#garfield Logs
Jul 11 2020
#garfield Calendar
12:02 AM rue_shop1: 6803?
12:08 AM rue_shop1: no mux'd
12:57 AM rue_shop1: ok, so
12:58 AM rue_shop1: the bus freq is the external/4
12:58 AM rue_shop1: then the system takes 12 cycles/instruction
12:58 AM rue_shop1: and it takes 3 of those to execute a NOP
12:59 AM rue_shop1: so the input clock freq is divided by 144 on a 6809
01:30 AM polprog: morning
01:30 AM polprog: yeah rue_shop1 thats what i meant, the slip
01:31 AM polprog: every cap gave me a square-ish waveform instead of triangular.. idk why
01:31 AM polprog: the resistor connected to the push pull is 100R
01:32 AM polprog: but yeah, i know why the slip
01:37 AM polprog: 8:27 do i want to sleep more or start making breakfast
01:58 AM rue_bed: if the caps are big enough the time isn't enough to see significant charge
01:58 AM rue_bed: thats why it doesn't affect the circuit, there is no delta charge on the cap (if verry little)
02:07 AM polprog: yeah
02:08 AM polprog: ok. breakfast time
03:54 AM rue_mohr: and its only 1:44am!
04:00 AM polprog: cant wait for the counter ICs to comr
04:00 AM polprog: come*
04:00 AM polprog: I want to make a music device, that would just play the contents of an eeprom via an r2r dac
04:01 AM polprog: but the ripple counters i have dont have all the necesary outputs
04:01 AM rue_mohr: got a 6502?
04:01 AM rue_mohr: or a 6809?
04:02 AM rue_mohr: z80 wont work, its got a memory refresh cycle that would screw things up
04:02 AM rue_mohr: and it looks like the 386 wont work either, turns out, they start at A2
04:02 AM polprog: actually i think i have a 6502
04:02 AM rue_mohr: as its a 32 bit processor that assumes your reading 4 bytes at a time
04:02 AM polprog: some came from aliexpress sometime ago. would be nice to test them
04:03 AM rue_mohr: polprog, well, want me to post how to use it as a counter?
04:03 AM polprog: let me walk to the bench
04:03 AM polprog: sure
04:03 AM rue_mohr: ok give me some time here
04:03 AM rue_mohr: there aren't really many processors you can do this with...
04:04 AM rue_mohr: the 8085, 8031, and 8051 have multiplexed busses
04:04 AM rue_mohr: the z80 does that refresh thing
04:04 AM polprog: yep got two 6502 here
04:05 AM rue_mohr: haha I dont have a pdf for the 6502
04:06 AM polprog: what pdf? datasheets or some guide?
04:06 AM rue_mohr: I need pin descriptions
04:06 AM rue_mohr: some of it is easy
04:07 AM polprog: http://archive.6502.org/datasheets/rockwell_r650x_r651x.pdf
04:07 AM polprog: page 3
04:07 AM polprog: i have the R6052 one
04:09 AM rue_mohr: ok, clock goes in on P0
04:10 AM rue_mohr: RDY goes high
04:10 AM rue_mohr: ok
04:11 AM rue_shop1: CAT IS SLEEPING on this keyboard
04:12 AM polprog: ok, let me build the clock
04:12 AM polprog: yours like to sleep on the keyboard? mine likes to sleep on the chair so i have two chairs that i swap ;)
04:12 AM polprog: does the clock have to be 50% duty?
04:14 AM rue_shop1: no
04:20 AM rue_shop1: quick summary
04:20 AM rue_shop1: vss to ground x2
04:20 AM rue_shop1: vcc to +5
04:20 AM rue_shop1: pullups on RDY IRQ NMI and RES
04:21 AM rue_shop1: clock input on phase 0 (pin 37)
04:22 AM rue_shop1: oh AND
04:22 AM rue_shop1: whats NOP for a 6502?
04:22 AM polprog: let me check
04:22 AM polprog: 0xea
04:23 AM rue_shop1: ok EA in binary is...
04:23 AM rue_shop1: 11101001
04:23 AM polprog: 1110 1010
04:23 AM polprog: ah
04:23 AM rue_shop1: no your right
04:23 AM polprog: right, a is 10
04:23 AM rue_shop1: its 2am
04:23 AM polprog: its ok ;)
04:25 AM rue_shop1: so, D0, 2, 4 to ground, others high
04:26 AM polprog: should i put resistors or just wires...
