#garfield Logs

Jan 24 2019

12:00 AM Jymmm: BTW I can get wax in 140 to 190F melting points
12:08 AM rue_mohr: not heat ENERGY
12:08 AM rue_mohr: heat is the difference
12:08 AM rue_mohr: no because you take the energy from the water and put it in the wax
12:08 AM rue_mohr: which keeps the water cool
12:08 AM Jymmm: right
12:08 AM Jymmm: BUT
12:08 AM rue_mohr: you can pull all the energy out of the flue gas and only raise the water temp a few degrees
12:08 AM Jymmm: how to "extract" all/most of the flue gas heat?
12:08 AM rue_mohr: if you did one long series water run, it would boil cause it would be taking on too much energy
12:08 AM Jymmm: as in how much water would I need to "pass over/thru the end of the flue?
12:08 AM rue_mohr: if you do a huge parallel set of water runs, none of them take on enough energy to boil, but they take the same energy as a whole
12:08 AM rue_mohr: and after you have removed all the energy, there is no more heat
12:08 AM rue_mohr: did you see how I did mine?
12:08 AM Jymmm: right, leaving enough for the "updraft"
12:08 AM rue_mohr: screw that
12:08 AM rue_mohr: use forced draft
12:10 AM Jymmm: 55 gal drum (24" x 36" == 11 cubic ft)
12:11 AM rue_mohr: ok
12:11 AM rue_mohr: so
12:11 AM rue_mohr: how many joules is that?
12:12 AM Jymmm: 9495503
12:12 AM rue_mohr: 9000 BTU/hr for 24-36hrs?
12:12 AM Jymmm: https://www.google.com/search?q=9000+btu+to+joules
12:12 AM rue_mohr: ha
12:12 AM rue_mohr: na
12:13 AM Jymmm: Ok, fine.... 30000 BTU/hr ;)
12:13 AM rue_mohr: 2.6kw for 36hrs
12:14 AM Jymmm: http://blog.dragonheaters.com/wood-heat-storage-flues-vs-bells/
12:15 AM rue_mohr: god it would help me if you used freaking metric units, stand by
12:15 AM Jymmm: metric watts? teeheehee
12:17 AM rue_mohr: still caulculating
12:19 AM rue_mohr: ok when I get this, dont use "btu" in ANY reply!
12:20 AM rue_mohr: Jymmm, about 300 square foot space then, right?
12:23 AM rue_mohr: ok you need 0.3TJ
12:24 AM rue_mohr: thats 279600 gallons of water thermal storage
12:24 AM rue_mohr: in 1 hour, is...
12:24 AM rue_mohr: about the output rate of the sun, rounded up a bit
12:25 AM rue_mohr: would you like to rethink your problem?
12:31 AM Jymmm: Yeah, make it 400 sq ft and only 150 gallons =)
12:31 AM Jymmm: could it be a nova instead of a sun?
12:32 AM rue_mohr: I have 100gal tank,
12:32 AM rue_mohr: its designed to heat the house for an hour as a reserve tank
12:32 AM Jymmm: and you have what, 1500 sqft ?
12:32 AM rue_mohr: 1200
12:33 AM Jymmm: and what about using wax?
12:33 AM rue_mohr: that leaks heat like a siv
12:33 AM rue_mohr: no, just water
12:33 AM Jymmm: Right, but you kept emphisizing wax storage capacity to me
12:33 AM rue_mohr: yea
12:34 AM rue_mohr: the state change stores a LOT more energy than water
12:34 AM rue_mohr: but I'd still use water as the trasnport mechanism
12:34 AM Jymmm: I think (long ago) you figured around 4000 BTU of wax per 55gal drum
12:34 AM rue_mohr: now you have had me think about tubes, I can seal the ends
12:34 AM rue_mohr: and expansion is easier to deal with
12:35 AM rue_mohr: no more btu math tonight
12:35 AM Jymmm: Yeah, I thught tubes sealed on both end, filled with wax and a little room for thermal expansion
12:35 AM rue_mohr: a lot fo room
12:35 AM rue_mohr: have you heard of wax actuators?
12:35 AM Jymmm: 4220223 joules
12:36 AM Jymmm: like in a car thermostat?
12:37 AM Jymmm: Well, how about a 55gal drum filled with wax, and a coil for the water?
12:37 AM rue_mohr: no, like enguage 4 wheel drive
12:37 AM Jymmm: no I havent' then
12:38 AM Jymmm: pex tubing is cheap
12:38 AM rue_mohr: hvvv
12:38 AM rue_mohr: hmmm
12:39 AM rue_mohr: P1V1 = p2v2
12:39 AM Jymmm: ?
12:39 AM rue_mohr: I need to play with the expansion amount of standard waxes
12:39 AM rue_mohr: I may use wax actualors for my big welding helper arm
12:40 AM Jymmm: http://solarenergyengineering.asmedigitalcollection.asme.org/article.aspx?articleid=1454238
12:41 AM Jymmm: https://res.mdpi.com/energies/energies-10-00219/article_deploy/energies-10-00219.pdf?filename=&attachment=1
12:47 AM Jymmm: COF https://pp.bme.hu/ch/article/download/3199/2304/
11:47 AM ffurrywol is now known as furrywolf