#linuxcnc-devel Logs

Nov 10 2021

#linuxcnc-devel Calendar

12:00 AM seb_kuzminsky: the issue is with building the html docs, which our github actions and the buildbot do, but most humans don't
12:06 AM seb_kuzminsky: part of building the html docs is validating all the links
12:06 AM seb_kuzminsky: that's done by docs/src/Submakefile running docs/src/checkref, which tries to run "linuxcnc-checklink", which is created by src/configure and lives in scripts/
12:06 AM seb_kuzminsky: rene's cleanup of our python redirector script (linuxcnc-python) in 9c05629c9c30 also removed the part of docs/src/Submakefile that modified the PATH to include scripts/
12:06 AM seb_kuzminsky: so the scripts/linuxcnc-checklink script is no longer found by docs/src/checkref, and it prints that totally misleading error message
12:07 AM pere: note, I did not ask for a formal process.
12:09 AM seb_kuzminsky: i think of the mailing list thread as a proposal, people speak for or against, usually technical things like this end up with near-unanimous consensus, or at least a clear majority agreement
12:13 AM seb_kuzminsky: fix pushed, thanks for your patience
12:17 AM seb_kuzminsky: i think it'd be good to keep the po4a transition and the "manpages in asciidoc" transition as two separate projects, to make them easier for the community to evaluate
12:17 AM seb_kuzminsky: i'm personally in favor of both
12:18 AM seb_kuzminsky: (i started but didn't finish a po4a project in linuxcnc back in 2015: https://github.com/linuxcnc/linuxcnc/tree/seb/master%2Fpo4a)
12:19 AM seb_kuzminsky: but in general, "rough consensus and working code" is pretty much our decision-making process, such as it is. sometimes it works well and sometimes not well :-/
12:20 AM seb_kuzminsky: off to bed for me, talk to you in the morning
09:29 AM pere: seb_kuzminsky: I notice your po4a testing had individual po files for each document. do you thing this is a better idea than one large file?
01:04 PM -!- #linuxcnc-devel mode set to +v by ChanServ
01:12 PM seb_kuzminsky: pere: it seems intuitively better to me to have lots of small specialized files, rather than one big file with everything combined in it - just easier to understand and look at, imo
01:12 PM roycroft: hello, seb_kuzminsky
01:12 PM seb_kuzminsky: hi!
01:13 PM roycroft: funny that you unidled just now - I just joined this channel hoping to chate with you for a moment.
01:13 PM seb_kuzminsky: good timing, what's up?
01:13 PM roycroft: I want to give PyCAM a go, and tried installing it last night in a VM running Debian 11.1.
01:14 PM seb_kuzminsky: uh oh, how did that go?
01:14 PM roycroft: It failed due to some missing libraries.
01:14 PM roycroft: I did not document the process, as it was an initial test, but I'm rebuilding the VM right now and will definitely document it.
01:14 PM seb_kuzminsky: which version of pycam are you trying to use?
01:14 PM roycroft: I thought that once I'm able to describe the problem accurately you might have some insight on what to do next.
01:15 PM roycroft: Whatever the lastest version is - one moment
01:15 PM roycroft: pycam-0.6.4.tar
01:15 PM roycroft: I think that's the most recent
01:16 PM seb_kuzminsky: it's the most recent *release*, but there has been significant work since then in the development branch, and we all ran out of steam to release it :-/
01:16 PM roycroft: OK
01:16 PM roycroft: I *just* booted the new VM for the first time, so I have some things to install before giving PyCAM a go.
01:17 PM pere: is pycam something that should go into debian too?
01:18 PM roycroft: Yes and no, IMO.
01:18 PM roycroft: Yes, because it would be nice to just install it via aptitude or whatever.
01:18 PM pere: seb_kuzminsky: in my experience, translators have an easier job with fewer files to juggle.
01:18 PM seb_kuzminsky: pere: i was hoping you'd ask that! :-D I say yes, but it's pretty immature at the moment
01:18 PM roycroft: No because debian packages are notoriously ancient.
01:18 PM seb_kuzminsky: roycroft: to go into debian, the latest pycam should be released first
01:19 PM roycroft: That would help, especially since the one I tried last night does not work on Debian 11.x.
01:19 PM pere: roycroft: yeah, they have quality control and digital sovereigh requirements, features on longer in fashon.
01:19 PM seb_kuzminsky: sadly, pycam is even more neglected than linuxcnc
01:20 PM seb_kuzminsky: speaking of neglect, i have to go do $DAYJOB for a bit...
