes on the fly? Why not just hardwire them to what you want.
[22:10:47] <Valen> use the i/os for something else?
[22:11:25] <uw> jdhNC, Valen ok so i guess this is a "best practice" question here as well, as im pretty new to this
[22:11:43] <uw> Typically, does linuxcnc change the step mode?
[22:11:43] <jdhNC> what drives are they?
[22:11:45] <uw> or can it?
[22:11:54] <Valen> *generally* people report smoother movements at higher levels of microstepping
[22:12:15] <jdhNC> it can set IO lines. Never heard of anyone switching stepmodes that way though.
[22:12:20] <Valen> it would be possible, to have different configs for different step rates
[22:12:28] <Valen> but you couldn't change it on the fly
[22:12:38] <Valen> well at least i dont think you could
[22:12:41] <jdhNC> you could, your scale would just be off :)
[22:12:48] <Valen> (well you could change it, but i dont think emc could handle it)
[22:12:57] <Valen> thats what i was trying to say
[22:13:26] <uw> ok so i guess theres no really need to switch to course mode (full step)?
[22:13:32] <jdhNC> no.
[22:13:39] <Valen> unless your running into issues with step rate (ie physically getting enough pulses out of the computer) I'd just tie to to the finest mode your driver can handle
[22:13:46] <jdhNC> if you need full step mode for torque, you need to leave it there.
[22:13:49] <uw> ok thanks (sorry, super noob here lol)
[22:14:10] <Valen> quater step would still have the same torque when you get to the poles though jdhNC?
[22:14:13] <jdhNC> if you change from say full to half, your distance travelled would also drop in half
[22:14:36] <uw> the driver btw is called "opti step" from microkenitcs (cant find any info on it)
[22:14:54] <Valen> I'm after a teensy stepper driver, the more micro steps the better
[22:14:59] <jdhNC> Valen: there is a nice paper somewhere on torque vs. uStep modes
[22:15:29] <jdhNC> http://www.microkinetics.com/pdfmanuals/OptiStep.pdf
[22:15:36] <jdhNC> that?
[22:18:08] <Valen> i can see the torque would follow a sine curve when microstepping
[22:18:11] <uw> well, that is the similar (but pin incompatible) successor of the unit. it is called "opti driver" and is in a paxton patterson CNC training mill. was made in 1994
[22:18:45] <uw> i was able to get 2 pages off archive.org for the thing, as they have since yanked it from the website
[22:19:40] <jdhNC> http://www.micromo.com/microstepping-myths-and-realities.aspx
[22:20:37] <Valen> yeah the incremental torque to use their nomenclature
[22:20:56] <Valen> but when you hit the poles it is still full torque
[22:22:51] <Valen> the advantage to microstepping isn't so much the increased resolution, its smoother operation and fewer harmonics
[22:23:25] <Valen> rather than "hitting" it every time it steps it will smoothly push from one to the next, so your less likley to excite a resonance
[22:23:46] <uw> ok so i will just adapt my cable and leave it as always microstepping. btw this is what ive had before and it did work fine. I just wasnt sure if it would be more efficient (faster) if linuxcnc would control the step rate
[22:24:26] <Valen> what is limiting your speed?
[22:25:16] <Jymmm> physics
[22:25:16] <uw> I am guessing torque of the motor but really i havent used it much yet to say for sure
[22:25:47] <uw> i was thinking that maybe full stepping would make it faster for some reason
[22:25:48] <Valen> *generally* available voltage sets your top speed
[22:25:54] <uw> looking back, that doesnt make much sense
[22:26:03] <Valen> well it is a common result
[22:26:21] <uw> hmm
[22:26:28] <Valen> microstepping makes things smoother so its less likley to loose a step when your going faster
[22:26:55] <uw> the unit has a fixed 5v supply and i havent tried messing with it yet. Im not sure the opti driver supports much higher (cant find documentation on it)
[22:27:22] <Valen> 5v? is it for writing on dvd's with a texta or something lol
[22:27:35] <Valen> 5v for logic sure
[22:28:10] <Valen> but steppers are usually 12v at least? (i could be wrong but i am pretty sure the low end geckos drop out at 11 and a bit)
[22:29:31] <uw> ok just went and checked it out
[22:29:47] <uw> the motors say 6V
[22:29:51] <Tom_itx> ok got the first good part off using linuxcnc
[22:30:13] <Valen> that will be the voltage you put through them for holding
[22:30:21] <uw> howeer the power supply also made by microkinetics says 36V
[22:30:22] <Tom_itx> post is fixed i think, figured out the tool change in hal, set all the tools in the tool table
[22:30:23] <Valen> IE if you feed them 6v you can't break them ;->
[22:30:28] <Valen> yes thats more like it
[22:30:56] <uw> ok also it is a sherline CNC mini mill
[22:31:11] <uw> packaged in some bootleg training center, which houses the opti stepper
[22:31:16] <Tom_itx> the 203v needs 18 to 80v
[22:31:33] <Tom_itx> uw, so is mine
[22:31:49] <uw> lol is the case red?