04:31 AM rue_shop1: the 6502 loses it at about 6.5Mhz
04:34 AM polprog: weird i had a signal at A0 A1 for a while but now they are all high
04:35 AM rue_shop1: did you put resistors of all the data lines?
04:35 AM polprog: no, i put wires
04:36 AM polprog: ok, it works
04:36 AM polprog: one of the wires must have been loose
04:37 AM rue_shop1: k
04:37 AM polprog: 44khz in, 11khz out
04:37 AM polprog: on a0
04:37 AM rue_shop1: yea
04:37 AM rue_shop1: A0 is /4 on phase 0
04:37 AM polprog: letr try burning an eeprom now
04:43 AM rue_mohr: https://twitter.com/RueNahcMohr/status/1281884335486857217/photo/2
04:44 AM rue_mohr: have fun, I need a bit of food and sleep!
04:46 AM polprog: goodnight
07:29 AM polprog: well, the rompler works fine!
07:29 AM polprog: just need to find out why is there so much noise
10:39 AM rue_mohr: what is the output supposed to look like?
10:43 AM * Tom_L waits for rue_mohr to drum up another cnc project
10:43 AM rue_mohr: heh
10:43 AM rue_mohr: i still need to recover from the last one (fix my app)
10:44 AM Tom_L: figure out why yours cuts undersize
10:50 AM rue_mohr: that is another mystery, I'm sure it didn't fit
10:50 AM Tom_L: could be the different materials
10:51 AM aandrew: https://www.a1k0n.net/2011/07/20/donut-math.html
10:51 AM aandrew: I hate how smart people make me feel even dumber when they try to describe what they've done. :-)
10:55 AM rue_mohr: wait
10:55 AM rue_mohr: char output[0..screen_width, 0..screen_height] = ' '
10:55 AM rue_mohr: since when can you .. in C
10:57 AM Tom_L: huh
10:58 AM rue_mohr: you cant
10:58 AM rue_mohr: its a javascript thing
10:59 AM rue_mohr: its an editing oops
11:06 AM jymmmm: rue_mohr: I thought it interesting, wondering if you could reverse the process and get heat... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R_g4nT4a28U
11:10 AM rue_mohr: hmmm...?
11:11 AM rue_mohr: huh
11:27 AM jymmmm: Just found he did a whole room version... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7w4rg3UcsgI
12:55 PM rue_mohr: yea, but whats the data on the rom look like?
12:55 PM rue_mohr: what sample were you targeting?
01:16 PM rue_mohr: 6809 0x86 6502 0xA9
02:04 PM polprog: just a raw 8 bit audio
02:04 PM polprog: hence the r2r, i cut a piece of recognizable beat from a rave track
02:04 PM rue_mohr: hmm
02:05 PM polprog: i dont think i have a 6809
02:05 PM polprog: hmmm
02:06 PM rue_mohr: turns out 6502 is better
02:06 PM rue_mohr: instead of NOP
02:06 PM polprog: ?
02:06 PM rue_mohr: use lda.. just posting...
02:07 PM rue_mohr: use 0xA9 with the 6502 and it counts the PC twice as fast
02:07 PM rue_mohr: cause in the same cycle it has to load the value too
02:07 PM polprog: oh, interesting
02:07 PM rue_mohr: for some reason the same trick didn't work on the 6809
02:15 PM rue_mohr: nop was 0x12 and LDA (imm) is 0x86
02:17 PM rue_mohr: ^^ 6809
02:19 PM jymmmm: DIY water filter (kinda cool) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kazEAzGWuIc
02:27 PM polprog: ok
02:28 PM polprog: rue, did you have any digiscope in the lab before that tek? or did you do everything on that goldstar (iirc, the brown one)
02:28 PM rue_shop1: no
02:29 PM rue_shop1: the old one was a "circuit test"
02:29 PM rue_shop1: they rebranded stuff, so you might find the same scope with lots of different names
02:29 PM rue_shop1: but you can get a LONG way with the salee logic ana
02:30 PM rue_shop1: well I'm confused
02:30 PM rue_shop1: the 6809 wont double its address rate for the LDA
02:30 PM rue_shop1: it should
02:30 PM polprog: oh, ok
02:30 PM polprog: still, the tek's neat
02:30 PM rue_shop1: I love it
02:31 PM rue_shop1: *I hope it never breaks down*
02:31 PM polprog: same with my agilent :)
02:31 PM rue_shop1: its 20 years old now?
