Dec 11 2021
01:42 AM rene-dev5: Yes, please add me
01:48 AM rene-dev5: I just posted the weblate link in a large German cnc community, let’s see what ze germans come up with
02:37 AM pere: rene-dev5: look like someone in the community started working on the german translation. :)
02:38 AM pere: and someone started added proposals to the russian translation. :)
04:22 AM hansu: A general question: Should bugfixes still go into 2.8 branch? Or not because there will be no 2.8 release after 2.8.2 and the bugfixes will all go into master?
04:38 AM silopolis[m]: <seb_kuzminsky> "thanks silopolis !!" <- You're very welcome. I'm so glad to participate 😊
04:42 AM silopolis[m]: <pere> "and once we move to a very..." <- That will be awesome !
04:43 AM silopolis[m]: <seb_kuzminsky> "i'll add some notes on how to..." <- We need to add a mention of Weblate usage for translations in the project's README to fully comply with Libre Hosting requirements
04:46 AM silopolis[m]: <pere> "why do none of these have..." <- I'd definitely add splitting other subprojects/UIs in separate components to the ToDo list
09:05 AM jepler[m]: Pere: hey I'm late to the discussion but weblate is great, we use it with circuitpython. Can't we configure it to create pull requests? My recollection of setting it up had it automatically add all GitHub project admins to weblate but that doesn't seem to have happened in this case. I wonder why.
09:05 AM jepler[m]: I'm traveling and anyway don't put in much time on linuxcnc these days so forgive my brevity but again thanks to you and others who made this happen
10:15 AM silopolis[m]: smoe: u around ? Just starting to run migrate-translation script for french and would gladdly benefit from your experience 😛
10:18 AM silopolis[m]: smoe: first question, did you have to add placeholders when translated file had less strings than source, and how did you do that ? I'd prefer to use the same patterns from the start
10:58 AM seb_kuzminsky: rene-dev5: what's your weblate username? i'll add you as an admin
10:59 AM seb_kuzminsky: jepler[m]: do you know if circuitpython's github "has the weblate app installed"? that's weblate's preferred way of being connected to a github project, but we haven't done that yet
11:00 AM seb_kuzminsky: hansu: that's a question for andypugh, who's the 2.8 release manager, but my guess would be "yes, bugfixes should go in 2.8 when possible"
12:33 PM Tom_L: considering how long it took to get 2.8 out and the number of edits i'd think it would be maintained for a bit anyway
12:36 PM hansu: Ok.
12:36 PM hansu: So i guess fixing of wrong translations go into 2.8 and enhancement of translations go only into master? Is that right?
01:01 PM silopolis[m]: hansu: standard way would be to improve master and then backport to 2.8
01:02 PM seb_kuzminsky: hansu: for translations of the software (using weblate/gettext/po) i think it makes sense to focus on master
01:02 PM seb_kuzminsky: note that weblate only supports master at the moment, not 2.8
01:03 PM hansu: I thought it is usually done in the other way - the 2.8 is merged at some time into master.
01:03 PM seb_kuzminsky: regarding translations of the docs (which currently happens "by hand", without using weblate/gettext/po), i think it's best to ignore any issues for now, and save your energy for the near future when the docs transition to use the normal po tools
01:04 PM hansu: The thing is, I started to do some translations and I thought it was the best to start in 2.8 and then let it go up to the master.
01:04 PM seb_kuzminsky: yes, you're right, usually we make fixes in 2.8 and merge to master... if you're comfortable making translations without weblate (ie using one of the locally-installed tools like gtranslate), then sure feel free to do it in 2.8, and we'll merge to master later
01:05 PM seb_kuzminsky: i'm expecting a surge of translations in master due to all this interest and the new weblate tool, so the merge will be kind of difficult, especially for someone like me who doesn't speak most of the translated languages
01:06 PM seb_kuzminsky: if you have made translation changes in 2.8, it might be easiest if you offer them up as a PR against 2.8 now, i'll merge it and merge 2.8 to master, then any future translating work you can do in master
01:06 PM seb_kuzminsky: how's that sound?
01:09 PM hansu: Yeah that sounds good. But i can also merge the po file manually to master (I just did that from master to 2.8 to use the improvements from master)
01:10 PM hansu: I only thought it would be good to have these improvements also in 2.8. But maybe not a good idea at this point.
