#linuxcnc-devel Logs

Sep 16 2018

06:07 AM jthornton: pcw_home: there are a bunch of typos in the 7i77 manual referring to 7i76
07:42 AM pcw_home: Ill fix tomorrow. probably copy-paste errors when I added the D versions
07:48 AM jthornton: just thought I'd let you know
08:09 AM pcw_home: Thanks!
08:58 AM andypugh: Why am I so sure that the only reply to my recent email about multispindle to the mailing lists will be from Gene, and he will have missed the point?
09:03 AM jthornton: I don't get them anymore...
09:13 AM rene_dev_: his emails? :D
09:14 AM rene_dev_: who is the release manager?
09:19 AM rene_dev_: I am thinking about live tooling on my lathe, and that might come in handy.
09:20 AM rene_dev_: I still did not find a good way of using spindles as axis. both my lathe and mill can run the spindle in position mode, but thats not set up in hal
09:23 AM pcw_home: spindle as axis seems pretty awkward in motion. It seems like a constant velocity mode could be added to motion axis rather than doing it in hal
09:25 AM rene_dev_: yes, thats what I thought as well.
09:25 AM rene_dev_: but there is currently no nice way of doing it.
09:26 AM rene_dev_: so I thought about muxing stuff in hal, to change from position to velocity mode. but what I really want is to have the axis go at a constant velocity on spindle enable
09:26 AM pcw_home: Yes
09:27 AM pcw_home: I think motion is the best place for this mode change
09:27 AM rene_dev_: yeah, also there is no spindle amp fault pin, which annoys me a lot :D
09:30 AM pcw_home: so a spindle mode pin for each joint?
09:31 AM pcw_home: or just ABC
09:32 AM rene_dev_: abc or each one, dont really care. why not each one?
09:33 AM pcw_home: Depending on hardware you might need to re-home when going back to position mode
09:35 AM rene_dev_: with the stmbl I use the encoder index as 0
09:36 AM pcw_home: dont want to unwind the spindle motion...
09:36 AM rene_dev_: yeah, of course
09:37 AM pcw_home: probably safest to re-home to index
09:38 AM rene_dev_: yes, thats what I thought
09:51 AM rene_dev_: andypugh can you add fault and amp-enable pins for the spindles while you are at it?
09:52 AM andypugh: I actually only started multispindle because I thought we should have spindle-homing,
09:52 AM rene_dev_: ah, does that work now?
09:53 AM andypugh: I don’t think we need amp-enable. (and should stop having separate amp-enables for every axis, as they all go on and off at the same time)
09:53 AM andypugh: No, I haven’t started on spindle homing yet :-)
09:53 AM andypugh: amp-fault for spindles seems reasonable, though
09:54 AM rene_dev_: yeah, ok. but the fault makes sense
09:56 AM andypugh: Enough software for a while. I am off to machine a chuck backplate.
09:56 AM rene_dev_: I also think amp fault should be a int, so you can see the error code in the gui :)
09:56 AM rene_dev_: ah, I also need to machine chuck backplates...
10:27 AM Jin|away is now known as Jin^eLD
10:28 AM Jin^eLD: doh.. I need a chuck backplate as well, but I have no mountable chuck to do it :P
10:37 AM rene_dev_: depending on your spindle nose, you dont need that.
10:38 AM Jin^eLD: unfortunately I do :( even worse, the adapters that can be bought have a wrong number of holes, I have quite a special spindle nose version
10:39 AM Jin^eLD: these days if you have morse nr 4 you have only 3 holes, I have 4 holes
10:39 AM rene_dev_: morse with holes?
10:41 AM Jin^eLD: http://deadlock.dhs.org/jin/1I611P/2018-06-18/DSCF6843.JPG
10:42 AM Jin^eLD: http://deadlock.dhs.org/jin/1I611P/2018-06-18/DSCF6786.JPG
10:42 AM rene_dev_: thats a kurzkegel, my machine has the same
10:43 AM Jin^eLD: there are bison chucks that would fit if I had 3 holes, I know some people who redrill the chucks but I am not sure thats a good idea given their price
10:43 AM Jin^eLD: not sure why my manual says morese 4, but yeah, probably kk4 is the correct description
10:43 AM rene_dev_: DIN 55027
10:43 AM rene_dev_: yes, kk5
10:43 AM rene_dev_: you can get backplates from ebay
10:43 AM Jin^eLD: only for 3 hole spindles :) thats the thing
10:44 AM Jin^eLD: this DIN standard - 3 holes
10:44 AM Jin^eLD: not 4
10:44 AM rene_dev_: no, that depends on the size
10:44 AM Jin^eLD: well, yes, kk4 - 3 holes
10:45 AM Jin^eLD: I think from kk5 or so they use 4 holes as well
10:45 AM rene_dev_: https://imgur.com/a/CrWx2dK
10:46 AM rene_dev_: 5-8 have 4 holes
10:47 AM Jin^eLD: lets put it that way: I was not able to find a kk4 with 4 holes.. only with 3, I checked TOS, Bison, some others, I also looked for adapters
10:47 AM Jin^eLD: if you know where to get one - you'll make me very happy :)
10:47 AM rene_dev_: sure its not kk5?
