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[00:09:36] <rue_shop3> https://cyclingexperiences.files.wordpress.com/2012/01/img_0762.jpg
[00:09:40] <katsmeow> what is the voltage on a dsl line?
[00:09:40] <rue_shop3> who can spot the irony
[00:09:47] <rue_shop3> 48V
[00:09:54] <rue_shop3> maybe up to 56 depending
[00:11:13] <katsmeow> seriously, the dsl tones ??
[00:11:47] <rue_shop3> no, the voltage on the line
[00:12:17] <katsmeow> i mean the dsl ac tones voltage
[00:12:23] <rue_shop3> maybe 1V
[00:12:46] <katsmeow> in the pic, their flex hose is unsupported, will sag and pull off the connectors
[00:12:58] <rue_shop3> roof over the rain barrleS?
[00:13:31] <katsmeow> gotta keep the sun UV off the platic tank, they'dd degreade to powder
[00:13:45] <rue_shop3> hmm
[00:13:52] <katsmeow> overall, that plumbing looks real amateurish
[00:14:31] <katsmeow> no need for 3ft ov overhang, put side walls on the tank frame
[00:15:02] <katsmeow> and easy-to-read level guages on each tank
[00:15:50] <katsmeow> as you can see, that 3ft of floppy overhang is not keeping all the sun off the tanks
[00:22:34] <katsmeow> 100 hc 574 dips
[00:24:40] <katsmeow> i am real sure i have form 74F574 in dip too, dunno how many, but it was long enough ago i paid good money for them from Mouser
[00:25:02] <katsmeow> worth waaaaaaaaaaaaaay less now
[00:34:24] <rue_house> what did you get them for?
[00:34:40] <katsmeow> making a 100Mhz 6502
[00:35:00] <rue_house> oh
[00:35:07] <rue_house> why did n't you start making it?
[00:35:07] <katsmeow> got the HC to make a 100Khz 6502
[00:35:13] <katsmeow> no pcb driller
[00:35:16] <rue_house> them, ..
[00:35:30] <rue_house> Mhz?
[00:35:45] <katsmeow> megahertz
[00:36:06] <rue_house> <katsmeow> got the HC to make a 100Khz 6502
[00:36:22] <rue_house> so, whats all to a 6502?
[00:36:28] <rue_house> A register, X Y
[00:36:31] <rue_house> IP
[00:36:43] <rue_house> thats 5 573
[00:37:12] <rue_house> rom instruction decoder?
[00:37:22] <katsmeow> program counter, stack counter/pointer, the math and boolean seciotn
[00:37:37] <rue_house> did you have mroe than the 573 lined up?
[00:37:44] <katsmeow> i was making a hypercube, not copying the 6502
[00:38:24] <rue_house> ok
[00:38:31] <rue_house> what for alu?
[00:39:19] <katsmeow> ram lookup
[00:39:29] <rue_house> ram?
[00:39:38] <rue_house> preboot seq?
[00:39:41] <katsmeow> it's faster than the 74Fxxx math chips
[00:40:13] <rue_house> rom?
[00:40:33] <katsmeow> read outa 200ns 128k x whatever eprom bank to load the lookup tables
[00:41:28] <katsmeow> i have handfulls of eproms and at least 600 flash chips from thos cable boxen'
[00:44:02] <rue_house> I'v not sat downt o write the code to write all the flash chips I have
[00:44:10] <rue_house> some of them are really laborious to write to
[00:44:53] <katsmeow> mine are dips, i cannot use them, no pcb driller
[00:45:50] <rue_house> you should be a rebbel and just finish the driller without telling anyone
[00:45:59] <rue_house> or use verobaord...
[00:46:08] <rue_house> its awefull cheap now
[00:57:50] * katsmeow gets depressed
[00:59:57] <rue_house> it all changes
[01:00:20] <katsmeow> 74F needs a ground plane
[01:00:28] <katsmeow> vero doesn't do that
[01:35:27] <rue_bed> k
[01:36:16] <rue_bed> well, I screwed up the code for reading my cnc control files, it seems that I used to put everything on one line, then I broke it into multiline
[01:36:23] <rue_bed> so I used the wrong formar
[01:36:26] <rue_bed> I think
[01:36:36] <rue_bed> I'll work on it more later
[01:37:04] <katsmeow> hence saving backups, and never mod'ing the backup files
[01:39:48] <rue_bed> I changed the format
[01:39:59] <rue_bed> at sokme point, I was using hte wrong code as a reference
[01:40:13] <rue_bed> it was designed to be easy to parse
[02:17:12] <katsmeow> i goto bed, gnites
[03:13:21] <Moon_> peace OUT
[14:51:34] <katsmeow> RUERUERUERUE
[14:51:44] <katsmeow> TOMTOMTOM?
