#garfield Logs

Feb 24 2015

08:45 rue_bed eee
08:45 katsmeow-afk yestwerday wea another day when i was the only one to talk in here in 24 hrs
08:45 tsmeow-afk looks at her k
08:48 tsmeow-afk was glad to see the latest film by the Wachachowskis labled "by the Wachachowskies" instead of "the Whachachoustieces Broth
08:49 katsmeow-afk i feel knowing the name(s) of the people outweighs the need to know their sex and or gender also, especially since those variables that don't matter
08:50 tsmeow-afk wonders where rue's ca
08:52 katsmeow-afk after all, they made the latest film just as frenzied sci-fi action as The Matrix, and the lack of one set of male appendage didn't make a difference, right?
08:53 katsmeow-afk tv is saying we may get inches of snow/ice starting tonite and thru Wednesday, but the temperatures forecasted online don't really allow that
08:55 katsmeow-afk rue, there's some cheap chinese 30amp 12vdc/12.6vdc switcher psu on ebay, they have an adjustement pot on them, but the sellers tell me they won't go to 13.6v/14v ,, what do you think?
08:56 katsmeow-afk think they'll smoke if the Vsense is tweaked?
08:58 katsmeow-afk http://www.ebay.com/itm/181249443002
09:02 katsmeow-afk think they'll smoke if the Vsense is tweaked? but i lower the max amps to 25 to keep the same wattage as at 12vdc?
09:05 katsmeow-afk anyone?
09:11 rue_more they acutally adjust down quite a ways
09:11 katsmeow-afk The output direct voltage adjustable range: �10% <<== ok, that says it can goto 13.2v
09:11 rue_more dont trust them to operate long at low voltages tho
09:11 rue_more https://hackaday.io/project/296-bench-power-supply
09:11 katsmeow-afk i was thinking more of battery charging to 13.6
09:11 rue_more katsmeow-afk, ^
09:12 rue_more ok, next is breakfast....
09:13 katsmeow-afk that is a pretty psu
09:19 katsmeow-afk the "new" battery on the ups is being charged witht he invertor's 2amp internal charger, and a 4amp laptop psu brick, so it's getting *maybe* 6amps charge current to 14v (14.03v according to the Micronta), but that means if i have a 15 min power outage, it will take at least 12hours to restore the battery charge
09:20 katsmeow-afk i are thinking i need more charge current
09:21 katsmeow-afk plus, if i do something really silly like use $5 recycling center batteries, and a $25 360w charger, and a 300w invertor, i can run the invertor right off the charger, with the 12v battery floating
09:22 katsmeow-afk that will support one desktop puter and have enough oomph to charge the battery some while still using the puter
09:25 rue_more online ups
09:28 katsmeow-afk fulltime ups
09:29 katsmeow-afk my lil ups uses a triac to switch to invertor power, sometimes it's just not fast enough, and i worry about a raid box power failing during a write
09:30 katsmeow-afk i could just power the drives right off a battery stack, but that could get wierd
09:31 katsmeow-afk switchering 12v down to 5v, and 18v (12 + 6) down to 12v
09:31 katsmeow-afk i hear google had some mobo built with batteries right on the mobo
09:31 rue_more 'online' is (AC->DC)->(dc storage)->(DC->AC)
09:32 rue_more offline is your run on the average with a relay
09:32 katsmeow-afk ok
09:32 rue_more as I heard it, its computers with built in batteries
09:33 katsmeow-afk plus, the watermaker box will be all 12v, and i need a portable superduty charger for the diesel
09:33 rue_more hmm, need to work out the gain amp for that power supply
09:34 rue_more I suppose if I take a voltage amp and a current amp, combine them with diodes such that the can each hold down the output signal
09:34 katsmeow-afk 50 should be plenty, but i would not count on the gain for an accurate output, gain will vary with temperature
09:35 katsmeow-afk your opamp must have enough gain to override whatever temp variations happen in itself pluf the mosfet's variations
09:35 rue_more the gain is 5 (5V control to 25V max output)
09:35 rue_more er, acually, kina
09:35 rue_more the adc is 2.5, so I suppose the gain is 10
09:35 katsmeow-afk the fet is in the feedback loop tho, yeas?
09:36 rue_more I'm thinking of making a 1:1 analog stage that goes to a switching power stage of 1:1
09:37 rue_more er, so the analog stage would output 0-25V, and the switching power stage would enforce it
09:37 tsmeow-afk would have wasted one opamp tomake a switcher to get over 12v for mosfet driving and opamp power, it's only jet fuel, i mean milli
09:38 rue_more the problems I was running into were ....