02:31 PM rue_shop1: :S
02:31 PM rue_shop1: its a freaking heater
02:31 PM rue_shop1: there is a ~400w breeze comming out the side continious
02:31 PM polprog: the agilent? probably. i think... it was made 2002
02:31 PM polprog: haha
02:32 PM polprog: good for the night hacking ;-)
02:32 PM polprog: im also 20 years old now, and i hope i wont break down
02:33 PM polprog: going to the summer house for the weekend
02:34 PM polprog: but im happy i got the 6502 working
02:34 PM rue_shop1: :)
02:34 PM polprog: im in the process of getting some weird PAL boards
02:34 PM rue_shop1: so yea, switch it to 0xA9
02:35 PM polprog: looks like someone took apart some tvs/vcrs. There is an eprom and an MCU that i cant find the datasheet for, of an arch i never heard about
02:35 PM polprog: ill show you a pic in a second
02:35 PM rue_shop1: I'm really confused why the NOP only runs as fast as LDA on the 6809
02:36 PM polprog: https://a.allegroimg.com/original/1e8fbd/c952343e4b68a29bc5df9858c44d
02:37 PM polprog: that mitsubushi IC.. cant find any datasheets
02:37 PM polprog: gotta go
02:38 PM rue_shop1: I have a bunch of i960 too
04:54 PM rue_mohr: I think I have 3 directions
04:54 PM rue_mohr: try a mega32 (has the right clock seperation and asynchronous stuffs)
04:55 PM rue_mohr: reduce to 16 bits, use a 74ls393 set and a 74ls74 synchronizer
04:55 PM rue_mohr: or figure out if I can use the 29030
04:57 PM rue_mohr: if I drop the rom to 16 bits, the pwm goes to 15khz
04:58 PM Tom_L: didn't like that chip i pointed out?
04:58 PM rue_mohr: I need all the bits
04:58 PM Tom_L: that was divided into 8bits though wasn't it?
04:58 PM rue_mohr: it just gives them up 8 bits at a time
04:58 PM Tom_L: no way to chain them?
04:58 PM rue_mohr: no, no carry taps, all super-buffered
04:59 PM rue_mohr: but a great suggestion, I couldn't find anything (one 16 bit down counter)
05:00 PM rue_mohr: if I were willing to lose the fpga to this, I could just do that
05:01 PM rue_mohr: cant program any of the cpld, so cant make a plain ole counter outa those
05:02 PM Tom_L: i wonder if a different variant would give the full output
05:02 PM Tom_L: https://www.mouser.com/Semiconductors/Integrated-Circuits-ICs/Counter-ICs/_/N-6j74p?P=1z0w2vk
05:02 PM rue_mohr: like I say, I couldn't find anything
05:03 PM rue_mohr: heh, all same part
05:04 PM rue_mohr: I should probably just drop it to 16 and use the '393
05:04 PM Tom_L: 74hct4040
05:04 PM Tom_L: 12 stage
05:04 PM rue_mohr: most of these road forks are quite long
05:04 PM rue_mohr: I think they skip a few bits...
05:05 PM rue_mohr: they skip on the 4020
05:05 PM rue_mohr: hmm
05:06 PM rue_mohr: hah, and I'd need to add 4 more bits
05:06 PM rue_mohr: er 5
05:06 PM Tom_L: http://www.farnell.com/datasheets/76360.pdf?_ga=1.107757058.1295713794.1473099215
05:06 PM rue_mohr: more efficient than the '393, but no use for whats left over
05:07 PM rue_mohr: the '393 is an "8 bit" so, 2 of those makes for 16 bits
05:07 PM rue_mohr: I suppose two 4040
05:07 PM rue_mohr: I could get the 17 bits
05:08 PM rue_mohr: the 4516 is only 4 bits
05:08 PM rue_mohr: (mc1...)
