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[00:00:04] <iwoj> ha. thanks.
[00:00:06] <|n0b0dy|> ... otherwise you might not be loading the right conf ...
[00:00:39] <|n0b0dy|> should be a desktop icon that matches your setup's name
[00:00:46] <iwoj> that's the mystery. i use stepconf to generate configs, but when i load them into AXIS, it doesn't respond.
[00:01:02] <iwoj> yes, I've been using that.
[00:01:20] <iwoj> also, AXIS periodically freezes my machine.
[00:34:17] <fragalot> who here was it that had a monarch lathe? the one in my friends' shop just had hte original DC controller break on him & he's wondering what's available out there to replace it.
[02:03:59] <DJ9DJ> moin
[03:22:04] <pingufan> Good morning.
[03:24:54] <pingufan> I have a principal question on linux-cnc. When I installed my AXIS 2.3.5, I tried at that time (~ 2 years ago) first a newer version which was based on a different Ubuntu. At that time I experienced that this newer Ubuntu had troubpes with my graphics card (OnBoard, VIA Unicrome), so I installed the older one which works.
[03:26:08] <pingufan> Because I repeatedly hear that my version is very old, I think about trying the newest release.
[03:26:43] <pingufan> Does the newest release support Unicrome and Via C7 CPUs meanwhile?
[03:27:25] <pingufan> Does the new version (so I hope) support power-off on shutdown? Mine only tells "System halted" and I have to press the power button.
[03:28:08] <pingufan> Finally: Can I make a backup of the old configuration and use it in the new release, or are they incompatible?
[03:29:31] <pingufan> Please, if somebody here has experience in this, give me some details.
[03:34:20] <cncbasher> pingufan : you should find your configuration will swap over , or a few changes , nothing major
[03:35:23] <archivist> reading the docs and change logs helps
[03:35:30] <cncbasher> cpu support should be a lot better also
[03:58:56] <pingufan> Sounds good.
[04:00:55] <pingufan> archivist: You know: Reading docs is one thing. That is theory. But practice is often a little bit different. :D Therefore I prefer to ask about experiences before running into the same troubles as others.
[04:02:54] <archivist> if we dont get you learning your own experience we have to read the docs for you!
[04:10:02] <pingufan> We say in Austria to this practice: Let someone run into an open knife.
[04:12:34] <archivist> you have the equipment and are in the best place to try it and see
[04:14:38] <pingufan> Sure. But if one knows about (possible) troubles, I'd like to know them in advance before experience them, too. This is what I mean.
[04:14:59] <pingufan> Well, I heared that this should be working meanwhile, so it is worth a try.
[04:16:21] <archivist> I always use a clean hard disk so I can go back easily
[04:16:22] <pingufan> cncbasher: Thank you for your information.
[04:18:14] <pingufan> mhm. My machine has a little laptop harddisk, there's not more room inside. And this disks are not cheap. But you are basically right, that will be the safest way. I'll have a look if I have an old other disk, 6GB should be enough.
[05:39:04] <MattyMatt2> run-out is half the difference between min & max dial readings?
[05:41:42] <MattyMatt2> if so my $80 silverline drill press is 0.075mm = 0.003" at the chuck. suck it joe9 :)
[07:05:03] <joe9> MattyMatt2: runout of 0.003 inches at the chuck is awesome. more than good enough for me. mine is at 0.015 in to 0.020 inches at the chuck.
[07:10:04] <archivist> joe9, did you buy the drill new or used
[07:10:14] <joe9> archivist: used
[07:11:15] <archivist> ok more faults are possible bent spindle, and very likely is morse taper dirt/damage
[07:13:33] <joe9> i agree.
[07:13:59] <mazafaka> our hard-load drill press has a huge radial and even more worse vertical runout. This vertical runout makes me to make back surface of the drill bits almost horizontal - i.e. makes me make back angle about 1-3 degrees, never more.
[07:13:59] <joe9> at the quill, runout is 0.002 inches and I see a little flop in the bearings.
[07:14:29] <joe9> at the end of the arbor, the runout remains the same as that at the quill, prompting me to think that it is the bearings.
[07:14:51] <joe9> i am about to get new bearings, nothing wrong in trying them. if that does not help, the dp is out.
[08:39:26] <mazafaka> What id these bearings are adjustable with the use of screw nut on the spindle, which moves the inner ring of the bearing a little.
[08:53:00] <tehDarkAura> http://www.ebay.com/itm/290610314227 hey is this a good board to get ??
[08:53:00] <tehDarkAura> all i neet to do is drive 5 nema 23 or 17 steppers
[08:55:05] <tehDarkAura> the 3.5 amp rating i assume is per motor...
[08:55:55] <tehDarkAura> looks like it has a fairly nice heat sink :)
[08:56:47] <jdhnc> It's still a chinese TB6560
[08:56:59] <jdhnc> I have a 3-axis one that works fine for what it is and the price.
[08:57:45] <tehDarkAura> okay cool -- i think ill give it a go :) those mesa and other FPGA boards are a little intimidating ;)
[08:57:58] <jdhnc> not really the same thing
[08:58:25] <tehDarkAura> yeah using a par-port instead of the fpga just seems easier
[08:59:39] <jdhnc> they are motion control cards, not stepper drivers.
[09:00:32] <tehDarkAura> i see
[09:01:01] <jdhnc> you could use a pport-> mesanet 7i43 FPGA-> cheap chinese tb6560
[09:01:18] <tehDarkAura> ohhh i see
[09:02:01] <tehDarkAura> cant use Par-port -> Cheap chinese tb6560?
[09:02:44] <jdhnc> sure
[09:03:02] <jdhnc> if you are going to use a cheap chinese tb6560, it would be silly to use anything but a pport :)
[09:03:04] <tehDarkAura> ahh okay cool ;) thought i was really misunderstanding something ;)
[09:03:12] <tehDarkAura> okay cool :D
[09:04:05] <jdhnc> I did not like the performance of my not-so-great steppers and my tb6560 and not knowing any better, got a xylotex w/ motors
[09:04:23] <jdhnc> which is also fine, for what it is, but not what I would get now.
[09:07:19] <tehDarkAura> ahhh i see
[09:09:16] <tehDarkAura> Im just trying to do this on the cheap and have a slow pcb router in the end -- going to have the steppers attached to 1/2 10 TPI acme rods to controll the axis -- shouldnt require very much torch
[09:23:05] <jdhnc> I would like something like that also. Mine still has too much lash to be good for normal PCB's
[09:25:00] <tehDarkAura> ahhh backlash -- yeah im not far enough along to know much about that yet
[09:25:29] <tehDarkAura> does micro stepping help that at all?
[09:25:51] <tehDarkAura> less accuracy from what i've read though
[09:26:03] <jdhnc> no, mine comes from the acme nuts/screw
[09:26:15] <tehDarkAura> ohhh
[09:27:12] <MattyMatt2> those chinese boards need some mods to work well
[09:27:50] <tehDarkAura> easy stuff to do ? extra caps etc?
[09:28:00] <jdhnc> other than making sure the heat sink works?
[09:28:58] <MattyMatt2> my 2nd one has the quiet freq caps already, but you need to bypass the optos on step & dir or the max stepping rate is terrible
[09:29:18] <tehDarkAura> ohhh i see
[09:29:29] <jdhnc> oh, that. Mine wasn't whiney
[09:29:29] <tehDarkAura> good info thanks MattyMatt2 :)
[09:29:50] <MattyMatt2> the optos are near useless anyway, as the ground is common
[09:30:12] <MattyMatt2> and there's a buffer chip before the optos
[09:30:41] <tehDarkAura> ahh
[09:31:11] <MattyMatt2> so all the optos are doing is protecting one chip from the other, which share a psu :p all utterly pointless
[09:32:32] <MattyMatt2> only bypass the step and dir lines tho, the enable ones are wired differently
[09:32:56] <tehDarkAura> ahh cool -- added to the notebook -- :)
[09:32:58] <MattyMatt2> you'll need to look at a schematic for that, or the pics in the cnczone thread
[09:33:37] <MattyMatt2> beware that thread, it's massive and the first few mods involving extra chips are a distraction
[09:33:52] <MattyMatt2> but there's good advice on other things
[09:34:18] <MattyMatt2> chinese?
[09:34:26] <MattyMatt2> wrong bot :)
[09:37:27] <tehDarkAura> ;)
[10:17:57] <danimal_laptop> hi
[10:18:08] <ssi> hey danimal
[10:18:20] <danimal_laptop> hey
[10:18:29] <danimal_laptop> get your lathe yet?
[10:18:32] <danimal_laptop> lol
[10:21:32] <iwoj> hey gang. AXIS is causing my installation of EMC Linux to freeze the whole machine.
[10:21:40] <iwoj> any ideas what could be causing this?
[10:24:33] <ssi> danimal_laptop: I'm having an existential crisis, thank you very much
[10:25:27] <danimal_laptop> what happened ssi?
[10:28:49] <ssi> I can't decide if I want to embark on this nightmare journey to try to get this lathe, or wait for something different
[10:31:45] <jdhnc> where is it?
[10:31:51] <ssi> CT
[10:32:03] <jdhnc> I've heard of that place.