09:38 rue_more arg, I'm almost out of time
09:39 katsmeow-afk one opamp as an oscillator, one more capacitor, 2 diodes = ~2x the voltage to play in
09:39 rue_more or was I shooting for a 30V output
09:40 rue_more generating the pwm is less a problem than controlling the regulation
09:40 tsmeow-afk
09:40 rue_more I now have the working current sensor
09:40 rue_more the pwm regulators I was trying had horrific regulation
09:42 katsmeow-afk Tek had aneato way of measung current with no drop, but it did inject a lil ripple: current transformer on the dc, using the dc current to saturate the iron core, saturating it changed the peak of the ref ac fed on the other winding
09:42 katsmeow-afk it was made very linear by using a feedback dc on a 3rd winding
09:43 katsmeow-afk they servoed the counter dc by measing the 50-50 duty cycle of the ref ac, and then the counter dc amp-turns would match the output amp-turns
09:44 rue_more saturable reactor
09:44 tsmeow-afk
09:45 rue_more :/ the world has prettymuch forgotten them
09:45 katsmeow-afk because of the counter-dc tho, the core could be very small
09:45 rue_more bye
09:45 katsmeow-afk it was to never saturate
09:45 katsmeow-afk have funs
09:46 katsmeow-afk the world forgot selsyns too
10:04 katsmeow-afk train taking a break : http://a.abcnews.com/images/US/150224_kabc_train_16x9_992.jpg
10:06 katsmeow-afk the accompanying text says : "and the locomotive also remained upright" , but you can plainly see it is laying down n it's side
10:14 tsmeow-afk plainly considers cranking one 30amp psu up as high as it will go, to feed separate protected 12v psu for each hdd, and then making another deliver 6.5v to feed separate 5v for each
10:14 katsmeow-afk so if a hdd shorts to gnd, it will not affect the other hdds
10:14 katsmeow-afk plus, makes it easier to determine which are on/off
10:16 katsmeow-afk 12 across the face of a 19" box, and 3 deep to be raid-config'd, is 36 drives
10:16 tsmeow-afk has 36 drives right now with no puters to put them
10:20 katsmeow-afk two such racks = 24 "drives" , if i use 2 pata expansion cards in a puter, i need only 3 mobo to access each directly, altho windose will stay in barf mode due to the size of the file tables
10:37 katsmeow-afk remember the good ole daze of the "cuba missile crisis" ? it's baaaaaack ==>> http://www.politico.com/story/2015/02/ash-carter-russia-vladimir-putin-defense-115421.html
10:40 katsmeow-afk how to win in the Ukraine: unarmed soldier walks up to "rebel stronghold" or depot, quietly and calmly tells them they have 2 hours to leave, then he leaves, and two hours the place is obliterated in precision air strikes
10:41 katsmeow-afk do that a few times, and the message will be understood and meaningful
10:42 katsmeow-afk if rebel soldier walks up to Ukranina position and tells them they have 2 hrs to leave, the Ukrainina soldiers leave, and in 2 hrs the place is obliterated by precision air strikes
10:43 katsmeow-afk because, lets face it, by the time any town changes hands now, it's just piles of rubble anyhow, there's little left of any value at all
10:46 katsmeow-afk hover a drone overhead, drop some precision guided high altitude ordinance, then send in the apaches and warhogs, if there is a hole (window, door) somewhere, insert a missile
10:46 katsmeow-afk target the weapons and ammo dumps, leave the humans alone, collapse every hiding spot
10:48 katsmeow-afk no one who couldbe serious in these idiot war games is being serious, and along with the towns being uttery destroyed, too many humans are being killed or injured for life
10:51 katsmeow-afk once you accept the town is going to be destroyed by fighting anyhow (look at the airport recently destroyed in Ukraine), the civilians cannot return and pick up their lives, might as well use a few more bombs to make it easier for the bulldozers to clean it up
10:57 katsmeow-afk i'm sure some propaganda spinners can call this "urban renewal" instead of "war", since all the humans are give warning and not targetted
11:04 katsmeow-afk http://www.sundaytimes.lk/140914/uploads/ukraine1.jpg airport, gone
11:08 katsmeow-afk https://images.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=http%3A%2F%2Fs.newsweek.com%2Fsites%2Fwww.newsweek.com%2Ffiles%2Fstyles%2Fheadline%2Fpublic%2F2014%2F10%2F06%2Fdonetsk-airport.jpg%3Fitok%3DRKq_hc2x&f=1 airport, gone
12:07 katsmeow-afk holey mackrels, there's been 1000's of thses bearings sold for cheap, and the price is falling :
12:07 katsmeow-afk http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40|R40&_nkw=MIXED+LOT+%28180%29+17x47x14+Alternator+Bearing&_in_kw=1&_ex_kw=&_sacat=0&LH_Complete=1&_udlo=&_udhi=&_samilow=&_samihi=&_sadis=15&_stpos=&_sargn=-1%26saslc%3D1&_salic=1&_sop=15&_dmd=1&_ipg=100
15:47 katsmeow-afk was hauling a 12-foot trailer and was southbound on Rice Avenue and wanted to turn right onto 5th Street when he turned right onto the railroad tracks instead and got stuck
15:48 katsmeow-afk The truck, which appeared to be an early 2000s-model Ford F-150, sat there and was hit by the train, which then derailed and sent three of its five cars spilling onto the nearby gravel and adjacent street. Authorities said 28 people were injured, four of them critically including the train's engineer.