05:08 PM Tom_L: ahh
05:08 PM rue_mohr: ok
05:09 PM rue_mohr: with the 4040 I still need a syncronizer but I do get the 17 bits
05:09 PM rue_mohr: in 2 chips
05:10 PM rue_mohr: so 2x 16 pins + 14 pins
05:12 PM rue_mohr: did I get a bunch of 4040 as dividers?
05:37 PM jymmmm: rue_mohr: The outside fan on my HVAC was kinda fluctuating in RPM, and then kinda smelled something burning. I shut it down, pulled the fuses and the motor was about 208F. I replaced the main cap last year, is there a chance it could just be defective? Motor pic https://i.imgur.com/WIIcT1k.jpg
05:39 PM zhanx: Jymmmm hold that thought rebooting my router
05:41 PM jymmmm: k
05:42 PM jymmmm: Tom_L: Yes, the motor spins freely, it's still at 138F, no side play
05:43 PM Tom_L: i think rue_mohr just started a counter project.. he may be a little preoccupied
05:45 PM jymmmm: Tom_L: he said he's rebooting his router
05:45 PM zhanx_: Jymmmm what to the motor windings read for ohm
05:45 PM Tom_L: that was z
05:46 PM jymmmm: zhanx_: between the 220 lines?
05:46 PM zhanx_: Yes on the motor ( you will need to disconnect the power,)
05:46 PM jymmmm: YEL and BLK ?
05:47 PM zhanx_: Yes
05:47 PM jymmmm: Power is removed (pulled the fuses), you mena disconnect the the power leads?
05:47 PM jymmmm: so just the motor alone and not other circuitry?
05:47 PM zhanx_: Power as in fuses should be fine
05:47 PM zhanx_: Just the motor
05:48 PM jymmmm: LEt me see
05:48 PM zhanx_: You might have a bad winding or a bearing going out
05:54 PM zhanx_ is now known as zhanx
05:54 PM zhanx: Yellow black, yellow brown and black brown readings
05:54 PM jymmmm: WEird, the motor comes with perm attached cabling. I'll have to open the main cbainet and disconnect/read from there, gimme a few
05:54 PM zhanx: K
05:54 PM zhanx: That is normal also (pita to change )
05:57 PM rue_shop1: Tom_L, 8Mhz is slightly over the line for most of the 4040 chips
05:57 PM rue_shop1: the answer might be to use a '393 first for the first 8 bits, then the 4040 for the rest
06:20 PM rue_mohr: how many layers deep am I in distractions?
06:20 PM rue_mohr: are any of them gonna finish?
06:21 PM Tom_L: you wouldn't know how to act if they did
06:22 PM jymmmm: Lookup "interrupt driven" and you see a pic of rue
06:24 PM rue_mohr: twitter has not helped things
06:24 PM Tom_L: nor the butterfiles
06:24 PM rue_mohr: someone posts a schematic and 4 hours later I'm back to what I was doing before i saw it
06:25 PM rue_mohr: so, the goal is a board that ouptuts the modulation signals
06:25 PM rue_mohr: +pwm and -pwm
06:25 PM jymmmm: rue_mohr: Put down the device, and step away from the interwebs
06:26 PM rue_mohr: after that, I need a dual isolated 12V supply, and a optic fet driver (easy, I have chips for that)
06:26 PM rue_mohr: with any dual rail power supply, I can then make sine wave power
06:27 PM jymmmm: rue_mohr: what are you making now?
06:27 PM rue_mohr: I still have a custom 7 segment distraction calling me
06:27 PM rue_mohr: jymmmm, I built a shed
06:27 PM rue_mohr: http://ruemohr.org/~ircjunk/projects/shed/slide.htm
06:28 PM jymmmm: rue_mohr: and the shed needs a optic fet?
06:28 PM rue_mohr: the 12V lighting options were stupid so I went 120V leds
06:28 PM rue_mohr: I thought I could just run them off an el-cheapo 12V inverter
06:28 PM rue_mohr: but no, they need clean power
06:28 PM rue_mohr: from what I can tell
06:29 PM rue_mohr: so, I revived the true-sine modulator project
06:29 PM rue_mohr: I only need 100w, this isn't hard
06:30 PM jymmmm: rue_mohr: and you coulda just got one these... https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07SSFYLS6/
06:31 PM rue_mohr: I can use a computer power core to build a flyback 12->+-84V inverter, then I just module it
06:31 PM rue_mohr: I got 2 flouescent fixutres with 2 17w led lamps each
06:31 PM jymmmm: I saw, shed looks nice
06:32 PM jymmmm: whats going in the shed?