01:11 PM hansu: I haven't really started yet, only did ~hundred strings, but I don't want to throw that away. For future translations I can do that with Weblate.
01:11 PM seb_kuzminsky: hmm, do you mean you hand-picked the po-file changes from master into 2.8? you didn't merge all of master into 2.8, right?
01:18 PM hansu: not by hand, with msgcat and then merge with linuxcnc.pot (vie 'make pofiles')
01:22 PM hansu: But the effect is the same as handpicking the changes of one po file
01:22 PM seb_kuzminsky: great 👍
01:39 PM pere: seb_kuzminsky: more than 840 translation updates are waiting in weblate now. :)
01:44 PM seb_kuzminsky: hmm, wonder why weblate didn't send me an email notification about it...
01:46 PM seb_kuzminsky: i just fetched from weblate and i don't see any new translations (i fetched and merged a few hours ago)
01:47 PM seb_kuzminsky: it looks like there's nothing new pending to me
01:51 PM pere: seb_kuzminsky: it do not create git commits right away (it would create 840 commits), but only after a while and at least once per day.
01:51 PM pere: seb_kuzminsky: you will have to visit the weblate admin page and press 'commit' to save the 840 changes to git.
01:54 PM seb_kuzminsky: ah, i see it
01:56 PM pere: good.
01:56 PM seb_kuzminsky: and i see the "Age of changes to commit" is set to 24 hours, for Lazy commits
01:56 PM pere: really happy to see so much good work being done on the translations.
01:57 PM seb_kuzminsky: so if i do nothing, 24 hours after the last edit, weblate will make a commit from those changes (and presumably email me a notification)
01:57 PM seb_kuzminsky: yeah, i'm impressed with all the work!
01:58 PM seb_kuzminsky: makes me super excited for the docs to get under po4a and that mess to be resolved
01:59 PM pere: and I saw silopolis[m] did some more work on the french migration
02:07 PM pere: seb_kuzminsky: I am not sure if it happen 24 hours after the last, first or just once every 24 hours.
02:07 PM hansu: What about squashing the commits when merging from weblate? There are quite a lot commits of translations and it leads to a lack of overview...
02:07 PM pere: hansu: the debian handbook got a script that will squash translations done by the same person on the same file. let me dig up the recipe.
02:08 PM pere: <URL: https://salsa.debian.org/hertzog/debian-handbook/-/blob/bullseye/main/README.maintainers >
02:10 PM hansu: Yeah that's right, but still 40 commits the the second last merge. Why not squashing all together and mention the translators in the commit message?
02:12 PM pere: hansu: squashing them all seem like a bad idea, as it will make it impossible to track who did what in the translation.
02:13 PM seb_kuzminsky: i don't mind all the un-squashed translation commits that much
02:13 PM pere: anyone got any idea how to get <URL: https://github.com/LinuxCNC/linuxcnc/pull/1440 > working? Seem stupid to not be able to add a correct link because the link checker do not undersatnd irc:?
02:13 PM seb_kuzminsky: it's different with code commits, where each commit should be small and logically consistent - as i understand it, translations don't really have a natural unit of commits
02:14 PM seb_kuzminsky: pere: i'll look
02:14 PM pere: well, the smallest logically consistent translation commit is one msgid/msgstr pair... that would be a bit much.
02:14 PM seb_kuzminsky: yes
02:15 PM hansu: pere Maybe squash the changes of one user together, even when several files?
02:15 PM seb_kuzminsky: or squash into one commit per user, per file
02:16 PM pere: hansu: very few users work on several languages at once. one per user per file is the approach done by debian-handbook, kind of.
02:16 PM seb_kuzminsky: since at some point, i think, each po file will be some unit of language, maybe one for each document, one for each gui, etc
02:16 PM hansu: one commit per user, per file, per day ;-)
02:17 PM pere: feel free to make it as complex as you want. I recommend making the merge as simple as possible, to make sure it happen regularly. :)
02:19 PM hansu: pere: >very few users work on several languages at once
02:19 PM hansu: yes, maybe the big number of commits is only because of the starting phase...
02:19 PM hansu: pere: >very few users work on several languages at once
02:19 PM seb_kuzminsky: i'm not too worried about the weblate commit count at this point. i don't mind lots of commits, if that's easier to set up (as apparently it is). if it becomes a problem we can solve it
02:19 PM hansu: yes I would also say so, but not right now. Maybe the big number of commits is only because of the starting phase...