10:47 AM Jin^eLD: yes, sure
10:47 AM rene_dev_: you can just redrill the thread for the stuts
10:48 AM rene_dev_: anywhere you want
10:48 AM Jin^eLD: well I can't - I don't have teh equipment to do it precisely
10:50 AM Jin^eLD: but generally yes - that will be the only possibility for me, to either make or buy an adapter and find someone who can redrill it for me
10:51 AM Jin^eLD: only 1-2 years later model of my lathe already uses the common 3 hole kk4 spindle
10:51 AM Jin^eLD: but I still have the old 4-hole one
10:58 AM rene_dev_: thats annoying
10:58 AM Jin^eLD: it is
11:00 AM Jin^eLD: and I got it without a chuck, only with collects and an Ortlieb collet system
11:01 AM Jin^eLD: so I'm now in a bit of a chicken and egg situation - can't find a chuck for my spindle, but need a chuck to make a backplate
11:02 AM andypugh: How annoying for you :-)
11:02 AM Jin^eLD: :)
11:04 AM andypugh: Looking at CAD (as I have a D1-4 CAD model open now) at least re-drilling a 3-hole to 4-hole doesn’t have any hole-clash problems.
11:05 AM andypugh: Is it dimensionally similar to D1-4 but with threaded studs?
11:05 AM Jin^eLD: it does work, I know people from forums who did that, they reuse one hole and drill the other 3 anew, its doable
11:05 AM Jin^eLD: the studs are threaded, yes
11:06 AM Jin^eLD: I have no dril for that though, nothing good or usable enough, but I might try at my friends, he has a rotary table
11:06 AM Jin^eLD: or we finish his MAHO retrofit :)
11:08 AM andypugh: It is identical to D1-4, but you (probably) can’t re-drill a D1-4 chuck / backplate because of a clash with the anti-rotation screw hole.
11:09 AM andypugh: Though it might be worth a try, they are a bit more readily available, I think
11:09 AM Jin^eLD: TOS sells backplates for bajonet/kk4 which I could redrill, but it costs almost half of the price of a new chuck, so I was inclined to try and make one myself, but probably wont be able to due to the chicken and egg problem I have
11:10 AM andypugh: Well, rene-dev did say that he was about to make a backplate…
11:11 AM hazzy-m: andypugh: WIth multi spindle do you specify the spindle number with, say G76? Like G76 P.... $1 ?
11:11 AM andypugh: (I am actually machining a chuck for direct-mount)
11:11 AM andypugh: hazzy-m: Yes
11:11 AM hazzy-m: ok
11:11 AM andypugh: And in that case it _only_ specifies which encoder the Z is slaved to
11:12 AM hazzy-m: ah, interesting
11:13 AM andypugh: I should have anticipated an email saying “I don’t like how you have done it, it isn’t the way I would have done it after 2 minutes thought, spend anohter 2 months doing it my way"
11:14 AM hazzy-m: We all have are own idea of how WE would have done it, but then none of us would have done it as all, so ...
11:14 AM andypugh: Incidentally, for drilling chuck backplates, polar coordinate mode in LinuxCNC is really useful.
11:15 AM hazzy-m: I love polar mode!
11:15 AM andypugh: hazzy-m: Yes, quite. And I did canvas opinions when I started (about 2 years ago)
11:37 AM rene_dev_: ah, I always just cammed the hole circle :D
11:37 AM rene_dev_: Jin^eLD where do you live?
11:38 AM Jin^eLD: rene-dev: Bratislava, Slovakia
11:40 AM rene_dev_: ah
11:40 AM Jin^eLD: you?
11:41 AM rene_dev_: germany, but Im in Vienna occasionally
11:41 AM Jin^eLD: my parents live there
11:41 AM Jin^eLD: I spent 20 years in Vienna, then moved to .sk because I did not like it anymore :)
11:42 AM Jin^eLD: I go to Germany for the metalworks courses in Schweinfurt, metal shaping oldtimer bodyparts
11:44 AM rene_dev_: oh, cool
11:45 AM rene_dev_: I do a lot of bodywork on cars as well
11:45 AM Jin^eLD: sandbag and english wheel and stuff like that?
11:46 AM rene_dev_: yes, a little. but most parts I do are straight, and bend. the more complex shapes I just approximate as good as I can get them.
11:47 AM rene_dev_: or give it to pepole that can do it better than me :D
11:47 AM Jin^eLD: the sandbag-english wheel stuff is exactly whta they teach in Schweinfurt, thats what I want to learn
11:47 AM Jin^eLD: building up a workshop
11:48 AM Jin^eLD: so I got this ancient super robust beadroller, but it came without beads, so I bought a lathe so I can turn my own beads :)
11:49 AM rene_dev_: ah, I like that approach :)
11:49 AM Jin^eLD: one thing spawns another thing spawns yet another thing and so on
11:49 AM rene_dev_: now you need a mill to make the backplate to make the wheels
11:49 AM Jin^eLD: lol sort of, but here I rely on a friend of mine, he is in the process of retrofitting an MH400E mill
11:49 AM Jin^eLD: I wrote a comp for him which does the gearshifting
11:50 AM Jin^eLD: so I hope if all works out I won't need to buy a mill myself
11:54 AM Jin^eLD: downside of this approach is - its time consuming, now that I got the lathe, its again a whole new world to learn turning, learn how to use it, and then - those backplate issues and stuff like that, all costs time
04:24 PM Jin^eLD is now known as Jin|away
07:05 PM hazzy-m: andypugh: You predicted it, there goes gene :D
07:15 PM hazzy-m: why is the spindle section in the INI called SPINDLE_9 ?