#hazzy Logs
Sep 28 2019
#hazzy Calendar
08:49 AM roguish[m]: jthornton: just ordered mosfets and gate drivers to try and repair a couple 7I40s.
11:13 AM jthornton: cool
11:19 AM hazzy-m: morning
11:22 AM hazzy-m: Lcvette: The main reason fo having ProbeBasic seperate is so that it can have its own release sechedual.
11:22 AM hazzy-m: Before if you fix a spelling error in ProbeBasic we have to make a whole new QtPyVCP release, and everyone has to update all of QtPyVCP just for that one little thing, which puts a lot of load on me and TurBoss and makes it MORE difficult for the end user to stay up to date
11:23 AM hazzy-m: it also causes people who don't use ProbeBasic to have to update QtPyVCP just to get fixes for stuff they aren't even using, which again does not make any sense
11:25 AM hazzy-m: Also with PorbeBasic tied to the QtPyVCP release schedual you can't test probe basic with new QtOyVCP feature branches, now it is possible to run the most recent probe basic on the VKB branch, which before would not have been possible without a lot of work rebasing etc.
11:26 AM Tom_L: sounds like a plan
11:27 AM Tom_L: can i update now? :D
11:27 AM hazzy-m: ALso if sombody wants to make their own version of ProbeBasic all they have to do is fork and edit the ProbeBasic repo, and its easy to install and test. Before theyu would have to fork all of QtPyVCP and distribute the whole thing
11:27 AM hazzy-m: Tom_L: hey Tom!
11:27 AM Tom_L: but you've created a disturbance in the force...
11:27 AM hazzy-m: yes, you should be able too
11:28 AM Tom_L: hi
11:28 AM hazzy-m: yes, but change is not always bad :)
11:29 AM * hazzy-m lost his coffee cup
11:33 AM Tom_L: now that _is_ bad
11:34 AM * hazzy-m found it outside in a flower bed
11:41 AM Tom_L: tryin to stunt their growth?
12:27 PM Lcvette: The forking will be difficult for most but I understand your point.
12:27 PM Lcvette: Is it fixed?
12:27 PM Lcvette: Bebas kai
12:28 PM hazzy-m: you need to install QtPyVCP again
12:28 PM Lcvette: Find anything wonky or could it have been from when I uninstalled it?
12:28 PM hazzy-m: from the dir using `pip install -e .`
12:28 PM Lcvette: It's a new version?
12:28 PM hazzy-m: and all will be well
12:29 PM Lcvette: Did you change anything
12:30 PM Lcvette: I'm in chapel hill, had to take my dad in for his igg treatment, heading back to Wilmington now
12:30 PM Lcvette: Should be home in hour and a half
12:31 PM Lcvette: What directory?
12:31 PM Lcvette: Not main terminal?
12:31 PM Lcvette: Install it in the pro e basic directory?
12:32 PM Lcvette: Do I need to uni stall probe basic first?
12:32 PM Tom_L: uninstall and re'install or update?
12:34 PM Lcvette: Hazzy
12:34 PM Lcvette: ?
12:36 PM hazzy-m: uninstall QtPyVCP with `pip uninstall qtpyvcp` and then from your `dev/qtpyvcp` directory run `pip install -e .`
12:36 PM hazzy-m: I'm working on embeding the font in ProbeBasic now
12:36 PM Lcvette: I don't have a Dev qtpy directory
12:37 PM Lcvette: I was just doing the little install
12:37 PM hazzy-m: same dir where you used to edit the Probebasic files
12:38 PM Tom_L: should i move mine to /dev/qtpyvcp or leave it where it is?
12:39 PM hazzy-m: Tom_L: you can leave it where it is
12:39 PM hazzy-m: the location does not matter, as long as you know where it is!
12:40 PM Tom_L: that's the hard one
12:42 PM Lcvette: Hazzy I installed on my machine,
12:42 PM Lcvette: No edit on that ine
12:42 PM Lcvette: That's the one that was busted last night
12:42 PM Lcvette: I didn't touch the dev machine, left it alone
12:43 PM hazzy-m: ok, then install with `pip install git+https://github.com/kcjengr/qtpyvcp`
12:43 PM Tom_L: ok so after the uninstall, there are still files in the /qtpyvcp directory
12:44 PM Lcvette: What directory
12:44 PM Tom_L: /home/tom/qtpyvcp
12:45 PM hazzy-m: when you install with `pip qtpyvcp` it won't install any files outside of the install location (usually .local/lib/python2.7), so that is why you are missing the font file and possibly the hallib which I bet is causes your problems
12:45 PM Lcvette: Ah
12:45 PM hazzy-m: Lcvette: it does not matter what directory when using `pip install git+https://github.com/kcjengr/qtpyvcp`
12:45 PM Lcvette: Sounds reasonable
12:45 PM Lcvette: Ok
12:46 PM Lcvette: Should I do a fresh install or uninstall everything and do I install qtpyvcp first then probe basic?
12:46 PM hazzy-m: Tom_L: yes, when you install with `pip -e .` it just creates a ling to the folder, so when you uninstall it just deletes the link, not the files
12:47 PM Tom_L: oh
12:47 PM hazzy-m: you can run pip uninstall for both qtpyvcp and probe_basic if you want to make sure everything is clean, and then install qtpyvco first and then probe_basic
12:48 PM Lcvette: Ok
12:50 PM Tom_dev: so where does: pip install git+https://github.com/kcjengr/qtpyvcp put the files/
12:50 PM Tom_dev: ?
12:53 PM hazzy-m: Tom_dev: it downloads the zip file from github to a temp dir, unzips it and runs the equivalent of `pip install .` which installs the compiled python files to .local/lib/python2.7/qtpyvcp
12:56 PM Tom_L: so should i be in the probe_basic directory when i install it?
12:57 PM hazzy-m: if you install with `pip install -e .` yes
12:57 PM hazzy-m: the . just means install from here, so you could also pass the path instead of using the .
12:58 PM TurBoss: hello
12:59 PM TurBoss: rpi4 just arrived
12:59 PM TurBoss: \o/
12:59 PM hazzy-m: yo
12:59 PM hazzy-m: Hurray!
12:59 PM hazzy-m: 4gb?
12:59 PM TurBoss: yup
01:02 PM TurBoss: oh I can' power it
01:02 PM TurBoss: lol
01:02 PM hazzy-m: oh no!
01:02 PM hazzy-m: usb c
01:03 PM TurBoss: yes
01:03 PM TurBoss: i don't have it
01:03 PM TurBoss: xD
01:03 PM TurBoss: and is just 8:00 pm all closed
01:03 PM TurBoss: nooooooooooo
01:03 PM * hazzy-m didn't either lol
01:03 PM Tom_L: no corner convenience stores?
01:04 PM Tom_L: they have em
01:04 PM hazzy-m: :(
01:04 PM * hazzy-m passes TurBoss a USB C power supply
01:04 PM * TurBoss is downloading
01:04 PM TurBoss: lol
01:04 PM hazzy-m: big file ...
01:05 PM Tom_L: ok something must be installed right. probe_basic comes up in the editor
01:05 PM hazzy-m: lol
01:05 PM hazzy-m: sweet!
01:06 PM TurBoss: I was taking a look at the offsets table
01:06 PM TurBoss: but python only gives the currently active one :|
01:06 PM Tom_L: ok so where are the sims at now since i moved the qtpyvcp install?
01:09 PM Tom_L: found em i think
01:10 PM Tom_L: probe_basic doesn't show up in the vcp chooser though
01:27 PM hazzy-m: Tom_L: it should show up in the lower installed VCPs section
01:30 PM Tom_L: i think i'm figuring it out
01:31 PM Tom_L: just more than one way to install
02:05 PM TurBoss: hazzy: I'm trying to figure thow to show the popuo over the fullscreen
02:05 PM TurBoss: any idea?¿
02:06 PM hazzy-m: did you try setting the always on top flag?
02:07 PM hazzy-m: we will have the same problem with the VKBs ,,,
02:09 PM TurBoss: yes
02:09 PM TurBoss: I did try all of them
02:36 PM Lcvette: Yo lcvette is pulling in
02:36 PM Lcvette: \o/
02:36 PM Lcvette: BE at Dev in 10
02:36 PM Lcvette: Machine install
02:36 PM hazzy-m: hurray!
02:36 PM Lcvette: Tom_L (@freenode_Tom_L:matrix.org): did you get it fired up?
02:36 PM Lcvette: Hurray
02:37 PM Lcvette: Lcvette spends every Saturday for the next 2 months taking Dad to chapel hill
02:37 PM Lcvette: We leave at 4:30am
02:37 PM Lcvette: It's brutal
02:38 PM hazzy-m: how is he doing?
02:38 PM Lcvette: Lcvette has not slept since Thursday night
02:38 PM Lcvette: We'll see after 2 months of infusion therapy and igg
02:39 PM Lcvette: His lung cancer is shrinking, bit his CLL is flaring up
02:39 PM Lcvette: He calls it cancer Wackamole
02:40 PM Lcvette: Between his prostate cancer, lung cancer, leukemia and lymphoma and of course COPD
02:40 PM Lcvette: He's a mess
02:40 PM Lcvette: But today we had some good time
02:41 PM Lcvette: Was nice to spend it with him, he is coming up tomorrow after church for lunch and to see the machine probing \o/
02:48 PM hazzy-m: Awesome!