[14:54:53] <katsmeow> COEV C2181 dsl transformers work nicely from 10Mhz on down in the 3Khz range, delivering enough power to light an led brightly
[14:55:18] <katsmeow> i didn't measure more power, but that's plenty to operate an avr on
[14:57:13] <katsmeow> tween 1Mhz and 10Mhz, the led loading could clearly be seen on the input waveform when driven thru a resistor, so it's possible to supppy power and simultaneous bidirectional signal if one side supplies the Mhz ac power and that ac is the clock
[14:58:22] <katsmeow> the transformer is 2 primary and 2 secondary windings
[14:59:20] <katsmeow> i got 1000 of them for $8.50usd
[14:59:24] <katsmeow> <cough>
[15:00:10] <katsmeow> it's in keeping with my habit of not paying more than a penny for anything, they were 0.85 cents each
[15:00:14] <katsmeow> that is all
[19:43:47] <rue_shop3> katsmeow-afk, at 1Mhz you can push enough power thru the signal transformer of a vcr head to light up an led nicely
[19:44:31] <rue_shop3> just incase you want your computer to spin while it operates
[20:01:57] <katsmeow-afk> well, ok, just poo on my 0.85 cent power/signal isolation transformers
[20:26:27] <katsmeow-afk> rue, should i go dig a hole and bury them?
[20:30:57] <Moon__> RUE
[20:50:48] <rue_shop3> yes!?
[20:50:54] <rue_shop3> katsmeow-afk, no?
[20:51:17] <rue_shop3> how many times can I listen to CCR play Green River?
[20:53:04] <katsmeow-afk> i dunno, i was listening to Yellow River
[20:53:50] <rue_shop3> I can still hear myself think
[20:54:49] <katsmeow-afk> i wonder how much trouble these guys have with their neighbors :
https://www.google.com/maps/@29.2975919,-90.7377568,130m/data=!3m1!1e3
[20:56:33] <rue_shop3> heh
[21:05:13] <rue_shop3> its the rule, as soon as you find peace, some asshole moves in beside you
[21:05:18] <rue_shop3> it happened to my neighbours
[21:06:08] <katsmeow-afk> me too
[21:06:39] <katsmeow-afk> errr,, <cough> were your neighbors there before you arrived?
[21:07:39] <katsmeow-afk> NASA : the gov agency that goes around in circles the fastest
[21:10:27] <rue_shop3> yea
[21:10:36] <rue_shop3> they moved out about a year after I got here
[21:12:00] <katsmeow-afk> oh, you raised property values, and they cashed out at a profit
[21:12:00] <Tom_itx> damn, finally got the multidimensional array thing working
[21:12:46] <katsmeow-afk> congrates?
[21:12:54] <rue_shop3> if your time traveling, grab me some lottery numbers
[21:13:00] <rue_shop3> *future* ones!
[21:13:01] <Tom_itx> it was kicking my ass all weekend
[21:20:12] <Moon__> hay rue
[21:21:24] <Moon__> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rpGOKGrcpAk
[21:21:39] <Moon__> Is this guy using the transistor like a zener diode?
[21:22:01] <Moon__> with a reverse breakdon voltage?
[21:25:35] <katsmeow-afk> there's a special snap-action switching that occurs in reverse breakdown, i forget what it's called
[21:30:47] <Moon__> on the transistor?
[21:31:24] <katsmeow-afk> yeas
[21:31:28] <Moon__> cool
[21:31:36] <Moon__> Im still a NewB
[21:32:04] <katsmeow-afk> the transistor can survive it if the current is in microamps
[21:32:23] <Moon__> could i get a simular effect if I use a zener diode? instead?
[21:33:05] <katsmeow-afk> i dunno, but i doubt it
[21:33:12] <katsmeow-afk> googe: tunnel diode
[21:33:18] <Moon__> ok
[21:34:50] <Moon__> high speed stylings
[21:35:00] <katsmeow-afk> https://duckduckgo.com/?q=reverse+breakdown+picoseconds
[21:37:49] <rue_shop3> > REPORT PROJECT STATUS
[21:37:52] <rue_shop3> PROJECT HALTED
[21:38:14] <Moon__> ??