[10:32:05] <ssi> I'm in atlanta
[10:32:09] <jdhnc> "up north"
[10:32:14] <ssi> it'd be 40hr of driving
[10:32:26] <ssi> plus the guy doesn't have facilities to load the thing
[10:32:32] <ssi> so we'd be rolling it on pipes and plywood heh
[10:32:37] <iwoj> What do you need the lathe for?
[10:32:45] <ssi> what does anyone "need" anything for?! :D
[10:32:47] <iwoj> (Sounds like fun.)
[10:32:47] <jdhnc> to make round things
[10:33:12] <iwoj> long round things?
[10:33:20] <ssi> no, short round things only on this machine
[10:33:20] <ssi> heh
[10:34:21] <iwoj> Has anyone had any problems with EMC2 freezing on them?
[10:34:35] <ssi> danimal_laptop: I asked about whether the machine had the cutoff slide installed, and got a response back that no, it doesn't
[10:34:52] <ssi> and for some reason that tripped a switch in my brain that's making me not want to expend the effort to fetch it
[10:34:55] <ssi> heh
[10:35:11] <danimal_laptop> i have a cutoff slide, never used it
[10:35:14] <danimal_laptop> took it off
[10:35:27] <danimal_laptop> ssi it's easy as hell to move
[10:35:34] <danimal_laptop> dont let that stop you
[10:35:43] <danimal_laptop> it is a long trip though
[10:36:04] <danimal_laptop> ssi i unloaded mine out of the penske truck by myself
[10:36:16] <danimal_laptop> using the lift gate
[10:36:19] <ssi> go go moral support! :D
[10:36:29] <ssi> I guess i need to see what my boss says about taking friday off
[10:36:51] <jdhnc> 40 hours of driving would suck.
[10:36:52] <danimal_laptop> what's 40 hours when you're building a cool cnc lathe
[10:36:54] <skunkworks> danimal_laptop:
http://youtu.be/U61ub6mtpH4
[10:37:28] <ssi> then I got to looking at superslants... and they look WAY cooler
[10:37:40] <ssi> and I found old posts on the list about a guy that had one for sale two years ago
[10:37:40] <jdhnc> paying for $40 hours worth of gas?
[10:37:47] <ssi> and I called him, and he's already scrapped it
[10:37:53] <danimal_laptop> atlanta isnt that far
[10:38:07] <ssi> but he convinced me that a superslant would actually be a terrible idea
[10:38:30] <ssi> I'm not worried about the fuel cost; more the drive
[10:38:32] <danimal_laptop> i grew up in CT and i drove down to your area
[10:38:48] <ssi> I wish I had an airplane big enough to hold the damn lathe :D
[10:38:50] <danimal_laptop> nice skunkworks, i need to set up a probe
[10:39:15] <danimal_laptop> ssi, it's 1 day of driving each way
[10:39:31] <ssi> it's almost 20 hours! that's a hell of a day
[10:39:42] <danimal_laptop> if you drive like a little old lady
[10:39:44] <danimal_laptop> lol
[10:39:47] <ssi> our plan is to leave atlanta at around 4pm thursday
[10:39:52] <ssi> try to get to the VA border
[10:40:02] <ssi> then have all day friday to get to hartfordh
[10:40:17] <ssi> load saturday morning, get as far south saturday night as possible, and then home on sunday
[10:40:28] <jdhnc> heh... atlanta at 4 on a friday, should be out of town by 8pm
[10:40:36] <danimal_laptop> lol
[10:40:37] <ssi> nah it'll be fine
[10:40:53] <danimal_laptop> same with the 95 in CT... good luck
[10:40:53] <ssi> I know atlanta traffic, it's NYC I'm worried about :D
[10:41:23] <danimal_laptop> the 95 sucks no matter what up north
[10:41:32] <ssi> danimal_laptop: where are you now?
[10:41:46] <danimal_laptop> and they say socal traffic sucks.... it's way better here than back east
[10:41:51] <danimal_laptop> san diego, ca
[10:41:51] <tehDarkAura> I hate driving in NYC :/
[10:43:54] <iwoj> Does anyone have any thoughts on what could be causing the EMC freezing?
[10:44:28] <iwoj> It only happens when I launch AXIS or tkEMC
[10:44:28] <danimal_laptop> iwoj: are you using a mesa card or par part?
[10:45:05] <iwoj> danimal_laptop: parallel port
[10:45:20] <danimal_laptop> ah
[10:45:32] <danimal_laptop> i wont be of much help then
[10:46:06] <jdhnc> you could helpfully suggest he invest in mesa cards.
[10:46:36] <danimal_laptop> lol
[10:46:54] <danimal_laptop> i was going to say reseat the card in the slot, that happened to me once
[10:46:55] <iwoj> are mesa cards less of a hassle?
[10:47:15] <iwoj> the strange thing is that stepconf works just fine
[10:47:22] <iwoj> i can control the cnc machine from there
[10:47:28] <iwoj> but not from axis or txemc
[10:47:33] <danimal_laptop> odd
[10:47:38] <danimal_laptop> well i gotta run, adios
[10:47:40] <iwoj> i know, right?
[10:53:55] <mrsun> gah stupid incscape has put alot of strange vectors in place :(
[10:54:03] <mrsun> so dots have 3 vectors and f-engrave does not like it :P
[10:54:10] <pcw_home> We've got a full tank of gas, half a pack of cigarettes, it's dark, and we're wearing sunglasses.
[10:54:11] <pcw_home> - Hit it.
[11:03:46] <mrsun> hard fockers to spot also
[11:04:08] <mrsun> they look just fine, then there can be a coord right on the 0, 0 mark local to the vector
[11:04:29] <mrsun> or it can be a thingie that is bound somehow, so when i try and move it it jumps away then i can just move it in one direction, if i delete that then it works .. like wtf =)
[11:05:44] * skunkworks really needs to get the tool table setup with lengths.... I could use the probe as the reference tool.
[11:05:54] <skunkworks> *he
[11:07:32] <mrsun> lucky this is not a job for a customer :P
[11:16:36] <syyl> mh
[11:16:39] <syyl> made a mistake
[11:16:53] <syyl> touched of a few parts of my lathe with spotting blue...
[11:17:02] <syyl> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/24396704/IMG_0099.jpg
[11:17:11] <syyl> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/24396704/IMG_0092.jpg
[11:17:14] <syyl> not to good ;)
[11:17:29] <syyl> headstock is the best
[11:17:29] <syyl> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/24396704/IMG_0102.jpg
[11:24:43] <MrSunshine> syyl, perfect contact! =)
[11:24:59] <syyl> almost :D
[11:25:18] <syyl> i did the only thing, that made sense..
[11:26:03] <MrSunshine> one should never had gotten a surface plate and spotting blue
[11:26:14] <MrSunshine> EVERYTHING is crooked from the day you get it
[11:26:14] <syyl> thats the case with the chinese ;)
[11:26:17] <MrSunshine> no matter what
[11:26:26] <MrSunshine> not a single thing is made to "specs" :P
[11:26:51] <syyl> now i do this..
[11:26:51] <syyl> .
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/24396704/IMG_0103.jpg
[11:26:56] <syyl> rip it apart :D
[11:27:44] <MrSunshine> nice leadscrew covers =)
[11:27:55] <syyl> they work pretty good :)
[11:27:56] <syyl> ah
[11:27:58] <syyl> also funny
[11:27:59] <syyl> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/24396704/IMG_0100.jpg
[11:28:05] <syyl> ground topslide...
[11:28:18] <MrSunshine> syyl, thats about how my mill base looked when i spotted it
[11:28:26] <syyl> hehe
[11:28:28] <MrSunshine> or it was even worse
[11:28:37] <MrSunshine> one of the slides only had just one little part of a corner touching
[11:28:46] <syyl> you know what?
[11:28:52] <MrSunshine> now its fixed? :P
[11:28:54] <syyl> i worked four years with that lathe :D
[11:29:09] <syyl> made good parts...
[11:29:25] <syyl> but its time to fix it :D
[11:29:29] <MrSunshine> syyl, i guess if its manual you can stand a bit of stuff rubbing etc giving some resistance to move
[11:29:39] <MrSunshine> but when you throw steppers at it i dont realy want stuff to bind =)
[11:29:47] <syyl> hehe
[11:29:53] <syyl> it will stay manual
[11:30:01] <syyl> but some parts are just
[11:30:09] <syyl> *uargs* when you touch em
[11:30:42] <MrSunshine> atm im fighting inkscape
[11:30:45] <MrSunshine> stupid program
[11:30:53] <MrSunshine> i need some other vector graphics program i think ...
[11:31:16] <MrSunshine> stupid vectors are pointing all over the place, looking fine until you feed it to a v carving program
[11:31:19] <MrSunshine> stupid thing :/
[11:53:18] <anonimas1> I hate fanuc.
[11:53:32] <anonimas1> they must be the shittiest controls ever made.
[11:58:26] <pcw_home> I thought they were the reference standard by which all others were judged...
[12:01:07] <jdhnc> much like windows is?