02:19 PM pere: the procedure for debian-handbook is so complex that it only happen every few months. :(
02:22 PM silopolis[m]: <pere> "hansu: squashing them all seem..." <- Squashing by translator seem like the good deal 👍
02:24 PM silopolis[m]: <pere> "and I saw silopolis did some..." <- Yep, rebased my branch, and after a few git rooky head scratching, I'm very hapoy to be on track for french doc restructuring
02:37 PM hansu: seb_kuzminsky: ok I have done the PR for 2.8 ;-)
02:37 PM seb_kuzminsky: i see it
02:40 PM seb_kuzminsky: hmm, it didn't build
02:41 PM seb_kuzminsky: po/de.po:2059: 'msgid' and 'msgstr' entries do not both end with '\n'
02:48 PM hansu: ahh
02:58 PM hansu: sorry, is now fixed
03:08 PM seb_kuzminsky: thanks :-)
03:22 PM seb_kuzminsky: pere: i made a PR to your PR that fixes the checkref thing
03:23 PM seb_kuzminsky: feels a little silly but i guess it works
03:23 PM pere: seb_kuzminsky: thanks!
03:24 PM seb_kuzminsky: hansu: that worked, thanks!
03:24 PM seb_kuzminsky: and thanks for updating the docs README with that explanation, that's helpful
03:25 PM pere: seb_kuzminsky: I'll squash and push, if it is OK with you?
03:25 PM seb_kuzminsky: yeah that sounds good
03:26 PM seb_kuzminsky: in debugging that i noticed that our internal link checker is missing some html files, i've got a fix for it here, for after we merge #1440
03:27 PM pere: #1440 updated.
03:27 PM seb_kuzminsky: i see it, thanks! i'll merge after the robot validates it
03:28 PM pere: btw, what about #1430? do you plan to take it after the po4a migration?
03:30 PM seb_kuzminsky: it's clearly a good change, would it mess up your po4a work if i merged it now? it looks like it'd be easy to rebase your branch on top of it
03:30 PM pere: nope, do not believe it will harm the po4a work.
03:32 PM seb_kuzminsky: ok, merged
03:36 PM seb_kuzminsky: hansu: unfortunately there are a *lot* of merge conflicts from 2.8 to master in src/po/de.po :-(
03:38 PM pere: seb_kuzminsky: what about #1396?
03:41 PM seb_kuzminsky: the debian/rules.in patch looks a bit wrong to me, let me look closer and give smoe feedback
03:46 PM pere: seb_kuzminsky: did you try to run 'debuild' twice in a source directory? did it work?
03:47 PM seb_kuzminsky: i haven't tried that - i'm working on the 2.8->master merge
03:47 PM hansu: seb_kuzminsky: I can apply my changes also on master. That should bring the merge conflicts to a minimum I hope.
03:48 PM seb_kuzminsky: the german translation has changed a lot in master, so please be careful when applying your changes there so we don't accidentally lose everyone's hard work there!
03:49 PM hansu: Yes of course.
03:50 PM pere: perhaps you too will discover that each language team should decide weblate or not, and not try to mix direct git po file updates with weblate updates.
03:51 PM pere: seb_kuzminsky: please do not update po files in master without merging from weblate first, lock weblate whlie updating po files in master, to make life easier when the update is over.
03:51 PM seb_kuzminsky: this isn't exactly a problem of using different tools, this is a problem of doing different work on the same file in different branches
03:51 PM pere: sure.
03:53 PM seb_kuzminsky: i'm not going to merge the de.po changes from 2.8 to master right now, i'm merging 2.8 just before the de.po changes to master
03:55 PM hansu: the weblate/master branch isn't public, right?
03:55 PM pere: hansu: sure it is.
03:56 PM seb_kuzminsky: it is public
03:56 PM hansu: Ok, where to find?
03:56 PM seb_kuzminsky: you can add weblate as a remote in your local linuxcnc repo and just fetch it
03:56 PM seb_kuzminsky: hang on i'll get the url
03:56 PM seb_kuzminsky: https://hosted.weblate.org/git/linuxcnc/linuxcnc
03:58 PM hansu: Thanks
03:58 PM seb_kuzminsky: hansu: ah, but keep in mind weblate does something called "lazy commits" currently, which means there may be changes people have made that aren't committed to the git repo yet :-(
03:59 PM seb_kuzminsky: there, i just overrode weblate's laziness, all changes should be reflected as commits now
03:59 PM pere: I recommend starting any large translation updates by doing 'commit' on weblate.