[21:38:16] <katsmeow-afk> WHICH PROJECT ?
[21:38:18] <rue_shop3> > REPORT REASON PROJECT HALTED
[21:38:31] <rue_shop3> ULTIMATE SWITCH REQUIRED
[21:38:32] <rue_shop3> >
[21:38:53] <Moon__> >>
[21:39:23] <Moon__> hey rue call me
[21:39:35] <rue_shop3> ok, did you hear me calling?
[21:39:46] <rue_shop3> I could try outside...
[21:40:05] <rue_shop3> resource conflict, I need my body right now
[21:40:08] <rue_shop3> what do you want?
[21:41:40] <Moon__> long winded questions
[21:42:08] <rue_shop3> I just just the thing!
[21:42:10] <rue_shop3> ASCII
[21:42:13] <rue_shop3> :)
[21:43:23] <Moon__> /x90/x90/xGI/xVE/xME/xA/xSH/xEL/xL0
[21:43:28] <rue_shop3> heh, i was thinkign the ultimate switch would be a recessed slide switch, and I found one!
[21:43:40] <rue_shop3> but it says 115 / 230 on it
[21:43:59] <rue_shop3> Moon__, !? what do you need ashell here for
[21:44:00] <rue_shop3> ?
[21:44:13] <katsmeow-afk> ok, if using a P-chan mosfet in the + leg of a psu, to regulate voltage and be a "fuse" for the current sense to trip, how do you keep the mosfet from amplifying psu noise if it's gate is held steady ?
[21:44:55] <rue_shop3> kat, that taken me over 18 months to solve so far
[21:46:01] <rue_shop3> oh I was thinking I need to replace the bra strap on my goggles, cause the elastic stretched out again
[21:46:14] <rue_shop3> then I realized I should just use a spring
[21:46:16] <Moon__> boulder houlder hay
[21:46:26] <rue_shop3> but I argued that the furr would get caught in it
[21:46:27] <katsmeow-afk> springs trap hair
[21:46:37] <rue_shop3> but them i solved it with a peice of pvc pipe over it
[21:46:51] <rue_shop3> so I'm gonna build that sometime
[21:46:54] <katsmeow-afk> i am thinking a cap from gate to +, but that would make driving the gate even harder
[21:47:17] <katsmeow-afk> so a cap from + to the + on the opamp, but that puts opamp lag in the loop
[21:47:52] <katsmeow-afk> so the spring holds a pieve of pipe against your head (i presume) and that's comfy?
[21:48:11] <rue_shop3> op-amp
[21:48:39] <rue_shop3> as long as the gate is way over its saturation voltage it wont carry noise forward
[21:48:41] <rue_shop3> ?
[21:49:16] <katsmeow-afk> but if it is biased to drop a volt, then it mau provide gain tot he switche noise
[21:49:24] <katsmeow-afk> erg
[21:49:39] <katsmeow-afk> my keybd ran out of ink there
[21:50:23] <rue_shop3> op-amp
[21:50:30] <rue_shop3> did you see my schematic for it
[21:50:35] <rue_shop3> oh your in linear mode
[21:51:09] <katsmeow-afk> yeas, linear, unless it's off because the load shorted
[21:52:55] <rue_shop3> I didn't do a linear mode version with a fet
[21:52:57] <rue_shop3> I dont think
[21:53:11] <katsmeow-afk> you sholld try thinking
[21:53:44] <rue_shop3> I'd do a gain controlled fet amp and wrap a op-amp around it
[21:53:52] <rue_shop3> do you have a min voltage?
[21:54:46] <katsmeow-afk> 0v when off
[21:54:59] <rue_shop3> then I dont suggest a drain follower
[21:55:13] <katsmeow-afk> someone pisses moon off
[21:55:35] <katsmeow-afk> why not?
[21:55:38] <rue_shop3> no his internet prolly died
[21:55:52] <rue_shop3> cause the gate-drain voltage of a power fet is about 4V
[21:55:56] <rue_shop3> :) tried it
[21:56:03] <katsmeow-afk> p-chan same as a pnp, push the gate voltage way up and it should turn off
[21:56:28] <rue_shop3> 0V G-S usually is a turnoff to it
[21:56:35] <rue_shop3> ....