[12:02:25] <pcw_home> exactly! We should all work on BillGs farm
[12:03:23] <syyl> windows should be reference for anything ;)
[12:03:36] <syyl> "oh my car has a bluescreen"
[12:03:42] <tehDarkAura> haha
[12:03:50] <syyl> ah
[12:03:50] <tehDarkAura> i like windows :P
[12:03:57] <syyl> it even has windows ;)
[12:19:04] <anonimas1> elmo40: limited
[12:19:17] <anonimas1> elmo40: i got a design change for 3mm holes instead of 2mm it should be way easier.
[12:21:54] <anonimas1> pcw_home: well, that dosent make them user friendly or remotely good
[12:22:20] <anonimas1> pcw_home: i have a old lathe with a fanuc10-tf i got it working.. but lost battery = hell
[12:22:52] <anonimas1> i guess the control is decent in 198x something..
[12:23:04] <anonimas1> but everything requires alot of button presses..
[12:24:10] <anonimas1> and you have to turn a key in the cabinet to be able to get jogging in two directions working.. -_-
[12:27:44] <IchGuckLive> hi all around this wonderful blue planet
[12:29:27] <ssi> bah nothing's ever simple
[12:29:38] <ssi> my boss may want me to be in NYC thursday afternoon
[12:29:58] <jdhnc> while you are there...
[12:30:07] <jdhnc> can you pick up a lathe for me?
[12:30:17] <ssi> mebbe!
[12:30:34] <pcw_home> anonimas1: well its obvious you should upgrade to a 22I
[12:32:03] <ssi> syyl: can you tell me about those screw covers on your Z screw?
[12:34:21] <IchGuckLive> vladimirek: still cold in slowakia ?
[12:36:52] <skunkworks> gah - I guess the only way you can rigid tap on cheaper commercial machines is by putting a servo on the spindle.
[12:37:23] <ssi> why's that?
[12:37:25] <anonimas1> 22i?
[12:37:56] <anonimas1> it costs like 17 times then the iron :)
[12:37:58] <IchGuckLive> skunkworks: how cheep how tal
[12:38:06] <anonimas1> and the current control
[12:39:07] <IchGuckLive> anonimas1: good stuff is pricy
[12:39:15] <skunkworks> anonimas1: You should find some software that you can convert it to computer control.... ;)
[12:39:30] <anonimas1> haha, find me the time and I know just the software
[12:39:32] <anonimas1> ;)
[12:40:01] <skunkworks> you need to find a few minions...
[12:40:20] <anonimas1> got a few hundred parts to make and four five shafts, and some other stuff...
[12:40:51] <anonimas1> and some more automation projects in the works..
[12:40:58] <anonimas1> so much for machining as hobby :)
[12:41:19] <IchGuckLive> anonimas1: ask a chinese to do the job
[12:41:37] <anonimas1> -_-
[12:41:43] <anonimas1> it wouldnt be my hobby then would it
[12:41:44] <IchGuckLive> O.O
[12:42:05] <IchGuckLive> Steel parts or brass
[12:42:18] <anonimas1> steel
[12:42:40] <IchGuckLive> brighport or heavy duty
[12:43:19] <anonimas1> heavier
[12:43:30] <anonimas1> the shafts are some 450mpa steel
[12:43:37] <IchGuckLive> so take your time and do it your own
[12:43:49] <anonimas1> 80mm dia and 700mm long
[12:44:03] <anonimas1> yes, but converting my machines meanwhile keeping up with other stuff dosent owrk
[12:44:06] <anonimas1> work.
[12:44:29] <IchGuckLive> thats whar we all fighting agaiunst
[12:46:45] <anonimas1> hobby gone bad..
[12:48:18] <ssi> all hobbies are bad
[12:48:25] <ssi> they're giant ass money and time pitv
[12:48:27] <ssi> pits
[12:52:21] <A2Sheds> PCW: are the new PCIe cards out yet?
[12:56:50] <PCW> protos soon: freeby.mesanet.com/6i25mech.pdf is first, then some cabled PCIE ones
[12:58:25] <A2Sheds> PCW: deciding on boards for 3 axis flatbed printers
[12:59:25] <A2Sheds> 3 servos, 3 encoders and some GPIO
[13:00:22] <ssi> oo shiny
[13:00:39] <IchGuckLive> 3 most need 4
[13:00:46] <IchGuckLive> C-axis or B
[13:01:24] <A2Sheds> just 3 here
[13:01:57] <A2Sheds> IchGuckLive, whats the 4th motor for?
[13:05:41] <IchGuckLive> C-axis or B
[13:06:13] <A2Sheds> IchGuckLive, what does that axis do?
[13:06:29] <A2Sheds> what does it move?
[13:07:02] <IchGuckLive> a table around the X axis to go 3.5D
[13:07:41] <A2Sheds> wierd
[13:08:10] <IchGuckLive> oh A not B C
[13:08:25] <IchGuckLive> A around X Baround Y C around Z
[13:09:03] <A2Sheds> have a pic or a link to a printer of that type?
[13:09:26] <A2Sheds> maybe it's still too early here
[13:09:27] <IchGuckLive> oh arend we talking on mills sorry
[13:10:39] <A2Sheds> heh, i was trying to picture what the hell kind of printer that would be :)
[13:10:52] <ssi> you and me both!
[13:12:37] <IchGuckLive> makerbot 4D
[13:14:10] <A2Sheds> http://code.google.com/p/lemoncurry/wiki/main photopolymers are done
[13:14:57] <A2Sheds> just using an atmega and a stepper driver for the z-axis
[13:14:58] <IchGuckLive> lemoncurry that sunds spicy
[13:16:24] <IchGuckLive> im off for today have a nice working day today or tomorrow where ever you are on this nice planet
[13:17:37] <ssi> A2Sheds: wow that's nice
[13:17:41] <A2Sheds> PCW: I was thinking about adding a Xilinx FPGA to an eoma68 card making them compatible with the daughter IO cards
[13:17:59] <A2Sheds> ssi: thanks
[13:18:10] <ssi> I want to HAVE THAT
[13:18:13] <ssi> please :)
[13:18:24] <A2Sheds> kits are almost done
[13:18:33] <ssi> what's it likely to cost?
[13:19:07] <A2Sheds> they start under $1K and include everything
[13:30:48] <ssi> that'll be fun
[13:31:58] <A2Sheds> you can order resin to play with
[13:48:57] <tom3p> A2Sheds, very bleeding edge, and BucktownPolymers as in 'bucktown'! i forgot you were Chicago based :)
[13:53:41] <A2Sheds> yeah Bucktown/Wicker Park
[13:55:44] <tom3p> :) UrbisOrbis for coffee
[13:58:20] <A2Sheds> I miss the old Filter
[14:07:22] <tom3p> fwiw the halgui tools now handle side swapping of pins
http://edmsolutionsservice.com/pix/halguiHandlePinSideSwap.ogv
[15:01:29] <iwoj> Has anyone here experiences their EMC2 apps freezing their machine?
[15:01:42] <jdhnc> NO
[15:02:00] <skunkworks> only when I do something wrong..
[15:02:06] <skunkworks> have you tried the sim configs?
[15:02:09] <jdhnc> unless you count trying to run emc via X over an ssh tunnel.
[15:02:11] <iwoj> When I launch AXIS or tkEMC, it will run for a while and then Linux freezes...
[15:02:27] <jdhnc> dead dead? nothing in the logs?
[15:02:28] <iwoj> sim configs?
[15:02:31] <skunkworks> have you run the memory check on the system?
[15:02:48] <skunkworks> So - it runs for a bit?
[15:02:56] <iwoj> The system runs fine in stepconf
[15:03:04] <iwoj> and the OS itself is stable.
[15:03:24] <skunkworks> That almost sounds like a hardware issue.. (overheating / memory issue or such)
[15:03:34] <archivist> what was the latency test like
[15:03:35] <iwoj> but when i run the configs generated by stepconf in AXIS, it freezes.
[15:03:45] <jdhnc> GL problem?
[15:03:46] <iwoj> around 20000
[15:03:56] <iwoj> GL draws.
[15:04:06] <iwoj> I've got an NVidia Gforce card.
[15:04:31] <skunkworks> Did you install the closed source video driver?
[15:04:40] <iwoj> yes
[15:05:07] <skunkworks> That could be your problem also. You should stick with the opensource NV or vesa
[15:06:07] <iwoj> I'll double-check. But strange that it should fail only when running the EMC2 software.
[15:06:33] <iwoj> I was wondering if it might be a RT kernel timing issue.
[15:06:39] <skunkworks> This has some good info too..
http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?TroubleShooting
[15:08:04] <iwoj> awesome. thanks.
[15:08:10] <skunkworks> in the sample configs - there are simulated machine configs. try one of those..
[15:08:16] <skunkworks> sims
[15:12:46] <iwoj> thanks man
[15:41:08] <ssi> anyone have any experience running encoders with steppers?
[15:46:13] <pjm> ssi
http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Steppers_With_Encoders
[15:47:55] <ssi> hrm
[16:03:59] <syyl_ws> (i run steppers with glas scales
[16:04:02] <syyl_ws> does that count?