02:59 PM Lcvette: what the code line to uninstall probe basic?
02:59 PM Lcvette: hazzy: ?
02:59 PM hazzy-m: pip uninstall probe_basic
03:00 PM Lcvette: bnoth uninstalled
03:00 PM Lcvette: now install deps and qtpyvcp
03:01 PM Not-5e4d: [02qtpyvcp] 07KurtJacobson pushed 031 commit to 03master [+0/-0/±1] 13https://git.io/JeZMK
03:01 PM Not-5e4d: [02qtpyvcp] 07KurtJacobson 038df5aa1 - app - add support for loading custom font list
03:01 PM hazzy-m: yep
03:01 PM Lcvette: dp i need to log out?
03:01 PM hazzy-m: deps should already be installed
03:01 PM Lcvette: before installing or restart?
03:01 PM hazzy-m: no
03:01 PM Lcvette: ok
03:02 PM Not-5e4d: [02qtpyvcp] 07KurtJacobson pushed 031 commit to 03gh-pages [+460/-0/±0] 13https://git.io/JeZMP
03:03 PM Not-5e4d: [02qtpyvcp] 07traviscibot 032b72e35 - Deploy kcjengr/qtpyvcp to github.com/kcjengr/qtpyvcp.git:gh-pages
03:04 PM Lcvette: do i need to log out before installing probe basic after installing qtpyvcp?
03:04 PM hazzy-m: no
03:05 PM * Lcvette sent a long message: < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/ZMAdnyjzOPgliSNapEYxGpPu >
03:05 PM Lcvette: ok all insrtalled succesfully
03:05 PM Lcvette: now to test\
03:06 PM Lcvette: no bebas kai
03:07 PM Lcvette: sim opened
03:07 PM hazzy-m: nope
03:07 PM hazzy-m: you need to update
03:07 PM Lcvette: turboss you here?
03:07 PM Lcvette: run update?
03:08 PM hazzy-m: I just pushed the fix for the font
03:08 PM Lcvette: update which probe basic or qtpyvcp?
03:08 PM hazzy-m: had did you install PB?
03:08 PM hazzy-m: how?
03:08 PM Lcvette: same terminal as i did qtpyvcp
03:08 PM Lcvette: from the pyseid page
03:09 PM Lcvette: pypi
03:09 PM Lcvette: https://pypi.org/project/probe-basic/
03:09 PM Lcvette: instructions here
03:09 PM * TurBoss is away
03:09 PM Lcvette: turboss is there anything i need to install extra for probe basic?
03:10 PM hazzy-m: ok
03:10 PM hazzy-m: sek
03:10 PM * hazzy-m created a new PB release
03:10 PM Lcvette: ok
03:10 PM Lcvette: do i update qtpyvcp also?
03:10 PM hazzy-m: it will be up in a sek
03:11 PM Lcvette: which one?
03:11 PM Lcvette: both?
03:11 PM hazzy-m: then run `pip install probe_basic --upgrade`
03:11 PM Lcvette: k
03:11 PM Lcvette: now or when you tell me?
03:11 PM Lcvette: lol
03:11 PM Lcvette: more info in your comments please :D
03:11 PM Lcvette: turboss is looking for a power plug?
03:12 PM hazzy-m: now
03:12 PM Lcvette: ok
03:13 PM Lcvette: in probe basic temrinalk or anywhere?
03:13 PM hazzy-m: anywhere
03:14 PM Lcvette: still non bebas kai
03:14 PM Lcvette: machine config doesn't open still
03:14 PM * hazzy-m forgot to att .ttg to the manifest file
03:15 PM hazzy-m: *add .ttf
03:15 PM Lcvette: :O
03:20 PM travis-ci: kcjengr/probe_basic#26 (v0.0.3.post1 - 453f99d : Kurt Jacobson): The build passed.
03:20 PM travis-ci: Diff view : https://github.com/kcjengr/probe_basic/compare/v0.0.3.post1
03:20 PM travis-ci: Build details : https://travis-ci.org/kcjengr/probe_basic/builds/590899688
03:29 PM Lcvette: lcvette fixed machine config
03:29 PM Lcvette: is missing halfile
03:29 PM Lcvette: motion_atc.hal
03:30 PM hazzy-m: what was the problemo?
03:30 PM hazzy-m: aha!
03:30 PM Lcvette: copied opver and it opened right up
03:30 PM Lcvette: must have missed that one
03:30 PM Lcvette: shouold i update now?
03:30 PM Lcvette: or wait more
03:30 PM hazzy-m: yes
03:31 PM hazzy-m: I made a post release, not sure it will work, but worth a trt
03:31 PM hazzy-m: `pip install probe-basic==0.0.3.post1`
03:33 PM Lcvette: probe basic opens but it take for friggin ever now
03:34 PM Lcvette: used to open almost instantly
03:34 PM Tom_L: get a faster pc
03:35 PM hazzy-m: Lcvette: what is taking time?
03:35 PM * Tom_L wonders what he should upgrade since this morning
03:35 PM hazzy-m: run it with --log-level DEBUG and it will print the times it took for each stage of the start up
03:35 PM Tom_L: hazzy-m what lib controls mouse functions in qtpyvcp?
03:36 PM hazzy-m: Tom_L: I made only minor changes to QtPyVCP and Probebasic
03:36 PM hazzy-m: Lcvette: does bebas kia there too now?
03:36 PM hazzy-m: it might be taking longer since it has to load the font ...
03:37 PM hazzy-m: Tom_L: its the default Qt pointer interactions
03:38 PM Lcvette: yes
03:38 PM Lcvette: \o/
03:39 PM Lcvette: how do i run it?
03:40 PM Lcvette: hazzy: how do i run from temrinal?
03:40 PM Lcvette: with debug
03:40 PM hazzy-m: linuxcnc path-to-ini --log-level DEBUG
03:40 PM Tom_L: linuxcnc /pathto/probe_basic
03:40 PM Tom_L: what he said
03:40 PM hazzy-m: :D
03:41 PM Tom_L: can one add functions or events to a button or dialog entry?
03:41 PM hazzy-m: Absolutly!
03:41 PM Lcvette: linuxcnc /home/chris/linuxcnc/configs/probe_basic/xk7130
03:41 PM Tom_L: where?
03:41 PM hazzy-m: What are you trying to do?
03:42 PM Tom_L: if i told you i'd have to shoot you
03:42 PM hazzy-m: `linuxcnc /home/chris/linuxcnc/configs/probe_basic/xk7130 --log-level DEBUG`
03:42 PM hazzy-m: depends on what you are trying to do
03:42 PM Tom_L: lc wants a mouseover function to display tool tips
03:42 PM * Lcvette uploaded an image: Screenshot_2019-09-28_16-36-27.png (103KB) < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/BqpKxSeslUQecugxvyUvcVxR >
03:42 PM Lcvette: ```
03:42 PM hazzy-m: but usualy would go in the main VCP python file
03:42 PM * Lcvette sent a long message: < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/eaXQzgsXytvRIMsiGIpoyZur >
03:43 PM hazzy-m: you need path to the INI
03:44 PM Lcvette: linuxcnc /home/chris/linuxcnc/configs/probe_basic/xk7130/Xk7130_INCH.ini
03:44 PM hazzy-m: `linuxcnc /home/chris/linuxcnc/configs/probe_basic/xk7130/XK7130_INCH.INI --log-level DEBUG`
03:44 PM Lcvette: ```linuxcnc /home/chris/linuxcnc/configs/probe_basic/xk7130/XK7130_INCH.INI --log-level DEBUG
03:44 PM Lcvette: ```linuxcnc /home/chris/linuxcnc/configs/probe_basic/xk7130/XK7130_INCH.INI --log-level DEBUG
03:45 PM * Lcvette sent a long message: < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/aENTTjeElZzKSMEHZQeaxRKe >
03:45 PM hazzy-m: your struggling :)
03:45 PM Lcvette: i copied and pasted what you sent
03:46 PM hazzy-m: man, all it is is the file path to your INI!
03:46 PM hazzy-m: its not that hard
03:46 PM hazzy-m: select the file and ctrl+c
03:46 PM Lcvette: thsat is the file path to my ini
03:46 PM * Lcvette uploaded an image: Screenshot_2019-09-28_16-41-05.png (8KB) < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/LnNCoBAvlHDqqjaoRqvXPsuD >
03:47 PM hazzy-m: then type `linuxcnc ` in a terminal and hit ctrl+shift+v and then type ` --log-level` at the end
03:47 PM hazzy-m: what you posted there is the path to your config dir
03:48 PM hazzy-m: `linuxcnc /home/chris/linuxcnc/configs/probe_basic/xk7130/Xk7130_INCH.ini
03:48 PM hazzy-m: --log-level DEBUG`
03:48 PM Lcvette: linuxcnc /home/chris/linuxcnc/configs/probe_basic/xk7130/XK7130_INCH.ini --log-level
03:48 PM Lcvette: that is exactly wyhat you told me to do
03:49 PM Lcvette: ```linuxcnc /home/chris/linuxcnc/configs/probe_basic/xk7130/XK7130_INCH.ini --log-level
03:49 PM hazzy-m: yes, but I'm not on your PC lol
03:49 PM hazzy-m: only you know what the path it
03:49 PM * Lcvette sent a long message: < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/bseqnMqzytQolZgmgKOLfLaO >
03:51 PM hazzy-m: ok, at least you have the file path right now
03:51 PM hazzy-m: `linuxcnc /home/chris/linuxcnc/configs/probe_basic/xk7130/XK7130_INCH.ini --log-level DEBUG`
03:52 PM Lcvette: linuxcnc /home/chris/linuxcnc/configs/probe_basic/xk7130/XK7130_INCH.ini --log-level DEBUG
03:52 PM * Lcvette sent a long message: < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/fCeBEFXUsJUllAHqjpvJvyhl >
03:53 PM Lcvette: takes forever when it gets to the vcp launcher portion in temrinal
03:53 PM Lcvette: 41 seconds
03:53 PM Lcvette: bit excessive
03:54 PM hazzy-m: wow, that is huge amout of time
03:54 PM hazzy-m: YUGE!