06:32 PM rue_mohr: storage of other peoples stuff
06:32 PM Tom_L: make em pay rent
06:32 PM rue_mohr: a buddy is losing his shop, needs somewhere to put things
06:32 PM jymmmm: that sucks
06:32 PM rue_mohr: I was going to build it anyhow, I just needed a bump
06:33 PM rue_mohr: and he helped build it, so that worked
06:33 PM Tom_L: i still say the door opens the wrong way :)
06:33 PM rue_mohr: he built the floor and 1.9 walls
06:33 PM rue_mohr: tell that to the fireshed that you can walk into :)
06:34 PM rue_mohr: but if you stretch you arm out real good you can flip the compressor on
06:34 PM rue_mohr: just done lose your balance and get your fingers in the belt after its on
06:44 PM Tom_L: mine has a guard around it
06:44 PM rue_mohr: yea, I'v thought about how to make one a few times
06:45 PM rue_mohr: I'm learning my mind has a 'do' blocker
06:45 PM rue_mohr: I'm not physically or mentally unable to do something, I just cant get myself to actaully *do* it
06:45 PM rue_mohr: trying to learn how that works
06:46 PM Tom_L: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/cnc/Mill_Steel/Belt_Guard/Belt_Guard.jpg
06:46 PM Tom_L: one i did for the mill
06:47 PM rue_mohr: I remember that
06:47 PM Tom_L: http://tom-itx.no-ip.biz:81/~webpage/cnc/Mill_Steel/Belt_Guard/Belt_Guard1.jpg
06:47 PM rue_mohr: its not hard
06:47 PM rue_mohr: I'm stuck on my ass just now
06:47 PM rue_mohr: I need to go shopping
06:47 PM rue_mohr: I have a list
06:47 PM rue_mohr: and I'm out of do
06:48 PM rue_mohr: I'd sleep, but I'm not tired enough
06:48 PM Tom_L: go tomorrow?
06:48 PM rue_mohr: I'd do things, but I'm too tired
06:48 PM Tom_L: do something fun
06:48 PM rue_mohr: not if I'm gonna have supper tonight and breakfast tommorow
06:48 PM rue_mohr: that requires shopping
06:56 PM rue_mohr: polprog, I'd like to know more about how your making out with the cap tester
06:56 PM rue_mohr: you have to build it like the schematic tho eh? (the driver stage anyhow)
07:02 PM Tom_L: what's it test for?
07:02 PM rue_mohr: it measures ESR
07:03 PM Tom_L: i got a cap tester i got years ago
07:03 PM Tom_L: almost forgot i had it
07:05 PM rue_mohr: mine works in-circuit
07:05 PM rue_mohr: if everything is good there is no real votlage across the cap
09:25 PM jymmmm: rue_mohr: If you know... If I leave the outdoor HVAC fan running tomorrow, will it just blow up the motor, or could I damage something else too?
09:28 PM Tom_L: if it indeed has thermal protection it should shut down but it seemed pretty hot today
09:29 PM jymmmm: Tom_L: The motor is probably ancient, no clue why it didn't shut down at 200F
09:37 PM Tom_L: how long had it been running?
09:38 PM jymmmm: Today? a couple of hours
09:38 PM Tom_L: i don't think i'd trust it to be left on then
09:41 PM jymmmm: because it ran too long today?
09:42 PM Tom_L: you said it ran a couple hours and got that hot?
09:42 PM jymmmm: yes
09:42 PM Tom_L: seems awfully hot to me
09:42 PM jymmmm: Yeah, but if I have to replace it anyway, I don't care if it breaks as long as it doens't damage anything else.