[16:04:25] <JT-Shop> I have a stepper that spins an encoder... for fun
[16:04:41] <ssi> haha
[16:04:59] <ssi> I have a couple of encoders, was thinking about putting them on the back shafts of my lathe motors to try to improve my homing
[16:05:18] <ssi> I realize that they won't help the positional error caused by slop in the screws or couplings
[16:05:29] <syyl_ws> right
[16:05:33] <syyl_ws> to compensate that
[16:05:37] <syyl_ws> you will need glas scales
[16:05:48] <ssi> yeah scales would be a nice option
[16:05:53] <syyl_ws> or some kind of other linear/direct encoders...
[16:06:18] <ssi> syyl_ws: what was that machine you were posting pictures of spotting on earlier?
[16:06:22] <ssi> looked like a g0602
[16:06:42] <syyl_ws> naa
[16:06:49] <syyl_ws> only my mill is cnc
[16:07:13] <ssi> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/24396704/IMG_0103.jpg
[16:07:14] <ssi> that
[16:07:34] <syyl_ws> no, thats my lathe...
[16:07:39] <syyl_ws> or whats left of it ;)
[16:07:48] <ssi> yeah... it's very similar to my g0602
[16:07:51] <ssi> almost exactly the same castings
[16:07:55] <syyl_ws> :)
[16:08:05] <ssi> where'd those screw covers come from?
[16:08:10] <syyl_ws> now its only a big pile of chinese castings and a lot of work...
[16:08:18] <syyl_ws> they were stock...
[16:08:22] <ssi> really
[16:08:25] <syyl_ws> i am pretty happy about them
[16:08:26] <syyl_ws> yes
[16:08:26] <ssi> who made that machine?
[16:08:34] <syyl_ws> its a HBM 250x550
[16:08:50] <syyl_ws> thats the importeur
[16:08:50] <syyl_ws> http://www.buitelaar.nl/
[16:09:09] <syyl_ws> strange language...
[16:09:49] <ssi> http://www.grizzly.com/products/10-x-22-Bench-Top-Metal-Lathe/G0602
[16:10:17] <syyl_ws> looks absoulte similar
[16:10:26] <syyl_ws> except the springcovers :D
[16:10:27] <ssi> yeah it's the same castings I'm pretty sure
[16:10:34] <ssi> I wonder if I could get those covers
[16:10:42] <syyl_ws> all the same chinese fun...
[16:15:50] <mikegg> shit guys, I just got a sweet job offer today. and then I found out they do hair follicle drug testing. which goes back 90 days.
[16:16:17] <jdhnc> shave your head
[16:16:24] <mikegg> I think DARE needs a new slogan: "careers: to keep thirty-somethings from recreational drug use"
[16:16:39] <mikegg> I think that's the plan
[16:16:55] <mikegg> but then they look elsewhere, which will need to be shaved too
[16:17:11] <jdhnc> I'm subject to random drug testing
[16:17:12] <cradek> if a place does shit like that, it's probably not really going to be a sweet job
[16:17:46] <mikegg> well, it's just pre-employment, not continual.
[16:17:51] <|n0b0dy|> mike bleach and dye, bleach and dye
[16:18:00] <DJ9DJ> gn8
[16:18:32] <mikegg> wow, you guys are awesome, I thought everyone was going to tell me i'm a fool
[16:18:50] <jdhnc> for doing drugs?
[16:18:54] <cradek> well you might be a fool too
[16:19:03] <mikegg> hah
[16:19:35] <|n0b0dy|> this is probably the remove warning labels and let life sort things out...
[16:19:37] <ssi> what kind of job
[16:19:39] <cradek> doing certain drugs while looking for work in an industry that tends to test for them is foolish, but you probably already know that
[16:20:11] <cradek> but if the test is atypical, then probably taking a pass on the job is smart, if possible
[16:20:28] <mikegg> mechanical engineering with big oil in houston
[16:21:21] <cradek> I had one when starting work for a pharma company (many years ago) but you expect it there
[16:21:56] <mikegg> yeah, I would expect it for like a rig job given the current climate, but this is a desk job
[16:22:06] <cradek> yuck
[16:22:13] <|n0b0dy|> insurance...
[16:22:36] <cradek> no, authoritarianism
[16:22:41] <mikegg> yeah yeah, there is some field work involved
[16:22:55] <|n0b0dy|> insurance companies offer cheaper rates if you drug test...
[16:23:03] <tehDarkAura> eww -- hair folicle testing
[16:23:05] <mikegg> really?
[16:23:11] <tehDarkAura> i just had to pee in a cup once
[16:23:14] <mikegg> for what, like car insurance?
[16:23:15] <tehDarkAura> :P
[16:23:28] <cradek> I'd say that kind of thing too, if I wanted to drug test my employees
[16:23:29] <mikegg> I'd be thrilled to pee in a cup
[16:23:32] <jdhnc> I had to pee in a cup, with some guy watching me to make sure it was me.
[16:23:34] <|n0b0dy|> workers comp... health insurance... disaster insurance...
[16:23:53] <|n0b0dy|> think about a bunch of crackheads running a chemical plant...
[16:23:59] <mikegg> they can look at my tallywhacker all they want
[16:24:10] <tehDarkAura> hahaha
[16:24:45] <tehDarkAura> i've never had someone watch me pee
[16:25:08] <Connor> Are they looking for ALL drugs or just hard core stuff?
[16:25:14] <tehDarkAura> i was even on probation for a while when younger :P they just sent me to a room
[16:25:42] <tehDarkAura> if you dont have a script for it your not gonna get the job in my experience
[16:26:39] <mikegg> i'm leaning towards the hairless option. they can give me a pee test, or hair when it grows back
[16:26:59] <tehDarkAura> they might look otherplaces for hair if you go there saved ;)
[16:27:13] <tehDarkAura> no way your getting every hair off your back -- etc
[16:27:18] <tehDarkAura> *shaved
[16:27:19] <mikegg> that's a valid personal hygiene preference, right?
[16:27:19] <cradek> you could shave everything, but isn't that a bit ... obvious?
[16:27:31] <tehDarkAura> yeah i think thats a bit obvious
[16:27:33] <Connor> Swimmer.
[16:27:44] <mikegg> i'm not a real hairy fella
[16:27:46] <tehDarkAura> they can tell by your lack of tanning in the shaved area you just did it
[16:28:32] <mikegg> but then what? "we noticed your head is peeling, wtf mate?"
[16:28:40] <tehDarkAura> hahha
[16:29:07] <jdhnc> "must be a false positive, check again next month"
[16:29:18] <tehDarkAura> its not like they are gonna look mat your bald head and decide to let you off the test ;) i bet they have plans for situations like that
[16:29:18] <mikegg> the company outsources to Hire Right
[16:29:36] <mikegg> sure sure, so do I :)
[16:30:12] <tehDarkAura> you dont have a headshop nearby?
[16:30:29] <tehDarkAura> id say get something from there and die you hair on top of that
[16:30:40] <tehDarkAura> cover your bases without looking too suspect
[16:30:44] <mikegg> yeah, not sure i'm willing to trust those folks
[16:31:06] <mikegg> $24.99 and a 100% money back guarantee
[16:31:14] <tehDarkAura> check the reviews online after you find what brands they have available
[16:31:35] <tehDarkAura> take your phone with you and check while there ;)
[16:31:40] <jdhnc> http://www.passhairdrugtest.com/
[16:31:50] <mikegg> they are all pretty much strong bases I think
[16:31:53] <tehDarkAura> i would check at norml
[16:31:57] <mikegg> I bought some draino
[16:32:16] <tehDarkAura> there you tend to get more real results instead of paid ads
[16:33:00] <tehDarkAura> but i bet thats mostly for thc -- depends what your vice is too i would guess
[16:33:33] <mikegg> *gasp THC i'm not worried about
[16:33:48] <jdhnc> shooting up heroin again?
[16:34:00] <mikegg> only on weekends!
[16:34:07] <tehDarkAura> ;)
[16:34:57] <tehDarkAura> i dont think coke shows up very good in any tests
[16:35:19] <jdhnc> people still do coke?
[16:35:43] <tehDarkAura> yeah i know -- xtc is way better right?
[16:35:47] <tehDarkAura> ;)
[16:36:38] <mikegg> I went out and got a John Q Doe hair test today on my own
[16:36:41] <tehDarkAura> crack is like coke -- only have a few days (if that) to test positive
[16:36:56] <tehDarkAura> not sure about the injectables
[16:37:08] <mikegg> 3-5 days and $120 to see where I stand
[16:37:50] <|n0b0dy|> yea thats urine... i think coke is stronger in the hair
[16:38:22] <tehDarkAura> i know acid is hard to find in UA but super easy to find in hair -- you might be right
[16:39:37] <|n0b0dy|> to beat the hair you gotta open up the cells, and get something in there that transforms the metabolites to their stage in their chemical life cycle...
[16:40:57] <tehDarkAura> if its a perscibable drug -- or has something similar that is -- you should just go to a pain doctor and get a script
[16:41:11] <mikegg> I can handle that...
[16:41:17] <tehDarkAura> then your legally covered and dont have to worry about it
[16:41:33] <mikegg> it's the non-prescribables...