03:54 PM hazzy-m: almost as slow to start as Mach3
03:54 PM hazzy-m: wonder what its getting hung up on
03:54 PM hazzy-m: it's fast in the sim
03:54 PM Lcvette: i sent the debug
03:55 PM Lcvette: it was fast previously for the machine
03:55 PM Lcvette: super fast
03:55 PM Lcvette: had a launcher it opened almopst instantly
03:55 PM hazzy-m: I read it, but it only shows that the hangup is in loading the windows
03:56 PM hazzy-m: go back to the launcher and see if it speeds back up
03:56 PM hazzy-m: it could actualy be LinuxCNC hanging on something at the same time
03:56 PM Lcvette: how to do?
03:56 PM Lcvette: before it asked if i wanted a launcher and i said yes i think
03:58 PM hazzy-m: there used to be a command line option to show the launcher
03:58 PM hazzy-m: don't see it anymore, strange
03:58 PM Lcvette: oh wait
03:58 PM Lcvette: think i know
03:58 PM hazzy-m: change DISPLAY = probe_basic to DISPLAY = qtpyvcp
03:59 PM Lcvette: launcher popped right up
04:00 PM Lcvette: but here are two PB's
04:00 PM Lcvette: examples and installed
04:00 PM Lcvette: which to choose?
04:00 PM hazzy-m: installed
04:01 PM Lcvette: whoops i selected the other
04:02 PM Lcvette: took forever for both to load
04:02 PM Lcvette: still waiting on the second one as i type this
04:02 PM * Lcvette uploaded an image: Screenshot_2019-09-28_16-56-51.png (5KB) < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/ATLqDlmclFqXnOQwAIiOHnJL >
04:03 PM Lcvette: has this error message too
04:03 PM Lcvette: afk 3 mninutes
04:03 PM Lcvette: pee break
04:03 PM Tom_L: you must really have to pee
04:03 PM hazzy-m: xD
04:08 PM Tom_L: where do i look for mouse pointer functions?
04:09 PM Lcvette: wife cornered me
04:09 PM Lcvette: tried the heisman but she knows the counter defense
04:09 PM hazzy-m: Tom_L: they are all the default functions, so I have not added any
04:10 PM Tom_L: but where do you find them?
04:10 PM Lcvette: launcher used to have an xfe something i think
04:10 PM Tom_L: i'm in the designer
04:15 PM hazzy-m: Tom_L: I'm not exactly sure what your after? Do you mean the mouse pointer shape?
04:15 PM Tom_L: no
04:15 PM Tom_L: i'm not entirely sure either
04:16 PM Tom_L: but things like mouse over, button click etc
04:16 PM Tom_L: where are those actions coded?
04:16 PM Lcvette: in the stylesheet
04:17 PM Tom_L: how do i find out what actions are available?
04:17 PM Lcvette: qss file or in the stylesheet option in the properties tab
04:17 PM Lcvette: qtdesigner docs
04:17 PM hazzy-m: Tom_L: ah, mouse click events are generaly handled by an indicidual widget
04:17 PM Lcvette: you mean like clicked pressed, toggled, etc?
04:18 PM Tom_L: yes
04:18 PM hazzy-m: individual*
04:18 PM hazzy-m: you can edit the predefined mouse actions in the signals and slots editer
04:18 PM Tom_L: but like an input dialog box that i mouse over... what handles that?
04:19 PM hazzy-m: do you want to pop something up on mouse over?
04:19 PM hazzy-m: that would be the hover event
04:19 PM hazzy-m: you could override that in the widget class, or if you just want to show a tooltip on hove you can enter that in designer
04:19 PM Tom_L: well i just botched something up and uninstalled so i'll re'install and see if i can find it
04:21 PM * hazzy-m uploaded an image: image.png (13KB) < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/jDPctrUJNbcXHqPmyzHodBmZ >
04:21 PM hazzy-m: oops
04:22 PM * hazzy-m uploaded an image: image.png (158KB) < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/gaYrQNzrcjxCQZceKdiqumNh >
04:22 PM Tom_L: how do you show hidden directories?
04:23 PM hazzy-m: ctrl+h
04:25 PM Lcvette: hazzy: i think its vtk related maybe
04:25 PM Lcvette: the long load\
04:25 PM Lcvette: because the origin is the really big oprigin like i used to see in designer
04:25 PM hazzy-m: Picture?
04:27 PM * Lcvette uploaded an image: Screenshot_2019-09-28_17-21-10.png (61KB) < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/dYLQgcyzcyzqBqTZzYJchdap >
04:28 PM Lcvette: its also says parameter file is missing
04:37 PM Tom_L: how do i get all my designer windows in the designer again? they're all tiles outside it right now
04:38 PM Lcvette: use your pictures
04:38 PM Lcvette: send pictures so we can see what your working with
04:39 PM hazzy-m: Tom_L: you can drag and redock them
04:39 PM Tom_L: tried that
04:39 PM Tom_L: where do you drag them to?
04:39 PM hazzy-m: I usualy put them stacked on the right
04:40 PM Lcvette: this long load time is driving me nuts, what else can i try?
04:40 PM hazzy-m: if you drag to the edges of the window it should highligh in blue were you can put them
04:40 PM Lcvette: i went through and double checked the ini file
04:40 PM Lcvette: all paths are correct
04:41 PM Lcvette: i did them with the ctrl + c and then pastred them in
04:41 PM hazzy-m: Lcvette: try addind an DISPLAY OPEN_FILE=some/ngc/file.ngc and see if that helsp
04:41 PM Lcvette: and error parameter file name is missing?
04:41 PM Lcvette: whats that?
04:41 PM Lcvette: linuxcnc.var
04:41 PM Lcvette: thats the parameter name correct?
04:41 PM hazzy-m: yes
04:41 PM Lcvette: is there another var file needed?
04:42 PM Lcvette: its in the folder and is named such
04:42 PM Lcvette: is the var file listed elosewhere?
04:42 PM hazzy-m: Tom_L: oh, maybe you changes the docked windows settings
04:42 PM * Tom_L[m] uploaded an image: Screenshot at 2019-09-28 16-35-32.png (803KB) < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/gUSaHWoMqaCgiSUCNrXNBZqa >
04:43 PM Tom_L: not sure how i did that but i'd like to undo it
04:44 PM hazzy-m: on the main window go to Menu>Settings>Preferances> and change the top combobox to docked windows
04:44 PM hazzy-m: under the appearances tab
04:44 PM Tom_L: just locked up the pc... hold on
04:45 PM hazzy-m: too many windows
04:46 PM Tom_L: impossible!
04:46 PM Lcvette: its m,issing something from turboss
04:46 PM Lcvette: where is turboss?
04:47 PM hazzy-m: away
04:47 PM * hazzy-m uploaded an image: image.png (541KB) < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/mbkqCLcdzwTbedMqTxaNjase >
04:48 PM Lcvette: hazzy the probe basic ui is very laggy in use
04:48 PM Lcvette: it is missing something turboss must have forgotten to add to deps i think
04:48 PM Lcvette: it did this before too
04:48 PM Lcvette: im remembering
04:54 PM Tom_L: ok how to you run in qtdesigner?
04:54 PM Tom_L: to test...
04:54 PM Tom_L: i forgot all this stuff
04:55 PM Tom_L: got it
04:59 PM Tom_L: Lcvette
05:03 PM * Tom_L feels abandoned
05:15 PM Lcvette: lcvette was going deep in the logs to resolve the missing file and loading problem and the unusabole probe basic on the amchine computer'
05:15 PM Lcvette: Tom_L: editvcp
05:15 PM Lcvette: ?
05:15 PM Lcvette: whatb you trying to do?
05:37 PM Lcvette: qttools
06:44 PM * TurBoss is back
06:44 PM Lcvette: \o/
06:45 PM TurBoss: lags?
06:45 PM Lcvette: turboss i think probe basic is missing something
06:45 PM TurBoss: what?
06:45 PM Lcvette: its doing the same long load and doesn't react very well like when we did the first time
06:45 PM Lcvette: but i can't think what may be missing
06:48 PM TurBoss: I'll try
06:48 PM Lcvette: it was the same then you said oh wait we need something
06:48 PM Lcvette: it was the same then you said oh wait we need something
06:49 PM Lcvette: it was the same then you said oh wait we need something
06:49 PM Lcvette: then we installed something and voila it worked great
06:49 PM Lcvette: Whoa my riot spazzed out
06:51 PM Lcvette: maybe a qml thing
06:52 PM Lcvette: Maybe something for qml?