09:43 PM Tom_L: if the fan finally shorted, it may just pop one side of the 220v fuses and leave one in tact for the compressor to hum all night on
09:43 PM Tom_L: not good for the compressor imo
09:44 PM jymmmm: Yeah, I don't need the compressor to go
09:44 PM Tom_L: and if the fan quit, it's not going to release the heat from the coil like it's supposed to
09:45 PM Tom_L: i had a filter clogged up and froze up the whole A coil and also outside around the compressor tubes
09:45 PM Tom_L: once i cleared it and changed the filter it's been fine. it's a fine line of working or not
09:46 PM jymmmm: the air filter?
09:46 PM Tom_L: yes
09:46 PM jymmmm: I date and replace mine monthly
09:46 PM Tom_L: not enough air flow to keep the coil from freezing up
09:46 PM jymmmm: ah ok
09:46 PM Tom_L: i keep a box of them on hand all the time
09:47 PM jymmmm: I JUST bought a 3 pack a few days ago
09:47 PM Tom_L: things happened and it got away from me that time
09:47 PM jymmmm: Yeah, it happens
09:47 PM Tom_L: i get a 10 pack from the hvac supply
09:47 PM jymmmm: I'll ask them come monday
09:48 PM jymmmm: I get a 3 pack for $10 from home depot
09:48 PM Tom_L: a bit cheaper that way
09:48 PM Tom_L: i get decent filters
09:48 PM Tom_L: probably 60-70 for a box
09:48 PM jymmmm: ah
09:48 PM Tom_L: incidentally they plug up quicker
09:49 PM jymmmm: haha, of course
09:49 PM Tom_L: pets etc i get good ones
09:49 PM Tom_L: she burns candles alot so when i change em, they always come out black
09:50 PM jymmmm: AC and candles?
09:50 PM Tom_L: :)
09:50 PM jymmmm: lol
09:50 PM Tom_L: i've learned to cope with it
09:51 PM jymmmm: There are battery candles too =)
09:51 PM jymmmm: big ones, very realisitic
09:51 PM Tom_L: they don't smell the same
09:51 PM jymmmm: oh scented candles
09:52 PM Tom_L: electric is never over $130 so i don't complain much
09:53 PM jymmmm: that's good at least
09:53 PM Tom_L: the unit is new too, i had to replace it maybe 2-3 yrs ago
09:53 PM Tom_L: got one wholesale
09:54 PM Tom_L: traded the install for auto repair
09:54 PM jymmmm: This unit is probably like 20yo's
09:55 PM Tom_L: mine was closer to 30
09:55 PM zhanx: Ok new router
09:55 PM jymmmm: I really have no clue how old it is
09:55 PM Tom_L: still worked but the coils outside were deteriorating
09:56 PM jymmmm: ok, it's cooling off outside, let me check the motor...
09:56 PM Tom_L: it's down to 80ish now here
09:56 PM zhanx: What was the ohms on it jymmmm
09:56 PM Tom_L: zhanx, i don't think he's checked yet
09:57 PM zhanx: K. I was digging in boxes for a router for a bit
09:57 PM zhanx: oops
10:01 PM zhanx: Hopefully my internet is more stable now
10:02 PM zhanx: Ping is running about 400ms
10:20 PM jymmmm: zhanx: Motor completely disconnected from everything (includig cap): BRN/YEL: 115 ohms, YEL/BLK: 20 ohms, BRN/BLK: 96 ohms
10:20 PM jymmmm: zhanx: Motor completely disconnected from everything (including cap): BRN/YEL: 115 ohms, YEL/BLK: 20 ohms, BRN/BLK: 96 ohms
10:21 PM Tom_L: any to frame?
10:21 PM jymmmm: eath ground (grn)
10:21 PM Tom_L: check the rest to frame too
10:22 PM jymmmm: hang on
10:24 PM jymmmm: open on all three
10:25 PM zhanx2: What?