[21:56:57] <rue_shop3> sorry, I'm designing a 4-20ma tool
[21:57:13] <katsmeow-afk> oh, using the bipolar totempole, you couldn't drive that far up, or down below .7v
[21:58:18] <katsmeow-afk> i can hang a to-92 pnp off the + and yank the gate all the way up
[21:59:14] <katsmeow-afk> should be able to get the gate to 1.2v with a szlakai
[21:59:53] <katsmeow-afk> let a resistor pull the bipolars up, the opamp pullthem down and on
[22:00:29] * katsmeow-afk needs a functional pen
[22:03:58] <rue_shop3> https://hackaday.io/project/296/gallery#109c39464e53943961d785af44c839dd
[22:04:09] <rue_shop3> if I did a good job, you will end up with one of the schematics in there
[22:04:28] <rue_shop3> https://hackaday.io/project/296/gallery#d5c0ffded70f0e94640da78f7fda0e9c
[22:04:37] <rue_shop3> that lower circuit works well at low powers
[22:11:02] <katsmeow-afk> mogrifying.......
[22:13:15] <katsmeow-afk> i have not tweaked it, or even halfway analised it, but just tossed parts at the paper :
http://www.designerthinking.com/images/DSCF6713.jpg
[22:14:08] <katsmeow-afk> the zener is to push the opamp's utput down closer to the middle of it's operatng zone
[22:14:35] <rue_shop3> what is the peak current/voltage?
[22:14:43] <katsmeow-afk> there's a dead zone that may or may not be of little consequence because of the mosfet's capaciatance
[22:14:59] <katsmeow-afk> hold on, lemme copy/paste......
[22:15:08] <katsmeow-afk> [21:48] <katsmeow-afk> i have not tweaked it, or even halfway analised it,
[22:16:05] <rue_shop3> I dont think you can get much more than 50W with a linear regulator
[22:16:15] <rue_shop3> unless its a really large supply
[22:16:15] <katsmeow-afk> the pnp should be able to turn that p-chan off
[22:17:09] <katsmeow-afk> well, in one app i wanna control 8amp from 10v to 13.6v out
[22:17:32] <katsmeow-afk> in the otehr app , 4amps from 0v to 13.6v
[22:17:46] <katsmeow-afk> i can use 2 mosfets, not a problem
[22:18:06] <katsmeow-afk> IRF4905 got cheap
[22:18:41] <katsmeow-afk> well, comparatively cheap : $15 for 50 of them
[22:19:49] <katsmeow-afk> actually, i see now that if i used a LM393, i can eliminate ne of the bipolars
[22:21:00] <rue_shop3> your gonna use a huge heatsink?
[22:21:04] <rue_shop3> with fan?
[22:21:22] <katsmeow-afk> anyhoo, that should swing 0.7 to 8v across the G-D
[22:21:34] <rue_shop3> I was pushing a fraction of a laptop supply into my 128"^2 sink and it got to about 80c
[22:21:46] <katsmeow-afk> i got two fans i lan to use
[22:21:54] <rue_shop3> 4x8"
[22:21:58] <rue_shop3> ok
[22:23:02] <rue_shop3> I need a really small 1/4" fuse holder...
[22:23:24] <katsmeow-afk> remember, one app is dropping only a max of 3.6v across the mosfet @ 4amps max , that's not a whole lot of power
[22:23:51] <katsmeow-afk> it's not a lilttle, but not a whoe lot
[22:26:20] * katsmeow-afk ponders a salmon sammich
[22:28:13] <katsmeow-afk> i got 11 HOURS of youtube yet to go
[22:29:01] <katsmeow-afk> and it's ALL on sealevel rise and land sinking
[22:29:09] <katsmeow-afk> i got nothing to listen to :-/
[22:33:28] <rue_shop3> put on some of your favorite singer
[22:33:39] <rue_shop3> or instrumentationalist
[22:34:10] * katsmeow-afk looks for the right hdd to power up
[22:38:39] * rue_shop3 wonders why there are left and right hard drives
[22:39:30] <katsmeow-afk> to maximise useage of the human's grasping appendages?