06:52 PM TurBoss: hmmm
06:52 PM Lcvette: currently it takes 42 second to load
06:52 PM TurBoss: I can't remember
06:52 PM Tom_itx: Lcvette where were you trying to add descriptions that you weren't able to?
06:52 PM Tom_itx: the other day
06:56 PM Tom_itx is now known as Tom_L
07:01 PM Lcvette: and says it is missing the name for the var file
07:01 PM Lcvette: and says it is missing the name for the var file
07:01 PM Lcvette: but i have the var file in the configs folder named the same as in linuxcnc
07:01 PM TurBoss: brb 10 min
07:01 PM Lcvette: but i have the var file in the configs folder named the same as in linuxcnc
07:01 PM TurBoss: brb 10 min
07:01 PM Tom_L: why are all my lines repeating x2?
07:05 PM Tom_itx is now known as Tom_L
07:07 PM TurBoss: oh matrix server restarted
07:07 PM Tom_L: wtf
07:08 PM TurBoss: test?
07:08 PM TurBoss: Lcvette Lcvette can you ear me?
07:08 PM Tom_L: i was getting double replies on irc
07:08 PM Tom_L: still not connected here
07:08 PM Tom_L: not on riot anyway
07:11 PM Lcvette: im here
07:11 PM Tom_L[m]: hello?
07:13 PM Lcvette: im here
07:14 PM Lcvette: turboss
07:14 PM hazzy-m: Whoa, I think there's an echo
07:14 PM Lcvette: hgello
07:16 PM TurBoss: hi
07:16 PM hazzy-m: Whoa, I think there's an echo
07:16 PM Lcvette: hello
07:17 PM Lcvette: hgello
07:17 PM TurBoss: there is
07:17 PM TurBoss: there is
07:17 PM Tom_L[m]: so are we back/
07:17 PM Lcvette: can you see me?
07:19 PM Tom_L: well crap.
07:21 PM Tom_L[m]: so are we back/
07:21 PM Lcvette: https://youtu.be/mmiHvYxrCAU
07:22 PM Tom_L: so Lcvette can you see me here?
07:25 PM TurBoss: I can see but seem to be some lag ?
07:25 PM Tom_L[m]: hello?
07:25 PM Lcvette: https://youtu.be/mmiHvYxrCAU
07:25 PM Tom_L: like 5 min lag
07:26 PM Tom_L: Lcvette you there?
07:35 PM Tom_L[m]: hello?
07:35 PM Lcvette: yo
07:35 PM Tom_L: wtf happened to the server?
07:36 PM TurBoss: this is very broken
07:37 PM hazzy-m: Whoa, I think there's an echo
07:37 PM TurBoss: I send a message and takes ages to arrive
07:37 PM hazzy-m: Lcvette: check the VGA cable
07:40 PM Lcvette: i know
07:40 PM hazzy-m: TurBoss: could it be an echo from the discord bot?
07:40 PM Lcvette: sucks
07:43 PM hazzy-m: TurBoss: same here, very laggy
07:43 PM Lcvette: sucks
07:43 PM Lcvette: sucks
07:43 PM hazzy-m: is there a matrix server status page?
07:43 PM TurBoss: the matrix.org server has issues
07:43 PM Lcvette: how long before fix?
07:44 PM Lcvette: where else can we chat?
07:44 PM TurBoss: https://status.matrix.org/
07:44 PM Lcvette: i replaced it with dvi, same issue
07:44 PM Lcvette: i replaced it with dvi, same issue
07:44 PM TurBoss: test 123
07:44 PM Lcvette: this started the moment atom and the deps were installed
07:44 PM Tom_L[m]: what about irc?
07:44 PM TurBoss: :|
07:44 PM * Lcvette uploaded an image: Screenshot_2019-09-28_20-33-03.png (114KB) < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/kczyJxJQVwBgxfVcRiwoFpcT >
07:45 PM Lcvette: i uninstalled atom and libcurl3 and libcurl4
07:45 PM Lcvette: but cant remember the grvbin one
07:45 PM Lcvette: to uninstall it to test if it clears up
07:45 PM TurBoss: hey
07:45 PM TurBoss: this starts working
07:46 PM Tom_L[m]: ok seems to be getting better here
07:48 PM hazzy-m: Lcvette: did you try restarting?
07:48 PM Tom_L[m]: still very laggy
07:52 PM Lcvette: hazzy: yes
07:52 PM Lcvette: It comes and goes is wierd
07:53 PM Tom_L: can you see me here?
07:54 PM Lcvette: Was wondering if I needed to get a video card
07:54 PM Lcvette: Or would that not fix?
07:54 PM TurBoss: I can see you Tom_L
07:54 PM Lcvette: Tom_L (@freenode_Tom_L:matrix.org): I see you
07:54 PM Lcvette: But it's delayed
07:54 PM TurBoss: Lcvette: try another computer
07:55 PM TurBoss: maybe is the screen ?
07:55 PM Lcvette: Not so easy
07:55 PM Tom_L: cable
07:55 PM Lcvette: This computer is built into the cabinet
07:56 PM Lcvette: Already swapped from vga to dvi, no change
07:56 PM Lcvette: Would video card fix if it were the onboarding graphics
07:57 PM TurBoss: if you can try
07:57 PM TurBoss: if you disable onboard gpu youl get better latency
07:59 PM Lcvette: Is matrix working?
07:59 PM Lcvette: Oki will get a graphics card
08:00 PM Tom_L: that might mess with your latency
08:00 PM Tom_L: better check that again too
08:01 PM Lcvette: Which one?
08:01 PM TurBoss: seems ok now
08:02 PM Lcvette: Mobo is ASRock H997M pro4
08:04 PM Lcvette: https://www.asrock.com/MB/Intel/H97M%20Pro4/index.us.asp
08:05 PM Lcvette: Cpu is Intel G3258
08:05 PM Tom_L[m]: ok try again
08:05 PM TurBoss: if you plug a pcie GPU you can disable the onboard GPU on bios
08:10 PM Lcvette: What brand?
08:10 PM Lcvette: I'm using pcpartpicker
08:11 PM Tom_L[m]: Lcvette where were you trying to add descriptions the other day that you weren't able to?
08:12 PM Lcvette: Nowhere back burner it
08:12 PM TurBoss: Lcvette: you said probebasic lags
08:12 PM Lcvette: Yes
08:12 PM TurBoss: in what way?
08:12 PM Lcvette: Takes almost a full minute to load
08:12 PM Tom_L[m]: :(
08:13 PM TurBoss: ok
08:13 PM Lcvette: If I try and hot a button it takes about 10 seconds to react
08:14 PM Lcvette: Was doing this the other day and you fixed by adding a file or installing something
08:14 PM TurBoss: in where in your dev or machine?
08:14 PM Lcvette: Only happens on machine config not the sim
08:14 PM Lcvette: Machine
08:17 PM * Lcvette uploaded an image: _20190928_211054.JPG (155KB) < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/bkPFGZmICDeMpslCXVpNKjTD >
08:17 PM Lcvette: These for my Mobo, which one to get?
08:17 PM Lcvette: Fit
08:17 PM TurBoss: PNY
08:17 PM Lcvette: For my system
08:17 PM Lcvette: Ok
08:17 PM TurBoss: doesn't really matter
08:18 PM TurBoss: my quadro is pny and works smooth
08:18 PM Lcvette: Ok
08:27 PM TurBoss: Lcvette: on the machine if you run a sim its slow too?
08:29 PM TurBoss: Tom_L: did you manage to scale pb to 640x480?
08:30 PM Tom_L: heh, no
08:30 PM Tom_L: i haven't tried and probably won't
08:30 PM TurBoss: xD
08:34 PM Not-5e4d: [02qtpyvcp] 07TurBoss pushed 032 commits to 03master [+0/-0/±4] 13https://git.io/JeZH9
08:34 PM Not-5e4d: [02qtpyvcp] 07TurBoss 03a3e6f75 - make use of QtPy
08:34 PM Not-5e4d: [02qtpyvcp] 07TurBoss 03f9da32b - Merge branch 'CameraWidget'
08:34 PM Tom_L: i did get tooltips working but he said to shelve the idea
08:35 PM TurBoss: oh
08:36 PM Not-5e4d: [02qtpyvcp] 07KurtJacobson pushed 031 commit to 03gh-pages [+460/-0/±0] 13https://git.io/JeZHQ
08:36 PM Not-5e4d: [02qtpyvcp] 07traviscibot 03e59dc65 - Deploy kcjengr/qtpyvcp to github.com/kcjengr/qtpyvcp.git:gh-pages
08:36 PM Tom_L: unless it wasn't what he was after
08:59 PM Lcvette: TurBoss (@TurBoss:matrix.org): TurBoss (@TurBoss:matrix.org) sin isn't problem
08:59 PM Lcvette: Only Mariner config
08:59 PM Lcvette: I didn't try ATC sim
09:00 PM Lcvette: Sorry I dozed off
09:00 PM Lcvette: Haven't slept since I woke up Friday morning
09:00 PM TurBoss: lol
09:02 PM Lcvette: Matrix is fixed now?
09:02 PM Lcvette: Tom_L (@freenode_Tom_L:matrix.org): if you got it working it's not shelves
09:02 PM Tom_L: i just wanted to verify what it was you were after
09:03 PM Lcvette: I just want going to try anything with it right now
09:03 PM Lcvette: Tooltip mouse over pop up
09:03 PM Tom_L: on what elements?