10:25 PM Tom_L: so no shorts to frame
10:25 PM jymmmm: Tom_L: correct
10:26 PM Tom_L: zhanx2, zhanx: Motor completely disconnected from everything (including cap): BRN/YEL: 115 ohms, YEL/BLK: 20 ohms, BRN/BLK: 96 ohms
10:26 PM zhanx2: What is the ohms
10:26 PM jymmmm: zhanx2: : Motor completely disconnected from everything (including cap): BRN/YEL: 115 ohms, YEL/BLK: 20 ohms, BRN/BLK: 96 ohms
10:27 PM zhanx2: 2.8 - 3.8 is average for that motor
10:27 PM zhanx2: It's dying
10:28 PM zhanx2 is now known as zhanx
10:28 PM jymmmm: zhanx2: How so (for my curiosity and understanding)
10:29 PM zhanx: Ok the 20ohm is a base right low end
10:29 PM jymmmm: zhanx: I don't have a clue about starter caps, etc
10:29 PM Tom_L: jymmmm, take the cap with you to the motor place and let them test it
10:29 PM Tom_L: they should be able to
10:29 PM zhanx: The 3x -4x reading on the windings over 20ohms = heat
10:30 PM zhanx: Tom that cap is a startup cap
10:30 PM Tom_L: i know
10:30 PM rue_mohr: see, there is another one, there is no emoji for "high as a kite"
10:30 PM Tom_L: it could be going too though
10:30 PM zhanx: The windings are causing the heat
10:30 PM Tom_L: right
10:30 PM jymmmm: Tom_L: I replaced it last year, but I can check it's value in a few
10:31 PM Tom_L: it should be ok if you just replaced it
10:31 PM jymmmm: zhanx: So the BLK/YEL should "normally" read about what?
10:32 PM zhanx: Jymmmm it's not the cap and 20ohm or less normally 2.8-3.8 ohms
10:33 PM * zhanx is certified by the EPA as and a/c repair man
10:33 PM jymmmm: zhanx: so it's too high, normally would be 2-4 ohms?
10:33 PM zhanx: Yep
10:33 PM jymmmm: zhanx: And the BRN?
10:35 PM zhanx: 3 windings + - + on ac
10:35 PM * jymmmm <--- deer in headlight look
10:35 PM zhanx: K
10:36 PM zhanx: Replace the fan motor problem solved
10:36 PM jymmmm: THAT, I understand =)
10:36 PM Tom_L: heh
10:36 PM zhanx: Rue school jymmmm on motors for ac and how the pulses work one day
10:36 PM jymmmm: But, for future troubleshooting purposes, that's what I'm trying to udnerstand
10:37 PM Tom_L: next time it'll be something else
10:37 PM jymmmm: I dont have a clue on what/how starter caps work/do
10:37 PM zhanx: The cap is a startup helper and line Voltage conditioner
10:37 PM zhanx: It's only to keep the power at 220v
10:38 PM Tom_L: it's like a kick in the pants to get you outta the lazy chair
10:38 PM jymmmm: so the other leg "dips" below 220 when starting?
10:38 PM zhanx: As the fan starts it draws amps and the cap supplies quick power to keep it at 220v
10:38 PM zhanx: All the legs might
10:39 PM zhanx: But you have too much resistance in the motor windings causing heat due to wear and fatigue
10:41 PM jymmmm: gotcha, and that's why it was ramping up and down in RPM's for about an hour?
10:42 PM Tom_L: yep
10:42 PM zhanx: Heat causes resistance
10:42 PM zhanx: Which restricts what?
10:42 PM jymmmm: current
10:43 PM jymmmm: It's an unwanted current limiting resistor +)
10:43 PM jymmmm: =)
10:43 PM zhanx: Current or amps?
10:43 PM jymmmm: current/amperage
10:43 PM zhanx: You are getting it
10:44 PM jymmmm: zhanx: If I leave this running tomorrow, can I blow up something other than the motor?
10:44 PM zhanx: Nope
10:45 PM jymmmm: zhanx: It's suppose to be 98F tomorrow, so since I have to replace the motor monday anyway, just let it keep going?
10:46 PM zhanx: Sure
10:46 PM zhanx: It will be 112 here
10:46 PM jymmmm: Shit, that works for me. I started freezing gallon bottles of water
10:47 PM jymmmm: zhanx: Where's here?
10:47 PM Tom_L: Tx
10:47 PM jymmmm: Ugh
10:47 PM zhanx: Texas
10:47 PM zhanx: Southern Texas
10:48 PM jymmmm: zhanx: TYVM for the help, very much appreciated.
10:48 PM zhanx: No problem that's why we all are here
10:49 PM jymmmm: zhanx: I'm uploading a pic now, there's a black thing with a terminal on the side of it, any clue what it is/does?