01:20 PM roycroft: With some packages, I like to install via apt to make sure that all the dependencies are there, then uninstall the old Debian version of the app and install a more current version directly from the developer.
01:20 PM roycroft: I'll be a few minutes before I'm ready to try PyCAM and document what makes it unhappy.
01:20 PM roycroft: I'll report when I know.
01:21 PM seb_kuzminsky: roycroft: if you are comfortable with git, try building the pycam debs from the master branch, that might have better chance of working on debian 11
01:21 PM roycroft: OK, I'll give that a go.
01:21 PM roycroft: I've already installed git on the new VM
01:22 PM pere: roycroft: are you aware of etckeeper?
01:22 PM roycroft: I'm pretty familiar with git - in fact I use it to manage my CAD library, because I can't afford to buy those multi-thousand dollar CAD library packages.
01:22 PM roycroft: No, I'm not, pere.
01:22 PM roycroft: Git + LFS support works decently for versioning binary files/blobs
01:23 PM pere: roycroft: I install it as the first package on freshly installed debian derived installations.
01:23 PM roycroft: I'll look into it.
01:28 PM pere: seb_kuzminsky: I can split up into smaller po files, if you want to.
01:37 PM roycroft: OK, the requirements.txt for the version I just cloned list pyaml as a dependency
01:39 PM roycroft: I guess I can just try the one(s) I think appropriate
01:39 PM roycroft: I see that PyCAM has moved to Python3, and I think that will get rid of the missing libraries issue.
01:41 PM roycroft: And it works now.
01:41 PM roycroft: At least it loads and does not complain about things being missing.
01:42 PM roycroft: So that was pretty easy, once I got the "bleeding edge" version.
02:33 PM pere: roycroft: how many dependencies are missing from the debian archive?
02:38 PM pere: roycroft: if you believe it should be in Debian, you should create a RFP WNPP request, <URL: https://www.debian.org/devel/wnpp/ >.
02:41 PM pere: Or perhaps ITP, if you are so inclined. I can help you.
02:44 PM roycroft: As I said, I have mixed feelings about that.
02:44 PM roycroft: I also have no experience with the software yet. I may decide it's utter crap and not care. :)
02:45 PM roycroft: I seriously doubt that will be the case though - enough folks whose opinions I respect use it and like it, so I'm pretty sure it works just fine.
02:50 PM roycroft: And if I'm honest, if I had the ability to steer energy into packaging, I'd rather see the current version of the app run on current MacOS, especially since it turned out to be so simple to install on Debian 11.1 today.
03:17 PM roguish[m]: the only good Mac, is a mac'n cheese.
04:42 PM pere: roycroft: just want to present the option for you. :) Was all its dependencies already in Debian?
04:46 PM pere: seb_kuzminsky: btw, anything new on <URL: https://www.openhub.net/p/linuxcnc >?
04:47 PM roycroft: apt -y install python3-gi python3-opengl gir1.2-gtk-3.0
04:47 PM roycroft: apt -y install inkscape pstoedit
04:47 PM roycroft: apt -y install python3-gi python3-opengl gir1.2-gtk-3.0
04:47 PM roycroft: apt -y install inkscape pstoedit
04:47 PM roycroft: apt -y install python3-gi python3-opengl gir1.2-gtk-3.0
04:47 PM roycroft: apt -y install inkscape pstoedit
04:47 PM roycroft: ack
04:47 PM roycroft: but only once :)
04:48 PM roycroft: apt -y install node-js-yaml
04:48 PM roycroft: and that's it
04:48 PM pere: roycroft: look like pycam already got a ITP, <URL: https://bugs.debian.org/600779 >.
04:49 PM pere: roycroft: having all dependencies in place make it a lot easier. the really problematic ones are written in a language where the compiler is not yet in debian. :)
04:52 PM roycroft: That's a pretty old request/ITP
04:53 PM roycroft: But it's good to know that folks are thinking about it.
04:58 PM pere: sure, but it is already in place and there are now three people expressing interest, two in the WNPP request, one one here. it is a good start for a small team. :)
04:58 PM pere: if you share your experience building it there, you can help the next person trying to repeat your work. :)
04:59 PM roycroft: that's how i "built" it
05:00 PM roycroft: that, plus: git clone https://github.com/SebKuzminsky/pycam.git
05:00 PM roycroft: then it worked
05:07 PM pere: roycroft: do you know how to add to BTS#600779? Send your contribution to 600779@bugs.debian.org to have it added to the web page. Add the others on CC to let them know about your email.