[16:41:39] <tehDarkAura> thats what i did ;) got a marinol perscription ;)
[16:42:01] <tehDarkAura> ahhh
[16:42:33] <mikegg> I bought a whole bunch of methanol - ready to bite the bullet
[16:43:27] <mikegg> but then i read a study that said methanol INCREASED metabolite detection as a result of increased digestion when they analyze the hair. or some such nonesense
[16:44:16] <mikegg> If I have time, I will try the bleach dye, and maybe mix in some Lye for good measure
[16:44:27] <mikegg> then test again to see if I'm below the limits
[16:44:48] <tehDarkAura> wow they have home hair test kits?
[16:44:52] <mikegg> here's the kicker - family reunion this weekend for Gramma's 90th
[16:45:08] <tehDarkAura> ;) happy b-day granny!
[16:45:11] <mikegg> heh
[16:45:48] <mikegg> not looking forward to explaining to the fam what's wrong with my hair
[16:46:09] <mikegg> argh
[16:46:16] <tehDarkAura> lol -- tell themm your really into eminem now ;)
[17:58:03] <mikegg> well thanks for your support, fellas. Me and Johnny walker will let you know how it turns out..
[17:58:50] <Tom_itx> he's pretty good at making things look a whole lot better
[17:59:24] <alex4nder> just don't hang out with him with an active spindle on a new program.
[18:00:27] <FinboySlick> Hehehe, for some reason this talk reminds me of this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EF1V8HFfpTE (Though it's vodka)
[18:00:48] <FinboySlick> the chainsaw bit specifically.
[18:52:21] <iwoj> EMC2 keeps crashing on me. I'm wondering if you guys can make any sense from these log details:
[18:52:21] <iwoj> Feb 28 16:30:34 krakow kernel: [ 617.696815] I-pipe: Domain RTAI registered.
[18:52:21] <iwoj> Feb 28 16:30:34 krakow kernel: [ 617.696820] RTAI[hal]: <3.8.1> mounted over IPIPE-NOTHREADS 2.6-03.
[18:52:21] <iwoj> Feb 28 16:30:34 krakow kernel: [ 617.696822] RTAI[hal]: compiled with gcc version 4.4.3 (Ubuntu 4.4.3-4ubuntu5) .
[18:52:21] <iwoj> Feb 28 16:30:34 krakow kernel: [ 617.696844] RTAI[hal]: mounted (IPIPE-NOTHREADS, IMMEDIATE (INTERNAL IRQs DISPATCHED), ISOL_CPUS_MASK: 0).
[18:52:21] <iwoj> Feb 28 16:30:34 krakow kernel: [ 617.696846] PIPELINE layers:
[18:52:21] <iwoj> Feb 28 16:30:34 krakow kernel: [ 617.696848] f8205e20 9ac15d93 RTAI 200
[18:52:21] <iwoj> Feb 28 16:30:34 krakow kernel: [ 617.696850] c085cb20 0 Linux 100
[18:52:21] <iwoj> Feb 28 16:30:34 krakow kernel: [ 617.712979] RTAI[malloc]: global heap size = 2097152 bytes, <BSD>.
[18:52:22] <iwoj> Feb 28 16:30:34 krakow kernel: [ 617.713148] RTAI[sched]: IMMEDIATE, MP, USER/KERNEL SPACE: <with RTAI OWN KTASKs>, kstacks pool size = 524288 bytes.
[18:52:22] <iwoj> Feb 28 16:30:34 krakow kernel: [ 617.713153] RTAI[sched]: hard timer type/freq = APIC/12603182(Hz); default timing: periodic; linear timed lists.
[18:52:23] <iwoj> Feb 28 16:30:34 krakow kernel: [ 617.713156] RTAI[schFeb 28 16:39:29 krakow kernel: imklog 4.2.0, log source = /proc/kmsg started.
[18:53:06] <iwoj> Sorry. Annoying. I should have just posted this:
[18:53:06] <iwoj> http://typewith.me/p/MJGTUKnksK
[19:09:47] <iwoj> I tried running my machine with the VESA driver instead of the nvidia driver, but it still freezes.
[19:11:48] <jthornton> does another gui like mini or keystick work fine?
[19:12:00] <jthornton> might be an opengl issue
[19:18:43] <iwoj> I tried tkEMC
[19:18:50] <iwoj> i don't think it uses opengl
[19:18:57] <iwoj> let me try mini
[19:24:54] <iwoj> no, mini also stalls the OS
[19:25:25] <iwoj> Could it be some kind of timing problem?
[19:26:04] <iwoj> I set-up stepconf with 50000ns maxjitter
[19:30:58] <iwoj> I think I've found the problem.
[19:31:18] <iwoj> running the latency tester I get values above 80000
[19:31:26] <iwoj> but stepconf maxes out at 50000
[19:31:46] <iwoj> is there a way to reduce latency or set the value above the max?
[19:34:35] <skunkKandT> above 80 is really starting to be bad for step gen
[19:36:50] <iwoj> are there ways to tune the system to reduce latency?
[19:37:52] <skunkKandT> wahat is the system?
[19:38:56] <iwoj> the hardware?
[19:39:01] <skunkKandT> yes
[19:39:26] <mikegg> http://rtai.dk/cgi-bin/gratiswiki.pl?Latency_Killer
[19:40:01] <iwoj> http://typewith.me/p/COmEf3a2QK
[19:40:51] <iwoj> good link.
[19:40:52] <iwoj> thanks.
[19:41:05] <iwoj> the typepad link has my system specs
[19:44:19] <danimal_laptop> hi
[19:50:42] <skunkKandT> heh - coordinate rotation is cool.
[20:01:15] <elmo40> anonimas1: yes. 3mm should be easier.
[20:21:24] <joe9> does anyone know how to remove the pulley spindle of a drill press. It has a 22mm nut, but, I cannot hold the pulley tight enough to turn that nut with a wrench.
[20:21:34] <joe9> Is there any smart way of removing it?
[20:21:46] <joe9> I read about "A/C pulley clutch" remover tool.
[20:21:52] <joe9> Is that a good idea?
[20:25:16] <jdhnc> I think you have to get the nut off before that works
[20:27:12] <jdhnc> pipe wrench on the small pulley perhaps
[20:30:01] <skunkKandT> air impact wrench?
[20:30:08] <skunkKandT> or tap the wrench
[20:30:11] <Loetmichel> re @ home
[20:43:28] <joe9> jdhnc: I could not get the pipe wrench to hold the small pulley.
[20:43:42] <joe9> the biggest one has jaws that are more than 3/8 inch wide.
[20:44:22] <joe9> and the smallest pipe wrench, the jaws do not open wide enough to hold the pulley.
[20:44:48] <joe9> impact wrench would work. unfortunately, I do not have one.
[20:45:36] <joe9> jdhnc: i thout that the "A/C clutch removal tool" will remove that nut..?
[20:45:39] <joe9> maybe, I am wrong.
[20:48:12] <A2Sheds> http://akroncanton.craigslist.org/tls/2823431007.html bridgeport or?? I've never seen a tilt by bridgeport
[20:48:41] <jdhnc> we have a bridgeport at work that tilts
[20:49:08] <cstop> nods gracefully
[20:51:45] <hatch789> PCW, if you're here do you have any idea why my hal meter shows my resolver velocity in motion when the machine is at rest?
[20:53:55] <pcw_home> Do you have 5V on the 7I49 now (and resolver drive and sine /cos coming back)?
[20:54:54] <hatch789> I have 4.65 solid on the 7i49
[20:55:09] <hatch789> I have wired the power into the 7i43 directly from the pc now
[20:55:39] <hatch789> when you say resolver drive sine/cos coming back what are you meaning there?
[20:56:04] <hatch789> I have positively ensured that each pair is isolated, no leaking and that none are wired in reverse now
[20:56:11] <|n0b0dy|> http://houston.craigslist.org/tls/2841774083.html
[20:56:51] <hatch789> pcw_home, on my resolver driver pins I show 4.17v from both pins when tested to ground
[20:57:10] <hatch789> all lights are lit up properly now (all 3) on the 7i49 board
[20:57:49] <pcw_home> OK thats a lot better (output is a balanced bridge 1/2 way up the 8V supply so dont short then to ground)
[20:58:23] <pcw_home> Can you measure the AC output signal now
[20:59:22] <hatch789> not shorting them, just testing voltage to ground on those resolver driver pins
[20:59:33] <hatch789> ac signal output on what?
[21:00:05] <pcw_home> across the drive pins
[21:00:26] <pcw_home> just to make sure you have the sine wave exitation
[21:00:45] <hatch789> 2.44 v
[21:01:11] <hatch789> 2.72v AC on sin
[21:01:15] <hatch789> 1.93v on AC cos
[21:01:24] <hatch789> 1.93vac on cos
[21:01:39] <hatch789> the 2.44vac is across the driver pins
[21:03:40] <pcw_home> can you rotate the shaft till you get the maximum signal on sine or cosine?
[21:05:23] <hatch789> yes, but I'll need to add another pair of wires into the pins to bring those leads out to my meter while I'm up at the handwheels
[21:05:51] <hatch789> is there a way to use the hal meter or hal scope to see those readings without my external wires and volt meter?