[22:39:46] <katsmeow-afk> oops, add those to your word list
[22:42:55] <rue_shop3> hmm:)
[22:43:03] <rue_shop3> map is different for every person
[22:43:35] <rue_shop3> my 4-20 multitool is getting really heavy
[23:09:41] <rue_shop3> kat
[23:10:01] <katsmeow-afk> rue
[23:10:01] <rue_shop3> do you think a 20mA meter thats FSV is .03V can withstand .5V?
[23:10:17] <katsmeow-afk> only with voltage clamps
[23:10:28] <rue_shop3> that was my clamp :(
[23:11:03] <katsmeow-afk> wait,, what are you calling FSV ?
[23:11:16] <katsmeow-afk> i thought yo mean Full Scale Voltage
[23:12:27] <katsmeow-afk> .5 is 16x .03
[23:13:02] <rue_shop3> the meter is pinned at .03V
[23:13:15] <rue_shop3> the shottkey is .2V..
[23:13:24] <rue_shop3> its still 6x over
[23:14:34] <rue_shop3> how to protect a 20mA meter.... hmmmmm
[23:15:24] <rue_shop3> I suppose I could put in a series resistor to bring up the drop
[23:16:16] <katsmeow-afk> it's ging to be difficult to get accurate tight voltage control without a gain stage
[23:16:39] <rue_shop3> its for 4-20ma circuits, a little loss isn't gonna matter
[23:17:17] <katsmeow-afk> how about you measure the current some other way, and then use any ole circuit to drive the meter?
[23:19:46] <rue_shop3> na, raw meter
[23:19:53] <rue_shop3> less battery draw
[23:20:09] <katsmeow-afk> tradeoffs
[23:20:20] <rue_shop3> the meter is 1.715 ohms...
[23:20:21] <rue_shop3> heh
[23:21:50] <katsmeow-afk> use one transistor, an opamp servo biases it's base so the emitter clamps down at the right voltage, use another transistor and opamp to clamp up
[23:22:17] <rue_shop3> if I put a 5.1R resistor in series with the meter, and use a .2V shottkey across the both of them, it should be find
[23:22:19] <rue_shop3> fin
[23:22:20] <rue_shop3> e
[23:22:22] <rue_shop3> ksdhfkalshf
[23:23:00] <rue_shop3> trying to go really simple, with no power
[23:23:15] <katsmeow-afk> you are aware shottkey Von drifts like every other diode?
[23:23:38] <katsmeow-afk> you can see .7v across a shottkey n normal operation even
[23:23:54] <rue_shop3> there is a 1/16A fuse in series with all that
[23:24:06] <rue_shop3> if someone puts 10V across it, I think it'll react fast enough
[23:24:16] <katsmeow-afk> ok
[23:25:28] <katsmeow-afk> so how much votage can i put across the dsl transformer with out arc over pri-sec windings?
[23:27:02] <katsmeow-afk> 500v? 1000v?
[23:28:43] <rue_shop3> pri-sec 1500V
[23:28:59] <rue_shop3> (hipot)
[23:29:21] <katsmeow-afk> kooool
[23:30:05] <rue_shop3> dosn't mean the board under it can take that :)
[23:30:46] <katsmeow-afk> i can put the 2 sec in series to power an avr, drive one pri with 100khz sine, and send/recieve signal off the other pri
[23:39:59] <katsmeow-afk> pretty :
http://images.intellicast.com/WxImages/Radar/usa.gif
[23:43:26] <rue_shop3> pretty clear
[23:44:43] <rue_shop3> hmm, .2V with the meter, about .3V at 30mA
[23:44:53] * rue_shop3 recalculates
[23:45:43] <katsmeow-afk> then put .5v across it as watch the schotkey be happy with it, while the meter smokes
[23:47:22] <rue_shop3> **^*^%$&*(^ NO 22 OHM RESISTORS?!
[23:48:50] <rue_shop3> 24 ohms will do
[23:48:58] <rue_shop3> wtf is with not having any 22 ohm!?
[23:49:18] <katsmeow-afk> i know, make the meter needle be gnd, and put a electrically hot pin for it to hit when full scale, shorting itself out
[23:50:11] <rue_shop3> wouldn't that cuase it to EDM thru the needle?
[23:51:02] <katsmeow-afk> eventually
[23:51:24] <katsmeow-afk> it's gonna be whamming on it pretty hard and fast
[23:53:57] <rue_shop3> This plastic is a tight fit...
[23:54:07] * rue_shop3 considers the 20ton press