09:04 PM Lcvette: Buttons, line edits
09:04 PM Tom_L: an easy thing to implement
09:05 PM Lcvette: Yeah?
09:06 PM Tom_L: i did it on one of your buttons
09:06 PM Tom_L: but i wasn't sure where you wanted it so i stopped
09:06 PM Lcvette: Lol
09:08 PM Lcvette: How do you make it work?
09:08 PM Tom_L: lemme pull it up again
09:09 PM Tom_L: gimme one you want to change
09:09 PM Tom_L: and i'll walk you thru it
09:11 PM Lcvette: K
09:20 PM Lcvette: turboss
09:20 PM * Lcvette sent a long message: < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/XpIKaiSLawEFcGTtOwvxEBAR >
09:21 PM Lcvette: unrecognized line skipped
09:21 PM TurBoss: that doesn't matter
09:21 PM TurBoss: but this one
09:21 PM TurBoss: ```
09:21 PM TurBoss: sys.path.append("/home/chris/linuxcnc/configs/probe_basic/xk7130/python/toplevel.py")'
09:22 PM * TurBoss sent a long message: < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/rJnnnYFSnmynNfvtxVQkLAda >
09:22 PM Lcvette: ok
09:22 PM Lcvette: how do i get it?
09:23 PM TurBoss: do you really need the python/toplevel stuff?
09:23 PM TurBoss: I mean the python directory
09:23 PM Lcvette: i don't know
09:23 PM Lcvette: not sure what it does?
09:24 PM TurBoss: duno
09:24 PM TurBoss: you have it on your config
09:24 PM TurBoss: its for python remaps?
09:24 PM Lcvette: think so
09:25 PM Lcvette: remap.pym mmissing
09:29 PM * TurBoss sent a long message: < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/BobrfChNmvmFBUYaZDnIRNtZ >
09:29 PM TurBoss: https://github.com/LinuxCNC/linuxcnc/blob/master/configs/sim/axis/remap/manual-toolchange-with-tool-length-switch/python/remap.py
09:30 PM TurBoss: Lcvette: ^^^^
09:30 PM Tom_L: missing the remap .py stuff?
09:31 PM TurBoss: I don't really know if he needs it
09:31 PM Tom_L: remap.py, toplevel.py
09:31 PM Tom_L: you do if you're doing remap
09:31 PM TurBoss: ok
09:31 PM Tom_L: and the remap .ngc file
09:32 PM Tom_L: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/cnc/configs/NEW_MILL_2.8/
09:32 PM Tom_L: those are minimal for a config directory
09:32 PM Tom_L: except the postgui.hal etc
09:32 PM Tom_L: those are for extra features
09:33 PM Lcvette: emc/task/emctask.cc 405: interp_error: Parameter file name is missing
09:33 PM Lcvette: Parameter file name is missing
09:33 PM TurBoss: so did you fix the remap thing?
09:33 PM Lcvette: didn't fix
09:33 PM Tom_L: add remap.py and toplevel.py if you're missing those
09:34 PM TurBoss: change_prolog change_epilog
09:34 PM Tom_L: those would be .ngc files i bet
09:34 PM TurBoss: you have to create the remap.py file on the python directory
09:34 PM * Lcvette uploaded an image: Screenshot_2019-09-28_22-29-03.png (65KB) < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/RLElgpzTVaXkTEHobdwQrEYD >
09:35 PM TurBoss: oh is there
09:35 PM Tom_L: that should be it
09:36 PM Lcvette: Interp ctor: cant instantiate Python plugin
09:36 PM Lcvette: but maybe this is why
09:36 PM Lcvette: this is before it call for those files
09:36 PM TurBoss: https://twitter.com/matrixdotorg/status/1178123144642662400
09:37 PM TurBoss: Lcvette: can you paste the remap section of the ini?
09:37 PM Tom_L: how did those files get messed up?
09:38 PM * Lcvette sent a long message: < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/NUdMDeaqfFGCveEbaVvDBpTC >
09:38 PM Lcvette: no clue
09:39 PM Tom_L[m]: i thought you backed them up
09:39 PM Lcvette: (opt_parser.py:191)
09:39 PM Lcvette: Interp ctor: cant instantiate Python plugin
09:39 PM Lcvette: i did
09:39 PM Lcvette: they are the same files as before\
09:39 PM Tom_L[m]: no, the before files worked
09:39 PM Lcvette: maybe issue with the python plugin
09:40 PM Lcvette: and everything python after that is an issue
09:40 PM Tom_L[m]: remove the .pyc files and let it rebuild them
09:40 PM Tom_L[m]: those are the compiled .py file
09:41 PM Tom_L[m]: probably won't matter
09:42 PM TurBoss: ```
09:42 PM TurBoss: * ```
09:42 PM TurBoss: PATH_APPEND = /home/chris/linuxcnc/configs/probe_basic/xk7130/python
09:42 PM TurBoss: ```
09:42 PM TurBoss: remove toplevel prom there
09:43 PM TurBoss: path append is looking for a directory
09:43 PM Lcvette: \o/
09:43 PM Lcvette: turbo0ss wins the race
09:44 PM Lcvette: that was it
09:44 PM TurBoss: \o\ /o/
09:44 PM Lcvette: not sure how that got there
09:44 PM TurBoss: to many crajillos
09:44 PM Tom_L[m]: ok now back all that up
09:44 PM * TurBoss goes away for 10 min
09:44 PM * Lcvette sent a long message: < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/WPOEoYcjOyMhnEvMkBcUkLBT >
09:45 PM Lcvette: new debug
09:45 PM Lcvette: loaded in 40 seconds less
09:45 PM Lcvette: lol
09:45 PM TurBoss: runs smoth now?
09:45 PM TurBoss: * runs smooth now?
09:46 PM Lcvette: seems yes
09:46 PM TurBoss: great
09:46 PM Lcvette: have not powered on machine yet
09:46 PM Lcvette: hazzy the sims still do not have bebas kai
09:47 PM Lcvette: the box entries are not working like you did turboss\
09:49 PM Lcvette: Tom_L: backing up now
09:49 PM Tom_L: store it offsite somewhere
09:52 PM Lcvette: TurBoss: the boxes that change when you hit enter aren't orking
09:52 PM Lcvette: is this the newest?
09:52 PM Lcvette: or do mwe need a version release?
10:01 PM TurBoss: hmm maybe you have the qtpyvcp release
10:01 PM TurBoss: thats currently on master
10:01 PM Lcvette: :(
10:01 PM TurBoss: give me a sek
10:01 PM Lcvette: so confusing
10:02 PM Lcvette: [DISPLAY]
10:02 PM Lcvette: DISPLAY = probe_basic
10:05 PM TurBoss: what I mean is that probebasic now requires the "stable" release but you wnat a feature that isn't released yet
10:05 PM TurBoss: * what I mean is that probebasic now requires the "stable" release but you want a feature that isn't released yet
10:05 PM Lcvette: oh
10:05 PM TurBoss: make sense?
10:05 PM Lcvette: but i thought probe basic was in its own repository and could be upodated easier now?
10:05 PM Tom_L[m]: oh to be on the bleeding edge....
10:06 PM TurBoss: yes but that feature is a qtpyvcp thing
10:06 PM Lcvette: booo
10:06 PM Lcvette: so where is the benefit in that?
10:06 PM Lcvette: lol
10:06 PM Lcvette: make it fly they said
10:07 PM Lcvette: it will be better they said
10:07 PM Lcvette: lol
10:07 PM TurBoss: boo
10:07 PM Lcvette: "can i have the updated probe_basic fix please?"
10:07 PM TurBoss: you wanted a release
10:07 PM TurBoss: we need 0.2.7
10:08 PM TurBoss: on your dev machine should work
10:08 PM Lcvette: this whole thing of me swapping to the new probe_basic was so those buttons would change when i hit enter
10:08 PM TurBoss: you have master there
10:08 PM Lcvette: now after everything..o worky..lol
10:08 PM Lcvette: no im on machinenot dev here
10:09 PM TurBoss: now things go slow because of the release system
10:09 PM * Lcvette uploaded an image: VectorImage_2019-09-28_110332.jpg (97KB) < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/gWJPKctoJOhwgVgjQbBowipR >
10:10 PM Lcvette: can the fix be in probe_basic instead of qtpyvcp?
10:10 PM TurBoss: no
10:10 PM Lcvette: copy files over?
10:10 PM Lcvette: :(
10:10 PM Lcvette: i9 need that fix!
10:10 PM TurBoss: can't you wait ?
10:10 PM TurBoss: xD
10:10 PM Lcvette: my dad is coming up tomorrow
10:10 PM Tom_L[m]: he doesn't want to
10:10 PM Lcvette: i want to show him the system
10:10 PM Lcvette: its gonna be dead with no feeling
10:11 PM TurBoss: :/
10:11 PM Lcvette: if i dev this machine can i have it?
10:11 PM Lcvette: working?