[21:07:33] <pcw_home> OK well anyway looks signal amplitude is too big (so you either need to use channels 4,5,6 with the 1/2 scale option) or divide the input down (a couple resistors)
[21:08:35] <pcw_home> The current firmware does not do AGC so you have to manually get the amplitudes close
[21:09:49] <hatch789> ok I think I follow
[21:09:53] <hatch789> driver voltage is too high
[21:10:00] <hatch789> hence signals on sin/cos are out of range?
[21:10:10] <pcw_home> But I think the problem with spinning while standing still is the firmware bug I mentioned (a bug in WebPack)
[21:10:31] <hatch789> how do I update my firmware?
[21:10:53] <pcw_home> So I can send you a new bitfile tommorow that should fix that
[21:11:02] <hatch789> ok
[21:11:08] <hatch789> chris@oupower.com
[21:12:20] <pcw_home> (I can even make one with lower drive amplitude) I dont think I want to mess with the AGC stuff until I have a full free day to work on it
[21:13:07] <hatch789> will one with a lower drive amplitude negate the need for me to use resistors on my driver windings?
[21:13:16] <pcw_home> Yes
[21:13:28] <hatch789> if that's easy for you to do it would be nice
[21:15:14] <hatch789> getting you those max sin and cos readings right now
[21:15:22] <hatch789> I figured out a way to do it easily
[21:15:25] <pcw_home> The resolver part of the driver could allow access to the excitation drive amplitude as well but since
[21:15:26] <hatch789> hold on if you want to know
[21:15:27] <pcw_home> Andy is embarking on a 2 month sailing trip I dont think thats going to get added anytime soon
[21:15:55] <ssi> he seems to do that a lot :P
[21:16:44] <hatch789> 3.5vac on SIN is max
[21:16:49] <hatch789> testing cos now
[21:17:03] <pcw_home> well his job keeps him on the go, funny he doesnt stay home for vacation...
[21:17:21] <hatch789> same for COS
[21:17:35] <pcw_home> good sign...
[21:17:55] <hatch789> good how?
[21:18:21] <pcw_home> well if they were not the same it indicates a bad resolver
[21:19:25] <pcw_home> OK tommorow Ill make a new bit file
[21:20:00] <hatch789> ok
[21:20:09] <hatch789> are those values too high?
[21:20:09] <ssi> how hard is it for one of us consumers to make our own bit files?
[21:20:24] <hatch789> too high for EMC to read?
[21:22:00] <pcw_home> ssi not too hard but you need Xilinx webpack (~5G download)
[21:22:28] <mikegg> Tom_itx made a pretty good write up. lemme see if I can find it
[21:23:30] <mikegg> http://tom-itx.dyndns.org:81/~webpage/emc/xilinx/xilinx_install_index.php
[21:24:27] <ssi> sweet
[21:24:32] <ssi> I've worked with ISE beforeu, but it's been ages
[21:24:35] <pcw_home> what happens if the ampiltude is too great is that the peaks and valleys get clipped so the resolver angle thats calculated is wrong
[21:24:37] <pcw_home> for those portions of the rotation where the clipping happens
[21:25:18] <hatch789> so is 3.5v too great?
[21:25:20] <hatch789> causing clipping?
[21:25:29] <pcw_home> Yes
[21:25:36] <hatch789> what should it be at max?
[21:25:59] <pcw_home> it should still kind of work, just be inaccurate
[21:26:07] <hatch789> ahh
[21:26:17] <pcw_home> about 1V RMS
[21:26:30] <hatch789> oh wow 1v. so my biggest problem right now might just be the firmware issue?
[21:27:15] <ssi> I'm gonna have to go thorugh all this mess soon myself, if I get this HNC
[21:27:17] <ssi> it's all resolvers
[21:28:15] <hatch789> well it's really not bad at all :)
[21:28:25] <cstop> could one reduce the resolver excitation voltage?
[21:28:34] <hatch789> I am a total newb and with some help from PCW and CNC Basher I'm in good shape
[21:28:38] <pcw_home> Probably, the spinning issue is a know problem with bitfiles compiled wit the bad version of webpack
[21:30:03] <hatch789> so right now, even if I add resistors to my excitor winding to bring the sin/cos RMS down, it won't really help anything?
[21:30:05] <pcw_home> Yes thats the easiest (if you reduce sin/cos you need to do it accurately matched or you get elliptical interpolation)
[21:30:55] <hatch789> yeah it would be hard to get exact resistors with little to no error between them
[21:31:23] <ssi> hand-pick 1% resistors
[21:31:29] <ssi> or you can likely order more precision ones
[21:31:43] <hatch789> so right now my AXIS screen is on and as I turn the wheels I see no movement in the X & Y axis readings on screen. Should I see them at least trying to move?
[21:31:57] <hatch789> I was just hoping to see something (kind of)
[21:32:31] <pcw_home> gettting the amplitude right will probably not help
[21:32:33] <pcw_home> Ive seen the spinning thing entirely too much
[21:32:37] <pcw_home> (I thought it was a software bug so spent about 2 days trying to fix it in the resolver DSP code)
[21:34:28] <mikegg> I wonder if you could make an ellipse into a circle with comp
[21:35:11] <pcw_home> Do you have a fairly recent Linuxcnc 2.5? there were some bugs fixed Maybe around January
[21:35:44] <cstop> pcw I've missed something....what "spinning thing" are you referring to?
[21:36:52] <cstop> spinning while at stand still?
[21:37:00] <pcw_home> The resolver interface provide a velocity pin. Some bitfiles compiled with Webpack 9.2 have a bug that causes the velocity to be non 0 when idle
[21:37:26] <cstop> Clear!
[21:38:26] <ssi> ooh, so the 7i49 has the servo outputs on it too, huh
[21:38:35] <pcw_home> (and none of the resolver signals to work)
[21:38:37] <pcw_home> its a wonderful bug, it makes small counters (~8 bits or less)
[21:38:39] <pcw_home> not count if the whole design is complex enough
[21:38:59] <ssi> so basically it's the only thing I need besides the servo amps off the machine
[21:39:27] <pcw_home> Yes its like a 7I48 but with resolver in instead of encoder
[21:39:39] <Tecan> hey got a question
[21:39:49] <Tecan> on a co2 laser the gold side goes to the light right ?
[21:40:08] <ssi> I haven't dealt with servo machines at all yet.... my one and only mesa-based system is all stepper
[21:41:05] <pcw_home> You get to learn tuning...
[21:41:20] <cstop> If one is controlling a commercial Servo drive (read Yaskawa) with a "simulated encoder output" Is the 7I48 the best match up?
[21:41:23] <Tecan> on the mirror
[21:41:29] <ssi> woo
[21:41:46] <ssi> I've tuned pid loops before, thankfully :D
[21:41:52] <pcw_home> Probably or 7I33 or 5I25/7I77
[21:48:23] <cstop> So if a combined system, ie servo and stepper, the combination might be 5i20 or 5i25 along with a 7i77 and a 7i78?
[21:48:39] <cstop> Is the 5i25 sufficient?
[21:49:32] <pcw_home> Yes you could have a 5I25/7I77/7I78 combo
[21:51:42] <cstop> The application is a process tool that increments vert, and rotary, while feeding long.
[21:52:00] <pcw_home> that would give you 6 servo axis + 4 step/dir + spindle encoder +spindle analog +48 I/O + 2 RS-422 expansion ports for more I/O
[21:53:51] <hatch789> how do I tune my signal input to my servos so they are 0v? right now X is .009v and Y is .003v
[21:53:59] <hatch789> is there a way to adjust those in tiny increments?
[21:55:04] <cstop> hatch how did you measure those very small values?
[21:55:41] <hatch789> with my volt meter across the 7i49 boards pins for the servo signal
[21:55:46] <pcw_home> You can do it with the bias parameter of the PID loop
[21:55:59] <hatch789> is that under calibration?
[21:56:48] <pcw_home> I doubt if anyone really bothers, a .1% offset is not significant
[21:57:01] <hatch789> ok ...just checking
[21:57:08] <pcw_home> once the feedback loop is closed
[21:57:39] <hatch789> by that you mean once my resolvers are working properly
[21:57:48] <pcw_home> and you should disable your drives until the feedback loop is closed (EMC-on)
[21:57:58] <pcw_home> (so they dont creep)
[21:58:24] <hatch789> ok dumb question, how do I disable my drives from the AXIS screen?
[21:59:27] <pcw_home> They should be disabled when EMC is off (but you need to wire this up figure how to drive the enable signal)
[21:59:31] <hatch789> and they are creeping, but that means my Westamp Drivers need a bit of tweaking, which is why I wanted to do this exercise. it will let me tune my westamp drivers tonight
[22:00:54] <cstop> pcw do you offer cables and connections for the 5i25-7i77, 7i78 combination? Sorry to hold two different conversations hatch ;)
[22:01:05] <pcw_home> but both the 7I49 and the drives will drift so you need to wire up the enable (one enable for all axis is usually OK)
[22:02:00] <pfred1> pfred1@spot:~/emc2/emc2-dev$ grep -ir emc * | wc -l = 55742
[22:02:32] <pcw_home> cstop: Yes the 5I25/7I77/Cable is a set (Plug_and_Go) I think $239
[22:02:38] <pfred1> So, how is that name changing coming along?