[22:32:01] <Tom_itx> just finished updating the psu steppers and drivers
[22:32:18] <Tom_itx> oh and switched to linuxcnc
[22:32:28] <Tom_itx> from my old control software
[22:36:04] <Tom_itx> http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/boards/USBTiny_Mkii/Boxes/milling1.jpg
[22:36:08] <Tom_itx> there's mine
[22:36:25] <uw> btw Valen jdhNC thank you for your help
[22:36:30] <Valen> nw
[22:36:39] <Tom_itx> looks a bit different now that it's rewired with larger steppers
[22:36:54] <Valen> awww its cute Tom_itx ;-P
[22:37:02] <Tom_itx> it works
[22:37:19] <Tom_itx> i'd rather have a full size one in a nice air conditioned shop
[22:37:21] <Valen> i'm just raggin on yer
[22:37:24] <Tom_itx> i know
[22:37:36] <Tom_itx> the process is still the same
[22:37:37] <Valen> direct drive on the steppers hrm
[22:37:47] <Tom_itx> they do ok
[22:38:02] <Tom_itx> i get about 80 ipm which is more than it can feed while cutting
[22:38:02] <Valen> i would have thaought belt reduction for more acceleration
[22:38:20] <Valen> acceleration seems to be the real figure of merit these days
[22:38:30] <Valen> at least for me
[22:38:36] <Tom_itx> i was getting about 20 to 25 max before
[22:38:45] <Tom_itx> so i'm happy with the upgrades
[22:38:46] <Valen> that might have been a bit low
[22:38:58] <Valen> what size are the ones in the pics 17?
[22:40:26] <Tom_itx> 23
[22:40:34] <Tom_itx> i went with 23 doublestack
[22:40:34] <Valen> you went bigger than 23?
[22:40:37] <Valen> wow
[22:40:55] <Valen> seems like overkill somehow
[22:41:02] <Tom_itx> why?
[22:41:21] <Valen> i *think* i see people driving bridgeports with 23s
[22:41:30] <Tom_itx> i don't think so
[22:41:49] <Tom_itx> http://www.kelinginc.net/NEMA23Motor.html
[22:41:52] <Tom_itx> #3 there
[22:41:56] <Tom_itx> is the one i have
[22:42:04] <Tom_itx> 282 oz in
[22:42:27] <Tom_itx> bp would take 400 to 500 i would think
[22:42:29] <Tom_itx> maybe more
[22:42:44] <Tom_itx> these aren't ballscrews either
[22:43:03] <Valen> they normally run a 4:1 reduction
[22:43:07] <Valen> and perhaps more volts
[22:43:13] <Valen> and ballscrews
[22:43:28] <Tom_itx> i'm at 50v now
[22:43:40] <Tom_itx> was 25 or thereabouts
[22:43:45] <Valen> you actually using the 50v?
[22:43:58] <Tom_itx> it's wired to the stepper drivers
[22:44:16] <Valen> i meant how much voltage is the driver giving to the motors during a rapid
[22:44:26] <Tom_itx> i dunno how to tell
[22:44:33] <Valen> scope it
[22:44:33] <Tom_itx> it's current limited to 3.5A
[22:44:53] <Tom_itx> the steppers are rated for 4.2
[22:45:15] <Valen> the psu is limited or the driver?
[22:45:19] <Tom_itx> the driver
[22:45:30] <Tom_itx> current limit resistors on each one
[22:46:02] <Tom_itx> they don't run hot, just warm to the touch
[22:46:06] <Tom_itx> the steppers get warmer
[22:46:16] <Tom_itx> but not any warmer than they used to
[22:46:27] <Valen> they shouldn't really
[22:46:41] <Valen> current limit resistor is probably a sense resistor
[22:46:45] <Valen> .0something ohms
[22:46:52] <Valen> (well hopefully lol)
[22:46:56] <Tom_itx> it's user selectable
[22:47:03] <Tom_itx> i put a 47k on it
[22:47:04] <Tom_itx> iirc
[22:47:21] <Valen> yeah, that'll be some kind of amplifier then
[22:47:39] <Tom_itx> it's quite a driver i think
[22:47:57] <Valen> http://finance.groups.yahoo.com/group/geckodrive/message/21085
[22:47:58] <Tom_itx> 1 sec after the last pulse is received it drops the current by 71%
[22:48:18] <Valen> using nema 23 steppers on a bp
[22:49:09] <Tom_itx> there are lots of different nema23 steppers though
[22:49:13] <Valen> true that
[22:49:33] <Tom_itx> some as high as 570 in oz
[22:49:37] <Valen> I'm trying to work out if i should go steppers or servos for our new mills
[22:49:40] <Tom_itx> look on the kelinginc page
[22:49:43] <Valen> we like servos
[22:49:50] <Valen> but they are spendy :-<
[22:49:53] <Tom_itx> i would to but these are cheaper
[22:50:06] <Tom_itx> and especially for this little mill
[22:50:21] <Tom_itx> i think it's working about as good as it can now
[22:50:36] <Tom_itx> beyond a mill upgrade
[22:50:44] <Valen> if it does what your after then its all good
[22:50:55] <Tom_itx> i'm always after more
[22:51:06] <Valen> our new mill is going to be 5 axis of stainless steel coated epoxy granite filled goodness ;->
[22:51:17] <Tom_itx> it's why i went with the drivers i did, so i can use them if i do upgrade
[22:57:02] <Tom_itx> now to find a proper enclosure for all the electronics
[23:08:12] <Jymmm> dumpster?
[23:10:17] <Jymmm> portable and room for expantion
[23:40:49] <uw> hey Tom_itx
[23:41:04] <uw> do you happen to have a config file for your sherline?
[23:41:27] <uw> that you wouldnt mind sharing?