10:12 PM TurBoss: I'll try to push the new release
10:12 PM Lcvette: \o/
10:12 PM Not-5e4d: [02qtpyvcp] 07TurBoss created tag 03v0.2.7 - 13https://git.io/fhCou
10:12 PM TurBoss: ok I did
10:12 PM Not-5e4d: [02qtpyvcp] 07TurBoss tagged 03f9da32b as 03v0.2.7 13https://git.io/JeZQK
10:13 PM Lcvette: \o/\o/
10:13 PM TurBoss: hmmm
10:13 PM Lcvette: we are the champ[ions
10:13 PM TurBoss: not sure yet
10:13 PM Lcvette: :O
10:14 PM Tom_L[m]: QtPyVCP v0.2.6
10:14 PM Not-5e4d: [02qtpyvcp] 07KurtJacobson pushed 031 commit to 03gh-pages [+460/-0/±0] 13https://git.io/JeZQ6
10:14 PM Not-5e4d: [02qtpyvcp] 07traviscibot 03cd6236d - Deploy kcjengr/qtpyvcp to github.com/kcjengr/qtpyvcp.git:gh-pages
10:15 PM Tom_L[m]: mmm not done yet?
10:15 PM Not-5e4d: [02qtpyvcp] 07KurtJacobson published 03v0.2.7 | v0.2.7 - 13https://git.io/JeZQi
10:15 PM Lcvette: Looking more legit
10:16 PM travis-ci: kcjengr/qtpyvcp#1093 (v0.2.7 - f9da32b : TurBoss): The build passed.
10:16 PM travis-ci: Diff view : https://github.com/kcjengr/qtpyvcp/compare/v0.2.7
10:16 PM travis-ci: Build details : https://travis-ci.org/kcjengr/qtpyvcp/builds/590979392
10:16 PM Lcvette: Hazzy is gonna be like wtf I did not..lol
10:16 PM TurBoss: lul
10:16 PM TurBoss: i hope I didn't break mu8ch
10:16 PM TurBoss: * i hope I didn't break much
10:16 PM TurBoss: now on your machine
10:16 PM TurBoss: pip install --upgrade probe_basic
10:16 PM Lcvette: Upgrade
10:17 PM TurBoss: and see if qtpyvcp is upgraded
10:17 PM Lcvette: Sek
10:17 PM Tom_L[m]: QtPyVCP v0.2.6
10:17 PM Tom_L[m]: no
10:17 PM TurBoss: ?
10:18 PM Tom_L[m]: after: pip install qtpyvcp --upgrade
10:18 PM Tom_L[m]: still .2.6
10:18 PM TurBoss: pip install --upgrade qtpyvcp
10:18 PM TurBoss: Successfully installed qtpyvcp-0.2.7
10:19 PM * Lcvette uploaded an image: Screenshot_2019-09-28_23-13-14.png (38KB) < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/GbcqXhdXlSRngVCWTJgneqjf >
10:19 PM Tom_L[m]: QtPyVCP v0.2.6
10:19 PM Tom_L[m]: same
10:20 PM * Lcvette sent a long message: < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/gNUSgbjcwhLlQlRklMjShnOX >
10:20 PM TurBoss: now should work
10:20 PM TurBoss: or no
10:21 PM Lcvette: \o/
10:21 PM Lcvette: works
10:21 PM Lcvette: turboss did it!
10:21 PM TurBoss: great
10:21 PM Lcvette: o/\o
10:21 PM Lcvette: thank you!
10:21 PM Tom_L[m]: still shows .2.6 ver here
10:22 PM TurBoss: Tom_L: do you have a directory named qtpyvcp by any chance?
10:22 PM Tom_L[m]: no
10:22 PM Tom_L[m]: not in the /home/tom folder
10:23 PM TurBoss: 😐️
10:23 PM Tom_L[m]: Lcvette: what version do you show for qtpyvcp?
10:23 PM TurBoss: then I duno
10:23 PM Lcvette: how do i check?
10:23 PM Tom_L[m]: qtpyvcp --version
10:24 PM TurBoss: ```
10:24 PM TurBoss: $ qtpyvcp --version
10:24 PM TurBoss: QtPyVCP v0.2.7
10:24 PM Lcvette: chris@cpe-2606-A000-FEC8-3700-0-0-0-7:~$ qtpyvcp --version
10:24 PM Lcvette: bash: qtpyvcp: command not found
10:24 PM Lcvette: chris@cpe-2606-A000-FEC8-3700-0-0-0-7:~$
10:24 PM Tom_L[m]: so wtf?
10:25 PM TurBoss: ```
10:25 PM TurBoss: $ export PATH=$PATH:~/.local/bin/
10:25 PM TurBoss: that should make qtpyvcp run
10:26 PM Tom_L[m]: QtPyVCP v0.2.7
10:26 PM TurBoss: I have to issue this export on every shell
10:27 PM TurBoss: or add it to .bashrc
10:27 PM Lcvette: do i have to do something?
10:27 PM TurBoss: no if works
10:27 PM TurBoss: :D
10:28 PM Lcvette: \o/
10:28 PM Tom_L: yeah dammit do something!!!
10:28 PM Tom_L: :)
10:28 PM TurBoss: lul
10:28 PM TurBoss: ok no more releases for a while
10:29 PM Lcvette: lcvette is testing the machine with power
10:29 PM Lcvette: all is good
10:29 PM Lcvette: !
10:29 PM TurBoss: nice!
10:29 PM Lcvette: question on homing
10:29 PM TurBoss: shoot
10:29 PM Lcvette: is it possible to have the x axis (table) move to mid position after homing without setting the mid position as the zero position?
10:30 PM Lcvette: i liike having x0 at end of travel
10:30 PM TurBoss: yes with some gcode
10:30 PM Lcvette: but would like it to move to center after homing
10:30 PM Tom_L: just tell it to do that
10:30 PM Lcvette: thats what i do currently is manually do a g0 x13 to center it
10:31 PM TurBoss: but after home
10:31 PM Lcvette: was wondering if that was something could be in the ini
10:31 PM Tom_L: sorta
10:31 PM Lcvette: if not no big deal
10:32 PM TurBoss: http://linuxcnc.org/docs/devel/html/config/ini-homing.html#_home
10:33 PM TurBoss: hazzy: I did a release 🙂
10:33 PM TurBoss: not sure if did well
10:33 PM Lcvette: \o/
10:34 PM Lcvette: seems well
10:34 PM Lcvette: machine is running good
10:34 PM TurBoss: Lcvette was in a hurry some guy was gona kill him if no release
10:34 PM Lcvette: just ran some probing routines
10:34 PM TurBoss: lol
10:34 PM TurBoss: hahahahhahah
10:34 PM Lcvette: no was my dad coming up tomorrow to check the machine and software we built out
10:34 PM Lcvette: didn't want dead lineedits
10:34 PM TurBoss: o then I missunderstood
10:35 PM TurBoss: :P
10:35 PM Lcvette: \o/
10:35 PM TurBoss: Lcvette: did you tried he HOME thing?
10:35 PM Lcvette: not dead entries anymore!
10:35 PM Lcvette: i was reading when i saw you message hazzy
10:35 PM TurBoss: oh opk
10:35 PM TurBoss: * oh ok
10:36 PM TurBoss: looks like what you need
10:36 PM Tom_L: maybe maybe not
10:37 PM Tom_L: just a sec
10:37 PM TurBoss: ok
10:37 PM Lcvette: it reads like home offset is for moving the axis after it triggers the home switch then sets zero
10:37 PM Tom_L: HOME = 0.000
10:37 PM Tom_L: HOME_OFFSET = 0.10
10:37 PM Lcvette: at the specified new position
10:37 PM Tom_L: the .1 moves off the limit and becomes the soft limit
10:37 PM Lcvette: ?
10:38 PM Tom_L: if you move to the middle of the table that might become a soft limit
10:38 PM Tom_L: i'm not entirely sure
10:38 PM Lcvette: no it doesn't
10:38 PM Tom_L: ^^ on a per axis basis
10:38 PM Lcvette: as long as the min and max are set appropriately
10:38 PM Lcvette: thos become your soft olmiit distances
10:39 PM Lcvette: ie home at table end travel then mov x13 home offset min -13 max 13 bthose become your soft limits
10:39 PM Lcvette: *lcvette thinks at least
10:39 PM Tom_L: ok then put it in each [axis] section
10:39 PM Lcvette: o/
10:39 PM Lcvette: nubby
10:39 PM Tom_L: give it a try
10:39 PM Tom_L: i don't think so but try it
10:39 PM hazzy-m: TurBoss: you did a release! Great!!
10:39 PM Lcvette: thats how i used to have it
10:39 PM TurBoss: hurray!
10:39 PM Lcvette: hurray!
10:40 PM Tom_L: MIN_LIMIT = -17.750
10:40 PM Tom_L: MAX_LIMIT = .10
10:40 PM hazzy-m: Now Lcvette won't have dead buttons xD
10:40 PM Lcvette: hazzy i saw it said save persistent setting to jason\
10:40 PM Tom_L: make sure those are set correctly and you may be ok
10:40 PM Lcvette: my buttons boogie
10:40 PM Lcvette: json*
10:40 PM hazzy-m: Lcvette: yes, you can specify a position to move the axis to after homing
10:41 PM Tom_L: ^^
10:41 PM Tom_L: those ini settings
10:41 PM Lcvette: [qtpyvcp.plugins.settings][DEBUG] Saving persistent settings to /home/chris/linuxcnc/configs/probe_basic/xk7130/.settings.json (settings.py:48)
10:41 PM Lcvette: hazzy: does that position become machine 0?
10:41 PM hazzy-m: No
10:41 PM Lcvette: \o/
10:41 PM hazzy-m: Just the position it moves to after homing
10:41 PM TurBoss: so HOME = -13?