[22:02:43] <hatch789> I have my milling machine powered off right now but when I click the power button on my AXIS Screen those servo pins shoot up to 10v
[22:02:52] <A2Sheds> pcw_home: whats the highest clock rate between anything IO board and daughter cards over the 50 pin connectors?
[22:02:52] <hatch789> which I believe right now would drive my servo at max speed
[22:03:25] <cstop> pcw I have your page open... expect a contact soon
[22:03:29] <pcw_home> Do you have the PWM mode set to mode 2?
[22:04:01] <hatch789> oh I need to go check that hold on
[22:05:20] <pcw_home> A2Sheds We use up to about 16 MHz (to say 5 ft)
[22:05:22] <pcw_home> FPGA outputs are parallel terminated on the daughter card
[22:05:24] <pcw_home> FPGA inputs are series terminated on the daughtercard
[22:05:25] <pfred1> pcw_home you ask leading questions
[22:06:12] <pcw_home> pfred1?
[22:06:19] <pfred1> 22:49 < pcw_home> Do you have the PWM mode set to mode 2?
[22:06:54] <A2Sheds> pcw_home: the eoma68 cards only have 20 GPIO, so I'll have to multiplex a few to get the 25 required
[22:07:32] <pcw_home> The 50 pin daughtercards use 24 pins, the 25 pin use 17
[22:07:47] <pfred1> pcw_home a more accurate answer would come if you asked simply What is your PWM mode set to?
[22:08:21] <A2Sheds> easy peasy
[22:08:23] <pfred1> the 2 simply confuses the issue
[22:08:51] <hatch789> pcw_home, ok Mode is set to 2 but when I turn AXIS on it still sends those servo drive pins up to 10v
[22:09:16] <pcw_home> Ahh but I was less interested in the answer than getting the mode set to 2
[22:09:36] <hatch789> ok :) so any idea why it's sending those pins up to 10v?
[22:09:42] <pfred1> then you should have said set PWM mode to 2
[22:10:14] <hatch789> if my mill were turned on right now I think it would fly at max speed on both my X & Y axis until it hit the limit switches LOL
[22:10:23] <hatch789> that would not be good :(
[22:10:25] <pcw_home> If you have the servo loop closed and the resolver is not working thats entirely possible
[22:10:27] <pcw_home> (and its still posiible when it works if the feedback is backwards)
[22:12:23] <pfred1> damn i knew it I'm intellectually peaking ATM
[22:12:57] <pfred1> http://www.facade.com/biorhythm/personal/?Name=Anonymous&Month=11&Day=16&Year=1964&tMonth=2&tDay=28&tYear=2012&range=14
[22:13:23] <pfred1> pcw_home sorry my logic is in overdrive
[22:13:24] <clytle374> pcw_home, isn't there some kind of function to stop that... same as if the encoder comes loose?
[22:13:39] <ssi> limit switches! :D
[22:14:06] <mikegg> tight following error limits are good too
[22:14:23] <pcw_home> Yes theres ferror and theres also a PID signal that can be used to stop if the drive is saturated
[22:14:34] <clytle374> I though I read something about integral wind up.. IDK
[22:14:53] <hatch789> ok I'm off to bed thank you for the help guys.
[22:15:03] <hatch789> pcw_home, you got my e-mail to send me the new bit file tomorrow?
[22:15:09] <pcw_home> (so a bad encoder causing a static runaway gets detected)
[22:15:10] <clytle374> ferror should work good
[22:15:11] <pcw_home> 'Nite
[22:15:22] <pcw_home> Yea some time tommorow
[22:15:56] <hatch789> ok ...just let me know what to do with it (in the e-mail) or point me to a URL telling me what to do with it
[22:16:49] <hatch789> you were also going to adjust the resolver driver voltage so it was not so high ...right?
[22:16:57] <pcw_home> the case where ferror fails is a encoder goes bad while holding position it no longer counter and integral windup generates full drive
[22:17:43] <cstop> run away!
[22:17:47] <pcw_home> so LinuxCNC doesnt know it moving so no ferror
[22:17:51] <clytle374> pcw_home, that is what I was thinking of.
[22:17:59] <pfred1> cstop look at the bones!
[22:18:26] <pcw_home> this can be caught with excessive drive detection (saturated drive)
[22:19:05] <cstop> pfred1 IC none
[22:19:16] <pfred1> cstop
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XcxKIJTb3Hg
[22:19:19] <pcw_home> ou just install it in lib/firmware.hm2/7i43
[22:19:43] <pcw_home> ^^^^^^ for hatch789
[22:19:55] <hatch789> pcw_home, ok no building or anything funky... just plop it into the directory?
[22:20:37] <pcw_home> yep
[22:20:45] <hatch789> pcw_home, ok cool... you were also going to adjust the resolver driver voltage so it was not so high ...right? or do I need to start looking for matched sets of resistors?
[22:21:24] <pcw_home> well dropping it in the drive side is easier (no matching)
[22:21:56] <pcw_home> Ill look at whats needed to lower the drive
[22:22:06] <pcw_home> bbl sleepy time...
[22:22:16] <hatch789> ok night ...me too
[22:22:27] <cstop> ta ta
[22:38:26] <cstop> any experience with open DRO?
http://sourceforge.net/projects/opendro/
[22:44:25] <cstop> elmo401 has changed to elmo40 in just moments! ;)
[22:48:59] <clytle374> So I was yelled at today for a manufacture not sending the correct parts for a machine. To my dismay I was informed that since I work on them, I represent the manufacture.
[22:49:41] <pfred1> clytle374 care to repeat that in English?
[22:50:51] <clytle374> What are you the English teacher today? Sorry to hear you can't make sense of that.
[22:51:07] <cstop> accept the burden of your post.... :)
[22:51:26] <pfred1> well who yelled at you?
[22:51:47] <clytle374> A customer that bought 5 POS lathes
[22:51:49] <cstop> We can share the burden ;)
[22:52:13] <pfred1> ah ha a customer now see I figured it was either your boss or the manufacturer
[22:52:20] <clytle374> I come in as a 3rd party to fix them and he blames me for getting the wrong parts
[22:52:45] <clytle374> And somehow I 'represent' them because I work on them ????
[22:53:06] <pfred1> you represent yourself you brought the wrong parts I'd have been pissed too
[22:54:10] <clytle374> That's not how it worked out. The part number should match your order
[22:54:35] <cstop> I know the brand POS, but here in Vermont POS means Piece of Sh_t
[22:55:25] <pfred1> cstop just on principal I think I couldn't get involved with any brand named POS
[22:55:34] <clytle374> I didn't know there really was a POS brand. This is the Piece brand
[22:56:16] <pfred1> chevy had a problem marketing Novas in south america seems there nova meant no go
[22:56:19] <cstop> Well, when I get the wrong part, I"m angryb at everyone!
[22:56:49] <clytle374> me too, but in my face yelling almost got out of hand
[22:56:49] <pfred1> tough to sell a car with a name like no go
[22:57:25] <cstop> POS is an Eastern European maker/ seller of lathes
[22:57:32] <pfred1> not here they ain't!
[22:57:42] <pfred1> get that POS out of here!
[22:57:53] <clytle374> I've seen TOS, but never POS
[22:58:18] <clytle374> Are the POSes any good?
[22:58:48] <cstop> You might have me there it's late, and the wine has started to taste rather good
[22:59:27] <pfred1> wine hangs me over too badly
[22:59:37] <clytle374> TOS is okay if it isn't a odd voltage 50hz machine that all the motors burn up on
[22:59:53] <iwoj> hey all y'all
[23:00:17] <clytle374> howdy
[23:00:18] <cstop> Now I remember...POS and JET are the same ;-)
[23:00:23] <iwoj> I've been working on my cnc linux box trying to get the machine to lower its latency
[23:00:34] <iwoj> I found this handy webpage:
http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?FixingSMIIssues
[23:00:47] <iwoj> which recommends disabling SMI
[23:00:56] <iwoj> has anyone done this before?
[23:01:09] <pfred1> if SMI is hitting you you either disable it or use a different PC
[23:01:42] <pfred1> there is no third option available
[23:01:49] <iwoj> yeah. i'm trying to disable it.
[23:02:10] <pfred1> the instructions work
[23:02:18] <cstop> One could lower their standards and accept dysfunction
[23:03:01] <pfred1> with SMI my latency score was 135000ns turned off 18000ns
[23:03:14] <iwoj> nice.
[23:03:30] <clytle374> is the hardware newish?
[23:03:39] <cstop> did you get a better interest rate on your auto loan?
[23:03:42] <pfred1> my machine? lord no
[23:03:49] <iwoj> i'm just working my way through the vocabulary of all this. It looks like i've got an installation of EMC2 that is "run in place"
[23:04:00] <iwoj> the hardware is very newish.
[23:04:09] <pfred1> has a designed for windows 98 sticker on the side of it
[23:04:22] <clytle374> iwoj, what is it exactly?
[23:04:56] <pfred1> iwoj you're not trying to use a craptop are you?
[23:05:15] <clytle374> iwoj, is it an atom?