04:00 PM seb_kuzminsky: i just pushed the merge of 2.8 (just before hansu's de.po changes) into master
04:02 PM seb_kuzminsky: ok, i merged all the weblate stuff into master
04:03 PM seb_kuzminsky: and that's it for me, for now, i'm stepping away from linuxcnc for a few hours
04:03 PM seb_kuzminsky: see y'all later!
04:03 PM hansu: Great
04:03 PM pere: seb_kuzminsky: you should finish of with an 'update'
04:03 PM pere: on weblate, that is.
04:04 PM pere: it bring master and weblate in sync.
04:04 PM hansu: then I can start with updating de.po in master
04:04 PM seb_kuzminsky: updated weblate, *now* i'm heading out :-)
04:06 PM pere: great. :)
04:08 PM silopolis[m]: seb_kuzminsky: thanks for your support 👍🙏
04:09 PM silopolis[m]: pere: that french restructuring is quite something 😅
04:09 PM silopolis[m]: Migration script chokes several times on each file
04:10 PM pere: silopolis[m]: perhaps a long time since french was sync-ed with english...
04:11 PM silopolis[m]: I'm dropping placeholder files I had created as, like you told me, it seems better to have nothing than these
04:13 PM silopolis[m]: In some places, I'm copying/pasting source strings in fr files
04:13 PM silopolis[m]: In others, I'm "playing" with line length to match number of lines...
04:13 PM pere: hansu: what do you think of the weblate web interface?
04:13 PM pere: just remember, the goal is not to get pretty adoc files, but to get useful PO files to help future translators.
04:14 PM silopolis[m]: I've put everything aside but pleasing migration script!
04:21 PM hansu: pere: I haven't really worked with it yet, but It looks quite good so far. They provide a lot of information and functions but the UI can handle it I think.
04:22 PM pere: hansu: if you work on german, I noticed 15 proposed translations in weblate.
04:22 PM pere: just need a logged in user to look at and approve
04:23 PM hansu: Yes I also noticed those :-)
04:27 PM pere: great. :)
04:27 PM hansu: But I think I'll first bring the 2.8 changes and the master in sync
07:27 PM Tom_L: dunno who maintains the webpage but i noticed a minor thing, the link to my logs on: http://linuxcnc.org/community/ should be: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~tom-itx/irc/logs/%23linuxcnc/index.html
07:28 PM Tom_L: instead of what it is http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~tom-itx/irc/libera/logs/%23linuxcnc/index.html
07:28 PM Tom_L: that was used during the server transition
08:18 PM linuxcnc-build: build #1619 of 1660.rip-buster-python3 is complete: Failure [4failed compile runtests] Build details are at http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org/buildbot/builders/1660.rip-buster-python3/builds/1619 blamelist: Petter Reinholdtsen <firstname.lastname@example.org>, andypugh <email@example.com>, John <firstname.lastname@example.org>, Rainer Stelzer <email@example.com>, Leonardo
08:18 PM linuxcnc-build: Daniel Marsaglia <firstname.lastname@example.org>, Steffen Moeller <email@example.com>, Sebastian Kuzminsky <firstname.lastname@example.org>
08:46 PM linuxcnc-build: build #8420 of 0000.checkin is complete: Failure [4failed] Build details are at http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org/buildbot/builders/0000.checkin/builds/8420 blamelist: Petter Reinholdtsen <email@example.com>, andypugh <firstname.lastname@example.org>, John <email@example.com>, Rainer Stelzer <firstname.lastname@example.org>, Leonardo Daniel Marsaglia <email@example.com>,
08:46 PM linuxcnc-build: Steffen Moeller <firstname.lastname@example.org>, Sebastian Kuzminsky <email@example.com>
11:25 PM jepler[m]: seb_kuzminsky: weblate github app is now "installed" on the linuxcnc github installation and should cover all repos.
11:26 PM jepler[m]: I still don't seem to have administrative access on the hosted.weblate website though
11:26 PM jepler[m]: g'night
11:39 PM pere: jepler[m]: what is your weblate username?
11:39 PM pere: jepler[m]: I can add you to weblate