10:41 PM Lcvette: in th ini?
10:42 PM Tom_L: in each axis section
10:42 PM Lcvette: 13
10:42 PM Tom_L: use small numbers to test it
10:42 PM Tom_L: then use the real ones
10:42 PM Lcvette: home is away from atc
10:42 PM Tom_L: so you don't replace your trucks again
10:42 PM hazzy-m: Yes, in the ink, I can't remember exactly what the option is though
10:43 PM Tom_L: MIN_LIMIT = -17.750
10:43 PM Tom_L: MAX_LIMIT = .10
10:43 PM Tom_L: are mine
10:43 PM hazzy-m: It's not the limits
10:43 PM Tom_L: HOME = 0.000
10:43 PM Tom_L: HOME_OFFSET = 0.10
10:43 PM Tom_L: change home offset to center it
10:43 PM TurBoss: Note
10:43 PM TurBoss: The distinction between HOME_OFFSET and HOME is that HOME_OFFSET first establishes the scale location on the machine by applying the HOME_OFFSET value to the location where home was found, and then HOME says where the joint should move to on that scale.
10:44 PM Tom_L: also
10:44 PM Tom_L: HOME_SEARCH_VEL
10:44 PM Tom_L: HOME_LATCH_VEL
10:44 PM Tom_L: should be reasonable values
10:45 PM * Lcvette sent a long message: < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/WzyYGrJkdkzSFmEIkWptqOOB >
10:45 PM Tom_L: latch can be faster
10:45 PM Tom_L: err vise versa
10:45 PM Tom_L: HOME_SEARCH_VEL = 2.50
10:45 PM Tom_L: HOME_LATCH_VEL = -0.20
10:45 PM Tom_L: notice latch is opposite search
10:46 PM Tom_L: so it backs off the switch
10:46 PM Lcvette: these work fine
10:46 PM TurBoss: Lcvette: do you have absolute encoders?
10:46 PM Lcvette: no
10:46 PM Lcvette: incremental
10:46 PM TurBoss: ok
10:47 PM hazzy-m: http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.8/html/config/ini-homing.html#_home
10:47 PM hazzy-m: Yeah, what Tom said
10:47 PM * hazzy-m goes back to bed
10:47 PM TurBoss: n8
10:47 PM Lcvette: i need to change something?
10:48 PM TurBoss: !!giphy n8
10:48 PM TurBoss: * !giphy n8
10:48 PM Lcvette: night hazzy!
10:48 PM TurBoss: fail
10:48 PM TurBoss: !giphy night
10:48 PM * Giphy[m] uploaded an image: night-ZLK4TAsmlIyOI (1816KB) < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/QYjfYVEGxepuTylpvzVWVOrW >
10:48 PM Lcvette: Tom_L: are you saying my vcelocities are no good?
10:48 PM Tom_L: the ones i posted are for my machine
10:49 PM Tom_L: you've homed yours already and they must be ok for you
10:49 PM Lcvette: ah
10:49 PM Tom_L: i was just showing which settings to look at
10:49 PM Lcvette: i checked mine and it repeats to 0.0001 or under
10:49 PM Lcvette: on the home switch
10:50 PM Lcvette: usually its right on 0.0000
10:50 PM Lcvette: on the dti
10:50 PM Lcvette: so i just set home offset to 13?
10:51 PM Tom_L: try it but i'd start with a small number to make sure you're going the right direction
10:51 PM Tom_L: so you don't replace more trucks
10:51 PM TurBoss: Lcvette I would read this twice
10:51 PM TurBoss: http://linuxcnc.org/docs/devel/html/config/ini-homing.html#_home_offset
10:51 PM TurBoss: then http://linuxcnc.org/docs/devel/html/config/ini-homing.html#_home
10:52 PM Lcvette: i have limit switches
10:52 PM Lcvette: should save it no?
10:52 PM Lcvette: and i have to enter x13 to move to table middle
10:52 PM Lcvette: and search and latch are in the negative direction
10:52 PM TurBoss: Tom_L: doc says
10:52 PM TurBoss: HOME_OFFSET
10:52 PM TurBoss: Contains the location of the home switch or index pulse, in joint coordinates.
10:52 PM Lcvette: si i feel somewhat confident 13 would be back towards center of trave;
10:53 PM Tom_L: TurBoss, it's the ammount you back off the limit switch
10:53 PM Tom_L: but the overall limits may play a role in what he wants done
10:53 PM Tom_L: i'm not sure why he want's 0 in the middle
10:53 PM Tom_L: it's not common
10:53 PM TurBoss: he doesnt want 0 in midle
10:54 PM Tom_L: in effect that's what he's asking for
10:55 PM Tom_L: after i machine home mine, i generally send it to the G54 offset location
10:55 PM Tom_L: and i have a button for that
10:55 PM Lcvette: no i want 0 at travel end but table to move to middle after homed
10:55 PM Lcvette: ie dro show 13.0000
10:56 PM Tom_L: MDI_COMMAND = O<work_zero_xy> call
10:56 PM Tom_L: sends mine to G54 x0 y0
10:57 PM Tom_L: MDI_COMMAND = O<work_zero> call
10:57 PM Lcvette: how do i get off the limit swiotch
10:57 PM Tom_L: raises z first then executes the same
10:57 PM Lcvette: lol
10:58 PM Tom_L: HOME_SEARCH_VEL = 2.50
10:58 PM Tom_L: HOME_LATCH_VEL = -0.20
10:58 PM Tom_L: one is negative
10:58 PM Lcvette: if i change no_force_homing = 0to 1 does it remove the need to home the machine to move an axis?
10:59 PM Tom_L: i think so
10:59 PM Tom_L: i haven't done that in a while so you better read that one
11:00 PM Lcvette: found a flaw in probe basic i think
11:00 PM Lcvette: need to ignore limit switches to back off limit switch
11:00 PM Tom_L: NO_FORCE_HOMING = 1 - The default behavior is for LinuxCNC to force the user to home the machine before any MDI command or a program is run. Normally, only jogging is allowed before homing. For configurations using identity kinematics, setting NO_FORCE_HOMING = 1 allows the user to make MDI moves and run programs without homing the machine first. Interfaces using identity kinematics without homing ability will need to have this option set to 1.
11:00 PM Tom_L: just remember, it's not homed
11:01 PM Tom_L: generally used for sims or testing
11:02 PM TurBoss: just tried HOME = 10 on X
11:02 PM TurBoss: it homes then goes to X10
11:03 PM TurBoss: I mean joint0
11:03 PM Lcvette: and sets zero?
11:03 PM TurBoss: no
11:03 PM Tom_L: great
11:03 PM TurBoss: zero still the homed
11:03 PM Tom_L: does it go back to zero on G1 x0 ?
11:03 PM TurBoss: what remembers me tha jcnc needs a dro
11:03 PM TurBoss: yes
11:03 PM Tom_L: ok
11:03 PM Tom_L: great
11:03 PM TurBoss: just tried
11:04 PM Tom_L: so the HOME_OFFSET is just to back off the limit switch a bit
11:04 PM Tom_L: it's been quite a while since i set mine up
11:06 PM * TurBoss uploaded an image: image.png (35KB) < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/WwafcZOdygPfBYkutMTaFdFy >
11:11 PM Lcvette: ok, lcvette writes the full sequence to install linuxcnc, update to master, install qtpyvcp deps,install qtpyvcp, install probe_basic
11:11 PM Lcvette: is that correct?
11:13 PM Lcvette: turboss or tom_l
11:13 PM Lcvette: i forgot how to upgrwade to master
11:13 PM Tom_L: on a preempt-rt linux ver
11:13 PM Lcvette: yes
11:14 PM Lcvette: don't see it in the qtpyvcp website
11:14 PM TurBoss: qtpyvcp can be in pb requirements
11:14 PM Lcvette: turboss
11:14 PM Lcvette: thats what im trying to layout
11:15 PM Lcvette: the complete installation without gaps or holes on how to do something for the fiurst timer
11:15 PM Lcvette: liike me rifght now not knowing how to upgrade master
11:15 PM Lcvette: should be spelkled out for dummies like me
11:15 PM Lcvette: lol
11:16 PM TurBoss: for now qtpyvcp has to be installed but can be autoinstalled
11:16 PM Lcvette: right
11:16 PM Lcvette: i know where to get those code lines
11:17 PM Lcvette: i thoight there was a blurb on how to upgrade to master on the qtpyvcp site
11:17 PM Lcvette: but i can't find it
11:19 PM Lcvette: this upgrades?
11:19 PM Lcvette: sudo apt-key adv --keyserver hkp://keys.gnupg.net --recv-key E0EE663E
11:19 PM Lcvette: sudo add-apt-repository "deb http://buildbot.linuxcnc.org/ stretch master-rtpreempt"
11:20 PM Lcvette: from this website
11:20 PM Lcvette: https://gnipsel.com/linuxcnc/uspace/debian9-emc.html
11:26 PM TurBoss: Lcvette: I think you don't need master anymore since 2.8 was released?
11:27 PM * Lcvette sent a long message: < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/SnpFRhFYnfVbzcYSimOpSpxA >
11:27 PM Lcvette: 2.9
11:27 PM Lcvette: ?
11:28 PM TurBoss: 2.8 is ok
11:28 PM Lcvette: how does that look?