15:53 katsmeow-afk each of those railroad cars was $2 million
15:58 katsmeow-afk i wonder how the truck driver will explain how he did not know the difference between pavement for his truck vs a railroad track
16:57 katsmeow-afk well, cusswords: if i set up a cube of my evaporators ~23ft x 23ft x 23ft and could evaporate a foot of ocean water per 24 hrs from each module, i could extract maybe $1700 of gold (and tons more of other stuff) per year
17:03 katsmeow-afk it would not pay for building the system unless i had zero operating costs, and zero shipping costs, in which case the offset by having free energy to runthe system and free shipping would be of more value than the gold
17:03 katsmeow-afk but it would evaporate a cubic kilometer of ocean per year, if that ever becomes necessary
17:04 katsmeow-afk and with condensers could make a cubic kilometer of fresh water
17:08 katsmeow-afk if a square km is 248 acres, then a cubic km is 815,633 acre-feet, and at a measely $10 per acre-ft for drinking water, would be worth $8 million
17:08 katsmeow-afk ergo, water is worth more than gold
17:18 katsmeow-afk yeas, i wanna put a boat on the ocean, and sell water from it
17:19 katsmeow-afk might be worth it to buy some of those Bahama rock outcroppings south of Fla, sell water to the Fla keys, Miami, and Bahamas
17:20 katsmeow-afk Miami has dumped $millions nto RO water plants that so far have lost them all their money
17:21 katsmeow-afk the largest island in Bahams is largely undeveloped because it's the sole freshwater source for Nassau and other islands, they barge the water 2x a day from Grand Whatever Island
17:31 katsmeow-afk ....but the lowest price for desalinated seawater from a reverse osmosis plant is around $750 an acre-foot ....
17:31 katsmeow-afk ....Over the last decade the price has gone down from $2,000 per acre foot in 1990 to $800 in 2003. .....
17:32 katsmeow-afk ....The city of Perth has been successfully operating a reverse osmosis seawater desalination plant since 2006, ... Poseidon plans to sell the water for about US $950 per acre-foot.....
17:32 katsmeow-afk .....The San Diego County Water Authority has agreed to buy at least 48,000 acre-feet of water from the plant each year for about $2,000 an acre-foot......
17:35 katsmeow-afk ....Water that cost about $500 an acre-foot in 2005 now sells for more than $1,200 an acre-foot,.....
17:35 katsmeow-afk ....The Carlsbad Desalination Project will use reverse osmosis, ... for about $2,000 an acre-foot for 30 years after the plant goes online. ... The trouble is, that cost is almost double what the agency now pays for water, ......
17:39 katsmeow-afk if i can put enough solar heat and ocean coolng into my 3x3x4ft module to evaporate and condense the equal of a foot of water from a 30x30ft pool, per day, that's 7.6 acre-ft per yr
17:42 katsmeow-afk if i build a 30x60ft boat with 8ft tall modules, that's 400 modules, making 3,040 acre-ft per yr, or $1.5 million at $500 per acre-ft
17:43 katsmeow-afk need extra space for the condensors
17:44 katsmeow-afk 30x60 ft is a lil larger than my livingroom (24x48)
17:47 katsmeow-afk hello
17:50 Tom_itx hi there ms meow
17:51 katsmeow-afk hi mr Tom
18:38 katsmeow-afk worst case solar btu on a 2-axis flat plate collector ini January in Fla is 17,000 btu per day per sq meter
18:39 katsmeow-afk one btu heats a pound of water one degree F
18:40 katsmeow-afk a cu ft of water is ~65 lbs
18:41 katsmeow-afk so one sq meter can heat one cu ft 261 degrees F
18:42 katsmeow-afk or heat 4 cu ft by 65F, bringing some 80F surface ocean water up to 145F
18:42 katsmeow-afk that's the ballpark i was looking for
18:43 katsmeow-afk it hastobe low enough to get up to temp fast, not overheat plastics (used because they don't corrode in seawater)
18:44 katsmeow-afk i don't want the hot water to radiate heat away, needing pricey watertight foam to block
18:44 katsmeow-afk but a surface air temp of 70F to condense with, and a hot side temp of 145F, seems ideal to me
18:50 katsmeow-afk The amount of heat transfer depends on the evaporation rate, however for each kilogram of water vaporized 2,257 kJ of energy (about 890 BTU per pound of pure water, at 95 �F) are transferred.