[23:05:35] <pfred1> clytle374 if it was we probably wouldn't be having this conversaiton
[23:05:51] <pfred1> they score sub 5000ns
[23:05:52] <iwoj> no, not a craptop
[23:06:15] <iwoj> it's a coreduo, i think.
[23:06:18] <iwoj> socket7
[23:06:24] <clytle374> pfred1, not with smi is on, iirc
[23:06:39] <iwoj> asus motherboard
[23:06:42] <pfred1> I have a core2 craptop I have to say its performance never impressed me
[23:07:15] <pfred1> iwoj you should look into dedicating a core to the RT task
[23:07:27] <pfred1> supposedly that helps a lot
[23:07:31] <clytle374> iwoj, did you turn off hyperthreading, if it has it?
[23:07:36] <pfred1> oh and disable hyperthreading
[23:07:41] <pfred1> jynx!
[23:08:33] <pfred1> iwoj so now you really have your work cut out for you
[23:09:13] <pfred1> iwoj cat /proc/cpuinfo to see what it is
[23:12:17] <cstop> can one just install a non Nvidia video board to overcome that impediment?
[23:13:07] <clytle374> cstop, can't you just use the nv driver instead of the nvidia one?
[23:13:08] <pfred1> what is a compatible GPU to run with RTAI?
[23:13:22] <pfred1> I hear even the nv driver can be problematic
[23:13:39] <pfred1> I have a crappy old ATI card and I wouldn't rate it top shelf
[23:14:10] <pfred1> I seen folks having some problems with some of the intel stuff too
[23:14:26] <pfred1> I mean what's that leave?
[23:14:26] <cstop> Apian technology was good
[23:16:13] <iwoj> My cpuinfo:
http://typewith.me/p/yrHsovbNPK
[23:16:52] <pfred1> iwoj you should get good performance out of that
[23:17:16] <pfred1> just make sure HT is disabled and dedicate a single core to the RT process
[23:19:26] <clytle374> iwoj, what are your latency numbers?
[23:21:48] <iwoj> they're over 100K
[23:22:05] <pfred1> yeah must be SMI there could be HT though I never dealt with it
[23:23:09] <cstop> Must one use a terminal to change the RTApi file?
[23:23:28] <pfred1> cstop what's that?
[23:23:42] <clytle374> cstop, for smi?
[23:23:47] <pfred1> the RTApi file I know what a terminal is
[23:23:47] <cstop> yes
[23:24:52] <pfred1> why would you have to use a terminal to edit a file?
[23:25:00] <clytle374> smi disable is not as straight forward as it would sound
[23:25:25] <iwoj> So, first step: disabling SMI.
[23:25:45] <iwoj> I've followed the instructions on the linuxcnc.org website but I've run into this problem:
[23:25:46] <iwoj> http://typewith.me/p/UAejYsZ5Ad
[23:26:00] <iwoj> Any ideas why it doesn't like the smi module?
[23:26:02] <cstop> if I follow places/ computer /filesystem/etc/ emc2/ etc, Changes are rejected
[23:26:44] <clytle374> try hyperthreading first, smi disable can hurt to
[23:27:55] <pfred1> I thought you could never get decent latency if SMI was enabled
[23:28:06] <pfred1> just because of what SMI is
[23:28:10] <iwoj> hyperthreading's a bios thing?
[23:28:18] <clytle374> iwoj, yes
[23:28:38] <iwoj> okay, I'll drop hyperthreading
[23:28:59] <clytle374> pfred1, if you look at the rtai readme there is lots about it. and disabling it all isn't the best route
[23:29:01] <pfred1> intel's idea of a shell game
[23:29:41] <iwoj> great.
[23:29:45] <pfred1> I wasn't aware there were shades of gray between on and off
[23:31:20] <clytle374> pfred1, smi off is a shotgun approach
[23:31:39] <pfred1> clytle374 it is an interrupt
[23:31:57] <pfred1> either its there or it isn't
[23:32:17] <iwoj> clytle374, there's nothing on hyperthreading in my bios...
[23:32:22] <pfred1> what are yo usaying you can selectively ignore it?
[23:33:32] <iwoj> there's a flag for SpeedStep and a flag for C-STATE
[23:36:36] <iwoj> how do i tell if my emc2 system is "run in place"
[23:36:38] <clytle374> iwoj, you might niot have hyperthreading then,
[23:36:38] <iwoj> ?
[23:36:51] <clytle374> iwoj, is it a live disk?
[23:36:53] <pfred1> or no way of disabling it
[23:36:54] <iwoj> no
[23:37:05] <iwoj> it's installed on a partition
[23:37:21] <clytle374> iwoj, from a live emc disk?
[23:37:29] <iwoj> yes
[23:37:49] <clytle374> iwoj, then it is installed... Not RIP
[23:38:02] <iwoj> got it.
[23:38:03] <iwoj> thanks.
[23:38:27] <cstop> is it not possible to edit the rtapi.conf file in the gedit app?
[23:38:51] <clytle374> pfred1, smi a bunch of things. I'm not an expert... but the readme is there for all to see.. Including several instances of it is important
[23:39:15] <pfred1> cstop would depend on who owned the file and who was running the editor
[23:40:19] <pfred1> clytle374 the peole that put SMI into PCs had the best of intentions but one of them wasn't RT tasks I'm afraid
[23:40:43] <pfred1> so yeah you are losing stuff disabling it I know that
[23:41:08] <pfred1> but the PC is worthless to me unless it can perform the function I set it to
[23:42:07] <clytle374> disabling it can also hurt latency the way I understand it. So only disabling the parts that hurt it is the idea
[23:42:47] <pfred1> there is no way turning an interrupt off is going to increase your latency
[23:42:58] <pfred1> look up what the word interrupt means
[23:43:18] <bossseries1> Anyone used a hostmot2 smart serial interface yet?
[23:43:35] <pfred1> in the world of computers it means everything comes to a hault until a service os performed full stop period the end
[23:44:31] <iwoj> anyone have an idea why i can't load the SMI module?
[23:44:31] <iwoj> http://typewith.me/p/UAejYsZ5Ad
[23:44:42] <iwoj> the file is there
[23:45:04] <iwoj> but it's complaining:
[23:45:05] <iwoj> insmod: error inserting '/usr/realtime-2.6.32-122-rtai/modules/rtai_smi.ko': -1 No such device
[23:46:45] <pfred1> no such device means you don't have the device in your /dev directory
[23:46:50] <iwoj> (It's counter-intuitive, but I have to enable this module to disable SMI.)
[23:48:06] <pfred1> file not found would mean the module file itself was missing
[23:48:16] <iwoj> what device?
[23:49:44] <pfred1> the rtai device I think
[23:49:59] <pfred1> I had to make a udev rules file I don't use the CD image
[23:50:42] <pfred1> I use a locally compiled LinuxCNC well I use EMC2
[23:51:15] <pfred1> I thought the cd image came configured to give you the device etc.
[23:51:25] <iwoj> i have no idea what udev rules are. Downloading knowledge now...
[23:51:33] <iwoj> Please wait...
[23:51:46] <iwoj> ...
[23:52:17] <iwoj> ...
[23:52:17] <pfred1> iwoj do this ls /dev/rtai_shm
[23:52:46] <iwoj> no such file
[23:52:48] <pfred1> or perhaps ls /dev/rta*
[23:53:12] <pfred1> maybe the CD uses a different name?
[23:53:21] <pfred1> anything?
[23:53:26] <iwoj> oh, it's there now. I just had to launch the latency tester first.
[23:53:35] <pfred1> yeah that is what udev does
[23:53:37] <pfred1> it makes it
[23:53:45] <clytle374> pfred1, like I said smi isn't one thing.. yes it is an interrupt, but there are lots of them happening all the time. Feel free to RTM
[23:53:53] <pfred1> personally I cna't stand it but it is the wave of the future
[23:55:32] <pfred1> you load and unload devices dynamically today
[23:56:04] <iwoj> this is all so annoying. Just to get one little homemade CNC machine working.
[23:56:29] <pfred1> not nearly as bad as scraping your knee learning how to ride a bicycle
[23:56:45] <iwoj> To think I've dumped about $5000 of time and money into getting this little bugger working.
[23:56:58] <iwoj> And I could have just bought one off the shelf.
[23:57:14] <iwoj> grr.
[23:57:26] <pfred1> iwoj I don't want to break your heart but I did this for $30
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fHPKaHLzXes
[23:57:35] <iwoj> So I'm looking at the dev rules now...
[23:57:41] <bossseries1> I guess it's all relative. I sold my EMC'ed grizzly mini mill for $1500, and have less than that in my brigeport boss.
[23:57:41] * pfred1 just gave it some thought
[23:58:16] <bossseries1> But I came from emc1, so linuxcnc is kick ass easy compared to that...
[23:58:30] <iwoj> yeah, I'm building one of these:
http://makeyourbot.org/
[23:58:32] <pfred1> by $30 I mean everything involved cost a total of #30 PC motor drives hardware all of it
[23:58:39] <bossseries1> nice
[23:58:48] <iwoj> it claims to be a $100 machine.
[23:58:54] <iwoj> no way.
[23:59:02] <pfred1> yes way
[23:59:59] <pfred1> I could have done it even cheaper today too