10:50 PM Tom_L: probably a thermal switch
10:50 PM zhanx: Just link it and tag me
10:50 PM jymmmm: zhanx: https://i.imgur.com/zedF1WI.jpg
10:51 PM Tom_L: ahh no that's something else
10:52 PM Tom_L: do the copper pipes run thru it?
10:52 PM rue_mohr: tilt switch!?
10:52 PM rue_mohr: !?!?!
10:52 PM zhanx: That looks like a pressure switch
10:52 PM jymmmm: Tom_L: That had a BIG hole in it last year when I replaced it. no pipes
10:53 PM jymmmm: it's an electrical thing, not connected to any pipes
10:53 PM zhanx: Jymmmm is this a "smart" system?
10:53 PM Tom_L: i think it's too old to be very smart
10:53 PM jymmmm: zhanx: As in all relay logic and a timer, ZERO PCB's
10:53 PM zhanx: Mmm
10:54 PM jymmmm: zhanx: 20+ years old carrier, maybe older than that
10:54 PM zhanx: Looks like it measures draw
10:54 PM rue_mohr: jymmmm, you cant get a shot of the writing on it eh?
10:55 PM zhanx: Jymmm the panel should have a wiring diagram FYI
10:55 PM rue_mohr: ooh wait there is another wire out the back isn't there.. a black one...
10:55 PM rue_mohr: so relay?
10:56 PM jymmmm: tart thermistor maybe?
10:56 PM jymmmm: start*
10:56 PM rue_mohr: I was thinking that, but I dont have enough context
10:56 PM zhanx: Context is key on this
10:57 PM rue_mohr: I'm used to the starter being a little thing *on* the compressor motor
10:57 PM jymmmm: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l927gdKi9UQ
10:57 PM rue_mohr: usually under a cover
10:58 PM zhanx: Need to make food
10:58 PM zhanx: I spent all day at the bank and haven't ate yet
10:58 PM rue_mohr: freaking youtube only has 2 ads that apply to me, its all I ever get
10:58 PM rue_mohr: ok, that makes sense
10:58 PM rue_mohr: its like the degauss thinger on a tv
10:59 PM rue_mohr: the only part to ever explode due to no load
11:00 PM jymmmm: rue_mohr: Before I replaced that last year, it had a HUGE (1/2") hole in the back side of it =)
11:00 PM jymmmm: rue_mohr: and was SERISSSSSSLY arcing against the chassis
11:00 PM rue_mohr: yea, sometimes those things explode
11:01 PM rue_mohr: the 2 terminal ones were generally ok
11:01 PM rue_mohr: the 3 terminal ones could get excited
11:02 PM jymmmm: I swear, I'm diagnosed problems on the HVAC by sound alone. I wouldn't of had a clue soemthing was wrong today except I heard soemthing "different" than I was used to hearing.
11:02 PM jymmmm: I've*
11:03 PM jymmmm: Just been VERY lucky that way thankfully
11:03 PM rue_mohr: glad I live an an inhabitable part of the planet...
11:04 PM jymmmm: Oh before I forget, I better spray some wd40 on the spindle so I cna take it apart
11:04 PM rue_mohr: and I'm going to go re-wire the inverter for the 8th time
11:05 PM rue_mohr: I wonder if I'll get stuck on making a MPPT charger after this...
11:09 PM jymmmm: rue_mohr: why?
11:15 PM jymmmm: Tom_L: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P0JUUCEQl-U
11:24 PM jymmmm: Tom_L: THIS is what I have... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p8_0jhhHh6U
11:33 PM rue_shop1: cause they should be $20 and their not
11:34 PM jymmmm: rue_shopI mena why are you having to rewire your inverter for the 8th time?
11:36 PM jymmmm: Tom_L: Heh, rated at 60C/140F ambient, so I think 208F was a wee bit too much :)
11:51 PM rue_shop1: oh cause the 74ls393 will do a better job of knocking down the high freqs
11:57 PM jymmmm: rue_shop1: Ah. how many watts?
11:58 PM jymmmm: rue_shop1: I'm building a 4S LiPo battery, fully charged it'll be 16.8V, most inverters I've found have a over voltage cutoff at 15V, Any suggestions?