18:51 katsmeow-afk that's 19lbs of water per sq meter of solar heater space, or 3.5 gallons
18:51 katsmeow-afk <cough>
18:59 katsmeow-afk the 30x60 boat would recieve 3.4 million btu/day in Jan in Fla, enough to evaporate (aka keep the water hot while it's cooling by evaporation) 3,820 pounds or 450 gallons of water <cough>
19:02 katsmeow-afk 2 years to make an acre-ft
19:03 katsmeow-afk either needs more heat or needs to operate at the typical 80F surface water temperatures
19:05 katsmeow-afk well, good thing about the ocean, you don't need to pay rent on it unless you sit on the bottom in some way
19:33 katsmeow-afk tv weather guy keeps saying it will be tween 41f to 31f tomorrow, and i will have 3 inches of snow
19:33 katsmeow-afk internet says it will be above freezing from 9am till 7pm, and i will have 3 inches of snow
19:33 katsmeow-afk i don't see how
19:33 katsmeow-afk looks like all the schools and .gov offices in Alabama will be closed tomorrow
21:50 jennie hello
21:50 jennie rue_bed: rue_more rue_shop2 rue_shop3 hi
22:42 rue_more je...
22:42 rue_more drat
22:42 rue_more who was that?
22:43 katsmeow-afk . 9:29:54pm 02/24/15 jennie joined .
22:43 katsmeow-afk . jennie!~nn@unaffiliated/jennie .
22:44 rue_more I want to know why [she] wanted to contact me
22:44 katsmeow-afk [she] didn't tellme
23:33 rue_more I onder if the motor control areas of the brain follow the same sequence as the spinal cord
23:34 rue_more I'm starting ot think thats large parts of the brain are just for tranporting signal paths
23:34 katsmeow-afk i doubt it
23:35 katsmeow-afk all the structures at the base of the brain are hardcoded decode and transport wiring
23:36 rue_more I think there is a lot of space taken up in macro encoding/decoding between the brain and the spinal cord
23:36 rue_more there dont seem to be enough verticle travelers for there not to be compression
23:36 rue_more which makes sense
23:36 rue_more local processing dont ya know
23:37 tsmeow-afk
23:37 katsmeow-afk worms have no "brain", it's all distribted processing int he spinal cord
23:38 rue_more which also expalins why carefully controlled movements take so much brain effort, the macros would be really inefficient at direct control if they are optimized for general motion patterns
23:40 rue_more apparently there are two standard signal polorization paths
23:40 rue_more some people are left-right linked, and some are front back linked
23:40 rue_more with allll sorts of stastics on who is what
23:41 rue_more documetns did seem to indicate that the two lobes can communicate directly
23:42 rue_more I'm not finding good documentation about functional deviation of left vs right lobes tho
23:42 rue_more and little documentation relates sensory or motor interconnections with the brain
23:43 rue_more for example, there isn't a lot to even show how smell or sight links to the brain
23:43 katsmeow-afk why are you looking for details on the brain, when it has very little to do with how an Ai would best be built?
23:43 rue_more I'm hoping to get a block diagram
23:44 rue_more how many sections are suggested between A and B
23:44 rue_more general machine archatexture
23:45 rue_more another thing generally lacking in detail is which sections are split into left and right halfs
23:45 rue_more there are prodominently two brain diagrams, the outside left side, and the middle split
23:46 rue_more there is no cross split, or quarter or diagonal split
23:47 rue_more there are some images of dissasebled brain models
23:47 rue_more I will correlate more data tongiht maybe
23:48 rue_more there are 3 images I want to merge data from
23:50 rue_more goodnight
23:50 katsmeow-afk oh
23:50 katsmeow-afk tonite isn't over yet
23:51 katsmeow-afk [23:27] <rue_more> I will correlate more data tongiht maybe
23:51 rue_more I'll work in bed
23:51 katsmeow-afk you still have 1:30 of tonite left
23:51 katsmeow-afk oh
23:51 rue_more I might fall asleep while doing so
23:51 rue_more which is ok
23:51 katsmeow-afk k, gnite