11:28 PM TurBoss: checking
11:28 PM Lcvette: corrrect except for master
11:28 PM TurBoss: I can make qtpyvcp installation auto on pip install probebasi
11:28 PM TurBoss: * I can make qtpyvcp installation auto on pip install probebasic
11:29 PM Lcvette: will it auto update also?
11:29 PM Lcvette: with just probe_basic updates?
11:29 PM TurBoss: hmmm
11:30 PM TurBoss: https://github.com/kcjengr/probe_basic/blob/master/README.md
11:32 PM TurBoss: not sure
11:33 PM Lcvette: So upgrading probe basic may require multi step process
11:33 PM TurBoss: just adding your nothes
11:33 PM TurBoss: * just adding your notes
11:34 PM TurBoss: I don't know now
11:34 PM TurBoss: but
11:34 PM TurBoss: so for now just pipinstall qtpyvcp then pipinstall probe_basic
11:35 PM Lcvette: Yup
11:35 PM TurBoss: ok I'll update the readme
11:36 PM TurBoss: but 2.9 isn't required
11:36 PM Tom_L: you shouldn't need master though, i agree
11:36 PM Lcvette: is 2.9 useable on a machine for cutting yet you thinik?
11:37 PM Lcvette: thats what i have
11:37 PM Tom_L: it's not considered stable
11:37 PM Lcvette: :/
11:37 PM Tom_L: it's where changes and testing are done
11:37 PM TurBoss: ^
11:38 PM Lcvette: so can you downgrade from 2.9 to 2.8?
11:38 PM TurBoss: it should be posible
11:38 PM TurBoss: just remove the extra repo
11:38 PM Tom_L: change the repo link
11:38 PM TurBoss: and reinstall linuxcnc
11:38 PM Lcvette: :o
11:38 PM Tom_L: make damn sure you've got your configs
11:38 PM Tom_L: sir
11:38 PM Lcvette: the whole system?
11:39 PM Tom_L: just linuxcnc
11:39 PM Tom_L: unless you feel so motivated...
11:39 PM Lcvette: that means that my mpg hal; file will be broken again
11:39 PM Lcvette: and my ini file
11:39 PM Tom_L: how so?
11:39 PM Lcvette: aren't they different?
11:39 PM TurBoss: I would stay on 2.9
11:39 PM Lcvette: joints
11:39 PM TurBoss: so you can report bugs on linuxcnc
11:39 PM Lcvette: ok
11:39 PM Lcvette: i will stay on 2.9
11:39 PM Tom_L: 2.8 uses joints
11:40 PM Lcvette: but the hal file is different no?
11:40 PM Tom_L: it gets converted in 2.8
11:40 PM TurBoss: no
11:40 PM Lcvette: changes all axis blurbs to joints
11:40 PM Tom_L: so does 2.8
11:40 PM Lcvette: oh
11:40 PM Lcvette: ok
11:40 PM Tom_L: i'm testing with 2.8 on my dev pc
11:40 PM Tom_L: using probe_basic
11:41 PM Lcvette: but didn't you say yours had axis.x.
11:41 PM TurBoss: that was for 2.7
11:41 PM Lcvette: rather than joint.0.
11:41 PM Tom_L: yes it was converted from 2.7
11:41 PM Lcvette: ok
11:41 PM Tom_L: master may force the change
11:41 PM Tom_L: either should work in 2.8
11:41 PM Lcvette: cool, so my buddy with the same machine can do 2.8 with the same files as me?
11:41 PM Tom_L: afik yes
11:41 PM Lcvette: ok
11:42 PM Lcvette: cool
11:42 PM Lcvette: guess we will test it
11:42 PM * TurBoss sent a long message: < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/PVfVqPpcoxAaeZEAGTSeExpk >
11:43 PM TurBoss: looks ok?
11:43 PM TurBoss: I should push?
11:44 PM Tom_L: how does pip get installed?
11:44 PM Lcvette: yes
11:44 PM TurBoss: true
11:44 PM TurBoss: python-pip
11:44 PM TurBoss: is on the list
11:45 PM Lcvette: need to install pip ?
11:45 PM Lcvette: or is in deps?
11:45 PM Tom_L: ahh there it is
11:45 PM TurBoss: is in deps line
11:45 PM Lcvette: typo
11:45 PM Lcvette: fron should be from
11:45 PM TurBoss: where
11:45 PM Lcvette: after dev pip install
11:45 PM TurBoss: ok
11:46 PM TurBoss: nuked
11:46 PM TurBoss: ok pushing
11:46 PM Lcvette: wait
11:46 PM TurBoss: ok
11:46 PM Lcvette: turboss
11:46 PM Lcvette: thought we didn't need to upgrade to master?
11:47 PM TurBoss: is optional
11:47 PM TurBoss: 2.8 or master
11:47 PM TurBoss: but iso comes with 2.7
11:47 PM Lcvette: i would leave it ith just 2.8
11:47 PM TurBoss: ok
11:47 PM * Tom_L senses doubt
11:47 PM Lcvette: does anyone know if the lastinstallation of preempt is 2.8 or 2.7?
11:47 PM Lcvette: or will update with sudo apt update sudo aspt upgrade?
11:47 PM Tom_L: 2.7 afik
11:48 PM Tom_L: i dunno if anybody changed it or not
11:48 PM Lcvette: so will 2.7 usb install update to 2.8with just the apt update and apt upgrade?
11:48 PM TurBoss: I'lll check
11:48 PM Lcvette: k
11:48 PM Lcvette: thank you
11:48 PM TurBoss: I'll downgrade to 2.8
11:48 PM TurBoss: and see if works
11:48 PM Tom_L: http://www.linuxcnc.org/testing-stretch-rtpreempt/
11:48 PM Tom_L: 2.8
11:49 PM Tom_L: err sry 2.7
11:49 PM Tom_L: typo
11:49 PM Lcvette: ok great
11:49 PM Lcvette: then we don't need the upgrade to master blurb
11:49 PM Tom_L: no, you need 2.8 though
11:49 PM Lcvette: i think maybe best to send out instruction for stable version
11:49 PM Lcvette: oh sorry didn't see you changed
11:49 PM Tom_L: generally what happens yes
11:49 PM Lcvette: lol
11:49 PM Lcvette: ok turboss then add this
11:49 PM Lcvette: gimme a sek
11:50 PM Lcvette: almost finished
11:50 PM TurBoss: oki
11:51 PM Tom_L: http://linuxcnc.org/docs/2.8/html/getting-started/updating-linuxcnc.html#_hal_changes_updates_for_joints_axes_2_8_x
11:51 PM * Lcvette sent a long message: < https://matrix.org/_matrix/media/v1/download/matrix.org/ojEIdcwKwzCOLxcSKOzogoqj >
11:52 PM Lcvette: think its best to put ist all on the same page, hate getting sent to a different place during install
11:52 PM Lcvette: its annoying
11:52 PM Lcvette: lazy
11:52 PM TurBoss: ok just noticed that I'm using linuxcnc from sources so can't downgrade
11:52 PM Lcvette: not to give them the whole kaboodle in one place no?
11:52 PM Tom_L: do like jt does where one tut leads to the next
11:53 PM Lcvette: no
11:53 PM Lcvette: i don't like that
11:53 PM Tom_L: not everybody runs debian
11:53 PM Lcvette: i loose confidence having to go and decipher from another page what i need to do
11:53 PM Lcvette: formatting changes in the instructions etc
11:53 PM TurBoss: Lcvette: pip install probe_basic
11:53 PM Lcvette: remember this is for total newbs
11:53 PM TurBoss: not git+
11:53 PM TurBoss: etc
11:53 PM Lcvette: not linux people
11:54 PM Tom_L: i literally copied and pasted his directions
11:54 PM Lcvette: tom, can't think like you do
11:54 PM Tom_L: so if you can do that the directions are good ones
11:54 PM Lcvette: you are accustomed to it already
11:54 PM Tom_L: what? copy and paste?
11:54 PM Lcvette: think as if you were a windows only user with little expoerience
11:54 PM Tom_L: beyond DOS everybody does that
11:54 PM Lcvette: having to go to different places to complete the whole task
11:55 PM Lcvette: better to put it all in one place
11:55 PM Lcvette: scroll up all i did was add the master installation lines to our page
11:55 PM Lcvette: instead of a link to go to someone elses page
11:55 PM Lcvette: makes it easier
11:56 PM Lcvette: im closer to most non linux users then you guys
11:56 PM Lcvette: you will be desaling with people who have never seen a terminal before
11:57 PM Lcvette: dealing
11:57 PM Tom_L: if you dare to tread this path, you're above the average windows user
11:57 PM Lcvette: not true
11:57 PM Tom_L: very much so
11:57 PM Lcvette: some people just want to use linuxcnc for a few of its key benefits
11:58 PM Lcvette: but 100% would be happier if it was easier
11:58 PM Lcvette: lol
11:58 PM Lcvette: all they will ever do is load it to use it
11:58 PM Tom_L: but it's not. it is what it is
11:58 PM Lcvette: set it and forget it
11:58 PM Lcvette: but we can try and help those transition
11:58 PM Lcvette: i have at least 12 buddies who are hesitant to switch but want too
11:59 PM Lcvette: just in my small circle
11:59 PM Lcvette: they are late 30's mid 40's like me
11:59 PM Tom_L: 12 more like you? omfg :)
11:59 PM Lcvette: probably thoussands more like me
11:59 PM Lcvette: and even worse